Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 764 | What Really Happens at Pregnancy Centers? | Guest: Leanne Jamieson

Episode Date: March 2, 2023

Today we’re joined by Leanne Jamieson, executive director at Prestonwood Pregnancy Center, to talk about what really goes on at pregnancy centers. In the aftermath of the overturning of Roe v. Wade, pregnancy centers across the country have found themselves targets of vandalism and vitriol, most notably from Elizabeth Warren, who deemed them “dangerous.” Leanne sets the record straight, explaining that these are centers where women come to be loved, served, and given actual choices that Planned Parenthood would never present. We go through exactly what happens when a woman enters Prestonwood Pregnancy Center and how the center serves both long-term and holistically. Leanne shares some stories of how God is working in these centers, as well as what PPC was able to do with all of our listeners’ generous donations after the “Elizabeth Warren Exposes Very Scary Pregnancy Center” parody video last year. You can give to the Prestonwood Pregnancy Center registry here: https://amzn.to/3SHrBWE --- Timecodes: (01:34) Interview with Leanne begins (03:00) Leanne's testimony / giving women choices (09:55) Process for a woman entering PPC (14:46) Stories of women in need (26:50) Criticism of pregnancy centers (39:34) "Pro-choice" beliefs (49:25) Needs of the mother/baby after birth (56:05) Encouragement (01:01:30) Impact of Relatable listeners' generosity --- Today's Sponsors: My Patriot Supply — prepare yourself for anything with long-term emergency food storage. Get $200 of survival gear when you buy a Three-Month Emergency Food Kit when you go to PrepareWithAllie.com. Carly Jean Los Angeles — use promo code 'ALLIEB' to save 20% off your first order at CarlyJeanLosAngeles.com! Fearless Army: Roll Call — join hundreds of like-minded men in Nashville on April 15th for Fearless Army: Roll Call - an all-day event to encourage men to put on the full armor of God to take a stand against the evil forces destroying American culture. Tickets will likely sell out, so secure yours today by going to FearlessArmyRollCall.com. --- Links: Prestonwood Pregnancy Center registry: https://www.amazon.com/baby-reg/prestonwood-pregnancycenter-july-2023-richardson/3J4JYXTT783ZD Elizabeth Warren Exposes Very Scary Pregnancy Center: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-W2HaQrtDU&t=151s TIME: "Anti-Abortion Pregnancy Centers Are Collecting Troves of Data That Could Be Weaponized Against Women" https://time.com/6189528/anti-abortion-pregnancy-centers-collect-data-investigation/ --- Relevant Episodes: Ep 728 | Want to End Abortion? Make Disciples | Guest: Roland Warren https://apple.co/3ENrdjz Ep 738 | My Response to 'Christian' Pro-Choice Congresswomen | Guest: Ericka Andersen https://apple.co/3Iz4clu Ep 701 | Progressive, Pro-Life, & Indicted by the DOJ | Guest: Herb Geraghty https://apple.co/3YcG8L2 --- Buy Allie's book, You're Not Enough (& That's Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love: https://alliebethstuckey.com/book Relatable merchandise – use promo code 'ALLIE10' for a discount: https://shop.blazemedia.com/collections/allie-stuckey

Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Pro-lifers are just pro-birth. Pro-lifers don't do enough for women. They only care about keeping the unborn child alive. And that's it.

They lack understanding. They lack empathy. They lack love. These are the accusations that pro-lifers. get, but most people who launched these accusations have never been to their local pregnancy center. Today we are talking to a director of a pregnancy center in a blue city, in a red state who is going to tell us what exactly they do. She is going to give us the testimonies of women who have been helped by the women and

the volunteers at their center. if you can make it through this episode without crying tears of joy and gratitude and praise to God for what he is doing through these Prestonwood pregnancy centers, well, then you are a stronger person than I am. You are going to be so encouraged, so edified, and so educated by the conversation with our guest today. So Leanne Jamison from Prestonwood Pregnancy Center will be joining us in just one second. this episode, as always, is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.

Go to Good Ranchers.com. Use promo code Alley at checkout. That's good ranchers.com code Alley. Leanne, thanks so much for joining us. I am so grateful to be here today. Yes. For those who don't know, can you just tell us who you are and what you do? Sure. My name is Leanne Jamison and I am the executive director at the Presumint Pregnancy Center. Yes. And tell us a little bit about how you got that. very, very busy job.

Yeah. Well, you know, I've been working in ministry for a long time, a couple decades and was on staff at a church that had started a pregnancy center, Preston Wood. And so when they had a need, they asked me to step into the role. To be honest, I had never, I hadn't even ever served at a pregnancy center. Wow. I, you know, like a lot of believers, I was pro-life and believed in the sanctity of life, but didn't really understand what a pregnancy center did. And so initially had stepped into the role in Trump, thinking that it might not personally be a fit in that I loved being in the church ministry world and ministering to women through women's ministry in a church.

But my goodness, fell in love. Incredible what I get to do every day. And how long ago was that? That was eight years ago. Eight years ago, we started at Prestonwood Pregnancy Center. And you said that you had always been pro-life. Tell us a little bit about your journey. I mean, obviously they saw at Preston Wood that, okay, Leanne would be a good person for this.

And so they must have known, obviously, about your values and what you cared about. But tell me just kind of your testimony. need up to that. Yeah, I think like a lot of believers, I was pro-life inward. And I mean, it was a heart, it was a heart hold for me. I believed in the sanctity of life. I had had women, young women in my ministry that I'd walked through on planned pregnancies with, without a question, believing that that child, regardless of how it was conceived, was a gift from the Lord that had a plan and a purpose. But, you know, when I went to the pregnancy center,

I really had to confront why do I believe in the sanctity of life? What does that look like? In what ways does the church need to operate? How do we stand the gap for that young couple that finds themselves in that unplanned pregnancy? And so I really often will say I went from being pro-life inward to pro-love in action, You know, those beliefs, I had a vehicle now in which to operate or work them out through the pregnancy center. So tell me what surprised you the most, just seeing it day in and day out, women come in who are in crisis or just in unplanned pregnancies. What did you learn?

You know, I think looking back, it's still one of the greatest motivations, too, for what we do? is that, you know, I think we have a society that tells people to react to their situation. Sometimes that's a positive thing, right? You find yourself in a situation that you need to move quickly out of because that is what's best. But in my experience, reacting is not the best or healthiest way to make a decision. And that is, and instead it's responding. And responding, just the idea of response requires an element of time. So we have done a very effective job, and I think it's one the abortion industry has played

off of, of telling people like, look, you're in an uncomfortable, difficult situation. Don't linger there. We've got an option for you that can quickly take care of that uncomfortable situation that you find yourself in. I think what surprised me is how many of those that find themselves in that situation have it has, they don't slow down to think, okay, let's look at my situation. Let's think about the pros and the cons to each of my options. Let's navigate this. And instead of reacting, instead of responding, they're reacting. And so I think what surprised me is just a place that we have in helping navigate a decision-making process with a young person,

to be able to slow down and look at those options with truth, wrapped in love and grace, and how needed it is. I think about, you know, when I was having my first baby and I was told, oh, yeah, let's just do a C-section. I could get into that whole story. It was really not necessary. But I think that, you know, a lot of times we have white coat syndrome where someone who is in charge tells you, well, this is how we're going to react or respond to your situation. It makes you feel maybe even without saying the words, like you don't have any time or you don't have any other option to try to learn about the choices here or learn about what's going on.

This is just what we suggest. And because that person is in authority, you take their suggestion as this is what you have to do. So I imagine it's really difficult in those situations, especially when you've got a 17-year-old girl, she is stressed out and someone tells you, come on. Of course, this is what you need to do. Of course you have to finish high school and go to college. Of course it's going to be easier if you get an abortion. You kind of, you know, get a little starry-eyed at this person in authority telling you this is what you have to do to be smart and to be responsible. So I'm sure that's one of the reasons why a lot of young girls say, okay,

whatever you say, Planned Parenthood. Absolutely. I mean, I think we find that. We have young people that come into our center. And when we ask them questions, they have like, you know, because I think there's a lot of just misunderstanding of how pregnancy centers work. Yeah. I think there's a lot of belief that we're out there arm twisting and manipulating and lying.

And I'm sure we'll get into that. But, you know, I think when we sit with that young person, and we say to her, these are your options. These are these are the choices that you can make. And here's, you know, let's talk through that, asking them some good questions. It's so interesting how often they haven't even really thought about it. The only space that they've gotten to is I have a positive pregnancy test

and I don't want my life to change. Or I can't do this. because I don't have the finances or I'm a student or and they fill in the blank the reasons that we hear. And when you say let's let's talk about that assumption. Sometimes assumptions are true. Sometimes assumptions are not true. So the best way is for let's let's talk about what you're being told. You know, I think we have we do teach our young ones from the time they're little. I would take my little ones to the doctor, they're going to give you a needle. It's going to hurt, but it's okay. It's for what's best. You trust this person because they have a white coat. We should trust

our medical professionals. But I think that you still have to discern and gather information and think about your situation and be able to make a healthy decision for you and your unborn child. Yeah. We certainly should be able to trust our medical professionals. I think a lot of people have been kind of questioning that authority for the past couple of years with a lot of things that have gone on, including the big push for abortion among our medical professionals and the experts saying that this really is health care from the president of the United States saying this is health care. It's a woman's right. Before we get into any of that, I do want to hear, what is the process from the moment that a young woman calls you? Maybe she doesn't really know

if she's pregnant. She wants to get it confirmed or something like that. To her coming in and her leaving for the first time, tell me what that process looks like and what the pregnancy center is doing for her. Yeah. So often she'll find us online or through word and mouth referral. So 40, 45% of our clients come because someone else has come to us and told them that we are safe and caring place for them to show up to. Or they found us through just that internet search where a lot of us go now for our first source of information.

She'll call or chat or text. She is going to talk to a very compassionate woman on the phone who's going to figure out and ask good questions about her situation. She is going to learn on that initial phone call that we need, we don't perform nor do we refer for abortions, but we're going to tell her all the things we can do for her and why it is still a good idea for her to come to us. She's going to come in, she's going to have that pregnancy test, she's going to sit with someone who's going to

provide guidance. Should she be going through a specific, difficult situation of trauma, we have licensed professional counselors on staff that we will pull into her visit. She's going to meet with a nurse sonographer for that sonogram. You know, the people that are employed at the pregnancy center are professionals that know some of the best, I think, in pregnancy centers around this nation. You have some of the best medical professionals, doctors providing oversight. She's going to get a continuum of care, I don't think that she gets anywhere else. So when we talk about woman's health care, when we talk about reproductive health care, I think we have to look at a woman as a holistic being. And in our mind at our clinic, she has physical, emotional,

and spiritual needs. And we're going to address those. She's going to find out the physical. Is she pregnant? How far along is she? Is she? Isn't an interuterine pregnancy. That's important to know as well. She's going to get good counsel. She's going to get good counsel on her situation. She's going to be, that's going to be guided and, you know, help her come to the decision that she needs to make around that pregnancy. And we do that, you know, it's interesting on a side note that women coming to a center like ours at our center who can come to us thinking initially that the only option for them is an abortion. 86% of the time they'll choose life.

When they just take a breath, it's nothing that we're doing other than just saying, okay, we're here. Let's navigate this with you. And she takes the option or she chooses the option of life for her child. But through that, if she has material needs and physical needs, we have a resource center. food, diet, all, you name it, holistically, we're going to care for her. And parenting classes as well. I mean, this is stuff that extends beyond even the first year of life in many cases.

I mean, is, you know, it's interesting because that's, that's a question we get is how long will you walk with her? And I will often say, honestly, there's not a policy of like, okay, two years, you're out here. We are pro-life and we're pro-her-life. And so that means that should something come up in the future, we want to help support and enable and equip and empower her to be the mother and the woman that God has designed for her to be. So that means that should she need our help longer than two years or there's no deadline. And often, She has other children.

So, you know, we're going to look at her situation, her needs and come up with if she's parenting herself. We're going to come up with a parenting plan and look at not just how can we provide, but how can we equip and empower her to be able to long-term provide and have this incredible abundant and filled life that we know that Jesus wants for her. You and I have talked about some stories of women who have come through your center, who have had especially dire needs. Like you've told me about women who have needed help with immigration, who have needed help with health care enrollment, needed help with refuge from different kinds of abuse, maybe domestic abuse. Can you tell us just a couple of those stories that have struck you and stayed with you over the past couple of years where you really.

saw kind of redemption and transformation for that woman because of how God used the center and the people there. You know, some of the criticism out there about pregnancy centers, it's interesting and like I said, I'm sure we'll get into it. But we had a client and she came to us and she was abortion determined. And through her meeting with a nurse, it became evident that she was an abusive relationship. That was one of the reasons that she was abortion determined. And the nurse stopped and immediately looked at her and said, I need to know if you're safe. And they had a long conversation and she felt like she was still safe. And that nurse said to her, I want you to know that we are here for you, that we love you and we are concerned about your

well-being. And should you need us, we are a mere phone call away. When she left that day and was still uncertain about whether or not she was going to parent and, you know, we knew that we were going to continue to reach out to her and have her come back as should she need us. And the very next day, during the night, they got, she and her significant other got into a really large argument. And she ran, left the house the next morning with nothing but the, like, she had shoes on and nothing, not her purse, nothing. and she came to us the next day.

So think about this. Your abortion, so obviously didn't feel judged. I obviously felt loved and cared for because she showed up that very next day. She was beaten and we were pretty sure she had broken bones in her face. And so we took, I put her in my car and we took her to the emergency room. We spent the day with her trying to get her and paid for her. her to get out of town to go back home where she could be safe. I will say that she chose life as a positive and, you know, she'll come back in and she'll ask to come. And, you know, what I love is

so she'll come in and she asks for me. And I get to go and I get to love on her and hug her. And, and, you know, it's not that her life isn't still got some messiness to it. But I always tell the staff, messiness is just an opportunity for ministry. And I love her just the way that she is, because she is a child of God. And she has had difficult life circumstances. You know, we had another client, a refugee client and came to us. She was sitting in a Planned Parenthood, and this was before Roe was overturned. And she had just, she was tragically pregnant. That's how I'll put it, tragically pregnant from just a difficult circumstance. And she was seeking an abortion.

And so she had found out sitting in this Planned Parenthood, what the abortion was going to cost. And she didn't have that. So she put in, where can I get free help? And we popped up at the top of that search. So she showed up that day. because she called and said, can I come? Is it really free? And can I come now?

And we said, absolutely, we're free. This is what we can do for you. This is what we don't do, but this is what we do. And you can come. And so she showed up that day. And she would tell you that she met love for the very first time through one of our client advocates. And so she ended up choosing life.

We stayed in touch with her. I'm always terribly honest. I'll tell you what we do well. And I'll tell you what we didn't do well. And we did follow up, but we missed a very important question during our follow up over the next few months with her. And that was, tell me about your support system. So it gets to near the end of her pregnancy. And one of my staff walks in and says, hey, Leanne, this client is on the phone.

And she's in labor. And she's wondering if one of us can go be with her in labor. And I'm like, I have, I mean, I've been in labor. I have never been there to cheer. And I mean, this is a dream. So I'm like, I am your woman. And I get in my car. And I'm heading down to one of the hospitals here in the city.

And all of a sudden, you know, it dawns on me. I don't know where I'm to be going. Because from Canada, I've never given birth in the U.S. I don't know. Do you go to the emergency room? Do you go to labor? I don't know. So I call.

And they tell me that actually it was a good thing. because she was being sent home because she was in false labor. So I head back to the center. And as I'm heading back, I'm thinking, hold on here, Lord. Like, you're in labor. And, you know, not that we don't have a relationship with our clients. We do in some close relationships. But we, you know, you're in labor and we're the people that when you are thinking about

who you need there that you reach out to, like that's just a bit of a red flag for me. So by the time I get back to the center, I said to one of the staff, I want to go, let's go see her at her home. Like I grabbed another staff member, but I don't want to go empty handed because that might seem a little strange that I just show up at her doors. I'm like, we need to take her something. Do we have a car seat? And so we happen to have a car seat. And so we grab that car seat and off we go. And we show up her at her door. And I knock on the door and she opens the door and she sees me with this car seat and she just starts to sob. She falls to her knees, put the car seat down and I pick her up and I kind of cup her face and I'm like, sweet one,

what is going on? And she said, I, you know, I was sent home from at the hospital and I'm not in real labor yet and she's just sobbing and she said, but the nurse said as she was sending her off, listen, when you come back and you're in real labor, like, you need to have a car seat with you or you can't take your baby home. Was she all the way home? She had been crying like, I don't have, like, she couldn't even afford a car seat. And here we show up with this car seat. And I took a look around her apartment that day.

And it was obvious that she didn't have anything. And I said, hey, tell me, like, what have you been eating? And she started to cry again. And she'd been living off a loaf of bread. a dozen eggs for like the last week. She was not, again, a refugee, didn't know about food banks, was just in a really tough situation. So I said to her, look, I'm going to leave now.

But, you know, remember I told you I was a woman's ministry director. I have a lot of women in my phone. I'm like, I'm going to make some phone calls and some of my friends are going to show up and they're going to bring you some things that you need. And just let them in. If they say they're a friend of mine, just let them in. And so I made them. phone calls and women started to show up. I said she needs food. She didn't know just everything.

She needed everything. So that was a Thursday. That Saturday I got up, woke up my husband up and say, hey, babe, we need to go to Costco. I need to go by. I do this to people. I'm sorry. If you're not, if you're watching or if you're listening, you can't see that I have tears streaming down my face. I can't help it. I can't help it. I can't help it. I love that about your heart, Ale, Beth. You're the real deal. So anyway, so I could wake my husband up. I'm like, we got to go to Costco. We need to buy, but rice. And I'm a gosh shopping list. So off we go and I'm like, you know, we head off to her place after going to Costco and, and we show up and I knock on the door and she opens the door and she's crying again. And I'm like, what on earth? You know, like, what's

going on? And I can hear voices in her bedroom. And some of the women and their spouses I had sent were in her bedroom, setting up a crib, because she didn't even have a crib. And she is just, at this time, the tears are of just being overwhelmed. And she said to me, and I'll never forget these words, she said, Leanne, I thought God had forsaken, forgot him me. And I thought he had turned his back on me. And I said, sweet one, God has heard your cry. And he has sent the Prestonwood Pregnancy Center. And, you know, just, I could go on. I could tell you about her baptism and just her part of being a part of my. So did she have a religious background at all?

Did she know about Christianity having been a refugee? She had some understanding. We took her to church. My husband that day said to her, it was a Saturday. You know, how about we come pick you up and we take you to church the next day? And that she had said, I had given up all hope was what she kept saying. And so, oh, now you gave me a little bit. This still gets me.

God and how he works. But so we had picked her up the next day and taken her to church with us. And we show up and she's like already. She's like nine months pregnant, cute bow in her hair. She's like ready for us to take her to church. And the sermon that Sunday was a pastor named Jared Stevens. And he was preaching that Sunday morning. And the sermon he was preaching on was how you never.

give up hope that God hears our cry and that she walked forward that day at church and um you know I tell people all the time that we were going to do a shower for her we decide we were going to put out the call to the church and say hey we have this young woman she needs everything um she has chosen life and we need to stand in the gap for her I would have thought that would have been the thing she was most excited about, but she was most excited about being baptized that next weekend, nine months pregnant. She was baptized. So she still hadn't had the baby yet.

Wow. The following Thursday, I was with her in the hospital when she gave birth. She had to have an emergency C-section, and she labored for about 24 hours. She was a toll champ. Yeah. And when they came out, it was about 1 o'clock in the morning, and they came out with her baby, and they were pushing her little one out of in the bass net and I was waiting and they're like Leanne Jameson, Leanne Jameson.

And I'm like, oh, that's me. And they're like, here's your baby. Meaning like, I'm like, oh, that's not my baby. But thank you. I got to hold her. And God knew. God knew when he put her into false labor. Obviously strong enough for her to feel like she had to go to the hospital that she was

going to call you. and that she was going to go home, that you are going to show up with the car seat, and that you were going to see her apartment and that she needed things, and that people were going to show up at her apartment, and that that was also going to be the opportunity for her to go to church and get baptized all before she had the baby. That's incredible. Pro love and action.

And can I just say, when I say to you, I was pro life and word and now pro love and action, It is a gift of the Lord that I have been able to walk this out and to get to witness him move in a mighty way in our client's lives. But it is holistic care. And so I get a little defensive in a holy way, I think, when people criticize pregnancy centers. Because we're the ones who are willing to call it. the warriors of God's people and say, this is the need. Yeah. Like, here's where we need to go.

And holistically and completely with Christ's love surrounding that woman and helping her through sometimes what's the darkest days of her life. Hey, this is Steve Deast. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this Steve Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. And it probably goes without saying, I mean, for us, maybe not for everyone listening or watching, that Planned Parenthood doesn't give that kind of care. I mean, I know we can't say necessarily for sure, but I do wonder if that abuse victim had walked into Planned Parenthood and said, here's what I need. Obviously, she would have been told, well, you should get an abortion.

That's going to be the easiest thing. But I do wonder, would there have been any follow-up at all, that refugee woman, if she had been able to scrap together. some money to get an abortion. Would she have gotten any help with any physical, certainly not spiritual needs? I mean, people like Elizabeth Warren, she talks about Planned Parenthood or, you know, name any Democrat politician. It really is kind of that black and white. I mean, they talk about Planned Parenthood as if it's this hub for women's safety and health

care and betterment and empowerment. And then like Elizabeth Warren talks about places like Preston Wood pregnancy. Center as Centers for Manipulation. Iona Presley, she is another politician that we talked about recently, that she just went on a rant in some committee hearing talking about how basically pregnancy centers coerced women into having their babies. They don't actually provide anything. You guys, Preston and Pregnancy Center had a whole hit piece written about you.

Yes, we did. And Time Magazine basically saying that, that you were lying to these women. manipulating these women. And what we hear all the time pro-lifers is that we're just pro-birth. We don't care about what happens to them after. But really, like, the opposite is true. Planned Parenthood can't even muster being pro-birth. They're actually just pro-abortion. And they don't care what happens to those women after they get their checks. So, I mean, talk about that a little bit. Just, I'm sure it's so frustrating for you to hear that propaganda. Well, it makes me mad. Actually, first off, when we it's in a lot of ways it's double speak in that we talk about or they talk about these poor women

that are being manipulated and being lied to and being coerced and yet then they use the word empowerment for women in the same same sort of breath and it frustrates me because I truly do believe in the empowerment of women. I truly believe that women are intelligent and capable, that they are able to make good decisions. We don't need to manipulate her. We don't need to lie to her. We, you know, often what we are, we're just a guide. We're a navigator. standing beside her saying, okay, I know this is traumatic. I know this is difficult. I know you don't want your life to change, but your life changed the moment you had a positive pregnancy test.

Now let's navigate what way does it change? And we ask questions. And you know what? We counsel the best through listening. and it's fascinating how often the clients that come to us feel like they've never truly been seen or they've never truly been heard. And we're just there. The idea that a, so it, to step back, to say that a woman is easily manipulated and therefore

needs to be protected from a pregnancy resource center who might just be laying out her options in front of her, it doesn't ring true with this whole idea that they're for women's empowerment. Either women need to be protected and aren't capable of making good, healthy decisions on their own or discerning or being able to come into a center like ours and know, okay, these are good people that really just want what's best for us. And also, quite honestly, you're getting me riled up. I'm not saying anything. You're just thinking through it. It's getting you. You're just thinking through and it's getting rowed up. This is my moment, Ellie.

I understand, though. I understand feeling riled up about it. But yeah. So, you know, just this idea that we would need to lie or that we don't, we just care about the unborn child is also very offensive to me. Because, you know, if you are a believer and if you understand the gospel, then you know, that that woman has as much value as her unborn child. The moment that she walks through our door,

I have as much concern and care for her as I do that child that has yet to be able to take its first breath outside the womb. And so, you know, we do, we aren't just pro-birth. Mm-hmm. Elizabeth Warren, her comments were what inspired my hysterical video that I did. People can go watch it if they want to. But I mean, she called these places dangerous. She said they're actually dangerous. People have compared them to terrorism, which is not laughable, but also, I mean, serious. It kind of is. Places of death. Yeah. I mean, come on. And obviously,

we saw the backlash after the Dobbs decision was released against pregnancy centers. One of them was that propaganda and Time magazine about Prestonwood Pregnancy Center lying about you. But we saw physical backlash. We saw the vandalisms, the pipe bombs and things like that. So tell me just what it is like being in the face of that kind of national disdain, too. I mean, there are many powers that be that are against you, maybe not against you personally, but certainly the idea of you, corporations, obviously the federal government, we've seen the DOJ kind of in a very partial way handle the attacks against pregnancy centers versus. pro-life activists and how they have been advocating for life outside of, you know,

plant-parent hazard abortion centers. And so, I mean, there's a lot stacked against pregnancy centers. And so tell me just what's that, what is that like and what has it been like over the past few months since Roe was overturned? I mean, I'm not going to lie. There have been, it's been hard at times. You know, I'm leading a staff and volunteers. and concerned about the safety and the well-being of those that come to us, whether through that side of staff and volunteer or client, you know, it's been an education in the fact that you can have a mic or a camera or a blog or even access to being a journalist and having the right to be able to

pin an article. and not truly tell the truth. That's been fascinating. You know, it easily could be a distraction at this point to what we're called to do or what the care that we're supposed to give. You know, I've had to very clearly be able to compartmentalize, okay, I've got to deal with the media and this accusation out there. you know, I think it's been interesting that in a lot of ways, pregnancy centers have become the target of this post-row existence that our nation is now in.

As if we are, have not, that we're new to the scene or that we're operating in a way that gives the, them fuel to this idea that abortion, it should be a right to, for every woman in our nation. And, you know, it's, I guess I would say pregnancy centers, although there's a political discussion that needs to take place on abortion and is taking place, you know, we are, we don't, We exist sort of separate from that. Either way. You know, like I was never, I wasn't called to be a politician. I believe there are people out there.

They are called to fight the political battle of abortion. And that's not us. We're purely here to deal with the emotional, the physical, the spiritual consequences of a woman finding herself in an unplanned pregnancy. You know, go, the politicians need to handle the politics and the lawyers need to handle the laws. And just let those of us that feel called to be boots on the ground deal with the women. We were there before. We're thereafter.

We're not going anywhere. The lies and the rhetoric using pregnancy centers as being the potential, you know, scapegoat for this anger that they have. over the road decision. It doesn't make sense to me. Yeah. And it's, you know, she wants to, it's so fascinating that the accusations against pregnancy centers, they don't hold true. Those same accusations for Planned Parenthood would totally hold true. Yeah. And yet they're being directed at us. It's not fascinating. As a believer, I believe if we're doing something right, there's always going to be attack. Yeah. And, you know, I go back to Nehemi. of building the wall.

And there was criticism and there was attack. And he, you know, he, he had a sword in one hand and a trial in the other. And so the sword for me is the word of God and the trial is, you know, the mission and the ministry of the center.

And so we are going to continue to do what we're doing. And, and you know, I jokingly said to my husband at one point when that news was going on about the DOJ and some of the direction, they were going to take with pregnancy centers, I'm like, I could end up in jail one day for doing what is right. Mm-hmm.

And that is okay. Yeah. You count the cost. Count the cost. You know, there's a lot of people who will say, even people who profess to be Christians, that they're not pro-abortion, but they are pro-choice. It's important for women to have the choice. And yet they won't support their local pregnancy center.

They will maybe support their local Planned Parenthood, but not their local pregnancy Center because they believe that Planned Parenthood is a center for choice. And really, as you said, the opposite is true. You walk into a Planned Parenthood. They are not evenly telling you about all of your options. Very often there's a lot of manipulation, sometimes coercion, but certainly a lot of deceit and cover up about the development of the child. They won't allow you to see your sonogram.

They don't want you to see the sonogram. They certainly won't suggest it. They won't tell you evenly about the option of keeping your child, raising that child, yourself. They won't allow you to see the full adoption options. They won't necessarily, they don't want to refer them to centers like you. So there's actually a lot of, a lot of darkness, a lot of manipulation, a lot of Lyme that goes on in Planned Parenthood to get someone to simply abort their child. If you are truly pro-choice, why would you be against showing a sonogram or her listening to the heartbeat.

Why would you be against her knowing all of her options? So have you ever had someone who calls themselves pro-choice volunteer at one of your centers? No, but only because we go through a really good vetting interview educational process. So I would say it's, you know, I've dealt with this quite. a bit because I moved from a role where I, you know, was involved in a large ministry of women and then moved into this role of running the pregnancy centers. And I think because of the relationship I had with so many of these women, they felt safe to come to me. So I did have some of those conversations. The conversations that say, I would never have an abortion. But I don't

know if I should be telling another woman what she should do. And, you know, or what about rape or what about incest? And all of the, you know, we, the things that we should be talking about because I think it will help solidify why we believe in the sanctity of all life. But we've had those conversations. And I will, I will first on one challenge. If you, whether, regardless of whether or not you would have an abortion or not, if you believe in someone else having the option to have an abortion that makes you pro-choice. Flat out, that is the definition of choice.

So these are women who would sometimes be calling themselves pro-life saying that they would be okay with the option for someone else but not for themselves. Right, that they themselves are pro-life. And yet they're kind of reiterating a pro-choice position. Yeah, that is pro-choice. You know, we are told in the Proverbs that we have to be a voice for the voiceless. So we need to be a voice for those being led to slaughter. And therefore, as believers, you know, we do need to stand firmly on the sanctity of all life. So, you know, we navigate that through those discussions, obviously.

through the interview process. Sometimes it's just an educational deal where it's like this is our stance, this is why we believe what we believe. And they actually get to see it through a loving viewpoint that they then will be like, you know, I think you're right. I think I am pro-life across the board.

Yeah. And there, you know, we have probably gone through every debate point, every discussion point, every disagreement point when it comes to pro-choice versus pro-life or some people like to say pro-abortion versus anti-abortion. So people can go back and listen to those episodes. But to just kind of summarize, I think what is really the pro-life position is that the worthiness of someone's life, the value of someone's life, someone's right to life is not negated or diminished at all by the circumstances surrounding their conceptions or the potential of hardship after their birth.

That's basically the pro-life position. And that's, part of it. And another part is that we believe that the woman is also, the mother is also made in the image of God and that she needs to be cared for as well. And obviously there's a lot of ethical questions or people have ethical questions and debates about, you know, at which point is the mother's life so at risk where abortion. And those are, you know, can be hard conversations. But at the end of the day, we believe that both of those lives are equal in worth and in value. And there are difficult decisions sometimes the doctors have to make before the baby is viable and things like that. And pro-lifers don't deny that, as you said. Those are discussions that we want to have

because our interest is to do whatever we can to preserve the lives and to help the lives of both the child and mother. But we want to preserve the lives of both the child and mother. And going back to something that you said at the beginning, we don't believe that a child should be discarded for the sake of inconvenience or even tribulation or anything like that. We just believe that people are worth more than that. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that the whole conversation around issues of rape and incest, you know, I know in our center and we saw around 24,000 client visits last year. So you can imagine that we see. And was that an increase? Because you live in a red state, kind of a blue area in a red state. Like was that an increase from before the overturning of

Roe v. Wade? Yeah. We. definitely saw an increase. August was our largest month after that we had ever had. That was immediately after the decision. January this year has been a yet even another record setting month. These are records. I wish we didn't need to or weren't setting obviously. But grateful that these women are coming to our center because we feel like we're the safe place for them to come. Yeah, so 24,000, you can imagine that we see lots of difficult situations from ectopic pregnancies to, you know, my nurses would tell you, they have saved lives through seeing and being able to tell there's an ectopic pregnancy and sent that woman immediately to the emergency room under consult with one of our medical doctors. We have a whole team of them. But this issue of rape and incest, first off, it's a very small percentage of the clients that we see.

And often a woman, when she finds herself at our center and she has, as an example, been raped, the discussion at that immediate point isn't about abortion. It's about her trauma. And, you know, I'm so grateful that we have professionals on staff, professional counselors that we can bring in to help or navigate that trauma. Immediately making a decision for abortion is just layering trauma upon trauma. It's not a healthy. It's not healthy. No one should be counseling a woman in the weeks after.

I mean, we're not seeing a woman immediately after rape. We're seeing her often, you know, four, six weeks after. Right, right. So often in our experience, she has not gotten any help. You know, she often, you know, the majority of rape is through someone that a woman has a relationship or knows, not necessarily a romantic relationship, but, you know, has had an acquaintance or so the reporting even is, it's not well reported. And so, you know, to be able to have trauma,

are licensed counselors are trained in trauma and be able to navigate that with her and get her the care that she needs. I just honestly believe we're unique in that we're able to do that for her. You know, there's a lot of women. I've heard this a lot,

especially after the overturning of Rovey Wade, and I'm actually talking about Christians with a lot of influence saying that well, there to be pro-life, basically, you have to be pro-choice until we start to do more work to, you know, meet the needs of women after they give birth. And until then, we have to keep the option of abortion on the table. And I'm not asking you to enter into a political discussion. There is a political discussion, obviously, to be had there.

Yes. But I wonder how many of those people who say that, well, what about welfare? What about education? What about all those things? I'm fine putting those on the table, by the way. I think we should be debating all those things, discussing all of those things. All of us believe that we want more than for them to just give birth. But I just wonder how many of those people saying that have gone to their local pregnancy center

because a lot of those people, they are chastising and finger wagging other evangelicals, typically Republican voters for voting for pro life but not doing enough. And I just wonder how many times have you gotten off of your couch and put your phone down and gone to your pro-life pregnancy center? Because chances are, and this is not in a spirit of shame, this is just the truth. Chances are there's probably a center that has been doing that work that you say needs to be done, maybe two miles from your house for the past 30 plus years. Now, maybe not. Maybe God is calling you to be the person to provide those needs. in every single state, there are pro-life pregnancy centers that have been doing this tireless work

very often without praise and very often with a lot of pushback for decades since and before the overturn, or not the overturning, but Roe v. Wade in the 1970s. And so before, before, I think, we chastise other Christians for not doing enough for vulnerable women. Why don't you engage and the work that's already been being done, maybe since before you were even born. That's my encouragement is that there's a lot of work already being done that we can get involved in. Yeah, I think if you think about it,

if every one of your listeners, if every person sitting in a pew on a Sunday, even like beyond even, let's say gave $10 to have local pregnancy center, what a force would a pregnancy, these centers across this nation could be what we could do. There's not a director that would sit in front of your listeners and say, listen, you don't know, like the dreams and the hopes and the ideas that we have to meet these growing needs, the potential is just there.

If people bought diapers, if people just supported their local centers, we could end abortion, without ever changing a law in this nation in a lot of ways through spiritual revival and the love a woman can find walking through the doors of a pregnancy center. I promise you. I promise you that most women that are seeking abortions don't really want to have an abortion. They just don't know what to do next. And pregnancy centers are the ones who are saying, here, let's just look at it. at the next step and we can help you and we can provide the things that you need until you get

your feet under you and it's not just pregnancy centers we're great networkers you know i think it's shocking and i had no idea you asked me earlier what is some of the things that i was really surprised by and i think the network of ministries out there that are providing this beautiful tapestry of care for those that find themselves in crisis in this nation, it's actually incredible. And I think pregnancy centers also do a really good job of networking and being able to tag, okay, I've got this. But there are ministries out there providing housing and food assistance and job assistance.

And sometimes they all come to places like our family resource center and provide an on our in our building. And we, you know, I think we're, we've got to get better at that. You know, I think if we've got to do a better job of coming and forecasting and looking

ahead. The other criticism and you alluded to this of like, you know, what about this and what about that? You know, we hear that all the time in this movement. Okay. So you're doing,

you know, you've convinced her to have this baby. But what about Bill in the blank? But we also know that we're in a rapidly changing culture. I mean, you know, up until a few years ago, we weren't thinking about schools being shut down for a pandemic. And what would your average hourly wage couple that have children, they're now at home? How are they going to cope?

And, you know, it's provided that the culture is constantly changing and providing new what-ifs and what-abouts. And so I think that's a unique position for us is that we do pivot and we do look at those needs. And we do try to figure out, okay, this is new, this is upcoming. You know, as an example, offering help providing for pregnancy Medicaid. That can happen. We help our clients on site navigate that. That's something new that we've done in the last few years is it became obvious.

that we had clients that needed some assistance in understanding what are some of the programs out there that can help them. Yeah. And I just want to encourage people because on this show, we have to talk about a lot of bad things that are happening, a lot of frustrating things. We've talked about some of them today, just that the powers that be are so ardently pro-death and pro-abortion. And there's just so much sadness in that, that alone can make me cry. When I think about some of the laws that have been passed over the past few years that just completely ignore the dignity of unborn children. Now, even some professing Christians are just very deceived when it comes to this subject. But what I like to remind people is that God's work doesn't always make headlines. That story

that she told of that refugee who had Christians rush into her home just to make sure that she and her baby were cared for and that she felt love. And then she came to Christ because of that love and was baptized and all of that, that's not going to trend on Twitter. That's not going to be written about by Time magazine. And so sometimes we can be so flooded with the bad. It's important to talk about that, of course, and to understand how we as Christians can bring clarity to the chaos. So we have to talk about the chaos. But just remember that God's people everywhere, every day, every moment, are doing unseen and unsung acts of radical love that are changing. And they're changing. And we're changing people's lives through the power of the Holy Spirit and changing communities for the

better. Maybe you'll never hear about it on social media. And I guarantee you'll never hear about it. Even on, you won't hear about all of them on this podcast because I have Leon on today, but she is one of hundreds, if not thousands of directors who are doing the same thing. So the stories that you tell me today, that's not just happening in your area. That's happening in every state, hopefully at least every major city. in the United States every day, overwhelmingly Christian, overwhelmingly pro-life, showing up in ways that the world says every day, we aren't showing up and isn't happening. And so we get to praise God for that, that no matter what happens in Washington, no matter what happens in our state capitals, all that matters.

I say politics matter because policy matters because people matter. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So that absolutely matters. But that does not dictate or change what the Christian is called to do on a daily basis. And I think sometimes people are like, am I doing enough? Am I doing enough? Am I like stewarding my resources enough? Am I doing the next big thing? What is God calling me to do? What is this dream that he's calling me to fulfill? Maybe it is some big public thing, but maybe it's just the next right thing. Like maybe it's just donating $10 to

your local pregnancy center. Maybe it's just showing up and saying, how can I help? Sorry that I haven't so far, you know? I mean, that's true for all of us. And I'm not just saying people out there. That's true for me. Yeah. That's true for everyone. And wow, to be a part of the body of Christ and seemingly small ways. I mean, that's bigger than any of us could imagine. That is like more glory and more goodness than any of us could even dream of being a part of without the Holy Spirit. It's, it is the greatest opportunity I have ever been given to be able to watch God work.

you know, pregnancy centers are holy ground. And, and it's incredible what happens there at every day. You know, I'm pretty sure that most pregnancy centers would welcome a phone call and a request of, hey, I just want to come see what you're doing. I just want to come, you know, support you through just a word of encouragement or a prayer. Can you just show me around, you know, demystify. local pregnancy center and become an advocate for what they're doing. You know, this much I know, crowdsourcing works and that your voices matter and that you tell saying to people, you know what? What Elizabeth Warren is saying about pregnancy centers, it's not true.

Yeah. And, you know, that, that alone, it doesn't matter what Time magazine writes or the next news article that's coming out about us, what it says, like, go see us and see the truth. And then, you know, and then tell your neighbors and like, hey, listen, they're just loving on people. Yeah. There's no agenda other than to just love someone who is finding themselves in that difficult situation.

I just want to help. Yeah. Like, I'm guilty of wanting to help. Okay. Finally. There's a lot of people who are listening to this, watching this. They might not have even made the connection, but maybe they bought a onesie or a pack of diapers or maybe even a crib through the Amazon Baby Registry that I've posted a couple times for Prestonwood Pregnancy Center. Can you just tell them what impact their generosity has made on the women who have come through your center?

Oh, Ali Bath. First off, I want to tell you that when your people moved and they bought truckloads of items, for us to give away this sweet Amazon driver. When he had this Amazon truck, he'd come with his second load of the day. And he was just baffled. He was like, what is going on? I keep having to drop whole truckloads of items.

And we were able to share, do you know that one of our male client advocates shared Jesus with him in the parking lot? And he came to Christ, the Amazon driver. The Amazon driver. none of you out there that gave to our pregnancy center thought that the Amazon driver or driver was going to be the first one to come to Christ. When we give a crib, well, it's not the crib.

It's not the onesie. It's a tangible love of Jesus that we're handing that, hey, someone that doesn't even know you cares enough about you that they gave diapers to us or they gave. we have a family resource center with a baby boutique now where it is stunningly beautiful it's so beautiful i've been it's beautiful yes and we our clients get to come shop for free and they'll often walk in just wide-eyed and you know the whole thing is so beautiful and so dignified and it really is to say to them like you matter and we care about you we want to give you this experience and it causes is an anticipation of this child that is about to come into their lives. And then they can keep

coming back and it's beautiful. And you have provided for that center. Thousands and thousands of families over the last year have been touched by your listeners' generosity. They may think they're just buying a pack of diapers, but they are being the hands and feet of Jesus through the sitting just purely added computer and swiping by. Yeah. It matters. There's a lot of that in our current technological landscape. There are a lot of things we can criticize, but man, the amplification that goes from

social media and the ease and convenience that comes from things like Amazon makes it really easy to better people's lives. There's a lot of bad, but gosh, God can use seemingly exclusively bad things for good. for the good of other people and for his glory. So we're going to do another link to a baby registry in the description of this episode. So you can click on that. Again, just a pack of diapers, bibs, whatever it is that you can do. Some people, you've got enough to buy a crib or to buy a car seat. You just heard how that can really change someone's life. And so please, if you can donate, or you can contribute toward a gift. If you're like, hey, I can only afford $10 to $20,

those cribs or those larger items that are often $300, you can contribute $10 towards that. That makes a big difference. So thank you guys. Also, y'all are so generous. This audience is so generous. You care so much about vulnerable moms and vulnerable families. I know that as I was crying, all of you washing your dishes, going on a stroll, driving your car, you're doing, you were doing that through tears too because you care so much about

these vulnerable women. So don't only go to the Amazon registry that we will link. but also go to your local pregnancy center. If you have it, just see how you can help. And like Leanne said, see if you can just pray for them. If that's what you can do right now in the season of life, I promise you. I promise you. Directors, like Leanne, they covet your prayers and they can't take enough of them.

So thank you so much, Leanne, for what you do. Is there anything you want to close this on? Just any encouragement for pro-lifers out there. Honestly, I want to thank you, Ellie Beth, for being a voice. and for standing in an area of this ministry or for the sanctity of life, you know, and just your support of pregnancy centers, you are a blessing and your listeners. You know, pray, serve, give your local pregnancy center. We can do this.

Yes, yes. All right. Thank you so much, Leanne, for taking the time. And thanks for what you do. and I'll continue to just support y'all and pray for you. So thanks so much. Thanks, Ellie, Beth. Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself.

On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort. We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this T-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us.