RHAP: We Know Survivor - Is Parvati the Survivor GOAT?

Episode Date: June 28, 2026

Is Parvati the Survivor GOAT? Who really owns the title of Survivor’s Greatest of All Time? On this special installment of the Survivor GOAT series, Rob Cesternino is joined by Mike Bloom to put Parvati Shallow’s legendary gameplay under the microscope. As Survivor continues to celebrate its iconic history, Rob and Mike debate whether Parvati’s bold moves, social mastery, and challenge prowess are enough to earn her the GOAT crown. The conversation jumps right into Parvati’s resume, covering her historic double idol play in Heroes vs. Villains and her more recent coup in Australian Survivor: Australia vs. the World. Mike makes the case for Parvati’s unmatched ability to survive as an ongoing target and how her strategic thinking and charm have set her apart across multiple eras of Survivor. Rob pushes back, questioning moments where Parvati’s social game didn’t connect and whether her reputation sometimes worked to her disadvantage. Together, they break down Parvati’s alliances, challenge dominance, and her impact on the way Survivor is played—not just by women, but by everyone who’s followed in her footsteps. Key points of interest discussed include: – Parvati’s signature idol play that flipped Heroes vs. Villains on its head – How her relationships and alliances, especially with players like Danielle and Cirie, shaped the outcomes of her seasons – The memorable moment in Australian Survivor when Parvati persuaded an opponent NOT to play an idol for themselves – Debating if her legacy (and even her “celebrity” factor) gives her a modern edge—or makes her more vulnerable – The strengths and shortcomings of Parvati’s social game when facing enemies versus allies As Rob and Mike weigh Parvati’s place among icons like Sandra, Boston Rob, and Tony, the big question remains: Does Parvati’s game truly stand the test of time, or did certain missteps keep her from GOAT status? Will her bold moves—and her reputation—help or hurt her if she returns again? Dive in to hear if Parvati gets your vote as Survivor’s GOAT, and stick around for debate about alliances, idol plays, and which legends might take the crown next! Chapters: 0:00 Is Parvati Shallow the GOAT? 2:29 Parvati’s Unique Survivor Resume 4:44 Defining Greatness in Survivor 6:13 Surviving Early Season Targeting 9:10 Parvati’s Strength in Alliances 12:13 Heroes vs. Villains Double Idol Move 19:28 Masterminding Knowledge Is Power Steal 25:16 Debating Australian Survivor’s Legitimacy 29:48 Parvati’s Social Game Weaknesses 34:14 Managing Allies and Perceptions 38:02 Handling Russell in Heroes vs. Villains 46:56 Parvati’s Celebrity Aura Advantage 51:12 Dominating Endurance Immunity Challenges 55:01 Parvati on Winners at War 57:25 Parvati’s Legacy and Influence 1:01:29 Danny Bonaduce Alters Survivor History 1:07:14 Previewing Cirie Fields Episode To order Rob’s book, The Tribe and I Have Spoken, visit www.robhasabook.com Never miss a minute of RHAP’s extensive Survivor coverage! LISTEN: Subscribe to the Survivor podcast feed WATCH:  Watch and subscribe to the podcast on YouTube SUPPORT:  Become a RHAP Patron for bonus content, access to Facebook and Discord groups plus more great perks!

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Saying that Parvety Shallow is not the greatest player of all time, is that kosher? Mm-hmm. We'll see. We'll find out here today. We have been going through our five-part series trying to figure out who is Survivor's goat. We have talked about is Tony the goat. Maybe Sandra is the goat. Maybe Boston Rob is the goat.

And now today we're talking about Parvety. Next time we will round out this five-part series talking about it. Maybe Surrey. Parvety's partner in crime on a number of occasions. Maybe she is the goat. We'll talk about that here next week. But the task at hand, Parvety shallow, Mike. And I know you relish, speaking of maybe something you might put on a kosher hot dog.

You relish this opportunity. My mood is not sourcrow. It's getting the opportunity to take the position of pro here. Because what I'm really excited to talk about when it comes to, poverty's overall body of work is the fact that I do feel like out of the people we've talked about thus far, she has the most recent resume point and then some. You know, we have talked about the success of Tony, Sandra, Boston, Rob, from their early days all the way through as recent as, you know, the 2020s.

But Parvety picks up her second win as recent as last year. So when we talk about, you know, the various games they were able to put together, We have some very recent work that we get to refer to here. And as I alluded to last time, certainly at the end of Australia versus the world, I believed that Parvety was the goat. And so, you know, we talked a little bit. I was able to convince myself maybe in a couple of directions

over the course of this. But Rob, I deluded myself once again. I put myself right back in the poverty camp for the sake of this exercise. And we'll see if I leave the podcast feeling the same way. Okay. If you have missed any of the previous parts of this series, what we have done is that we have flipped a coin.

And after that coin flip, one of us is in charge of trying to make the case. The other is trying to be the devil's advocate, maybe why they might not be the goat. That is what we here are here to do once again. Okay, remember, there's a coin flip that decided how this podcast was going to unfold. Why, right, why don't you just say there was a bottle that you, were presented with and when you opened it up at the end of our podcast, it said that you were forced to take the antiposition. I think that would really satiate all the poverty fans out there. Yes, that would be very Cook Islands coded. But I myself was recently asked in different

red carpet interviews of who is Survivor's Goat. I believe, Rob, when you came into the parade office, so you were asked that question as well. by you. Yes. And so I myself have given most recently poverty has the answer to this question. So this will be a thought exercise for me to work on making the case why she could not be. All right. Well, let's dive into it. Shall we? We'll talk about the mistress of murder, the Duchess of deception, the Black Widow herself, and quite the web that she has woven over the course of two decades on reality television here, Rob, because I want to start with your words

in my opening argument here, because for the past couple of weeks, you have sort of settled upon your own personal criteria for picking the goat, which is, I want sustainability, I guess, for lack of a better term. I believe that the goat, and I'm sort of putting words of your mouth here,

but paraphrasing a little bit, is someone who, if you ran a survivor simulation, they would have the skill set and the perception that the most amount of times would tend to do well the most. And to that I say, Mother Effer, I take your fiction and I raise you the reality

because across all of survivor history, only two people have made it to not one, not two, but three, final tribal councils. And only one person has done it in English-speaking franchises. And that one person has also won the game twice. Look no further than the very title of this podcast, Robert. Here is the deal or no deal on Poverty Shallow.

We talk through all of these podcasts about, in general, the goat is somebody who should have an incredibly well-rounded game. Someone who's been able to play from the top as well as from the bottom, who's responsible for some of the most innovative and impressive moves in Survivor history, someone who has inspired myriad players that have come after them, and someone who has a game that has been able to replicate its success multiple times over. And I could think of no better person to fit every single piece of that criteria. Not to mention, Rob, she is the only person who has a strategy that also resonates in the bedroom. Well, that goes without saying. Exactly. The actions speak louder than words in that capacity. So yeah,

I think that there's going to be a lot of arguments we made about poverty, obviously, over the course of this. But to me, the thing that strikes truest is, talk all the time about the various things that have to go right and go wrong to make it to the end of a game of Survivor, let alone win. And I think what puts Parvety above so many of these people that we've talked about, again, we've talked about the other two-time winners in the form of Tony and Sandra. But all three times that Parvety made it to the final day of her respective seasons. She hit the beach on day one

and someone said she's got to go. All three of those seasons, she was actively targeted as the first boot. Jerry Manthy said that girl is a virus, but damn, did she not contract parvety fever

by the end of it? They all did. And so, we'll talk about this, but I cannot imagine that's coincidental whatsoever. The fact that as much as you talk about people like Sandra Sarie being able to be underestimated and go back to this Jesse Pinkman meme of she can't keep getting away with this, I would wager that poverty satiates that perspective even more,

considering that we have firsthand evidence nearly every season she plays in of someone saying we've got to vote poverty out and they never do. I mean, sometimes they do. Two times they've done it. Okay. Listen, that's enough. That's as many times

as I've been voted out. I guess that's true, but that's... Am I the greatest player of all time, Mike? I mean, you were not... You're so humble, Rob,

that you did not submit yourself for it. You just revealed the sixth mystery podcast that will be coming to this feed. That's next month. That's next month. But, okay, very fair points all around. Parvety has done

her great work over a myriad. of seasons of with Micronesia and then most recently in Australian Survivor as you brought up to me

and I have to really think about how to approach this Mike I feel like that Parvety is really a great player in an ensemble I think that she really

shines as being a person who she has gifts. She has superpowers. And when you put her in any given form of her Avengers Black Widow Brigade, she's going to shine in that. Of which Black Widow is a member as well. Yes. Yes. But as a as a soloist, as a solo artist, is she able to resonate in the same way. So that is, it's an interesting question because, yes, on paper, when we talk about the things that poverty has been able to contribute in terms of the survivor tapestry, we look at the Black Widow Brigade, we look at the alliance that she had with Danielle and with Russell.

To that, I first say, we should not necessarily punish the fact that poverty has very loyal friends that want to work with. You know, like Tony, what he was able to do in Kagayan is incredibly impressive, but he's the one that's deciding to take this all on the chin, essentially, alongside Wu, to be like, yes, I'm my own person. But Boston Rob is someone who has also crafted some fantastic Survivor games alongside people. As much as Sandra ascribed to the anybody but me perspective, she has certainly gotten to the end on the backs of either very close allies

or people who erroneously felt like they could. could beat her and wanted to take her to the end. If anything, I think that speaks towards Poverty's ability to charm and disarm and to be able to feel like, despite how powerful of a personality I am, you want to keep me within this group. This is not an instance where it's like, okay, but Poverty is the real head honcho, so we're going to topple her eventually. Within these powerful alliances, we haven't really experienced any sort of like discord from within that caused Parvety's allies to turn on her. That's what's so interesting.

One of the many things about Parvety's entire resume of work is that despite being labeled this villain, I think, due to, you know, the playfulness with which she regards her fellow castaways in confessionals and the cutthroat behavior that she certainly was able to, you know, revel in in Micronesia, she is an incredibly loyal ally. You know, she did betray some people in Micronesia, yes, but that's because she was able to get herself in a really good spot or a hot pickle at the merge surrounding herself with so many people from essentially all sides. But outside of that, there weren't really a lot of instances where she has actively and unnecessarily betrayed people. And if that was the case, it was more so a, hey, you're coming for me. And so I have to come for you.

and circling all the way back to the very first point you raised here, Rob, I'm going to completely go against it. I'll push back against it because, yes, some of Parvety's most well-known moves involve other people. The Parvety Shallow has made some of the most impressive individualistic moves that I have ever seen someone make across 26 years of Survivor. Well, name them. Okay.

Hey, let's do it, shall be? You fell right for my trap, Black Widow style. Let's talk about this double idol play in Heroes versus Bens. Because, yes, Russell does give her an idol. But Parvany is the driver in that merge scenario. She is the one who has all the information. She was able to ferret out through Amanda's, you know, not necessarily deep skills of deception.

that the heroes are gunning for her, but they're not gunning for her at this. Parvety makes the wise decision to not so, and not so discreetly drop the information that she has an idol, which she is able to really bold and underline by throwing the immunity challenge to Danielle. And so when Amanda tells her,

oh, well, if you have that thing, you better play it. Parvety is able to clock to her face, okay, I know the plan is not me. Obviously, this is something that's going to lead to Danielle's ouster down the line, but her and Danielle are the only people who know that she has an idol herself, something she has very much kept in private so that it doesn't necessarily become a piece of public information, especially because the public information has warped this weird narrative about her as the puppet master,

as yet again the day one target in this merge tribe. Despite being called yin-yang here, Rob, there's quite an imbalance in terms of target. Everyone had Parvety's names on their lips. It was Villains Beach all over again. Maybe that's why they wanted to name the tribe villains. All villains. All villains, right, to just really underline that perspective.

But I really do feel like in this move of giving an idol to Jerry and giving an idol to San Diego. First off, it really represents the gutsyness and riskiness with which Parvety plays, which is something we really pride Tony for, right? And not to say that Big Moos will always win you the game, but it's that ability to put everything out there, you know, to accrue some short-term cost in the hopes of long-term gain that is survivor investment at its finest.

And Parvety was, again, banking on her reeds. and the fact that despite everyone saying my name, I am not the one who's getting votes right here. So if I play these idols on the other two people that locks in our entire side as guaranteed safe, if I get five votes against me, this pretty much secures Sandra the loosest end to my side, makes her feel indebted to me.

So there's no way she's going to turn on me. And look, then it's 4-4 at the re. vote, then it's a rock draw, and guess who's safe? Me. In this move, I believe Parvety Shaldo represents the three core tenets that we typically look at when it comes to a prototypical survivor game. Strategic, social, physical. Obviously, the strategic merits kind of speak for themselves. She was able to, again, truly firsthand wield power showcase to everyone in the jury and those who would be able to be able to on the jury. I have all the power. I tricked you. You were coming for me. I'm taking hold of this

tribal council. I'm taking the driver's seat for the rest of the game. Social. Again, because of her relationship with Amanda, she was able to have a very proper and correct read as to where the votes were going. And I would say physical. She could have stood up on that poll to kingdom come. But she knew a key facet of this plan was that she wouldn't be immune because if she was, then they would be gunning for Danielle. And so she purposely steps down from that challenge to give Danielle the win, which was a necessary point in this legendary survivor move. So again, yes, the move on paper is that an entire alliance was essentially protected because, you know, the heroes thought that Russell would flip, so they wouldn't have voted for him. But if you really unpack it,

Parvety was behind every single thing that was necessary to have the villains survive that boat. It is one of the greatest moments in Survivor history. There's no denying that, Mike. But in terms of the inception of this great and wonderful move, I asked Parvety herself about this. Last year, Parvety was on the podcast. She was talking about her wonderful book, Nice girls don't win. And we talked about this.

And I happened to be rewatching Survivor Heroes versus Villains. It was the 15-year anniversary. And Josh Wiggler and I were doing a re-watch about this. And I asked her about this move. And I asked her about how she came up with this idea. And she told me that was actually Danielle D. Lorenzo who had the idea to make this idol play.

So yes, she was the person who handed out the idols. but is Danielle D. Lorenzo the greatest player in Survivor History, Mike? To that, I would say, does that not speak to the choice of allies that poverty has and the ability to build such strong relationships that they would go to her instead of selling her down the river and say, here's how we can protect you. Moving forward. Yes, of course, it's great to have those innovators and the people who are able to come up with these ideas. But don't they say that the best leaders are those who surround themselves with people who are smarter than their own? Aren't the best people who are able to sit

at the head of the company, the delegators, the ones who are able to inspire others to create their own forms of creative gameplay to bring the ideas to them. And not to mention, it's one thing to come up with the idea. It's another thing to execute. And I don't know if any other survivor player that happen to be in Parvety's spot, would be able to make this happen. Because again, A, it relies on someone as physically capable in the challenges as Parvety to last long enough to ensure that Danielle is going to win. But it's also somebody who has relationships on the other side to be able to get this intel, sort of like haphazardly through Amanda, to be able to make the read to play these idols properly. So even if someone else came up with the idea, that's 10% of the work.

Parvety is responsible for the chief 90% of it, including getting the credit for it. I guarantee you, if it was a Parvety Russell Danielle Final 3, do you think Parvety's sitting there and saying, well, actually, Danielle was the one that told me to play those two idols? And she wouldn't say that of the Final Tropa Council, of course. But, hey, you never know, Mike. This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery

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It's my one daily pack of gummies covering my greens, vitamins, and minerals. Plus, it has six grams of prebiotic fiber, which is more than two cups of broccoli. No mixing powders, no giant pills, no hassle. I just rip open the pack and I'm done. They taste good and they make it easy to stay on top of my health, even when life gets busy. Save up to 52% with the code podcast at grooms.com. That's code podcast at g-r-un-s.com. All right, well, let me turn to her other big individualistic move here,

because here's one of the other things, Rob, that makes poverty the goat, is that she is a tear above everyone else with this move alone. You know, again, we talk about all the various successes these people have had, but I've talked throughout this entire process about how it's not necessarily about quantity, it's about quality. Listen, I think any survivor player would be entirely satisfied.

They can die happy knowing that they have accomplished an absolutely legendary move pretty much on their own over the course of Survivor. But Parvety Shallow was able to make it happen twice. Now, we haven't really talked about Australia versus the world in any of these previous podcasts or Australian Survivor in general.

You know, Tony was a blip on it. Sandra put together actually a very impressive performance, but goes out in the pre-merge. So apologies here. I'm going to spoil the ever-living bleep out of this because this is part of the second way. I mean, that's also very true. But I really want to set the table here for quite the meal

at the final eight of Australian Survivor, Australia versus the world. Because Stommy, have you heard this before, Rob? at a certain point, everyone's saying, wow, poverty is a really big threat. Much like Heroes versus Villains, she is one of only a few winners brought into the game, and at this point, she is the last winner remaining besides Lisa,

amongst this group of all-stars of venerated players. And she just catches a bad vibe that even her closest allies, with the exception of Surrey, are turning on her. On paper, this should be an easy, six to two vote against her. But Parvety has a couple things in her pocket, yet again.

A, she has an idol, but more importantly for this exercise, she has knowledge is power, which happened to be found when Luke sent her out of the auction. She got a big bundle of cookies, but right at the bottom of the jar amongst the shards of glass was something that would truly cut the throats of a lot of other people in this game. Now, knowledge is power, I believe it was the order of operations was that if you have played knowledge as power, you cannot do it after the votes have been cast. You have to ask somebody for their advantage or their idol before anyone gets up to vote.

But there's a lot of chaos. There's a lot of fracas. Parvety really just throws everything into disarray by being like, hey, I know I'm in trouble. Try to get a live tribal council going. So she takes out her idol, puts it around her neck, saying, I don't know if I'm going to play it for me, I don't know if I'm going to play it for Surrey, against something straight out of a Tony style of gameplay.

And then she finds out that Cass, who is her target, also has an idol. Well, crap. Then if Cass plays the idol for herself, that nullifies all the votes against her. If they voted for Surrey, if they bought Parvety's idol bluff, That means sorry is gone.

That might mean that Parvety is gone if they didn't buy the bluff. So Parvety says, hold up, sis, and pulls out her knowledge as power and decides to omit a very key piece of information. I talked out the wazoo about Tony absolutely being able to weaponize production, something that I wish more players did in lying that the Tyler Perry Idol expired one round later than it actually did. Parvety decides to completely lie about how knowledge as power works. She basically implies in reading the advantage right there, right then, oh, I can steal your idol right now. And so basically says, hey, I'm not going to use it on you. Essentially, if you use the idol on yourself, I'm going to take it from you.

You're safe. Don't worry. she has somehow able to talk someone out of using an idol on themselves when they absolutely needed to. She completely miscast, completely misdirects her to use the idol on Lisa, setting up a blindside. This is Parvety branded from beginning to end, and it's enacted over the course of just a couple of hours. I said at the time that this is the most impressive move that she has done across five seasons of Survivor. And again, considering what I just spoke about five minutes ago, that is saying something. You know, Mike, there's some people that say that Australian Survivor versus the world isn't even a real Survivor season.

Some people said it's only maybe it should be half a Survivor season. All right. Let's get into this. I'm just saying that I've heard it both ways. Well, first off, let me just say, say it with my whole bird chest here. Australian Survivor versus the world is a survivor season. We could have this day's argument four days until the cows come home. But I feel like, especially if you're comparing it to Australian Survivor, you're opening up a whole can of vegemite with that. If we are basic...

It's a jar. I guess it would be a jar, I suppose. You've had the Vegemites. You can speak to that first. So I would say put a cork hat in it, people, because then if we're going to speak about, okay, do we value people's games based on the number of days that we play? Well, congratulations, Christy Bennett. You're the goat.

Because you played the most days. Come on. That's like carried away. But let's look at this because I think another argument that can be made as you've been alluding to is, okay, 16 days doesn't matter. But there were only 14 contestants on Australia versus. the world. To that I say, I didn't think of that. Let's drill into

the numbers, people. Parvety voted nine times in Australia versus the world. Because they merged at 10. It was a very small pre-merge. Now, when we started this entire process, there have been

some names that have been thrown out of other people that might be involved in the goat conversation. Let me just list them off here. Todd Herzog, brilliant. game in Survivor China. Very good. Voted nine times.

Earl Cole, some have said one of the greatest one-time players in Survivor history, hashtag Bring Back Earl, voted nine times in Survivor Fiji. Tom Westman, some have said, most dominant game of all time. It's because his ass didn't go to tribal council in the first half of the game. Two fewer tribal councils. than Parvety. But let's look at, you know, some recent standouts. D.

Kyle Aubrey, these new era stalwarts, or even someone like Kim Spradlin. Again, someone who maybe next to Boston Rob played one of the most dominant games of all time, all went to 10 tribal councils, voted 10 times. So even though this game, this game was compressed over the course of two weeks

and changed so I'm not sure how Tony would describe to it. I think it'd be three weeks according to him so maybe that's helping her case a little bit more. It's not like she went to three and that was it. This is not some sort of like Survivor Exhibition match.

She was starving on an island and she was voting with the frequency that either keeps pace or sometimes outmatches some of these. other winners that people have thrown out to be in this very conversation. Yeah. That's fair.

She did a really great job with that particular moment in Australian Survivor and had a great understanding of how the advantage worked and what she was able to say, even playing JLP for not answering his question and him asking her multiple times and her just reading back the same part of the clue over and over and again and he's in a tough spot there because he's like no there's another part you need to read again if it was Big Brother they absolutely would have

come over the loudspeaker you can't use production as a strategy but again that's what makes the gray areas of survivors so intriguing a quarter of a century on is that there's no rule against it and so Parvety is able to showcase how you can use anything and everything

to your advantage with an advantage. It should also be mentioned at that tribal council, not only did she get cast to go completely in the other way, but she subsequently is able to lock in a final four alliance, which, surprise, surprise, she will take to the end game with her. That's the other great thing about poverty

is not only is she putting herself... That was wild that they went for that. I mean, to be fair, Luke and Janine was a bit of a beggars, can't be choosers, situation where like they were already on the bottom, right? The Australians were just bleeding out in terms of numbers. So they were going to go with whatever. But that showcases the charm and ability that Parvety has to make people feel comfortable. I think a lot of people speak to like,

okay, she had this knowledge of power, but then, you know, Luke lets her rip it in half. So I mean, that Luke will bring up at the final travel council himself. But Parvety vocalizes a really great counter argument to that, which is like, dude, you were sketched out A.F. about this, if this piece of paper is what was keeping you from working with me, I have no need of it anymore. I utilized it. I could have stolen your idol, but a relationship is better than an idol any day. You could use an idol and then be done with it and never get anything back. You will stick with me until the final day of this game, which he did. Yeah. Yeah, I would say that that was a good moment for Parvety, a opportunity for growth.

I feel like one of the things I was going to say in terms of something that I don't think she does particularly well is that when somebody is she's not feeling it with somebody. That I feel like that there are not a lot of overtures to win over a perceived enemy as opposed to the social game, which is in,

incredibly well documented. The social game that causes people to just want to be in her presence, people that will follow her. If she's not feeling it, though, she could very easily ice people out sometimes to her detriment. I mean, I would say that it's certainly the case early on. You know, we should speak to the fact that one of her less successful show is, again, one of the only two times she has. hasn't made it to the final day of the game, but she still makes it to sixth freaking place. You know, it was one

spot away from making it to the finale is Cook Islands, where I think one of, you know, her fundamental flaws is the fact that this relationship with Jonathan gets entirely mismanaged. But Harvardy, as you mentioned,

is able to showcase that growth. Fast forwarding again to something like Australia versus the world, there are people who are very prominently her ops. And listen, she could get loud to, what the F? When Rob Bentelay is calling her out of tribal council, when Tony's calling her out a tribal council,

she's more than happy to call them out again to their faces. But it wasn't really a game where it's like, now you're an enemy for life. And now we can't work together anymore. I even encounter by going back to Heroes versus Villains, where her and Courtney Yates, certainly in opposite alliance considering the way that everything

was going. They were strictly in camps of Team Russell and Team Rob but I remember Courtney's final words from Heroes versus Villains where she goes down the very short list of the people who she felt close to

that she had fun with. And listen the majority were in her alliance, Tyson, Sandra, Rob, but she does mention Parvety as well. And so yes, when you look at the peners of the world, when you look at the Elizas of the world, there are certainly some documented cases of like, oh, Parvety's a mean girl, you know, she doesn't necessarily, she's necessarily a welcoming presence to everyone.

But I do think that when we talk about, okay, well, she's not necessarily able to get everyone on her side, there are some cases like Heroes versus Villains where A, she was able to do so in the case of someone like Courtney, and B, you could argue, like, was she really given a fair chance by some of these people who walked in with a reputation that certainly preceded her of like, even if I do get close with you, I don't want to get devoured. And so let me personally distance myself so I don't have to succumb to that. Yeah. When she's feeling it, she is absolutely the best at it. I think that I would like to see over the body of work.

And I feel like that we did see that with Luke, where somebody that she was not getting along with in Australian Survivor v. The World that she did get him to come around and see the light. I do feel like that many times over her career, we have seen where, you know, if, look at the merge in Heroes v. Villains. And yes, we've documented how that ends up working out. But in terms of how she's playing it socially,

I would say that that is not ideal in terms of that, hey, these people don't like me. I'm not going to try. I'm not going to attempt to fit in. It works out. It's one of the all-time greatest survivor plays, but there were some extenuating circumstances where J.T. has written this letter.

He's given the idol to Russell. There's a lot going on here. Yeah, but that works both ways as well, right? Like, yes, Parvety could certainly extend the invite in a perfect world to be like, listen, I'm not so bad. Come on. But I would counter by pointing out the fact that on paper, her closest ally. Because remember, one of the arguments that Randy is going to make a losing one at the beginning of Heroes versus Villains is

Parvety has so many friends on the other side. By the time the merge hits, she has Amanda, maybe Candace, despite the fact that they played at the, you know, she's a lot less closer to Candace than Amanda Candace wasn't starring alongside her in Into the Crush 2 or whatever that movie was. Blue Crush too. I got my crushes mixed up.

But at that point you would say that like the relationships that poverty has been able to work on did not want to work with her because of this narrative that was built up the entire time. Amanda pretty much burns that bridge.

And yes, Maybe in retrospect, you know, a part of what he should have tried to curry favor, to try to be able to mend fences and say, like, listen, I'm sorry that you got left in the dark here, but I knew you were coming for me. But to that, I say, ticks two to tango, people. And to me, it is abundantly clear that these heroes did not want to work with her. That there was this preconceived notion that was so elaborated, on and built upon with the segmentation of these two tribes throughout the entirety of

this pre-merge, that it led to a written letter saying, we know that poverty is so dangerous that here is a plan, an unforeseen consequence in survivor history to take her out specifically. I cannot imagine a circumstance where that bell is unwrung, where even if Parvety opens up as she has in her fantastic book about everything she has been through and why it's given her this persona and why it's made her as, you know, fierce, and bloodthirsty as she is. I don't see a world where that completely eradicates the previous, what, month of the season. Everyone on the other tribe is saying, Parvety's got to go. She's dangerous. Don't believe a word that she says. But should she not try?

Who's to say she didn't try? really seems she was trying from the show. I mean, I think that it's tough because, again, it was a very Russell-based edit. I have to imagine. Listen, you're on that beast for 24 hours a day. I don't think it was a situation where Parvety is sitting in the shelter

giggling, barely acknowledging the heroes. This is not the buddy system. Eating all the green bananas and not having good banana etiquette, Mike. Well, listen, Rupert was in the wrong there. Listen. What? Banana etiquette.

I understand. But you see how many bananas there were? This is not like a... They were waiting for them to ripen. There's a bunch of other bananas. Rupert's not living with two McGillard gorillas. It's not like they're going to go through 12 bananas a day. There's plenty of a...

It was a bit of a faux paw. I mean, it was, I suppose so, waltzing into the hero's camp. But again, I'm sure it just further underlined the point. I'm sure if Russell... Did it? Are they going to be like Russell's an enemy for life? No, I think it's a little bit of a confirmation bias of like, truly this is the spawn of Satan herself. Yes, okay. So let me bring back the specter of Russell and talk about it.

Because I think Parvety does a really great job in the first half of Survivor Heroes versus Villains. Has in the first half, not going to lie. Yes. And then in the second half of Heroes versus Villains, I think that she does a lot to antagonize Russell. and but antagonize him but not necessarily eliminate Russell and I think it's sort of she gets the worst of both worlds where that she keeps Russell in the game but then also

doesn't do much like where she does she talk about Russell as her dragon am I getting yes in her final travel council she says that Russell was the dragon and he she tamed him and kept him as her pet she tamed him but you know when we talk about De Nairus, like, she was not, like, ever, like, antagonizing Russell or the dragon, and hitting it with a stick and making fun of it and getting it, like, all, like, worked up

and out of control and spinning out. So I do think that she has these powers. She has these gifts, but does she always use them to the maximum effect? Because I think that in Heroes v. Villains, I do think it was a winnable game for her. her. And I feel like that there were misplays that happened that caused her to not win that game. Well, let me sort of take apart your statement here. I'll start with the second part first about casting out Russell, about turning on him. That would be a game losing move for Parvety. This is someone who wants to take her to the end. And as she experienced as recently as the

merge vote, there are people who are few and four between. who would take her to the end. Because you also look at this narrative as well of she was, again, the very first name that was pretty much thrown out by these villains. She overcame a seven to three disadvantage as the target of those three to somehow make her way to the end. That's one of the best winning cases you could have in terms of a narrative in Survivor. So I do not think that she really would have an ability to display.

of Russell. Yes, maybe quite literally she would not want the stink of him on her. But I have to imagine also at a certain point, she is looking at what this guy is doing and is saying, wow, this is one of the goadiest goats that I've experienced on Survivor. And I haven't watched a lot of Survivor. Yeah. And so if we are, if we are, she was very bad at the Survivor Trivia challenge in Survivor Cook Islands also. Yeah, was Survivor Cook Islands, what, four at that point, according to the chronology of things. But I think at that point, if we're lauding Boston Rob for being able to,

Philip was the one that was also saying, like, I got to get rid of Boston Rob eventually, but Rob was able to wisely see Philip is one of those people that would want to go to the end with me. I think it speaks to the fact that she was able to read somebody that would be loyal to her.

And it should also, you know, yes, Russell is perturbed by the fact that she kept information from him. And so decides to take it out on Danielle and you say, oh, she's poking the bear. To which I say, this is a bear that can poke itself. You know, I feel like even if Poverty wasn't necessarily sniping little remarks at Russell, if Poverty woke up sweet as honey every day and said, Russell,

how are you doing today? I'm so lucky to have you. That Russell and his crazed Hobbit on crack, 72 days of survivor mentality would be like, they're all against me. She's got to go. Danielle, you're getting taken out before you. I can't take it out.

Blindside, baby. That's just the mental spiraling that Russell was operating under at that point. Daniel spoke about it, I think, in her final words that like every time anyone would have a conversation, Russell would ask you what happened in that conversation. Then he would go to the next person,

what happened in that conversation. Yes. Poverty tamed a dragon, but a dragon is still a dragon at the end of the day. And yes, we could talk about, we certainly talked about in the Sandra podcast about how I think a large reason why she lost

is because of that association with Russell. But I think the pros of working with him very much outweighed the cons. So I guess to put a finer point on what I'm trying to say is that she has these gifts, she has these superpowers, that she can charm almost anybody,

she wants to. I feel like at times she doesn't feel like charming people. And I don't understand why. I mean, I think that is something that she has learned over the course of her time on Survivor.

You mentioned the growth, but I think it's something that does warrant getting discussed, you know, especially the comparison between her two wins. What's so fun about her Australian Survivor win, is as she mentioned, you know, 15 years beforehand, she went to Heroes versus Villains in Samoa,

and she ended up losing. She had unfinished business, and she made this her business trip. She made sure to put in the work, to not necessarily neglect those relationships or taken off day necessarily. I think as successful as Poverty was in Micronesia in Heroes versus Villains,

I think we can acknowledge those as faults. So, I mean, that certainly in her early game provided this perception of like, oh, she's just the lazy, young, mean girl. Look, how does she get off? She's coasting on all the hard work that we're doing, even though I think that's a bit of a misnomer for, again, all the relationship work

that she's been able to put in over the course of her survivor career. But she comes into Australia versus the world as the most fully formed version of herself. And she has the ability to look at those games one winning, one very close to winning, and say, okay, these are little apples and oranges, but these are things that I was not able to do last time

and is able to then put together an equally successful, but much more well-rounded game. As a result, we talked three weeks ago about all the great stuff Tony was able to learn from and fine-tune to form arguably a perfect game of Survivor. I don't understand why we can't say the same thing about Parvety's Australian Survivor game as well. Yeah.

Look, it's a very fair point in terms of the evolution and the game she plays, albeit over a shorter time span, is pretty overall flawless. Yeah, and I mean, again, we could have this. Maybe this will be a future, if we do a more debate podcast, Rob, we could do a 26 days versus 39 days debate show overall.

It'll be like a crossfire. We'll see if we get someone to step in as a moderator. But I do feel like, you know, it's also picture poison in terms of the frequency of things. Like, I'm trying to check. I feel like Australian Survivor, they were voting like pretty much every day. Sure. That is rough turnaround times. I mean, when you have barely enough time to like put a new plan together, you have to be sharp as attack

and have an ability to be able to not only create relationships, but build enough of a foundation that you can go out on a limb on some of these votes and say like, all right, I had to do damage control over the course of like three hours because we're voting the next day. And she was able to do so. And again, when we talk about Tony's winners at war game and the fact that he was able to get all this fantastic stuff done, despite the reputation, you know,

create all of these fantastic plays, social, strategic, physical, and not get a vote against him. Parvety does the exact same thing. and every single tribal council she pretty much attends everyone's saying poverty has to go. People are literally saying poverty's got friends on the other side. Look at what poverty has the key to the bucks.

Parvety has an idol. Let's get rid of her. And they never even vote for her. Rob, they never even put pen to parchment. It's a little like Boston Rob because it's a bit of this, you come for the queen you best not miss.

And I think that's not to say that like poverty is this out of reach person that she can't connect with you, that she is this queen bee and that if you end up gunning for her and you miss that she will take you down. I think she's still approachable in that regard. But I think kind of like Rob,

she puts forward a bit of this mentality of like, hey, if you call me out, you best believe I'm not only going to call you out, but I'm going to call your family saying that you're taking a return flight home soon. Yeah, I think something that works in her favor is especially in these short season, like Australian Survivor versus the world,

especially where people who are fans of hers from Australian Survivor. She comes into it with fans in the same way that Boston Rob comes into Redemption Island where the people who are playing with him also are fans of him. They've just watched him play.

And I think that her legacy and her aura and everything that comes around, Parvety, the celebrity also, I think does play into her hand of making her more effective as a player now, because I think that people want to be in that Black Widow Brigade. They want to play with Parvety in ways where I think if some of these other people, like Rob, for instance, when he plays again, I don't think that people like look at it, like there's no cachet of necessarily being like, wow, I'm going to be in Boston Rob's Alliance.

I'm going to be friends with Boston. Yeah, it worked for Dylan Ephron, but not for many others. That's the thing, is that, again, as much as Parvety might have this Black Widow persona, she is Madam Webb, you know? She has a brand. She has a brand, exactly. I mean, even if you look as far back as the Black Widow Brigade, Parfrey is the glue girl there. She is the one who is separated from Serene Amanda at the swap and approaches Alexis and Natalie

and says, okay, I think we can get something going. Yeah, man, is a little pissed that she had another deal going on. But guess what? When they decide that Ozzy's getting a little too big for his britches and Surrey puts together this vote, it's only because Parvety did all of this legwork with Natalie and Alexis that they are able to get fans and favorites on board together to take down the frontrunner to win the game at that point

and truly cement one of the greatest, alliances in survivor history. Fadra once infamously called Parvety an ice queen. And I will say that, yes, Parvety is like a flat out ice skater in the regard of when, when you slip on some ice when you're driving, she is perfect at steering into the curve. How so?

This is somebody who is not necessarily, as you mentioned, she's going into basically every subsequent season with her name on at least one person's lips. And it only gets bigger and bigger as her resume grows and the more successes that she has in these games. And she's not necessarily one to be like, oh, you don't need to worry about me. What about this other person? Instead, I think her tactics are like, yeah, I am. I've won the game before. So what? I'm not hiding it. Instead, let me show you why I can work for you. It's a demonstrably different skill set than maybe someone like Sandra, who I think is able to disarm a little bit and have people perhaps forget how successful she is. But I would posit that that's even more

impressive than something like Sandra is able to put together. Because let's talk about perceptions here a little bit. Like, yes, people like Sandra, we'll talk about this with Surrey next week. We watch from our couches and we're like, I don't understand how people are so willing to work with these people who have been so successful in the past, but I think they certainly have this perception of like the warm motherly figures, the people who are able to make these nurturing relationships, make them feel cared for, make them feel like, I've got you. I've been talking to a lot of people, but like, you're with me, don't you worry, to everyone else's detriment. Parvety, due to the demographic that she usually occupies, can't play that game. She can't.

necessarily deceive through that type of perception of, you know, being that gangster in an op pursuit. Instead, she is being looked at as this lethal force. And so I give her a lot of credit for playing into that and being like, yeah, I'm a weapon. So how are you going to utilize me to get what you want done? Yeah. Can we talk about parviting the challenges? Sure. Let's do it. Yeah. Well, I don't have any other points to make against parvety. I want to I want to talk about that she is so good in the endurance competitions. I think she might be the best player in terms of these challenges that involve just ready-set, stand-still challenges in Survivor history. I completely agree.

And she spoke about it a bit in her book as well. I think, unfortunately, you know, some traumatic instances in her childhood have sort of given her the ability to dissociate. which makes her absolutely lethal in these challenges. And that's something I talked about all the way with the Sandra podcast, right? It's like, Sandra has this ability to find people to get her to the end, but I do laud somebody who, even when her back is against the wall, if she's given the right challenge,

is someone who is primed to take herself to the end. And that's something else that Parvety was able to accomplish really well in Australia versus the world, is that one of the reasons why she guns for Cass is because as great as she was in these endurance challenges, Cass was right up there with her. There's an entire running theme where Parvety says, hey, if you give me immunity here,

I'll give you immunity at the next one. The two of them have gone back and forth. And so Parvety looked at someone like Cass and is like, you're one of the biggest threats to my game because the power you wield from both an idle perspective, a person perspective, and you could beat me in the challenges. That's the work of a mastermind. to be able to look at somebody who is a direct threat to your game,

to guarantee that when you look at like, probably after Cass leaves, she is far and away the best challenge performer across that board. And so not only do you have to, you know, be able to celebrate the fact that she is so good in these challenges, which are also, yes, they're not every post-MERS challenge, but there's a good majority of them that are pretty much this, so she has a hefty track record to her as well.

but she is then able to craft the moves that she makes around that as well. Let me sum myself up with an end game where, if need be, worst case scenario, even if everyone turns against me, they can't because I'm going to be sitting with that necklace at the end. She really pissed off Philip on dealer no deal island. And there was no coming back from that. Yeah, that's, I mean, that's very true. This is also... That was a bad social game on that one.

Yeah, though I do wonder if this was perhaps Poverty. Listen, it's been a while since Pardy had been playing with newbies, right? 2008 was the last time. The past few times she'd been playing with Returnies, so I think Philip took it a certain way. She felt like she, he felt like she weaponized, like, his trauma. Pilot Pete really got under her skin. All right, well, listen, now we are just completely extrapolating things from games

that have no connection to Survivor whatsoever. Though it should be mentioned if we're talking about challenge performances Parvety was, I haven't even heard this one before,

Rob, Target number uno in Dondy because of her survivor career, but what, was safe pretty much every single round

through challenges and through the relationships that she made until the one time she wasn't, and then she took power into her own hands, face the banker,

David put her in and then she ends up, you know, losing. And of course, the greatest test of skill, the temple. Banker's

Temple, Christy Teigen, really, you know, cooked her on that one. No, Mike, you make a great point. It's a very difficult task to try to poke holes. I mean, I don't even think we talked about winners at war. Yeah, so winners at war, I mean, again, I think this is one of those rare examples of, like, poverty comes in with her back against the wall, and she's just not able to maneuver her way out of it. But to be fair, we spoke about this with Sandra. We spoke about this with Boston Rob.

I don't know how she could have. Just as a reminder, first off, she was able to for a little bit. The old schoolers were an endangered species when they landed on that beach. I talked about this last week with Boston Rob, and then her and him make the perfect move. And if you speak to, again, her alienating people

in previous seasons, they make the move to connect right away. Let bygones be bygones. They need each other right now. And so they decide to work together. Danny decides to turn on them. Ethan unfortunately ends up going by the wayside. And then Parvety, let's face it, get swap screwed. Swapscrued.

Not only is she in a minority from her original tribe where it's just her and Michelle, but also the majority of this tribe is made up of a pre-game alliance of Wendell, Michelle, and Nick. And yes, Michelle and Wendell used to kick it. But listen, those boots were made for walking, and that's exactly what Parvety did to the edge. because her reputation preceded her. She was far too powerful, and she really had nobody to vouch for her in that majority, as opposed to Wendell and Nick,

who were able to say, let's keep Michelle in. Poverty is more dangerous. So I really can't think of things that she could have done. It's tough. You can't even really attack that because, you know,

we talked about Sandra, we talked about Boston Rob, you know, that they all go out in, like, the exact same spot in Winters at War. So, you know, people are going big game hunting. And also, if you look at, I don't think necessarily the,

goat needs to be well practiced in the art of finding advantages and idols. But obviously, poverty has that skill in spades, obviously finds the very important one in Heroes versus villains, finds an idol and an advantage in Australia versus the world. But we don't remember during her voluminous amount of time on the edge of extinction. Like, she's finding advantages out the wazoo. She finds the 50-50 coin that she sells to Michelle. Her and Natalie find that extortion advantage that she's able to give to Tony in that infamous episode. And so she is a hustling. in every sense of the word. So even if you feel like finding trinkets

is an inherent quality necessary for the goat, Parvety has got you covered there as well. Okay. Mike, anything else that you want to say in terms of making the case for Parvety as the goat? Oh, I mean, there's so many minute details that you can get into when it comes to Parvite's five seasons.

And I think that kind of speaks for itself. That I really do feel like any piece of criteria that you turn to and listen, much like a jury vote proper, anyone can have any sort of syllabus as to who the goat is. Is it someone who's made big, bold, impressive moves? Check.

Is it someone who has made moves for herself by herself, as I've talked about before? Check. Is it somebody who has been able to replicate the success time and time again? Check. Is it somebody who has been able to navigate their way out of a corner, despite again experiencing a rerun in every single survivor premiere

of somebody saying that poverty has to go and she never does. Check. Is it somebody who has such an incredibly well-balanced game that they can be looked at as someone that could out-move their way either socially, strategically, or physically? Check. Is it somebody who, even speaking from a legacy perspective, was able to demonstrate how they can win Survivor in vastly different ways, I would argue as vastly different people, check. Even looking to this final element of legacy, which I don't think we necessarily spoke about,

and may not weigh necessarily heavy in the minds of everybody, but I think bears mentioning here, there is a reason why poverty was essentially the number one family feud answer on Survivor applications for decades of who do you most want to play like. because I think that poverty is an inspiration as a player. Yes, there have been many people who were able to showcase this type of behavior to plot these big moves, to be able to make these major blindsides happen,

to get paid handsomely for doing so. But I think Parvety, again, has this just unique blend to her of that charisma factor as well, that she is somehow able to do this, while having so many people in her corner at the same time. And even if people are not, she's able to make them in her corner by the time that the jury votes come in. I think that Parvety was also able to showcase

and truly change the perception of what women are allowed to do in Survivor. We certainly had had female power players in the game up to that point. For some reason, like Amy Kusack is the one that really speaks to me firsthand in terms of like quite literally wielding machete, able to cut swath through this game of like, let's devour these people, chew them up and spit their bones out on the edge, as she would say, about Adam.

But I feel like Parvety was one of the first, like, you know, really dominant female winners from what we had seen previously to season 16. I feel like the emerging gameplay for a lot of women up to that point was a little bit more of the Vaseppia under the radar, like, let all the big guns take each other out, you just sort of are able to very nicely manipulate things behind the scene until you get to an advantageous point in which you take the money home due to the relationships that you accrue. Poverty was playing from out front and she was able to do the impossible from that gameplay perspective, make her way to the end, not once, not twice, not thrice, but win twice as well.

I think she has one of the most complete bodies of work Survivor has ever seen. And I think if I were to bank on any type of player to do well in any season, my money is on poverty, considering the vast amount of money she's won up to this point. Well said, it is worth noting,

none of this could be possible without Danny Bonaducci. To be fair, I believe Surrey has been on record saying that Parvety was never going to go home. For, if it were not for Danny Bonaducci, that as lore would have it, for him not back body dropping Johnny Fairplay at the 2007 Fox Reality Awards, reality channels awards, the really awards, I believe they called them. Johnny Fairplay tried to hump Danny Bonaducci's leg. Danny Badducci picked him up over his head. threw him backwards and then caused so much damage to his face that as lore would have it,

that Parvety would have been the first boot of Survivor fans versus favorites, have Johnny Fairplay not tapped out. See, I feel like there's competing lore about this, though, because I feel like, as I mentioned before, Sarie has been on record recently saying that she wasn't going to let Parvety go home first. So I believe Surrey was like firmly ensconced with that couples alliance pretty much from the beginning that. And I imagine that she could work her magic and not make a five-five tie. Did she have that kind of pull, though?

I know she is Surrey. I'm telling you, Parvety's got to go. A fair play said. I mean, I think so. I think Surrey is able to work her magic here and be able to pull one person over. Why was she so connected to Parvety from Jump? I think that, and that speaks to, again, Parvety's skill is that we have this scene

in what episode three, where it's the three of them out on the raft and Surrey outright expresses like, I'm worried, I don't want to be the fifth wheel in this alliance, and Parvety continues to double, triple down on like, no, no, no, we will dispose of these guys at the merge. It's us three until the end.

And so as much as I feel like Parvety, again, maybe I'm just sort of playing into the role that I've been thrust into in this podcast, but I feel like Parvety and the relationship is she quickly builds with her future survivor soulmate is one large reason why Sarie does go with them. It's because she's able to convince

her like, no, despite what it might look like from the outset, like we're closer with you than we are with any of these hymboes. Who's to say? You know, it's like, it's always a better story. The person who won the season was going to be the first boot. So maybe that has been also

kind of like hyped up over the years that she was going to be the first boot and then she won. You know, they say that about Parvety. Yeah, they said that like, I think Chris has been on... Yeah, I think both of them have been on record being like, oh, no, actually,

that's not the case whatsoever. The edit just made it built up so that, yeah, there is this sort of like sliding doors moment. It's almost the opposite of Aubrey. Right, was like, oh, no, she actually would have been really in trouble if she went to tribal council.

I also want to bring up as well as from Micronesia, because I imagine the one thing that people are screaming at us about, I know we don't want to necessarily create strong-man arguments, but we can bring up the Micronesia Endgame as well, which I think people pointed out as one of Parvety's rare faults, which is, okay, they thought it was a final three. Why would she want to go to the end with Surrey? And there was something that was sent to us on social media a little while back,

courtesy of all people, my co-counsel, Parvety's defense attorney. on Twitter, which is an answer from an AMA that one Eric Reichenbach did over a decade at this point. I don't even know if it was an AMA because I know that Eric loves to lurk there from time to time. But he was asked, you know, how would the votes have worked out? One of the biggest what if questions in Survivor history, Rob, about what if it was a final three between the favorite women as they wanted to make happen. And he, you know what? You can say what you want about Eric. he was historically tapped in.

He knew at pretty much all times what everybody was thinking, what they wanted, what their motivations were. So go ahead, Mike. The most reliable narrator there is. But as Eric recounts, quote, there was a thread of Amanda is a Mess and Parvety is the 21st Century feminism representation from the Alexis Natalie Camp.

They kept trying to sway myself and Jason at Ponderosa to vote Pardt at all costs. That said, I didn't really want to vote anyone, but Jeff mentioned if there was a tie between the two, there was a super secret envelope containing a super secret tiebreaker that would be open at the live finale. So I voted Amanda, knowing a lot of people were already vocal about voting for Parvety. So I think what people have recounted, and I'm so anticipatorily excited for if I have to now argue Surrey would win in this final three next week. But I believe what people had worked out was like,

if it's a final three here, Surrey like squeaks out a victory in a three to two to two. But there's a couple things that might work against that. One of them being that as people thought, okay, Alexis is definitely in Surrey's camp, because I think there was a Ponderosa video where Alexis was saying that she would vote for Surrey. But from what Eric is saying here,

it does seem like Alexis was really in love. lockstep with Natalie, who obviously was very pro-parvety. He also goes on to say that she was not on lock for Surrey. And I believe also the legend is that Jason Siska respected challenge wins. And so I think he would give it to somebody who stood there for six and a half hours, holding her arm above her head longer than he did. Okay. Well, you've teased what's coming up next.

Next time we're going to talk about Surrey is Surrey the goat. The only person on this list that does not have a win. doesn't have a finals appearance. It will be an interesting discussion. And she did such a great job in Survivor 50. We'll see has she added enough to her resume to be considered the goat. Mike, three times you've made the case of who is the goat. They've been a real simp over the course of this series.

The only time that I have made the case has been for Sandra, but that's been the luck of the draw. And so we will flip the coin one more time. I will say that I would like the opportunity to make the case for Surrey, but as we've done every time, we'll flip the coin. We have, this is John F. Kennedy Jr.

on his half dollar, his heads that represents me. Hopefully, I have a similar fate. Here is Mike Bloom is the eagle, a bird chest, he referenced earlier. So, okay. heads or tails, who will be making the case for Saree Fields is the goat. And it's tails.

Now, we flip the coin, but I guess we could tweet through those. Is there any chance, Mike, that you would not like this task? You could give or receive. Oh, listen, how does that resonate for you in the bedroom? I cut I think it is kind of funny if this entire project is just me

Big Pop Pro everybody except for Sandra That's just really good earn me a lot of hate In the Stagra Everybody knows what we did here Yeah that's the other thing too Is I feel like we should do what Mother Nature Intended

And let the Bloom Talk up Sarie field who's also my favorite survivor player. So it'll be very exciting. Listen, Rob, I think as you've showcased over the past couple weeks as well, you've been able to certainly throw in, I think, your own pro arguments too. I would certainly

love it if you're able to throw in a couple points my way. I'm sorry to rob you of the opportunity, but I guess I'm apologizing on behalf of John F. Kennedy, you listen, that's fine. I thought that, like, making the case for serene, I thought it would actually go kind of hand in hand with the points that I was making about why Sandra is

the goat, but I will argue out of both sides of my mouth. Yes, and then arguably, you've already kind of done that, right? So now it's my turn. Give me a chance. All right, give Mike a chance, everybody, please. And so, Mike, what else is coming up for you? So much stuff happening. I alluded to all this stuff going on at parade.com. That continues, including an interview with Derek and Haley Huff.

I also realize I'm bleeding right now. What happened? I don't know. I pour my blood, sweat, and tears into talking about parties. Yeah, I thought maybe you had a mark. I didn't realize that now it's getting a boy, my... You know what, actually, it's my own ode to Parvary

because remember people don't have remember this, remember she like chopped her finger in half with the machete in Cook Islands one? So this is my own ode to the queen herself. Yeah, I don't think I've ever drawn blood on a podcast. So you have me beat. You drew water, I drew blood. So I'm bleeding out content at this point.

So please... My blue bleeds red for Parvety. And I am a villain. So I think the buff color calls for it. So please check out everything I'm doing. at a Mike Bloom type and hopefully I can get some sort of transfusion

before I come back here in a week's time to get to talk about all things serrated. Okay. All right. And then, of course, check out we've got

our Survivor Co-Rong rewatch going on all month long. We're going to end a podcast so Mike can get a tissue. All right. Thanks, everybody. Bye.

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