RHAP: We Know Survivor - Know-It-Alls: Survivor 47 Ep 4

Episode Date: October 10, 2024

Rob and Stephen break down episode 4 of Survivor 47.

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Survivor knows. Is this real life, bro? This is Survivor, bro. Steve and I are up without a doubt. Got the game all figured out. They know it all. Yeah, that's right. The Survivor Know-It-Alls are back after another exciting episode. Excited to talk about it here with Stephen Fischbach. Stephen, how are you? Oh, hold on, hold on. I muted you in the

theme song. It was a wish fulfillment. Sorry, Stephen, please. I'm great. And if the Lord is willing, we will have many, many years ahead of us of podcasting together. Oh, wow. Okay. I've never heard you so bullish on the podcast before. Well, listen, you know, two 45 year olds, you know, we might have have some years ahead of us yes look we're not in a wheelchair we don't have a cane we're out here still podcasting yeah um yeah oh what a night to quote the four seasons uh landscaping yeah four seasons landscaping that's yeah okay yeah so uh very exciting episode yeah me like, wow, what a great episode. So can't wait to get into it here with you. We will take your questions as well. I'll be live at 3 p.m. There was so many people calling in for the patron Q&A.

I was a couple minutes late. I couldn't get in. The room was too full. It was like, eh, room limit. You know, 15 people are on hold already. Rob, you can't get in. Wow. What makes a good question at the patron Q&A?

Like, what makes a particular, like, what are the key parts of a successful? I think just something that I haven't thought about something that hasn't come up on the podcast. That has to be pretty easy. You haven't thought about it. That's like a lot of fun. Oh, Stephen, this is I mean, this is, you know, no small feat to come up with new things to talk about. I mean, this one's a little bit easy because I can really rely on that what you think about things but you know i'm always trying to come up with new angles to talk about these episodes on the podcast

wow yeah um well speaking of angles this one had a lot of them okay let me hear let me just finish live 3 p.m uh for the patrons that link is going to go out uh tonight go to rob's website at com slash patron and then steven next week we are going to be doing our live show in new york city on october 16th so uh we will have a live show coming to you hopefully can't wait to see so many of you there we'll have a special patron meetup coming up on tuesday night and then because of my traveling home steven and i will be with you on Friday next week. Yeah. And speaking of Friday, that's tomorrow,

which is exactly what happened on the show. We last night. I'm really the bad transitions. I think. Yes. Yes. Yes. Was it Friday?

Let this episode happen. Speed. Well, Friday is tomorrow and today is tomorrow compared to yesterday when survivor aired, which was a great episode of television. And here's what was so great about it. OK, these 90 minute episodes are sublime because we go into this tribal council knowing not one, not two, not four, but three separate plans. And we understand the rationale behind each and every plan. We see the challenges of the plan.

You know, why maybe Rome and Genovese don't want to vote out Saul. We see why maybe Rome and Saul don't want to vote out Kishon. And then we have, you know, is this plan, which plan is going to come into fruition? We don't know. And yet when it it happens it feels like Such a beautiful you know perfect ending And what was also great about this episode Rob that I love so much was that

First of all we see so much interesting Social play and there was also Like really smart Thoughtful advantage play you know like The advantage created this Interesting dynamic around Which the strategy kind of, you know, rotated. So, I mean, it was it was everything you can want out of a survivor episode, like all of all of the components coming together.

Yeah. Great episode of Survivor for sure. Best of the season. Now, Stephen, where do you want to start with discussing the events of the Lavo Tribal Council? Well, I mean, I think we have to start. I kind of like the like, oh gosh, there's so many places to start. I mean, what do you think? I mean, I guess I would love to start with the emergence of Genevieve. Yeah, Genevieve, who, you know,

was notoriously under-edited, now sort of has this like big moment of, you know, moment of coming about, like realizing- Forgetting the moment yeah of uh of realizing that if kishan was willing to throw out her name as the decoy boot and we've certainly talked before about how you never you know you never want to be the decoy boot and then you should never be cavalier about making the decoy boot because it always puts their hackles up. Now, if I may just push back against the narrative from the show, Kishan in his exit press today really tried to downplay that. I

really don't think it was necessarily that, you know, she heard her name in that he was pushing back against that and saying that he felt like it was more, she realized that this was his move. The last vote was his move and that he was the person who was really, you know, going to be getting more of the credit and a real player more so than it was a mistake on his part to mention her name. Well, if I've learned something from listening to the exits, it's never any of their mistakes. None of them made mistakes.

It was all the other players around them making mistakes um but but um i mean there's probably something to that you know that part of it is not just feeling like can i ask you then that it is that enough based off of that alone was it enough for genevieve to say like, oh, if Kishan is telling Saul that in the fake plan, we're telling Rome to tell Saul, even though, even though Kishan is working with, with Genevieve to vote out Rome, the fact that he sold to Rome, that they're telling Saul to vote for Genevieve, is that enough to vote out Kishan? Well, so I do think that there's probably some element of truth to what he was saying in his exits about the sense that he's this, you know, moving, making too many moves, really.

Like, really, right? Like, this big player, and I think, my guess is it's a combination of things, right? Like, first of all, they make a big move last week, or maybe that wasn't considered a big move. I don't know. But and then this week they tacked back and now they're blindsiding Rome, who is, you know, Genevieve's number one ally. Like I would be worried if I were Genevieve about being on, you know, sort of stuck at the mercy of, you know, voting out my number one ally. And again, like we've heard over and over how close they were and then sort of stuck at the mercy of this of this duo.

And especially Kishan, who's like willing to turn on allies willing to like upend things you know back to back you know what why are you putting trust in that person more if they are showing that they're not going to reciprocate that trust and that was why i thought it was such like a like a nice touching moment when rome was said but i'm doing everything for the alliance and he really has been you know he's really been so alliance focused it's never himself. He shares all his information with the Alliance. Anyway, that's, that's, that's, that said, like, I do think it's worth it. I think if someone is willing to make you the decoy boot, even in the fake plan, well, that's what the decoy boot is. It's the fake plan. That is, that's worrisome because it shows that they're

not, you know, they're, you are in a way disposable to their plans. If the thing blows up, if Rome played an immunity idol that he found out of nowhere, if he played a shot in the dark, you're the one going home. Keyshawn's not offering himself as the decoy boot, you know? And in fact, he made such a big thing about the fact that, hey, my name's not even out there at all. And like, I'm feeling really good because nobody's targeting me. Genevieve doesn't have that luxury luxury she doesn't feel that comfort because in fact kishan is targeting her well in in reality no one was going to be writing her name again that was in a fake plan that they were selling to rome that saul was not actually writing genevieve's name down that

was not actually this was all a ruse to vote out Rome. Uh, but, but I do think that, uh, for Genevieve, Rome would be writing down Genevieve's name, right? I don't think that Rome was, uh, voting out Genevieve. I think Rome was going into thinking that they were going to dupe Saul into like, give me your shot in the dark. And then he, and then Rome's mind. No, I hear you. I hear you. But in Rome's mind, Saul is writing Genevieve. I mean, that's a, that's a fair point. That's, that's a fair clarification clarification that like there's no person who is actually supposed to be writing down Genevieve's name. But yeah, but even so. So I want to know for you, do you think that Genevieve is playing with fire? Because, again, this is an interesting decision.

stable decision makers in Kishan, in Saul, players that are probably more reasonable than Rome, who is a flawed player, but a loyal flawed player. And that's her number one. She's going to stick, or at least that in Rome's mind, that's his number one. Maybe Genevieve might be a little bit more fluid with maybe where her number one is ultimately. But is Genevieve playing with fire in the same way that we saw like Tiffany and Kenzie working with Q? OK, we're going to I'm going to stick with him. And not to say that Q and Rome are the same, like they're different in a lot of ways. But ultimately, Q comes around and says, hey, Tiffany's not with the six. Like, hey, everybody, I'm going to turn on my number one in Tiffany and gets a bunch of people to try to write down Tiffany's name. Yeah. So sorry, what are you saying? What's the Q comparison? I'm missing it.

I'm asking, is Genevieve playing with fire to a degree in that? How far can she go with Rome? Where, okay. I mean, I think it's my choice for her, to be honest. Because, first of all, she knows Rome is loyal to her. And again, like, that was Rome's biggest objection. Like, we've got this core four. Why are we blowing it up?

You know, and she's just kind of created this thing with Saul out of the gate. So, if I'm Genevieve in that group, and I'm seeing Kishan, like, first at this thing with Asia turned on her, now is like turning on Rome, who's supposed to be before they have this like very straightforward vote and is throwing out her name just like as any kind of target. I'm thinking like, well, I'm disposable to him, but I'm essential to these other two people. You know, yes, Rome is flamboyant, but like disposable to him, but I'm essential to these other two people. You know, yes, Rome is flamboyant, but like that makes him a target that attracts attention to him. So, you know, and she did have that confessional, you know, is there a point where I defend Rome so much that the target then becomes on, comes on me. But, you know, now that she has this thing with Saul, I would, I would feel like she's putting herself in a great spot she's at the center of the tribe she has two allies both of whom are loyal to her but you know who can't stand each other which has its virtues right like if

they turn on each other they're going to be turning on each other first and they're both big targets like Rome is a big target because of his flamboyant personality Saul is literally a big target um and so I feel like it's actually a really good spot for her. I mean, watch, she'll be voted out next week, but like, it is a really good, I mean, and, and again, like the Keyshawn, the guy who's just making all these moves, I would be, I would be nervous about him. You know, like your, your last, it's like, you got to stick with a group, at least for a couple of votes to build up trust.

Like the people who turn on the group and then turn on the group again, and then turn on the group, it becomes, um, you know, you can't trust those. You really just can't trust those people. And I, I mean, I get that some of the narrative of this episode, it was that Rome was like, he had passed, um, he had passed what they thought was like a human marker. Like, like he had passed sort of like a um i don't know like a point of like behavior that they felt was acceptable and they kind of had reached the point of saying like we don't want to be playing with this person like he's not treating saul kindly um and so like we can take him out we we like saul we don't feel like rome is like treating him respectfully this is a this is an opportunity for us to do that even so it, it did feel kind of, you know, there was a glee.

There was a glee. Right. And the way Keyshawn was doing it. I thought it was Keyshawn's big coming out episode is like, yeah, I mean, that Genevieve stole it from him. Keyshawn is like getting all into like his mustache twirly ways. And he's like, OK, here comes Keyshawn. And then easy come, easy go. Now, I think that Genevieve did make a very smart play in the episode. I do wonder, though, that did she go too far down the road of voting out Rome to be able to do the U-turn

and double back? In Saul and Teenie, do they know enough information to potentially bury Genevieve with Rome? Does Tini know any information? I think Tini knows that the plan tonight is going to be that Rome is going to get voted out. Now, Tini was blindsided with Kishan in all that, so maybe there's some plausible deniability. But Saul knows a lot. Yeah.

liability, but Saul knows a lot. Yeah. I, I mean, I hear you, but ultimately Genevieve was the one who saved Rome and was the one who, you know, stopped the plan. I would, you know, much rather have that person than the people who were spiriting the plan. And it was incredible. Like what was such a great, was so great about this was that she there was just the way the episode built up this deep personal antagonism between Saul and Rome. And then that is the hinge on which this whole plan depends. Can these two people who dislike each other so much, especially Saul disliking Rome, you know, on this like deeply personal level, like, are they able to put it aside for the strategic vote? I mean, it's just such a great question. It's like the fundamental survivor question. Like, where does the, you know, where is the line?

Like, how much do you value, you know, a temporary strategic or, you know, your personal connections and your personal feelings versus your strategic feelings? And what was so cool about it was that the episode started with that question, you know, with Teenie saul talking by the well where saul said you know like hey teeny has this like big moral dilemma like i made a choice that i'm not personally comfortable with and saul says hey this is a game you can't let that personal stuff you know get get in the way um and then that ultimately is his decision at the end like do i let the personal stuff get in the way and he ultimately chooses to to make it a game it's just like such a such a perfect structure now it's a lot of people online who were saying about kishan like hey you know you now you reap the whirlwind right like you sold the winds now you read that the i mean you're asking me anyway what you so we put you so and he put you so, and he sowed, you know, chaos.

I mean, Rome, not necessarily a chaotic player, but, you know, instead, you know, he, he chose to vote out Asia last week and now, you know, he's got this sort of very chaotic tribe dynamic that ended up hurting him. Like, is there any merit to that? So are we talking about that? Keyshawn chose to be super chaotic in this week's episode and then ultimately came back around on him or he chose to work with Asia and establish like that group as the four. wonky in terms of like how they presented this because they the edit never really gave us that uh according to kishan that uh that he really looked at there being an alliance of three that he felt like that he had teeny was his number one but also he was extremely close with genevieve

and so that while like it may have been perceived more of a uh a two two two from the asia and saul's perspective and maybe even from Tini's perspective, that I think in Kishan's mind that he felt like, you know, I have a three. I have Tini and I have Genevieve. And Genevieve is attached with Rome. And so that's really, ideally, it would be great if we could just vote out Rome and then we have our three and then Saul and Asia are two.

But the circumstances just did not dictate that. So I did ask him specifically, do you do you wish that, you know, you could have done things differently last week? Kishan stood by it, that he felt like that. No, that they still made the right decision last week that, again, not knowing that Kishan and Genevieve have a very tight bond. I do feel like that for if it was up to Tini, I think that decision would have come up to split the votes. But for Kishan, he felt like that Genevieve was a very reliable number for him. Rome was always going to play the idol on himself. And so he didn't want to lose Genevieve in that spot.

Yeah, I mean, we said last week, Rob, that the danger here was that basically Rome, you know, in a five person tribe, Rome's, you know, steal a vote becomes in like enormously overpowered. And that's basically what happened, right? Like his steal a vote was entirely determinative of what happened here to the point where it was with just him and Genevieve, right? It didn't really matter what Saul did because teeny couldn't vote. So where, you know, Saul votes for Kishan, but like, doesn't, doesn't really affect anything. I mean, and I mean, you know, I gotta say, I gotta give Rome credit here because I think he's playing so intelligently with these advantages, you know, to, to only go for the one tribal council idol, lock it up. I cannot be voted out here. Then I believe, and I could be wrong. I believe this is

the first time. And again, like maybe I'm wrong here that the steal vote advantage has ever been used in a decisively like correct way. Now, Sarah Lucina, when she used it, she wasn't voted out and her target was eliminated, but she didn't need the steal vote in that point here by playing the steal vote, you know, Rome doesn't necessarily need it because theoretically he has Saul's vote, although it forces Saul to vote with him when maybe Saul would not have. And he, you know, he eliminates the possibility of Gishan playing his shot in the dark. So he takes this power. And I think, you know, what I really like about Rome is a lot of people when they have these powers, right, they get and I've certainly been there. You kind of start projecting forward, right?

You're like, I'm going to use this at the final seven. And I'm going to like this huge splashy thing. And Rome uses it in this very conservative way that I think makes a lot of sense in this new era. Um, to just like, I've got this thing, people know about it. I'm using it now to make sure this vote goes my way and we can advance one, one vote. And like evolution of strategy here, like this is something we've talked about. I don't think we've actually seen anybody play this way using two successive advantages in such a conservative fashion

to absolutely lock up like the votes in their favor. I mean, you gotta give them a lot of credit for that. Yeah, it's interesting. And I feel like it's sort of a advancement of sort of like the Sandra, anybody but me, actually. But this isn't anybody but me. This is like, I'm going to, you know, use everything and I'm going to unload everything

I have to make sure that, you know, my agenda advances on this particular day. And so and for if you're Rome, they feel like, hey, I'll go out there. I'll find the next advantage, too. Right. I mean, he the next advantage, too. Right. I mean, he obviously thinks that, right? He's got tremendous confidence in himself to do that, which has both served him well and poorly, right? Yeah. I mean, Mike Bloom pointed out how, like, you know, last week we were saying, you know, Rome put himself in this clutch position and it paid off.

And then this week he did the exact same thing and, boy, did it not. You know, potentially the worst challenge performance in i mean the worst puzzle performance in survivor history i think it was the worst like like just like objectively objectively they didn't get one piece and they started at the same time as everybody else a little before even jeff had to try to like do it show it like hey it's not a rigged puzzle like uh oh that's funny that's i didn't i didn't like i don't think he was that's what he was doing but he was showing but okay i want to just one more thing on uh genevieve and rome that is the right move for genevieve now should genevieve go forward if rome has no more advantages has he outlived his usefulness to genevieve should genevieve

be targeting rome next no i you got again like loyal ally who is going into the merge himself yeah but i get loyal like rome is going to be a big you know a big lightning rod you know and and create a lot of just a distraction i think that's exactly who you want in this game someone who's loyal to you you know he's not even really an erratic player i think people people like to talk about him like he's an erratic player but he's he's not you know he's he votes according to his alliance you know he sticks with the plan um he says what he's going to do and he goes and he sticks with it. Like that's a conservative player who's loyal to you, who attracts a lot of attention.

You know, like that's exactly who you want to keep around in the game. Yeah. But if Tini and Saul start going around, you know, once we get to the merge, like, oh, Rome and Genevieve are very close. And then so all of a sudden Rome wins immunity rome safe and mergatory like i could see potentially like uh genevieve who i think wants to be a little bit more under the radar could end up garnering some attention that she may not necessarily want yeah i mean that's true although you know again like we have saul saying that he too is is you know like we saw the foundation of that alliance so So I don't see a lot. I mean, allying with, with Rome here as,

as a bad thing, you know? And again, like you'd much rather have a Rome as an ally who is, he's locked in. Then the Kishan is an ally, you know, who is going to turn on you at the next vote because there's been a subtle

shift in the vibes. Fishy for Genevieve, the easiest one of the season. Fishy for Genevieve for sure. I mean, what Fishy for Genevieve, for sure. I mean, what a great play. Like, what, you know, totally sees the way things are going, not to her advantage. And I think, you know, Keyshawn is probably very right that, you know, suddenly he is emerging as this big player and, you know, nobody likes that, right? Nobody likes someone else kind of being the leader of all the strategic moves. And of course, like the ability to bridge that divide

between Rome and Saul was so good. You know, obviously like the sense that, you know, she got Rome to come apologize. She got Saul to see past this, you know, slight that had been inflicted on him. Just really, really, really excellently. Well, then like, that's what we, like that's classic survivor, right?

Like that is classic survivor. Like you see an opportunity to take, to create a new alliance by bringing together two people who who might not normally work together you you expend your social capital to do that and it and the plan comes off in a surprising blind side like what a great classic play i also this might be highly contentious i'm gonna give a fishy to rome You're giving two fishies away? Two fishies. Because first, I think Rome has played. I thought using the steal a vote today, again, like first time ever that it was a decisive, you know, maybe the vote would have gone through without it.

But we don't know for sure. And it neutralized the shot in the dark. There's only been the two steal votes, right? Was there a different steal vote? There was me and then Lucina. Was there another one that got- I think it's come up. I think that, did Noel have the steal vote?

Has it ever been used in a way that unquestionably, you know, was effective? Well, I think that, so going back to Survivor 43, if I remember this correctly, uh, Noel had the steal a vote and then she stole Owen's vote and then used it to vote out James Jones. Uh,

that's true. That was, that was, that was a very effective too. Cause then I kept James and James had an idol, right? So James had knowledge is power. And so that was sort of like,

okay, that she's like, Hey, don't, don't take my, like, cause I, here's what I want to steal Owen's vote just to mess with him, but then stole Owen's vote to then use it to vote out Jinx. Yeah, that was, that was a great move, but it was kind of similar in the way of like, I'm using this to like make sure, well, I mean, sort of different because that was like a misdirect.

But anyway, like, I really do think Rome's play for the past two episodes, you know, while again, on the social level, he has certainly alienated some people. He's also built solid alliances. And I really think that we have to acknowledge this way he's playing with his advantages of just getting them for a short period, spending them. And again, with, you know, using it out like right away, the steel of truly one of the most interesting and powerful advantages in the game to just expend it on the second tribal council to to lock it up when you know there's a world where he could say like oh i'm gonna risk it you know uh i think that i saw is with me here like you know jennifer and i are together no he he you know i don't think he's not knows about it you know like he makes it a certainty right he takes a potentially flawed plan that we saw had a lot of other outcomes and really locks it up for himself to make sure he's not the one going home. I think that's really smart advantage play. And he also has done enough to secure the loyalty of his allies. Right. So it's like, yes, on the one hand, Genevieve was wary of Kishan.

She also felt that Rome was a better and more loyal ally to her and that you have to give credit to Genevieve was wary of Kishan. She also felt that Rome was a better and more loyal ally to her and that you have to give credit to Genevieve, but you also have to give credit to Rome. That's okay. Well, I certainly can't condone giving two fishies away, but Steven, this is something that you have been talking about since you played all the way back in Survivor 31 that you said you got the secret advantage in front of everybody that once you had it,

that you were sort of like, uh, a huge target was on your back. You've been saying, you know, if you have these known advantages, spend them, use them,

you know, get the heat off of you. And I don't know if it took survivor 46 and all these players to get voted out with idols in their pocket to finally catch up. But it seems like that maybe this, uh, people are finally listening to you catch up. But it seems like that maybe this, people are finally listening to you. That's what it is.

It's people finally listening to me. But it's truly, it's not just, I mean, there's that. It's like that sense of like, get the heat off of you. But there's also the sense of like, not being like misled by your like new precious, you know? I mean, the fact that like, you're able to resist that like beguiling whisper. And I have spoken to a lot of people who have had those advantages and how they curse them because they start to project forward.

And you can never do that on Survivor. You have to play tribal council to tribal council, elimination to elimination. I mean, obviously, you want to plan forward and look ahead. But once you start to project too far ahead and try to like move pieces around, just like set up the perfect move, then, you know, that's where people get into trouble. And I really, I got to applaud Rome. I mean, you could see a player like him who likes the big flashy move, who obviously like likes, is a bit theatrical. You could see that person, that personality type kind of wanting to like set up some like, you know, big blindside. And the fact that he has played really a very conservative game um i'm really impressed by i mean he he has been um you know you could say it's playing conservatively and you could also say like there's a little bit of like

the marshmallow test of like that uh maybe like uh having the advantage in his pocket he has to spend it as fast as he has it also. Well, yeah. Okay. But you know, that's true. I mean, he's in the hot seat. Um, but he, even when, even when he, you know, when he came on, uh, teeny showing, you know, Kishan, the, uh, advantage, he played that off so perfectly. He was like, okay, great. Like this is, this is the group. Like, you know, he didn't, and then he was like, I'm going to, I'm going to spend this right away. I look a lot of, a lot to say that Rome could... And he would have, for the record, and he would have been voted out this week

had it not been for the grace of Genevieve. Well, right. But, you know, that's, you know, you could say that Genevieve could have been voted out last week if Rome hadn't had the threat of the idol play. Look, Genevieve played a, like I said, Genevieve played a spectacular social game. Rome played a very bad social game this week.

I think we can all agree about that. Terrible social game from Rome. And for four weeks. Yeah. But I thought his advantage play was really good. And I think there's a really good case to be made that I should have given him the fishy last week. And I think the combined two-week advantage play

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Tier 1 compensation provided. Investing involves risk. Acorns Advisors, LLC and SEC. Registered Investment Advisor. View important disclosures at acorns.com slash robpod. Transat presents a couple trying to beat the winter blues. We could try hot yoga. Too sweaty.

We could go skating. Too icy. We could book a vacation. Like somewhere hot. Yeah, with pools could book a vacation. Like somewhere hot. Yeah, with pools. And a spa. And endless snacks. Yes! Yes! Yes!

With savings of up to 40% on Transat South packages, it's easy to say, so long to winter. Visit Transat.com or contact your Marlin travel professional for details. Conditions apply. Air Transat. Travel moves us. Top it all off quick and secure withdrawals. Get more everything with FanDuel Sportsbook and Casino. Gambling problem? Call 1-866-531-2600. Visit connectsontario.ca. Steven, something that was super interesting in this episode this week was that we had the return of the chickens as a reward.

And this is all so interesting, okay? Yeah. First time there's no sea award and then the chickens are back it this is very interesting just the whole like sort of like okay we had the sea award and then the sea award is gone and all of a sudden the chickens are back was there a deal like i'll give this award to save the chickens i'm not sure but i think the story was that the original the origin of like getting rid of the chickens was Sia didn't like that they were throwing the chickens off of the boat. That's a very stressful thing. Very stressful thing for the chickens.

So I don't know, maybe we have, we sort of like landed in some middle ground where we won't throw chickens off of the boat, but we'll still have them out pro put the chickens out there because for 47 seasons that they give the survivors chickens and they cause there's nothing that will cause more fights in the tribe than giving them chickens. That's funny. They let them out. Who wants to eat them? Who doesn't want to eat them? Who wants to save them? Who ate too much? I think it's a weird move, though, to put that, like, take them out for, like, moral reasons and then be like, yeah, those morals were sort of disposable.

I hear you. They're not throwing them off votes. But look, I eat meat. I'm still not totally comfortable with it. I mean, I'm sure this. Did you all get chickens in token jeans? No, we did not in token jeans, but we certainly did in Cambodia. We had a chicken and, you know, killed her.

Juicy J right. Yeah. Yeah. It was a very funny deleted scene. Um, the juicy J escaping, I think actually escaping Jeremy, you let juicy J out. There was a, you know, uh, uh, jailbreak. Um, but, but, uh, he did that intentionally. Yeah.

Why? So I think it's just to create chaos. I think it was just like him having fun. Um, it was a very funny deleted scene. Right. If you haven't seen it, you know, it's worth to create chaos. I think it was just like him having fun. It was a very funny deleted scene. If you haven't seen it, you know, it's worth going back and watching it.

It's very, very humorous. Yeah. But, but yeah, the, the, I don't know. I mean,

I always was fine with the chickens and that, but then like, like taking them away and then putting them back, just kind of like something. Look, Survivor has done this quite a bit in the new era of like jeff comes out like hey it's me i'm i'm your i'm your grandpa now i'm spicy jeff you know it's like uh we're being nice to the chickens now we're back yeah now we're eating them now this is the

spicy nuggets yeah um yeah i don't know i mean it's fine no they gave them three egg laying hens i feel like in the past they used to give them a rooster also well you don't need. I mean, it's fine. They gave them three egg laying hens. I feel like in the past they used to give them a rooster also. Well, you don't need the rooster for the egg laying. But they used to give them a rooster too. Just for like fun? For like the cock-a-doodle-doo? I feel like they would get three egg laying hens and a rooster. And then the survivors would get stumped on.

What do we do? Can we kill the rooster? There's a deflation in the chicken, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. To make make it annoying to wake them up so there's a lot of stuff that you could do with the with the rooster but yeah i was excited to see that the chickens came back i mean that's a big reward yeah it is a really big reward especially when there's no food yeah um and and let me just yeah and let me just say to the gata tribe they're thinking about it kill all three chickens in a row right away i mean a i'm a little uncomfortable with chickens but b the purely correct strategy is to kill them all um right away because otherwise like

there's going to be a swap you're going to be sharing them yeah yeah i mean this has been and this did not this did not help me in Survivor All-Stars because this was my opinion of, we got rice and we had it. And my, what I was trying to sell to my tribe was like, Hey, we have rice. We should be eating it. And Amber was like, no, we in Australia that we ran out of food and we didn't have any more, like, but there's going to, we're going to have to share it with people. We eat it now. We get it. And they were like, it's like the advantages, you know, and even though I was, and this is a lesson that I learned of like, I can be, I learned that day that even though I am right, that I can just also be quiet

and stay. And that is a lesson that I have taken with me. And I can tell you that I am now successfully married for 14 years, Steven. Wow. Okay. And many times I have been right. And I have kept that to myself. So Sam was right here. I mean, Sam basically had basically had that lesson right he wanted to eat them but he saw that the rest of the tribe was a little more ambivalent about that it looks on sierra loves chicken she pets them um so yeah goes to wineries that have chickens yeah it goes to wineries you know they drink wines chickens love wine they're luscious the chickens are luscious okay uh how about uh baby andy in it's such an interesting uh spot and he ends up uh getting the word from uh sierra about the women's

alliance and then did you think that was a funny moment when he was like i love you and she's like i love all you guys i love everyone you. You know, I didn't catch that. It was a Candice Billy Garcia moment, really. I didn't catch that, yeah. Oh, it was great. It was great. It really was exactly like that Candice Billy Garcia where Candice is like, oh, we love you.

And Billy's like, I love you. It really was very similar. Yeah. Did Andy successfully, completely destroy the Sierra and Sam alliance? The alliance he's trying to build up. It's a tricky one. It is a really tricky one.

This is like, you know, whenever people ask, why don't the survivors just like tell each other what's happening? This is why. It's because of like literally this thing where Sierra tells Andy, this pretty anodyne piece of information that the three girls have a name for their alliance which is um the breadwinners which is a fun name actually for

their alliance um I can but it's funny because like it's gonna you know emasculate Sam a little bit right um like as uh you know the self-imagined um glue or whatever he is glue guy glue guy glue gun uh glue guy not gluten guy oh yeah that's right not in the breadwinners not a right that's very good that's pretty good um but but but then like so that she tells andy is kind of like a throwaway comment and like don't tell anybody and andy feels rightfully good that he's got some kind of inside intel with sierra andy wanting to you know bolster his relationship with sam who he sees as his number one yeah tell us about the breadwinners and then sam's wondering what on earth are you telling andy for not me and i do think there had to be a little

bit of like really you guys i mean like what about me i'm not a breadwinner here um you think that he was annoyed not only about not knowing the name but also what the name was i i think that had to be i mean personally that didn't cross my mind yeah this is just like you know armchair psychoanalyzing not only about not knowing the name, but also what the name was. I think that had to be, I mean, personally- That didn't cross my mind? Yeah. This is just like, you know, armchair psychoanalyzing, but like, I think that maybe there was a glimmer of that. But also like, even the fact that your best ally is sharing something with someone else and not with you,

and then it's getting back to you. Like, how do you not start to wonder, right? Because information is the currency of the game. You know, and fire tokens, that's the other currency. So I would love to just talk about that um in the different parts uh what was it a mistake for andy to mention this to sam yeah it's a tough one because he doesn't want to keep anything from sam he wants to like bolster his relationship with sam so i think like this is this is the point you're like you at every stage the person is hoping that nobody that they don't go and tell anybody right with the three bread

winners they're hoping sierra doesn't go tell sam and andy when when sierra tells andy she's hoping he doesn't tell sam when andy tells sam she's hoping she doesn't you know take it back to sierra and then then sam you know is, I mean, which all happens. Everybody talks. There's nothing, there's no currency that people love to spend more than your secret. That's a good line. It's really true. It's very true.

And so I was like, oh, I got, hey, I got Sierra's secret. You want to hear it? So I thought that for Andy, like, okay, good. He's spending the the sierra secret that he got from sierra mistake to tell andy i think but then i thought for and i talked about this with james jones last night i thought it was a mistake for sam to confront sierra on it like i just feel like question yeah because now that his objective is i want to keep andy he made it harder on himself to keep Andy by confronting Sierra about, hey, why are you telling Andy the secret? Yeah, and I'm sure that they have like a really good like interpersonal relationship where maybe he feels it's OK to kind of bring this up, you know, where he can say like, hey, why are you telling me these things?

Why are you telling that to him? And I'm sure he's just annoyed. And sometimes when people are annoyed, they don't act perfectly, right? Like they confront people. They, you know, object. They complain. But yeah, it was also not a good move, I think, for Andy to tell Sam. Yeah. Because then that could be a piece of intel, you know, just to like build his. He keeps talking about how important it is for him to build his relationship with Sierra.

And this was an opportunity to do that. And there was always the danger telling Sam that he would bring it up with Sierra. Yeah. Hey, look, I've been there, too, because a lot of times I talk about I reveal my secrets all the time on the podcast. And then sometimes people like slide into my wife's DMs and be like, hey, did you know Rob said blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then she gets mad at me and starts yelling at me, and I'm like, who told you this? Let me know so I

can ban them from listening to the podcast. Did you mention your second family on air? I didn't mention my... Let me know so that I can excommunicate them from the RHAP community. Yeah. Yeah.

And so, too much information. the RHAP community. Yeah. Yeah. And so, uh, yeah. So, you know, too much information, uh, doesn't,

and not everybody needs to know everything. Sometimes things are just between a podcaster and his podcast audience and not his immediate family. And I want to say this about Sam. Okay. How was his freestyling, this positive character moment that gets its own confessional about his freestyling is related to his game. When myiting a gerard manley hopkins poem from memory you know a lot

more complex than whatever that dog girl was you know is is portrayed as ridiculous okay i got clown music the difference is steven that he was freestyling his his was an original creation you were parroting back something that you memorized. Yeah, but that's what Survivor is. It's all about parroting. You know, it's like my game in Token Chains was based on Rob Sesternino's game. You know, it's all parroting back things that you memorized. You're like Coach delivering quotes he memorized before he came out there,

maybe to the wrong historical figure. Oh, God. It's the first time I think. I'm honored to be compared to coach thank you for that listen i would much rather be coach you know but coach coach was also giving by the way you know an original poem speaking with which one of us is more like coach the one who's creating original garbage or the one who's bringing the you know the highlights of civilization to the cbs audience yeah um i i'm not sure. Could go either way.

Gabby in the chat says, the clapping for the freestyle was like the clapping for the coconuts. Gabby in the chat. I know that, Gabby. Yeah. All right. Steven, let's talk about the amulet advantage. Now, they changed it up a little bit.

Do you feel like, did Survivor do enough to make this amulet a three-way idol instead of an extra vote, a steal a vote, and then ultimately an idol? Did they do enough to make it something that players will use constructively? Yeah, I think it's a really good improvement. I mean, because previously the three-way usage of it

as an extra vote was so incredibly situational, it was never going to happen. So we're hugely incentivized to vote the other people other players out which obviously was a great storyline right in um in in season 45 um very fun the way like austin like picked off the other people who had the other parts of the idol and the idol comes back to haunt him anyway very very fun like whole whole arc arc there but but um i think they had to realize that there was no real way that it, you know, at that point, that's the strategy. Right. For that thing. There's no reason for the three people to work together, given that that as as a trio, it's it's basically useless. So I think like making it strong as a three and then, of course, like stronger as two and stronger as one, because it's just yours.

You don't have to share it. So suddenly I think the tension is a lot more interesting now where there is a reason to work together. It does create a bond, but at the same time, there's also some tension of, you know, some, some selfish tension of like, maybe it's good to vote them out. I think it's a much better time now. What do you think? I really, I agree. I think it's much a better design.

And I thought it was interesting that all the players told their original tribes about it. Nobody tried to hide what was going on. And I think that, I don't know if this is necessarily what the players were thinking, but I think it could be advantageous for them in two different ways. That one, I think that for the players

who are on their own tribe, if you're Andy, you come back and say, hey, I got this thing. It's like, well, now if we get rid of Andy, now we've now given an idol to two people, like half of an idol to two people that aren't in our tribe. At least we had some agency. And I think that with the tribes being even in numbers, the way they are, I think that all these other tribes are like, oh great, we'll pull in teeny and Andy now to be in our group. Or now we'll pull in, you know, teeny and Caroline to vote with us because they're connected to this person.

So I think it makes all the amulet holders like these interesting people that the other tribes think that they might be able to pick up and pull in with them. Yeah. Yeah. That's a great point. That's a really, really good point where suddenly it's creating this whole, you know, show wide dynamic of who's going to be with me. Who can I recruit? You know, and kudos to Andyy too by the way for again like so thoughtfully positioning himself as on the bottom yeah which has some credibility he did a great job with that but i loved how he came in and didn't

like i'm not going to tell you everything it's like hey let's just say like i'm i'm at the bottom and i'm a good person to pick up later it's almost like and you play in like blood on the clock tower for instance it's like hey i have a role that'll help the uh the good guys uh trust me on this and like you'll need me later right yeah exactly exactly and he did it you know he's very smart right i mean uh you know show them that he's available to be to be picked up i mean rome r, you know, fishy winner Rome did something very similar. Co-fishy. Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, two separate fishies.

They each get a fishy. You know, you don't like, you know. I think it's interesting because the Emmy rules, you know, I know the Emmy rules from time to time. I wonder if it's the same thing at the Oscars. Like, it's very specific who gets to get a real statuette. And I think, you know, both Rome and Genevieve get statuettes. to get a real statuette. And I think, you know,

both Roman and Genevieve get statuettes. Steven, let's get to some questions because a lot of people had questions about this very exciting episode. Okay. And Marco wants to know, is the amulet worthless now

until there's one person left? Should they have kept it more of an incentive to keep it a secret? It is funny that they all shared it. You know, that they all kind of, I wonder if they agreed on that, that we're all just going to go tell.

Do you think, actually, that's a question, Rob. Do you think that that is an important subject of conversation? Like how much we're telling? Yeah, they must be asking each other this, right? Like how much we're telling our tribes about this? Are we sharing it or are we keeping it a secret? Yeah, and I think that in Andy and in Teenie,

I think that they are mostly truth tellers in terms of like what they're gonna tell the tribe so i think that they're gonna go back and and so for caroline who might be more inclined to keep things a secret i think that um you know it ends up being just like a mutually agreed upon uh decision so the negotiation yes i think so i think that teeny if I'm teeny and I know in my heart of hearts, I'm going to say yes. You say yes with you say I'm going to do it

with one second left on the clock. Yeah, yeah, right. But she I even felt like out of the gate like both Caroline and Andy were like, no, no. And she's like, well, what if? And at that point, she's already lost. Right. It seemed like that Caroline was going to potentially, you know, like they presented it like Caroline was about to blurt it out. I just think that I don't have as much of an issue with Teenie ultimately giving up the vote.

But I do feel like that that was with, you know, you know, two minutes left. A lot of things could happen. Somebody else could panic. Well, and Teenie had the best rationale of we're going tonight. You know, I mean, I feel like that would be incontrovertible. You know, I mean, they all know Andy's on the bottom, so maybe he wants his vote. But I think that Teenie could really have drawn a line there and said, you know, we're going to I can't, you know, so. But from Teenie's perspective, it seemed like that going to tribal, it seemed like a little

bit more of an open and shut case, but you know, that's Survivor, things change. Yeah. But Steven, okay. Can I get you to lock in? Will the idol, the amulet idol be played this season by three or two people? Oh, wow. it idle be played this season by three or two people oh wow or or will it end up going down to

like will players successfully combine to use the amulet yes or no this is just yes right I'm just what do you think I'll take me in the middle I'll say two well I wasn't even so that I was just looking for yes or no you don't even have to specify three or two yes okay yeah that would be exciting if it could happen that I was just looking for a yes or no. You don't even have to specify three or two. Yes.

Okay. Yeah. That would be exciting if it could happen. What do you think? I'm going to say no. I think that the odds are still against the people agreeing upon it. Like, and maybe there could be some sort of like a alliance of people that are on

the bottom coming together. And then maybe it's sort of like a day, you know, shout out to Gabby, like the David's coming together. And then maybe it's sort of like a day, you know, shout out to Gabby, like the David's coming together to use their advantage. But I'm going to say the odds are still more against them being able to use it. I mean,

teeny and Andy, both in not great spots on their try right now. Yeah. So we'll see. All right. Josh Kettles has a Steven specific question. Can Steven explain to us the difference between a threat and an ultimatum? I feel like an ultimatum is like an if then statement,

right? Like if this happens, then I am going to do this. Whereas a threat is like, it's just an if state, you know, like it's like, if you like,

like there's no, it's a, it's a little more open ended, right? I'm going to get you if you, if you do this. Yeah. But like,

there's like a more of like a a definitive conclusion okay so i feel like that there is a difference between a threat and ultimatum uh i i think it's a different question of that was what rome was doing a like basically if i say like hey like you know if you know you say to somebody, if you're late again, I'm going to have to fire you. Right, an ultimatum. Yes. But was what Rome was doing to Saul, was that an ultimatum versus a threat? I think it was an ultimatum, right?

If you don't give me your shot in the dark, I will vote you out. Right. So Google is saying an ultimatum is a demand. Like there's like a – like let's focus on the punishment or the harm, but instead it's a demand. So it's like you have to do this thing or there's a threat. It's like I'm going to – there's a demand attached to it. And there was a demand. If you give me your shot in the dark or this will happen.

I mean an ultimatum can clearly be threatened yeah is the word if just the only difference there of like give me your shot in the dark or you're going home is a threat if you don't give me your shot in the dark i am going to vote you out right is an ultimate but if you give me the shot in the dark then i won't vote you out yeah that's interesting yeah okay so i felt very badly for saul oh my gosh but like you also considering that rome was still gonna vote him out yeah well yeah but i mean the thing with rome following him around the beach you know how many times in the past have we said made you know mocked players for not locking down their target right like you know i mean with ben in you know healers. Like, you know, I mean, with Ben in, you know,

healers, heroes, hustlers, you know, oh, and then they, they cut back and forth with, with everybody on the beach kind of lazing around and then they're like, well, these idiots, why are they not following Ben around? Uh, and he's doing it. He's doing the things that we make fun of people for not doing. Yeah. In fairness to what he's doing, even though he is not doing it with like the grace of like Andrea following Malcolm around. Like I think that, you know, when Rome was running around looking for idols, like there was a lot of like, like, can you believe this guy? Can you believe it? I can't believe this guy. But there was no like people weren't trying to stop him physically.

And Rome at least is like, OK, well, you may not agree with his methods, but it was effective. Yes. I mean, like, you know, in Cambodia, when Joey was out looking for idols, I would follow him to be out looking for idols. Like that to me is how you play Survivor. You know, if you like your fate in the game could be dependent on this person playing and and rome knows that his is right like he knows that saul wants him out saul is his target if saul gets an idol his plan is screwed of course you should be following him now was there like a gentler way he could have done it i feel like that's like you know picking splitting hairs like um you know like he was doing the thing that he should be doing he wasn't doing it in like the optimal way.

But there's no great way to like tail someone around an island for hours at a time. You know, I did think the stuff with like you have to give me your shot in the dark or I'm going to vote you out was a little unnecessarily aggressive. But also like why is that? Like honestly, like so much of it was Saul's indignation, you know, the sense of like Saul being so beaten down by what was happening to him that like Rome should have like taken his foot off the gas as a human. But from a purely strategic standpoint, the idea of like muscling someone to give you something, you know, as leverage to work with them, knowing that you're going to screw them over anyway, like that's that's that's a decent survivor play. Yeah, I think that the issue was when saul is like saying like hey can i just go sit on the beach he's like well i'm gonna be right next to you it's like i i think it's a point you you can just watch saul right and sit on the beach and it's like all right all right like uh

that's take five saul yeah yeah because saul not looking for the idol is also a break for you so i i think that he could have like uh like given Saul like a little bit of breathing room. If you're not in the jungle, you're fine. But like, you know, if on Survivor you are going to err one way, you should err as being like more vigilant rather than less vigilant. I think like, you know, I mean, we've certainly again, like how many times in the past have people just like let their targets wander off, find an idol and ruin their plans? And we don't like applaud them for their humanity and i really like the way that kishan was like hey rome you better go check like uh better like if somebody's got to do it better it's not you yeah i mean very well played by kishan for you know stoking that antagonism to

the point that it almost saved him you know like the antagonism was so intense that at least from the story we saw, it almost was. He almost had it this week. He almost he almost like this could have been like he was like one like a little like he was 99 percent of the way there to this just being a Kashan love fest this week. You know where he went wrong, Rob, was when his floating head started talking to genevieve yeah ideally yeah where he was screwed up right if you could avoid that her like her inner monologue uh really uh saving the day okay so steven uh this is a question from ll cool dubs what is it

about this season that we're getting so much more dynamic gameplay within the small tribes that's a good question i mean first of all the fact that it's balanced i think has helped a lot right like not having an absolute disaster tribe where we just see like the absolute you know the total implosion of not just a tribe but like six humans is is is nice and also has kept i think some of the energy level up the sense of competition up um you know i do think some of the energy level up, the sense of competition up. You know, I do think some of it, too, is the shorter term advantages. Right. Which are driving some of the strategy, you know, both because the players are so aware of what happened last season and also because of these new, you know, fun boxes, you know, that they that they created. They Survivor just on their Instagram had a thing about the Flint team that makes these boxes. A survivor just on their Instagram had a thing about the Flint team that makes these boxes.

And, you know, having this kind of like tiered advantages, I think, was was a really smart choice that has kind of helped power to the. Does this change your opinion, Rob, about the three tribes at all? A little bit. Like, I feel like that it's certainly been better this season where we don't have just like it's not as lopsided. And I think that maybe they get more lucky than it's necessarily like that they've changed something by design. And so it's been pretty good. I think that what you said about all three of the tribes going to tribal council, I think that that is a really big part of it where that, you know, we've had where it's usually like one tribe doesn't even go to tribal council. And there's such a learning curve where that you know we've had where it's usually like one tribe doesn't even go to tribal council and there's such a learning curve where that the people that haven't been to tribal council yet they're a little bit hapless the first time that they go but the fact that everybody like jeff talked about i forgot uh to he said in the tribal council last week he's like oh lavu

tribe uh this is your first tribal council some people would say you haven't even started playing survivor yet but the fact that all three tribes have gone there, they've all like been to a tribal council, it's only day eight, that I do think that we're going to see a very fast paced game that everybody's involved with from a very early point. Yeah, yeah.

That's a great point. Yeah, and it's true. Like we do have a sense of like almost all the players. We got a little tease of, there's going to be a big point. Yeah. And it's true. Like we do have a sense of like almost all the, all the players. We got a little tease of, there's going to be a big twist next week. Do you think that we will go to two tribes? That's been, Oh,

that's interesting. That'll be fun. That'll be really fun. I hope that does happen. Yeah. It'll be interesting to see how long we do that for. I know in second chances, they went from two to three back to two,

just for the one vote. Do you think that we would be in two tribes potentially for short as one vote but it's only one vote because of the terry evacuation right yeah i believe so um but typically they have in the last couple seasons they've done mergatory with i think 13 people and so if that holds, it would only be for one vote. But, you know, I kind of feel like if they go to two tribes, like two tribes of seven, that's exciting.

Yeah, a 12-person merger is even a little bit better, right? We don't have that one random person kind of like sitting out picking their feet. I feel like they love that. That's so silly. Okay. All right. Yeah. How about Tommy Guam says,

if Rome keeps treating his fellow castaways like he has, will he eventually become a goat and brought to the end because of his attitude to the other players? I mean, it's a viable idea, but he's such an aggressive player that I don't think you can ever think of him as a goat. He's already done a lot of stuff. You know, if in resume era survivor, he has a pretty good resume. So it's like I don't think he's a pure goat like that he's not just someone who's you know we talked a bit about q being a goat um last time are people going to try to take q to the end because maria was trying to but you know liz was saying she would have voted for q so um i think that you know these i don't see don't see him, it's possible, right? It's possible that he could be, but he's such a big player. And, and, you know, it's, it's not like, um, you know, some of the

people who you think about goats in that role, in that position, you know, who have been obstreperous or, or, you know, angered a lot of people, they don't usually have like, also like really big strategic resumes in the way that Rome already does. Yeah. I mean, I, I, I wish I could get on board with what you're saying and yes, he's played two advantages, but I really just don't know if that that's going to be the kind of thing that the jury is going to reward.

But also, I mean, yeah, look, I mean, if he keeps on, if he, if he goes like person to person and alienates

them to the extent that he has salt that's probably not going to work out so hot for him and it's obviously you know ultimately you know we've certainly said quite a few times that the goal is to just be there at the end as the person the jury likes most right like and not stress too much about the rest of it. But I just don't think he would necessarily be an obvious GOAT right now. Like, yes, if he like angers everybody, like if he keeps up the like pissing everybody off part of his game

and not so much the like aggressively strategic, aggressive strategic play part of his game, like yeah, he'd be a GOAT. Yeah. Okay. Steven, this is a question from Mana who says, do you think that this move may humble Rome a bit? He is too much. Do you think that this near-death experience in the game could potentially change Rome for the better? went up on the beach and then he apologized at tribal council again and said you know i really crossed the line and i shouldn't have done that um and so maybe yeah like you know we we've talked about how players have freak outs and then come back from them right we certainly talked about it

with andy after the first episode how players have you know these big emotional moments and they can kind of like rein that in and come back and play very well and it seems like andy's doing a great job of that um and you, why not the same thing for, you know, more, you know, this, this type of thing.

I don't think that Rome changes his stripes just because of one thing. I think that Rome is going to be Rome. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe you're right. Yeah. Rome is not built in a day and it is not going to change in a day. But again, like, I just think that like, you know, I see it all.

I don't want you all to think I'm like a Rome apologist, you know. I'm absolutely like, I thought the way he treated Saul was really bad. And especially because of Saul's reaction, right? You love Saul more than anybody. I know. I know. That's why you should, you know, that's why this is so hard for me to say. That's why you have credibility on this. That's right. That's right.

That's why I have credibility. So, you know, I did not think he for me to say. No, but- That's why you have credibility on this. That's right, that's right. That's why I have credibility. So, you know, I did not think he was nice to Saul, but I think there's like aspects of his gameplay that are really good. And that, you know, according to all the metrics we've established as like for good gameplay, like he's digging the boxes.

Okay. Cecilia wants to know, did the Kashan vote benefit Saul more than anybody else on the Red Tribe? Well, I mean, definitely better than getting voted out, which was the point at the start, I guess. But yes, because it puts on, you know, it builds the, oh, that's interesting. Cause like, then he is going to be, he's got,

then teeny has got nowhere to go, but Saul, that's a really good point. Teeny's got nowhere to go, but Saul really, cause Genevieve just masterminded the ouster of her ally. You know, she's already kind of sour on Rome. So, like, it's great for Saul and Teenie. And then, you know, Saul's also got this like budding thing with Genevieve. Like, yeah, Saul's in a great spot right now. Yes. I do wonder if the Red Tribe ends up getting through this. Does Teenie kind of have like an escape hatch with the amulet people of like to

like hey uh you know caroline take me in andy take me in to be able to get away from them and i wonder like uh could the red lavo tribe end up getting picked off when we get to the merge oh that's yeah that's an interesting that's a totally viable world where yeah yeah, I mean, Teeny's got this way of, you know, this other path. Yeah. Why do you think Goda sent Andy? If they've always talked about- That's such a good question. I don't know why.

Maybe they just feel like, okay, what does it matter if he loses his vote? But he could get an idol. And so I don't know necessarily why they would do that. Where it seemed like that Annika really wanted to go on the last one. Sam seemed like, hey, I should be the one to go. I was really surprised.

Is he feeling like, hey, I don't want to put a bigger target on my back? Yeah, I mean, you'd think that, you know, they had a big thing about it. They didn't want Andy to get an idol so that he could be, you know, voted out. It is interesting that now they're saying it's okay to go. Yeah, so that's a good one for if we ever get to do,

uh, any kind of exit press in the near future with anybody from yellow, uh, we can ask them that. Um, let me see if, uh, maybe one more question for Steven. Um, okay. How about the question of, uh, 26 days versus 39 days? Does that affect the ethics and immediacy of killing the chicken right away versus keeping the chicken for the eggs? Yeah. Right. Like you got to kill it sooner. Right. I mean, we've often seen these chickens on Survivor like not be particularly like chickens have to be well fed.

They have to be relaxed to lay eggs like that's like not you don't exactly see these contestants tending to these chickens particularly well. I don't think they ever laid an egg. So, I mean, I would. Yeah, that's a really good point. OK. All right. Stephen, anything else on your mind in regards to Survivor 46? No, I want to just check the comments. What? And everyone is very against my uh my support of rome again like i don't want to say that he's like playing so you know that he's like his social game is great or he's gonna make i just think that like yeah there are aspects of his game that we should

i respect the hot take steven i really do i i disagree with you but i i really respect you uh saying something that might be going against what the conventional opinion is going to be and so i think that that's what makes you a good podcaster and so um i didn't like that you gave out two fishies but i definitely i like the contrarian thought on you don't think genevieve deserves a fishy rob that's that's i like the contrarian thought that of rome is actually doing a good job with his advantages. But again, it's like the stuff like following Saul around where like when people don't do that, we're like, you idiot. Why aren't you following him around?

And he's doing it and he's pissing Saul off, but he's also doing it. So it's like he's an interesting, you know, he has many facets of this Rome, as do we all. You know, he is both somewhat annoying and also I think is playing well in some ways and in ways that are like unique and really good. Yes. But are they winning ways is, I think, the bigger question. Right. Are they setting him up to win? Like Russell, Russell Hance was also doing things that were very effective and helping him. Russell Hance has got all the fishies every week. Go back and check the record. He does. Yeah.

Yeah. But, but those weren't winning games. No, that's true. But you know, we, we,

you know, together we agreed that Andy deserved a fishy for his, his work last week. And I don't know if that's Andy's playing a winning game right now. Yeah. So, but it's a possible winning game. I mean, Rome is a possible possible.

I mean, Rome is definitely has a possible winning game. I don't think Rome is off the table as a possible winner. I don't think he's a likely winnerome is a possible possible i mean rome is definitely has a possible winning game i don't think rome is off the table as a possible winner i don't think he's a likely winner but a possible winner yeah i guess it's it's only day eight okay yeah all right steven this weekend we had such a successful launch of the first ever rhap production of Blood on the Clocktower. And this was your brainchild to say, like, hey, we need to bring a Survivor Blood on the Clocktower video to RHAP. And with Christian Hubicki was very involved in the planning. We brought this game to the world and it's been received with uh so much acclaim yeah i mean the comments in across everywhere i've seen them you know twitter reddit youtube have been so

enthusiastic that it's the best received thing we've ever done it actually might be maybe it balances my support of my support of my apology for rome um so yeah i mean it's really been so first of all it's such a fun game to play um it was it came out great it looks really good i'm really happy with it we put a lot of care into into it and to how the pacing and the way it looks and it was like it was great it came out great people have enjoyed it um you know i just wanted to play more clock tower and i all, you know, and I thought it would be like a fun thing to share with our community too. Cause like, it's like all the things that our community loves. It's like games of social strategy, you know, with like secret powers and advantages. Um, it's people

voting each other out, you know, people lying to each other, you know, old grudges coming to fruition and, and heated exchanges. I mean, truly it had, it had it all., you know, old grudges coming to fruition and heated exchanges. I mean, truly it had it all. So, um, and I know the people who know blood on the clock tower, I feel like we're very quick to early adopters to come in and check this out. I just want to make an appeal to the people. If you do not know what blood on the clock tower is, we do a really good job of holding your hand and explaining the rules of the game as we go along. So go ahead. If you're looking for something to hold you over between this and the next episode of Survivor, look up the Survivor Blood on the Clocktower game from RHAP on our YouTube channel.

I don't think you will be sorry. Yeah. One last thing. Someone else in the comments is saying, you know, Rome could have followed Saul around without dehumanizing him. Yes, I agree with that. I agree with that. But he also like, you know, there's, there's, there's good and bad. We've all, we're all criticizing the bad, but like, we should also, you know, acknowledge

the good. Yeah. All right. Uh, Steven, uh, anything else that you want to tell people about? Um, don't hate me for this. No, I think people can look, you know what, If you went on Twitter and, and, and drop these takes, I don't, I would not advise that, but here I'd like to think in the podcast space that there is still room for nuance in being able to say something that might not be the, you know, conventional thinking.

Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, this has been a joy as always, Rob. And you're not just a hot take artist coming in and just like

for the sake of being controversial. Yeah. No, no, no. I just, I don't want anybody to think that I'm like excusing because I love Saul

and it was hard for me to watch Saul be harassed. Yeah. But I don't want anyone to think I'm excusing the bad behavior. No, and I have your back on your right to say, you to, to call out the interesting and potentially a good aspects

of what you see happening on the show. Thanks so much, Rob. Yeah. I just, like, like, I, I, I don't think that, uh, like I listen, I, I, that I think everybody is clear on how we, we both feel about this. I just want to say I support, I stand by Stephen Fishback 100%. I'll go down with you. I'll go down with you. Okay? You're not going down alone. All right, good.

Okay, good, Rob. All right. No one else in exile. Okay. Exile Island, right? Yeah. All right. So then, of course, if you want to be with us in New York City, go to RobbinsWebsite.com slash NYC47 for tickets for our live show.

We got a big brother. Last Thursday night of the season tonight coming up. We'll be live at 9.15 p.m. Eastern time. Check out my exit interview with Keyshawn as well. And everything else we have going on here at RHAP. Thank you so much for joining us. Take care of a good one. Bye. We'll be right back. We live by a simple creed. If Rob has a podcast, we have a hero. Rob says to Nino, time to fly. Four things make me. This is your time.

This is your time. Big thanks to Eric Barger, who composed the beautiful ballad you just heard. Hear more of his music at itelectric over on Instagram.