RHAP: We Know Survivor - Summer of Survivor | Season Defining Moments 2

Episode Date: August 2, 2024

This week, Shannon Guss and Mike Bloom are joined by Peridiam to discuss the best season defining moments...again!

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Iris and Josh seem like the perfect match, but when a weekend getaway turns into a nightmare, Iris realizes that things aren't as perfect as they appear. From the creators of Barbarian, and the studio that brought you The Notebook, comes a twisted tale of modern romance, and the sweet satisfaction of revenge. Companion, only in theaters January 31st. Hi everybody, and welcome back to the summer of survivor my name is mike bloom and even though it's a new month we're talking about an old topic all the best survivors themes have sequels and we're bringing you one today as we bring you the second part of finding

the defining moments of each survivor season of. Of course, I am not alone. Of course, bringing in someone who is by my side every week here on the Summer of Survivor. Bingo Balls at the ready. It is the Baroness of Bingo Balls, the one, the only, Shannon Guss. Yes, we're back with the Bingo Balls. There is no point to the Bingo Balls

because we're going to try to slash. We're definitely getting through every season left. So we could not have Bingo Balls, but then what would be the point of survivor bingo balls which is what this was once erroneously made the artwork for in part one we didn't have to wait 10 years for part two and here we are exactly it is the rare sequel that does not take a decade to age to mature on ghost island but we are so excited of course rob is not able to make it, but we brought in one hell of a sub student, out-and-out Survivor expert.

You know him from these YouTube streams, but we are bringing him in to the Summer of Survivor. It is the one, the only, Peridium! Coming to you live from my... No, I'm not going to do that. Yes, the coup is happening, everybody. This was the plot all along. Yes. Thank you, Mike. Thank you. going to do that. Yes, the coup is happening, everybody. This was the plot all along. Yes.

Thank you, Mike. Thank you. Happy to be here. Happy to sit down and do one more, just one more bingo ball. We're going to get through all 25 of them, I think. We're going to try our best to not have a part three and to just blitz through this. I'm happy to be here.

Part three would be so upsetting if we have to take it to a part three like we could not have that happen there's like five seasons i mean listen survivor editing is made famous by someone declaring at the top that something definitely won't happen and then it does happen by the end so hopefully we will not make that folly but before we get into the bingo balls i'd be remiss not to bring up already what we're doing next week for those that might not remember, if you haven't checked your calendars, next week on the Summer of Survivor, we are doing the New Era Wand Off.

It'll be myself, Shannon, Rob will be back, and we'll be joined by Josh Wegler to do a Wand Off, a song parody contest, specifically with songs around the new era of Survivor, 41 through 46. That being said, get your submissions in. You have a little less than a week to do so. Rob has a website.com slash Wandoff 2024.

Wandoff 2024. That's where you can attach your files, put your name, all that jazz, and we'll listen to it all next week. So I want to plug that at the top right now. So if you need to run off and record and listen to this podcast later you absolutely can but for those that are looking to stay shannon just as like a brief reminder what are we doing today yeah that's a good question sorry i'm just now tweeting out the links and stuff because it's 8 a.m because big brother decided to move itself earlier and now we're starting to Shannon which

is great because everyone knows I'm a morning person so I'm here at 8 a.m with my bingo balls in my lipstick trying to get this done and now I've tweeted out the link and here I am um what are we doing we're defining we're finding the defining we're firstly we're finding out if I'm a human at 8 a.m that's the first part That's the initial test, yeah. We're seeing how quickly we can do 25 seasons in two hours. That's the second part. Third part, what this actually is. What is the defining moment of every Survivor season? If you haven't listened to

the first part of this, you should definitely stop, go back, and listen, because this will be pointless without that. And it will spoil that whole podcast. We're going to go through what we did in part one, where we defined all the defining moments of 21 random seasons as decided by the bingo ball machine that my husband bought for me off amazon then we're going to randomly for no reason bingo ball the other 25 and argue about what should be the defining moment and by the time we're finished in two hours from

now we're going to have we're going to have solved survivor discourse and scene yeah i did like how you snuck this in last time that apparently the purpose of this podcast is to solve the miranese knot that is the survivor discourse i don't know if i necessarily signed up for that but i'm more than happy to have it sort of succeed as a bonus yeah i think it's good for my ocd to just like have like certified things and i think that's what we're trying to do this summer so yeah yeah, Peridium, thank you for being on the wild ride. I mean, I don't know if you know what you got yourself into, but you should regret it.

No, I don't think I've ever podcast with you, Shannon, have I? Yeah, exactly what I just said. You should regret it. Yeah, so I've listened and I co-sign a lot of what you say. And sometimes you channel my superfan energy really well. And I know we've met before. We have met before. I remember telling, is it Peter?

Yeah. Two years ago. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, we're going to go. I'm going to Australia at some point. And he was like, everyone says that and they never do it. And I still haven't done it.

I still haven't done it. Marianne did it. Marianne did do it. Yes. I saw. Marianne also won the Olympic. So she is just crossing things off that list that none of us would dare to do if you win survivor please use some of those winnings to visit me in Australia

I yeah Mary yeah I will I mean I want to come to Australia it's been my number one thing prior to COVID it was a thing and uh I just haven't done it yet but otherwise you can come stay here I'll say that we have a room you can come stay at us, I like your I like your cat, by the way. Thank you. That's one of the premium. You're not you're not in the chat. You don't need to suck up to Shannon. You're already on.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Speaking of people in the chat already trying to suck up to me. Will Middleton said, Shannon, you are so smart. You are never wrong and definitely the best drafter. So kind. Well, thank you. But we have actually I've read Kieran is coming on the podcast.

Sam, get here. It's been his anniversary was two weeks ago. And we put this off for two weeks. He will come on and he will solve one bingo ball with us. But please get in touch with Kieran. Now I'm done. All right. Well, as we start getting into contact with our inevitable chat guest,

let's take a look back, Shannon. Last time on this edition of Defining Moments of Survivor, let's go through the 21 moments that we already did just to put ourselves back in the mindset of having to solve survivor discourse as you say yeah so peter taught me how to like list my excel spreadsheet in order of what we'd already done so i'm going to run it through peridium firstly i want you to stop me if there's anything you majorly disagreed with and i'm also going to want your takes on some of the biggest arguments that we have we have 25 seasons to get through yeah i know believe me sam's already in the private chat with the countdown on to big brother which is something

i did not ask for but yet here we are it is 809 in the morning no uh okay so we did borneo the snakes and rats speech we did australian outback scuba falls on the fire thailand we did the fake merge sure amazon we did chocolate and peanut butter palau we ended up doing stephanie going back to ugon alone guatemala if i'm correct we did um steph and bobby john on the temple yes the first moment of the season yeah the bond what i have some of the things we did we did a randy's fake idol play i believe it was the year okay randy's fake idol was the one we went with? I believe so, yeah. Yeah, that's what I have first here.

I think I wanted Forget You, Go Home, Goodbye, because I still have that in the column. Nicaragua, we did the double quit. South Pacific, Cochrane flipping at the merge. Blood vs. Water, Sierra voting out her mom. Worlds Apart, I just have auction. Did we just do the auction? I think we just did the auction,

or I think it's specifically Mike with the letters at the auction is there anything that you hugely disagree with yet peridium no no i don't sounds pretty good that's how we know we solve survivor discourse so that's good um this one we did not solve co wrong i wanted and i saw the first in my in my spreadsheet that i wanted michelle beats aubrey and then second i said caleb almost dies i know we we said on caleb almost dies where did you fall on that debate um so i yeah i did skip around i didn't listen to the discourse on that one but uh i would say from a superfan perspective it definitely feels like the final result but then again i wonder if the i would probably vote for the Caleb one. I know. Okay, well, I guess that's the start.

That's why you don't stop down, Shane. Three to one. All right. Game changes, we did Advantage Get In. Ghost Island, we did the final vote tie. Edge of Extinction, we did Underwood putting himself into fire. Island of the Idols, we did the things that should not be named. Winners at War, I think we did a drink before war. Yeah, like the first moment of officially officially starting the season the season peaks there no yeah i would

probably agree with that i know you guys have talked about the family visit on that one and i probably wouldn't agree with that one so i'd probably go with the drink before war yeah was there any others like we have here like adam i mean again like it's hard to divorce my super fanness which is like maybe it's tony and the whole extortion episode and the whole blind side or maybe it's tony winning uh becoming the the super bowl winner of survivor i don't know i could see a drink before war at the beginning of it like the just that sandbar at the beginning of it that whole thing like that's kind of the defining moment yeah anything we didn't do any new era seasons, did we, Shannon?

We did. We did 41 with the Hourglass, 42 with Marianne voting out Omar, 44, we really struggled with 44. We ended up with Carolyn at the Sanctuary. Right, her listening to Danny and Brandon and saying that like she was going to get rid of the bros. Man, that is a very weak defining moment, isn't it?

Do you have a better one? It's still red on my screen. I don't know if I do, because I did listen to that one, because I was like, okay, I wonder which are the new era ones. I know you guys talked about the beginning of the season with Carolyn's cold open,

and I thought that could be it. Honestly, I struggle with that one too. I think of all 46 seasons, that might've been the one that I had the most difficulty with, because of the ones that we haven't covered yet, I think I have something for almost all of them that i was like i think i could that could be it there's like one or two 44 i don't know what defines the season enough it really is just

like the ticas it's something about the ticas it could be carolyn yeah i don't know there's no defining tica moment it was too consistent through this there's just like yeah it's just it's just like a smorgasbord of just stuff, of Tika stuff. It's just like a shot of Tika, but that's not what we're doing here. It's meant to be a moment, but that one is tough. I still have one other red one that we haven't gotten to.

So I'm excited to get to that with the bingo balls. And then 46, we ended up going with the I'm pissed moment, but I wanted Maria not voting for Charlie. Do you have a good one on that debate? What did you guys do for 46 they ended up doing Liz saying she was talking Shannon why don't you get the bingo ball spinning so we can just get right into it yeah

46 I could do Maria voting for Charlie that definitely capped the season off I don't know if I define this season what was the moment you guys picked we picked the Liz meltdown Liz meltdown that's another one. That's pretty good.

There's also a hide and seek. I think I ended up suggesting hide and seek first. Yeah. Liz meltdown could be it. That one's tough because it's like that has like the least age to it. So it's like, I don't know exactly what defines that one for me at the moment, because it's the most recent. I think that history will be kind to maria not voting for

charlie well i don't think the fan base was kind to maria no i could see that one i think that was a really strong reaction it really ends the season that's what you're gonna remember walking away from that season i think thank you pretty i could see that yeah yeah and also it defines it in that she like didn't you know like voting out your ally not voting for your ally type of theme so it's also thematic right that history will be kind to that one so all right that's what we did 25 21 seasons now we're gonna get through 25 we're excited about it and which one's up first pull the first bingo ball and it must be so hard for you to like jump around pretty because it was no rhyme or reason it was bingo ball defined um i've

pulled in the way that the bingo ball loves great survivor seasons and we're carrying on that tradition i've pulled redemption island oh wow oh boy ascending orders but we're gonna end on like the best season that's like i mean like bottom two of my seasons of all time like great it might be my least favorite i mean the one i gotta throw out first and foremost is boston rob carrying his family on his back it wasn't the winning moment for him but it represents how that was such a coronation for him from a production perspective and a player perspective the image of him doing that really tough challenge where they're building the stairs and him running to the top and And again, it wasn't the final immunity challenge, but like it was

such a big victory for him that I do think it encompasses the overall dominance he had of the season. Yeah. Do we count the reunions? I don't think we put David Murphy proposing. Oh, we can't do that? Oh, OK. No, we do because

Rogue wanted to do that in terms of Sia giving Ty the money. So no David david murphy proposals okay that's fine um that would be that would be a crazy way to define redemption island i feel like redemption island much like tika has to be defined in boston rob a couple people to chat are saying rob throwing the idol clue into the volcano that is what i thought of what about the what about the map line side is that a thing that's the other one i had the map line side is good yeah you know what actually i like the map blind side? Is that a thing? Yeah, that's the other one I had. The map blind side is good. Yeah, you know what? Actually, I like the map blind side

because I think it represents, A, again, the Rob dominance that he was the one that said pretty much both times, okay, Matt, you're going to go. I think it represents the Redemption Island concept where this guy comes back into the game and get immediately voted out. It's able to accomplish two things at once.

It's like getting where Matt was. Like Redemption Island is the name of the season that is the focal twist and matt represents that best he does come back he gets sent right back and it's at the hands of rob the winner who is this four-time player who is dominating but the image of rob standing there is more ingrained i don't have a single image of my in my head of the matt blindside per se but i do have rob standing over the volcano laughing with his hands in the air, like chucking the clue behind him. So if I could see the chat saying that as well.

So, but I, I, I wrote down Matt, the Matt blindside, like just the votes coming in and everyone's just like shock and awe. Yeah. I do think that that's the vote defining vote, but isn't the defining moment. I do think the image of the volcano is what stands out in my mind the chat's also saying russell getting voted out but like it has to be like they're giving some philip stuff and it has to be and the thing is that we talked about this last time i would say the defining moment of the season does not mean the

moment you like the most i think it is not always going to be the same thing if it was it would be the david murphy proposal so you know why do you love that so much? I don't. It's just, it's just such a highlight. Look, first of all, there's nothing wrong with love. Even if it falls apart like one season later. It's just, you know, cringe. It's just really cringy. Look, I want to say.

We get a moment like that every season of The Bachelor, like a proposal that's not going to work out at the very end. It's pretty much the whole point of that show. I put together two lists, like the two wolves inside of everyone. One is the answer to work out at the very end. It's pretty much the whole point of that show. So I put together two lists, like the two wolves inside of everyone. One is the answer that I think makes the most sense. And one is the answer that I think makes the least sense. So there you go.

Oh, and we get to pick which one is which that's a fun game. All right. Well, let's put this to a vote because I feel like it's between Rob throwing the clue in the volcano and the Matt blindside. Shannon, where are you leaning?

I think I'm going volcano. I mean, I have the, the map blindside in my spreadsheet, but just like thinking about it now, like that's just the moment that, that's like what came to my head first. And then I overthought it.

I'll go with the Matt Blindside just to leave it to Pritam, make his first vote a difficult one. Okay. I mean, I wrote down Matt Blindside. That was my number one pick, but I do love the image of that. But I also don't want to spend too much time thinking about this season so i'm gonna go with the map blind side okay all right that is

what i said but it like originally and then i changed now i've been outfitted so okay and i should be going with the bingo ball yeah so there we go redemption we're slowly but surely i thought we had crossed a lot of the paths of some of the least recorded seasons and shannon has already dropped a bingo ball you know i i thought he'd have it on the first one, so you did define my expectations by it happening on the second. The bingo ball dropped. The cat tried to get it. It's a whole thing. I have nowhere to put the bingo ball, so they're just going in my pocket.

So after this, I'm just going to have pockets full of bingo balls. You're going to be like Rupert in Heroes vs. Villains. I finally got a good and also easy season. Micronesia. 16. I think we should hand this off to the next ball much like Eric handed the necklace off to Natalie. season. Micronesia. 16. Yeah. I think we should hand this off to the next ball, much like Eric hand the necklace off to Natalie.

Yeah. I want to give immunity to Natalie. Yeah. That's probably one of the easiest ones. I mean, you can argue. I mean, if we do a podcast of like,

what are the defining moments of survivor? That would be in the top five, let alone. Yeah. Is that the defining moment? But is it, I in the top five let alone yeah is that the defining moment but is it i want to give immunity to natalie or is it the confessionals all being given in like we see them all or is it all of that and that's enough of the moment in and of itself i think it has to be eric saying i want to give individual immunity to natalie yeah because i think that's like while while the confessionals were nice it's the image

it's the sequence that we see the most it is the culmination of the dominance of the black widow brigade i think second most from a memorability perspective would probably be it's an effing stick but it can't hold a candle yeah i mean there's like the aussie blind side it's nothing sick like in other these those moments are more iconic and memorable than some other seasons have whole moments as their defining moment if that makes sense but that's how iconic micronesia is there could be like five but this is by far yeah ozzy has had a lot of whole moments i think the pre-marriage is underrated chet hits his head that's a good one and joel didn't care yeah you know that's a good one was that was that on your that was on my list that was you know

top two okay okay well my cat is just waiting for her next bingo ball to drop down she's just like lying in a way um okay the the bingo ball machine now like good seasons because i got heroes versus villains oh right now this is an interesting one do we go this's really hard. It's actually way harder than you think. Because I think the reflex one, obviously, talking about memorable moments, would be Parvati talking about the debaucherous little villains and green bananas turning yellow with her double idol play. Yes.

But there's also, so these are the ones I had. So I had those two in my tier A, that one, and JT actually giving the note right yeah or like xoxo jt when they're like reading it how much is that a side of the times by the way there was so 2010 gossip girl but then i also have the typhon boot a little bit left and then i don't know about that we have we had that when we talked about um yeah the best quotes of all time it defined sandra's win um yeah i mean sandra beating poverty is a huge moment that is talked about to this day you could say that the end result the image of sandra going like this with the tiara

at the reunion right just the two uh the tyson move is the tyson vote out is could easily be a defining moment on any other season but that's what makes heroes versus villains such a such a heavy hitter uh i i think you could have like rupert and stephanie getting injured as like the defining moment on a different season and it doesn't crack the top five because heroes versus villains could do a defining moment of my toe got cracked jeff and colby break up on national could do a defining moment of every episode. My toe got cracked. Jeff and Colby Jeff and Colby break up on national television over a chocolate, piece of chocolate. That is one of my favorite moments.

Colby taking it out on his brother. Right? Yeah, damn it, Reed. Come on, Reed. So, yeah, it's tough. Like, I don't want to be that basic bitch, but I think what the parv double idol play does have is, granted, like, I think the season very much revolves around Russell and it's not, in fact, to Russell's chagrin, it's not a Russell-invol have is granted like I think the season very much revolves around Russell and it's not in fact to Russell's chagrin

it's not a Russell involved moment but I think it does speak to the dominance of the villains and while JT writing the letter is like an image this does feel like a little bit of a culmination of that as well like having JT curse damn it once the second idol shows up realizing that like the entire

plan that they tried to pull off went up in smoke I mean again this is one where it's tough for me to divorce like an iconic defining moment of survivor history versus a defining moment of this season but it's tough to beat for me yeah i do think it's because it's the culmination you say it doesn't involve russell but it does like it involves everyone that's still there it's a reason jt goes home so it definitely is the culmination of the letter and handing the idol russell's left out of that so it does define his relationship with poverty and how complex that is and will continue to get it does have everything and who can forget the jt then says don't trust women and that was what he

took from that moment which is not a good way to self-assess and he never watched gossip girl again well that was probably a really good thing for him because it was all downhill from 2010 from when they were playing so is it that is it i mean we're looking to be basic bitches that's the point it's meant to be the most like first come to mind thing yeah yeah i wrote parv's idol play there's a couple of great moments but i think it comes down to that at the end of the day that's just the biggest one if it's 10 episodes or whatever eight episodes on episodes gets up to this moment it swells it's huge volcano goes off then uh the rest right we're gonna get to that one too but i just feel like at that point the rest of the way doesn't

nearly define the season as much even if even if we do talk more a lot about sandra becoming the first two-time winner but and that's the other thing is that the season was quite literally heroes versus villains this is the first time they faced off and the villains proved that they won and that would go on to spell pretty much the entirety of the post-merge yeah the villains win that battle poverty saves sandra and jerry um so there's also stuff there you can everyone is involved amanda's like you know what like that whole episode but i think it's like it all culminates in that moment so we get fantastic amanda go eyes that comes into play um you know it it it's it takes the entire pre-merge to build up to this moment the merge this is why like the not a

completely different topic but they earn the merge needs to go away because this is why you need these moments the merge the first time in the season is the climax the first half of the season so good anyway yeah i gotta think it's gotta be this moment it defines it you could have like amanda bad lying to poverty and like again that could be a bigger defining moment than some seasons have right and it's not the biggest of this episode it might not even be's not the biggest of this episode. It might not even be in the top three of this episode. Like poverty,

giving up immunity. There's so many. Can we rewatch Heroes vs. Villains? Let's just do that. Let's just put that on. Listen, it's even got a month and a half

until Survivor. Might as well. All right. But for now, the bingo ball awaits. We got two really good seasons back to back, but they were fairly,

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Head to salesforce.com slash careers to learn more. This one I actually also think is not easy. There's two options, but we got all stars we're going to the returning seasons at the moment a lot of boston rob today the bingo ball machine is feeling very boston robbie so again i'll go back to basic bitch corner and i will say is it the look out for her if you can if you can is it you take care of her i'll take care of you if you can yeah yeah i or the question is is it that or is it the subsequent follow up of like, I said that and I can't, you know, of the actual sort of breakup of the alliance between Lex and Boston Rob. So this is one that I was like, it's definitely that quote.

It's such an iconic image and nothing could top it. And then I thought of one. I go back to what sometimes happens on the bachelor but much more rare than the than the david carolina stuff than the full month oh the real proposal i mean i thought that i wasn't sure if i should include the reunions or yeah i think this is arguably the most famous reunion moment in survivor history that's a very good point i was i was between that. I was between the proposal and then the Lex and Rob of it all.

But I was like, if I'm including the finale, technically it happened before the votes were read. Right. So like you could even include it if you're not going to go for the reunion part where it's after the game is already over at that point. Hell, if you're watching the episode on Paramount plus,

it's going to include the vote reveal in the finale. And that's what matters. Even more important. I think if a reunion moment is the most defining moment, that would fine i just think we're not gonna know it doesn't really count as a reunion moment but i i think it is because look yes it is technically outside of the game being over while they're in this purgatorial space before the votes are read but the season was defined by like the first out and out survivor romance that this was a pair of two people that maybe arguably some would say shouldn't have been on All-Stars in the first place. And then joining up together inexplicably, you know, falling in love with each other while also ramming roughshod over the course of the game.

And so, well, I think does it like define the gameplay that Rob was doing like All-Stars, which was what the Lex and Rob moment does have the benefit of is kind of representing what All-Stars was, which was this initial idea of pre-existing relationships coming in and seeing what Survivor was going to be in this new form and how tough that was on people. But like the proposal was such a big moment yeah i think i think the proposal probably is like the overall essence of the season it's the cap of it all whereas again we're talking about the merge where the players come together they're all the all-stars on one beach and uh it results in what turns into the proposal well the eventual final two i gotta go with the proposal though at the very end the final two of it all i think that i think that like a part of me originally wrote the robin lex conversation what the at the whatever that challenge was but yeah i think that i think

the proposal defines it the best yeah it's interesting that we i feel like we all had the same thought process where it was like oh it's definitely that moment and sticks out so much in our mind. But yeah, All Stars was the first season I ever watched in full. As a child, I started watching Pearl Island. I'm so sorry. Yeah, well, I loved it. No, as a child, I was like this romance. I didn't care about Lex.

I was like, stop getting in the way of love. And then I found The Bachelor. Stop cock-blocking Lex. Well, I think that's what it is. It's like, how do we define the season? Robin, Lex, with Amber, to be fair, because you take care of her i'll take care of you she is a her three tickets for challengers please but do we look at it like that or do we look at it like robin amber's relationship defines the season because then i feel like it has to be the proposal it's so iconic

in her i love rob shirt i recently showed this clip to chrissy in the green room of talking tribal because she'd never heard of boston. And I was like, you got to learn your history. And so I showed her all of this clip of the proposal. So yeah, I don't know. It's so iconic. It starts, it starts in episode one. It carries itself into the merge.

It carries itself into the finale. It's a season long defining storyline. And it creates a marriage. Yeah, it does. And like this shifts a bit of a meta where I go, I did a whole video on this where i looked at like how impactful was this dynamic duo showmance that we got with robin amber and it does put a target on like there's never been nearly as much of a successful romance in the

history of the show as in relation to the show itself on the season because of robin amber they are like the black widow brigade with like all women's alliances you know now we can't let the the people that are falling for each other do anything they can't pull robin amber from like 20 years ago yeah so yeah i don't know i think it defines it not cock blocking people no i think that um i think we're all kind of leaning this way it does feel kind of wrong not to have you take care of her i'll take care of you if you can if you can it's so iconic boston rob and it is so iconic all-stars but and it does and it does also like if he doesn't do that do they ever get married you know like if lex then doesn't help him i mean and then like i think they never made an argument between like biggest move biggest like the for me the word define what defines that moment is a little bit more like in the conversation as opposed to, we could easily reword the topic of the podcast to something different.

And I think you would not include the proposal, but I think what the word define is in this case, defining the word define. And I think that that is what we're looking at. Let's go back to your friends argument, Shan, that you used with the first one. I think people would remember All-Stars as the one where Boston Rob and Amber get together. Right. The one where Boston Rob The one with the proposal. Wait, which one?

The proposal. That actually is an episode. And that's the fun thing we should do, is what friends episodes and Survivor seasons can we also now that's what I'm going to try. And that's when we're talking about Redemption Island again now. all comes full circle one where joey threw the sandwich into the volcano the one where rob is fine um okay cat's still waiting here for her balls this one's also good and easy it's probably i should read the number out because i feel like i'm

taking an eye test every time i have to squint hey don't insult the balls mike i will chew the balls with you every time i have 35 years of insulting the balls this is my dojo okay well um dead grandma yeah i wrote that but i was like you know could you make a case for the outcast twist is there any relevance there to being like i mean the outcast it's interesting because pearl islands is the one that has one of the most like aesthetic themes right with the pirate thing and that's the one that calls closest to it but it also ties back to the theme when rupert says in the very first episode pirates lie pirates steal and johnny fairplay tells one of the biggest lies in survivor in survivor history there yeah like rupert stealing shoes i also had in the second column i had the outcast in the

second i think that actually got voted at the All-Stars reunion as, like, the best moment in Survivor history, if I'm remembering correctly. Yeah, I think it did. But the Dead Grandma Lie is, like, as we say, like, top five defining moment of the season. I think we said top three defining. We did Snakes and Rats, Dead Grandma Lie, Scoobin' Falling in the Fire.

Yeah, and then probably Eric giving up the necklace. Yeah, that's the Mount Rushmore. So if you're on the Mount Rushmore of Survivor moments ever, you get on the Mount Rushmore of Survivor moments ever, you get on the Defining season. Right. Yeah. I think also like you could, it's got a skosh of Sandra in there as well.

Like if you include Sandra's like very unamused reaction of like, okay, I don't believe anything that he's doing or I don't care what happened to his grandma, then that also includes about the Sandra Fairplay narrative too. Yeah. I mean, I quote, I quote, she died, dude. Probably like top five quotes. that's actually a different season a different podcast that we did but i hope that you're not quoting it in like a way that's really relevant yeah no no no nobody's dying it's more of

uh just you know just there could be a lot of ways death it could be like oh dying inside i'll just say hopefully well no then you say so much for my dreams so much for my dreams that's a great one i love again literally did this podcast yeah so you're like the way that you would use that quote again a different podcast that we did would be like oh how's your will to live today she died dude she died and it's just the dude it's the dude part of it um and my wife my wife is british and she don't they don't use the word dude as much over there so she just makes it like even funnier when she says it because she just don't use the word dude as much over there. So she just makes it like even funnier when she says it. Cause he just doesn't use the word dude in her vernacular. She doesn't like anglicize it.

Be like, she died chap. Yeah. Right. Oh, she died, bruv. I,

um, it is, it's like, it's like you couldn't write it funnier that because that's not the way someone would tell someone that their grandma died. So the fact that that's how we, and the fact that he has to be reminded, it's a great moment.

All right. And Thunder D coming out. Come on. You got the. Final seven. And the fact that he's not. And the reveal after the moment when it comes back. And Lil, anyway.

Let's pretty much go to the islands too. I remember watching it as a child so again these are the moments where like rob proposing like these are the things that i think people remember also this has become such a fun game of who can get to the falling bingo balls first meal the cat it's a game of high stakes because i don't want to get to it um great seasons at the moment the bingo ball machine is out of it we're pulling you like these are like the biggest of the ones that are left yeah well we got rid of all the bad ones in the first part for you that's true yeah it's with stupid rob who cares um david versus goliath wow oh this

is okay so this is interesting because i feel like there are memorable moments and then there are moments that kind of inform the thematics of the season. Let me go back to my heroes versus villains example of why the merge vote served as a perfect example of heroes and villains facing off. If we lose that logic, could the minority vote split on John Hennigan or even the idol nullifier Bing be an example of David versus Goliath? So here's where i sit with that that was where i originally

thought of it because that defines david versus goliath honestly there was so much going on in the davids getting these little wins and then like kind of toppling the whole power structure that even i kind of struggle with like wait what was played when there was like the john vote there was the dan vote there was a nullifier there was a vote steal there was the Dan vote, there was a nullifier, there was a vote steal, there was an idol. It was a lot going on. So I think that is the defining concept. But I don't know if there's one moment for me that stands out definitely as much as, Natalie, can I have your jacket? Or a rights negotiation, yeah. Yeah, so when we say something like Caleb almost dying in Korong as an example, for me me that wasn't necessarily as thematic it's the

biggest moment is it also the defining moment does it define angelina does it define kind of the humor of the season and then because it's the biggest moment is that enough to make it i i feel like now that i'm thinking about this i did write down um the minority split vote with uh nick and davy and christian and i think now that you bring up all this like defining it doesn't incorporate literally everyone because it is really like the trio they even technically leave out gabby and i i don't know if carl was involved in the minority split vote or not um but i do also feel like if we're looking at david versus goliath this is the defining moment of david slaying goliath and taking out uh what's his face the the mayor of slam town and he's like the biggest goliath and they get him with the tiniest rock a split vote of the minority players that to

me defines and it really is like it's it's bigger, in my opinion, than the next one with the Dan Idol thing. I think that that kind of feels like it's emblematic of that David Goliath moment. Well, let me add another one that could serve as a thematic example and is probably more memorable. Christian Hubicki talks for six hours to defeat Alec, another David. That's my second tier. I feel like if you're going for a character moment, that's not I mean, that David defeating another Goliath. That's good. That's good. That's in my second tier. I feel like if you're going for a character moment, that's not,

I mean, that is David beating Goliath. So I guess that is defined. But I think if you're going character, you're going the Angelina jacket moment. If you're going

David's beating the Goliath, you have like the minority vote split. And I feel like while Christian's moment is a part of those two, it's just not nearly as big as either one

in either of those categories, if that makes sense. So right. It's tough because we have this is a very fun season full of big characters there's also moments that are full of like big gameplay there's not one that really encompasses both i think that's the impasse is like we have to figure out which direction we want to go for this season i also think of like davey though with the with the jacket slant he gets the jacket and he slams it right after he takes out the mayor of slam town he goes Davey Rick and back or whatever like takes down the mayor this is in the following episode to be fair but it incorporated it focused it factors into my thought process of like what defines it and that is definitely for

me one of the biggest moments just seeing the the result after a jacket moment and it's not the Angelina jacket moment, that would... No, but it helps. It's a little like, you know, it's like a cherry on top. Yeah. I really want to argue for the jacket moment because I just feel like,

and for me, look, minority vote splits like revolutionized the game. I know, this feels like you putting down one of your own children and arguing against minority vote splits. I love minority vote splits. Believe me, I like now, whenever anyone just does some random vote, I mean, now with Sean in the dark, I'm like, oh, how are they splitting on Sean in the dark? The one with the minority vote split. I love the minority vote split. Believe me, I like now whenever anyone just does some random vote, I mean,

now with Sean in the dark, I'm like, oh, how are they splitting on Sean in the dark? The one with the minority vote split. Yeah. Yeah. Look, it opened up strategic implications that I love 100%. The one where the David slayed the Goliath. But that's not a moment. Like, that did happen. That defines it.

That defines it. They took out, that's where they started the steamroll. What's the picture? What's the image of the minority votes? But compared to Natalie, can I have your jacket? I can see Angelina in my mind's eye standing awkwardly. It defines Angelina. You could do rice negotiation.

You could do the latter for Angelina. Like she's such a big part of that season. You could take a snapshot, but I also feel like a moment could just be like a brief period of time. It doesn't have to be like a single second in time it's just it's a you know a good 30 seconds or so of that reveal with uh you know uh what's his face again i keep forgetting his name john uh you know just laughing and going you got uh guys and i don't know i think i think the theme and i think that it incorporates itself so well into David versus Goliath as a theme itself,

where the Davids finally take over the Goliaths for the first time all season. And they did it with the tiniest of rocks. And it's not the idol nullifier. The Bing is good. For me, it's probably like second or third or something like that. Look, we've defined define. Now we're defining moment. What is a moment?

A moment is a very brief period of time. Let's Google it. I genuinely, like Angelina and the jacket is the biggest moment. I think it's so big that it's defining. I think it's bigger than any of the other ones in a way that it's defining. I don't know if I agree. I don't know. Because it's so like relegated to like the first five episodes,

but it doesn't really define anything beyond that. Plus like the Davids don't really get there. Like they're just sort of meld with the glass and it's also like and i i feel like the comparison to the kayla moment is maybe a little faulty because the reason the reasons why we picked the kayla medivac is because it was the season with the most medivacs in survivor history it wasn't just oh there was one big medivac and then the rest of it was a regular season and yes the season is full of lovable angelina delulu moments but i do feel like protean puts forward a very good argument about i mean i i don't know what people would say though going back to the friends argument is david versus goliath the one with the minority vote or the one with the david slay the goliaths is what he's yeah so or the biggest

goliath of them all the one where angelina doesn't get the jacket no the one with natalie can i have your jacket one with the jacket and eggs the one with the jacket the one literally that's the friends which might is that a friend that's a fine this season i'm i'm i will it's a bit controversial i'm gonna go with peridium here i will go with the minority that's very controversial mike i um it's the first one i had but i just feel like that i was like oh the jacket this is a case where it's like this is i mean we just talked about a few seasons where it's pretty easy like oh the most memorable moment is the defining moment this is the rare season where that's not the case in my opinion upsetting but even like when like when was all the when was the was the minority vote split when they played christian's idol it's when they play it's when

they play christian's idol dan played an idol on angelina but they had split enough votes onto john hennigan to get him out yeah it's good moments great i'm like i'm arguing against minority vote split okay it tears me apart inside that's not what i want okay but all right i'll take the loss because of time yeah we have a lot of seasons to get to yeah and this one is my cases all right well okay oh well this is i think this is a pretty easy slam dunk. Yeah. You know, chopping those coconuts. Yeah. Knocking them down, revealing the pecking order, getting the first time the underdogs kind of David versus Goliath a little bit. I would argue that like this could be a low key moment, defining moment in Survivor history in terms of like the the echoes it played in the rest of the game.

You talk about the effect of Rob and Amber, but like what happens if this doesn't happen? Does the prevailing survivor strategy just become what it's been the previous three seasons of like whoever has the most numbers at the merge wins? Yeah. Yeah. So is it the vote itself? Or is it like the Sean confessional of checkmate, bro?

Always bet on black. That's a good one. I think it's a top challenge. I feel like for me, yeah, I been on black. That's a good one. I think it's a top challenge. I feel like for me, yeah, I was going to say it's the coconuts falling and then you see them on the bench. Yeah. Looking around like. Sean and me looking around being like, you see what they're doing.

That's the image. Because that's the first time where it really is driven home. Like this is the catalyst that creates a completely different, which we've never seen through four seasons, you know? So. Yeah, I agree. And I had rocks in the second column. So I think in terms of like, if the Friends quotes,

that would be like the one with the purple rock, but I don't know if it defines the season. I don't think it would be that. I think it would be... I don't think it defines it either. Yeah, I feel like it's probably the least iconic rock draw. Like for me there are so many ways i've been doing this for seven years this is this is how i get into the

weeds like how do i after several years right i've i'm like okay i could talk about both of these moments and stick them into completely different top five top ten lists because you just change the word define to biggest to greatest to most epic and so here we're talking about every week it's a new most epic bigger balls yeah that's what i found uh the end of the list of ways to drive myself insane you added a new one onto it i think you just i feel like when we're defining the moment i think it's not the purple rock that defines Marquesas, but I don't know. No, I think it's gotta be the moment of the moment of,

of them sitting at the challenge. I really respect how much you care about the word define and the topic. Oh, I get very particular. You at some point you have to, that's like the debate team. Otherwise I'm just like doing the same topics over and over again forever, which may happen at some point in my life i don't know we'll see if i'm doing this and it's

like survivor 75 and i'm like going back to the old water well i love it well yeah this is what defining is we've defined define which is so great and meta all right the words lost all meaning at this point well no we've found the meaning we've defined it and i people said um yeah kathy peeing on john's hand well that's not the that's not the number one moment of the season unfortunately another um friend's reference right yeah there we go when they got stung by jellyfish yeah when um chandler did chandler peel monica yes that is what it is forget who peed on who um we have fiji and we also have a guest to bring on to help us with survival finally took two weeks happy anniversary kieran two weeks later i feel like i should plug in my

headphones i don't know if y'all you sound fine you're good pretty do you know that we bring in people from the chat who are nice i saw you guys bring in somebody last week that our last podcast so yeah no the last time was three weeks ago and i know listen karen we were we were uh flush with very fun guests we had a lot to get to but we made some room to bring you on how are you doing tonight uh i'm i'm doing very well. My fiance's graduation was yesterday. So we drove. I'm in Orlando right now.

So we drove all the way down to Miami. She graduated. We went to dinner and got back at like 12. So I was very groggy this morning for work. But yeah, it went really well. And I literally thought like, okay, you know, the first week, well, you guys had said, if someone has an anniversary, and I was like, it's me. It's my time.

Like, not a wedding anniversary. No, for like, when we started dating. I'll allow it. Oh, okay. But you can make you could get married this day next year and make this day your anniversary in so many ways. Well, we kind of already have a date. No, change it, Kieran!

To be honest, we actually changed it today. Oh! Today? It's been a year? No, we didn't change it to today, but it was February 9th until we realized that was the Super Bowl. I was kind of like, do we want everyone on their phone

at our wedding? That doesn't really seem like a good idea. That's good. You'll see who really cares. Probably kind of cheaper. Not a lot of traffic. Everyone's just at a bar. Yeah, I've seen people have weddings on, like, 4th of July

and sometimes even New Year's Eve. I went to a wedding on New Year's Eve. Kind of annoying. Well, Kieran, let's talk about a different memorable date in the past, though, not in the future. Wait, Kieran, let's talk about a different memorable date in the past, though not in the future. Wait, Kieran first. I know Big Brother soon. Do you have cats? So I'm

sorry to disappoint you. I do not have cats. Kieran, you're going to have to change your wedding date and you're going to have to get a cat. I don't know what to tell you. Before Shannon radically changes Kieran's life from the ground up, what in your opinion is the defining moment of Survivor Fiji? Survivor Fiji? Oh, is that the one we're on right now?

So my gap in Survivor is between season 10 to season 31. I started watching Millennials vs. Gen X when it came out. And so then I kept watching every season. I was a Big Brother fan first. I've been watching that since I was 11. Eventually, I hopped on Big Brother. I'm sorry, am I disappointing you? You're going to have to keep up Big Brother and watch 21 seasons and get a cat and change your wedding.

I don't know what to tell you. It's been two weeks in the making. Okay, okay. I see the first two, but you're telling me we're we're not watching big brother is that okay open your mind it's actually wonderful but um i don't feel like that's me being close to just watching both shows but anyway all right well i don't know if uh i'm i'm educating you on survivor history but if i may throw out an opening bid here for this discussion it was considered in the preview of this season

to be called by Jeff the most controversial decision in Survivor history. Is it as simple as either Dreams not giving up immunity to Yao Man or Yao Man making the car deal at the challenge with Dreams? Making the deal. The one with the car deal, right?

It's the one about the truck. The one with the truck deal. This is still about Survivor Fiji? Yeah. Okay, in Survivor Fiji, this is going to be a spoiler for Survivor Fiji, but in Survivor Fiji, Yao Man won the car and Dreams won the car. And so he said, if I give you the car, then you have to give me immunity at the final four. And they made that deal, and then Dreams did win immunity at the final four,

and he did not give up immunity. And then Yao Man, spoiler alert, got got sent home and that was super controversial because and we looked at it through history i feel like it has a different lens then and now but definitely killed one large pipeline of a sponsor to survivors if we talk about legacy it certainly is the last car deal the last car sponsor. I think we're all on board. Kieran, just vote with us and get a cat. Yeah, if everyone is down with that, then sure. Especially since I haven't seen the season yet.

I'm making my way through. I'm re-watching the old ones. All right. I believe in you. Good luck with your wedding, Kieran. Yeah, good luck. I hope you've picked a new date, and I hope everything goes well with the wedding planning.

If you need someone to apparently make over your life, I think you've found a person in the form of Shannon. She's giving you a to-do list. Sounds like a great life to me. I already have a wedding to-do list right now. I don't know how many more to-do lists I need. There are like 18 things at least that are just on my mind. Well, thank you so much for coming on, Karen. Apologies that it was a little belated, but better late than never. Happy anniversary. Yeah. Yes. thank you so much for coming on karen apologies that it was a little belated but better late than never and happy anniversary yeah yes thank you so much yeah have a great night

all right there we go all right we've done that one okay here we go there's a i was gonna say there's a good book i read that's called the lie about the truck it was written only a couple of years ago and it's all about survivor if youor, which you might if you're on this podcast, I would definitely check it out. It's on Amazon. I'm looking at it. I actually have it, but I'm like, it's a pretty good book, and it talks a lot about Survivor, reality TV, and, yeah,

the lie about the truck. Well, that just shows how iconic that moment is. I did have the Edgardo blindside, like, definitely when the face was all full of the four horsemen. I feel like that's a moment, but the one with the truck deal is definitely the truck. Okay. What do I... Africa.

Oh, this is a really interesting one. I was going to do the exact same thing. I'm like, this is the one of all 25 that I think I struggle with the most of these 25. No, I thought that too. And then I thought, this defines the season. This defines the win a bit. This defines the vibe of history.

The first challenge throw into Silas getting swapped. Screwed the one with, what was it called? The twist. Is that the episode? I mean, the twist was the name of the episode. I would say the twist is more defining then.

Cause I do agree that this is a case where we were just getting into, right. Where I think the challenge throw itself was a big moment, but i don't know if it's like a defining moment so the swap itself yeah i think that's fine yeah i thought about yeah i thought like my it's just weird again because we're going back to like the the first i guess episode five um and i feel like there's interesting because we go from argument to argument with like cope wrongwrong episode four. And then we're talking about Natalie in the jacket and David Goliath, which is like episode five. But I'm like, I guess this is for the wrong retro for the first for the third season. It's like I guess it would be the first time they implemented a really huge twist in the show.

Yeah, it's tough because like it didn't necessarily have a huge impact on the season because once the tribes merged then like right it all kind of just baron just basically got together again i mean i would say like maybe another thing would it be the like lex going after kelly i did think about like lex looking at the witch hunt trying to figure out who voted for him line to lex t-bird line but i'm like ah and that's such a good that is a big moment on this season it might be my runner up maybe i don't know but i do think the twist the latter half of the season is very much defined by lex and the fact that he he kind of hoists himself by his own petard but i don't know if it's like that big of a moment that it feels like that defines the entirety of the season i don't think it does I don't think it does. I don't think it does.

This might be another case where this speaks to almost a larger implication in survivor history, like the coconut shop, then it does like specifically define and this definitely has less of a case than the coconut shop. But I mean, it is such a monumental for lack of a better term twist in the course of the rest of survivor history. Yeah. It's's very important from a production evolution perspective.

I think it does matter to the strategy of the season because they throw the challenge and that's how it gets into them eventually having dominance as a thematic concept, at least. Might be the first challenge throw in the history of the show.

It is. I guess Richard not trying. like well actually okay the first yes yes okay yeah and silas falling to that i think is a really big moment yeah because he was the guy that was like the big power player of the first it ages well so i don't know silas getting screwed you know what's yeah so maybe that's I think that was that was my number one yeah I think it's gotta be that and to your point episode five but that's almost halfway

through the season in Africa that's true it was like 13 episodes yeah I mean if you don't like all of these early episodes defining it let's change the Caleb moment together pretty you can make it a tie and then we can debate it again Let's change the Caleb moment together, Pretty. You can make it a tie and then we can debate it again. Listen, there might be another Caleb

moment that happened halfway through a season that we can talk about with another season here. What about Big Tom putting a feather in his butt, acting like a chicken? No? Not good enough? Alright. That's a nice runner-up. Maybe not. A little bit of a second runner-up. Bronze medalist

nope about as bronze as the late Kim Johnson would you give this a five star bingo ball thing

no I mean the numbers are tiny I feel like the bingo ball machine is hard to maneuver I feel like you've lost him a lot

is that the fault of the machine or is it is it like that's on you but like there's a give and take it's not if it could be bigger right like, there's a give and take. It's not...

If it could be bigger, right? Like the opening and... No, I mean, the machine itself is kind of small. Okay. And that's fine. It's hard to get the balls out, but that might be a skill issue. Right.

The fact that I don't have anyone to put the balls... We'll have to do a third podcast with the bingo ball and... We'll have to. Otherwise, this is a waste of time. I mean, literally, look, they're all in my pocket. Like, this is what I'm like... like they're tiny yeah i know i hope i don't like accidentally put this in the wash without taking the bingo balls all right which of the tiny balls do you have your hands on the tiny balls i have the tiny caramon ball caramon all right so there's

a couple i think that could be yeah i mean i think the first thing we go to is like the most memorable one which is uh the three amigos tribal council interesting so there's three yeah so i didn't even have that did you have uh take out your teeth i had the dawn and brenda controversy yeah but i've also thought like you got the brand enhance meltdown in episode five which does define i think a lot of the negativity and oddness that caramon is known for i do feel like it kind of defines it kind of well which is kind of bad but like the overall feeling but then i'm like you know the brendan dawn it probably uh eclipses what happens in the pre-merge and it also has this icky weird vibe feeling at the end of it all

that's no i think that's a very good point i think as well if you talk about like uh will maria not voting for charlie be the one that stands the test of time for 46 i do feel like it wasn't as direct as like dawn votes brenda out and then brenda leads the charge to not vote dawn to win but like certainly something that was the thing to talk about this point that brenda finished second in the fan favorite polling despite being purple until her boot i think there's i mean yeah so that those are the two i had three amigos i think the three amigos is the biggest moment yes it's defining that's the question we're gonna ask you'd have hold up bro which is smaller than three amigos it's a honorable mention and then with you know um dawn taking out a teeth you could have the family visit as like connected to that where brenda gives up the

family visit and then watches them on that pontoon but i do think that these are all kind of runners up to the three amigos or dawn taking out a teeth so given that the three amigos i think is the biggest moment is taking out the teeth defining enough to the three amigos i think is the biggest moment is taking out the teeth defining enough to eclipse the i will say my personal i would probably still go with dawn and brenda just because the i'd agree when i think of caramon i do generally get like a a mixed emotional feeling inside when when i consider the entire season and the three amigos are more of like a side plot that blows up after a few episodes into the merge but i don't know if it for me defines like beat by beat the feeling with uh i feel like

the don brendan encapsulates the shamar the brandon the philipness the yeah lunchbox you know it just sort of all comes to a head with it's just a series of like slightly unpleasant unpleasant moments until we get to the end of it with uh teeth gate and and the the you know the final travel so yeah you're saying that it defines how we think back on the season and go yeah a little bit i think like the reason why again i think the liz moment ended up winning out for 46 is because we thought it really invoked how wildly emotional and funny 46 was over again, like what you remember about the season. This definitely evokes the tone more and is more memorable. I would say that the Three Amigos Tribal Council is more memorable in the course of Survivor history because you could argue it is one of the first live tribal councils in the show's history.

But I still think in terms of representing and defining the season it goes to brenda and dodd yeah i mean malcolm is so defining for me that's what made me a super fan was that malcolm double i was so in love with him that i um watched i became a full super fan from that alone and so that was very defining for me but it's hard because neither of those moments are a Cochran moment. And Cochran's incredibly OTT edit and him winning is such a big part of that season. But I would also say that like Cochran was not nearly as much of a character as he was in 23 either. He does already have a defining moment.

He already got one, right? You guys picked that for South Pacific? The Cochran flip? Yeah, we did. He already got one, right? You guys picked that for South Pacific? The Cochran flip? Yeah, we did. Maybe if we were Jeff Probst defining moments,

it would be Cochran, you know, and so on. Yeah, it'd be like Cochran winning the eating challenge. The one with Cochran. Yeah, the one with Cochran. And then the other one with Cochran. That would be the moment. The one with Cochran part two. I think the best moment is the three amigos but i think i don't know if the season deserves the best moment as its defining moment that's almost yeah yeah i i think that's

a very valid point yeah okay well we'll do the teeth that's great do the teeth um i think this one's really obvious too but it's token teens oh yeah coach coach coach uh the monastic approach, right? We're all taking a monastic approach to discussion about this. What's the, uh, is it the up close screenshot of him and it's facing him? Is it the hike on the dune? I think this,

we could cheat a little bit and have this be like basically the entire. It's the entire thing. I mean, it is. I don't think it needs, I guess the question is, is it that or is it him walking back and especially doing the whole like you over the top pass out during the endurance challenge? I think it's him on exile. I think it's still him on exile.

Yeah. The crazy thing is that, I mean, Togentines gives us so many important characters and is a really fun season. And yet I don't actually have another, a second moment. mean is coach on excel so defining or am i not thinking of like other good honorable mentions here i mean coach was in this era where we're going to have like a lot of editing on one specific main character and this was coach he was by far like the most talked about person from the season i think the second thing would be some sort of steven and jt moment but there's nothing yeah like yeah it's another it's a season-long storyline that doesn't

really have a maybe the final two final two breakfast is it like throwing steven under the bus that's not right though because that doesn't define what jt and steven were like that's almost like the adverse of what that's like the epilogue of the lord of the rings when they come back home and like the shire gets attacked yeah that's that doesn't define that for the novelization you know i'll agree with you i feel like i know what that is um the i feel like there's like a picture i don't know if it's a moment but there's definitely a picture of like jt and steven holding hands that's defined there is and they look out onto their camp i have seen that yeah no no, that's before they go off to the final tribal.

It's like the ritualistic burning of the camp, but I still think it's Kochan exile. Yeah, no, it definitely is. You guys see that? Oh, you can't see it. It's working. Okay, it worked. There you go. Invincible. I think it's that. That's the defining moment of

Kochan. But that's not on exile. It it is on exile it's him standing on the top with the like it i think it just represents how over the top this man is as he went over the top of a dune right and but then and then the second most is him at the challenge when he's like crying what is it he literally like like as he's like he's like and then he goes when Courtney does an impersonation of like oh we're gonna do that challenge like remember when coach said that's where it comes from alright well

okay that's it I guess I guess that could be something with the era people are saying maybe the Tyson blind side but I think they're all just honorable mentions to be inevitable yeah coach's poem did he have a poem that was him that was him but I think they're all just honorable mentions to be inevitable. Yeah. Poacher's poem? Did he have a poem? That was him.

That was him. He did, yes. Hold up, bro. I have a poem to read before I leave. I mean, he also had the Amazon story. Like all of that. By getting his asshole in and out. Yeah.

You said it. You didn't need to. I think we all knew what it was, but we're going Poacher on Excel just now. We're just chatting um all right let's go recent 45 okay now this is an interesting one let's let's throw out some picks here uh i have the whole kelly what the hell guys whoa i'm sorry whoa we have caleb shot in the dark play. We have arguably, if you want to go to like a moment that defines a winner, is it D telling Julie to play the idol? Something that she will pull out as her, like,

you know, final nail in the coffin at the final tribal council. Yeah, I've got all of that. You swore on Nana. The final five. Yeah, the final,

the final five is a good representation of the season of it's just being a hot mess where nobody is on the same page so i don't know because i i don't know if that's 45 yeah because the narrative of 45 where it was like there was an alliance of four that pretty much ran the whole game until a certain point when it all kind of shattered apart they were they were foreshadowing 46 with that one yeah they gave us a dose of 46 at the end of 45 yeah i think i mean look don't make me vote against the plurality vote. I've already gone against a minority split vote. I can't lose my entire essence, but I don't think it is the final five.

Could it be the Caleb shot in the dark? So the Caleb shot in the dark. I'm just trying to think about, like, how does that define the season? Because the season is all- Maybe if he had lasted longer, it could be. Is that the idea? Yeah, well, the season is all about dominance. Like, it's the most

dominant winner of the new era it is the most dominant alliance we probably have seen alongside the ticas so that's why maybe the kelly would also be in play because that was a reba move right they were the ones to specifically say all the bellows are going for bruce we're going to take a shot at at kelly and it does include as well the comedy that exists in the big character moments with this cast it's hard because i don't know the reba defines the season i've spoken about this before and i'm talking about this with some of the listeners and that the season could be in thirds of lulu bello reba um and lulu to me is so defining like i think as much as there's like the reba for dominance i mean that's how we get a really dominant winner lulu like a lot of these

moments that i have even as honorable mentions, I think I have an honorable mention as Hannah quitting. Let's talk about it because everyone did, right? So I think, you know, it was somewhat defining. It wasn't even the first, the only quit of the season. It defines like the chaos of Lulu. I also think that like the Sabaya boot is a crazy moment. I know this is all really early as we're saying,

we're going really early. But I think that you could talk about that. But think that caleb and the shot in the dark that defines like the whole lulu journey to there there's a bit of emily in that i think that's so important i feel like the emily is also involved though in d telling julie to play her idol and like how thematic is that that the last lulu gets taken out due to like a majority idol play where she's the only there's with only one vote to her name yeah those are the two for me is is d telling julie to play her idol i do think it's a culmination of a lot i do think it ties it all up but definitely later as something that pretty seems to want um so maybe then i wrote caleb shaw in the dark but i'm like now i'm like is that consistent with how

i've been handling this podcast for the past hour i feel like it might not be and what i will say about consistency thank you what i will say is jeff i did ask jeff probst what's the theme of 45 and he said it was all about duos and secrets and where is it represented in a scene where a duo in d and julie you know d reveals a secret or has a secret revealed to her that julie's going and tells her to play her idol. Another duo. What about? Caleb and Emily share information and we get the, I'm not Batman, I'm the Canadian. And then he plays the shot in the dark.

But does that factor into the shot in the dark play? You could take what Jeff said and extrapolate that to any way. Juos with a secret. Mike and I are a duo and our secret is that peridium didn't know that this was going to be a nightmare like anything could be like that's podcast i i think for me it would be that kayla playing the shot in the dark is the bigger moment and i think detailing julie is the more defining moment so again it's the psychotomy of which one do we go with and then it becomes it's the same thing it's like is it so big that it eclipses definition i go to the i come to this crossroads

a lot when i sit down and like outline a youtube video where it's like what do i think most people would want me to say and what do i probably need to say to be consistent with the idea of the exact topic of the 15 minutes and i would probably say it's d talking to julie but i did initially write caleb shot in the dark yeah i go back to that a lot and i think about that a lot with 45 but i do think that like the reba dominance capping off the season the the i don't know i i mean this is another one where it's like there are a handful of moments the bruce blinds how you pointed out i don't know if that necessarily defines it but it's up there I would I would say Caleb Sean the dark defines the new era D and Julie defines 45 that's a decent argument I am currently swayed to go with D and Julie yeah because I think the

Sean the dark what are you saying what I want to be honest yeah I don't even know what you're swaying me to what are you what are you I feel like we need to give a little bit more to Caleb but I don't need I feel I need to be swayed back to Caleb. I feel like you were convincing me not Caleb because it's too... But then you also did say... Well, no, I don't know. Lulu.

I think Lulu is a big... Lulu, right. But I don't know if Lulu defines the season so much because it is Caleb and Emily, but Caleb gets clipped in the next episode. I think when we have 50 and they're running back like, this was Survivor,

they're going to have that more of Caleb playing the shot in the dark. But I don't know if that's necessarily defining this season. I watched Caleb playing. That's why I say it's defining the new era. They'll show the three amigos. Hey, these advantages exist so that anyone can be safe at any point in time. That's the danger.

You never know when you're going, J. Maya. It is. It literally justified the seasons of the shot in the dark. We should have caleb go longer that's the that's the biggest anyway yeah it is unfortunate that he just does leave the next time i watched that episode three times in the space of like 20 hours because i did um the i did the nodals that day and then i watched again and like i wanted to watch my brother and peter watching it i wanted to watch them watch their reaction yeah yeah and i was like it still hits and i watched it three times in a day i was a little delirious i don't know is it really

detailing julie i mean that defines the win but it's not always the winning story sometimes it's a losing story and sometimes lulu losing is the story and that was i think i watched the story because of that moment that That was Lulu's losing. I know, but that was such a weird ending for Emily. I mean, to be fair, the moment you're speaking about, Lulu won in that moment. Yeah, the defining moment of the season when Lulu comes out on top. What a victory.

Got one victory until the inevitable end. But then they immediately crash and burn. Yeah, that's Lulu. But we already had that moment earlier in the season when they won a reward challenge, then immediately lost. They did it a lot. I i'm i'm like 60 40 on caleb yeah i'm i'm pretty staunch in the uh in the d and julie camp so pretty much it's up to you maybe you should calculate percentages add all our percentages come on here i think i'm gonna have to go against what i would

like to say even though i think i have i think it's a better argument with mike unfortunately for shannon well i'm 60 40 myself like i'm not so okay that's fine because i'm thinking i'm 60 40 in the other way um and with that means you're 100 why um i i'm i'm i would say like i'm 95 5 i could never never be 100 anything so it feels like of the 300% off the grab, they got 195% to a 1. There you go. It's 9am.

How many of these do we have left? Are we making a good clip here? I think we might have to go a little lightning round at like 7.30. There's a couple we can just sort of blitz through. Yeah, we're doing really really well. The bingo ball is very... I think there's one that I'm like, I don't know, but otherwise I think every single one. We just talked through, I think, one of the bigger bowl is very i think there's one that i'm like i don't know but otherwise i think that was that we just talked through i think one of the bigger discussions yeah yeah we're halfway through we're doing really well this is uh this is my other red one though

i know what it is 24 one world it is this is another one for me where i was like okay so it's tough because so there is there's kim stuff and then there's also a representation of like how the opposition to kim was a little subpar which would be the men purposely giving up immunity to go to tribal council the bad news is that does not involve one of the most dominant winners of all time i mean there's a theme that carries on after colton gets medevaced where the men continue to channel their disaster tribe of it all, where they just slowly turn on each other. They quickly turn on each other and then slowly get picked off, not even realizing. But I don't know if it's like, because I feel like Kim playing arguably the strongest game in the history of the show, dominance at least, is ultimately like what caps off this season for me.

But it starts with the absolute crash and burn that is the men's tribe. Yeah. And I feel like the biggest moment might be Colton getting medevaced, but I don't know if that defines the season, per se. And the tough thing is that Kim played an incredibly dominant game, but unlike Rob in the Volcano or the map blindside, is there a huge calling card that Kim had? Is it like the J blindside, like, is there a huge calling card that Kim had? You know, is it like the J blindside

or like when they convinced them to turn on Michael Jefferson? Cat blindside? The cat blindside, maybe. Is it like, is it cat saying how much she loves blindside is willing to get blindsided herself? I don't know. I think this is the exact issue that 44 had

in that it feels so wrong to do anything other than Tika slash Kim, but there is no, like Kim's moment is that from the whole season long, she just completely dominated. So. I mean, is it Trojan and this is, this is my Island, but almost to like the Caleb point, like, but then it goes nowhere. Right. If he does like a Chris Doherty storyline where like he goes on to waste and win don't even put that timeline out there can you imagine if we lived in that sliding doors moment but then i'm pretty but then i'm pretty sure he goes in the next episode right because like leaf goes and then yeah he does right after he loses doesn't win immunity

i can't yeah like the even the men being bad and like giving up immunity it's on the list but like i can't give it to the men in kim season i cannot do it right a season where the women completely just steamroll um but i'm like that's like looking at the pre-merge of like micronesia and giving it to one of those but there isn't like a there is no black widow moment there's no yeah yeah epic like challenge what about when she when she hangs on the that challenge where she's like hanging on the rope i don't think so but what about when she talks about her options that's to me oh yeah that's that's a nice she says like every episode if you take a shot every time kim

has a confessional where she mentions the word options could Could it be like something, and this is not really a memorable moment, but like when they do touchy subjects and like Kim is voted on as the one that they trust with their life, like that represents almost Kim's game in a nutshell, but it's not very memorable. Yeah, I didn't remember that happened until you just said it.

Maybe it's the one with no definition. Maybe there's no definition. Do we just, yeah, we pull a poll again, we say none. I'm only polling myself. It's the one with no definition. Maybe there's no definition. We put Paul Mulligan, we say none. I'm not loopholing myself. It's the one where Kim wins. Which is like just Kim winning, which is I guess. I mean, it felt like she won.

I thought she was the winner in the pre-season. She was the only winner. I was like, from the moment they showed the cast interviews, I was like, I think she's going to win. And then it just never stopped. I think it's her winning. I think it's it might be winning yeah it's so it's so i mean maybe like when she like wins the final immunity challenge maybe but that doesn't even remember what that challenge was the defining moment what was it i think i think it was like stacking the

bowls and maybe it was like for them then to me it was that moment of like okay now i know she definitely makes the final three she's gonna win but yeah i think it might be as simple to your point as like her winning the winner of this one world sign off of like oh wow outside of returnees someone can play an incredibly dominant game you know i think i can get on board with kim winning i think that probably to me has the strongest hook to it because when i do think about one world it's like that's where i think probably the most dominant winner in the history of the show other than maybe boston rob showed up and did their thing on their first try and it's always usually about kim and how it sort of came to be but yeah i would say it's it's the one where kim won yeah where kim crushed you could also argue

about like uh echoes through survivor history was this a season besides the black widow brigade that helped embolden paranoia about all women's alliances i think as well you can't do that for tika obviously because jam jam winning doesn't define tika's dominance in just jam jam beating carolyn and not to mention that with uh with no disrespect to people like sabrina and chelsea like kim was the star of that alliance whereas I think Jam Jam and Carolyn certainly were regarded as like one two billing on the Tika three also Carson was a very big

he was a big draw to very big player very big character I think he winning I think we can do it okay okay sounds good that was the biggest one that I had to talk about I was like I don't know where downhill from here I'm willing to update the red to the yellow for kim winning i think that's good enough i think that's good enough i think

it's good enough okay let's go to panama oh okay um nail shot there driving up put you in that in that uh can i curse are we allowed to curse sure shitty apartment uh i don't think that was what we had to clarify let me just say so that's the thing is that it really comes down to me of like do we go with the comedy of panama or do we go with like an iconic survivor moment i have such bias because my favorite episode is on panama of the entire series of survivor it's the bruce medevac and it's not because bruce gets medevac but it's a part of it it's so freaking funny it's my number one favorite episode i've rewatched probably what part what part it's literally every single scene why is it your favorite episode ever

there's a so i made a video about this like five years ago where i broke down like pretty much the entire episode every scene works off of the next and they're all it's almost all gold in every single scene with like just the comedy of it all and then it kind of even makes light of a medivac in a weird way. Oh it completely does. It does.

Courtney says it's a cherry on her pretty poo poo day after the man got medivac for being constipated. Yep. Um funniest moment sure define not not to the finding moment that's the question though is that like this is regarded as one of the funnier seasons does a moment like that represented over something like three two one which is like it's tough because sari i think is a star on that season and represents also one of these inimitable survivor journeys she got up off the couch she went from

being afraid of leaves to like a game-breaking strategy in this plurality vote to get the goat but like does that obfuscate some of the chaos and comedy that panama is it does i mean look yes because sire's insanity does mean moments like that possibly i did have as well i'll cue i'll kill you in your shitty apartment um the blackberry shane moment question mark which could be any of like sari looking at shane's nether regions but look in this podcast i've argued against a minority split vote is defining i've argued against a two one one one i cannot go against the three two one three three two one that it's a. That is everything. I can't.

I have, please. No, not Bruce being constipated over the 3-2-1. For my heart and my soul. Please. Look, that's probably my biggest fear of everyone on Survivor is getting constipated.

The 3-2-1? Oh, yeah. It's getting constipated. It's the 3-2-1, yeah. So Rhi shows up and 3-2-1's me in episode one. I would take it as an honor. I hope that happens to me. Which could happen, by the way. We've gotten a 3-2-1 in thei shows up in 3-2-1's being episode one I would take it as an honor I hope that happens

which could happen by the way we've gotten a 3-2-1 in the new era yet have we not in the first episode at least

anyway I put 3-2-1 as the defining moment of the season I think with the legacy of Seri with

it's I mean it's tough because I don't really view Panama as a strategic season that much because it's very much just like, here's a merry band of misfits

against the big bag boss and Terry Dietz. And then there's just a lot of calamity in spite of the simple dynamic there. But the 3-2-1 does hold up really well. It's an incredible moment. And Ceri Fields has such a legacy to her. Yeah, I think this is where we, again, we go back to this fork in the road of like this is a moment that i think almost defines survivor

and like both the concept of splitting these votes as well as also the concept of getting the goat of saying like this person is taking up a spot in the final two so i want to take them out even though they lose at the end i think that speaks more towards the pantheon of survivor than the chaos of kasaya so i could see this a case where like it doesn't necessarily apply to the season but it's appropriate for survivor history to be fair firstly fam is in the chat saying boo vote poop there was no poop that's the whole point right secondly it was no poop yeah that's the whole do you know what constipation is the whole point is anyway i could argue that the 3-2-1 does define the chaos and the infighting.

I was going to say, there's a lot of confusion in the strategy and the fact that they pulled off a 3-2-1 here is pretty wild. This is also the same thing that did what? Like a 3-2-1-1 vote on Bob Dog as well? That's like the precursor. That's like the rough draft. Exactly, and that's Kasaya.

This is when they eventually have to crack um this is when all of those factions start coming at each other and so re-capitalizes on that right to achieve 3211 insanity if bruce managed to actually go to the bathroom we would get a three no we wouldn't get the 3211 no there was no two there there would have been well 321 yeah right i mean but it's also interesting as well you talk about evocative of themes uh this is again another vote that terry is left out on as well i think he finally feels like now that he's the last lamina standing he's brought into what he thinks is an aris vote alongside courtney and it turns out that that is not the case so it

also ties that in it also ties into like shane and courtney also being their kookiness and they don't they're also on the outs. So I do think there's elements to it that define it overall. There we go. 3-0, that's the vote. Yeah, I had two battering rams. It's like, which of the twos is going to define us? Two battering rams, 3-2-1, or Bruce's lack of two?

I mean, the weird thing is that as well, like two battering rams. Again, if it had come down to Otis winning the final immunity challenge and voting out Terry, then yes, that makes a lot of sense. But again, it's this weird thing where like, no, it's Danielle who goes, who helps Terry help save her. And then she immediately votes him out. And she's the one to get rid of it. It was like Ghost Island with like Dom versus Wendell or something like that. And this was Terry versus Aris Otis all season. Wendell or something like that and this was Terry versus Aris, Aris all season

I could see that maybe having a moment where that was like the head of the conflict where they really you know physically hit each other but I do think that I think the 3-2-1 is we're gonna be able to look back at this with pride okay absolutely

an honorable mention to Bruce in the medivac yeah specifically Bruce being taken out with naked chain right we're doing this right now can i uh okay millennials versus gen x oh man there's another one okay oh man this is another one that could be the that could be oh man here we go again so let me let me throw someone if we're talking about big moments. We have the rock draw. We have David getting voted out again.

He is someone who has this story storyline of like becoming the power player of the season and getting voted out. We have Adam confessing to Jay about the situation with his mother, which represents that yin yang dynamic as well as Adam's why for being here. We could even have from a certain perspective him revealing his mother in the final tribal council as well. Yeah. Yeah. So I have a few. So I had, I think, rocks if it's going to define any season because we didn't give it to 27. We didn't give it to my cases.

I feel like, so I have rocks. Deacon Brett's heart to heart. Adam telling Jay about his mom as my top category. And then Adam at the final tribal council for me in my second team what about the uh brett brett and zeke scene yeah yeah so brett and zeke define this is an example of defining the theme of the season right despite all the cringiness of jeff's oh do they still use vinyl do you text the letter you or do you spell it out like this was a genuine sincere moment where two people across generations connected over a shared community and it was like a really celebrated scene in survivor history that i think

does a good job of like defining the season from that perspective but is that the perspective we're going from when it comes to i don't think it defines it i think it's a good moment i don't know if it defines millennials gen x in the chaos that is there's a very strategic season with a lot of heavy hitters i don't know if that character on it but i mean do we go with jay getting tricked by the fake idol i think for me if it's gonna be a gameplay moment which i think it should be because it's hard then i would go rocks because i feel like rocks is hard because it's not millennials versus gen x they were in random groups so that almost defines the season they were in trust clusters exactly that it was so fluid and so gamey like my brother was saying

that you could put we were talking about the defining the eras last season i guess survivor discourse will never be solved he was saying that you know 32 as we said film before 31 should be put with that because 30 and i don't agree but 33 did i think trigger this like big moves super gamey meta modern meta yeah when you have trust clusters being defined where you have like the pendulum strategy being like articulated as like with a name and i think that them going to rocks was that chaos was that gamesmanship was somehow the fluidity and that it's not even going to ironic yeah given the fact that they were so staunchly solid they said we're that's i think the thing is the

final four right like that's but no well that's no at the final 10 that's where they go to rock no i know but i'm i know i know but i'm saying that the the final the five of the 10 that win go to the final four and so that's the thing that could define the rest of the season as well is that like those five two relative so it was the it was that zeke zeke and david go to war against each other yeah in the back half of that episode and then that and will flips the next episode but it doesn't matter because adam plays an idol on hannah anyway um but it goes to show that it does sort of like the poverty double idol play it does kind of inform the rest of the season even though they end up losing in that moment i think it does serve as a nice representation of the fact that this was a very gamey cast that was going to play very hard considering it was at the final 10 half the cast was still left in the

game and they chose to leave it up to fate i i've been yeah i didn't really have a great moment for this um now that you've run through all of them i did look at like maybe adam winning defines it they chose to leave it up to fate i i've been yeah i didn't really have a great moment for this um now that you've run through all of them i did look at like maybe adam winning defines it but i don't think it does i think it's a very it's a great moment one of the most emotional in my opinion yeah but um i think the rock draw because it's again taps into the theme of we had these two generals and it's like the millennials and the gen x now the armies are a little bit up in the air as far as who's in what camp but i think that's also pretty compelling and i think that it speaks to the level of gamesmanship and competition that goes in like a lot of seasons

don't do that they just yeah if somebody's gonna flips more than that but these guys went to the bitter end to left it up to chance so i would say the rock draw probably i'm convinced you've got zeke and brett in that yeah to you know it's like again like the culmination you're even involved in the whole tribal council you can do uh david wright's anxiety getting called out as well which wraps up into his arc so many things yeah i think the fact that like zeke and david are leading it i think you know everyone's got a part to play when it's all 10 people left in the game so yeah i think that that has to be it you have like will being super gamey and he was going to flip and then he thought someone else would flip and i think we did it oh one has fallen bigger balls oh boy don't let the

cat get it she she looked she looked up and she was like do i bother waking up with this? And she's like, no. Vanuatu. Vanuatu. B9. All right. Bubba's Bob Barker shirt. No. I'm going with, this was a tricky one, a little vague,

but I think it's the Leanne blindside for me. Yes. My initial thought. I was like, how do you incorporate the overall arc of Chris coming from behind? And I think it starts here, really. I mean, it starts prior to this, but it really is the defining catalyst where things shift. And Chris is now in the... And it takes part in the whole theme of the men and the women, and the women are dominating, but a man wins the season. And the Liam Blindside is where the other shoe drops. And it just involves all of the biggest players wins the season uh and the liam blindside is where the other shoe drops and it

just involves all of the biggest the biggest players of the season okay i'm gonna passionately fight for this did we really not do this the first time because i feel like i've already passionately fought for this i have the liam boot in the second tier i have chris at the final tribal council at the second tier. First tier, I need your support on this, guys. I need to win one. I really care. Twyla swearing on her

son's life. God forgive me. As a child, I look back and I remember it so well. It defines the loss, which defines Chris's win. It's the moment. That's the one moment. I can't picture the image of Leanne's blindside. I do believe that's the defining vote, but it defines the loss which defines chris's win it's the moment that's the one moment i can't like picture the image of leanne's blindside i do believe that's the defining vote but it's the defining moment of twilight's loss into the moment what's the thing she says maybe if i'm something god will forgive me maybe if i win the million god will forgive me or something

like that yeah yeah yeah important in so defining so god did not forgive her well i don't know what we can say and she gets to make up for it i'm between i see your argument i would be between that and some sort of chris final tribal council moment where it's whether it's like julie i brought you your hat or something because that really is i agree with you pretty i'm that from a momentum perspective yeah after things start to shift but like chris doherty's game in a nutshell was like as scout tells him right like you can't bullshit a bullshitter and like chris brings one of the best final council performances in the show's history by like absolutely eating crow sucking up when twilight doesn't do it i would also say like i don't think this would make it but chris's confessional maybe it's in that episode of like, you question a woman's character,

she'll snap your neck, but you open your heart, show a woman you're vulnerable. That's when they open up the back door. Yeah, it's a pretty iconic confessional, but I don't think for the reasons we, is that defining? I guess, to a degree. Because I think it defines an entire strategy right there now of like, listen, you got to suck up a little bit. You got gotta kiss ass brown nose so that you're the one who ends up in the green yeah i'm i'm conflicted i feel like on

one hand this is a season with the narrative of chris starts out in episode one with he's the prime target to go and he's the winner and it's his arc to get there but i also am like but it very much hinges on Twyla and Scout and their ultimate, like the whole pre-merge is focused on them with the women. Right. And how they,

and the work ethic between the younger women and the older women. And then they come into the merge. They have the flip that happens with getting Julie over flipping against the guys. Then they ultimately make the flip on the women. And like if Twyler Scout won, I think I would be a little more sold on it being a distinctly Twyla moment

that defines the season. I mean, I guess her losing is another. There are a lot of seasons where the person who loses like Stephanie, for example, you could argue it's like it's not really about Danny winning. It's not really about Natalie White winning. It's more about the person who lost. So then I'm like, but I feel like Vanuatu does a really good job of threading a line between

it is about Chris, but it is also about Twyla. It's a little bit about both. So I feel conflicted about involving only one, but I don't know. I honestly, I don't know what to say. I don't know what to include for the defining moment.

It could be, I mean, it could be Twyla, but I'm like, how, how do you not include Chris in a defining moment? I almost feel like the land blinds. He is included. He is included because he's there and yeah like he

received he's gonna lose right and then he's gonna win like those are the two options not that he won because she lost but I do think that there's so much of that it's like Eliza versus Twyla all of that like toxicity and all of the all of those relationships and I think her yes swearing on her son's I try to look at the exact quote but i think it was if i maybe if i win the million god will forgive me yeah that's out of my mind so much from childhood when i look back on this season that's what i think about i do think that the chris confessional is defining but maybe more in an ironic way or you know like because of the like i don't know it's a weird confessional for a winning confessional it's it's i guess it is kind of classic chris yeah the thing is the dude had weird confessionals out the wazoo out the back door

if it's lately lian boot up the moment for me is when like chris is um with his wife and he's like although it's funny because chris doesn't have as much of an influence on the lian boot at all so i don't even know if that really works it's more of like twilight scout eliza yeah and it's the fact that like am Amy's immune to it's not even Amy. But also it's like the downfall. There's more of an impactful Chris led boot. It's the Julie boot. I mean, the season is largely defined, I think, by the women dominating.

And then they ultimately collapse and they do collapse at the final seven, which is the Leanne boot. But then I could argue, is there a representation of the woman collapsing in the form of one of them swearing on her son and then going back on that deal yes yeah for for twilight i don't know if that defines the whole season though for all of them for the for the chaos of the women for it all breaking down i mean mike where are you not voting for her to win i'm curious because i see i know where shannon's to go with this. And I mean, I would still probably go with a Chris led thing. Please.

Is this where she said, guys, I need you for me. I need you to do this. Yeah. Think about the merge. What if I swear on someone's life? And if we, if we, I mean, it's a great. Yeah. I don't know.

Don't just do it out of my desperation. I still got like 10 other seasons to get to. So I'm like, maybe I'll just go with that just to say it. Cause I could, and I guess technically Chris is the recipient of her swearing on her kid's life. But.

I, I. If you don't want to, don't do it. Don't do it out of pity. I don't need your pity vote. That's Twyla. That's Twyla in a nutshell.

Right? Like, you know, don't vote for me because of that. Yeah. I would probably, I'll just go with the leanne boot i know it's not as like singularly momentous but i mean it sounds like if you're going with twilight anyway then like the two of you will will outvote me but i'm like 50 50 i was like going into it thinking it's the leanne boot that defines the moment when she gets voted out. Yeah, I guess.

I don't think it pops on the screen, but it's like what it represents, you know? I mean, every time I think of Benoit, too, I do think of that. I don't actually think of like Twyla losing and how, but then of course there are seasons like Timo we're going to talk about. I don't know. I think it's both. I mean, I don't think the season is as much like Russell losing as Twyla losing, but I think it is a part of it.

And I just think that moment is so defining. I think if Amy got voted out of the final seven, maybe that would be more iconic. But the fact that it's like a slow build, like the slow bleed of like Leanne into Amy is kind of, not that it's like, yeah, it's not because it's still a huge vote. It is the defining vote of the season for sure. But is it the moment?

I'll give it to Shannon. She's put more effort into this argument and she really believes it mike i don't know if i believe it and i'm 50 50 don't do it pretty it's fine like don't do it then i don't want you to have to do something you don't believe in i believe in it just i'm not like i wouldn't you know go to rocks for it but you know well that means you won't be on millennials versus gen x no maybe the reason why i'm not into it is i do have an eye on the clock and we've got yeah yeah yeah i'm like okay we got 25 minutes to get a rapid fire this a little bit so i'm like i'll go with the twilight i think i think i think if i was doing the liam boot i would do chris telling his wife he's out okay we won already it's done um china i think this one's really obvious james blindside yeah

because i don't think there's much... We were just talking about what a winner moment it is. That is Todd making a move, cutting one of his closest allies with two idols in his pocket. Right. And it really exemplifies Todd, Amanda, the whole Feilong dominance, even within themselves. James, two idols, like what in the world?

Final seven, too? This isn't even... It's a huge moment that's been referenced so many times and yeah right so i think this is easily i mean this is one of the most defining moments again in the show's history obviously top five it clips a little bit by eric following season but it's up there it's a big rain is the dumbest survivor ever right and that ties into it you know with the following season afterwards so yeah all the iconic characters um i think yeah it involves everything and as we're saying like defines the

show in many ways i think that it probably is did we define the defining moments of the show if we had a mount rushmore and this is next up next up we can't go into that wait one thing on this i had in the second tier jamie fake idol and the reason that's fun is because i also put in the second tier um for 44 jamie fake idol and then xl just filled it in because i had it for both 43 oh so no no no no is it gabler winning or is it jesse cutting i think it i personally decided for me in my own personal before i got on i said i think jesse blindsiding cody defines this season more because i think gabler winning is doesn't he's not as relevant in the scheme of if you rewatch the season he's there but jesse and cody take up so much of the post merge and even the pre-merge and that swell that comes with like it it costs jesse he loses because he probably does it one round too soon or whatever. This is a different conversation,

but Gabler is the result. Gabler wins on the result of Jesse's cutting Cody, but I don't think Gabler wins otherwise. And I don't know if Gabler winning defines that season. Not to mention, I think that people remember the season by Jesse. I think that a lot of the strategy runs through him. And so it would be weird to be like,

and the moment that defines the season is something that doesn't really involve Jesse whatsoever. And so, and also it's a moment that reflects so much upon future seasons as well. I don't think we get a string of people turning on their number ones in 46. If Jesse doesn't turn on Cody here. I think it's,

yeah, sorry. It's one of the most emotional moments for the new era. And I think it's for me, like, yeah, I wouldn't have thought that any moment could eclipse the jesse cody moment which is i think for me maybe the moment of the

new era until the week after well maybe not if like when like right that's then gave the one to be fair could you have done it could peter have gotten a picture of you reacting that way to jesse blindsiding Cody? And we could have made the same argument. Definitely someone could have. I mean, it's hard because I just said that it's a defining moment. Maybe not the defining moment, but the biggest moment of the new era, I do think, is Jesse voting out Cody.

I mean, I like it more as a moment. Do we look back at Gabe Lewinney now more? I think maybe we do. I think it's that shocking and maybe more talked about. I don't want it to be that moment. I think it could be that moment. I'm'm personally very torn if you're both going to go the other way then it doesn't matter i think the common opinion might be gabler winning but i think that when i look at what the findings the season overall i do think it comes down to the we got like jesse giving us a whole scene with montage we had a blind so how to pull off a blind side in one episode yeah they got the dwight the dwight of it all with the idol probes

i know we said that his opinion is a matter here but he calls it a hall of fame move like i think this is sort of like an eric giving up immunity and a moment that eclipses sort of like the the pervades of the season overall i think abler is a result of the win but i think that up until that point all of the season is is the jesse and cody so i'm going jesse blindsides cody agreed i mean it's it's it's a better moment it is yeah this is something that i would have to explain sorry you're finishing second for once right that romance yeah i've never been more blindsided by a winner just like shannon that photo of you is like me that's the essence of like the gabler one for me and i'm like yeah i'm just like all right next up what have we got we should have memed it more but okay i'm

happy to go with that but i do think we i mean look we've talked more about the gabler one since and probably will continue to but i do think right both are good happy to do it 35 yeah this one's easy too so let's we can yeah final. Final four fire making that. That's not an advantage. Ironically, that's a different moment of the season, but that really was not. It's just the entire last last third of the season is the story of Ben. One man against an entire army. And this is like the last hurdle he has to get over. Basically, you could say Ben bombs, but there's like three of them at this point.

So you could say like Ben playing the take out Lauren, but maybe it does get nullified a bit. Ironically enough, by the fact that he plays so many afterwards he does it after after and then the fire making shows up and you're like oh okay that's what we're doing oh okay i know big brothers in 20 minutes is it the moment where he makes fire or is it the moment where chrissy opens up what she got to learn it's the moment where he makes fire as a super fan i always have the chrissy with the and then they cut away yeah they cut away and it's like where she interrupts her own i want to see the raw footage of that what does she actually say because i don't yeah they show i don't think it would be safe for television yeah right look you asked if you could swear

saying shitty i think it would have been a little bit right worse than that but i think i think it's the ben fire making beating devon maybe him standing up this one is interesting with cambodia i think for me it's wentworth does not count it's either when we're it's either like idle late in tribal council i think it's either when word does not count or no votes yeah um that's actually i had not thought about the final six and that's a, like Keith volunteering to go to the house. I do think that that defines again, like how hardcore strategy this was. But I still think Wentworth does not count in a sentence.

Like the one where Wentworth does not count, it defines Wentworth's journey, which is tied in many ways to Jeremy's journey. I just think it's the biggest moment. it define she doesn't win but in her loss jeremy wins like there's that defining kind of underdog story the other two that i had were jeremy and final tribal council talking about his impending child right and the vote to get in i know if we're doing if we're not doing reunions are we doing pre-unions of them actually because that for me is like an all-time as a fan moment of the fan vote. I don't think it's that.

I think it's when what does not count, but I just wanted to put that one in. Is it will not or is it does not? It's will not. We just did this on... Yeah, it's a little Mandela effect. We think it's does not count, because that's how he usually says it when idols are played,

but it's will not count. He says will not, right. Yeah, he does. I've always had that. It's fine. We've Mandela effected, but it's also not, Natalie, can I have your jacket? I mean, you could argue that will not, right. Yeah, he does. I've always had that. But it's fine. We find Della affected. But it's also not, Natalie, can I have your jacket?

I mean, you could argue that will not count is interesting because it's Kelly Wentworth who proves almost the theme of the season. I'm like, she's someone who gets blindsided, who gets voted out pre-merge in her first season, is definitely the least known cast member going into this season,

proves her worth, and also, you could argue, gives herself a second chance in the game by nullifying all the votes against her i think she for me represents the theme of the second chance like more than almost anybody else yeah even though obviously all of them do in some way and they'll all have a story to tell regardless of who ends up winning like jeremy in this case but i do think that that moment defines the season the best where she just she showed up we're not

well you walk into when you walk into cambodia and you're kind of like most people are gonna be like who and after cambodia you're like that's kelly wellworth yes yeah and to me that's like that's that's the defining moment where's we knew jeremy we knew spencer you know these are players we all but like kelly wellworth and was probably bottom two for name recognition, I think, going in but came out of it maybe with the highest stock of anybody. Yeah. So maybe other than Jeremy. I mean, the irony is, is that for a season

and a post-merge that was all about the voting blocks and all these shifting allegiances, it's like one of the biggest pile-on votes of the post-merge, but it is a big enough moment to warrant it. Yep. Yeah, I think so think i love that i already thought it was that and you've just convinced me more with the beauty of how it's also it's the biggest moment and you've also explained why it's defining there you go that's very important

to me thank you so much you're welcome we sold it let's talk about a similar so we're talking about these similar people um 29 okay so for me this one is also sum it up in a sentence. Jacqueline, did you vote for who I told you to vote for? For me? Yeah. It's not West Nail

reveals the 858 chicken nuggets in a five minutes and eating competition. That's a very close second. Okay. It's between that and like stick to the plan leading into the whole

Natalie convincing John to play the idol, which I think almost in the way that we talked about the men on One World is kind of a representation of like the hot mess that sam wandel sore was in the middle of its game where like all these guys are basically tripping over each other to get voted out in some way shape or form but if we're speaking towards like we've done with a bunch of these this is how the winner won it's got to be that like yes natalie does have these moves where

she votes alec incorrectly or she blindsides john but like this is her most public moment where she is able to single-handedly basically blindside baylor out of the game yeah yep yeah she splits up the duo the mom and the mom and daughter she idols the whole second half is like the revenge plot of natalie yeah anderson yeah and how she managed how she managed it it caps it off at the end with that did you vote for i told you to vote for uh so for me yeah that was the show and even though stick to the plan is great it's a huge you know it's a very big moment it's funny um it does represent part of that season really really well but i don't know if it defines it yeah i think i love natalie's end game so much

and like even if natalie somehow didn't win from the final five you'd still maybe have that moment but the fact that not only does she win but it assures that she pretty much will win because she's not even a possible target at the final four and then it's gonna win at the final three like she had it on lock because that move is so good it defines her winning story the jeremy blind side is an honorable mention but that as we're saying kicks off the journey that leads to this moment which is basically the crowning moment in such an incredible way and it has an iconic quote like it's ticking all the boxes it's also the first moment that got me to start my youtube channel maybe she didn't do that maybe because it was like i really wanted to talk about the flashiest idol plays made by winners which is kind of random and i decided i wanted to find an excuse

to talk about natalie anderson so this your Twyla swearing on her son. Yeah, a little bit. I don't know if I would say that much about Twyla for me, but. And then second was Twyla swearing on a kid. That's what got me to make my second. No, no, this is you being in love with Malcolm. I did love, I love Malcolm. Who doesn't?

I feel like we've found out peridium's whole lore and processes and it's great all right we're down to the last few i have a feeling one two behind the couch three four we have five more we have four more all right let's go we got we got 15 minutes do it oh no speaking of malcolm go to the philippines philippines um i think oh it's got to be something with matt singh i mean i think i know i understood your lulu argument but like matt singh begins and ends the season i think for me what defines it is it's episode four when they lost their fourth straight one yeah i have that too lord i mean jeff i don't know exactly which moment in the in the episode but obviously it could be when they lose at the challenge that defines it and i think

as well i mean this is this is a weird season where it was three returning players but they all were like not the best at the game and like how much is that represented in the form of russell swan again this returning player brought back to captain his tribe, having a meltdown in front of Jeff Probst. Yeah, I think it's, you recently clipped that challenge, right? In comparison to Lulu, in comparison to Yano. It has to be Matt Singh. They defined the beginning of the game and the end of the game. And I think that is the moment where they just lose again.

They don't get that moment of like finally like euphoric when I guess eventually Denise is going to get that. But it finally like euphoric when i guess eventually denise is going to get that but it has to be that um i think malcolm losing the final immunity challenge is an honorable mention i also have abby moment question mark like i mean like you f with me you're dead like but i really do think and because it also leads to denise going on this unprecedented streak where she goes to every tribal council in her season i think i think it's got to be that if you want to do specifically to pretty much point it is the slow motion sequence of the last pot getting smashed and then russell swan's subsequent meltdown was that the fourth was that episode four it was episode four yeah that was episode four wow

that was the last challenge about saying ever competed in as a tribe oh my gosh that that's slow-mo yeah i think that to me is i was like it has to be something matt saying is it either them winning at the end somehow but then they do turn on each other like like uh steven and jt or but i feel like that doesn't represent the overall season getting up to the final four so i'm like it could be just denise winning um which cap encapsulates her going to every single tribal council she's like the iron woman of survivor where she survives the absolute onslaught that is survivor of the philippines she's basically runs through the whole the whole thing from start to finish but there's a little bit of a i think this is a moment where it's the the asylum where you raised me and that's representing the form of

matt sing in that moment right and it's episode yeah i do yeah it's not denise's story as much it's not it's not malcolm and it's them coming from that thing. Right. Right. Right. Next up. Cookies. But cookies.

Yeah. Cookies. Cookies. We've talked about it. We've alluded to it. We're at 19. Here we go. I think it's going to be Russell losing.

Yeah. I think it's got to be that. I don't think we have it. I think this is our first time doing the X loses. We ended up passing over Aubrey for that ironically enough but yeah it has to be Russell losing he was the main character of the season he was the main he was like the biggest thing since

sliced bread especially for that time it has to be the fact that he lost the game yeah I think of all the seasons where somebody lost like you could say Boston Rob losing all-stars but there's even a bigger moment I think maybe even I could if I was here for part one maybe I would have swung in favor of uh if i had been argued enough to go for aubrey losing you can still do it pretty but i will that's in the past we're here now in the present yes we are

russell losing is the biggest this is player lost this season to Natalie, who also had like 15 confessionals, which is just absolutely wild. Like what's not even Michelle can do it. She had like 50 something. So like, at least in that case, you kind of got it. Like Russell was a hundred,

108 confessionals and he is the star. They build him up to just for the next season coming up with the all-star season of heroes, villains. That moment is what, honestly, it might be talked about the most of anyone that I know who talks about survivor.

Like if they've seen that even 25 seasons later, they'll still be like, can't believe that guy, Russell lost. Remember that guy? It's like, that is so defining for Samoa that even if you could say like, Oh,

maybe Russell's idol play at the, against Kelly and just yet. Right. Like I finished playing. I've said that I've I ain't finished playing just yet. Right, like, I ain't finished playing. I've quoted that a bunch as a joke, but I think it really comes down to, like, Russell loses after, like, 13, 14 episodes of Survivor Samoa, and it just changes the entire perspective

of the season. All right, as much as I want to relish in Russell losing, we should move on. No, we've got time. We have 10 minutes. We need to get this through. We have two seasons after this. If we argue about the time, it's going to take up time. I've got a couple of things on this. Firstly, if it's

Russell losing, the chat is saying, like, is it the Eric Cardona speech specifically? Then Josh in the chat says Russell whining in the room that the game is flawed. No, I think it's just the vote reveal. It's Russell slumped at the finale with the votes coming in, and he just looks like he probably wants to cry.

I feel like I didn't even remember if he said the game was flawed in that or Heroes Villains, but I do remember him offering Natalie White the money, and it's possible that's in it. I think just a couple of honorable Russell-toned mentions. Russell burning the socks, I think is indicative of his game. Russell addling out Kelly, we've said. Russell pulling over Shambo, I think, is a pretty important move.

And then I also said the Russell-Swan-Maddie back, but that's not really as much. I think they're all part of the resume that is Russell losing this season, but I think it's Russell losing at the final vote. They're all breadcrumbs leaning up to that big old loaf. Yeah. So what do we got, 13 or 28? That's it, right?

Kage-yan. Kage-yan or ending. Okay. yeah so what do we got 13 or 28 that's it right kageyan well you are ending yeah okay i mean you're at 13 i feel like we could just get out of the way if you want to yeah we're doing it with the bingo balls decided if i mean this that do we want to end on the one with more discussion or the one that's the shoe in is it a shoe in like whatever we can go we should follow the order of the bingo balls right but we'll get to the mutiny, but we'll get to it. I don't have the mutiny. I think it's between two. Nothing but shoo-in with me. I'm always annoying.

All right, well, Kaga-yan. Jeremiah reveals he's a model. There we go. That's the one I remember the most. Let's go to Cook Island. His name is Jeremy, by the way. For me, this is maybe my biggest moment in Survivor history. Woo taking Tony to the end end for me it it defines

woo it defines tony it defines cast to a degree it defines so much of that season and it's just such a major moment in survivor history that could be i said we defined the top five but maybe we didn't maybe that's five i completely agree with that i think on paper you would say the merge tribal council but again this doesn't need to be like a moment about tony but that was much more of a trish move honestly than a tony move i think tony is such an outlandish character that you would want like either this is huge i needed this or llama noises but i think nothing represents tony's inexplicable gameplay more than him somehow convincing woo that it is the honorable thing to do to take yeah and then he makes one of the biggest blunders in survivor history it's almost like the reverse

of samoa where we're talking about the whole like because season 28 is very much defined by tony and his manic all over the jungle gameplay but you could point to any of his moments that define the season from the pre-merge to the post-swap to the merge to the anytime in the post-merge with the bag of tricks but i think ultimately the cherry that caps it all off is one of the most impressive things is convincing woo to take him when he even tells us he shouldn't do it he tells gas like that would be the dumbest thing and it's like that's probably the dumbest thing that's happened on the show yeah as far as a or b which which door do you pick and i think to me that sort of and it involves tony and cas who's another major component maybe the second most important after tony in this season so to me yeah i would agree with you

we're taking to yeah like there's that's the gameplay version of the llama noises being taken over i mean yeah as you said the merge boot especially like cast zero chance of winning the game top five baby we've said llama noise as we've said this is huge i needed this the lj boot jatia throwing out the rice i mean it's a great season it's got a lot of it's a resume of tony but it ends at the very end where he wins because woo takes him yeah and you're just like and that's the thing as well tony was someone who never won an immunity challenge and you know had a super idol that he never needed to play. So it was all about the stuff that he was able to influence without like

any of that stuff on his side, except for his words. And that's represented right there with the Wu stuff. Yeah. And it's Wu and Tony that I think that was, I mean, it's, it's Tony, but there's also Wu and Tony who were like, I feel like they vote correctly every like they're the ones swinging like the pendulum that will be named after them. Well, not after them, but we'll be named later on. Right. let's see what the bingo ball machine does we got one left right this is the last one i don't know there might be a one imagine if it was wrong imagine if i left in like yeah

no it is 13 i will say it's a in the in the chat it's high says there's no time for this but would love to hear shannon do this for australian seasons maybe on twitter or something i do want to do it for global seasons on the global feed so i'm just putting it out there all right another uh is that a sequel or a uh a spinoff that's a spinoff like an in the you know the international spinoff but yeah no if i if i may if i may look into your head i would imagine the other moment you're thinking of besides the mutiny is yule flipping penner at yes those are the two i have i actually have that birth that yule flipping penner at the verge. Those are the two I have. I actually have that first. I have Yul flipping Penner. Is there anything to like I2 making the final four

or is that just like a foregone conclusion? That's why he does when he pulled over Penner. Right. It kind of all comes together, but the defining moment is when I2 swings, Yul swings Penner over to get the numbers. I think for me, what I'm going back to with the mutiny

is what it represented as sort of like the origin story of that comeback i agree that that's like a pivotal moment for the comeback i think also look not to be too obfuscated about this but in a season that divided people by race is there something to represent that season like all the white people coming back together again i did think possibly the race twist of it all at the beginning could even define the season a little bit i don't think it's a moment though i agree it's not really so i was like it's not a moment though and it's not even the theme it's just it's just a twist that they implemented for casting i don't think it ultimately defines the season i think the season

is bigger than that and then there's like a two off a two episode twist it's done by episode two uh episode three so i i yeah i was like i think it has to be i2 something to do with i2 the underdogs um they take over they take the numbers over and it it comes down to flipping penner at the final nine oh i think i'm gonna win because you're saying it'd have to be the mutiny was such a shoe in the shooting but it's not because i think the mutiny is the biggest moment when you think of a moment but i think defining yule's win specifically i2 getting to that point the fact that it is also involving the mutiny that it like he came over and then mutinied back and then he pulls him back over like i think

yule pulling penna has all of the things that we're talking about other than as brett is saying in the chat billy being in love with candace but um the only thing i would say it doesn't involve is that cook islands had so many wtf twists and it is a good example of that which will lead to the bottle bottles to the final three but i i i see your point i'm not like blanking at it too much for time i am like at the time as well i think i think the pen or flip defines the essence of cook island at the end of the day even though there is an element of like the annoying constant twist happening so i'm with you i agree i'm with shannon all right well we did it we solved survivor discourse i've got a pocket full of bingo balls oh that's the name gonna be my

falling out of my pocket and that's what we've with. We've ended with an empty bingo ball machine. Nice. A pocket full of bingo balls and survivor discourse being solved once and for all. I call that a full tummy, in my opinion. Hope you all enjoyed this two-hour meal. It's like four and a half hours total. This is a lot to chew on between part one and part two. And then the spinoff coming up that I want to do.

And the spinoff, like, this is, there's a lot. Thisinoff coming up that I want to do. And the spinoff like this is, there's a lot. This is great. Last thing I want to plug. Wandoffs next week. Get them in. Robhasawesite.com slash Wandoff 2024. You have the next six days or so to do it.

Let's just do some quick plugs around the horn. Peridium, start with you. Same as always YouTube video every single week. I am currently, we're in the middle of the summer. So I'm in the throes of Big Brother, which has nothing to do with Survivor in the summer,

but as far as I'm concerned, it's just how it works. I'm releasing a new video on Big Brother every single Thursday on my YouTube channel. Go there, subscribe. I've been doing it for seven years. No plans of stopping anytime soon. All right, Shannon, any plugs? I love that we got the law, Puritium.

Puritium, I really appreciate your attention to Webster's dictionary defining things. This is how it works, absolutely. Including define, including- I die on the hill of the definitions and semantics. It's, and look, you're speaking my language, which I love. So thank you so much for coming on.

This was a great time. I'm glad you got to finish this. A lot of people asked for part two and we got it done. Under two hours, starting at 8 a.m. Other than Summer of Survivor, I'm covering traders new zealand with puya and yeah i want to start doing a little bit of these things for global when we can so all right of course i am uh rounding the corner at the end of the wish list

going through season 41 at this point today with maggie morgan 42 tomorrow with brian scali before we approach the final week and the subsequent opening of the ballot so make sure you check that as well as all of our Big Brother coverage happening on a daily basis. So we're going to be back on Wednesdays from now on. So this coming Wednesday at 6 p.m. Eastern, 3 p.m. Pacific, 8 a.m. for Shannon. Wanda, send them in if you want your voices to quite literally be heard.

And we shall hear all your melodious voices alongside Josh Wiggler from the new era as we hear all about these Wandoff songs. I personally cannot wait. But this has been such a great time. Thank you, Pyridium. Thank you, as always, Shannon. Thank you, Dave. The chat. Happy belated anniversary, Kieran.

And we'll see you again next week. Take care, everybody. Bye-bye.