RHAP: We Know Survivor - Michelle Khare Talks Survivor 50

Episode Date: April 14, 2026

Michelle Khare Talks Survivor 50 Survivor 50 is back, and Rob Cesternino sits down with YouTube creator and Jet Lag champ Michelle Khare for a deep dive into the game’s ever-shifting alliances, confessionals, and edge-of-your-seat strategy. Michelle brings her unique perspective as a superfan, zeroing in on the episode’s biggest twists—like whether anyone can keep a secret with all the idol talk and confessional fireworks flying at camp. Rob and Michelle break down the latest drama from Survivor 50, focusing on shifting alliances, idol antics, and the delicate balance between blending in and standing out. They dig into how Cirie is staying under the radar while Rizo makes memorable moves in and out of challenges, and how social currency is traded with shared secrets—sometimes a risky play. They also discuss the rise and possible fall of major players like Coach and Ozzy, the ongoing saga of the oversharing tribe, and speculate which castaways are poised for a true comeback story. – Cirie’s stealthy gameplay and her ability to avoid being targeted, even with her reputation – Rizo’s standout confessionals, meme-worthy moves, and sharp reality TV instincts – The Billie Eilish Boomerang idol: why it hasn’t lived up to its backstabbing potential – How sharing secrets has become the season’s “currency” and whether this will help or hurt players like Emily – Tiffany’s underdog journey as she struggles from the bottom, sparking questions about who might use her for a blindsiding move – Coach’s breakdown at Tribal—are we watching history repeat or a clever new play? This week’s discussion asks: Can Cirie and Rizo keep flying under the radar while bigger threats are targeted? And will Tiffany’s position as an “easy vote” spark the next big blindside? With so much information out in the open, who still has a hidden advantage? Dive into Rob and Michelle’s full Survivor 50 breakdown to get all the insider strategic analysis, big player moves, and what might be coming next with those pesky idols! Chapters: 0:00 Intros 6:08 Seven Marathons, Seven Continents Challenge 12:32 Michelle Becomes Survivor Superfan 15:00 Jeff Probst’s Hosting Mastery Discussed 21:23 Favorite Players: Cirie, Ozzy, Rizo 25:46 Rizo’s Reality TV Awareness 29:33 Would Michelle Ever Play Survivor? 34:38 Karma: Teens In Strategy Competition 44:14 Michelle Discusses Fear and Planning 47:11 Coach Versus Ozzy Game Evolution To pre-order Rob’s book, The Tribe and I Have Spoken, visit www.robhasabook.com Never miss a minute of RHAP’s extensive Survivor coverage! LISTEN: Subscribe to the Survivor podcast feed WATCH:  Watch and subscribe to the podcast on YouTube SUPPORT:  Become a RHAP Patron for bonus content, access to Facebook and Discord groups plus more great perks!

We all love Survivor, and in my first ever book, The Tribe and I have spoken, I'll tell you how this little show evolved from that juggernaut first season on the beaches of Borneo all the way into its landmark 50th season. I'm like a storyteller. That's what I do. What role did the greatest players, the unforgettable moments, and Jeff Probst himself have in shaping what Survivor has become today? And what contribution did we play in building this worldwide tribe of Survivor fans? Love you, Bay.

For you future players, I've also included my ultimate survivor playbook to help you win the million dollars, unlike me. It's fine. You know what, dude, it's fun. This hardcover edition is filled with beautiful survivor illustrations in every chapter and is an amazing addition for every survivor collector. I'm a meat collector. Pre-orders are everything for a book launch, so to say thank you to everyone who pre-orders, you'll receive an exclusive digital bonus chapter called the Ultimate Rights. of passage, my personal tribute to all the players who have ever competed on the show, all 751. This is huge.

I needed this. Free order wherever books are sold in hardcover and as an audio book at rob hasabook.com. That's rob has a book.com. Nicely done, Rob. Hey, everybody. What's going on? Rob Cisterino back with you today. and we have such a fun interview here today because we are talking with another big survivor fan and somebody who has had just an amazing career as a content creator.

Of course, you know her from the YouTube series Challenge Accepted, and of course is a two-time undefeated contestant on Jetlag. Also, that she was the host of HBO's Karma has a big new three. part video coming out this weekend about going on to the, I want to make sure I get the name right, the great world race. Yeah. Competing in seven marathons on seven continents. It's Michelle Carre.

Michelle, how are you? Hey, Rob. Yeah, I ring that bell. It is so good to meet you. Yeah, so nice to talk to you also. And so cool that you have been following. following Survivor over these years as you have been very, very busy. I mean, we all are, but we all make time on Wednesdays at 8 p.m. for Jeff and the crew.

You know what I'm saying? Not everybody does. Not everybody does. Michelle, would you create an advantage for Survivor 50? And if so, what would it be? Oh, the first question. Wow, right out the gate. What advantage would I create? Gosh, you know, that's a hard one to answer because I know people are very, very opinionated. of the challenges, like the Billy Ilish boomering idol from this season. If I were to make an advantage,

hmm, this isn't an advantage, but I'm a person who does have fondness and nostalgia for the really vast reward challenges where, you know, from the early days where people were going on vacations in the middle of it all. I'm also a person who, who has fondness for at a certain stage of the game,

rather than letters from home, actually getting to see your family. So, yes, seeing the loved ones visit. So I don't know if that's, give them a day of luxury with their loved ones. Yes, I have a lot of, I think we forget, we as viewers, because in the newer seasons, it's not talked about as much,

we often forget they are starving out there. They're out there. you guys are out there for days and days without eating. And so I have a lot of empathy for that because attention, I feel like, doesn't go to the survivor component of it as much as the gameplay component, which makes sense. Yeah. Okay. Well, Michelle, you, I threw you into the fire right off the bat.

Did you come up with an advantage? Okay. But that's the kind of stuff you're used to on challenge except. Can you tell people who may not know about that, what it is that you've been for all this time? Yeah. So I host a show on YouTube called Challenge Accepted,

which is about me trying the world's toughest professions, stunts, and lifestyles. This can range from last year. I became the first person in the world to recreate Tom Cruise's Mission Impossible stunt. So I was hanging off the side

of a military aircraft as it was taking off. I also trained for and learned Harry Hurudini's escape called the water torture cell where I learned how to hold my breath for three minutes.

It's upside down in a glass box, walk picking my way to safety. And it can even mean things as vast and interesting as going to clowning school for a month or joining the Secret Service Academy. So we do it all and we accept all of the challenges. But you've been so successful. Why do these dangerous things anymore, Michelle? You've made it. Why do people return to Survivor? For the love of the game, Rob, for the love of the game.

You know exactly what I'm talking about. It's so exciting and such a privilege to get to challenge yourself. That's the ethos of survivor. Yeah, exactly. So you guys know what I'm talking about. It's addictive. It's exciting. It's fun.

And what's cool about Challenge Accepted is we get to highlight a lot of communities that don't get highlighted otherwise or have only seen their stories told in a certain way. So I really love. I truly completely transform my lifestyle for days, weeks, months, sometimes even up to a year to embed in a community and tell its story of a person entering and trying to go from zero to hero. And this year we're really excited because we are trying to go for a primetime Emmy and outstanding hosted nonfiction, which is a really, really big goal, specifically for a YouTube channel going up against big studio shows. But challenge except and why not? Let's do it. Okay.

You know, Survivor is always trying to go for an Emmy also. I'm aware. In a different category. I haven't gotten Emmys recently. Well, I think 50 is quite the contender. And obviously I'm biased as such a fan. But the first episode of season 50, I think, was some of the best reality television hour we've seen in a long time, period.

Yeah. That's my opinion. It was three hours. premiere. Yes, that's true. Multiple our best episode, I should say. It was a marathon like the great world race that you're going to be participating in. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. So you just tell me about the great world race and what you have coming up because I believe a couple of survivors that I know, I think they do this every year, right? And I feel like that I've heard that David Samson and Sarah Lassina, I think, had done this in the past. Really? Yes. No way. I didn't

that. Yeah, so the new series we have coming out on the channel is the first time, to my knowledge, that this event has been documented for long-form television. It's the story of me attempting seven consecutive marathons on all seven continents back-to-back in one single week. And yes, that includes the Antarctica. This is an event that happens every year. It's called The Great World Race and about 60 people do it annually. But no one has really captured the story of what happens. It is by far the craziest thing I have ever done. Oftentimes people ask me, what's the hardest challenge you've ever faced?

I have a very clear answer, and it is this. So this story was just so grand and so exciting that we couldn't contain it to one episode without really doing it justice. So this is the first time it's going to be a multi-part series releasing on the channel starting April 18th this Saturday, three back-to-back episodes chronicling this insane journey. I mean, Rob, this is a journey where you run a marathon, don't shower, you're thrown onto a plane, you wake up and you're in a completely different part of the world, and you've got to go do it again. And the type of people that this attracts are the most fascinating people in the world.

For example, there is a man named Dan Little, who is 83-year-old. old, who has done this event four times. He's 83 years old and he's out there every day with the biggest smile on his face. He's the last person to cross the finish line every day and he does it. And so what's cool about this is a lot of the episodes are about, you know, my story and maybe a bit of the community around me, but this is really a shared story with many other racers. So in the way that we watch Survivor and see confessionals from all of the players, not even the people who have an A and B plot in a given episode, this,

this three-part series widens out to other characters and other people attempting this. Because I think you can look at this and say, yes, this makes for a great piece of television because of the concept. So it makes sense why I'm doing it. But there are people who sign up for this and do it on their paid time off from work. And this is a big dream of theirs. And to me, those stories are even more fascinating. The reasons why people have been drawn to this race are. are incredible. I mean, the stories are top-notch. So we're so excited about this coming out this

weekend, and it will be a part of our Emmy submission. Yeah. So were you a runner prior to this, or did you start running to get ready to do all these marathons? So in my athletic history, I have run two marathons. I ran L.A. Marathon in like 2017, and I ran 50K in Death Valley. Both of those are very challenging, but they are nothing compared to running seven back to back. How do you train for an event like that? Is it physically possible? How do you recover? And how do you recover on a plane without being able to shower or eat all the food you need or have a perfect environment? I think what's really fascinating about this experience is a lot of the limits that we set on ourselves are self-imposed. And that really got tested for me during this challenge.

Yeah. Again, that's Survivor also in a nutshell of, you know, that you go out there to learn about yourself and you go out there seeking something and you find out that what you were searching for all along was inside of you. Do you think that every player has that experience, no matter the length of time there on the show? No. No, that's not true. They'll tell you that's the case. But I talked to a lot of them and that was not the case. But for some of them, I think it was. And I'm sure for all the people doing the race, I'm sure that that's the case. Because, you know, I feel like that it's not necessarily about winning the experience. Like there's 60 people do it, but there's not 59 losers. You know, like maybe one person had the best times, the overall. But the other 59 people aren't feeling like, I was this close to winning. Not for an event like this.

Maybe for a 5K, 10K half. Exactly. Exactly. Really, for an event like the Great World Race, it's an accomplishment to cross that seventh finish line. It is a win. It is a life milestone just to get it done. Because even this race destroys even the most elite athletes. Like there are people who are world class runners who come out and do it and drop out at Marathon 5 or 6 because they haven't paced themselves appropriately or an injury pops up. Like this race is so unpredictable. And I think a good example of that is historically the race always starts in Antarctica because, first of all, it's the hardest one for many. It's literally Antarctica. You're running in the snow, carrying all of this gear to keep you warm. You want to do it on your freshest legs. Also, there's a huge weather component to Antarctica. You don't want to go and run Antarctica and then be stuck there for three days and it ruins your attempt to get seven and seven days. So it has to be. first. And without spoiling anything, basically what happens is we go to Cape Town South Africa, where all the racers gather to go to Antarctica. And the night before we fly to Antarctica, they send an email out at like 9 p.m. that says, weather is changing. We're starting in Africa. So you have to be ready to pivot. Everyone has mentally prepared. First race is going to be in Antarctica.

I'm going to have all my winter gear, have everything prepped. I personally even try. I personally even trained in a cold storage freezer to prepare for this. Like all of the training of the seven months led to Antarctica first. And you have to be ready to pivot. Okay, I guess we're running in Africa now. Yeah. You have to be ready for anything. Yeah.

Be like you're getting ready to go to Survivor. Okay, I'm going to Fiji. It's like plot twist. We're going to Alaska. Exactly. Which I wouldn't put past Jeff or any of the producers to. They're going to stay in Fiji for a while. I'd be real surprise.

That'd be a real curfball. Michelle, I'd love to know. How did you first find Survivor? Are you a lifer? Oh my gosh. Am I a lifer? So my husband is a Garrett. He is a massive reality head. So he is a lifer. Like he has seen every season since one. And when we got together, like seven or eight years ago, it was one of the first things that we did. So I, I guess I'm newer to Survivor in the past seven or eight years. But during that, time. My God, have I seen a lot. And we, and he started me way back. We started with everything. We started with Amazon, All-Stars, Pearl Islands, all the classics. And of course, now we watch regularly since we got together. It's a part of a part of our date night routine. But I think of Jeff Probst. When I think of like, who are the people I look up to as producers and hosts and

performers. It's three people. It's David Blaine, Evil Knievel, Jeff Probst, period. Wow. I think, and I know people are divided on some of those individuals potentially, but I think what Jeff has done with the show, it's on season 50. It is one of the longest running shows on television, period. It has gone through a roller coaster of reviews, of feedback, of viewership, his commitment to always coming back to it is really admirable. And I think having hosted challenge accepted and hosted karma, understanding intimately what it's like to sit at Video Village with a binder of all the contestants, furiously memorizing everything about them on note cards,

while watching all of the video feeds, taking notes so that when you go to speak, to the contestants, you know exactly what questions to ask to not push too hard, but to get them to open up. That is a craft of interviewing that is not taught in any acting school or like performance art. You have to do it to know and he's the best at it, period. Is there anything that you notice that Jeff does that maybe doesn't get talked about that maybe we don't appreciate that you see that he's doing that you're impressed by? Something I'm real. There are so many things that I'm impressed by Jeff.

First of all, I think something that's really undervalued is his challenge commentary. When I was hosting karma, that was actually something that would- What karma is. Yeah. So karma, and please correct me if I'm wrong, was on in 2020, was on HBO. I'm not sure if it was Max then. I think it's gone. There's so many iterations.

I think it was eight for Max. You know, the artist formerly known as HBO, maybe maybe again. It was a show that was a survivor-like game for young teens competed. It was 18 teenagers in the wilderness paired into teams of two doing challenges and competing in social strategy for a cash prize fund, which was so fascinating because in the way that we love and appreciate. not only Master Chef, but Master Chef Jr. Seeing young people in an environment like this, for many of them, it was their first time away from their parents. For many of them, they had never been away from a screen

for longer than 24 hours in their life. And seeing them come into young adulthood through the course of this summer was insane and incredible. And like, kids are just so wonderful and fun and honest in ways that I think adults, are scared to be, that it was incredible. But having hosted that show, you know, I understand what it's like to have to pull those history moments from the contestants to be so intimately aware with plot A-line, A, B, C, D, E, and have

to resolve all of them without knowing which one is going to get used in the edit. but to answer your question about things that I can empathetically be impressed by our Jeff Proves, it's challenge commentary. And I think that's really underappreciated because we watch sports. We hear people commentate on sports. And I don't think people realize how challenging it is to not sound insane while you're doing it because you're calling out things that are very obvious to everyone in person, but may not be to the viewer at home. And so, at least on karma, I was, calling on a lot of things that would often get cut, things that are very, very obvious. So you're just standing there yelling at the top of your lungs without trying to sound annoying and be thoughtful.

And I think Jeff does it really elegantly in a way that never shames any of the contestants, but keeps things honest to what's going on. Another thing that I think he does really well is... Can I add to that? Because I think that it's interesting because he didn't start doing it in the beginning of the show. He sort of like that was an evolution after the first couple of seasons. And I'm not sure if there's like ever been in, you have sports broadcasters who are talking about the game, but the players don't hear that. That's not necessarily like when you are going to like a baseball game, like the person who's calling the game for people at home. That isn't piped into the stadium. And so it's interesting. Like I don't know if there's anything else that I

could think of that was before that where somebody is commentating on what's happening in front of. of the people, like where the people are also hearing, like, what's being described and narrated. That's true. Because for reality competition commentary, you are playing to two audiences. The audience of millions of people at home who are trying to understand the tension of the game. And your role as a host is to raise those stakes constantly. But then also, as we see in Survivor, that out loud commentary impacts the contestants and how they feel as they're going through this. We've seen time and time again

when someone's stuck on a puzzle and they hear Jeff call it out how that impacts the player. I think he does it really, really delicately well. Also, I mean, his tribal council is masterful. And the fact, like, we know Jeff knows all the drama. We know he's heard it from a producer

or he himself is sitting at MCR, getting everything on video feed. He's very well prepared going into tribal, but he does a really great job of being a fan in tribal council. He's asking the questions the audience wants to know with the right amount of respect for the game and understanding of the history of the game. Additionally, I think how he pulls out memories from like 20 years ago, oh, this reminds me of the tribal council on Amazon or something.

Like that is nuts. I mean, his memory is wonderful. whether he prepares for it or just has it I think is really impressive. Also his impressions of the players. Yes, he liked that when he did the impressions. I thought it was fun. Yeah.

Maybe not everyone. Are you alluding that not everyone likes that? I think that that really went over a lot better than when he rapped. Yeah. Sure. That was unexpected. That was unexpected.

Yes. Could you wrap better than Jeff, do you think? I don't think I, I don't think anyone wants to hear me rap. I'm going to put that there. Yeah, if Jeff ever is looking for a host for another show, I would love to audition, but if rapping is part of the expectation, I might fall a little farther down in that select audition.

Between you and Jeff. Do you think you could take Jeff in a battle wrap? I don't think I could. Everyone listening right now can hear my voice. this is not a rap voice I feel like you need a low tone voice to be effective as a rapper even as a female rapper

that doesn't exist in my I would need to work on it challenge accepted I'm going to have to do a rap episode I don't think anyone would watch it but I would have to formally train to do that yeah

Michelle can tell me about some of your favorite players from Survivor history whether they're on Survivor 50 or not Mm. Some of my favorite players, well, a lot of my favorite players are on 50. So I think within 50, the people I'm enjoying watching play the most are Rizzo and Surrey, Christian. I loved watching D. I think D, as we all know, is one of the best players of the new era. So those, those I think are the people that stand out to me. Also, I've really enjoyed watching Ozzy a lot. It's interesting to see somebody who has played the game so many times. And in many ways, I'm overgeneralizing here, of course, but Ozzy has always sort of landed in the same fate, the same sort of story arc. And it's neat to see that this season, he has grown a lot. And I really enjoy that.

and I feel like we're kind of entering an opportunity to see the Aussie we've always wanted to see. So I love seeing him be self-aware of his faults from prior seasons and actually attempt to make change. That's really cool. Are you and Garrett on the same page about all your favorite Survivor players? Do you have any disagreements in your house in terms of some of the favorites? Oh my gosh. We don't have Survivor arguments if that's the question. We're pretty aligned, honestly.

Yeah. We both love Surrey. Yes. Okay. Well, Siri, easy to love. Do you feel like that Survivor 50 could be the season that Surrey brings it home? Gosh. It's really hard to know.

It really is. I would love for it to be. I mean, watching her on Traders was very exciting to see her get a win. I feel like right now we're seeing Surrey in like CIA mode. She has not come out of hiding yet. She is doing everything so well. And what I love about her play is she's a very tempered and constrained player when she needs to be.

She's always, she always knows when she needs to fade into the back and then step into the light. And so we haven't seen her step into the light yet. This is like Surrey on 5%, I think, right now. Yep, she's done a really good job of, I kind of thought that people would be a little more worried about her in this season. And it really doesn't feel like there's a lot of people talking about her. The couple of people that were are gone.

Exactly. She has really excellently faded into the background. She's like that Homer Simpson gift when he just goes back into the bush. Like, we'll go through several minutes. runtime in an episode. I'm like, oh, yeah, Surrey is here. What's going on? And she, yeah, I think she's aligned herself very well with Rizzo, which I think is really impressive for someone who hasn't seen 49. Again, a thing I think meta-wise, we forget is that nobody has actually seen Rizzo play before. And very interesting

and fun. I just think they're a hilarious duo together. And they're doing a great job. Yeah, you mentioned Rizzo as one of your favorites who's here in Survivor. or 50 and he's come on the scene and made a real impression. What do you like so much about the Riz God? R-I-Z-G-O-D. What I really love, I mean, a lot of my love for him comes from his performance in 49. I think he's a great player, period. But what makes him so fun to watch is he's a fantastic on-camera reality star.

He knows how to navigate a confessional, whether or not he's thinking about it, he's very good at making a confessional, not just a moment to progress plot, but to be a jiff, to be a meme. He is thinking in ways that are extremely memorable for the game. I mean, examples like he's referencing bad blood by Taylor Swift when he's talking about taking out Charlie. That is really, really smart, not just as a player, but as someone who understands reality TV. And I think the best players, the best hosts, have a little bit of that. that producerial understanding of what's going to make an edit. And that's why he's gotten, in my opinion, so much runtime and why he is so memorable.

Are you surprised, though, Michelle, that the Swifties didn't turn on him after he was talking about bad blood and went after Charlie? Well, I wouldn't be surprised if he got a few DMs from Swifties. However, as someone who is a fan of Taylor Swift myself, I appreciated the reference. And I thought it was respectfully done. Even though he was weaponizing Taylor Swift to hurt Charlie, who was the bigger Taylor Swift fan. I think he was speaking the language of the community personally. You knew enough. Yes. So that's fine. So our research team here at Rob's podcast, they gave me a list of Survivor.

players on Instagram that you follow. And it's a notable list. And you had any interesting experiences on social media interacting with any of the Survivor alumni. Gosh. Have I, I don't think anything, I don't remember,

honestly. I mean, I follow people. I engage with their posts. I comment on their posts. Whether or not people see, see me doing my thing. And,

you know, I respect the. the relationship we have, me being a fan, I suppose. Did you find something that I might not remember? This is not a hit piece. This is in 60 minutes. We're not here to say like, well, you said this to Adam Klein. But I just like, oh, I've met Adam in person.

Yes. What was that like? Oh, it's great. Yeah. He was in L.A. and I just met up with him. He's really nice. Yeah.

The nicest. And do any of them ever reach back out to you? Is they like, hey, oh my God. Michelle Carre. I didn't know you liked Survivor. I don't. I don't think so. Yeah.

A lot of them are in their own bubble. Sure. Sure. Yeah. I don't expect it. I guess this is me saying, if you're a survivor player, I'm available to hang out.

No, I haven't had any like super notable interactions with anybody, though I have met Jeff probes over FaceTime once, which was very fun. First off, that your husband is the longtime, lifetime survivor fan. How did he react to you getting the chance

to talk to Jeff? Oh, he was there. It was amazing. It was really fun. Basically, we were at a meeting with someone who is a mutual friend of Jeff's, and we were just sort of talking about everything, and they're like, let me just FaceTime Jeff and see if you'll answer. And I was like, listen, I need about two to three business days notice before I speak to Jeff probes myself.

And he picked up. And he picked up. He was in the middle of recording the podcast, and I think he stepped outside, which was so generous of him. He's such a nice person to answer for this friend of his. And we got to talk, because he had seen some of the channel.

He had seen some of Challenge Accepted, which was really, really cool. And he was like, why don't you apply to be on Survivor? So that was very exciting. Yeah. Would you ever consider being on Survivor? You've done so many other challenges. You know, I think it's a maybe someday type of answer for me.

As somebody who understands the behind the scenes of reality television, both for Child Accepted, as well as karma, I understand, I think I understand both sides of it as a contestant and as a host producer. I think I would really, really enjoy the challenges. I think where I would struggle, Rob. and I would actually need you to give me a crash course is the component. I'm a very emotionally vulnerable person, which is shown on my channel all the time, at the same time, I do get to have creative edit over what we show online.

Giving that up when I'm starving, haven't slept is a little scary for me. However, as I do accept challenges, I do think it would be an incredible growth opportunity. So what do you think, Rob? What do you think I need to improve on before if I were to go on Survivor? I think maybe you might be too threatening. I think you need to, people might look at you and say you're too polished. Too polished? You're too big of a threat.

In what capacity? Because like I don't, when I see people like you and Surrey play, I'm like, I, when you guys, like, the way that you socially handle situations. I find is very impressive. That is the part where I would be nervous to take action in leadership. And I'm the person who would be taking everything personally. If I hear my name, I would go to, I would just start crying. I'm going to be so real with you, Rob.

So I would need to work on all that. But as a threatening player yourself, how do you, Surrey, Homer Simpson, yourself into the bush? Well, Seri's, I'm a threatening person and then they just get rid of me. That's really my lot in life. So I don't know how to do the Surrey blend into the bushes thing. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Only she can do that.

Maybe, maybe, maybe we'll follow each other on Instagram and I can ask her for a boot camp. If I'm ever luckily selected to go on Survivor, I can call up Surrey. She knew me some pointers. Yes. Well, you know, I was just thinking also with, you know, in Hollywood, would if this merger goes through with Warner and Paramount, that maybe they could, you know, they could just call it Survivor Jr. now and maybe it's maybe bring it back. Listen, if, if a Survivor Jr. emerged and they were seeking a host, this is me publicly saying,

I would love the opportunity to audition for it. I think it would bang. I think it would be incredible. Though I, obviously, things would have to be different with kids. Sure. They would have to be fed three times a day, for sure. But I think there is so much to explore. And kids just have such a fascinating perspective on the world. And I think when we look at the marketplace of docu reality TV, there's a real opening right now for kid teen contestant content. And when we're talking about reinvigorating television for a gen Z, Gen Alpha, just like the business person in me thinks it's a really cool opportunity for a story and for hitting a new audience. Yeah. Michelle, can you tell me more about karma because I did not catch it when it was on.

I listened. It was 2020, right? It was a weird time. You know, God knows what I was doing at that point in time. Maybe Tiger King. Who knows? But could you just talk about, like, so you had young people and they were playing, they were playing a game outdoors, but that you fed them all the time.

They were fed. They were fed. And how long did the game last? Gosh, I think, I think from talent arriving on set to the final winner winning was about three or four weeks. Wow. That's longer than Survivor now. The kids who ended up winning, I mean, they were away from their family for about a month. Yeah.

And they were very, you know, it was really impressive to see them work through those hardships. Yeah. Did it get cutthroat or the kids, they were all supportive of each other? Oh, gosh. I mean, any competitive environment and with the right casting brings out the right people. So I don't want to give away anything even though the show is well over, but I think the kids that ended up doing really well were fans of the genre and had studied. They were ready. One of the competitors named Jack was a chess champion. And you could directly see how that applied to the game.

I know, like, sometimes when we're watching Survivor, you hear somebody has a certain profession, and it doesn't necessarily manifest in the edit how it impacts their game. I would say that it was pretty incredible to see these kids' extracurricular backgrounds come into play with how they handled things. And none of them have gone on to be Survivor players yet, right? Not to my knowledge.

I think at this point most of them would be, most of them are just starting college now. So I guess on Survivor, you can go at that age. but to my knowledge, none of them... They're not disqualified from ever being on Survivor, though, right? I don't think they should be. I mean, some of them would be fantastic. There was a show called Endurance, which was, you know, a young person survivor way back when.

And he went from that show to now... Yeah. That's amazing because Endurance was produced by J.D. Roth, who is another just huge heavy header in the reality space. he has, you know, his mind has come up with some of the greatest reality shows of all time. He was the executive producer of karma. Yeah. So I think that was one of the coolest things about that show was, the show was amazing. Jonathan calls him Mr. J.D.

Yeah. Mr. J.D. He's amazing. I'm obsessed with him. Shout out J.D. Roth. Yeah. Just an amazing, extremely intelligent and underappreciated person. and I think he deserves all of his flowers.

But the coolest part of working on karma, you know, the location, the show being on HBO, that was awesome. But being a mentee of JD's changed my life. I mean, he really took me to host and producer boot camp. And you can see in my own channel, even, my content, a huge shift in how I hosted it and produced it, produced before and after karma.

the way that I understand exactly how to prepare before meeting somebody on camera before interviewing anyone, even though I'm the contestant of my own show on Challenge Accepted, I have a far deeper preparation methodology. And again, this is nothing they teach in school. I mean, he taught me so much about it. And again, I would add that to my resume as for Survivor Junior host. Yes. So going back to Challenge Accepted, what gave you the original idea to start this as a YouTube channel? So I, before I did Challenge Accepted, was living this Hannah Montana lifestyle, where during the day, I was a video producer for another YouTube channel, just a producer. and then at night and on the weekends, I was a professional cyclist. So I was making internet videos during the day.

And at night and on the weekends, I was flying somewhere in the world, racing 100 miles, and then flying right back and restarting my week. It got to this point where I felt like I could combine these two loves. And eventually I got to a point where I decided to leave my job and take a bet on the channel. But it took about a year of experimentation on the channel for us to arrive. on challenge accepted as the format and the show name. But it came out of this space of unscripted was having a renaissance, not just on traditional TV,

but online, specifically on YouTube. And there are plenty of shows out there where a comedian or an actor or a public figure tries a job for a day. I'm going to use that as sort of like a blanket term. And I wanted to ask the question, well, what would happen if someone fully committed their life to trying to learn this thing? Getting the best coaches in the world.

Really, and I truly do this, like my 9 to 5 schedule is completely different based on what I'm training for. And to ask the question, could a person go from zero to hero with the best people in the world helping them? And what's been interesting about the show is that because I'm literally transforming my life for months at a time, It's created this moat of nobody else's crazy to do this. And so what's been special about that is the thing that was very hard in the beginning became the thing that made it special and unique. And that's how we actually choose episodes of Challenge Accepted. If it sounds so outrageous, how could we even do that?

I know there's something there that is deserving of exploration. Was there one episode that you did that really was where the dam broke, where it really put you on the map? You know, I have a lot of friends who are content creators who can name this was the video I uploaded and the next day my whole life was changed and I had millions of followers. That was not actually my experience, even though it would make for a better story. mine was has always been long, slow, steady. And that's just out of necessity because the episodes take so long to make. I mean, some of these have a lead time of a year on them, which is rare for content creation online.

And what that creates is a situation where we are slowly, constantly evolving and pivoting with each episode. So there hasn't been a single standout, But there have definitely been moments, for example, when we became, I think, the first YouTube channel to collaborate with the Secret Service. They allowed me to embed at their academy and experience what it's like to protect the president of the United States. That was a big milestone for our channel, not only because it performed well, but because on a production studio capacity, we showed, hey, this hasn't even been covered by traditional TV. and there's a high barrier to entry. I mean, I was on the phone, me, sending emails convincing the Secret Service, the FBI,

all of these organizations to collaborate with us. And so I think people appreciate that there is high production value, but it's grassroots effort. For example, when I did the Mission Impossible stunt last year, where I'm hanging off the side of a plane as it's taking off, that started with me just tweeting a picture from the, the frame of Mission Impossible where the stunt is happening, asking, does anyone have access to this plan? A lot of our episodes start with me just throwing something into the ether. And then it

escalates beyond there. And of course, we have an amazing crew to bring it together. But those initial steps have always come from a place of absurdity and putting yourself out there vulnerably. Yeah. I'm so interested to know, like, what scares you to not do? Is there anything that you considered and then walked back, looked over the ledge? Like, no, no, no, I can't do that. Well, what's interesting and this is definitely a part of the show is I'm actually a really anxious person. I am not the stoic daredevil.

Like when you think of David Blaine, you think of this monolith of a person who can just do anything. And I think maybe some people view the show that way, but genuinely, I've created this show because I wrote all of my fears on a whiteboard and connected each fear to a circumstance that would push me to address it. And that is the birth of the show was me as a person who had always been on a life path predetermined and pre-carved of go to school, get the good grades, get into a. a good college, go into a profession that thousands of people before me have proved is a high earning position, whatever it is. This was a departure from that for me to uncover a part of myself and hopefully help other people who struggle with the same fears to really attack it head on. And what's interesting about fear is that I've learned, because I think some people might ask like, well, after doing 60 episodes, can't you just be brave? And I think the truth is, as we grow and

evolve as people, new fears emerge. And also, I'm a person who believes fear never actually goes away. Like, I think fear is always there. No matter, you just get better at knowing how to manage it and when it appears how to respond. So I've definitely improved at that. Like, I know when I go into a challenge, for example, I know that week three and four are always going to be miserable, whatever I'm training for. The first weeks, you have this beginner's mindset, you have the joy of I'm learning something new, but weeks three and four is where it always gets hard. I just know that every time. And I know how to manage that. I know how to prepare for that. And it also comes into situations like with running seven marathons,

my producerial hat thinks about, okay, I'm going to plan all my outfits ahead of time. So that's not, I'm not thinking about what's in my luggage. I just grab the bag for Antarctica and go. So I think you learn how to mitigate fear, but it never goes away. And that's what I think has been the well that I continue to be drawn to from the show.

Do you have advice for people who are facing fear? just confront it and go into it, or are there more practical steps that you can take to deal with a fear? I think approaching a fear without a plan and just jumping in sometimes works, but oftentimes can actually be reckless. So I'm a planned fear addresser. For example, when I left my job to start my channel, that was a year-long process of me thinking about all of the fears. that I had associated with it. I started saving money. I moved into a studio apartment with a roommate.

I created a circumstance to train myself for, if I was totally failing and ran out of money, what would my lifestyle be? And how would I overcome that? So I recommend Tim Ferriss's fear setting exercise, which I think, have you heard of this by chance, Rob? I know Tim Ferriss. I don't know the fear setting exercise.

Okay. So if this was really transformative for me when I go into some of my bigger challenges, he asks you to define the fear, define, prevent, and repair. So what that means is you define the fear. You force yourself to think through if this fear actually comes true. How would I repair afterwards? And also, what can I do to prevent it from happening? It's a very simple framework. But that's really helpful to me. But I think you actually need to think deeply about the fear. And is it warranted? Is it not?

You know, a very simple example of this is the plane stunt from last year. There are many fears associated with it strapping yourself to the side of the plane. But I knew to mitigate some of that I would need to do the appropriate training. So we designed this insane training plan where I am in a wind tunnel. preparing what it feels like to have that type of pressure on my body so I don't hyperventilate on the side of the plane. We got custom contact lenses made to protect my eyes from debris. So I think looking at fear very directly actually gives you answers to how to become brave. Michelle, I want to get your take on where we're at in Survivor 50 right now and hear some of your

reactions to the season. This was a big week with Coach, and I'd love to know your opinions on Coach as a player over the course of his career and where he's at right now in the game. Gosh, what, and I know you guys have already discussed this on the podcast,

this idea of coach having a little bit of a breaking point this past week. It's so interesting and fun to watch players for whom we have such story paths. You know, we think of coach not just as the coach we're seeing in 50, but all of the seasons prior, and that's really, really fun. And I think the best way I can explain it is the dichotomy we're seeing between coach and Ozzy, which we were talking about before, in some way.

And of course, the edit can assist in this perception, but what we're seeing with coach is almost a little bit of a repeat of history, whereas with Ozzy, we see him transforming into a character we may have not seen before. It's yet to be seen, but I have faith. And seeing those storylines progress adjacent and parallel with one another is fascinating. But I think, as you guys discussed, this idea of 14 people on a beach trying to come to a consensus is it's like hurting cats when everyone is very vocal and information is so fluid on this season. Nobody's really keeping secrets. And so I think this idea of honesty and integrity is an old era type of mindset that I don't think is necessarily working on these evolved players,

if that makes sense. But what's your opinion on coach in terms of, like, I think it's like the age-old question of, Is he losing it? Is he, you know, sly like a fox that he is putting on this persona to ultimately get what he wants? Do you ever read on coach just as a player and what he's trying to accomplish right now? Well, I'm not a psychiatrist, but what we're dealing with is multi-layered analysis. we're dealing with players that are extremely aware of the edits, of the cameras of the producers. And so I think as viewers, as fans of the show, it's something interesting that we should keep in mind as we are interpreting their performances. Like we were discussing earlier, these are players who are extremely seasoned in confessionals.

They know how to say a line, if they're a great performer, how to get it in the edit. And so it's hard for me, at least watching, to know how to divorce those characteristics in between what is the real person, what is the person the edit and the producers are presenting it to us, and what is the characterization of themselves that they are putting on. Yeah. So that's my assessment. That's the type of scrutiny you wouldn't necessarily want to succumb to as a survivor contestant. Of course. Are you kidding, Rob? Gosh, I mean, I watch all of this stuff.

But this is my favorite part of it. I love to get to like really like, especially with these returning players. It's so fun for me to say, like, we really know these people. Like, are these characters so rich? Mm-hmm. Oh, of course. And that's why it's really fun to watch. But to be the person, as you know, receiving to be the person on the Rob has a podcast,

Patreon that everyone is talking about, the Reddit everything. And I receive some of that, of course, from the audience that we have from Challenge Accepted, people are opinionated when they're fans of something. And I think that's what makes for a great fandom. But it is scary.

Yeah. This is me admitting a fear I have. I do think that Coach likes not letting you know. Like, I think he, part of him, I think he enjoys the like being, the person who is a little mysterious and talked about.

Yeah, and I think that's part of his characterization, the Dragon Slayer, that we have seen over all of these years. It's hard because Coach has stuck the landing in some ways with this tactic previously. It didn't work last week. We'll see how he adjusts moving next. Coach has given out some nicknames this season and in the past. Do you have any cool nicknames, Michelle?

Do I have any cool nicknames? Yes. Oh my gosh, I don't. Some people call me MK. That's not the type of nickname like a Dragon Slayer or... How did they come up with that? That's just my initials. But, you know, maybe if I'm fortunate enough to play on Survivor in the future,

I can ask coach for a nickname. But again, like, this is me being too meta-rah, but I, as a person on both sides of the production of a reality show, I know, I would know that using nicknames, that's a good sign for the edit. It helps the audience understand who is a part of the alliance, naming things. It's memorable. It's interesting. We're having a conversation about it right now. if we just saw that coaches align with these four people and there's not a branding to it. He's literally using branding and marketing as a part of that, whether or not he's aware it helps

get in the edit. But like I think I'm too like meta and all of it. No, that's a really good point in terms of these returning players, you know, name your alliance, give out nicknames. All these things are good in the battle for airtime with 24 players. Yeah. It's interesting. So yeah, it's hard. to know if if coach's big swing is for performance or for playing. Obviously, he wants to stay in the game. And then, of course, you question, what of the hundreds of hours of footage are we missing for context in any of this? Sure. Now, I know that one of the other people that you are following on Instagram is Christian. I feel like that. I love Christian. Yeah, I get that. I feel like it's

somebody who, and Christian is also somebody who I think is very interested in a wide variety of things. I can definitely see the overlap where you would be a fan of somebody like Christian. Well, you know, Christian, Christian won my heart when he won immunity in his original season, clinging on to that pole against a challenge beast. I think he's always just been really endearing to watch and you know he's sort of he's he's been a bit of a star of this season he's gotten a lot of airtime he's done some crazy stuff I mean he he should himself

he did yes wasn't expecting that to be where you went but yeah he did do that um yeah I I love yeah no you know I'm I'm curious um what what would context we may have been missing in his decision to choose Emily over Mike was interesting to me. But I'm excited to see how he does with Rick in the merge. Yeah. Do you think that this fake idol is going to come into play? Do you think that at some point that that's going to pop up? I'll just say kind of as a blanket thing that idle usage throughout the season has somewhat perplexed me. This fake idol is so crazy.

Will it come back? You know, they keep playing it in the edit and reminding us it's there. So if it doesn't come back, I'll be disappointed for sure. The fact that it hasn't been a conversation yet, I think is just a sign of how secure Rick and Christian might feel currently. They probably haven't included that like discussion. in the edit of them talking about, should we go, like, should we make a scene with the fake idol tonight? Because I don't think they're in a position

where they need to start worrying about that quite yet. But I really hope it comes back because with the Billy Irish boomering idol, for example, conceptually, I think it's really interesting. It's such an interesting psychological experiment to feign allegiance with someone and then have the opportunity to stab them in the back later. Conceptually, I think it's really interesting.

But nobody has used it for the, that purpose. I mean, Audrey used her idol last week, which I thought was also surprising. So I don't, it's hard to understand, I think. Yeah, with all due respect to Billy Elish,

who I hear is great. Yeah, there's no way that we could get the intended boomerang purpose, because Genevieve, who found two of them, is gone. And then Aubrey, has flushed her own, so there's no way that any of these idols can boomerang back. Right, unless they come back into play and it all starts over again.

Do you think that that will be the case? Do you think that that will be the case? Do you there's more Billy Eilish boomerang idols? Maybe. If I were production, I would be thinking if we had planned more at the merge phase, we need to pivot potentially introduce normal idols. Normal idols, please. Ornal idols.

Yeah. Because, again, because information is so fluid on this season. There could have been a world where it was truly under wraps and a complete secret, but because maybe that would have happened if there was only one Billy Ilish Vroomering Idol, but because there are so many and the information is so available that I don't think, I don't think it's going to work. And we may have as another situation where people feel pressure to flush it just to get it out of the game. Yeah, I think also it seems like that,

sort of the currency of the culture of the season has been, I'm going to share information where I think that there is a lot of mistrust between people. Can I trust you? Okay, we were cool on the outside, but like, what are you giving me here? Q had a line earlier in the season where he said like, hey, if you're going to come to my house, you better bring something for me to eat. And I think that that's sort of been the mentality of almost all of the players are like, hey, you want to work together?

Like, you got to give me some information. That's, like, the price of doing business. So everybody is, like, very quick to share any sort of secret, especially Emily, we've seen do this the most, of, well, I won't tell you my secret, but let me tell you everybody else's secrets that I know. And it's helped her be able to foster good relationships. I just think it's been a very, like, overshary season. It really has been for better or for worse.

I do wish there were more secrets. though. I like I like when a group of people, when an alliance is able to keep something under wraps and then you know, fire the bullet when nobody's expecting it. That's fun to watch. I suspect, and this is usually

the time in the season where it happens, that there will be, now, Aubrey played her Billy Elish boomerang idol. There'll be a normal idol hidden back at camp. Somebody will find it, and that will be like the one big secret that is out there. and that nobody will know.

And then we'll have like a big moment where somebody plays an idol at an unproductive moment where we get like a big reaction out of that, where that's the one thing that'll be secret, I hope. Me too. Yeah. Tell me Tiffany has been in a bad spot now for a couple of weeks coming out of that she was with Camillo who got blindsided. And now she's firmly at the bottom.

Do you think that Tiffany can turn it around? Gosh, especially, you know, after last tribal with D, gosh, I think Tiffany has a lot of work ahead of her in order to turn it around. I'm very eager to see what she does. And I know that there have been critiques of the show this season that she hasn't gotten much airtime. Unclear, again, understanding both ends of it, if that's because she's not doing anything or if it's because it's, being, it's just not making the edit, it's not as interesting as other stuff going on. I'm not sure.

So I think because we haven't seen enough of Tiffany's strategy or gameplay, if it's happening, it's hard for me to know, okay, Tiffany can really like rise to the top based on something that happened in episode two. We don't really have much information. But she has the last couple of episodes

really gotten a lot of air time. So I think that's the case of Tiffany, I just feel like there's she's somebody, that her story, for whatever they're going to show us, her story, like, didn't really start until she was sort of, like, at the bottom. And hopefully it's like the start of a comeback story. But, you know, in a big cast, I think that she did get lost in the beginning of the season. But she's here now, which I appreciate.

She is. She's here now. Yeah, and I feel like we're getting teed up that this episode will be Tiffany heavy. Whether or not she moves from the bottom to elsewhere. we have to see how she navigates this either way. Well, I think she's in an interesting spot where this is really set up now with 13 people. Everybody's thinking, okay, Tiffany's on the bottom. Tiffany's on the bottom.

Great, great, great, okay, easy vote here. And just when you think it's going to be an easy vote that really sets the table for somebody to be able to use Tiffany as a smokescreen and do something else, interesting. I completely agree with you because there's, as we know, a difference between either. vote versus strategic play. Yeah. Is there one person from everybody that we've lost so far that you really were the most sad to lose in the first half of the season? Oh, of course, Kyle.

I was really, really excited to see Kyle play. Kyle and Dee, both of them. I mean, they're both favorites of the fans, favorites of me. I was looking forward to a Kyle and Camilla something at the, the merge. I was looking forward to D just being amazing D. So I think I'm sad about all, you know, in a season with everyone. I must admit bias because those are the people we spend the most time with. So I thought they were fantastic. And I think it's exciting to see when someone, you know, if you come into a returning season as a winner, you only have

something to lose in a way. But and so I think that. So I think that puts a lot of stakes on them and makes them interesting to see how to navigate. I would have loved to see Kyle. I was disappointed Kyle was medevac. If he had been voted out fairly, sure. But a medevac, I think, is just unfortunate for everyone. Now, do you relate to the winners as a winner of Jetlag, a two-time winner of Jetlag? Well, I didn't get a million dollars for winning Jetlag twice, but I, I, I,

But jet lag was fantastic. I loved competing on jet lag. Though it's a tough comparison to Survivor because I was fed and I was sleeping in a bed every night. But still, very fierce competition, as you know, having seen the show. Yes. And so as a competitor, somebody who has done so many challenges but also with this athletic background, was that the key to your success on Jetlag? I think to prepare for jet lag, you have to have a life experience of experiences behind you, physical, mental, emotional. It's the only way that you can really succeed at that game.

And you have to be very adept at Google Maps. Yeah. Do you have any other survivor hot takes that maybe people would be interested in hearing? A survivor hot take. Gosh, I feel like this fandom is so big. I don't know if anything I'm going to say is new or interesting. A hot take. This is not, I don't think this is a hot take.

It's an opinion I have. And I know this has been discussed immensely online, but I wish the blood mood had been one tribal with three votes in a row. One tribal with three votes in a row. So we get, we get seven or it's 15 people there, and then we have one vote. And then we do it now the tribe is spoken. we do the same thing with 14 people.

Potentially. And I think that has problems too. I think that has problems in and of itself. Here's a crazy idea. Here's a very bad idea. Everyone's going to eat this up. But a bad idea. I don't even know if like this would be fair.

Imagine they vote as a group of 15. The person leaves. And Jeff turns around and says, it's time to vote again. Complete surprise to everybody. And then they all have to vote. again with like zero notice. That would have been exciting.

I think like the way it was it was done currently. Again, maybe from a production perspective is interesting and solve some issues versus so many people voting three times. But I think that the split tribal felt more like a tribe swap and sort of just didn't really give like Genevieve. And I need to actually fight for a position to come back, come back. Yeah, a lot of people.

did not love it. It just felt like that, okay, these people got unlucky more so than they got outplayed and that's kind of a bummer for these people that you waited years and years for them to come back. And then it's sort of like, oh, well, you drew an unlucky rock today, so you're out. Yeah.

Yeah, especially with a player like Genevieve, who had two Billy Elish boomerang idols as an opportunity. Yes. But no idols to show for it. Okay. Michelle, anything else you want

the Survivor fans to know about what you're up to? First of all, thank you so much for having me not just Rob, but also the Rob has a podcast community. I'm so grateful to be here. I'm grateful to be a fan of Survivor. You can check me out on YouTube

at Michelle Carre. And if you're a voter for the Emmys, vote for us for Outstanding Hosted Nonfiction. For your consideration to all the Emmy voters out there. Please, you know, have some, you know, the consideration for all of Michelle's work. Yes. We appreciate it.

Consider it. How about does we make it a challenge for the Emmy voters? Yeah. To come through. I'm going to challenge you. Do what's right, Emmy voters. But, no, Michelle, I really appreciate you making time to come on and talk about Survivor and everything that you have going on because I know that you, are incredibly busy and you're doing so many cool things. And it really does mean a lot that you

came on to talk some Survivor with us here during Survivor 50. Yeah, likewise, Rob. Thank you for having me on such a historic season. I'm so excited to see how it goes. And it's just great to meet you, Rob, and hear from you as someone who is a student and fan of the game. Yeah, thank you so much and appreciate you. And I'm going to, listen, my kids are watching so much YouTube. I'm going to turn them on to Challenge Accepted now. Amazing. And then when they're old enough, they can vote for the Emmys too.

Well, we'll see. We'll see if that's the real life takes them to be Emmy voters. But thank you so much. Thanks everybody for checking out this video. Of course, we are going to have full coverage of the next Survivor episode kicking off Wednesday night with Survivor No-It-All's. the episode. Michelle, thank you so much. Be sure to check out what's going on a three-part episode where Michelle is going to be going across seven continents coming up this Saturday. So I'm sure to

check that out. Take care, everybody. Have a good one. Bye.