Rich Habits Podcast - 38: Tax & Retirement Strategies To Do Before 2024 w/ Ankur Nagpal

Episode Date: November 14, 2023

In this episode of the Rich Habits Podcast, Robert Croak and Austin Hankwitz are joined by Ankur Nagpal of CarryMoney.com. Ankur sold his previous company, Teachable, for $250M. After receiving such a large lump sum of cash, became fascinated by tax optimization and retirement investing strategies. Today, he's the CEO and co-founder of CarryMoney.com, a platform that makes retirement investing for small business owners easy. ---Be sure to check out Public's new ⁠⁠High Yield Cash Account paying 5.1% APY.⁠⁠ This is higher than anything else on the market and is FDIC insured up to $5M. ---Earn 5.1% APY using a Public HYCA, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠click here!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Opt-in and share your email, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠click here!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more about our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠4-module video course!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Download our FREE Budget Template, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠click here!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠To learn more about Robert: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://stan.store/RobertJCroak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠To learn more about Austin: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://stan.store/austinhankwitz⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Contact: [e-mail] ---Hankwitz Group LLC has an existing business relationship with NEOS Investment Management LLC. The opinions expressed are those of the author, and the author owns several NEOS ETFs.

There's more to life than finding the perfect car. But finding the perfect car can help you get the most out of life. Like the SUV that handles everything from drop off to off road, and the car that hulls groceries and hockey teams, or the van that's gone from just practical to practically family. Whatever you want, wherever you're going, start your search at autotrater.ca, Canada's car marketplace. Amazon presents Laura versus Fruitflies

Swarming your fruit and terrorizing your kitchen These little freaks multiply at a rate that would make a rabbit say yo Chill But Laura shopped on Amazon and saved on cleaning spray, countertop wipes, and fly traps Hey fruit flies, your baby boom ends here Save the Everyday with Amazon Hey everyone and welcome back to the Rich Habits podcast, a top three business podcast on Spotify. My name is Austin Hankwitz and as always I'm joined by my co-host Robert Croke.

Robert is a seasoned entrepreneur in his 50s with more than 200 million in company exits under his belt and I'm an entrepreneur in my late 20s with a background in finance and economics. Since quitting my full-time job in corporate finance a few years ago, I've built a seven-figure media business and actively advise some of the most well-known fintech companies around the world. Now, as the show name might suggest, every episode, we talk about rich habits as they relate to business, finance, and mindset. However, we try and bring you two unique perspectives, one from an industry veteran, which is Robert and the other myself, someone who's still in the process of building wealth and figuring it all out. So, Robert, what are we going to be

talking about in today's episode? In today's episode of the Rich Habits podcast will be talking about retirement and tax strategies every business owner and side hustler. Listening right now needs to implement before the end of the year. To help us with the technical aspect, we've invited Anker Nagpal, CEO of carrymoney.com to break things down. Anker was one of the co-founders of Teachable.com, a course selling website I'm sure many of you listening right now have heard of. He sold that company for more than $250 million. Now he's building a new company entirely dedicated to helping side hustlers and business owners like us save on taxes while maximizing their retirement savings.

Anker, why don't you introduce yourself to all of our listeners? You introduced me very well, but yes, my name is Ankur-Kin-Kal. I was a founder of a company called Teachable, was fortunate enough to sell that business. And in the process, I learned so much about how the tax code works in America. And specifically how much of the tax code is geared for business owners to help business owners save money on taxes. So the last two years have become an expert on this topic and I'm excited to dive in. This is going to be really fun, man. Like, I don't think that you understand, but literally 60%, I'd say, of the people listening right now have a side hustle. They have a small business, right? We always talk about

what is that sort of unique perspective or skill set that you're sitting on and how can you monetize against that, right? Robert and I talk about side hustles that I had at a college like selling websites or, you know, side hustles that Robert has all the time. It's just, we talk about this stuff. And unfortunately, a lot of those people also aren't experts on the tax code. You know, they know about write-offs, they know about this and that, but there's a ton more. It's like a Pandora's box, right? Once you open it up, it just keeps on coming out. So we're going to dive deep. We're going to go into the rabbit hole. We're going to be like Alice in Wonderland. We're going to take the red pill like on the Matrix and we're going to figure this all out in today's episode. So kicking it off here

with the first point I want us to dive deep into, and that's the solo 401K. Now, I use a solo 401k. I've actually invested $66,000 this year toward my solo 401k on carrymoney.com. But Anker, can you break down for our audience, one, exactly what the solo 401k is, and two, how small business owners or that Uber driver or side hustle are listening right now can leverage this for tax savings and retirement investing? Yeah, so a solo 401k, the way. way to think about it is it's the most powerful retirement account in America. And it's only

available to anyone who's either a business owner or has a side hustle. But most people are familiar with their 401k's from work. But the downside with that is you can't customize it to do the things you want. A solo 401k is a 401k plan just for you. So you can basically build the coolest retirement plan ever. So I'll quickly hash out the benefits. One, it has super high contribution limits up to $66,000 this year, $69,000 next year, and the entire thing is one big tax deduction. Awesome. Two, because it's your own 401k plan, you can invest it in any asset you want. Most corporate 401K plans are very limited in what you can do with it.

Your own 401k, you can invest in individual stocks, funds, startups, crypto, whatever. It's your plan. Third thing is, it compounds tax-free. So anything inside it keeps growing without having to pay taxes. The fourth thing is it supports Roth contributions. For those who know what that is, you put in post-tax money, but then never pay again. I won't spend too long talking about the mega backdoor rot, but it's a crazy tax move where you can actually make the entire $66,000 contribution as Roth. And it even has more flexibility than other plans.

Like let's say you want to borrow money from your own 401k. You can borrow up to $50,000 or 50% of your account, whichever is higher, from your own plan and you pay yourself back. It's super flexible and it's a sort of thing that most business owners are blown away when they hear about this. Most people don't know it exists and that's what I was. Two years ago, I didn't know this existed. And I then looked for a platform to do this and couldn't find it so we built it. But really, it's the most powerful retirement account in America. So what I'm hearing is, is let's say there's a small business owner out there right now who's doing, call it 100, $150,000 a year in annual profits.

And maybe they're doing it by selling custom candles or T-shirts or coffee cups. or whatever. And they're now able to take $66,000 in the solo 401k and invest it and then write off that $66,000 against their personal income. That's crazy. The exact numbers are they're allowed to contribute 22,500 as an employee and about 25% of their net profit as an employer. So in this example, yeah, it's probably closer to $40,000, not the full $66, but yes. Okay. So question that I have, on this. Let's say I have that candle shop. I'm crushing it on Etsy or TikTok or whatever and I'm implementing this strategy. What happens if I need to bring on help? If they're a 1099 employee or a 1099 contractor, can I still use this strategy as long as they're not on the actual company

payroll and their independent contractors? Yep, that's a very good point. You're not allowed to have a full-time W-2 employee with this plan, excluding your spouse. If you have your spouse, you can actually both double up the contributions and get to 130,000, so very powerful, but you cannot have full-time employees. So in this case, let's say someone wanted to bring on a contractor, cool, let's say you wanted to bring on a W-2 employee. We've built a platform with one click. You just roll the dollars into an IRA, shut down the plan, and you're good, right? You've still done that. So for a lot of people, even if you're able to do this two years, three years, especially if we do the mega backdoor, you can get hundreds of thousand dollars into your plan. So when you hire someone, you can immediately

move that into an IRA and you've still really leveraged the strategy for a few good years. Oh my gosh. This really illustrates on a high level. It's not what you make. It's what you keep. This is something that we preach a lot, Ankur. So this is amazing. And I hope everyone listening has this on rinse and repeat and taking a lot of notes because

this is some high level stuff that can benefit everyone along your wealth building journey. All right. That was fantastic. So let's move on to number two, credit card points. Now, this is something I've actually never. heard of. On your website, it says small business owners and side hustlers that have business credit cards can spend on those credit cards actual business expenses, earn the reward points, but now use those points for personal benefits. So let's talk about that for a minute. I heard there's a little

gray area in there, but then let's also expand on some of the other great credit card point hacks that you have. I love this strategy because as a business owner, you tend to have certain expenses, especially like let's say you're in the construction industry and you have to buy materials or if you're an online marketer enough to buy ads and we have a lot of business expenses and as long as you are responsible and don't get into debt credit cards are just awesome they're basically such powerful benefits and I've used this to travel for free for the last few years of my life so the way this works is put your business expenses on a card set it to pay every month right now credit card points are in a little bit of an IRS gray area where they've indicated at some point they want to

tax it. Right now, they have no idea how to tax it. So as a result, you know, there's this great untax benefit that you can use. And as a business owner, you can use this for yourself and your family. What I use it for a lot and for anyone who loves to travel, I think travel is such a great way to spend these points. The one very important thing most people get wrong is what they do is they'll set up a credit card, earn a lot of points. Then they'll go to the credit card. rewards portal, book of flight, redeem it. That is very, very inefficient. Do not do that. What you want to do instead is create an account with the travel provider. So in my case, I'll give you a specific example. I wanted to fly to Dubai, to see my family. By transferring my American Express

points to Emirates, I was able to get a flight, a first class flight for about 120,000 points. While if I redeemed it from the Amex portal, it would be almost half a million points. So that's simple strategy, I think will save people so much. That additional step, while it adds a little bit of complexity, will basically allow you to fly for free in business or first class almost anywhere in the world. Okay, hold on here. So I have 140,000 chase points because I did do like the, got like the business ink card. It was like a $3,000, you know, intro spend and you get 80,000 points, whatever. I've used a couple points here on some other stuff, but I still have a good chunk here. So what should I do now? So I've got these chase points. Do I transfer it?

How do I do this? Let's imagine you and your girlfriend are flying to Paris. Let's make this real, right? So let's imagine my goal is to get you and your girlfriend to Paris in business class for 140,000 points. What you may be tempted to do is go on the Chase portal and try and look for flights to Paris and be like, oh, you know, maybe I'll get one flight, but it's kind of expensive. What I would do is there's a website called Flying Blue. It's the loyalty program for Air France, KLM, a few others.

I would create a Flying Blue account. I would then search for flights to Paris, business class, two tickets, across a bunch of different dates. And what I will then notice is I can probably get a ticket round trip for 60,000 points. And by transferring your chase points to Flying Blue, which you can do one for one, you and your girlfriend can probably get to Paris for 140,000 points round trip. It's that little additional step of creating that account and transferring those points where all the difference comes in. That is incredible. And what's awesome, too, is these points were generated to your point earlier, Robert, from actual business expenses of things that I had to spend money on to operate my business, right?

So it's like, I had to spend this money anyway, and now the money translates into free flights for my girlfriend and I to Paris. That's so cool. The other tip is look at what types of expenses you have and some cards pay a bonus on that type of expense. As a very specific example, I can't remember the name of the card, but we spend a lot on Amazon Web Services hosting and they have a higher point multiple on that. So that's worth looking at if you have one type of expense that's much more than the other. So I have a question, are there any hacks when you have a lot of like Delta Sky Miles points? Or are those just basically they are what they are and there's not much of a hack you can do with those? Delta is amongst the trashiest points to have.

Like, not, I mean, look, I'm a Delta diamond. I love the airline, but the points are just not super valuable. Because when you're redeeming a Delta flight, the points are proportionally as expensive as the cash ticket. But a lot of international carriers like Emirates, for instance, the same flight is a fixed number of points no matter when it is. So it's very, very good value if you're able to get those flights during a busy time. So it also, yeah, depends on which carrier, but Delta unfortunately is not the best for points. Love it. Yes. It sounds like I need to do a better job of optimizing my credit card points,

transferring them to that carrier or to that platform that I want to use them. Make that extra step so I can get the actual benefits to the max value. This may sound like work, but honestly, it takes such little time. And it's kind of fun in a weird way, right? Like, it's like, oh, how do I get to Tokyo for free? And it probably will take 10 or 15 minutes of research and then you feel like you figured it out. And yeah, it's awesome. I still, as much as, you know, I had a successful exit, I still can't get myself to, you know,

spend $8,000 on a plane ticket. And I can't do it. So points come to the benefit. That's why you're our kind of people because you see so many of the fake entrepreneurs out there that, you know, show you their pictures and their content in front of the Renniget and the Lambo or whatever. And, you know, I always tell people that I don't think it's a lack mindset at all. Money can be fleeting. And when you get a large sum of money, so many people don't realize.

And I was victim to it early on with silly bands that when you've never seen tens of millions of dollars in your bank account, it's very easy to lose track of what got you there. And I think one of the most important things is remembering that you don't need to spend $8,000 for that three-hour flight when you could just fly first class for $1,100. And who cares? You can work on the flight. It might take you an extra hour or 90 minutes,

but you're not losing any value in time. And so I agree with you 100%. We could go on for hours about all the stories I've seen people yelled at me for not flying private, but now they're broken back working a job. So it's hilarious. Okay. Sounds like I need to figure out how to go to Paris with my girlfriend for my

chase credit card points so good call on that one now this part is actually something i'm also doing personally point number three here which is splitting your income with an escort anchor i want you to get into the nitty gritty though right let's say someone out there is a side hustler or a solopreneur they're making some decent cash right they're selling those candles the coffee mugs the hoodies how can they leverage an s corp to save on payroll taxes so the way to think about it is when you first start a business you typically may not incorporate you may just have it passed from your tax return. If you first set up a business, most people set up what is called an LLC, which is the same for taxes, but it provides a little bit of legal protection. When your business starts doing better,

you can think of incorporating or filing taxes in a different way, and each of them have their sort of own tax benefit. So I'll talk about S-Corps specifically. Every time I can talk about C-Corps and why it may make sense. But what an S-corp does is once you're making about $100,000 in net profit, some people will say a little bit less, but I think $100,000 is a good number. What you can do is is either set up an S-Corp or elect to file taxes as an S-Corp. And what that does is it bifurcates your income into the income you would make as an employee and the income you would make as an owner. So on 100,000, you may say, look, as an employee, my job is worth the 50,000 salary

because that's what I would hire someone else to do. And the rest is me as an owner. And then what happens is you only end up paying self-employment taxes, which are Social Security and Medicare taxes on the amount as an employee. So in this very specific example, if $50,000 is bad, business profits and does not have self-employment taxes, you would save almost $5,000, a little bit less, but right there, just by making this one election to being filed as an S-Corp. So very, very powerful. Super powerful, right? So from my perspective here, I've done this. I pay myself

$70 or $80,000 a year with a salary. And, you know, with that, that money that I'm paying myself is taxed both from the employer and the employee side. So let's say, to your point, Anker, there is an Etsy shop owner who's profiting after everything said and done that $200,000, I'm definitely closer to $300,000 or $400,000. And so after paying myself that $70,000, I'm getting double taxed both myself and the company. But that other call it $250,000 difference in profits, I'm electing to take that as an owner distribution, which is only taxed once and not that additional payroll tax, right? So I'm saving, call it $40,000 a year by doing that. But this, I think, is a major that a lot of people might think is too complicated to actually do, but with gusto, with all the

resources online, it makes it super simple. That's why I like the $100,000 number, for instance, because you could probably save a little at 70k, 80K, but at 100,000, you're saving thousands of dollars to make the little bit of additional admin work worth it. But look, if you're willing to do the work and you're willing to internalize a little bit of paid, look into it at 70, 80K, at 100, it's a no-brainer and it's kind of stupid not to at that point. I want to touch on this, moment and this is amazing for me because this is I have goosebumps literally right now having this conversation because I fight tooth and nail every day with all of these influencers that don't know what they're talking about. If you watch on Instagram and TikTok right now, there are a million

people out there saying, go start that S corp, do this, do that. And they don't realize that the additional admin costs outweigh the advantages of having an S corp until you hit that 70K, 100, K-profits. And Anker, you're the first person it has ever echoed that because I've had so many conversations with my lawyers and my tax attorneys saying, am I wrong here or what? And they're like, no, you're absolutely right. And I want to add one more layer to that for everyone listening. Always remember this. You can start an LLC and migrate it to being an S-Corp and an S-Election, but you can't start an S-Corp and migrate it to an LLC. So make sure when you're starting that company, it's okay to start out as an LLC and migrate to the S-Corp election or S-Corp

filing because of the fact that it's less expensive to operate the LLC in the beginning until you're making that 70 to 100K of profits. Huge, huge point here that I want to make sure everyone is writing down and listening because this is something that has been on my mind for years and I talk about it all the time. Yep, absolutely. While we're at caveats, another caveat that I haven't heard a single influencer say is, if you live in New York City, chances are an S-Corp election may make less sense because New York City hits you with an almost 9% unincorporated business tax. I've had friends of mine, you know, see the escort marketing fall into this. A lot of times if you're in New York City, audit your numbers very well

and find someone who knows what they're doing because an S-Corp may not make sense since you get an additional tax. Joy's of Living here. Interesting. I didn't know that. Yeah, New York is very tough and there's a lot going on in the crypto space as well. That could be a whole different episode of what they're doing to the crypto space there, which I think is crazy. While we're on the topic of incorporation, something I also want to quickly point out is if you are graduating to the next level of business, a C-Corp could make sense for what I think is the largest tax benefit by size, which is something called QSBS, where if you sell your C-Corp after five years, you can pay zero taxes on $10 million. That's like the granddaddy of all the sort of tax savings, but less

applicable with a side hustle, more applicable if you're building a larger business with the idea of selling it. Very cool. I mean, I think that's what you did, right? Correct. Correct. QSBS was something that I learned about four or five years after starting my company, but it was, I couldn't believe it. I was like, this is a gift from the government. We don't get those gifts very often. All right, so we know the solo 401k is a great way for side hustlers and small business owners to write off their own retirement investing. The mega backdoor Roth Solo 401k is a way for folks to invest up to 66,000 toward that retirement over 10 times as much as the Roth, right? So that's what I've done myself. Robert is all about it too. We talked about the credit card points. We talked about the portals, ways not to use the credit card

points, ways that I need to now use so I can go to Paris. And finally, we talked about splitting income with the S-Corps, something I'm also doing. Roberts doing it. Really excited about this one. This is something that folks who are profiting $100,000 or so per year should definitely consider in their wealth-building journey. All right, everyone. Time to jump in to everyone's favorite segment of the podcast question and answer. We're going to have Onker hang out with us this time as well to answer some of these. So it's going to be a good one. So our first question comes from Holly M. Holly says Robert talks about creating and inventing products all the time. And this is something I'm ready to start doing myself. I've got some ideas for a new product,

but I have no idea how to go from idea to final product. So do you have any perspective here, Robert? And then also, Robert, I'm going to let you answer this one with your background and your expertise, but then Ankur, I want you to talk about the R&D tax credit for Holly as well. Yes, Holly, great question, and I get asked this thousands of times a year. And I would say we could spend hours on this question, but I'm going to try and condense this down and make it make sense. Number one, protection. Get your idea figured out, get it flushed out, do your research, make some pencil drawings. I don't care if they're on a napkin, you've heard that phrase before. And make sure that before you start sharing the product with the public or manufacturers or

designers or CAD people, anyone else, that you have a design and manufacturers agreement, two different documents, with the people that you're going to work with to flush this out and get you through the drawing phase. So then once you get to that point and you can start speaking to factories, finding a manufacturer, you want to make sure that you have that second contract, that manufacturer's agreement flushed out. Because what you don't want to do is just randomly go on to Alibaba, start sharing your idea with a bunch of factories because if it's good enough, they're going to run with it without you and you're going to see your product somewhere on the market in six months. You have no idea how it got there. So those are the first two things.

Number three, before you go spend a bunch of money on patents and this and utility patents and design patents, make sure you really flush out what is the market's reception to this product. Is it big enough? Does it solve a big enough problem? Is it trendy enough? Because what I would recommend sometimes when you're developing a new product, do the design patent. first because it's quick and inexpensive, then get the product to market. You have some protection and then go after the utility patent if you deem necessary. Because remember this and I just went through this right before COVID. I developed a product that was a silicone bracelet that held a half ounce of sanitizer in the bracelet. I launched it with a design patent and within four months

we were absolutely killing at schools, churches, governments were buying it. And at one point four or five months in, there were 20-some knockoffs already on the market, driving the price way down and making it really unprofitable to do this product. So you want to get to market, prove it out, because that patent might take you two years for the utility patent to get. And by the time I got the patent on the bracelet, nobody cared about sanitizer anymore. And COVID was something no one was talking about. So I think those are the key points. Protection, research, and understanding the dynamic of the market. And to know how big this could actually go and then spend the money as you go along because what you don't want to do is spend two years building, prepping, and getting it ready and being

bulletproof and then find out nobody really wants the product. So I would say those are my key takeaways. Amazing. You can see an expert in action right there. The one thing I'll add real quick while we're on taxes is look into the R&D tax credit. It's another thing the government gives you when you're working on innovation and innovative products. You can get a tax credit sometimes for 6 to 8% of payroll for people working in innovation. But what's especially powerful is in the first couple of years, your business may be losing money. But even then, it will save you because you can apply this not just to income taxes, but also payroll taxes. So all my tech startups always take this credit. I love it. And I don't have any perspective because I never built a product

before, which is why I've got these two awesome people to give me a little bit of backup. So our next question comes from Peter B. Peter says, I'm a high income earner consistently making over $300,000 per year, and I'm trying to find different ways to offset my W-2 taxable income. I've heard of short-term rentals, bonus depreciation, oil and gas investments, as well as conservation easements. Do you all have any perspective on this? So I'll share my favorite type of investment for W-2 earners, and there's not a lot, right? Because a tax code gives business owners more than W-2 earners.

But right now, commercial solar investments may have the highest ROI in terms of tax savings driven by Biden's Inflation Reduction Act, where when you invest in a commercial, solar project, you can get up to a 40% tax credit right there, which is a dollar for dollar deduction against taxes. It doesn't reduce your taxable income. You have depreciation that you can take over five years, as well as an income stream from projects. You typically have to qualify as a solar professional, but it is substantially easier to qualify as a solar professional than a real estate professional. It's like 100 hours versus 750 hours. That's my quick take. I know Robert has thoughts as well. Yes, this is a great topic. And I'm blown away by how much I've learned in the last few

months in looking to invest and build solar farms. And the recent numbers of a project that didn't work out, I couldn't even believe how good they were. And basically, in a nutshell, this project with land, architectural drawings, soup to nuts, everything to build it was going to be $4 million for a nine acre solar farm. And here's the kicker and what Onker's talking about. Over two years, they say 18 months, but let's give it two years. Of that $4 million in credits and savings and governmental kickbacks, you would get back like $3.4 million of your original $4 million investment. So then if you think about it, you have a very, very short window where you'd be breaking even or losing a little bit of money on the investment. But then you get almost all of the investment

back over that two-year period, making the returns just incredible from that point on. And the key to solar investments are very passive. You have to mow the lawn and clean the solar panels once a year, but also is the fact that it is locked in guaranteed rates of what you're selling that energy for. So that's what I love about it. I'm flushing it out. I'm working on a project right now in New Jersey. And for all of you following along, I will keep you posted on the step by steps as this thing gets signed up and starting to be built. So with that being said, Anker, I'm sure you may be on carrymoney.com, you have some additional resources for people who want to learn about Solar. We'll link that in the show notes below. So, Peter, if you're looking to offset some W-2 income, maybe Seller's the answer. Our last question comes from Rachel C. Rachel says, my boyfriend and I,

love your show. Shout out to Rachel and your boyfriend. Thanks so much for listening. We want to start gifting investments to our loved ones so they can begin their own wealth-building journeys. How should we go about this? What do we gift? Is it T-bills? Is it ETFs? What do we do there? And what are the tax implications? I'll go first. So the gift tax lets you give about $17,000. per year to anyone without worrying about taxes. So I would recommend starting there. I also think of all assets to give individual stocks in high quality companies might be cool if learning is a part of it. Otherwise, a single market ETF is great. T-bills and other assets don't quite compound. And historically, the stock market returns about 8% per year on average. So that's what I would recommend.

Based on how fancy you want to get, I can talk about trust and estate planning. And, you know, if you want to give, you know, millions of dollars or bypass estate taxes. But I think that's a little bit out of scope for the questions. That's my quick version. Over to you, Robert. Yeah, I'm going to take a different approach to this one and be on the other side of the fence from Anker. I want to make sure everyone listening and Rachel see you and your boyfriend as well, understand, and make sure to take care of yourself first. Make sure that all of your ducks are in a row, you have all of your retirement accounts, you're diversified, and you have everything we talk about to create these rich habits and have a really sound financial basis before you start helping other people financially.

and where I would say it means the most, and anchor touched on this, is education. I think at this part, and again, I don't know your net worth at this point or where you're at your financial journey. I think having the tough conversations and providing educational tools would be the better strategy than starting out by just giving people money that you care about. Because at the end of the day, depending on your age, you want to make sure you're good for your lifetime and your children's lifetime before you start helping everyone else. That's why I would start with educational tools and having the tough conversations.

And if you'd like, you could check out our podcast, the Rich Habits course that we have in the show notes. I think it'd be a great start and a great gift for anyone for Christmas. Great, Black Friday maybe, right? Everyone, thank you all so very much for listening to this episode of the Rich Habits podcast. Major shout out to Onker Nagpal for joining us. Go check out carrymoney.com. It's his company. It makes it super easy for side hustlers and business.

owners to invest toward retirement and save money on their taxes. I'm a customer. I'm a lover. I'm also an investor. So if you do have that desire, that's going to be in the show notes below. Anker, thanks again for joining us. Don't forget to go check out the Rich Habits Wealth Building blueprint. That's also going to be in the show notes. We've got a budgeting template. We've got all our affiliate links down there, tons of education. And if you have a question, email us at Rich Habits Podcast at gmail.com. Follow us on Instagram at Rich Habits Podcast and ask us a DM question that way, or hop on to the Discord channel, link in the show notes below, and ask us a question over there. Again, thank you all for following along every single week with the Rich Habits podcast.

And Anker, thank you for stopping by. This was incredible. I learned some things today. And so I love having you on. And this was amazing. Thanks for having me, y'all. Oh, and by the way, if you are not a business owner or a side hustler, but you know a business owner or a side hustler, send this episode to them.

It might not be for you. We get that, right? but you probably do know someone who's got the Etsy shop who's selling the mugs selling the candles driving Uber doing that thing and this episode could really help them out so be sure to share the episode with a friend and have a great start to your week