Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 559 | An Atheist's Take on Christianity & The Power of Truth | Guest: James Lindsay

Episode Date: February 7, 2022

Today we're finishing our discussion with James Lindsay about history, Marxism, and theology. As James explains exactly what Marxism is and what its historical roots are, it becomes increasingly clear that this ideology is entirely antithetical to that of the Christian's. Apparently, the Marxists want redemption for mankind as well, but they believe that can only happen when literally everyone on Earth has complied with their worldview. We also discuss some Christian theology as well, and why it is has been such a good foundation for Western Civilization to thrive on. And although James isn't a Christian, he talks about why he still thinks Judeo-Christian values are the best for society. --- Today's Sponsors: Birch Gold are the best people to trust to help you diversify your 401(k) & IRAs into gold. They have thousands of satisfied customers & an A+ Rating with the Better Business Bureau. Text 'ALLIE' to 989898 now to get a no-cost, no-obligation info kit! Bambee was created specifically for small business. Get a dedicated HR manager available by phone, email or real-time chat for just $99/month! Get your free HR audit today at Bambee.com/ALLIE! --- Previous Episodes Mentioned: Ep 556: How Race Marxism Is Infiltrating Schools, Churches & the Government | Guest: James Lindsay https://apple.co/3HBp7Tg Ep 529: Why Bad Ideas Deserve to Be Mocked | Guest: Seth Dillon https://apple.co/3GzpNYj --- Buy Allie's book, You're Not Enough (& That's Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love: https://alliebethstuckey.com/book Relatable merchandise: https://shop.blazemedia.com/collections/allie-stuckey

Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Monday. Today's episode is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers, Better Than Organic Chicken and Craft Beef shipped right to your front door. Go to Good Ranchers.com slash alley and check it out.

All right, today is part two of my conversation with James Lindsay. Part one came out last Tuesday. If you have not listened to that, definitely go listen to it. We talk about the cultural moment that we're in and the long lineage, philosophical lineage that has led us to where we are, especially when it comes to race politics. It was a fascinating conversation, as it always is with James Lindsay. But today I wanted to talk to him specifically about theology and our disagreements there. He identifies, I believe, is an agnostic slash atheist. You guys know I'm a Christian. And I really wanted to know why isn't James a Christian? I mean, he references Christianity in the Bible a lot.

He seems to really understand Christian theology on a very profound level. And so I wanted to talk to him about why he's not a Christian. and our difference is there, and I think that you're really going to enjoy this conversation. So without further ado, here is our friend, once again, James Lindsay. Nobody's really read Marx. And the people who have, according to the, you know, the Marxists that I've read in the past, say, 20 years, I don't think a lot of people understood Marx. So Marx had this very simple kind of construction of the world.

You have this thing called the base later in the structural framing. It got called the infrastructure. That's your productive workers. It's also where nature is. It's where all the stuff's happening. But all of your productive working class is the base. That's what actually builds society. Society is made out of that. And then you have all these people who do things like what we're doing. We're talking. We don't do real work. We talk. We write books. You know, we're lawyers. We mediate people's problems. We're priests or pastors and we just shepherd people through spirituality that's their opiate of their

masses or whatever. These aren't real jobs. They don't produce any real tangible stuff. So in a sense, Marxists see that as a grift. But what Marx calls all of that is the superstructure of society. And that's where the real organization of society kind of gets its kind of basis. And everybody who's involved in the superstructure is also known as an ideologist. An ideology is this bunch of excuses the people who get to work in the superstructure give for why they get to be in the superstructure. Why they get to do this fake work that doesn't have to produce anything while somebody else has to toil with a hammer or a sickle to produce. to produce the base of society.

And so they have these things called ideologies. And they convince themselves that their ideology is the real explanation for how the world works. And so they, therefore, are trapped into thinking, well, this is how it's supposed to be. I've earned my way here. I went to school longer. You know, I'm meritocracy. I did the right stuff. I'd sacrificed.

I've worked my way up. And you could too if you wanted to. But what you have is that those two things are held in this relationship and tension with one another, and they're creating the structure of society that organizes how society works. And it therefore conditions how everybody thinks, depending on where you are positionally, as they would say in intersectionality, against that structure of power. Where are you relationally to being part of the either cultural or material production base? Where are you in terms of the ideology? And one of the features of the ideology is that you, you think that you don't have an ideology.

That's the magic sauce of the ideology. You can't see it. But you are being conditioned by these structural forces that are ultimately what Marx called the social relations produced by the relationship between the infrastructure and superstructure. And this is a dialectical relationship. So that's what dialectical materialism is all about. So you are conditioned by that.

That determines who you are. It determines your character. So with critical race theory, whiteness becomes the property, white supremac. becomes the structure that justify, it's the ideology, I should say, that justifies why some people get access to whiteness and why other people don't. And then systemic racism becomes the structure that shapes all of society, conditions everything. And so any answer or excuse that you give. It's truly conspiracy theory. It's a huge conspiracy theory. You know, it reminds me not to interrupt you, but as you were talking, I'm thinking, I'm like, this sounds exactly like

what people say when they talk about Kim Trails. Seriously. When they're talking about Ken Trails and they're like, we'll see the Kim Trails are like convincing people of different things. They're like playing with your mind. But I, I am the one person who has escaped the power of the Kim Trails and I am here to tell you about that. And if you deny the Kim Trails have had an effect on your thinking, it's just because the Kim Trails are working. It's working.

That's right. And I use the special soap or whatever that got him out of my hair. It's like, no, seriously though, it is a huge conspiracy theory. Even in the book, I have to call it a conspiracy theory. the whole thing is a giant conspiracy theory and that everybody's participating in and the only people who are aware that this is even how it works, just like with the chemtrails, are the people who have the awakened consciousness. In other words, the Marxists. And so they therefore get to appoint themselves the arbiter of how everything's going to go, how everybody's going to have to respond. And they're the only, if you disagree with them, you must not have understood correctly. So you don't have epistemic authority to challenge them.

or you must be secretly a racist. Yeah, it's because you're white. And it goes back to almost like, almost like pathologizing whiteness that your white brain just can't understand. Because it's been conditioned by the structural reality of systemic racism so that it's just not possible. Even though, you know, we've had comedians, you know, breaking down the racial barrier by talking about white culture and doing, you know, Eddie Murphy or whatever, Bernie Mac, all these guys coming out doing their white person voice and making fun of white people culture. Like, everybody's been making fun of this for a long time. What they're saying doesn't even make any sense. But they think they're the only ones who can actually see that this is how this really works in society.

But they don't realize that they're actually in a cult. It really is a cult. And culture is always downstream from cult. That's one thing that I think a lot of people don't understand. And I was actually reading about a critique of John Locke last night. And a lot of what we're talking about reminds me of that. that Locke's legacy, I would say, is even more pervasive than like the outright Marxist, this idea that you, that everyone, you know, starts equally and it's all these systems.

It's all these external things that are, you know, like tearing people down. And really he extracts the human experience from human nature and all of these institutions that have created good societies. That's where we get Atlas shrugged and all of these things that I just don't necessarily agree with, but even conservatives kind of latch on to. And it's reminding me, it's reminded me of, of all of that that. That Locke seemed to not understand that culture is downstream from cult. It's downstream from what you believe about God, what you believe about where people came from, what you believe about human nature, why humans do the things that we do, and the things that human

beings actually naturally need, not just to survive, but to thrive. In my opinion, leftism always gets that wrong. There are even some people, I would say, on the libertarian right that tend to get that wrong. They just get human nature wrong. The laughs tends to think that when it comes to nature versus nurture, that we're all nurture, that we are all just completely malleable. And if the social engineers at the World Economic Forum, if they want people to live a certain way, we'll learn to adapt and we'll just be happy, you know, owning nothing, eating bugs and things like that. But the fact of the matter is is that we do have a human nature. Everyone belongs to a, I don't want to say a cult, but some kind of worldview belief system theology and understanding these things and how our nature flows from that is actually really important in order to create a society in which people can function together.

Yeah. Locke was really good on life, liberty, and property. Like, he really nailed it with those. And his explanations for why are just really short. Blank slate, however, really wrong. Really, really wrong. We are not blank slate slates. It's more like, and this is an image I've always wanted to have like to build so I could have it.

But it's like a canvas, that's like a blank slate. You can paint whatever you want on it, right? But imagine that the canvas is contoured to look, say, like a human face, right? So you just have this canvas. It's got wood under it. So it looks, it's shaped like a face, like a person. And if you paint that, you can only go, like you can paint it however you want. But it still looks like a human face.

if you paint it just right so that, you know, you contoured makeup like I have on right now and look so good. If you contour it all out, you can create some illusions, but then you change angle and it's like you just have a weird brown line on the side of your nose, right? And so there's limits to how far the nurture argument goes. Now, with Marxism, they actually believe they, of course, Marx deposes God. He replaces God with man, like literally with man in himself. And he says that man is creating himself through the process of history.

So man becomes as subject also his own object. And so for them, they actually believe that by creating the social relations, that the social relations then condition man back and create man. And so anything that's a limit from that kind of super blank slate mentality, total nurture, is actually a social condition limiting the range of your subjectivity, which they believe is. Yes, that is Marx. Like if you read the economic and philosophic manuscript of 1844, he goes into it. He's very clear about it. Man is creating himself and it's the limits on man's subjectivity are created by the social relations that are created in dominance and oppression. And dominance and oppression arise from property ownership. And that's in fact property ownership is characterized as the original sin that kicked us out of the Garden of Eden. I mean, it's very religious, but that's why they think that way. Is so, Everybody is responsible to shape the social relations in a way that will, as Michelle Foucault put, expand the potentialities of being by expanding one's subjectivity. You always hear them talk about

subjectivity because they think if they expand the subjectivity, then you can create some broader sense of the object in the world, including yourself, and come to know yourself as creator, independent of God. And it's why does it march hundreds of millions of people to death everywhere where it's tried. That's why, because it's a fundamentally anti-human mentality posing as humanism to use Marx's word for it. You know, I didn't realize this when I was writing my book. It's a little pink book and it doesn't look like it would, you know, contain an analysis of Marx, and that's because it doesn't. But I critique the, you know, the legacy or not the legacy, but the product of that legacy, which is this idea that you see a lot in new age circles,

that you see a lot in self-help, especially female self-help. So coming from places like Lenin Doyle, coming from places like Brune Brown or Rachel Hollis, I don't expect you necessarily to be familiar with them, who certainly wouldn't consider themselves Marxist, but they are on the left and don't realize that their ideas are kind of rooted in that. And the idea that I articulate and critique in my book is this concept that inside all of us is this beautiful, like, perfect princess or diva or whatever it is. And it's really, it's society. It's the patriarchy.

It's capitalism. It's advertising. It's unfair expectations. It's fat phobia. It's whatever it is. Your kids, your marriage. All these things are holding back. that inner perfect princess inside of you.

And what you need to do is to liberate yourself from those things. And so you need to commit yourself to radical self-care, to radical self-love. And they use all these euphemisms, once again, drawing boundaries, cutting toxic people out of your life, which of course sounds good. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with boundaries or cutting actually toxic people. But what they really mean by that is a form of glorified narcissism. and they tell you that you owe that to yourself because you're never going to fully find who you really are, your true authentic self, your autonomous self, until you throw off all of these things that are holding you back. And that is in direct contradiction, as is this whole blank slate thing,

which I'm realizing are very similar, if not the same. It's in direct contradiction to what Christianity says that we are actually totally depraved. I mean, the Bible talks about, How in sin, my mother and father conceived me. And so we actually believe that we are depraved and that we need to be not just made better, new and improved, but we actually need to be made a new person, that we actually need to be born again because the old self is wasting away because of sin. We need to put on the new self made after the likeness of Christ in holiness. And the only way that we can do that is through regeneration of the Holy Spirit by grace through faith in Christ.

And so it is actually in direct contradiction to the gospel, this whole thing, this whole blank slate, this whole inside you as this perfect self and all of these structures, which is all really a form of Marxism, which I didn't really realize before. And that's just another. And I would say probably the most fundamental reason why the Christian worldview and the Marxist worldview, they just cannot, they cannot align because their view of where we come from and who the moral authority is. and what human nature is, they're totally opposite. Completely opposite. Like, you could be the only Christian on the planet, and your relationship with Christ and that renewal doesn't depend on anybody else, and it literally doesn't matter.

But with Marx, they're actually seeking spiritual renewal as well, and that you actually have to, in a sense, be born again as social man, or depends on how it gets translated from the German socialist man, social man, one or the other. And so what that means is it's a man who's, according to the dialectical process of their thought, who has been made to live in a society. In other words, to fully integrate into society where there's no longer any tension between the fact that you're an individual who lives with other people. Right. And so the way that you achieve your awakening is by making everybody else think the same way you do. And that's man in society are renewed at the same time in the Marxist theology.

Whereas with the Christian theology, your renewal begins the moment you accept Christ, period. It's a totally individual decision. It's totally up to you. You are given free will by God to make this decision or not on your own. Well, you're sitting with a Calvinist, and so I have a little bit of a different take. I got you. I understand what you're saying. So, yeah.

I understand Calvinism has a slightly different perspective on this and the elect and all of this and the, yes, irresistible grace. that said within Marxism But see, now that's just been that God is ordained in advance Which things are going to happen And that's what's going to happen Over here within Marxism again, man and society Either don't renew at all or renew together as one thing So until you have the perfect socialist society or communism

You don't have the renewed man either They are in dialectical relationship with the world one another. They are opposites. They can't pull apart from one another. They are defined in terms of one another. And their resolution is when those things become co-continuous. Man in society become co-continuous. So your renewal in Marxism as a spiritual thing has nothing to do with your beliefs about Christ or any other such thing. It has to do with if you can make the new society come about and get other people, all other people to be on board with it. And it is so much like Christian eschatology in that it says, you know, this is what the end time is going to look like. And it really

does remind me of the promise of the World Economic Forum that you'll owe nothing and be happy. Obviously, in Christian theology, we believe that Christ will rule in perfect peace and that we will be fully joyful and at peace and that we will have no sorrow or sickness. But that's because we believe in Christ's rule, whereas the Marxist believes that that can happen here on earth. We can achieve that kind of liberation, but basically everyone has to comply and become their own gods in a sense, right? Yes. In fact, the goal, they say this explicitly in their literature, I don't know how metaphorical they're being, is to get back into the Garden of Eden and to kick out the jailer that was there from the beginning. Our birthright is the garden. And I say

that they say this literally. Herbert Markuza, for example, in Errolson Civilization, which you wrote in 1995 said that the goal is to get back into the garden and the way that you do it is by taking a second bite of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. That's in there. He says that. And, you know, the being in the garden, this kind of perfect utopian kingdom of God. It's exactly what they think. But we're all in it together because the garden only works when we're all there as one perfect, no domination, united society. But also like within the Garden of Eden, because they they tend to, it seems like Marxists tend to think that all like hierarchies are inherently oppressive. But there was a hierarchy in the garden, not just between God and man, but also between man and the rest of creation.

And so again, this goes back to their just erroneous view of human nature. We were created in hierarchy from the very beginning. So it's a little bit confusing to me why they think going back to the Garden of Eden is going to get rid of all hierarchy. No, because God won't be there. See, that's absolutely key. God. So it's not getting rid of Satan when you say the jailer. It's getting rid of God.

Yeah, God's the jailer. Marxism is ultimately a Gnostic religion, which means that it holds that God is a demon, not actually the deity. And he's, so what he is is somebody that went through this process already, reached a level of power and ability or whatever, and then came into the garden and ruled over people falsely as a demon. and then, you know, used his power to kick people out and all of this, but this is all fake and evil.

And so it's our birthright. And we just have to, we have to get God out of the way and realize that he's a demon. And then we become like him. In fact, the point of the Marxist project is the dialectical relationship between the subject and object. I am a human subject. I visualize in my mind that which I want to see in the world and I create it. And I know myself through my creation, which is I know myself as a creator. but because there's intersubjectivity.

In other words, you have a subjectivity, I have a subjectivity, all the people have subjectivities, and they have to work together somehow. They all have to synthesize into kind of the same program, or it's not going to work, because one of us is dominating the other. There's a hierarchy, unless we're all thinking the same thing, working the same way, like the Star Trek Borg or whatever. And we all therefore know ourselves as creators as the authors of history. And history is, in fact, the authorship of man realizing him.

as creative or as the creator. It's totally, to think that you could take anything that's derived from Marxism and kind of cobble it into Christianity is absolutely insane. And I know very smart people who try to do that, who tried to say, well, I agree with 20 to 30 percent of critical race theory or whatever. Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch the Steve Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you. you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Okay, we only have a few minutes, and this kind of leads into what I at least want to briefly talk to you about. It seems to me, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, I don't want to mischaracterize you, that you kind of understand, well, okay, I won't even put that on you. What it seems to me is that it's not just that Marxism and all of its subsidiaries

are a direct contradiction to Christianity, but also that Christianity and Christian theology alone is actually the antidote to Marxism. It's the only. thing that can really replace it. And it's, well, I'm curious to know if you agree with that or if you think that there is something else that we can replace Marxism with here in the West as far as a guiding philosophy goes as the foundation of Western society and the making of laws that is not Christian in nature. You're not a Christian. And so what do you think is a good basis for society?

What do you think is a good moral foundation? Well, I mean, I'm not opposed to using Christianity, obviously, but what ultimately boils down to is a disposition of either humility or arrogance. So the Marxist view, if you see yourself as the creator, then that's obviously crazy arrogance. And you think that anything becomes possible and you start blaming other people for why your subjectivity is limited and therefore you can't create and have whatever you want. That's a very arrogance-based problem.

Now, within Christianity, obviously the whole idea is that you can do nothing but be humble before God. It would be ridiculous, not to. But if you don't take a theological perspective in the traditional sense of believing in a God, there's still the fact of there is the world. We are human beings within it. We have a nature that it turns out maybe we could mold through something horrific like eugenics, but we shouldn't be so arrogant as to screw with things like that. That's a bad idea, right?

And so being humble before the fact that human beings and the world are as they are, and therefore that there are right and wrong ways to engage with one another that clearly manipulation and forcing people to believe all in the same way about the same things, that's somehow very inimical to whatever the human spirit really is, whether you see that as being a unique child of God made in Magodei or otherwise. It's still, I think our spirit is fundamentally based in freedom, wanting to be free, not arbitrarily from so-called systems or structures, but rather that we get to do to the degree that's possible our own self-determination in life. And so I generally think that any broad philosophy that's rooted deeply in, you know, an epistemology geared toward truth, an ontology that accepts being as something that is outside of us that we are not the creators in our heads of that which is.

therefore we have very limited faculty over it. Maybe we're incredibly skilled people and we can drive a great big machine and move the earth. It's still so small, right? Anywhere we start to have kind of an epistemological and ontological and an axiological, which is values-based orientation toward humility and that there's something core to what it means to actually be human that's rooted in being able to be free to the point of self-determination. I think is extraordinarily key. Now, as somebody who has obviously benefited tremendously

from the kind of Judeo-Christian backbone that's been in this country, and having read scripture and thought about the message that it's providing, I think that it is actually an excellent anchor, regardless of, you know, if some people decide to believe it in various degrees of literality or not, and other people decide that they don't want to believe it at all,

but I still think that it's an excellent backbone of, you know, values and what meaning in life is and what the role of faith actually should be, whether it's faith in God or faith kind of in this, you know, generally in the best of humanity or whatever else. I think that that's a, I really do think it's a good anchor that we should be encouraging as a cultural, backbone throughout society. And of course, it falls heavily to believers, to be the stewards of that, and to bring that light, you know, to, as it said, spread the gospel to people so that they can hear these messages, the values contained in their work. They're extremely effective. They're effective for very good reasons. If you believe they're divinely inspired you, that's the reasons if you see that

they've stood the test of time for 2,000 years and produced flourishing societies everywhere they've gone. That's other reasons that are a little bit more practical in the world without invoking theology. But generally speaking, I think that that's what it comes down to and a disposition toward humility rather than arrogance toward taking responsibility and seeing people as individuals. I invoke the Imago Dei all the time despite not being a believer. Like to think that because you are an individual who was formed for a purpose according to the theology and that you know you need to live that purpose that's a very powerful and important message so you know and again just stop thinking you're the creator and that everything is possible like you're not going to change your gender you're not

going to yeah like some things just aren't possible and you don't have to make it uh it's not oppression that some things are not possible. It's not oppression that, and I'm all about people experimenting with things in life, but you also have to be willing to admit that didn't work. And that's like the whole Old Testament, right? Israelites experimented with life and God got mad at them and bad things happened and then they bring back up, he brings up a prophet, prophet brings them back to God, and they get their life right.

And that's metaphorically speaking, you know, a lesson. Try things in life, but be humble. come back. Yeah. I would say it'll end on this. That Christianity is the why behind anyone should have humility underneath those things. Because there is a transcendent moral lawgiver who says what is and what isn't, who isn't just answering those ontological questions, the philosophical questions that we're talking about, but also the teleological questions. You mentioned purpose. There is only a creator of something can tell you what something is actually made for.

And that's what we get in God. That doesn't just tell us, okay, you are made male and female biology because you only have one telos, just like anything else, just like a bird, you know, can't be a turtle and vice versa. Man can't be a woman. And obviously Christian theology tells us that, but it also answers that question of, well, why are we humble? Why are we not our own gods? If we are the greatest power in this universe, why can't we, why can't we create man or society in our image? And of course, the Christian answer is to that is because God made us in his image. We actually don't have the power and the authority to do that.

And the only authority that we do have over creation, which of course from Genesis 1, we believe that we have, is endowed to us by God. just like our rights were endowed to us by God. And of course, as I'm sure that she would agree without the, not just Christianity, but the Protestant Reformation, this idea that, okay, we're not just handed down truth from some person on high, but that we actually have the ability, that self-determination feature, that individualism feature that comes from Protestants. And that's why America exists. That's why the West exists.

I don't see us getting back if it's even possible. getting back to, you know, where we used to be as Western civilization without realizing the values in the biblical worldview, in particular in the Protestant worldview, whether or not you're a Protestant or Christian. I just don't think that we can push back against Marxism without Christian theology. And of course, the bigger reason why I believe in all of that is not just pragmatic or political, but of course, because I believe that Jesus is the son of God and that there is no salvation apart from him. I just take him at his word in John 14-6. But just in talking to you, I just see how Christianity answers all of these intricate,

complex questions. And I mean, I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful that you will believe that Jesus is son of God because that's the piece that's missing. You understand it cognitively. You just don't believe in your heart that it's true. That's correct. Yep. Well, I think that my audience will be praying about that. I'm going to be praying about that. And there's nothing you can do about it, especially from us Calvinists, especially from us Calvinists. Yeah, we don't believe that you're going to be able to resist that grace when it comes to you. So we'll see. We'll be praying. Thank you so much. Thanks for taking the time. And everyone can buy your book anywhere. On Amazon, actually. We're publishing it, self-publishing through the company. So it's only available on Amazon. It's called race Marxism. And it should be out very soon, if not already, depending on when this goes. This will be out today. Okay. It goes out on the 15th then.

Okay. 15th February. Pre-order the e-book now if you want. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, James. Yep. Okay, guys, I hope you enjoyed that conversation with James Lindsay. There was even more that we could have talked about, but we were running low on time.

Obviously, this was a really long conversation. And so we'll have to have him back and exclusively talk about theology and Christianity. and why? Why doesn't he believe that Jesus is Lord? I'm sure that he has his reasons for that, and we didn't even have time to get into all of it, but we will in the future. But I hope that was an edifying conversation, an interesting conversation for you guys. I know I touched on predestination in Calvinism a little bit there. And for those of you who haven't been listening for very long, you might be wondering, hang on, what is she talking about? What is Calvinism? How could she become whatever it is that you were thinking there and hoping that I would expound upon

I will link some previous episodes that I've done talking about this. And we'll, I'll talk about predestination again in a future episode because it's a, I really like that topic. It's a fun topic for me to talk about. And so we will make sure to dive into that again at a future time. Maybe we'll have a discussion. Actually, I did. Seth Dillon of the CEO of Babylon B.

We did kind of have a disagreement in our conversation about that. And we'll put a link to that conversation. in the description of this episode as well. Thank you guys, as always, for listening and for subscribing on YouTube. If you love the podcast, leave a five-star review on Apple Podcasts. That means so much. All right, I'll see you back here tomorrow. Hey, this is Steve Day.

If you're listening to Alley, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort. We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular.

This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us.