#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Biden racial equity exec order; Misleading Sen leads COVID panel; Southern Baptists vex Black clergy

Episode Date: January 27, 2021

1.26.21 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Biden racial equity executive order; VP Kamala Harris gets second dose of COVID vaccine; Biden unveils plan to fight the coronavirus pandemic; Bishop T.D. Jakes talks COVID; Misleading Senator leads COVID-19 panel; Black Family handcuffed by cops sues Aurora, CO Police; Southern Baptists vex Black clergy; CBS responds to NABJ calling for the ouster of two top level executives; It has been one year since the tragic death of Kobe BryantSupport #RolandMartinUnfiltered via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered or via PayPal ☛https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfiltered#RolandMartinUnfiltered is a news reporting platform covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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at taylorpapersilling.org. Brought to you by Opportunity at Work and the Ad Council. Today is Tuesday, January 26, 2021. Coming up on Roland Martin Unfiltered, President Joe Biden announced his plans today for promoting racial equity and signed a series of executive orders to increase equality and address discrimination. So all y'all black folks who keep tweeting bullshit about, oh, Joe Biden hasn't done any executive orders targeting black people. Y'all can shut up now. Vice President Kamala Harris got her second vaccination today

for the COVID-19 vaccine. Also, an Ohio senator who said blacks are more susceptible to COVID-19 because of poor hygiene will now lead an Ohio Senate health panel. Really? Also, SAG-AFTRA makes a statement, along with NABJ, after CBS announced they are suspending two hierarchy executives for allegedly making racist and misogynistic comments regarding staffers. We'll also show you the reaction of black staffers to what was said. Also, folks, black pastors are considering leaving the Southern Baptist Convention because of racial insensitivity. We'll talk with Pastor Dwight McKissick of Cornerstone Baptist Church in Arlington, Texas. All right, folks, we got a jam-packed show for you. In addition to Bishop T.D. Jakes, we're talking to him about COVID-19 and what he is saying, what we need to do to ensure black folks are getting the vaccine.

In a black family that was handcuffed and wrongfully accused of riding in a stolen vehicle in Colorado, they're now suing the police department. Plus, protesters picked up the streets in Tacoma, Washington, after seeing a video showing a police car plowing through a crowd and running people over. Folks, it is time to bring the funk. I'm Roland Barton on Filthy. Let's go. He's got it. Whatever the piss, he's on it. I'm Roland Barton on Filthy. Let's go. With entertainment just for kicks He's rollin' Yeah, yeah It's Uncle Roro, y'all Yeah, yeah

It's Rollin' Martin Yeah, yeah Rollin' with Rollin' now Yeah, yeah He's funky, he's fresh, he's real The best you know He's Rollin' Martin Now He's real, the best you know, he's rolling, Martin. Martin.

Today, President Joe Biden signed four new executive orders aimed at improving racial equity in America. Each of his actions are expected to lay the groundwork for improvements in discriminatory housing practices, government ties to private prisons, tribal government relations, and increased xenophobia against Asian Americans due to COVID-19. This is Joe Biden speaking earlier today. In my campaign for president, I made it very clear that the moment it arrived as a nation where we face deep racial inequities in America and systemic racism that has plagued our nation for far, far too long. I said that over the course of the past year that the blinders have been taken off the nation, the American people. But what many Americans didn't see or had simply refused to see couldn't be ignored any longer. Those eight minutes and 46 seconds that took George Floyd's life

opened the eyes of millions of Americans and millions of people all over the world. It was the knee on the neck of justice, and it wouldn't be forgotten. It stirred the conscience of tens of millions of Americans, and in my view, it marked a turning point in this country's attitude toward racial justice. COVID-19 has further ripped a path of destruction through every community in America, but no one has been spared. But the devastation in communities of color has been nothing short of stunning.

Just look at the numbers. 40 percent of frontline workers, nurses, first responders, grocery store workers are Americans of color, and many are still living on the edge. One in 10 black Americans is out of work today. One in 11 Latino Americans is out of work today. One in seven households in America, about one in four black, one in five Latino households in America, report that they don't have enough food to eat in the United States of America.

Black and Latino Americans are dying of COVID-19 at rates nearly three times that of white Americans. And it's not white Americans' fault, but just a fact. And the Americans now know it, especially younger Americans. It's just been weeks since all of America witnessed a group of thugs, insurrectionists, a political extremist, and white supremacists violently attack the capital of our democracy. And so now, now is the time to act. It's time to act because that's what the faith and morality call us to do. Across nearly every faith, the same principles hold.

We're all God's children. We should treat each other as we would like to be treated ourselves. We have never fully lived up to the founding principles of this nation, to state the obvious, that all people are created equal and have a right to be treated equally throughout their lives. And it's time to act now, not only because it's the right thing to do, but because if we do, we'll all be better off for it. For too long, we've allowed a narrow, cramped view of the promise of this nation to fester. Just imagine, of more incredibly creative and innovative, how much more creative and

innovative we'd be if this nation held the historic... In my campaign for president, I made it very clear that the moment it arrived as a nation... All right, folks, a bit of slight technical difficulty there, so we'll work through that and figure out what went on there. We'll try to play the rest of that.

These executive orders, again, President Joe Biden signed a series of executive orders on Wednesday and Thursday. Now you have these executive orders here. He also said it's time for the United States to no longer be in the private prison business, overturning a decision made by the Donald Trump White House. You might remember President Barack Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder made it clear the U.S. was getting out of that business as well. So let's talk about all of that with our panel right now. We have, of course, Candace Kelly, legal analyst in F. Lee Francis, the Federalist Society,

and later we'll be joined by Misha Cross, political analyst and Democratic strategist. Candace, I'll start with you. There are it's amazing. I had some some crazy person who's utterly clueless sent me a tweet. Oh, where are the black specific executive order? They had some fool today sent me an email whining and complaining. And I kept saying, well, first of all, you need to realize a lot of stuff that y'all calling for. You can't do it by executive order. You have to actually do by passing the laws. Okay. But let's talk about this here, the actions he took today, the private prison action. And let's talk about these other executive orders,

your thoughts on what he signed today. Yeah. Well, the private prison action, let's talk about that. I mean, the government should not be in the business of private prison because what's happening is that people are going to look at this and they're going to say, well, of course, this makes sense that the government would have their hands in the private prison and connect it to the policing and the state of the police system now and what's going on. And that's not a good look for the government. And we know that when Joe Biden first ran for office, he ran on the basis of eradicating the racist system. So this was a great move by Joe Biden. I think a move that people were expecting.

I think when we look at some things like the Fair Housing Act, if we look at the Fair Housing Act and making sure that people are not discriminated against because of the types of families that they have, or with their mortgages, or even with sexual harassment as part of the Fair Housing Act. While it's great on paper, what we need to do is retrain people who are in the business. This is the same thing that police are going through in terms of let's retrain the people. You can have all of these acts on paper and the words are great, but if it's not put into action, then what you end up with is a lot of people just suing based upon the Fair Housing Act. When they don't get the mortgage, then they're spending all of their money on fighting these lawsuits. So while it is great, we have to change the root of the system. We have to retrain people to make them understand

that they have to change their minds in terms of how they perceive people of color. And that is where the real work is that has to be done. Lee, your assessment of the executive order signed by President Joe Biden? Yeah, I don't think really much of it has any teeth at all. I think the one that maybe has the most punch is the DOJ's instruction of not renewing their private prison contracts, which by the way, was started to reduce overcrowding. This isn't significant because out of the millions of people that are currently in government prisons, less than 9 percent, 8.2 percent of all prisoners are in private prisons.

That's 128,000 out of 1.5 million people currently incarcerated. So to say that somehow private prisons are overrun or taking over government authority. That's just simply not accurate. Also, private prisons are cheaper to run. They save taxpayers upwards of $144 million per year, which is $17 a day per prisoner less than it takes to run the government system. Lee, are you mindful of that story that came out of, I think it was Connecticut, let me know if that's the right state, Candace,

where a judge actually was found guilty and was sent to prison because he was purposely sending black folks to a particular friend's private prison because he wanted, because he needed those bodies in there. This is precisely why people oppose private prisons. It's because private prisons, the entire business model is based on more prisoners. The United States is already the world's leader in imprisoning people. So we dealt with the reality of black bodies being an economic driver in this country when we had slavery. What we don't need is for there to be private prisons whose stock prices go up based upon a law and order candidate winning because they, in order for their stock price to go up,

they need more people in prison. In fact, in Mississippi, one second, one second, one second. In Mississippi, there were cities and counties in Mississippi complaining about the reduction of people going to jail because the people in the town said, oh my God, if we don't have these inmates, then we might lose our prison and might lose our jobs. They weren't caring about mass incarceration. They weren't caring about the problem of criminal justice. They were like, we need more of these prisoners.

That, Lee, is why it's not a good idea to have private prisons when they are all driven by economics. Well, I think you missed the entire point of private prisons. No, no, no, no. I know the point of private prisons. I let you talk. No, no, no, no. Do this here. Don't tell me I missed the point.

One second, Lee. I'm going to let you talk. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Don't tell me I missed the point. One second, Lee. I'm going to let you finish. Don't tell me I missed the point where if you create a private prison and it is a publicly traded company, that means that that company's whole point is to drive their stock price up and their stock price is driven by more and more prisoners. Now you can finish. So I think you missed the point in that private prisons are not putting people in jail. The people who are committing the offenses are doing that to themselves. In 2008, there were 1.2 million violent crimes.

And that includes murder. That includes rape. That includes anything with a weapon. So what do we do with those people who commit heinous offenses? Obviously we need somewhere for them to go because if we put them in a government run prison, someone's going to come back and say, oh, well, you know, this is overcrowding or the conditions aren't, aren't great. But what's the alternative? Again, we're talking about a de minimis amount of people, less than 10%, 128,000 out of 1.5 million. So to say that this is somehow going to change or that the government is fostering incarceration, that's not true. People who

commit these offenses are doing this to themselves. See, Candace, here's the problem with Lee's argument. We all know that when the federal government does something, it does have an impact on what the states do. And so when you begin to have a change in federal sentencing policy, when you begin to have a change in federal prison policy, it then impacts the state. In fact, legislators in the House and the Senate could literally craft bills to offer incentives for states to lower their prison populations, just like they did in that 1994 crime bill where they offered incentives for the states to actually put folks in prison longer. So, right. The one that Joe Biden authored? Yes, yes. The one that Joe Biden authored and the one that Republicans and Democrats voted for.

So the whole point here, Candace, the whole point here, Candace, is that this is significant. But what I find to be interesting is that if it's not significant, then why did Donald Trump and Jeff Sessions and Bill Barr revert back to instituting the private prison?

See, Candace, that's why Lee's argument doesn't hold any water. Candace, go ahead. This is a perfect example of the three branches of government that we learned about when we were younger, that a lot of people don't remember, right? The executive, legislative, and judicial branches. And we've seen some stark misrepresentations of how these three branches should work separately because they haven't. They've been overlapping for the past four years. And the example that you gave about the judge making recommendations for a prison is a perfect example of how we need to keep these separated for that very reason.

We can't have this overlap or else you end up with the prison system looking the way that it does today, which is why exactly what you said is true. This is why Joe Biden said, let's get out of this game. Let me reverse what Trump did. And basically speaking, whatever the reversal of what Trump did is going to be in the name of something good for people of color, because most of what Trump did on paper or what he said out of his mouth was either something racist or xenophobic, phobic or misogynistic or something within those realms in order to hold certain groups of people back. And that's exactly why President Joe Biden did what he did.

So please explain to me, Lee, how these executive orders won't do anything. So you're saying the housing executive order is just sort of irrelevant? Well, so before I get to that, I think we need to get the constitutional issues right here, because while the branches are separate, they are co-coordinate branches. So they are by default supposed to work together. Consider, for example, an appointment. The president appoints, nominates someone, gets advice and consent from the Senate. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no No, not Lee, Lee, not all appointments. Susan Rice, who Biden picked as part of his team, does not have to go before the United States Senate. So the Senate does not advise and consent on all appointments as only a select. No,

no. Lee, you literally just said I never said a presidential said with appointments. And I think we've got to listen to what the Lee Lee. We heard what you said, but we know the Constitution. Lee, I'm asking about the housing. I'm asking about housing. And again, so when you say these executive orders don't mean anything, really. So you just so these they mean nothing. Are you saying that the executive order signed today won't have any impact on the issue of racial equity?

So let's look at the language of the actual executive order. So when we look at the fair housing order, the order that he sends to HUD, it says that it is to examine the effects of the Trump executive orders. So that isn't somehow, and it goes on to say to increase compliance with the Fair Housing Act. These aren't anything new. This isn't a new law. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You said it's not anything new. Did you forget when Ben Carson, the secretary of HUD, when they actually told states that in the cities they did not have to submit their plans and abide by the rules of the Obama era when it comes to ending patterns of housing discrimination? Did you forget that? No, I think what I'm trying to get you to realize is that the language of the executive

order does not actually show anything. It doesn't do anything. It says we are going to examine. This executive order is calling for a committee to look at what Donald Trump's administration did. It's not actually directing anyone or directing any kind of policy. That's the whole point of an executive order. It's a government email, essentially. Candace, go ahead. What it does do is it reinforces what is on paper, and that's what we often have to do, whether it is the Civil Rights Act. You know, let's, for example, we think about applying for a job, right? When you apply for a job, at the bottom of the application, it normally says that we are, you know, an equal opportunity employer.

But on the other hand, we have the EEOC, which deals with issues that have to do with employment. And it's ripe with lawsuits and concerns from people who feel like they have and have been discriminated against. So I understand what you say by, hey, we have these things on paper. But with the same token, we need to examine these things that are on paper to see if they are working, if they are not working and what we need to do in order to make them work. All of these things that are on paper need a little bit of oversight because nobody was watching them for the past four years. Well, we certainly know that has been the case. So bottom line is this here. These are the early actions being taken by the Biden administration. And we certainly are going to be following more of these. All right, folks, today, in a huge contrast from obviously Donald Trump and his minions, Vice President Kamala Harris received her second dose of the COVID-19

vaccine. Harris was given the shot at the National Institutes of Health live on television. She was joined by her husband, Doug Emhoff uh nih director dr francis collins dr anthony fauci y'all can play the video please uh she who's the nation's top infectious disease expert Okay. Yeah.. . . . .

. . . . .. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you. All right. We have helped protect your health. Yes.

Well, so I have the vaccine. And it really was painless, relatively painless. But I want to thank everyone here at NIH for all you do. As you said, so thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. It really was painless, relatively painless. But I want to thank everyone here at NIH for all you do. As you said, so growing up, my mother, our mother, would go.

We always knew that mommy was going to this place called Bethesda. Mommy's going to Bethesda. Now, we're living in California. My mother would go to Bethesda. And, of course, what she was doing, she was coming here to NIH. And she was in the biochemical endocrinology study section. She was a peer reviewer.

And my mother had two goals in her life, to raise her two daughters and then breast cancer. In fact, little known fact, my first job was cleaning my pets in my mother's lab. She would take us there with her after school and on weekends. And I grew up there around science in a way that was taught to me by someone who is so profoundly passionate about a gift, which is the gift that scientists give to us, and that their whole reason for being is to see what can be unburdened by what has been. Their whole reason for being is to pursue what is possible for the sake of improving human life and condition. It is such a noble pursuit. And the importance of NIH is that this is about an essential function of government,

which is to provide for the public health. The work that happens here has one goal, to improve public health. And the importance of the pursuit of the work that happens at NIH is it's not about profit, it's about the people. And so I want to say to everyone who works here i know who you are i know what you do i know that you work around the clock with those experiments that have to be checked on every few hours and they don't care about what time it is on the clock i know the work you do and the collaboration that is required.

I know the work that you do reviewing grants, because of course, some of the most significant scientific research has been publicly funded. That's what my mother did, she reviewed grants. And so I have the luxury of being here at this moment on just the fifth day of our administration is coming full circle. Because you see, NIH was such a huge part of my youth

as this place that my mother went all the time and was very excited to work. So I want to thank everyone for all you're doing. So now to the vaccine. NIH, these scientists, these medical professionals, doing the work of pursuing what is in the interest of the public health have been a big part of the vaccine that I just took. They, through the research, through the dedication,

created something that will save your life and the life of your family and the community. And so I want to urge everyone to take the vaccine when it is your turn. It is really pretty painful, and it will save your life. So thanks to all who are doing this great and important work. Let's make sure everyone gets a vaccine. On behalf of President Biden and myself, I thank you for everything you do every day. And the bottom line is that we're going to get 100 million vaccinations in 100 days. And then we're going to continue to do what is necessary to improve

the health and well-being of our country. So thank you. Thank you, Dr. Fauci. Thank you again. Okay. Have you talked to any senators about the COVID relief package? My God, isn't it wonderful to have an administration official who can speak fluently about the COVID-19 vaccine and not play to the stupid people in the cheap seats? Amisha Cross joins us. Amisha, that is a huge difference between what we've had to watch. Sure, Vice President Mike Pence took the shot, but goodness, I mean, just the nonsense we heard from the previous administration. This is night and day. No, you're absolutely correct, Roland. Leading with facts, leading with earnest, leading with an understanding of just how grave this pandemic has been and just how far we have to go,

not only in getting the vaccines in the arms of people who need it, but also decreasing vaccine hesitancy and making sure that we are ensuring that people of color specifically are actually receiving this vaccine and that they have access. I think that what we've seen from Kamala Harris thus far is someone who is poised, someone who is ready to lead on day one, someone who knows how to speak to people, which was something we did not see from the previous administration, and someone who is leaning in on the science. We've seen the relationship that she's developed with, as well as Biden has developed with Dr. Anthony Fauci. And there's an understanding that these are people who are leading with the winds of science at their backs. They're not just up there making things up. So I think that a lot of this is also reemphasizing

how important the vaccine is, that it's safe, that it's effective, and it's easing a lot of fears and getting rid of a lot of the conspiracy theories that we saw around the vaccine that were spread by the previous administration. You got to admit, Lee, even though you're a Republican, it's great not to have an idiot talking about the COVID-19 dilemma and the vaccine in Donald Trump to have competency now speaking about it from the White House.

Well, you know, I think Mike Pence is a good example of someone who is a humanist and can relate to people. But to your point, I think, you know, we need people who are educated to be talking about this. This is very important. We need people with all the information to be able to give that information back to those who need to receive it. And I think we did see some missteps with the former administration. But I think, again, this vaccine is a product of that administration. And so I think we do need to give them credit where it is due. But I think we should encourage people give them credit where it is due. But I think I think we should encourage people to get the vaccine. We should encourage people to know that it's healthy and we'll see

what happens. But I think this is a positive step forward. Candace. You know, it's nice to be able to listen to someone where you don't have to feel like that you have to immediately fact check. And what this was was some wonderful marketing, because that you have to immediately fact check. And what this was was some wonderful marketing, because that's what we need right now. There are still about 50 percent of people who are just not on. Yes, according to the latest studies. And they are encouraged when they see their friends and other people that they trust doing so. So what she did was not only wonderful and getting the vaccine, the second dose, but also connecting her mother to it and how her mother connecting to connecting the dots and how she was there growing up as a child and showing everybody that she's not just invested in this vaccine, but she's invested in the NIH, the work that they're doing and how all of it just makes perfect sense to her and has always made sense. And she knows that they're

working to do good. So that was a wonderful look in terms of what she was trying to share and express with people, which is go and get the vaccine if you're eligible and if you can. And look, the bottom line here is that we're facing a significant issue. We now know the administration is ramping up what they're going to be, vaccines are going to be sending to the states. I mean, that's kind of importantly, look, you got to have a national plan for the vaccine. A lot of the states were complaining that it was just a hodgepodge rollout that existed. There has to be a real national plan. And really, it has to be a plan where you're also getting it to the people who are most in need. Well, I think if we're expecting the federal government to get things

to people who are in need, I think we are either in the wrong country or we have the wrong expectations of the federal government. Actually, actually, we don't. I tell you what, though. Hey, Lee, hey, Lee, have you ever I've got a question for you. Have you ever been through a hurricane? Yes, I have. And guess what? When those hurricanes hit, do you know who normally rises to the occasion? It's FEMA. And when people, one second, one second, one second. As somebody who's born and raised in Houston, who has lived through multiple hurricanes, I can tell you we've also had massive flooding in this country as well.

It's really interesting when I hear people who complain about government, but when they ask, is there some serious need? You know what they are thankful for? When government is able to come in. Well, no, I think government is obviously a part of the system, but whether we're talking about the federal government versus the state's government, the county is more connected to the people than the folks in Washington. And where does the county get the money from? Where does the county get the money from versus the state's government. The county is more connected to the people than the folks in Washington. And where does the county get the money from? Where does the county get the money from and the resources? No, I think the point is, it's not about the money or the resources.

It's who is able to get the virus or the vaccine. No, who gets it to the county? No, no, no. Hold on, hold on, hold on. So as you talk about a constitution, let's walk through this here. If you're the county, who do you go through to get it from? I think we're making the same point. Actually, no, actually we're not.

The federal government isn't, you don't have people in the federal government. I think, I'm not sure where your disconnect is or where the rest of the reality is here, but the idea is the federal government directs it to a place. It directs it to the state. The state directs it to a place. It directs it to the state. The state directs it to the counties. So if you have a hodgepodge, mismatch, confused federal policy, that means you're going to have confusion on the state level. And then on a state level, you're not going to be able to have a clear plan to get to the counties. That's not what that means.

That's not what that means. That's not what that means. Are you telling me? So you're telling me. I'm aware you all are. So you're telling me that if you have this hodgepodge, absolutely, utterly confusing federal response, you're going to have a seamless state and county response. Let me tell you this. What was the

federal plan? There wasn't one. There wasn't one. Exactly. You're missing the point here. The federal plan was to encourage the states who are connected with their people to get to the places that needed to go. Lord have mercy. Amisha, Amisha, this is why what Lee just said is nonsense. We know for a fact. No, it's nonsense. No, no, no, no, no, Lee. This is why it's nonsense. We know for a fact that after COVID hit, states were competing against other states for PPE, for masks, for all sorts of different things. Federal has the capacity to come in and say, hey, we ain't doing that.

You're not going to charge nine times more in Maryland. But because it was such a need, New York says we'll pay more than Maryland. So you have massive price gouging. So what the federal government is able to do, Amisha, they're able to come in and say, federal is now here. We're going to level this whole deal off. We're going to acquire massive amounts. And then we will then distribute to the states based upon need as provided to us by those officials. Now, when you're the governor, you then say to your counties, provide for me what your needs are. So when I go to the federal folks to ask for stuff, I know your needs. Then the county judges like those in Texas

will then say to the city mayors, let me know what your needs are. So then when I go to the state, the state has a real idea what to ask the feds. But at the end of the day, if you have federal folks saying, states, y'all do whatever y'all want to do, you're going to have mass damn confusion all over the country. And that's what we have right now. No, you know, you're absolutely correct. And I can't speak for everybody on this panel, but as someone who's worked at the federal, state and local level in county and city government, what I know is that when there are crisis points, crisis points that raise the level of ire of what we've seen from what we've seen from COVID-19 and what we

know from some of our previous, you know of our previous health concerns and health issues, the federal government has to lead. In any situation across this country where we've had to get vaccines or vaccines became part of a required process, the federal government led. The federal government had a plan for the states. That plan was made clear immediately. And then from the states, it fell down to the county and the city level. So I'm kind of confused at this now, all of a sudden Republicans wanting to have a removal. The whole reason why Donald Trump pushed to give everything to the states was because he didn't want to take blame for any bit of his bungled non-action plan. And I think that what you have to realize here and hearing in this argument is a misunderstanding by many Republicans who repeat these Trump rhetoric points is that this is not how our

government is supposed to work. When you have these issues, and I love, Roland, that you brought up natural disasters. When you have issues that elevate to that level of emergency, it requires federal action and support for the states. Because what ends up happening is you have states competing for resources, where you have price gouging, where you have states that are going to get left behind, where you have states that will never see an allocation at all, and they're trying to figure out ways to be able to help their people. And we've seen that happen across the country in red states and blue states, and it's really affecting communities of color more than anything else. But when we're talking about the allocations that we need to see and

what we need to see in terms of a federal response, it matters to lead from the top. There has to be that coordination. And that's why one of the first calls that now President Biden made was to state governors. He was calling governors during the campaign to figure out what their needs were, because that was not happening from President Trump. He didn't care unless you were willing to cut a commercial for him and get some votes out. It's frustrating that he didn't want to eradicate the process. Actually, it is true. And the reality is here, Candace, you also had Trump was playing favorites. If you were a governor who kissed his ass, he liked you. But if you were a governor who didn't, oh, he dissed you. Ask Republican Governor Larry Hogan how that went when the federal government actually seized PPE that they actually had acquired.

Bottom line is this here, Candace, thank goodness we're having competent people who are not afraid of leading to put in a national federal COVID-19 vaccine plan. So we're not going to deal with states competing. Well, are you going to get the Pfizer or the Moderna? How much am I going to get? What are my needs? All of those sort of different things. As you've said, the states are too partisan. If we take a look at what happened with the governors of, let's say, Florida, right, or even South Dakota,

we see how governors responded directly correlated with the number of people that had COVID and the cases go up astronomically. We cannot leave it up to the governors because they're too busy playing politics, which is why, like you said, we need somebody to come along like a Joe Biden and a Kamala Harris to say this is going to be the national plan. And this is not new. As you said, the federal government comes in and they make rules where people cannot manage themselves often, whether it's FEMA, whether it's whether it's, you know, you know, different, you know, other laws that we all have to abide by. OK, there are federal laws and the and the government makes them when states cannot do them for themselves. We need to understand that different states can't have different laws when it comes to gay marriage, for example, which is why when the Supreme Court spoke or, you know, or when different parts of the government speak, they make national law so that everybody can be on the same accord. There's no sense.

That's not true. That's not what happens. The Supreme Court created a law that didn't exist in Obergefell. And states did have different rights when it came to marriage. Well, okay. Okay. All right. Here's the deal.

Here's the deal. First of all, we ain't talking about gay marriage. And bottom line is, it's law. The fact of the matter is this. What Candace said, and Lee, you can try to latch on to that one. What Candace is saying is that when you have a national disaster, that's the perfect place for the federal government to lead. Finally, we are seeing leadership come out of 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue because all we had before was somebody who did not want to have any blame, who downplayed the whole deal, who actually said, oh, we have 15 cases. We're soon down to zero.

And you had Larry Cutler who said we pretty much have this whole thing contained. Four hundred. Do we just do we forget the comments that Governor Cuomo said? Governor Newsom thanking the Trump administration for their reaction? Guess what? That's fine. Because those are different kinds of stuff. But also, and I already said, don't Trump desire governors who kiss their ass to get stuff? And that's what you were dealing with. And guess what? Now you don't have to kiss up to Trump and soothe his ego to get what's right because

we now have people who don't need their asses kissed to do what's right. Thank goodness. That's why the 81 million did what was right. And the 74 million can go kick rocks. One of the issues we're also dealing with right now, folks, is how do we get people to actually believe in the science and take the COVID-19 vaccine? Bishop T.D. Jackson and I sat down today, had a conversation about this and what he is doing to get people to understand, to have the right information and not be victims of misinformation when it comes to the vaccine. Bishop Jakes, always good to see you, talk to you, say hello to all my folks there in Dallas.

I still own a home there. My parents are there. And, you know, I've only been able to see them one time since the pandemic. I flew to Dallas. I'm still registered to vote there. I flew there in October. Got to see my parents the first time. And this is really been so difficult on lots of people. We're used to family reunions. We're used to Thanksgiving and Christmas and birthdays and anniversaries. And so for you, for someone who travels way more even than I do, how have you had to cope with this? First of all, Roland, thank you for having me. It's always a pleasure to be a part of anything that you're doing.

You know, I want to say it's been very difficult and that it's been very stressful. And I want to say, being a pastor, the stats that we incur from the pandemic become the realities for us because we bury the numbers. And we know that the numbers are not numbers. We're at 420,000 people are dead. They turn into funerals for us. So we see the families, we see the pain, we see the tragedies, and we're trying to service them through masks and social distancing and feed families without touching families who are grieving. It's been difficult. But I'm a little reticent to really say that because when I look at the families themselves and realize how much harder it's been for them than it has been for me, I'm embarrassed to complain about any inconveniences or pain that I had.

My children are healthy. My wife and I are healthy. And all in all, we came out well. But the reality is we all are impacted. Our churches are impacted. We're not having in-person services. We are our business or businesses are suffering all of those different things. And so this is one of those things that it doesn't matter how much money you got.

Dave Chappelle recently tested positive for COVID-19. We've lost other folks for it as well. And so so we, this thing does not discriminate. Your money cannot, your money and your faith. I mean, look, you've had, look, Bishop Harry Jackson, who was, you had that, that event at your church with a conversation between him and Paula White, Joshua Dubois, April Ryan, Father Michael Flager. He passed away due to COVID. And so it doesn't discriminate.

No, it doesn't. And then when you look at an organization like ours, people see me, but there are 300 employees that I'm trying to keep paid while our doors are closed. I'm trying to keep from laying them off and their families adjoining the food lines that we have been feeding. We've been feeding thousands and thousands of families, and I'm trying to keep my staff out of those food lines with the doors closed to the church. So it's been very difficult. We had to pivot in our approach to ministry. We were able to pivot fairly quickly because we were used to streaming anyway, but we were not used to streaming where the entire organization was dependent upon streaming to do

it. So that's a whole different animal. It's been tough. A lot of our businesses are closed. A lot of our people are unemployed. A lot of our restaurants are shut down. It's taken a toll, particularly on people of color who provide service-oriented type jobs more readily than other people groups. So black and brown people have been disproportionately economically affected by the challenge and disproportionately affected by the disease itself, incurring it more readily, living in smaller spaces, not able to socially distance in a two bedroom apartment with six people in it. It becomes very difficult to socially distance.

Information, information, information is so vital. And one of the things that that we had to look at, even if you look at on the political side, black people were greatly impacted by voter misinformation. Now let's talk about COVID. Bishop, it is stunning to me what I am hearing from our people. The comments, when we talk about a vaccine, oh God, no. I mean, Henry Hank Aaron just passed away, took a COVID shot. People are like, oh, the shot killed him. So how are you as a leader now dealing with this in terms of getting our people to understand that disproportionately more of us have died from COVID than anybody else. In the medical arena, nearly 30% of the medical workers who have died are black.

How do we deal with this fear of black people and this readiness to latch onto these conspiracy theories and misinformation and folk bring up Tuskegee and everything else? How are you dealing with that? Well, first of all, it's understandable that we would be skeptical of anything coming from the science field because of the history and some of the atrocities that have been done to black people, not only through the Tuskegee experiment, but through the high rates of childbirth deaths in the black community. When you look at the high rates of hysterectomies done on black women, there's a lot of reasons why we would be a little bit concerned.

But what we are after more than anything is truth. You know, Jesus said you should know the truth and the truth shall set you free. And we're living in a time that truth is ambiguous and very difficult to find and to focus on. And so what I did was to use my platform to bring together experts to have an open, honest, frank discussion about what is going on with this vaccination. Where are we with the virus? What are the ramifications if you're pregnant? What are the ramifications if you're of a certain age? What are the ramifications if you're on certain types of medications?

Just to ask some very thorough questions that I wasn't seeing asked as often as I would like to in mainstream media, and to have an opportunity to have four professionals of the level that I did, one of them being my own personal physician co-hosting with me, we were able to really get down to the bottom of some things. And I put it on my YouTube channel so that anybody could go to it and access it and then make their own informed decisions. I'm not trying to tell people what to do.

I'm just exposing them with the kind of information that helps them to make informed choices. This to me, I really believe, Bishop, for those of us who our people look up to, this is probably going to be one of the biggest challenges we've ever faced, trying to fight the fear and the misinformation. And we know black folks trust in more from a black source. The studies don't lie. Black people get better care from black doctors and black medical professionals than they do anyone else. And one of the things that I did with my show from the moment COVID hit, and we probably, I dare say,

have done 80 to 100 COVID segments. I purposely put on Black experts from HBCUs, Black doctors, Black infectious disease specialists. I wanted our people to see African-Americans speaking on these issues. And then also, I think it's just important having black experts say, hey, we feel y'all we're in this, but we're the experts. Listen to us on this. That's one of the reasons I had Dr. Kismiki Corbett to to be on the panel because she was one of the epidemiologists that created the vaccine

and happens to be a black woman and has happens to be a black woman of faith. And I brought her on because I thought that she would add credibility to the discussion, that she could dispel myths about the vaccine, that she could help us to walk through the process. And then Dr. Ogubogu, I went to the opposite side, Yale University, not connected to anybody related to Dr. Fauci, so that we could get different people from different streams of consciousness to weigh in in an objective way and have a holistic conversation about what does it mean to take the vaccination,

what does it mean to not take the vaccination, and what are the consequences of the choices that we're about to make. This conversation had those experts. Dr. Anthony Fauci was also a part of that. We have seen how people greatly respect him and what he has to say. And that's also vital because our people also, and why he should do those things, because our people need to also realize that we can pull in those experts as well and then pair them with our experts. And we're getting the best information, the latest up-to-date information to keep our folks informed. That's exactly what we're trying to do.

The other thing that we're fighting is that the vaccination has become politicized. I don't know how it became politicized because both the right and the left have agreed about the vaccination from the Trump administration to the Biden administration. They've agreed about the vaccination. We haven't agreed about anything else. We've agreed about the vaccination from the Trump administration to the Biden administration.

They've agreed about the vaccination. We haven't agreed about anything else. We've agreed about that. But now that has become politicized. And this politicization of masks and everything else has just become redundant and reprehensible. Because while we are debating about our particular political persuasions, people are dying, black, white, and brown, at disproportionate rates, more than what have died in World War II. When you look at that many Americans dying just in America alone, we have to get on one accord about this. We've really, it's imperative. And we don't have long. We have to do it quickly. Well, look, as somebody who covers politics, part of this was also, when I look at all of the analysis coming out of the White House, where there were people who were trying, I mean, the experts were trying to get Donald Trump to say no, push wearing masks.

His whole deal was, and even his, they showed him polling, his own poster said, this actually helps you. He said, it's going to hurt, it's going to, my base is not going to like it, not going to do it. When, so when it became that political, when it became all about, oh, red states, open them up. We don't want y'all wearing masks. It's y'all blue states who are causing the problems. That was the moment when a president has to set aside partisanship and say, no, no, no, no. I'm leading the country. I'm not leading red states. I'm leading red and blue. I'm not leading Republicans. I'm leading Republicans and Democrats. And I've said this to conservative black pastors. E.W. Jackson Jackson of Virginia stood up there and said,

God is going to protect me from COVID. He later tested positive. And I keep saying, y'all, the Lord also sent doctors. Right. So listen to them. We've had a lot of preachers to die. A lot? I mean, a lot of preachers to die. Some i mean a lot of preachers to die some of them were

friends of mine some of them were people i've known for years and we have to understand that faith without works is dead being alone you can have great faith but you still have to have works if you have a heart attack you still call an ambulance if you break a leg you still have the bones set that doesn't negate that you have faith in God. And I think it's important that we dispel all of those kinds of myths. It's unfortunate that we've been down the political road, that we've been down unprecedented, unlike anything I have ever seen in my entire life. But we also have a pandemic that did not care about whether the state was red or blue. And some of those states that were red and bragging about their freedom

and their freedom to make their own choices, their freedom led to a spike in the rates that became so reprehensible that thousands and thousands of people died because the virus doesn't stop at red. It doesn't stop at blue. It doesn't care if you're independent. It doesn't care if you're an atheist, agnostic, a believer. It doesn't care whether you're independent. It doesn't care if you're an atheist, agnostic, a believer. It doesn't care whether you speak in tongues.

Indiscriminately, it is looking for a host, and your body is a host. And if somebody breathes, sneezes, sings, shouts around you, and you are not protected, you can be infected. And you're right. We've lost great people. Harry Jackson was a dear friend of mine. We didn't always agree about everything, but we were great friends. It's such a tragedy to lose him at a moment that he just got married again.

He was happy. He was excited. He was a cancer survivor. He beat cancer twice, and then we lost him. And it was just really sad to see. Anytime we lose anybody, we can't divide. And historically, you know, black people didn't do this. We didn't divide about everything and fight about everything. There was an underlying loyalty that existed in our community when I was growing up that is fading away now. cannot take on the tactics and the ideologies of those who once oppressed us. Number one,

we're minorities. We can't afford to divide like that. We can't afford to fight about everything. We need each other. We need a Roland Martin. We need Don Lemon. We need T.D. Jakes. We need Noel Jones. We need everybody we've got in order to survive. Everything else is fighting us, killing us, shooting our kids, shooting us down in the street, breaking in our house and shooting us in our own beds. We have to be more united than we've ever been before. And social media by its nature itself lends to divisiveness and tribalism and cable news where you can get the truth you like and the flavor you enjoy and avoid the facts and move them, move into feelings. And I think we've got to get away from that. That's why I did what I did.

Knew it would be controversial. Put it on our YouTube channel. Made it available for everybody to see, not try to make them make a decision. I didn't take a side. I just gathered information so I could put it out there. I respect the intelligence of our people that if they have the right information, they can make the right decisions about their bodies. And then call your doctor. Don't just make your decision. You wouldn't have a heart attack and call a congressman. Right. So why would you bring politics into the help? I don't get it. I don't understand it. I mean, we go to the very people

who are fighting about science, go to a doctor every week or every month or every year. Why have we gotten to this and become ignorant? You're absolutely right. And trust me, those members of Congress who are fighting this as well, they will go to their doctor real quick if they get sick. Right. President Trump did. Straight to the doctor. Yeah, precisely. I mean, straight to the doctor. Just straight helicopter ride. Straight to the doctor. Didn't go to Congress or anybody. Didn't go to Giuliani.

He went to the doctor. So let's be smart. Let's be smart before we're dead. I am sick to death of burying our people. I'm sick to death of crying people, grieving because they didn't get to say goodbye to their parents, didn't get to spend their last moments with them. No closure, no decent funeral, graveside services. Everybody wrapped up like mummies trying to say goodbye to their wives. This is what this is going to do for the next decade to the emotional well-being of American people in general will have long lasting effects.

The trauma is going to last after the virus is gone. The quicker we get past this, the quicker the economy gets up, the quicker we get back to our normal lifestyles. Our churches open, our things we like to do, golfing, fishing, going to movies, going to a club, whatever you're into, becomes available to you on the other side of this pandemic. And so anything that will get us to the other side, we need to study it open-mindedly. All right, then. Well, Bishop T.D. Jakes, we certainly appreciate it. Give my best to your wife, and I'll tell my preacher wife you said hello. Yes, give her my best. God bless you.

Good to see you again. Thanks a lot. Take care. Bye bye. This is going to be a critical issue. Candace, bottom line is Bishop Jakes and others. This morning, Tyler Perry was on the CBS morning show. He took the second dose of the Pfizer vaccine. And look, as we talked

about there, I understand people's ambivalence, their concern. But the bottom line is this here. If you tell me I got a choice between taking a COVID-19 vaccine and risking death from COVID-19 and just for everybody out here, I need people to understand what, I mean, how significant this is. We can't fall for this, you know, whole, well, you know, I'm young, you know, if you're young, I'm gonna go ahead and chance this. No, no, no, no, no. Let me show you this here. I literally just got this text message. Literally just got it. And I knew this brother. Go to my iPad.

This is from Mark Jones of ESPN. Heavy heart today. We lost a good brother to COVID. Sekou Smith of NBA TV and NBA.com was a brilliant and insightful writer, a positive dude. He's gone home to be with the Lord. Philippians 4-4. This is another photo here.

Mark Spears posted this. Y'all, Sekou was in, I think Sekou was in his early 40s. I knew Sekou through the National Association of Black Journalists. COVID. Lost his life to COVID. You tell me if that brother would have wanted to take that vaccine a month ago.

That, to me, Candace, is what we are dealing with. And I am not going to play games with these black folks who want to get caught up in all this conspiracy nonsense and this whole BS. Oh, they're trying to take us out. No, COVID has already taken us out. Yeah. When you look at the numbers, it's in there. You cannot beat the numbers and you cannot beat looking at someone like Sekou and saying, hey, he looks like he's in pretty good health, as you said, in his 40s. So it doesn't have anything to do with age. It doesn't have anything to do with politics. It doesn't have anything to do

with race or what shape you are in. This COVID is not discriminating. So if there's the opportunity for you to get the vaccine, which we would have had the opportunity had there been stronger and more coherent leadership, then get it. Then get it. You're not only saving your life, but you are saving someone else's. And lest we forget about the second strain that's coming in, right? Already, I'm in New Jersey. We have a couple of people who have the strain. We don't know what's going to happen. So we definitely need to take advantage where we can and take it seriously and stop coming up with these theories. But this is what's happened in the past when we've gotten different types of vaccines. Right. Whether it's smallpox, whether it's measles, whether it's chickenpox, people have fought historically. So this is not new, but we should learn from the lessons that we have already gotten and move and understand that we need to be sitting in those chairs as soon as we get the opportunity to do so.

And look, Lee, there are people, I mean, I already see somebody asking on YouTube, did he have a comorbidity? There are a bunch of people who are healthy as hell, who are healthy. I remember reading a story, white guy, triathlete. He was, I think it was in Boston. I mean, this guy was so close to death. They had no idea how this was probably, this was March or April last year. Guy was in the hospital like 42 days. They had no idea how to save this guy. They were trying everything. This is a person who was in tip-top shape. He came that close to dying of COVID.

The basketball player from the University of Florida, it was the Florida State, they were playing Florida State. He had COVID this summer. Comes down, massive dunk, coming out of a timeout, collapses on the floor. Serious condition later got released. He almost died. This is a division one and one athlete who was a projected top 10 lottery pick who almost died because the effect, the after effects of COVID on his heart. This ain't nothing to play with. Yeah, no, I think you're absolutely right. You know, I think we learned that there was a congressman who had just been elected from Louisiana. You know, he was 42 years old, died.

He wasn't even sworn in yet. So we definitely see that this does not, this virus doesn't care how old you are. The only thing I'll say about that though is when we make statements like coherent leadership and we try and politicize something that really shouldn't be politicized, the effect of that is we have

to look and say, well, someone who's 42 years old, someone who's 18, someone who's in their 50s arguably, would not have access to the virus, regardless of who's in power. And so I think the idea is we should try and produce as much as we can so that we can get, you know, people who are vulnerable, those who are older in age and have pre-existing conditions. But unfortunately, I don't know that any leadership would have saved these people just because they wouldn't have even come on the chart to get the vaccine. And I think that's unfortunate. No, no, see, the reason I got to push back on that is because, the reason I got to push back on that is because the reason I got to push back on that, Amisha, is because if Donald Trump had taken this seriously, had taken this seriously, had you had had you had a massive focus on mask, a mask, a marshalling of the federal government. If you had a president who was who was it who was

so I'm being manly, I'm not wearing this mask. You wouldn't have the folks who are running around saying it doesn't make sense. And they did rapidly develop this. But Pfizer said they offered for the United States to buy 100 million doses. They balked at it. So Pfizer went to other countries. So the reality is, Lee, we could have bought 100 million doses from Pfizer. Bottom line of this here, this is why when it's a national public health crisis, you do have to take politics out of it. And the Washington Post or the New York Times, one of them, Amisha, had a story where Trump's own pollster went to him and said, you poll well among your base when it comes to mask and COVID-19. And he said, it's going to hurt my base.

The pollster had the information. And also right here, Sekou, 48 years old. 48 years old. Go ahead. It's sad. It's frustrating. My heart goes out to Sekou's family and all those who knew him at NAVJ and through his work. The frustrating part here for me is that I think it's easy for conservatives now to say that, you know, this is this shouldn't

have been this shouldn't be led by the federal government or, you know, they're arguing for small government or saying that at the end of the day, this level of death and this level of the virus being contracted by many people would have happened regardless. That's simply not true. If we had have had a strategy from the start, when Trump had all of this information, mind you, he knew how deadly the virus was. He knew how it spread. This information was given to him. He had to have had a strategy from the start. When Trump had all of this information, mind you, he knew how deadly the virus was. He knew how it spread. This information was given to him. He had it in March, and he acted as though he did not.

And he purposely told his followers and many state leaders that he was depending on to help him win in November. He told them to push against masks. He told them to push against social distancing. Everything that he was given from scientists and from medical professionals, he threw out of the window because he did not believe that this virus was deadly. He thought it was a hoax. And even up to and through him catching the virus himself, he went around pushing faulty drugs. He went around pushing faulty remedies. And he kept acting like it was no big deal because, according to him, he had American blood. And somehow that was going to be able to shake things off

and everything was going to be okay. This is a president who planned on walking out of Walter Reed and pulling his shirt open to reveal a Superman sign. So you cannot sit here and say that- This is a very essence of politicization. Because there never was, except jokes, hoax, and trying to push off COVID-19 is not important and not serious.

No. I have a friend who just turned 30. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Let her finish, Lee. Let her finish, and I'm going to go back to you. Go ahead. I have a friend who would have turned 30 last week who passed away from COVID-19. She went to the hospital with seizures, something that she had never had.

She didn't have any preexisting conditions, and she died from COVID-19, leaving two young kids behind. This is a young woman who was in her tip-top shape, had no previous negative medical history, and was rushed to the hospital with seizures and died there from COVID-19. So when I hear people act as though this does not matter or that it's something that you can easily be relieved from, and if you're young, you don't have to worry about the vaccine, that is hogwash. Because people who are younger than those that we hear about in the news all the time are also passing away from COVID-19 and contracting it at higher rates, specifically if you're somebody who comes from a diverse community. So we all need to take it seriously. We need to work to dispel the myths around the vaccine itself. And we need to ensure that our people understand why it's important to get it, but also why it's important to tell your family and friends to get it as well.

Lee, real quick, go ahead. Well, I just think Amisha is doing two things at the same time. She's talking about politicization and then saying, well, we shouldn't politicize it. I don't know how you get both of those out of the same person. Well, you just did it. I mean, I think the more we continue this—and President Trump is no longer president. We can keep going back in the back and say, well, that guy did that. Or we can actually be a leader and move forward. So I think you can live in the past or we can move on, which apparently doesn't seem like something you want to do.

Well, that's the point. Go ahead. Go ahead. This virus doesn't care what party you're on. And so I think the more it doesn't care how old you are, it doesn't care where you live. I live in Manhattan. I was there at the peak of the vaccine, at the virus. There's still 10% in certain area codes there now. So there's a lot that can happen. Masks may help, you know, maybe they do, but they're also- No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

hell no. I'm not going to allow bullshit on my show. You are not going to say mask may help. Mask do help. Well, explain to me, Will, and again, I'm not. Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee. I'm not debating. Lee, Lee, we're not debating mask. It's not debating.

No, no, no. So no, no, no. I'm not going to allow mask may help mask do help. Now move on. So with masks, there's still an increase in the virus. There are still thousands of people getting it a day in New York. Because if you listen, if you know, Lee, you said that Lee Lee, the availability of a mask means nothing if you don't wear it. If you do wear it, you can't wear it on your chin. OK, you got. So here's my whole point. Folks, that has nothing to do with your political party.

Everybody in New York ain't Democrat. I didn't say that they were. Lee, Lee, bottom line is this here. Bottom line is this here, Lee. We had to deal with for almost a year of a person in the Oval Office refusing to wear a mask, telling reporters, take your mask off. He wore a mask. Excuse me.

No, he didn't. No, he didn't. What are you talking about? Lee, Lee, please. Where are you living at? Lee, him wearing a mask in a couple of videos at Walter Reed and taking it off is not wearing a mask. Donald Trump, it is undeniable, did not want to wear a mask. He told reporters to take your mask off. He got upset when they left it on.

He said, I can't hear you. Reporters said, I'll talk louder. They also did not require in the White House. The White House was a COVID hotspot, bro. Just stop it. I hear you. I hear you. But again, don't make statements that aren't true.

He wore a mask. OK, listen, listen, listen. That's the Donald Trump wearing a mask is the equivalent of a dude saying I wore a condom when he wore it one time. But the other three hundred sixty four days out of the year, he had unprotected sex. You ain't going to get credit for that one day. I think Candace, go ahead. Candace, go ahead. Candace, go ahead. Apparently you're not doing it. The reason why we are talking about partisan politics is because that is the groundwork that the previous president laid. And that's why we are dealing with the aftermath of it.

And we have to speak in these Democratic and Republican terms because of what happened with the governors, because of what happened with him talking about how his base really loves him because of his disposition on mass. He is the one who added politics to it. He planted the seeds. We're just dealing with the crazy growth that has come out of it. That's why we're talking about it in this way. And the reason why we are behind is because there has not been over the past year a coherent effort on various mask mandates or anything having to do with PPE. If he had started that earlier or the previous administration had started earlier, then maybe somebody like said coup, it would have been his term to get the shot. But we're behind.

So he's put so many people behind. That's the problem. We're trying to make it. There are so many maybes. There are so many. No, no, no. There are no maybes. They are undeniable facts, Lee.

We've got to be honest here. And apparently we are not okay. No, we've been real honest here. You're the one who said masks may work. You said that. Not one of three of us. You did. Okay. I know people who were in Washington, who work at the White House, who are involved in the closeness of this kind of government. They wore masks. Mike Pence wore masks. President Trump wore masks. Well, guess what? Guess what?

Tell me about the guy at the White House who got COVID had to have his leg amputated. Tell me about another other people. Tell me about Bishop Harry Jackson who survived cancer. Again, these are anecdotal stories. No, no, no. I'm not done. I'm not done.

Bishop Harry Jackson who survived cancer, who went to the White House for the Amy Coney Barron event a few weeks later, contracted COVID. He said, well, tested positive for COVID, died November 9th. He tested positive on November 7th. 66 years old. He gone. He ain't here. OK, he was praying. He was praying. Oh, wait, wait. He was praying in the Oval Office on Easter Sunday with Trump. And Trump didn't even have that, did not even have the decency to even say a word about that man dying. Look, look, Lee, we're not going to debate COVID. Here's the reality. The reality is you want to walk your ass around with no mask. If you don't want to wash your hands, if you don't want to protect yourself, guess what?

Stay in your own little world. But when you are walking around with no mask on and if you got one that's down on your chin or around your neck and you're sitting here talking, you are putting other people's lives at risk. If you want to kill yourself, kill yourself. Bye. But what you're not going to do is keep having these dumbass events at the folks in Maine who had a wedding because they were so damn arrogant, and 30 people at the wedding all contracted COVID. You've had whole families who've gotten COVID

because folk are so dumb. Now, now, we're going to have a wedding and we're not going to practice social distancing. It's dumb. It's dumb. It may very well be. I don't disagree with you. No, it may very well be. It is. If you have a wedding.

No, Lee, it's not made. See, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, why are you using made? Let me ask you a question, Lee. If somebody decided to throw a wedding and invite 100 people, are you going? Well, I can tell you I've got two weddings I'm going to this spring. But I think the idea is if you don't want to do this. Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, how many people are going to be there?

Well, I'm not privy to the guest list, so I can't answer that question. You ain't. Hold on, hold on. The so i can't answer that you ain't but i think you ain't asked that question no i haven't you got your damn mind i'm telling you right now first of all look i had a homegirl said hey roll cut my birthday party i said birthday party how many folk gonna be there oh by 50 your ass't going to see Rome. I'm not saying that that's a problem. I'm not saying that, but I think we have to understand that people still choose to do what they

choose to do. And guess what? You've been a black conservative. You can go to the grave site of Bishop Harry Jackson and Herman Cain because they listened to that fool Donald Trump and went to them, around them, didn't put a mask on. Both of them are dead.

I got to go to a break. When we come back, we're going to talk to another pastor, Pastor Dwight McKissick, about the Southern Baptist Convention and how they about to drive black pastors out because of their refusal to acknowledge the reality of race. Plus, we'll talk about CBS suspending two white male executives for alleged racist and misogynistic comments. It's time for them to get fired. I'll explain more right here on Roland Martin Unfiltered. Western civilization, any sizable group of people started to work to change by insisting we can use non-violence power to create the change.

Gandhi said that non-violent power, the power of life, is the greatest and most creative force, power of the universe. And that if we human beings turn away from conventional wisdom towards using the gift of life which is ours at birth, we would be surprised what the future of the human race will look like. George W. Bush will be one of the greatest champions. Are you trying to say that as of January 20th, that President Trump will be president? Well, that depends on what happens on Wednesday.

And the Kansas City star writes plainly that he has, quote, blood on his hands. Let's have trial by combat. Jack Danforth called Hawley's objector movement a highly destructive attack on our constitutional government. It's the opposite of conservative. It's radical. All right, folks. Welcome back to Roller Martin Unfiltered. These Southern Baptist folk, y'all, they're a little special.

They're a little special. They've always shied away from the issue of race. Now they are causing another rift with black pastors. Several black pastors have recently exited Southern Baptist Convention, which is predominantly white, due to racial encounters with some convention leaders. Now, this whole issue of critical race theory, the Southern Baptist Convention, the leaders of their seminaries got together to denounce critical race theory. Well, that didn't sit too well with brothers and sisters in the SBC who understand it quite well. Joining us right now is Reverend Dr. Dwight McKissick, senior pastor at Cornerstone Baptist Church in Arlington, Texas, who says he is considering leaving the SBC as well.

Pastor McKissick, glad to have you back on Roller Martin Unfiltered. Well, I had you on my TV One show, this first time on Roller Martin Unfiltered, but glad to see you again and say hey to all of my folks there in the Metroplex. Hey, I can't get there to see them. My pastor, my alpha brother, Ralph Douglas West, wrote a letter criticizing the SBC as well for their actions when it came to them coming out with with the denouncing critical race theory, saying that it was inconsistent with biblical views. You have been quoted as saying that, you know what, it may be time to have a divorce with the SBC. Explain. Roland, so good to hear your voice and appreciate the years we've known each other. Explain. We were all blindsided by the action of the Southern Baptist Convention presidents.

We didn't see this coming. We don't know what motivated this in as much as they did not denounce the Proud Boys, the Lost Cause theory. There are many things that they could have denounced that they have chosen not to. Why CRT is still a bit of a mystery. But the issue is six Anglo males have provided with the institutions rules about race, what is permissible to say, first of all, disrespectful to the black pastors and congregations that you would make such a ruling without considering us. I got a feeling Frederick Douglass, Phyllis Wheatley, Sojourner Truth, W.E.B. Du Bois, Booker T. Washington would look at us, would ask us to say, you all are going to let an institution make rules about race, the boundaries of what can be taught about race, and you have zero input in that, not only the conversation, but the decision. Pastor, Charlie Dates, many others. And more people are quietly leaving than are even verbalizing it.

But I do have a long history with them, 45 years. It's been more positive than negative, though we've had our battles along the way. And you featured me on one of your programs when we had a battle on your TV show. But this will be a final straw. Now, the untold story in all of this, Resolution 9, they made a great decision in June 2019. Dr. Curtis Woods, who graduated from Black institutions, Philander Smith in Arkansas, University of Arkansas, Pine Bluff, his doctorate in Black college, went on to get other degrees at Dallas Seminary, Southern Seminary. His Ph.D. is in the subject of critical race theory.

He's the most articulate, knowledgeable man in the Southern Baptist Convention on the subject of critical race theory. His resolution committee, which has about four other Ph.D.s, all of them, the most versed, educated people on critical race theory recommended a policy that said some things we accept, other things we reject. The Bible rules supreme. The Baptist faith and message rules supreme. But there are certain beneficial aspects that critical race theory teachings. A founders group that is equally on the other side, very right wing. And then you had two or three state convincers in the South who went against that critical race theory. So in an unprecedented way, the presidents have since decided that they want to reverse what the convention has voted on.

That is right. Here's a race theory. You're not denouncing the Proud Boys. Right. They've never denounced the Lost Cause theory. But you're going to denounce critical race theory that Derrick Bell, a Harvard professor at one point, is the architect of this. He said it was not Marxist or communist in its nature. He did not connect his critical race theory views to critical theory, which is another discipline.

They keep trying to tie those two together because critical theory does have some Marxian influence. But we are appalled that whatever you say about race in the Sunday school class now, Black Southern Baptists need to understand this. The Jeremiah Wright speech, who would determine whether his race speech that got President Obama in trouble, we remember that, would that violate this Southern Baptist policy? Nobody want to answer that question. In other words, they have put themselves in a position, particularly adopted this summer, as having control over what you can say in a black pulpit about race. Some of us will not accept that. This is what my pastor, Ralph Douglas West, wrote. And it's important. My wife was ordained under Pastor West, was the first education, was the first education minister under him. And this is what

he wrote. And y'all can roll the video of Pastor West while I read this. To be sure, I do not offer a full-throated affirmation of all of the tenets of critical race theory and conceptions of intersexuality. Roll the video, Pastor West. Thank you very much. I am fully aware these are secular theories rooted in notions that suggest solutions are wholly secular. I know Christ is the answer to the world and all of its ills. Of this, I have no doubt. But I take issue with the assertion that such theories are, quote, incompatible with the gospel. As their brother in Christ, as an African-American Christian, as a pastor in the Lord's church, I stand against this assessment and I strongly disagree with the seminary presidents. He has gone so far,

Pastor McKissick, as to withdraw from a doctoral program at Southwestern Theological Seminary. And this is what Pastor West also wrote. One would expect they would stand against the rise of anti-Semitism and racism seen in groups like the Proud Boys. They would stand against police violence against black bodies and stand in solidarity with the black community. They would call the names of George Floyd, Breonna Taylor and Ahmaud Arbery, but they have not done that. Their stand against racism rings hollow when in their next breath they reject theories that have been helpful in framing the problem of racism. Are these systems spiritual and unparred with the biblical text? Absolutely not. But can one secular theory helpful in human flourishing be named that is not also equally

lacking? One could look at economic theories, social theories, et cetera. Enlightenment conceptions have been upheld despite having no root in the Bible because they still offer us some value. Very good. I mean, Christian nationalism is much more of a problem. It led to an insurrection on January 6th. People praying in the name of Jesus, holding up Christian flags, waving Bibles, breaking into the Capitol. They have never, these same six seminary presidents as a council of presidents, have not denounced Christian nationalism. to create a tool to identify racism and root it out of American society. The thing here, Pastor McKissick, and let's just cut to the chase.

Yes. And Reverend Barber uses this term all the time. The Southern Baptist Convention historically has been about white slaveholder religion. Yes, it is. It has been about white supremacy. And the reality is, if you go through the 50s and the 60s, they was they was they was still there. They were still they were still there. SBC standing up for Jim Crow. And if we really want to be honest, there are, when you look at

white conservative evangelicals in this country, they ran after anything and everything Donald Trump said, did not denounce comments of dealing with Charlottesville, did not denounce his constant attacks on black women who are members of Congress, has not denounced any number of things that impacted

because for them, whatever Donald Trump said, they stood behind. And this is an example that black folks keep saying why you have black folks who've been leaving the SBC denomination, going to the National Baptist Convention in the USA, going to the Full Gospel Baptist Fellowship, or choose to be non-denominational because you got white folks in the SBC who are showing their whiteness and not loving the same Jesus as black Christians. Roland, did you happen to see A Night in Miami? Yes, I did. One night in Miami, directed by Regina King. Yeah, Jim Brown on that porch, that was a telling event to sort of remind

me of what we're discussing right now. Jim Brown had access to the full porch, could drink lemonade on the front porch, be treated with certain dignity and respect by Bo Bridges and his daughter. But request him to go inside and help. Help him to move some furniture around. Right. Bo Bridges, let him know that there's just a limit. A nigger can't come inside here. Well, Southern Baptist.

With a smile on his face. With a smile. Exactly. The Southern Baptist Convention tells us we'll let you on this beautiful front porch. We'll even serve you lemonade. We'll even let you preside on this front porch. But, you know, come in the house and rearrange furniture. You will not come in the guts of the doctrine on race and declare it incompatible with the Baptist faith and message, which means that we determine what you're saying about race is wrong. You have just become a heretic. Dude, hey, Pastor McKissick,

whoever's with you, let them know, we can't see the messages popping up on the phone. They don't need to be putting a finger across the screen. So what's popping up is not showing up on the screen. So don't worry about it. People think it is. It's not. I appreciate. All right. Go right ahead. And so, yeah, that's that. That's where we are. The message they are sending to us is that a limit.

You would never have full equality in the S.B.C. You can have the porch. We'll treat you nice on the porch. We might even let you be president a job with no budget, no salary, no employees, no personnel. It's basically an honorary job. Most people didn't realize that. We'll let you do that from the front

porch. But you will not come in and rearrange the furniture. You will not come in and set parameters. All the entity heads are white. I've been talking about that for years. Now I see that is by design. And we won't even let you have input into a policy we make.

We're surely not going to put you in charge of presiding the policy, which means if I have a Sunday school teacher or literature, everything, all literature that rolls out from SBC will be filtered through this policy that says critical race theory, even the good aspects of critical race theory will not be tolerated or accepted. in a position now where when the non-institutes send us literature, it has been, had to be approved, and its parameters were set by somebody who didn't look like us. That's a, Ralph West, Charlie Day, said, that's a pill we cannot swallow, we'll not swallow. And

some asked me, why are you waiting until June? That's a very good question. I hope for a miracle. But they are overturning, don't miss this, Roland, Ph.D., Curtis Morris, smartest black man on this issue in the entire convention, not of our race, period. Ph.D. in the subject. He resigned his teacher position at Southern Seminary

after Al Mohler would not stand with him on this. They are overturning the work he led a committee to do. That is huge. And I will not disrespect him and stand with a convention that would so openly defy the good work not only he did, but that entire interracial, intergenerational, and cross-gender committee not only worked hard to put together, voted on and approved by the messages. Now, in hindsight, we're going to go back and undo that because a few white folk with money and who are driven by right-wing politics said we don't like this.

And this is where we are. Well, Pastor McKissick, we'll be following this story and we'll see what you decide in June. Thank you so much, my friend. Good talking to you. I appreciate it. You take care. Let's go to my panel here. Lee, isn't this a fundamental problem with these white conservative evangelicals? They have no clue about black folks. They don't want to actually hear. The fact that these seminary presidents would make this decision and not even consult any black pastors,

that's an insult. Well, I think I would prefer my preachers to be less involved in politics and more involved in religion. And I would point to the Bible as plenty of an example of critical race theory. Look at Galatians 3.28. They're neither Jew nor Gentile. I think there are lots that are in the source of the material that we could look to. But isn't this the problem of white conservative evangelicals? Isn't this the problem that they are more white, conservative, and less evangelical? Isn't this the problem that they are more white, conservative, and less evangelical?

Isn't that the problem? I think the problem is making a racial issue out of something that should be religion. So I would say no, this isn't a problem. You've got 15 million members of the SBC. What's not a problem? 400,000 of them are black. I think if they want to stick to,

and this is their argument, their argument is, and I think it's a good one, is we're teaching what the Bible says. We don't need outside material. If I go to mass and my priest opens up the new Jim Crow instead of the Bible, that's the real problem. The real problem is not a focus on religion, on the text, on the words of the scripture. That's something that we should encourage. And to seem somehow that we have to bring in critical race theory, which I have, my graduate work before I went to law school,

is in women and gender studies. So I have a very storied background in critical race theory. I'm very well aware of what it teaches. And I don't think it's the place in the church. I think if you want to have a book club or you want to do something like that on a college campus, that's a different story. So do you also condemn these white conservative evangelicals who stand in the pulpit, who prayed against Biden's election, who prayed to overturn the election for Donald Trump? Isn't that politics in the pulpit, who prayed against Biden's election, who prayed to overturn the election for Donald Trump.

Isn't that politics in the pulpit? No, no, I agree. I mean, I definitely don't think, again, I don't care what color you are, although it seems to be that we have to make it about white versus black. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Lee, Lee, we don't make it about white versus black. They make it about white versus black. They make it about white versus black, Amisha. And they always have.

Like, Lee, I don't know you personally, but this whole argument has been, quite frankly, disgusting. And I say that because the white evangelical church in this country has for the longest, since its inception, divided America. The most divided place in America is the church on Sunday. And what we know is taught by and what they stand by in the white evangelical church for the longest has been everything that is against diversity. We know that many of them also stood part and parcel to the KKK, anti-civil rights. They were largely the people who stood by holding slaves. And today, they're largely people who were also found leading this insurrection. So let's not pretend like this is anything different. We saw Paula White. We saw, you know, Liberty University leaders who are now, you know, gone off in some stage of infamy. We've seen this time and time again from evangelical leaders of the white church

who have never come to grips with the issue of race. They don't want to have the conversation. They want to shut anybody else down who does, but they have absolutely no problem in standing by when discriminatory laws pass and actually pushing them themselves. Like this is something that really matters. And I think as someone, me, who went to Belmont University, which is a very large Christian university in the South that used to be run by the Southern Baptist Convention. They broke away from them because they refused to have anyone on the board of the university that was a person of color. That is how, and that was in 2009. This is what we were looking at when we were talking about the Southern Baptist Convention. These are people who within their grain, a lot of their leadership

has very racist tendencies and there's no other way around it. We can argue that they need to be taught better. Maybe they just need to understand. But to be honest, many of them have blinders on, and critical race theory can be helpful. I would like to hear Republicans not talk about it like it's some type of antithesis to America or an antithesis to democracy, because race isn't antithetical to democracy. What it is, it's part of our culture. It's part of our country. We need to have these discussions because the microaggressions, the racism, the white supremacy, those are things that have been in this country since its inception and show no real signs of stopping. Us ignoring it

and not wanting to have that conversation and not face it and not pushing the religious leaders who have benefited off of it for years is ignorant. And I think that at this point, we need to make them face the music because they have no problem in standing up and using the Bible to push a lot of their racist narratives. And they have done it for decades. Anybody can pull out a verse from Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John or anything in the Old Testament and

still be absolutely fine with certain levels of discrimination across this country. And I think, quite frankly, that is disgusting and sick and is antithetical to the teachings of Candace. For hundreds of years, quite frankly, that is disgusting and sick and is antithetical. Well, Amisha, one second, one second, Candace. For hundreds of years, the church has been a place where people have come and galvanized to deal with issues of race. This is really no different.

The systematic racism that exists is something that the SBC should take seriously. But as you mentioned, Roland, they have a history of being the antithesis of a group that should be supporting people to make sure that they are treated equally. Now, I do agree in a way with Leah on some points in that they can look to the Bible for several examples. That's that's that's what's that's what's getting away from me. And that if they are the SBC whose mission is what they say it really is, and if they're going to abide by it, then they should look to the Bible to see that there is one human race and that the Bible does not separate by anything, not by race, not by sex. Okay. And so that when we look at what the Bible

says, it's just inexcusable why they can't even use that basis to form a critical understanding around critical race theory or this whole idea of systematic racism within America. There's no reason why they shouldn't be addressing it. That has been a part in a history of who they were and are. I'm not sure why they're stopping now. Well, this is very simple. If you don't even have the decency to talk to black pastors before you release a statement on critical race theory, that means you have a severe blind spot when it comes to race. Folks, we come back. We will talk about, give you an update on the story dealing with CBS News, excuse me, CBS, in the suspension of two white male executives for making alleged racist and misogynistic comments. That's next on Roland Martin Unfiltered.

When you think about the fact that 2043, we are going to be a nation that's majority people of color. I've really focused on this a lot, on television, on radio, in my speeches. That my focus is trying to prepare us to have demographic power while also having educational economic power at the same time. Because there's nothing worse than having demographic numbers but then you still don't have that economic power

that political power and education power well you know you and I and I think most people know and understand that education is what we have got to impress on all of our people we've got to help people to understand that if you want a decent quality of life, if you want the kind of quality of life where you're not having to worry about your food and your nutrition and being able to pay your bills or buy a house, then you've got to become educated. The more education you have, the larger the paycheck is. And of course, we've got to be involved in entrepreneurship, taking the talent that we have to create businesses. And there's a lot of opportunity for that. Folks, yesterday we told you about NABJ calling for two CBS executives to be fired for making alleged racist and misogynistic comments as detailed in a story by the Los Angeles Times. We had that reporter on

the show yesterday. Y'all should go to our YouTube channel to look at that particular video. Well, last night, CBS dropped this statement here announcing those two have been placed on suspension. Peter Dunn, president of the CBS television stations, and David Friend, senior vice president, news for the TV stations, have been placed on administrative leave pending the results of a third-party investigation into issues that include those raised in a recent Los Angeles Times report. CBS is committed to a diverse, inclusive, and respectful workplace where all voices are heard, claims are investigated, and appropriate action is taken when necessary. Now, NABJ met with CBS on Sunday night.

George Cheeks, who heads all of CBS, and Marva Smalls, who's the global diversity leader for ViacomCBS, where we made perfectly clear to them that we wanted them fired and that there should be an external third-party independent investigation. They agreed with that. I'll be working with them to determine exactly what that investigation looks like in terms of who is going to be leading it and what is going to be the structure. This is the statement that NABJ, I participated in the writing of this statement, released today in response to last night's news. The National Association of Black Journalists, board of directors, applaud CBS's decision late Monday night to place two senior executives,

Peter Dunn and David Friend, on administrative leave, pending the outcome of an investigation into racist, misogynistic and homophobic comments as detailed in Sunday's Los Angeles Times. Dunn is president of CBS Stations and Friend is senior vice president of news for CBS Stations and VP of news at WCBS-TV in New York. George Cheeks, who heads the CBS television network, CBS News, and CBS television stations, made the announcement in a company-wide email to CBS station employees. We are thankful that after meeting with NABJ representatives on Sunday, CBS leader George Cheeks moved swiftly, said NABJ Vice President Broadcast Ken Lemon. It provides a level of security for journalists who told us they have

suffered irreparable damages to their careers. In the last 24 hours, we have been inundated with phone calls, emails, and social media posts detailing disturbing accounts of abusive behavior and a toxic work environment. In a call Sunday night, CBS agreed with NABJ's call for an external investigation into complaints from staff, and the board has agreed to work with the company on a path forward. We see this move by CBS as the first step, said yours truly. The allegations level against Dunn and Friend are too much to bear, and they are in no position to change the shameful conditions of CBS employees nationwide. They must go.

The stories we are hearing are shocking, including that Philadelphia has not had a full-time black news producer in six years. That is unconscionable in a city that is 43 percent African-American. Additionally, based on information gathered so far, NABJ is now calling on CBS to release employees from signed nondisclosure agreements relating to charges of racism, misogyny, and homophobia during the tenures of Dunn and Friend so they can speak freely about their experiences at the company. As journalists, we should always stand for transparency and openness, said NABJ Executive Director Drew Barry. The public counts on us to bring light to such situations, whether in government, corporate America, or other areas that impact the communities we serve. Media companies

are not immune from such scrutiny. The NABJ board believes that media companies should set the standard for diversity, equal equity, and inclusion. It is only by knowing and understanding what has happened in the past that corrective actions can be taken to make for a better future. Reverend Al Sharpton tweeted this today, saying he stands with NABJ. Nantoli supports NABJ in seeking accountability and fairness at CBS on the complaints of two former employees who will be monitoring the investigation. Last night, the sports anchor for the CBS affiliate in Philadelphia had this to say about comments supporting their anchor, Yuki Washington, who was also cited in the article where Peter Dunn

made comments saying he didn't like his jive talk and also criticized him for dancing on air. No, no, no. I need the sports video first, please. Thank you. Before I go, I just want to say I've had the good fortune of working alongside some of the greats in this business at ESPN and Fox Sports. Our Yuki Washington is the most hardworking, authentic, caring and skilled journalist I've ever been around. Yuki is our quarterback. He's the crown jewel of Philly. support them 100 percent. And the good people who work at this station reject racism and misogyny in all its forms, no matter where or who it may come from. That's all for sports. We'll have more at six. I'm Don Bell. Back to the studio. On today's broadcast, Yuki Washington, his co-anchor, addressed the story. On a personal note, I know that I speak for myself

and on behalf of our news team, Yuki is synonymous with family. We are a family and we will get through this just like family does and we will all be better for it. Love you, Yuki, more than ever. And here at CBS3, President and General Manager Brandon Stewart sent an email to staff earlier this week stating in part, I want to assure you that as the GM of this station, I will continue to champion the effort of providing a place for all employees, no matter their race, gender, or sexual orientation. Please be assured that our commitment to a diverse, equitable, and inclusive workplace is a core value for CBS Philadelphia, both on air and in our halls. You.

Jessica, thank you for that. On a personal note, I just wanted to thank everyone for the love and support over the past couple of days from you at home, social media, people on the street, all my coworkers here at the station, as well as colleagues from other television and radio stations and newspapers right here in town. I'm good, keeping the faith, staying strong, and I want all of you to do the same. I feel your love, and we all feel the pain of the subject matter. Clearly, these past few days have been difficult for everyone, including my teammates. The details in the story you just watched are painful for all of us. We cannot and we will not tolerate the type of behavior that's been alleged.

There's no room for it anywhere, anytime. And I'm so happy to see the leadership of this station and our parent company are supporting efforts to create and maintain a fair and inclusive workplace here and across our nation of stations. You know, my mom told me as a kid that there is strength in numbers. It's still true. We all have the power to create change and we can do it together. You know how I love to use the word family and that, in my opinion, is what we all are, children of God. So do me a favor. If you have young children, give them a hug. Tell them it's going to be all right. Because deep in my heart, I do believe we shall overcome. We must.

Back in a bit. This is what Gayle King had to say this morning on the CBS Morning Show after they did a story with regards, they did a story on this particular issue. It's another one of those times where I feel like we've been here They did a story with regards, they did a story on this particular issue.

It's another one of those times where I feel like we've been here before. I'm sick of it and sickened by it. And the more you hear, the worse it gets. Glad the Los Angeles Times did the story. I'm glad that we are talking about it. We're not running away from it. But, you know, we haven't handled it well. We have to own up to that. CBS hasn't handled it well.

And hopefully now things will change. It's very, very, very upsetting to me. Yeah, that's great. The L.A. Times story is very upsetting. It is. It is. Very upsetting. We can do better, and we are better than this, and actions speak louder than words. We have new management in place that sees that, too. Folks, this is a statement that was released today by SAC AFTER, which represents a number of the employees at these stations. This is their statement.

SAC AFTER read with shock and disgust the L.A. Times article by reporter Meg James regarding management's behavior with regard to hiring and employment decisions at CBS Philadelphia station KYW-TV. We were stunned to see the comments attributed to CBS's national management team in internal emails and other testimony related to employees of KYW, including members of SAG-AFTRA. SAG-AFTRA is requesting a meeting with CBS Labor Relations as well as station management to address these most recent revelations. SAG-AFTRA has addressed issues of diversity, equity, and inclusion at KYW, both in the negotiation and enforcement of the union agreement. Most recently, SAC-AFTRA achieved a significant increase in an essential compensation element of the union agreement with KYW to address a gender pay equity concern. We have encouraged CBS and other employees across the country to make a meaningful commitment to

fairness, equity, and diversity in hiring, assignment, compensation, training opportunities, and advancement in broadcast news organizations. Our membership is committed to the principle that radio, television, and online news organizations should truly represent and reflect the communities they serve. For the last several years, SAG-AFTRA has been proposing language in its agreements requiring employers

to focus on issues of diversity, including requiring the formation of diversity committees at stations and news operations across the country. Following the June meeting of the union's governing body that addresses issues related to its broadcast membership, the broadcast steering committee issued this statement on diversity, equity, and inclusion. If members feel they are subject to discriminatory behavior or harassment, they may confidentially reach out to staff or their fellow members who serve as shop stewards and avail themselves of the resources the union offers. Now, that's the statement that they actually released. I got some issues with the SAG-AFTRA

statement because they make no issue of race as well as the other comments that they made. But trust me, I'm having a conversation with SAG after after this show is over, because I'm working. I'm part of the team with NABJ that's going to get this issue addressed. And I can guarantee you, if you all think I'm a pit bull when it comes to folk who lie on this show. Imagine what happens when I'm sitting across the table from some folks addressing issues of race in media. This is a statement that was put out by the National Lesbian and Gay Journalist Association. N-O-G-J-A, the Association of LGBTQ Journalists, stands with our partners at the National Association of Black Journalists and all journalists of color in regards to the recent allegations of racism, sexism, and homophobia at CBS. The revelations reported

by the Los Angeles Times allege a pattern of disturbing behavior by several executives. This behavior also extended to several CBS television stations. A number of CBS employees have spoken up about a lack of diversity within their stations and newsrooms, with black journalists being particularly underrepresented. Additionally, the story alleges that one of the executives in question made hugely inappropriate comments about the sexual orientation of a candidate for an anchor job. Since the story was published, CBS executives have met with representatives from NABJ. hugely inappropriate comments about the sexual orientation of a candidate for an anchor job. Since the story was published, CBS executives have met with representatives from NABJ.

Additionally, CBS announced that it has launched an investigation and has placed the individuals in question on leave. We applaud that decision and expect the company to conduct a thorough investigation and take appropriate action. Racism, sexism, and homophobia have no place in newsrooms. NLGJA, the Association of LGBTQ Journalists President Sharif Durham said, we are proud to stand with our colleagues at NABJ in their call for accountability and change at CBS. Just so all of you know, I've also been in contact and communication with the NAACP, National Action Network, National Urban League, the NAACP LDF, Reverend Dr. William Barber and the Poor People's Campaign, the National Coalition on Black Civic Participation, Rashad Robinson with the Color of Change, as well as the Progressive National Baptist Convention, the National Baptist Convention USA,

and the Divine Nine as well. My point, we're coming and we're not going away. Candace, the call that we're making to release folks from these NDAs is important because if they release the people with nondisclosure agreements who have worked under Dunn and Friend, I believe we will see even more examples of the heinous behavior already alleged in that L.A. Times story. Exactly. If we think about the Me Too movement, there were women who were out there who thought, oh, maybe it's just me. But then we started to see the numbers of people once they really avoided and disregarded their NDAs and said, I don't care. I'm coming forward. And we saw the power in numbers. Listen, it was raining men then. Get out your umbrellas. It's going to continue to rain men now, the deeper that this investigation goes. Because there have already

been people who have complained, as you know, to CBS. And the investigation team ignored these complaints. So we're going to see a lot more where this comes from. And for people who don't know it, do a Google search and see how beloved Yuki Washington is in Philadelphia. He is a star. He is an iconic figure down there. To see him on there, to have to defend a position when all he was doing was just being a news anchor, which, you know, is so hard to do inside of a white institution. You know how difficult it is. You know the eyes that are on you. And to see him have to just go away from his job because of the racism and fear that has been in somebody else's heart is just heartbreaking. But we're going to see more people tumble, definitely. Amisha.

I agree with what was just what was just said. I think one of the greatest things that came out of this, in addition to obviously the L.A. Times making this a worldwide story. But one of the greatest things that came out of this was the argument for the release of NDAs, because where there's smoke, there's fire. And when people are strong enough to speak, you get others who will speak as well without fear of retribution. And I think that for the longest, CBS's top brass has had a habit of, in Philadelphia and in other cities as well, not paying attention to the voices of Black anchors, not paying attention to or utilizing racist tropes in regular conversation. In addition to being sexist, I think that after CBS had their Les Moves scandal, they decided to brush certain things under the rug. There were, in fact,

hundreds of allegations of racism, sexism, and workplace violations during that time as well, and they didn't pay any attention to it. This is the same CBS that went out of its way to release a very flowery statement after the wake of the George Floyd protests about how committed they were to diversity. And we're seeing all of these stories come out now. I think that it is very, it's encouraging to see what's happening and how NABJ actually stood up and basically issued an edict of what they should be doing. But it's frustrating to me to see some of the statements coming from CBS where they are still, you know, basically pushing down even further about their diversity and inclusion initiatives, when clearly that's not what we're seeing in practice.

Lee? Well, it seems today, you know, you can find racism in a stone. I mean, it just seems like it's all over the place, even maybe sometimes when it's not. You know, I'm not particularly familiar with this with this anchor. Well, that standards for racism are not what it used to be. You actually had to say something racist. Well, actually, first of all, you read the story when a white executive, when a white executive, David Friend, is saying in the story, first of all, that questioning someone who's black. When you have Peter Dunn who says he doesn't like the face of the black anchor, when they say that the black anchor, Yuki Washington,

I don't like his jive talk, why is he always dancing? When the black female anchor, Brooke Thomas- How is that racist? How is saying jive talk racist? Are you serious? I mean, what I'm talking about is racist- Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Are you serious? I mean, I mean, what I'm talking about is racist. Are you saying when a white, are you saying when a white male executive says, I don't like his job talk, what the hell is that? So that was never in common use. Job talk was never something black people said to each other. What the hell are you talking about? You don't want Dylan. Hold on, stop, stop.

Are you being serious right now? Or are we being punked? No, I think you pick and choose. So we didn't say anything about Joe Biden talking about the word thugs, but if Trump uses the word thugs, somehow it's racist. Hold on, stop, stop, stop. Don't come on my show. No, no, no, no, Lee. Don't come on my show with bullshit. When Obama used the word thugs, no, no, Lee, no. When Obama used the

word thugs against Baltimore, he got his ass lit up. Don't even try that. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Lee, Lee, Lee, you're not going to shift this to Biden, Obama and Trump. We're going to stay right here on CBS. I'm asking you, if a white boss says I don't like his jive talk, you telling me that has no racial connotation? Do you know what jive talk means? Do you know what job talk means? Do you know what it means? Oh, my God. I mean, because we can say, oh, well, I don't like the fact that he's wearing a red shirt. Well, I guess somehow that makes the white person.

Hold up. So when the white male boss says, I don't like her face to the black, the black anchor, what is he talking about? Well, let's put it in context. Lee, Lee, Lee, you know what? Lee, hold on, Amisha, Amisha, Amisha, Amisha, Amisha, Amisha, no, no, no, no. No, no, no, hell no.

What we not going to do is the crap that you're doing right now because you're not going to be a black apologist for racism. I'm not apologizing. That's exactly what you're doing right now because you're not going to be a black apologist for racism. I'm not apologizing. That's exactly what you're doing. Oh, my God. We can find racism in Iraq. I mean, he a white.

That's not racist. So what is it? Is it just is it colorful? You know, Roland, I you know, I think just as much as there are white people who can be racist, there are absolutely black people who can be. We are talking right now about what? be racist. We are talking right now about white. Hold on. We are talking right now.

We are talking right now about two white executives who have been accused of making racist comments by two white executives. And again, I think this is the point, Roland. This is the point that racist comments had to be racist. If black people can say something to another person, or if it was in common use at a particular time, somehow today it's racist when it was not racist before. And I think we can...

Boy, bye. Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, you can take that bullshit to somebody else's show. Lee, that's nonsense. Lee, it's utter nonsense. What you're saying right now is absolutely undeniably ridiculous. I have dealt with

employment cases where I have had when I've worked on behalf of clients, whether that's a prison union, whether that's someone in a business. Comments like that do not rise to a level of actionable racism. Candace, you're a lawyer. Can you respond to this nonsense? Has she worked on employment cases? I have. I've got experience.

Candace, go ahead. So in this particular case, when you are dealing with someone using racially filled tropes, describing someone who is of color, that does amount to something, especially when you are threatening their job and taking them out of it because of that. Not only threatening, just in Yuki's case, but there was another woman who worked there who was removed after a few months. Producers don't work there who are African-American. In the past six years, you've got two women who left high paying jobs because they could not take the racism and misogynistic tone from higher ups.

So what we are saying is that there is a case that is being built. Evidence is coming forward. And this is why these men have been temporarily suspended from their position. So a case is being built. It hasn't gone to court yet, but there is evidence. The evidence is strong. And let me tell you, there are going to be more people that come to the hotline, more people that will be sharing their information and stories in order to build a case. This is what people said in the Me Too movement. Oh, nothing's going to happen. And look what happened. So I tell you, I saw so so Lee, let me ask you this question, Lee. You don't find it strange that in Philadelphia, that's 43 percent black.

This station hasn't had a full time news producer in six years. So I think the whole point of that question is bias. No, no, no, no. It's a bias. Actually, I'm asking you to look at you have to look at the way that the question is raised. You have to look at it's not just 43 million people. It's how many. No, it's not 43 million. It's 43 percent. Oh, 43 percent. It's how many people of that percentage are qualified. How many of them have a journalist degree? You can't just throw out a number and say black people.

Lee, do you actually wake up with this bullshit in your mind? I'm convinced, Roland. No, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee. I'm a 31-year member of the National Association of Black Journalists. Are you telling me, Lee, Lee, Lee, you say you in New York? You in New York, right? I am. So if there was a law firm in New York, that's a major law firm in New York City, which has the largest concentration of black people in America. And if that law firm was all white, it would have ever occurred to Lee to say, how y'all all white in New York City. What legal? Well, I think this is going to take into question

whether any qualified black lawyers actually applied to work here at the firm. You're not going to say that, Lee. You're going to say, you're going to say, how in the hell y'all don't have any black lawyers here? But, but, so are you, or are you going to say,

hey, just give me a group white hug. We good. Roland, I think, I think what we have to realize is that when you make things about race that are not, you look at how many people, if I see a room full of white lawyers

and ain't nobody black, that ain't race. It's not, Roland. I think that's the problem. It's not. You look at how many people, for example, let's take your legal field.

Let's take your legal example. No, no, no. I'm going to stick with the journalism. All I'm asking is this here. If I got an all-white newsroom, six years, not somebody left, we didn't replace them in a year. Six

years, no full-time black producers at all. You telling me that's not an indication we got a problem? Knowing full well, knowing full well that Philadelphia is one of the top five media markets in the country and there are people all over the country eminently qualified

who would love to work in philadelphia are you telling me they ain't a problem i'm telling you you're looking for a problem where there may not be one. No, no, no. Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, Lee, that's stupid. Lee, that is so stupid. Lee, Lee, no, no, no, Lee, here's why it's stupid. Lee, Lee, let me ask you a question. Lee, let me ask you a question. You don't want the answer. Lee, Lee, I'm a question.

Have you ever sat down with television headhunters? I can tell you that I've been in boardrooms. No, no, no, no. I asked you specifically. I can tell you. No, no, no, Lee, answer my question. Has Lee ever sat down with television headhunters? No, I have. But that's not indicative of racism. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I have. I have. Do you want to respond? Lee, Lee, Lee, I am educating you about my business, which you know nothing about. And I'm educating you on reality. 1990, 1990, board meeting, the National Association of Black Journalists.

We had a meeting with the top head head hunters for television, Frank Maggot, all of them. They said, oh my God, we just have difficulty finding qualified black producers. The nonsense you just said. Sitting to our right was Callie Crossley. Callie Crossley was the top producer for medicine at ABC's 2020. Call Crossley, Oscar-nominated producer for Eyes on the Prize. Kelly Crossley then said, how many do y'all need? They said, well, what do you mean? She says, y'all said y'all can't find any. She says, how many do you need?

Give me your category of. This is exactly what I meant. She said, give me your category of, do you want five years experience, 10 years experience, 15 years experience, 20 years experience. So, Lee, when you say, oh, my God, did any qualified actually apply? Yes. Well, how do you know that role? Because how do you know? Because, Lee, this is what happens when you read. You're asking, how do you know that, Lee? Because I know my business. There's a lawsuit that's been filed against CBS in Miami where they were pushing people to only be freelancers. There's an entire

body of people who are freelance producers in Miami, in Philadelphia, in New York, who are Emily qualified, who they would not hire for full timetime positions. Lee, I know because I know. Again, I'm not saying that that's not true. I'm not saying that that's not true. But I think what you are missing, what you are missing, what you are missing is that you can't take a percentage of people. You can't say, oh, well, there are 43% of black people live in this particular area. So there should be, you know, maybe something equivalent to that, or maybe why aren't there more black

people? It doesn't work like that role. And I'm sorry to tell you, but the world doesn't work like legal. You try and you try to see Candace and Amisha. This is what's silly when black conservatives make these arguments and they literally are essentially apologies for white supremacists. That's not what I'm saying. And I think if you say that, you obviously conservatives make these arguments and they literally are essentially apologists for white supremacists. That's not what I'm saying. And I think if you say that, you obviously are not. Here's the deal, because I'm happy to explain. I am smart enough to know, Amisha, that when I can walk into a room, ain't no black people. And then you ask the question, how y'all all white? And then it's like, oh, that sounds like a question that someone who's racist would say.

No, that's because you're assuming you're assuming. I mean, go ahead. Believe the dichotomy you use is the same one that white supremacists have used for decades. Well, black people don't compare to white supremacists. You don't have to apologize. Actually, it has been proven faulty. Lee, I just listened to you talk for almost 15 minutes, sending all of America off. Apparently, you haven't learned anything.

Anyhow, what we have heard time and time again from people who do not want to hire black people is that they cannot find qualified black people. That has been proven faulty time and time again. As a fellow member of NABJ and somebody who has worked in various news stations, what I have seen is talented black person after talented black person not get the same type of review as you would somebody who is not black. Black people who've been told, oh, you can't come on because you don't have a certain look, which means that that look is your skin tone. So when you look at something like what we saw at CBS, where they're talking about jiving and dancing and all of that, I have no understanding in my head as to why you as a black man don't understand how that's offensive, but

you know, flow, flow by your own boat. Anyway, because I think you're just too sensitive. Can see that when a white person says that they are seeing it to diminish you, they are seeing it to diminish your talent. This, he. It was used as a trope against a man who was known in his community, who was esteemed in his community, who had a legacy of career wins. This was not something that was said in a joking manner. This is something that he said over and over again. It is a pattern of behavior that was done by executives at CBS to shut out black people. And I think that for a black man to sit up here, regardless of what political stripe you are, you may be a conservative, fine and good, whatever, but you cannot in good faith, be here and talk as though racism does not exist in these

situations. You cannot argue. Let me tell you that. Wait, wait, wait, I mean, you go ahead and not hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold up. I'm going to go to Candace. Candace, this is very interesting. If I can, if I went to if I went if I went into a neighborhood and I see it, well, let's say I went to a mortgage office and I see. Let me ask you a question. How is it every loan you sign is for white folks. How is it? And then if I say, how are you in a diverse city and everybody who you, every loan you process is white?

Anybody who understands housing discrimination, what they would then do is, they would do these studies, where they would actually send testers in. And then they would actually test them. It is undeniable when you're talking about major cities in America, there are the top TV stations, Los Angeles, New York City, Chicago, Dallas,

Philadelphia, Houston, okay? I can go down. And you say, y'all ain't got no full-time black producers like zero. What's up with your hiring practices? Who's doing the hiring? Those are basic fundamental things. And Candace, I would think for attorney, you sitting here going, let's get to work. Go ahead. Right.

I smell a case coming. Now, here's what typically happens in newsrooms for people who don't know. They will hire people on the anchor desk who reflect the community, right? So you look in Detroit, Michigan, they have a large Muslim community, people of color, too. They typically will hire someone that looks like someone that looks like someone in the community. Atlanta, you go down, you have a lot of anchors that that are black, of course, because Atlanta has a large population. What unfortunately happens in these newsrooms is that the people who work and play together in the newsrooms, they are the gatekeepers of people

who don't look like them because they have to play and spend long hours and they don't care to be amongst them. That's on the producer side. On the other side, Black women especially have always had to negotiate the way that they looked on air. From their hair to their size to the width of their nose, there's always been something where people, executives, have had something to say. Which is why often when you are in these newsrooms, you're the oh and oh. You're the one and only. It's not just at different levels of operations and different, you know, in academia. That's how it happens. Here is how it happens on boards of big companies.

That's just how it happens. There has to be a change in the infrastructure, a change in the system so that people can understand that their mentality and saying, oh, I can't find someone who's qualified for this job is grounded and rooted in racism. Lee, I have said to you before, I would like to key to the parallel universe that you are in. It seems rather free. No, wait, wait. Now, finish your comment, Candace. Go ahead, Candace. It's not real.

All right, Lee. Lee, you guys. I can tell you. Not Lee. Wait. You got 60 seconds. And then I got to end the show. Go. You know, as someone who is an attorney, I mean, you should know that that's just not how it works. I mean, you don't have boardrooms. You don't have law offices that are flowing with black people or not because it's racism. That's not the reality. And Amisha, I'm sorry to tell you, but you're going to have to open up a book or read the news or something because that's not what's happening in the real world. I have three degrees. I've worked in news.

Trust me. So do I. I'm a presidential administration. Don't try to take me. And I can tell you, Amisha, that you still have a lot of work left to do because when everything is racist. You need to learn about critical race theory. You need to learn your place. When everything is about race, and Amisha, I'm sorry to tell you,

but that's what you're making. You're making everything about race, even when it's not. No, you're a black man who disgusts me, and I'm going to tell you why. Because for me, it's not racism and leftist. Hold on, hold on, hold on. One second, one second, one second. Hold on, one second, one second, one second. Hold on, one second. Hold on, no, hold on, hold on. One second, one second, one second. Hold on, one second, one second, one second. Hold up, one second.

Lee, hold up. No, no, hold up. Lee, hold up. Hold up. Hold up. Everybody wait. Lee, I'm giving you 20 seconds. Amisha will have 30 seconds to respond.

Kenz will have 30 seconds to respond. And then I'm into the show. Go. I'm saying as a black man, I have no problem calling out racism when it happens, when it exists, when it happens. But when we jump on every single thing because someone said one comment or because someone thought of something, that's not racism. And we're taking it too far. Justice Scalia said an opinion that these are going to equivalent or equate to living in a society with civilians. 20 seconds is up. Amisha, go. Amisha, go.

Lee is one of those conservatives who feels as though unless the N word is said or a cross is burned in your yard, it's not racism. I've heard this time and time again from Caucasian conservatives. And I think that Lee has swallowed the Kool-Aid. He has drank the Kool-Aid there and he is here spewing that same stuff. It's depressing. It's frustrating. But it's more of the same when it comes to conservatives denying that racism exists. Candace, go. Lee, if you had told Anisha in the middle of a workroom that the three of us worked in that she needed to read a book or open up a newspaper, you would be fired. And I would make sure that it would happen. And I could tell you that I would have a very good loss. That is that is that is it for us. Let me go ahead and do this

here today, of course, is the four year anniversary of the death of Kobe Bryant and his daughter, Gigi. They died with a number of others in a helicopter crash one year ago today. Folks all across the country, across the world are are remembering them. It was on January 26th when they were among nine people killed in a helicopter accident in Calabasas in north Los Angeles. Kobe was 41. Gianna was 13 years old. Of course, Kobe Bryant, one of the all-time greats, is going to actually be inducted into the Professional Basketball Hall of Fame this year. A number of people have been paying tribute, baseball, basketball players, you name it, all across the place. Actress Viola Davis tweeted, missed in love, heart goes out to Vanessa and family today. Now, while Kobe's wife, Vanessa, is questioning why this had to happen to her and

her family, she says she's grateful knowing that Kobe and Gigi were loved by so many. And so we certainly remember Kobe and Gigi on this day. Folks, that is it for us. This is why this show is important. We have the opportunity to have a debate and cover the issues that matter to us. I'm going to keep you all informed on what's happening with this story with CBS. We're going to stay on top of this. And of course, the story we discussed yesterday with Joe Anthony, his lawsuit against DDB, dealing with the issue of race as well. You might want to read that story. I want to read that story. You might want to read that story, Lee.

Folks, if y'all could support Roland Martin Unfiltered, join our Bring the Funk fan club. Our goal is to get 20,000 of our fans contributing $20, $50 over the course of a year. That's $4.19 a month, $0.13 a day. And so, please, we ask you to support us via Cash App, Dollar Sign, RM Unfiltered, PayPal.me, forward slash RMartinUnfiltered, Venmo.com, 4 slash RMUnfiltered, and, of course, ZellRoland at RolandSMartin.com. Let me give a shout-out, y'all.

Of course, when I was at my – I went to a communications high school, Jack Yates High School in Houston, where we had a school of communications. And while I was there, I was named the best student there by the teachers there. And so one of the things they did was we had the Letterman Jackets for our school of communications and while I was there I was named the best student there by the teachers there And so one of the things they did was we had the Letterman jackets for our school communications And so now y'all that was course 1987 brother was 170 pounds So I can't fit that jacket my knee one of my nieces or nephew has it so I went ahead and said I got I got to represent my school So I had a replica made of the jacket and just so y'all know a brother was on path to what I'm doing right now this is what the all the students at Jack 8 used to call me when they would

see me coming down the hallway going to videotape another program that's what they would say right there here comes Mr. TV just in case any of y'all confused, I've been doing this, Lee, since I was 14 years old. Ain't a damn thing you can tell me about media. I've worked in television, newspaper, magazine, radio, online, shot video, shot photos. Bruh, I know racism when I see it. That's called experience. I'll see y'all tomorrow. Ho! That's called experience. I'll see y'all tomorrow. Holla!

I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. This is Absolute Season 1. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad listen to absolute season one

taser incorporated on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts i'm clayton english i'm greg lot and this is season two of the war on drugs podcast last year a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of starts that a little bit, man. We met them at their homes. We met them at their recording studios. Stories matter and it brings a face to them. It makes it real.

It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I always had to be so good no one could ignore me. Carve my path with data and drive. But some people only see who I am on paper. The paper ceiling. The limitations from degree screens to stereotypes that are holding back over 70 million stars. Workers skilled through alternative routes rather than a bachelor's degree.

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