RHAP: We Know Survivor - Survivor AU vs Survivor 50 w/ Drop Your Buffs

Episode Date: September 22, 2025

Rob Cesternino welcomes Sean Ross and Evan Ross Katz from the Drop Your Buffs podcast to discuss Survivor 50 and the impact of Survivor AU: Versus the World. The trio explores the excitement surrounding the upcoming all-star season and how it compares to the recent international edition.

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Hey everybody, what's going on? Rob Sistradino, back here with you to talk a little bit of the all-star seasons of Survivor of the past and the soon to come as I am back here once again. Sean and Evan are joining us from the Drop Your Buffs podcast to talk. Hey guys, what's going on? Hello. Hi. And I'm very excited to get the chance to talk with you both always, of course, that there was such excitement around Survivor, A.U. versus the world.

Sean, you, for anybody who is uninitiated may not know, you were there and you were with Ricard and Nick Iadanza, you were there on the set and got to see it all play out in real time. So you had a very unique vantage point for all of this. Yes. Last time I was on our Hap, we teased that I had Survivor news incoming and everybody thought I was on Survivor 51. Not true. It was that I spent. Does that mean that are you saying that's also not a possibility? Not on the car. It's not interested in playing Survivor, but I feel like I got the best of both worlds where I got to watch Survivor play out. I got to be there. I got to experience the whole thing, but I also got

to sleep in a hotel room and be fed, et cetera. Yeah. And Evan, your vantage point was you watched it all play out on television like the rest of us, but you were blown away. Well, yeah, but I got the voice memos from Sean during production in which he was telling me. you know, some details about what was going on. Not spoilers. Not spoilers. I didn't break my NDA for this. But Sean, he's, you know, he's out there living his dream.

So I just didn't know how much of what he was saying was hyperbole-laden. So in my mind, I'm like, okay, great. Like, you know, good for him, happy for him. Had no idea. Like, I wish I could go back and play these voice memos now, that he was literally, like, had just come off witnessing literal history. and, you know, it was in the room where it happened. I didn't know then.

But I know now, and I'm glad that I know. Okay. Full spoilers for Survivor A.U. versus the world. Just want to say, of course, if you missed any of it, of course, we try to make it so easy for the patrons of RJP to check it all out. I got to live vicariously through Shannon Gus's incredible coverage of all of the episodes and then ultimately interviewing so many of our favorites.

So I have a, I can relate to that a little bit, Evan. yeah i wish uh i wish there were more i feel like uh i said this because sean and i did like three recaps like we did a recap each week um of the three episodes and i think you know 10 episodes was not enough and then releasing three episodes a week within that the fact that this entire season which i think sean correct me if i'm speaking out of turn here we would put as one of the all-time greatest seasons of survivor the fact that it was a what three and a half week window in which we all got to enjoy it feels like a robbery it was interesting because i really felt like that the shortened condensed time frame of it

all of it being only a couple of weeks and then also you know a shorter shooting schedule was going to be like a bigger factor in how it was received but i agreed with the take that you both had of that like i don't think it ultimately mattered so much of having it be a shorter season in terms of what it brought in terms of uh being a survivor season as a viewer yeah i thought that that was so interesting because going into it with a 16 day game i mean when that first started to trickle out that it was going to be a much shorter game even than the u.s new era which has all you know been highly controversial um amongst the fandom i thought okay nobody's going to take this seriously, right? Like, is this even going to count? Is this going to be a canonical season of

Survivor? Does the winner have a major asterisk next to their name? And that doesn't seem to be the case. Yeah. I don't think it was the case in terms of watching it play out. I do wonder if this was a season where it was people that we didn't know for the first time where in terms of like learning about them as characters, I'm not sure we would have necessarily been able to keep. keep up when we were, you know, we had a couple of new characters that we got to meet on this in Cass and Tommy, but if this was like a whole cast of new characters, I'm not sure necessarily we would have been, I think we would have been like our head spinning a little bit more. Yeah, I think one of the big takeaways for me, like, recognizing this is one of the

greatest seasons of all time, I think there's a quite a bit of lightning in a bottle around this particular season. And while I'm certainly enthused at the possibility of what AU versus the world too could be, I think that there are some tweaks and things that would need to be made to solidify it as like a viable format because I think we just had so many stars and so many, like there was just so much cosmic alignment to this particular season that I think make it incredibly special and not easily repeatable. Okay. So we have that in the rearview mirror, but also we know around the corner is going to be Survivor 50.

And I don't want to ask a leading question, but would you say that the the appetite for Survivor 50 is increased or decreased after Survivor A.U. versus the world. Great question. I think that AU versus the world may have taken a little bit of the wind out of the sales of Survivor 50. And I think this goes like, take this back in time. I mean, Survivor 50 was announced as an all returning player season when Australia versus the world, you know, was announced or was starting to come out, right?

So it felt like they were a little bit on the defense there. And now that it's come out, it's like we're kind of like reliving this again where it's like, okay, well, is this overshadowing 50? Is it not? I'll say for my personal experience or my personal view on this, I wasn't really excited about 50. after the cast came out, we did a whole episode about all of the Helen Glovers that should have been cast on season 50 that weren't. But having said that, I do think that after AU versus the world, the Surrey factor has actually heightened my interest in Survivority. That's the connective tissue. Yeah. It's crazy to think that, you know, Sri was more or less out of the reality

television universe comes back with traitors, then Big Brother, and then we're getting two back-to-back Survivor seasons. The dominance in this run and just how much we could not have forecasted this cannot be understated. I think for me, what makes Survivor 50 challenging is sort of the lack of theme going into it. It's just an all-star season. We haven't had an all-star season since 40. Obviously, 40 had a very clear theme around it. So I think what was needed here, especially in comparing it to AU versus the world, again, a really strong theme there, is some sense of like what Survivor 50 is trying to do. And I know the host has been out there saying this is meant to celebrate 25 years of Survivor, but there's nothing about this assemblage in terms of the cast itself that really says that. I mean, the fact that we have, you know, obviously we have Jenna Lewis, but very limited representation from the early era of the show, it just does.

doesn't feel like there was a great effort made to, like, show the breadth of seasons or personalities. And also, if you just do like a one-to-one, which I think many people will be doing, Survivor A.U. versus the world seems like it was just 14 Titans of the game. Even coming into the season, not knowing who Lisa, Cass, or Tommy were, I can come out of it being like, okay, I get it. You know, like, I watch this season and I'm like, I want to go back and watch Cass's season, for instance. There are a number of things. There are a number of of people on 50, and it's no disrespect to them or their game, but I just don't think they are like categorically icons of the game

that make going into 50 just sort of feel like, okay, sure, we've got our Stephanie's, we've got our series. There are certainly some people I'm up out of my chair about. And there are also some people, like an Angelina, who are like icons of television, who I'm excited to see. But overall, the cast just doesn't seem to have as much, it doesn't feel like as the sum of a whole in the way I feel like AU versus the world ended up feeling.

Now, mind you, going into AU versus the world, I didn't, you know, that was a question mark for me. So this is more, we're looking at something on the tail end of one at the beginning of another, and I can recognize that, but that's sort of how I think there's a little bit of a difference between something that is a complete unknown, that is like a mystery box of you don't know what this is, but that there is, this person was actually a big deal in their thing.

You just don't know who they are, as opposed to somebody who might come back, who, you actually know what that is. You're just not that excited about it. It's kind of like the traitors casting because I remember we do like a little bit of, what do we call it when we do like the prediction, like who they are, the cast assessment.

That thing, yeah. We did one around season two, and I remember we got so many voicemails being like, you guys have no idea who this Echin Sue is because we had never heard of her. We're not a part of the Bachelor universe, but then, loom to hold people. Whatever, yeah, same thing.

uh different but yeah uh but then we learned you know this is an icon and so rob to your point it's like yeah there's something fun about being told you don't know this person but they are an icon in their world and you may soon know and that's why i think a lot of people felt about people like george and david people because there are a lot of people who i've spoken to and i'm sure you have who this was their first season of australian survivor period and i'm sure many of them come away from it being like oh i want to go back and watch luke's first season now or i want to want to see what's the Shawnee lore like I think this piqued a lot of people's curiosity around who these people are outside of this particular season okay so outside of the casting issues which

we've litigated for many months now is there anything in terms of like the how the show played out and the gameplay of that it's not a shorter season in Survivor 50 from what we know we assume it's still 26 days, but there are more people. This is the biggest cast that we've ever had. So it will be seemingly a quicker pace. I think that the thing that they could be doing, and I hope that they do, is to lean into sort of the pre-existing relationship, the lore, basically, right, of who knows who and how they know them.

And I think that that's what Australia versus the world did so well. and was able to, and I think that that's how they were able to turn this 16-day game into something that felt like a classic 39-day game of Survivor, is to say, like, Parvary and Surrey have this incredible lore of their relationship, of working together, of coming back together. And, you know, on the flip side, there's, you know, Jordan, Johnny have all of this history together and they're enemies now. And I think that focusing in on those relationships and what they mean and how,

they're going to play out in this particular season is what Survivor 50 should be doing. The problem I think is that the connections are pretty limited that we do have. And I think a great example is like Surrey and Stephanie, right? So Surrey and Stephanie are longtime friends. They have been on a tribe together before, but not with any consequence, but they played the traders together. And so what I hope Survivor 50 can do is sort of acknowledge that in some way. know they're not that that's such an interesting point yeah will they acknowledge something that

came in the way that on on traitors season three you know that there was talk about reindeer games you know it doesn't seem like that traders minds bringing up these things that happened on these other shows sometimes they have to lean into that yeah will survivor talk about something like we had in survivor 40 there was talk about oh these people played on a poker show together but will will they reference something that happened on a completely different show that's not part of of the CBS Paramount universe. Yeah, well, Surrey come in and say, Stephanie was the snake in the grass.

That's what I want. That's what I want. And I think that you can have, and I think there could be a really interesting story around the three David versus Goliath players and what their relationship is. And there's this like power dynamic that Mike is this incredibly powerful person in Hollywood

and has given Angelina and Christian opportunity. to be in, you know, the most buzzed about show on TV in a very long time. And what does that mean? Are they all friends? Well, one of them betray one, the other. I think that there's an interesting story around that, and how much will they acknowledge that explicitly? Yeah. I think one thing that I would hope for for 50 would be, I'm curious around how much they're going to be celebrating the 25 years of the series.

And I think it could be a great opportunity to bring back some classic challenges and say, we're replaying this beloved season two challenge and, you know, paying homage to the show's past. I don't get the sense that that is going to be something that's going to be there. Again, we will see. But I think for me, in comparing AU versus the World to 50, what I think sort of puts a clamp down on some of my would-be excitement would be how incredible the challenges were on AU versus the world. And I think there was, one, the lack of puzzles and, two, the emphasis on endurance challenge. And I think that's one thing that makes me, I mean, there are a couple of things, but one of the things that makes me pessimistic going into 50 is, I think for me, it was just so enthralling watching the might, like the displays of might and grit on AU versus the world.

I mean, it's not just watching Carverty on screen. It's watching Carverine an endurance challenge that I think scratches an itch for so many. Yeah. And I think that that's really an interesting thing to parse because I do think that we do have a lot of endurance challenges still on Survivor in the new era. But I feel like that really what I came away with that Parvite is one of her superpowers is just her ability to really withstand these torturous endurance challenges where the endurance challenge isn't stand here and balance a ball for as long as possible. And if the ball falls off, you're out, you know, it's really a how bad do you want it type endurance challenge and ultimately that we see at the end. And I think that this is something that I said this with Shannon when I talked about the finale, Australian Survivor does such a great job at that final four challenge with all due respect to Sumotion, you know, that they do a final four challenge that really is just such a battle of wills where that it's a real. great way to determine who has that final four immunity.

Yeah. And I honestly don't even think that it requires a poverty who happens to be great at those. It doesn't even matter that there is a player who is great at withstanding torture, endurance challenges. It's just that those challenges exist. And it's the desire to win it, the will to withstand whatever that challenge is throwing at you that makes that final immunity challenge. so gripping to watch. I mean, we are regretfully rewatching Survivor Thailand over on

our substack. And I think that that final immunity challenge where they have to do that Thai statue pose, nobody lasts all that long in it, but it's gripping because you want to see, well, who does, who does have the will to withstand that. Yeah. It was a cool setup. It was like, they kind of wasted it with all their respect to Jan and the late great clay. It was like, it looked cool. What are you going to do? But yeah, I guess I just, you know, you said just now you were like, Survivor still has lots of great endurance challenges. And not to like put you on the spot, but like, can you name them?

I don't know if I said that lots of great endurance challenges. I said Survivor still has a lot of endurance challenges. Okay. So taking the qualifier out. Yes. What are the lot of endurance challenges that the show still has? I mean, I think they have a lot of, you know, stand here, balance here, balance the ball.

You know, you just look at like stand here and hold the thing with the ball is moving back and forth. They'll do the one where it's, I guess this, you could probably say there's a little bit of a torture challenge of that David and Joe had the thing stand on the platform and hold the thing so the ball doesn't fall out. It's a lot of stand in one place and do this one thing. so that the ball doesn't move. And they have, to be fair, they have brought back the poll challenge. We have seen last gas. Yes, but they brought back the poll challenge in a way

so that they, I think, are trying to let make these challenges go fast because that they want to, hey, we got to, you know, we got to, you know, hit our day here. We can't be standing out here for five hours. So they have, when they do have an endurance challenge, that they make it where it needs to, you know, be done in 20 minutes. Whereas I do think Australian

Survivor will let those endurance challenges breathe. Yeah, but counterpoint to that is in Australia versus the world, they didn't want those challenges to go all that long. And you could see that, right? If you look at the one where we had Cass and Parvety with their foot on the

box against the pole, it's like they changed the rules at least twice in that challenge to put your hands behind your head and then only use one leg. They were trying to speed that challenge up. But how fun then to watch that and be like, these women are so powerful that they have broken our concept of the challenge in such a way that we're having to restructure in

real time because the level of goddess that we have, the level of goddess says, plural, that we have here is such where we just, we simply, they have broken our challenge. And I know we've seen challenges broken on Survivor before, but this felt it. so now that we have survivor australian versus the world one in the books i'm so interested to know if there will be more australian survivor versus the world or if even we could see this type of short season format replicated by the u.s version of the show bank more on course when you switch to a Scotia Bank banking package. Learn more at scotiabank.com slash banking packages.

Conditions apply. Scotia Bank, you're richer than you think. Yeah, that is the most interesting thing coming out of all of this to me is what is the response from the American version of the show to this? Are we just going to pretend it never happened and hope nobody looks over here? Or are we going to try to capitalize on this? because it was such a huge success and, I mean, huge success. I don't know.

I don't really know what the ratings were. I don't know how it did for the network. A critical darling at the very least. Critical darling. It got the fandom talking. And you would imagine if you are in any kind of position of power at CBS, you would say, what can we do here? Is there some U.S. versus the world that we could put together and look, look how quickly it can

be done. It can be done on the back end of another season, 16 days. easy, peasy. This is not that big of a cost and look at the response that you get as a result. And so you would have to think that they're throwing around ideas at least, whether it comes to fruition or not. And I think they would be crazy not to take advantage of it themselves. And I think I would be shocked if Australia doesn't put on a part two. Yeah. So I think it was probably hard for Australia to get a second one of these made because of their production cycle where they're basically like a year ahead. So they had no idea if it was going to be well received

and be a hit at the time that they would have had to have greenlit the second one. So maybe we see that maybe a year from now that they end up doing another one. Because from what I understand from Shannon that it was doing well in the ratings and people did receive it very positively. I I do wonder, had either of you watched the influencer edition of Survivor that they posted? Yes. Sorry. I'm not saying. Yes.

Yes. So I do wonder, I don't think that the U.S. version of Survivor would do anything with people who played Survivor in other formats. They really don't even, you know, acknowledge, you know, I doubt that they'll even acknowledge that Surrey had just played Survivor. another non-U.S. season of Survivor in Survivor 50 at any point. But I do wonder if I think that the U.S. version of Survivor has always been toying with the idea of having other famous people play Survivor and they've never had the format to do it. Do you think a short season like this could be the vehicle where we end up getting some either influencer types or celebrities playing Survivor in a format like this?

What's funny is, like, I actually don't think, like, the shortened season factors in when it comes to celebrity. I'm not the first person to say this, but, like, there is no bigger cultural cachet than being on television, and Survivor is one of the most watch shows on television, period. So there are many actors out there, one's household names even, who would long for the kind of exposure that a show, like, Survivor would bring about. And at the end of the day, let's say we're talking the OG scheduled, the 39 days, compared to the shoots that they go on location and shoot for months and months and months, this is nothing. And I'm just talking about actors. I'm not even talking about influencers here. I really do think they could get their pick.

I think it would all come down to locking those three initial gets so that when you go out to other people, you give those people a sense of the kind of deck we're playing with. I think it's just and also it's a matter of do you want to go like the celebrity big brother route and like get your scaramuchis and your housewives or do you want to try and get like your Tyler Perry's and like people who are like legit fans of this show real celebrities and I think you can go either way and I think both could be entertaining but I would love to see it something I would love to see it come to fruition but I think it would need to be a lot of decisions around like those that critical casting of those first three people, and they would need to be willing to sign on and sort of 10 toes down, regardless of who else is going to be there and say, I'm planting my flag and saying, I'm doing Survivor, and, you know, basically you're going to cast around me. I am bringing the gravitas. What would be your reaction for both of you to something like that? Because I feel like the Evan sounds a little bullish on it. I would be up out of my chair. I think it's necessary. I've

always been surprised, not just with Survivor, but in general, I'm surprised there's not more emphasis when it comes to casting around people with pre-existing followings, especially at the end of the day, it's a numbers game, right? Like, we're all trying to get ratings. You can be a critical darling. You can be a beloved season, but if no one's watching it, it doesn't really ultimately matter. And so there are so many opportunities out there. And also, a lot of these influencers are just creators or people with significant followings, they're fans of the show already, like they are clamoring to be on. Case in point, Rachel Riley, right, who has made it explicitly clear how interested she is on being on Survivor. It seems like a no-brainer that you wouldn't want to

cast this beloved reality TV icon, whether it be an all-star season or a civilian season and she just happens to be the star. I'm surprised that there's not more effort to sort of jump on people who have followings, who could potentially bring their audiences into this show. Rob, do you remember after season one aired? This is very niche. I remember Kate Hudson going on the talk show circuit to promote the fact that she submitted an audition video for season two and she wanted to be on it. And Mark Burnett responded and said, we won't put a celebrity on this show. I don't remember that specifically.

I do remember that when they talked about, a celebrity version of Survivor. I feel like that they had talked about like, well, we would, and I think that maybe this was more Mark Burnett than Jeff of like, we would want an A-lister, we want, you know, Tom Cruise won't do it. And they wanted like the biggest possible names

to be able to do it. But I do feel like that they could put together a season of Survivor with celebrities. And I do wonder if you could pair that maybe with also returning players, where the one thing that we found from the 50 casting was that there are a ton of survivor players who are looking for a vehicle to go back. And so it does feel like that you could satisfy a lot of different masters here

to be able to, you know, have something that's going to bring in viewers and then also satisfy some of the fans who are clamoring for these other people to come back and give Survivor something that would be able to generate a lot of buzz. Yeah. Yes. And it reminds me of Big Brother UK, right, where they, and this was in their heyday, where they had these civilian seasons, incredibly popular, and people became stars out of it. And then they had these celebrity seasons that they would do, you know, in between. And at one point, somebody became such a big star out of the original version, Jade Goody, that she went back as a celebrity in the celebrity edition. Didn't really go well for her, if you know that story. But that's a great example of that. Like, you can have a celebrity edition of Survivor, these big stars, and, hey, you could throw

a Mike White on there. You could throw a Parvity Shallow, a Surrey Fields on there. You could throw a Boston Rob on there, right? There are people, I think, who have in some way transcended survivor that could be classified as a celebrity, and then you get this connective tissue that would sort of pull things together. And it would give maybe the celebrities who are less attuned to the game, maybe in some way a mentor to make sure that the game play, the level is at an acceptable level that the fans would

enjoy it. I also think what you get with a celebrity survivor that you wouldn't be able to get with like a say dancing with the stars is the idea that there are going to be people on there celebrities who are there for the adventure component and not just like the being on television component. That's why someone like Mike White goes back and plays Survivor 50. It's not because he's longing to be back on television, it's because he loves this show. And so I'm just like, spitballing here, but thinking about like a Glenn Powell is like a great example of like, you go to Glenn Powell and you're like, we're giving you five weeks off, five weeks away from the humdrum of Hollywood, um, and go and have this crazy adventure and, uh, chatting Tatum,

we're throwing him into, you know what I mean? Like, I just, I think you could really go after a certain instead of Hollywood, who are actually looking for to break out of the bubble and actually have this wild, crazy adventure. And that's the selling point. It's not the being on television. And let's up this. Let's say, hey, million dollars. How about million dollars to the charity of your choosing? Not unprecedented, right? But I think that's a great way to convince someone who's kind of like, I'm into it. But like, what does this do for like my image? And you basically are like, you're not doing it for you, you're doing it for charity. Yeah.

Wow. I didn't think that you would be this excited about this idea. We're doing a, the 26-day version is going to be with celebrities? I mean, I'm never going to advocate for the 26-day. You want 39 days. I think of America. Yeah, yeah. We don't want.

We need. We need 39 days. I also feel like we need to stress the rigor, right? So I did notice with like the influencer survivor, it was a little bit, you know, like safeguarded a little bit. And so it's like if these celebrities are coming on here, we are doing survivor. You know what I mean? No rights negotiation, none of that.

Like we are doing survivor. Wow. You know, because I kind of felt I came away from the Australian survivor even more flexible on the days where I felt like that. Like really why, especially if we're concerned about, I guess that for the. average viewer, they are not concerned about the budget. But I feel like that from a production standpoint, like, why are we shooting so much stuff that we're not going to use?

Well, I think that, like we have a challenge. We go back to the beach. We have a scramble. Yeah. It's easy to say that looking at this past season of Australian Survivor, but I think in a lot of ways, they got lucky so, so many times. And part of that had to do with the boot order, right? think that's the biggest stroke of luck that they had. And I don't know that if we had more days

that that boot order would have been the same, right? And so one of the things that we were talking about on our post-mortem podcast of the season was, let's say they had more days. Let's say George was able to get more of a footing in the game. Let's say he survives that vote and he goes to the merge. Can Parveni and Saris still get to the end, right? Would he let them get to the end in the way that Luke let them get to the end, right? And then how does that change the season? I think in terms of Australian Survivor versus the world, we lucked out as a result of that because of the way that things played out. But I don't know that that's always the case, right? There's this big unknown factor of how do those extra days impact the game and do they impact

them for better or for worse? I think it impacted it for better in Australia versus the world, but that's not always going to the case. And I think my, despite the way that Australia versus the world played out, my inclination is always that more days means better gameplay overall. And although I was very happy for Parvite to get a second win here, I don't know that if there were more days, she would have been able to do that. And while that worked out,

I'm not sure that that's necessarily the format. that we should be moving forward with. I also think if you're looking at this in terms of like if this were something scripted, right? If you have the option to do something in two takes or eight takes, you're going to take eight takes, right? Because it's just you're more safeguarding the idea that you're going to get better footage.

So for me, I just don't see any disadvantage to 39 days. You're giving the editors more material to work with. You're deepening the relationships between these players. You are raising the stakes. I also think in terms of what made this show something back in the day, it's the effect of the malnutrition, what it does to the body and the mind. And I think that's something that a lot of the audiences come to the show for

and pick up on and are really intrigued by. The other thing, this is like a small thing, but I think this factors is like the impact of the family visit, right? Like seeing these people after they've been away from their family for 30 plus days and what that does for them, I mean, we don't get it now. And it's not to say, hey, if we got it on day 22 of new era, maybe it would hit. I don't know. But that's an example of something that like seeing people away from their families, away from home, there, I think there was something that was built in our

systems having watched the show for so long that something around the 30 day mark. And we've heard this from a lot of the former players that we've spoken to. Something changes around like that 30 day mark. And that stretch between the 30 and 39 days is really, again, from what we've heard what separates the, you know, the Titans from the Nogs. Yeah. I think that the one thing that you do really miss, and I've heard Tyson talk about this, is that having downtime is something that really generates organic conflict where people aren't fighting over, you know, how are you going to use the advantage?

People are fighting over that they just can't stand each other. So I do think that that does help to drive more of this old school conflict that we like to have in the show. So I can understand it both ways. I guess I just was not thinking that you would be able to get as many people to do a season that was that length of time. Like I thought that the appeal would be come out and do this thing. It's just 10 days. It's just 12 days. I feel like that you'd be able to have a better pick of people that would do it.

But if Evan says that people would do it for longer, I believe you to remember, like, again, it depends on what caliber of talent we're talking about. For a lot of these people, there's an appeal. Again, like, you talk to Mike White. It's like the idea of being a busy Hollywood. The idea of being a busy Hollywood person and having to give up your phone and not contend with phone calls, your agent, your manager, your publicist, your lawyer. So in the case of like a parvety, I understand it's like she doesn't want to be away from her daughter. Like I understand.

So yes, it's going to be way more appealing to truncate the game for someone like her. But I think for a lot of Hollywood people, the idea of being forced to be away from their work life and how suffocating it can be would be very appealing. Sure, I think you would maybe widen your pool with the shorter game. But I still think you get some true. A-lister's, and I think it would reinvigorate people's appetites towards the OG format. I think there's something about if they were to trot out the return of 39 days, the return of the family visit, the return of the live reunion that could really get people amped up. It could just be like this, you know, not even return to form.

I mean, I would call it that, but that's my own personal. But I just think it would be sort of like the, you know, we are a country that's moving towards traditionalism and like this would be like another like, you know, feather of the additional survivor values. Let's make them back. It's great again. Right on that platform. Yeah.

Okay. So one of the things that I know you both talked about was just like how epic the survivor A.U versus the world felt. And it certainly was my impression watching it as well. Is there anything that Survivor 50 could be doing after it's already shot that they could have taken away from AU versus the world? I think that the biggest thing that they need to lean into is the versus, right? So this show has so many times relied on pitting one group against another,

heroes versus villains, fans versus favorites, Davids versus Goliaths, right? And I think that that inherent sort of conflict is what appeals to so many viewers. And I think that they missed a big opportunity by not theming this. old school versus new school, right? Or old school versus new era, whatever they want to call it. I think they missed a big opportunity there because there's an inherent conflict. You know, whether it's real and whether it actually plays out that way or not, I think it's a great conceit to draw somebody in to watch the first few episodes.

And also, I think there is an aspect that that gets into the players' heads a little bit, right? Like you saw that in David versus Goliath. You saw that in Heroes versus Villains. It's like, oh, no, this is my camp and I'm playing for this camp. You saw it in Australia versus the world. And then within that, you see, looking again at Australia versus the world, you look at the world tribe, and it's like internationals versus Americans, right? There are sub-like conflicts happening there, and that's what makes it so appealing.

That's what you look back at the first episode of Australia versus the world, and it's Rob versus Parvety, right? And these are two titans of the game going head to head. And I think that, you know, whether or not the players themselves are thinking in that way, this is a show that ends with somebody getting booted off. You can make that edit, right? And I think that you can tell that story in the edit. And I think that that's what they really need to lean into,

as opposed to, I think what we've seen in more recent years is that it's like a chessboard with pieces moving around it, not so much a one-on-one conflict. And for me, I feel like, because one thing that really drew me to AU versus the world was that return to like more of the Verite filming style. that is sort of synonymous with early survivor. And new era for me feels very dependent on like drone footage

and like these sort of like zoom outs and like this effort to sort of underline like the epicness of the show. Something that for me is just not what I come to the show for. So you're basically like you're highlighting something that I never was giving a second pass to begin with. And so that often frustrates me. So to answer your question in terms of like, the approach, I think it could just be, first of all, I would love to see more of an emphasis on

the music, which I think was a huge critical component to AU versus the world. Two of my favorite things about AU versus the world outside of the casting, where the costuming and the music. And I think if you are someone that is not particularly attuned to that, I think if you go back and watch those episodes, even thinking about like Parvetti's costuming on AU versus the world, I'm not being funny. Like, it was like, that's Oscar-winning in costuming. It reminded me of like that this show, especially the early days of the show, had so much visual iconography that made it uniquely Survivor. And I think that Sean coined this term on Drop Your Buffs. He calls the present day the Ellen audienceification of Survivor. And I think

that is so true. When you look at these, you know, when we get the first images of all of these new era cast that tend to, I'm sorry, look a little cut, copy paste, everything. starts to sort of like has this homogenous aesthetic that we've seen throughout the seasons. And when you're no longer changing locations, when you're no longer theming the seasons, it starts to make everything just feel super repetitive. So to answer your question, I think 50, if there was just more of an effort to find ways to sort of give it a little bit of unique flair, and because we're talking about after the fact, I think it would come down to musical cues and kind of moving away from the cinematic nature of the show

and moving back towards Verite. That's interesting. You explain the Ellen's audienceification of Survivor and put a finer point on that? So if anybody's ever attended a taping of a talk show before you get very specific instructions on what you can wear as an audience member, and it is like solid, bright colors, no logos,

you know, no identifying features, basically. They just want you in a bright blue shirt, and, you know, cacky pants. And so that the attention is not drawn away from the action happening on the show when they cut to the audience, right? That is not what we should be doing on Survivor, right? We want the attention on the show. And so I think that as a result, you have the Ellen audienceification of costuming in the contestants.

And so they're just wearing the bright colors of whatever their tribe is, whatever's basically, you know, that they're given options and then they submit five options and we'll pick the best ones for you. They're all kind of the same. They're all, they've all gone to Target or Amazon and purchase yellow T-shirt, right? And so you lose so much of, so much of, you know, the first impression of a character is how they present themselves, what they're wearing. I mean, look at Evan's vest, for God's sake. It tells me something about Evan. He could be a librarian. The costumeification on this podcast. Incredible.

Yes. Yes. And but like look at the great examples, right? Rupert's tie-dye shirt. Lil's Scout uniform. Jerry's blue bikini. There's so many iconic outfits in Survivor history that tell you who that person is, you know, whether it's accurate or not, you form an opinion about that person before you even get to know them. And we're making television here. I think that's critical.

Yeah, that is a really great point that I feel like that in. the new era we have gotten, you know, so many of these seasons and we've just gone with the numbering for a variety of reasons. So it's 41, 42, 43, 4. And we also like tend to start the seasons in very similar ways. And I feel like that at this point in the new era, I think we even abandoned where people are dressing like, as you made the point, Sean, where I feel like that maybe Bruce was wearing a suit earlier in the new era, but I kind of feel like that when we tune into, for whoever's tuning into the new season that's going to be starting, I feel that everybody's just sort of like at leisure, ready to go. And nobody is really dressed in a way

that really represents their character and who they are outside Survivor. Yeah. And I would point to, oh, go ahead. I love so much Pearl Islands because I just rewatched Pearl Islands. And that was one of the many seasons where they tricked the cast, right, where they said, oh, we're going to do promo photos. But actually, we are, we're marooning them right now in the clothes on their back. So so many suits, dresses, heels, so much that tells you about who that person is outside of the game. And then it brings this authentic factor of being, you know, marooned. And I'm no trademark lawyer, but I think one of my favorite things about AU versus the world was

Shawnee's jacquamouse hat and I think it's great to like it gives you such a sense of who Shawnee is she's a fashion girly and so again I don't know if you can get away with wearing a jacquamose hat on reality part of me thinks it's like how could you not like it's not yeah but anyway so I I am pro label but not just the need it doesn't necessarily even need to be the jacquamose hat, Jacamoose makes other hats that don't say Jacamoose. But for me, and I'm saying this to you as, you know, I'm a fashion gay, I would love to, like, see some fashion represented on this show. I would love to see, like, what happens to that, you know, I guess the last time we really had

fashion was Dan Lembo's shoes. Yeah, that would have been the last, you know, real fashion on Survivor. But needless to say, I think that, um, I think the visuals could be something that could really amp things up. Yeah. And I think that we will, when people come back on Survivor 50, at least for the old school players, I think that they will have their iconic looks.

The new school players, I think that from being part of the new school, maybe don't necessarily have iconic looks from the new school because it's already part of this era where everybody is just sort of showing up in similar clothes to go play the game. But I do feel like that that's similar. and that like homogenousness of how these seasons are deployed.

Like I do feel like that coming into Survivor 49, it does feel like almost like an afterthought before it's even happened. It's tricky though because it's like there, again, to Sean's point about like the no verses, there's nothing to discern 49 from being just another new era season. And so, listen, I'm not saying it's going to be bad. It might be great. We might be here a year from now being like, thank God, 49, like, set us on a good course. But there's nothing from what we've seen of 49 to indicate that it's anything of a different flavor

from what we've already seen from 41 through 48. Now, you might be someone listing that's like, that's perfect. I loved 41 through 48. Great. But when we're really talking about this from the perspective of, you know, making a television, show and wanting every season to be different or additive, there's nothing that we've seen, whether it be from the visuals, whether it be from the social media that the show is putting out, the trailer, what have you, that indicates there's anything that's going to set this

season onto a different course than the past. And I think that's one of the frustrations for some people. It's not a conversation about the qualitative decline of the show. That's a separate conversation. What it's really about, though, is just the idea of, like, is the show making any effort these days to change things up if the location isn't changing if the kind of casting isn't changing if they're you know they arrive on the island have that same mat talk about how excited we're all to be here you in the back in the blue you know it's just like how many times can we hit that beat before we as an audience say okay i think that's part of the reason why the traders is as successful as it is is because it feels like something fresh.

Yeah, certainly. And I think there's lots of different reasons for that. And I'm going to hold off on going down that road to compare the two shows. What about, I mean, should, in the post-50 era, should themes come back? Here's something that I want to ask you is that, we have we have this we're in this era right now by coincidence of australia versus the world an all-star season and season 50 an all-star season where it feels like you know within the span of less than a year these two things are happening does this feel like a cap on what has come or does this feel like

the beginning of a new dare i say new era for survivor hmm it's so hard to imagine and squint and think about, like, what post-50 Survivor looks like. I mean, I'm getting the impression that it's just going to be business as usual following 50, but I know that there was talk after Survivor 50 that potentially there would be more seasons of returning players. But I just find I feel like that, as you mentioned, Rachel Riley, and not specifically the idea of Rachel Riley on Survivor, but in the way that Rachel Riley really engaged the fan base coming back and being part of Big Brother 27,

I do feel like that they need like a little bit more of a hook for these seasons that come back, that it's not just like, hey, here's the next group of new survivors that feels a lot like the last group of new survivors that we brought back. Yeah, because it feels, it feels to me like this is an opportunity for a refresh. And not to sort of say, and of course, 50's already in the can, so who knows what they did. But it feels like an opportunity to sort of set the stage for the next era of the show. And I hope that that's what they're doing, where, you know, we might make some small adjustments to the way that the game plays out. And maybe the way that it's presented, we're bringing back some of these really big personalities.

I mean, look at the way Stephanie LaGroza went off on social media. Like, this is the kind of energy that we need from reality TV stars in 2025. That is what makes the traders so successful, as people willing to come in and make television. And so I'm hopeful with 50 that bringing in some of these people, and maybe some of these new era people that I'm very mid on will come in with that, like, I'm going to make TV this season sort of attitude. We've seen that happen before.

Parvety is a great example. Who was Parvety, Young Cook Islands, comes into Micronesia and makes a name for herself. I'm hopeful that we can have that. And if that's the case, then presumably people will be up out of their chairs, 4.50. And you hope that the show will take their lead from that in terms of how they're casting and presenting and formatting the seasons to come. But I think using Stephanie as the example, I think that for me, there are just so, many icons in waiting that have been on this show historically who are ripe to bring back.

And Stephanie's a great example of like, you know, kind of out of mind, out of sight, then comes on the traitors and snake in the grass, pretty low impact. And you might have been like, okay, like we turned this stone over. Maybe we didn't need to. But then what we saw recently on social media was like, holy F, like, this is an energy I'm craving. And so, It makes me wonder. We are not endorsing what she said. We're endorsing the energy. We're endorsing the energy.

To quote Valerie Cherish, I do not endorse it. Yeah. But I think that for me, it's like I would really love to see that pool, especially from the early era of the show, knowing that they just have less time. They're older, right? I just, I would like to see a focus on looking at people. And I think that the show's done a great job of like, yes,

We know the show like Coach and Ozzie and Surrey and something like they've got they've gotten their opportunities and deservingly so. But I think there are a lot of other people that are less top of mind that I think the show could really go back and make an effort to give another chance to and see if there's something there. Some of them who I think are just owed it like, you know, like Michelle from Panama. Is that something? Michelle Yee.

No, not Panama. She was from Fiji. Okay, close, close. We got there. Michelle Yee from Fiji, an example of someone that it's like, okay, unceremoniously ousted, second chance idea. But also just people like Rob from your season, like from Amazon, there are so many people that, again, out of mind, out of sight, but maybe worth turning the stone over. Yeah. No, I think that that's a really good point of, I think that if you want people, especially after all of the hoopla and hype around survival.

Survivor 50, where even when, you know, at the Emmys, when they were doing the Survivor segment, you know, Survivor 50 was what they were showing on the screen. And even my son was like, hey, it's still only Survivor 49. Why that's not Survivor 50 yet? What, you know, it's all about Survivor 50. What does Survivor look like in 51? I love the idea of, okay, let's continue to service the stories of these other people that we've built up and give people a reason to keep coming back to see the lore around the people that they're already invested

in instead of like, hey, okay, learn 18 new people again. Yeah. And hey, not for nothing. When you talk to most people and ask them to rank their top 10 seasons of Survivor, many, if not most of those seasons are going to be returning player seasons, right? And so there's something about the fact like this formula is try to. and true. Not just on Survivor, on other shows as well. I think it's part of what, I know we're not supposed to vote the traders, but part of what makes the traders so great is that these are returning

players, albeit on other shows. People like familiarity. They like the idea that these people don't just exist and if it's in starts, but have renewed lives on these shows, have other opportunities to make amends or find greatness once again or find greatness for the first time. Or, you know, like there are opportunities for prolonged storytelling and so i think that yes to your point introducing 18 people over and over again difficult but also when especially like with shana it's like we're longing to see so many of these people that haven't brought back i don't need no new friends yeah 18 new people without sort of like a real container of which these people are in i do think that the themes and i know that the reasons why you know uh

They've decided not to continue on with the themes. But I do think it does make it a little bit more approachable to be able to put the people into some containers coming in. So it's like, okay, it's this versus this or it's like these types of people against these other, pitted against these other types of people. So I think that just from a digestibility standpoint, like I think if you're going to bring new people in, I think we need to frame it. You know what's amazing, though, Rob, is that you think back to the 20s and the 30s of Survivor, those seasons. Yeah. Like, I at least, and I felt like a lot of fans were like enough with the themes. These themes are ridiculous.

They don't make any sense. Why are we doing this? People don't say that about an Australian Survivor when it's like, you know, challengers versus contenders. They did around champions versus contenders. And it was like, what is that? What do you mean? Champions versus Contenders. does that even mean?

But all of them, what makes the great themes great is they basically come down to that idea of champions versus contenders, Davids versus Golias. I think that's the ultimate theme, underdogs versus overdogs, whatever you call that, right? I think that that's the great theme of Survivor. And I think that however you need to, you know, pitch that, however that needs to sound, whether it sounds as ridiculous as champions versus contenders, or if we just do David's versus Goliath two. I think that that's where we need to be going. But I remember that time where we were like enough with the themes and enough with the returning players, enough with putting three, four

returning players. So I think that the problems with the themes were when we were really straining it like heroes versus healers versus hustlers, which is not a thing. That is not a, that is not like blue collar versus no color versus white collar. Yeah. That is not like groups of people that you ever heard compared before in any way shape or form and then also when we were like really trying to like every the tribal councils were really focused on like so like as a gen xer what does it feel like to be blah blah blah so i think that you know for the it should be for the viewers a little bit more than something that like they're being like the narrative of the season where we're really trying to drive at home. That's where people get sick of the themes. Right. Like, it's just the framework,

right? It's just the setup. It's the conceit. But we don't need to show to lean into it. Because to Sean's point, so I'm currently working my way through, I'm doing my first ever watch of Australian Survivor and I'm currently on season four, but season three was my first champions versus contenders. I was scratching my head at the beginning being like, well, what's the difference? Also, the contenders had a ton of really beefy men on it. Um, great to look at, something I miss. But within that, I sort of was like, this doesn't make any sense.

And then after one episode, I was like, okay, yep, doesn't make sense. I submit. And I just was like, okay, great, fun to watch. So I agree with you where it's like the themes are not the sort of problem. It's the idea of like layering in the theme narratively that there can often become some dissonance around. But there are so many themes.

I mean, obviously the show has this history with like men versus women and separating age. That's certainly something we've talked a lot. on our pod about, you know, different, well, we've always, we've wanted a Republicans v. Democrats, which we think would be really fun. Obviously, no, it's never going to happen. But I just think of the ratings, Evan. Come on. I'm always thinking about the ratings, Rob. But yes, I think just creating a framework. It would be the last season of Rob is a podcast. We wouldn't live through it, but. The other thing, too, because I go in and I work with a lot

of companies and do social media consultation. And I often say to the companies when I go, go in is that one of the biggest things that I think people react to on social media is pride. Pride is so important for people. It's one of the key reasons why people choose to share content. And that can be like pride in their sports team. It can be pride in an actor they love. It can be pride in their family. And I think when you create the framework of the themes, it allows the viewer to create innate pride because they have a tribe that they're rooting for that they feel they have a vested investment in, excuse me, a vested investment,

sure, vested interest. But like, I know for a lot of people, when you do a David versus Goliath, I'm one of them, I'm always going to be with the Davids because I'm the kind of person that always roots for the underdog, right? And so it creates this idea of like,

even no matter what happens with them, I'm with them. It doesn't mean I like everyone on the tribe, but it's like from the outset within that template, I'm with them because they say, stand for what I think that I stand for in life. You know what I mean?

It kind of gives you that sense of pride. I think that's missing when you take the themes on. That's a really great point of trying to find the themes that like things that people identify with, even if it's like like book smart versus street smart, you know, that's like an easy one that I feel like that people are going to say, okay, are you book smart or street smart? And also remember with heroes versus villains, you put, it doesn't ultimately matter. You know, you had people on the villains tribe who weren't villains,

but for the sake of fitting it into the theme, you shove them in. So to your point, book smart versus street smart, there might be someone on there, day one. She's like, I'm pretty book smart. I got a, you know, 2,300 on the SATs. Shut up, move on. You know what I mean? Who cares?

Okay. But yeah, but my point about this was that we thought we had it bad then, right? Like, we thought we had it bad in the 20s and 30s. And sometimes we did. But I feel like now that we've strayed so far away from that, I'm ready for it to come back, right? I'm ready for the themes to come back. And if not the themes, then, you know, team captains, throw three returning players back off. Like Philippines is a great example of, you know, and maybe not all the people that we brought back were the right choices.

Hindsight, 2020. Yeah. But you had three tribes and you had a person back. And it was like, okay, this is this is Penners tribe. And you gave people like a little bit of like a hook coming back in. And I think that Philippines was really the start of the three tribe era in the modern game. And it really did, you know, it brought on things like Kagyan and some of the other three tribe seasons that were really great during that era. Which I'm fundamentally against, especially in your traditional new era season.

We talked about this a ton of, you know, just the. lack of variables that come with six people in a tribe. The new Mitsubishi Outlander brings out another side of you. Your regular side listens to classical music. Your adventurous side rocks out with the dynamic sound Yamaha. Regular U owns a library card. Adventurist U owns the road with super all-wheel control. Regular side?

Alone time. Adventurous side journeys together with third row seating. The new Outlander. Bring out your adventure. side. Mitsubishi Motors. Drive your ambition. Is there anything else? And we're sort of all over the place. But I feel like they're generally pretty positively. Yeah. I got to ask you, Rob, there was a lot of talk about Australia versus the world in the beginning being Australia versus America. And you don't really know what happened with that or if it was ever seriously

pursued. Were you ever asked? No. And I would have said yes, if they were. would have called me but I never heard anything about it because just to tell you like from my personal perspective at that point and I forget at what what point they were casting this I did not think that there was a chance that I would go to survivor 50 and and I had not gotten any sort of a call yet so it was early I guess it was earlier in 2024 I'm like well I'm not going to be on 50 they should call me for for this like I'd go do this I mean this was to me I felt like, hey, if I lose on Australian Survivor versus the world, like, nobody's going to be like, hey, you know, Rob sucks now. And I felt like it was low stakes, high ceiling to go

back and play. Would you do part two? I think I would. Wow. Pick up the phone. Pick up the phone. It just occurred to me that we're talking to you for the first time since you found. That did not a Curtinian saw right now. Right. Well, that's what that's why he wasn't going to go to. We had spoke to the shows. I know it went over my head. You know how I am.

Yes. We had spoken right before I went to go film traders. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Back in June. So can I ask you? I'm not asking anything.

Spoilerie, but like what is your approach? This is your first time within our HAP being a part of something that, you know, there's a coverage plan around. What's your approach? and how much pre-pro are you having to do in terms of figuring out what you can and cannot say? And then also just like I imagine

some of the, when you film something, the memory of it kind of congeals. So you're, you know what? You might be talking about episode three, but there might have been a conversation that happened, you know, at a different time. How are you approaching that? You know what?

We have not even started talking about that yet because that the season is still so far away. We don't know when the season is going to start airing. So those are all good questions that we have to figure out before we get to. to when Traders is going to come on. I had to do this with Australia versus the world because, of course, I knew everything that was going to happen

except for the winner. I didn't know who the winner was. And so that was something I had to continue. Did you slip at all in your podcasting? Did I slip at all? No, I didn't. But he's so professional. There were things that I edited out,

but they were more so, they were more so like behind the scenes, this sort of like production stuff. But I didn't really slip at all. I found it actually, I was very worried about it beforehand. But I found that in watching the episode, and these episodes were so good, that all I wanted to do was react to the episode. I did distinctly stay away from sort of speculating on where the strategy would go.

Yeah. If I went down the strategy route, I tried to make sure I hit every possible avenue that it could have gone down and not favored one. But I tried to react to the episode of television. and luckily these episodes of television were so rich that I had a lot of material to talk about. Yeah, I think it would be very interesting to podcast about a thing that you already know how it's going to play out because I think that it might in some ways really focus you on only talking about what was on the screen and not be like future casting of like, okay, well, I think this is where it's going to go and I'm reading the edit. Like I think it might in some ways like really force you to be like, oh, did you see how they did that?

Like, that was so well executed how that thing came together in this episode. But it's also particularly interesting that I don't know the rulebook, but we've seen a lot of past Traders players podcasting in real time when the episodes come out, which is something that Survivor players are not allowed to do. So it's interesting. There seems to be like a little bit less reins around what Traders players can and cannot say or perhaps they're all just breaking their contract who's to know for certain.

But that's just interesting too because we're sort of used to, there's an institutional framework with which Survivor exists within where it's like they can talk during these brief segments and for this amount of time and then they kind of have to sort of keep a lid on it

whereas I think traders, whether just through their lack of control or lack of care, has a little bit more of a laissez-faire attitude when it comes to conversations, particularly about the behind-the-scenes. There have been a lot of things revealed about how the sauce is made that I'm surprised to know. But my takeaway, too, sometimes is, like, once you know, it kind of removes some of the

preciousness, because you might be like, oh, my God, I can't believe X is saying why about how this actually works. And then you're kind of like, okay, now I know. Yeah. Rob, like, I mean, you cannot answer this if you want, but when they were talking to you about coming on, I mean, was that a part of the discussion of like, hey, this is my job. And I talk about the show and how am I going to talk about the show? I was so thrilled to have been talking about it.

I felt like that we were going to work that stuff out. And I let my representation have those conversations. Who from Survivor, again, this is not spoiler related. Having now played the game, though, who from Survivor do you think would be great to see on the traitors? Well, I think that the fact that Tyson hasn't been on it yet, I feel like it seems like that's an easy one to have him come back and him go and do that. I think that Kelly Wentworth would be a really good next, like, logical person. Michelle, I think is somebody else. It's interesting, though, because you mentioned Tyson and Kelly, who are two names that have come out and said that they were in consideration for AU versus the world.

So I think the question now moving forward becomes when they're saying, someone that you want back, it's like which pipeline to send them down, like the possibility of AU versus the world too or traitors. And I think they both have virtues, but I think that's one thing I'm contending with is like when I have a fave, like we've been talking about prognosticating about who we'd want on AU versus the world too. And Sean smartly brought up Natalie Anderson. Like we need to see Natalie Anderson on AU versus the world too. But I'm also like, yeah, but I, she's an example of like, I also really want her on traders. And thankfully, we're getting it. But it's sort of interesting to sort of wonder, like, are there people that we just want

back on television in any form, or are there people that we specifically want to see on one of these two shows? Well, everybody who did Australia versus the world had been on the traders at that point, right? Yeah. So maybe they have to do both. Also, yeah, and Luke also was on Australian traders. Yeah. And Jerry, you had mentioned also with somebody that you thought would be good to do Australia

versus the world, too. And, of course, then she has the great tie-in of being from Survivor the Australian Outback, but she would also be somebody who would be very fun to watch on the traders. Yeah. Just one thing, and I said this on drop your buffs, but just to say it here, I think for me with AU versus the World 2 or whatever the future may be, I really think that adopting more of like an attitude around like representation of the country and the pro, again, to go back to that word pride.

So whereas this season sort of felt like a not quite their idea with the AU versus the world, it's like, I'd like to see an Australian tribe and an American tribe and a South African tribe. And I don't know, whatever the fourth may be. But like, I want to see the idea of rather than the world tribe having to be, you know, this bringing together of everyone other, I think it could be really exciting to sort of approach it with that idea that like when you're from the U.S. and you're watching it, you're rooting for your home team. I think that could really create some fun within the fandom as well. I mean, I know, you're, like, Eurovision.

I know, yeah, like that's fun. I know you're the number one cast super fan, but do you feel like that? Could it just be Australia versus the U.S.? It could be, but I think what's exciting, I know for me and watching it is like I have such a myopic understanding of survivors being like this American show, right? Then Sean introduces me to Australia and my mind's, blown. I'm like, oh my God, there's this whole other version of the show, maybe better. There's this whole other show that's out there. And so for me, it's like what I came away from

this being like, I wonder, and I don't have the time, but like I wonder like, is Survivor South Africa appointment television? So I kind of like the idea that this AU versus the world or whatever it ends up being is a window into these other franchises. And I might not have the time, but I bet there a lot of people out here that meet these people and subsequently say, I'm going to go back and understand, I want to watch how Lisa won, you know? And so I think that, like, there's a lot of this show inviting people to discover the other franchises and creating more of an idea that Survivor is universal, right? Like, it's not saying the U.S. is not to be home with the franchise that it is. We all recognize that. But it's saying, like, isn't it incredible, like, the seeds with

which this show planted and how many roots it has globally? Like, I think. I think that's something to celebrate and lean into. All right. Well, this has been such a fun discussion with Survivor A.U. versus World. Survivor 50. Survivor Beyond 50. So always great.

Love getting the chance to talk with you both. And of course, you could hear Sean and Evan on Drop Your Buffs. And they're going to podcast about the Survivor 49 premiere. We are. At least. At least. Yeah. And then how will you make that the same?

if you go on past the 49 premiere well uh evan's now saying that we've committed to the premiere i thought that we had committed to the first two episodes so i think we're committed to the first two episodes of survivor 49 i think we it's just going to be a vibe check we'll probably check in with the audience you know to take a poll yeah because the thing is it's like we for those that don't know our tone can be a little bit more negative and the thing for us is like there's always that line between us like being negative and having fun and then just being negative. And so I think for us, it sort of lies in just tonally for Sean and I, when we move

forward, if we're not vibing with the season, can we still talk about it in a way that's having a good time? And if we're not, I think both for ourselves, but for our audience, like there's a place that can go where we're no longer having fun. And I say we, I mean our audience. So it's just like, you know, keeping the vibe check. What if, for whatever reason, you're not having fun, is the podcast just on hiatus? Will you talk about something else?

We would do a rewatch, I think. We would do a rewatch of something. Yeah. We have rewatch. Not Thailand. Oh, my God. We were so excited going into Thailand. We were like, you know, this is sort of like this, you know, forgotten season, blah, blah, blah.

And it's like, thank God. But no, we would do a rewatch. We have Traders 3 coming up. So that's definitely in our pipeline. And then... Traders four. Three? Excuse me.

Traders four. So sorry. By the way, can I just say, I dipped a toe into Traders Ireland last night because there was a little bit of hoopla. Yes. I wasn't doing it for me upon, you know, just dip my toe in real quick.

But anyway, I don't think that that is a show that can last, that it doesn't have the legs of Survivor. I don't think the scaffolding of Traders is strong enough to support a long, deep run. Conversation for another day. Anyway, we'll also be doing... I think we're going to dive in and watch some old episodes of Sex in the City. Yeah, I don't.

I mean, I think we're kind of like, yeah, I'm going to email Sean about that. But yeah, I think we're going to be covering Survivor-adjacent content. We want to watch some classic Mike White films. We want to do Parvety Shallows. Of course not, Sean. What do you even say that? What's Amanda Kimmel and Parvety's movie? Blue Crush 2.

Into the Blue 2. Oh, Into the Blue 2. We're going to do Into the Blue 2. What's the Colleen Haskell? The Animal. The Animal, yeah. You can skip the red eye with Colby Donaldson. Yeah.

Red eye. Okay. Well, thank you both so much for coming on, of course. Listen, I'm pot committed to, even if it's the worst season of Survivor that ever Survivor 49, and we have no reason to think that it would be. I'm with you the whole way through, okay? So don't worry. And thank God.

And thank God. There's nothing that gets me more excited than polishing, well, not polishing off the Survivor episode, but getting into bed with my husband and cranking up, uh, No It All's episode. Like, that's what I come for. That's what keeps me. So, so no matter, even if we stop potting the show, we will remain loyal listeners. Thank you, Evan. Even if I stopped watching the show, I'd be tuned into No, at all. Did you hear how excited Stephen was about the influencer episode? Yeah, I did. I did. Yeah. Shot out of a cannon. Is he being paid? I'm not funny. It's funny. Stephen will get like really excited about some things that are so,

innocuous to me and then other times there will be something that I think is like actually like incredible and Steven will be super mid on it but that's what I love about Steven is I never quite know what the temperature is going to be and that's you know that's what we tune in for he's the ultimate enigma yeah all right all right thank you both so much looking forward to getting everything started and looking forward to hearing what you say in the comments take care of good one bye RHAP fans know I spent my life breaking down Survivor and Big Brother's strategy.

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