RHAP: We Know Survivor - Know-It-Alls: Survivor 47 Ep 9

Episode Date: November 14, 2024

This week, Rob and Stephen discuss Survivor 47 episode 9.

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And if you're like me and think a TFSA stands for Total Fund Savings Adventure, maybe reach out to TD Direct Investing. The smartest guys around Are about to break it down Like they've won the game a million times Well, actually, they didn't really win the game at all Survival, the game at all Survivor know it all Survivor know it all Steven and Rob went out of town Got the game all figured out

They know it all Okay. Hello, everybody. No music today. A very special podcast coming to you live from my house. It's the real know-it-alls here. I'm here with Owen Knight. Rob had to take Nicole to the doctor. She's not feeling well. I wanted to make a joke about how he was hobnobbing with the glitterati. But but, you know, I felt like accurate information was was probably better. So anyway, here I am with Owen. I feel really, really lucky to be with someone who actually knows how to make it to the end, not know how to get votes just like me. So that's not going to be where kind of the conversation focuses today. But Owen,

welcome. Thank you so much for filling in on such short notice. Of course, it's an honor to be here. And yeah, like the chat is saying, I was a little upset we didn't get the music. But out of respect for Rob, I guess we won't be singing my name in the in the song, but next time. But yes nicole is feeling better soon and uh yeah very really flattered to receive the call i know rob and i share third place uh hopefully we share some strategic acumen and have a nice chat today about a fun episode oh yeah yeah we've got the no vote saying you and rob are both third placers there's a lot of there's a lot of connections there that kind of like uh knit you very well into this um oh and there's a big call in the

chat for you to sing the theme song are you right are you up for that no one wants that no one wants to hear me sing anything but i was ready to chime in steven and owen was out but yeah they can make up the rest we'll we'll get it next time um so dark days here on survivor saul voted out i have been you know if i seem a little like stunned or at a loss for words, I've been kind of like wrestling with this. I was very upset last night. How are you taking this? Were you a big Saul, Stan, Owen?

Of course. I mean, how could I not be? You know, we don't get a ton of Koreans on Survivor to begin with. And he is just such an amazing person. So fun to watch his um just like how indignant he was with the whole rome stuff in the pre-merge and just like watching him just lose his mind slowly was very entertaining um seems like a great guy so yeah i was i was very very upset i know rooting for asians out there somewhere is very upset as well and yeah yeah

it's just a in a blue sky account now as well but um yeah just just kind of a bummer but uh it was really fun i thought the scramble was really well edited and it was fun to watch it happen but yeah i i am in mourning myself i feel like i you know it's like when the band blows up and you're like i used to go see them at like the small club and then they become i feel that way about saul Like I was in on Saul episode one, you know, it was like, at first there was very little of Saul to like, you know, really latch onto, but like we saw his quads, he was a beast in those early challenges.

I feel like I was an early Saul adopter. And then when I saw, you know, just like kind of like the pile on from the fandom, obviously I was happy to see my like favorite band blow up. But I felt a little like, you know, you guys are all kind of Saul come lately. Were you, you you know where were you in the sort of trajectory yeah i was an early adopter i'd say as well but it is it's funny yeah it's like i liked saul before it was cool to do that it's like we're like saul hipsters right but um i remember seeing his profession and being intrigued by it because famously gabler was also a medical device rep and uh it is an interesting

career it's not one you see a lot on the show. I know a lot of people thought Gabler lied to everyone and said he was a doctor. But I knew the whole time that he was in kind of the biomedical engineering device world. And I thought that could translate well because clearly it did on my season. And, yeah, he just seemed like a really interesting fella. Like reading his interviews, you know, his age at this point in the game, it's like like someone in their 40s is not something you see as frequently on the show, which is kind of a shame.

I know. I know. Let's make you feel geriatric. But yeah, but yeah, I thought he'd have a great perspective. And I was really bummed early in the season when we weren't getting a ton of him. Yeah. Well, so let's talk about the move last night, because that's like this is like, you know, it was this it was this crazy thing, I mean, watching that tribal council,

I truly, I mean, when it was so chaotic and they couldn't decide on Kyle versus Sue, I kind of thought, okay, like there's no definitive plan in place. And Gabe seems very chill right now. So at that point I kind of thought that Saul was probably going, but did you have a sense going into that tribal of, you know, what was going to go down? Like, where were you? You know, where was your take? Yeah, I was actually extremely nervous for Saul. Like you said, there didn't seem to be a definitive plan B and like counter option.

And then I was reading a little too much into the edit of the show itself when I noticed I thought Sue and Kyle's confessionals looked too bright to be from that evening. So I thought Sue and Kyle had been interviewed the next day and were being asked about the previous day's proceedings. And I was like, oh, Saul's cooked because I don't see a confessional of him in the broad daylight. So I don't know if that was me trying to galaxy brain what was going on. but apparently like correctly like the galaxy brain did did figure it out yeah for once it worked out but yeah i was nervous because like you said i i think that you really made a good point that there wasn't a definitive uh you know option and just the the fluid nature of what was happening i think would have made it

a lot harder for the flip to happen um and from sa's exit press, I was hearing him say he found out from Sam that his name was out there just 10 minutes before they left. So that is no time whatsoever in Survivor when you have to juggle a lot of conversations. You're trying to get a coalition together. And yeah, I was I was worried. I was very worried. Yeah. Rob had a great interview with Saul. Well worth checking out. So I had a lot of like insight and perspective. But so like among those things, he just he never said and I wondered this, you know, do you think like if they had been able to settle on a name, which is so hard in that like very brief time, you know, could that have gotten the plan together? Like that's the question I'm so curious about, because it seemed like in that tribal council scramble, so much of it was, is it Kyle? Is it is it you know, is it Sue? And then the narrative that I kind of saw unfolding was, OK, you know, let's just settle on Saul because we don't really have a definitive, distinct plan. Like if we can't even decide between Kyle and Sue, you know, let's like we don't have anything.

Like so we kind of have to stick with this majority. Now, the salt, like kind of suggested but didn't outright say that, like, he was the vote, you know, like it was going to be him and all the rest of it was smoke. But I do wonder, you know, it seemed like Sam was genuine. It seemed like teeny was genuine. Like, I don't know, was Andy really in the middle there was Rachel, you know, do you think if they really had been able to settle on a name like that plan could have come together or was that always a decoy plan? I think there was a chance. I think there was a chance Andy and Rachel may have flipped, but I think not having a definitive name cemented that it wasn't going to happen. My perception was Rachel and Andy were in that swing position.

it wasn't going to happen. My perception was Rachel and Andy were in that swing position, and it seems like they both have started to foster a relationship with Genevieve and her being the driver of this. I think they saw themselves in a better position to stay with the numbers there. And yeah, just not having a solid counter plan just was kind of the nail in the coffin for the Saul uprising with Teenie and Sam. So it was a bummer. But I think props to Andy for executing his flip last week and sticking with it and finding himself in this power position to where he's got some flexibility and people wanting to work with him and kind of jockeying for him as a vote.

And I don't know if I'm jumping ahead here, but I was a little shocked by how Andy-centric the edit was in the beginning of the episode. It really seems like he's kind of turning in or he has been the main character of the season. And I'm so curious where it is going to lead, because to me, you know, it was easy to write him off after the first episode and his little meltdown after the challenge and the not clapping for the coconut. And I personally wrote him off as a potential winner back in episode one. But we're seeing this sort of redemptive story being told.

And I know you're a big novel guy. I'm curious your take on where this this might be leading for Andy, too. Yeah, I'm having the same thoughts. Oh, and like part of me, like I've so been locked into this idea of Andy as a like a loser in the finals where, you know, he gets there. He's a huge character, but like he just like is doesn't get the respect from the jury, you know he gets there he's a huge character but like he just like is doesn't get the respect from the jury you know and and even um when when he was even at the start of this episode you know you have i think it was teeny saying you know thanks andy for voting with us and he's like yeah it was a team effort you know you you keep on having andy you know you know same thing with

like when like um whoever it was said like who did this and and um uh oh my gosh who was sam yeah well sam raises his hand um annika annika is voted out and says like who did this and um sam raises his hand and he was like you know it was me too it was us three it was all of us yeah exactly like you keep on seeing him being like hello i'm part of this too i've like assumed he's not getting the credit for it but that being said you know watching season 43 i was totally blinded to the gabler because of the gabler at all because of like the kookiness in that first episode with him playing his like you know single use idol you know because of the palm fronds and the shelter which i still think is one of the craziest things i've ever seen on

the show um so i was like there's no way this guy like and he was just like Gabler, you know, like there's no way this guy is winning. And then he did. And so, like, does Andy have Gabler upside? There's a chance. I mean, crazier things have happened. But I think I mean, I'm with you and we would know a thing or two about zero vote finalist edits, right?

Like it doesn't like he's he's a good storyteller. He's got an interesting perspective. I think he's got this interesting combination of both cerebral analogies and like analyze analyst analysis. There you go. Of the game with this like kind of emotional, insecure back and forth that you can see him battling with. So I think it makes for really interesting television.

But it's so hard because I was of the opinion that no one took Gabler seriously. And then, you know, you saw my job unhinge. So it's not out of the realm of possibility. But it's been interesting to see. It was really with the flashbacks with Rachel where I was like, whoa, they are really focusing on this Rachel Andy coming back together and i think that was probably part of the reason why this move was so uh hinged on them i think they wanted to highlight that the two of them could maybe find some common ground and then potentially be a force moving forward as we get into kind of the end game here yeah i was interested because like in that even in that like that sort of like flashback you know when rachel was narrating it she was like yeah you know like andy wanted to work with me for a while and then i wanted to work with him and we just never connected. Like she, we never saw her wanting to work with him. We never like that felt like she was gaslighting the viewers. Like you're just lying to me at this point.

Yeah. You seemed pretty not keen about him waking you up in the middle of the night to be comforted. Like you weren't about that. Yeah. Well, let's talk about Rachel here because I'm furious. No, we, we know one of our 49 laws of survivor power that Rob and I did like, you know, 600 years ago was like gratitude. Gratitude is going to get you nowhere in survivor. So obviously, Saul gave Rachel the sort of get out of jail free card, you know, safety without power, where she got to leave tribal council.

Look, by all accounts, looks like she was going to get voted out and then Tiana got voted out instead. Do you feel like Rachel being so quick to jump on this? And it did position her really as the swing vote, right? Andy and Rachel were the swing votes. Had they said no, this probably would not have happened. Did Rachel give in too soon to an ally or is this a reasonable move once she sees Sierra voted out of the game and herself left out of the last vote? I think it's reasonable. It's hard because obviously we love Saul. We like Rachel. We want to see our faves working together. But I think objectively, something that separates a really excellent survivor player is being able to cut those

emotions out of the game and look at the big picture and not get too focused in on one relationship. I know that's something I personally struggled with. You know, I was like loyal to a fault. And you really need to be able to cut bait and just and just move forward and see the next couple moves ahead. So, yeah, I don't think it was too fast. I think it shows that she's she's shrewd and she can analyze the whole situation. But it doesn't make it not a bummer. And I wish we had seen her hemming and hawing about it a little bit more. And I'm sure she did internally.

She seems like a really nice person. But I will say I did. I did chuckle a bit when Saul is trying to scramble and he's like, please, I helped you out. And like he didn't really like to try to tug at the heartstrings very much. It just felt very quick and objective and just like, hey, quick reminder. Do you think he should have twisted the knife a little bit more? I think he maybe should have tried at least just like Rachel, please. I begging you like you know i helped you out i really want to work with you you know i maybe he did and we didn't see it but it was it did make me laugh a little bit it just

it felt almost so defeated just like i helped you out could you please please vote with me it's just like oh man poor guy you could tell he was just like he was he was frazzled. Is Saul an anti-Rachel juror now? Because like, you know, there's nothing that motivates like hatred in the jury house than this feeling of being betrayed. And like, I guess like he's got like, you know, betrayed by quite a few people here. I mean, Saul's secret agents is the worst alliance in the history of the show, like doesn't even last an episode, you know, like, in fact, those are the people who immediately turn on him. Like, do not, you know, he should not have hired those people. He's a bad hiring manager. Yeah. Yeah. Saul's angels, all secret Asians, whatever you want to call it. It just did not

work out. And at the same time, though, I don't think he'll be a bitter juror. I think it's harder to be when, what, nine people vote you out. You know, he can't just be mad at one person for cementing his fate. If anything, if he sniffs out that Genevieve was kind of the main driver of that, maybe he'd be pissed at her. Because I heard him say in his exit interview that his ideal final three was with Genevieve and Tini. And he wanted the Lavos to make it all the way to the end. I don't know exactly what his vision was there, but I think he could be crossed with Genevieve. And that, I guess, we skipped over this before. Do you think it was the right move for Genevieve? No, no, I want to ask you that question. No, I don't want to have to answer that question.

It's a very tricky question. so so this is interesting in um in rob's interview with saul he says that in that sort of tribal council scramble he you know we see him only get up one time he got up three times there's a lot more movement of course like it's all condensed um but he said that like in the last time i think that teeny was the one to tell him that hey this was genevieve's plan and then, you know, let's all write down Genevieve. And teeny was like, no, we can't write down Genevieve. I think because it was just like, there was just no traction there basically. So Saul,

so Saul said that, you know, the story that we're we were given was that Genevieve, you know, was, this is like revenge for Rome and I, you know, which is like, what a, what a silly story i mean it was very funny like if that were the case but you know and we've seen that that kind of attitude work out very successfully you know natalie anderson famously you know basically won her season as revenge for jeremy um but but um and her twin sister well right right right yeah um the the my read on this so so anyway so so saul said that what he really

believes was happening was that genevieve you know saw that he had like a lot of different connections like everybody's name was being floated out but but nobody was saying his name he was friends with everybody i mean we certainly saw that you know uh in the episode you know in the episodes where like you know kyle Kyle saying Saul's his favorite person. You know, he's got this secret relationship with Andy. It's the relation with Rachel. You know, he said he had a great relationship with Gabe. Obviously, none of these relationships were that great. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because everyone voted voted him out. But, you know, my read is that this is a not good move for Genevieve.

You know, you look back at Survivor Cagayan, right, and you've got this like final, you know, this three-person group of the Brains tribe. They're flipping back and forth between the alliances. You know, everybody wants to work with them. And then one of them turns on the others, and then all three of them are on the jury. You know, none of them make it to the end. And that's kind of the trajectory I see here. Like, I mean, although Teenie is still my winner pick. So I just see this blowing up in Genevieve's face.

You know, I think this is for a few reasons. Like, first of all, I think that she was insulated by having this like three person Lavo group. Right. And it really did seem like everyone still kind of wanted to work with the Lavos. You know, Sam obviously has his Lavo vendetta, but it did seem like they kind of were the locus of power. And, you know, we've seen a lot, you know, we just saw in season 44 with that trio of Jam Jam, Carson and Carolyn, you know, and maybe they were a little bit more like stealthy as a trio than the Lavo group. But, you know, you really could see them, you know, operating well.

And you have Saul saying, I wanted, this is my final three. Like, I think it is a bad idea to vote out people who want you in their final three, right? You want to have people with you who want to move you further in the game. And especially at this point, at this point in the game, right. Where like, there's still a lot of game left to play. There's a lot of people left in the game. It's, it's, it's 10, right.

It's the final 10. Like, you know, you vote out the big threat who's going to screw you over, you know, for votes at like the final five, you know? And also because it makes Genevieve a huge player. You know, this happened to Emily Flippen, right? Like as soon as she like, you know, has her big moment and like blindsides Bruce, she's gone next because it's like, Emily is this big threat. And you have Gabe in this episode saying, Hey, this is all her move. This is all Genevieve's move. You know, we see, you know, the fact that Genevieve like cobbles together this plan, you know, from from everybody and like flips on her ally.

I'm not thinking that that makes Genevieve a great ally. You know, that's not my takeaway. I think Genevieve is like maybe the next to be voted out. And if not, like she's not long for this game. Well, what's what's your perspective? No, I agree with a lot of what you're saying. I think it reminded me a little bit of Soda and Tevin on 46. You know, it seemed a little early. It shows Genevieve can build a coalition. It shows that she's willing to cut an ally. It shows she's persuasive. Although I did laugh when Kyle said, I don't think Genevieve's much of a thinker.

Although I did laugh when Kyle said, I don't think Genevieve's much of a thinker. That was really good. But I think a lot of people picked up on the fact that Genevieve was kind of the conductor behind the train here today. And it's scary. I think it does leave her a bit exposed. And if the whole like basis of her pitch about targeting Saul is that he is well liked by everyone. I feel like that makes him a shield for her. And like you said, Lavo was in a pretty good spot. It seemed like they were kind of being jockeyed for votes.

And if people decided to turn on Lavo, she could have always tried to get it on Saul once she felt that they were in trouble. Right. So yeah, I think overall, it could be a game-winning move, but it's so early. Like there's a lot of game left and a lot of rounds left. And now the question is, you know, what's going to happen? But I was trying to draw a little like alliance chart and see what was like.

Oh, this is good. Thank you. Thank you. And my handwriting is terrible, but I guess I'll just show the camera real quick. But like I can't think of that. Yeah. Yeah. But I put Genevieve in the middle like teeny. Obviously, that relationship is gone. But it seems like she's got relationships with Andy and Rachel. She spent all that time with Sue. Like she does have some people that could have her back moving forward. But now there's this big, like, you know, red flag. It's like, well, Saul thought Genevieve was good with him.

So why would she keep me now? So it's it's tricky. I think objectively, like just looking at it, it's it's probably safest to say, like, yeah, that might have been a little early and a little bold. But it's not just her fault is the thing. Like it was a nine person vote. So there is some opportunity for her to kind of deflect and like remind people that it's like, you know, we all were in on this. But I feel like she got like full credit for that. I mean, she pushed it. you know, she sold it,

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slash Rob Pod. You know, it's so interesting to me with these new era players always turning on their allies. I really believe that the best thing that happened to Kenzie last season was failing to vote out Tiffany. You know, I think if Kenzie had voted out Tiffany successfully as she wanted, like Kenzie loses. So, you know, what is it, Owen? Like, like you're a new era player. What's the deal? But although you were part of. So I wonder, like, is it partially this three, this shorter season?

Like, do you have, like, less of a bond with these people so you don't feel that same sense of connection? But, you know, you were part of the Baka Boys, a great alliance that made it all the way through. You know, and obviously so much of what we perceive as alliances, like maybe we're wrong, right? We see, hey, they're the law of 03. They've all they're all wearing the same color clothes. Obviously, they're an alliance. But like maybe that's just a misperception. You know, maybe Genevieve sees like my real alliances, these people.

Like what's what's what's your take on why? Why all the pressure in the new era to blindside your best allies? Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of the meta around the new era has been big moves and like taking ownership of moves. I remember being a little surprised during 46 with how open everyone was in conversation and in confessionals about like, who owns this? I want to own one. Like I need my my fingerprints on a move. And then I think there is something to be said about like the amount of time you have. You know, there's there's far fewer down days, uh, in the post merge. I think maybe we had one like day with no challenge or nothing happening in the post merge and you get a couple in the pre merge and you it's, it's a lot of the devil, you know, versus

the devil, you don't situation. And, uh, with how early you merge and that there's only maybe five tribals before the merge. Um, if your tribe only goes to to one tribal like mine did, there hasn't been a lot of opportunities to build or break trust with people. And you only have a very limited sample size to go off of. And I was in the position where we had a 5-1 vote at our first tribal council, and then we never went again. And these people had not given me any reason to distrust them. And certainly, I was wary or less wary of certain people based on just like my perception of them as players, but they hadn't done anything necessarily to break my trust. So I think that is a difference with Genevieve and Saul is like,

she's perceiving that Saul did break her trust and vote out Rome. And even though I believe she went along with it, you know, that she I think she said herself, she's petty. She's acting petty in this game. And I'm kind of here for that energy. I think it's hilarious and fun. But is it objectively the like best way to move forward? That's that's tough to say. Yeah. I mean, I love that quote that she had about like, you know, I was my name came up in our first tribal council. I've got a license to kill. And I do think there's something to that of like you see your name being written and you're like, oh, this could be me. I like every I have to play hard and I can't feel bad for it being somebody else, because like if it's unless it's, you know, if it's if it's not somebody else that it's then it's me. Then it's me going home.

Yeah, I love that. I love that. You're somebody, though, who you get to the end without that resume. Right. Like that was obviously your story is like I never had my signature move. Like you have like any empathy for Genevieve just from that perspective of, you know, you do need to like have something you did. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. You certainly want to have an impact on the game. I think it's I mean, I think it's Rachel in a secret scene.

She was saying, like, I'm just sick of being left out of things like it's really demoralizing being there and just feeling like you're treading water. And, you know, all of your efforts and all the starvation have been for not. And you're just like, like, even if I keep lasting, like what's what's going to happen? I'm going to I'm going to get coming third. Woo hoo. Like I even remember like when Cassidy took me to the final tribal, she's like, I'm going to bring Owen to the end. I was like, hooray. Like I was just like, okay, cool. Like it's, it's hard. That breakfast, that final day breakfast is good. Breakfast was goaded. The breakfast was incredible. That, that was, that was really nice. Million dollar breakfast. Um, so yeah, I, I can a hundred percent empathize with people wanting to,

to make their mark on the game. But that that brings into the whole conversation about big moves, itis. And, you know, are you doing something just for the sake of making a move or are you thinking a couple of steps ahead? And I'm not I'm not trying to dunk on Genevieve at all. Like, I think she's a phenomenal player. And I don't doubt that she has thought about the ramifications of this. And we saw her after Saul's torch got snuffed that she's like, holy shit, that worked. Like she's she's like thinking and I'm sure she's got a vision for how she wants it to go. She was well aware that Teenie was going to hate her after this.

And I'm sure she has contingencies and a plan moving forward. But it is a little it is a little scary because I would certainly be threatened by Genevieve out there if I was on the beach with her. Yeah. Yeah. Let's talk about the one part aspect of this that we haven't discussed yet, which was Sam. A very funny scene where Rachel goes to Sam and says, you know, Sam, don't don't blow up my game. And Sam goes away and says i'm gonna go blow up her game you know what what like what do you make of sam's choice so the the structure of that was like rachel goes to him and says like i can't tell you who it is it's not you don't vote and then then he correctly guesses that it's saul which was a great moment and um and then you know he and rachel says like don't vote for Saul. Cause then you'll blow up my spot.

Um, which like I thought was interesting from Rachel's perspective, because like you're putting him in a really tough position because that means he has to vote for someone who's still going to be in the game. Like maybe he could vote for Rachel, you know, like, um, or maybe he plays a shot in the dark in that, in that spot. Um, but it's a really difficult choice. And then he kind of goes into overdrive. We'd seen Sam earlier in the episode kind of being really upset at this feeling of not having a place in the game.

Sierra being voted out means suddenly he has – this is sort of what we're talking about, right? This feeling of not having agency in the game. This feeling like you want to be controlling things but aren't. What's your take did like give me your thoughts about like how sam handled that yeah well i think time played a factor for sure so he probably didn't have a lot of time to mull it over and i heard in saul's interview him saying there was also this like conversation about a fake idol pass off between sam and saul that was happening concurrently while this was happening. But I think Sam's calculus probably very quickly was like, do,

am I willing to kind of turn on Rachel here and break her trust a bit to try to pick up Saul and teeny. And by his extension, he thought maybe Genevieve as well. So I think he was probably thinking like pulling the lever on the trolley car problem to maybe swap his relationship with Rachel for potentially with a relationship with all three Lavo members. Because my perception was that he was unaware that Genevieve was the one that was really fully pushing Saul. And he thought he was helping Lavo out by doing this. And it's like, oh, Tuku's trying to get y'all.

So that was my read on the situation. But I think a lot of it just had to do with how fast everything was happening. But, yeah, I empathized with Sam a lot in this episode. You know, it was I'm sure a couple of people laughed when he was like crying a little bit, like after he lost the immunity challenge. But I thought it was very earnest. No, I'm glad to hear you say that, because, yeah, it's really frustrating. And you hate feeling like your back's against the wall and your fate isn't in your own hands and um it must have been really nice to get his vote back at least to feel like he had a voice in it um and i thought it was

hilarious when he was having that conversation he's like there's no hard feelings towards andy and he said it but then his face is like like in this like no hard feelings at all yeah sure i believe you dude um so yeah it was funny that he was saying at the start of the episode like like i'm gonna get revenge on lavo and like these are like i'm like committed to like you know my revenge and um and then like at the end of the episode he is like scrambling to save a lavo member yeah and and really the person who had been pushing for sierra last episode right right it is funny how quick you can turn. But that that's that's the game. You know, you get new information and you try to figure out how that can benefit you moving forward. And I don't I don't hate the move, but obviously it did not work out in his favor.

Now, Rachel is going to be way less trusting of him. And I think really his his main lifeline now is andy who does not seem all that keen on working with him so i i think sam is in a pretty tough spot um i i i'm worried for him yeah i i don't see him lasting too much longer see i feel like sam has some upside because i do i mean i think you're right that he's kind of like a lone person now so you know maybe he's easy to pick off he like seems like vaguely threatening um but i kind of of like a lone person now. So, you know, maybe he's easy to pick off. He like seems like vaguely threatening. But I kind of think like a lot of his like danger has been like somewhat neutered where like, you know,

when he lost, you know, losing his psychic Sierra, you know, he and Rachel don't seem to have like a great operating relationship, you know, like who is, I mean, maybe Andy still feels some kind of way about him, but like who's targeting Sam? You know, maybe the votes will end on him because you know there's like it's easy are protecting two coups yeah and then um but i do wonder like who's actually gonna go for him it doesn't seem like he had he's like a huge immediate

um that's true too and i might be a little like uh blinded by my own season it's a little reminiscent of me with uh like he's the Janine now where Ellie got voted out. They were a strong pair. And then Janine is just down in the dumps. She's lost her idol. She's lost her number one. All she really has is like me, who was not 100 percent locked in with her and everyone just voted her out. I think it was nine to two that round. But, you know, we are in the final nine now. was nine to two that round but you know we are in the final nine now there's there's a lot of room like all you need is five unless jeff pulls some more lost vote mischief um but yeah you could see a situation where he's an easy number to scoop up um but i guess it just depends on on how the

how the game goes obviously and like if they want to like just punt and just take out an easy number as long as it's not me and get rid of Sam or if a group of four sees an opportunity there. I just I'm just I'm trying to struggling, trying to think like who he has like tight relationships with. Like maybe if Andy and Rachel, like if this continues with them, they bring in Sam, maybe a Genevieve, maybe, you know, Genevieve and Sue, maybe then Caroline. Like and they go after Kyle or Gay. I don't know. Who knows? Well, that's like all the animosity seems to be intertribal now. You know, presumably there's going to be some teeny, you know, Genevieve rivalry now, but also like the real heat is in the two coup tries. So let's like, I love that conversation or I mean, I thought it was terrible, you know, but it was funny, but like, you know, where Sue

and Genevieve were talking and Sue's like, we got to turn on Kyle. Kyle's the real enemy. And Genevieve's like, no, Saul's the enemy. You know, they're just like, why? Why? They're like, they're trying so desperately to like settle these old scores and like totally lost sight of the game in front of them. You know, Kyle's not gunning for Sue. Like, let it go.

Like, why? Because you wrote your name down once. Oh, like a week and a half ago. Yeah. Yeah. So, like, what are your thoughts on that? And like, well, let's talk about let's talk about the two coups. So I thought that, you know, Gabe seemed to handle it very well.

You know, I thought that, you know, he obviously want immunity, you know. But in terms of keeping his alliance kind of chill and together, you know, we saw him at tribal council with kyle looking very nervous understandably i'm good yeah right you're good you're good um what is your take on sort of where that relate like that alliance is going because it seems like like the greatest source of hatred right now is sue to kyle a hundred percent and it seems like gabe is just just trying to broker peace the best he can and like reassure everyone that they are together. And that might be identifiable by the other people in the game, seeing that Gabe is kind of the linchpin between the pair of Sue and Caroline to Kyle and that if they take Gabe out, then, you know, Tuku's done, you know, then it's just a pair and the challenge beast left.

And that's easy to, you know, make moves against. So, yeah, I think he did a really nice job. I mean, that that scramble must have been terrifying for Kyle. I mean, I'm sure he thought he was going to catch some heat. Maybe he heard his name. But at the very least, just winning three necklaces, although one was on a technicality. But, you know, it's it's an obvious threat. You've seen it a million times where people like, you know, Joe or Hunter or whoever, just people who win a lot just get picked to be the villain. But I think he really is a really empathetic and like, has good emotional reads on people and is able to kind of cater to what people are looking for and play into their perceptions. And so I think he's done a really nice job, although his dancing skills could use a little work, I think. And the necklace, the necklace falling off mid Ray Lewis dance kind of kind of made it flop a tiny bit.

Now, it would have been better if it had stayed on. See, I was not able to identify that. I had to be informed. I think I think Dalton told me that it was that it was a sports a sports thing. I had no idea what that was. Sports ball reference. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, what what let's talk about speaking of of losing votes.

We were speaking about it at some point. Let's talk about the challenge. So, uh, really, did you guys have the, the Paris challenge in your season? We had it at 12. This is when, um, Gabler won the, the forearm. Oh, right. Yeah. Right.

He was giving thanks to everybody. Yep. Yep. This minutes for Idaho, et cetera. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That was, that was a great moment.

Um, what's, what's the strategy here? Like what was, uh, what was your, I, I, oh, and I don't remember anything about et cetera. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was a great moment. What's what's the strategy here? Like, what was what was your I don't remember anything about your season. It's OK. Yeah. Most people don't. It's all blur. We drew rocks because I wanted to pick Sammy because I felt like he and I would be good in a, you know, with a two on two on two on two challenge. And then I felt like i was better at

puzzles than him and i could beat him in certain physical things if it wasn't brute strength um but then everyone else was like ah let's just draw rocks i was like you freaking nerds like it's like so i actually quite enjoyed watching everyone um like publicly pick their people and then in confessional give their reasoning behind it. And it's all kind of this. Oh, that's funny. That's yeah. Yeah. They like ex post facto are like arguing what like what why they made their choice. Yeah. And I like the duality of it where it's like really nice on the surface and they're like, yeah, let's go, buddy. And then in the confessional, it's like, yeah, I could kick his

ass in the challenge. You know, I thought it was really it was cool. So I prefer that method. I was bummed when we did not do that on my season. But then you get to the challenge and it's like this like CVS receipt of addendums to the rules of this challenge. And I was like, Jesus Christ, like, yeah, can we just like run a challenge? I mean, I'm glad I guess I'm glad only one person lost their vote. And I did like the mechanics of it. I thought it was an interesting way to do it. Although I saw someone I think on Blue Sky saying they wished it had been some sort of like there was a more of a strategic element to the game that could have created some friction or confusion. And it's like, do you gang up on someone or like are it doesn't of cracks, uh, in people's relationships? I don't

know. What did you think of the, the, the functionality of it? Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, when, when first he said four people are going to lose their votes, I was like, oh my God, no, please like just give us normal travel council. But it, but it ended up being not so bad with one person losing their vote. And it actually like, I, you know, it actually had a kind of interesting impact on the game. At first I was annoyed, you know it actually had a kind of interesting impact on the game at first i was annoyed you know you have this quote um from from um genevieve i think it was genevieve like it's really impossible to pitch a plan when you have no idea the ingredients that are going into the plan and like that was kind of like i was like yes this is why new era is so

conservative like people can't plan because everything is so in flux all the time. And that's why we see like just like standard vote outs happening. I was obviously wrong because that's not what happened. But but, you know, so so ultimately, I thought it was cool what happened where, you know, they do have this plan in place. And then they kind of have to adapt to the question of who loses their vote. So great that it ended up being Caroline who lost her vote because that meant that the whole right, like the easy kind of to cool group that could come together to form a majority didn't come together. And they had to include people like Andy and Rachel who were, you know, more on the, you know, more in the middle there. And I agree that a lot of like fun tension in terms of the actual like the Jenga of it all or like the reverse Jenga of it all more in the middle there. And that added a lot of, like, fun tension. In terms of the actual, like, the

Jenga of it all, or, like, the reverse Jenga of it all, like, the game itself, it was fine. I mean, I hear you that it would have been better if it had been, like, some other strategy thing, but honestly it might have been too much. Then you have to have, like, confessionals about, like, why I'm choosing this person, and, like, it's like, you know, you've got this

whole chaotic episode around you, like, I don't need too much of, like, the strategy of, like, the min like, you know, you've got this whole chaotic episode around you. Like, I don't need too much of like the strategy of like the mini game within the game. Yeah. You know, and if it had been a dud episode, maybe I would have like wished for that. But I think you want like player choice as much as possible. And like here, we didn't even get to see like who was next, like why they arranged themselves the way they did. But it didn't bug me. I mean, I guess like abstractly,

yes, I would prefer one where we got to see like people having like strategic conversations versus the one where we didn't. But in the moment, I was like, all right. Yeah, I didn't hate it. I didn't hate it. And quick, quick insert here. Like Caroline is like the most positive person alive. I know it was so cute. She's like, oh, like when when Rachel got that shaky one, she's like, epic. That was epic. She just sounds so earnest and nice. She's like, oh, like when when Rachel got that shaky one, she's like epic. That was epic. She just sounds so earnest and nice and just like it's funny because like her resting face isn't as smiley as like when she's talking. And so I don't know. I just it's I feel like she could make some like her edit is obviously a little bit on the on the lighter side. But she's someone that I'm keeping an eye on because she seems really analytical and smart.

And like people would want to keep her around, I think, just because she is so positive. But yeah, like a pleasant person to be around who's going to make like rational decisions. Like that's exactly even if they're against you. That's kind of like who you want in a game. Like 100 percent. Yeah. You want people that you can at least understand why they are doing things. And I felt like I mean, I'm sure

you've like encountered this too, when you'd like arrive on your starting tribe and you're like, oh my God, like who are like, where did they find some of these people? It's like, how am I supposed to predict what Sandy Bergen is going to do? You know, it's like, it's crazy. Um, not, not that she was on your starting tribe, but she was, she was, she was, she was, yeah. Um, and, uh, the only other thing I'll say too, is I, I also didn't hate it because an odd number number of votes, you know, does add for a little bit more, you know, potential for an explosive result. That's a good point. All it takes is a one person swing for something to happen. And then, of course, we get an eight one vote. But still, in theory, it is nice to have those those small margins um so it was cool like as much as it was a disappointing result and i and i questioned

like whether it was a good decision like it's always great to see people kind of like at least just from like a drama perspective like if it had just been kyle that would be like okay like kyle lost immunity like we all expected him to go and then he went so it's just exciting it's exciting from like it was it's like a tv viewer TV viewer perspective to see to see it happen as it happened. Yeah. And I thought the edit with the music and then the sunset and the cut to black and the Genevieve narrating that whole thing. I thought that was really excellently done. Yeah. So such like a tense, like great, like bit of TV. Although apparently the you know, the the after the fact confessionals were a clue into you a little bit. But that's just me trying too hard.

So what, what's your feeling generally on like losing votes? Like, you know, do you like this idea that at a challenge you could lose a vote just for not performing well on the challenge? Short answers. No,

I do not. I think that's a little antithetical to the, to the game's structure. Cause it's like, no matter how shitty you are at challenges, you always have your vote that's kind of my feeling too they like double penalizes someone like you should be rewarded for doing well in challenges or and then but like if you don't then you should still have like some

strategic you know agency right like like sandra you know not a challenge beast by any imagine imagine if she was losing her vote every other tribal council or something right like you know if you're not a physical player you should be able to lean on other elements of your game because that's the whole like premise is outwit outplay outlast if you're not good at the outplay that shouldn't prevent you from being able to outwit people or be hamstrung when you're trying to so i don't love it um am i totally opposed to it like pre-merge? Not necessarily. Like, I don't hate it, but like it's it's been a little much, in my opinion. I would maybe hope they peel it back or something.

I don't know. It's not ideal, in my opinion. Let's take some questions from the viewers. Gray has an interesting question. He wants to know who is the strongest duo in the game. I'm curious your, your opinion, but I think it might be Sue and Caroline.

I would have said Sue Gabe, but cause like Gabe, like when, I mean, granted Caroline was on the, on the loser trip, but when Genevieve, Genevieve went to Sue,

you know, and she said, well, you need to like launder this through Gabe, basically. And Gabe was kind of the clearinghouse for that. You could be right, though. I mean, that's that's I mean, I see either of them. My only pushback to that is because they knew Gabe had to vote that round. And Caroline wasn't even there yet. So like there was no there was no opportunity to talk to her yet. Interesting.

All right. Let's see. Simone wants to know, is Genevieve screwed? No one who voted with her is actually loyal to her yet um interesting all right um let's see simone wants to know is genevieve screwed no one who voted with her is actually loyal to her i don't think she's necessarily screwed i have a lot of faith in genevieve's ability as a player like to me she has all the tools to to be successful um and thinking with like loyalty like like at this stage in the game you almost don't need it 100 like it's great to have a super loyal number one but you can't expect to like have a like a loyal super trusting relationship with too too many people that's just like a little um naive

to think that you'd have that deep of connection with everybody at this stage in the game so i think she does have some some lines with Rachel, with Andy, with Sue that could help insulate her. But as Stephen, as you said before, people have clocked that she was the conductor this round. So she's got a chance, but she might be in trouble. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, I think she's in real danger.

I think that she is, if not the next to go, then I think, like, you know, I don't give her more than two weeks in the game. I give or take, right? Like, maybe it's three. But I think she's not making it even to, like, the final five. So, you know, I've really enjoyed her. Like, she's been one of my favorite characters to watch.

She's been super fun. You know, I was almost bummed that she didn't have more content in the early episodes because that's typically the sign of like not having won the game and it seemed like she was really instrumental to those early votes you know because she had all those like that relationship with from that we didn't really see early on um and then it became obviously a bigger narrative as the you know in episodes like three or so but um i i really like her as a character and a player i think this might have been her like her game losing move here. I mean, we'll see. I could be wrong. Strong possibility. No, no.

That's I think that's more likely than my like wishful thinking that she pulls off this Kim Spradlin like insulated from all angles kind of victory. Yeah. It just seems like in this day and age, you kind of like need that sort of little like that safe harbor. it just seems like in this day and age you kind of like need that sort of little like that safe harbor like the people who are making it to the end and winning are for the most part like those who are kind of like in the middle of their little alliance group you know they're sort of like the last person to stick and also the last person standing as other people you know turn on you know their alliance their alliance group um let's see who what do we have what else you mentioned final five so simone asked who's your ideal final five well ideal and what like i don't even see it in terms of my preferences you

know i always like think like who who do i think is likely i mean i think likely is and this is like really out of nowhere um i think the final five is going to be Andy, Sue, teeny Rachel and Caroline. I could totally be wrong here. And, and, and I just think that like Andy and Sue, well, Sue, I think is going to be a final three loser. Like that to me has been, I mean, I don't want to talk, get too deep into the edit stuff, but like, and even just from a gameplay perspective, I think, although I, although I guess she was the potential target of Sam today. But, but I, you know, and I think Andy, you know, as you said, is,

is the main character now. And I think that's, he's either like the Carolyn of this season or he's the Gabler of this season, but either way, I really believe he's, he's at the end there. And I honestly think teeny has a lot of upside. You know, I feel like teeny is always wrong feel like Teenie is always wrong. Like, or not always wrong, but like they never get their way. Teenie never gets their way. Like this episode, Teenie tried to save Saul, didn't work.

Last episode, Teenie like tried to like make Sam be the target. It was Sierra, you know, tried to save, or, you know, it was out of the loop on the Keyshawn vote, you know, tried to save Asia, didn't work. You know, I don't think we have once seen Teenie like successfully pull off a plan. But even with that terrible track record, you know, they're consistently portrayed as like being strategic, being empathetic. But that Sam montage last week where we see Teenie like going from conversation to conversation and trying to make it sam like it felt like a big you know and it didn't like blow up in teeny's face you know we didn't see and i saw someone saying like is teeny maybe the owen or the jake of this you know the person who never can get it together

but i felt like that was so much a part of both of your stories it's like your your story of course was the charlie brown and jake's too it was like you know so many of your confessionals and so many it's so much of the narrative around you guys was like these are the guys who like are trying so hard and they just can't get it and we don't see like that second half with teeny you know it's always like well she's like in there making moves and we also see her being really empathetic we always see her like tearing up we see her like you know embracing people we see so much of teeny's you know um kindness and connection with people and it's way similar to kenzie so i think there's a world where teeny wins i think he's got

to get at it um i would love that because yeah i i'd seen some of the charlie brown comparisons to myself and jake and i i'm leaning more towards that but then it's it's like this weird conflict in my head because i feel like that's what andy is set up for. And it's like who like I see them both going far. And it's like, why are we getting these perceptions of them as having this this ability and this like pulse on the game? But it's just not working out. And then Andy's kind of getting this more redemptive story. So it's almost looking at it wise to me like Andy could somehow screw around and win.

And then teeny is in that zero vote finalist kind of spot. could see it i really could see it wouldn't that be something that would be that would be wild yeah that would be wild i mean that would be a i i definitely could see that i like um and then there's there's rachel who i think is like really strategic i have to say i love rachel rachel got the reflection of fire in her glasses. It was like a little corner. I saw you post that on on disgraced Twitter. And she was like fire. It was like in the tiniest little bit of her glasses. It wasn't like paying attention where his eyes were flames. I don't know.

Maybe they're just trying to give like the little, you know, maybe they thought they overdid it with Carson. But now it's just a little tease. They're like, hey, hey Hey Louie, move over. You're getting too much fire in the glasses. Trying to get the camera angle, right? Post-production team was like airbrushing out the fire. Yeah. I love Rachel. I really think she could do well. And I'm just curious to see where it goes from here.

Cause they, they made a real, like they, they were a little ham fisted with the Andy Rachel. Yeah. Coming back together. That's going to have some ramifications down the road, I think. And then she's got that idol that nobody knows about. Right. We didn't see any counter confessional saying like, oh, Rachel must have played her shot in the dark to try to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like they they didn't seem to clock her with that.

Sam might be trying. Well, she's going to be pissed at Sam, but Sam will try to, like, get back in her good graces. Like be trying well she's gonna be pissed at sam but sam will try to like get back in her good graces like i think there's a chance i she was my winner pick um once i listened to her like long form interview with mike um i thought she had had the sauce like tiana was my original winner pick and then um i think rachel has the tools but i'm just curious how it goes from here for her um but it's so final five wise like i i'm with you i think andy's long for the game i think teeny could be there sue seems to be not taken seriously by people like yes they're threatened by her relationship with caroline but i think we heard gabe say like sue's not going to be the one to say let's vote out saul and then

cut to sue saying like we need to get out Saul. I loved that. But that that says a lot about how Gabe perceives her, because I think even early in the game when he was kind of having his Machiavelli and like, let me collect my my old woman to drag to the end. You know, I think that was kind of his perception that like she would not be taken seriously. And if then two went to the end he would have the upper hand so i don't know if that's his like a little bit of like bias you know coming into play there or what but um i could see her kind of being dragged along there and yeah kyle getting clipped out because of his challenge ability so we'll see but um i'm glad we had to talk about teeny because i wanted to ask you about that because i I'm not sure what to make of their edit. It's I would love for them to to finally kick the football and pull something off.

And I'm curious, but it's it is very reminiscent of like, oh, man, just like they can just not get their way to save their life here. I do feel like he's going to have a big move and it's going to be like enough, you know, like I'm not like enough, but like it's going to be enough to justify the win you know sort of with like like like marianne kind of at the end sort of like like having like some big thing that was like their uh her distinctive her distinctive move i did see someone on twitter calling um saying that teeny was you know i i pushed back on the idea that like teeny's that it was similar to yours or jake's and then someone's like well what about carla and i thought that was an interesting comparison interesting someone who we saw as being strategic but like ultimately especially in the post-merge like never really had much of an impact on the game and then kind of goes out as like as like a big threat at five

like i thought i i think there's a world where that's true too i see that possibility and carla's is interesting because her edit started off so strong. And then her her reputation almost overshadowed the reality of what was going on in the end game on my season. It's like Carlos, such a threat. She's so dangerous. But it's like, what has she done lately? Like not not as much as she did early in the game. So I don't know if I see that as much. But I hope Teenie's not the Charlie Brown. I hope there is no Charlie Brown. I hope they I hope everyone at Final Tribal gets a vote, at least. I don't hope that. I love our club.

That's true. I do love our club. It's a great club. It's really, it's good people. Come on down. So I'm also not out on Sam. Like, I do think that Sam might have longevity, you know, as I was saying earlier, just like because he might be seen as a wounded bird now, you know, which was like a big thing.

Right. Of like like now he's the wounded bird. And like I think like he's got like maybe some sense of, you know, now this guy, like I think is smart enough to kind of like pull back a little bit. Although maybe like or does this thing with Rachel blow up in his face? You know, like Rachel is going to be pissed. I think that's more likely. But I think Sam is an attractive number and shield because he is like if they get Kyle out at some point, you know, Sam's the next tallest person. And that's how people's brains work. It's like, oh, the strong man, you know, we must get them out with reason. Like he seems like a pretty athletic guy, but it's just like, I don't i don't know i it's hard to see

someone on on island but then again like i didn't have a whole lot going on in terms of deep relationships and i i got drug along to the end so there is a possibility for sam as well well what about gabe like so like you know he was supposed to be the vote or you know of course like it's always they always make a story right about the person who wins immunity like that person's supposed to be the vote. But, you know, it sure looked like there was there was heat on him and then he won immunity and got the heat off of him. Where do you like does he have longevity or is he you know, is he like soon to be? I see Gabe kind of in that that Carla type position where their reputation as a strategist and like people's pregame perceptions and early game perceptions of like, oh, he was scrambling, looking for the idol ipso facto. You know, he's a super strategic

person. I feel like that could end up biting him in the butt. I think they do see the bond with Sue and that could be perceived as dangerous. So I have Gabe pegged kind of as like a six, seven, fifth kind of spot personally. Yeah. I want to give. So I was wondering like who I was going to give the fishy. So so Alice asked, you know, fishy question mark. I was really debating this.

And at first I was like, I can't give it to Genevieve because I don't think this was a great move. But she was the one who really drove the action. You know, there's nobody else i could say like had like a great move tonight i was thinking of giving it to rome just to troll rob but rob's not here right now because like it was you know allegedly this room this move was like for rome um but i kind of think i want to i want your take on this i'm thinking gabe because like first of all there's no great obvious contender for it second of all g Gabe is one of the two people left this season who has not gotten a fishy and I think like he's played like

a really smart strategic game like he what is this a communist fishy awards like are you just making sure everyone gets one well no I think there's justification to like I'm not just gonna give it's not like you know um even with his weak burps compared to Saul's minimizing his threat right level

by like under burping. He's like allowing Saul to have that sort of like dominant position and making himself the beta burper. I think that's very smart strategy. And then he, you know, just generally like he kept his alliance cool. Like he kind of like let the vote come to him. You know, like, you know, he kept everyone together in his group, you know, but made sure that this was Genevieve's move. Right. It's her move. It's her move. So like and, you know, he was like not freaking out and was able to, like, bring bring the group together.

It's you know, he did win immunity, which is never really a factor for me. I think I'm going to give it to Gabe unless you have like a strong argument for somebody else. I do not. And it is called the fishy. You know, this is your award to get out knighted oh and who's getting knighted this episode well i see i'm i'm tempted to agree like obviously genevieve would be like the the you know oh start there and think about it but yeah i i mean she was like the most important player of this week but i don't think it's her move her episode but yeah if we're if we're trying to break it down in terms of like what's this best for her game yeah i i do i i do like your your

logic there with gabe trying to deflect it off him and he he seems to be the one i i liked how he was kind of the agent that genevieve worked through to get the tukus in um and then he still well obviously he had the necklace but still it like it wasn't deemed overly threatening that he was the connector. And right. The one who was able to, like, rally the votes on Cuckoo. So, yeah, that's exactly how that's well said. Like, yeah. OK, so fishy award and a knighthood for Gabe. Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Let's do it. Kneel down. Yeah. knighthood for gabe yeah let's do it kneel down and yeah um any last questions we want to get a few more questions in um ellis also asks are you happy to see the jury walk-in return sierra looked so pissed i loved it i'm here for it i i missed that i missed that i think it's great for the

jurors to get their you know to be able to have their moment and stare down the people and it it's it's fun it's fun to be reminded of who was there. And someone else earlier had asked, like, what did we think of her being like good? And when Caroline revealed that she lost her vote, I chuckled. I thought it was funny. But, yeah, I guess Caroline wasn't the one who was, you know, like, really. I guess I mean, if I was here, I'd be pissed at everyone. So, yeah, she probably would have said good to anyone except Sierra. Yeah.

Angela wants to know, how does Kyle move forward in the game? Lay low and throw? Is it too late for Kyle to minimize his threat level? Yeah, I think it is too late. I mean, I think throwing challenges, it could be good in theory, but I don't think anyone would ever do it. It's hard to do you know like when you're out there and you're in the heat of the moment and especially kyle who's like

like clearly and like an athlete and likes doing this stuff and enjoys challenges i don't see that happening but i think he's done a decent job lying low in terms of his like threat level strategically like i think it was a couple episodes back he said it's like i'm the most honest dumbass here and everyone kind of laughed and like i think he's he's playing into like the country bumpkin simple man you know i'm just a blue collar guy from michigan you know and everyone thinks he's sweet and nice but that could turn into a threat later where it's like oh he's the young dad and he's got these kids at home and you know he's he's a hard worker but those good old boys will get you in there. Let me tell you. Yeah. Yeah. You would know a thing or two about that. But I think he's floated across that balance beam.

That was oh, my God. Yeah, he really did. He's good at everything. He's good at everything except chimney sweep, apparently. But yeah, I think I think that ship has sailed in terms of threat level. Greg wants to know, too. This is interesting. I saw a comment suggesting the four who were up for losing their vote don't find out the result of who lost their vote until they're in the voting booth. Would that be an improvement or too chaotic? So people would not learn who lost their vote. Obviously, it would have to be a different game because this game is clear who lost their vote.

They would not learn who actually lost their vote until they showed up and i mean i guess in this case it wouldn't be like a game at all they'd like spin a wheel and you know um what do you think about or maybe there'd be like a like a counting thing right like who got the correct number of triangles i don't know um a lot of ways to run it but what do you think of that idea i don't love it because it just it it lends itself to conservative gameplay. The only analog I can think of and sorry to bring it back to 43 again, but that's my experience. No, no, no. This is delightful. I'm so happy. But when Cody did the choose your champion at last gasp and he he could have potentially won immunity and it wasn't going to be revealed until after the votes were cast or whatever it was.

So everyone just operated, assuming that he did have immunity. So it's like to strategize around that is pretty much impossible. So then it's like those four people will just be put in timeout. And it's it would just turn into a live tribal, I think. Well, I guess no, it would only be if they were in the booth. And you wouldn't even know. You have no idea. I agree. I don't like it. It would be a shit show. Honestly, I don no, it would only be if they were in the booth. And you wouldn't even know. You'd have no idea. I agree. I don't like that. It would be a shit show, honestly. I don't like it. I mean, it was enough challenge for them with like knowing who lost their vote to assemble the requisite votes.

Like this plan might not have happened had that happened, because like you have four people with no votes. Like we just have no clue who's got voting where. So let's point saying if the bottom four lost their votes privately and then had the option to decide who to lie to or be truthful with, like there was some element of it where Caroline's like, I lost my vote. OK, right. Strategizing, you know, like there there was an opportunity there to try to like, I don't know, maybe be a little more clandestine about it. But like I just was saying, that would make it a disaster. So so i don't know but that could be an element to it yeah um let's see there's one uh more question here um question from kevin um should survivor create more scenarios like they did this episode that broke the merged group into three reward camp and journey to allow for more strategy moments that's interesting like it's inherently giving people like you know a opportunity to break off and talk what do you think of that i didn't hate it and when i was re-watching it this morning i i actually found

it interesting that sue and genevieve you know they they would never have had that opportunity to talk for that long organically right so it's so hard to sneak off you're always wondering if someone's creeping up behind you behind the shelter, yeah, I didn't hate that element of it. I think if you remove the you're forcing new connections to be made and like giving people opportunities to try to build some bonds with other people. So I'm not, I'm not opposed to it. As far as twists go, like I would still prefer if it was just normal every time, but I don't think this is like horrendous. I don't know. Yeah. Well, Oh, thank you so much for your time today i mean i i agree

with you about the last one that was a sort of terrible transition on my part i was like yeah yeah um no but truly like that was that was great like i really like that was um that was uh it was really good having you i i have a question for you owen um so i saw you tweeting or i guess skeeting on blue sky last night you said like you know i don't have the exact quote here but um you know they have so much food here in season 47 seasons 41 to 44 they had no we had no food no food you are someone who has been on the receiving end of a lot of the older school players saying oh my gosh 26 days is so easy this is what a ridiculous and now you're saying 40, 47 is so easy. Are you now an old new school player? Like what? I guess so. I said that the curmudgeonly nature is catching up to me, I guess.

That's yeah. Now that I'm a couple of seasons removed, I will say, though. OK, let me just to be in my defense and your final six reward. We got coffee and pastries and then early merge. They're getting BLTs and barbecue and all this amazing stuff. It's like I would have killed for real food. So there's always an argument to be made, Owen. You know, there always is. It's only like two thirds of thirty nine. It's two thirds. It is literally two thirds. So I can't.

There's always a point, but there's always an argument. There is no, you know, it's just, you know, I guess i'm glad that now the new schoolers are doing it to each other i'm becoming what i used to fight on twitter but that's that's that's the passage of time for you tell us what's going on with you owen yeah what is going on with me well sam i don't know if you're pulling up a graphic or this for not but i'm excited in a couple weeks to go to houston, Texas, to attend the Rob has a podcast live show. Oh, Sam is not pulling up a graphic. So you can just imagine the beautiful poster. But we will be in Houston on the 4th to watch the episode and do a live pod.

So I will be there and other survivors will be there and it should be fun. What else is new? I got married a couple of weeks ago, so I'm very excited. Yeah, congratulations! Thank you. Thank you for sending me a gift off the registry, by the way. I was very honored to receive my grease collector from you.

In this situation, obviously my intimate friends, but for people who I know and I want to celebrate them, I like to get the most ridiculous thing on the register. I love it. I love it. Every time I will discard my bacon grease, I will think of you, Stephen. That's, that's, that's, you know, that's what I'd like. That's my hope. I love it. I love it. But yeah, shout out to Rob and Nicole. Like I, I now, especially now that I'm married, I understand like you, you would drop everything to go take care of your wife. So I hope Nicole is feeling better at the doctor. And yeah, the other thing I wanted to shout out

is my our good friend Dwight of Blood on the Clocktower and Survivor 43 fame wrote a great article for the RJP newsletter about the worrying about disappointing people. And I thought it was really beautifully written. Dwight is one of the best guys out there. So definitely check that out. Who is Dwight? Was he on which season? Oh, yeah. He's just some guy.

No, it's a great. It is a really, it's a really like lovely newsletter. I really like it was very heartfelt and like great. It was a great piece and I'd recommend everybody read it. Definitely. Definitely. But yeah, last plug, I'll say just like blue sky last night was great the vibes are so much better than on uh uh twitter x whatever like i don't miss it at all um it just

felt like we were all just hanging out and um i saw jolias on there dalton was there you wiggler like there's a lot of people making the migration over to butterfly land and uh i i thought it was just like it's just feels better like i'm literally it was like a very like collegial vibe it felt like a small group of friends kind of like chatting in a way that now it's like the the on twitter you know which i still love and i'm gonna stay on twitter and i'll keep calling it twitter but like i'm gonna stay there and i like i love just like the the huge like range of viewpoints you get but blue sky you do like have like it's like a little bit more like like uh intimate and it feels like like a

little friendlier and like it didn't feel like everyone was necessarily like competing to like get like the most explosive tweet because or skeet because like you know there's only like uh like 30 people you know like yeah it was great yeah where can we follow you on uh on blue skies i am the young knight the young knight. The young knight. Blue sky dot whatever. I forget how the handles work. But if you put like the young knight into the search bar, that's the way. You'll probably find me.

You can find me at Stephen Fishback on Blue Sky. Please follow me there. I'm like really like terrified of this idea of losing, you know, all these followers. I have a Twitter. Who cares? Who cares? This is our close friends now. I've worked hard for that.

The and yeah, I mean mean it was it was fun like jolie like like you said who's one of the producers of the show one of the long-standing producers was like you know this is so great like it feels like old times here and um it's kind of cool that you know they're listening like they're they're over there listening and i can only imagine like on twitter obviously they're listening to they're hitting the survivor hashtag but it's just like a flood So there actually are like people over there who are like reading what's going on, you know? So, you know, if you want to, if you want to get your ideas into Joliet's, you know, eyes, that might be the way.

I'll tell him you said that, not me. Exactly. He has you to thank for any, any DMs he gets. No, no, no. I didn't mean like, well, whatever. So yeah. And again again thank you so much owen for being here um congratulations to gabe on on on being a fishy night and um the um the yeah and we'll see you all next week and hopefully nicole will be feeling better and uh well gosh next week i really hope she's feeling better but like um you know we'll we'll uh hopefully sooner

than that yeah right and you'll get rob back thank you all for putting up with me here. I wore I wore a plaid shirt to try to. Oh, I meant to shout that out. Yes. Yeah. Thank you. It's a Capitals shirt as well. Washington, D.C. You're a new hometown.

But yeah, what are the Capitals? The hockey team. Oh, OK. Thank you. Let's do that hockey, Stephen. Yes. It's a fun time. I will say if you ever if anyone ever offers you tickets to a Caps game, it's pretty electric.

But yeah, thank you all for watching. It's an tickets to a caps game, it's pretty electric. But yeah, thank you all for watching. It's an honor to be here. Music next time. Thank you. I think someone, Jacob, thank you,

Jacob for saying I deserved music, but it was so fun. All right. All right. Thanks a lot, everybody. Bye. Bye.