RHAP: We Know Survivor - Survivor AU: Australia V World Ep 4 Recap

Episode Date: August 24, 2025

We Know Global Survivor host Shannon Guss is recapping every episode of Australian Survivor: Australia V World. Tonight, she and Chappell talk about the twists in episode 4, as well as the strategy, and look ahead to the merge.

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coverage of Australian Survivor for AUV World. I'm your host, Shannon Gass here to talk about episode four. Spoiler alert, don't be here if you haven't seen episode four, move along, pull over if you're in the car, everything, and then press pause. but if you've watched it, the king, the third king in a row, well, there was a god. There's a lot of kings, but the king, really, the king is dead. I'm very, very upset to lose Tony.

I spent a lot of time crying after this episode, but I am happy to talk about it with my guest today. It is a Sunday, and it is Chappelle. Shepal, thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited. I love this show so much. I love this season so much.

And I totally enjoyed Tony and this, episode as well. So I have so much excitement being here. You know, I've been loving listening to you talk about this with other people, but I'm jealous every time you do it. I'm yelling at the podcast. Like, Puyah, what are you talking about? Mike? You're wrong. Like, I'm right. So I'm happy. I'm here. Yeah, but I'm right. And so like now I get to talk to you again. But like, I know, we're right, Shannon. That's what I'm saying. The point is that you and I are right. And these other days, they be wrong. And so now I'm here. But you know, Shannon, now that I'm back. It feels like the landscape of the season is completely different. And I don't like that. I don't like

that last week, we knew who these people were. I was so happy to meet them. And now it feels like everything is gone. Like, it's like, what, you know, like I came into the season so excited to talk about David and George and Tony. And I, what, what do you mean? Like, where are the people? And so this doesn't work for me.

I know, I know it's crazy. And I know we don't have a long season. But we need some non-alims, okay? We need to some redemption islands. We need to, I'm sorry. Shannon, any other season, we'd be getting this stuff in Australian. environment. This is not fair. No. Well, I did think about you when we said, oh, when you come back in a week

from now, we'll have lived lives that can't feel truer. It felt very true when immediately David shockingly went home. But we don't need a noddle him. He's going to be the host of the show Chappelle. You will get your David. You will get him in droves. So you'll be fine. I need an honor for Tony. I have a lot to complain about in terms of Tony going. But I am so devastated about it, especially because we'll talk about it. I don't really feel like Tony did anything wrong. here. Like, I feel like especially of the first four boots, Tony was just straight up screwed in a way that you can't say with nuance of the other three. Like the other three made mistakes or were outplayed in ways where I just feel like Tony was stuck. And watching him fight

against that was not a lot to do, even though he did tie a shoe around his neck, don't want to bury the lead. But, you know, there wasn't a lot for Tony to do. So that's why he just kind of devastated me. I hate seeing him in that position where he's not game changering. I'm putting that is a verb now. He just is in a bad spot. But yeah, after the episode, I just cried thinking about how much I love Tony, how sad I am to lose him here, how unfortunate it is. And the fact that I'm going to have an interview with him.

And you're having an interview on Monday. So I was like, that is the one civil lining for me. And like, I can't think about that without being emotional because I'm so excited for it. I'm so happy. So it's a lot of emotions right now. What did you think of this episode? Shannon, before we even get to that, think about it like this. you have an interview with Tony

but based on what happens tomorrow you could have an interview with literally anybody on this cast and I think all of them would be incredible you know what I'm saying like tomorrow you could be interviewing Janine the next day you could be interviewing poverty like I mean God forbid

but I'm saying like you are in such a good position where although we are going through the roller coaster of emotions on every episode you do kind of get to meet these people you know and it would be so cool I mean like you get to meet Saria at the finale after she wins Shannon there's so much to live forward

to. Where? I'm watching a finale in my apartment. She's going to be here. I mean, she's invited, but I can't tell you something about Surrey before we do it? Before, before we podcast about the season. So, Surrey shared Bryce's is a look video where we were talking about her. Yeah, I saw that. So I replied to her story. I said, Surrey, I'm in this video. I love you. And you know what? And then she said like, hey, and she did like a heart face emoji. And then when I, when I did it, I could see that I used to message her.

I could see that in 2017 I messaged her Can I read you what I wrote For the finale of games? I messaged my mom Yeah let me know what you said I said hi Siri I wanted to be one of the many thousands

I'm sure privately send you A ton of love and support I can proudly say I'm super fan of Survivor and I've watched all seasons multiple times And you're my favorite player of all time By a long way I've been so proud to watch you be brilliant again this season and I continue to be inspired

by a positivity, intelligence and toughness You're my hero and I'm cheering for you all the way Good luck that Lisa was able to quote your message to Ceree verbatim when she got to the island, you know? I know. It's crazy that I might be able to say those things to her in person when she wins in a couple of weeks through now.

But Tony is well. Tony is with the man of the hour. I love Tony. He is sorry. Then it's Tony. You know, I don't like to pick my favorite children, but like between Eliza and Jellica, no, I love me.

But I'm just saying, talking to Tony's a dream come true. I can't wait. Anyway, why am we talking for five? I've been just about my love for these players. You're not even talking about anyone enjoying this. I can only apologize. No, this is great.

I love this. I love this. And I love Tony. I love Tony more in this episode. I have always kind of been like, kind of like, yeah, Tony's a great player,

but he's not for me. You know, like, for me, I'm like, give me to three every time. Look, look, look, I have my issues with Kagayan.

Of course, game changers. Went into wars an awful season. So for me, Tony was just like, he's good. He's really good. But I'm not showing up for the Tony show a lot.

But now in this episode, I was so impressed. I loved him so much. I love any survivor player who's going to do anything it takes within the bounds of the game and not being awful to try to win. The man saw his back was up against the wall, and he did whatever he could. The shoe around the neck is priceless. I loved it. I thought all of it was great.

He went down swinging, and that's all I can ask. I've said this before, and I stand by it. Survivor players are fun when they're in the lead. But when they're playing from the spot at the bottom, when they're playing against adversity, and you get to see them in the fight they have and the passion they have for the game, that's what endears me to a survivor player.

So Tony walking around with the Tyler Para Idol did not endear me to Tony. But this, Tony would like, his back against the wall, up against the all devouring women's alliance, you know, the one that everybody's been clamoring for, including you, Shannon. And so the fact that it came back

to bite Tony is kind of your fault. But you know what I'm saying? Like, that is the type of Tony I want to see. Him putting all his weapons to use here. And even though it was futile, I love the effort. I have so much respect for Tony Vlachos and I'm so excited that you get to talk to him.

Well, you're 11 years late, but we will welcome you to Team TV. It's a great team to be and it has $3 million and it keeps on winning. And honestly, I feel like Toney's five reality TV seasons are like two phenomenal wins. One, bad since and game changes. And now like traders in this where I don't take anything away from him personally. I mean, to talk about some criticisms people have actually had of the season,

because I did actually find some people are like a little negative, but it's like a tiny little minority. I don't want to add to that. I love the season and it's a gift. I know it exists. Actually, there are corners of everywhere. There's an opinion for everything on the internet. But I think we, like, all of those things have been mentioned.

It's just like how much you mention it. Like, it's true. 16 days is unfortunate. The skews, I talked about this even recently with Rob. We've talked about this a lot. You know, it is the minority Americans, minority male. Like, returning seasons will have a skew. Small tribes will have a skew.

Like all of those things might paint someone into a, corner against their will. And this has all of that to extremes. I think it's like how much do you, how much emphasis do you put on those negative? Some people are like, this season doesn't count. Very few people, I think.

I'm like, I love the season with my whole heart. Here are my small notes. It's still incredible. So with all of those skews and those extremes, I think Tony by far is the most and really the only person actively screwed by it. And the show is lucky, I think, so far that it's really only been Tony. because even though we have seen all men go in this uneven gender caste, like Rob made his bet.

If anything, Rob came in with four internationals against three Americans. He had an advantage, and he made mistakes. David didn't play terribly. There were some strategic things we disagreed with, but he was outplayed by Kirby. David came in again with a cast that was suited to him, with long-term multi-decade friendships sometimes, and Kirby, who's been in the community for six months max before they filmed,

got one over on him. He got outplayed by Kirby, I think, even though it was more minimal in terms of like the actual mistakes. George came in in a very bad spot, and I think probably it mentally affected him, but then also made mistakes where I think if he does things differently, he actually gets out of that bad spot based from the way things are happening, and you can see, like, clear blunders. Pony is put as the only American man, like minority American, minority male,

with this like all devouring women's alliance, as you said. And we usually say if someone mentions a woman's alliance in the first act, a woman will go home into the third act. I don't make the rules. It's simply true. There's an antidote to that, and that person is poverty shallow. and that has made sure that we can have all men go so far when we're talking about these women's alliances and for Tony I don't know that I can say

there's much more he could have done you know he wasn't acting crazy until he pulled out his shoe the very end and like I think that that play had merit too and he you know you can go back and I think even in talking about the bad spot there've been conversations in the last few days should he have let Rob Bentley go Rob Bentley was giving him less than Surrey and poverty were

Rob Bentley told me the exit he would have been happy to vote Tony out had Parvey and Surrey um yeah they they probably three were giving him more like if parvine serri had thrown tony under the bus rob bentley which they didn't even do rob bentelay would have been happy to vote out tony let alone the fact that rob is wanting to work like very much with internationals and has this like passionate like international dream without the americans let alone the fact that can tony even do that like can tony get tommy and cass to make a four with rob i don't think so i think tommy and cass are in with lisa Like maybe it is being outplayed by Lisa there to have that connection,

but then they also are unified by being these internationals. So sure, in ways it's like party's also on the back foot as she comes out of it really well, she does have a good group for her with the women, but she, like, still a credit to her. Lisa does really well, but Lisa has a good group with the internationals. You know what I mean?

It's like it's still a credit to them, but they have a little bit of runway, whereas Tony is up against it and then doesn't capitalize on it. But I can't fault him for decisions that seem fine at the time. that I don't think he could make any other way. And I can't fault him for the fact that I think it was just a really bad situation. I don't fault him for going home here at all. So it is a little bit unfortunate for me to be like,

you're a victim of the system, you're a victim of the structure, and to watch him just try so hard in the face of that, like, giant wall was tough for me to watch personally. So why, why Tony, why did Tony go to this episode? Because he, because Cass and Lisa have the power of those women. have the, the emphasis, I think, in that relationship. So you think Cass and Lisa were over to overpower Parvety and Surrey and get Tony out instead of going to, like, rocks or something like that for Tommy?

I think that they care more about Tommy than Surrey cares about Tony. Hmm. So the reason I asked. And as I said on the Rob podcast, well, actually I said that the way to win is to care less. But in this situation, actually is the opposite. Then they were able to put their foot down and care more. Surrey is willing to do that more for them and they fight harder for Tommy So the reason

The reason I asked is because at tribal council You know we weren't clear as to which way This 3-3 split was going to go You know we had both sides fighting for their men I think we were I'm pretty sure it was that Surrey and Parvety were saying we will vote out Tommy

And the international people were saying I mean you know Tony and we would vote out Tommy Like I'm pretty sure it was split going in the travel council Sore also said Soree said, I will do it for She, so re wasn't between Tony and Tommy, Surrey was between poverty and Cass and Lisa

and she was willing to do it for Cass and Lisa. We have the confectioner where she's like, I will do that. So Rie was breaking more than any of the other three. And that that's the break. So Surrey flipped basically. I think so. Yeah. Okay. Well, I don't know, man. Because when they get to tribal council and they're talking and, you know, they're trying to give us this vision of

these two women. They're both women. of both pairs of women are fighting over who's going to keep their third, right? And so when we get the tribal council, if we find out that Sarri flipped, is there anything that Tony could have done with Surrey maybe to keep her a little bit closer to him?

Is there any way that he could have won that fight? Because I thought this was a stalemate. I thought there's no way you're going to get, you know, like just Sarin poverty. If they want this person to stay, they're not going to just bend because you said so. And the fact that they did, I'm kind of looking at them like, huh, it's interesting.

You know, especially for somebody like poverty who I expect to be able to hold her ground a lot more. So that's why I asked. I wasn't sure watching the episode if it was, you know, maybe Tony's antics at tribal council once he realized that him and Tommy were at the bottom? Does he put the target on him by saying, hey, you know what? Look what they're doing. Let's blow it up.

Let me put the fake idol around my neck. Can I do this? Do I do this? Was it him pulling out the stops that made property say, okay, I'm ready to vote now and for you? Or was it always going to be Tony going in? I thought that was unclear, but it seems like you've already made up your mind. Tony was going. I think Tony was going.

I think in Poverty's mind, maybe not. But at the end of the day, Pavity's not the vote that matters. Like, Cerea's going to say, okay, we're going, Tony. And Ceree is the one who's breaking there. Like, I don't think. And also, Tommy and Tony are very different players. And you also can't blame Tony in the game for the things really that they're saying about it. I mean, Lisa's like she can't really work with him.

But she has an agenda because she's trying to work more with Tommy. Parvety says that about Tommy as well. Tony comes in as a two-time winner. Tony comes in as a threat. Now he's also a shield. But some people don't want that in the game. that doesn't help Lisa and Cass at all. And Surrey also doesn't seem to think it helps her that much.

Parvety needs it a lot. I think Sarri is a huge name. But Parvety seems like the only one who really wants to keep that massive threat level in the game. So it's not only that Tony comes in against the skew, he does come in as this huge, huge target, which to be fair, all four of the boots so far, and probably everyone in this cast, to be fair, can talk about as well.

So I don't think that it's anything Tony did. I don't think he played himself out of the game. I saw him coming in at least on the back foot, but not intended with the shoe-eyed. at least. At the very least, I thought he was out the door with his shoes around his neck. But I don't think you played himself out. I think the only thing that you could say that actually I thought was a little dicey was that he told Tommy, he was like, I'm out of here the second we merge. I'm like, Tommy could use that against you. But I do think that there's a confessional

on the cutting room floor of Tommy in the Lisa spot being like, I just want to work with Tony. Like I know I need to throw him under the bus, but I just love, I think that there's that exact dynamic. And I kind of love these like mirror image U.S. internationals where you have like Lisa Surrey, Cass Poverty, Tony, Tommy, which was with the accent sometimes very hard to decipher. But yeah, I mean, do you put any, so you put things on Tony? You think he played himself out of the games? No, I don't put things on him.

I don't put things on him. I'm just saying like, if you talk about Tony's position, Tommy's position is exactly the same. Like, yeah, Tony has a bigger, it is. It literally is. They have, like, the math is even. The math is literally even. You know, it is even, but there's so much more nuance to the math.

But that's the thing. They don't even know Tommy. You know, so they can't be like, well, Tommy's not as dangerous. They don't know them. And they have reason to keep Tony. No one is dangerous. But that's the thing. Parvety has been making, she made her stance clear.

She made her stance clear that she wants Tony in the game as a shield. That doesn't change. Like two hours later, Tony steal that shield that she needs. So the fact that they fold it is, I'm trying to figure out why is this like, why the fold happened, basically? Is this just like, Sarri was like, I don't really care about Tony as much. And if that's the case, then Cerey made this choice, Parvety is in a worst position.

I thought that they were like coming in as a united front against these international players. That's why when we talked about the first episode, and I guess it's kind of cool that they haven't gone back to tribal council since then, so we can pick up where we left off. I was like, neither one of us agree with the rob. Neither one of us agree with the rob thing.

We're like, it's just going to send you to a stalemate. Like, yes, it works for poverty. But now the internationals are like, hey, here we are up against it. we have to, and we have to stand our ground and potentially go to rocks. And so that's why I was very confused as to like, okay, well, what happened to make it Tony specifically? Because I don't know, if I'm party, I'm digging my feet in. Now, don't get me wrong.

Once Tony does his whole thing, party's like, I'm ready to vote. And she writes Tony's name and we get it right in the camera. But was it always going to be that? I don't know. And maybe that's a question that you can ask for, you know, once you get to those people to exit press or whatever, because you're going to get the chance to. But I don't know. Maybe the people in the comments will tell us that they knew Tony was screwed from jump.

but I really thought we were going to have two sides that were just, I mean, I don't know Cass as much. I know Lisa, I know poverty, and I know Ceree, these women aren't going to get bullied by these other women. They're going to, I just thought this was it. Like, this was the clash of the Titans, and we were going to see who came out. And it looks like the U.S. people folded. And I didn't know why. I agree. I agree, but I don't think that they got, like, bullied.

I think that the smoking gun confessional is Ceri saying she will let Tony go. and kind of that she will prioritize Cass and Lisa almost not beyond poverty in the game but beyond poverty's wishes of a shield. It's two people in her lines versus one. If she's a little bit neutral, then that's the way it folds. And it's not to me being bullied,

it's the way that Surrey plays the game. She's a wonderful mediator in that very interesting conversation where they're all giving kind of objective reasons of why you might keep Tommy versus Tony and like Tony is a threat level and Tommy is more workable to some, but then Tony to others and the shield capability. But then they're also, like, very openly saying, like,

I work better with Tommy and poverty's like, I need Tony of the Shield. You guys don't, but I do. And they're very honest about that. And Surrey is the one who's like, what do you think? What do you think? Let's table this. We don't know where it's going to go. Like, let's table this.

Like, we want the best for our lives. We always prioritize our alliance and, like, keeping that in mind. But we're just a little bit of a stalemate right now. And I think that she's just willing to put that alliance first. So I do very much give. extreme credit to Cass and to Lisa, I think that the way they've won that war of relationships is very impressive. But I don't see it as like negatively to Tony. I'm not like, well, Seri was willing to let you go. Yeah. I'm not saying it's not like Herbie beating David for me.

But it's just, no, no, I'm not saying it's negative to Tony. But yeah, but they're both coming in in this spot where they are the ones that are expendable. Both of these guys are the ones expendable. And it's kind of like, okay, well, you're in a messed up situation. But it's not your fault, but it's your problem. And so the question is like, what's the solution? right? Is it, does Tony come in and does he try to throw the women on the bus? I wish we had really gotten to see more. And I don't know what Tony was doing, but like, is there a scene somewhere where Tony goes to Lisa and cast like, look, anybody but me? You know, like, I'll take, like, let's get poverty out. Does he have the option to even try that?

You know, because I feel like there's, there's decades of people getting swapped screwed out of survivor, getting put in a situation where there's just the numbers are against them and there's nothing they can do, especially in those pre-iddle days. It was just kind of like, hey, you're going home. But here, I'm like, okay, is there anyway? Because he was fighting, and I loved watching him fight. But it felt like at tribal council, it was like slowly starting to spiral, right? Like, it was like, the women are huddling in front of them, you know?

Like, if nobody knows they're on the chopper block. They definitely know they're on the chopping block. So that's why I was like, huh, I didn't really read it as Tony was coming in. And he was automatically, you know, the de facto target, because I, I just felt like if Sarri and Parvety wanted him in the game, they would have dug their feet in and we would have gotten a little bit more fireworks. I mean, they have to-

But also, I don't blame Sarri-Reed. Yeah. Yeah, they're not going to rocks for Tony, and they want to prioritize their women's alliance anyway. So, I mean, even if that were a consideration. So I saw Tony is coming in very much out the door. And I think that if you look at Tony's play in the tribal council, it very much personifies a tough spot he was in

because he's up against this women's alliance, where there's an emphasis on the internationals and they have two idols. Like that's what Cass knows. Like Cass has all the knowledge and she's aware of that much information. So what Tony tries to do, I think is really smart. He tries to go to the internationals to basically be like, you can't split because, like,

and like, so you would think like Seri and poverty might want to split a vote. If he's coming, he's trying to break up Serene poverty. He's also against the, like, the fact that poverty is very deservedly one immunity. But anyway, continues to make his really, really tough spot. So he says, you know, okay, well, they're going to split a vote on Tommy. Internationals, are you choosing Tommy or are you choosing poverty and Surrey? Now, he's up against a lot of very unfortunate things. Yeah, first unfortunate thing is that Harvey and Surrey will not split a vote because they

know that there's an idol they could use if the shoe is an idol. And we can talk about any of the doubt that was in that. But it's like if it happens, they can use the idol. I still think it was crazy for them not to split a vote because you'd hate to lose an idol on that when like poverty can throw a vote while immune at Tommy and she has nothing with Tommy. I know you want to go in congenial to emerge,

but I think that it would be worth an idol to split the vote on Tommy. It's not like he doesn't know that they aren't huddling together as the four women, but they don't split the vote. So for Lisa, Lisa, I think, is actively choosing Surrey and she also doesn't have a choice. Like Surrey will be immune if Tommy plays an idol. But even if she had the choice, I think she chooses Surrey. She initially says they should split.

So she's one who even says that to split on Tommy she's choosing her women's alliance over Tommy but she definitely wants to keep Tommy but yeah so she also knows Sarri will be fine and not only does she know serri will be fine but she knows that she doesn't even have to have any splits on Tommy and Surrey will be fine and she's probably fine with poverty playing the key idol if it comes to that the podium idol so she's in a perfect spot where it's like I'm not splitting on Tommy Tony will probably go if he plays an idol sorry will be fine and unfortunately Tommy will have to be sacrificed this is all fine so Tony is not getting like you know I'm preceding her as much as he is hoping to, even though the plan makes sense because she would choose

Surrey anyway and because you know she doesn't even have to do it because they have this backup idol. And then Cass is a level above that where she's like, I choose Surrey. And I have an idol. And I know I don't have to choose anyone because I have the idol. So she's like at another level. So he's trying to really get to Cass and Lisa to save Tommy and for like a bunch of different reasons they're not into it. But it's not Tony's fault. You know what I mean? It's just it's so unfortunate because I see what he was trying to do, even though it was in the Tony fashion to be tied his shoe around his neck, Chappelle. Why aren't we talking about it? I love that. I love

that. I'm telling you, these were the moments that I was like, okay, I love Tony. I love seeing somebody who's so passionate that they're trying. Well, that's the thing. Look, I have strong feelings about somebody marching to the end of the game with an idol that you can play after the Volta Red. It just, it's not for me. You know what I'm saying? Anybody could have done that. No, no. I completely disagree. Okay, well, we've only seen the people who have that idol do it twice, so, you know, two out of two. They were both brilliant players.

And that's not true, we've seen another person not do it. We've seen Terry Dietz loose. Terry Deach made it to the end, too. But then he lost. I'm talking about getting to the end. He didn't convince who to take him to the end? Yes, you're right. He didn't convince Surrey?

Like, who are you looking for? There's no woo in that season. Anyway, listen, the point here is that that that, That wasn't so impressive to me. This was more impressive to me. Somebody, like I said, who is willing to say, okay, I can see that the writing is on the wall and I have to do something.

And I'm going to figure it out because Tommy was sitting over there like a bump on the log, literally just sitting there. There was moments where it looked like he wanted, he wanted to get in there. But he's like, I don't really know what to do. Tony's going off the rails. And I love Tony going off the rails

because at least a little chaos could get people questioning things. You know, him tying the shoe around his neck. It wasn't that he put a shoe on him. with the confidence in which he put the shoe on. It takes you back to that Kagayan bag of tricks, right? Like, I got something in here. There's nothing.

You know, this man is a former cop. You know, so he's probably used to the people like, hey, I have a gun. It's like, I can't see the gun, but I think you have a gun. You have your hand in your pocket. It might be a gun. So I can't risk, you know, making a move because what if it's a gun? He puts the shoe around his neck. And he doesn't say, like, oh, I put the shoe around my neck sheepishly.

Like, oh, I know this isn't going to work. I hope this works. He puts it around his neck. Like, now what are y'all going to do? and they're kind of like, Spool got a shoe around his neck. What? And I was thinking, well, he must not,

nobody would have put the shoe around their neck for nothing. You know, so they have to, it has to mean something, right? Then they go talk about it. They're like, it means something. Someone's like, no, it's just a shoe.

It's like, is it just a shoe? Because, like, he's wearing it around his neck. It's like, no, no, it's just a shoe. You know, that kind of confusion is what you're looking for in a masterful elite survivor player because had it worked, and it could have.

Like, you know, that's the type of gameplay you look for from somebody like Tony. You don't get that from everybody. And so I think that these moments are the ones that solidify him and one of the greatest players of all time. Okay.

Firstly, you're so wrong about Kagayan, but I'm acutely aware that it's not the time to argue with you about it. Acutely is crazy. You get it to the end. There was no God idol then. Stop it. Wu is not smart.

So? Do you understand how bad the mistake was? Yes, because Wu is not smart. it's not just on woo you also have to credit we're not even talking about kagan shen come back you're killing me but it's fine you've joined the party but you're not a good guest at the team team it's the fact that you keep calling me late i thought this was a welcoming party i'm trying to get in here now people in the comments mad at me i just showed up to the party i didn't know it wasn't like i don't know it was hostile like this you can't come to the party

and be like woo i'm tony now yeah team tv but he shouldn't kagean wasn't that good everyone's like get out i came to the party and you were like you were like you're like you're You're late. It was like, wait, what? At least I'm here. You're 11 years late. Oh my God, I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. Tony's great. As someone who's like late to everything, 11 years is more than fashionably late. Okay, but it's fine. We welcome you. Don't insult Kagiang. It's fine.

Moving on, I had points. Oh, hi, buddy. Who's the best? You are. I wish I could spend all day with you instead. Uh, Dave, you're off mute. Hey, happens to the best of us. Enjoy some goldfish cheddar crackers. Goldfish have short memories. Be like goldfish.

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Because Tommy, to be fair, is like, we're fine. Just don't split. He's going to vote for Surrey. So in Tommy's mind, Cass and Lisa have chosen him because Cass and Lisa have the benefit of being like, we're not splitting. In Tommy's mind, he just won that war because Cass and Lisa didn't split. And for some reason, which maybe should be concerning. And he doesn't have the idol, neither to Tony. And maybe that's just, maybe that's what you think. But yeah, and so fair enough, you can assume there's an idol. But if you're thinking there was no split, technically Tommy wins that battle because no one's split to take him out. And Sarit technically goes home if Tony has an idol, unless you're thinking someone has a idol.

an idol which to be fair someone does have to do so tommy is kind of willing to be like just no one do anything and they don't but they also know they have the backup i think as well it's like then you have to try like work out how much is this happening in terms of does tony of the idol now the idol would be if tony got a clue i'm working it back in tony's mind like tony gets a clue that's like the idol's already in your possession simply simply dye a shoe around your neck and you will activate the idol that's how i thought yeah The thing is that Tony is acting desperate, which makes it seem like he's vulnerable. But the other thing is Tony will always play big, that Tony shouldn't just allow them to split and let Tommy go.

So he should do something to keep Tommy and something big and Tony will. So there are parts of it that are believable, I'm saying, about the shoe around his neck. And they're having to do that, but they just have so many fallbacks that it's not going to work. And it's just, he's up against, you know, an alliance with two idols. it wasn't Tony's time it just wasn't his time which you know we're very sad in the party

and there's a guy ruining it as well talking about Kagan I too am sad about this party I just wasn't at the Kageyan party that's okay you know this party is not that party I agree I thought they're like

he did what he could within the bounds of the game you know I like I said people have been swapped screwed and screwed by a twist for Survivor nobody ever said Survivor was fair this time it landed on Tony we have seen Sari get look

I as the first person at the Surrey party okay the person at the door letting people in I will tell you I will tell you I will tell you I let you in I will tell you people get screwed it happens you know but it's not fun it's not fun it sucked this really did suck because I think we're being robbed of seeing Tony

at the merge and like we didn't know what that was going to look like but Tony doesn't play a straightforward game and I could just imagine what it looks like once Tony and the Aussies and everybody is on one beach because what we get is the preview of the next episode and Shannon, we're right there. We're right there at the merge. It's right there.

We're so close. We could have had Tony running rampant. Let's talk about how we might have had it in terms of the twist of the episode. I, again, small notes, the season's the best thing that have happened to me. I thought this was pretty convoluted. Like, it definitely could have been worse.

Some of the things they were suggesting, which have all been done by Australian Survivor were all worse. I know you say you want non-alims, but someone still would have gone home had they done the firemaking thing that they've done in all. stars where two people are voted out and then one comes back. And I always hate that.

It's like, you didn't even save an episode with the non-alim. And now someone has an asterisk next to their name and that they've been brought back. And I was like, please don't do that. Then Surrey was like, maybe only the people immune are voting, which we've also done. Which I famously didn't love. So it could have been, it could have been a lot worse. I think this was kind of like, kind of like what they've been doing recently. Like, it wasn't so bad because it didn't, it wasn't, didn't like ruin the

sanctity of the game in huge ways. but it was just, it was very convoluted. It made the entire immunity challenge for the Australian tribe redundant, which also felt unfair because the world rushed that. I loved Luke giving birth. That was hilarious. That was really fun. But I think that, yeah, it made that redundant.

And then I also thought them picking rocks for the firemaker. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff. Like, you know, Tony the fire winner, trying to coach Surrey, who's already been a fire loser. Like, I get the history. I just think that they should have been able to at least put in their best champion because then you get decisions, right? then someone's going to put their hand up and be the champion and lose.

Now, that's interesting. The Rock, it's like no one wanted Surrey to go up there and she didn't want to do it either. Like, it's just unfortunate. So I thought it was a less interesting decision and it was way more unfair. And then the immunity challenge made less sense structurally. It just kind of made, didn't make that much sense for me. It felt like they were just trying to take up time, which they don't need to do because I'll just spend time with these people every second. If the episodes were five hours, I'd be there.

I just think if they wanted like a big Sunday night twist, like just merge them. if you want the interactions we're barely getting them anyway just merge them or just do a swap last episode and swap like do two episodes and then swap for two episodes and then that might also i mean swaps can screw people too but with these big skews it would get rid of some of that um well i mean it would move to the swap but it would be in different ways it might make it more dynamic it might switch it up i think they should have just maybe they could have swapped for one episode they could have swapped here and then merge tomorrow or they could have done what we suggested which they didn't return of the outcast and done the kind of big tribal council and then they just merge right after it but

they all vote together. Someone can definitely get screwed there as well. But I honestly just think they should merge them tonight. But no, no. They wanted them going to the merge even. They wanted this even split. And the best way that happens, I mean, but look, you don't get that if you merge them, right? If you merge them right now, you get the world up one on the Aussies and then potentially

you could get a poggong. Of course, that wouldn't happen. But you could. Yeah. Here, you say, there's no bonging in this season. I mean, we can talk about it. we can talk about it but um yeah so here you flip a coin the world ends up having to vote somebody out and the Aussies get off scot-free they lost the challenge and have lost the last three

and here they are just like nope we don't have to vote anybody out i thought that was kind of messed up like what is the point of the immunity challenge if you're like yeah yeah but your tribe still gets to be intact like y'all you lost you should have to vote somebody out i'm sorry we don't know we don't know like sarah could have outlasted the entire world tribe unlikely I mean, it's just, I mean, maybe. It was just horrible. Like, I have said Cass and Parve are two of the best endurance athletes I've seen on the show.

I don't know. I don't want to put that past there. I'm just saying. Yeah, I won't put it at the point where they all dropped before the world players without even leaves of playing. Like, they all did, seri, like, amazing. Right.

It seems unlikely that Australia would have won that challenge. So it feels like we had a bit of a homeground advantage. It feels like when you watch like a football game and the umpires like giving the crowd a homeground call you know, didn't love it. Yeah. Oh, yeah, no. What?

Is that a different language? Yes, because you meant football like soccer. No, I meant like Australian rules football. But it doesn't matter, whatever. It's true. Anyway. In any sport where the umpire referee is like hearing the crowd and kind of like, let the call go.

What do you know what I mean? I hear you. Usually at football, I went to a different. It's fine. But yeah. So I think you get this, you now get this opportunity to put them at 5-5 going into this merge. And that's a totally different ballpark. know, like, you have the Aussies have the opportunities.

You say, like, no, we're going to say Aussie's strong. You have the world looking to either divide even further or get, you know, or to stay strong too. Who knows? So, I don't know. I feel like if you swap them a little early, you don't get this opportunity. I think they really kind of want this. This is like Heroes of Villains, right?

You get to the merge and it's dead even. And then it's like, okay, now what do you do? And I think that this kind of puts us in that same vibe. And we talked about other parallels with Heroes of villains, but I do think that this puts the same vibe of like, it's still AU versus the world at this point. I think that that's overlooking the coolest part about all of this, which is

the interactions. Like, we don't want especially because it's not even US versus AU. You know, then I would get it. It's like country v. country. Like, it's AUV the world. Like, they're all from different countries anyway. So I kind of feel like what you want

is the dynamic interactions. What we want is like Kirby already trying to like get something going with part of like they wanted it here they're like also down to tribal council for one second and then jonathan is going to explain the twist and like but that's not enough like they don't you don't want them to sit next to each other we want them to be like actually interacting and another thing i didn't like about the twist was that was that was that no one knew what's happening so you did get two tribes strategizing which in many ways is better but they were also half strategizing because they didn't know like you say was tony walking in going home technically no one was

because they felt like they didn't really have to make that decision they were hoping they would just go back to camp. And if Tody was the firemaker, like, maybe that would be the case. So they didn't know. And you can even tell that Kirby, you know, Kirby is like, I might save Shawnee. And Kirby loves clearly, like a tribal council, you know,

she loves, she loves shenanigans. Yeah, yeah, that's my girl. She was also right, because you'd hate to blow up, like, I think she could have, like, to save Shawnee, what I would do is I go to Sarah and be like, Luke and Janine told me what you said, verifiably. I still trust you, but we should vote out, Janine. You'd hate to do that. And then you'd, like,

at camp and you don't even know if you're voting and then you don't vote. Yeah. So she did the right thing by keeping it to tribal council, but the thing is it like gutted both strategies. I'd rather they just had information for what they were doing because people don't want to play. People will be more conservative. People will keep things closer to the vest if they don't know what they're doing.

And rightfully so, as we see, God forbid, Kobe does block her whole tribe and then they move in as a five to the merge anyway and they don't go to tribal council here. Oh, Shannon. let me tell you about a little show called Big Brother. That is where we are in Big Brother right now, is that we have this Battle of the Block, this BB Blockbuster or whatever that happens

on the day of the vote out, right? And so everybody is planning for basically all outcomes because they don't know who's going to be up for elimination. And that's what we had here. Like Kirby's saying like, okay, when I get there, I might save Shawnee. But that's only if I get there and I have the ability to save Shawnee and we were going to vote

somebody out and I have to vote somebody out. And then in that case, you have to say, can Kirby say Shawnee, you know, and can she do it within the confines of the tribal council? So I don't hate that, but I definitely agree with you. I think giving them more time to interact is what I, is what I personally want, right? Like, I want to see like the Avengers, right? Like, I don't really, I don't really care that they're on two different tribes. I'd rather them be at tribal council. Was it, was it game changers, in fact, that they did the, was it the joint tribal council where both tribes came together and had to vote out one person? Isn't that the J.T. Yeah. Getting Malcolm voted out tribal council?

that would have been cool you know it was so you can get screwed on that you can't like it can be unfortunate that's the game yeah yeah you can get screwed but what I'm saying is I think that's way more interesting than what we got yeah I like anything like this was like kind of a little unfair and then also just kind of weird it's fine

it's still the best thing that ever happened to me I just think even if it was the same challenge and then you know then poverty wins also reward and then they get to eat reward while watching the tribal council and then they merge after it or something you know so anything like I know that's kind of like small stakes but the stakes here were kind of small the stakes here were like you actually the immunity challenge you thought you were doing was individual immunity for just one of you and not actually the other

one of you who want immunity and now you have a different immunity challenge which is that you're going to randomly be assigned a firemaker and then that's the immunity challenge like no part of that is fair or make sense. And I also think like if they had won that fire, you'd be pretty pissed off if you were poverty who offered for cast, that she would give cast an endurance challenge later. And then it wouldn't have mattered at all. It did matter here. I was surprised at poverty did that anyway because it felt like if you go to tribal council, you're so okay. You have the key at a worst case scenario. If it's just your tribe, you have like a splitable majority. Like they seem fine and then like even if it like because they didn't know what was happening maybe that's why you

do it um in case it is like a double tribal or whatever but then you do have the key as like for worst case scenario i think that she should have not done that to cass and i think that giving up a future immunity when she's so scared about being a target and needs tony's a shield wasn't the right deal what did you think about that i mean she was just talking you know like if it comes down to it we don't you know come on man what what cats go do like you told me you get girl this is a survivor and you're in the world it was a truck involved guess what We moved on, you know? Like, life went on.

I don't think you want to be, like, bargaining with that social capital here. I don't think it matters. Cass might not even be there for the next endurance challenge. You say whatever you got to do to win this immunity and then you move on. So, like, I think poverty gets in the spot she's in because she was immune. She did not have the key idol. She was going to go get that thing from the podium. And that would have been a whole thing in and of itself, too.

So, you know, I don't mind her. Not if you're about to play it. The worry is. getting it to, yeah, but like if you, if you need it tonight, which is what I'm saying, it could be the desperate situation if he doesn't have immunity, then it's just like pulling it out, like just to go get it from Jonathan's podium. So that's actually not that big a deal. But lying the cast doesn't bother me. It doesn't. It doesn't. It doesn't. So what? And okay. It's like, all right. So I didn't give you the end to doing Shepard's like you don't,

you don't even know if you're ever going to be in that position again. Like that's assuming, like you said earlier, we can't count out that Sarah wouldn't have been in that spot next time, you know, or even Shawnee. I was very surprised that Shoney didn't. Yeah, yeah, I was very surprised that Shawnee didn't outlast it. Like they were talking about Shawnee as if she's not like great at immunity endurance. I'm like now Shawnee's like one of the watch, you know? And so you make this, this is

an empty promise. Like yeah, sure, I'll honor. Okay, fine. And then you deal with that later on. You can vote her out before you can get there. Like, who knows? So I don't have a real issue with that. I do have an issue with you bringing up Terry Dietz in an episode where we had to watch the remake fire. Apologize. Sorry. It's Terry's bold.

I'm just saying, I was negative on Terry. I'm saying he had the god idol who didn't win the show. anyway, no, but it was also an empty promise from Cass because Cass was about to drop. I was like what is saying was at a point. It's just saying words, yeah, it didn't matter. What did you think about watching Sarri play fire, do fire because this is traumatic.

They should not be allowed to show us this. This is, I was like, okay, I was like, anybody but serene. Then it was serene, I was like, okay, think, can she do this? I was like, thinking back, I was like, okay, it's been years. It's been decades. She's played like six times. surely surely she can do this she has it and then to watch her like struggle and struggle and struggle

I just like what is happening like she still doesn't have it and like me the delusional serris stand that I am I'm like she can do this she can do this I shouldn't she can do this right right honestly I don't care no I care because a survivor 50 she might have to make a fire do not no I voted against that I didn't ask you bored I couldn't vote. I'm Australian, but I'm just saying I don't care if we can make a fire.

She's the best person alive. I don't care if she gets across a balance beam. It's not important. The fire is important in Survivor 50. No. It's very important and you know it. Well, it is very. Who's most likely to get screwed by Shannon?

Who's most likely to get screwed by the fire? I'm just saying, I'm just saying watching Surrey in this moment, I was just going through a range of emotion. I was like, I feel like Lisa could have made the fire I would have bet, I would say, Sarita got this, she can do this. I said, do you know what I said?

I said, Sarah probably can't make the fire like Surrey can't. It's been so long since Sarah's played. Saris played every other year for the last decade and a half. Like, this is fine. It played at the same time. They both played in 2017. But did they both play four times prior to that too? You know, I was like, she's got more reps.

Shannon, what happened? She's only known for losing the fire. Like, that's the only information. we have. I think, look, imagine being a person whose two favorite players are Surrey and Tony. And then, like, you're a child and you watch Surrey

lose at fire and she loses the game in Panama. And then, like, decades later, she loses at fire and then Tony goes. It's just like, I don't like this. I don't like episodes where Surrey loses it fire. And I don't like who goes home. I don't like this. Yeah, I don't like this. This was tough. I don't know.

The fire thing really bothered me, but It bothered me even more because it landed on security. Reading, playing, learning. Stellist lenses do more than just correct your child's vision. They slow down the progression of myopia. So your child can continue to discover all the world has to offer through their own eyes. Light the path to a brighter future with stellar lenses for myopia control.

Learn more at SLOR.com. And ask your family eye care professional for SLOR-Stellus lenses at your child's next visit. I'm saying that. Not for Sarah strategically, and it has been an absolute mess. I love Sarah with my whole heart, but in the challenges, I think Sarah came in,

I don't think George has won an individual immunity. He will tell you he won, like a reward when they were, I think at the merge of Brainsfeed-Bron where they were like throwing the stamp back. But I think other than George, Sarah on the Australian tribe hadn't won an immunity

because she, you know, she came eighth and she'd only played that one season, so she didn't have that many immunities to play. She won immunity, her first immunity, as far as I'm aware, and she won fire. Like, she actually was, like, beasting out these challenges in one episode, but it wasn't going well for her. She would have gone home if she wasn't immune and if Ben wasn't immune again.

Like, she literally saved herself twice. And if she didn't win those two or one of the, yeah, she goes home. So what do you think of that? What do you think that she goes up? Do you think Kirby can do the Kirby at tribal council and make this happen? Oh, no, well, that's not even what it's about. The only reason that Kirby has to get it. off Shawnee is because Sarah's immune

if they don't have an individual immunity challenge and that's automatically Sarah Sarah was out the door in Tony the idol shoes like the this was crazy to me. Firstly Kirby's power it's something I don't I don't believe I watch it every week

no stop it I'm a believer we sat on that finale podcast me you Leanna and Puyah and me and Leanna were like y'all don't get it like yes we see Ferris but y'all don't get it. Like, y'all don't get it. Me and Leona were going to the back.

I'm at the party. You don't get it. Once I'm out of the party. I've been here. You at the party. I've been here from the first day. I invented the party. I sent out the invitations. Listen. Did you guy invite to the Kirby party? The Kirby party is a special party. I love it. Because there's a moment, even in this scene, I think in this

episode where Luke goes, well, Kirby's in charge. And I'm like, do you know how it sounds? Like, do you look around you? Look the players you're surrounded by. Kirby who has not seen any of y'all play Survivor at all. Kirby who has not played nearly the amount of days that any of you have played

and she's in charge? This lady, I just we need more Kirby's in this world who can just show up and do stuff. Because how can she do this? I love it. I don't care what happens from now. Like even in the next time I'm on, they're like

talking about taking out Kirby. I'm like, don't do that. But even if she would go home tomorrow, this season has only like quadrupled my already high estimations of Kirby that I had when I was setting up the decorations for the party that I'm the host of in the Kirby party. But it is insane because when we talked about this last week and we thought, Kobe's not in a great spot because Sarah's pulling away. She's worked with Luke before and yes, Kirby knows Luke. Luke knows everyone. Okay, Luke had so many connections on this tribe. Sarah has worked with Luke. We thought Sarah's going

to go to Luke and Janine and say Kirby or Shawnee. My thought Kirby was out. I thought we could, I thought Kirby could throw Shawnee under the bus. What actually happens is firstly, Sarah even says Johnny not Kirby. So Kirby's already good to go. Even though Kirby should manage Sarah better, I will say that part. Then before even the challenge, like they might not even go back to a tribal council. They couldn't have known it would be an individual immunity

that Sarah would win, but they might not even go back to tribal. And they still blow it all up rather than going in more congenial or just taking the easy route with Sarah. And they go to Kirby. And they say, Kirby, we want to work with you. even though Kirby's want to talk out David like sure Sarah flip but Kirby like took that shot they go to Kirby and Kobe has complete control

she has all the information and the ammo that may be to save Shawnee or at the very least she was never in danger and the only reason any of that is even a concern is because Sarah is immune like Sarah is just going to go home so Kirby was completely going to have a cake and eat it too and even with the difficulties of Sarah winning immunity and them having to possibly vote like that

she would maybe lose Janine or could like hopefully you know keep Shawnee or maybe lose Shawnee at absolute worse because Sarah's immune. She's so powerful. How is she doing that? It's amazing. I do want to talk about what you were saying

about Kirby not managing Sarah well enough. Is this Kirby taking her foot off the gas or is this Sarah being Sarah? Because she's very wishy-washy in this season. We've seen her like she's, I want to be loyal, but I don't know who to be loyal to, but I'm loyal sometimes. And she put all her eggs in the Kirby basket.

And now she's coming to Kirby like, look, it's me. you're number one. And Kirby's like, okay, cool. And I don't know if she's just looking for words of affirmation. Like, do you really believe that Kirby was like, it's being culture? Because when we cut to Kirby and Kirby's finding this information out, she's like, why is Sarah playing me like this? We're ride or dies. You're supposed to ride or die. It's not ride, get paranoid because I'm not giving you enough and then jump ship or start complaining to other people. It's ride or die. I said I got you. So I got you. Is this just like Sarah doesn't play the

Kirby style of game? Is Kirby not giving Sarah enough? What do you read about? on this situation between the two of them? I mean, there have been pain points, right? Like Kirby has made Sarah, yeah, pretty much made Sarah do what she didn't want to do two different times. Like, I think she should be going out of her way to manage Sarah, knowing there's that kind of issue in the relationship and that Sarah could be unhappy about it.

So I do kind of put a little bit on, I put, I don't put it really on Sarah because I can kind of see why Sarah would be upset. I put most of it on the situation because, as I said, like, Sarah most wanted to work with David and Kirby and, like, mostly target Shawnee. Kirby most want to work with Sarah and Shawnee and, like, mostly target David. Like, that's a very untenable relationship. So I think it's mostly just that they have, like, such misaligned priorities, and that's really tough.

But I do think knowing that that that Kirby could put in a little more love. I don't think that that's really, like, she's not like a Surrey style player like that. Like, you see the way Surrey caters to her allies and he's, like, kind of mothers them in some way. She is mother, but like, I don't think that's really Kirby. Like, I don't think Kobe's really going to coddle you, but maybe she should a little bit more. So, but even saying that, like, Kirby also doesn't need to because apparently if she mismanages it or if it's a tough situation, when someone comes to another, you know, other options, they ain't even taking you out. She still wasn't even taking Kirby out. And then they're going to come back to

you. Like, that was just absolutely insane. And I have to say for Shawnee as well, like, Shawnee, there's like some pros and cons. The pro is like they also want to work with Shawnee over Sarah. Like they don't want to vote out Shawnee, which is what Sarah is saying to do. But Shawnee has had this crazy Sarah blindside. And to be fair, it might because it's unforeseeable. But if Shawnee watching this back, like, why does Sarah have it out with me? Like, she's in Sarah line.

Yeah, it would be very confusing. You know, Shawnee's in the group chat. Like, what the hell is wrong with this girl? You know, like, you know what's happening. And, and, you know, to Kirby's power, I don't think knowing Luke outside the game hurts. you know, we do see when Janine and Luke are coming to Kirby like, hey, maybe it's the

three of us. Like, well, having a pre-exist relationship. Yes. I did totally tribal with the two of them. And that's perfect for somebody like Kirby because she knows nobody. So she needs something. And so I think that you do have that natural bridge. I'm not saying that it couldn't have formed if Luke didn't know Kirby, but it definitely helps.

And so, yeah, I don't know. Of course, I kind of agree with you that Kirby should be paying more attention to Sarah. But Sarah's not really in a powerful position at all to be like, acting out you know it's kind of like once you got up under kirby's thumb you have to be her like got a ride or die you

you put yourself at the foot of the master you can't go and start plotting against her because if it gets back then you put yourself in a situation where you're in today where it's like if you lose this challenge it's you and I think that she was playing a really dicey game I think this uh this twist with the fire as you pointed out definitely saved her

and I don't know what that looks like moving forward now that Kirby has lost trust in Sarah now that we're going to emerge what do we do next And I would love to talk through the merge with you prior to us getting there. That's crazy that that's tomorrow. It's tomorrow. Before that, I mean, Luke and Janine have always had a really lovely relationship

and we see, like, how tight they are here. I think Genez lost her too hot on herself. I thought the split was very fine. And, like, just because it doesn't pan out, like, you don't do a split because someone definitely has an idol. Like, you do a split because they might have an idol and he didn't. Anyway, it's also a fair bet that George might have an idol. But you don't split on your ally.

No, but you don't split on your ally. It's really, I understand. But yeah, yeah, you do. You do have a choice. You do, don't split. That's the choice, you know, like, if you're a lawyer as an idol. But he didn't, and you could have not split, and you'd be in a, like, you could be at 100% if you didn't do that.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't split. I'm saying that you do have options. And that's why you feel bad because you want to work with somebody, because if somebody, no, because if somebody split on you, you wouldn't be like, this is fine. I understand. Even Shawnee's saying that. She's saying that, exactly. So that's why I feel like Janine has to kind of have, like, look at the situation and say,

I split on this. I want to work with. Now I have to mend that. I can't just sit on it and be like, it's the numbers. Look at the numbers. It's fine. No, no, you voted for me. So what's up? What, you got to, you got to, you either, you either got to vote me out or you got to lock me in. There's no middle ground. Well, that's why I was fun. Like, if he does have an idol and she doesn't split, she looks like the biggest idiot on the planet, you know, like, then he doesn't have an idol, but you took that you, it was a cautious approach for that. And you were willing to make that, like, social gap. You did it with Luke as well. And I mean, they had, I mean, they ended up

other options here. I don't know if they thought they would. Luke obviously knows he has an idol in terms of that. Genean thinks she's a little bit more vulnerable. There's not a lot of tribal councils and you're thinking you're going to merge soon. You'd really hate to not split and then the merge was next episode or you don't go back to tribal council even, let alone the fact that like Janine might have even been fine here. And yeah, and you didn't split and George did have an idol. It's also such a fine bet that George has an idol. I just think she was a little too hard on herself. Sure, it's always a fun back and forth, but she was like, oh, I can't if I split, it's like, no, it made sense.

It's just a decision you made. Like, it's just one way or the other. Yeah. But you have to manage the decision. You know, there's aftercare to these decisions. Shawnee, like, we're going to get to the merge next episode. If Shawnee is feeling some type of way about y'all voting for her, what's keeping Shawnee from going to the highest bidder at this point?

Like, I know I'm at the bottom. Y'all voted for me on the split. It was George or me. George could very much be here and I could be gone. So now maybe I should work with some people who wouldn't split on me. Maybe I should vote some people who vote with some people who, I could use to split on y'all, you know? So I understand why you would be looking at this

and being like, damn, because you do show your cards a little bit. You did show Shawnee where she was in the pecking order. You have to, though, because of, like, it's a tough, tough situation. We can go back to Mark cases that show you. You shouldn't show people where the pecking order is, Shannon. Like, we've been doing this. Yeah, but it's not something you want to do. Sometimes it's something you have to do if you're in a tricky spot.

And I'm sure people have been yelling at the podcast, because I feel like in every podcast, I'm like, yeah, and then Janine would go home. George also did actually vote for Luke, but like that's just a caveat that doesn't really matter. But like, so she really wasn't out of the door at all.

But anyway, this is the beauty of splits. We're here since Cowboy thought of it a very, very, very long time ago in seasons. We keep referencing about that period.

Why don't we keep coming back to these same seasons? Yeah. Yeah, but, and it's still interesting because, and we do this every time.

We do this for the new era for every episode. Should you split on a possible shot in the dark? And, you know, it's, we weigh it up and it's always interesting.

I do think Gene's a bit hard to be like, I definitely shouldn't have it's like no it's a choice and it's anyway but then what about the choice to go back to Kirby like you would think they would just take the easy option I think especially when you don't know if you're going to go back to tribal council and then you could merge like they really like blew it up and maybe to be fair to be fair I guess now I'm like talking myself back around like you don't want to split the majority which they are in the loosest of terms because they don't want to put them on their terms right so it's a more aggressive

move and that might not be great right before Emerge. The more congenial thing is like, okay, we have Sarah in our back pocket. If we go to Tribe, we know we have this. We could vote out Shawnee. Or we can try work with Shawnee. We can try work with Kobe and like really blow it up to take out Sarah. That's what they do. It's more aggressive. But I guess if you're at the bottom and it's a short season,

maybe you play with fire. But I think just because it's right before Emerge, I would expect them to be a little bit more passive. But now that I'm talking it through, I guess I'm not that mad at it. Yeah. I mean either. I like the move. I like the move. Okay. What else? do we have? What else was

it? I feel like this. Oh, you want to hold of the merge? Oh, yes, definitely. I definitely want to talk about the merge because I feel like there's so much that can happen. As we talked about earlier, you know, it's not, like, the line is not as clear as it may seem, right? Like, this is not tribal lines because you have two

Americans, you have the three people from separate countries, and then, of course, you have the Aussies who are all coming in as one big tribe, but, yeah, and the Women's Alliance as well. And you have the Austin's governing in is one big alliance that, you know, could just decide to stick together, you know, or whatever, but they probably won't because they're dysfunctional. We also saw that the Kirby, what was it, the Kirby, Luke, and Janine alliance appeared in this episode. You know, so it's like, hmm, or maybe the international people get back again with Tommy.

Do they scoop him back up? Does Tommy now seeing that Tony was at the bottom and that he probably is at the bottom, too? Does he automatically go running to the highest bidder? I feel like there's so many different, like, possibilities going into the merge. don't know what it would be, but I highly doubt they're going in 5-5 and they're going to go to rocks. No, no. I mean, if anything, the Australians are like coming for each other's throat.

Like, there's so much going on. But I think the way that I would think it would work in a longer season is like the women's alliance picks up like a Kirby and a Shawnee and they kind of dominate. But I do wonder if in a shorter season, it's like the women's alliance isn't looking to recruit. They look like, they're not looking to recruit the big name players. like maybe they are looking to like get a really big win. Recruit maybe some more passive players.

Like definitely get like a Tommy. See who's on the outs. Maybe you can recruit like a Sarah. What if Sarah goes at a like let's take out Shawnee. But I feel like poverty will love Shawnee. So I think that I think the women's alliance is in control because I think that they're the most unified biggest block. And Rob always says that right.

Like what like that's where the kind of power lies. So that's four of 10 but with extreme recruitment potential. and I think a lot of targets so is it like oh no we're just going to like devour like a loop but then Luke has an idol is there like some sort of split is it something as easy as that I think I'm struggling with I don't know what a merge vote looks like

in this permutation I don't know if you do a big vote or if you do something kind of easier at first because it's such a short season I don't know if you do an easy thing so maybe they could be game hunting I think Sarah's gone how so how does that look because kirby's in charge

kirby so like all this stuff doesn't matter when yeah that's what that's what i really think i think that all of this stuff is cool until kirby decides it's not she comes in and she already wanted to target sarah anyway the girls alliance it definitely works for kirby because she is also a woman so this is perfect and so if she wants to throw somebody to the wolves sarah's easy pickings they were already thinking about getting rid of her and then she said okay i can ride with the Women's Alliance for a little bit, and then if I need to take out some of these other threats, then obviously I can. But I think the first sacrificial lamb is Sarah. I don't think there's any reason to target Tommy. Yeah, he has nowhere else to go. I think Shawnee and Kirby are locked in.

I think Sarah kind of have, she's betrayed everybody on her tribe. You know, like, Luke and Janine did not come in wanting to get rid of David, you know? So it's like, she doesn't have any allies, for real. Like, she's at the bottom of the room. Yeah. Tommy at least has the other international people looking out for him, possibly. yeah I mean the strength of the women's alliance won't get rid of Tommy because half of them who apparently have like the power here don't want to get rid of Tommy at all and I think that if they like if it got to that point if like there was another tribal council they would have had to but like they really don't want to so I don't think that Tommy's in any danger I could see Sarah but then I think what the issue that you're pointing to is that Sarah's too easy because if everyone will do it then what's the point like I think they could go from like they could be a bigger power struggle than everyone having consensus. vote when there's so few votes it is interesting because we have it's such a good season it is amazing but like four three of the four votes have been like unanimous so i think they might want to like draw some real blood and i don't know if sarah's that bloody but who do you but who do you

think who's the big game from my from my from my no but that's the thing's the thing's big game in this game i don't know if there's numbers there are numbers to take out kirby because the australians will never do it yeah so they don't know they love her yeah so that's what i'm like Huh. I don't know. I feel like Sarah kind of Luke has an idol too. And I also think they're like, if there's, if it gets, if Tommy, let's say Tommy runs it back to Luke, hey, these women are all working together. I saw it happen last time. It was crazy. Tony went out talking about it. You're in danger. We're all in danger. The Luke's playing idol. Yeah, there's a shoe. It was a whole thing. Like I can just picture Tommy like, hey, hey, hey, hey, you got to understand. And so if he does that, I think that Luke could probably have some type of immunity or at least, you know, he'd have the insight from what Tommy is. experienced on that other tribe to know that, like, he might be in danger. I really think that Sarah is probably easy pickings here. And, you know, it's a fast-moving game. I think an easy consensus merge boat is kind of normal for these types of games, you know, like let's go to the person that we all just kind of want out and then we'll figure it out after that. So I just was watching

this episode specifically kind of looking at, okay, like, if they merge, what happens? And to me, it's just like, it all keeps coming up, Sarah, unless Sarah decides to flip. And I think that would be so interesting as a character moment for Sarah because she is Miss Flip-Lop. And I would love that. But it goes against everything that she's been saying prior to this. She's like, I ride it out for Kirby. I want to play a loyal game. But I would love Sarah so much.

If she gets that merge, looks around and says, I kind of want to work with cast and poverty. You know, like I would love that so much where they're targeting, Kirby's trying to target Sarah, but she's already found greener pastures. And then we have a lot more fluid gameplay moving forward. But right now, it's looking like, it's looking like Sarah to me. But I think Kobe doesn't like doing the easy thing either. And now Sarah might be too easy.

You know what? Now it's like, okay, whatever. I can do that any time. What else can I do? Maybe Kobe tries and unites the Australians, but they might be too far gone. I love that I really don't know actually how it's going to go. How fun is that? I can't make a prediction.

Yeah. Either way, I'll be sad. Whatever it is makes me sad. Do you think the Women's Alliance is the prevailing alliance? I know you said they're the four, but I was really kind of looking at almost like a Tika 3 thing with the internationals, you know,

whereas like they have the women's alliance as protection. Tommy obviously doesn't, but they protect Tommy and then they can still use him to do their bidding as long as he's not the one getting voted out.

You know, like if they're coming in as the women's alliance and they're going to target the next man, I think they're going to protect Tommy and they're coming after Luke. Luke has an idol. He could save himself.

He can also go home with an idol. That's possible. But I do think that like, honestly, although the women's alliance is probably the bigger alliance, I think that if they are strong three you've seen this you know

that's kind of the thing in Survivor it could happen well firstly poverty three voting out a man with an idol would be on brand um no I think I think Surrey I think it's nuanced they trust Surrey more than poverty

which I thought was interesting they say that I also thought thank God poverty had told them about the key because Tony Zincincts was so good to also just come for the key there so and that she'd managed that fine and it's like communal idol I think that I think Lisa chooses

Surrey over Tommy Yeah I don't think he has to choose Surrey over Tommy now Yeah I know But I'm just saying That you're saying Like what's the prevailing alliance

Is it the women's alliance Or is it Tommy The prevailing alliance It's Lisa and Surrey Yeah well I mean They didn't have to make the choice In the end right Because they knew Surrey

Would be protected by an idol So But I think that had they had to make the choice I think I think they vote out Tommy here like if if if Lisa says to split originally so I think that maybe it's different for poverty but with poverty immune I think yeah if they had the choice I think Tommy goes first which means the women's allies or Lisa Rhee is more important yeah if if if if they don't have

the key idol they split on Tommy or they allow a split on Tommy which must mean Tommy's a lesser priority. I still think they're very important. As I said, I think that I don't, like, I think that they were riding with Lisa in the rob boat no matter what. That's one of the reasons I think Tony was true. I think that three is very important. I just think that Cass and Lisa are between two very good and important alliances. Like, what a credit to them. You know, not everyone always has a hierarchy of things in their mind. Like, maybe things are just both really important to them and then like push will have to come to shove. But it is a huge credit to both, I think, Cass and Lisa, which we will definitely talk about in the jizzy for me. Yeah. And a big shout

out, first of all, big shout out to Tony for recognizing that that key got found because no one was looking for it. That's the type of energy. That's what type of energy I'm talking about, okay? Welcome to the party. I'm here. I'm here. I'm at the party. And then also... A little bit. But also,

big shout out to Cass. She watched Parvety like a hawk going to get that podium idol. She's like, girl, what you're doing back there? Oh, I should have to stop and get something? Oh, yeah, really? Can you hold my torch? She was sitting there right there the whole time. I was like, yes, Cass. You got to send me these links

so I can watch cast play Survivor. I'm getting frustrated because I'm starting. Do you want to? I think I'm showing up to the party. Yeah, I'm trying to get to the cast party. Okay. You can watch it. She does go to tribal council

with 26 episodes at one point. I would be 11 years too late for the cast party too, you know? No, that was really recent. She was, I think she played the most recently. I'll talk about the chaos cast party. Oh, right. I'm going to so many parties.

Most of them are on this season, but should we get to the gym? kissy? Not of the cast? Yeah, sure. I'm at the new cast party. I think we might agree. Anyway, this is, you know, it's fine. It's fine.

It's fine. It's fine. One thing in an MC color. One, two, three. One, one, one, three, one, one, three, one, one, three, one, two, one, three, one, three, one, two, three, it's getting, it's getting, it's getting kind of chizzy. Three, two, one. Your local Benjamin Moore retailer is more than a paint expert. There's someone with paint in their soul.

A six cents. honed over decades. And if you have a question about paint, it's almost as if they can read your mind. I sense you need a two-inch angle brush for the trim in your family room. Regal selected an eggshell finish and directions to the post office.

Benjamin Moore paint is only sold at locally owned stores. Benjamin Moore, see the love. We're at the chizzy party now. Can I think of some better Tony-themed snacks than chips and dip? I mean, you only need them for today. Mama?

You're a vegetarian. Yeah, I'm not going to eat it, but I'll serve it. Oh, sounds like you need to leave the party. You know, I came off the podcast with Rob doing, like, we talked so much about Tony, and I'm like, oh my God, I've got to do Wordle. I'd actually set my clock back because the podcast was going to go over midnight, and I knew that my wordal would expire. This isn't interesting to anyone.

The word was Lama. Hey, look at that. Yeah, and I was like, and I said to Rob a sign that Tony will be, okay. Because I said to him like, Rob, do wordle picks taken moments before disaster. Tony, I miss you. I love you so much.

We shout out of Tony. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to be cliche and give three points to Surrey, but I kind of do. What? I mean, always, but I'm surprised. I kind of do. But so here's, because again, I came in thinking that this was a stalemate. And now that I've talked it out with you,

it was kind of like, no, Sarri was willing to just cut bait with Tony. She didn't care for him that much as far as like keeping them in the game versus like going to Roxoram or whatever. And she wasn't willing to dig her feet in for that. She kind of throws Parvety out there. Parvety is now her shield, which is kind of cool. But like I really wasn't giving them that much credit for this. I just felt like they folded on Tony when he started acting crazy.

But like going in now, if you're what you're saying is true and they were always going to get Tony here, then I'm like, you know, Sarie has worked that relationship with the other two women so well that they're willing to work with her. As you said, Lisa pointed out that she does trust Seria a lot and she wants to trust poverty. I do think the split is tough that, you know, just based off of everything we said, but also because like, if you split, you know, who's to say they don't pile on you? You know what I'm saying? So I thought it was cool that they just kind of stood their ground. But I don't know, man, like, I don't know if I

can give Tony's gone. So I mean, Lisa? Yeah, okay, I'll give Lisa the three. I owe her because I gave her one last time. So I'll give Lisa the three. I do think that they all stay in their ground here. They save Tommy. That's a good thing. Tony's gone. I don't think Tony had any interest in really working with Lisa. Lisa didn't have any interest for working with Tony probably because she's seen him play. And so she knows it's probably a volatile person to play with once you get to the merge for sure. So I'll give that to Lisa. Two points to cast because I really did enjoy her in the immunity challenge. I liked watching her kind of like watch. I liked her watching her watch poverty, get that idol.

I was just like, look at, look at Cass, get episode for her. She's also popping on the screen. I've been enjoying her confessionals and stuff like that. So she's becoming a good character for me. And then Seria lost that fire. I can't give her a point for losing that fire.

That's tough. It's tough, man. That was, I think it hurt me more than it hurt her, which is crazy to say. And so I'll give one. I can't, I don't think I can give one to poverty, though. she was like Tony she really lost Tony in this episode and I don't think that was good for her um okay yeah I'll give one to serri so three for Lisa two for Cass one for Surrey

I was in a similar space I'm maybe three to Cass obviously she and Lisa I'm going to give three to her two to Lisa um they keep Tommy and the women they really have their cake and eat it too she also but I think she also has the idol so like cast has like such perfect information in that tribal council where like she just says Tony dead to rights as she says no voting professional. She's like, I know that the shoe is nothing, you know, because I have the idol. So I think she's just got it on lock. But she comes out of this tribe. They both come out of this tribe with the exact five they want to. And Cass has the idol and they have a group idol. Like Cass is in a fantastic spot, I think. And having a private idol as well. Like she has

capacity to really do something big and make a real name for herself. So I gave her three. I gave Lisa two. Yeah. So Ria thought handled all really well. But they technically lost out on Tony, and I also think that it's just crazy to me that they risk playing the key idol when they could have just split a vote on Tommy and I know that's what we just talked about with Janine and it's always a decision. Do you want to piss Tommy off right before?

Like Tommy can tell he's not with you. Like poverty says she has nothing with Tommy. Throw one vote on Tommy. Like how annoying would it have been if that shoe was real? And maybe they're correctly reading that and that's fair too. But I kind of think I'm surprised they didn't split a vote. Not not giving it to her for that reason, but that's just some of the caveat.

I will give one to Kirby. Everyone wants to work with Kirby. I've watched it now in like one and a bit seasons. It's actually crazy. Okay. Like, Michael, she might be the boot here.

And instead, even with Sarah possibly not working with her, she held all the cards. It's beyond. And I also like that she didn't blow it up before tribal.

Yeah, yeah, I hear you. I just, to me, I'm still questioning of Sarah. You know,

like Sarah's getting squirley. And this is a person who come in, yeah, but that's what I'm saying. Like, I don't know. Because, like,

again, if Sarah goes rogue at the merge, she's within her rights. If they're not coming for Kirby. Yeah, but it doesn't matter if she goes rogue. They don't have, they're losing numbers. And I don't think they can lose numbers at the merge. Like, this is critical.

We're going in 5-5 in theory. And so, like, that's why I was like, that's why I hesitate on the Kirby. I definitely considered it. But to me, I was just like, man, it's tough. And then also, for Kirby to be about to throw away one of her number one allies, like she has Sarah who was basically said, here's my game. You can have it. I'll do what you want me to do.

Cool, bet. But now I'm like, I'm kind of annoyed by her. I'll get rid of her for Luke and Janine. it's like well she's not annoyed like sarah with anything said that she was considering voting out kirby like she gained more allies than she lost in this episode so on the roundabout you know like she came yeah she came out more yeah yeah yeah no man yeah i don't know so i don't have a huge problem with it i don't have a huge problem with it but that's why i didn't give the one to kirby yeah i think i think these are all this is all very reasonable um right that's it chappelle tell the people where they can

find you. I'm sorry, my head hurts. We just went through so much. It was a lot. A bit more? I don't know. A lot. It was fun.

It was really fun. Yeah. So, follow me on Twitter, on Blue Sky, at Recap Kickback. Follow me on subscribe on YouTube. Go to YouTube.com. At recap, kickback. Hit that like button, hit that subscribe button. Show me some love because I need more.

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Leave some comments. Say, hey, Chappelle. I disagree with what you said. I'm going to say, thank you. I love you too. Thank you for subscribing. That's going to be cool. And then keep up with all the podcasts and I'm doing,

the nothing but Netflix podcast. I talked about the biggest loser last week with Omer and Brandon Domlin. There's a Netflix documentary called Fit for TV about the biggest loser. And so we talked about that. So it's a survivor crossover right there. And then on, of course, RHAP, you can catch me on the Big Brother coverage, behind the paywall, talking about sloppy things on Big Brother. It's a crazy Big Brother season, tune in.

Make sure you keep up with that. and then you can catch me on my podcast right now I'm covering season one of flavor of love and we're almost done we're about to do the finale live next week or this week and so keep up with that

and then follow me on all social media platforms to keep up what else I have going on what about you Shannon well go to April's comments and tell he needs an education on Survivor Kagayan oh my god we're explaining it to him

I'm at the party I'll do it after this podcast I'm going to press a separate podcast Imagine it would bring so many podcasts out right now. We end this recording. We just start again and we put up a podcast that's like Shannon and Chappelle argue about Survivor Kaggi-on. It's so funny that we

would spend that kind of time when Survivor 49 cast just dropped. Yeah, that's the thing happening in the Survivor world. No, it is. It's a thing happening. Yeah. I didn't have space in my brain for it, but I just wanted to like listen to Mike and Rob. So anyway,

the things are happening in Australian Survivor. I will be interviewing Totee Flakos. I'll be shooting him. I hope he's speaking back to me. I'm so happy for you. This is so dope. I'm telling you, I told you, this season was created for you. Embrace it.

I'm so excited and also so sad, but that will be happening. So that exit interview is going to drop soon when you're listening to this. And then recaps with Pua and Mike and then the show with Rob and hopefully all the exit interviews from now on because I don't think any of the other players are going to be the host of a show and maybe unavailable for the ex-interview times. I'm hoping to get the interviews. Chappelle, how do you think about David being the host now?

Oh, yeah, I haven't got the comment on that. I'm so happy. I'm so happy. As somebody who's new to the David party, but also who's new to the party and moved to the very front of the pack because I came from the Dondy party. So I kind of, we met at a different party and then we brought into this party. I'm very excited.

I'm sad for JLP, like everybody else. I think he's an incredible host, but I think David could bring so much character to that role. I think that JLP and Jeff kind of play it one way. Very similar ways, but not the same. But I think David has the opportunity to really bring some of the golden god to that

role. Rob kind of talked about it when you and him were talking and you're saying like how he was talking about like and Kirby wants me to come to her on the beach, you know, like that kind of energy. She wants to threaten me and my son, you know, like those things, those sound

bites from David. I just want him to bring that type of exuberance to hosting the role. I cannot wait to see what this looks like in the future. Yeah, well, you're in the David party now. I mean, I don't think anyone would criticize that. I feel like I've been to actual parties with you and you're always alive for the party. That's you at the David

party. Like, you're there handing out the shots, so the golden shots, I don't know, alcohol, but... Well, I'll see you in San Francisco and... Yeah, at that party. At the Golden Gate Bridge Party? Yeah, yeah. You don't do that. Golden God Gate Bridge is where we'll go to in San Francisco

in just a couple of months. But follow me at channing gates follow we know or subscribe to vina globosliver.com to you don't miss any of this coverage. Thank you all as always for checking the podcast out, spiriting this season with us. Thank you Shepel. Thank you to our team behind the scenes and I will see you tomorrow. Bye. Euron each other. I mean, million, Ruby.

I'm sorry. It's right. ride. The adventure of a life-drun.