RHAP: We Know Survivor - Emily Flippen & Jenna Lewis-Dougherty Survivor 50 Preseason Interviews

Episode Date: January 29, 2026

Emily Flippen & Jenna Lewis-Dougherty Survivor 50 Preseason Interviews Mike Bloom (@AMikeBloomType) is here to chat to the cast of Survivor 50! Join us to hear from your favorite returning Survivor players! Survivor 50 preseason interviews are here, as Mike Bloom sits down with Emily Flippen and Jenna Lewis Dougherty to uncover what’s driving some of the season’s most intriguing castaways. In this deep-dive episode, Survivor 45 standout Emily returns to Fiji after publicly swearing off a comeback, while OG icon Jenna Lewis makes her fierce return to the game after more than two decades away. Hear firsthand how these two women—each with unique Survivor journeys—plan to navigate the complex social web and shifting strategies of the milestone 50th season. The episode starts with Emily Flippen explaining how she surprised even herself by returning for Survivor 50, when she’d once insisted she was done with the game. Emily opens up about her mindset shift, wanting to control her narrative after feeling her “softer” story arc in season 45 left an incomplete lesson. She discusses the pressure of fan expectations, overcoming personal insecurities, and why she’s aiming for a “Goldilocks zone” between directness and tact. Jenna Lewis Dougherty, meanwhile, reveals how the game has—and hasn’t—changed since Borneo and All-Stars, describing her plan to weaponize being underestimated and use “conjecture flattery” as a tool. Mike explores their thoughts on the new era, their targeted alliances, and what it takes for an old-school or new-school player to thrive among legends and wildcards. Emily reflects on her evolution, admitting she didn’t love the lesson viewers took from her arc on Survivor 45, and wants to prove you don’t have to change your core to succeed. Jenna outlines her “mommy complex” strategy, aiming to bond with younger players and then outmaneuver them at critical moments. Both women assess their competition, highlighting who they see as friends or threats—with hilarious, candid takes on castmates like Coach, Aubry, Ozzy, and D. Emily weighs the impact of social media buzz and fan perception, while Jenna describes using her “real life” negotiation skills in the cutthroat Survivor world. Strategies for handling returning players, “winner killers,” alliance flips, and being underestimated are front and center. As the cast prepares to hit the beach, questions loom: Can Emily strike the right balance between bluntness and gameplay finesse? Will Jenna’s old-school instincts keep her safe among the sharks—or lead to her early downfall? Who will take control in a game where every move is scrutinized? Chapters: 0:00 Intros 6:07 Emily Reflects On Survivor Return 12:07 Friend Or Foe Game Begins 18:25 Emily Assesses Her Competition 26:36 Jenna Lewis Dougherty’s Big Comeback 32:29 Adapting To Modern Survivor Game 38:20 Strategic Prep And Challenge Training 44:10 Forming Alliances And Manipulation 50:15 Targeting Winners And Forming Bonds 56:05 Dream Loved One Choices Revealed Never miss a minute of RHAP’s extensive Survivor coverage! LISTEN: Subscribe to the Survivor podcast feed WATCH:  Watch and subscribe to the podcast on YouTube SUPPORT:  Become a RHAP Patron for bonus content, access to Facebook and Discord groups plus more great perks!

This episode of Rob is a Podcast is presented by 20th Century Studios Send Help from the Twisted Mind of Sam Ramey, Director of the Evil Dead, and Drag Me to Hell, starring Rachel McAdams and Dylan O'Brien. It's a new film that begs the question, what would you do if you were stuck on an island with your terrible boss? Do not answer if you work at Rob as a podcast, okay? In Paradise, HR, can't hear you scream. Now playing only in theaters and 3D. Hi everybody, Mike Bloom here back with another day of Survivor 50 preseason interviews. We kicked things off in a major way yesterday between the official release of the cast photos and bios,

as well as the big kickoff of my interviews with all 24 cast members from Survivor 50. Yesterday you heard from Christian and Surrey. And today I have two golden interviews. with two golden-haired women on the Sealy tribe in Emily and Jenna. Of course, you've missed any of the stuff that we had going on yesterday. Make sure you do not make that same mistake again. Subscribe to all of our Survivor Podcasts at we knowsurvivor.com. And, of course, go to Rob has a website.com slash YouTube for video versions of all of my interviews.

Let's start with one of, I would say, the fan favorite characters, of Survivor 45, financial analyst Emily Flippin. For many reasons, I, and I think many people were quite surprised when they found out that Emily would be on this season. She made it incredibly adamant the day after she was voted out, that Survivor is not something she would necessarily want to do again. When I was doing the wish list, I pulled a few of her respective cast members asking, are you sure that Emily would never come back to Survivor?

They affirmed that. But lo and behold, here she is in Fiji talking with me right now. And for what it's worth, she was not necessarily telling this big, grand lie to try to trick people into not thinking that she was on 50. More so it has to do, interestingly, with probably the biggest takeaway from her time on Survivor 45, which is. her character arc, one of the biggest transformations we've experienced in recent Survivor memory, if not across 25 years of the show, had Emily entering the game as this more

blunt, direct personality nearly gets voted out first and goes all the way to the final seven where she's able to make so many bonds and becomes such a, you know, strategic presence in the season that the other person from 45 on the season D conspires to idle her out with one vote. It was this really interesting metamorphosis, but Emily, interestingly, was not entirely happy with it. She gets into that and a lot more in our interview.

Just a couple of quick stats as to where and who Emily is today. Emily is currently 30 years old, originally from McKinney, Texas, currently lives in Laurel, Maryland, and of course, as the memes say, is an investment analysis. So very interesting to see that when she looked at the bottom line of her survivor career so far, she decided she needed to make another investment. But I think it's time we invest our efforts and give a listen to my interview with Emily.

I have to ask Emily, and I ask with love, what the hell are you doing here? Because I, you know, when we talked two years ago, you were adamant, you were not doing this again. When I was doing the whole wish list thing last year, I asked several of your cast members like, are you sure? Emily did it alone and do it? They were very, matter of fact, that this wasn't the case. So what led you to sitting here with me today? Well, in my defense, I wasn't just lying to you and everyone else. I was also lying to myself, I think.

You go opportunity offender. Yeah, exactly. And I don't know if I actually have a real answer for you. I've been trying to figure it out myself. I got the call initially, and they were kind of like, you don't have to make your, mind up right now, just let's go through the process. And enough months went by that I just didn't back out. And then at some point I thought to myself, well, if I haven't backed out yet, clearly there's some part of me that is interested in doing this again. And I think part of it is

I don't love the note that I left 45 on. Oh, interesting. Which is odd. Because when I finished the game and I finished my season on 45, I was really happy with obviously how things turned out for me, which I still am really thankful for that. But one of my last confessionals, I said, I learned to be a softer person. I literally use that word softer. And I hate the idea that my story ended with the idea that you have to change who you are in order to do well. And at no point in my life do I think I'm a soft person. To this day, nobody would describe me as soft. And it's not to say that you can't adjust. Like I learned to be a little bit more open minded and flexible, not to see the world so black and white. I think those are important values. But do I think you need to be passive and indecisive and insecure and

softs and all of these things I think I was by the time I was actually voted out. Also, no. So I honestly, I'm not sure if that's all of the story, but in my mind, that's kind of how I'm rationalizing my decision to be here because I don't love the lesson that I think I love the people with. And that is so interesting because I think when we talk about what's the mindset you're coming into this game with, obviously one of the reasons why people really glomest to your story was this metamorphosis, right? Was that starting off, things were a little rough to say the least, and then perhaps they did get softer to a certain extent. So what is your headspace coming into this first day, because it does seem like from your perspective, like,

you do want to showcase that you don't need to necessarily like, you know, dull a little bit of your shine in some certain areas to be able to glow as a future winner of survivor. Yeah, actually, I love that way of putting it. Thank you. And coming into 50, I'm a little bit afraid that I could make some of the same mistakes. I'm hoping not to. But I think there is a nice middle ground between being genuine, direct, aggressive, and

speaking your mind while also being tactful and thoughtful and flexible and flexible and open-minded. And I feel like, unfortunately, season 45 was almost this metamorphosis from being way too much in one extreme to way too much in the other extreme. You want the Goldilocks. Exactly. I think there's a Goldilocks zone. And that's not to say that I don't think I took away lessons from 45. I think I did. And I learned a lot and I'm so thankful that I had the opportunity to have as much time there as I did. And that change and the self-reflection that I did was very genuine. I think it's a very true story. But I know I can do better and I want to do better. Yeah. So let's talk about also what your life has been like because, you know, when you were out on the island, we have that,

of course, iconic wine-laden session at the sanctuary. When you talk about getting new perspective into your relationship, you are newly married. So what has it sort of been like to go through so many life stuff in between these survivor seasons? Yeah, that's such a good question. And when I came into 45, I think I said, you know, if I'm not going to win the game, I'd rather be the first person voted off. Because in my mind, you're here to play, you're here to win. And if you're not here to do that, there's very little value you get otherwise. And I now, I'm acutely aware, as for my recent marriage, there's value and experience. And what I'm going to take away from season 50, I don't yet know, I think, coming in right now.

I hope it is a million dollars, plus all these wonderful lessons that I'm sure I'll learn. Don't get me wrong. But at the same time, I think I've learned there's a lot of value and experience within itself. And I need to be, again, open-minded to that possibility. When it comes to your own almost like strategic mindset, because when you and I talked, you said, yeah, admittedly, I suck it lying. And you were able to, again, fool Bruce into not playing his idol. So do you feel like there's some capabilities that you're coming in here with that you know you're able to possess as opposed to last time?

I feel like part of the reason my season 45 game ended the way it did was because I was really insecure. I mean, I was insecure coming into the game. I think I just masked it with aggression. I was insecure of leaving the game. I think I just masked it with passivity and indecision. I'm afraid that I still have a lot of those same insecurities. and one of my insecurities is, you know, I suck at lying or I'm not able to do a lot of these things. And I think if I trust in myself and believe in myself a little bit more, maybe I'd find that, no, you can.

And I feel like that's part of it is I feel like I just set the bar so low because I don't want people to be disappointed in me. And I don't want people to get their hopes up. I don't want to be disappointed in myself. But you're just kind of manifesting disappointment in that regard, right? If you don't believe yourself capable of anything, if you set expectations too low, then you'll probably achieve nothing. I don't know what the middle ground is there. I don't want to come into this saying, I'm going to win season 50,

and that's going to be the end of my story. And obviously, I'm up against so many incredible competitors that I think having the mindset that I am going to win would literally just be deluding myself and ignoring reality. But at the same time, I have to believe that there is a possibility for me to win. Otherwise, what am I doing here? When you and I talked following your boot,

you know, you had spoken about the fact that you did not realize the voluminous fan base that Survivor has, especially from like an online perspective. Now that you've kind of discovered it and you've come back here, is that anything you're sort of like keeping in your mind, considering how much people, again, like really glommed on to your story from 45? I don't know if this is what you're expecting or not what you're expecting, but to be honest, I am trying to do my best to completely ignore it.

I don't think it's providing any value to think about what other people's perceptions of me are. And if somebody reflects on my time here and reflects on my story and learn something from it, grows from it the way that I did, that's great. And if it resonates to someone that's wonderful. Yeah. But I learned really the hard way going through season 45 that you can't make everybody happy with you. And I think if you think everybody loves you and is happy with you, then you're either lying to yourself or you're lying to them. And I'm a really bad liar, like I said. So I want to come in and I'm doing this for me. I'm going to do my best to tune out everything else.

And I think that means that, yeah, I'll probably make some mistakes and I'll probably do some stuff that fans are probably going to hate and hopefully I'm blissfully unaware of it. But it still leaves somebody with something. Listen, up to this point, it was in the hands of the fans. Now it's in your hands. Exactly, exactly. They had their say. Now it's my say.

When it comes to prep, because, again, you've only done this a couple of years ago. Did you find any distinct differences between getting ready for season one versus season two of your journey? Yeah, that's a good question. Season 45 came up on me really quickly. I think it was only a matter of a few months between when I submitted my application video to when I was in the island in Fiji. And I didn't have a lot of time, I think, to wrap my head around what exactly my strategy was.

So you would think now, with two plus years of prep for season 50, with the expectation that this was a possibility that I'd be better prepared. But I'm an incredibly anxious person. And I know this is not what other people would do. They'd be like, I'd be, you know, doing everything I empowered to learning how to make shelters and working out every day and opening coconuts. I was just trying to keep my head on straight. I was anxious about the experience. I was nervous about the journey. I wasn't sure if I was going to do it again.

If I should do it again, if I did do it again, this type of person that I would be, I spent a lot of time, I think, just internalizing. So my prep for season 50, I think, was a lot less external and a lot more internal. And I just wanted to be in the right headspace to do it again and actually enjoy myself. And I can fully say, I'm sitting out here right now. And I'm actually, I'm in a good mood. I am happy to be here. I was so anxious and uptight during season 45.

I was in a really bad headspace, and I actually feel positive this time around. And for me, that's a minor victory, a bit a big victory of my world. Said before you were on another Lulu. Yeah, exactly. But inevitably, what's going to happen is I'm going to go out there. This means I'm going to be the first boot. Exactly. Like, I prepared myself for the first three days, and that's it.

Well, let's talk about some of this competition here. We're going to play a little game called friend or foe. Okay. So we're going to go down the list. You give me either friend, someone you're eyeballing to work with or foe, either someone who you might not vibe with or someone that you're going to act. target for whatever reason or another. To be clear, everybody is foe.

I'll play the game, I'll save for it. But to be clear, there's a foe baseline. Their foe baseline is there, right? I'm not losing to any of them, right? And while we're there, we can also touch upon a couple of, you know, key relationships, too. But let's start with Jenna Lewis. Who? From, uh, Jenna from Borneo.

Is there an option that's not friend or foe? Yeah, and you go with the third one. Irrelevant. Oh, okay. I'm sorry. I genuinely can't remember a single thing about, Not only Jinnah, I mean Borneo in general, sure it was a great season. I watched it maybe when I was seven years old.

I mean, Jenna, the vibes out here, from what I can tell. Yeah. Also very neutral. I got nothing. I got nothing from her. So, you know, if she's on my tribe, that is a complete blank slate. All right, well, let's move on to Colby. Foe.

Oh, okay. Why so quick with the response? I just don't think he's going to vibe with me at all. Purely based off of what I can take. Again, not somebody I've ever met or interacted with, but the physicality, the kind of like almost American hero of it all, that is not me. And I hope that we have something in common, maybe we do, but baseline foe. How about Stephanie?

Fo, for the same reasons as Colby. Mm-hmm. Okay, how about Surrey? Ooh, foe. And the reason I'm giving Surrey faux, and I thought about that in my defense, I did think about it because I think there's an opportunity there for us to work together as two of the less physical people on a season of what is turning out to be a lot of really strong people. Okay, I'm very insecure right now.

It's because the vibes that I'm getting at so far, Ponderosa pregame, we can't talk, but we can look at each other. I'm not even sure if she wants to be here. I mean, it's like heads down, headphones, and uninterested in what's going around. And maybe that's just three, and maybe I'll see a different side of her on the island. But right now I'm almost wondering, like, can I even work with you? Because do you want to play this game? How about Ozzy?

Is that going back to the Colby Stephanie model of things? Do you have other thoughts on him? Ooh, Ozzy might be more friend, actually. Okay. And that's only because he's such a weirdo. And I kind of feel like if you're a weirdo, then that gives me, that's a crack. You know what I mean? Yeah, I know he'll be probably more attracted to, like, the D's of the world,

who has a little element of, like, quirk, but is a little bit more conventional. But if there's a crack, I can work with a crack. So maybe, maybe more friend, but it's borderline. Well, you talk about the weirdos, and I say this with love. How about coach? Friend, friend, friend, friend. I don't know why. You lit off.

I know. I am just like, I have my fingers crossed that I'm on the same tribe as coach. And I cannot tell you why, because I have never met the guy until, you know, three days ago when we're on a plane going to Fiji together. And we have so many things that are very different. So it should be faux, like, thinking of going back to like all these other things. But at the same time, I feel like when it comes down to his baseline, I'm like, you're kind of a weirdo who is really direct and will always speak his mind. And I love that. I love people who are just truly authentic to themselves. And so, I don't know.

I feel like I'm going to vibe with coach. How about Aubrey? Friend, friend, purely because I think the archetype, you know? Like, Aubrey doesn't have much choices out here, and I feel like I'm going to be one of her limited opportunities. How about Chrissy, fellow financial analyst? Friend. And I don't have any reason to say that other than she's very adorable, which, oh my God, is judging someone based off their how their look, and I hope nobody else is doing that for me, even though I actually think maybe my look is pretty fair to judge me off of.

But she just seems really friendly. Okay, how about, let's go to our trio from David versus Glouc. Let's start with Angelina. I really want to say friend, but for some reason I'm leaning foe, and I really can't provide a logical explanation for it. But maybe it's the makeup, maybe it's the, you know, the beauty of it all. And maybe I'm making a judgment based off of that. But I just don't know if she's going to like my out thereness. I don't know it.

But I did, gosh, I loved her on her season, and that's what's so confusing about it. But the vibe that she's bringing to the island now is, in my opinion, it feels different than when I watched her on TV. So I don't know if she's changed in that time. All right. Well, let's talk about somebody who you do have a preexisting relationship with. Yes. Give me your thoughts on Christian. Yeah.

Christian's definitely friend, only because that is a known quantity. I think I understand how Christian's brain works. And I think he understands logical, strategic gameplay. Yeah. It's logical and strategic, I think, for him to want to work with me. That being said, like, he's... such a big threat. If he makes it, he's not targeted for his lack of physicality on his tribe, which I don't think he will be because he's such a strategic puzzle mastermind,

then that's somebody that I would not want to be sitting next to in final three. Mike White. Foe. What are you even doing here? No, I want somebody to answer that question for me. Yeah. I mean, you'll maybe ask him on the beach on day one whenever that comes. Hopefully he's not on my drive. I mean, that'd be the perfect Emily one point of start where you just be like, can I push back What are you doing here, Mike? You know what? I have half a mind.

What I want to get him to do is publicly promise to everyone that he will not put a single contestant from season 50 on any of his TV shows or moving. This movie's moving forward because I feel like otherwise the entire narrative around his time here is going to be, oh, well, are they trying to buddy up to Mike White? Not to say they won't vote him out, but are they just trying to be friendly with him and work with him because they want something from him? Let's shut it down right now. All he has to do is say, hey, it's not happening, guys.

So, you know, if you work with me, you're working with me, you're not working with my TV persona. Yeah, I mean, that's a great way to put it, because then it also kind of kills two birds with one stone where they're not like sliding into his DMs afterwards being like, season. Exactly. That stuff irritates me. How about Rick? Foe. And that doesn't make logical sense, I can tell. Your eyes. No, I'm just trying to think through that, yeah, the pause you took.

And that surprises me because I think coming into the East India told me Rick Devin's just going to be on it, I'd say, oh, that's a friend, right? Similar kind of like archetype almost. But there's, oh, I don't know, he's probably a really pleasant guy. I only judging him based off the lack of interaction he's had upon to Rosa, but what I've seen him doing. And there's something about him that comes off a little smart, like a little inauthentic, lots of like buddying up and cozing up to like the producers and other people like, we're friends, bro, come on, give me a, you know, a hand slap or something.

And then he were sitting day one. We just got to Ponderosa, okay? Like, we're just coming down, we're sending our tables, nobody's saying anything. He pulls out photos of his family. And he's like, holding him up, flipping through photos of his family. And I'm like, man, you saw them 48 hours ago, okay?

You didn't miss him that much. And also, we know you have a family. You have a private place. You can go and look at photos of your family. What is that? What is that? It just strikes me as like, okay, he's already playing the game,

and that just annoys me. Well, let's start getting into your new era, castmates here. Let's start with Jonathan. This one's hard. Eileen Fo. I'm really hoping that we can work together because I think there's a very good chance that we end up on the same tribe. Just because my lack of physicality and his presence of physicality, maybe that would be a balancing.

But from what I can understand, I never met him in person, but what I know about him is ideologically, I don't know if we exactly get along and see eye to eye in that regard, which is fine. I think you can work with people of lots of different backgrounds. I just don't know if he'll be interested in working with me. So I might try to make an end with him, but I come on kind of strong. And I don't think Jonathan is a type of person who's like, yeah, I really vibe with that. Like, that's really working for me. All right. Let's talk about the D of it all because I know that 45, you are extremely incredibly close as a cast.

There's also the thing that last time you were out here, D helped arrange for the one vote that took you out. So how are you feeling about her coming into this? I have a lot of respect for D. And I do think that it's accurate. People describe her as one of the most dominant players of the new era. She has it all. When you meet D, you love her. It's really, really hard.

on to and that is electric. And that can almost be an asset because I do think that she is aware that she's a big target. And if in her mind she can view us as working together, then that keeps a big target around. And I think when it comes down to the season 45ers, who's like, oh, Emily is so threatening. Not when there's D sitting right there. That being said, I am not going to lose to the same person twice. It's embarrassing to lose once. Imagine losing to the same person twice. So I have no intention of going to the end with D or doing anything that is going to be like, I'll further her game at the expense of mine. But I do think we can work together to some extent. All right. Let's move into 46. Charlie. I like Charlie. Seems like a nice guy.

I don't know if he'll like me very much. He seems very conventional. I'll go friend purely because the new era, 45, 46, like we're all out there together. I feel like he'll want to work with me. and I feel like he knows what he's getting when he gets me. So I'm not like an unknown quantity to him. All right, well, let's go to the exact opposite of conventional, perhaps. Give me your thoughts on Q. Ooh, this is so difficult. I'm leaning friend for Q.

And let me explain why it's difficult. I have met Q once or twice maybe in person. And I cannot get a read on the guy. Like, if you think the Q you see out here is different from the Q in real life, it's not. It's not. And that's concerning. So I can't tell if the guy hates me. Because every interaction we've had has been weird.

Yeah. And so I'm a little bit afraid he low-key just despises me. I have no idea. But I think the only way I'm sitting at Final 3 is if something weird has happened. Like this would be a crazy season if I'm sitting at Final 3 with this group of people. So I need the chaos. I need the Q chaos. So for that reason alone, he's friend.

How about Tiffany? Maybe more foe for Tiffany. I know Q and Tiffany are close. I know post-game they're probably likely to be working together. So I don't know how I work with one and not with the other. Not that they won't eventually turn on each other, but Tiffany is just very strategic and thoughtful, and I find that very threatening. How about Genevieve?

I think friend for Genevieve purely because Genevieve's on an island right now. Literally. Literally, literally on islands. Similar to me. She is coming into the game, I think, with some of the less preexisting relationships. She was also perceived as a big threat, so like D probably gets targeted before me. I think she needs allies. She's coming in probably not very many.

And I think I can be an ally for her. I'm, again, a known quantity. So, friend. Talking about known qualities, let's talk about some very recent known quantities. What about Joe? I genuinely forget that Joe is here. Not to be mean to the guy.

I love him. But, like, sometimes I look around and I see him. I'm like, oh, oh, my God, you're here too. So Joe is almost kind of like going back to, who is it on season one? Whose name is already forgotten? Jenna. Joe and Jenna. It's the Jays.

I'll go with foe because I think his alliance in 48 if I'm not mistaken was was one of the buff guy alliances and obviously it don't fit. How about Camilla? Friend. Again, similarly to Q, I've interacted with Camilla a couple of times and I can't tell if she hates me or not. And for that alone, it makes me a little bit nervous because she has had plenty of opportunities. We've talked. We've played some games together.

She could have been like, hey, Emily, I'm on season 50. Not that I think that you should do that. I hate pre-gaining. If somebody does that to me, it irritates the heck out of me. But nobody did that, including Camilla. And that to me says, okay, she either has the same mindset I do, or she's just really not interested in me. Both are fair.

How about Kyle? Similar thing to Camilla. I'll say Kyle lands a little bit more on the foe side than the friend side, only because with this cast of people, I can always figure out a reason why somebody was put on the cast. Right. Something's wrong with you, something's going on. That's why you're here.

With Kyle, he's way too well adjusted and way too. normal. And that is so, so threatening to me because I'm like, what's wrong with you? Yeah. And the answer is nothing. Well, let's talk about the two unknown quantities that they're here. It could be assets, could be liabilities. Where are your thoughts right now on the two people from 49? Yeah. So right now, I'm not getting great reads on either of them. I will say, not trying to meta the producers here, I would probably be casting two people who either hated each other or two people who worked really closely together on 49. And right now, the two 49ers, I believe the maze are Savannah and Rizzo.

They are sitting very far away from each other at Fonda Rosa. They're not interacting with each other at all, which is exactly what I would do if we were actually very close and we wanted to pretend like we weren't. So that makes me think that they probably work together. Savannah seems nice enough, not getting a great read on her. Rizzo seems jaded as hell. And I don't know if my read, my reads are usually totally wrong, by the way.

But he has an intensity to him, just sitting at a tinge, just almost seems like he has something to prove. So I kind of like that. And if he actually is coming into this game with like an element of intensity, then I could work with that. So it's interesting because when it comes with returning players, they usually will glom at least some qualities on from the winner of their season to bring into their own. Now, you are playing with the winner of your season. But I'm curious, is there anything from Dee's game in 45 that you're trying to adapt into your own? I think if I try to be D, I'm going to fail at it really, really spectacularly.

I'm not sure if there's much that D and I have in common. But there is one thing that D did that I have a lot of respect for that I hope I can do, which is keep my mouth shut. It's hard for me to keep secrets and to only share information that needs to be shared and know when the information should be shared. Dee was really, really good about only giving tidbits when it was necessary. So I hope I can take that away from her. Now, let's do some creative thinking here. What role in Blood on the Clock Tower are you going to play like in season 50? Ooh, that's such a good question.

I hope I can be kind of like the Scarlet Woman. If anybody's unfamiliar with this, basically if the big, bad person gets killed on the Clock Tower, the Scarlet Woman's the backup plan. The game continues with the Scarlet Woman. And that's what I'm kind of hoping I can do, is latch on to somebody who is more of an immediate target than myself. That should hopefully get me through the first half of the game. And then by the time that person is knocked off,

I am ultimately the person sitting at Final Three. I love that, exactly. And you can still play like, no, listen, I wasn't the demon to start off. Exactly, exactly. Last thing I want to ask, you know I asked you this last time, but I'll give you another opportunity. If you could bring a celebrity or a fictional character out, as a loved one. Do you remember what you said last time?

No. You said Ron Weasley. I'm sure I did because that's the only fictional character I can think of it. I mean, if you want to stick with your answer, you did. I literally, the immediate thing I thought of was Ron Weasley again. It just feels like the biggest impulse thing. Yeah, to be honest, right now I'm actually reading Mistborn. Yeah, it's so good. I finished the first one and I put it in the discarded books at Ponderosa, hoping that somebody else would pick it up and nobody else has. And I'm like, pick it up. It's so good. A future player will come along and read Emily's Mistborn. So I read through Miss Forne. I'm happy to do the second one in that trilogy. And I'm going to go with one of the main characters in Missport, which is Vin.

I feel like that would just be very, very helpful skill set to have. So, yeah, if you ever read Miss Ford and you want what I'm talking about, do it. There we go. Well, I'm excited for you to miss the competition moving forward. And there you have it. The more I talked with Emily, and the more I sort of ruminated on this interview, the happier I was that she did make the decision to come back, to decide to sort of settle.

her survivor story on her own terms because we get some incredible sound bites out of her. Yes, she may have been able to become a little bit softer, perhaps, in her tactics of approaching other people, but that doesn't mean she's not going to be her lovely blunt self with talking about the competition. So really excited to see what Emily is going to bring and what the next stage of this metamorphosis is going to look like when her feet hit the sand. But I'm going to put you all in quicksand for just a little bit as we take a quick break. But when I come back, at long last, after 22 years away, you'll listen to my interview with Jenna Lewis Doherty.

You know, I did some math here, perhaps in honor of the previous person that I spoke to on this podcast. It has been, by my count, 7,962 days since we last saw Jenna Lewis Doherty on Survivor. Of course, made a huge splash one of the cast members of that groundbreaking. Iconically, putting it mildly first season of television, that really forever changed the realm of what was possible. on the small screen when it comes to unscripted storytelling. Then Jenna comes back a few years later, becomes a power player right off the bat fashions herself,

the winner-killer, gets a couple of heads as a result, but loses her head at the final three. And for a long time, silence, which is not trademark for Jenna Lewis-Dority, if you know her. And so, at long last, she has returned. We got to have somebody from Survivor's first season to represent this milestone. And so not only is Jenna back to truly, you know, hold the flag for the old schoolers, but she's kind of coming in with a very new school cut throat mentality.

Here's what you need to know about Jenna Lewis Doherty. Jenna is 47 years old currently, originally from Franklin, New Hampshire, but lives now all the way out on the west coast from Woodland. California and is a realtor. I'm so excited for you to listen to this. Luckily, this tape did not get lost in the mail. Here is my preseason interview with Jenna Lewis Doherty. There used to be like everything was on video, like not digital.

Can you imagine when I did it? That's the thing. Like you're playing in the HD era now. No, I know. These people would have had to watch me on VHS. Like people were not. born that I'm going to play with. And the other half of the people, they weren't, they weren't. There are people here that I'm going to play with that were not born when I played my last time,

not even the first time, the last time I played. Oh my God. They were not born. Rizzo was not 100% 21 years ago. That kid can't drink alcohol. He can't grow a mustache. No way. Absolutely not. Was that kid born? So he has no idea who I am, which is great, because I am fully ready to exploit this whole survivor madness where there's an older woman and a younger guy. He's like, I need a mommy out there and I'm like yes and then you know as a mom I know that boys grow up and they break their mom's hearts like moving away so I will be ready to slit that boy's throat and toss them away that's only if I'm on Rizzo's team but I'm already planning for it well let's get let's get into all this because like I can not think of a better way to to jump into it I mean we got

to start by obviously the fact that we have not seen you on our screens no in 21 years yeah how has life been for you in these decades decades I know I was going to say I didn't mean to Put the name to it, but... No, no, no, no. Honestly, I don't feel old. I don't feel like, you know, I think I have grown so much since Survivor, not just since the first one,

but between Survivor 1 and Survivor All-Stars, I grew a lot, but in the past 20 years, I've grown a ton. I have calmed down. I think I played the first two times from a place of desperation. And I was desperate. I was a single mom coming out of a tiny town in New Hampshire

with no expectations of a big, beautiful, bold, adventurous life. And then I came out on Survivor and I learned some lessons the first time, number one. My name should have been Zelda. Thank you, Dr. Sean. But no, number one, actually, I learned I can do difficult things. And then on All-Stars, I learned to trust my own voice. I ran All-Stars from the day I landed. And I know it's not edited to look at that, but I did. On my, we landed, Rupert wanted to quit day two. That's true. Absolutely. I mean, the shelter would have done a lot better in retrospect. Oh, Jesus Christ.

Which, by the way, you see me. I don't say a word. I'm say a goddamn word. I'm like, I will sleep in that mud pit and because he is my ally. And I would sit at Ethan hated it. Oh my God, the best was Ethan and I had just done Eco Challenge together. So we were teammates. Yeah.

We had dated and he is still one of my best friends. To this day, I adore him. He's probably the only survivor I really keep up with a lot. I'm interesting. Yeah, and I adore him. But man, did he not like the. that I controlled it out there on All-Stars. He says in one of his things, he's like,

Jenna, like the godfather over there, who's going to be voted out? Oh, he did not like to be put on that back foot of not having control, especially with a girl that he used to date. I was going to say, it's a complicated dynamic to say the way. It was a complicated dynamic

because we were teammates, friends, and exes. A lot of my exes are friends. So it's not that dynamic, nearly as much as then you have to be on a tribe where you have to vote each other. Right, exactly. You don't have to do that a lot with your exes, except for me because I did use Mark Burnett's like survivor picks as my dating pool for like a decade.

It was great. They were all psychologically evaluated so that they weren't going to murder me. They were all cast specifically to be hot on a beach. Hot on a beach and like, you know, gregarious usually. Like it was my own survivor dating pool and I just like, it was assessful. I was going to say it's more like that stagnant water in all stars. It's like full of microbes. Yes. But you got to taste it to find that out.

You know what I mean? But sorry, yes, I came out on Survivor All-Stars. I learned something about myself and I learned I had my own voice. I learned that I was good at strategy, that I could play people, that I could understand the game. Now, I have to prove to myself I can play this faster version of the game. Yeah. That an old dog can learn new tricks, right? And everyone's like, oh, this new fast game, you're not even going to be prepared.

What? Like, I wasn't for the first one. Nobody knew what Survivor was going to be. We had no clue. we had to go out and play. And then I came back for the first time they ever brought people that knew each other back. And I had to learn those social dynamics. Of course I know what these, this is all going to break down to you.

How quickly can I make you like me and then slit your throat? How well can I lie to you and get you to believe me? How much can I trick you into who I am? Well, you and I were talking about this before we started. I mean, Borneo recently celebrated its 25th anniversary. And you feel like you are an unknown quantity coming. which is well because we have theoretically known you the longest out of anybody. So talk to me more about that.

Is it more so like the fact you haven't been on for so long? Is it the fact that you played maybe in a time where again the game felt so different? I think we also played in a time where we didn't have the outlets post that you got to see who I was. Like right now somebody comes off of Survivor, right? And they've got Twitter and Instagram feeds and they've got YouTube and so you get to see their life after. I did a lot after Survivor 1. It was the biggest thing in the world. Like I hosted MTV Spring Break back when it used to be.

I watched that Three's company. Yeah, exactly. Like, so we did so many things, but I don't think those really tied into who I was. Whereas I think the entire world has shifted because of what we created on Survivor and Survivor All-Stars is that you really kind of do want to see what the average person is doing. If that average person is exciting to watch and has an interesting story,

then you want to know what they're doing, right? We tune into YouTube stars. We turn into Instagram. Instagram people turn Insta-Famous because just their regular people who are doing what we did out on Survivor. But you don't know that about me because I'm not in that world. Number one, I am not friends with anybody out there. They have all been doing, number one, a lot of them have played together.

Number two, even if they haven't played together, they've gone to a bunch of these Survivor charity events. They've gone to all of these CBS premieres. I see them all the time, like, series at every premiere, and so is, I don't know, Stephanie has been to some. And, like, they're all in this Survivorverse. Yeah. I am not in this survivor group.

So it's not just that you haven't seen me in 21 years because I could have been all over, like Rupert and Ethan and all them, they're all over social media. Right. Unless you are looking to buy a house in Woodland, California, you probably are not on my feed. To be fair, there might be a lot more looking to do that after this. You might just have a whole, you might have 23 clients right now.

Oh, I hope so. Maybe not after I slit their throats. That's true. Will they be like, you know what, actually, if she can slash prices? Well, I actually, you joke about that, but I say to people all the time, like, my job is to convince people to work with me and trust me. Like, you have a lot of choices to use a realtor. You probably know for yourself.

And you're like, wow, okay, I need to trust that they have good negotiation skills, that they're going to be looking out for me, that they're going to be a little cutthroat on my behalf. Like, these are all things that I am going to use. Like, I negotiate contracts for a living. I make people like me for a living. I don't slit their throat after. I don't vote my clients off of an item. Necks are intact.

too. Yeah, they are. I mean, I actually love my clients. So when you find out that you're coming out here, what is your prep process like? Because to be fair, I mean, the Borneo thing was an entire unicorn, but looking at what the modern day game sort of comprises in terms of like challenges and things, there's certain skills you you boned up on? Firemaking. Because there, if there had been firemaking on All-Stars, I would have won that season. I was going to say if it wasn't the Purple Rock. If it wasn't, I absolutely would have won that season. A hundred percent I would have won that season. if there had been a final three even because it would have been Amber Rob and I

and I would have beaten them 100%. How did I prep? Well, I'm in good shape anyway. I mean, I like to work out. You know, I want to. Yeah, you should even show it up? Absolutely. That's an asset.

Yeah, like, I'm fit. But there's a different element to Survivor and it's not necessarily something you can really train for. It's like agility and balance. So I did build a balance beam in my backyard. And I would take my ping pong cattle and try to bring a ping pong over it. And I would like get it to where I could run across it. So we'll see how my balance is because I also, whenever I'm on a deserted island,

whenever I'm on an island, I can kind of feel the waves. So it sets off my balance a little bit. So it'll be interesting to see how I am at balance. But the challenge is you can only prepare to a certain point. Like I know a lot of people like Carson in the new era, like they 3D printed every single one. I'm not that technologically advanced. You should see what I have back there. I have a CD player.

But that was part of my gameplay, like pre-gameplay. Okay, so you're trying to be like, I'm stuck in the 2000s. Interesting. So from the get-go, I'm whispering right there. I know they're right there. I know they're right there. Yeah. But my thing was, of course, I know how to set up an MP3 player.

Like, I was the first series of people that learned how to set this up. Of course I know. But I got a CD player because I wanted them to see me sitting here, embroidering. I brought embroidery. Embroidering with my glasses and my CD player because they're going to be like, oh my God, how cute! She doesn't know how to play this game. It's pregame. I want them to underestimate me. I'm not here for any other reason than that they are going to completely underestimate me. Well, let's get into some of these people that will be that prey that I've been watching you, embroider for the better part of a few days. So we're going to play a game called friend or foe.

Okay. We're going to go down the list. And you give me either friend, someone that you were looking to eyeball an ally or foe, either someone you won't vibe with or like someone you're actively targeting as a threat. Okay. All right. So let's start from the beginning. Let's start from your fellow All-Stars cast member, Colby. Um, friend. I would say friend because I find him easily manipulated. I think I can easily manipulate him. I don't think he's a strategist. I think he's kind of, you know, not as highbrow. I think he's coming out here to prove himself, though, but I think he's coming out here to prove himself physically. I don't think he liked that he sucked at the challenges

when he was seen as like this, like, strong man of Survivor 2, Australia. So I think he's coming out here to prove himself, but I don't think it's in strategy. I think he's coming out here to prove himself physically to feel better about himself, which is great because if he's good at that, I'm going to need that. But I think that I can easily control him. So friend. How about Stephanie?

Stephanie Friend, for sure. She's Captain America, female version. So Captain Marvel, I should say. She's Captain Marvel. She's everything I wanted to be in a survivor player. Like, she's super strong. She's, like, beautiful. I think she can be funny.

I don't remember any offhand. But I think that she, too, is a lacking strategy. She's never really had a really great strategy. So I think that's somebody I can take by the reins and manipulate her. How about Surrey? Foe. Okay, tell me why. I do not trust Surrey at all.

I never have. When I watch her play, I wonder why people just keep letting her get further in the game. Why? Not that I don't find her likable, but people that have. or likable. Those are the people you need to get out. Those are the people that you need to target. She's very likable. But that means that I don't want to have her as my friend

or my ally because I can't trust her. Like I think that I could get to the point where I could trust Stephanie or I could trust Foley. Maybe not. Maybe they're coming in with a different game. But I don't think Ceres coming in with a different game. I think she's coming in with the same gameplay. And that means that I can't trust her. Ozzy friend. 100%. I actually get a really good vibe.

I don't know Ozzy. I met him once, like, I don't know, 2002, 2003. I don't know when his was, but I met him once. I get a really good vibe off Ozzy. I don't know. I really like Ozzy. He's actually going to be, I'm looking for Ozzy for my number ones. I'm hoping he's on my tribe.

How about Coach? Do you want to hear what I really think? I'll be going to listen. Okay, so I've been joking around, but honestly, I think Coach is the one that I want off first. And this really just does not come down to Survivor. this is that I read a lot of romantacy books, and he calls himself the dragon slayer. I'm a 47-year-woman who reads tons of romanty books. I am firmly in Camp Dragon. Like, I'm on the dragon side. I'm on the dragon side. Of course I am. Don't call yourself a dragon slayer. They are ancient and

majestic beasts, motherfucker. Like, I'm dragon slayer. I am hurt. When I vote him off, I am going to call that, like, I don't know, Operation. and Zayden or something. Like anybody else read Fourth Wing? Like, God damn, Dragon Slayer, I'm appalled. No, my wife is a huge fourth-wing reader, so I think she's very much... Team Dragon!

Team Dragon! What the fuck? Honestly, in this day, maids, you're still calling yourself a Dragon Slayer? Move it around, I don't know, like Troll Slayer or something. Maybe he could have gone after Russell. Yeah, exactly. He tried to slay a troll in a different way.

Right. How about Aubrey? Aubrey, like watching how she plays, I don't get a good read on what her strategies are. Okay. Because I feel like she, I think she's smart enough to convince people when she needs to form an alliance. But I don't think she ever comes in with a plan, which is good, because that's how Survivor ends up playing out as being adaptable, right?

And flexible and being able to manage those social connections well, even if they're brand new, you have to, you know, kind of throw yourself in because you're going to be mixed up in tribes and you're going to have your allies voted off and you have to kind of pivot, right? Yeah. I think she's really good at that. So I am on the fence. I really don't know yet. She's probably my, her and Genevieve are probably my two biggest question marks as far as friend or foe.

The others, I think I have a pretty good, like, I will mark them. But I think I do want to work with Aubrey? Okay. I think so. How about Chrissy? No. Mm. I don't.

I don't trust Chrissy. I think she's probably coming in playing a similar game to what I am, which is like. Interesting. Neither can live while the other survives. Yes. there cannot be two moms out here. Like, one of us has got to go. There can be only one mom.

This is not Mormon wives or sister wives. Like, there can only be one of us. Yeah, this is a monogamous game. The monogamous game. Like, you have one mommy, people. Like, I don't mind if it's an Oedipus complex, like one of these younger boy players, and I'll be like, I'll be your mommy right until I throw you up.

But there can be only one mommy. I think she's going to play a similar game. I think she's going to be like the, oh, I'm doting and I'm sweet. There can be two of those. I think that I'm more cutthroat than Chrissy. But I think that I can definitely see where she would play a game like me, and I don't want her around to mess up my game.

Let's go to our David versus Goliath trio. Okay. Angelina. I actually like Angelina. And I know that she's one of those controversial, like people either love or her or hate her, but I think she played decently. And the other thing about these friend or foes, I got to tell you, is that I have in the back of my head how I'm going to be.

to manipulate each of them. Like, I call it conjecture flattery is what I call it. Like, I have a theory that all of these people want to hear something about themselves that nobody else is giving them credit for.

So you've got people like, you know, Chrissy and Angelina and these people that, like, have played these games where they've pivoted and strategy, but nobody's coming up and telling Angelina like how marvelous she is at these challenges. I can't wait. for her to do one thing right and I'm just going to give her so much praise because

Angelina really loves praise that's what I know I'm even looking at her now with her eyelashes all done she is looking for that close up and I am going to give it to her you've got the camera oh I'm going to be like oh my god you're so much more beautiful in person and you're so good at these challenges how do you do this they did not capture this about you Angelina like conjecture flattery yeah when you watch Genevieve when you watch Genevieve walk up here if she hasn't yet when you do watch how she Jennifer walks would like this purpose. Genevieve's tall.

Genevieve was a woman that was tall before the others weren't tall. So she made herself small. So now she consciously tries to walk with a grace. So I will for sure be telling her, oh my gosh, you'll just walk with such grace. Things that nobody's sitting and telling me, Genevieve, they all want to talk to her about strategy. I want her to like me.

So I'm going to do conjecture flattery is how I get all of these people to like me and not. You don't vote out who you like. How about Christian? Christian. I have mixed feelings on Christian. Do you want to know what I've really? Please, always.

Christian looks like the Chucky doll. Which, I know that that sounds like it was my era, and I should be like, oh my God, I loved, nobody loves Chucky. He's free. I'm not thinking that doll is a lot of friends by the end. Yeah, no. He always says, he always says want to play,

but nobody wants to play. Nobody wants to play. Well, I don't know about playing Christian. I think that Christian tries, really hard to be likable, which is great to keep around for a little while. So I think he could be a lackey. Okay. The other thing about Christian, I do think he has like these very insect like movements.

Robotic almost. Kind of robotic, but less like that. Have you ever seen James and the Giant Peach? Oh, yeah, like that. Like the stop motion bugs. He's the centipede. And now that you see it, you never get unseeked. So I want to pop a stogie in his mouth and call him Lieutenant Dan because he honestly.

And they chop his legs off. And chop his legs off. Like he moved? like this and all I see are like 50 other legs behind him. Like he, so as far as playing with Christian, I think that I could make him my lackey. How about Mike White? Ooh, Mike White's tricky. Mike White's tricky because Mike White is in Hollywood.

So Mike White might see past my bad acting skills. We've already touched on the fact that I just want to get people to like me so that I can vote them off. And this is a game of lying to every single person. Like either they're in your alliance and you're going to have to lie to them at some point. They're not in your lines. And you have to tell them, you have to make a believable lie if you want it to be a blind side, right? So I have to trust in my acting skills against somebody who's actually doing this for a living. I think I can do it. But do I want to work with Mike White? Yes. Okay. I think that he can be trustworthy enough, and I think that he will buy him to my act.

How about Rick Devons? No. But I know exactly how you can treat Rick Devin's. Rick Devin's just wants to be liked. even in his season. Like he didn't feel like anybody really liked Rick Devin's. So you just tell Rick Devin's how much you like him and how glad you are to have him on your side and you will have Rick Devin's right here. All right, well, let's get into the new era. I'm so excited to hear her thoughts.

Let's start with Jonathan. Jonathan, yes. I want to play with Jonathan right up until I slit his throat. But yes, I want him in my alliance because the guy is a beast. He's going to help win challenges. But also, beasts can be taken down. Like, you can get a very good

group of people to see him as the target that you want him to be. It's very easy to paint a target on Jonathan. It's a big target. So I think for sure. All right. So there are a couple winners out here. Yeah. And you famously, though not the only person, but you were definitely the most vocal.

Winner killer. Yeah. That's a fantastic way to put it. Are you carrying that over to D as an example? I think that I always want the winners out because it's dangerous territory ever since Sandra won. Being a winner. they can get to that final tribal council and say,

hey, I had a huge target painted on me for being a winner. Like, I wanted to paint, yes, get out, because we all want to have our shot at winning. But it is a very strong argument to be sitting in the final three and tell them, hey, I had all odds against me as a winner, and I still got here. Right. So I think that I would still go with the winner-killer,

and I think I'd try to take D out. How about Emily? I like Emily. I think you can trust Emily. Like watching Emily play, I think she played with a lot of heart. And you saw the whole arc of Emily. And I really enjoyed that arc. Like, I get it.

When she sat there on that first thing and she's like, they're talking about aliens and pyramids, which I'm so into, by the way. But I love that she sat there and was like, I have no idea who these people are. Like, I got that. And she was honest. And she was like, she said what you wanted. And then she learned. You watched her learn a little bit how to play. But as she came into that, she came into Emily.

And she became like a really cool person. And so I would really like to play with Emily. How about Charlie? Charlie, there's that edipus complex. Charlie had Maria, and he liked that because she was the older mom. And they were like, oh, memoramalgam and be, like, this is going to be great because I can take Charlie and be like, oh, my little son who loves Taylor Swift. My son does love Taylor Swift. So is my daughter.

But I think I can play up on that mom's son thing dynamic. To be fair, it did not work out for him last time with his motherly figure. So it could be either or. That's okay. That means that he's going to think he has the upper hands, which is great. You want people to think that they can beat you. They're not going to keep you around unless they think they can beat you. There's the bottom line. People are like, I need to show authority and like, no, you need to convince, I always say, especially on a returning season, we all have our redemption stories, right? So I have to find out what your redemption story is, and I have to make sure that mine, you see me as integral to your plan. And as soon as you've do that, you will take me far. Like, I need to make sure you think you can beat me or take me out when it's necessary. I need you to think that. Otherwise, we're not going to work out. I got to get your thoughts on your fellow realtor. Yes. Q. What do you think about him? I think Q is great because Q will get voted off very quickly. Q is absolute chaos spelled with a Q. Like, chaos, chaos, chaos, chaos.

Like, he is absolute shit show out here, which is amazing because you want to work with Q because you can cut that guy loose at any time. All you got to do to someone else is be like, Q, and they're like, yes, Q. So I think I definitely work with Q, but not for long. Yeah. How about Tiffany? I don't know about Tiffany. I don't have a good- fellow eighth-placer.

Yeah, but I don't get a good read on her. Like, I feel like I came out with like a strategy and you knew where I stood and I was vocal about it. And I don't think I ever heard from Tiffany, like what a plan was. She didn't see things to the end. So I think she's probably had some time to reflect on that. So I think of her as a positive. She's the friend territory. Yeah.

She's not a foe, which is good. All right. Well, let's move into, we talked about Genevieve. Let's get into some of these recent faces. Yeah. Joe. Joe. I think, well, Joe's from my area.

He's from West Sack. Okay. And I live about 18 minutes from Joe. And I'm a Sacramento Kingsman. I mean, I literally. lived like 18 minutes from downtown Sack and he's in Sack. What do I think of Joe? I think here's another thing, another theory of mine for Spiger. You have people who come out here and I don't know why, but they want to play by being noble. They want to tell you I didn't lie to anyone.

Please, we are all here to lie. Don't tell me you didn't lie to anyone. Lie to everybody who helped me blindside. But just because you didn't lie to me yet, like I'm supposed to believe that you don't want to lie. But I have a plan that you use the people who want to be noble to vote out the people who are chaos, like Q. So the noble you use to vote them out, but then you can always get the noble out because they're noble. They're like, I want to be fair.

Nothing in Survivor's fair. How about Camilla? I actually really like Camilla. Everybody does, right? Everyone's like, oh, Pamela's sneaky. Camilla had kind of what I did in All-Star. She had an alliance that she wrote it all the way to the end. And they worked together beautifully in tandem.

Like, she never wanted to turn on him. which I love. I'm hoping that she doesn't do a complete heel turn like I did from one to eight and all stars. Like I did a complete heel turn. Right. She may. And she may go,

everyone's expecting me to have this one person, even if it's not Kyle, like one person and then like I can't pivot. And she may be out here to make her big play and like cut down her ally. But she's trustworthy. She's smart. I love Camilla. Kyle.

Is he going to be another victim of the winter killer? No, I like Kyle. He's the one exception. Yeah, I like Kyle. I would, I would place Kyle in the top winner category of New Era.

Not D. I don't consider her. Interesting. What was it about Kyle in particular? Kyle had to maneuver a lot. Kyle's first play with him and Camilla when they got switched up on the tribes and they did all the acting of like, one of us is going home. Where? Where? And then he played the idol.

I thought that was beautifully done. And it set the tone for those two. Like it could have been either of them, honestly. And I would love them both. But I love Kyle and Camilla. I just don't want them together. Well, you talked about this a little bit at the beginning, but just a little bit back around.

Your thoughts on the 49ers. I'm actually really excited to play with the 49ers. Number one, because I do see that sort of like mommy complex, I might be able to use these young ins who were not even born the last time I played. Not the first time I played. Not just that, because I'm an original. But the last time, they were not, they're not 21 years old. Like, floppy-haired little Rizzo.

I think he's so cute. Like, he can't even grow a mustache. He can't shoot a shot of whiskey. I am going to be able to mommy that boy right until the final end when I need to cut him. He's probably going to think the same thing about me, but every young man out here has been susceptible to the mommy. And I will be like, oh, you sweet little thing. I will mommy him right until the end.

What about the other one? Oh, I love Savannah. Oh, I actually really, really love Savannah. There's something very cunning about Savannah, which I cannot wait. I love your faces. You're like, hmm, where did you get that? I'm just trying to throw you off as much as I can. No, I know.

I like Savannah. Savannah's my friend. She's like one of the four people I really am hoping is on my tribe, so I get to work with her. Kyle's one, too. Ozzie's one only because he catches a lot of fish. I want to be fed. But I think that she is cunning. I can kind of see it in her.

She looks athletic like a gymnast. So I think that one of them could have won. Nobody knows. or they're dating or hell they may be even married they may be brother and sister none of us know like who the fuck knows who they are they could be step brother and sister nobody knows their relationship but i will tell you this is my favorite quote that i want to give you yeah survivor 50 is not gen pop like this is death row so to get here you had to do some bad shit oh i love that and i'm saying that we don't know what they've done right but whatever they did to get here they did some bad shit is there one person

that you wish could come out here from a previous season, who did not make the cast? Who would that be? Ethan. I would want to see Ethan. He's been my true friend for a very long time. We played all-stars together, but we were also teammates

and did Ego Challenge here in Fiji 23 years ago. Wow. So, like, he's my teammate too, but I would want to see Ethan out here. Last thing I'm going to ask, it's a little bit of an odd question, but obviously you know your way around a loved one's visit or two,

but for this version of the loved ones visit, you can only bring a celebrity or a fictional character out as a loved one. You have to give me a minute. Please, take your time. Celebrity, I'd want Eminem. Okay. I threw him in a pool once, and like his bodyguards, I was in his video, and he was terrified of the water, terrified of the water.

And so he goes like this, but I was a cute 22-year-old girl, so I was like this, give me a hug. And so he's like, I don't trust you. He shouldn't have trusted me. So he leans down, and I pulled the fucker into the, I don't know why. Why do you do this to him? what you're about to do. That's exactly it. I'm welcoming you in

and then I'm pulling you in the pool with me. What I'm doing? And I think to myself like, who the fuck did you think you are? It's embarrassing. How egotistical I was that I'm like, come here, Eminem. After I know he's terrified and he sensed it too.

It was like a dog that you're like, he's like, I don't know. So it's like a man cult. Like I'm so sorry Eminem, come out, see me. No, no, no. I think that he would offer some really good life advice. I think he had, I mean, his, the theme song for me is lose yourself for this.

Like, you've got, One shot. One opportunity. Will you capture it? So that's playing through my head. But he's saying that from a place that's what he grew up. He was a young dad, single dad, going through fame. I was a young single mom. So I would 100% have Eminem here. Fictional character. Carl from dungeon crawler Carl. Okay. The reference is lost on me, but I'd love to hear more about it. Fuck, man, you do not know the dungeon crawler Carl series? I don't, I've heard of it. God damn it, donut. Seriously, I'm going to say that every time I stub a toe. Just can't wait.

God damn it, donut. Go read it. It's the best thing is. I'm going to check it out now. This is on the top of my wish list. Yes, I would bring Carl. I love this. Well, I know your poems are sweaty.

You ready to serve up some mom spaghetti. I am. Yeah, mom spaghetti, exactly. There we go. I am the mom. I cannot tell you how much my survivor-loving heart was beating getting to sit there and talk with Jenna Lewis Dordy from the very first season of this show.

She was talking about Eminem, and I was losing myself, getting the chance to hear all of her thoughts from, you know, memories back in the days of Rupert's Long cabin to a lot of her takes on her competition, a lot of interesting comparisons about one of her fellow tribe members, it turns out, and Christian Hubecki in particular. So she's going to be kind of proof of concept,

of this casting, right, as to can somebody from the first season of Survivor, which was so entirely different, be able to fit into this environment that is constantly moving and constantly looking to stab each other in the back? If there is one person who is game to do so, it probably is Jenna.

So that's going to do it for today's Survivor 50 preseason interviews. We're already halfway through the CELA, tribe. Of course, today we talked about two of the women, but tomorrow we're playing with the boys and the big boys, as we are talking about two of the alpha males of both the old school as well as the new era. You'll be hearing my interviews with Joe Hunter and Ozzy Luce. But make sure you don't miss out on any of that. Go to Rob has a website.com slash YouTube to watch the video versions of all of these interviews.

And of course, we know survivor.com to make sure you're subscribed to all the podcasts we have going on between these daily drops of our cast interviews as well as me and Rob breaking down each tribe once we finish each little batch. Thank you all, as always,

so much for listening. Hope you've been enjoying them so far. Four down, 22, go. Tomorrow, again, my interviews with Joe and Ozzie. Until then, everybody. Take care. Bye-bye.