RHAP: We Know Survivor - Road to Reality | Survivor x BB Crossover with Andy Herren

Episode Date: July 31, 2024

Episode 5 of Road to Reality features Andy Herren, the winner of Big Brother 15. Join the effervescent Andy (@andyherren) and Kellyn (@theKellynB) as they discuss Andy’s application process and the paranoia that comes with being a reality tv star hopeful, building his own business, becoming sober, getting recognized daily, and hear about his Survivor fandom.

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From the creators of Barbarian and the studio that brought you The Notebook comes a twisted tale of modern romance and the sweet satisfaction of revenge. Companion, only in theaters January 31st. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to Road to Reality. Today, we have an exciting crossover episode. It is Big Brother season, real loud. All of that's going on with Big Brother that I see on the Twitterverse. I do not spend much time watching Big Brother. I did when I got back from Survivor. You can hear about why I got obsessed with the live feeds a little bit through this conversation. I'm so excited to

introduce you to Andy Heron, who won season 15 of Big Brother. If you are not a Big Brother fan, that is totally okay. This episode is about Andy's life, who he was before, during, and after being on a reality TV show. We compare the differences in casting and being on Big Brother versus being on Survivor. I found it all incredibly interesting.

And Andy is so funny and so effervescent and lovely that you will not be able to listen to this and not have a lovely time. Also, Andy spends his full-time job outside listening to podcasts all day, walking dogs, and he has some of the best podcast recommendations we've had so far on Road to Reality. So stick around to the rapid round questions to hear those. We go through Andy's application process, some of the paranoia that

comes with being a reality TV star hopeful, what happens to him at the airport. I almost peed my pants laughing. It's so funny. I cannot wait for you to spend the next hour with the funny, friendly, kind, and underestimated you'll find out Andy Heron. I do want to just start out with like where you were, what year you applied to be on Big Brother, where you were in the world and what was going on in your life then yeah um i okay so it was 2013 i finished i got my master's in 2011 at the university of illinois moved to chicago in 2012 um and was teaching at a college in the suburbs um and so basically i was like not even at a full year in chicago yet when i applied for big brother in march of 2013 um and then like everything happened really fast my friend marnita like i would always there was like a commercial that would air when big brother was airing. That was like, like outgoing.

Like, are you fun? Do you think you have what it takes? I always kind of thought I did, but I just never, like, I was also lazy and was like, I'm not going to send in a video.

And my friend, Marnita, who was like a friend of mine from college, she was like, Hey, like she knew where I lived. And she was like, they're doing an open casting call,

literally like five minutes from your apartment in Chicago just go and so I did and I like like it's actually funny I mentioned this on other podcasts as well but at the open casting call I actually like sat down at a table like randomly with Helen a woman who ended up being on my season and so the two of the two of us just like talked and talked and talked and then like I kind of credit her I mean I credit myself with being like an interesting person and that's how I got on but she went into the room first and when she came back she told me what questions they asked her and so I was able to formulate good responses to the questions that

I knew that I was gonna get and then it's funny because like he cut to six months later I was like the reason that she didn't win like she really trusted me and I just kind of screwed her over and she was like damn like she's like if I had known that day like that like letting you know what questions they were gonna ask was potentially going to lead to my downfall um which I think is funny but basically like I went into the casting call like I purposely dressed just kind of innocuous I remember I was wearing a Kelly Kapowski from Saved by the Bell t-shirt red shorts and just like I looked just like a sweet little sweetheart and when I went in they asked

everybody in the room who they thought was the biggest threat and nobody said me and then finally I was the last person I was like six people in a room I was the last person to go and I was like well actually I'm the biggest threat in the room and the fact that nobody said it just highlights what a threat I am I was just like like, I look like this. I do not look threatening. I am smarter than you'd think. I'm quicker than you'd think. Like I have a master's in communication. I do improv in Chicago. I can think on my feet. I was like, I will be the biggest threat in that house that nobody will see coming. And that is honestly, that is like exactly what happened. Um, I feel like people would be out the door and they were just like, damn, like we did not factor him in.

And he was a lot scarier than we thought. And you were the only one out of the six that made it on the show, probably. Yes. I mean, granted, it was very exciting that the other person from the Chicago casting call that made it on the show was Ellen. That's crazy. That is an early, early, early connection. I assume. Were there hundreds of people at the casting call?

There were hundreds of people. You line up to move into the house and you're not allowed to talk. The first time you see the rest of the cast is when you line up to move in outside of the lot on the like on the cbs studio and i saw helen and i was just like oh my god like i was just like holy shit

and so we when we moved into the house like you're not supposed to know anyone that you move in with and so the two of us never addressed it but we just like we looked like i was like two of us never addressed it but we just like we looked like i was like and she was like and so we like we knew and like and i've said this on podcasts before too it's like all of my friends were just like why did you align with the moms right away like it was helen and then alissa who were both these moms and they like had the mom connection uh-huh and i was in the mb right and i aligned with them because i was like you don't know if anybody or if everybody is what they say or who they are, who they say they are. I knew, I knew Helen. And so I was like, I trusted her right off the bat. And like, it also helped that she was just like a smart woman that I

enjoyed. Okay. So you go, some of your friends says, go, go to the calling. You walk out feeling like I nailed it. I would think. Yeah. you walk out feeling like I nailed it I would think yeah you walked out feeling like I nailed it and how long was it until you heard from casting like immediately uh so basically I had the casting call and I I mean I'm not like a not confident person but I was really confident I was just like man man, they loved me. And so I would say like four hours later, I got a phone call that I was a semi-finalist. And then like two days after that, I had a taped, I had to go to a hotel downtown and I had a semi-finalist interview where they like filmed me. Like they talked to me for like an hour and filmed me. And then after that, I would say I

heard back maybe two weeks later and I was told that I was a finalist but that like there was like a month that was going to go by until finals casting but they were like you are a finalist and they were like we will be flying you to LA like mid-May and so I flew to LA and that was like really it's like a fun exciting process because like you disappeared I was there for a week and you can't tell anyone. And so it's like, yeah. Did they threaten you guys as much as they threaten us? Like don't tell anybody where you're going. Okay. And I was like pretty, I'm like a rule follower in that regard.

And so I was just like very nervous about it. And so I truly didn't tell anyone. Oh my God. Were you like on the airplane, like looking at, I remember going to casting flying there, like looking on the airplane, like, Oh my God, does somebody know why I'm going to la just like being so paranoid this is actually crazy like just cbs is messy and just like like whatever but on my boarding pass like they they they figure everything out and they just like send you your information yeah i go and i print my boarding pass off and my name is spelled wrong and so i and so i have to

like go like and so like yet again they tell you you're not allowed to say anything to anybody and so i was just like what the fuck do i do so i go like to the i go like to the ticket counter and i was like um my name is misspelled and they were just like they were like well why did you misspell your name and I was like I don't know what to say if I told you I'd have to kill you so I literally like called I called like the cb and I was like what do I do like I was like am I allowed to tell the ticket agent like what is going on because they're not gonna let me on the plane because like everything is weird because they think that i entered my name in incorrectly uh it all worked out but did they tell you did they tell you you could tell the

i actually like god i don't actually fully remember what happened but yeah yeah of course um but i thought that was very funny on On Dom's episode and last season, we talked a lot about our paranoia and like how we lied to people on the airplane going over there. Cause you're just like so nervous that you're going to miss mess up this chance or get caught or they've got people watching you or whatever. So to have your poor ticket not lined up and then you're like, do I tell?

And then of course at the airport is like the worst place to be acting sad. I'm stressed out. Yeah and so but yeah so then i go to finals casting and it's like at finals i think speaking of me being stressed out i also they were like you're not allowed to speak to anyone who is not like from the production team so i once was watching the movie rosemary's baby which is actually like not a loud movie i was like not talking i was i was on my computer watching rosemary's baby in my room and i got a noise complaint and so in my head i was like did i actually get a noise complaint are they testing like i was like a hotel worker came and was like hey like you got a noise complaint are you able

to turn like whatever you're watching down and i yet again was so paranoid about speaking I was like thumbs up silent talk I was just like is this them testing me and so yet again I would not speak to the person that came to the door to warn me about my noise complaint um it's not funny it is funny it's super funny but in the moment you're so nervous that you're gonna do something to trip the wire to get out of the casting process it's also the casting process is so stressful and nerve-wracking but it's also kind of fun when you keep like when you keep making it one rung further up the ladder and then you notice that like the people that you're seeing around are getting less and less and less it's like oh my god like okay i'm like actually they're like they are definitely sending people home and i am still here and that's exciting did they run the hotel

similar to the survivor time which is like you get a time to eat you get a time to go to the gym then sometimes going and doing okay i noticed my groups waning um yeah and it was exciting yeah that's I I feel like I don't even really remember the I guess I remember the group getting smaller but they only had us together as a big group one time and there were about 24 of us how big ever was the group were you in? I would say smaller than that. Okay. Well, actually, so I mean, for my like pool time and gym time and like eating time, it was like probably 10 to 12. Okay. So there were a couple instances where they did put a lot of us in like a big room and they would like call us one by one to do interviews. Yes. And so there were times

where I would see like 50 people but whoa that's okay so there were a lot more people there than than what i've ever heard of in in survivor like weeks casting weeks is lynn spillman around at that point is she also doing this was not our casting director okay i didn't know if i'm i'm not uh i'm not a real huge Big Brother fan or watcher. I'm an Andy Heron fan, but I'm not. So I don't know a ton of Big Brother. And I imagine a lot of people listening here are not necessarily as keyed into the Big Brother space.

So you go to finals, you get to finals. We know we make it through finals when they give us vaccines. They start to shoot you up in the arm with vaccines. What happened at the end of your casting week? Like before you left, you made it all the way through. And how did you know you were like? I mean, they were like,

here's the start date of finals and here's the end date, but we could send you home anytime before the end date. Okay. I made it to the end date. And so that's how I knew. Yeah, they just sent me home and they were like, okay, you'll hear back from us in a few weeks and then they reached out probably like early june and they were just like okay you are in the top 25 and they were just like so what we're

gonna do is we are gonna send a film crew out to chicago on like june 13th or something and we want to get more footage of you to like sell you to the network. And I was like, no, you don't. I was like, I made the show. Absolutely.

I was like, you would not be spending like thousands of dollars to get photos of me, like pointing at a whiteboard teaching. Like that's absurd. They were doing at the time. Like, had you watched the show enough and you were a big enough of a fan that you knew that they had like,

I was like, I'm absolutely going to get my key today. Like they give you a key. They like surprise you with a big enough of a fan that you knew that they had like I was like I was like I'm absolutely gonna get my key today like they give you a key they like surprise you with a key and I was like I'm 100% getting my key and here's the thing I would have looked like such an asshole if I didn't because this was when I truly did break protocol I had a goodbye dinner with like all of my friends I was like I'm definitely leaving for Big Brother tomorrow and so I love you all like 25 people at dinner I was like I love you all like I definitely leaving for Big Brother tomorrow. And so I love you all. Like 25 people at dinner. I was like, I love you all.

Like, I am going to Big Brother. Like, they're going to take me tomorrow for sure. And so then they came and we went to the school that I was teaching at. And they surprised me with, I mean, yet again, I pretty much knew. What were you supposed to do with your job? Like, they told you they were like, like, like I mean I was lucky enough where I basically took the summer off and it was a gamble like I was just they were like basically I was an adjunct and so it's like I taught semester by semester and so I was like oh I just I'm not gonna be I

told them maybe a week or two before I was like I'm not gonna come in for the summer semester and so if I had not gotten chosen for Big Brother I just like wouldn't have had a job for the summer. Yeah. But I was lucky enough in that I just was able to like take the summer off. And then I told them also I was like I told my friend Chandra, who was running my life, essentially. Yeah. Let the school know by like August if I was still on the show um to like let them know that I was not going to be back okay and so when you go on Big Brother at least at the time do you get to leave

early or do they have like a equivalent of Ponderosa house where you have to stay if I mean you didn't you win so you're there the whole time if you get voted out because big brother is how many days at the time 90 for 90 days so if you get voted out do you have to stay or you get to go home um if you are so my season the jury sometimes the jury is seven people sometimes the jury is nine people my season there were 16 of us the first five people evicted just boom went on like they literally just got sent out and then the next nine people were the jury and so like our first juror candace was voted out on day 49 and so from day for like over 40 days she was in they go to a sequester house and so there's like and it's just like a mansion um it's just like a mansion a nice house yeah it's like a mansion in la and so it's like i always say like if you're not gonna win big

brother i think like the ideal position to get is first juror because then you just get like an amazing summer in a mansion off like like so basically yeah like the nine jurors I'll go to the jury house one per week or if there's a double two in a week um and there's a competition where a juror gets to come back and I remember like Candice our first juror literally when she came back to like compete to like get back into the house she was like the jury house is amazing she was like I just like lay in the pool and watch movies all day I love love it. And I'm not on camera. I'm not getting filmed. I always say if I ever got asked to play Big Brother again, I mean, clearly I'd want to win,

but I would also really want to make jury because that is the one part of the experience that I never got. Can we talk about what the mind, what it does to like the mind and the body to be in the big brother house for 90 days I mean okay so like it wasn't that hard for me like I don't know what that says about me um but also this there's like I'm gonna sound like such a dick but it's like I got my way every week like I never didn't get what I wanted and so it's like sure like that took a lot of work I had to like work

people over and like constantly be on my toes but I was never really that like but I was like never really in trouble and so I like didn't really you know like like I think it would have been a lot worse if there were multiple weeks where i would have had to like where i knew that i had to like win something or i was out or like even if there was like a week where like i had to go an entire week knowing everyone was going to vote me out but just that never happened like i i just like i had a stressful experience in the fact that like i needed to like i was lying lying I was it was like I was juggling a hundred plates and none of them could fall or I would get discovered which yes is stressful

but none of them did fall and so like as a result I had like I got my way and it's just like I never really had to go to like a dark or like depressing place while I was there if that makes sense yeah I assume that some people have a really hard go of it and get lied to and betrayed and have that whole experience yeah if I had known that I um if I had known that I was like gonna go home I would have been devastated because it's like pretty much when like someone wins head of household on Thursday and like if your enemy wins you know you're fucked basically. And so it's like, if that had happened and I would have known that my dream was like coming to

an end for a week, I would have been, I feel like I would have had a really rough week, but that just didn't happen. And so like, it also just taught me that like, like the house broke some people and it just didn't break me. I feel like I really always had my eyes on the prize and I didn't have as

stressful of a situation as a lot of people. I feel like if that makes sense. So given, we'll say that you got out as unscathed as it is possible to be given that you got out as unscathed as possible compared to most people's experience what was still difficult like were there still things about watching for camera are you just totally forgetting the cameras okay after like a week you totally forget about the cameras that's really not a big deal I mean the biggest deal is like I'm an like I trick everyone into thinking that I'm an extrovert but I'm an introvert like I need my alone time. I need time to like just decompress.

And so not getting that was maybe the hardest thing for me, but I even still kind of get, got that. Like I would go, there's a room about like when you win head of household, get your own bedroom. And the perk of being friends with everybody is whoever won head of household,

I would be like, Hey, can I go up to the head of household room and just lock myself in there for like an hour and like take a shower and listen to music and like I would do that and everybody would like let me do that and so I just kind of like got my alone time okay um and then but then the other thing is like if you don't like someone you have no escape from them like it's just like in real life if you don't like someone, you don't have to be around them. But in the big brother house, if you don't like someone,

you, like I said, you get, you have no way of escaping them. And so it just like festers and grows. And like, like it, it does not shock me when people fight.

Like, you know what I'm saying? Because I'm just like, no escape of getting away from this person. That's annoying you. But the good thing is on my season, I feel like we got rid of a lot of the annoying people right away like it was just like okay this person is fucking annoying and everybody sees it and everybody agrees like they're in like it's like honestly unless you like really come out

as like like someone who wants to make huge moves right away and you play too hard too fast you can go that way but usually what happens is the people that you vote out first are the people that are annoying it's just like i don't want to live with this person who like is annoying me you know what i'm saying like you kind of just band together with the other people you like and you're just like okay this inconsiderate like alpha male who is like eating all of our food and screaming at the women like can we just get rid of him and it's just like yes absolutely you know so on the like experience of being quote-unquote locked in not being able to get to the outside world. Like you were a person who could just ride the ride. And so does that, would that describe it?

Well, like you were just in it, it's going well, you're forgetting that you're, I mean, you're aware that you're on camera, but kind of forgetting it. You're not stressed about it. I don't want to say it was not stressful because it was actually incredibly stressful but like it was never that like upsetting if that makes sense like i guess people it is an upsetting experience it looks like it's upsetting from what i've seen yes and for me honestly for the first like half of the summer i was just like in summer camp like i I was like, okay, I am in no danger. Everybody likes me. Like no, my motto was like whoever wins head of household,

make sure that nobody will put you up. And I really did think that that's exactly what was going on. But then halfway through the summer, I was like, okay, now I feel like we're entering the end game here. Like I am like lying to all of these people and nobody suspects me now. I really do need to be like much more aware of what I am saying and to who. And so that was stressful just in and of itself because I needed to always be on my toes. And I was like always thinking about what I was doing and saying and making sure I didn't slip up or anything. It just blows my mind. Like, honestly, like I can't even fathom, like when you're saying like, Oh, I was like halfway through the summer,

like, like given the intensity maybe of the survivor experience of not eating and being outside and all of that, i wonder if it's different but i i can't believe that it's that different i mean other than not being malnourished which i assume does some stuff to our brains and like sleeping outside and being in the dirt i imagine it like does some stuff but the how do i how I say, like when you're saying like, Oh, halfway through summer, like my body goes into like almost a tense and I had a great time. Yeah. My body goes into this tense thing of like, you were in it for an entire summer. Get groceries delivered across the GTA

from real Canadian superstore with PC express Shop online for super prices and super savings. Try it today and get up to $75 in PC Optimum Points. Visit superstore.ca to get started. Are you feeling disconnected from the Andy that you were before you go on the show? Are you feeling like this is big brother Andy? This is my TV person. This is like, what's happening with your self-centeredness through that?

I like have always, I was like just talking to a friend about this. Like I have just always been like unabashedly me. Like when I was in high school, I was like overweight, closeted, the number two ranked bassoonist in the state of Illinois. Like basically I was on my knees

begging people to bully me. And I like never was just because I feel like I've always like kind of liked myself and been comfortable with who I am. And so in that regard, I really do feel like I didn't lose myself while I was in there. Like I was my like jovial, friendly,

like I think an underrated thing about my win and how I did well is I joked around with people and I like made fun of people but like in a warm way and I used humor to get people to like me um but in that regard yes that person was still there but I also am like a type a person who is like who can like command a room and things like that and when I was on the show I was like oh I'm living with 15 other type A's. I need to become a type B. And so my friends who were watching me were expecting like me to be more entertaining,

I guess. And so basically I was like, I could either be entertaining or I could win. And I was like, I want that money. Like, I want to win. I was an adjunct professor. I had no money. I want the money. And so I just like shut up and I

listened and I like let everybody else do the talking. And I like, everybody told me everything. And then I would use that information against them. Like, you know what I'm saying? Where did you learn to do that in your life? Did you have other examples of doing this in your life before you went on the show where it's like I'm gonna take the type b quiet listener I mean not really but like but also like I said that like I'm I do I'm like an introvert in my core and so like I can only be on for so much time and so also there were I was just like I've been like on I want to just like sit back and like you know what I'm saying like it's like I definitely feel like I was still me but I was like a much lessened version of me can you talk about how different you think it would have been if there weren't live feeds or how different survivor beat would

be if there were live feeds I mean honestly probably not too much different to be honest with you it's like like yet again I wouldn, I feel like I would not have been very conflict prone. Um, I don't, I really don't think it would have been too different. I would have like, like there were moments where I like reigned in my humor sometimes. Cause my humor, I feel like can be misconstrued. Like my humor is dark and sarcastic and I was just like, okay, I need to like, I feel like I could offend people watching the live feeds,

even if I like, don't think I was going to offend people that I lived with. So sometimes I read that in. But like, I mean, yeah. I'm just curious. It's just like, cause there, I've always felt like there were times where I was out there, like where I talked about my divorce

and my sex life and all this stuff, but we always had this kind of false sense that none of it would be right which isn't true because they could they pull sometimes they pull the most random stuff but we could forget that the cameras were going because there isn't this live stream and i wonder if you guys couldn't just knowing that there was this potential i mean it was live stream you really kind of forget and it's like i talked about a bunch of stuff that i like probably shouldn't have like about like my personal life and things like that um you really do when you're in that environment forget that you're being filmed 24 7 i don't doubt that i know i did for

sure and the cameras are in our face just as much as they are now and it's like people don't doubt that. I know I did for sure. And the cameras are in our face just as much as they are now. People don't realize you don't see there's you never see any other people besides the people living in the house. And so there is not like a cameraman in your face with a camera. I'm just endlessly fascinated by this live feed thing. And when I got back from Survivor, it was actually the first time that I watched Big Brother because it was filming or there were live feeds when I got back. And I was in my post-Survivor illness. I was watching the live feeds ferociously. What season was it? Do you remember?

Yeah, it was the season with caitlin and it's funny okay that's a good one yeah so it was really it was really fun but i just remember like and you could select which live feed kind of i think you could select it yeah you could select which live feed and just like incessantly like i was obsessed with watching it because it gave me the, it gave me the feeling of on survivor. You're like trying to, people are over there on the beach. You want to know what they're saying. People are over there on the Island. What are they saying? People are on the other tribe. What are they saying? So being able to click through those live feeds was like a very, I think maybe unhealthy, like addiction. Did you have that when you got back or no?

maybe unhealthy, like addiction. Did you have that when you got back or no? I always wanted to know where everyone was and who was talking to who. And I was notorious among feed watchers for like popping into every room. And one thing that I did that was very strategic is I left a personal item of mine in every room so that I could come in and not seem like a busybody.

Like I would be like, oh my God, I'm like, I'm so sorry. Don't mind me. I'm just getting my, I can't keep track of your shit. Right. But it's like, weirdly like, yeah, like people should have been like, why is your stuff in a bedroom? It's not yours, but nobody ever questioned it. And so I would be like, don't mind me. I'm just coming in to get my hairbrush or like my shower stuff.

And I would like clock what was going on in every room. Sorry. What was your question you asked me no no it's no it's so that first of all that's so fascinating oh my gosh I love it I just was wondering if you when you got back could you watch the live feeds of the other seasons or what how were you handling that I think you either like have the live feeds gene or you don't and I I just, I just, I think they're so boring. Um, and here's the thing, like this like came back to bite me in the ass when I was on the show, because I was a, I was a very huge fan of the show, but I feel like a super fan is someone who watches the live feeds and I never did. Like I watched every episode of the televised

show. I kept up with things on Twitter and like things like that, but I did not do the live feeds. And so I just was like, not aware of how you were supposed to like, like, so for example, if I had watched the live feeds, I would have known that in this one instance,

there was, it was final five head of household and it was like a knockout competition. And I got knocked out first. And so they were like, Oh, will you go into the house and entertain the live theaters while the competition is still happening? And I'm so dumb because like viewers, my game was like very complex and nuanced and a lot of viewers didn't know

what I was doing. And in this moment, if I understood the live feeds, I could have come back in and been like, everybody, this has been my plan. Everything is going according to it. This is what's going to happen next. But I did not know to do that. When I came into the house, I just like did the dishes and like folded silverware and like just like cleaned and just did not say a word.

Missed opportunity. They're all like, oh my God god we could hear everything from you i don't know why i didn't even think of it but i was like well i guess the live theaters can watch me clean the couch like you know what i'm saying like that's what i was doing when i came in and i like didn't even like i never knew to speak to the live theaters which like a lot of people do um yeah i feel stupid like looking back it's like that is actually like like of course why didn't i do that but honestly i just didn't did not even think to did it cross your mind since you don't have the live feed did not cross my mind i don't think i have the live feed gene i think i was dealing with some

yeah okay but to get back to your question so when i got back i know i have never been that into the live feeds but i like fake i like i like fake that i am like i will follow accounts on twitter that are just like big fight at like 302 p.m on camera three and i will go watch that and then i'll like tweet about the fight like i actually watch the live feeds but i do not uh you watch the highlights of then I'll tweet about the fight. I actually watch the live feeds, but I do not. You watch the highlights of the live feeds. I watch the highlights. There is no world in which I ever find myself just sitting in my apartment with the live feeds on.

Is there a transition time when you get out of the house where you are still wanting to hear every conversation that's going on you're still trying to track like you're you're back home and you're back with your friends or family like absolutely not absolutely not no absolutely not when I like it it's funny I just like I was so over it and like exhausted when I was done they were just like oh my gosh like usually when people win like they stick around LA like they're like parties and stuff. We can like, they were like, we can fly you home tomorrow or we can fly you home in a week. And I was like, fly me home tomorrow. Please get me home as soon as possible. And I just like wanted to see my

friends and get back to my everyday life and like, just get back to like a sense of normalcy if that makes sense so what if anything when you go back to your sense of normalcy feels weird to you anything I mean the only like it's like meeting new people if that makes sense like I like every once in a while I would like be going on dates with a guy and then on like date three he would be like I'm a huge big brother fan and i would be like oh like i was just like damn like i want to know before they knew or after you had aired that's right yeah after like yeah live and so it's like oh yeah sorry yeah they would be like i'm a huge big brother fan and i was like like i was like i want to know that you you like me for me and not because you watch me on TV. But that wasn't even that big of a deal.

But other than that, not really, to be honest. And you're still in Chicago. So you didn't have huge... Well, you're not still teaching, right? So tell me about some of the changes that have happened in your life post Big Brother. And are any of them prescribed post Big Brother? And are any of them ascribed, prescribed to Big Brother? What I'm doing work-wise now, I would give a little bit of credit to Big Brother.

I like, I run my own dog walking business and I feel like I had the resources to just like let it grow slowly, if that makes sense. Like I had some money under me where like I wasn't super strapped for money. And so like over the course of like a couple couple years, I amassed this base of clients that have now... It just kept growing and growing and growing. And it was nice to be able to smoothly and slowly transition into that, as opposed to being like, I am strapped for money. I need to figure something

out now, if that makes sense. Did you ever go back to teaching or you started? I did. I went back to teaching. And then on my days off, I would usually teach like Monday, Wednesday, Friday. And then on my days off, I started walking my friend's dogs. And I was just like, because I was bored. And I was like, oh, I like this more. And I think if I actually like focus on this,

I could make like double what I'm making teaching. And it turns out that I was right. But basically, I now work a job where like, I am like getting fresh air all day. I'm listening to podcasts all day. I'm with dogs all day. It is like amazing for my mental and my physical health. And I really like what I do. And I don't think I would have been able to figure this out as smoothly and

as easily if I didn't have a little bit of a cushion. Yeah, sure. Do you still work for your own business? Do you have business partners? It's you and your dog. Here's the other thing. I am so lazy. It's just me. Like, everybody is like, Oh, my gosh, you should like hire employees, you should expand. And I'm like, but that would require me to have like one ounce of career ambition which I just don't and so it's like I am comfortable I am happy that's like all that really matters to me um I it's funny I was like at a party the other day I was saying how I have no career ambition like I have I never have had the like drive in me to like climb the corporate ladder like I just want to be happy and that is what has like mattered the most to me always um and then like corporate ladder like I just want to be happy and that is what

just like mattered the most to me always um and then like 10 minutes later I was talking to the same group of people and I was talking about how I am not handy and can't fix anything and I was like wow no career ambition not handy I was like I sound like such a catch you are such a catch and I imagine that that has to do with the fact that you prioritize what you want to be doing on a day-to-day basis and have turned that into your career you are a career person you own your own freaking business like you so i think our world today has this idea of what success is. And yeah, maybe some people would be like a dog walker. Isn't that my Z or whatever?

Well, I get that. I truly will. I will get, oh, so you're just, you're, you're a dog. Yes, yes, absolutely. I get that. Or like you have your masters and you're a dog walker. And I'm like, yep, I am. And I'm happy happy and that's all

that matters to me love you and you must really love it because you do it in Chicago winters which I think is the hell on earth this is you're gonna think I'm crazy I was recently asked if I could choose a like 10 degree day or a 90 degree day 10 degrees all day every day i would choose over 90 oh my god i don't know how you do that what's your ideal what's the ideal if every day could be temperature 65 no hesitation san francisco weather a little overcast in 65 is my like ideal where did you where did you grow up yeah i grew up in Chicago yeah I grew up in Aurora which is like 45 minutes outside of Chicago okay so you're and you you love being there there's no you just said San Francisco there's no no plans to go somewhere I was just trying to think of weather

like a city's weather that I like the most it's that yeah I think I think I am here to stay at least for a while I really love it here. I love the idea. I feel like I follow your Instagram in the way of like, well, first of all, who doesn't love dogs? I mean, some people, but still loving dogs. And you just had posted about how good you feel because you are moving your body and you have a job where you're out in fresh air

and doing all this stuff. Another thing that I've noticed on your social media as i've stalked you um that has brought a lot of joy and freedom to your life is sobriety do you would you like to talk about that or not so much no apps i am i am so happy to talk about it so tell me about your decision to be sober and what that has meant for you. Okay. So my thing was like, and I'm very thankful for this. I never was the type of drinker who was like, oh, I've had a stressful day. I need a drink. Or like, I need to like loosen myself up at a party. I need a drink. That was never me. Like never once did I like come home from work and have like a glass of wine or a beer. My issue was I was a social drinker and I was a problem drinker once I started drinking. So like once you pop, you can't stop. Absolutely, girl. And so it's like

it's reaching for that first drink is never an issue, but on like a Saturday where I would start drinking, I would then have 15 more drinks and stay out until five in the morning. And it's just like, I'm getting too old. I was just like, I'm getting too old for this. And I'm just like waking up. Like I would be like, I blacked out last night and I'm like embarrassed. And I was just like, I don't like the way that this is making me feel and it's like it's like there's a movie called smash with with Mary Elizabeth Winstead where

she has this big monologue where she's like what used to be fun is now kind of embarrassing and scary and that was like how I felt I was just like it is not fun anymore I am waking up not feeling great about my choices and like what I'm doing. And so I was like, I want to just make, I'm like a go hard person. I was like, I want to just make a big change and see how I feel. And it has been amazing. Like, like, and so I do. Did you just like cold turkey? You're like, I'm just, did you, did you say I'm going to do it for two weeks or 30 days

or what? Oh, I cold turkey. I was like, I'm done forever. And it's all substances. So people are like, oh, are you like California sober? And I'm like, no, I'm sober to do it for two weeks or 30 days or what? Oh, I cold turkey. I was like, I'm done forever. And it's all substances. So people are like, oh, are you like California sober? And I'm like, no, I'm sober, sober. And like, I have to give both myself and my friends credit. I think one of my superpowers is being able to choose good friends.

Like, like growing up, like, like I said, like kind of overweight. And like, like I i was able like my friends who were my friends were people who liked me for me and i am able as an adult to suss sorry i am able to as i'm able to suss that out and i feel like i really truly think i have the most amazing supportive group of friends and so they have been a godsend like they have made things very easy I never feel like I'm like alone or feel like I don't have things to do I always have people wanting to do things with me and like the thing is I already my natural demeanor is like someone that's five drinks in like I don't need it to like have a good time a social lubricant yeah yeah and so I will go what I will

do now is and I also just feel like it's a thing where my friends are aging out of like the crazy binge drinking our bodies can't do it anymore oh but it's like I will go to a party and I will I will from 7 until 11 I will stay there and I will have a great time and then when I see people's eyes getting glassy and people being like, let's go to the bars, I go home and I don't think I've missed anything. Like I will ask people what I missed and people will be like nothing. Like if anything,

people fought at the bar or like people, this happened and I'm like, I'm glad I didn't miss it. And so I get to bed earlier. I have become like an early to bed, early to riser. But no, and it's like,

I don't think sobriety is for everybody but i do think that it was the right choice for me like i think that like me a few drinks in was absolutely my like silliest and funniest and me like like at like my comedy apex but the problem was i did not know to stop there and so i would go from being so funny and so great to being like a blacked out zombie. And I was just like, that sucks. And that's annoying. And I don't like that. And I don't like I am a like smart, interesting, cool person.

I don't like people who are out at a bar seeing me like barely able to stand up. That sucks. Yeah, I my body is just sort of given up on me more than anything that I just get so sick that I can't even have if I have a glass of wine sometimes I'll throw it up so my body's just says no and you'd think I would stop trying but I still try on occasion but I've definitely been like looking into sober curious and just what is it like to stay away from those sorts of experiences and my mom always said nothing good ever happens after midnight and i totally agree i always say that too i absolutely agree i mean i'm annoyed that my mom was right but i think she

might have been right and like i said it's just like it has shown me like what great people i have in my life and i still have i still have a lot of fun like it's like i don't miss it i truly don't what do you do what do you what do you do instead if you're gonna go to what do you drink instead i mean diet coke i don't know yeah dc's baby be like oh my gosh do you love like a mocktail and i actually like I'm weird about that I'm like no I'm like I don't want to spend $19 for a glass of juice I'm sorry like I think that's ridiculous like um I hear you like my my big saving graces are that I have good friends and how much I love movies like it's like that gives me some like usually at least on like one weekend night I will go to a movie with a friend at like seven. And that like gives me something to do, something to do that I like.

And I also just like, I'm content just like staying in and like watching a movie in my apartment or you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't really get FOMO that bad. Yeah, yeah, it's good. It's a and as you said, all of your friends are getting older. And I wonder if some of your friends to enjoy having a person in a space to go to where they also don't have, quote unquote, have to drink.

So just like a different way of being. Is there any like resources or anything that you like podcasts or books or something that you listen to about sobriety? Or are you just like... I feel like yet again, this is annoying because I know like some people really struggle with it and I hate just sitting here being like, it was so easy.

And I didn't do anything other than... You don't have to be sorry about your life experience. I just one day decided that I was done. And then I did not read anything. I did not go anywhere. I did not. I just was like, I'm done. And I'm never going to do it again. I think that's refreshing to hear. I think sometimes when we want to change something in our lives, we feel like in our society, like packages up and sells all of this self-care stuff. Like sometimes it doesn't feel like we can just make these decisions. Sometimes it feels like we have to listen to the right pod or get the right

book or take the right exercise class or do some checklist to get to where we want to be. I think it's refreshing to hear that for some things, it's still just an option. Anything else about like sobriety life or life changes that you want to share? Not really. I feel like it's like, like the one thing it's like meeting people to like date. I feel like that's one thing that I had to like, it's like, I would meet people at bars and it's just like, that doesn't happen as much. I guess I like am on apps more, but I also just like, that's another thing. I'm very comfortable not dating. And so it's like, I am not closed off to the idea of dating,

but I am usually not like on the prowl. I'm not someone who's like, I must have a partner. I'm very content being single. And so how much does that that how much does along with dating and just like being out are you recognized still for big brother stuff does it still happen a lot or does it i i don't look like anybody and so it's like if you see me i feel like you know and so i would say when on the off season like if a season is not currently airing i am probably recognized twice a week during the season like during the summer i would say it's like almost daily so that is a lot that's a lot what how has that played into your that's that's 10 years ago now we're talking. You're still on a daily or a couple of times a week.

I would say at least maybe daily is a little much every like a couple of times a week for sure. Couple of times a week. I can go months without somebody now, now like a family friend or something. I can't, I probably, I can't go months. I can't go a week without somebody bringing up that I was on survivor,

but I cannot go. I could go months without a stranger stopping me on the street and of this i'm thankful for yeah what is what is your tolerance for that what do you love it do you i don't i'm i'm kind of indifferent i don't love it i don't hate it um i'm never like seeking it out like if like going back to dating i'm never gonna bring it up like usually it will somehow come up after a while but i'm never gonna like mention it first um i've only been like i'm always gonna be i'm just friendly in general and nice like i'm always gonna be nice the only time i ever haven't been i was wasted and it was like pretty soon after the

show and i just like it was like to the point where i couldn't go out and have fun without like being stopped a ton like it made me realize that i truly think being famous as a prison um i was z-list famous and i was like getting fed up when i was out but i was like in the bathroom at a bar peeing and a guy like came up to me and like grabbed my shoulder and was like andy from big brother and i just like whipped around and was like fuck off like i was like i was in the bathroom i'm like that i still feel bad about that because that is like not me but just like he my my fuse is low and this person just handled it incorrectly and got me right as the fuse went out um i mean with that many times we're talking 10 years now.

This is hundreds of times. To have one go, quote unquote, not as well as you'd like, and you were in the middle of taking a pee, I would say that you get an A plus in handling it all. Most people know the appropriate way to do it. They will come up to me. They will talk to me for 30 seconds or less and they will ask for a picture great there would be times at bars where people would

talk to me for like 20 minutes and I would just be like I'm here with my friends like I'm never gonna be like leave me alone but I would be like I want to go I'm here with my friends my time is valuable like get away from me like like I I do not owe you anything but i'm still going to be nice to you but it's like how do you not realize that it is unacceptable or unacceptable to be speaking to me for this long that is a crazy amount not that i not that i i don't want to take anything away from your fame andy i just that is that is a lot that's it's more than i think than most survivor experience people i think so i wonder what i guess it's just more hours on the television and also you're just so memorable and in a lovely way you're hard to forget i just like look like i just there's nobody that looks like me so i feel

like i do stick out i have like very ident features. And the other thing you have to take into account is I spend eight hours of every day walking around outside. And so it's like, there is a much higher likelihood that someone is going to see me doing that as opposed to if I worked like an office job or worked from home where I'm never outside, you know? That's true. That's true. I'm in the middle of Indiana working from home. I don't have many people coming off the street recognizing me from Survivor. Okay. Well, is there anything else? You have the attention of a Survivor audience here. Is there anything else that you would want the Survivor people to know about you as a person that maybe isn't out in the world or about the big brother experience or just anything you have the you have the floor

i mean i'm just such an open book i feel like if you follow me on any sort of social media you know pretty much everything about me um i don't know i i can't really think of anything off the top of my head really um it's okay you don't have to think of anything off the top of my head, really. It's okay. You don't have to think of anything. I just want the guests on this show to feel like they actually can be themselves and not have to be the version that they were on Big Brother or Survivor or whatever. So I just want to make sure that... You are pretty much always going to get an authentic... I'm just going to be authentic with you.

And so you are getting me. Here we go. Rapid round questions with Andy Heron. How many times did you apply for Big Brother? One. One and done. And I always tell people, Big Brother is a puzzle. And your piece just has to fit in a certain year.

I really do think my year, they were like, OK, we cast a lot of like bitchy, like not very strategic gay guys. I think we kind of should put in like a somewhat smart gay guy. And I think I just got lucky that that's what they were looking for my season. Like if I applied one season later,

I never would have gotten on because Frankie Grande was on the season after me. And so it's like, it just so happened that I chose the right season to audition for. I mean, there were a lot of suppositions there taking away credit for like the unique individual, like engrossing,

like wonderful, warm person that you are. I agree. I don't really like, yes, I agree with you. But like I said, I really do think that like,

I really just fit the puzzle piece that they wanted for my season. I think that's how it is for all reality TV shows. Like you just don't lie, be yourself and then wait for the timing to be right. I always tell people just be yourself, but maybe like a little heightened version of yourself. But don't sell yourself as someone that you're not because they can tell so fast yes real quick um so on the survivor bios they use you have to when you first apply you write down three words that describe yourself yeah and then they post those as your bio like when they release the cast which is sort of a unique thing for us survivors because it's like, wait, when did I write that down? I wrote this down when I didn't even know I was getting a callback.

And now it's like my official bio. So I let people on this show rewrite their three words that they use if they want to. But do you just have three words that you connect with describing yourself? I mean honestly like funny friendly like kind I feel like yeah like I feel like in life I am consistently underestimated and I like that because

like I don't think I come off as like some idiot but I also just think people will be like oh you are like sharper than I initially thought or like like I said like on I come off as like some idiot, but I also just think people will be like, Oh, you are like sharper than I initially thought. Or like, like I said, like on big brother, people were like, Oh, you were definitely someone that I should have been worried about.

And I wasn't, I think that me being like warm and friendly is like something that people can like, people will assume that I'm like weaker than I am because of that. But it's like, I'm quite strong-willed as well. I love that. And it seems like that's how you've been your whole life. Like when you describe

little Andy playing the bassoon, bassoon, I feel like you were probably just still running with a smile and doing all that stuff back then. Absolutely. What was, so from the day you like walked into apply until this moment right now, what was the hardest part of the big brother experience and the best part? this moment right now, what was the hardest part of the big brother experience and the best part? I mean,

like the best part was winning. Yeah. That's what all the winners say. That's right. That's check baby. Honestly, like the hardest part of the experience, like,

man, like that's, this sounds so annoying, but I'm like, I don't really feel like there was a specific thing that was that hard. Okay. This is probably nothing, but if you could go back and give yourself one piece of advice on day one of starting Big Brother, what would it be? I mean, like, just honestly, it's listen.

Like, it's like, listen to people and like, don't like so many people that are on big brother are going to really want to talk about themselves which is fine but it's like let them talk about themselves to you and like let like just listen to them and take in what they're saying and number one it helps you to get to know them as a person and number two they might tell you things that you can use again and leave your goodie bags in all of the rooms so you can every single conversation. But just honestly, be nice. Like it's like I brutally like lied to and backstabbed three quarters of the jury. And they were all still happy to award me a win because they were like it was strategic what he did. I was never personal. I was never nasty. like it's like i was nice to everybody be nice it's great advice some people

can't sort that when they go on reality tv um other than big brother what's your favorite reality tv show survivor survivor are you just saying that because you're here i've seen like people are like oh like how much like i'll be on one of these podcasts on like rhap or something. Pierce like and they'll be like it'll come up like how much Survivor do you really know and I'm like honey I have watched every episode of every season of Survivor don't come from my Survivor knowledge. Would you if they called you up for Survivor 50 would you go play? Sure actually I mean I don't think I would be as good at Survivor I've never camped a day in my life um and so I think Survivor I always thought Big Brother was my game and Survivor was not.

And so I think I would be much better at Big Brother than Survivor. Okay. So you, but you would. I'd do it. You would do it. You would think it would. You'd take the risk.

I'm not going to say no. Okay, cool. I wondered, some people are like, I'm not doing that. Those people are crazy. Is there a favorite place in the world that you'd like to share that listeners could visit? The Great Barrier Reef in Australia.

The most stunning scuba diving I've ever done in my life. The coolest thing I've ever done. And it is dying, sadly. And so like go as soon as you can. It was absolutely gorgeous. That is like the greatest place I've ever been. That's so cool. I have never

even been to Australia I need to need to make my way over there uh is there a book or an article that you would recommend to listeners as your favorite oh my god I'm so like I'm gonna bunch something I'm a movie and tv person over well actually give a movie because I don't have a movie question so what's your movie my favorite movie of all time is romey and michelle's high school reunion uh-huh um and my favorite movie series of all time is scream i do not think there is a bad one among all six of them um and so if people want like an actual like thing to do watch all six scream movies do you so you say you listen to podcasts all the time. You're in your ears all the time.

What is your favorite podcast? Okay. Oh, God. This is one of those things where I listen to so many, I'm going to just blank out. Truly, I'm not just being a suck-up. I love all of the RHAP content. I listen to a lot of movies and TV podcasts like The Big Picture,

Keep It, Las Culturistas, The Deep Dive with June Diane Rayfield and Jessica Stica st claire this had oscar buzz the daily um the new flesh horror movie podcast um oh my god ruined uh which is a podcast it's two female comedians where one who loves horror movies describes the plot of a horror movie to one who hates them and i love that podcast the michelle collins show sup Show, SUP, which is Sexy Unique Podcast, which is a Vanderpump Rules podcast. I'm serious. I have like five every day that I listen to.

I mean, if you're like out listening all the time, you have to have quite the list. So this is great. I love hearing all of them. I've not even heard of any of them. Well, now you have, honey, so get to listening. Okay, so are you always listening to podcasts or do you listen to music too while you're out there walking it's like if i'm obsessed

with a song i will like listen to it or an album but it's mostly podcasts what song what most recent song were you obsessed with uh apple by charlie xcx is my current obsession. I love the whole Brad album. Well, Andy, the last question is, if people want to follow you, find you, what you're up to, where can they find you? How can they interact with you? It's just at my name, Andy here on everything.

Well, Andy, thank you so much for being with me here today, crossing the line over to the scary survivor pond. Sometimes, you know, I love survivors. I'm happy to do it it was great to spend some time and hear more about your experience and uh i just love

i now i'm now i feel like i need to talk with somebody else from big brother as well to like you should see i'm like i'm wondering if it's just that much less psychologically i think i'm a i'm a weird case i think i think a lot of people like sari literally said that big brother was the much tougher show to do because of the psychological like toll that it took on her oh you know i didn't even i didn't even listen to that i should have i should have asked her which show was harder and she said big brother okay so we we all all of us listeners need to take that into consider i might put that at the top of the call so people because what the whole time i'm like is this is this it's easy

or but like i went to um a reality event like pretty much right after caitlin's season was on and the people other people from rachel and caitlin and winston is that a thing yeah like quite a few of them were at that show or at that event shortly after their show had aired and they all looked very yeah in it yeah we say on this show so it's amazing that you made it through ones. I think winning helps. Winning helps for sure it does. I've found that a little bit with the people I interview who've won. It's just a smidge easier to process. It makes the experience more easy to process for sure if you have a bunch of money at the end.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That might have changed it for me too. I might not have to be here going through therapy every week while i interview people to ask them what their traumas are it's refreshing to hear that it some people get get through unscathed so well thank you so much andy thank you for having me it was such a pleasure thank you so much to and Andy for coming over here, crossing that bridge over to the sometimes unfriendly to him survivor universe. He dares to have opinions about the show. And, you know, some of y'all don't take kindly to that. We should do better.

I loved hanging with Andy and I was so thankful that he was willing to come and spend time with all of us. Go follow him on Twitter and Instagram. It is so fun to watch him and his hairless cat, Andy Jr. Thank you all for being with me today and stay tuned for the last three episodes of Road to Reality of Season 2, where we have some doozies and somebody who you know quite well. Well, you think you do anyway. Can't wait for those to drop. Have a good week and see you next time. I'd like to thank Rob Sestranino and the entire RHAP team for their support in making this podcast. Jessica Sterling is the editor. Tricky Rice created the artwork. To all of my fellow survivors, thank you for showing up for free to give me and all the listeners a look into your lives that we

wouldn't otherwise get to see. And much gratitude to all of you listening. If you'd like to connect, and only if you're kind, you can find me on social media at thekellenb or at kellenbechtel.com, where I, as a holistic career coach, try to give away as many free resources as I can to help people find more happiness and success in their

career journeys. May each of your realities lead down a road of peace, joy, and a whole lot of adventure. And now here's Jacob Derwin with Mira from Manhattan. Her name is Mira from Manhattan Her name is Chelsea from Chelsea Her name is Krista from Columbus It doesn't matter much to me Now she's staring out the window She's turning on the night

She takes a pen to her new novel And the airplane takes flight Mmm I never knew I never knew I never knew

I never knew you You Now we're flying out to Dublin Just to stop along the trail Mira hops from there to Paris I ride to Belfast on the rail Now she's cheering in the winery I'm staring at the sea Her name is Mira from Manhattan

It doesn't matter much to me Mmm, I never knew I never knew I never knew I never knew you you Never knew you. You.