RHAP: We Know Survivor - Rob Reacts to AU v World Week 1

Episode Date: August 20, 2025

Rob Cesternino and Shannon Guss dive into the thrilling first week of Australian Survivor: Australia Vs the World. This international clash of Survivor titans has delivered explosive gameplay, shocking eliminations, and unforgettable moments that have left fans buzzing.

Get to Toronto's main venues like Budweiser Stage and the new Roger Stadium with Go Transit. Thanks to Go Transit's special online e-ticket fairs, a $10 one-day weekend pass offers unlimited travel on any weekend day or holiday anywhere along the Go Network. And the weekday group passes offer the same weekday travel flexibility across the network, starting at $30 for two people and up to $60 for a group of five. Buy your online go pass ahead of the show at go-transit.com slash tickets. Hey, everybody, what's going on? Rob Sester Nino, back with you, and I am chuffed to bits to get the chance to talk about an amazing week one of Australian Survivor versus the world. And I'm so glad to have here with us, our chief international survivor correspondent

who's back with us, it's Shannon Gus. Shannon. How are you? I'm chuffed to bits. It's chuffed to owls, or do you have chuffed? No, I, well, what do you mean? I think it's really British. We've set it on Rannap quite a bit. So that I just, I just will often say it as I'm just tickled to get the chance to talk about what an exciting week this was to get the chance to watch all this stuff. And of course, listen. to all of your coverage, which you can hear, in our global survivor feed, and it's the season that Shannon has been waiting her whole life to talk about. And I've been waiting all week to talk to you. I know. It's like how you should never meet your heroes, right? Like, if you build

something up over like decades, it could never live up to the hype. Like, don't do that. But then it did. Isn't that crazy? Like how high the bar was and it was just like leaping over the bar? I find that that's impressive. Yeah, it was really, really good. And I think that it shouldn't have been as good as it was when we talk about it is, okay, it is, you know, 14 people in 16 days. But, you know, like the survivor has already gotten like so short. I feel like it did not feel any different to me as a viewer that this was like I was not feeling how compressed it all was in terms of the real time. Yeah, and it's a novelty match to, like, in some capacity, but it's also with the best of the best. So there's like a higher degree of difficulty.

I did my ex-interview with George today. And we couldn't get through it. We could have spoken for hours on just his two tribal council. So there's so much layered strategy already that I feel like we're off to the races. And it makes everything feel like bigger. And it makes it, yeah, it makes it feel more proper. If you couldn't figure it out yet, full spoilers of the week of Australian Survivor versus the world. Of course, there's so many different ways that people are watching.

but we do try to make it so easy for the patrons of Rob as a podcast to watch a great international versions of all these reality shows. We've been having watch parties in our Discord as well, and everybody is so excited. And Shannon, your coverage has been amazing so far with recaps of all three episodes. Shannon does a daily recap. And then what we said was at the end of the week, we'll jump in, and I'll get the chance to react to each week of the season,

which we expect to be four weeks long. correct? Yeah, I think as well I wanted to say about that it's even more proof that it will end exactly three weeks after it began on a three, three one schedule because the amazing race is starting on that Monday, the eighth. So I think we can expect the finale as your amazing race, yes. Yes, yeah, our Australian amazing race. Yes, it's going to follow Australian survivor. All right. So Shannon, how are you holding up after this week? How are you holding up? I mean, people, people ask people, I think people worry about me. I think they really worry. I'm great. Like, I'm, it's been such a fun week. Like, it's, I can't believe it's been only three days. It feels, it really feels like it's been a month. How are you feeling, though?

Yeah, I feel great. It's been just a really, really fun ride. I have not gotten the chance to talk about any of this with anyone. So this is, this is really, you know, my, like, appropriately, my venue to get to talk about Australian Survivor. And I'm so lucky that I get to talk about it with you. Yeah, I will, thank you. I'm not just, like, agreeing with that. I mean, imagine if you came on and just, like, hated it. Imagine how strange that would have been if you were just. It wasn't for me. Like, I did, no, I'm glad that you're on board with the entire Survivor fandom. I feel like everyone, everyone's watching and everyone is agreeing.

I didn't hate it. I really, I really enjoyed it. But I think that there's, like, such a frustration that we have with an all-star season of Survivor, or really of anything, where, like, we love the idea in concept of, like, okay we're going to get this we're going to get all these people and then we have to watch people that we wanted to see leave and so it is like i do find it to be a frustrating experience of just see i wanted to watch more of david like i i loved having it like and it was i thought it was so fun david and luke and they're plotting with janine and and like okay

this is great and then it's like oh no no david's gone and george you know i always feel like that George is great television. And so that while it's great to watch George get voted out, it will stink that the next episode isn't going to have George. Yes. But two massive butts on that. Sorry. That firstly, like what exits?

Easy, Shannon. Okay. George came back and he has a dad bod. But we don't have to like talk. Like I don't, that's not what we do here at R.HAP. I watched it with George at George's Premier Party I saw we saw a lot of it I you know anyway

So the the butts we were talking about Is that they went out in spectacular fashion In these like You're gonna talk about George's alliance With with with Luke and and David Is that what you're talking about? Yes I mean look I'm not doing it

It's certainly not me I'm feeding into what the show is giving me And now what you are Like I can't avoid it And I'm trying to And I'm just like I'm sorry Smithers meme.

So you watch the premiere with George. I wish the premiere with George. The premier party that I went to. Hobnobbing with the international glitterati, as always. It felt like it. It felt Kirby was there. If you don't get the Kirby thing, meet Kirby. Yeah.

Like, I would do it. I'm like, I'll give up my game for you. I do want to follow up and ask you more about that. But tell me about this. So you watch the premiere with George. Yes. Yeah, no, I watched the premiere with George. And no, I was just saying about his butt.

That's fine. Not from the butt. I'm just saying that the caveat that you were saying, It's like it's hard to see people go. So you're saying that basically like, hey, yeah, for you, yeah, George is off your TV, but he's in my life and I don't, I still see George regularly. That's not what I'm saying at all. I was just saying that I watched his butt with him on Sunday night.

Okay. Now I'm going back to what was originally said. They went out in spectacular fashion. The episodes were amazing. It was incredible TV. Yeah. Especially that second episode. Also, now I can't even remember.

No, also, we're left. Okay, you can't be mad when we're left with the wealth we are left with because it's not an inconsistent car. Okay, like, I know that not many are like David and George. And Rob Bentelay is one of the best one in the full time. But we still have all three Americans left. We still have, like, Leif has been incredible TV. Every Australian is delivering.

I know Cass and Tommy can bring it. Like, we're okay. Sure. Cass and Tommy, I'm sure they can bring it, but I didn't come here to see Cass and Tommy. Like, you know, sure, sure. Well, he's so sweet. And he came in on a motorcycle. That was cool.

That was so cool. Sure. Okay. I don't want to get, like, listen. Listen, we're seven minutes. I don't want to start talking about Tommy. Okay. No, Tommy, I will.

Tommy, thank you for listening. Tommy DM me, he listened to our Finland recap. And he said it was very accurate and I was like how because I'm sure. I'm sure. Shannon watched all. 60 some odd episodes of Survivor Finland to get ready to talk about this. But let's talk about the week that was because I have feelings about everything. How many of them are about butts?

No, I don't have a lot of. But I didn't do this. I didn't do this. You did this. Neither of us came in here to talk about butts and it's been about butts and I'm just saying I didn't do it. It was you. It's not what I do. But you did it. I did. I think people can rewind it back who made this about butts. I don't think it was me. Yeah. Anyway, did you have thoughts? Non-butt related thoughts? Yeah. So just in terms of the week that was, you know, we really started off that first episode. We spent a lot of time with the world tribe and it really was uh you know such an interesting episode in terms of the downfall of rob bent delay yes you got it and yeah and just really a classic like survivor

downfall for him and parvety doing parvety things like i really felt like in the first episode though and i think this was uh correctly awarded in the chizzy point discussion i really felt like that surrey was the hinge in that whole episode in terms of uh what she was doing there. And I don't know if she got enough credit. I mean, we gave a six-chizzy points. So definitely here on our 50. Yeah, from you, from you guys.

And really, it was so much of like Parvety's story, but I feel like that without Surrey, it wouldn't have worked for Parvety. People will hate me for saying this, but you are describing Survivor Micronesia. Like, literally the sentence you just said could be applied to Survivor Micronesia. It's not an anti-parvety take because Parvety was great.

And she was doing all of the. parvety things that we expect. But in the conversation that Parvety had with Rob, and that was like great television to watch, I really so admired how Surrey handled her business there when Rob comes to Surrey and tells her, hey, okay, so the vote tonight is going to be parvety. And Saragia says like, oh, okay, yeah, that's good, that's good, that's good, that's good. And just the way that she is going to, okay, I'm going to receive that information. And then she tells us, I'm not doing that. Like, that doesn't work for me.

It's not what I want. And then goes about the process of how do I change what's going to happen and working with Parvety and working with Lisa, who I think has been so much fun. But I just really felt like that that whole first vote, really hinged on Surrey. And what I also liked about Surrey so much in that first episode was there's that moment when so much Dondy stuff. I had meant to, I was going to text Joe Mangonello and I was like, hey, you watching this?

That's how you pronounce that? Joe Mangonello. Yes. Okay. I was so off. I was in anywhere near that. When Surrey got up at tribal council and then went over to everybody and was like, hey, we're still good, right?

We're still good. I didn't get the sense that that was Surrey being the enforcer. Like, I got the sense that, you know, if they said to Surrey, like, I don't think so. Like, that, that is the deal breaker. I think Surrey might have wrote down Parfrey's name.

Wait, you're on texting basis with Joe Mangonello? That's not the point of this story, Shannon. No, I just, I flew by it because I was a great guy. And he loves. He loves Survivor. You can text him? You have his number. Listen, listen, we're not...

That's ridiculous. What do you want to tell Joe Mangonello? Something now. I mean, I'm put on the spot. Stay with me. Stay with me. Stay with me. Okay. It's crazy, though.

Yeah. That's amazing. What a hard humble brag. That was subtle flet. But... Yeah, Sarie? Yeah. Do you think that Surrey, if they said to Surrey, like,

that was, that's kind of a big deal. that's the stuff about the fake Dondy spoilers. The Dondy bombs. Yes. That do you feel like would Surrey have voted with the like Rob's people against Parvety in that spot? Yes, because it's not Rob's people. Like Lisa's the swing. Sure.

Lisa and the Cass Tommy trio. And I know you don't want to talk that much about Cass and Tommy, you know, right? But they were the people group. Yeah. Yeah. Well, they, I think that they. You can say their names. They're not Voldemort.

Wow. It's saying Voldemort out the gate. No, I mean, yes, redacted Quebec woman and redacted Finland man and Lisa were the three that were in power, I think as led by Lisa. I love the way they came to Lisa and kind of like looked to her for what to do. And I love their little bomb between the three of them. And I do think that Surrey would be aware of that. Like they're between Rob and three people.

Like they're making a decision between a six one or a four, three. And so we would know if they're not going that she's not going to be on the three of the three, four, you know? So I think that she had that relationship with Lisa to do that. And she also probably was like, if they want to jump, who can blame them at this point? Because poverty didn't even tell us about Deal on O'Dill Island or she, poverty on texting basis with Joe Maginella. We didn't even know about it. I would suspect. They're on texting basis with Joe Maginello.

How did that happen? So, yeah. Because to me, it was evocative of the survivor Micronesia final. six when we see that Amanda and Parvety are at the bottom and then of course Amanda goes to exile island and then she has the idol and the edit hides that from us and Surrey doesn't seem to know that that's the case and sir I believe Surrey does vote with uh what is it Eric and Natalie and is it uh is Alexis still there is that uh he goes out okay Yeah, so it goes out. Yes. And Surrey votes with them, right? Because it's like, well, you don't know if the numbers. I'm not going to go to a tie.

I mean, has it always been debated if Surrey knew about that? And now I can't recall it. I don't know. Not what we're here to discuss today. When you do your three deep dive at the end of the season, that's nine hours long. You could ask her about that. Don't even tempt me with a good time. Like, I could only dream. Well, I do think that the 50 of that maybe complicates things where I don't know if Surrey can, you know, I know, I know you, you. Like, I'm sure you'll get to have your long-awaited exit interview with Surrey. But I don't know if Surrey will be up for able to do like a very lengthy deep dive to talk about this. Like, had she not played on Survivor 50. And that's also so interesting about this, where we didn't even anticipate that, you know, we were going to get. This is also like a window into.

This is only the first of two Surrey seasons of Survivor that we have coming. it speaks to the like reality TV legacy of these players that they've either just come off a reality show that's like a big plot point or they're about to host a reality show or beyond another one so it's it's in the it's the multiverse as Lisa said as Lisa said yeah and did you like the um the Lisa fan girling over so because Lisa won Survivor New Zealand in an RHAP shirt like this is Lisa's level of fandom for Survivor and it was just it cheap I think spoke for me and a lot of the listeners I love that Lisa so much as a TV character. And I had never gone through and seen all of Survivor in New Zealand. But I just felt like I could personally relate to Lisa so much because I felt like that, to me, it was a lot of how I felt to go play on Survivor All-Stars, where I felt like, okay, sure, and I didn't win Survivor the Amazon, but I had my own, like, little survivor experience. And now here I am with all of these people that I had watched on television. And I

was so excited to have seen. And so, like, I definitely could relate to what Lisa. I thought that she was so good in her own right. And I thought she was so much fun and such a great, you know, TV character to watch. So I really was, you know, very happy for her getting to watch her play. And I think that she's done such a great job. She was great in that episode. I mean, I didn't agree with the decision, but I still thought she put itself in a great position. So we watched that episode at the premiere party next to Lisa. And in that scene where she's talking about how much she loves Surrey, Peter's at the bar across from Lisa crying. He's already seen the episode. I'm like, why are you crying? I think a lot of people had an emotional reaction to how much this game

means to her and to us. Like, I think it was so, it was just a beautiful way to see him. Can you talk that through? Why was Peter so emotional? Should I go ask him? I don't, I think maybe he sees me and Lisa and he just knows and you know like anyone who has a passion for anything and I think anyone who has a passion for survivor like Lisa spoke for us about loving this game and loving Surrey over decades and putting your whole heart into it and like living this dream and just the emotional connection that she felt to it I think I tear up watching it I think a lot of people but I also have a big smile like I think a lot of people felt that way about Lisa and how emotional she was just to be there with Surrey yeah like it was so relatable you know it's such a

a interesting thing where you know it's like uh and this is like maybe i'm like so like off base about this but i want to just like try try something on where it's like you know so many of us and i think the thing that really unites the survivor fans across the world is that we have like a love and a passion for this game and like you know like peter like there there's like ways like if we just like think about the beauty in this format and no matter it's the kind of thing that like no matter like what they do to it like we still love it you know they they they can't kill this thing even though that there's many things about it that we don't agree with like how it's been treated maybe over the years and that we have we carry this thing and it's in our heart

but I think that the difference between us and some of these other people I don't know if that's necessarily like how Surrey or Parvety or Boston Rob or Sandra like they like I don't feel like and maybe that's what's different about them yeah like or or David or like you know like I just kind of feel like that that we have like such a like a reverence and a passion for this beautiful thing that we like cherish and for some of like I think for almost like all of the greats I don't think they have that yeah I mean so Rie more than anyone maybe

gets it like Surrey's a fan Surrey loves Survivor we're a special kind of crazy like I think that's the thing is that Maybe that's why she doesn't want Exactly you care too much You can't wait if you care too much I guess you can but

Yeah, I want to actually talk about that with Kirby because I was saying this to Peter earlier was that a lot of, I think, what Kirby does so well is she's like, she loves the game, she's learned to love the game, but it's like, if it goes badly, like, she'll be fine. They don't care as much. Think about it.

Think about Nick. Think about Brandon Donnell. Think about who we see again and again. Arctoves who love it too much and it's actually really hard of the game. The greats are beyond that, and I think that is good for their game. But like, and this is a weird thing to say

because these people have played the game multiple times. I'm not saying that Survivor is more important to me than to them. I'm just saying that. that it's bizarre for, I think, a lot of us that Survivors so much of our life and our friendships. You love it more. And, like, I mean, I interviewed Parvite a couple months ago. She's like, yeah, I haven't watched any of the new era stuff.

I love it so much. Like, could you imagine, like, if you, even if you were in podcasting, could you imagine not watching the show? I know. I can't. Like, I look back at Survivor and I think, like, it defines periods of my life. And a lot of these players do as well. And so, Rie, and I'm sure means that to Lisa.

And obviously Lisa is a kindred spirit. And poverty, like, it feels like I'm back in high school watching, like, the coolest person alive. And Tony, I think about 2014, I think about 2020. This is my, this is my point. And I think that I just, I just want to be very, like, intentional about what I'm saying. This is not like a knock on the greats. Like, what I'm saying is, like, for the greats, what's great about them is that they are driven by the desire to get a win. like to win it to win it all costs that's their passion is winning it's like the like cobi

Bryant mentality more so than their drive is the passion of I love survivor so much yeah and as you know I love winning you know I'm competitive but I love survivor more like I think that our audience and Lisa and Lisa voiced this and that's what was so emotional about it is our audience get that and most of the greats are like get away from me weird right why are you crying And I'm like, that is I imagine if I meant to read. And this is a self-criticism. I think I love Survivor more than I love winning. I know.

That's what I'm saying. Like, I love this thing. I love Winning. I love Survivor so much. Like, I love it. This week, like, I love it so much. Like, watching, you know, I've seen the episode twice when I went to the premiere party. I was watching it for a third time.

And I was like, I love this show. Watch this episode again and again. Like, I think, I think, I think, if, honestly, if you don't feel this way, like, I'm sorry, I called you a free. and a loser but like you're in the wrong place if you don't feel this way like we're on our like six hour of content about this week and this week really reminded me anyway so my point about lisa is i think that she if you get it you get it and i think many of us get it and she she put words and tears to that in such a beautiful way and seri was kind enough not to be like get away from me weird person why are you crying like i'm just a human being it's like no you're not you're

you don't understand and serri's very very gracious with that but anyway Surrey, I think also, and Parvety, to her credit, like, I think that some of these, like, all-time greats, they can recognize when, okay, like, this is a person that is wants to work with me, and this is person is, like, picking up what I'm putting down. Like, why would I want to get rid of this person? And so I don't mean it in, like, any sort of, like, that she is, you know, doing anything bad towards, it's a win-win. Yeah, 100%.

And I think Lisa's lovely. And I think she could get along really well with Lisa. And also Lisa was the swing boat. And the irony is, you know, there are people that if you put them out on the island with Lisa, they would be like how Lisa is with Surrey towards Lisa. Yeah, 100%. I mean, Lisa was the star of the episode. She's on the show.

Like she said about Rob, she's like actually won the show. Like she's a survival winner, which is a very elite global club. And she still is like, like she paid to be there, which is, which is great. She's the Adam Klein with that, you in all stars. You were the original, honestly. And it's great. I loved it. And I'm so glad that Lisa was so entertaining. Like, she was such a star. She represented us all so well. So I enjoyed it. This show is sponsored by Better Help. You ever have these days where you look at the calendar and you just think, how is all of this supposed to get done between work, family, the podcast, emails, texts that I forgot to answer.

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I didn't get the chance to listen to your exit interview with Rob Benthalay. How was he? He was gracious. You know, he was like, I didn't know these people coming in. I knew the Australians. I'd watch Australian Survivor. I didn't know who Pavity was. I didn't know Pavity and Cerey's relationship.

I underestimated Poverty. She was right to be offended. So he was like, look, I'm going to go big or go home. I'm always going to try it a type of way. But I think that he took some accountability for coming in pretty hard and underestimating his opponents. Can I give some flowers to Tony because they vote out Rob Bentelay in the first episode. And this is like kind of, I guess they're just like, okay, well, I guess they're just going to lose all the challenges now.

And then since they get rid of Rob and then really now Tony has become like, especially in that second challenge, he was such a like Tony carrying the world tribe on his back. And then he and Parvety also were so great in that third challenge that they ended up doing with holding up the sandbags. But Tony, I think, has come in and has really, you know, learned so much, I think, from the Winners at War game. And I think that Tony is, you know, I don't, I think he's in a horrible spot. I'd be really shocked if we're not sitting here a week from now and Tony's not out of the game. and I'm sad about that and I just think that he has done you know everything that he has needed to do

and that he's just like in such a no-win situation yeah which is ironic for Tony who often wins who probably loves winning more than he loves Survivor yeah I think that he learned a lot from game changes like Tony will never be that player again like he's learned what to do on winners at war sometimes it's not going to work out situationally and hopefully this is not that case

hopefully it goes well but he has been playing well. Can I say something we didn't say on the third episode recap? And I was re-watching a bit of it before we came on and just like kicking myself that we didn't talk about it because it's so funny. One of the best moments of the week is how Tony loses the ladle in the well. And he wants to be, he's getting Lisa to push him in the well. And he's like, push me, push me. And he's like half in the well, Rome style. It's genuinely like classic Tony. The business with Tony and the key, I did wonder like, do you think that my thought was, Did Tony lose the ladle or is this an excuse for Tony to search for the key in the well?

Like was he like like like Rome had to do? Is he like, okay, let me like, okay, is it in here? Let me just double the check. Yeah, but you got to love again, like the Lisa, at least there is the fad has to be sitting there like I'm pushing Tony into this well. This is an iconic Tony moment. Like, you know, like she should appreciate, but I just like just like testing out like could the spy submarine finally be

like he's gone to the air he's gone to the spy nest he's gone into the ground could he finally go into the water true submarines have been they've got on a lot of good PI lately I think

if you're going to be a spy submarine are you talking about the submersible I'm just the one where the people died yes yeah we're really using the word recently very loosely that feels so recent to me

time is absolutely abstract. Um, if you're going to be a submarine, do it in the ocean. Like, don't do it in the well. Yeah. Because can you imagine if you open up the well and Tony's inside it? Like, that's so scary. Like, Max Dawson got voted up for putting his feet in the pot. I feel like if you submerge your whole body into the well. Like, that's a ticket out of you. But that's game changers, Tony. Like, that's not, that's not good. Yeah. We have to ask if he really did lose the ladle or, uh, if he was looking for the thing. Yeah. But no, I, I'm, I'm sad for Tony because I feel like that he has done almost everything that you would have asked for.

Like, it's hard for me to really critique his game other than to, like, just not be Tony, where he really has sort of, like, has seemingly, like, loyalty to poverty and Surrey. And they just don't want it. They don't want to work with him. And he has, like, really no other avenue to go down. the returning cast are always like that and this is more than that like it's like you know what i mean like there's always going to be the skews of people who know each other and like possible pregame relationships like we have people who've known each other for decades we have a gender imbalance

we had a country imbalance like yeah this has been the most skewed which is why it's even more insane that that flips on the australia tribe and david who is so connected goes out even though it is a man who's in the lower half of the gender imbalance i think tony as like the in like with the Americans and as a man and without the pregame relationships, it's a tough spot. But look, look, we don't count Tony Locos out of the game. I won't count them out of the game, but I just feel like that for Parvety and Surrey, and I get it, they want, like, they're looking to recreate some of the Micronesia magic and the thing that's, reheating their own, their own nachos.

I just feel like they, not, and I wish they were reheating flachos that they, that they, Where's Tony going? Are they worried that Tony is going to flip and start working with all the Australian people that he's never met before who probably have no desire to work with him? And I feel like that there could parveny and Surrey are probably like, hey, look, we're going to work with Tony and then he's going to like go out there and he'll be like finding an idol and not telling us about it. Like instead of that, we're working with Cass. That's somebody who's, we're like, we're going to be able to trust her. She's not going to do anything like go out and find an idol and then keep it for herself and not tell us about it. Cass, who has never voted out of her closest ally and who lost her closest ally.

Class who we called the Quebecian Amanda Kimmel. Now, I'm sure they're extensive knowledge of Survivor Quebec is informing that relationship. They're getting the band back together. Yeah, exactly. We literally, Mike said that on the recap. Like he's like, when we call her the Quebecian Amanda Kimmel, we probably should have seen that. But I think as well, Tony is always going to be a huge threat. won the game twice in such dominant fashion

he's Tony has nowhere to hide. I'm just I'm sad for Tony because I just feel like he's not getting it wrong. Don't give up home. No. I'm not. I just I feel like that he's not getting like if Tony is like if there was a little bit more evidence in the show where it's like yeah yeah there's there's like lots

of reasons why they're like they are like they shouldn't be working with Tony like you know it's just like he has and I guess you know we're not there like it does feel like that Tony is like trying to what he's on house arrest like he's on house arrest like he says yeah he's being good he's being good but it does seem like he is trying to like cultivate Tommy to be like his Nick Wilson of like or his woo like basically like he always he always has like his like a guy who's like going along with like what he's trying to do that he may or may not like include in like some of his. his plans. And I know he's such a dangerous person. I just feel like that I'm a little like I'm pre-morning that, you know, Tony is going to go out. You're nighting it. That's before the morning. It's always darkest before the dawn, Rob. Like, we're going to, it's going to be like,

because, okay, this is a, this is a theory. Like on the recap, Mike and I were talking like, it's definitely a double tribal next time. There are two necklaces, but I've had messages since my brother was even saying maybe it's a combined tribal. Maybe it's everyone at one tribe. But if you look at the next time on, it's like they could both be at that tribal council. And what they did in Survivor South Africa Return of the Outcast, and I don't know how much this production team has watched Survivor South Africa, but they did steal the podium idol, technically from Survivor South Africa, which is, you know, the lesser idol. But in Survivor South Africa Return of the Outcast, before the merge, they came together

in one tribal council and wrote it out one person, and then they merged there and then. So that's a theory. And if that's the case, firstly, Tony could win the immunity. Secondly, then the whole dynamics are different. Yeah, I'm not saying that he's at the next tribal council, Tony is going out. I just don't. If it's a double tribal and he doesn't win immunity, it is looking very bad for Tony. Yeah, I just think that he doesn't have a lot of runway to be able to work.

And just to speak to the season, like, you know, we had three men go out this week. And I don't think it's necessarily that specifically on the Australian tribe. I don't think it's necessarily like the women are saying like, hey, let's let's take out all. the men, I think it just so happens that the, like, most dangerous figures on the tribe happened to be a couple of the men that ended up going out, but it just doesn't feel particularly good. Like, I kind of feel like that Luke, Tommy, or Tony, like, I don't see any of them going particularly far.

I could see Tommy is sort of like being, I think Tommy will be the last man standing in the season. Like, I could see him as sort of like the Eric Reichen back there with. like, it's just me with five of the girls left here at the end. Your impression of Tommy is unfair. You've called him Wu, Nick Wilson, and Eric Reichenbach. Like, that's very harsh to any human being. I just, I don't have that much to work. It's, it's no disrespect to Tommy, other than,

then he's, like, doing, like, wolf stuff, which maybe you could give me the lore behind. Why is Tommy? Yeah, he's a wolf. Why? But why is he a wolf man? Well, he has a wolf shirt. I don't know if the finish

subtitles missed out the rest. Why has he adopted the Team Jacob? Yeah. I don't know. He wore a wolf shirt in his season. He's wearing a wolf shirt now. He wears a wolf shirt. Why? What is the, what is the lore there?

You've watched 62 episodes of Survivor Finland. I was hoping you could explain to them. Quebec was 67. My bad. Maybe our Finnish friends can tell us if there's some sort of finish reason that one might be wolf in. Yes. Why is

the wolf Tommy's spirit animal? I've said that he should have been wearing a sheep shirt because what's the point of wearing wolf's clothing? Like you would want to be in sheep's clothing as what they say. But yeah, I think Luke will go the furthest of the man. Luke was my winner pick. I now kind of don't feel

great about that. It's like if it's a whole jury of women, like are they going to give it to Luke? But maybe he does have a good story. I think Luke's in a good spot. So Luke is in a good spot, but I think that Like if Luke gets to the merge and it's all women left, I think at some point they're just because it's like, oh, look, let's just vote out, Luke, right? Think this is like a Vanuadu situation, maybe? I don't think so. I think that at some point, like, I think, not in poverty, watch.

No, I don't think, yeah, it just does not seem like that that is like a viable outcome. So that, I would say that that, like, that's a small complaint on my, like, and that, like, it has gotten, the gender imbalance has gotten so lopsided. so quickly that I feel like, and I'm sure there's some people that's like, yeah, finally, it's about time, great. And I love that for you. But I'm just saying that there are like a certain number of outcomes that seems like that they are pretty closed off at this point.

It would have been lovely if we could have got like a Matt Haywood on the internationals and we could have got like a Ferris on the Australian tribe and we could have had 16 people, no gender imbalance, or even an American man. yourself, Rob, maybe you could have been the fourth man. And we could have had. If I would have called me, I would have gone. Do it for 20 days instead of 16, put in two extra guys.

Like, I think that would have, I don't want to complain about the season at all. It's the best thing that ever happened to me. But that would, that would have been quite nice. But I do imagine, like, they get to a point where it's just Luke and all the women. And just imagine, like, Luke just staring down, like, eight women. And they're just like, get him. And it's like, that's kind of how it's. Yeah.

So, an Amazonian, yeah, fittingly type situation. And everybody is, you know, entitled to, you know, play however they want to. I'm really not complaining about, I'm not complaining about the play style. It's just I think it's like a little bit of, for me, just like it feels like that Tony does not have a lot of avenues left because it just feels like, okay, that there's just so much momentum already that three men have gone out. out in a row, it feels like that, that, that trend will continue. Yeah, I don't, I'm not, but not, okay, I'm wanted if it happens, Rob, please, please, I can't, I can't worry about this for the next few days. I need to be able to, to rest and not worry about Tony Blackos, but I love him so much.

And I just, just hook him falling into the well into my veins. It's like, only Tony can be a two-time winner of this game. We all love so much. And it's like, that's the best player of all time. And he's like, I'm stuck in the well. Like, I can't get out of the well. A man of many layers. He did such a good job in Winners at War

where he was able to let people forget about him and he was so quiet and he was just like the goofy character. Remember Tony's ladder and all of the fun things that he was doing in the beginning of Winners at War and then ultimately you let him get far enough in the game and maybe that's a good enough reason

why Parvety and Surrey are like okay listen like we can't sleep on Tony eventually he does need he does need to go and I think that that's probably happening sooner than later. He came off game changes for that. It was a, that was a great, you know, that was a great facade. And now he's coming off being a two-time winner. Like, you can't even compare the threat level.

But it's like, we're like, I can't stop laughing at the thought that it's like, that's the best ever winner of our cerebral show. And he's like, I'm in the well. It's a very smart show. It's not like regular reality TV. That's what I tell everyone. It's like a board game. on the island is very smart and then he's just like I'm in the well and he's smart he can be both

anyway do we have other things yeah I'd love to talk a little bit about I thought that the second episode might have been my favorite of the week it really was um just I was loving like the back half of the episode and just like all of the maneuvering that was going on where you know David says pretty early on like I don't work with George and so and there's there's all of that going on and then there's the plan where you know uh george thinks like remind me again what what was george's original plan that he thought that he wanted uh he wanted he wanted everybody to vote out jeanine uh but david didn't really want to do that but it's really kirby who you know as you spoke to is the person that's like no i don't want to work with david

and so kirby is sort of like leading the charge and there's everything that's going on with who I just thought was in such an interesting position all week long. And I really love Sarah just as a TV character because that Sarah to me and she's incredibly smart, but I feel like that she doesn't have a great poker face. And I feel like that her face is like very expressive, a beautiful face. But I feel like it's a face that I think often gives her. thoughts away, at least to me as a viewer, where when, okay, like in the third episode, there's the scene where Shawnee comes up and is talking about, I want to work with you guys.

And Kirby is just so happy. And so, like, you know, it's obviously Kirby is receiving this, like, extremely well. But, you know, Sarah's face in that, like, her words are saying, like, yeah, yeah. But her face is like very much, I have big concerns about that. And then her struggles through episodes two and episodes three. And as you've talked about in the past, that, you know, she has an allegiance to David. You know, David is somebody that she's known for quite some time. She wants to keep the golden god in the game, but she also is conflicted about how she wants to play on this return.

And she really wants to play a more loyal game. And now here she is in an immediate, conflict with what she set out to do versus what she wants to do. And I just thought that that's the stuff that I find to be so interesting of these dilemmas that the players find themselves in. Isn't it like that's one of the things we love about Survivor, right? That it like reveals who you are. Like you can only be who you're going to be.

And like Sarah in this season, who has been such wonderful TV and who I truly love, has made Sarah 1.0 look like a loyal player. Like in the, I mean, obviously she turned on David, but she also turned on Kirby before. she turned on David by telling David and Janine for David to play the idol. And even in the second episode when she is trying to take out Shawnee, like that only really works if she's going to be playing both sides, right?

Like that also speaks to her connection with Luke who she's played with before. So even that is not like sticking with a group. Like sticking with a group would be Kirby and Shawnee. They have a name. It's not great. It's not a great name, really. But like they have an alliance.

And that should be it. But she's like so out on Shawnee. So she has fallen into old patterns very much. in this week. Yeah, and she describes in the third episode, she says to Kirby that, you know how you felt about David? That's how I feel about Shawnee. And I would love, yeah, I would love to know, like, I didn't know where that came from of that. She just feels like that, you know, Shawnee is just so likable and charismatic and then just wins people over, like, with her vibes. And is, is that what she doesn't like about Shawnee? Because I do feel like that maybe that's

something like and I again Sarah is probably a very different person than me but I felt like that I related so much to Sarah because I feel like that she's somebody who you know is like winning people over with her like logical arguments in the way that she is trying again this is my perception of her of that she is trying to like okay you know think about the numbers and work with people, but there's some people like Shawnee, that it's so effortless. You know, Parvety has this too. You know, and Surrey has this where it's just like their presence makes people want to work with them.

Yeah. And as somebody that I feel like that, I wish I had that. You know, is that why you think Sarah is particularly concerned about having somebody like Shawnee around? I do think that she could see Shawnee. If she doesn't really trust Shawnee, I think she could see Shawnee taking up that space, but better, as you said, more effortlessly, whether it is in a relationship with Kirby that she feels threatened by, whether it isn't a possible relationship with poverty. Like, poverty is going to take only so many women under her wing. And I know that you can see when poverty came out on the mat at the opening challenge that

Sarah was like poverty, poverty, poverty. Like, I know that it would mean a lot to Sarah to work with poverty, but I also think poverty will love Shawnee, even if Shawnee doesn't necessarily know who poverty is. So I think that she could encroach on spaces that Sarah feels maybe limited and could be hers. And I think that maybe that's what she means when she says to Kirby that, you know, I feel a similar way because I think Kirby felt that way like David attracts people. David has this charisma. David can build a group. Kirby does that, right? Like that's Kirby's superpower. So she took it out and she won that war. And maybe Sarah sees a similar kind of battle for how like Shawnee could encroach on her space. Yeah. It's for some people, it's just the game comes so easy.

It's so effortless for some people And it's something that You know, I I don't want to say I'm jealous But I'm very good rob I'm envious of Of the people who can just do it so easily Like for me

I feel like it's a lot of hard work To try to do that I feel like That's true of life though Right like that's like I was literally at a work event last night And I like had to talk to like important people And like this might surprise people

Because I obviously like sit here on the podcast but I was like, it took me like five minutes of me in my head being like, do it, talk to them. Like, I will give you a treat later if you talk to the people. Like, that's not a natural skill for me. Like, I have to be very comfortable. But like with everyone, no. The way like Johnny can do that or poverty can do that or Kirby can do that. I mean, that's next level.

That is why they're, you know, god tier level in this game. But I think that like probably maybe some people can relate to that in life. Like you either have it or you don't. Like you either, yeah, I don't know. I think that that's a skill that's very, very important. And to go back to that earlier thought of like people like that if you care less about the engagement, like maybe I think that that's the secret to all of it. And I think that that's maybe what somebody like a parvety might end up having.

And again, I don't want to try to do like psychoanalyze too many people. But isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. And I think that, you know, Ashani, a parvety, like this type of person like, may not be like super invested in like what the outcome of every single engagement might be in the way that you might be. And that's why it just comes across as, you know, so effortless. Well, I would love to bring that comparison to Kirby and George because, yeah, when I spoke to

Kirby on her deep dive of Titans v. Rebels, she just like, yeah, she doesn't overthink it. She just kind of does. And I think you can compare it to George who's maybe more like us and how much he cares because George certainly cares a lot. And I think that you see the different way that they approach this game. Like I think Kobe looks at it like, I don't know if I'll win, but I'm going to go for it. Like Kobe goes into this vote.

Does she think she has three of seven? Like she doesn't tell George in the tribal council to vote for David. Like she's like, but she takes a shot on a plurality and hopes it works out. And it does. George is like he's too, he cares too much. Like he's scared. Like he comes in in such a bad spot that he's like,

he's being conservative. Janine over David. Like I don't know if we can get. David, he said at this in the ex-interview that he feels like he didn't want to piss off Shawnee. Like he was tying himself into knots rather than just like taking the shot. And I think it was because he cares so much and he felt so on the back foot. Whereas if Kobe feels on the back foot, she, if I think of anything, she pushes harder.

Well, let me start with Kirby. And I thought that what she did was so brilliant in that tribal council where it seemed like that there was momentum of, okay, that David wasn't going to go home. And Sarah, we saw like her, she was. conflicted and then she got the green light and it was going to and she went back to David and was able to tell him like, hey, okay, we're going to, uh, you know, vote for that, I just want to make sure I have that right that they, they thought that they were going to vote for Janine. David was going to do that or they thought it was going to be who did when,

when it looked like it wasn't going to be David. Who was it going to be at that? They wanted to vote. So I think they came into tribal council, I think voting for George. Okay. All right. It was going to be, it was going to be George and everybody was happy. And then at the tribal council Kirby says to Sarah, hey, it's going to be David tonight. And

someone's up there on the shoulder. Yeah, like listen, votes David. And for Sarah, you could feel like oh, wait, no, no. And there was no time to change it. And I do wonder again, and maybe I don't know if we'll

ever know, was that Kirby's plan all along of that I'm just going to yeah like i'll just tell sarah at tribal council like that's that's what's going to be and it'll be a loyalty test for sarah of this is what it is and to me it's like that's like a very like boston rob type move of that's just basically at the end of the day i'm the godfather the godmother i am the person who is like you know what i say goes and there's not going to be a discussion and so like I'm going to then I'll tell her at tribal council this is what it is and there's no time for

a debate back and forth. It's like, okay, I said what it is and we're going with that. And I just thought that that was such a, you know, great character point for Kirby and just how she handled her business. And it just put Sarah in such a bad spot. Yeah. It's kind of awesome. Rob, like it's kind of Rob Bentley like in some ways of like pushing your agenda with the shawnee type aura right like i said i think cobi's one of the most naturally gifted players for the game like she has the aura that will that will take sarah cross to begin with but then she'll also push to get her way and she's stubborn she was like not go to the big one and she would she was more stubborn on taking out david than sarah was on

keeping her friend of many decades um yeah and i think the thing and the reason here's why here's here's how you win an argument. You care less, right? Like, Kirby's like, no, I'm doing it. And if it goes badly and I go home or I lose Shawnee, like I'll move on. But I'm doing this. And I think that's the thing.

It's like Sarah comes in and she is a fan. And I think she really does care. And this is true of any relationship. If you care less, you can usually get your way because then you can just be like, no, I'm out. And then the other person has to come to you. And I think that's true of Kirby. She's like, I'm taking the shot.

This is what I want to do. I don't care if it's dangerous. maybe it all go badly. She almost lost Rihanna, who was her, Rihanna, sorry, who was like her main ally in Titans v. Rebels in the pre-swap if there wasn't an on a limb. That's how old days she had been that early.

She could have lost Shawnee here. It definitely could have gone that way. But to be fair, though, if the other side were voting Shawnee, they'd probably bring in George and they'd have like a four person and George said he would have voted out David anyway. But like, she's risking Shawnee's life.

And she doesn't care. Yeah, and if you're Kirby. And that's how you win. And you're coming in and you don't really have, you're the new person on the block. you don't have the connections that these other people and Sarah has known David for all these years

and David has Luke and Janine and so Sarah knows Luke yeah and so there's this whole like web of people who all know each other and you're Kirby and you come in and you really don't know other people it's like yeah that is the most dangerous guy on the board he has like all these things going

for him doesn't even know about Dundee yet and so it makes all the sense in the world why Kirby is as like listen who's going to work with George and George is like the he's the guy that we know is we all know who George is. David is the person who could win people over with, of course, like all of the things that we said about, Parvety and Surrey and the people that it just comes so effortless and easy for,

you know, you have that in David. And on top of that, he's a brilliant strategist and, you know, a guy who is just people want to work with. So, yeah, totally understand why Kirby is worried about David. And nevertheless, I wanted David to stay because it was so fun when David was doing his confessional. And David recognizes the threat that's Kirby. And when David, David's confessionals about Kirby in the water, when he's like, who does she think she is that I have to come to her and she's sitting in the water? like he's so good at what he does and i thought he just even being back in his element like i thought he was even better than he was on dandie of just like he was just so instantly back to being

the golden god and i just was really really enjoying david across these episodes he was really fun i think my favorite confessional was like i don't trust george as far as i can throw a well-worn trope, but like, you know, with probably about 20 meters, maybe 25 if I've eaten. I thought that was great. It was so good. I think with Kirby. And I just want to say like JLP is great. I think that David will be also very good at the like, you know, it's unfortunate because JLP is like, you know, so good at what he does. But I just also think that David will be like a, a different version of a survivor host than we have seen where I kind of feel like that. I think he will bring like a sarcasm to it that I don't think that we have seen in any of the other survivor hosts.

Yeah, I think maybe the British host was a little sarcastic, which would make sense. But yeah, I think that David's one of a kind and we can't imagine how that looks and we wish him the best in it. But yeah, for Kirby, I think some people ask why and Kirby always ask why not. They have the numbers, we lose, you know, like, and if it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. But I'm going to take this shot. And it's just, it's so audacious. shouldn't work. Like if I was Kirby, and I said this one on the deep dive, I would be like, but what if we don't have enough? What if they have and what if this goes wrong? And what

if there's an idol? And George was doing that. See, George was like, but what if Sarah doesn't want to vote David? And what if someone plays an idol for David? And then what if I wrote Johnny and then Johnny gets mad at me. And like, he was doing what I do. And it's exhausting being me, by the way. Don't recommend. But Kirby, those voices don't exist. She doesn't hear all of that. She just does it. And then sometimes it works. Then it did. And it was spectacular. And it was a plurality vote. It was so exciting. It was unfortunate to lose David in that way, but again, a spectacular way to go. You know, they used to say about Steve Jobs that his, like, superpower was he had like a reality distortion field was what people used to say about him.

And the fact that, you know, you're like, well, what if this happens? What if this happens? What if this happens? And, you know, somebody like Kirby is like, no, I'm going to, this is what's going to happen. This is like, but what about this? No, no, no, no. This is what we're doing. And just the fact that, you know, there are people.

like in this world that they are just like okay they can will these things to be and it's not like woo-woo it's just that their like a force of presence just like wills things into the direction they want them to go yeah and i think as well i think shonnie's a bit like that like shonny's state you know it always says life is for living you know and it's survivor like for them they will move on but i think that's different like i don't think that necessarily that's like that that Shawnee ends up like willing things to go in a certain direction by the like the strength of like her her just like what what's her principles of like what she wants things to go. I think that things just like things gravitate to a Shawnee to a parvety whereas like a Kirby like is going to inflict her will and it's going to happen because she says it's going to happen. but the common denominator of all of that is to care a little bit less and we came into the saying

that we're all weirdos who love the show so much and we're now saying that that's an extreme detriment in our lives if you're that type of personality type like we're all in the struggle together because yeah I do think that the common denominator is like you know it's a two-week season whether I'm here I'm here for a good time not a long time like let's just do it you know like and a lot of them felt this way Kirby was like this in a long much longer season so I do think that it's a skill that many super fans really struggle with. I think George really struggled with it. I think he came in in such a bad spot that even when he was presented opportunities, he was still like, no, but there's still so many hurdles. And he was in his head. I think that

that probably was his biggest issue. That was the root of the issues coming into it. You said, like, playing scared, which I think was a good way to put it. So yeah, I think that was a troubling spot. But what a tribal council, Rob, how do you look at like the fact that we have lost three legends. Like, do you look at legacy differently like that? Or does anything happen? Or is it, like, this is a novelty match. It's tough.

It's skewed. It's, there's a lot of different reasons. Like, how do you look at it? I think that in the case of David, I think it's like the easiest to talk about this where it's like, what are you going to say about David and what he, like, what he's accomplished in Australian Survivor and say, did he play this badly? Like, was there, was there something that he could have done drastically different that would like really change this outcome.

So how can you say, look at his, you know, what he's done in the past and, and say that he, like, oh, David, he's not as good as we thought he was. Look at what happened to him. No, it's like that he, he is who we thought he was. And everybody else realized that and said, okay, well, he's too dangerous to play with. I think in the case of like a Rob Bentelay, like I think that, yeah, I think, I, I think, that that's somebody that we can look back at and say like, okay, well, like what he did worked in one way, but then, you know, there's a body of work where, you know, David has

two different seasons to point to where he's able to do David type things and we can look to Dondy. So like, I think that you can't really, it's a case by case basis I really, I really do feel like, where, you know, Rob came back and we saw him make mistakes or try to, like, he read the room wrong on a few different things. And so we can say that, like, you know, he played a great game there, but maybe his game isn't as portable to, like, play with other different play styles. Whereas David, I think he's kind of unimpeachable. Yeah, I think, I mean, the most things say about David is we thought he should have gone for

Shawnee over George and invested in George, who, to be fair, in the ex-interview for me was more like, oh, well, David was a backup. I'd get an interesting message from Zach Sinclair about how if David is investing in Sarah and Kirby, like we're going to vote out George as a five. If you just hope that they're with you and you do vote for Shawnee, then you could get them on a two. You could get, say, George and Shawnee on a two for David and then you win on a three-two. That's an interesting thought just in the moment. That's a lot of tribal council. I kind of feel like he's choosing between just Sarah and just George to get to one type of four and it's tricky

and he chose his friend of 12 years. Tough one. You know, like I feel like with David as well, as you said, there's two seasons and this is like a minor loss. Rob has one incredible season, but it does kind of feel like he played one type of way.

He can play one type of way and sometimes it's going to be incredible or it can go very much the opposite. And George, it wasn't great. He came in in a very bad spot. I think he was off kilter from the beginning and I think that that kind of messed up the reeds and maybe some of the instincts.

At the end of the day, George comes back after Brains v. Braun and does what he does in Heroes v. Villains and nothing can take that away. That's what I feel about like Tony after winners of war. Like most of these people like, you can back it up and George already has and I'm not talking about buts. I'm just saying, I'm not saying that. You were saying it. I'm just saying he's backed it up. No, I'm just saying he's followed it up already. So that's the legacy and this is like this one didn't go so great.

But it was a tough spot. Like George came in in a very, very tough spot and then many ways did make it. Well, we haven't really talked too much about George in this conversation, and I feel like that that's the next logical place to go because, and George, of course, is so interesting to have on television. And George was probably overdue to have this outcome in one of his seasons where that he seems like he's almost always in this position, and this is the one time. And this would happen in most seasons.

Like, I thought it's a whole of brain be born and here as be villain. So actually, yeah, it's long, long overdue, actually. Yeah. And I think that really when George has been most successful, that is that George comes in and he sort of says like, no, no, no, no, no, this is how it's going to be. And many times in his Australian Survivor playing career that there are people who are scared and they are very fearful for, okay, George is saying that this bad thing will happen to me if I don't do what he's saying. And at the end of the day, enough. people blink and then say like okay well i don't want it to be me and so i am going to like okay fine like there's there is some safety in just going with you know what george wants to do those people were not on this tribe yeah yeah and it's not but to be fair it's not just about that type of person like it's a bad spot for george like sure he only knows shonnie you blinds that's Johnny, like, he knows Kirby a bit.

Like, I'd been in an event with them before, before this, but, like, minimally so. And David's the vice group. I wish George had just, like, picked aside and that, I wish he had just held on to Kobe for dear life and just, like, had her lead the way. I said to him in the ex-interview, he was like, I didn't believe that that Kobe could get Sarah across. And honestly, I get parts of that because Sarah turned on, like, Kobe did that.

But that is unforeseeable in some ways that she would turn on a multi-decade friendship for Kirby, but I kind of wish he, I'm like, George, we analyze Kirby's game. You should have believed in the power of Kirby. Like, I think if he just prayed to the altar of Kirby, taking that, then he wouldn't have- Not Macedonia and Jesus. Yeah, which as she was, maybe she should have been as Macedonian Jesus. Carra was, like, I think that he pissed off Kirby, obviously in that conversation. The one conversation with her and David and where David comes over and says, like, so, like, who's, who's saying my name? And then it was such a great television when George said like, she's right here.

That's the wildest conversations you've ever seen on the show. I don't think I'm being hyperbolic. Yeah, that was probably bad. Like you say, well, you know, you said before, they know George, what's George going to do? I don't think anyone thought George was going to do that. Like, Kirby knows George in some capacity. He commented on the show. I don't think she could have expected for one.

I don't think I've watched George for two seasons and I know him personally. I don't think I expected him to do that. And I expect a lot of George. I expect George to do some crazy things. And that was one of the wildest things I've seen on the show. Yeah. That he called Scurby out in front of her face. That was like the most draw-dropping moment of the entire week for me.

Yeah. We had a only bomb and still that beats it. Yeah. That was a bad play by George. And I think that his decision in this last episode where he's like, okay, I'm going to get Janine to vote for Luke and Luke to vote for Janine and you know he's really going to try to force this and it's just like it didn't ever feel like that that was what was going to happen where that it just seemed like it was so easy for

that there was enough like bad blood in that in that group that I really was surprised that ultimately Janine and Luke even vote for Shawnee in that spot yeah and Shannon did I did I miss it maybe could you just like, oh, talk this through to me? Because, like, I felt like that, you know, for there, there were the two votes on, on, on, on Shawnee. That we never saw Kirby, like, have the conversation with Sarah of like, no, no, no, we're still, we're still doing George, right? That they hid that from us.

Yeah, I mean, we can tell that conversation went based on everything we know about that dynamic. So I think that that makes sense that Sarah, Sarah thought there'd be one vote on Shawnee. And she was like, we need our two votes. If she knew there was two. Would she have, do you think that she would have? I think so.

I think that she was so past feeling like she had no agency that I actually think at this point she would have done that. But that being said, okay, so Sarah, if she writes down Shawnee, now it's a tie, okay? Now Shawnee and George don't get to vote on the revote, okay? It would be a three, two, one. Is it three, two one? Because George would have voted for Janine. Got it. And then Shawnee and Kirby would have voted George.

And she would have voted Shawnee with the splits. Had she known, but they changed that at tribal council. So she was trying to do a three, two, one with her and Kirby on the one split, and it would have been her one vote, which would have been cool, which would have been awesome. But I think she might have. It would have been changing allegiances to Luke and Janine, which she can do from, from Kirby because. And she does have the relationship with Luke.

So maybe it's not a bad spot for her. But I feel like she really wants to throw her lot in with Kirby. And it really did seem like that, you know, I felt for Sarah so much that she felt like that, oh, no, Kirby is going to get sucked in by Shawnee, and I'm going to be the third wheel here, and I can see it happening already. And so I understand how badly she wanted to get Shawnee out of the game. I just feel like that at the point where she does that, where she double-crosses Kirby, like I kind of feel like she's kind of in no person's land at that point anyway.

Sarah loves no person's land. Like Sarah lives in no person's land. Like that's exactly what she would do, I think, yet she had the opportunity. or known she would have the opportunity, which she didn't. I mean, I feel like she's already breaking from Kirby. They're not well-aligned allies because they have completely different interests. So it's a very uncomfortable relationship where Kirby always gets her way. So it's tough.

It's tough. I mean, it was, yeah, it's a, it's, she had to make a choice at a point between, like, because she could have gone to Janine. Well, Janine, to be fair, Janine and Luke also wanted George out. It's a very hard one to do because you have to pile on a split where every other person wants George out. Yeah. Because obviously Janine and.

Luke do. Shawnee has her reason, which I actually think can be debated, but like revenge and like he'd said her name and everything. Kirby had had the conversation with George days prior. So George came in and he'd made enemies and it's hard for Sarah to kind of bring that back herself. This is a really interesting group if they go to another tribal council with the five because you have, okay, so there's Kirby who now has Sarah and Shawnee.

And then on the other side, there's Luke and Janine, but Luke has an idol. I really did think that Luke should have played the idol for David, but it sounds like that maybe that they didn't really think that he didn't know for sure that David was going home. But that idol is going to be, I think, a very big deal if they go to another tribal council. Who do you think ends up going home? Is it ultimately that Luke plays the idol and then whatever name, Janine and Luke wrote right down is going to go home? I don't think it would be the idol.

I don't think Kobe had Sarah. I think Sarah is gone. I think that Sarah's been pushed to do what she doesn't want to do too many times, literally two times, the two times available. But she did come through. She didn't, she didn't betray her word. She couldn't. She couldn't not.

She couldn't think she could do it without Kirby. Like Kirby's vote was the swing in her mind because she thought there was one vote. So when Kirby turned her down, Sarah had no option based on she didn't know there'd be two split votes. So I think now, especially knowing Luke and Sarah's working relationship and their real life friendship, like these are people who've also been friends for. the years. These are people who are very used to working with and against each other and no bad blood in the game. So I do think that I think she's with Luke and Janine now. Okay. So George at the end of the episode, episode three, he said, okay, well, look at me. Like, okay,

you know, at least I beat the golden god. And also that this season would not have happened without me. I'm the person. I'm responsible for bringing an Australian survivor to the global community. I did that. I'd love to just get your reaction or your thought on who do you feel like is the person that was responsible for bringing Australian survivor to the world? And do you feel like it was George? In many ways, it's not one person. You know, in many ways George was it wasn't in the New York Times like I think if you ask a lot of American people like

one person they know especially in this like new Australian era era I'm saying um I think it is George from Australian Survivor um I don't think that that's I don't think it's an unfair statement I think it's it's George type it's egotistical in some ways but I think that you know they were obviously trying to do this before George was ever cast they had had Russell they would have Sandra they had had talks with Boston Rob has always been the rumor they were looking to do this, but I think the way that Australian survivor has exploded is in many ways due to the quality of Australian survivor. And in many ways, that is George, to be fair. So it's not, it's not at one person's feet, but George has a part of the pie. I think he has,

that's a, that's a claim he can somewhat make. It's a really interesting question. And I'd love to hear more of like, uh, like, you know, opinions from other people. But it's hard for me to separate, you know, the, I feel like that the Americans that watch us. Australian Survivor, like, I feel like, I don't feel like that it is widespread. I don't think the average survivor fan in the, in the U.S. knows much about Australian survivor. So, yeah, and it's hard to find. It's hard to watch.

So, like, I really feel like that the person who I think is the most responsible for Australian Survivor, you know, being global is, I think our friend. Nick Idanza. How so? Because I feel like that he was really the first bridge from what was going on in Australian Survivor

into the community of people who care about Survivor and you know, started bringing in you know, he's somebody who would comment on American Survivor and ultimately, you know,

brings you in and I feel like that what do you I mean am I thinking too too deeply about this? Maybe you you covered the first season with Stephen. You have a big podcast yeah with Stephen you and Stephen combined share that equally

maybe maybe it was maybe you did that I mean I don't think so I like I'm like you and and George I feel like it was I don't think it was one person I think it's hard to like attribute it because I just think back to, like, I feel like Australian Survivor was a thing

prior to 2021 when George first plays on Australian Survivor. It's gotten bigger, to be fair. I think it's gotten... To be fair, it would be a very different landscape if they just kept it on Paramount Plus. That is the thing that almost doomed it. Yes. But, yeah, I mean, Nick is an interesting kind of archetype for that

because I think also Nick points to something that they showed. They had Nick there in the first season with all the other people who didn't know what Survivor. was, a trend that would continue, but they cared about Nick's Lisa style fandom that he cared too much and that he was so passionate. They always connected it back to the older brother that we have so much reverence for. So Australian Survivor has always, and Nick, I think, personifies it, had that reverence for US Survivor.

They've always wanted to do something like this. And then, through many machinations, it became global and it became international and not just USAU. But yeah, I think that Nick, maybe he's not the reason. Yeah. But I think he certainly personifies. that love from the beginning, that connection from the beginning. And, of course, it's nice to see Nick involved with the coverage of the,

and I'm not sure that I know it's, you know, is it, is it drop your buffs on? Like, what's the official title of the after show that, that is, that they're doing? It's, it's okay, it's drop your buffs on. I wasn't sure if they called it, like, if it was, you know, that Sean was hosting the, like, official whatever they had like a different title for it with Nick is there and with Ricard and so it's nice that

Nick has a place in this because I really do think that so much of what he started you know you have now taken the torch and run with it so much I think also Luke is a big part of it where in my timeline of the you know

there was the first season of Australian Survivor which we watched we talked about but it wasn't necessarily received especially well like it would felt like in the real time kind of a slog and i feel like that the 27 season 2017 season which uh luke was such a big part of and you know a lot of the people from that second season really you know where nick was podcasting about that second season of the show i felt like that really was such a turning point for there's not so much like uh where big brother two is like drastic is a completely different game

But, like, I just felt like that the gameplay went more in the direction that Nick wanted to go in that first season and ultimately became, like, a on par and as exciting with the big moves in the 2017 season of Australian Survivor. And that's really the show that I feel like that we've come to know so well. Yeah, I mean, look, the jury was out for me after the 2016 season. the jury was actually great on that season but you know like genuinely generally that's how I felt but that second episode of 2017 I mean the 2016 season

the inaugural season it was like the mateship season which was like I don't if it stayed in that direction I don't think it would it would still be here no if that was God I hate to think about me

having to cover that every time if that's what a straight survivor still was but then in the second episode of 2017 I think Adam went home I think that was his name it was like the chicken idol thing with AK yeah the first of

episode was also interesting. You had Luke and like, it was, it was okay. Like, this is interesting. But that second episode, I was like, is that a person? Jake, it was Joan and Kent. They win the tie in the first. And then, but then it was when Somatow went to tribal council in that second episode that it was just, it was incredible. And then episode five was so good. Like, that season was so good. That season made Survivor what it is today. But then, but then it's continued on that. Like, it's stayed with a lot of really great seasons. And George has been a big part of that. Like, it came back after the COVID break and we had brains be born and that was, you know, amazing. So I think that it's kind of like U.S. Survivor. Like, you can kind of

tell where people fall in based on where they are. Like there were, there are people who think of the Borneo cast or people who think of Rupert and then on we move like Stephler Gross and everything. Like that's like the Luchs and the Georges. It's, I know, the week for that. But that's like the, the way you fall into it. George, I think is really the face of like modern Australian Survivor and I feel like that I feel like that the third season of Australian Survivor was like a little bit like a not as heralded and then and then the fourth season is like David is David's first season and and then I think that David David is a big part of like of you know building it up you know even further so very true like I think those the names that they got

Luke and David and George not to discredit like the Seanies of the world and Haley and everything as well, but I do think when you think of names, especially the way that Australian Survivor edits, you think of that kind of Trinity, that Holy Trinity, the God, the king and the other king. Another king. Yeah, I think that the king of a town, a lot of people have a lot of, yeah, a lot of credit to take the mayor, wouldn't it be a mayor, you are right. A lot of people should take a lot of credit of how good of Thrones Survivor's been, like it put itself on the map through fairly consistent, fairly consistent run over the last almost 10 years.

And that's what got us to where we are today, I think. And I think, though, that if we're looking for the person who brought Australian survivors to America, like, I do think that now when we have to look back at it, where David coming to play on Deal or No Deal Island, like, I think that he is probably, like, I think clearly the most well-known internationally Australian survivor player that there is and certainly now being named as the host

like I think that that award with all due respect to George I think does go to the golden god which will kill George you know it's already been a tough week like maybe we don't do that now let's not dance on the grave as he said in his final words he also said I've at least beat the golden god

so maybe he did well in placement sure Okay. One last question for you, Shannon. How have the ratings been? Do you know anything about this? Better, better. Better than the last civilian season? Brain Fiborne 2 already was beating Tidonsley Rebels.

And this, I think, has been even better than that, like much better. So I think it's going well. Sam, I think we have a couple of things. Do we have the confessional charts? We might just have a quick look at that because that might be interesting. Does Sam have the... I saw the episode one confessional chart. I saw like Parvety had like, what, like three times?

17, yeah. Welcome to Australian Survivor. People complain it towards poverty. I don't know where it is. I'm talking into the void. We also have a chizzy, the cheesy charts. Oh, here's it is. Thank you, Sam.

Sorry for complaining. Yeah, so poverty is on 20. Wow. She's on 20, but she was on 17 after the first one, right? Or no. Well, it was 13. I might do it differently. Okay, yeah.

The one I had seen was that she had 17 on the first episode. Because some confessions are really long. I love the poverty confessional about how surreal. he talks out of the side of her mouth and then Surrey immediately does it Parvity, they should call it Parvah TV. Has anyone ever made that joke? She's so good for TV.

Like, she's so much fun. David got 15 in those two episodes. Who's not getting a lot of love? Tommy and Cass on two. Janine on three, even though two tribal councils, you don't love every. Otherwise, honestly, it's pretty even. And do you have a, do you feel like,

other than like really kind of Tommy, do you feel like, I feel like we're seeing everyone quite a bit? Yeah, I think, Tommy and Cass just feel like that the also Rans who are there. But that's fine. I'm not like I'm also not. It's a hard spot to be in because it's like we don't know who they are. And because I don't know who they are, I'm not like, hey, I need more of them.

So I'm not complaining. I'm sure they're lovely people. They really seem to be. Can we have the chizzy charts as well? By the way, Rob, we're running a chizzy raffle. Yes. Do you wonder how much money we've made in the last three days? How much money have you made?

We've already made $1,290. Well, I applaud the effort. I'm a little confused about what you're doing with stealing the chizzy points. If I donated, so I donated, so if I win, I'll steal the recap bitches, chizzy points. And my mom donated, and she said that she would steal that. But somebody, like, the person who donates the most money can...

No, no, it's a raffle. We've sold 154 raffle tickets. So you can donate more. to buy more raffle tickets. But does the winner of the raffle win money? No, they win my chizzy points or the recap bitches chizzy points. That's the part that's confusing me. On the finale podcast, when I would usually say, here are my chizzy points,

all the recap bitches would give their chizzy points. The winner of the raffle will choose who to steal the points from and they will give out chizzy points. But not for the whole season. Just for the finale. Okay. I was like, what the hell? in the like Erica hourglass

is this where you're going to then take away at all the points that somebody gave out this season? No, that's not it. But you can give it to anyone. They could give points to you. They could give points to JLP. They shouldn't, though. Don't do that.

But they could. They would win. It would be their points to give. So we've done very well. We don't have the cheesy charts in front of us. But thank you so much there. What do you think of this, Rob? What do you think of the jizzy points?

20 is on 7. Here, let me see. Let me just let me. zoom in here okay oh shawnee has seven chizzy points yeah might give a three last episode I you know

nothing nothing wrong with Shawnee but I feel like that to me I would not have come away from this week if you would have given me a couple of guesses of like who dominated the week Shawnee especially because I think Shawnee could be in trouble next yeah but it is still quite

three I don't have any issue with really based off of the strength of the first episode. Kirby is doing doing great at six. Luke seems a little high for me because I don't really love his placement in the game. I feel like that he's another

person who may struggle to get through next week and I don't really feel like that he had like he found the idol is that based of did he get three for finding the idol? No, I gave him three last episode. I thought he was great last episode in taking out George who was coming for him and I feel like he's in a good spot with Sarah

now. I thought he did really well on sewing the discord between Shawnee and George and keeping his idol through that. Parf seems a little low at three. And then, yeah, I mean, I hate Zero for Sarah because I feel like that. Yeah, Sarah, I've not agreed with, I love her. I just haven't agreed. It's been, it's been so wishy-washy. Like, she's trying not to be which he went.

And poor Tommy. Also, those are the only two people in the game. No, I have no issue with Tommy at zero because he's done nothing. So, yeah, and Cass, you know, found. the idol like I feel like one only only one jizzy point seems seems low uh for her especially considering that um you know lisa seemed to have the great relationship with seri in the first episode but it does feel like that cass has like uh moved her way into being uh the third wheel in that so like i kind of i like her positioning uh really well in terms of like how she's situated in that

alliance and seems like that nobody is like concerned about her and here she is with a an idol. She's got the connection to Tommy. So I actually really like where she's at in the tribe more so than, you know, some of the other. So I think that she seems a little undervalued. Well, that's fair. But there's only so many points to give. And we haven't seen as much from the world. I will say so Sarah and Tommy are the only people still in the game on zero, all three of the guys who went, didn't get a point. But the interesting thing is that, yeah, so of the people left, only two don't have points and it's quite even. So your choosy points have never mattered more if you want to be in the raffle.

And I'm also aiming to enrage people. People thought poverty needed more bid. Bid and give her points. I'm doing that on purpose to anger people. Yeah, don't try to like rage bait people. I am. I'm doing it. It's not a winning path.

I wouldn't do that. You're hanging out with George too much. We've already beaten what we did four years ago when we did the cheesy raffle before. I'm very proud of us in three days. it's gone so well. But yeah, you're right. Maybe this is George start to rage bait. Next time I'm just going to say,

you made me do it. Who made you rage bait the cheesy points? I'll be like, he's right here. And you'll be like, what? Who could say such a thing? And then come back. Then come back the next day and be like, yay team.

Kirby is like, I could throttle to you. I do remember what you did. I do love George in his like, you know, sometimes he like loses himself and is like to like delusions of grandeur. But when he sometimes gets on a role, at tribal council like where he's like giving his his speeches and he's like really like uh he can deliver a speech at the tribal council like nobody else like he he might be one of the best to ever do

it where it's like i feel like okay i guess i guess we have to do what he says there's so many things about george's who's such an interesting tv character i think the first thing is a lot of it is like water off his back like i've had this in my relation with him i'm like are you mad me, he's like, no. And so I think that that's why, like, maybe he expects Kirby will come back and not care that he's done, you know, thrown her under the bus. Because I think, like, you even see with Shawnee at the end, he's like, good job, Johnny. And that as well is George. In the exit interview, he's like, oh, well, I knew it would be good TV for Shawnee to vote me out. And I believe that that is truly, like, he does think about that. Or setting up a tie.

I'm like, George, I set him on the exit. I'm like, you can't be producing and playing the game at the same time. Like, hard enough to play it. Like, maybe we take the producer cap off and try to, but that, George thinks so much about this. And to be fair, he makes great TV. Yes. He very much has always reminded me of Richard Hatch in terms of, like, how he approaches things. And he's, Richard Hatch, if Richard Hatch cared also about the show and not just himself.

I was going to say that's such a compliment, and then it went that way. It's, it's complicated. Yeah. yeah he cares a lot about the show we come back to caring George wants the show to do well Richard Hatch doesn't care if you know he's on a show

like he is like very much like self-interested where George is self-interested but also wants to make a good TV show also he like he really does care I think that George which you can tell that and that's why the production loves George

but he like he will take solace in the fact that Shawnee got revenge he'll be like that's good, that's good drama. George will play Australian Survivor again. Yes. Like, you know how David said he was retired? Mm-hmm.

Yes. And that will be, like, don't you want to see when George is playing and the Golden God is hosting? Like, doesn't care. Like, don't know people are concerned about, actually? Well, what do you want to, like, are you concerned about that the, like, when, when George is fighting with the host of the show at tribal council? Like, isn't that going to be very exciting? I think people don't like that What don't they like

They're going to be like hey the golden gods Picking on George No it'll be like when David tells George a tribal council Like hey George Why don't you shut the hell up for once Like is anybody going to be like That's not fair to George

Yes They'll love it People will be standing The Golden God when he does that They won't like it if he's up against Other favorites that he's been against What if he's against like like Shawnee.

I mean, not against. He's a host. What if Shawnee plays? You know, which he will. I don't think that David is going to be biased against Shawnee playing in a future season.

Like I think that David is like, you know, a professional enough. But like I think that like if George starts like giving him lip at tribal council, like I think David will shut it down. Yeah, we'll have to see.

It's definitely something that will happen in the future. I think so. Okay. All right. Shannon, I can't wait to see where this all goes from here. This Sunday, you will have episode four coverage as we get through another week of week two of Australian Survivor. And of course, we know where we can watch it.

Yeah, we found it. We did it. All right. Shannon, of course, has exit interviews with Rob Bentelay and also with George. You can also listen to for even more about that. Is your podcast coverage done for the week? Yes. We did it. And also we also had another podcast about David being host. Mike and I did a new reality flash about that. So this is the seventh podcast of the week of the last four days. Thank you all for everyone for listening. I've been really thrilled with how the podcast is done. Thank you to everyone who's donated to the chili raffle. It's very exciting. Yes. And I really feel like that with this momentous event, I really feel like you and your coverage has only risen to the occasion. Thank you.

I'm having a great time. Like, I'm really, I've enjoyed every second of watching and covering it. So I hope everyone feels the same way of being part of it with us. All right. So thank you so much. Of course, we will have all of our coverage about all of the world's Survivor News right here on our HAP as we begin the Survivor 49 preseason. How about that? I'm not ready.

I refuse. Put it back in. A long preseason for Survivor 4th. Yeah. Okay. I'll think about that in two weeks. Hey, when you have something that people are so hyped about like Survivor 49, like give the people what they want. I don't know what to do with that information, Rob. I'm going to get to it in time. Plus, all of the big brother that's going on and so much more, of course, right here at RHAP. Thank you so much for joining us. And looking forward, I love to read your comments. as well here on the YouTube channel. Make sure you subscribe to all the podcasts to get all the coverage. Take care everybody.

Good one. Bye.