Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe's Parenting Hell - S11 EP41: Russell Howard

Episode Date: January 2, 2026

Joining us this episode to discuss the highs and lows of parenting (and life) is the brilliant comedian and presenter - Russell Howard Russell Howard tours his brand-new stand-up show Don’t Tell The Algorithm across the UK & Ireland from 22nd January to 29th November, including six dates at the London Palladium Russell Howard's Five Brilliant Things podcast episodes are released weekly on Wednesdays and are available on all major podcast platforms. Parenting Hell is a Spotify Podcast, available everywhere every Tuesday and Friday. Please subscribe and leave a rating and review you filthy street dogs... xx If you want to get in touch with the show with any correspondence, kids intro audio clips, small business shout outs, and more.... here's how: EMAIL: [e-mail] Follow us on instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@parentinghell⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ A 'Keep It Light Media' Production  Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, I'm Rob Beckett. And I'm Josh Widdickham. Welcome to Parents in Hell, the show in which Josh and I discuss what it's really like to be a parent, which I would say can be a little tricky. So, to make ourselves, and hopefully you, feel better about the trials and tribulations of modern day parenting, each week you'll be chatting to a famous parent about how they're coping.

Or hopefully how they're not coping. And we'll also be hearing from you, the listener, with your tips, advice, and of course, tales of parenting wo. Because let's be honest, There are plenty of times where none of us know what we're doing. Hello, you're listening to Parenting Hell with... He's here. Jago?

Can you say Rob? Rob. Beckett? Beckett. Can you say Josh? Josh. And Whittacom? Welcome.

Well done. Welcome. There we go. That's Jago. Lovely. Very, very well done. A five-month-old Sanjayago, I doubt your guess where we're from, as I don't have a hint of accent, despite living here my whole life.

Birmingham. Perfect for our guest, Rob. Bristol. Yes. The Bristol accent is a life choice, though, isn't it? It really is. Russell Howard hasn't really got it, has he? That's what I think you can choose to get rid, I think.

Can you indeed? Yeah, I think so. I think people from Bristol make a decision. Do you? You double down or you slide in. Which would you make the decision to do? It depends what I'm doing. I've been a listener since I was pregnant

and I've been eagerly awaiting the day that Jago can have a go at your intro and it actually bes intelligible. I love the podcast so grateful to have something I can tune into every week that helps ease the guilt I feel for my various parenting choices,

mainly those involving screen time. It's like having a parenting support group on the drive to work. Thank you for keeping it going. Your England's best agony uncles or the best Maddie England's in fucking trouble then. There we go. We have an idea.

dilemmas, have we sent in? I think people realise me not very good at answering them. They're not very good at answering them. I don't know. I just ask someone else. I'll tell you, I've got a dilemma. Go on. I'll get that y'all now, mate.

Yeah, that's the diary. Save it for the record. You wait until this gets... I'm hands to my pockets, just fill a bit... When this is filmed. Um, yes, so, basically, this... My daughter... My two daughters, I was with my two daughters and a few of my younger daughter's friends.

Now, I've got a really funny photo of my daughters when we was in Tokyo of one asleep, on the train and one that had drunk too many drinks, like fizzy drinks, and needed a wee and sat there, it looked like she's about to burst, right? She's sort of got her arms all tense and looking to the side. It's really funny picture that we sort of have a little laugh at. And it came up on my phone, my daughter saw it. And then she was laughing.

And then my other daughter said, oh, can I see and show everyone? And I said to my oldest, do you want everyone to see? And she was like, no, not really. Because she was like, it's funny for us as a family. But she doesn't think she wanted loads of people just laughing at her in this photo. Who are these people? My younger daughter's friends. Oh, right.

I think she just felt a bit like, oh, no, it's a bit much. So I said, no, she doesn't want everyone to see it and to laugh, had it like that. So then, because it's a photo of her and she doesn't want everyone to see. And then the younger one's like, but it's a photo of me as well. I'm in it. I want to see it. And I'm like, yeah, but then I don't want to show you. And then it feels like I'm excluding your friends.

I was like, let's just not look at the phone anymore. And then the other, the younger one starts sulking that she can't see the phone. And he's just like, I don't know what the right one, what's the right thing to do here, Josh. I think you've done the right thing to not show the photo. because the photo is laughing at the older one, isn't it? Really? Yes, because the other one's just not doing much. And it's fine if she's in on the joke,

but she's maybe doesn't want to share that with lots of people. You've got to respect that as well. Totally. Totally. I think you've done the right thing there, Rob. But it is the classic situation where having two kids is very difficult because sometimes you have to make a decision

that's going to fuck one of them off. It's not you versus them, as in not that parenting is you versus, but it's not like do I draw a line because I want to I don't think they should do this or or they do you know it's not like a decision where it's like this is me parenting one child yeah it's the decision of how do I mediate between two children that want different things and both it's not like a yeah it's a different thing you've got to make a split second decision to decide your stance and how you're going to implement it and make sure it's the right decision and then do that immediately with live living people well exactly you know in law Absolutely. Keep talking. All of the laws come from previous ruling. Well, not all of them, but laws come from previous rulings in courts, don't they? So it'll become like if there's a court case that makes a ruling, then others use that

ruling later on. That's a bit like parenting. So now you've delivered that rule. That's something that needs to be implemented going forward now. That is now the rule going forward because the case of daughter one versus daughter two over photo shown to friends is now the statute in the room. They get to have a full trial, like present evidence and a judge make a final decision in their own quarters, but I'm doing all that live.

Exactly. You're doing it straight away. You're going, I think that is murder. Just off the bat. Yeah, immediately. And you will be sentenced to death. Now, let's enjoy the rest of our day out. Yeah, exactly.

So there you go. Russell Howard, Rob. Yes, Russell Howard. Great guest. Dad. Partly older, dad as well. He's in his mid-40s. You always think of him as about 28, Russell,

but he had a kid at 43, and what's quite interesting, he's already super successful and now integrating a child into that as opposed to having a child on the way up. Should we bring on Russell? Yes, this is Russell Howard. Russell Howard, welcome.

Fucking out, lads. We should want to do that again? No, we don't really give a shit and the women are quite forgiving. but given but given that you're sort of like a digital ant and deck i was just thinking they very rarely speak over each other and do they ever have a rift i've never seen it that would go viral wouldn't it aunt and deck going do you want to stop stepping on my lines aunt yeah i mean i think they might have had a couple of crosswords when he crashed his car drunk into a roundabout but um

on screen i think they're quite chilled yeah but you were implying he was in the back he's always to his left and if he's driving he has to run on the side of something that's why he couldn't see his blind spot isn't it? That's the problem isn't it that you just go he's got me

he's definitely got me to the point you know when they've got like you know you do your driver's licence and the guy's got the brakes and he just presumed that Anna had over so do you know what I wanted to say Russell because I don't know if I've ever said this

is that I saw one of your gigs because it was kind of quite a big moment in my life. Oh, really? Yeah, I know. I've got the same story. I think we might have been going to comedy when Russell was in his too big and too good for comedy clubs peak and then was just roofing gigs.

You know, you're sort of too good just to be doing 20 minutes and you need longer and then you're just cramming it all in. Tell yours first. This is horrible starting of Rizzing him up. I didn't want to start like this. I don't remember that experience myself, Rob, So I saw you at Ashton Court Festival in about... Oh, yeah.

Yeah, 2003. My friend was at Union Bristol, and we went to that music festival, and I didn't know who anyone was, and John Richardson was on, and he did a kind of impression of a dolphin. Does that? Yes. Is that a thing?

Yeah, he had a really... You're still doing that, isn't he? He had a really... He had a... Yeah, John had a bit about, remarkably, given that he was born and raised in Lancaster and to my knowledge I've never seen a live dolphin

had a really extensive and funny bit about dolphins and it led up to this incredible impression of a dolphin and then suddenly you get like it's quite a big tent it's probably about 500 Bristolians and fucking hell that wasn't bad

that actually sounded like a dolphin I'll tell you what he's got a serial killer's eyes but he's got a range of animal voices I've never seen in my life but yeah well thank you that's very sweet of you Josh Well, that's, we'll go on to

Parenthood in a minute, but that sort of follows on while I saw you up the creek and you just were doing 20 minutes, I think on a Sunday, but you had done a bit of, I don't even think you'd done maybe a bit of telly, but not much, but you just came on and I've been going to up the creek a lot and you see a lot of the old school acts of their set routines and there's references

from 20 years ago and then you've got the newcomers in the middle working out to do it, but you just came on and it was nonstop, bang, bang, and there wasn't a let up and then you're watching it going, oh my God, this is just like nonstop. and you're doing stuff that because you're similar to my age, I could get a bit more than some of the older lads.

But for you now, though, like, because that kind of comedy club or smaller theatre where you can be yourself in chat and throw lines out as Russell rather than the comedian, how do you find being in an arena? Because you've got, you know, you've got another arena tour. You've been in arenas for years and years now.

Well, I'm not. Is it possible to bring that in? Or how do you find the difference between those two venues? So I purposely kind of, I'm not really doing TV anymore. So I was, I did arenas because I had to kind of fit a tour in quite quickly when I was doing telly and now I kind of do, so I'll do like four nights in a theatre. So like, you know, so I would, I would far rather do that.

And then that way my wife and son can come up and we can kind of hang out in like, so you're going to take them on tour? Mate, I've done it. I took them on tour to America. I took them on tour to Europe. We did like a tour bus. It was incredible. Oh, wow.

How old is your, how old is it? Is it one kid? You got one? Mm-hmm. Yeah. How old? 18 months old. 18 months.

Yeah. So he was, the first time he was on stage was the Sydney Opera House, which is pretty cool. Pretty cool. He did, he did the warm up and was pretty good.

He hasn't found his voice yet, has he? He's not quite, he's very similar to his dad. He's still working off and written stuff. Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, did you do? To answer your question, I kind of,

I think those, those 2,000-seater venues, something like the Palladium, or the kind of, of the Liverpool Empire, those rooms where they're obviously massive, but you can still be kind of small. I think there isn't a bad seat in any of those venues, even if you're sort of way at the top. Whereas, like, I really loved doing arenas and there was so much fun. And it had to be this kind of all-powerful monologue where you just like wallop them for like an hour and a half.

But creatively, you stand still. Or I did. I was never, I never felt like. You can't improvise on the age you've got to just give them what you've written it's this kind of sort of ocean that's just flowing and you're smashing it and you can't then stop and bring it down I've seen people do it and it's it's really impressive when you see I remember seeing Chappelle kind of busking at the O2 which was wild to but he's got such charisma that he was able to kind of make it and he was following Chris Rock Chris Rock had just done his set they did on Netflix and then Chappelle basically just came on and went you're right And it was so compelling to see someone just dick about at the O2.

I suppose you can use the screens, though, for the small moments and act outs in your face and facial expressions because they zoom up. But yeah, that's what I was saying, because it felt like, you know, the kind of act you are, you're perfect to really get involved and improvise all the way through like a 3,000 scene. Would you go to the audience now a bit more? No. No. Don't you go to them anymore at all? Well, it's just, it's been, it's been ruined by all these kind of like, crowd work sets, don't you think?

I find they're a bit of bullshy the crowd now than they were because they feel like they're part of the show. Oh no, I just think I like not to sound kind of nostalgic for my youth, but I, you know, you guys would be the same. There's no problem with that. No problem with that. I'm built to wear on it. That's his bread and butter.

You look at like, you know, Kitson and Ross Noble and Jason Byrne and Rob Rouse and Andrew Maxwell and these Phil Kee, like genuinely brilliant improvisers. Whereas now, it's kind of like, you know, what do you do? Your mum's a whore. Yeah. Or, you know. Wait, you learned to a helicopter. Yeah, but it's just, it's just, this is good stuff, guys.

I'm just getting it down if that's all right. But it's stockies. That's what blows my mind, those kind of stock lines that you'd see jungler's acts doing. And now kind of done by a lot of, um, kind of improvisational heavyweights on. And I just, I don't know, it just, it makes me ick now. Yeah. If you're kind of, if something happens, I love it. and you can kind of create something,

but I would never kind of go to somebody and sort of say, what's your job, what are you doing? I always used to use the crowd work as a pivot really where I'll chat to them a bit like to warm them up slightly

and then get something out of them out of a babysitter or being late for work or what time I've got to be up and then spin it into the routine. So then it looks like you've just got, oh, and you're off. And then once we're off, we're off. Yeah, but and then that, weirdly,

that's what makes the gig, it's, I always call it that liquid funny. So you have 15 minutes of liquid funny that is so specific to the room where some woman called, Mandy has got a cat and she's got to be back for the babysitter or whatever and then you you're able to bring your material into the room but that could it's so for the room it can't go viral no of whereas now that whole idea of I find it's so funny that you're improvising specifically not for

the people in the room but for people on the phone so you're just go what what do you do and you're kind of looking to this audience that aren't there and yeah you know I just it's not it's not really for me I kind of if things happen organically let them go but but I don't really want to berate. And I also remember what it feels like to be in the front row and that panic of going, oh, God, oh God, oh God, oh God, oh God, oh God, you know.

But some people love it, though. I'd have broken Mike and put his hand up and I'm Pete the pillow man. I'm Pete the pillow man. I'm like, what the fuck? And three years ago, he was in the front row because he was sat on a pillow and I'd spoke to him about his pillow.

And I was like, well, I was like, yeah, I had a growth, but it's gone now. I'm like, fucking hell. Keep it like, Pete. I think you should read the brand as Pete the Cancer Survivor, not Pete the Pillow, Matt. Yeah, but that's lovely. And because you've done a really nice thing with it

and you didn't, that's what I mean. It's when you can kind of turn moments into something sweet and funny and unique rather than, right, let's just shit this out for the masses. The worst of all the emcees did it when I was new, there'd be two, when Brokeback Mountain came out. And if there was a man in a sort of played or cowboys kind of shirt, collared shirt of a check pattern on it would just be homophobic you gave them like that kind of stuff because of broke that mountain i was stood there i was like this is mental but they're all

doing it but can you imagine can you imagine what would have happened if the guy went yeah no i am oh fair enough yeah it is just your boyfriend yeah it actually actually is my husband yeah you're married yeah it's legal now is it the touring's legal right you're not going to believe this David Cameron So Russell You take your family on tour Yeah Can I like what would your day be like there

Do you feel like Because we've I've done that a bit and stuff like But I find Are you literally with your son Before the gig Or are you like right I need to shut off

I had a moment It really just one of the oddest moments We were doing a gig in Where were we? I think we were in Seattle And because we were on a bus So the bus would drive from, let's say, Portland. We did a show in Portland.

What's that? How big is this? Like what a picture? Like a... How old is that for a family? Oh, so the way it works. It's called a star bus, right? And I've done a bunch of these in America.

And I famously, in my head, had, um, I had Dolly Parton's tour bus one year. Oh, yes. Which was incredibly exciting. And our driver, it was a guy called Cadillac Jack. Perfect. he'd come out of retirement to do this kind of one last tour and he used to drive Steve Martin so he had so many brilliant stories

it was great. Was he a huge, that Russell Howard fan then was he just in some debt? Why was he back down? No, I think he was in debt. He was, he didn't know anything about stand-up other than he'd sort of told with Steve Martin and just that he was like a mate of his and he'd been, because he was also,

he was a Vietnam War veteran and he told me this fascinating story that, I mean, he's great in the dead of night when you're driving to Minneapolis, the U.S. government gives veterans, I think, four Viagra or six Viagra a month, they kind of send them. And he was basically bemoaning the government just like, just kind of, Jesus Christ, like, just stop sending me Viagra. Do you know what I mean? It's like, I can't use all this damn stuff. It feels like they really try to pressurize me to go out and try and bang women. And I can't do that anymore, Russ. And I was like, yeah, I know what you mean, Jack.

He's left there, mate. There was a lot going on. So he was driving. My tour manager, Kumar, would be in, you have like six bunks. So Kumar would be in one of the bunks. I would be in one of the bunks. My wife's friend was in one of the bunks. And my support act, Joe Maggio, was in one of the bunks.

And my wife and son were in the kind of big bed at the back of the bus that they would sleep in and it had a kind of a little kind of shower if they needed it and there was a little cot so they would kind of go off so so basically what would happen is we would drive from one venue to the next overnight and then park up outside that venue and then in the morning we would kind of wash in the venue in their showers and sometimes they're amazing sometimes yeah that's a gamble I'll say what is a gamble is when you've got a an eight-month-old son and he wants to sit

on the green room carpet and you're like, who was on last night? It was a metal, it was a metal battle, wasn't it? Up you get. Up you get, come on. It was folk. Go on, there you go, you're fine.

So yeah, that was pretty murky. And then what would happen is my wife would get ready to go to bed to put my son to sleep in the bus while we would do the show. Oh, perfect. And she was having a shower. and he was in my arms with 15 minutes to go before going on stage in Seattle.

And that was a really, you know, you kind of need that hour. Yeah. But there's just no world in which you can say to your missus. Can you bring the child in with you whilst you wash yourself for the first time today? Because I'm incredibly busy. I need to think of my thoughts. The other thing with that hour is, and I know this, maybe we've all got different things we do that hour. But what I want to do is zone out by looking at my phone.

Do you know what I mean? Or just do nothing. So it's almost even worse to go, could you just take my son? Because I just want to look at Instagram mindlessly. Yes. Because I'm not, it's not like I'm pacing and remembering the show or something. I just need to almost not exist, if that makes sense. It's a funny thing, isn't it?

Or kind of like, it's so interesting, the rituals that everyone goes through. I remember a really brilliant moment during lockdown or the beginning of the lockdown. Or maybe, no, we were just coming out of lockdown and I was doing these shows at Clapham Grand and Michael McIntyre texted me and it was like, you know, can I come and do 10 minutes? I said, absolutely.

And it was so... Have you got 10, Michael? Yeah, well, this is it. But it was so funny because he had a gig for a year and you could see him backstage kind of like revving himself up. It was incredible to see someone, a talented comedian just

he was just chatting to people and just trying to get it you know that thing where you're like wow you forget even someone as incredible as him this is clearly his process he's got to go and find strangers

and just make him laugh and just sort of yeah yeah yeah because I try and zone out but then about 20 minutes before I go and annoy the sound engineer or the tour manager's got I just need to speak at people for a bit

just to warm up slightly or otherwise it's just like such a cold opening I used to do that for my TV show was like I would go up I'd be away from the guys I wrote the show with and I'd just go up for like an hour to kind of just chat to the researchers

and sort of and do exactly that and clearly they're busy I do that with wardrobe yeah I'm gonna sit there like putting some like making a last minute you know royal guards outfit or something I'm just sat there going can we watch Top of the Pops too

on your screen in it It's funny, but that kind of very, I don't know, like low level, just chat with strangers is, it's so invaluable. But hopefully they'll come an age where my son is able to just chat with me, and that'll be nice. At this point, he was just kind of looking at me and I was looking at him. Did your wife enjoy it, enjoy it though? Like, because, you know, it's a lot of ball like moving around. It's great for you because you get to see your son and stuff. But like, it would probably just be easier in the house.

Yeah, but the bus. the bus became that it was a moving house so we had everything and you know we were in so she went with one of her mates came um so then they you know when we were in europe they kind of went to the van goff museum and they kind of then the next day they're going to the we're in Paris and they're kind of mooching about and then right we're in Vienna and they're they're kind of off and they were doing stuff so it was brilliant so she had a friend yeah that makes a difference on your own is depressing isn't it well yeah exactly can you just because I were just like making notes

and trying to write stuff about the place we were in and whatnot so yeah it was great it was I would thoroughly recommend it and also it was kind of you know my wife was on maternity leave and when do you ever get the opportunity to kind of travel from yeah yeah I've got the yeah the itinery was nuts we were just like did Berlin and then kind of you know Munich and Vienna and it was incredible it was so much fun they be coming on this one as well

Well, hopefully my wife's back at work now but she works Monday to Wednesday so I booked it Thursday to Sunday so she can do Whip Switch and Nottingham she can't get out of those ones Russell Well this is it Well but you know

It's a bit different wandering round fucking ipswitch for the day Isn't it where you mate She can spend a Saturday and Sunday in Stockton Well that's it's a bit like But can she do it on a wet Tuesday in Stokes You know what is that Anyone can tour at Amsterdam

down. So are you driving around in a bus for that one then? Are you just back and forth for the tour manager and she'll start home? Yeah, so I'll kind of like back and forth and, you know, get back whenever I can. So then you'll have the baby like Monday to Wednesday essentially and then you hand over for your tour shows at the weekend. Yeah. You've absolutely nailed it so far. It's absolutely bulletproof system.

Well, that was the plan really and it's worked really well. And also you then, at the minute, I'm kind of, like, when you're in kind of like stand-up mode, it's so much fun. And then when you're in dad mode, you don't kind of, you know, it just feels like the perfect mix of like, you know, of doing the two things. What I find interesting is like, so you, I'd say you and Rob are the two people I know that are most kind of teethy. Teethy. Yeah, we, but Rob's natural. Yeah.

easy to work with because they'll provide a lot of stuff and I can just sit there. So it's been a lovely morning. Now, there are two people I work with that you like love comedy and stand up. I've got a theory that almost every comedian who I'm friends with wanted to be a musician but became a comedian. But I'd say you two don't really fall. Maybe the two exceptions. But if you go, Ramesh would have done anything to be a hip-hop act. A castor wanted to be a drummer.

Joel was in a metal band. Ed Gamble would be in a heavy metal band. Nish Kuma would be Bob Dylan if he could be. All these people wanted to be musicians but became comedians. But you two are comedians, right? So what I find interesting is like that was the central thing of your life, right? And then you've had a kid. And how have you found it as, you know that phrase like the pram in the hallway

is the death of creativity or whatever? It's not that. But it's like, how have you? you found it has affected your relationship with work. Do you know what has made me think? To bring up McIntyre again, I have such respect for those comedians that got incredible when, and well, including, you know, you guys, you had your kids young, I mean, I'm 45 and I've kind of done everything comedically that I ever dreamt I would get to do.

And I now have a kid and it's like, oh, cool, I'll do the job I love alongside it. But the fact that when I was doing the Edinburgh Festival, I didn't have a kid. McIntyre had a kid. That's what I found you to imagine. It's so incredible that he was able to write all these genius routines. So what I would, what I, it feels to me like you have this kind of parental responsibility to provide. And that this is the way that I provide. So it feels like almost like gigs are like you're going out searching for firewood that you can then bring back to the family.

this is the only way I know to kind of provide. So that's, I feel that that's changed me slightly. And listen, I'm fine financially, but I still feel that need to kind of. I totally found my relationship with the work in terms of, I saw it, not like it became a, but I saw it much more financially once I had kids. Yeah, it's weird. Because it felt like I was doing this for the family now. It wasn't, it is essentially quite a selfish kind of job in a way.

Do you know what I mean? where you are going out for yourself you're doing blah blah blah and when I had a kid it did totally change my relationship with like the thoughts I had around work and why I was working if you know what I mean but what never goes away is when you have that thought or that idea and to bring it back to Bob Dylan Bob Dylan said that he wrote songs to perform for people so I can't I can't entertain myself I don't have this skills to sit with myself and write a book and enjoy my own company. If I think of a thing, I need to say it to strangers so that it becomes something because before that it isn't anything. It's just an idea. Yeah. But that feeling, and I bet you, you have that. I don't know when you mention all of those comics, that the great thing we get to do, we get to write songs with people. Essentially, that's what a routine is. You have this idea and the

audience let you be funny and they let you get to a place. When they laugh at it, opens up other roots because you get egged on and it's all this now. And it's so immediate. That's what I love about it is you have an idea. You can go out that night and say it. You don't have to run it past a producer or anyone else or another band member. It's just yourself. Or it can just come to you and it's it can be anything.

And you're only ever sort of two months away from being brilliant again. If you're a bit bored with your stuff, you can just sort of sit down with yourself, have a few thoughts and just go to a club and try and kick it around. And that's what I love about it. It's the ability to kick it about. out you know so you like you you had an insane work epic you're so ambitious and you did so well and everything you touch sort of turn to gold like your russell howards tv show was massive and it was on

every it was basically on every edinburgh poster there must have like they wanted to get on your another comic show like to showcase themselves but like obviously had long writing days for that and you was really committed but i found when i had kids not so much financial thing there was all i've always had that and i think i speak for all of us none of us come from any money so that you always have that thing in the back of your head. I'll need to keep the money and you're worried about money. It's an inbuilt thing. But I used to find that like when I did not the week,

I'd work so hard and I'd be killing myself to do like as much as possible to get as best as best. But now I'm at a point where I go, right, the kids have finished school. I've got five good jokes. I'm just going to have to accept that that's all I've got today so I can see my children and make that sort of joke. Do you ever struggle with that where you feel like,

oh, I'm not giving my career 100%. But what you've just said is like the, perfect working class distillation. There's a book called Deep Work by a guy called Cal Newport and there's about I guess 300 pages in this book and you've summed that up exactly. But it's like if you want to work deep, let's say you do two hours and then you stop and whatever you got you got and then you put the

laptop away or you put your notepad away and that's that and then you go back to your life. But it's this kind of gradual um because tomorrow you'll come up with another five and then the day after that another five yeah and then you can get rid of four of those and then it's it's that kind of process i think otherwise like imagine being you know i'm 45 imagine giving up spending time with your son just to kind of you know come up with a routine so you just have to you but you have to then put it into sort of system. So you go right Monday to Wednesday, I'll work my bollocks off like I used to. I'll do a proper 9 to 5, you know, if I'm writing or whatever, or Thursday to Sunday, I'll properly

go for it on tour. And then when I'm in dad mode, you know, you just kind of hang out and see what happens and it's incredible. And what's amazing about having kids is every cliche is true. Yeah. They'll sometimes, and they are so oblivious that they've given you a memory forever that's what i find fast remember and they won't remember any but he i remember my son just put his he put his head on my sort of inner arm and he just like just rested it there for a bit because there was no other place in the world he wanted his head to be and i just felt like so happy and like oh god i just warmed my entire soul and then he just like just wandered off and he has no idea and I'll now look like it just feels like that's his place moments like that why would you

give that up just to go right I got to write this bit about Farage did you struggle did you struggle with that though like you say you've read a book about it so it must have been something that was playing on your mind and with a working class background I think we are built to go right you've got to move all that sand over to that you know it's like you work your bollocks off for 12 hours and that's how you feel like you've been successful and done well that you're completely exhausted at the end of it like did you struggle with that balance no I think honestly, I think if you're trying to create something and you get something out of it like I do, it's just about setting a time limit, isn't it? I think Seinfeld speaks about that.

It's whether it's two hours, four hours, whatever it is, just do it, right, and then just put it, put it away. And you have to change your life because when I used to do the TV show, I would work. That sounded all-consuming. It was crazy, but Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, you know, Monday and then Tuesday we do the show and then Wednesday I was in the edit and Thursday. So it was kind of like some weeks, but sometimes it's 12 weeks. But I loved it and I also felt like I was responsible for kind of steering the ship of the show.

Well, that's your name on it. That was your purpose. To that point, a young kid who wanted to become a comedian, you've got your own show, your name's above the door, you're in charge, this is everything you've ever wanted, but then all of a sudden this thing lands in your lap that's way more important than that. Exactly.

and but it's and it's so but it's also so much fun and so kind of tiring and but you know my son's beginning to walk now which is just great and you know he's kind of he's kicking a ball which is you know as a football fan the most exciting thing in the world and um he's kind of talking and you're reading in books and he just wants to hug you or play you know and he's just beginning to do jokes so you say kiss you want to kiss can have a kiss and he'll kind turn his head away and then lean his head in and pull it away and just all these lovely things that you're so I love him I love him so much I think that I love him I've said it I've said it I love him the test is can you do stand up where you don't sell your

kid down the road for the welcome to our world well yeah yeah because you don't want to kind of I remember my my friend our picture told me an insane story that it will always stick with me. He was doing a joke about his son and his son was four at the time and they were in Sweden where he lives and his wife was going to be looking after his son. They were doing this festival and the son walked into the crowd. He's at the back of the crowd. He sees daddy on stage and daddy can't see his son and daddy does a joke about his son and everyone's laughing and his son's going that that's not true that's not true oh god and he can't be heard because the laughter is so loud oh my god and then the next morning at breakfast when this is all you know this all comes to

be his four-year-old son just looked him and it was just so unfair oh my god but it's i think about that so much where you go, God, I can't imagine how awful that felt, but it completely changed Thal's perspective where you go, right, I have to make sure I do stuff that you can stand by. Well, that's kind of the rule I have. And I think, Rob, you're the same, is it's about me. It's not about, it's about my relationship to being a parent and my relationship to trying to be a parent. Yes. And because being a parent is basically like an apprentice, task. You know how the apprentice task is set up to fail? Yeah. You know, like, you, the producers make an apprentice task where however hard you try,

you can't succeed, basically. That's parenting. And like, I think that is the core of the joke, isn't it, when you're talking about parenting, is that you're trying because you're desperate for it to succeed and because you love your children so much, but you can't help but fail. and that's why I find it difficult if it's like I there's loads of things I wouldn't speak about because it's like you know that's my daughter's business or that's my son's business yeah and that's kind of everyone's not everyone's like that and I I always find that fascinating where you go it works now but at what cost yeah yeah you know you might be making money now but you're going to have to save that for therapy is this money is this being said out loud by someone else or just

my own mind talking. But that's been the thing and that's like from the start we decided not to put any photos up of our children. We don't say their names anywhere. Obviously we do this podcast but like I say it's I always so this is my

I am talking about my experience of being a dad that my children are sort of bit part plays in as opposed to she did this the other day and then there were a couple of moments where I have done that. I've not always been perfect with that but when they were a lot younger but now they're much older I'm really steering away from

exact moments and it'll be more me going oh my God I tried to get them up from school I tried to do that's more of the I think actually that's what But it's really funny as well Relate with more than my kid Because no one cares Oh my kid said a funny thing the other day

Everyone just think they'll fuck off No they didn't You think it's funny we don't Yeah it's a bit like explaining what your tattoo means It's like you should know Oh your strings And nobody gives a fuck

But then I throw My brothers are my parents and extended family right under the bus. We're fucking booting them under. Do you know what I mean? I throw away and I feel like, but they're grown up so I'm allowed. But it's sort of, it's weird, isn't it? That like, well, it's funny. My brother come around my house every day and like my brother has a preternatural ability

to get out of trouble. Like it's extraordinary, like the amount of times where, I'll give an example, during COVID, we were doing one of those zooms with all my cousins. It was brilliant. We're all kind of drinking and it was, you know, I was hanging out with them. I felt like I was in the room. It was great. And all, like Lee and Lewis and they're all, everyone's there and Jake's there.

It's brilliant. And then we hear this like running water sound. And I look over at my brother's like quadrant. And I'm like, are you in the bath? Right. And my brother goes, people wash, you dickhead. And suddenly, I'm the weirdo. My brother has, he has that ability where you got.

I've got him there. But he's kind of looking at me. He's completely naked. We can't see anything. But he's just chatting away. kind of washing himself, it's disgusting. So the other day, we've got a dog bowl on the table because my son likes putting his hand in the dog bowl.

My brother walks into the house, looks at my son who's in his chair, and does what he knows to be the funniest thing. So he puts his head in the bowl and starts drinking from the dog bowl, pretending to be a dog. Now, I found it very entertaining. It blew my kids' mind.

Just a moment, once you go, and water's going everywhere. we're really, really going for it. My wife comes in and understandably says quite loudly, what the fuck you're doing? To watch my brother goes, maybe next time offer your guests a drink and just walks out of that. That sums him up that you go,

no one has an ability like him to do that. But I guess it's stories like that, isn't it, where you're trying to do those kind of parenting adjacent stories where they're kind of in them and it's funny. And I'm, but I've always been. quite mindful, similar with my missus, of not wanting to kind of make their, like,

because my wife's a doctor, I don't want to make her life heart. Do you know what I mean? I think times a million with your kid where, you know, what have you told a story? And it was really funny, but then they've got to deal with the repercussions of that story. And I don't know what

school is like now, but I know what it was like in my day. Can you imagine that? The children hasn't changed. The children That's what I mean. I was brilliant that clip of you shitting yourself that thought parts gone viral. Yeah.

And he's like, great, I've got to go to school now, thanks. Yeah, exactly. And everyone knows about that. Yeah, exactly. It's that funny thing. We often ask like kind of how, because obviously there's a very different generation we are to the generation above.

Plus we are kind of, we've lived a real different life because often we're interviewing people that have, you know, done kind of mad things. And that's why the point. set tapes, which now feels like something from the fucking Victorian age, having a Waltman with a cassette

for like my child now. They're like, what is that? My, mate, listen to this. I was at Top Secret the other day and the MC said, we got any 20-year-olds in? A big cheer. We got any 30-year-olds?

Big cheer. Goes anyone, anyone 40? And there was like a couple of, and this, the MC went well done on surviving the pandemic. And you're like going, oh, God. Oh, Jesus. We are all.

We are all. It was just that moment where you're like, flipping how we are now the punchline. So like, because I watched your, and it's a really interesting, like really great documentary, the one you did about the pandemic. And it sums up what you were saying earlier about.

Like, you know, you want to get out there and you want to connect with people. People don't know, though, Russell, when you basically flew to New Zealand in the middle of the pandemic to go in isolation in the hotel so that then you could move freely and do shows in New Zealand, because that's the only place open

because they'd done quite, severe lockdown measures at the start. So you went there to isolate so you could tour. Yeah. Insane. And your parents are in that. And they couldn't be two more different parents in the world. Yeah.

So you've got your mum, your dad who's like an achiever and he's like really straight. And then you've got your mum who people all have seen on things who's very sweet kind of kind of really mumsy woman. What have you taken from that? Like, and, well, have you consciously taken stuff from that? Yes, you must do, eh? But I'm, I work quite hard because my dad's, you know, a real work. And also, my dad's just a very strange, man.

Like, if I did a travel show with my mum where we're just chatting all the way, if it had been with me and dad, it would have been two men who look very similar, sat in a car in utter silence. He's absolutely not interested in me, you know, he's just, and that's fine and I get it but like he used to get he'll come to gigs and he loves the gigs but he'll be so honest

you know really? Yeah, he started slow you started pretty slow down and you're like well you know sometimes you start slow down Oh my God but is he doing that because he doesn't want you to get too big for your boots do you think

or is it actually real feedback where if you had a quiet moment with yourself you'd agree with that comment or you know what you think it is? I don't know I never know I, it's kind of the mystery. Like, he's, he's just a very, he's a lovely, odd fellow, my dad. And my dad is fairly indifferent to me, and my mom loved me too much.

And I think that's how you become a comedian. Mommy's little soul, you're looking for daddy's approval. It was a bit like doing, yeah, in many ways, it was like doing the downstairs gig at Top Secret and then the upstairs gig. This is great. This is absolutely fine. Oh, God. Oh, Jesus, I've got nothing.

So if your son had done a gig and you're watching it and you thought it was a bit slow, but then he got into his groove, what do you think you'd say at the end of the gig to him? Oh, Jesus, what a question. Like, I just think the style of parenting is so different these days. So, for example, but my dad... But it wasn't for your mum back then, was it?

Well, but my dad's, so my dad's dad left. before he was born. And then his mom died when he was young. So he just wasn't really ever, you know, and he was like living in a car when he met my mom when he was 16. So, you know, he's kind of, he's done. At least his son's upgraded to living in a bus. That's the idea.

I remember at Christmas our dad would just, you know, he'd kind of go off and he'd just like light a fire at the bottom of the garden. And we sort of knew, be like, Oh, right. He needs a moment. Yeah, he needs a moment. It's so funny, isn't it that generation? But it is that generation.

He's like, oh, dad's burning something. Okay. Even age eight, we were like, you know, but he's just got, I remember having a bit that sums him up so brilliantly that there's a kindness and just he's inadvertently weird. So my sister's, my sister had a rabbit,

and this thing was twitching because it had mexomatosis. and my dad killed it with a spade, like in front of us as kids. He just went clear, like, whack, whack, like that. And even as a kid, I remember thinking maybe clear the perimeter first before you'd go ahead. But he genuinely was like, I just don't like, I just don't want to see it suffer. And you're like, well, that's fine.

But, you know, she's six. I make, listen, I find it incredibly entertaining. Like, I've got an ability to look outside of my world and see that you're, mad but she's she's done now dad she's sick and the honest truth is me and daniel hated that is my brother we hated that rabbit because we had to clear it out so when dad killed it it was just a glorious day of just of just suddenly like going get in we've got we got our sundays back but you know like that's the thing we just my entire childhood was just jobs that was what all the time it's just kind of this weird like you know get a paper around right and

and now, you know, dig a hole and help me put this fence up and, like, bright, plastering. Like, doing plastering when you're nine. Like, plastering's hard. I don't think you can do that now. If you don't skim it right and then, you're like, fuck, you know. He must say if he's had that difficult child

and was living in a car and he's seen you, all of your, you and your siblings all do so well for themselves and you, you know, you're travelling the world with these big sold-out shows. It must be really proud deep down. Yeah, of course it is. Yeah, he just, yeah. He just, yeah, and he, he adores my son and he adores my, my sister's kids.

He's like, he's a brilliant, he's a brilliant, brilliant dad and granddad. He's just, he was forged in fire. So there's, there's going to be, there's complications. Whereas my mum is, it's got like six siblings and, you know, everything was, he was, really, is all right. That bristolian, I was left in a pram, I was left in a pram once. And that's my mum's big story. Do you know what I mean?

I was left in a pram. I just left, and nobody took me. Nobody stole me. So she kind of makes it very much about herself. But my dad would never kind of go, well, I see you're stuck in a pram, and I raise you this. And so how are you then going to, like, as a parent, do you think about this?

Like, obviously, and we both discussed this, we could make our children's lives really so much easier than it was, you know. It's difficult, isn't it? How do you do it? Yeah, well, I think, I don't know I just think my wife's really clever

and has a really good emotional intelligence and so I kind of like she's definitely the leader I think of how to parent and I'm I kind of like you're the assistant

you're like she's pet and you're one of the assistants yeah yeah exactly and like sometimes I'm like that bloke at Newcastle and everyone's like sit down me sit down I've got it

I've got it with you haven't you're not managing Give one's hands at the school gates, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll sort with that out. So I kind of, yeah, I kind of, it feels like you're the sous chef to the kind of the main chef, really. But, but I don't know, maybe it just, like, again, to put it into sort of context, my dad, I read my dad's diary. My dad went to university on a scholarship, and I read his diary when he was doing his finals. and he basically did really well in my exam. I'm pretty certain I got 85%, which is mad to kind of react like that.

But he kind of won a medal for like the top degree that year. And the next day he took me down the beach because I was won. And he was like, took the board to the beach, he loved it. So again, it's like how are you able to revise? Know that you did really well in the exam and then still be an amazing dad. So yeah, it's very, I don't know, like, I feel very fortunate. I almost feel like I'm stepping into, like, when my son is, I don't know, five,

I'll probably be retired, probably be doing gigs occasionally, and I'll be like this weird stay-at-home dad. And I'm quite looking forward to that. Like John Lennon, when he had his period where he just lived with his son in the Dakota building. Yeah, I think so. I just kind of want to do the school run. You'll be school run. I do.

Mate, honestly, I did, I did NCT. I loved all that. Do you know what I think, though, I think if you fully commit to being school dad, right, and you do all the pickup. all the drop-offs, your wife's working, you've done your, you know, you've hit all your ambition points in your career, you, and you join all that the parent group, you're, it's a good little, and it's like, what is it, you get when you go off heroin? Is it called like, methadone?

Methadone. You can just sort of just get a little bit out of that sort of a need to be funny comedian thing, just at the playground, do a quick five, pick the kid up and go. And then it's like, keeps you on a level rather needing to gig all the time. Do you know, I think it probably will be like that. And I'd just be looking at my son, he'll be in the back going, how did I write that? but a few more the parents I knew turned up

there was a bit of a vibe but at the start it was hard work it's always that funny thing isn't it because I don't know if you're the same but I will try stuff out on anybody just you know if there's an opportunity if I've got a little bit

and I meet someone in the park it's like bang I'm in does that affect you when you're gigging so I have that if I'm gigging though I'm empty I've got nothing to gig if I've done a gig that week and I've been giging a lot

I don't but if I'm off the stand up up circuit. I'm not gigging at all. I'm awful for that. I'm a problem, right? And to lose kicking me. You could, you could never retire, Rob. No, I just have to sort of, I have to just narrow it rather because I've got, I can't do that. I don't know if Russell calms down a bit when he's on tour with the trying stuff out on people, because you've got you're out there. Yeah, but you still, like, if there's that, I bet, no, I don't. If the, if the opportunity, like, well, for it, it's sort of, I'll give you an example of like of this is a so there was some I was on holiday recently with my son

and he was chasing pigeons and it's just this thought I've often had in my head and he was chasing the pigeons and I was going right I will never have a better opportunity because we are quite literally seeing the thing I'm about to observe so the audience couldn't be more primed and I've tried this bit before to deathly silence but I was going well it might work now because they're actually seeing it. So I turned to this kind of this white, and I was kind of going,

I said, look, it's funny, isn't it? The world over. You know, the kids and pigeons, they're always chasing pigeons.

I said, if there's any justice and the Buddhists are right, then paedophiles will come back as pigeons. And it fucking ripped it. And I was like, there you go. I knew it.

And it was just that horrible thing of God, I knew that was funny. But how would, I ever get it. But, yeah, so if there's ever an opportunity. We're going to have to gig around pigeons from now on. Mate, but it's the fact that that's a big joke to sling in at a fucking breakfast restaurant of like, if the Buddhist are right, that's pedophiles, aren't they?

Two eggs. You know, it was, I've just, I have that, I have that illness. I just, because when people laugh, for me, it basically helps you realize that you're not mad. So you, and so, so, and some of the stuff is, like, I often think, can you imagine if they interviewed our partners, like the partners of comedians, because those poor people, they have to see all the jokes

that don't make it to the stage. Like all the, you know, these kind of weird half thoughts and is that something? And that energy and need for attention, really, because it is, you know, we have got a need to,

you know, it's weird, we may be in denial about it, but there is that need, we need for some reason. Yeah, I wonder what it is. Yeah, I wonder what it is. But you're right,

because I, I think there is that similarity. between music and comedy that they're just songs so you kind of go you know you have this very visual idea i think very often with a joke where you kind of go right that's funny now i've got to find the right words to make strangers see what i see in my head that's kind of what it feels like to me being a comedian that you're kind of like oh that's really funny yeah yeah that's interesting i've got to find something now so they can see what i see your son being a comedian how do you feel about him wanting to following your footsteps as a comedian

I would love that. Would you? Really? But I think because you would be able to kind of help, I think. And I think I'd be quite good at that in terms of like, I often, I really like giving people ideas. You've got to be very careful, you know, when you kind of offer a joke. But I love giving people a tag for a joke. Yeah.

I'm not really very kind of precious about it. I've gone, oh, you know that you should do that. Be really funny. um so i think i'd be like that but i'd have to kind of make sure that i let him have his own kind of voice without trying to write it for him i think that would be the worst if you were just trying to do everything yeah that's really funny you should try members try this or like the dad at the side of kids football you don't want to be the the comedy equivalent of yeah you've got you've got you've got to be slow you've got to sit with it a bit more

before you hit the punchline you're too nervous son yeah but again to make it about my dad so my dad used to come and watch me play football. He's not really interesting. You're a really good footballer, aren't you? Listen to this. This explains it. So my dad used to watch me a footie and go, oh, are you going to do something flash or what?

So he would, rather than like track back or give it easy, my dad was on the sideline, kind of a couple of robunas, a little pirouette. Like, have some stepovers. This is tedious, son. Like, so he was the exact opposite. I've never heard that ever in football. Mad. Isn't it mad?

Imagine being 10 years old. Go, come on. Let's have a couple of. Croy of turns. Jesus Christ. These people are dead. Yeah, everyone with it. Don't pass everyone else.

But, yeah. I don't know. It's, because my wife's a doctor as well, so it's that thing of, it's probably a safer job. You're both healing people. Wow. But one actually is, and the other one. And the sad truth is you won't find a doctor who wants their kid to be a doctor because it's unbelievably difficult.

or were you like, I'd just have an easy life, just be a comic, you know, but I don't know, how about you? Would you like your kids to be? Oh, I don't know. I, I like the idea of, I quite like it when they're into things that I'm not into, and I feel like I'm joining them on their patch, if you know what I mean. That's a better way, I'd love him. I'd love it if he did something creative, like I'd love him to be, yeah, I think that's

where I'd be a nuisance. If he was a songwriter or something like that, I'd be kind of like, yeah, let's, let's write some lyrics. I would love that. Dad, I don't want you to, I don't want you to learn a guitar solo. You've got mates to musicians. I've got a pal of mine who's, and I'm all, I cannot have dropped enough hints to say, you know, have you ever, you know, somebody, and he's so. Maybe you do want to be a musician, Russell. After all that, maybe you are one of the people. I would love to be in a studio and see people, like, but watching Get Back, I love it. that looks amazing

yeah like I was part of the team like fuck singing and dancing and playing yeah well this is it but the idea of being so splitting the money ugh yeah you're a sketch act fucking up

fuck off just be over the overheads of the roadies Rob think about the other yeah but that's it but it's why all the sketch acts you never get

working class sketch acts because it's like I'm splitting it free ways fuck that I'll do all the voices I'll go full Eddie Murphy on this for fuck all that Do you want to ask a final question, Josh?

You go for it, Rob. Because I've just got a thing saying your disc space is almost full, so I'm slightly panicking at that moment. Final question, we ask everyone, what's the one thing your partner does as a parent where you go, oh my God, she's amazing. Like, I'm in awe of her. I couldn't do this without her.

And what's the one thing she does that frustrates you slightly, parenting-wise, that if she was to listen, she might go, yeah, I think Russell's got a point there. Oh, gosh. It's a bit awkward bringing it up face to face. just her composure i think that's what i find one thing that blew my mind and i don't know if you had this feeling with your partners was their instant ability women's instant ability to hold a baby with such perfection that they they know that all the angles and where the head goes and

you know they're just clink and just her ability whereas i held him like like like a man on fucking mescaline holding a fish like i was so like just like i had no kind of grace so that's why just the serenity and grace with which she does motherhood i find phenomenal and her ability to to to just do it effortlessly whereas with me i'm very much kind of honestly we had to put the cot together which was all i had to do in the grand scheme of things and i would argue that putting your cot together is basically male pregnancy. And I had a very difficult labour. I was, you know, there was all sorts of noises come in. And, you know, I said some pretty full-on people about the Swedes, just, just screaming. But that's what I find incredible.

It's just the calmness and the effortless. My only criticism, my only critique is, it's very specific. She'll go, oh, can you go and get some socks? Or can you go and get, a coat or a jumper it's it's in it's in the drawer and I go in the drawer and for whatever reason I can't find I never I can never find it I'm there going and I'm looking in every inch going oh not again man where is it it's got to be here I'm looking at everything going where the fuck come on right okay it's not here we can say with real certainty it's not here so you go back oh yeah there isn't there's no socks and then she'll walk walking and go, they go, and they appear instantly.

And again, that feels like a critique of me, but I just want to know what she's doing. Like, where are, what the, I, it's so insane to me that I can, it'll be a good five minutes and the panic, you're trying to stop a bomb going, come on, man. Yeah, you don't want to give up in that situation. But when they're here, they can't be anywhere else. Like, she's going to find them. She's not, well, she can't find her because they're definitely not here this time. You're fucking right, man.

come on and then you go back she finds it and that the failure you feel when you come back with nothing and then she goes and finds it instantly you're like oh god be honest by it really Russell this has been brilliant thank you so much it's been a joy I enjoy I really enjoyed that

thanks fellas Russell Howard there we go I think you're right about that Russell Howard is one of the people in comedy that loves doing comedy pound for pound I think he loves doing stand-up comedy more than anyone that does comedy

Russell is on tour Yeah, from January the 22nd. Um, yeah, great venues. Um, go and see him. Right, Josh, I'll see you next time. Hello, Parenting Hell listeners. Recognise that voice? Yes, it's Josh Whitickham here.

I have got a new podcast, Josh Whitickham's Museum of Pop Culture. And I'm going to say it, I'm about 85. 5% sure you're going to love it. Here are the reasons why. Number one, I'm confident if you're listening now, you don't hate me and possibly think I'm funny. Number two, I'm confident if you're listening now, you like podcasts. Number three, I'm confident if you're listening to me and Rob, you prefer pop culture to people talking about things, let's be honest, boring things like history, economics or politics. I know I do and that is why I made this podcast. I wanted a show that tells the stories I love from popular culture in the way other podcasts do for drier topics.

see above. Basically, I wanted a podcast that realized Millie Vanilli were more interesting than Elizabeth I first. Join me as I give the definitive, or at least the funniest, takes on Mr. Blobby. When Ghost Watch convinced BBC viewers, ghosts were real, when a band burned a million pounds for a laugh. The Spice Girls, a truly catastrophic Spider-Man musical with music from You Two, and David Hasselhoff, Baywatch, and his part in the fall of the Berlin Wall. All of them are, by the way. Either you know what these things are and you're about to learn far more about them than you ever realized you wanted to, or you don't, and you're about to be introduced to some of the maddest things in modern or ancient history. Stiffnecks will learn,

lose next will laugh. New episodes available every Wednesday and Saturday, perfect to fill those gaps between your weekly doses of parenting hell. So go on, you might as well listen, subscribe and follow wherever you get your podcast now. Museum of Pop Culture with me, Josh Whitacom, available everywhere from the 1st of January. Thank you.