Right About Now with Ryan Alford - Creating Life After the Game with Cory Camp

Starting point is 00:00:00 You're listening to The Radcast, a top 25 worldwide business podcast. If it's radical, we cover it. Here's your host, Ryan Alford. Hey guys, what's up? Welcome to the latest edition of The Radcast. I'm Ryan Alford, your host. We say if it's radical, we cover it. Well, today we're talking about radical sport.

Starting point is 00:00:27 We're talking about recovery. We're talking about mental health in a lot of ways. We're talking to the founder of Forever Athlete, Corey Camp. What's up, brother? Ryan, man. Thanks for having me. I like that intro a lot. I'm just going to take that with me everywhere I go from now on.

Starting point is 00:00:42 There you go. You are our guest on Apple podcast, number one marketing and business show. We appreciate everyone listening. We're excited to tell Corey's story and we're always brought to you by vacay, V-A-Y-C-A-Y. Whenever you need to get away, take a vacay.com. Corey, man, it's fascinating learning about you. com. Corey, man, it's fascinating learning about you. I'll say this. So to bring it, I have four boys and they all have played and are dabbling in sports. They're all young, 14, 12, 11, and 7. And I played basketball through college. My wife was a college athlete.

Starting point is 00:01:26 And so there's a lot of things that I think related to your story. But I will say this, my two oldest are really gravitating towards swimming. They're badass swimmers. I was a good swimmer, but I'm tall. I'm six five and I played basketball and I swam, too. I was a good swimmer, but I stopped it. You do the swim team thing. I was probably eleven, twelve. And that's when you start getting into the camps and all that for other sports. So I just went the total basketball route. But my two boys are into swimming. So there's a little side thing there. So I like the swimming stuff.

Starting point is 00:01:54 I want to hear about all that. Let's tee it up for everybody, Corey, talking about your background. I know swimming will be involved, but I had to do that little intro with my boys. So I'm excited about that. But let's tell everybody a little bit about Corey Camp. Yeah. One, love to hear it. I think you should just forewarn them.

Starting point is 00:02:10 Like being on the swim team, not as much like street cred as you're going to get in a lot of other sports. That's just the way it is. I remember going, I spent at the University of Delaware. I remember walking onto campus freshman year. The captain sat us down

Starting point is 00:02:25 they're like all right first rule don't ever wear any of the swim team stuff to bars parties go out with it because whether you believe it or not it's not going to help your luck with anyone just leave it at home it's like okay you know what it's sad i guess i've seen that? It's sad. I guess I've seen that myself. It's sad because of how work and how good a shape. And as athletes go, swimmers are pretty badass. But it sucks that maybe that stigma is still there. It's not even a stigma as much. It's just no attention. Yeah, no, you're working in the shadows, right? I grew up, for context, my dad swam in college he swam at towson and i got involved at a pretty early age as you can imagine because of that connection i grew up

Starting point is 00:03:11 not really the fastest not really the best but just loved it man felt at home and at peace in the water i remember it probably wasn't until like eighth grade or so it was when probably about your oldest age where things started to really click, where this dream of, oh, I could be a college swimmer started to become a reality. Had some major time drops, started to get some interest in where I was going. And it was interesting now looking back, the swimming pool and just water in general, I viewed as my playground for just self-discovery of who I was. And I know a lot of athletes can relate to that, where it's just, you felt at peace. You felt safe to express yourself and to try new things because of the context of the environment that you were in. And so up until when I retired at the end of my senior year, 22, I viewed myself as a swimmer.

Starting point is 00:04:06 Everyone that knew me as Corey Camp, a swimmer. And that kind of laid the groundwork towards the work that I do now with Forever Athlete of understanding who are we beyond just that first title that we gravitate towards or that first identity. But yeah, for a while, I was like, this is me. This is who I am. And I never wanted to embrace any other title because I happened to be good at it. It's funny how that fascinating. I always, people talk all the time, like about following your passion. You got to follow your passion. You know what? You follow the passion of what you're good at and you get good at stuff that you work at. And so there's

Starting point is 00:04:45 this misnomer in business, I think in life sometimes that it's just going to naturally come to you, but like you got to get yourself out there and try things and do things to see what you're good at. Then it becomes somewhat natural for you to follow that path. Yeah. I even take it a step further back, right? Like before you can even discover passion or what might even potentially be passion you have to be curious yeah so i look at i try swimming was the one that i gravitated towards over time but played baseball played flag football played soccer a little bit played a little bit of basketball i'm 5 10 so didn't quite get the height gene there to continue on so you're kind of you got to be curious to explore the hand that you're dealt and then play it in the best way possible from there.

Starting point is 00:05:32 That curiosity is what breeds passion. And then with time, I think when you continue to add curiosity to passion, that's when you get to that ultimate purpose that we're all running around like chickens with their head cut off trying to find desperately right but if you didn't if you waited to start the company or whatever it may be until you were crystal clear on the purpose you'd be waiting forever it's just not happening you got to be curious first to take that first step yeah i love that your wise beyond your years the curious thing is in my people ask me naturally i go on a lot of shows too, and it's like, what's the keys to success? There is a total correlation to every successful person I know. There's this natural curiosity. I think you have to because you're curious how things work so that you can either create something better or something different.

Starting point is 00:06:23 But it seems to be just so important with i don't know with and i think athletes are that way too they're curious like can i push myself this far or how are they doing that like how are they that good and i think it comes in a lot of different forms but i think it's uber important shoot you want unlimited motivation you want something that you can tap into at any given time to get through those days where you're like, it's a drag. I don't want to do it. Find a way to get curious. And now all of a sudden you're willing, it doesn't make it any easier, right? But it now makes it attainable. It makes you actually want to go proactively towards this fight. Like I'll never forget my freshman year at Delaware. It was funny that the coach that

Starting point is 00:07:05 ended up coaching me, he didn't was the guy who recruited me, but I was really grateful that he was the one that was there. And he and I started to play this game where we were both getting curious, how hard can he make the practice to the point where I would miss an interval? And it got to the point where I think it was interval. And it got to the point where I think it was like five, six months into the season. And I was the only kid on the team that hadn't missed an interval as a freshman or as a team collectively. And he just threw me for a loop one day where he, I was a distance freestyler and I remember, but breaststroke was my worst stroke. I remember getting to practice one day and I look on the paper of the workout and I remember, but breaststroke was my worst stroke. I remember getting to practice one day and I look on the paper of the workout and I see six 100s breaststroke on 110 or something.

Starting point is 00:07:51 I was like, dude, I can't do this. And the head coach kicked us out of the 25 yard part of the pool and sent us over to the, so it became a 20 yard. And because of the double pullouts, I was able to make all six of those 100s. And I turned him, I was like, I guess we'll never know if I wouldn't have made those or not. Just made the most of the cards I was dealt. But it became this really fun game. And it made pushing myself every single day that much more exciting and enticing. more exciting and enticing because I was just getting up to be like, all right, can I beat Coop at this mind game today? And he would probably be waking up doing the same thing. Can I beat Corey down to a point where he can't make this interval anymore? And thankfully I prevailed. D1 swimmer at Delaware, couple of questions.

Starting point is 00:08:40 So number one, what was your stroke? Did you have a certain one or was it like all around? And then explain for people that might listen swimming's not if you talk about american football most people kind of know stuff like and swimming is not in any way complex per se that's your four major strokes but i don't think people comprehend just how in shape and just how hard swimming is. So maybe talk about your stroke and how truly tough it is. Yeah. So I swam. I swam everything from the 200 free up to the 1650 free, which is a mile.

Starting point is 00:09:17 And that's in yards. And then I would do the 400 IM, do a little bit of 200 butterfly. I could do a little bit of everything, which was a blessing and a curse, because then I became that versatile Swiss Army knife of sort. Wherever they needed me, they would throw me in. And for context, what that means is the shorter end of the stick, I'm going for about a minute and 40 seconds, maybe a little faster, a little slower, depending on the day for the 200.

Starting point is 00:09:47 And then for the mile, I was just over 15 minutes was my best time. And that's just that's continual. You're just going, you're going, you're pushing that pace as fast as you can to hold on for that amount of time. I'll never forget. I used to coach swim for a while as well. And I remember a family came that I coached to come watch me swim the mile and to put it into context. And they were like, it was crazy, Corey, you were going. And then I realized that I needed to put money in the parking meter. So I went and I went back and put money in the meter. I came back and you were still going. And I was like, yeah, like, how do you think I felt?

Starting point is 00:10:29 Like, I felt like I was still going. Like it was exhausting. Yeah. Yeah. I think they say, I forget what the exact actual energy, like one-to-one, it's not a one-to-one with running. It's like a one-to-three. So one mile of swimming is about the equivalent

Starting point is 00:10:44 of running three ish miles so like my mile swim is using the same amount of energy that your body would use to run like an all-out 5k well let me tell you i don't care what they say i'm 6'5 260 pounds if i go swim a mile in the water that's 10 miles brother that is not i don't even think that's fair maybe for a trained swimmer or something but i don't know that shit's hard i always joked with with people i was like i'm envious now of the people that are in that not great swim shape so to speak quote unquote because i was like you have to swim way less to burn the same amount of calories that i'm gonna have to swim like 3x 4x that yeah i don't know i'm just not efficient in it but i swim growing up but i'm just like man i'm just gravity is hurting me to

Starting point is 00:11:36 the bottom of the pool i think that body position and efficiency is everything man it's fascinating to me though watching like olymp Olympic swimming or watching professional swimming or something. Like you said, over 15 minutes, how close the times are and how shaving time. I would think there'd be these gigantic, depending on the day and like certain things, there'd be like 30 seconds difference or a minute like but on these 15 minute one mile you're talking shaving like a second or two and it's even middle it's like 0.1 0.001 seconds man i had a great day i shaved 0.01 off my time but how close it is and how consistent it becomes when you're professionally trained. I'll never forget.

Starting point is 00:12:28 So my dad swam in college. My mom very much did not. She knows how to swim, but that's about the extent of it. Mom, if you're listening, I love you. I'll never forget leaving a meet one time when I was in high school, and I absolutely ate it. It was so bad. I added a minute in my mile and my mom just is the one who took me to the meet and she's like in the grand scheme of things Corey it's just a minute

Starting point is 00:12:52 and in my head I wanted to be like you don't understand how bad a minute off your best time is but in her heart I was like I know she loved me one way or the other I was like like, I needed to hear that in that moment because it was like, yeah, it's just one performance. It's one meet. It doesn't really matter. The grand concept of things. Yeah. So when did the struggle set in for you? Like you swim.

Starting point is 00:13:17 What were like, I know everything you're doing is around this athlete. Like where did you struggle the most? Was it because of how much structure there was? Like the structure of sport and everything else? you said it's one day it's gone yeah for me it was i had a subconscious backup plan or had thought of future beyond swimming and i never really gave it much more thought than that. So I've, I plan to be a physical therapist, got my like PT hours. And as an intern, my senior year of high school, even so that I had like the resume ready to go. But by the time I was in college, I just took, I took swimming so seriously,

Starting point is 00:14:00 like that was my major and everything else was like, push came to shove it would get to 10 p.m i was like if i study for another two hours maybe i get another like five percent ten percent on this exam or i show up well rested for practice and can rock it there i'm gonna go to bed and wake up and go crush practice and that unfortunately led to 2.9 gpa where then going to try to go to grad school i just got denied from every single program that i applied to so where it really took a turn for me i would say was my senior year i going into it they brought in a freshman that was there to replace me and my events and that was the first time that there was like a doubt in my mind of, Oh, maybe I'm not the best in my events anymore on the team.

Starting point is 00:14:50 My role was called into question and I started to really realize, okay, this is a legitimate business. Like they're just churning kids out every four years as it makes sense, right? Like I'm running out of eligibility. They want the program to keep going, but it's natural. You need that. But it was feeling that on an interpersonal level. And then when it ended for me, my last race ever, I was slower than I was my junior year of high school. So it was like the slowest mile I had done in about six years time. And that was it.

Starting point is 00:15:27 in about six years time and that was it that was like hand touched the wall it's written it's now history i can't change it i was really upset with it i remember just turning to my coach and just being like at least i'm done now like i can walk away from this thing and it didn't i didn't really realize how much that last performance impacted me until years later i didn't realize how much that like rejection from the grad school a month later played into it and then the girl that i was dating at the time her and i ended up breaking up too as a result of me not having my shit figured out of where am i going post-grad and it, okay, I was already feeling kind of down on myself of, I don't have the thing that I've always relied on to define myself as. The secondary thing that I always thought would be there is not there. And my support system is now not there either. And

Starting point is 00:16:20 that was where the heavy drinking started to come in. That's where the heavy partying started to come in. I was like, you know what? Like, I hate how I feel on a day-to-day basis. Let me escape it. Because this feels better. At least if I'm numb, I'll wake up and I'm still young enough where I don't really get that hung over. So I can just wake up and do it again the next day and the next day. And as you probably know, that doesn't work.

Starting point is 00:16:44 No, it's called snowball downhill. And you know know that doesn't work no snowball downhill and you know what happens to snowballs that run downhill they eventually hit a brick wall yeah i feel it coming like a snowball about to hit me in the face yeah it was thankfully i never had like a rock bottom moment where like my life was in total shambles and I needed to make a change. But it was just that slow burn of the self-awareness started to really kick in. And I started to look around. I was like, dude, I'm really unhappy with what it is I'm doing. It felt like I was on just this like rabbit hole repeat groundhog day every single weekend, going on vendors, staying out way too late, spending time with too many girls. And I was unhappy with my Monday through Friday, but I was not doing anything to change it. Eventually, at the start of 2021, I was just like, I'm going to take a step away from this alcohol thing. I'm going to stop drinking cold Turkey 30 days. Let's see what

Starting point is 00:17:51 happens in 30 days. And then 30 days later, I was like, whoa, I feel like I unlocked a superpower in a lot of ways. Let me just keep going and see what happens. Yeah. I have older than you, but I have a lot of friends that have gone that path. It's becoming enlightening for a lot of people that like, Whoa, that's how I feel. Like I, they get their life back and then some. Yeah. I think what I learned, I'm truthfully, I'm still figuring out what that relationship looks like. Right. don't personally i don't see myself as sober for the rest of my life i would love to be able to introduce alcohol back into the as it's intended to be as like a celebration as a bonding experience but not over the top

Starting point is 00:18:38 point of diminishing returns and that's where i noticed myself really struggling was I had no idea where that point of diminishing returns was I just would start and I wouldn't stop I was telling my roommate last night I was like yeah man reminiscent of there's a bar right when I graduated college I moved down to Baltimore there's a bar around the corner from me that did Friday, seven to 10, all you can drink for $10. And I was like, the hack was to give the bartender $20 and say, keep the change. Cause you're a big shot. 22 year old, right? $10 tip goes a long way. And you feel pretty, pretty wealthy. And I could drink like a fish in that place because the bartender, I would be like six, seven people back from the bar.

Starting point is 00:19:26 I just raised my glass and they'd pass it and pass me another one because I tipped so well and quote unquote so well. It's like, yeah, this, I don't remember. I was putting myself for $10, man. I would have definitely been in trouble if I'd had those great school, great deal, great business, or maybe not. I don't know. It must not have had the drinkers we had at school know i don't know it must not have had the

Starting point is 00:19:45 drinkers we had at school i don't know i would have made money of that yeah it's interesting to look back on that time and i'm actually really grateful for all of that that might sound weird but i needed to get all of that out of my system to learn that, okay, when I'm feeling certain types of way, I can't turn to these things that are escapism, that are suppressing, that are allowing me to continue to just sidestep the problem and just feel good in this moment. It's okay that I've learned now. It's okay to actually feel anxious it's okay to feel angry it's okay to feel depressed sad and the way you actually address them is actually sitting in it for a second and like setting up your system around you and your support team that they help like you can

Starting point is 00:20:38 tug on the rope and they're like okay cool Ryan you've been sitting this for a while we'll pull you out of this I didn't have that I didn't know how to talk about that. The guys in my life, what we talked about was sports and how much we're drinking at that. All you can drink on Friday nights. That was the social currency. It wasn't, hey, are you unhappy at this job? Because this thing is miserable for me. Or if it was that talk it was just like screw this job so screw this job what are you quitting i was like i don't know but like when you do it let me know so i can believe too but that was like such surface level combo when did you have the epiphany or realize that you're self-aware to recognize the struggle from leaving the sport and then developing thoughts and mechanisms

Starting point is 00:21:28 the playbook the and the business that you're developing now like when did that like moment take place and it's formulate for you yeah so we'll paint a quick picture graduated completely lost drinking a ton took a sales job refinancing mortgages outside of Baltimore. I was doing VA cash out, refi loans in a call center. Definitely not what I expected myself to be doing with an exercise science degree with a concentration in biomechanics and a coaching science minor. But here I was, it was the highest paying job that I could land out of school. I was very money and monetary driven at that point. So I was, it was the highest paying job that I could land out of school. I was very money and monetary driven at that point.

Starting point is 00:22:12 So I was like, I'm going to be the first of my teammates to make $100,000 a year. If I couldn't be the first one, I wasn't going to get into grad school like some of the other ones. And I was telling myself like that was what I wanted. That was success for me. I hit a breaking point about eight months into that role where I just was like, man, I feel super, super lost and I don't know what it is. So without really any answers, I quit that job and I took a summer swim coaching job at a country club back in the DC area. And that turned into a swim clinic where we had a four lane indoor pool at that club. And I turned to the operations director and I said, Hey,

Starting point is 00:22:52 is this pool, is it used year round? He goes, yeah, but four people, no one really swims in this thing. And I was like, Oh, what if I start a year round swim program, a learn to swim clinic and teach private lessons in there? And he's like, sure, come up with a business plan. So I go on Google and I say, what is a business plan? How do I write one? And come back the next day, I was like, here is my business plan. Matt, thanks for taking the time to hear me out.

Starting point is 00:23:18 I've been thinking on this one for a while. He had no idea that I just wrote it up the night before. He liked it enough where he was like all right this space is yours we won't take a percentage of it you just run the thing and i was like oh this is weird what that wasn't in the business plan i was expecting some sort of rev share something but he just let me run with it So much so to the point where a year and a half later, he turned to me and go, hey, so about that no revenue share thing,

Starting point is 00:23:50 can we rediscuss that? Because you're making way more than we thought you would be making. Oh, sorry, man. That was the contract. That was the original terms. Not into fitness outside of that. How many kids are in that thing? I had about 120 kids and it was me

Starting point is 00:24:07 and one assistant and the learn to swim clinic kids were paying we had as many as 40 kids a session paying about 20 to 30 a drop in and then the year-round swim program we did in three different sessions and we had probably about i want to say we had about 60 kids in that and they were paying anywhere from a thousand to 1500 for that session. So it ended up doing fairly well, a lot better than he or I or anyone else involved anticipated it doing. and then of course that was talking about time for money it was great because my limiting factor was just like how many kids i could work with at once but instead of introducing more sessions because of the pool time caps i started to explore what would it look like to get in the personal training gotten a personal training on the side thankfully at the same club because they had a gym and before i knew it i was assistant fitness director running the swim program. And then COVID hit.

Starting point is 00:25:09 And I was like, oh, everything crumbled. Gone in a second. And that whole time, what I noticed was I was starting to feel more and more like myself again. As I was getting back into the coaching role. As I was walking with other people through their fitness journeys as I was walking with kids through this like to this day some of the best joy in my life is being able to help a kid go from absolutely terrified from the water to swimming their first lap across and I know like the confidence that instills in that kid

Starting point is 00:25:42 and the relief that instills in that parent as well. I was like, oh, what if I can instill that same feeling again now with former athletes? What does it look like to sit with someone who's 22 or 23? What did I wish I had at that age where someone actually understood me and what I was going through? that age where someone actually understood me and what I was going through and I can provide them that confidence boost that they don't even really realize they need and provide their parents and their loved ones that relief that they don't even know they need to be like, okay, I can stop worrying about Corey. Like he's got it somewhat figured out. Like he gonna land on his feet i can trust that what do you think are there like common signs obviously with yours it was you had such the trifecta hit you all at

Starting point is 00:26:34 once and led you down the path that you knew was not sustainable and then kind of waking up but like for other former athletes that are out there and are parents of athletes, are there like these telltale signs of the struggle? Yeah. So what ends up happening is what's very common. We actually see this in military as well. It's a concept called identity foreclosure. So when an identity that you've always embraced and viewed yourself as forecloses unexpectedly or even expectedly, we see this in later generations as we age and we retire, right?

Starting point is 00:27:13 And that sense of meaningful purpose is now removed or it's not as apparent. you'll see oftentimes if you're looking for warning signs and someone's going through this looking at any change like subtle changes in behavior are they have they always eaten well and now they're willing to grab a little bit more junk food they're turning to sweets a lot more that's a warning sign for me still to this day is if I'm grabbing ice cream three to four times a week, like I know, okay, something deeper is going on. I need to book a therapy session or I need to sit and open my journal and actually just give myself an hour to unpack what it is that I'm actually feeling. So changes in diet are huge. Changing in sleeping patterns. are huge changing in sleeping patterns. If someone who is always up early going after it, like I was as a swimmer,

Starting point is 00:28:08 if all of a sudden now they're sleeping in or they're snoozing multiple times, that's a pretty easy telltale sign to say, okay, hey, something a little bit deeper is going on. And really just subtle changes in mood. If they're really quick to be irritated or just don't want to be bothered, they're really quiet oftentimes, especially guys. If we're really quiet, oftentimes something's there. We just don't know how to articulate the words around it.

Starting point is 00:28:41 That makes a lot of sense. It's a lot of different. Whenever there's tragedy or any type, and that's what it is almost. It's a lot of different, whenever there's like tragedy or any type, and that's what it is almost. It's like loss on some level when you've had that structure. It's not just a crutch, but just it's like losing part of yourself. And it sounds like a lot of the same type thing. Yeah. I was going to say it's the structure can be viewed as oh it was a crutch but really that structure was what was needed to be in place for you to succeed at that level so it's not the structure that's tough you just have to look at it with a grain of salt right you're learning social

Starting point is 00:29:18 skills at 22 35 like whenever it is that people are finishing up and walking away from this sport that most of your peers learned a lot earlier because they didn't have to navigate this. I look at the biggest thing is community and teammates, friendships. As you get into an adult,

Starting point is 00:29:41 you never had to really worry about who your teammates were because they were just assigned to you. You showed up to the team your teammates were because they were just assigned to you you showed up to the team and they were there and then by default you're like i see you guys every single day i might as well just call you my boys and like we'll be friends outside of it it's given to you it's easy now when you get out you have to be proactive and actively seeking out those relationships and while while that can be challenging, it can also be really freeing

Starting point is 00:30:07 because if you were ever like me, it's like I didn't get along with every single teammate that I ever had in my life. Now I get to choose who is making up my team, who am I selectively surrounding myself with. And when you start to shift viewpoints like that, you're like, oh, okay. Yes, there's a lack of structure,

Starting point is 00:30:23 but now it's on me to become the general manager of my life. And I can build the structure that serves me now in this season. And it's way more personalized than any system that you found yourself in that inevitably, especially at scale, college athletics, pro, whatever, they can't serve the individual needs of every single person on that team. But now you have the opportunity to of every single person on that team. But now you have the opportunity to do that in your life after sport. And that's a really cool and exciting opportunity. It's, I wish someone framed it for me that way rather than, all right, all the things that you had gone. Good luck. But it's true. It's, I'm listening to you talk about that. And I'm thinking about my own kids. Like, back to that.

Starting point is 00:31:13 Like, they have – I want to think they're more resilient, but, like, looking at it, they do have these teams and things that they're naturally teed up to be around and just being aware that it's true. Like, they show up, and they have 40 people on their swim team or whatever and that's who they practice with every day so they're not that they're forced but it just creates that natural situation to become talking and becoming friends and doing all these things where in the real world you might have to try harder to make friends and like they learn it earlier. So that's that's an interesting insight. Yeah, it's a consistent cadence, right?

Starting point is 00:31:51 Like you look at even now, like the challenge of community building and where I think a lot of companies get it wrong when they're when we're talking about, oh, I got a community. It's out to you or is it an audience? Is it like are they actually connecting outside of the thing that you're doing? Or is it an audience? Is it like, are they actually connecting outside of the thing that you're doing? Anyone can have a one-off experience where you bring like-minded people together and form connection. That's the first level of any form of human connection. How many first dates did you have before your wife that you were like, oh, I felt connected

Starting point is 00:32:19 to that person. That was good. But obviously they didn't progress any longer because of a whole bunch of different variables. The challenge, if you're truly wanting to build a community, it's about consistent cadence of how often are you able to bring like-minded people together? And how are you able to diversify experiences enough where you're getting them to actually learn and trust one another, where they feel safe in that environment with one another. It's the same way that teams, championship teams were developed in sport is you had that consistent practice cadence, right? But within practice, you didn't do the same workout Monday through Friday for the entire season. The experience got diversified. And then if you were a part of a really great team, you did team building activities outside of that, whether that be something as subtle as you went to the dining hall and shared meals together or you watched the fight on Saturday night together or you went to the trampoline park and played dodgeball against one another. All of those different experiences diversify and add layers to the interconnectedness.

Starting point is 00:33:22 And that's ultimately the goal. to the interconnectedness. And that's ultimately the goal that we're talking about. And that's what I'm trying to do with Forever Athlete is just adding to this level of diversified experience to deepen connection among people that happen to have the similar background of sport. And so as core Forever Athlete is, you're bringing together people

Starting point is 00:33:44 that have shared this experience of being high level athletes or just. Athletes at some level doing and having that structure for an extended period of time, giving them a community, obviously giving lessons, but also the community with which to help one another. Am I summarizing that right? That's exactly it. It's the way I like to say it is we want to be able to honor where you've been in your life, because I think everyone's past experience plays a vital role in their present day future and the future. But we also want to be able to support you in that current season as you progress through these different seasons of life. The original slogan I came up with,

Starting point is 00:34:27 which I ended up scrapping was we want to be there for when the NCAA kicks you out the door, we want to help you land on your feet. And I was like, ah, probably doesn't sound too great, but essentially it's that. Yeah. When they've gotten all they can get out of you. Yeah. Those pre NIL days, right? Like now at least you got these athletes that are able to make something but you can talk about pay gap that exists in that

Starting point is 00:34:52 right nil that wouldn't have changed my college experience as a swimmer yeah it doesn't change most football players experiences but now you have guys that are making seven figures in the same locker room as guys that aren't making anything that's tough to continue to mesh this team together with getting tougher i don't know it might be the equitable thing to do but it's hard to i think for the coaches to navigate all that i think that's what they get paid a lot of money to do it but it's tough nonetheless is that is the nidl stuff entering into your discussions with what you're doing with forever athlete i think there's such a long way to go on that and there there needs to be more athlete education on how to pitch yourself how to actually show your value

Starting point is 00:35:39 the amount of messages that i get that are somewhere along the lines of, I'm an athlete. What can Forever Athlete do for me in terms of NIL? And I'm like, all right, show me your roster. Show me something here. And most of the kids that are sending me these messages, and it's not to shame them. I love the ambition. I love the courage and the confidence to go out and pitch. But they're like a fifth string player at their d3 school and i'm like i think the question is what can you do for me like why would i give you

Starting point is 00:36:13 x y and z what where's the value add here there needs to be a system in place that teaches these kids because quite frankly they're like 18 years old just thinking oh nil now i can make some money teach them how to create win-wins in business and that's going to be what actually helps them i think on the flip side as they transition out more one of my favorite guys that's done a really good job at this is this guy taj washington out of usc of USC. He's a starting receiver, but he's not like their number one guy, but they've done a really good job of showcasing how he has this passion for cooking

Starting point is 00:36:52 and spending time in the kitchen outside of football. And it's like now brands can see that and they can look at that and say, oh, okay, I can see how we can work with Taj because if we're a kitchen company, we have anything to do with cooking. He's a value out there and he happens to be a solid player on a top 10 team in the country. That's a win-win for both sides. Yeah. I tell people I've counseled a few athletes that they've got to be willing to lean into their passion outside of sport

Starting point is 00:37:23 and showcasing it so that whether it's baseball cards or tennis shoes or cooking or whatever it is you got to demonstrate something that has interest that a brand or someone might want to work with yeah i'll tell a quick story like i a client of mine she swims at the university of texas and a few years ago she was really struggling with just from the mental side like like feeling really burnt out, wasn't performing well. She's a top 10 swimmer in the nation at her events. And she was just feeling like basically borderline, like wanting to quit. And she said, I just don't understand it. Like I'm on a full ride. I should be excited for this thing. And when her and I sat down, I was like, what else do you enjoy i enjoy horseback riding i enjoy like

Starting point is 00:38:05 arcade games all this stuff i was like okay so how often are you doing that just none because i'm swimming so much i was like yeah i get that that's like been there done that i understand but if you don't prioritize these things you don't proactively seek out your interests that you're curious about outside of the passionate thing the passionate thing quickly becomes so worshiped that you lose the passion in the first place that brought you there i was like i know you're not scheduled out busy all the time you think you are but if we reduce time here and here and now we add in an arcade session or finding a time to just go ride horses watch what this does and enough, in six months time,

Starting point is 00:38:47 she was able to turn around and be in such a renewed headspace as she was going in, which is a shame because I wish that could have been a month turnaround if we were more proactive about this. But because it was a reactive, I'm basically ready to quit. I'm ready to step away. It took more time to build back up. The analogy that I like to give, it's like a bar stool and our identity, like as we start to embrace that we can be multiple things, actually it's like another bar stool actually being planted on the ground. So the more identities that you're willing to embrace, the more you're able to withstand one of those being taken away. So if that identity as

Starting point is 00:39:26 an athlete forecloses, yes, will it suck? For sure. Will there be a grief period? For sure. But will you be completely off balance and toppled over if you had three or four other things that you felt grounded and rooted that this is who I am as a person at my core? No. You'll just be balancing a little bit differently. And that's the name of the game when we're talking like proactive mental health and proactive identity building. It's how can you encourage people

Starting point is 00:39:54 in your culture, in your immediate circle to start to embrace this concept that you can be multiple things. Each thing that you do is an expression of who you are, but it's not an entire definitive. Like this is the box that you're placed multiple things. Each thing that you do is an expression of who you are, but it's not an entire definitive, like this is the box that you're placed in.

Starting point is 00:40:09 Yeah, makes a lot of sense. Good counsel. I think you know what you're doing. No wonder. I appreciate that. I try. What's it been like building the business and finding clients and doing all that stuff

Starting point is 00:40:23 on the business side? Yeah, truthfully, as you probably know, in the business world, it comes and goes in waves, for sure. I would say it's had sputters, starts, stops. It wasn't probably until earlier this year that I got really clear on how we're actually building this concept and how we actually want to grow things. And the focal point of it is this Wednesday morning idea that we come together for like cone drills, agility work in a field, and then partake in just fellowship of just dropping in and saying, Hey, what's going on in your world? What do you got going on this week? How can we support one another that has transformed into a platform where we're starting to keep athletes here in Austin connected in between these experiences.

Starting point is 00:41:10 Like I said, we want to inspire initial connection, but then allow for constant communication to be available to them if they choose to after the fact, which is huge. to after the fact, which is huge. So it's been a slow build, but now we're really hitting the cadence where I've gotten some bigger sponsorships, partnerships in place, started to secure more venues here in Austin that are allowing us to do what I want to do and get really creative with the things. Like our September event gel blaster is this like toy gun company they saw what i was doing they loved it they sent me 150 guns and i said great we're gonna do six teams of 25 we're gonna build an obstacle course at a gym here and we're gonna go all out war 25 on 25 people for tournament style and then do some taco trucks afterwards and those things have been really fun but it has come with lots of late nights lots of sitting here being like so what am i doing after

Starting point is 00:42:15 i talked to ryan today like i i don't know there's no clear roadmap right there's not the boss that i can report to anymore so it's come with it a lot of periods of, okay, if I embrace the, what am I doing after this and actually sit with it to get clear on it, that actually speeds up the process rather than just trying to go like meeting to meeting. And then as far as you asked to like, how are we getting people aware of this? It's just through social media was fortunate about two years ago, was able to grow a pretty sizable audience over on TikTok and that kind of cultivated awareness around what the brand represents and spark enough curiosity where people are like, oh, you wrote a book. What's that book about? I'm

Starting point is 00:42:57 going to order that. And then they'll message me afterwards and be like, oh, your book really made me think. Or like that thread or tweet that you put out, if we're still calling them tweets, I don't know, really made me think my favorite. Yeah. A friend of mine was like, dude, you put something up the other day. And I like, couldn't not stop thinking about it for two hours. So I guess I got you pretty good with that thought provoking thing. That's the whole goal is just to get people to second guess their experience and start to question like, Oh, can I maybe be doing this better? What would it look like if I did this slightly differently?

Starting point is 00:43:35 Is what was the name of the book? It's called forever athletes. Yeah. Forever athletes happen to your true identity daily. Where can people find the book that might be interesting? Amazon or website is forever-athlete.com. There it is. What's in the future, brother? I'm hearing symbols like if you paint the picture the next five or 10 years, like what's the success roadmap look like for you? roadmap look like for you yeah the goal is really right now this year in particular just hammering home on building a legitimate rock solid community here in austin of former athletes it's a hotbed of there's a ton of them here it's the city to do it building that out and then essentially franchising

Starting point is 00:44:19 out that model into other cities i want i see this being a concept that is in every major city across the world where when an athlete retires, they just simply go to forever athlete social club. And they're like, Oh shoot. Like, this is pretty cool. I never knew this world existed beyond sport. Let me get plugged in. And now all of a sudden they have mentors, they have peers that they can turn to, and now they have counsel that they can trust. That was the hardest thing for me was I went to that sales job and I was trying to express to colleagues and coworkers how I was feeling, but no one could really relate. No one even related to the fact that I was like, yeah, I still get up at five and go to the gym. Cause that's just like

Starting point is 00:45:00 part of who I am. And they're like, you're crazy, dude. Why would you do that? You were in the office until 10.30 last night. I was like, because that's what it takes. I want to be around people that challenge me in a way that's like, hey, are you still taking care of yourself? But also understand me and don't pass judgment and just write me off. And that's the goal in the next 5, 10 years is to make that accessible at scale. I want it to be bigger. It's bigger than me.

Starting point is 00:45:25 It always has been bigger than me. I don't want to be the face of the brand. I want it to be telling other people's story and just helping people one day at a time. I got an idea for you on your evolution. So you're thinking athletes and high-level athletes have the mindset and the skill set to be highly successful in almost anything.

Starting point is 00:45:47 Now, it doesn't come with a guaranteed roadmap, but if you are correcting and helping these athletes get some baggage out of the way, you're building a database and a set of highly desired individuals for companies and otherwise, because you're bringing together extremely good athletes. They're mentally strong already on some level. They have the discipline for what it took to get there. So if you're getting hurdles or you're getting the baggage out of the way, you suddenly become the source. So tying that together with some recruitment or something,

Starting point is 00:46:23 I think there's something there. Yeah, I love it. Yeah, a little bit of headhunting, connecting opportunity. I 100% see that in the future of whether it just be a job board, being able to go to these higher level, press for mutual Toyota.

Starting point is 00:46:37 Yeah, you're helping get jobs and the people looking to hire get the best, the closest thing to a sure bet. Exactly. And it's, hey, here's this model of, you want to talk about corporate wellness that actually work? It can't be directly tied to wellness initiatives

Starting point is 00:46:54 like from your work. It's got to be somewhat separate. So like they already have that in place. Yeah. And it's one less thing for that company to worry about. Yeah, 100%. It's win, win, win all around, all three parties involved. Hey, brother.

Starting point is 00:47:08 I love your spirit. I love what you're doing. Where can everybody keep up with, learn more about everything Corey Camp's doing and everything that's happening with Forever Athlete? Yeah. Ryan, first off, man, thank you for having me. This is fun just jamming with you. I really appreciate the time and if anyone

Starting point is 00:47:25 wants to connect more cory camp c-r-y-c-m-p on instagram you can shoot me an email cory camp at foreverathletela.com super confusing i have a whole bunch of domains but that's the one with the email address you can find that on the websites and you just go to instagram that's probably the platform i'm most active on i would love to connect further yeah man i love it everybody go check out forever athlete go follow corey camp on instagram and see what everything's got big things coming hey guys to find us the radcast.com search for corey camp you'll find the highlight clips from today the full episode the short episode and to find me i I'm at Ryan Alford on all the platforms.

Starting point is 00:48:05 You'll see the blue check before I could buy it. We'll see you next time on the Radcast. To listen or watch full episodes, visit us on the web at theradcast.com or follow us on social media at our Instagram account, the.rad.cast or at Ryan Alford. Stay radical.

Right About Now with Ryan Alford - Creating Life After the Game with Cory Camp

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