Robin's Nest from American Humane - Inside Culver Duck Farms: Humane Care from Hatch to Harvest

Episode Date: April 21, 2025

What does it take to raise ducks the right way? On this episode of Robin’s Nest, Dr. Robin Ganzert sits down with Heidi Parnin and Drew Frey of Culver Duck Farms—two passionate leaders shaping the future of humane poultry practices.From species-specific care to earning American Humane Certification, Heidi and Drew share how Culver is setting the gold standard for duck welfare. If you’ve ever wondered what responsible farming really looks like—or why duck care is different from other poultry—this behind-the-scenes conversation is for you.Tune in for a fresh look at compassion in agriculture—and the people making it happen.

Welcome to Robin's Nest. Many of us feel a deep bond with animals, from the pets we cherish at home to the endangered species in nature. Join us for lively, informative conversations where together we will build a more humane world. Today we're thrilled to have two incredible leaders from Culver Duck Farms with us. First we have Heidi Parnin, the corporate vet services manager. With over 13 years of experience in animal welfare and biosecurity, Heidi plays a key role in making sure every part of their operation upholds the highest humane standards. Joining her is Drew Fry, Director of Live Operations at Culver Duck. With nearly 40 years of experience, Drew has been instrumental

in ensuring top-notch duck care and production, all while staying true to Culver Duck's commitment to responsible animal care. I'm excited to hear how Heidi and Drew are shaping the future of humane and sustainable poultry practices. Let's dive in. Heidi, Drew, we're so thrilled to have you today. Thank you so much. We're here to talk Duck. Isn't that wonderful? And about your commitment to being American Humane Certified and importantly all the incredible work you do at Culver Duck. Glad to have you in Robin's Nest. Yeah, Robin, thank you for having us here today. We are very honored. This is very special for us to be a part of this. Thank you, thank you. Well, you have an incredible background and commitment, and my goodness, Drew, when we introduced you, 40 years, amazing. So you've seen a lot happen in the duck industry, haven't you? I have. It's been quite the journey, quite the ride. I've seen a lot of changes.

And over the last eight years, it's just rapidly changed. And being associated with American Humane and some of the other biosecurity with high pathogenetic influenza, the market's really changed. The industry's changed. Yes. It's been a major focus on continuous improvement and continuous education for all levels of the company. Anyone even in our facility to understand what's going on on farm and what can happen

with what is coming into the facility. So Heidi, when we think about raising ducks on a farm, a lot of people who are listening in today's Robin's Nest, who are joining us in the nest, never thought about a word like biosecurity, right? And the safeties and the protocols on what happens on today's farms. And I bet Drew, 40 years ago, right?

We didn't talk about the word biosecurity. I'm not sure if we even used that term on farms and ranches. But boy, you've seen a lot of things change. We now talk about bird flu, all sorts of things that I know that you're ensuring doesn't happen to the ducks in your care. But 40 years ago to today, what do you think some of the biggest changes have been? I think the concern about diseases from outside entities. Now it's in cattle, it's in pork. So our farmers need to be concerned about anything that comes close to their barn. Our producers are made up of mainly Amish Mennonite growers, 85 to 95 percent.

That's what we appreciate about our community. They want to be on the farm. They want it to be there for their family. They want to pass it on. And so they've had to go through a large learning curve as well. And so that's why we brought Heidi on is to help intensify our focus on biosecurity. With animal welfare. It has been a big partnership with our growers. They are family and that's what we want to keep that is the family aspect of our company. That when we go to the farm,

yes we educate everyone, but we want to see those kids running in and out. We want to see the kids pick up eggs. You know, they're the ones that bring us cookies. Those are the weddings we go to. So it has been stepping through that and culturally understanding where your boundaries are at. Yes. And working through that. I think back to my grandfather who at times, well, we would never do that. Now we do.

And we have to get them to understand why and where and what the risks are. You never want to have the devastation of losing a farm because of avian influenza. Well, let's talk about avian influenza. But let's go back to that one point. I didn't realize that your farmers are Amish and Mennonite for the most part, which is wonderful.

Talk about an incredible family strength and values, legacy of generations devoted to their land and to building that farm to pass on to their children and their grandchildren and the like. It's a really special group that's taking care of these ducks and raising these ducks. It is. And they're being challenged because land isn't being produced. Land is becoming a rare resource in our area. So it's harder to make a living off the farm like they used to. So poultry barns, other types of barns are one way to keep the family at home. The amazing part is we'll have five siblings of the same family with barns for us. We're working on

the third generation in one family that will have barns for us over 40 years. Which is amazing and a challenge at the same time when you think of your biosecurity. We talk animal welfare and we talk biosecurity, but they really come hand in hand. We always want to worry about and are concerned about the health and well-being of our ducks. Yes, handling is number one and making sure their needs are met. But that next step is biosecurity of making sure, you know, the, you know, two brothers don't share the same equipment. Simple little things that can really help them.

So how do you've joined the company, what, 13 years ago? Did I get that? I'm with, been in the industry 13 years. Yes, we're coming up on eight years with the company. Eight years with Colver. So you've really been instrumental coming in here and again, you're working with multi-generational farmers, family members, and try to teach and instill new practices in terms of security. A lot of people don't understand biosecurity. Can you share with our listeners,

what does that mean on today's poultry farm today? The biggest thing is, you know, we always take back to the growers as you know, always take back to the growers is you know you're protecting what's inside. Every setup is different. Some companies have to shower in to go in but it's the simplicity of what not tracking in, bringing in, or if you have an outbreak of some sort, a challenge, not bringing it out and taking it to another barn. You know the cutest thing ever is watching a little girl run through there barefooted, but at the same time educating them why and what the risk is of that.

Yes, and the risk today is primarily bird flu, am I right? That is correct. Can you please share with our listeners, many of whom have seen media highlights or headlines, bird flu, and they get very fearful. And tell us a little bit from your perspective, what is that impact on the birds and what is bird flu impact on human populations? Well, in the media right now, the word bird flu is big because people are alarmed with

the dairy cows and where it could be going. But as far as our industry, we were the duck company in Indiana to be unfortunately hit and we did lose three farms. With that, when you have one positive bird, you have to depopulate the entire flock. And if it's just in one barn, you still have to depopulate the rest of the facility. It is a huge safety factor taken very seriously with regulatory. You're stuck through the process, but it's heartbreaking, emotionally, I mean, wearing of what you have to see happen. And this is for the better of the duck and the community. Where we're at in Indiana, I mean, there are places where they say if we were hit, it could take out 100 barns.

Because it would put them on hold, and you can't move things logistically. You can't take chickens to slaughter plant. You can't take ducks to the slaughter plant. You can't move eggs without permits. It's not something that's just taken lightly. Every case is, you case is hands on deck and looking at who's there, what's going on. So the bird flu itself, how is that transmitted?

Is it from a wild population? So yes, it is primarily by your waterfowl when we think of the geese flying over. And if you walk through that material and take it into your barn, but with the onset of everything with the dairy and the other animals that it has infected, there was a dolphin itself that they figured that it probably had eaten some kind of material that was infected. So it can impact more than birds. And where is the line with humans? What have we heard about human? We're starting to see some cases

of humans that have worked with cattle particularly that have got eye infections and maybe some few other symptoms. But we're not seeing this as a huge issue for humans? Not yet, no. I mean, you never know what will evolve, but really it's just been devastating to the poultry industry right now, the dairy industry is facing some big challenges. We could probably do a whole episode in Robbinsbins Nest just on bird flu to understand all of that human and animal dynamics. But I think it's important for all of us who love animals to understand that what's really

necessary is to have experts like you, Heidi, understanding the implications, the crossovers and relationships between wild animals and our animals on farms and ranches and that disease potential and how to protect those populations. And you're on the front lines fighting for those ducks and for those birds and their health. And that's an incredible, incredible role that you serve. It has been changing.

I mean, it was a huge impact to us in everything we do from the processing plant to our flock supervisors in the field and how we interact between departments and what we have to do. But I think it's for a positive. It has also brought our community together with all the different entities and industry that it did affect indirectly? Yes. Our competitors themselves, you know, we've had a couple times where everybody's waiting for the test results but we're on the phone making plans with our competitor of what road are you driving down, what are you doing with

your employees to, you know, to reduce the risk of anything out there. So when you brought up earlier what has changed, there's a lot more transparency between companies and in the industry now than there used to be. I mean, we take every flock in to be tested at the university to make sure it doesn't have avian influenza. And like Heidi said, we are in constant contact with other companies and with

governmental bodies to make sure everybody's on the same page. Indiana is a great state. We can't say enough about the support that we received from the Board of Animal Health as we went through everything in answering the phone. It's wonderful. And I think that this is going to be a topic that we can, as animal lovers, have for years to come. And then how we protect our, and be part of the conversation with farmers and ranchers too.

I want to pivot from biosecurity and the changes in 40 years that you've seen, that being a huge one for sure. I would love to know about the increased interest in duck on American dinner tables. What are you seeing in terms of market trends? Well, I think more people are interested in trying duck. Our stable customers have been our more Asian customers, but I think more of the Western world's trying duck is just getting them to know how to cook it so they don't get turned away right away.

The education piece. Education. And the association of wild duck. Oh, it's gamey. Oh, it's this. It's that. It is the key of how do you prepare it. And I think that's where some of our already cooked things have helped.

You know, you can come to the store and buy those things to take home and warm up and try it for the first time. But it makes a big difference how you cook it. Yes. You know, to drain the juices from it properly to get a good quality taste. You know what's interesting is the pork industry a number of years ago found that people didn't know how to cook pork and they had to educate and I assume that duck is in the same trajectory as what the pork industry was.

Teaching people how to cook and enjoy that healthy protein is really, really important, particularly as people are looking to go away from processed foods. So it's wonderful what you're doing. And that's one reason we were so happy at American Humane to include culvert duck recipes in our Humane Table Cookbook, which now we're getting ready to launch our next cookbook called The Global Humane Table. And we look forward to inviting you to submit some more

incredible duck recipes as part of our joint education campaign, right? We would love to. We will plan to, yes. That's wonderful. Well, you know, we talk a lot about what you're doing on farms today, the family farmers that are looking to make this a multi-generation business to come. An important value that we talked about was transparency and now certification.

Tell us a little bit about what it meant to you to go through the American Humane Certification process. Well, when it was brought up that we needed to look for something. Our goal was something to make us better and continue to make us better. We had a lot of conversations about it and it was a great start of a partnership for the duck industry. There's not a lot of research and not a lot of audits out there and certifications to help with that. Everybody wants to compare us to turkeys and chickens and it's really not true whatsoever. A bird is not a bird. Exactly. I had a lot of growers that you know

coming from the broiler industry like Heidi, you're crazy, but we've heard from Butterball that turkey is not a chicken. Very true. So looking at this and as we stepped through it the first time, it truly was a walkthrough with the certification to say, does this all make sense? And I think that's where the partnership really came together because we were working together. It wasn't just another here, you have to do this. And we don't care. It was, you cared and wanted to know our feedback

and the understanding of, you know, I understand what you're saying, but it really isn't practical. And it's the same thing we have to do with our growers when we try to implement something. It sounds great on paper and we've all talked about it, but we take it in and it doesn't work out. So why? And that's kind of where it went with the certification. And the first step was, you know, we didn't put our

printing waters in. We took it as a company. We're gonna do this steps at a time. And we are gonna have a passing score and this is what we're gonna do. And the next thing was making that next step. Yes. And that's kind of- Continual improvement. Yes. Along that way. With this audit tool that you've been part of, with the certification process, give us some ideas,

if you could, for our listeners in Robin's Nest who've not been on a farm or ranch, right? What are the factors that go into play to look at a farm, a poultry house with ducks? What are you looking for that means that it's humane? First thing when you walk in, you can tell when you look at the bedding and the ducks, the care they've taken. The more the grower walks it, the more you can tell as you walk through with an auditor. don't run from you they come to you. We also have I mean the quality of the bedding the outside appearance of the barn when you walk in you can always tell first appearances are everything but we do check for air quality making sure water of course

bedding then the lighting is a factor in there. Our barns are sided, so there's a lot of natural light that comes in there. So it does throw another twist into the way that we call things out or reference things for understanding. And there's a lot of paperwork involved as well, because it's just a proof that the farmer's been in there, that they're taking care of what they need to take care of. And we realize that most Americans are probably a generation or two removed from farming. And so there's a lot of misconceptions, a lot of misunderstandings out there. And so our desire is to be transparent and to educate and have open an open door to people that want to see our barns. I mean, we're more than happy to take people through our barns.

That's wonderful. We want to give it to everybody. It's not a, oh, this is the best barn. No, which one would you like to go to? And give everybody the opportunity to see because our barns aren't cookie cutter either. People want to think of a factory farm and it's this way. We're a family farm. They are family farms. Every one of them has their little niche and I want to say personality because of the family they come from and what they each bring to it. Along with the setup. You know years ago they had-

I love that Heidi. I love the way you just put that. It is family farms. And when you think about that, I think that term, factory farm is a terrible term. It implies something that doesn't even apply to ranching and farming. You're talking family farms and multi-generational family farms that the backbone of this country, that feeds this country, and do so safe with a safe food supply, an affordable food supply,

and especially when they're American Humane certified as culvertuck is, an ethically sourced food supply, which is very, very important for consumers. So back to that farm. You're going to go on that farm and you're going to see lighting, bedding, you're going to smell. Yes, you're going to check the records. We have manuals in each farm that are signed off and checked yearly with depending on what all we need to do if we update a process. We do have preening waters on farms, which was a huge undertaking as a company because the thought of an open water source in a barn,

and the bacterial load, and what can it do, and is it going to be beneficial. So that's another part of that, you know, with the audit tool, but the partnership of working through it. We'll also check, you know, when we look at the records, the overall mortality, how is your, how is your flock health and what's going on? They'll also look back on our records to see what our history has been. It's not just today, it's every day. And that's what we really push. Every day is audit day. I don't want to have to say, hey, heads up, we're coming in. No, we just make the schedule and let's continue to roll with it. Sorry.

And we've invested heavily in establishing strong relationships with our producers. And through those relationships, we can make some of these things happen. They weren't necessarily easy. Some of the things that we had to go through with Danish entries and the printing waters and some of the things that we had to go through with Danish entries and the printing waters and some of the many other things that we've changed over the years, because of the relationships that we established, we're able to make those changes in these farms.

That's incredible. And again, multi-generational American farms. And so we need to get rid of that word factory farm when we're thinking about culverdoc. These are family farms. These producers are the backbone of our company. That's the way I feel. And the backbone of our country when we think about feeding our families. It's very, very important.

Part of our conversations in Robin's Nest are to really educate and provide the facts about relationships with animals and the importance of science and evidence-based practices in animal welfare and you've clearly defined that and you've tried new innovative practices with your new designs which I think is so wonderful and revolutionary. It's terrific for the animals. And we are continuously working with members of academia between just simple necropsies to you know troubleshooting barns what we're seeing that kind of stuff. We also have the open-door policy for them to bring their students in, ask questions and tour and

and see. It's about that next generation. Exactly. And I know when Drew came in to Robin's Nest today he said, Hottie you're the next generation. I love Exactly. And I know when Drew came into Robin's Nest today he said, how do you're the next generation? I love this. That's exactly right. And it's important for us to bring people into animal welfare and make sure that they are ready for this heavy mantle of responsibility. You want to hand it off in a healthy way. It's hard to do. It's hard to hand off something, but it's necessary for the continuity of what we've already established. And we're going to keep working at that. And we also continue to educate the community. A lot of people in Indiana don't realize that Indiana is number one in duck production.

I don't think I knew that. Everyone thinks of corn and everything else, ducks. But there's a lot of people that pass a duck barn, and if it didn't have a Culver Duck sign on it, they would think it, yes, they wouldn't know that there were ducks in there. But not just of the ducks, but I think in industry, we have to serve our community

in getting them to understand the options of agriculture. And you know, the children that want to become vets, there's more than being a vet. There's other options of coming into a company and what you can do. Yes, yes. And we really do have to educate the next generation because again, they might be three generations

removed from the farm. Maybe four. I know my personal experience. Both my parents were raised on a farm, but I was raised in Fort Wayne, Indiana in the city. And so when I got into agriculture, that was a big change for me. But I've loved it. Yes.

And it's been a very rewarding experience. And I think it can be for many other people a valid option to anything else that's out there. I have a nephew studying agriculture science right now. I'm very proud of him. It's wonderful, very important. Hattie, how did you get involved? So I was raised on a hog farm. I had a fair road to finish operation

when I was in high school. And then I always wanted to do, I started in compliance, but I always loved the farm, loved my hogs, kind of just fell into the spot with Miller poultry. And I had an opportunity to go out in the field and work and I was given the opportunity to then become a flock supervisor and kind of went from there. Started with broilers and was an animal that my father was like, we're never going to have chickens on our farm. It never did. But it was a learning experience. I've been very fortunate with all of my mentors in all of the years. I say I'm still learning. I learn every day. I pick his brain and I

make him write things down that, you know, he's like, we did it before. But it has grown as I come over to Culver Duck and it was, we need somebody for animal welfare. So researching what there was and going from there. That's wonderful and you serve as a role model for the next next gen too, which is terrific. We're going to pivot away from ducks for a minute because today we're in Robin's Nest. We're going to talk about the other animals in your life because I know that everybody has another animal that's their favorite animal. I was really fascinated today when I asked another gentleman this in Robin's Nest and he said, you know my favorite animal is still the chicken. I said seriously, how about a dog or cat or elephant? Chicken. It was still his favorite. So I have to ask you, Heidi, your favorite animal is? A pig. A pig. I love pigs and you know but... You didn't know that Drew, did you?

No, I didn't. Because of, you know, we can't have pigs and chickens and ducks and all of that stuff. Yes, I would, I loved having our farrowing house and the little pigs. And that is truly my favorite. They're smart animals. They very much are. I had a pot belly as a rescue for a little bit. But yeah, that's a no-no now. So I can only go see them every once in a while

on other people's farms. That's great. Besides my German Shepherd's my big baby at home. So. Yeah, so what's his name? Ruger. Ruger, I love that. That's my German Shepherd's my big baby at home. So yeah. So what's his name? Ruger. Ruger. I love that. That's love it. Okay Drew we're flipping it to you now. Growing up in Fort Wayne off the farm what was your favorite? Well we had dogs and cats growing up but I gotta say now my favorite animal is probably my grandchildren because they are animals. I got six of them under the age of four.

Wow. But my son does have a dog. Yes. And we love that dog. So I'm going to say the grand dog. If we go beyond ducks because ducks are the cutest poultry in the world. Yes. I'd go with dogs. I love dogs. Yes. Oh that's wonderful. And those grandchildren of yours too. Six under the age of four, if they're all over your house at one day, it's a hectic day. It is. It is. You have to find time to recharge after that. Heidi and Drew, it's been so much fun having you in Robin's Nest. We love Colfer Duck. Congratulations on being American Humane Certified. We look forward to helping to share with all Americans how to cook duck and enjoy duck on their table. So we look forward to having you be part of the Global Humane Table or our next cookbook. Yeah thank you for having us here and just letting us share a little bit about what we do and about the duck industry and we really appreciate that. Thank you very much for the opportunity and we do we very much look forward to the partnership and

continuing for years to come. Thank you, we do too. Thanks so much for the opportunity. And we do. We very much look forward to the partnership and continuing for years to come. Thank you. We do too. Thanks so much for being here. Thanks for listening to Robin's Nest. I hope you enjoyed today's conversation and learned more about the work we're doing to protect animals everywhere.

Don't forget to stay connected with us at American Humane. You can find us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and LinkedIn at American Humane. you can find us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and LinkedIn at American Humane. And if you're not already subscribed, make sure to follow Robin's Nest so you never miss an episode. Thanks again and remember, every act of kindness makes a difference. Music