#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Amir Locke Murder Connection to other cases, GA Judge booted off case, Missouri's Ahmaud Arbery Act

Episode Date: February 8, 2022

2.7.2022 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Amir Locke Murder Connection to other cases, GA Judge booted off case, Missouri's Ahmaud Arbery ActTwo of the Minneapolis SWAT members were the same ones involved in the Jaleel Stallings case and the judge who signed that no-knock warrant....The judge who presided over the Derek Chauvin case. Georgia Fort will give us the latest after a weekend of protests.The defense team for a black man in Georgia claiming self-defense for killing a white teen said they got a break. The judge they say had some racial biases was kicked off the case. We'll have someone from JustGeorgia here with the latest in the Marc Wilson case.Their plea deal fell through, so today, the federal hate crime trial for the three men convicted of killing Ahmaud Arbery began with jury selection.Ahmaud Arbery's murder sparked a Missouri state Senator to pen the Ahmaud Arbery Act to prevent citizens from killing people they think are committing a crime. That Senator will join us tonight to tell us about this new legislation.Plus, the Bridgeport Connecticut Police department has a history of racist practices.  #RolandMartinUnfiltered partner: Nissan | Check out the ALL NEW 2022 Nissan Frontier! As Efficient As It Is Powerful! 👉🏾 https://bit.ly/3FqR7bPSupport #RolandMartinUnfiltered and #BlackStarNetwork via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered or via PayPal ☛ https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfilteredDownload the #BlackStarNetwork app on iOS, AppleTV, Android, Android TV, Roku, FireTV, SamsungTV and XBox 👉🏾 http://www.blackstarnetwork.com#RolandMartinUnfiltered and the #BlackStarNetwork are news reporting platforms covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. It's time to be smart. Roland Martin's doing this every day. Oh, no punches! Thank you, Roland Martin, for always giving voice to the issues. Look for Roland Martin in the whirlwind, to quote Marcus Garvey again. The video looks phenomenal, so I'm really excited to see it on my big screen. Support this man, Black Media.

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Let's be smart. Bring your eyeballs home. You can't be Black on media and be scared. You dig? It's Monday, February 7th, 2022. I'm Ray Baker, sitting in for Roland. Here's what's coming up on Roland Martin Unfiltered, streaming live on the Black Star Network. Two of the Minneapolis SWAT members were the same ones involved in the Jaleel Stallings case,

and the judge that signed the no-knock warrant was the same judge that presided over the Derek Chauvin case. Georgia Fork will give us the latest after a weekend of protests. The defense team for Black Man in Georgia, claiming self-defense for killing a white teen, said they got a break. The judge they say had some racial biases

was kicked off the case. We'll have someone from just Georgia here with the latest in the Mark Wilson case. And their plea deal fell through, so today the federal hate crime trial for the three men convicted of killing Ahmaud Arbery begins with jury selection. Ahmaud Arbery's murder sparked Missouri state senator

to pen the Ahmaud Arbery Act to prevent citizens from killing people they think are committing a crime. The state senator who sponsored that, well, they will join us tonight to tell us about this new legislation. Plus, the Bridgeport, Connecticut Police Department, like the police departments all across the country, has a history of racist practices.

We'll discuss all that and more. It's time to bring the funk on Roland Martin Unfiltered, streaming live on the Black Star Network. Y'all know what it is. Let's go. He's got it. Whatever the piss, he's on it. Whatever it is, he's got the scoop, the fact, the fine And when it breaks, he's right on time And it's rolling Best belief he's knowing Putting it down from sports to news to politics

With entertainment just for kicks He's rolling It's Uncle Roro, yo Yeah, yeah It's Rollin' Martin, yeah Yeah, yeah Rollin' with Rollin' now Yeah, yeah

He's funky, he's fresh, he's real the best You know he's Rollin' Martin now It's Roland Martel now. Martel. A few days, thousands took to the streets in places like Minneapolis, Minnesota, to protest the fatal shooting of Amir Locke. 22-year-old Locke was shot when police were executing a no-knock warrant connected to a homicide investigation that he was not a suspect in. Amir did not have a criminal record, and it was less than 15 seconds from when officers opened the door

before Officer Mark Hanneman shot Amir. Amir's death has been ruled a homicide, dying of multiple gunshot wounds. And some interesting information has come out. Like, two of those on the SWAT team to carry out this no-knock warrant were involved in another highly watched case. And the judge who signed off on that same warrant

that led to Amir's death, though, is one we are all too familiar with. He is the judge from the Derek Chauvin case. To update us on all this and more from Minnesota is journalist Georgia Ford. Georgia, thank you so much for making time to join us here on Roland Martin Unfiltered. Pleasure to be here, Ray,

and definitely wish it was under better circumstances. Georgia, so let's ask some important questions to get started at the outset. We saw another weekend of protests, but for so many viewers and observers, their memories of Minneapolis protests was what we saw that kicked off the long, hot summer of 2020. What are you seeing on the ground from the people

out in Minneapolis in the St. Paul area? That's right, Ray. I was actually out there on Saturday afternoon when thousands were in the streets demanding justice for Amir Locke, and you pointed out some critical factors that are playing into the reason why so many people are turning out. The same judge who presided over the Derek Chauvin trial, Judge Cahill, is the one who signed off on this no-knock warrant. And so

when we look at Chauvin and we look at the fact that he was fired, he was convicted, that instance was an outlier. This is not the norm in Minneapolis, right? And so what is the norm is that these systems are working together, not only the Minneapolis Police Department, but the BCA, the Bureau of Criminal Apprehension, which investigates when officers use fatal force in the state of Minnesota, and then also the judges. They're complicit as well. And so individuals are pointing now to the fact that nothing much has changed since the

murder of George Floyd, even though we had corporations saying that things were going to change. We had senators and we had people in Congress saying things were going to change. But here we are again, right in the same very city where it happened, and not much has changed. Activists and community leaders worked tirelessly over the last two years to try to get legislation passed, including a bill that would have addressed no-knock warrants. In light of what happened to Breonna Taylor, activists here were trying to be proactive and prevent something like what happened to Breonna Taylor, activists here were trying to be proactive and prevent something like what happened to Amir Locke from happening.

There was eight pieces of legislation that community leaders presented after George Floyd, and a lot of those bills were watered down, some of them not passed at all, including one about no-knock warrants. And so here we are. And the question that the city of Minneapolis is asking now is, why does the cost of change always have to come at the expense of Black blood? And we saw on social media an intense exchange between the mayor and some reporters and or activists asking why Mr. Locke was initially labeled a suspect. There seems to be so much tension

there. Are the activists in the Minneapolis-St. Paul area now looking at some systemic changes or, for right now, are the immediate responses from what you're hearing a need to change the head of interim police, a need to change mayor? Is it a change in the

leadership of the individuals or are folks down there now clamoring for a different type of system, a different type of in the leadership of the individuals, or are folks down there now clamoring for a different type of system, a different type of governance? No, I mean, that's a great question. And in fact, it was civil rights attorney Nakeem Alevi-Armstrong who stood up and called out Interim Chief of Police Amelia Huffman, as well as Mayor Fry, for their press conference. And the reason being is because she's been on the ground even before George Floyd. She was organizing and demanding change for Jamar Clark, who was fatally shot before George Floyd.

She actually ran for mayor. And so she has done her best to work together with leadership, with the politicians here. She is co-chairing one of the committees that the mayor put together to try to help bring forward change in public safety. And what she called out after Amir Locke was fatally shot was the fact that here we are again with the same rhetoric. And when you look at these police killings,

it's not, I mean, obviously it's tragic when we lose someone at the hands of those who are supposed to protect and serve us. But in addition to that, there are some very fundamental things that go wrong, including the narrative that the police departments issue to the media and to the public about these incidences. And this is a reoccurrence. This is something that we saw happen after George Floyd was murdered. The Minneapolis Police Department published a press release saying that George Floyd had died of medical complications. Well, when you look at the footage from Darnella Frazier, you know that's not true. When you look at the determination Cahill made in the case, you know that's not true. And so the same thing here with Amir Locke. The Minneapolis Police Department held this press conference in front of the media, in front of the public, saying that

he was a suspect. They said that he had a gun. They even published photos of his gun. But they failed to omit information about the fact that he had his license to have that gun. This is an American citizen with the Second Amendment right to bear arms. He legally had his gun registered. He did everything he was supposed to do. And at a time when this city is seeing, I think, a 60 percent increase in carjackings, this is a 22-year-old who was working for DoorDash, who was concerned that his car would be jacked, that he would be held at gunpoint. And so he went and he did the legal steps of getting a gun so he could protect himself. And so when you look at that, and then to circle back to the

police department and the narrative that they portrayed, calling him a suspect, publishing the photographs of his gun without saying he had his license to have it. Then they also put this narrative out there that he was shot during a raid, but they didn't tell us that his name was not on the warrant. And so he was just there. He wasn't a suspect. So all of these things, what they did, Ray, they painted a picture that this was a criminal who deserved what happened to him. And when you actually look at the facts on this case, that is not the case at all. This was a law-abiding citizen who legally had his license to have this gun,

and he was staying the night over someone else's house, and this raid just so happened to happen while he was there, and within nine seconds. And not even, when you really slow down the footage and you count, his parents, Andre Locke, his father Andre Locke and his mother, Karen Wells, have talked about how their son, their 22-year-old son, was a deep sleeper. And they came in. You can see the officers kick the couch that he's laying on. And at that moment is when he came to consciousness. That's when he woke up. So, really, it was probably in the matter of two to three seconds that Officer Mark Hanneman made the fatal decision to shoot Amir Locke three times. And we can no longer, as the Black community, stand by and watch this stuff happen and not only try to hold these police departments

accountable, but I believe the media is playing a critical role in the narratives that are being distributed to our society. And we have white individuals who say that this shooting was justified. But when you examine the facts of this case, this was a law-abiding citizen, and we should not have to continuously try to humanize black men and women. We should not have to fight against these narratives. I've dedicated my entire career as an independent journalist to changing the narrative because this is the perfect example where this innocent Black man has been criminalized. Yeah, Georgia, you make a great point.

Hang tight for one second because I believe we have the video of that exchange that I earlier referenced regarding Mayor Jacob Fry in Minneapolis and the leader of their police department. So take a look. That there is an ongoing tension between getting things out quickly and getting things right.

We want to get things right. We want to, excuse me, excuse me. We want to gather the necessary evidence to make sure that we are not telling you something that is inaccurate now, only to correct it a day later. And so I'm going to ask... I don't know. But we could do one question at a time. We do want to answer the questions, but I would also prefer just to one question at a time.

To your question, I do not know. Does the chief know? Can the chief answer that question? Go ahead. So yesterday at the time that we were putting out the press release, we didn't have as much information as we have now, of course. And so it's unclear, certainly unclear yesterday, but it remains unclear if or how Mr. Locke is connected

to St. Paul's investigation. And more information will be coming as St. Paul digs further into the case. Why are you reverting him as a suspect in a press release if you didn't know? That's all the time we have, everyone. Let's call it. No, no, no. Was anyone apprehended as part of this? Also, when will you release the search warrant?

How is walking out of a press conference transparency? You are a murderer! Seeing that tense atmosphere, I think it's important to be aware of the fact that the investigation is going out of a press conference transparency? You are a murderer! Seeing that tense exchange there, and for those viewers who may not have been able

to hear clearly the audio, some of those in the Trowder in attendance were demanding answers as to why Mr. Locke was being called a suspect. In the initial press release, four different times, Minneapolis police referred to Mr. Locke as the suspect. The suspect, the suspect. In the initial press release, four different times Minneapolis police referred to Mr. Locke as the suspect.

The suspect, the suspect. But as your reporting indicates, Georgia, he was never a suspect. His name is not mentioned in the warrant. None of this is consistent. As an independent reporter, I don't necessarily want to ask you to offer your opinion

as much as I am curious as how other reporters on the ground are taking information from those establishment figures and the authority and treating them as gospel despite this long history of evidence we have both in Minneapolis and across the nation that the police are just as liable to sell them the story that will favor them as you or I might be

if we were in a discrepancy with one another. How come so many reporters continue to take the word of law enforcement? That's right. And we need to continue asking ourselves those questions. But that's why Roland's platform is so important. That's why the Black Star Network is so important. Because we understand through our own lived experience in this country that the way it's been done is not the way that it can continue to be done, that there has to be systemic change.

And so that's what I was referring to earlier when I was saying it's not just the fact that police officers are using fatal force. It's also the handling of the story after and the moments that follow and the narrative that's put out and the way that the media does treat that narrative by the police officers as though it is the gospel. At this point, the Minneapolis Police Department has shown it is not a reliable source for media outlets. So the process where, oh, they release a press release and the mainstream media puts it out, that process needs to change. It needs to be reexamined. If we're going to have real equity, if we're going to have any inclination of justice in this country, we have to continuously examine

these systems. And quite frankly, I think the media is just as responsible for the white Minnesotans who are showing up at protests, confronting activists, asking them, you know, why are they out here? Because this man had a gun. Well, the reason why people are misinformed, it stems from the process. Minneapolis Police Department, this is the second time that they have issued inaccurate information. They should no longer be a trusted source for reporters or

for media entities. So the same way that they vet sources, if mainstream media went into your community, they came and they talked to you and you told them facts or statistics, guess what they're going to do? They're going to vet that information. They're going to go back.

They're going to fact check it before they share it with their audience. Well, they need to have that same microscope on the information that they're getting from the police departments, from politicians, from government agencies, because what we're seeing when it comes to our lives, when it comes to our humanity, they'll be quick to criminalize us and very, very slow to give us the benefit of the doubt or even just look for the facts. Amir Locke had his license to carry his gun. Right. And another question is, where is the NRA on this issue? You talk about the Second Amendment. If you and, you know, even there was a gun expert who spoke recently at a press conference analyzing the footage, right?

Go talk to a gun expert about that footage. And when you look at the way that Amir Locke was, he did pick up his gun because he was startled. He didn't know who was around him, but he didn't have it pointed at anybody. He didn't have his finger on the trigger. He had his finger along the barrel of the gun. And when you're trained on how to use a firearm, you are trained to assess the threat before you shoot. And so what that footage tells us, based on what we've heard from Marcus Armstrong, I believe is what his name was, he had his finger on the barrel. He had his thumb up. He had the gun pointed to the ground.

He was assessing what was happening to him. This could have happened to anyone who has their license to have a gun. This could have happened to anyone. It could have been you. It could have been me. And unless there's an end to no-knock warrants, unless they examine this case very critically and think about the Second Amendment, we will see this happen again. This is... It's very similar to what happened to Breonna Taylor. And here we are again. Georgia, I want to bring my panel in,

and I'm going to do so in just a second. But first, I want to ask you this question, because you mentioned something that was... that really caught my ear. You said there are white Minnesotans who are coming out to confront the activists who are protesting. And I'm curious if, from what you're seeing,

are you concerned that we'll have a second incident like we saw in Kenosha, Wisconsin? Are the tensions that high? Or is it actually civil dialogue that's happening out there? You know, I think at this point, it's hard to say. It hasn't even been a week.

Amir Locke was fatally shot on Wednesday. I will say that, you know, the protest that happened on Saturday for Amir Locke was probably the largest protest that this city has seen since the fatal shooting of Daunte Wright, you know. And so there definitely is a potential for this movement to grow. I do believe that. It is something that I'm continuing to follow, something I'm keeping a pulse on. At this time, it's just it's hard to say. I think it truly depends on whether or not the officer ends up being fired.

I think it depends on whether or not Amelia Huffman, who's the interim police chief, if she's terminated. And I also think it depends on whether or not the mayor steps down from his position. All of these things are things that the community is demanding, activists are demanding. And whether or not their demands are met, I think will determine the size of response that you'll see from this community. Yeah. Thank you so much, Georgia. Hang tight. Let's bring in our panel to converse this, about this with you. We're joined by Dr. Julianne Malveaux, the Dean of College of Ethnic Studies in, excuse me, at California State University of Los Angeles, Lauren Victoria Burke, a writer with NNPA, and the Griot, and Reverend Jeff Carr, founder, the Infinity Fellowship.

Thank you so much, you all, for joining us. Doctor, excuse me, doctor, I'm thinking about your brother who taught me at Howard. Reverend Carr, let me start with you. When you hear about some of this, and you heard Georgia name that this last time that she saw a protest like this, Dante Wright. And then we mentioned before this, obviously,

there's Jamar Clark. And then we're referencing George Floyd, obviously. Now we add Amir Locke we mentioned before this, obviously, there's Jamar Clark. And then we're referencing George Floyd, obviously. Now we add Amir Locke's name to this, heartbreakingly. And who knows the countless black women that have been victims of police violence, whose names that we don't even put into our lexicon. Is

there, Reverend Carr, where can folks, black folks particularly, and those of us who care about justice, where can we turn for optimism or hope in a time like this? Well, first off, I say we should be able to return or turn to our spiritual leaders and our community leaders and our institution builders.

That's first and foremost what we should be able to turn to. When people are enraged, when they are angry, when they are facing frustration, that is a natural human emotion. And when you're dealing with systemic racism and systemic issues like this, in America, we know that that's just going to be real. It's a part of life. We prepare ourselves for it.

We teach our children about it generationally. And yet still, if there is nothing in place to ease that anger, if there's nothing in place for us to pour into to give us our own esteem, then we end up being victims of not just the racism directly, but we die early. We have health issues. We have mental health issues. So it becomes this complex intersecting system, and we end up always ending up being at the bottom of the pyramid. So we should be able to turn. And I do believe that there are spaces out there for us to turn to. But what we have to look at is an analysis of an Einsteinian concept, and that is insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

So we have a shooting. We now have body cam footage that is always added to it. People protested for years to get body cams and now police departments have figured out how to manipulate body cams to make themselves look as if they're being transparent. Someone dies, there are protests. We ask for someone to be fired, maybe they're fired, maybe they're disciplined, maybe they're not. We ask them to be indicted. We see that maybe they're not indicted I think we're beginning to see the start of doing something differently

so that we can get a different result. Lauren, I'm concerned about, as Georgia alluded to when she was with us, that so many mainstream media outlets are just becoming public information officers for law enforcement. What value, even when we have African Americans and others from diverse communities, what value is it to have Black folks in those spaces if they, too, just mimic the behavior

of being a PIO for the law enforcement? Yeah. Well, you know, in most, uh, cities, with big media organizations, what you find is a disconnect between, uh, the media and-and the people who are on the ground. I suspect that what happens, I've seen it a lot, you know, where I'm from in New York, where, you know, the people who are reporting the news have a completely different experience with the police, so they just believe everything the police say.

And the constituency that they're reporting to is having a completely different experience. So I suspect that that and the fact that people tend to just believe what police officers say generally and nobody checks them, there's really no check and balance on them when they put out certain information, that just sort of goes on and on and on and on. And it shouldn't. But there has been some, I guess, aggressive, what do I say? There's been some effort to change that. There's been a conversation that's been going on about not just believing what is put out by the police. It's a slow effort. I know it sort of bubbled up. Wesley Lowry, who's a journalist over at The Washington Post, is now at CBS, brought it up.

And it's a point it will change. But, you know, the fact that everybody has a camera phone, the fact that everybody has the ability to get information out independently has checked that as well. So hopefully that will change. You know, one question I had that maybe Georgia knows the answer to is whether or not the, do we know whether or not the cops were in plain clothes or in uniform? And do we know why they were there and what the warrant

was being served for? Yeah. And so, unfortunately, Georgia had to drop off, but one of the things that we do know is that the cops were serving in a SWAT capacity in their SWAT attire. We also know that they were serving a homicide warrant that they, the St. Paul County... St. Paul police

alleged that the person who was there to receive, that they were there to apprehend had made threatened statements against law enforcement. Again, I qualify that to our... Okay, Ray, it doesn't really make that much of... Yeah, I qualify that to say the St. Paul police have told us that

said person has made threats against law enforcement, which means that we at Roland Martin Unfiled have not independently verified that. We won't get involved in a conversation where we say we're just parroting police statements and then parrot police statements ourselves. But I do want to at least let the viewers know that the police

are alleging this. Dr. Malveaux, I'm going to come to you. On college campuses, so often, you all are engaged in these heady academic discussions that in meaningful ways turn out to be the practice that people follow behind. Are there discussions on college campus that move us toward a place where we understand the unique challenges and flaws with policing across all people, particularly the most vulnerable among us, which would often be black and lower income folks?

You know, that's such a great question, because our Academic Senate, and a couple of members of our Academic Senate, have actually begun to delve into the resources used for policing on campus. What was raised, and I haven't verified it yet, but one of my faculty members in the College of Ethnic Studies,

uh, Dr. Leda Ramos, raised the fact that we spent almost half of our student services budget on campus policing. Now, there's not... I've been living on campus, you all will laugh at me, in a dormitory for the past seven months. No drama, no trauma. Just need to find me someplace to live. But I have not seen a lot of crime, right? Frankly, I haven't seen any. So I'm trying to figure out how we're spending, you know, millions of dollars a year that could go to student services

in a time of COVID when you have young people who are experiencing extreme mental, financial, and other trauma. Why are we spending so much money? And I'm going to get in trouble for this because somebody at Cal State is watching and saying, there she go again. But why are we spending so much money on that and not on so-called security and not on student needs? Students, the college that I work at is an HSI, Hispanic Service Institution. Almost 70% of our students are Pell eligible. They're not here for no drama. They're here to learn.

We have a small but consistent and mighty black population, about 5% of the population. Again, they're not here for drama. They're here to learn. But Langston Hughes and Richard Wright wrote in the 1940s about the reverberations of violence anywhere and how it affects us everywhere.

And what I mean by that is when you hear of a shooting, at that time they were writing of lynchings. When you hear of a lynching, you time they were writing of lynchings. When you hear of a lynching, you didn't have to experience the lynching to feel the lynching, to feel that you too were vulnerable. And what I see from some of our students, especially Black male students, is the feeling of vulnerability, of this spit could happen to me any time. And so what we know is that Minneapolis is dangerous. Mama, don't send your children to Minneapolis. It's dangerous. But it's not just Minneapolis. It's Los Angeles. It's San Francisco. It's Oregon. It's Texas. But here's what we know. Basically, it's okay.

The disrespect... the disrespect, Ray, that those folks showed to the media by walking away because they could not answer questions is a disrespect that reverberates toward all of us. We know that they don't give a you-know-what about our lives.

And that's why Black Lives Matter is a slogan that we must continue to lift up. But, boy, I'm frightened for our young people. I'm grateful to the Lord for letting me live 68 years because I don't know at 21 or 22 if I will be able to manage some of this. And it's very challenging to manage. Yeah, Dr. Malveaux makes a great point

when she talks about how difficult and hot it is in Minneapolis right now. Paraphrase the poet, Sonny Patterson, it ain't just burning in Mississippi. Hell, it's hot wherever you be. To our panelists, hang tight. We're going to come back. We want more of your expertise. And coming're coming back. We're going to have much more here

on the Roland Martin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. We'll be right back. Teksting av Nicolai Winther Nå er vi på veien. ДИНАМИЧНАЯ МУЗЫКА on the next get wealthy why black women are deeper in student loan debt than anyone else i wanted to be the next Connie Chung. Nothing was going to get in my way. What was placed in front of me was a promissory note that said that, hey, if you sign this document, you can be able to achieve your dream. Not really understanding the full foresight of what I was going to be experiencing right after college.

Learn how you can turn it around and get wealthy in the process right here on Blackstar Network with me, Deborah Owens, America's Wealth Coach, host of Get Wealthy. Pull up a chair, take your seat. The Black Tape with me, Dr. Greg Carr, here on the Black Star Network. Every week, we'll take a deeper dive into the world we're living in.

Join the conversation only on the Black Star Network. You can't win unless you learn how to lose. Basketball star Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. After months of trying, the judge presiding over a Georgia case where a black man was using the stand-your-ground defense as his defense has been removed. Marcus Wilson, a biracial man, was driving with his white girlfriend when a group of white teens accosted them in a truck.

Wilson, fearing for their lives, fired his weapon, killing one of the teens. Wilson's attorneys claim Judge Michael Muldrew had issues with bias and prejudice against their client. Reverend James Woodall from Jess, Georgia, joins us from Atlanta with more details. Reverend Woodall, thank you so much for making time to join us here on Roland Martin Unfiltered

on the Black Star Network. Let's get started with the questions and the issues right here at this outset. How were you all effectively, not you all from just Georgia necessarily, but the attorneys and the activists on the ground there, how were you all able to demonstrate the racial

bias against the client that ultimately would hopefully get us closer to a more fair trial? Most definitely. First, thanks for having me. One of the very first things we saw was that there was a difference in how the judge was treating witnesses in this case. And the judge that ruled or issued the ruling that recused Judge Muldrew identified that as such.

But also, one of the lead defense attorneys, Attorney Francis Johnson, was actually held in contempt of court, as well as detained and arrested on the day of the immunity hearing, was also part of that kind of concern that we had was that any individual should be able to have the counsel of choice. And when you have a proceeding in which a sitting judge essentially tells some of the other lawyers on the defense team that this person would not be able to participate in any legal proceeding because he's in contempt, that deprives a defendant of their right to counsel. And so compounded with all the other things that happened in this case, the ex parte communication, the appearance of prejudice against some of the witnesses,

then the judge, seeing Judge Karp did agree with us that ultimately this judge was unable to be impartial or at least appear to be impartial and thus issue a ruling that essentially put another judge on the case. So many of us observers would, particularly black observers,

will watch cases and conclude that person clearly is biased, but bias and discrimination, particularly as is practiced in the United States courts, are always very difficult to prove. Were there anything that you guys saw that you knew that you've seen before that this would be able to stand up

in front of another judge in another court? Well, one, it was, is this question about a notebook in which the prosecutor hands the judge a notebook that includes emails between Mark and his family while he's in pretrial detention that was not previously seen by the defense team. And in fact, when the courts were made aware that the defense team was not, in fact, you know,

had any knowledge of this notebook, the judge then responds in a very aggressive manner in which Attorney Francis Johnson essentially says, I want to establish chain of custody. I want this to go to the clerk of court so that we can have it in the record to preserve that record so we can ensure that there is a very clear understanding of what had just happened. And instead of allowing that to take place, the judge responds and they held, uh, Attorney Francis Johnson in contempt of court, and that's where this entire process began. I appreciate you walking our viewers through that.

Just quickly, before I bring the panel in, because I would love for them to be able to engage with you, when you say contempt of court, for those of us who may not be completely familiar exactly what that is, what is the judge then doing to the defense attorney when they put them in contempt of court? Well, a contempt action is simply a public reprimand,

if you will, that says... person who is held in contempt of court has not followed the court's order, and the court's order in that particular situation was the binder in which was improperly submitted to the court, um, was not in possession of the person who it was intended to be in possession of, which was Attorney Francis Johnson, who had it. The judge asked Attorney Francis Johnson to give it back to the judge, but instead he

gives it to the clerk to, quote, unquote, establish chain of custody, because the judge simply wanted to give it back to the prosecutor so that they could undo their wrong, as opposed to saying, hey, I'm a judge, I've received improper evidence, let me let the entire court know in front of everyone so that there's no question that I am being improper in my behavior as a presiding judge. That did not happen. And so that's when the whole action of contempt comes. And I also name that that action is currently sitting before the Georgia Court of Appeals to really determine whether or not that was an improper action done

on behalf of Judge Modru. And so the courts are ultimately going to determine whether or not that was improper or proper, as Judge Karp said, that Judge Modru could not also be on this case. And so there's several things in this case that is just completely, not only wrong, but shines a light onto how, you know, court and the judicial process in South Georgia actually works. We appreciate you breaking that down, and we know that with Super Bowl Sunday coming up, more or less, you

told us that if the Los Angeles Rams jumped offside, the referee told them they can get back onside, and it won't be any problem. And somebody from Cincinnati had to later throw a challenge flag, and that's what you guys and the defense team did, and it won't be any problem. And somebody from Cincinnati had to later throw a challenge flag, and that's what you guys and the defense team did, and we're grateful you did that. Let's bring our panel in and have a conversation.

Again, we're joined with Reverend Jeff Carr, Dr. Julianne Malveaux, and Lauren Victoria Burke. Lauren, I'm going to go to you first. When you hear about something like this in Georgia, are you now excited that some of those activists there that are doing the work, activists, journalists, and others, are actually seeing the fruits of their benefits because, unlike in Minnesota,

we're actually seeing something that looks closer to justice coming to fruition. Yeah, no, that's true. I do think all of this activism that we're seeing is definitely going to bear fruit at some point. I would be sort of interested to know what the record is for Stand Your Ground in Florida and in Georgia with regard to black people, whether or not it has been successfully used

by anybody African-American. Because as we all know, you know, when these laws change, they're disproportionately used in a way that doesn't benefit us. But you do see, of course, that the activism we've seen over the years since Trayvon Martin in particular does, of course, bear out. I mean, anyone who says that activism doesn't work or getting in the streets doesn't work is kidding themselves. And what we just saw in Minnesota, I mean, they should be interrupting press conferences. They should be in the streets for that. Nobody should be shot dead sitting on their couch at 22 years old. And this is not the way the system should work.

So obviously, you know, in Georgia, obviously a different state, a different place than the American South. But we do, to answer your question, we do see activism working. And Reverend Woodall, do you have any information on the rates or the efficacy of the Stand Your Ground defense with regard to African-Americans and white Georgians? Most definitely. And it really breaks down into two particular points. And let me be very clear. Justice has not been served in this case. We have a young man who is sitting trial for murder.

He has been in pretrial detention for literally over 600 days. Without a bond, he's never had a criminal offense in his entire life. And yet, this prosecutor is being very adamant, as long as it's his former life, and yet this prosecutor is being very adamant, as long as it's his former judge, to keep him behind bars while he awaits trial. So that's number one. Number two, as it relates to Stand Your Ground, there are two particular

prosecutor—well, there are two particular process points in which you see a disparity. One is the pretrial immunity provision within Georgia's Stand Your Ground law that says you shall be immune for prosecution, meaning you don't even get to go to trial because under Georgia's Stand Your Ground law, you have demonstrated you had a reasonable fear for your life. That term reasonable fear, reasonable suspicion is really the crux of where you find that disparity because what's reasonable for a black male who is driving, you know, downtown Statesboro with his white girlfriend, and you have a drunk car full of white teenagers who are drunk while driving while underage, is not reasonable for him to fear for

his life, whereas a police officer in the same circuit, it is reasonable for him to suspect that a man who is not armed, who is driving a broke-down car, you know, is shot dead within two seconds of him, that officer getting out of his car. The same district attorney makes that determination that the white police officer is reasonable, has responded reasonably, but Martin Wilson did not. And so you see that disparity there as well. Dr. Malveaux, I'm gonna come to you

because Reverend Woodall offered the idea of reason. And as soon as I hear reason, I think about all those philosophy classes that had my head spinning around and around and around. And so... But, Dr. Malveaux, how do... How are we, the lay public, how are we supposed to wrap our head around language in legislation

that involves the word reasonable, whether it be for law enforcement officers, whether it be for the ways that citizens engage with one another? How should we, how help us guide our thinking around how we should hear the word reasonable and move forward? Ray, that's such a good question because reason has to be shifted through a filter of where you are and what makes sense. And we can go through our history and talk about the reasonableness of a predatory capitalist structure that is designed to oppress Black people

and the ways that we attempt to live in it, attempt to be within it. I'm thinking, has nothing to do with this case particularly, but perhaps more generally, about the number of Black men and women who were incarcerated during World War II because they refused to fight for our country. Now, reasonable people would say, why would they fight? What would they do when people were being lynched, even as they came home in uniform? But because of the law, it seems that that was unreasonable enough to

incarcerate these people. Literally, one man died incarcerated because he refused to fight for the United States, which had never fought for him. So fast forward to look at this particular case. You have a black man in a truck with his white girlfriend, minding their business, minding their business, bothering no one, and a group of intoxicated, unreasonable white teens become enraged. what's reasonable under those circumstances? Is it reasonable for this man to defend himself and his girlfriend? Or has it been reasonable for him to allow himself to be beaten, battered, bruised, and perhaps even lynched?

We don't know the answer if we don't allow ourselves to think about the various ways that we process the issue of reason. And so when we process the issue of reason, what I would ask white people to do is to say, what would you do if it happened to you? What if you were driving through Harlem with your old white girlfriend

and a bunch of mad brothers decided they didn't like the optics and so they decided to surround your truck? What would you do? And would that be reasonable? And those are the kind of conversations that are difficult conversations. You know, Ray, they're difficult conversations, but the conversations that we have to have about what reason means and to whom. And because we don't have one United States of America, I must tell you, to this day, I chafe when people pledge allegiance to the flag. I pledged it for five years as the president of Bennett College because I want to set a good example for my young ladies. But I can't do it anymore. I put my fist over there and I say something. I don't know.

The divided states of America and to the division for which it stands. Two nations under God. But because we don't have a simple, our binding value is racism. Racism is part of the cake that the founders baked when they created America. Part of the cake. We can't take the cake apart and say we want to take the sugar out. The racism is the sugar or the flour is the sugar. And so this whole notion of reason has to be parsed through where we are. And there are too few white jurists who will see it our way.

Reverend Woodall, let's look at the cake and the flour and the sugar that Dr. Malveaux just told us about. We would be remiss if we didn't acknowledge that this is an interracial couple. How has that dynamic influenced the reaction of people on the ground and those that are activists both in support of our dear brother, Mr. Wilson, and those who are

critical of what they saw in the killing of the white teen? How is that inflaming the tensions in Georgia? Well, one, it reflects a very unique reality that this family is a biracial family. This Wilson family has been supportive and made sure that, you know unique reality that this family is a biracial family. This Wilson family has been supportive and made sure that, you know, they, anything that they needed to do to ensure that Mark got not only a fair trial, but was able to have the necessary resources to be able to have a sturdy and a very zealous defense. But one of the things I would be interested in really talking about to this latter point is that this district attorney's office has never, in a community where over 30 percent, 40 percent of the entire population not only is

African-American, but you have an overwhelming majority of this population, which are college students, Georgia Southern University, my alma mater, and in that district attorney's office, there has never, there has never been an African-American to serve as an attorney in any capacity, a receptionist, a legal assistant or any capacity. And so when you talk about reason, what a white person and now we've had the first woman to be appointed or to be elected as as district attorney in Daphne Totten. But there has never been an African-American or any minority, for that instance, or a person of color in that office. And so when you talk about what the expectation is about who considers what to be reasonable,

that's where you know that context is coming from. But as it relates to the bipartisan, I mean, the biracial nature of their relationship, you know, people have their commentary as to what this should happen or that should happen. But at the end of the day, what we see is this is a black man. This is a black

brother who is literally being prosecuted and possibly lynched because he thought it not robbery to defend not only himself, but his partner. And that's something we cannot overlook, and it's something that we will continue to fight zealously against.

Reverend Carr, I want to give you the last word on this. We heard earlier the idea of justice. Reverend Woodall said, justice has not been served, and that came following me alluding to more justice is present. But I know that our spiritual teachings

lean us toward what this question of justice ought to be. As you hear all the conversation that we've had thus far, where do you see justice in the midst of this? I think I see justice in understanding what is going on and then taking agency in making a change. We often get this information and it can depress us. But I always want to remind people that during some of the hardest and most difficult times of our people in history, there were always people who said, we're not going for it. There was always a Sojourner Truth. There was always a Nat Turner.

There was always a Harriet Tubman. There was always someone who saw the system the way it was and decided that there was another way forward. And so they did not give up hope. I want to commend Reverend Woodall for the work that you're doing there. It made me think of a Sterling Brown poem. And I don't know if you all remember it, but it was called Old Limb.

And I encourage people to look it up. But there's something that he said that really sparked my mind to come to life on this topic. Because when we ask what happened to Mark Wilson and we see that he was followed by a group of white teens, one of the lines says, they don't come by twos, but

they come by tens. If you've ever had to deal with people who operate from a space of cowardice and you know that they don't come by twos, but they come by tens, the poem goes on to say they got the judges, they got the lawyers, they got the jury rolls, they got the law, they don't come by ones, they got the sheriffs, they got the deputies, they don't come by twos, they got the

shotguns, they got the rope. We get the justice in the end, and they come by tens. When we're looking at this space here, we are called on. We are the change that we are looking for. And we have to put ourselves in a position where we remain informed, where we're not afraid to stand up and put ourselves on the line. And one of the ways that we can put ourselves on the line is by building and supporting independent institutions, so that we're not worried about our livelihood. I always have to shout out the young activists, particularly the sisters down in Georgia and spaces like that, because they are bold enough to say, while I am young, while I don't have many things on the line that the older generation might have on the line,

while I'm not carrying a mortgage that can be taken out from under my feet at any given moment. I'm going to stand, I'm going to speak, and it is our job to support them. I wanted to ask something quickly to Brother Woodall, if he's still on. When I was teaching community organizing, I taught a concept of taking little bits and pieces to start moving toward the big piece. If you say crime and I want people to be involved in crime, you never can get rid of crime. So people feel deflated when they don't see it, they're making a dent. But when you take one specific issue at a time and take a chunk out of it, people begin to be empowered and then more people come. In the old days, they used to say,

it only takes a spark to get a fire going. How much does this recusal of this judge amount to a small win in the larger picture? How good of this, how good is this to the larger case that we're looking at here? Well, to answer that question, this has been a very long process. In fact, Judge Georgia was birthed out of the murder of Ahmaud Arbery. And when you talk about that case, we had all the national heroes, but most of them didn't talk about the work that was actually happening on the ground. So this is a continuation of some of the organizing that was done. And to your point about Black women, a lot of our coalition is amazing Black women who have been there since day one, ensuring that we support our people. And so we talk about citizens arrest, right? Georgia being the first state in the country

to repeal the ability for a private citizen to be able to arrest another private citizen, which was birthed out of the Reconstruction era, right? And so when you talk about this particular case, this is a continuation of how do we inform our communities about private interactions between one another? And so when you talk about this particular recusal effort, this is saying now that we have this judge

unable to be impartial, let's get someone who is going to be objective, let's get someone who will look at the facts and be able to make a determination based on the art of law, right? Not your own personal opinions about what he should have done, what he possibly could have done. What is the law individual able to do? And so once we get beyond this case, we're going to have to have a

conversation about what does it mean to have the ability to, quote-unquote, stand your ground? Should we have a duty to retreat? Should there be a responsibility for private citizens to de-escalate uses of force? That's not the law right now. And so if we want to talk about what he should have done, that's a conversation for the Georgia General Assembly, which is a conversation we are very much so engaged in. But right now, we need due process. We need a

judiciary that is able to analyze facts and evidence and make a determination based on that. And so we'll continue to fight until this case is concluded. Reverend Woodall, before we let you get out of here, you know we black folks. If we wanna pass the plate, because we like what they're doing down there in Georgia,

it was just Georgia, if we want to send our love and support, maybe I don't have any coins to give you guys, but I wanna send an email of encouragement. How do we get in touch with you? How do we reach out? How do we show some support? Yes, we do have a legal defense that we're trying to ensure that Mark gets a zealous defense. So you can follow us and follow this case

along on Twitter and Instagram, at AjustGeorgia. Again, that is at AjustGeorgia. And if you want to continue, I will be also doing some specific updates. You can follow me at imajorwish. Either way, or the family has their own page at

StandWithMark or Justice4Mark. There's two different platforms on Instagram and Twitter. And so you can follow all of us so that we can stay plugged in on what all we can do to ensure that justice truly is for Georgia. And we will be sure here at Roland Martin Unfiltered

on the Black Star Network to be sure that we tap back in with you guys whenever you need to amplify a message beyond the confines of the great state of Georgia. Reverend Woodall, thank you so much for your time today. Thank you. Roland Martin Unfiltered will be right back after this. You're watching us right here on the

Black Star Network. I'm sorry. Hi, I'm Dr. Jackie Hood-Martin, and I have a question for you. Ever feel as if your life is teetering and the weight and pressure of the world is consistently on your shoulders? Well, let me tell you, living a balanced life isn't easy. Join me each Tuesday on Black Star Network for Balanced Life with Dr. Jackie. We'll laugh together, cry together, pull ourselves together, and cheer each other on. So join me for new shows each Tuesday on Black Star Network, A Balanced Life with Dr. Jackie.

We're all impacted by the culture, whether we know it or not. From politics to music and entertainment, it's a huge part of our lives. And we're going to talk about it every day right here on The Culture with me, Faraji Muhammad, only on the Black Star Network. My name is Charlie Wilson. Hi, I'm Sally Richardson-Whitfield. And I'm Dodger Whitfield. Hey, everybody, this is your man Fred Hammond,

and you're watching Roland Martin, my man, Unfiltered. 13-year-old Bailey Cooper has not been seen since January 3, 2022. The Arcadia, California teen is 5'3", weighs about 100 pounds with black hair and brown eyes. If you have seen Bailey Cooper or know of her whereabouts, please call the Arcadia Police Department at 626-574-5150. Again, 626-574-5150. In Georgia, jury selection began today in the federal hate crimes trial of three white men convicted of murdering Ahmaud Arbery, the black man, charged in a white neighborhood.

About 1,000 jury notices were mailed to residents across 43 different Georgia counties. Some prospective jurors had to drive at least four hours to get to the Brunswick courthouse. Now, the first 50 got questioned to determine if they could serve as, here goes those words again, fair and impartial jurors. The judge plans to seat a jury of 12,

plus four alternate jurors. Father and son Greg and Travis McMichael chased Aubrey in their pickup truck and murdered the 25-year-old in February of 2020. A neighbor, William Roddy Bryan, joined the pursuit and recorded a cell phone video of the killing. Let's go back to our panel again.

Dr. Julianne Malveaux, Dean of College of Ethnic Studies at California State University, Los Angeles. Laura Victoria Burt, writer for the NNPA and the GRIO, and Reverend Jeff Carr, founder of the Infinity Fellowship. Dr. Malveaux, let's start with you. We hear about the federal trial for hate crimes here, and we're at least, I don't want to say satisfied,

but can acknowledge that for once, a black victim got the same type of attention that white victims get when crimes are perpetrated against us. But this next level of a federal hate crime, do you hold out any expectation that one, we'll be able to seat a jury, and second, that we will be able to see again justice? you know, Ray, I actually do think that this is a step in a positive direction. I'm concerned, of course, at what the family has said. A federal prison is a nicer prison,

if you want to use nicer, not nice with prisons, than a state prison that has already been investigated for horrible treatment. But how many Black men and women are in those kind of prisons? And therefore, I think the family is correct to say, let's not give these people a slap on the wrist or even three meals a day

if the brothers in the other... in the state prison aren't getting it. What I think is exciting about this is that it's moved in this direction both with the federal and with the state. And I have to think that the Biden administration and certainly Kristen Clark, who is the assistant attorney general for civil rights, has played a pivotal role in ensuring that this is moving forward. So I think we have to celebrate that. But I think at the same time, here's where we get into the weeds. Hold on right there one second for me, Dr. Malveaux.

I just got word that we actually have a Missouri state senator who has a breaking piece of legislation that we want to get to. We'll come back and revisit that conversation. My apologies for interrupting you. However, I do want to let our audience know that Missouri lawmakers are attempting to prevent exactly what happened to Ahmaud Arbery.

And State Senator Stephen Roberts introduced the Ahmaud Arbery Act today, and that legislation would add restrictions to their own citizens' arrest law. And Senator Roberts joins us now from Missouri with more on this legislative proposal. Senator Roberts, thank you so much for joining us on Roland Martin Unfiltered.

Hey, honored to be here. Thank you so much for having me. Now, Senator Roberts, I got to be honest. I just cut off Dr. Julianne Malveaux. That's one of my eldest, so you know I'm going to get in trouble for making time for you. So you better make sure you give us some good information on what it is we need to know. But let's real quick, can you give our audience an overview? Because in our last segment, Mr. Woodall talked about the efforts to repeal Georgia's ability to have citizens arrest, and you're getting involved in making sure that Missouri does not create laws that allow those folks

who would be the perpetrators of the crimes that killed Ahmaud Arbery to get off. Am I understanding that correctly? Right. So right now, there's these common law statutes that would allow someone to do a citizen's arrest. And what my bill that I actually just filed less than an hour ago would prevent folks from being able to do that, you know, notwithstanding certain circumstances. Of course, you know, if self-defense, you're protecting a family member, you know, someone's robbing a store and it's an actual crime and you're right there. This wouldn't affect that. But this is to prevent a tragedy like what happened to Ahmaud Arbery from ever happening again in Missouri. And so have you guys had any high-profile cases of that that you're

looking to address that helps spur some of the activists perhaps have been supportive of this bill and helping you push it across the finish line when we get to the part of hearings and everything else? Yeah, and for me, a lot of it came from my former experiences. So as a young lawyer, I served as a prosecutor in the city of St. Louis. I was on our felony armed offender unit prosecuting gun crimes. And, you know, one of the most challenging things for me really was running into young folks like myself on the back. And that's really what kind of led me to run for office in the first place. So legislation like this is really aimed at deterring those acts of vigilantism.

Now, one of the things I'm looking at at some notes from your, uh, Division of... Missouri State Division of Research. You sent a-a piece to the, uh, staff attorney. And one of the questions here that we wrestled with earlier was the question of reasonable, right? This language comes up time and again, and as a lawyer, as an elected official, reasonable. Uh, we-we talked academically about how to define reasonable.

But as a-a state legislator, how are you guys working around and negotiating and defining this language reasonable? So this bill was real more so focused on just, you know, taking reasonableness, all that, out of the equation to say, look, you know what, if you're just some citizen, you know, you're trying to act like a vigilante, you don't have that purview. This isn't your responsibility.

If there's an issue, do the right thing. Call law enforcement. So we're trying to get away from any of those situations where folks can say, hey, no, you know, I was doing a citizen's arrest and my behavior was reasonable and this is why I did what I did. We're trying to completely abrogate that from our laws to make sure that folks are doing the right thing and, you know, you aren't putting people in a dangerous situation. We recognize that you're just introducing the bill, but I'm certain that you've had conversations with those fellow senators, maybe even the state representatives, the activist community. Are you optimistic that most of the public that is in tune to

state legislative affairs in Missouri are going to be supportive, or do you guys have an uphill battle? I think it's going to be an uphill battle, but I think once folks understand what we're trying to do, and this is legislation actually that we modeled off of what was passed in Georgia with bipartisan support, so we're not doing anything off the wall. Really, this is something that law enforcement should get involved with as well. Yeah, I appreciate that you said that it was passed with bipartisan support, but we know now that our colleagues who don't always understand the plight of Black folks don't seem what friendship and collegiality happens to be when it comes to those folks. Is there anything that you think that's in this bill that you would like our viewers and the

larger audience to know that perhaps just hearing about it or reading a quick article, they may not get an important nut or bolt of that story? Yeah, I would just want them to know that citizens arrest laws are in effect in most states. So reach out to your local elected officials, your state senators, your state representatives, and let them know how you feel about this, how dangerous this law is, and how you want your elected leadership to make sure that these types of tragedies don't happen in their states and their homes. We know that you're tight for time. So with the little bit of time we have, I want to bring back our panel to offer questions

that they may have to you. And because I interrupted you, Dr. Malveaux, if you have any questions for our state senator, Mr. Roberts, please feel free to offer Senator Roberts your question. Uh, yes, I do. The whole issue of citizens' arrest is very troubling to me. It takes us back to the post-Reconstruction era

where white folks could just stop black folks for anything and arrest them, incarcerate them, whatever. Was the history part of your deliberation when you were thinking about this legislation that would limit the ability to do citizen arrests? Absolutely. 100%. And just the idea of you know, of someone being able to say, you know, I'm walking down the street, I'm not bothering anyone. Give your folks my best, by the way. I know your folks, so give them my best. Oh, fantastic. Thank you, Dr. Moore. Appreciate that. But yes, absolutely. And for me, just from a personal standpoint, you know, being able to just, you know, have the concerns that someone could just walk up to me and stop me when I'm not doing anything bothering anyone and to fall back on this sort of defensive.

Well, you know what? I was acting with the color of law behind me. You know, these are folks with no law enforcement training, just average citizens. So so for me, absolutely. It's wanting to get away from people who are just, you know, trying to take the law really into their own hands. Lauren Burke, any questions for Senator Roberts? Yes, Senator Roberts. Are there any other states that have any sort of law like this or is this first of its kind? Just Georgia. So we're taking the model that they used as a template when I crafted the legislation. So we're trying to follow in line and say, look, this is something that's worked there. And there's no reason why we can't pass this with bipartisan support here in Missouri. And Reverend Carr.

Yes, Senator, I appreciate you taking the time and the initiative to actually be a part of the change. I appreciate you, Ray, for being bold enough to even attempt to interrupt Dr. Malvaux. None of us do that. We understand. That's what's got going on. And that was good. And it was still smooth. It was still respectful. I love it. But Senator, I want to ask you something. Here in Tennessee, we have carefully constructed over a period of about 30 years, a super majority with the Republicans. It's extremely difficult to push bipartisan legislation through. So down there where you are, how do you sell this to the Republican majority as something that is

good for everybody? Absolutely. We struggle with that same situation here in Missouri. We're in a super minority position in the Senate. We've got 10 Democrats to 24 Republicans. So we're outnumbered by about three to one. But I think this is types of legislation is something that should appeal to folks from all walks of life. So I'm pretty confident that working with my Senate colleagues who actually sent it to our prosecuting associations as well and the law enforcement associations to try to get their support and explain why this is better from everyone. And for me in particular, just kind of starting my legal career as a prosecutor, I think that that carries a certain level of credibility when I'm working on pieces of legislation like this and why it's important.

Well, Senator Roberts, we appreciate the time that you've taken. We thank you so much for offering this. And I do recognize that you seem pretty strategic and pragmatic about having served as a prosecutor, that that should earn you the bona fides. But we also recognize that even when we have righteousness, credibility, and justice on our side, those who oppose us do not always acknowledge

the veracity of our points. So we wish you Godspeed in your efforts. And Senator Roberts, I will personally come down to Missouri to let you know about the kind of whooping I'm going to get when you go, and I have to come back and attend to interrupting Dr. Malone. But thank you so much for your time. Lastly, before you get out of here, tell folks if they want to find or follow you to continue to support and track this legislation, how can they go about doing that? Definitely. So you can visit my Senate website. It's senate.mo.gov

slash Roberts, or shoot me an email. It's just my name, steve.roberts at senate.mo.gov. And reach out, and I'd love folks' insight. Yeah, we appreciate that so much. And for our viewers in and around the Missouri area, know that there's at least somebody fighting for you. Thank you so much, Senator Roberts. Thank you so much. And so I'm going to come back and accept this humble pie that I need to eat

because I'm going to go ahead and give Dr. Malveaux her opportunity to finish her thoughts. Dr. Malveaux, I'm going to come to you. But when we were having the conversation about justice in this trial, this hate crime trial, you were optimistic around Kristen Clark and the Biden administration, whatever about Mr. Biden. But we know, right, particularly us here at Roland Martin Unfiltered, we know Kristen Clark. And so your optimism centers on Kristen Clark. Am I understanding that correctly? Yes, you are understanding that correctly. And you know

what? But she works for an administration that has been lukewarm about our rights. And we should be very clear about that. She has only so much wiggle room. This morning, I interviewed a woman who wrote a book about the Congressional Black Caucus. And, you know, Reverend Jackson always says that content without context is pretext.

In other words, what is the context of Kristen Clark? And she's my sister friend. I adore her. But what is the context of her service? What can she do and what can she not do? And so I find that the Biden administration has been playing Mr. Bojangles, if you will, with our rights, and she is not. And so while I have some optimism about her leadership, I also, Ray, have some pessimism about the ways that racial hatred is being codified in our country. Reverend Carr, I'm interested that we think about this as a hate crime.

And again, I love coming to you with these meaty topics that we wrestle with in our spiritual centers. But on the question of hate crime, beyond what the statutes in our governance say, how should we as humans who believe in love and decency, but also recognize when bad behavior, violent, harmful behavior has happened, how should we negotiate this idea of a hate crime

and what we should expect with regard to justice versus vengeance? Oh, sure. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think when we operate from a space of understanding that first and foremost, we are spirits navigating the human experience and not just human beings who show up for these spiritual experiences in this physical body that I call our earth suit, we see things that are wrong, and we have to speak up against them. We have to speak up about them. We have to recognize that punishments must fit the crime. There's nothing wrong with justice. Justice is accountability.

It doesn't mean that we have to look at the pictures of the perpetrators of this crime and sit in a space where we're going to send our blood pressure out of the roof or we're going to develop so much hatred in our heart that we consume ourselves. Hate is a frequency. And if you focus on hate, if you focus on negativity, the only thing you're going to continue to attract is more of it. However, there are opportunities for us to stand for justice and make sure that the punishment is fitting the crime, in this case especially.

When we talk about the difference between the federal system and the state system, there tends to be better security in federal prison. There tends to be better management in federal prison. There are a smaller number of people incarcerated in federal prison. State prisons tend to have a higher, especially in Georgia, a higher incidence of violence. So when we see the family rejecting that plea deal, we talked about that last week, that was saying we're not going to give you an opportunity to choose to be in a system that may be better for you. So even now we stand at this crossroads of dealing with the icing versus the cake. The cake is that they've been convicted.

They're not going anywhere. They're going to be locked away in state prison. But we also see the icing of being charged with a hate crime, which is more of a psychological salve for those of us who want justice and fight for justice out there. But needless to say, this would be the icing on the cake to also be convicted of a hate crime, to be affirmed as someone who, out of nothing, but fear in their heart, out of a space of hatred, perpetrated a heinous crime against an individual who deserved to be walking around breathing like we are right now.

So these subtleties in terms of sentencing and where people will serve, they are there, they are real. But in the end, we've gotten justice in this case. We're getting an opportunity to have even more justice in this case. And we did not create this. The individuals who made a choice to hunt down a black man and slaughter him and take him out of this world, made that choice. Because they made that choice, their action created a reaction that is the payback, that is the divine justice of the universe, period. Lauren, I know that you've pounded the pavements reporting in both Capitol Hill and out on the streets.

And I imagine some of those folks that you've interviewed and reported with out on the streets heard me ask about, well, should we hate and what is justice? And they might want to ball up their fists and hit me, right? Come on, black man, how dare you try to let those folks off? And so I don't mean to intimate that when I ask the question, but I am curious about what you think as to what is the best possible outcome here and what signal does that outcome send to other observers, Black, white, all Americans,

who have been following along with this case? Well, I think that the signal that was already sent when they were convicted the first time was pretty strong. I, for one, was quite surprised at what happened on the first trial. But hate crimes, obviously, hate crimes prosecution would send the signal that clearly there was some bias here in this case that would probably and likely would not have happened had Ahmed al-Bari been a white male. I don't think anybody can, you know, reasonably argue that these guys would have

pulled up in this truck with a shotgun if this was a white guy jogging down the street. It's going to be, I think, difficult to prove that in court, though. It's going to be, you know, it's going to come down to a lot of subjective conversation. But, frankly, I do think that there was a strong signal sent on the first trial. I don't know that anybody was expecting what happened, the way it happened, the drama of it, the judge, the whole thing. The ridiculous outlay that we saw from the defense with regard to trying to kick out Black reverends from the courtroom and all that nonsense was the buildup to all that. But, you know, we'll see what's going to happen. I do think that the signal has already been sent.

But, you know, if there's more to come that leads to more prosecution for these three, that would be fine by me and I think a lot of other people. Whew! I made it out of a situation where I cut off Dr. Malveaux and I was able to get to my next break safely. There's a book in there somewhere. You know what? I think Reverend Carl might have offered up a prayer.

Laura Victoria Burke might have gone over there and did some reporting to Dr. Malvo to see where her feelings were. I appreciate all of that. We're gonna take a quick break. You guys are watching Roland Martin Unfiltered streaming live on the Black Star Network. We're gonna come right back.

More conversation right after this. I'm going to go to the bathroom. Nå er det en av de fleste stående stående i verden. Teksting av Nicolai Winther Why black women are deeper in student loan debt than anyone else. I wanted to be the next Connie Chung. Nothing was going to get in my way. What was placed in front of me was a promissory note that said that, hey, if you sign this document, you can be able to achieve your dream. Not really understanding the full foresight of what I was going to be experiencing right after college. Learn how you can turn it around and get wealthy in the process right here on Blackstar Network with me, Deborah. Greg Carr, here on the Black Star Network.

Every week, we'll take a deeper dive into the world we're living in. Join the conversation only on the Black Star Network. I want to see how life can triumph. Artist Romare Bearden. Activists and radio show hosts Joe Madison and many others have sacrificed their health to go on an important and inviting hunger strike to protest renewed attacks on voting rights in America. After the voting bills were defeated in the Senate last month, Madison began eating solid food,

but unfortunately that was after 73 days without it. But during his hunger strike, doctors told the 72-year-old his prostate cancer had spread. He posted this on his Twitter account Friday. Take a listen. By December, I had already been 30 days plus into the hunger strike and found out that my prostate cancer through CAT scan and MRI had spread. The cancer cells had spread to the shoulder

and different parts of the body. But the doctor, he's a combination of oncologist and a urologist, yeah, yeah, urologist. So he, you know, he said, I looked at the CAT scan, and he said, it's spread. Now, how do you want to deal with it? And so the first question was, well, does my protest, does it, will I have to, should I stop the hunger strike?

He said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I, no, that, nope. That won't, he said, but if you decide to go with this treatment, it's hormonal, right? You're going to have to come in every three months and get infusion, in other words, injections in your stomach every three months. I said, well, for how long? And this was within, you know, the first one was mid-December. He said, really, for the rest of your life.

Wow. And what if I decide not to take this treatment? What if I just say, forget it, and I just won't bother for this kind of treatment? So what would happen? And the urologist, in a deadpan kind of way, you'll be dead in a year and a half. Oh, and by the way, during that year and a half,

we'll be giving you pain medication because you'll be in tremendous pain. Oh, okay. Well, that answers that question. Every three, what do you say, Sherry? Every three months doesn't sound bad. Injection every three months doesn't sound that bad. After all.

Because I want to live. I got work to do. We here at Roland Martin Unfiltered want to wish Joe Madison the best of luck on his journey to complete healing. We're going to go back to our panel. Dr. Julianne Malveaux, Dean of College of Ethnic Studies at California State University, Los Angeles. Lauren Victoria Burke, writer in NPA and The Griot.

And Reverend Jeff Carr, founder of the Infinity Fellowship. We talk about the ongoing struggle, Lauren, that Joe Madison and countless others waged for voting rights. And we pressed so hard. And I think about November 2020 and the lead-up to November 2020, and particularly for black Americans, particularly for vulnerable black voters

in places like Georgia, Missouri, Pennsylvania, and everywhere where we've seen these voting rights laws being stripped, voting rights being stripped. I think about those folks, and I wonder what culpability those elected officials in the Senate, in the House, in the White House, and those staffers of those folks feel. Has your reporting told you anything about what their feelings are, about whether or not

they feel, frankly, like they let us down or disappointed us? Oh, they're definitely not happy with, you know, what has happened in terms of lack of urgency on the part of the White House in particular. Uh, a lot of people feel like he should have teed up voting rights right as he came into office. Even with the

understanding, of course, that the COVID crisis is a historic generational crisis. And he did deal with that first with the Rescues Act. That was not, you know, that was understandable under the circumstances. But at the same time, he had a lot of momentum right at the beginning. Joe Biden, President Biden had a lot of momentum politically right at the beginning. And so a lot of the voting rights activists obviously are not happy with the fact that he didn't queue that up, first and foremost, because as Cliff Albright and the gang like to say, I mean, they can't be magical Negroes again and again, cycle after cycle, and win this thing because they've, you know, pulled out every stop to get people online to vote.

Now, of course, it's going to be harder because the Republicans have put in place a number of barriers, a number of hurdles, a number of things that are annoying, this whole thing of not being able to give food and water to people in line, not being able to have placeholders in line for older people. It's going to make it more difficult. But you do have to keep in mind that Donald Trump, who was the likely Republican nominee in 2024, he lost by three million votes to Hillary Clinton in 2016, and then he lost by seven million in 2020 to Joe Biden. There's no reason to think that he is going to get

the majority of votes. He fluked out on the Electoral College and pulled it out in 2016, as we all know. But the bottom line is, in answering to your question, that obviously voting rights activists are not particularly pleased with the state of play right now. And frankly, I do think that, unfortunately, Joe Biden picked the wrong person as his attorney general when he had somebody that would have been perfect for the historic moment in Doug Jones. At any rate, they're not happy. We'll see what happens next. Obviously, it's difficult to 50-50 Senate. Everybody knows that. And right now everybody's just trying to figure out what's going to happen with the midterms and whether or not Democrats

will be in control of the House after this year. Reverend Carr, I want to come to you because Lauren introduced a great point. She said that there was Doug Jones that was right there for the Attorney General position. Kristen Clark would have been fantastic to serve in that position. There are a number, Barbara Arnweiler,

we can name a number of folks. Sherilyn Eiffel. There's a number of folks who we could put in that position, interestingly. But, and I'm glad that Lauren alluded to Doug Jones, who was formerly a senator out of Alabama, for those viewers who might not know he was the prosecutor who held those responsible for that atrocious bombing, held them to... brought them to justice.

But I just got this, and I know it happened some time ago, and I'm not gonna ask you to opine on it, Reverend Carr, because I-I don't know if I'm blindsiding you with this. But the Supreme Court allows a congressional map drawn by Alabama Republicans to remain in place, freezing a lower court ruling that-that map violates the Voting Rights

Act. So when Lauren talks about all of the cow-the ways that seven million votes that Donald Trump lost by in 2020, three million Donald Trump lost by in 2020, 3 million that he lost by in 2016, it seems like Republicans are well aware there just aren't enough people to vote for Donald Trump, so their game plan is

how about we limit the number of people who vote? Is that something... Am I reading that correctly? Is that a fair understanding of what we seem to be seeing? That's not only a fair understanding, it is a clear analysis of what we're seeing with strategy. And Sister Burke knows as a media person, as a mind strategist for crisis communications,

you know that we're not just seeing the end result without a spark at the beginning that led to this result. This didn't pop up overnight. Again, for the last several decades, Republicans have been seeing that we are not going to be able to last and stay in power if voting lines stay the way they are. And that means that if they stay basically fair, we have to find a way to gerrymander and to nitpick and to draw the dragons in a way that allow us to have white minority rule.

It's not just happening with the Supreme Court now with the affirmation of that case. It's happening here in the state of Tennessee. The governor just signed with the Republican supermajority in Nashville at the headquarters at the legislative session a gerrymandering plan that now, in essence, takes Congressman Jim Cooper off the table. He's already decided in the 5th District that he's not running again, because they took the remaining part of Tennessee that was solidly blue, Nashville and Davidson County, and they carved it up into three separate Republican districts, so that the Democratic majority would now be

five to seven percent of each one of those districts instead of an entirely blue city of Nashville, Tennessee. So literally, you can live across the street from somebody and they could be in a district where their representative is 100 miles away, 150 miles away, 250 miles away. This is what's happening all over the country. This is when we start talking about the importance of voting. So when people say votes don't matter, yes, they do. Because when you're voting locally and you're voting nationally, you're giving people power to appoint judges, judges, appellate judges, particularly who can vote down, who can take apart these gerrymandered plans for redistricting and setting up new districts of voting, when those began to shift and change,

we began to see the trickle down of allowing someone like President Trump to get into office. President Biden is at a unique crossroads here. He promised in July 2020 that should he be elected over Donald Trump, his first priority was going to be voting rights. We've seen that continue to fall down the ladder. And now the activists who pushed for this, who saved the Democratic Party with this last election, are now angry and justifiably so. So we're standing at a crossroads now where the pressure has to be put on the administration to follow through on their promises. And I want to pause in this moment and just take a pastoral privilege to say that Joe

Madison's a hero. You're a hero. You put yourself on the line. You have compromised your physical health. And yet we know that there is a power that is stronger than any diagnosis that an oncologist can give, that anything that could come out on a medical chart could cause you to feel. So, Joe, if you're watching and I know you're absorbing this energy, know that the entire Roland Martin nation here, that everyone here,

is in concert in saying that we speak radiant health on you, we speak healing, we speak empowerment, and we speak that your struggle is not in vain and that you have your entire life, a number of years ahead of you, to watch and see this come into fruition because we're not going to stop until we make it happen. We appreciate you, Reverend Carr, for that word,

and it was the perfect spiritual tone to pass along our best wishes to our comrade, dear brother Joe Madison. Dr. Malveaux, I want to pivot to you, and something Reverend Carr said struck me as fascinating. He talked about how voting matters. Democrats always talk about swing voters, but the swing voters they try to court

seem to go between Democrat and Republican when the swing voters they try to court seem to go between Democrat and Republican, when the swing voters that make differences for them are do I vote or do I not vote? And so if I'm one of those folks who's not a regular voter, and folks tell me voting matters, voting matters, voting matters. So I showed up to vote

out Donald Trump. And what's happened to me? What do I get in reward for that? Not knowing which place I'm allowed to go vote next time. And if I go vote in the What do I get in reward for that? Not knowing which place I'm allowed to go vote next time. And if I go vote in the wrong place, they're going to put me in jail. And so how do we speak to the disaffected, the disenfranchised, if we will, those folks who showed up because their daddy or their grandpa, their uncle, because, you know, we always say that mamas get us out to vote. And sometimes the brothers do their work, too. But their daddies and their uncles got them out to vote,

and now they voted, but now all of the things they told that would come to fruition have not come to pass, but yet they hear Reverend Carr say, well, voting matters, and they may be disillusioned. Is there a word, Dr. Malveaux, that you may have for those folks? Absolutely, but first I want to build on

what Reverend Carr has said. Joe Madison has been my friend for decades, my comrade, my colleague. We've spoken together. We've traveled together. He is all that and a bag of chips with a little bit of spice on the side. I am so sorry to hear about his cancer diagnosis, but like Dr. Carr, Reverend Carr, I believe that God is good all the time and that it ain't time for him to go yet. And I just want to send my personal appreciation to him. I've written him and will talk to him,

but we all need to just surround this brother who put his life on the line for voting rights. Then what I would say to young people is that because he put his life on the line for voting rights, you can do no less than vote. No, it isn't fair, but we can go back down memory lane, Lauren, Rev, go back down memory lane and talk about how it's never been fair. One of the memories I love to share with people is that I was six, and my mama took me to the voting booth in San Francisco by my little hand

and let me pull the lever for JFK. And on the way down to the voting booth, it was only about a block and a half, and on the way back, she talked vote, it was only about a block and a half. And on the way back, she talked to me about why Black people in Mississippi fought so hard for the right to vote. This, of course, was before the death of Medgar Evers. My mama was an activist.

My great-grandmother... Great-aunt, rather, Annie Mae Randall, was a voter registrar in Moss Point, Mississippi. Voting is at the marrow of my bones. If there were a Malvo who did not vote, I would kill him. And I really would, but that's not even in the lexicon. What young people must understand is that the arc toward justice bends our way, but sometimes it bends exceedingly long. And so we're not going to get everything we want today.

Don't be discouraged. Don't turn it off. We have to do what Joe Madison has done and put our lives on the line, what Medgar Evers has done. When I think about my great-grandmother, and I'm playing elder today, so, you know, I don't play it every day, but Auntie Anna Mae's birth certificate read race collared, as in greens.

Not colored, collared. Because a white person who registered her birth had less education than she did. She was a Tuskegee College graduate. She was all that and more. But some illiterate white mm registered her birth. And we spent years trying to fix it because she was not collared. She was a black person. And so, you know, I just tell young people, we have to look at the long game. The short game is we voted in 2020. Biden is a flawed president. We can be angry. The long game

is when I look at my own family history, I look at Auntie Anna Mae being the, could not vote, had to do that jelly bean thing, have to count how many jelly beans there were in a jar, which she never could do, had to learn Latin. Okay, had to learn Latin. They kept changing the rules and eventually became a registrar of voters. I look at that and I look at where we are and I say, folks, we cannot give up.

You know, ain't no time to turn down now. We don't know where we're coming from. Nobody told me the road would be easy. But he didn't bring us this far to leave me. I pre... We appreciate that word, Dr. Malveaux. And I want to take our viewers back to something I alluded to. I kind of dropped it in Reverend Carr's lap.

And again, my apologies for that, Reverend Carr, for dropping it in your lap. No problem, brother. But a new ruling has just come down from the Supreme Court overturning a lower court's ruling that Alabama's redrawn districts were unconstitutional. Now, I'm reading, so please bear with me as I read this particular piece,

because it was a 5-4 ruling with Chief Justice John Roberts siding with the more liberal justices in their opinion. Now, the lower court ruled that the state of Alabama's redrawn maps indeed violated the appearances of the Voting Rights Act. And here's a quote from John Roberts. In my view, the district court properly applied existing law in an existent opinion with no apparent errors for our corrections, he wrote in a solo dissent. And so it's fascinating

that we're finding, and this is what's happening also is, much to the issue that Reverend Carr brought up, this question of vote dilution. And for those that are not familiar with the particular language and mechanisms of voting, vote dilution is just what Reverend Carr alluded to. It is when we understand that a preponderance of registered voters for a particular party are in a particular place,

and so to make that block of voters less effective, you dilute them across multiple districts or constituencies in which of the candidate they would have to vote for. And that had been deemed by a district court in Alabama, United States District Court in Alabama, to be a violation of the Voting Rights Act. However, the 5-4 decision handed down by the Supreme Court today says that that will be overturned, that the map that the Alabama state legislature drew can exist, and not all of those

who have been in favor of supporting the map have offered their opinions or offered their justifications or rationale why. However, we have heard from Justice Alito and from Justice Kavanaugh, and one of their immediate concerns was that the necessary period for filing is visiting upon us, and those folks who want to run

would need to know what district and what order they need to run in, and it may be perhaps too confusing to go back and forth. And, of course, it would be a question of confusion. Of course. We're gonna have much more on that and more. We're gonna wrap up our show when we come back. You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered, streaming live on the Black Star Network.

You guys stay with us. We'll be right back. Nå er vi på veien. I'm Dr. Jackie Hood-Martin, and I have a question for you. Ever feel as if your life is teetering and the weight and pressure of the world is consistently on your shoulders? Well, let me tell you, living a balanced life isn't easy. Join me each Tuesday on Black Star Network for a balanced life with Dr. Jackie. We'll laugh together, cry together, pull ourselves together, and cheer each other on. So join me for new shows each Tuesday on Black Star Network, A Balanced Life with Dr. Jackie. We're all impacted by the culture, whether we know it or not.

From politics to music and entertainment, it's a huge part of our lives. And we're going to talk about it every day, right here on The Culture with me, Faraji Muhammad, only on the Black Star Network. Hey, everybody, it's your girl, Luenell. So what's up? This is your boy, Irv Quake. Hi, I'm Chaley Rose, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered.

In Connecticut, the same Bridgeport Police Department that failed to investigate the death of two black women properly has a long history of abuses of power and racist practices. Over the past five years, there have been a dozen lawsuits and complaints about excessive force or discrimination. Bridgeport's population is 20% white, while its police force is 54% white, and 80% of police leaders are white. Black officers and captains in the department

called for an independent investigation into racial discrimination last September after they said their treatment harmed officers' morale, mental health, well-being, career development, and reputation. The police department was under federal oversight from 1983 to 2010,

citing racially discriminatory practices. Just for a quick word from all three of our panelists on this, Dr. Malveaux, when we see this type of consistent... I mean, 1983 to 2010, when we see this type of consistent pattern, what should folks in Bridgeport, Connecticut look to as their guide? You told us earlier about Kristen Clark

and your optimism there. Are you going to point us back in that direction to be hopeful? I don't think we have any other choice than to look at the feds to be hopeful. I do think that this is... Bridgeport is a cesspool. But you know what? We have cesspools all over the country. We have cesspools in Baltimore, cesspools in D.C.

Majority Black, but still the police do what they do. Cesspools here in Los Angeles. And we can go all over the country and talk about cesspools. We must fight. We must struggle. There is an integrity to our struggle. And so, yes, I want Kristen Clark to step up, but I also want us to step up, right? We have to step up. We have to be outside this police department on a damn, and I say damn, I try not to curse on here i get caught about it but a daily basis and to tell these devils and that's what they are the devils you cannot just keep killing our people and

ignoring our rights the things that have happened in bridgeport in the last couple of months have been bone chilling and yes we have no other alternative, frankly, but the feds. Where else do we go? So we have to really work at the feds. And this yet, let me just rule back to our last conversation, another reason why we have to vote. Lauren, your thoughts about

Bridgeport, Connecticut and the ongoing police challenges there? You know, the police challenges there are no different than so many other departments that, you know, across the country. I grew up on Long Island, so I've been to Bridgeport a few times, just taking the ferry from Port Jefferson to Bridgeport. And unfortunately, not much has changed in many, over many decades. I'm not sure what, you know, what gets changed in some of these departments that have shown a great deal of bias. And in this case, I think just really just gross

incompetence with these two deaths of these women in Bridgeport that they decided that they weren't going to pay attention to until the media really got in there and got involved. It's a hard nut to crack. And to me, it only happens really on the federal level, as Dr. Malveaux just said. Unfortunately, I'm not too sure it's going to happen with this particular attorney general, even though we do have Kristen Clark there, which is, you know, a meaningful thing, obviously. You know, it goes up to the top. It really goes to that type of decision would go to Merrick Garland. So I don't know. As you might have guessed, I'm not a big Merrick Garland fan.

I know I keep bringing him up. But, you know, we live in a particularly precarious moment in this country's history right now with capital being attacked and what we're seeing out of this time of Donald Trump and his supporters getting bolder and bolder. And you need somebody up at the top, quite frankly, who will take all that on. And I don't think that that's going to be Merrick Garland. So something like Bridgeport, Connecticut is going to be harder to change with somebody that has no forceful leadership at the top. And Reverend Carr, your thoughts?

Yeah, I think it's all about perspective. We talk about making societal change. I was sitting here writing a card, and I had this piece of card here that had black on it because it was identifying some supplies that we had. And I was sitting there thinking about this as it relates to us. And I thought about what systemic racism is. As a system, there is a machine that has been created whose job it is to cut through. And it begins to cut through us. We try to piece things together by small things like diversity initiatives. So if we're not cautious, we end up changing the hand that is operating the scissors. But because the scissors are created with one particular function in mind, it doesn't matter who the

operator of the machine is if the machine is still performing the same task. What we need is people who are in place, who have the mentality that dismembers the machine, whether that's Merrick Garland, whether that's President Biden, whether it's federal oversight. We have to look beyond the cosmetics and say, we are going to break the system. In this case, the

hope is that by getting federal oversight with Bridgeport, we can dismantle the scissors and create another system where black people feel safe, where they feel that they are empowered, where they feel they are part of policing, that they are actually put into a space where they can protect and serve and be a part of the, and enjoy the benefits that taxpayers are supposed to enjoy. We already know there's no such thing as having a conversation like this without invoking no taxation without representation. If we are paying taxes, and citizens in Bridgeport are paying taxes, we should be able to have ourselves represented,

but not only represented, but our interests represented as well. So it is our hope that the federal government will come in here. It is our hope that the pressure that is coming from all over the country, from shows like this, from conversations like this, will open the door for us to have somebody put in place who is going to take the scissors apart and make something different happen in that area. Thank you so much, Reverend Carr. Now, turning our attention to a new report by Caring.com, found that less than 70% of black Americans

do not have a will. 33% of Americans have a will, but only 27.5% of blacks have them. Now, blacks could be missing out on $68 trillion worth of wealth transfer over the course of the next 25 years if estate planning and will preparations do not increase. Experts say everyone over the age of 18 needs to have a plan in place.

I remember being one who helped my grandmother write her will, and I had such joy when she had the opportunity to have a Harvard-trained and a Howard University-trained lawyer to be the ones to look over her will to make sure it was in compliance. Dr. Malveaux, I'm going to start with you. Have you made sure that you've gotten your estate planning taken care of? Oh, absolutely. And my mama did. My mom passed in June of this year, of 2021. She did her will in 1995, well before she made her transition.

And she made it clear to all her children what she was doing. My baby sister inherited her house. I get all her books, about 5,000 books. One of my sisters gets all the music, and another one gets all the jewelry. But she was very clear. There was no drama, et cetera. But you know, this is an issue because if you die

without a will, the state takes your stuff. So if you have a home, if you have money, whatever you have, if you haven't said who gets it, the state gets it. And that means that they can take up to two-thirds of it, which means that you didn't work your whole life to get the state of California or the District of Columbia or the state of Missouri to get your stuff. But it's a difficult conversation, Ray, that we have to have with our elders. A lot of black folks have planned everything about their funeral, from the music they want, you know,

to the hors d'oeuvres they want to be served, and everything but what their end-of-life planning is about. So this is a really important topic. I'm so glad that you brought it up. Dr. Malveaux trying to be all fancy because she a dean of colleges. She ain't mean hors d'oeuvres. She meant who going to make the fried chicken,

who going to have the potato salad, and y'all know our favorite question, who going to handle the body? Lauren Burke, what are your observations about this? Yolts and your family, have they taken care of their estate planning? Have you? I haven't, actually.

Funny, I don't have a will. But thankfully, I have several relatives that have wills that were quite generous to me specifically. And I have nothing to complain about on my general family estate planning, which has been quite good. But I do have, you know, the assets that I have are typically liquid. Unfortunately, no property yet, but I'm working on that. And so my nieces and nephews would be very, very thrilled about what I've done. I've basically just added them to my account and my sister. So, you know, to me, the biggest thing is the money.

Who gets the money? Who gets control over certain accounts? And that's what I've focused on. But, yeah, I'll do a will soon, absolutely. I'll do a will soon, take care of some property. But I don't really have anything I value that much other than my guitars. So I'm working on it. And you're white folks that get it, Lauren.

But whatever you have, you don't know white folks. I was just about, Dr. Malveaux, you jump in there, just about to say, Lauren, I want your notebook. I've seen you report before. I want that little reporter's notebook. I want that. And Reverend Carl, we know that Mother Carr just recently made transition.

Our continued condolences to you and your family as you guys remember her and still bask in her spirit and her glow. But what was the experience like for you all as a family tending to her issues and her material possessions after her transition? You know, and I will say, first off, thank you so much for that.

For those of you who know, my brother and I are fond of quoting both my mother and my father, who were accomplished, accomplished, self-educated people with the sixth and 10th grade education between them. They taught us that we could do anything we wanted to in the world. And at some point, we actually started believing them. And that's what helped us to become the successes that we are in the world today and to continue to chase their example. We had 93 amazing years from my mother, who was a queen mother. And she has infected,

effected, and affected change and hope in so many people that we were just shocked and in awe to see the number of people who showed up to her home going, her celebration on Friday, and to see the number of people who watched it online. It's online. And 4,000 people have watched her ceremony. And it was a celebration. It was a celebration because we are able to come together as a family. My mother had an expressed wish that

all three of her children would make the decisions that need to be made for the future. She left a property that is in a high-profile part of town, but when she and my father bought it, they struggled to pay that property off that house for $6,000 that they bought it in 1968. And it was their express will and desire that we carry on their tradition. It took several years for us to help get a will in place for mom. But we got that in place. We're just now allowing everything to settle so we can go in and look at things and parse things out and figure out who's responsible for what. Fortunately, we have a minister in the family and yours truly. And I deal with people four times in their lives.

I deal with birth. I come. I name babies. I deal with initiation. I bring your kids into rites of passage. I deal with marriage. I put people together, hopefully for the long term. And I deal with death. I deal with transition into this space of life after life. Let me tell you,

get a will in place, put it in writing, get what's called an estate planning book. I teach people to get a notebook. And in that notebook, you put things like your will. You put things like your insurance policy. You put if you have small children or you have special possessions, you put where that's gonna go, where they're gonna go. You're gonna put where the possessions go. You let people know where your passwords are. If you don't trust anybody to have your passwords,

you have a piece of paper that says, hey, call Lisa or call Johnny for my email account. Call somebody else for my Facebook. You put that all together because the sooner you do that, the better it is for those you may leave behind. It's not morbid to think about transition. I've been able to stand over people bodies of people who were 93, 106, 13, 2, and 6. So I'm telling you, the more you plan now, the easier it is for people like me down the line, because we don't have to step in and stop people from drawing guns on each other in the front yard after the funeral, as I have, fighting over what's going to

happen to the duplex and what's going to happen to grandmama's car. So this is a very practical way for you, for us to take responsibility, to make sure we maintain peace, to make sure that there is a legacy that we can leave to our family. And all it takes is a little bit of planning and sitting down and thinking through. As my dad used to say, an ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure. And as Dr. Malveaux brilliantly just told us and explained right now, you want to make sure that everybody knows what's going to happen. Because trust me, the grieving process and the process of being unsure

will produce a space where you'll be caught in a paralysis of angry analysis. And guess what happens? The state does take it. And that's the last thing you want to end up doing. I'm so glad that this topic came up tonight. And I'm so glad that we had the opportunity to share that you don't have to be a millionaire or a billionaire to have an estate.

There are writings that you have. There are books that you have. There are valuable intellectual creations that you have made in your life that deserve to have life beyond you. Think about the future generations, because I guarantee you, somebody before you thought about us. And in traditions of hearing ministers close words, let the church say amen. Amen. With that, we do want to pivot and to share some heartbreaking and disappointing news.

Ashley Bryan, an award-winning children's book author and illustrator, has died. The 98-year-old centered much of his work on African and African-American folklore. He worked on more than 70 books in his six-decade career. His most... his more notable works include Beautiful Blackbird and Infinite Hope, a black artist's journey from World War II to world peace.

Bryan served in the segregated army during World War II, which he used as an inspiration in his works. He earned several Coretta Scott King Awards, a Laura Ingalls Wilder Award for Lifetime Achievement, and New York Public Library's Lion Award. And we will miss him in his transition. And before we go, here's a reminder for you HBCU juniors or seniors.

You have about three weeks left to apply for that scholarship from Roland and McDonald's. If you attend an HBCU and Thurgood Marshall College Fund member institution, you can submit your application for the chance to receive a $15,000

scholarship. I think that covers what? Books and like two meals these days. But no, that's a great scholarship and we want you to get it. The deadline is February 28th. Again, that deadline is February 28th. Go to TMCF

TMCF.org for details on how to apply. Now in addition to the free money scholarship, recipients will also have the opportunity to engage with McDonald's executives working within their respective fields of study. Well, that does it for us here at Roland Martin Unfiltered.

I want to thank the panel, Dr. Julianne Malveaux, Lauren Victoria Burke, who was my mentor when I first started reporting on Capitol Hill. Good to be with you again, Lauren. And Reverend Jeff Carr, who I unfortunately, mistakenly called his brother, Greg, my former teacher. But we thank you so much for being with us. And we obviously thank you, the audience.

The Roland Martin unfiltered audience is always the hallmark of what we do here. And we appreciate you watching for streaming right here on the Black Star Network. If you haven't done it yet, download the Black Star Network. If you haven't done it yet, download the Black Star Network on all of your devices. Matter of fact, download them for your aunties

and your grandmas because you know they want to see the content but they might not be so good with the iOS. If you would like to support us so we can continue bringing stories that matter to us, make sure that you download them on all those platforms. On iPhone and everywhere else that you can get it. I am Ray Baker. Roland will be back tomorrow, but don't fret. You like how I do this?

I'm going to come and join you on Friday again to head to fill in for our brother Roland as he heads to Liberia for their bicentennial. And in parting, let us remember the words of the Yoruba proverb, that if we stand tall, it is because we stand on the backs of those who came before us. Good night.