Retronauts - Retronauts Episode 214: The Many Voices of Sonic the Hedgehog

Episode Date: April 19, 2019

With the Sonic the Hedgehog live-action movie just around the corner, there's never been a better time to look back on all the actors who once brought life to Sega's little blue speed rat. Though improv master Ben Schwartz will play Sonic in the sure-to-be-great film, he's just the latest in a long line of actors—in both America and Japan—who convinced all of us that a hedgehog could speak. On this episode of Retronauts, join Bob Mackey and Henry Gilbert as they trace the surprisingly deep history of Sonic thespians. Plus: Larry King in the role he was born to play!

Hello, folks, welcome to this one, Bob Mackie, and today's topic is the many voices of Sonic the Headshot. Before I talk about Sonic and his golden throats, who is here with me today? Henry Gilbert, and a fair chili dog to you all. Chili dogs are on the menu today because we're talking about Sonic the Hedgehog. And if you go back, we've done a similar thing previously with episode 173. We did an entire episode about the many voices of Mario. And we traced the history of Mario's many different voices leading up to, of course, Charles Martinet, taken over about 25 years ago.

Yeah, and he's been pretty much it ever since I'm still. still waiting to see you know they haven't said who's going to play them in the imagination film of uh mario well you just have to wait and see i would think they're going to cast somebody like uh well not t j miller but uh in that range of yeah level comedy goofer i was thinking like who is in every animated movie like which voice set rogan no set rogan is mario yeah okay or zach alfenakis yeah yeah so go back to that episode we're going to be doing a similar thing, although there are far less voices and there are far less variants on the same

voice. So I'm already telling you up front, this is going to be real boring. No, no, I'm kidding, of course. It's interesting that in both Japanese and English, everyone is kind of doing the same voice where with the Mario voice, they had very different interpretations like, is he like a normal guy? Is he a gruff guy? Is he a

gruff guy? Is he a Brooklyn guy? Is he Mickey Mouse? Who knows? But with Sonic, they all had an idea in their head, oh, cool character because Sonic was made for us, people who were nine in 1991. He was engineered to be the coolest character ever. People 10 years younger than is,

who think that like Sonic Adventure, Sonic is made for them. Like, no, that's when they took away our Sonic and made it for you. They made him extra pointy or curvy or whatever the hell's going on. Thinner and pointier, yes. Yeah, thinner and pointier. But of course, the Sonic the Hedgehog movie is coming out, I believe, in November

of this year. It's going to be bad. It was never going to be good. I have to say the character design for him is like a new standard for awful just like let's make no one happy you know those are leaks it could be different i don't think those leaks were ever uh confirmed as non leaks i am 100% sure that's what he looks like or at least looks like now and they might do some last minute changes perhaps i mean he's he's he's a cg thing you can change it up to a certain point yeah but uh ben schwartz i like

him he'll be playing schwanik benny schwaas with mr solo bolo himself he's uh he's a very funny guy and the exact type of dude you get to be the funny voice of a thing in the movie like, hey man, he can play the cool dude Sonic who is a quip a minute and he's just, he also has a very hyper energy to him and on the show

Parks and Recreation, the character he played had a very like speedy energy to him and also he had slicked up his hair in a way that's not unlike Sonic the Hedgehog. That's very true. He was the human Sonic on that show. But yeah, I mean, I've heard many bad things about the movie in terms of pre-production. Many, many writers went through the many

writer mill uh i believe the podcast doughboys one of their pals was writing the movie and that was like six drafts ago yes yeah i remember like three years ago they're like he's writing the sonic movie let's talk about the sonic movie it's just like that was so many years ago and now there are like six credited writers always a good sign for a movie there were so many great gags on there of nick wiger asking his friend like uh so will cream the rabbit be in here and he would just say i can't confirm anything stop asking me about this so i want to get into the many voices of Sonic the Hedgehog and there aren't nearly as many as there are Mario voices, but they're all very interesting. But again, they're all going for the same thing.

So I want to start with his very first voice, which actually happened in 1991. And through research, I found that he was first voice in a arcade game called Waku Waku-Waku Sonic Patrol car. It was a kiddie arcade game where you got inside of a car and Sonic is a cop. Wow, that's, so the Waku-Waku is a sound effect. It is part of the line. I believe there's a line of Waku Waku Arcade Machines. It sounds like a manga

Anamonapia, I would see, you know, Wakuwaku, but I, but wow, an arcade machine where you're in a cop car. I knew that it feels like a proto-sonic drift almost, but... It's not a cart racing game.

It's a very slow-paced game for child. For child? For children. This preceded carts by like two years, like Super Mario Kart by two years. That's really weird that the, amusement division of Sega would throw Sonic

into that of all things in his first arcade game. So in that game, he is voiced by Takeshi Kusau and he voiced Sonic in the first three voice Sonic appearances. So he voiced Sonic in Waku Waku Waku Sonic Patrol car, 1991.

Sega Sonic Cosmo Fighter Galaxy Patrol, another kiddie arcade game where you climb into a thing and it's a very easy kitty game. And also Sega Sonic the Hedgehog, the 1993 arcade game that did not make it to the States. Are you aware of this at all, Henry? It's fairly interesting. It's a game you play with a track ball as a trackball and one button, and that's where Ray the Squirrel comes from. Wow, no, I had no clue of this game.

I know that. And like Sonic 3D Blast, it is an isometric game, so you know it's good. Yuck, yeah. Look, I'm American. We don't have caught into that isometric stuff around here. We didn't come to this country to play isometric games, people. But I have a small clip from the patrol car game. You can hear this actually. doing Sonic one of three times in his life. He talks a lot for a 1999. Yeah, my name's Sonic the Hitchell. That's about as much Japanese as I understand.

Yeah, but ORE is his pronoun of choice. He's a boy, man. He's a man. Boku no Sonic, eh? Boy, we're really showing off how little we know I know like 50 words in Japanese You're saying they're going to go on patrol I think I could fear that

But that's just a very like Down the Middle type of portrayal Just like this is anime hero voice Yeah Like a boyish, like a teen hero And I'll tell you what So Takeshi Casau also voiced So he started in 1988

Vicing things for anime His debut role was in Akira Playing Kaiske And Kaiske is the guy with a tie in kind of as gang. He's just made up for the movie, too. He is? Well, he's kind of an amalgamation character.

I didn't have time to read 2,000 pages of manga when we did our Akira thing for what a cartoon. You really slacked on that one, Bob. I only have so much time. No, you worked very hard on that podcast. So he's the perfect voice for Sonic because he would, I believe, a few years later, or maybe, I forget when he debuted in the anime, but he is also the voice of Trunks. Oh, that's perfect. Dragon Ball. So when was Trunks in the Dragon Ball anime?

Well, the comic would have been like 91. So I think the anime would be 92, I think. So I did a small bit of research. Trunks did appear in the anime for the first time in 1991. So at the same time, this guy was cast as Sonic, which makes sense because also, so Sonic is the ultimate, like, 90s, a fun teen hero character, but also Trunks is too. Like, Trunks definitely feels like, okay, Goku was the 80s. Trunks is the new cool 90s dude with a cool bull haircut, cool jacket, all that stuff.

Like, he does feel... Too many accessories, like his sword, too, which is completely useless after... They gave him a sword for his first appearance, and then he would never use it again. To what? Like, he'll freeze it instantly? Slice him up, yeah. Cool scene, though. Really cool scene.

Yeah, no, I think Trunks is super cool, but, yeah, also his... I love his half jacket. It's a neat look, too, like how it's... The sleeves are normal lengths, but it goes up to his ribs. But, yeah, I'd say he's the sonic of Dragon Ball. Yeah, he's like the Sonic of, like, Shonen-fighting anime at that time. But, yeah, he still voice acts, and he's also, for many movies, the Japanese dub voice for Leonardo DiCaprio.

Oh, okay. And Leonardo DiCaprio is like the real version of Trunks. Yes. He had the same haircut for a long time. That's true. Actually, yeah, he ripped off Trunks' haircut for Titanic. That's a fine, normal voice. Like, it's not very creative casting with Sonic, but it's just, you know, a good voice actor in different animated programs,

and you get him to play a normal guy. Who's not, you know, you got to, I guess also if they're making this game for babies, they got to pitch it right down the middle, too. Yeah, and also who's going to be actually hearing these samples very loudly, low quality samples at that. So, like, ultimately, who cares? At least got a voice actor, like a known voice actor to do it. When a video game talked in 1991, I don't care how it sounded, I was impressed. I thought nothing would ever be cooler than the hearing voices in, like, the Ninja Turtles arcade game. And then when I grew up and heard them again, I was like, oh, that sounds like shit.

So the next voice on our list is Jaliel White. Here we go. So he might have voiced the most Sonic if he kind of like all the hours added up. So he voiced Sonic for the Cartoon Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog, the cartoon Sonic the Hedgehog, both 1993 creations. One was dramatic and serious, not really. The other one was like Ren and Snippy-ish in a way, also not very good. Yeah, no, they were both not good. Sonic AM for the listeners who are, man, I'm disditing Sonic AM.

Sonic AM's fine. It's fine. It's better than any American animation that Mario's ever been in. I'll give it that. I could do with the French character. But Sonic, I am so afraid of everything because I am French. Yes, yeah. So I did have more attachment to it because I was reading the Archie Sonic comics at the time the show debuted.

And so it had a lot of those folks in it, including Sally Acorn. And, yeah, I like that show a little more. I mean, definitely every time I didn't see Adventures of Sonic until, like, Thanksgiving of 93, because it was just always at a time when I was not at home and couldn't watch TV. So until a big break, was I able to watch it on television. It was like immediately after school for me like 4.3.30, but I did see all of it and all of Sonic Saturday morning. And Jaliel White also played Sonic in. Sonic Underground, the 1999 series, that ran for 40 episodes.

And just like Donkey Kong Country, that CGI cartoon, it is a French production that has a lot of songs in it. What is up with that? The French, I guess they feel that the French, they feel that kids need to have songs to keep their attention in a show. I guess so. But, yeah, so Jaliel White, the first American voice of Sonic, very important. But also, for us, people born in the early 80s, he was Stephen Urkel. And Steve and Sonic were both at the height of their popularity in 1993. You could do no wrong if you were either character.

I mean, I thought of that as like amazing superstar casting at the time because nobody, I didn't know the names of voice actors and cartoons then. It was very rarely star power, like say in the MC Hammer Show, he didn't, oh, no, wait, in the Michael Jordan All-Stars show? Like he didn't voice himself. I think they were pro-stars, Henry, not All-Stars. That sounds like a trademark phrase. It really does. That's why I wanted to bring that up. But yeah, but they didn't play themselves.

So they, you know, shows wouldn't spend, animated series wouldn't spend the kind of money on a name person. So for Sonic to get Jaliel White, who was a big deal still in 1993, that was worth advertising. It felt like a bigger deal. It was done casting because obviously, I mean, obviously to us,

Urkel was the least cool character, but still the reason you watch Family Matters, and Sonic is the most cool character, so casting him with the voice of Erkel, basically, was an interesting choice, and I think it worked well. And my reflection back on Erkel now was that Erkel was a very easy target

for other TV shows, like Steve Erkel is annoying, the show is bad, but I will say, my new perspective on Erkel is that for little white kids like me, I think it was somewhat important to have a black character

that fell into an unexpected role. Like, there weren't black nerds on TV when I was a kid. Like, this is the first time I was just like, oh, there are black nerds. I didn't know. I didn't know. It was informative to us in middle America or in the South. Yeah, no, it, yeah, he was eye-opening in that way.

And it got, you know, it was a crossover star that got a lot more people to watch in African-American-led sitcom that they never would have. And also, it's like, you know what? Yes, the show is garbage. But it is garbage in such an entertaining way. More so than full... I'd watch an episode of that before Full House or an old episode of Perfect Strangers or hanging with Mr. Cooper.

Or say it by the Bell. Yeah. Yeah. But all the TGIF shows, I think it's the best of the TGIF shows Family Matters. Also because, like, it started... Full House tried to have very special episodes. Family Matters actually had an episode

about racial profiling by the police. That's right. Or about racism or about unemployment. Like, they had real things. And then eventually it was about evil puppets. pirate ships and tricking yourself and building robots and turning into Bruce Lee. I mean, every, well, yeah, and Jaliel showing off how Buffy is, as in his contract, the key and Peele sketch about the power miracle is, I think sums it up pretty well. It really does.

But let's hear Jalil as Sonic lecturing children about a very important issue. There are many of these, by the way. Believe it or not, every year, some ignorant kid takes a ride in a clothes dryer just like this one and ends up getting. hurting hurt. It gets pretty hot in there. And those dryer fins can break your bones when they get going. If you think it's smart to climb in a dryer, you're really all wet. Wow, Sonic, you're such a bit. Like, Sonic is so judgment. Like, Sonic is so judgmental. If you think this is a good idea, you're stupid. Boy, I, you know, that's a good, in a way, that's a good public service thing. But I, as a child, I would have never thought to get in a dryer until Sonic told me I shouldn't do

that. I was like, wait, kids can do that. Getting my bones crushed sounds pretty cool. Yeah, I know. I don't, I wouldn't. I never got in a dryer as a kid. But these, I mean, these were all government mandated garbage to put like good values in your show. It's educational. See, there's the 30 minute moral at the end.

Like, just like Sailor Moon says, there was Sonic says. Yeah, these He-Man commercials have to have a thing at the end. They're like, this toy commercial of G.I. Joe has to tell you to how to stop bleeding of a bloody nose, you know? it's uh and but hey it's fun to hear jaleel white of all people do it so i i had a curious thing about joliel and other sonics but him especially he is the most nasal sonic they ever had and i mean he's he has kind of a high voice but he's pitching he's panting and out like i'm sonic the hedgehog yeah i wondered if he always did it they did it extra nasal because sonic has such a long nose maybe but i think also just like he is Urkel or Urkel's the most nasal so it's like he's at 50% Urkel doing Sonic

Yeah he's at half Urkel I guess what you're paying all this money for Urkel you want people to hear the Urkel in there I mean up front they're not like starring Joliel White he's just in the credits for both shows so it's like when you listen to the show you want to be like oh is that that is that Urkel doing Sonic's voice I think I'll watch I love Urkel yeah well sonic is like he's the opposite of Urkel he's the coolest fastest guy around not a dork with hiked up pants who can't take no for an And Joyce cheese. Yeah, I guess we forget that aspect of Urquil, the creepy aspect. I'm wearing you down.

And then he eventually did, so it's a moral of all you young men out there. Yeah, but I, Jaliel's portrayal of him, he was okay. He was definitely better. I liked it better than in adventures, they played tales like he was four. Yeah. It's just so much of a baby. He's way, he's way better on A.M., I think. But in Sonic Underground, which I was far too old for, and it's sold with a lot of music,

Jaliel White played Sonic. Manick and Sonia So there are three different Jalil White voices here I'll play a clip I don't know how anyone could deal with this and watch this

But Maurice Lamarsh One of our favorite voice actors Is all over this cartoon Yeah he's doing a ton of voices But here is a brief clip Of Sonic Underground if you have not heard it This is Jalil White Not only doing Sonic but two other Sonics

Wow You guys really stood up for me Well you've saved me more than once And besides You are my brother You're not gonna kiss me are you No way but you are kind of cute

Hey We're gonna let these cool instruments go to waste And they play a dumb song Oh I wouldn't even do an imitation of Sonia But boy oh boy that's like Urkel Like it's just Urkel Yeah it's like there's a plot where he has to go like Dress as a woman for something

Or like I There has to be like an episode Where Erkel's like identical cousin comes to town And it's Steve it's Steve Urkel in drag or basically There's got to be some sort of female Urkel And Family Matters There's definitely they have to hit Well they have to hit every

fetish of the internet for Urkel so that one too yeah no that was girl that was girl Urkel right there I can't god yeah I didn't watch one second of undergrad I think I maybe saw the opening and when I saw it was like Sonic with made up cousins

yeah alternate reality robotnik is still there but they live in like a post apocalyptic war torn world where music will save the day or something as like this looks like shit it just looked like shit to me and it's actually the best animated of the three American cartoons Oh, okay. But it's still not very good.

Yeah, that's a low bar to anything's better animated than Adventures of Sonic. Like that's, I need to buy a great gift that you can get cheaply are cells from Adventures of Sonic because they apparently just got looted from wherever they were made and you can get them for like $10 a piece, like with a background sometimes. And they're so great of like one 24th of a second of Sonic as a cell looks. like shit it's so funny this is sonic he was drawn by nobody he is worth nothing uh yeah yeah this that sonic underground thing reminded me too of uh you and i's buddy in jose courtie he talked about how much he he he's inspired by sonic in so much the animation he did and about how like he loved the idea that his show okay ko would have different realities that neither was you know out did the other and that's he was inspired by how sonic a.m. and adventures of Sonic existed at the same

time. And out with these side characters too in underground. It reminds me of some okay. K.O gags as well. It's, uh, it's funny now. But man, Jalil, he's just too, it's too nasal. I can't stand listening to it. I can't take Sonia. But I mean, it is weird in my, from my perspective, it is weird that, uh, Sega went with a different unknown voice actor for the games to follow. Yeah. Like, Jaliel White was the estate. established American voice of Sonic. And I think it was just Sega of Japan saying, you know, we don't care. Well, yeah.

The sake of America could have been like, we'll get Jalil White. It's like, can you get like a nobody that costs nothing? Yeah, that's, I bet you're 100% right about that. From the, you know, the accounts we've all read about Sega in the 90s, Sega of America had a lot of power until about 96 or 97. And then once they're out of power, Japan's making the calls. And Japan doesn't know who Erkel is. I don't know, maybe they did.

But I doubt they valued Erkel all that much at that point. That culture disrespects Erkel. But Henry, so there's a Sonic the Hedgehog movie coming out this year. Did you know that there was one in 1996? Yes, I owned the VHS of it. I couldn't stump you with that one. But, yeah, Sonic the Hedgehog the movie, which is not... It's a lie.

It's a lie up front. So, yeah, 1996, this was released by 80 Vision in America in 1999 in one volume. So in Japan, you had to buy two. Probably like $80 VHS tapes for this. It soak you for every buck you can on OVA. But it is not very good. I will say I was watching a lot of clips on YouTube. Both versions are on YouTube, both the Japanese dub and the English dub.

They're both there. It will never be licensed again. Just watch it. And it's like it's not a good story or anything like that, but it is still like OVA animation for 1996. In case you're wondering what that means, back when the anime market was very much a bigger thing, you could release special projects on video.

that would cost a lot of money, but it would be very, a very high budget production, and people would buy it. They were seen as premium original video animation, and you, sometimes there were series that were only that. Sometimes they were spin-offs of series that were popular, like, you know, Dragon Ball Z got some OVAs, and they would, the appeal was that they were more expensive, in some cases, they'd have more nudity because they weren't on broadcast television, and they were just overall more fan servicey

so you were getting a lot for your buck on those but the market for the reason probably partially it didn't come out here for so long is because like it's not worth the same in America they can't charge the same so licensing fees are all wrong I mean

yes the animation is good but my gold standard was the Sonic CD anime and it's not as good as that no no but it's still as fat chubby Sonic around Sonic I love a rank. I like him.

And his English voice was Martin Burke, who, believe it or not, lived in Texas by 80Vision productions and basically did some dub acting for like five years and fell off the face of the earth. If you're not an old anime fan, 80Vision was based in Texas and mainly hired from the Texas community theater scene who were good actors. I'm not saying they were untalented, but they were all based in Texas and non-union and cheap. So here's a clip of Martin Burke as Sonic, his one performance as Sonic. Kail's, do you actually trust that ridiculous little gadget that Robotnik built for you? He's not exactly trustworthy. He could have put a bomb for us in there. But Dr. Robotic is the only person who knows where Robitropolis is this,

so we have to use his navigator and hope it works. I guess so. Gee, I hope the president and Sarah are doing all right. There you have it. That's a taste of the plot. I mean, I think Sonic Adventure, Sonic Adventure 2 features the presidents. Yeah. was like, hey, Thales, well, that's that. It's not very good.

No, no, not at all good. I, yeah, actually, I completely forgot that was the plot. It, uh, it didn't like a dress for pot, Nick. I'm sorry. It's, uh, no, I think, I think this is the kind of plot that Sega of Japan wanted Sonic games to have. So I don't think it's a coincidence that later Sonic Games had him saving the president and more human characters. I mean, Sega of Japan, Sonic always were trying to put him with a human woman. Nobody, no, who wants that other than them?

No fan wanted that. And that's, it's not exactly a human woman in it, but no, it is. He kind of has a girlfriend who's human. Yeah, and there's like some bizarre owl character in the, you know, and knuckles has a cowboy hat. Doesn't make sense. Yeah, it's weird. It's very confusing.

I mean, the music in it's nice. I do like that. I think there's a different soundtrack in the American version. So here's a clip of the Japanese, uh, version of that same scene. If you're old like us, that's who he is. Back when hearum, things were more innocent. They were pure.

You could have your spicy girl, your gentle girl, and the child. Hey, there were also like space cops, too. True, true. Eventually. Eventually. But, no, yeah, that play, actually hearing the Japanese version, they played it kind of close to what they were hearing in the Japanese performance in English. Yeah, yeah. Definitely, I mean, Tails is a baby there like that.

seems to be what Japan wanted to with Tales. Sorry, I'm actually more of a Miles fan than I am a Sonic fan, but... You call him Miles. That's how we know. Actually, I don't. Well, I normally don't, but I was trying to shake things up there. Oh, God, there. The passive aggressiveness of them being so mad, he's not Miles Prower everywhere. But anyway, yeah, I compared to the Wakuwaku version of Sonic, that has a little more character to it. He's like kind feels like he's throwing out more slang and sounds like a cool guy, I think. Go ahead and

To beauntlet me I'm trying to be Backet Outside Go outside Go ahead Go outside To make

Nobody one one one one one to make make set outside outside To show

Go Go Go Fast Go Go fast Go fast To go fast To fast too fast

faster faster faster faster Moving at speed of sound A track We can't hedgehog around Got ourselves in a situation stuck in a new location Without any explanation No type of relaxation

Don't Don't drink Don't think Go go go go go go go Go go go go go go So our next voice actor Would be the voice actor of Sonic For the past 20 years in Japan

And that's Junichi Kanemaru He was a voice actor from 1985 but they were all like very minor roles just like a character here a character there no major characters but i want to say sonic is his breakout role he is just he is just sonic now so he is the official japanese voice of sonic and uh yeah they kept him from 1999 on onwards so i'm kind of shocked at that i would have figured he would have uh gotten one other big role in some some named anime just because like anime when i when i look at the credits on imdb for any big name Seiru

like they have done 800 shows and they're a voice on every show like even I was like oh my favorite actor from Maisanakoku they probably weren't in Dragon Ball it's like nah they played one guy in Dragon Ball or they always have like one role in a major thing like that I have a minor

Japanese lesson for you Henry Sayru is a dragon and Sayu is a voice actor He is my favorite dragon I wanted to make sure we're doing this right Say you because I can see the the corrections rolling in as we talk. Pardon me.

But he could be a dragon so much. He could be a dragon. How do we not know this? But yeah, let's hear a clip of him from Sonic Adventure and he's been doing it in every Sonic thing across all media in Japan for 20 years now, or 21 years rather. Sonic Adventure was a 98 game in Japan. Good Lord, yeah. Hello everybody! My name is Sonic. Sonic's the Hedgehog, da. To any of greek just to be able to be. So that's Sonic's voice. That's just a bunch of clips from Sonic Adventure.

Just like every sound file like next to each other in Sonic Adventure. Yeah, that's not bad. That's good. He's, he has energy. He has, he's ready to tell you about how cool he is. That feels like a slim down, more excited, Sonic. Sure. So yes, that is where the story of Sonic's voice in Japan ends. the America Sonic still has three more voices to go through and we'll go through them now so the first one I like the Sega of Japan

at least stuck to the same guy the other time like it's I am in I normally with major mascots like Sonic I agree with the Disney way I was thinking of like it's a job for life

so the first English voice for Sonic in a video game the first time he was voiced in a game was by Ryan Drummond who would voice him from Sonic Adventure to Sonic Advance 3

so 1999 to 2004 it would be Ryan Drummond. And if you played Sonic Adventure, you know the voice, but here it is again in case you need a reminder. Sound test. You get to listen to cool sounds. Is your memory card set correctly? Hey, you don't have enough memory in the memory card. Oh, no.

I've had enough. All right, put him up. Oh, no. Come on, Tails. Hey. So everything is just like, it's up here, I'm cool guy. I'm cool. Memory cards are cool. Do you want to hear the sound test? Yeah, so basically everybody is doing an impression of Ryan

Drummond, post Ryan Drummond. Yeah. It's all the same. Like, even, like, there's more nuance to the final Sonic voice actor's performance, but it all starts here. This is not, nothing like Jaliel White's interpretation of Sonic. This is the model for which American Sonic's voice would be modeled after. Yeah. From here, from here on. So Ryan Drummond, this actor created that. That is a very major change from Jaliel White. That is for darn sure. And, wow, when Underground came out, like, that's not too long before 99. I think it was the fall of 99 it debuted. So like along with the Dreamcast, Sonic was being voiced by Juleleel White and Ryan Drummond.

That's some instant consistent stuff there, man. I mean, I think Jaliel, fine, stick with Jalil, it's more star power. But it should be the same in, it sounded like Sega of Japan didn't want to hire him for the video game. Also, I would bet the hourly rate for Jalil for the hours it takes to make a video game would be too out of the budget. I totally agree with you. But here's the thing, Sega of Japan agrees with you, Henry. So by the time Shadow the Hedgeraw came around, they're like, hey, wait a minute, Sonic has the same voice throughout all media in Japan. That should be the same thing for America.

And the most popular thing Sonic was doing in America at the time was the four kids adaptation of Sonic X, the anime by her favorite studio, TMS. You know, their quality standards by O3 had gone down a little bit. Yes. Yeah, they got in people don't know, TMS got bought by Sega. Well, Sega Sammy in, I think, 2000 or around that time. So it, once you, is Sega going to buy an animation company and not make them do a Sonic cartoon? No way. So the voice of Sonic and Sonic X was a four kids voice actor named Jason Griffith.

And if you are, I'd say if you're R-age or a bit younger, you know who four kids is. I'm sure they still do stuff, but they would do a lot of, I would say, unique localizations of things. But mainly Pokemon is what put them on the map. the kings of localization for American cartoons. Yeah, on our other podcast, what a cartoon. We talk about the downfall of 90s animation being the success of Pokemon. And Pokemon showed how cheap and much more successful localizing anime could be compared to making a Batman in the animated series. And once that succeeded, basically Fox especially was like, four kids, can you make 17 more Pokemon for us?

And boy, did they. They really did. They did a lot of that. So Ryan Drummond was replaced by Jason Griffith and basically not even given the chance to, you know, audition for the role again. Oh, wow. They just said, you're Sonic now. Yeah, yeah. They basically, I mean, actually, I think the story is that, you know, Jason Griffith auditioned for Sonic X and he got the role.

And he was just Sonic X and they were like, well, now you're Sonic forever, basically. And Ryan Drummond was like, no, I want to be Sonic. I'll move to New York where four kids is because everyone in four kids. are local New York actors. They're not in L.A. Or maybe they are now, who knows. And non-union as well. That's also very important.

But he offered even move to New York to voice Sonic, but they didn't care. And that's sad. I feel, especially for Ryan Drummond, he's like, I will have said my whole life, I will leave the Los Angeles acting scene because this is the biggest role I've ever had, probably, with Sonic. Actually, I want to say that Ryan Drummond lived in the Bay Area because that's where Sega was. Sega was in the Bay Area I think they still are in the Bay Area, right?

Yeah, a much smaller building than they were 15 years ago. And that's why Sonic Adventure 2 is like a San Francisco level because they were co-developing it in America. But I want to assume he was in San Francisco then because he lives here now in the Bay Area as a clown in a mime. So I think he's doing well. We should have hired him today and said like, no, no, you're not clowning today.

You're doing an interview about Sonic. I think we should get him on the show. I don't want to go too close to a clown, but I might have to. But yeah, let's hear Jason Griffith play Sonic. This is a clip of Sonic X that I included because I was another one of my favorite voice actors of this era. It's about time.

You'd think they could fly that thing a little faster. Hey, Sonic! It's over there! Chaos Emerald, here I come! You could tell it's a four kids production because they just have to put music over everything. This would be a lot easier for you if you didn't write all this new music for every episode.

Maybe they have like the Himesaband scam of writing new music and you pay yourself the most then. Maybe that's it. But wow, that's Sonic to me. I have not heard that one. I never watched Sonic X. It pushed me away immediately because it's like, let's give them a kid friend. Like, no, I don't want to see humans saying I was Sonic. Some dork named Chris is his new friend in that show.

Who's from our world, who then is sent to their world. it's lame as fuck I hate that concept as I'm a man who was 20 at the time the show wasn't made for me but if they want in my opinion it should just be all furries you don't need people people in the sonic world are bad it's always a bad idea yeah the only good person is robotic who does not look like a person and people are villains because they kill nature that's the whole point of it the environmentalist message of sonic has to have humans be the bad guys you can't have good humans in it There should be just one evil human in the world, and that's it. Who's killed every other human because they outlived them. And up top, we forgot to mention that Robotic will be played by Jim Carrey. Yeah, that's right. Yes, yeah. That's going to be interesting. He's going crazy in a fun way, I think.

I think he's just transitioning, like, many actors do. Like, I just do kids movies now. Like Christopher Lloyd, just like, yeah, I'll be in any kids movie now. Pay the checks. Oh, well, yeah. But that, okay, but anyway, the way Jason played it was just a very, like, cool guy kind of voice. Like, there's not too much more to it.

Though, it also felt a little like Yakko Warner. I heard a little bit of a yakko lilt to it. But I also included that clip because it includes Lisa Ortiz who played Lena Inverse. Oh, so if you want to see Sonic X, the entire series is on the TMS's YouTube page for free. So they have a YouTube page.

You can search for it. It's all there. It's the Four Kids dub. I believe the subtitle version is not somewhere. I remember watching it at an anime club at college. I think that's really cool. the TMS just puts all their stuff on their channel. That's really neat. And I feel like kids younger than us have fun memories of Sonic X. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's what's interesting about Sonic as a character that every, unlike Mario, where it feels like every kid who likes Mario likes Mario in the same way each generation. But Sonic is so different every five years that each generation of kids feels different things for him, you know? Like it's we is the pushing 40 Sonic fans. We feel a lot different about him than the folks who got on board with Sonic Inventure. And they feel different than the folks who got on board with Sonic 2006.

It's the people who just like making fun of him. But, yeah, it changes from time to all the time with people's impressions of Sonic. It's pretty interesting. And Jason Griffith played Sonic from 2005 to 2010. He played Sonic from Shadow the Hedgehog to Sega and Sonic All-Stars Racing until pretty sweet gig. get to be Sonic the Hedgehog for life. Not so fast, buddy. They give the role to Roger Craig Smith.

I think it's because Jason Griffith, this is just my conjecture, but I'm guessing he just lived in New York because he was doing the four-kid stuff in New York. He probably didn't move from New York. And like, oh yeah, Roger Craig-Smith is doing lots of voice acting. He can do a Sonic voice, and he's in L.A. So let's hire him.

And he's been the voice of Sonic from the game, Sonic Free Riders to the most recent Sonic game, which was Sonic create a character. Oh, it's Heroes. No? Forces. Forces, yes, yeah. There was another one called Heroes, wasn't there?

Yeah, Sonic Heroes was 2003. There's too many, signs. There's a lot of Sonics. But, yeah, Roger Craig Smith was asked by Sega to take on the role. So take that, Jason Griffith and Ryan Drummond. You can't be Sonic anymore. I mean, Roger Craig Smith is a very good actor. We did, on what a cartoon, we did regular show.

He did a ton of voices on regular show. He was high-five ghost. I think that was his most famous. Oh, and a very big. very, very convincing Kevin Conroy impression in Arkham Origins. He's totally the non-union Batman you'd get. What's the story behind that? Like, Kevin Conroy's like, nobody even asked me?

Because I thought, like, he wanted too much money, but he was like, they made this? Yeah, you know, I kind of can't really tell. I don't believe anybody has gone on record about it. The funny situation of it was that he didn't seem to know it was being made. And when people asked him if he was recording stuff for Batman, he said he was, which was really him breaking embargo on recording Arkham Knight. not Arkham Origins. I see.

And then when they announce Arkham Origins, you find out it's not him. And Arkham Origins in general, Rocksteady, the developer, treats it like it doesn't exist. Like,

it's totally Warner said they wanted to publish a Batman game and Rocksteady wasn't ready in time, so they had somebody else to it. And they got together all the non-union voice acting regulars you're used to hearing. That includes Troy Baker doing an amazing Batman.

I heard it's a perfectly cromulence. Or a Joker. Troy Baker's really good as Joker. Roger Craig Smith, a very fine Batman. Yes, so you played Etsio from Assassin's Creed as well. That's his best role. And he was Chris Redfield for about six years. I don't think he's Chris Redfield in Resident Evil 7, where he appears briefly.

Yeah, yeah. But that's because in those games, they do face capture and stuff. Yeah, I think they finally, they wanted to line it up with the face capture, which that makes sense. That's partially why David Hader got the boot as well. But here are fake. Here are some clips of Roger Craig Smith from the cartoon Sonic Boom. I'm going through the portal into the other dimension, too. You guys keep an eye on Lord Eggbutt.

It's a whole different place. Eggman could be anywhere. Or he could be right there. So you groan, Henry, but I want to say... I'm groaning at the video game. Oh, yeah, the video game. It's funny that, like, the game was the worst part of that whole situation where the game is terrible, it's broken, nobody wanted it.

People question the redesigns of the characters. But I think Sonic Boom, the cartoon series, is sort of, uh, this analogy will mean nothing to no one, but it is the pup named Scooby-Doo of the Sonic world where it's like, it's the first Sonic thing to be like self-aware about the jokes that are made about the characters,

the stereotypes of the characters fit into, what the internet is saying about the characters, things like that. It's very, like, it has a very wry, tiny tune style sense of humor to it. And I know adults, some adult fans are really into it. Yeah, from all the clips I've seen of the,

of the cartoon, the CG cartoon, It is written at a smarter level. Like, it is definitely not just written as a kid's show. Some writers were really getting away with stuff on that show, I think, which is really cool. Yeah, it feels like dream works. See, that's the level they're working at here, which is better than Sonic X and Adventures of Sonic That Chog and Sonic Underground and Sonic Satam. Yeah, I heard the way they pitched it internally at Sega to Japan was very confusing for them because they're like, no, we need to make a show like Phineas and Furb. And when they show Finnees and Furb to the, this was a story, I heard of the one of the Japanese producers seeing Finney's and Furb, they just don't get it that doesn't translate to them.

And they thought it was just weird, but they're like, whatever, if this is how you feel, America will go. And now it's kind of too bad because they, they did a good animated series with a awful name. I'm like the game The game killed the brand Before the show could get any love You know, it's very sad And this is also a French production What?

Yeah Man, what's the fucking French In the CGI cartoons? That's crazy But there are a lot of episodes of this There are 104 What? Two 52 episode seasons

I don't know if it's coming back But apparently it was very popular And this is like the new generation Of Sonic's cartoon It's like, so Sonic looks like in decades It's like the first Sonic cartoons were for us And then Sonic X was for people 10 years younger than us And Sonic Booms were people 20 years younger than us

So like every decade Sort of like Alvin in the Chipmucks It'll be a new version of Sonic For a new audience Wow, that's the tie Also the aging of it really hit me At when I worked at the video game website and they wanted to

Someone wanted to put Dr. Robotnik In the headline for something And I had to tell them like He's been Eggman for 13 years He was at he was Robotnik in only to us for four years, no one knows him as Robotnik anymore. He's Eggman. You're old. Yeah. If you think he's called Robotnik, that's because you're fucking old. We're all old. I like Sega of America's how they thought that, so number one, they came up with Robotnik, okay? And they're like, you know what a good name is? Robotnik. Amazing name for a villain.

And Japan's like, how about Miles Pryor? Absolutely not. That's stupid. That's a dummy. And they chose Robotnik. I don't know where they get off. Robotnik is stupider than miles per hour. Come on. Yeah, I mean, they're in the same neighborhood. I think robot, it's robot plus Sputnik. And so you bring in also like distaste for Russians, like a weird like commie scaredness to it. Come on, it's 1991. Let's figure this out already.

But though, I mean, Eggman is like, it's a lame in joke. It's one of those things like egg. I don't know. I don't feel like I would have accepted Eggman as a villain name as a little kid when I was. nine. I would have thought it was lame also. It might sound cooler in Japanese, but it's very like what's he? Eggman. Why? He's a man-ship like an egg. All right, let's move on.

And a Beatles reference. Oh, yeah, that's true. Yeah, that is true. It's funny though that for the new Sonic the Hedgehog movie, I saw a headline where it's like, yeah, Sonic the Hedgehog's creator, what do you think about the Sonic the Hedgehog new redesign? And he's like, number one, he's like, I'm disturbed that he's not wearing gloves,

like what's going on there. But my problem is number two, all these sites reporting on this, he did not draw Sonic the Hedgehog. Oh, this is fucking Tom Kalinsky. No, that's Yuji Naka. Oh, so they're talking to Yuji Nakkah. Yeah, Nautau Shima is the artist who created Sonic the Hedgehog. Find him and ask him.

Yeah, that's, you know what? Yujinaka, he deserves a lot of credit. He led the Sonic team. He built the Sonic team. He directed the games, most everybody's favorite Sonic games, and also some of their least favorite Sonic games. But what he didn't do was design Sonic,

and the design is everything. His coolness is the everything about him not the level design but I think too like I don't know Yuji Naka gives more interviews also he's fluent in English

I don't know if the other guy is like so I think it makes YuG more available for interviews like that so here is a translation of what he wrote from the site dual shockers which is disgusting in my opinion change your site name

so he says quote Sonic's design in the upcoming movie adaptation was leaked instead of being officially revealed I think it's part of the movie's marketing strategy and that they purposely leaked it, but it triggered a lot of negative reactions, which may also damage Sonic's image as an IP,

so it's not a good thing. Well, it's also possible that these pictures are fakes, made by some fans, but I wish they'd at least give him a pair of gloves. It's really shocking how Sonic's hands themselves are white, and that was all, that's how a fish of the Japanese language is. That's one tweet. Wow, that, all of that fit in one tweet?

There's a lot of kanji in that tweet, by the way. That's crazy. Wow. That's really crazy. That's the story. And then later he redesigned the image. And I have it right here, if you want to look, Henry. That's his redesign of it where it's like, it should look more like this.

It's like, that's just Sonic Adventure, Sonic. I mean, it's a little different, but it's like the human proportions are wrong. It looks like a man with a giant mascot head on. Yeah, the head, you're right. The head size is just too off, but not off enough. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, having worked with like executives of creative projects now at this point in my life,

I feel like the reason he looks like this. is someone was ashamed to be working on this movie. Like someone's like, I'm not making some weird hedgehog thing, make him look like a man. Yeah, well, when you see... That's every executive voice I do, by the way. Well, when you see a bright blue thing

with giant white eyes that looks weird to you. That's two that reads as simply cartoony. Same with like, I think it comes from the same made by committee place that you end up with the Transformers designs everybody hates.

Or fans hate, but you just have because those look more. serious and hyper detailed and also you know if you're just going to use what's right off the page and then everybody designed already then you're not adding your own stamp to it so you can't take credit for it so you got to bungle it up and make it yours but you're a big fan of superhero movies and the marvel movies and stuff and i think you'd agree uh with the idea that uh they were so resistant to making superheroes superhero like uh for a long time and still now like today we were talking at lunch is like, why can't

the Joker just be the Joker? We're post-joker or teaser, by the way. Just like, no, it's real. What if, what if superhero real? That was like the working thing behind every superhero movie until, like, I think the most recent Spider-Man movie was like, what if it was fun and he wore a red costume?

How about that? Well, yeah, that was the edge the MCU got that they just, not that they didn't alter the costume sums for the movie, but it didn't seem like it came from a place of hating what the, comic book page looked like they embraced it and made it their own thing i think you know it's it's just a different way of thinking production wise that like sonic uh it's being it feels when you see a design

like that it makes you think this is not being made by a person who likes sonic it's made by a person who doesn't give a shit what he looks like yeah or is just thinking about what looks better on a poster or whatever they see how you know uh the grinch got redesigned or other characters got re-designed to look better in the last 20 years. I mean, make people like Sonic for a reason, and part of that reason is his design, don't mess with it. It just sort of like, again, I'm back to the Joker, like,

make Sonic fat and blue. Why can't the Joker just wear a purple suit and live in a fun abandoned toy factory or whatever with the clown wife? Because you need the suffering. Oh man, don't make me mad. I'll go Joker mode on you. That's me on the screen. And the gloves, especially like, Sonic has gloves

because Mickey has gloves. Everybody, that's why they have it. But when you take away the gloves and it's just flesh-tone hands, when you're used to seeing Sonic with gloves for close to three decades, he just looks weird. If you can see Sonic's fingernails. It's just not right. It's wrong. I will say that the detective Pikachu movie, it looks like it could be fun. Sure. Yeah. I think they're doing a better job with that. But also it's a thing. It's like you wanted them to look. You wanted this to be like, what if Pokemon, but real? Like I want to get beyond that for. every one of these adaptations like movies about comics and video games and cartoons. It's like, no, it's got to be real. It's got to be pretty. Based on the trailer, it at least seems like they embrace like they're real, but they still act

like they are in the games. This Sonic looks realer, but also feels like a betrayal of the games. So I think that's why people are being a little more forgiving, at least to the trailers of Detective Pikachu. And I can totally get why they did Detective

Pikachu as a thing they adapt, Because I would bet Pokemon Company said were, I would bet Pokemon Company was not very flexible about having a regular Pikachu or the Pikachu say rye things or dirty words. But if you make up, if you use a story about a human who becomes a Pikachu, who isn't really a Pikachu, then you can break the Pikachu rules. You will not damage the brand. But I mean, this kind of marketing and this kind of approach to adaptations is nothing new. I remember when I was a kid, and the Ninja Turtles movie came out in 1989, was it? And the tagline was, this isn't a cartoon. But I'm a child.

I enjoy the cartoon. It's like, well, it's not the cartoon. But I want the cartoon. Shut up. No, you don't. We tell you what you want. You want Corey Feldman voice in one of these, don't you? It's like, I like the original voice actors.

We got Corey Feldman. I don't know who Corey Feldman is. It's 1992 now. I mean, that did irk me as a kid. It's like, where all the voices I like? Yeah, they don't sound right. They'd rather screw them out of the money, I guess. But I guess we're getting a bit off topic, but I hope you enjoyed our exploration of

songs' voices. It's not nearly as in depth. He had one more point, Henry? Yeah, sorry, Bob. I just remembered one extra clip I wanted to share with you. It's unbelievably Larry King still has a talk show. CNN canceled in, but he refuses. Larry King was like 70 when the Hedgehog came out in America. And so he's Larry King, though, he still interviews lots of people. And he had on Ben Schwartz. And Ben Schwartz was just doing like a general interview because you know, Mr. BV8 has a lot of things going on in his life, so he's got a lot of stuff to promote.

But during part of it, Larry King asked him about Sonic, mainly because he was reading down Benny Schwartz's IMDB and asking a question, not because he gives a single shit about Sonic. You're in a movie. What is movie? I think he's going to be losing his mind like that. But I want to correct myself, he was not 70 when Sonic the Hedgehog 1 came out. He was 58.

Oh, okay. He's not that. It only feels like he's 110. Let's hear this clip. Okay, what's Sonic the Hedgehog? Sonic the Hedgehog is based off a video game from 1991, I believe that's when the first one came out. And it's about this hedgehog that can run really, really fast. And as a kid, it's like one of the most iconic video games of all time. And now they're making a live-action movie.

So the fact that I get to play Sonic is like... Live action? It's live action. Sonic will be CG, so I'm just playing the voice of that. But everybody else, like Jim Carrey plays the bad guy and James Marsden is in it. And so... But you're an animated...

You're animated. Yeah, I wasn't good enough to be a human being. So it's just my voice. Hedgehogs are interesting, though, aren't they? I can't wait to see where this is going. What kind of voice does he have? I can't say it yet. They're not letting me tell...

It's very secret. This is a very secret. Why do they do this? If you wanted to be Sonic, tell me, what do you think a hedgehog would sound like? I have no idea. I got to hear it. You've got to take a leap.

This is your hundred-fifth episode. How long? That's great. No, I'm just a headclog. No one cares about me. Okay. That's great. Oh, boy.

Hey, how about Larry King is the next voice to sign that dog? No, I'm glad we ended with that Ben Schwartz is the next voice. Boy, Larry King is old. He just sounds like he's about to kick off. I love, he must have a lot of debt there. But I just can't stop. He's an old newsman. What I love about that clip is that Ben Schwartz is a improv machine.

Oh, yeah. You can see his piece he's an opening right there. Yeah. So when he hits what should be a brick wall of like, I can't tell you what the voice sounds like. I signed five to contracts and said I can't. And so he's like, okay, Larry, I'm going to send you and do a bit like, what would you be? Like, come on Larry, you got to go with me here, improv with me. What would you be if you were Sonic? And it's a very interesting take on nobody likes me. Whatever the hell he was doing. I just like how Larry King's interviewing style are just like, hedgehogs, they're pretty interesting. Actually, that's way too much energy. He's like, hedgehogs. They're, I like hedgehogs. It's, uh, Sonic. What's, like, explain. His talk show is just explaining things to Larry King.

Video game. I think I played a video game. Yeah, it's fat in that way. It's fascinating, I have to say. You can watch a man fall apart on the air. But thanks for listening. That's what Retron says about, isn't it? You can watch me fall apart in the air every week.

Thanks for listening, everybody. It's been a fun time going through all the different voices of Sonic the Hedgehog. I hope you learned a little something about Sonic the Hedgehog and perhaps yourself. If you want to help support Retron's a retron. and get every episode of the show one week ahead of time and ad-free, please go to patreon.com slash retronauts, and for the low sum of $3 a month, you can get just that and help support your favorite podcast. And this is completely Patreon-funded.

We couldn't do any of this without you. Your subscriptions help pay for things like recording space and, you know, everything we need to get a podcast on the air once and often twice a week. So please go to patreon.com slash retronauts, and you can find out how to help the show. We'd really appreciate it. But also, if you're in the mood to sign up for things on Patreon, we have other Patreon, too, including one for the Talking Simpsons Network, which is what I do.

I work on with Henry. We do so many podcasts for them. Henry, I'll let you get started. What's going on at the Talking Simpsons Network at patreon.com slash Talking Simpsons. Well, yes, everybody, if you love this conversation about cartoons a bit with me and Bob, you would love to hear our weekly, what a cartoon podcast for me and Bob. different animated series each week. If I get direct you to one, if you love all these classic cartoons and video games,

you should definitely listen to our one about OKCO. We talk about how the creator of the show in Jones Quarty is a big Sonic fan, as is Toby Jones, his co-executive producer. Check that one out. And of course, if you love The Simpsons, me and Bob are going through the entire series. We're deep into season nine now once a week on Talking Simpsons. You'll get those ad free in a week early at patreon.com slash Talking Simpsons if you sign up there. And you'll get tons of extras, including right now currently unfurling, our Talk King of the Hill podcast, where we go through the entire first season of King of the Hill only for our loyal subscribers at patreon.com slash Talking Simpsons.

And if you want to really bonus size it for $10 and up, folks, we have our What a Cartoon movie where we go through a different animated feature film once a month. The Secret and Mim, Batman Mask of the Phantasm, Kiki, Akira, and a goofy movie. You can hear all of that at $10 and up. So many podcasts, so much fun. Check it all out at patreon.com slash talking Simpsons. And you can follow me on Twitter at H-E-N-E-Y-G. Very well done.

And by the way, you can give the two Patreons at once. It's totally legal. It's good for you. No one's going to stop you. People think you're cooler and more attractive if you do. And I want to point out, we also talked about the Sonic the Hedgehog original animated series, the non-serious one. If you want to go back to 2015, dear Lord, almost four years ago. Retronauts episode 55, we talked about the Sonic's Christmas Blast.

That's special, and a lot of fun voices in that. But as for me, you can find me on Twitter as Bob Surabot, and that's it for this week's episode of Retronauts. We will see you Monday for a brand new episode. Take it easy. like all the planets right and look like i know it i notice different things are all like all the planet's right and move like i know it i know it's me and look at first i lookalikes