RHAP: We Know Survivor - Survivor Global: Gaming the Vula Trajectory | Season 48 Premiere with Mark Warnock

Episode Date: March 1, 2025

Survivor Global host Shannon Guss chats to Australian Survivor Titan Mark Warnock about the premiere of Survivor 48. They discuss where Vula goes from here and which play style will win out, who else is impressing in the game and a very difficult Chissy.

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Tribal space. For the adventure of a lifetime. The adventure of a lifetime. The adventure of a lifetime. Hello everyone and welcome to RHA Peace coverage for Survivor Global for Survivor 48. I'm your host Shannon Guss here to talk about the premiere. We're into U.S. Survivor. For the fans and the listeners who are watching, Australian Survivor and U.S. Survivor like me and my guest are currently, four nights a week there's a lot of survivor hours of survivor every single week. If I had to calculate, it was like, yeah, like five hours of survival this week. And we had to talk about all of it. Firstly, my great guest, he is someone who was with this finalist. Okay. I don't know. You mean the finale? I'll take finalist. I'll take it. I think finalist is a great Mark Warnock. Mark, thank you for being here. Thank you, Shannon. Yeah, hours and hours and hours of Survivor. Hours

of listening to you wrap up episodical episodes of Australian Survivor but um the OG's back. US Survivor. Yeah. Can't can't not watch it and uh I liked it. I liked it. It's good. It's different but it's good. Mark, how long were you on that final torture challenge? What was your hour? Shannon, buddy, you just go straight for the jugular, reminding me of my traumatic moment. I just want to know if it was longer than the Survivor you've watched this week and what was more torturous under it? We love you 11 Survivor, but how long were you on that challenge?

It was over two hours. Oh, over two hours. So easily we clear that. Yeah, that's right. Have you ever, did you watch these episodes while in like a spinning wheel of doom though? A spinning wheel of doom? No, I was on my couch, I was eating popcorn, I was having a nice cold drink. My wife wasn't watching me disintegrate and melt down in front of her eyes. It was very sweet and it's a much, I, much prefer watching a survivor from the comfort of my couch. Then standing on that torch wheel. Any other challenge I'll take, but that one, oh good.

But, um, no, this was great. I can't have too much content of survivor. And there's white Lotus is back. There's Dondi, there's traders us like, Oh my goodness. You know, just block the world out and watch reality TV people. It is crazy how much television, I mean, White Lotus isn't reality TV. It feels like, White Lotus kind of feels like reality TV

because you know that someone's gonna die, right? So it's like, that's like the, like who's gonna get voted out aspect of the whole series kind of, and then the characters. I mean, I always think about this, about how like, I mean, I think Mike White has probably spoken about like what his experience on Survivor like, you know, contributed to the White Lotus. Like, I just feel like he was watching there, like, he was right there watching Angelina ask for the jacket. Like, one of the funniest moments in

television history and he was like, I'm going to make a show about ridiculous people. Yeah. Yes. That's it. And also I've decided now, um, Steph, Steph for White Lotus. That's what Justice for Steph and Steph is White Lotus casting like 101. She's got to be on it. The hat, the outfit, the sassiness, the snorting. I love that she was snorting the whole time. It was hilarious. Uh, I love Steph and I think I'm devastated she's gone already and um but I think she can pivot from Survivor to something more profitable which is being on White Lotus season four wherever it may be. I absolutely love you getting us back on track I'm like we're going to keep it zippy and then I'm like what do you think Mike White's thinking when he creates White Lotus but it is true it very

upsets the Steph for the people who if you know you know that that I immediately got grenade after being on the highest possible horse. Like even I can see that it's funny. I was wearing a tiara. Everyone's like you dropped your crown. I'm like, it was a tiara and I'm still going to wear it while I'm still the reigning champion. But it's looking dire for me now because Steph, I think the issue was, I said, like, I saw parts of myself in her and that was already like such a red flag. Like, why would I go with that? That I would never bet on myself.

So no, Steph is better than me. And that's what I was hoping. And I don't know that she made a lot of mistakes, but I think in ways she got outplayed by someone playing very, very hard. And that's why I like my biggest questions of this episode. Like, obviously, did Justin and Kevin make the right decision, which I think is a very interesting conundrum we're going to look at. And did say play well, like, am I giving cheesy points to say those are like very much like my two like questions of this

episode but just in general how did you feel about this premiere like how are you liking it just where we are in Survivor right now? Yeah look it's great it's there's a lot of hype I think there's a lot of momentum going into season 50 so I like that they are weaving the season 50 momentum into season 48. So I think that the players are really gearing themselves up. They're buying into the excitement of the show, which is great. I think casting was pretty good in this season. I like that they have some big buff, brawny and slightly buffoonish characters characters. So, I like that. It brings a bit of um versatility um. And Australian survivor style casting. Present company excluded of course.

Of course. Hey, I like I I held my own. Um anyway. I felt more from the buffoon part of it. I'm not saying in terms of the. Oh yes. Yes. The the negative parts that we're talking about. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's good. And you know, Shannon, you say that you've picked up the grenade already, and we're wondering if say, played well or not. It's like your path to winning the draft is similar to say's path to winning the end game. I think that there is a very narrow way for you to win the draft. Unlikely, and I wouldn't want to be putting money on it. And I think the same goes for Say. I

think that she has pretty much cooked her own goose. So I am, I'm on, I, whilst I found it entertaining, I think that this is very much short term gameplay. And I think without making too many comparisons to Australian Survivor, I think she's a bit of a Nash character in that she shot herself in the foot. She's not going to win. But also it's sort of disrupted the tribe. And unfortunately, Steph caught a stray bullet and she's gone. So that's sad for Steph. But yeah, I don't know that this and for you, of course, that's the most important bit.

Yeah. Yes, of course. My draft legacy is more important than who wins a million dollars. I think that's pretty clear. But look, I want to talk about, say, and I want to talk about this whole vula tribe. I mean, it's so interesting in New Era Survivor where it's so constricted in so many ways. And for some tribes, they have like total outs. Like if you look at like a laggy tribe, the purple tribe, their whole big thing is like, you know, if the men are together, like they have stars as a target and then like who else will they

pick and it's like the stats and the odds of them ever getting to the point where they even have to make that decision are so incredibly low. Like just just to look at the stats, like if they're going to lose two challenges as what seemingly is like at least one of the two strongest tribes, if not the strongest tribe based on at least the precedent set in this episode and they're kind of you know, win record of this episode. So they need to lose two of the next probably four challenges, maybe five, very unlikely, probably two or four. That feels very, very unlikely. The new era has never seen every tribe go to two tribal councils. Yeah. And even to get to like six pre-moj boots at all, you'd have to go all the way back to 41. So you're asking for them basically to become like the new losing tribe

and like look you can definitely lose one and then lose your flint and get on a roll but it just seems incredibly unlikely that they're even going to get to the point where they're choosing between like Eve and Bianca compared to Vula who are on a track where they might become you know the disaster tribe and then every decision actually is so important because it's like, they're going to be lucky if half this tribe makes the two, the merge probably, because of how we see that, that the losing can compound, not like 47, but in most new era seasons, I think what 41, not really 43, 44, 45, 46, like that's already, you know, four seasons, we, there are disaster tribes. So every decision becomes incredibly important. So I'm kind of coming in higher than I thought I would be on what they did, because I think that like the Kevins and the Justices of the

Worlds were in these swing positions are going up now against like a quite a difficult force if they choose to, all the real was safe for for the long haul and we'll talk about that. But like if you were going to get Seiyah out of the game, this was kind of the opportunity. It felt like you could probably blindside her. It felt like she'd probably vote for Steph. You wouldn't even have to really fracture the tribe on a split. And if Steph goes, I mean, like she's the other option anyway. You could maybe split on like a Cedric, which we can talk about it.

I'm sure they didn't want to do that, but there a two two two split potential there's you know you can really go in that way with two people who really want to work with you in Mary especially and Steph and they don't do it and I feel like those opportunities will dwindle so it's very very hard for me because when I'm looking at the chizzy points I'm like high on Kevin as a player but then I'm also kind of high on Say and I don't know if you can be high on both because it's like one has to win out. Like, can Kevin fully have his way in this tribe? If Say is there, you know, with so much power, but like if Say playing a good long term game compared to someone like Kevin,

who everyone loves, but you will again have power. Like who's going to kind of be controlling what I think will be a tribe who is going to go through it probably in the next couple of weeks. And that's kind of my thesis point on this episode. Thank you, Rusty. I love they should really beam you into to Fiji as Shannon the historian just like a little I think that would be good. Yeah, I like it. Pretty clear. I like, you know, I appreciate that say is coming in hot. I like that.

I also think that Steph came in strong as well. Like she, they both had their approaches. I think that say, the whole, basically if you ain't got fool, there's the door. That's the motto of you're a survivor. You ain't got fool, there's the door and show yourself out. You know, don't let it hit you on the way out. And I think that say basically took that saying to its extreme, which is,

I'm going to find the bloody blue air advantage. I'm going to share it with my I'm going to get for I'm going to force it down their throat. And then we're going to be a fool, but they like it on. And I do think she had some good social elements. I think that's true. But I don't think that in the new era of Survivor, and I think 45 is my favorite. That's the one that D won. And that's right, is that 45? Yeah.

Yeah. So I think that like having a four that is built on something more substantial than shoving a Bewear appendage down people's throats is going to be more sustainable. So that's why I think that whilst it paid off, I'm really sad that Kevin and Justin, Stoner Boy Justin, Peter Boy, love him, fantastic casting. I also just side-noted, Googled where he's from. He's from a little town in Washington State, the far Northwest. And so I don't know how many people are from like little towns like that. But I think he really, I like to see a little like that rural small town

boy on my screen. Anyway, I'm sad that they also didn't step up to the plate and to the answer the call of Jeff, as you were saying, you know, what was the call of survivor? How did it speak to you? I wish that they had answered that call a little bit and was like, okay, you know what, we can actually have a super tight for get rid of say, get rid of the idol. And then we're, we are now in the majority without having to have this roadblock in the path that they're going to have now with say there, she's erratic, she doesn't like looking at stars, she doesn't like talking about star signs, you know, like, how are you going to bond with her? It's going to be like, she's just going to be, you know, in their face all the time and I think that it's going to be more difficult to navigate

around in such a small tribe when the other laggy, I've got the tribes printed off. I don't have a color printer so I need to like orange, purple and green. Vulu Vula tribe. Yeah. In black and white, they are going to be going back to tribal council again. And so I think I think Justin and Kevin Mr. Beat here to take the game into their own hands, pull off a massive move, get rid of, say, and Mary. Oh, my goodness, Mary and Steph. There's so much fun. I love them.

Also, Mary is a counselor of some description. I think she's going to be giving redemption for psychologists all around the world that have played survivor. I think she's fantastic. I really liked her social game. I really liked her style. I really liked assassinus. I think she had a genuineness to her confessionals that I loved.

So I, it's not a criticism of say as a person, I just don't think, I think she's gone for the, if you ain't got four days the door, but she's taken it slightly too far. And unfortunately, it is going to be to fool the tribes detriment. I basically have written them all off from winning the game except for a Hail Mary for Mary. Hail Mary. Literally Hail Mary, yes. You don't do that on purpose? Well, no, I didn't, but that just came out. Yeah.

Incredible. I am. Okay. A few things. Yeah, I guess let's look at Justin and Kevin first and then I can make the case for say that does feel so counterintuitive to things that I try to try usually to endorse around like you build up social capital and then you spend it strategically and maybe like, you know, checks will bounce if it's like done in these kind of anti-social ways like more through fear.

We can talk about that for say, which I would love to do. But in terms of like Kevin and Justin, I think that's the question is like, why do they side with say and it's what out of one of two reasons. The first which I love to look at is out of fear. And if they've done this out of fear, I don't love that. Obviously. Because then then I mean, you don't want to be making fear based decisions in episode one, especially because I think that Say as a threat is only going to become more real and scary to them. Like this again was like probably the most vulnerable she was going to be to actually take the shot at her. So are they scared of like shooting and missing and then like maybe come back on one of them at a worst case scenario or Steph

but then, you know, then well, again, like if they come back on Steph, that wouldn't be terrible. If it comes back on one of them, I guess there's a fear in that. Do they not want to split on Cedric, who I think it's not really three pairs. I think that it's, they're probably like a bit of a three with Cedric, so they probably don't want to do that. So they probably can't split. But again, you probably assume that say, would ricochet with an idol onto Steph, but that would be giving her all the power.

So if that's a fear of just like, we're too locked up to take her out now, you're going to be way too locked up to take her out in the future. Like this was the biggest shot you had at the blind side, at a split potential. So here's my issue with Say is that if you're getting to emerge in a three, even if you take out Cedric and Mary before her, or a four if you take out Mary next with an idol and it's this cohesive group, that's pretty good.

But you have to weigh the timing and the fact that that means that you now have to win most of the challenges. You're going to lose one challenge, which seems again for them incredibly unlikely. So you have to like weigh the odds of the fact that like you're going to come up against say at a point. So next time, what does Kevin lose someone like a Mary, which he might not want to do, but might have to do to stay in a four. And then what are you taking out like a Cedric at the four and hoping to go in as a three and then what? If you lose again and it's a real like disaster situation, she has all the power with an idol. How much trust you put into these situations where the splits become a lot less possible, where you don't have as great ricochet targets as the Steph who's the target here anyway.

It's only going to get Dacia. I think that they've chosen the safe path now for the long game. I don't see how she gets out of it. And if that's out of fear, I'm concerned about it. If it's the choice that they want to make out of trust. Firstly, let's credit say on the fact that we're saying she's in a good position here and they're kind of they have the hand signs. We have to credit say on that. That's the first part. If they want to work with her,

they should be able to work with who they want to play with, obviously. And it's like centered on this concrete idol and even Justin has a confessional that he likes her straight up, she's been with him and like, they definitely talk about that trust in positive ways, as much as it might seem strange to us, given how we're kind of seeing how it's going down in this intense way. But I just worry about kind of getting up the agency in the fact that she has power and the fact that she has protection. This is gonna be like a rapidly dwindling group.

And I think they'll kind of be without options. And if you keep losing, that actually might come back on you. So it's gonna become weird. I'm still unsure about my chitty points because I wanna give a lot of seven. But the more I think about this decision, I feel like you just handed so much of the game to say. And then saying that I have to credit say, don't I?

And don't we all? Look, I think the fear, okay, you've got the fear argument, which is, you know, bad. The theory, the fear theory, the theory is, you know, like is a- Love it, love it, bud. I know I've come to your puns before, but that wasn't me. I love the puns. The theory is wonderful. I'm just thinking about what you're puns. I'm just thinking about what you're putting down.

I know that's exactly who I am. I'm sorry. I'm getting it in the past. I love theory. I love the theory. It's amazing. Thank you. You have the list as well.

It's just perfect. Okay. So I think that they are playing out of fear. However, that's Kevin. Okay. Let's just focus on Kevin. Let's leave my boy, my stoner pizza boy, Justin to one side for a second. Love you, Justin. Hey, Justin went to an Ivy league school for the stoner guy. Okay. Give him some. Hey, I love stoner

guys. Like they're brilliant. They're probably maybe like, you know, they're probably ran countries in some countries. Anyway, some people have run. Well, let's not talk about, let's not make them the modicum of like the the metrics are you know running countries as being the art, anyway. I digress. Understood. The way that this could make sense for Kevin is and there's a little bit of history here, for me is if you get out, what's her name?

Steph, then you get out Mary, you basically are banking on the fact that you can survive up until a swap or a, they don't do swap, a merge, and then abandon ship. It's an abandon ship strategy. It's not a strategy of going in with the strong four, a la the reaper four. This is, I'm before this is a,

I'm backing myself to get to insulate myself, to get to a, get to like a tribe, stop or emerge or whatever it is in the new era. And then I'm going to abandon ship. I'm going to use my social skills to create new relationships. And I'm just going to absolutely tank and abandon Vula tribe. And I'm just going to become a number for another tribe. And I'm just going to create new number for another tribe. And I'm just going to create new relationships. That's not, I think, I don't think that's what's happened here.

But I do think that that is a legitimate strategy in New Era Survivor, which is, okay, you've got a wild card in say, she's got an idol. Just stay close to her. And then just try and scatter gun everyone else in your tribe. And then eventually when you can get out of this mess of a tribe, you just go out on your own and then use your social skills and strategic skills to navigate yourself to a different Alliance.

That's what I would be doing if I was Kevin. And I think that they're stuck with safe at the moment and which is, I'm so sad for Mary because I really hope that she can do the Hail Mary but uh if from Kevin's perspective I can't see how a lot creating a deep relationship with Say is going to work Justin and Kevin seemed and that's where I think Justin is at a I think he may struggle to be nimble enough to have that same strategy the abandon ship strategy. Kevin what does he call himself a lovable Labrador or something, or he calls himself a puppy dog.

Like I think other people see him that way. So I think that he has the ability to have the abandon ship strategy. Whereas I think Justin would think like a rat if he tries to do that. Well, a big week for rats. I feel like the ideal for me would actually be to stay with this for like, if you can be a type four around this idol, when we have heard positive social things,

again, it doesn't seem right to us because we see the way they talk to them. Like we see language where she's basically like, you know, don't be doing any funny business. And she's, you know, yanking the kind of idol thing out of their hands. Like it feels like a lot, but they are responding more and more. I think Cedric and Justin seemed closer to to say, and like, I feel like, um, even like Steph talked about this exit, that the way they slept was kind of those three and then like Steph, Mary and Kevin. So Kevin may be closer to like the Mary side of things, which again,

is like a negative. I should probably be critical of Kevin here, but I feel like I want to be positive about it. But again, this four seems like they could have social longevity. It doesn't feel right, but it is what we're hearing. But the thing is that will that four make it to a Reba four position? Reba weren't losing challenges. They are the Lulu. They're not the Reba. And it's very unlikely they're going to get there. So for me, it becomes more about this kind of structure that I've been talking about since Survivor 41, this new era structure. The tribes might lose a lot of challenges. We talked about it with like, I think that was it Yasa in 41, like with whatever he was doing. The way that you want to get, if you're in like a pair, like this Kevin Justin pair,

is you want to have like, basically you want to get to like a 2-1-1 eventually so you can have the decision. You don't want to be in like a 2-2, like this is how you go down to it. And the way that I look at it now is like, if say goes here and Kevin is even less close to a step, but it's close to Mary, then take out Steph next. And then you've got Cedric and Mary, and then you've got decisions and you can work with them even into emerge if you're lucky and you get to that point. Or you can make decisions to cut whoever as you move on. And my issue with keeping say here is that it's going to be hard to do that with say

next time. Like you can't do Steph say because she's more likely to play the idol take out say now and maybe even flush the idol and doing it. And they can be the one one to get you to a floor with Cedric next to you and Mary next to you. And I think that looks like the best structure from the limited amount of information that we have. And you can't do that.

So I should feel I should be critical of Kevin, because the more I talk and think about it, the less I like it, the more I think he's given the power to say. But then it's like I want to give Kevin Kevin three cheesy points because of these things. Firstly, his social game. So the way that people love him, the way that Se went to Cedric and Justin, and they said from the beginning, and Kevin, they had not even met the guy. And I doubt they'd listened to him on podcasts the way the teenie had with Asia last season. Like that's insane energy and social capital so so early the way people talk about him. The fact that to be fair, ruler started the puzzle last, but Steph still got all the blowback.

Kevin gets nothing is the fact that he injures his shoulder in the first challenge and they still send him on the journey, which is wild to me. And then they come back and they call him a hero. and they still send him on the journey which is wild to me and then he wins and they come back and they call him a hero. Like that alone on pure just social game is so exceptional to me. So then I think like should I be really private? Is he sparkly? I mean the way people are reacting to him he must be sparkly. So then I look at it and I think I have to be really positive about that but then I'm like will he be okay regardless? Cause everyone loves him. He's got so many allies. He has to cut an ally because everyone wants to work with him.

It's an unenviable position, I guess, to be so beloved. But then I'm like, has he put himself up against something difficult in a way that Steph was not going to be for him in a tribe where he could have total social power and control, but now has this idle threat in a way that will block him up and make that road more difficult.

And I feel like I'm still questioning my cheesy points, Mark, which is rare for me coming into a podcast. Yeah, well, I think that you can, as we've seen on Australian Survivor, like Kirby, she can have amazing social strategy, but then she makes it really difficult for herself. And I think that's what Kevin said. That's bad. Although I think the more we talk about it, so I don't know. I think you also missed that Kevin and Kyle were doing whatever that challenge was. And then Kyle fills up his bloody bucket. I know.

And I credit Kyle a lot for that, but you're right. Kevin's probably just so lovable that people just drop their own, smash their own bottles and start filling up his bottles. Like what is this power that he has, this mindful power that he has over people? It's great. That might be the sparkle in it.

I think that's it. I think that's it. Yeah, look, I think I'm really intrigued to see how Mary pivots here. I think, say, how is she going to navigate around these numbers and then navigate around this idol. Can Mary approach, say, can she try and use, say, eagerness to play a big game? Can she try and manipulate that some way? Who knows? So it's going to be interesting. I do think that we're going to see a lot of Vula tribe as well. But you know what, if this plan of Kevin's bites him on the butt at least they've got a butt doctor on their tribe we got Cedric he can like sort of do some like do a little bit surgery fix it up and hopefully uh hopefully that could be Cedric's like addition to this alliance is just like covering people's bumps. I don't know enough about the medical profession certainly not in that

area or in general but I don't think that's the kind of butt doctor that Cedric is like for bites I don't know how many bites he sees a year. So just bit me on the butt. I'm gonna need your help doctor. I don't think that's the vibe. Hey, look, you know, it's like we didn't ask Charles what sort of legal expertise he had. He's a lawyer. It's like I get in legal trouble. I need a lawyer. Something bit me on the bum. I need a bum doctor. That's just the line they seem to know. Fair enough. Well, okay. Can I, okay. So now can I make the case for say, I feel like in, in, in talking about why

I'm kind of down on the Kevin thing, I have to be positive about say, well, I mean, Kevin, to be fair, Kevin has like a clear number one was they were the swings, like he and Justin, both of them credit to them. He has majority, has a side thing with Mary. Like there's a lot of potential, but it's just a decision I query. But say, is it unlikely that she can win? Yes. Do I think that this ends in a Say win? I don't. However, however... For the sake of the draft. No, no, not even just, well just for like, just looking at Say as a player, the way she was going to come in was going to make this difficult for herself.

Within that framework, I think this might be the best way that she could have played the episode. I think she achieved the most that she could play. I mean, she talked in the pre-season about Dreya so much. I was like, man, she loves Dreya. That was like the most thing I took from it. She talked about Dreya over and over and over again. It was crazy.

She loved Dreya. And then she played a Dreya game. And during 42, I did, I spent a lot of time being like, in this new era where it's a shorter game, which I do think this is the kind of game where like, this is, you know, an Australian's Vibe, it's not going to work with the Kirby in her, not to really compare say in Kirby, but like, that intense like alpha gameplay, put Kirby very, very far. But I do think in the new era, this is like the biggest chance for a game like this to just like out for your way to the end. And I looked at that when the new era was starting with Omer and Dreya ironically, about like the kind of like savvy strategy of Omer and like the intense

trinket game of Dreya. And for Say to come in and want to play the Dreya game, she couldn't have maximized on it more. I mean, she comes out of it, she has a four person majority, she's won the vote, she has an idol, but to fair, she and she, she, she did it pretty much herself. Like she, she worked it out. She got it. She, she, you know, solve, beware all in this one episode. And what I really love is like, she did use the idol to create a majority. And if you compare it to someone like Nash, who I feel like obviously didn't do that. And I wanted him to do something like that. Nash put people off with the idol, he was intimidated, people were intimidated, he didn't use it intentionally.

She did what I want people always to do with the trinkets. To be fair, this is what I always say to do, create a numerical majority and really make people feel included in that around this like symbol and this thing. And she did that. That's her way of playing the social game. Now, again, I wouldn't back it over like a Kevin type social game, but for the kind of game that the only type of game that seems like someone like Say can come into play, she has to be who she's going to be. I don't see how she can do much better on that

game style than she did in this episode. Yeah, look, so essentially what you're saying is you've lowered your bar for Say. Well, I just have to judge her on who she is, you know, like I have to judge everyone on their own merits. Fair, fair. Look, I know what you're saying. And she got the outcome. Justin and Kevin had the agency to not give her that outcome. So, you know, there's a little column A, there's a little column B. In terms of playing that quote unquote alpha game the entire time, we got some big alphas on this season, you know, across the tribes. And is she going to be able to create connective tissue in the future with enough people that's going to be her challenge apart from just trinketing her way to the end? So let's wait and see. I'm confident

in my... I think, and I've heard other players talk about this in the past, and I'm still not sure where I sit, but it's like, would you rather try and play to win and risk getting voted off first, or would you try and delete the chance that you're going to be voted off first and then just get to the next day and then see what happens? And I think- Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. to the next day and then see what happens. And I think, yeah, yeah. And I think, I think say has gone, I, and you know, he, she, she listened to Jesus. Jeff was like, Jesus, at the start of this,

at the start of this episode being like, take that step and listen to the call of the survivor. And how did it affect you? And I was like, wow, wild. Anyway, Say decided to not be first voted off. She guaranteed herself the fall. She wasn't gonna be shown the door. Whereas Steph, I think, was setting herself up to play a winning game, but it comes with risk because you can be a hurricane, like Say can come along and sweep you away and then you're done.

So, but I think that Steph gave herself the chance to like establish social relationships, which typically are your best way of winning. So it's a risk-based decision. And I think if you had to do it multiple times, I probably, that's why I've got justice for Steph under my name, because I think that normally, I think it's the better way to go. But that being said, Say is still there. she got through, she's still going on. Or she's got her four people. Uh, good luck to her for the next 24 days or whatever could come to her.

So, yeah. Yeah. I mean, like Robin, Steven, we're talking about this a bit, I've listened to most of no one else, um, where they were talking about, you kind of like have to play to the speed of your tribe. You know, Steph comes in and most people are probably at her speed, you know, the speed of like making connections. Again, that is something I highly endorse. I wrote an article about it for the conventional last year about like the social capital that you build that you can then

spend. And like, you know, Steph is, is coming out there and wanting to build that social capital, which usually I'm okay with. Say is coming out there and it's like, you know, borrowing money and going into possible debt, but it's like making purchases that will help her accrue more money in the future. I don't understand money or business. I think that's clear, but I'm trying. I think that that makes sense. And I think, and she got overwhelmed by the fact that Say was going at such a fast speed, like she set the speed and the tone of the tribe in a way that was shocking because most people wouldn't do it that way. But at that point, like Say got left behind to that. So Steph got left behind to that. So is that what I said? For say, I would prefer if they chose to work with her on relationships,

rather than fear. I think for Justin and Cedric, it seems like they probably did as much as we see this as like Kevin being the king of the tribe and his decision, he still has to go with his swing partner and Justin, like, I think they're a bit of a three with Cedric. Like if that's the relationships they have, I think that maybe they did sway it for say. And if that was what it was, I'm very, very high on it. And if it was fear, either way, it got the job done, right?

And I think, again, it's gonna be trickier to get rid of her in the future. And I do think that she did other, she had good reads on like Justin coming back and giving her the information. I think she's even like, that Steph Plato shot in the future and I do think that she did other things. She had good reads on like Justin coming back and not giving her the information. I think she's even like that Steph played her shot in the dark. Like she has some good instincts for the game even if one of those instincts isn't I should make you know real friends before I start like you know jumping into bed with them. Um it worked and I have to credit that and I think that it was the best say could play. I think

that's the thing. I wanted to say quickly about Steph. So at the Tribal Council, I thought it was really, I thought it was a really interesting conversation between say and Steph, because Steph is lovable. She's got a tropical outfit. She's, you know, smiley roses. What is it? Air signs and talking about stars. But as soon as I say, yeah, as soon as I sort of comes at her, Steph defended herself. It was it was really she showed that she had an adaptability in terms of saying, hey, say, like, just because we're all playing our own game out here.

And I don't think that, you know, you can dictate to me how people are playing their games. Like don't, don't like, don't fool, don't be fooled into thinking that just sitting around looking at the stars is like us just being out here on a holiday, it's not. And so I think that that was, I think Steph read the room. She played a shot in the dark. So she, she also had the read as well.

And it was just, you know, can you imagine if that pulled off like the shot in the dark? That would be incredible. But yeah, so I think that Steph, I think Steph did, not only did she, she had her strategy, she obviously didn't realize how abrasive or how, what's the word I'm looking for, interest based game, say was going to be playing. But then even at tribal council, she kind of pivoted quite quickly and defended herself. And I'm, I'm just sad that Justin and Kevin didn't didn't see that. You know, what I do think potentially is, is that Steph and Mary may have looked like a really tight duo. They may have looked to the rest of the tribe like a really tight duo. They were clearly getting on

like a house on fire. And so potentially, it was the strength of the Mary-Steph relationship that was a, like they may have been the strongest pair and that could have been potentially a factor in their thinking. I wouldn't agree with that though, because I still think one person with an idol almost going to be a five person tribe. I'd rather a pair to my majority of three. Like I think that's a lot like I would rather do that and then just take out Steph next time. And then Mary has nowhere else to go without someone who's blocked up by an aisle. It's the fact that they are going to struggle to come to say next time and only have made it more difficult to blindside her than it would have been in this episode. Probably like as more time

goes on and she has more time to kind of like read the new direction of things. That's my issue with it because it's just like, that's going to give her a lot of power. And who are you splitting on? Are you, are you splitting one vote on Mary then? So what it's like, I guess they could do that. And then, you know, that Mary is going to be in it. Let's work this out. So if Mary's voting with Say, let's say that Mary goes to Say,

and it's like, let's do something. And then they vote, they put two votes on Mary. And then Mary and Say, if they put two votes on Kevin, and they split one vote, no, sorry, they put two votes on Say, Say is, you know, that can't work. So they're giving Mary an off. Okay. I think this makes sense. If they want to split the vote, the four of them, they'll have to split one vote on Mary,

two votes on Say, say two votes on Kevin if Mary flips over. Kevin would go home two to one with the idol. So you have to assume that Mary is going to be with you in the four to split that one vote while you're splitting on her and not hoping she goes over the other side out of self-preservation, which she might have the wherewithal to do. I think that makes sense. Mary needs to pull out an immunity win. She needs to get on the puzzle and psych out Lagi and Siva. She needs to do something. Yeah, this is my, when you can't properly split and you're going to have to include someone that you're doing a one vote split on because say is my, when you can't properly split and you're going to have to include someone that you're doing a one vote split on because, say, has an idol and you don't want to like pile votes on her, I think it becomes tricky business, whether it's Mary, whether it's like

Cedric in the future, gives a lot of power to people. So this is my issue for going forward with, say, in terms of the vote this episode, I think that all made sense. I'm doing it in the moment, I think it made sense. In terms of the vote this episode, I think that all made sense. I'm doing it in the moment, but I think it made sense. In terms of the vote this episode, there were some interesting decisions made. Firstly, as was talking about Steph playing her shot in the dark, the no-brainer, she said she really knew she was on the bottom, let alone the fact that they're not even like fake splitting with her. I mean, they're not with her at all, but like she thinks it's at best a 3-2, you know, 4-2, so might as well be a 3-2, or you're on the bottom, which seems highly, highly, highly likely, in which case players shot in the dark. So that was a no-brainer.

And then not splitting here was interesting with their 4, because they can split on Mary, and maybe that speaks to the social capital that Mary has with someone like a Kevin. I thought that was really, really interesting. And I guess the plan is, okay, if Steph shot in the dark hits, like you know who has the idol, so that's not the, if, if Steph's shot in the dark hits, like, you know, who has the idol, so that's not the issue. But if Steph plays a shot in the dark, which she does, and it hits, which one in six chances, a small, small chance then, not that, you know, say would go home and one of your majority would go home. Cause I don't think it would be the best for say to go home in that situation.

You voted against Steph. Now you're kind of like offside with possibly Steph and Mary, but they're both in the game. But that's not gonna happen. Like if Steph started in the dark hits, say he's playing the idol, at that point, Mary will be forced to go home on the revote. But now you've got the idol out of the game,

which isn't terrible. You can take out Steph next time and even move forward with say possibly and hopefully find the idol yourself. So I think they probably felt fine not splitting, maybe even flushing the idol, um, not pissing off Mary more than the tiny, tiny chance that like Steph plays a shot in the dark and it hits, there are still outs with saves idol rather than having to like split on Mary, split a vote on Mary out of an abundance of caution. So that's interesting. I've never, yeah, I've never thought of that before, like not

splitting Ben's still getting like if you can regain that out in your head, which is impressive if you can do it that you actually still going to get the outcome you want. I wonder. Yeah. Well, I mean, look for say alone, if I'm say, I think I'm splitting one vote on Mary because I don't want to like, again, like if the four of them are against you, it's done anyway, right? But if you're hoping that your four is gonna win out, I don't know if I'm saying, the others are probably happy for her to burn the idol,

right, let's go, that's the issue, it's gonna block you up, like let's go forward without the idol. If I'm saying you need one vote on Mary, because again, it's not gonna be a two, two, two, you know where the idol is, the issue is a shot in the dark. So the issue is that as what happens,

Steph will play her shot in the dark. Mary will have one vote on say it's a four to one on say. You would have what an alpha game, what an alpha game say would be playing if it's like I've got my four, but I don't trust you. I'm chucking one on holding my own trust them. It's more just in case the shot in the dark. It's because now if the shot in the dark hit, she has to play her idol. If she voted for Mary, it's going to a 1 1 on St. Mary. She would assume her allies will vote out Mary. I think

maybe at that point, when she doesn't play the idol, they probably maybe take a shot on on say anyway, which would be very back and forth, but would take say out of the game, especially again, with the kind of social investment that at least Kevin has in Mary. But you would think you just put like the one vote, it's your own vote only, you're the only social capital that's going to be burned, which feels like something they would not care about. So it was just an interesting thought that I'm having in the moment that she alone wouldn't do that to protect an idol. I totally see the other guys being like, let's go for strong and say,

if we cost us your idol, we're just going to have to deal with that in the knowledge of like if they were to lose her idol. There are probably worse things for the guys who are going to be blocked up by it. Does any of this make sense for me to say numbers now? Sometimes I get into this and I'm like, I don't know, but I think it makes sense. I think I agree that I agree that sometimes I get confused, but I'm actually not confused this time. So it makes sense. I love it. Well, that's kind of that tribe for me. The wait is over. The NBA season is here and FanDuel is the place to bet on all the

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Oh yeah, I've got my favorites. I've got my favorites. Let's talk about it. So, Siva, Orange, Camilla. Love Camilla. I really liked her game. I thought she was really good awareness of how the tribal dynamics were going. Charity was still coming to her, but she didn't like the vibes that she was bringing, and she managed to create quite an interesting mix of players together with some, like David is obviously such a random, big,

brawny, talking about eating red meat and fast cars and movies and stuff, but also trying to like nodding. I think Camilla is going to be able to work her magic in that tribe really well. I also like the shout out to the whole Guyanese thing. I think that's really interesting because I think, I think Jem on one of the previous seasons was one as well. So I like that a lot. And then on Lagi.

Oh my God, Lagi, what a tribe. What an interesting mix of people. Thomas, fantastic. Oh, So interesting. Also just, again, I think sometimes in the new era, there's this push to be a larger than life character, maybe someone who you're not, you're sort of like forcing it a little bit,

but Thomas was just purely himself, enjoying himself, having fun, being open to unexpected relationships. So I love the California girls. And then obviously Joe and Eva, what a moment. That was just incredible television, really special. And there's just so much about that. We don't have to go,

I'm sure everyone's already said it, but the way that the world has just evolved to have people like Joe to be able to listen and take it in what Eva's saying for Eva to have the ability to choose Joe. It was just incredible. So that was a really, I've never seen anything like that on Survivor. So that was really fun.

Star seems to be a bit on the out on that tribe. I like on Largie how you've got the California girls and then you've got Thomas still wants to be friends with, Bianca is his number one. and then you have Eva and Joe so there's this there's a bit of a messy network going on there and I'm really intrigued to see how that plays out but we never will because they'll never lose I love seeing firefighters and survivors seriously it's such a good, such good casting. Really good. I love it. Um, and, and I'm not sure how to pronounce his name. Sean Shaheen Shaheen Shaheen. Um, really interesting player as well. I love the thickness in his beard on day one. That's really good. I'm sure the producers love this because it's really annoying when, um, your

hair growth doesn't match the timelines in case they can't in case they cut in the confessional. More of an issue in Australian Survivor which we'll show some weeks later. But he's gone in thick on day one so they're like oh thanks yeah we can use we can use a confessional on day four for a day one confessional so yeah really liking that. Also shout out to how long has it been since we've mentioned Christie from Survivor Amazon when Mitch was talking about when he had his moment on the mat. That was really special. I always loved Chris. Like there's some of the Dina and Christie on Survivor Amazon were just like some of my favorites. And I just love that the show was able to acknowledge that that really deep.

And what an interesting player. So that was really cool as well for Mitch. So yeah, they're my they're my they're my so yeah, Camilla love Camilla. Love Thomas. Yeah, Miller and Thomas are my my faves and Chrissy. I actually think Chrissy is really fun as well. The Chicago act, I love the I love the different American accents when they have a bit of diversity and accents. And I picked up the Chicago accent from Chrissy. So I liked that too.

Yeah. What are the odds that like in two consecutive seasons, a survivor, the Amazon player would be referenced considering Asia said Rob has a podcast on the last one. That's our Rob. And then Christie two seasons in a row and Amazon doesn't usually get it to do. So a couple of things here. Firstly, yeah, Camilla and Kyle with the holes Alliance. Have you seen such red holes? I actually don't know what that movie is, but that's that's that's was like, oh, that's the bad like, um, because also Shia Shia LeBeouf. So if you if you Google go away and Google Shia LeBeouf, and he's bald, and he's got a bit of facial hair, I actually look a little bit like Shia LeBeouf. And so Sass was like, it's your guy, Shia LaBeouf, he's in holes. And I'm like, I have no idea what you're talking about. So then Sass yelled at me, well not yelled at me,

she like explained to me about holes. So yeah. Yeah. I think holes had more impact on my life than any other book in the whole world. Oh, okay. I should really watch holes. Basically, when I was in the fifth grade, this is it. Yes. Basically, when I was in the fifth grade, yes, so actually what happened was in the fifth grade I got moved up to English Extension and the first book we read, I don't remember what it was but I hated it, like I hated it so so so much. I think I was scared of it. I was scared of a lot of things at that time. I don't know, it was like a time travel book and I was like scared of the past. Anyway, um, I hated it and he went back to like the Shakespearean era. I just didn't like it and I was like I'm gonna drop out of the of English Extension, go back to where I'm safe.

And then the second book we read was Holes which I loved so much. It was like my favorite book of all time and then we went and we got to see the movie because the movie came out like right after we'd read it. We got to take our parents and I remember as a 10 year old like now I can recognize how irritating this would have been but I was like whisper explaining to my mom during the movie just like the context from the book that I'm sure the movie was doing a really really good job of explaining itself and that made me love English so much and it made me love that class and then like English became my subject and I went into journalism and now I'm in media like I honestly think without holes that probably doesn't happen like holes. We wouldn't be here today without holes and it's probably not

probably not it was like it was like a wouldn't be here today without holes and it's probably not. Probably not. It was like it was like a life juncture and holes did that. And I think well, you should come to Sydney and we should watch holes. Let's do it. Let's do it. And also, like, clearly, Camilla and Kyle had this reaction, like they maybe were also in grade five extension, because the level of their reaction was a was huge. I thought the Outsiders was my like, I was like, oh, there was like the book in the movie.

So I mean, obviously it's an old book movie, but look, let's do it. Sydney, Sass. I'm surprised I haven't read it. Cause I thought it was on the curriculum. Like you just said that he read it. Stop throwing shade. Were you at school in Australia?

Like I thought we all read holes. Oh, it's so good. I read The Outsiders. Yeah, my book was The Outsiders. I think it was the same thing. It's a very powerful book and movie. It's it's got Shia LaBeouf. He's my guy. It's me. So I'll do it. So I was all in like, I think Shia LaBeouf is it had like his own issues like stuff, but like that's I shouldn't take away from the fact that holds

is a great freaking movie. And I want to be in that alliance like I can only hope for charity's sake that when we see her throwing Carl under the bus to Camilla, like she's there in all the scenes where Carl and Camilla are like, oh my god, did we just become best friends? And I really hope when she throws him under the bus, it was like before Carl's even come back from the journey, probably because she's like, you know, he could have an advantage, he's not here. I really hope it was before that. But between that and then the shot of her napping, I was like, oh, deadly episode for charity. It's over, charity. I'm so sorry.

It's done. And I know she was a lot of people's winner episode for charity it's over charity I'm so sorry it's done and I know she was a lot of people's winner pit but it's over because she napped in one tiny scene so it's done. Well we know from Australian Survivor that napping in the game is never a good thing so. Well from any any edit of anyone unless they have agency and they're like the jokes are like Tyson if you nap it is the kiss of death you't, if you're shown to be napping in an edit, you're done. So charity, not in a good spot. Like both of the tribes have this kind of interesting dynamic where they have. A clear target and like a charity or a star, and then a majority,

like you have this majority in Siba that's Camilla and Carl, and then like David and Chrissy, Mitch is on a bit on like, he's not in that. And then charity and then laggy. We have the guys again, deciding between these these two women but it's never going to happen and then star as the as the the kind of you know next boot so we kind of have a sense of like where those dynamics are but yeah i mean everyone's talking about the joe and eva conversation and i think that like in the new era i don't know how many people are like intentionally using eva's autism against her in saying that she, like, because that's her issue, that's her concern, is like the vulnerability of that. In saying that Joe will give up his game for her, the confessional that he has where he's like,

if I have to go home for her, I will do it. I got you, I got you. I was like, yeah. She found the dad, like the old school dad who said he wanted to bring a group to the end, someone who will literally put her before himself. Yeah. And the crazy thing about it is like, if the issue, if the fear she has in her like in her autism is, oh, I can't pick up on social cues and it would be hard to connect with people. She just picked up on the best cue. She read the best person to give that to and perfectly connected. Like that was perfection. So like that shows that she can overcome even those kind of things she thinks about herself because then she makes a perfect decision on the perfect read of Joe. Yeah, incredible. Yeah, it was, it was Joe seems like he gives off that vibe as well. He may have spoken about his kids as well. Um, you know, that was a feature

in his, you know, as soon as he got the call at the start, he was with his kids. But yeah, incredible. Great. It's so genuine. It's such a genuine connection. And I think that it's going to be so valuable. You look at that strength of the Eva-Jo connection. Jo is never like the, I don't think the California girls is going to work because because of Joe and Eva. It's going to be a it's going to be a a bedrock a cornerstone. They're never going to get them. All right. I was talking about this at the merge like it's fine.

Hey I want to I want to say one thing I was just googling quickly. So Siva so so on Laguille you've got one, two, three people, like it's incredible that they have three people from California, right? And then the Siva tribe, the four that came together, what I like, I just wanted to give props to Camilla for one more thing. So Camilla's from Foster City, which is in San Francisco. David's from, he's the other one from California, Buena Park, which is in Los Angeles. Kyle's from Brooklyn, New York, and Chrissy's from Chicago. I like how they, and then that tribe, Charities from Florida, Mitch is from Texas. I like that when the tribes are a bit more geographically spread out,

so you don't have this like rush to like, oh, we're all from the same state, which is an interesting thing in Laguille, because I think Eva and Joe have made their connection. But in terms of that initial bond, Joe, Thomas and Shaheen being the California girls, I think it's like a, I think like the way that they split these tribes up is a bit strange to have all those California boys on there. And then also they're all so buff. And then you've got Vula who could have used a bit more muscle, you know, what's the, what's, what have I missed here missed here? Like what am I missing? It seems to be unbalanced. Yeah, people have said that. I do think it's interesting geographically because I know that US Survivor used to cast like a lot of

California, like really like stick it to the coast and I think I'd have to do the research, but I'm sure the diversity initiative has it also extended geographically. I'm not super sure. Like I know initiative. Has it also extended geographically? I'm not super sure. Like I know Australian Survivor sometimes would cast, like I remember one time in the first Brains versus Brawn, it was during the 2021 lockdown and I remember there was like a gathering outside which we were allowed. We weren't allowed out of the five kilometer radius, but there was a gathering outside of like half the cast and I'm like literally all of these people are from the same five kilometers or they're breaking the rules but I think they were like they were all from Bondi like literally I think the casting people at that time just walked around Bondi just being like do you want

to play survivor which is crazy because I lived in Bondi well my parents lived in Bondi at the time no one ever came up to me um but yeah I feel like it's interesting because sometimes they'll really kind of like stick it to these like same geographical regions and sometimes it'll be more diverse. But you are right, definitely in the way that the tribes, the tribes are, I mean, we've, we've said before, are they intentionally causing disaster tribes? Is this a storyline that they like? It does make you very, very invested in one tribe. There is a lot to think about with someone like Kevin, who's making a decision that might play out three to four votes down the road with someone like say, but then you compare it to a laggy who, as I'm saying, oh my God, who are they going to choose?

I really don't think they're ever going to get to that juncture. And that's the trade-off that they make. Are they doing it on purpose? You know, they put people on these like shitty beaches, the same disaster drives on the same beach every time they take away, they flint like it compounds. I think probably unintentionally, but like, if it was intentional, there'd certainly be a lot of decisions made to do that. So casting like an uneven try would be

only one of the laundry list of things they're doing that just screws over a vula that really looks like they are in like a world of trouble for the for the pre-emerge. I think Jeff is is got a dark streak to him. I think he's done this on purpose. And I also want to shout out to our good friend of the podcast, Annabelle, from Traders Australia, because she said that just on Jeff having a dark streak, he like Jeff can just set up this vote for season 50 and then just claim that everyone, all of the fans agree with

him and just manipulate the ending anyway. So I think that this- Well, we're going into vote rigging in the U S again. Is that going to be the conversation that we're going to have? But just for Jeff, just with respect to Jeff, no one else yet. So, um, yeah, anyway, so I think that he's done it on purpose. I decided, yeah, I don't think the tribe, I don't think that Jeff know, I understand, like has thought about, I'm sure I could understand it,

but I don't think he's thought about the ways that like these small tribes, like the losses compound to create disaster. I think a lot of that is unintentional, but I do think they like the storyline and I think they aren't probably that fussed if it's uneven. If that's the way the storyline goes, I don't think they're going to go out of their way to to designate the tribes away from it, if that makes sense. You know what I mean? They're like, well fight for your life. Like think that they're okay with letting it happen at the very least. Um, the vote stuff, by the way, we please talk. Did you see this? Did you see this?

Did you see the fire vote? I'm sure it's been talked about at length again. I haven't. It was like the framing of it was like, it was crazy. It was literally this. I'm paraphrasing, but barely. It was like fire is wonderful. It has created so many incredible moments. But some, for some reason, some people don't like it, those stupid idiots. Anyway, let's

vote. Do you want to have fun fire and give the players agency, describe fire as agency, which is crazy as part of that. But like, do you want to give the players agency for fire and be fun? Or do you want to be like a boring ball face who's boring, who gives them just a stupid vote? Anyway, you can be really fun or you you want to be like a boring bore face who's boring who gives him just a stupid vote anyway you can be really fun or you could be really boring you decide it's up to you if you want to be you decide it was it was i thought it was fake when i saw it on twitter at first i truly i did too i did too yeah it's self-parody now it was only until i saw I saw Jake from season 45 who I love, shout out to Jake, and he was like, he was like, due to like, like a edit of it being how he was like the only one voting for

the uh, for the fire option because obviously it was good for him. I mean like yeah, he was acknowledging it but I was like oh wow that's real, that's real, oh my god okay. Also I thought it was interesting that they had the, you know in in voting, like, you know, when you go to vote, they always, you always want to be at the top of the ballot paper because like, if you just do a donkey vote, like if you just vote top to bottom, you want to be number one. Yeah, I was interesting. I thought it was interesting that the, their positive golden fire is great one was the

first one. And then there was like, like the second one was the one was like oh yeah voting for losers i'm surprised that they didn't make it like if you can find it on the page if you can find it you can click on it and then make it like tiny small and then have it like jumping around the page you're like trying to click like if you can get it then you've earned it like the way that they have to earn everything we have to earn our vote to get rid of fire and like i genuinely like look the casting of the New Year is great. I think that they have maximized this format with the casting, even things like

the challenge that Kevin and Carl did, you know, it was, it was some interesting decisions, but again, it's, it's three challenges in an episode. Like it's not so interesting, but then Carl making that decision to help Kevin. Okay. Now, okay. So that's an interesting moment. That's what casting does. That's what Carl does.

Um, so I think that like, again, like the casting of the show is great. I'm always having fun with the New Year out because I think casting is like most of the show. But like, I'm just a little bit concerned that like, I mean, I'm glad I guess that they're giving us at least a semblance of a vote here. But it's the way that they see it. It's the way that they could describe fire as having agency. Like no, like your vote is your agency. It's the opposite. You know, like,

in anything just having to make a fire, like the wind and deciding your fate, a challenge and the wind deciding your fate to me is so much less agent than I have a vote and I can hopefully manipulate other people to vote how I want them to vote. That is viva. So it's the way that it's phrased, it's the way that it's seen. And even like I read an interview with Jeff where he talked about final three and two, and he was like, I don't understand how anyone would like a final two. I'm like, Hey, let's talk about it. And he was like, it's so much harder to beat two people. It's hard. We have to earn things. It's hard. And I'm like, okay, but like, just just to start, if it's the final two, like, as you can attest

to, it's harder to get to the final two. So that already makes at least that part harder. Like let's at least engage in that conversation. If I felt like they understood the other side and still chose their things like fire, like the final three, that would be fine. But I feel like we should be having a conversation on the pros and cons with production. And just when I see language like that, it just, when I see language like give them their, their, their, you give them their agency of making fire, I'm like, that is the opposite of what is true and that concerns me.

Jeff loves to talk about season one. Season one got referenced again by Chrissy. She, in the first, your first episode, Jeff, she said your first episode, season one. Rich stood down on the final immunity challenge to have a final two. Like he was there, Jeff was there, Jeff knows this stuff. He's blissfully, I think he's willingly ignorant of the conversation. He's got what he likes and he's going to use his power in his dark streak. We gave us a vote maybe. Maybe. So what are the other things that you can vote on?

It's going to be more throughout the season. We can't vote, by the way, because they know that I would just I would be there. I'm joking. I think we can use a VPN. Keep that Shannon girl out of here. Yeah. Well, should we let these in nationals? Well, there's one really annoying girl in Australia.

I think we just ban all internationals. We could use a VPN. Maybe. Actually, I voted. I think they've just blocked you, Shannon. That would be great. That would be great and probably well earned as I am here ranting about it. Jeff has asked Mark Burnett to ask you know who to block you.

Literally. Voter suppression. No, I feel like I feel I'm just concerned when he's like I just don't understand it's so much harder in a final three and it's just so easy to be, but it's so hard and complex to get to a final two. Just to get whatever. I can't be bothered. I can obviously. Please, please let me vote, Jeff. No, so the things I can vote on now that I think will, there'll be more things through the season, but this week was the colors of the buffs, which is something I don't really care about. And they gave them options. It wasn't just like you choose colors. So whatever. And then the via, really care about. Surely people are going to vote for that. That's something that they already want. Something that's that production is probably like, okay, we'll put this to a vote.

Yeah, we're already going to do this. Well, I mean, from a budget perspective, it's a lot more expensive, but it was COVID originally that took that away. But I mean, people don't like the fact that, you know, the final tribal council losers are like sitting there sad. I think that's always been a really tough one, having to like, you know, distill the whole experience rather than like, they probably read the writing on the wall to lose and then be there at the reunion. And at least they're like, you know, dollied up,

dollied up is not a word. Yeah. Whatever, dolled up. It's just dolled up, yeah. Yeah, and they've eaten and like, they have their loved ones there at a live reunion. And then it's's like they're all eating pizza. People hate that part of it. I think it just it always felt special when they were at the live reunion. I mean I guess I honestly I don't think I care about that as much as other people do. Like I think I would lean live reunion but

like I'm okay. There are other things I would take out of that I would change about the new era before that. I think what like Survive South Africa kept them all there for the next day and kept all of the and got all the pre-emerges back because it was filmed locally. I think the biggest thing about yeah so I think the next day and then they they were all dolled up and it was the next day and they all like had the chance to decompress. I think the biggest thing that I'm missing is in the library and the pre-merges could be there and I think having the whole cast there actually is very important. So that's like the biggest thing. I agree. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's fair. Hey also that season 50 logo like you decide or whatever, is that real or is that their actual? I think that's just for the vote. I don't think that's okay. All right, because it looks very actually thinking about it as well. Yeah. Well thinking about it as well 50 is going to be

returning season. So to have pre mergers who are probably like legends that we love, not at the reunion will particularly suck. So they have to like if you were to take the pre mergers back to Fiji and do it the next day like South Africa did, I don't really mind. But right after, in the devastation for the losing finalists and without the pre-mojis in a returning season, yeah, we have to go back live. And I think they probably, they don't seem to put their thumb on the scale of that. And then rice or no rice, how do you look at that? Because I feel like former players care about this the most. I don't know if you have a say on that. I mean, like, I will always, I've heard Ricard,

when I listen to Ricard talk about Australian Survivor, he's always commenting about how much food we get and he- It's 47 days! Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey,

hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey I think that for 26 day game, no Rice. I wanna see some struggle because I think that, yeah, I think that I would rather afford, I would rather a longer time, but I think Jeff said that's off the table with Rice. But I think, yeah, I think if you're going to go short a game,

I want to see smart people do dumb things like me. And I did dumb things because I was struggling, because it was a long time out there. And I think that Camilla, for example, is a genius. I think she's super smart. She's got great strategic read. She's really social. I think she's super smart. She's got great strategic read. She's really social. I think after 20 days, she's going to start to lose her marbles a little bit.

So I want to see that because otherwise it's too, I like, I like, I don't like the game bot game. I like a little bit of emotion. That's why I love Eva and Joe. And I think it's going to be really interesting after potentially a long period of time to see how they're like, their bond is just, they won't be able to see anything else. And I think that's going to be interesting. So I say no for 26 day game,

no rice. I think that's an interesting argument because I think what most people would say is like, we want them to be able to play well. So give them rice so that they have, that they have, they have some grain power. They've got sanctuaries, they've still got stuff. I mean, the rewards are shitty. You know what? I want to bring back like good rewards. Um, you know, when they don't give them just like one rotisserie chicken, like I think

when we see that on Australian survive, it's always so fun when they get some really like fun reward. I feel like that's one of my favorite. That's why you love the auction. Like that's one of my favorite parts of, not really. I love the strategy, but like I do really enjoy like, you know, these really fun rewards. I think Liz really wanted, Liz really wanted that, that, you know, that, you know, these really fun rewards. I think Liz really wanted that. Well, only because Applebees was like such a huge reward. In Strand Survivor, every reward is Applebee. Every reward is pretty

good. Unless they trick you. Unless we get tin bloody beans and a bit of spam. Once or twice a season they're going to do like the troll reward. But most of the time it's like a fun thing. And then like, I mean, it's so hard. I definitely lean towards rice because I think that I want them to make the best interesting decisions. However, I do think you make a good point that like the deprivation leading to stupidity. I mean, we've seen a lot of stupidity on the current Australian survivor.

That can be really interesting and funny. And it's the moment, both will create conflict in their own way. Like people have said, like rice is like the ration conversation, which obviously we've even seen an Australian survivor, um, even recently can cause conflict. But then the deprivation leads to like Liz exploding because she doesn't have that. And it's like, it's those like kind of bottleneck moments where you're like, so suppressed that you're like this one thing it has like such kind of like an extreme catharsis or release or whatever, like it's such an extreme price getting Applebee's burger because you're so declated. So I see both ways. I think just like, I just don't feel great about them having nothing.

I don't think I like the sense of deprivation in general. So I think I lean rice, but yeah. I'm allowed to say this because I've gone through it. So I can, you know, like you're, if you're wishing no rice on someone, it's hard play out, they'd be like, screw you, but I've done it. So I'm like, ah.

You played 46 days. No rice. Yeah. You've earned it. Yeah. You honestly have convinced me more to it than I thought I would be. I definitely see that other side. I think I still vote Rice. Um, but I think that there are interesting moments that you know what, you know, creates those interesting moments either way, as we say, the casting,

you know, like as long as you nail the cast, they will make interesting moments out of either of those things. So I mean, that's interesting though. I think your point is, is a good one. Um, I'm so torn on the cheesy. Let's do it. Yeah, let's do it. Let's go. I feel terrible about my cheesy points. Take it away, Jacob Seguwasein and MC Kala. One, two, three. One, two, three.

Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it.

Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. Let's get it. I don't know if I can give the cheesy points I thought I was going to give. They're so, so, so counterintuitive and like, well, they're just completely opposite to everything you've said in the podcast.

Well, I'm going to follow you. You go first. I can't, I don't know. I don't know. Okay. Can I give you what I was thinking? And then we workshop my points. Go for it.

Okay. I was going to give three to Kevin. Okay. I don't agree with his decision, obviously, but he's so beloved. He's so well positioned. I think he's given himself like more of an uphill battle, but I also think he'll come out of it okay because of the capital that he has. I think he's built enough to kind of work out the challenge. He set himself, but maybe I should discredit him for setting himself that challenge, especially as I am like continuously more down on the decision. I definitely want to give him some points for the social game. Should it be three?

TBD. This is just my initial thoughts. I think you're like basically saying Kevin is sparkly therefore and that's good so therefore he gets jizzy points. That's what you're saying. But should it be three now? Well I said two to say for achieving her objectives her spot will only get better and more powerful. She has a four. She has the idol. She won the vote. Can she win long term? No. But for the episodic,

she's the point she even began three points because I feel like she comes out of it. She's bested her spot the most from the potential that she had. Where does that feel like, you know, if Kevin makes the opposite decision, which I was more on tweener and then kind of started leaning against. And now, like the more we talk about it, I like less. So like he was, he was always, he started with these great skills that we should credit, but then like, has he like lessen that position by his decision, considering

the incredibly high bar he starts at. Um, I don't know. Who's your third? Who's your third? I was going to give one to Eva. Um, she's not technically in the three with the guys, but like the guys seem to like her. I think that's what they say. They all do like her. She's a workhorse. But it's more that I saw confessional with someone who was like,

I will put her above my own game. Like that is so powerful. And again, I don't think that this tribes dynamics will play out in the short term. And I think that long term, like, oh my God, like, look what she's earned. And then, but then in the honorable mentions, I feel like Camilla's running things. Kyle, like had that move with Kevin and is there with Camilla. Justin, to be fair, is a swing vote with Kevin. And maybe Justin's move is even better than Kevin's because it seems like Justin has more

of the relationship with Say. And Kevin had more with Steph. So just because Kevin's getting more of an edit, Justin still put himself in a swing position. Everyone's wanting to work with him. And maybe it was even better for him socially where he actively said he feels really good about saying, so should Justin get points?

Um, and then on will mention obviously Joe's in the majority of the bond with Eva. I just thought Eva gained more from it. Um, Thomas and Shaheen, uh, you know, good in that California girls alliances, we said with Joe as well. So I, I'm, I'm more torn than ever. Look, I think you've made a good case for Justin just there actually, even though I was giving him some stick before. You know what?

I'm going to, do you want to go first with me? What are we doing? I'm so torn. Look, let me go bold. Let me be bold. I'm going to head and heart, quote, you know, the great D head and heart. Um, I'm going to not award three to someone from the Vula tribe. And part of my rationale will be because, and I know that we're very focused on strategy and stuff here, but the other

two tribes still won challenges. And so I think that like, that is going to be my excuse to not give it to the tribe because I Because I can't give any of them three. Because I really think that Kevin and Justin should have voted out. So I'm going to give two to say, I'm going to give three to Camilla. And I'm going to give one to Justin. Because I think that you're going to go Kevin because of these sparkles. I don't know. I think Justin now. going to go Kevin because of these sparkles. I don't know. I think Justin now I've convinced myself on Justin.

Justin's in a sling spot with Kevin. Justin, Justin gained socially as much as Kevin did and then but then also I think made a better decision than Kevin. But I'm still kind of down on it generally. I think Kevin and I think Karen, but Mary, whereas I think Justin is going to be more of the glue guy in the Vula tribe. So yeah. That's a really good point.

Kevin burns Mary, Kevin takes away Steph, who's more of an ally. Justin was more on the side with Say. Justin getting three points, because he came in as an honorable mention for me. But like, he's, because we don't hear people like, like literally, it's when Kevin walks into the beach, they're like, Kevin! Like Justin doesn't have that, but he still achieves as much socially, like pretty much as much as we've seen. Like he's still in the floor.

He still is the swing. So everyone wanted to work with him. He's still, he still achieved as much, even if like he didn't have those moments. He's still like, everyone's coming into his restaurant. Everyone's coming to his restaurant. They want to get his pizza. They're like, yep, you get a slice, you get a slice, you get a slice. Like he's just, people come in, people go out. Whereas Kevin's like a bright shining light and he's like moth, everyone's like moth

to a flame to Kevin. But then he's, you know, he's zapping them out. So then do I, do I not have space for Eva? Do I give three to Justin? This is completely different clearly to what I wrote down, but is it three to Justin, two to say and one to Kevin? Then if I'm so down, Kevin's definitely getting some. Is it three to Justin, two to Kevin, one to say? Is it, oh my God, I'm breaking. Like I don't know what to do. I think it might be three to Justin who came in as an honorable mention, but we've just

convinced ourselves, I think, might be three to Justin who came in as an honorable mention, but we've just convinced ourselves, I think, on Justin. So maybe Justin, Kevin, Sey. That works. So if you go Justin, Kevin, Sey, and I go Camilla, Sey, um, uh, who did I say? I said Camilla, Sey, and then Justin. Yeah, that's good. I like that. Wait, you're going to give more points to Sey than me, but I came in higher on say than you did. Yeah, I know. But I think that I don't because I'm awarding her points based on one episode, but I think that, you know, it's short. Well, that's what the cheesy is. Should I do Justin say Kevin or Justin Kevin say this is the last this is it and then we'd know.

Well, who am I to tell you, but I think you should go Justin Kevin say okay okay and Eva unfortunately got bumped through no fault of her own. Shoutout to that fact checker who does your list. Yeah so I have a fact checker and Randy Neupel who'd both do the chart so just to clarify I went Justin Kevin say and you went Camilla say Justin somehow. But on remission to half the cast, like who all made the majorities. And like- Thomas, Thomas, that mustache, incredible.

What a choice. Oh, do you know that Thomas discovered Olivia Rodrigo, which I didn't even know before I drafted him and made him my winner pick. What discovered her as an artist? He, yeah, he works in music publishing and I think he discovered Olivia Rodrigo. Wow, that's huge.

I know. Imagine the world without... Wow. Yeah. That's intriguing. I want to know more about Thomas. Oh my goodness. Thomas, next time Olivia Rodrigo comes to Australia, can you help me get tickets? Because I missed out last time.

It was so hard to get. He did that. Wow, Incredible. So who do you who would who do you want to see more of in the you know let's assume that like take take away the reality that Vula is going to be going to every single tribal council who do you want to see more of? I mean so many people. I really like the Carl Camilli duo the Holes Alliance taste. I really like the Carl Camilli duo, the Holes Alliance taste. Holes. So good.

Please watch it. Please. Please come to Sydney. We watch it together. Who else? I mean, we've always seen, we're going to see a lot of Vula. I can promise you that. So many people.

Thomas was my winner pick. Oh, that's a good pick. Yeah, a lot of Thomas. You could still win. You can still win. No, I can't because then I'd also need Justin to be in the final three. That's adorable. It's not over yet. Unlikely. Keep that alive, Shannon Who's a winner pick? One episode in which doesn't really count.

Yeah so I had no background on the cast at all. It's somewhere if my top three are Shaheen, Thomas and Camilla in no particular order and something about Camilla that I'm really attracted to. So I'm just going to go Camilla. Yeah, she's my well, we know as well. The last season of the cheesy was a tie. So these these conversations now can play out to the point where it's affecting it. It's that slim, but it's hard because I'm giving out four rounds of cheesy points a week.

So my brain is scrambled, Mark. And I'm just just keeping my head above water. I don't know even what I'm saying anymore. It's turbulent waters, but you're going to be okay. It's going to be fine, Shannon. Well, thank you. Thank you for coming on to the podcast. This was so fun to break down the episode. That's such a good time. Oh, that was all my pleasure. Thank you, Shannon. Yeah, this has been good. And let's see where we go. I really saw that mug, the joint Chizzi presentation mug ceremony online. That was super cute.

What a great season. I know. That was fun. It was great that they organically won Chizzi together. And that was great. It was the right thing to do. I'm really happy with that decision. I feel better about that than I do with my current cheesy points.

I think I'm going to just ruminate on them for the next week, but we'll see how it goes. Let it go. This will be okay. That's not me. That's not me, Mark. I don't let things go. You know me. This was so fun. Thank you so much. Thank you to our team behind the scenes. Thank you to all the listeners. And I, oh, no, I should be plugging things. Sorry. Firstly, you plug, listen to me. You plug, where can people find you, Mark? And what you're doing is the first part of that. Listen, you plug into me. You plug in. Where can people find you, Mark? What you're doing is the first part of that. Listen to me. I'm I need to get there. It's okay.

I had my button over the end recording. Oh, Mark, I think that now look, Instagram, Mark T. Warnock. And one thing that if you've gotten this far, keep an eye out on the confessional. There might be a little article from you know who on there soon talking about what in Australian culture is different. So how do I say this again? Australian survivor, US survivor, we're different. What do you need to know about Australian culture, which makes Australian survivor different? And then how do our best players use our culture to weaponize it to be great players? That's very wordy, but it's a lot clearer in the article. You'll see it soon.

I got a sneak peek, so I'm very excited to see that come out. Everyone check that out. For me, I have much things to plug, but I forgot to do the plugs. Here they are. Australian Survivor, every week, if you aren't watching Australian Survivor, it's a very fun season. Get on board. We're two weeks in, which is like, you know, a lot to be in six episodes in. Um, I'm really having a good time with it. Three episodic recaps a week with Chappelle, Kuya, and then Mike. Um, and then a feedback show. We have one with Nikai Odanza that's currently out.

Next week will be with your former castmate on the, um, the torture wheels, Ferris. Um, and then we have one accident of you a week. And then for Global Survivor covering 48 every week. on the um the torture wheels, done so one and off man he's good I love Nick yeah you two listening to you two is so good it's fantastic thank you well this was this was such a good part of the lineup I feel like it's been a great lineup and you've been such a good part of that I think I can wrap the podcast out now follow me on channel get the button let's go you know global survivor.com okay I think I've done it thank you all as I said I will see you next time bye Go! Survival The adventure of a lifetime. and has your back all season long. From puck drop to the final shot, you're always taken care of with the sportsbook Born in Vegas. That's a feeling you can only get with Bet MGM.

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