#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Booker’s speech lauding Brown Jackson, NJ Cops Paralyzed Black Man, Shopping While Black

Episode Date: March 25, 2022

3.24.2022 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Booker’s speech lauding Brown Jackson, NJ Cops Paralyzed Black Man, Shopping While Black The historical confirmation of the 116th Supreme Court Justice nominee, Ketanji Brown Jackson, has ended. Jackson spent nearly 22 hours being grilled by Senate Judiciary Committee members. Today's testimony was from outside witnesses testifying about Jackson. We'll have our expert panel and one of today's witnesses discuss the confirmation hearings. In Georgia, a sitting judge up for re-election can withdraw from a race, canceling the election and be appointed by the governor. We'll take a look at this judicial loophole Georgia's got. He was unarmed and went to his car when surrounded by plainclothed New Jersey police officers.   They thought he was reaching for a weapon. He was reaching for some tea. Now he's paralyzed from the neck down. Jajuan Henderson's attorney will update us on the case and let us know why he's still facing charges. Shopping while black. An Ohio man was wrongfully detained and questioned by police officers who were actually searching for a white suspect described b dispatch. Eric Lindsay and his attorney will tell us about his lawsuit. Plus, an art exhibit uplifting the black man is open at the Reginald F. Lewis Museum of Maryland African American History & Culture in Baltimore. The executive of the museum will tell us about the Men of Change. #RolandMartinUnfiltered partner: Nissan | Check out the ALL NEW 2022 Nissan Frontier! As Efficient As It Is Powerful! 👉🏾 https://bit.ly/3FqR7bP Support #RolandMartinUnfiltered and #BlackStarNetwork via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered PayPal ☛ https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfiltered Venmo ☛https://venmo.com/rmunfiltered Zelle ☛ [e-mail] Annual or monthly recurring #BringTheFunk Fan Club membership via paypal ☛ https://rolandsmartin.com/rmu-paypal/ Download the #BlackStarNetwork app on iOS, AppleTV, Android, Android TV, Roku, FireTV, SamsungTV and XBox 👉🏾 http://www.blackstarnetwork.com #RolandMartinUnfiltered and the #BlackStarNetwork are news reporting platforms covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Today is Thursday, March 24, 2022. Coming up, I'm Roland Martin, unfiltered on the Black Star Network, the historical confirmation of the 116th Supreme Court Justice Dominique Katonji Brown Jackson. And it will actually, when she confirms she'll be the 116th Supreme Court Justice Dominique Katonji Brown Jackson. And it will actually, she confirmed she'll be the 116th Supreme Court Justice. Jackson spent nearly 22 hours being grilled by members of the

Senate Judiciary Committee. We're going to show you some of what took place today. We'll also talk with Wade Henderson, the interim leader of the Leadership Conference on the Civil Rights, who also testified today on her behalf. In Georgia, a sitting judge of a reelection can withdraw from a race,

thus canceling the election, and then be appointed by the governor. We'll take a look at this judicial loophole that Georgia actually passed. I told y'all don't trust these damn Republicans. He was unarmed and went to his car, was surrounded by plainclothes New Jersey police officers. They thought he was reaching for a weapon.

He was reaching for tea. Now he's paralyzed from the neck down. Juwan Henderson's attorney will update us on his case and let us know why he's still facing charges. Shopping while black? Oh, yeah. A man was wrongfully convicted. A man in Ohio was wrongfully detained and questioned by

police officers who were actually searching for a white suspect described by dispatch. Eric Lindsey and his attorney will tell us about his lost was wrongfully detained and questioned by police officers who were actually searching for a white suspect described by dispatch. Eric Lindsey, as attorney, will tell us about his lawsuit. Also, remember the brother in Florida where the cops busted into his crib and he fired a warning shot and fired at the cops and they charged him with attempted murder?

Yeah, they dropped the charges. Plus, an art exhibit uplifting the black man is opening at the Reginald F. Lewis Museum of Maryland African American History and Culture in Baltimore. The executive director of the museum will tell us about the Men of Change exhibit. Lot of stuff we wanna cover, folks.

And also, y'all know I got these ADOS, FBA, V1 people all mad and upset because I challenged them a week ago to stand up for Gary Chambers running for US Senate in Louisiana. Ooh, they upset with me. Ooh, I don't give a damn. It's time to bring the funk on Roland Martin Unfiltered

on the Black Star Network, let's go. He's got it. Whatever the miss, he's on it. Whatever it is, he's got the scoop, the fact, the fine And when it breaks, he's right on time And it's rolling Best belief he's knowing Putting it down from sports to news to politics

With entertainment just for kicks He's rolling It's on go' with Uncle Roro, yo. It's Rollin' Martin, yeah. Rollin' with Rollin' now. He's bulk, he's fresh, he's real the best, you know he's Rollin' Martin now. Martin. Martin. Over the last three days, we've heard over and over again, as we should, about the incredible qualifications that Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson has to serve on the Supreme Court. And I know I've touted them each and every day of this hearing myself. Hopefully you've seen me do it if you've been watching the hearings. I'm going to do it again

here in a minute. But before I do, I want to explain why I'm doing it, why I keep doing it. It's because I do believe every American should know. Should know Katonji Brown Jackson, the judge. Katonji Brown Jackson, the person. And the fact that she represents the very best of our country. All right, folks, the confirmation hearings for Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson ended today at the 22 hours, but the one moment, I dare say,

now, granted, we had, in the words of Senator Ben Sasse, a lot of jackasses showing themselves on the committee. We're going to show you what he had to say about that. But I dare say the moment that people are still talking about, especially black women. Now, yesterday, of course, we were getting ready for the show. Spike Lee was interviewing me for the Colin Kaepernick interview. I was not watching the hearings yesterday, so I actually missed that critical moment when Senator Cory Booker of New Jersey,

when he spoke for so many African Americans, but especially black women who were watching these hearings, who were watching the attacks on this sister, evoking in many ways the same way the white Southern Dixiecrats were attacking Thurgood Marshall in 1967 during his confirmation hearings, when Senator Cory Booker, when he spoke up, when he laid out this

moment, and it reached the point where Judge Brown, when she had to grab some tissue and she had to actually wipe away tears as she was talking about the point where Judge Brown, when she had to grab some tissue and she had to actually wipe away tears as she listened to Senator Cory Booker express his

thoughts in that particular moment, it was amazing. So many people were tweeting the video out back and forth. They were showing it. They were just speaking to it. So, folks, let's go ahead and play it. Thank you very much, Judge. After me, only five to go. But sit back for a second because I don't have questions right away.

I actually have a number of things I just want to say because this has been not a surprise, given the history that we all know, not a surprise, but perhaps a little bit of a disappointment, some of the things that have been said in this hearing. The way you have dealt with some of these things, that's why you are a judge and I am a politician, because you have sat with grit and grace and have shown us just extraordinary demeanor during the times where people were saying things to you that are actually out of the norm. I had to go up dais to ask some of my more senior colleagues about what I feel like is a dangerous precedent. People are taking a thousand cases you've been over. Is that right? I'm sorry. I said you wouldn't ask you questions, but just give me something like that. Something like that. And from what

I understand is that these cases are often takes take days, weeks, sometimes months, right? To decide in a case. Yes. There's a trial sometimes and folks are taking any of those cases and just trying to pick pieces out. And so my colleague, Senator Hawley, has been doing this all into the lead up and saying things, tweeting things that I think that a lot of us, when I was just trying to get some advice here, is this is what the new standard is going to be. that has ever chosen outside of the sentencing guidelines, below the sentencing guidelines. We're creating this environment now where I could make myself the hero of people who have been victims of some horrible crime and suddenly put whatever judge I want on the defensive by trying to drag out little bits

when they have no context to the case. None of the facts. They're seeking to be America again. The land that never has been yet, but yet must be the land where everyone is free. Oh, yes, I say it plain America. Never was America to me, but I swear this oath America will be. That is the story of how you got to this desk. You and I and everyone here generations of folk who came here and said America I'm Irish you may say no Irish or dogs need apply but

I'm going to show this country that I can be free here. I can make this country love me as much as I love it. Chinese Americans first forced into near slave labor, building our railroads, connecting our country. Saw the ugliest of America, but they were going to build their home here and say, America, you may not love me yet, but I'm gonna make this nation live up to its promise and hope. LGBTQ Americans from Stonewall women to Seneca, hidden figures who didn't even get their play until some Hollywood movie finally talked about them and how they were critical for us defying gravity,

all of these people loved America. And so you faced insults here that were shocking to me. Well, actually not shocking. But you are here because of that kind of love. And nobody's taken this away from me. So you got five more folk to go through. Five more of us. And then you can sit back and let us have all the debates. And I'm going to tell you, it's going to be a well-charted Senate floor because it's not going to stop. They're going to accuse you of this and that. Heck, in honor of your person who shares your birthday, you might be called a communist. But don't worry, my sister. Don't worry. God has got you.

And how do I know that? Because you're here. And I know what it's taken for you to sit in that seat. There's a lot more that he said. We're going to play a little bit more of that later. That was an unbelievable moment. Joining me right now is Reverend Leah Daughtry. She's the former DNC CEO, campaign manager for Fighting for Our Vote, Brown Lewis, Dean, North Carolina Central University.

Wade Henderson is the interim president and CEO of Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights. Also, Recy Colbert, Black Women Views, regular panelists on Thursday, and of course, Dr. Greg Carr, Department of Afro-American Studies at Howard University. Leah, I will start with... Actually, I'm going to start with you, Brown. As that was playing,

it appeared as if you were wiping away tears from your eyes. Yes, I was. I've watched it before, but it continues to be emotional because I know the journey that she's taken to get here because we've all taken similar journeys. And so it is just such an emotional time. So the tears of promise, tears of hope, but also tears of remembrance of what we've been through historically.

Leah, I dare say that that was the finest moment to date of Senator Cory Booker's career as a United States Senator representing New Jersey. That moment. You know, it was when he opened his mouth and began to speak and invoked Constance Baker Motley and Langston Hughes and Harriet Tubman and really just gave Judge Jackson some wind beneath her wings. I think he was not speaking just for himself, but really he was speaking for all of us. I had the opportunity to attend the hearings and to be in the room when the junior senator from Texas, Mr. Cruz, began with his diatribe, his shenanigans. And, you know, sitting there, there's nothing you can do.

The feeling of helplessness as you watch this eminently qualified sister who has put herself forward to serve this nation, be undercut, undermined, diminished, and demeaned, and you sit there proud of her, but with a feeling of helplessness because there's nothing you can do. And so Senator Booker finally steps forth in his last pass at this and speaks what we all wanted to hear, what we all needed to hear, what we all wanted to say, particularly as a Black woman. Your brother standing up and saying, I support you, sis. I see you.

I support you. And I'm with you was just so deeply gratifying and moving. I think I myself cried through his 20 minutes of speaking, because it was just such a needed moment. And you could see from her face that she needed that moment. She appreciated it as well. Arisi, there were, I mean, the number of sisters who I saw on social media commenting and moved to tears

was just amazing. And folks who were saying they saw it over and over and over again, because frankly, for many folks in this generation, we weren't even alive when Thurgood Marshall went through his hearings. I'm not wasting my time on Clarence Thomas. And so, but this was absolutely different

because for Thurgood Marshall, he was the first African-American. For Judge Brown Jackson, the first African-American female. And that really, I think, also why that moment was critically important. Absolutely. I mean, you know, we have to claw and scrape our way into any position that we get. And it's painful. And what Senator Cory Booker did in that moment was he elevated not just Judge Jackson, Brown Jackson, but all Black women. I mean, the woman that he invoked, Constance Baker Motley, Harriet Tubman, his own mother,

Black woman throughout our history. We have a rich legacy of black women being trailblazers. And as he pointed out, they certainly didn't get there by having a hand out, you know. But what he did is he gave her a hand up in that situation. And, you know, Republicans live in the gutter. They live in the mud. And I'm, for one, all for getting down and dirty with them and throwing some punches around. But what we really needed in that moment was to elevate her in a way that gave her the

honor of this really magnificent position. You know, the Supreme Court is one of the most prestigious appointments that one can have. It's one that has eluded Black women throughout the entire country, history of this country. And so she deserved that gravitas. She deserved that support. And she deserved that unequivocal backing in a way that really just showed that she earned the right to be there with dignity. She didn't have to sit there through all of those indignities and being debased and berated for hours so that people can get their soundbites for Fox News or OAN or for their primary campaigns or for the midterms,

she's better than that. And I think that that moment presented her with that opportunity to really relish in the accomplishment that she had just by being there. And I think it was a reminder for Black people everywhere that, you know, I think we're starting to get to the point where we take for granted these historic firsts. Not everybody, obviously. Older generations are much more in tune with the significance of this. But I think in this kind of, you know, popcorn society that we have, we're always moving on to the next story. The significance of this moment kind of gets lost. So I salute Senator Booker for giving her that gift, but for giving us that gift as well. Wayne Henderson, I'll go to you next.

And I got no problem saying this. I think all too often, we as men, including Black men, do not fully appreciate nor understand the reality of what women, black women, have to go through in this society. When we think, you know, I was traveling back from New York City yesterday after attending a conference for minority football coaches, Brian Flores and others were there,

and then sitting with Spike Lee for the Colin Kaepernick documentary that he's working on. When we think about our history, and actually when I was traveling back, I was watching Selma in our Sprinter, and even when I think about that, sure, we could talk about Millie Boynton and Annie Cooper, but the reality is, I mean, Diane Nash represented in that film,

but the reality is, in our history, black women have, especially the black freedom movement even before that and after, black women have often been erased, not centered, not held up, when the reality is there ain't no movement without black women, and so then or now. And so brothers need to fully understand why Senator Cory Booker needed to affirm this sister in that setting last night. Roland, let me say I'm honored to be on tonight's program. The women who are on tonight's program have so eloquently stated the challenge that Judge Katonji Brown Jackson faced in yesterday's hearing. And indeed, Senator Booker's moment was not just powerful.

It was transcendent. It really was. What made the circumstance so powerfully tragic is that in Katonji Brown Jackson, you have perhaps, really not perhaps, you have the most well-qualified individual ever presented to serve on the United States Supreme Court. Her credentials are unparalleled. So, you know, we know that she graduated from both Harvard College and Harvard Law School with honors in both instances, clerked for three judges, a district court judge, court of appeals, and the Supreme Court, served as a public defender, served as a commissioner on the Sentencing Commission, her record is unparalleled. There is no other member of the court currently, or that we can think of, whose credentials were more extensive than hers.

And yet she suffered the slings and arrows of demagogic criticism, criticism with no basis in substance, but was whipped up into a frenzy, a froth, for entirely political purposes, and in so doing degraded her at really her finest hour. And she was forced to sit stoically and listen to these criticisms and to have that couched under the guise of judicial temperament. It was a powerful moment. And Cory Booker's comments were cathartic. And that's why people cried, not just women. Men were touched by this as well. But as you said, Roland, I think, you know, as a Black man, it's certainly important for all of us to recognize what this moment represents, not just to Black women, but to the nation. And the qualifications that Judge Jackson presents

to the country as a whole is something that deserves to be lifted up and celebrated as the best of what America represents. She should be confirmed near unanimously. But the truth is, she'll be fortunate to get one, no more than two, Republican votes on her confirmation. And yet I am confident that even if she does not get one Republican vote, she will be confirmed. I think her presentations over the three days of these hearings have demonstrated time and time again why she should be confirmed and that her qualifications are exceedingly superb and that she really represents the best of what this country symbolizes

and as the nation's first Black woman to serve on the United States Supreme Court. We should all be honored to participate in this moment. Greg, it's interesting to listen to conservatives complain saying, oh, Joe Biden, he stopped the first black woman who could have been on the Supreme Court, Janice Rogers Brown. He he filibustered her when in reality you heard what Senator Cory Booker said last night. No, Constance Baker Motley could have easily been the first. And he said, remember, they call her a communist. And watching Judge Brown Jackson this week, watching her poise, watching her have to sit there and endure the lies.

And again, what Republican Ben Sasse said, the jackass behavior of people on his side. Again, I really thought about that scene. There was a particular scene from Selma that to me is one of the greatest scenes when the Coretta Scott King character, played by Carmen Ajugo, was actually talking to Lorraine Toussaint, who was playing Amelia Boynton and Boynton said this. And again, when I saw it, I said,

this speaks exactly what we witnessed this week from this. You are already prepared. Know what I can contribute to this moment. I'm grateful to you and to Black Star Network for giving us space. We taped a piece today with Angie Porter and Belithia Watkins, two professors, law professors, in Angie's case, for airing tomorrow on the confirmations. I'm a little conflicted. I mean, you know, only seen Selma once, that movie, in part because the criticism, one of the criticisms was I share is the mistreatment of student non Coordinating Committee in that moment. But of course, it's always good

to see Amelia Boynton Robinson portrayed there. Her son, of course, is the Boynton in Boynton versus Virginia. He was a student at Howard Law School at the time. And so watching Cory Booker, I watched him just before I went to class last night, I had class at the law school, and we talked about his comments. And what I saw was, and then again today in class, my undergraduate students, some of my law students and my undergraduate students, one of the law students was actually in the room yesterday watching.

And it was very interesting to hear young people filter Brother Booker's comments. The enthusiasm, yes, the support for the sister, yes. All of that. At the same time, we have to remember we're in a political formation. So I don't know whether he was giving a campaign speech. And certainly Harriet Tubman is not an American at the time. She was a criminal. She's a fugitive from federal law. But Cory Booker's almost Santa Claus construction of what America is. And I understand why he did it, and I think he does believe that. But it runs the risk of using that time, perhaps even as he continued to praise our sister, Kintaji, Kintaji Onyeka Brown Jackson, by the way. Her middle name is a Yoruba name. And while she has maintained her composure brilliantly, she has also been speaking through

her gestures, through her pauses, through those consonants she's been clipping. If you speak Ebonics, she has been giving it to them the whole week. It's actually been glorious to watch. But Booker, you know, it's interesting because I felt conflicted and listening to young people talk about how they looked at it. Everything from, you know, the idea that somehow she has to justify who she is. We keep saying she's qualified, she's qualified, she's qualified. Nothing she could do,

nothing she could do will qualify her to these white nationalists. Brett Kavanaugh got up there and snotted and snorted. He went to Georgetown Day. And remember Ted Cruz tried to take her out to CRT the same Georgetown Day that that white man went to. They were never going to vote for her. There's no amount of saying you're qualified. No, this is going to prepare you. This is going to help you. Remember James Eastland, as you've talked about many times, he drug Constance Baker Motley's nomination out for months in 1966 when

she was nominated to the federal bench for the Southern District of New York. And I'm bringing all this up as a background to the point I'm about to make. We should pause and celebrate our brother Cory Booker for saying what he said. And we also have to balance that with being very clear eyed in this intellectual warfare we're on, because while he was doing that, the Supreme Court that Kataji Brown Jackson is about to be on handed down a per curiam decision yesterday that cut a black district in the Milwaukee area because the criminal enterprise known as the Wisconsin State Legislature has gone completely out of its mind. The Wisconsin

Supreme Court stepped in, and the damn Supreme Court of the United States intervened in a state issue. These people are out of control. If you don't understand white supremacy, everything else you think you understand will only confuse you. And while we continue to say that this sister, who is eminently qualified, is eminently qualified, we also have to balance that with this, with disabusing ourselves of this aspirational back mapping of this, this fantasy we think of as American values. There is no such thing. We have to be clear out about this.

I can't wait for her to get on the bench. And then we'll see who Kataji Brown Jackson is, because nobody can predict what a Supreme Court justice will do, will write, will think until they get on the bench. So I'm just ready for this vote. Take this vote. Let these white boys do what they were going to do from day one. And then let's get down to brass tacks. And Clarence Thomas, get well soon as you retire from whatever illness has your ass

in the hospital, at home recuperating. And maybe it'll push you to consider coming off the bench. Then we're going to see who they really are, because then they're going to have to have a real fight, because this one is theater at this point. But, Brown, this is the dichotomy that we actually face, and that is we have to wear both masks. The reality is this. She could say what we want to say, but she got to get confirmed. And the reality is, Senator Cory Booker is operating in an institution

where it's just three people who look like, two other people who look like him. And one is a Republican who frankly votes against everything that he actually believes in. And that's Senator Tim Scott. And so for all of our desire to do a Colin Kaepernick, the reality is if you read I Never Had It Made by Jackie Robinson, Robinson didn't want to go through all the stuff that he had to go through,

but he also understood why he was going through it. And it's very interesting, when you read his book, and you can read the fury, the anger, but also understanding it. We still are living in a world, and I say this all the time, where in the last election, 73% of the electorate was white. We're still living in an America that is being defined by, frankly, white standards. And so this week, I think, show that. So even if you do all the things they say you're supposed to do and all the places you're supposed to go, you do all of those things,

you still are going to be treated like black folks have always been treated in America. Dean? I think you're exactly right. And I think that what was really impressive about her is that she handled it in a way that they were saying things that was infuriating, things that were not true. The whole thing about the pornography and the fact that she is being penalized for doing her job. Had she done something different, she would have been penalized for not doing that. And I think she handled it with so much grace. She controlled

her face, because, as Black women, we speak not just with our voices, but with our faces, with our hands, especially our hands. And I think that she did a wonderful job of working within the system. You're right, recognizing that she couldn't say exactly what she thought, she couldn't show what she thought, because she has an objective, and that's to get on the Supreme Court to maybe make a difference and maybe make things better for people who look like her. So I really appreciated her calmness, her posture, her temperament, and that she really did not go there with them. And she was polite, even when they were impolite.

So I really, really appreciate that. But it goes to your point, what we're saying is that she's reacting to the world in which we still live. What we always on, I always have to prove ourselves. I would have to be careful not to become that angry black woman to sustain and control our emotions in such a way. And not necessarily fair, but it was just what it is and what we are now. Leah, that as Greg talked about how his students, how they saw it, again, it is the reality of how we have to go through this world.

And we can, and I love it when I hear these people, you know, I had somebody who today was whining and crying and they were criticizing, they were like, you know, you trying to sit today was whining and crying, and they were criticizing. They were like, you know, you trying to sit here and get money from the government. I said, well, the government spends a billion dollars a year in advertising. So what you say, black-owned media shouldn't get any of the money, and the white folks keep getting the money, when they get $322 billion being spent every year,

and we're getting 0.5%. And so you have some people who somehow believe that you could just totally separate yourself from this world. Ain't no reality in that whatsoever. In fact, you can be at a Howard University, they call it the Mecca, but you know what? You still going to have to go to Capitol Hill and talk to folks when it comes to funding. And so it's getting people to understand that this is still the Black reality in the United States. What we have to endure silently, we know is bullshit. We know folks lying. But you got to sit there, keep a certain look on your face. Inside, you're cussing them out. But outside, you can't say a word.

And, you know, that is really the story of our lives as African Americans in this country, where we really have to keep our eyes on the prize and keep the main thing the main thing. And we can do a lot and say a lot, but what is the goal? And for many of us, those who believe in the liberation of Black people, we know that there are many roots to that, and we all need to work the route that we are in and work in the rooms that we've been assigned in order to move the liberation of Black people forward. And what you had, the point here, and let's keep the main thing the main thing, the point here is to have an African American with her lived experience on the Supreme Court. So sometimes that means you got to hold your tongue, bite your

tongue. Somebody else has to say the things that you can't say. But again, the main thing needs to be the main thing. And I think she was smart enough to understand what the goal is and would not let herself be dissuaded or distracted from the goal in order to give a sharp answer or a quick retort to a bunch of people who are quite frankly, running for president and trying to get their brownie points with their base. So this is this, but this is the tension that we have as black people in this country, that we have always had how to advance ourselves, protect our communities, move our people forward toward liberation while working inside of a system that was not designed for our success.

And we've quite frankly exceeded. We got a lot of work to do. And I'm with you, Roland, on getting the money. The money that the government spends is our money. We are tax paid. And we have every right to get the contracts, get the grants, get whatever the government is, because essentially they are giving me back

what I have paid in for all these many years. Why should I leave and let the white people spend my money? This is my money too. And I want some of it and I deserve some of it. And we ought to be able to have the funds apportioned to us in the way that we deserve. And so I don't see what the problem is. It's not either or. either or we make it an either or. But the fact of the matter is the only way we're going to be liberated in this country and get what we deserve as God's creation is to have an inside and an outside strategy. And as long as the inside and the outside are communicating, talking and collaborating, then that's what we need in order to move our people forward. Wade, I try my best to do what Maya Angelou told me years ago. I didn't see it that way. She did. We were talking, and this was a month before she died,

and she was being celebrated with her portrait, and they had a party for her at the Smithsonian Museum of African Art. And I was interviewing her, and I mentioned my brother and my sister's teacher. She says, no, you're a teacher. I said, no, I'm not. She said, oh, no. She said, I watch you. You teach.

She said, oh, you are a teacher. And so I'm always talking about how we have to rethink our approach to politics. And today I was going back and forth with some folk because a week ago, I challenged folks who support reparations. I'm like, well, are you going to stand with a brother, Gary Chambers, who's running for a senator in Louisiana? Gary talked about how John Bill Edwards won by 30,000 votes

the gubernatorial race and how many votes it took. And he said how many unregistered black people there are in Louisiana. And he said, we literally, he said, if we get the same number, I could beat Senator John Kennedy. And so I'm watching this hearing, and again, and I'm dealing with these trolls and these people who are going back and forth. And I'm sitting here going, don't y'all know that if Gary

Chambers beats Senator John Kennedy in November, Senator John Kennedy ain't questioning nobody with his fake accent on the committee? If Sherry Beasley wins in North Carolina, Tom Tillis ain't asking questions on the Judiciary Committee because he's gone. And so I'm sitting here going to the folk, you can't on one hand talk about how Judge Katonji Brown Jackson is getting treated and totally ignore what can happen if you remove and beat two of the very Republicans who are questioning her on the same committee. That they go hand in hand. Teach, Roland. Teach. Let me say Maya Angelou was correct. You are a teacher. And one of the things that has to be done under these circumstances is to link the lived

experiences of the people we're talking about, what they desire most in terms of accomplishing things like police accountability and reform or voting rights, not simply for the sake of voting rights, but to achieve a more just society than we have currently, it requires people to register and vote. I understand that is not everybody's answer to the problems that we face, but it is certainly one answer, and we have to pursue it. When we were in working with organizations like the NAACP, the National Action Network, the Legal Defense Fund, the Urban League, trying to get a voting rights bill passed this year, the leadership of Mark Morial and Reverend Sharpton and Derek and Cheryl Lynn was incredible, and it made a huge difference. But at the end of the day, we did not get that bill passed, and unfortunately, it was two Democrats that stood in the way. The refusal to adjust the filibuster was costly. states that are controlled by Republican state legislatures and governors, enacting a series

of new restrictions on voting right access, voter suppression initiatives that are sending us back in time to a period before 1965 when the Voting Rights Act was adopted. We've got to fight back on the ground. And that means registering as many people as possible and encouraging them to turn out with a common purpose. Hopefully, that effort is underway through a number of different organizations. But we also need that effort, you know, given volume by you and others, speaking truth, linking these issues together in ways that people can understand. And that is a challenge, Roland. You have a gift. Use it. And I think shows like this are very helpful and hopefully connecting with people who are not currently part of the

system, but could be a real force for change if they were to register and participate. Brown, you are dean of North Carolina Central. How have your students been, what have they been saying this week watching these hearings? Well, they've been excited about the way she's handling herself, but they are really shocked about, because for some of them, given their age, this is the first time they've really seen this type of confirmation hearing, which the last one wasn't as aggressive. So they're really, really surprised as to the lack of civility that is going on. But it is also motivating them to what you guys are saying, to get out and support Justice former Justice Beasley in her campaign.

And so I think it has invigorated our students, and it also has given them the opportunity to see the reality of how the world really works. Because I think that, given their age and the things they're going through, they don't remember some of the historical things that Senator Booker was talking about. Because even before the debate about critical race theory, a lot of secondary schools and a lot of high schools have started eliminating teaching history about Jim Crow and about slavery, it's about racism.

So I think that for some students, it was a shock to see the manner in which a black woman that was so highly credentialed, the way that she's been treated during these hearings. Which is precisely why, Leah, I need folk to understand, stop thinking this shit's gonna be easy. You need to see... I say this all the time, and I know how people,

they go, oh, man, I don't want to see them Jim Crow movies. I don't want to see them slavery movies. But for me, I mean, literally yesterday, again, I'm in New York, and, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in, um, in New York and here I'm sitting right next to Brian Flores, who was suing the NFL of a lack of head coaching opportunities. And Damaris Smith is talking about John Mackey being the first, the African-American suing the NFL for free agency in 1972 and taking 20 years and Curt Flood suing Major League Baseball,

going to Supreme Court, losing, but eventually it actually happening and walking through that history. And I'm sitting here going, folk, you can't act like this thing always existed the way you did just because you just were born in the last 20 years. And so this generation, whether I'm 53, whether people are 43, 33, or 23, need to see the remnants, the grandchildren of Jim Crow still doing what they do so folk understand the battle ain't over. That's exactly right. You know, Chancellor Williams, in his book,

The Destruction of Black Civilization, starts with a story, and the griot sees an old man on the road and said, what happened to the great people of Sumer? They were architects and doctors and history shows they were a great civilization. And the old man says, well, they lost their history and so they died. That's the moment we are in. If we don't understand the history of what has happened before, we are ill preparedprepared for what will happen in the future. If you didn't recognize the names that Cory Booker called yesterday, you got some work

to do, my sister, my brother, so we can be prepared and understand how to deal with the sons of Jim Crow and the daughters of Jim Crow as we marsha, marsha, marsha. This is what we have to do. And if we don't connect those dots, then we will stay in the mud patch, just stomping around in the same place, and we will never be able to move our people forward. Brown Lewis, Wade Henderson, Leah Daughtry, I appreciate all three of you being with us. Wade, I was going to ask you about what you spoke about today, but don't worry about it.

We're going to play the video later. So we'll hear your voice, but we'll play it in real time. I appreciate all three of y'all being here. You're certainly welcome to come back anytime. Thank you. Thank you very much. Recy and Greg, it was still, to me, me is just extremely interesting.

And Greg, I'm going to start with you on this one. And frankly, it bothers, it does irk me to no end when people are talking about how do we affect change today, they have no understanding of history. And we sit in these rooms and folk talk about how are we going to fix this problem and how are we going to do this? And I'm sitting there going, the same way they did then.

When I was having the conversation, when I was having the conversation yesterday and we were talking about these NFL owners who don't want to hire black head coaches, but they get billions from city, county, and state governments. I said, you ever heard of the Powell Amendment? Attach some EEOC standards to receiving publicly financed money. Adam Clayton Powell did it in the 1950s

With the education to build a president Dwight Eisenhower And it continued in the 60s And so, and I said Tell the New York Black and Puerto Rican caucus To hold up that 1.4 billion dollars They want to give to the billionaire owner Of the Buffalo Bills to build a new stadium. And so same thing here. If you watch these hearings and you are mad in Arkansas about

Tom Cotton, and if you pissed off in Louisiana about John Kennedy, and if you pissed off about Ted Cruz in Texas, if you mad in Missouri about Josh Hawley, then did you call their office? Did you email? Did you tweet them? Are you going to show up at their town hall? Or are you going to simply express outrage on social media and not do a damn thing? At some point, you got to either

get in this game or sit your ass down and be quiet. Of course, Roland, you're absolutely right. And that is, again, why this platform, this network is so important. We're not engaged in just cheerleading. And let me be very clear from earlier, I think Katonji Brown Jackson came as close to pitch perfect as you're going to see. So my remarks on Cory Booker were about him, not her. And I wish Cory Booker had been even more eloquent and precise. I think some of his metaphors were quite frankly

absurd in terms of these combinations. And it speaks to this point that you're raising here for this reason. These people don't care about facts. You can't appeal to them and call them colleagues like Cory, oh, my friend, my friend. All that rhetoric goes out the window. Do you understand Ben Sass, for all his kind of corn-porn, all shucks, is a soft white nationalist, and Josh Hawley was talking to QAnon

when he brought up that child porn stuff? That is the Kentucky Brown Jackson that gave four years to that white boy that drove up from North Carolina at Pizzagate and threatened to shoot up everybody on Connecticut Avenue. So, of course, her record is unassailable. But what these white men were doing, and I agree with Reverend Daughtry, they are campaigning for 2024.

They're auditioning. They were always going to vote against her. Now, what you've put on the table, Roland, is the only thing we need to be discussing when it comes to electoral politics. Register, vote, and get rid of them. Did you see Mike Brown, the Indiana senator that said that perhaps the Supreme Court should have never

legalized interracial marriage? Yeah, Senator Mike Braun. Mike Braun, yeah, Mike Braun. I'm sorry, I mispronounced it. Right, he said that leave it up to the states, and he was asked about loving, well, if you want it for this one, you got to do it for all of them. Absolutely.

Exactly. But I'm saying Cory Booker is saying, you know, Judge, when your parents came along, it was illegal for your marriage. Yes, that's true. But don't then couch that in, but we're better than this. There is no we, brother. You've got to energize our people like Gary Chambers is energizing him, in my opinion. And so when you see that, what you're saying, Roland, You've got to energize our people like Gary Chambers is energizing him, in my opinion.

And so when you see that, what you're saying, Roland, comes down to we have to be smart. Again, I was going to say this one thing. That's why this forum is important. There are people who have criticized Katanji Brown Jackson because of this Lockheed Martin case that they're saying, oh, she sold out black women working for Lockheed. No, you need to do some research. When you read that case, and I've read that case, and I discussed it with my students, what soon-to-be Justice Brown Jackson did at the district court level, most of her opinions are at the district court,

which is why she gave young Josh Hawley his entire ass lunch. If you watch and understand sentencing guidelines and all the things that were being discussed, she embarrassed Cruz. She embarrassed Hawley and all of them. But when you look at that case, what you realize is if she had accepted that settlement,

it would have precluded any other Black employee, any other Black employee at Lockheed for bringing a subsequent suit. So you could argue whether or not she should have allowed the agreement to go forward or not. But she, in effect, preserved the rights of other black people to sue in the future by sacrificing the settlement that this subgroup of black employees that happen to be black women brought in that moment. Now, that's something that legal scholars would argue about. But when people say, well, see, that's evidence she's against Black people.

No! We gotta be smarter than that. Because they ain't read shit. They ain't read a damn thing just running they mouth. Running they mouth. And then they say, well, the FOP endorsed her. Noble endorsed her. And then people say, what's noble? Exactly. Please understand

that this woman is going to be on the Supreme Court. This sister is going to be on the Supreme Court. This sister is going to be on the Supreme Court, and she's going to be in the minority for the foreseeable future. However, her dissents, her opinions, joining Sonia Sotomayor, and I'm not going to talk about Kagan, but joining Sotomayor, they may well turn into precedents in the future when we get a majority. But you'll never get a majority if your ass doesn't vote, because they are running a Boston on the United States of America right now, and you're not going to fix it by complaining. This is a complex thing. You've got to vote. one of the reasons why I started following Reesey, cause one, let's just be clear, Reesey couldn't have sat in front of that,

in that hearing with that face of Judge Brown. I'm just letting y'all know. I mean, they would have had to do some bleeping if Reesey was sitting up there. But the thing is, it's breaking these things down for these people who don't read Jack, they don't watch Jack, they don't study Jack. All they do is see a tweet that somebody else posted

and they run with it. And it's just like, I love these people here who talking about, oh man, you was sitting here saying that Hillary couldn't dance, she wasn't going to get the black vote. I'm like, don't you dumbass know what levity is? The whole room laughed. I said, oh, but you skipped over the whole hour of questions that we had at a Claflin University, the HBCU. I'm like, oh, y'all skipped over that. And see, that's the silliness we're talking about. What Greg just detailed.

Yeah, I've had some folks send me those tweets. Man, she screwed over the black employees. But you didn't read it. And that is what we're dealing with. We are dealing with a generation, unfortunately, I'm not labeling everybody, but we're dealing with people who only operate within the 280 characters of Twitter, who only see a meme on Instagram. And if you want to understand, all you got to do is look at time. See, this is what people need to understand. When we talk about who watches and how they watch and what they do, There's a thing called, in radio, called time-spent listening.

It's called T-S-L. In digital, it's called time-spent watching. For this show, for this show, last year on YouTube, because I love these people who say, oh, man, your show's a failure. Mm, really? 92.4 million views last year. 13.6 million watch hours. 1.2 billion impressions in reach.

Views from impressions, 56.6 million. Watch hours from impression was 9 billion. But here was the key. 9 million, I'm sorry. But here was the key. Average watch time of a Roland Martin unfiltered video is 8

minutes and 52 seconds. We ain't sitting here trying to give y'all... We lost you. Did you hear recently? I didn't hear that. Our average watch time on YouTube is 8 minutes and 52 seconds. So when people hit me

and go, man, you should be doing shorter videos. No, I'm not trying to sit here and teach your ass in 2 minutes. Because you can't explain every damn thing in two minutes. You got to walk people through an understanding, and that's what the deal was. And so when you saw her answering questions, it was like,

no, I got to answer your question. You don't quite understand. No, let me, she, no. No, no, Congress should have done this. No, judges can't do that. No, at the district level, I had to follow this. No, that's what it is. It's context and nuance, and the game of the Cruisers and the Hollies and all of them

is to see if I can tag you and as Sass, who, yeah, punked out, was critical of Trump, but then kissed his ass, went quiet to get his endorsement because he didn't want to fight him, and then criticized him after he won, but he is right. It was a bunch of

jackasses trying to make TV, and that's why Ted Cruz was busted looking on Twitter and searching for his own name. Risa, go ahead. Yeah, but let's be clear. Ben Sasse ain't shit either, so fuck him. I don't care if he wanted to call some people out, stating the obvious about Jackassery.

But the problem that we have, and, Roland, you said generational, but I would say it's a societal problem that we have. People would rather sound knowledgeable than actually gain knowledge. And so what Republicans did with these performances is they met their folks where they are, which is in the gutter, which is in soundbites, which is in captions, tweets, memes, clips. That's where their people are. And frankly, that's where most people are. And so that's where, to Dr. Carr's point, somebody would pick up the Lockheed Martin case and say,

well, she ain't for us, when they don't even understand the details of it. But the devil is in the details. And the details tend to be irrelevant for people once they formed an impression. And so Republicans are really genius at playing this disinformation, misinformation messaging game. And Democrats have a thirst to try to educate people that don't want to learn. They just want to sound smart.

They just want to sound like they know stuff. So I think that what Judge Brown Jackson did was really genius. She actually put on a clinic. I learned so much from listening to her, but whatever she said was beside the point for what Republicans were trying to do. And Republicans, to Dr. Carr's point of being clear-eyed, what I heard, it was disturbing. It was debasing how they treated Judge Brown Jackson. But what I heard is the next salvo for what they're going for in terms of the midterms,

in terms of what they plan to do with power. When we're talking about sentencing and we're talking about cherry-picking cases, what kind of chilling effect is that going to have on judges who are, you know, looking towards their career? Hold up. I don't want anybody to skip what you just said. That's right, Roland. Because 11 incumbent Democratic judges who supported bail reform in Harris County, Texas,

where Houston is, lost in the primary because the police unions endorsed and funded prosecutors who ran against them. Right. You have Governor Kathy Hochul, who was in New York, who is trying to scale back on some of the bail reforms that have been made there. You know, so what the Republicans always do, the same thing they did with contesting the

legitimacy of the elections, is they're always laying the groundwork and the pretext for the next corrupt power grab that they're going to take. And so when they want to talk about soft on crime, hard on crime, when they want to talk about soft on crime, hard on crime, when they want to talk about lawlessness and all these other things, what they're doing is they're laying the groundwork to further criminalize, to further incarcerate Black people. Because that's what the target always says, okay, Black people specifically. And when you talk about CRT saying KBJ equals CRT. No. What they're saying is this is just blatant white supremacy, white nationalism. What they're saying is anything black is a problem for us by default, period.

And so we do have to be, to Dr. Carr's point, clear-eyed about not just the theatrics, but what the theatrics signal. And Democrats in particular, I love what Senator Booker did. I think we needed that moment just to come up for air. But much of the hearings were completely squandered playing on a Republican turf. There you go. Yes, you do need... Go ahead. I do want to bring in, before I go to the breaks, my next guests have been waiting. I do want to bring in our third panelist, Dr. Larry Walker, assistant professor at the University of Central Florida. Doc, I just want to get your thoughts on the hearings

this week of Judge Katonji Brown-Jackson. It was political theater, you know, rolling, you know, for us to follow politics, we already knew what was going to happen. The script had already been written. So, just watching it play out was essentially watching actors and directors, someone directing a script that had already been written. So just watching it play out was essentially watching actors and

directors, someone directing a script that had already been written. So I think it was really important. And Recy just talked about Senator Booker's, what he had to say. And, you know, as someone, as a Black man, I was happy to see him defend Judge Brown Jackson the way he did. And for Black folks who have been in churches or on campus or in social events and you're the only Black person, sometimes we give each other things like a head nod. But what he did in terms of the support in front of a national audience, it warmed all our hearts because we know what it's like to be the only person or be the first one. And we're dealing with all these slings and arrows. But it was great to hear, you know, it's obviously the only black person on the Judiciary Committee. Here's Senator Booker give it. And it was passionate and the realism, right? Because we've been there before. And then to hear him talk to her about how happy he was and proud of her,

warmed my heart. And it's also the reason why we need more black folks on the Judiciary Committee. Absolutely, all right folks, gotta go to break. When we come back, if you wanna understand why black people have stress and hypertension and diabetes, heart disease, when I show y'all the video of my next guest and you see the bullshit that we have to deal with as black people,

what happened to him is a perfect example of what it means to be black in this damn country. You're watching Roller Mark Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. Nå er vi på veien. Kjell Andersen Don't you think it's time to get wealthy? I'm Deborah Owens, America's Wealth Coach, and my new show on the Black Star Network focuses on the things your financial advisor or bank isn't telling you.

So watch Get Wealthy on the Black Star Network. Pull up a chair, take your seat at the Black Table. With me, Dr. Greg Carr, here on the Black Star Network. Every week, we'll take a deeper dive into the world we're living in. Join the conversation only on the Black Star Network. Yo, what's up? This your boy Ice Cube. What's up? I'm Lance Gross, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. Roland Martin Unfiltered right here on the Black Star Network.

Look, we talk a lot about what it means to be black, the BS you gotta deal with, the stuff you gotta go through. Imagine you in the store and you minding your own business and you shopping and a white cop rolls up on you and accuses you of putting stuff in your jacket, and then they come to find out

the person who they looking for, who dispatch told them who to look for, not black, and wearing a totally different color than you. Roll the video. Caucasian male, maybe late 30s. He's wearing a dark green slash gray type colored Carhartt coat, got a red hoodie underneath.

Caucasian male, maybe late 30s. Freeze it right there. No, no, no. Pause the video. Put it back up. Caucasian male, maybe late 30s. He's wearing a dark green slash. Press play.

He's wearing a dark green slash gray type colored Carhartt coat instead of red hoodie underneath. Oh. Hey, boss. Come talk to me. Yeah. How you doing, man? Take your hands out of your pockets for me.

How you doing? I'm doing well until I got stopped. What's up? Yeah, LP called and said that you were concealing some items inside your jacket. Who do I sue? Huh? Who do I sue when you don't find shit? Hey, come get this on film.

Who do I sue? No, we're just trying to figure it out. Like you said, we got a call that LP is calling somebody. Okay, they say he's got a brown jacket on. Okay, jacket's on. I walked in here five minutes after you guys walked in. I saw you walk in. So how could they see me steal some shit? I have no idea. Get this on film, please. That's what, again, that's what we're here just trying to figure out. So what do you want? What do you want me

to do? If you have things concerning your What did they say? A black man did it? No, sir. What did they say? Because I walked in here after you guys. Listen, listen. This isn't tan. Do you have any items in your jacket? Hell yeah, I got items in my jacket.

The items that I walked in here with behind you guys. Okay. Clear one in custody. Y'all see this? This the damn person. Yeah, I'm taking him to the office. Attention all cars, roll over for record. Clear one in custody. Man.

We just take him to the office. Y'all, this took place in Ohio. My next guest is suing the Westchester Police Department for this just unbelievable. You heard him say, who do I sue? Off the top, somebody about to get sued. Eric Lindsey and his lawyer, Fannin Rucker, join us now from Cincinnati, Ohio. Glad to have both of y'all here.

And it's always good to see alpha men in the joint. I appreciate it. So, I... See, Eric, this is what I'm saying. I mean, first of all, y'all, get the video back up. If y'all see, go to the beginning of it. You see Eric's body language. He's like...

This is what his body language... Come back to He was like, this is what his body language, come back to me on one. This is what his body language really is. He first was like, all right, hear that bullshit I'm about to deal with. You saw the whole look up like he didn't come. So Eric, you walked in after them. Yes, I did.

And when you see me standing that way, you know, I had two cops walking toward me in the aisle. They had the aisle blocked off. So when you saw me standing there, my heart's beating fast because I don't know what's about to happen.

There you go. And then when he told me, that's what I'm doing right now. I'm trying to catch my breath. I'm trying to relax. I'm trying to stay composed. And then when he told me, that's what I'm doing right now. I'm trying to catch my breath. I'm trying to relax. I'm trying to stay composed. And then I said, screw this. Who the hell gets sued? Yeah.

I mean, that's the thing that we got to deal with. Elevated stress levels, heart starts racing, all that sort of stuff like that. And that's what it means to be black. And let me remind people, we're talking Ohio. What happened in Ohio? That's where John Crawford III was shot and killed when somebody called the cops and said,

a man was waving a gun in the store and there was a bb gun that they sold at the store and he on the phone and when you hear eric said they blocked off uh the aisle that's the cops when they rolled in on john cropper the third rolled in with guns and boom shot him shot him instantly, and he died. That's our reality, Fannin. Roland, and first of all, thank you so much for having me back. I'm glad to be back here with you. I'm a member of the Cochran firm.

What we see in this is exactly what the principal idea of criminalization of black folks. Black folks going about their daily lives and being assessed or being accused of being criminals for doing nothing that's even criminal at all. We see it so often. And unfortunately, we saw it on this particular occasion with Mr. Lindsey, and something has to be done. Eric, help me out.

What, okay, so after you jammed them up, what happened? Could we say, it was two different body camera videos. One was the two cops roll up on you, and then we saw this other guy get arrested. What happened after just this portion here when you jammed them up? Well, at a certain point, you know,

the two cops are standing together, and then the store manager is standing with them. And I come at the cops pretty hard because if you play back the video, he says I have a brown jacket on, so now he's trying to tailor the description to what I'm wearing. And then he says I have a brown jacket on. So now he's trying to tailor the description to what I'm wearing. And then he says it's a tan jacket. And then he's saying, listen, listen, listen. And I'm saying, what the hell am I listening to? This is not tan. This is orange as fuck.

And so soon, you know, then they get the call that the actual shoplift is on the other side of the store. So they go over there and the one cop stays with me and is apologetic and all this kind of stuff. And then he goes, you know, I understand you feel pretty, pretty, pretty upset. I said, you will never understand how I feel until you get black skin. So then they went on to the other side. And like I said, I really got into him. So I'm saying, well, you know what? I need to go over there and see who they arrested. Because if this guy has similar clothing on, then I owe them guys an apology. And when I got over there and saw that guy right there again, I mean, I lost it again. I just completely lost it because that guy looks absolutely nothing like what I had on.

From the clothing to the skin color. Doesn't look like you. Not the same skin color, all of that. But the crazy thing here, Fannin, the dispatch says, Caucasian man, green. How in the hell do you confuse that to walking in, oh, I see a black person, let me holler at you.

Take your hand out of your pocket. You got anything on you? So, Roland, there's a couple things, and let me just correct you. I don't mean to be rude. Fanon. I'm sorry, my bad, my bad. My bad. My bad. Go ahead. I got you. My bad. But there's some other issues of context here. First of all, you played the dispatch. No, the dispatch record first and dispatch record was clear that there was a shoplifting report that was going on.

No doubt. Criminal activity. police are in their rights to show up. They had a very clear physical description of the person. Now, Mr. Lindsey had no idea about the dispatch report, who was doing anything. He just knew that he was confronted by police officers. If you watch the entirety of the police officer's body cam footage, you see them go past, this is the Friday night at seven o'clock in a suburb of Cincinnati. This place is about 15 miles outside of Cincinnati, not too far from where you mentioned about John Crawford's incident. But as he's walking through the store at seven o'clock in this big box store, seven o'clock on a Friday evening, the officers walk past all kind of folks

wearing all kind of things, and they don't stop, confront, interrogate any of these other individuals. The first and only person these officers confronted and interrogated was what appears to be the only black shopper in the store during that time. So that's part of the context of this thing. Mr. Lindsey had no clue what their report was, when the report came in. Yeah, because he's just shopping. He's thing. Mr. Lindsey had no clue what their report was, when the report came in. Yeah, because he just shopped it.

He shopped it. Now, Eric, okay, now I need to understand. So the manager's standing right there. Did at any point the manager say, uh, we told y'all it was a white dude in a green jacket. What were we talking to the brother for? Did the manager say no? Absolutely not. Absolutely not. And see,

that's the part that really burns me up. Well, the whole thing burns me up. But that dude is a black man. Whoa, wait, wait, wait. The man's a black? Yes, sir. He looks like you and me and Fanon and anybody else with skin color like us. He got me related to that bank teller in Atlanta, Ryan Coogler. I did see that.

Go ahead. Go ahead, Doc. I can't speak to that, but I see where you're going with it. But what I'm saying is when the call came in that they had found that they got the suspect on the other side of the store, that guy told the cops, he's over here, and they just turned and walked away. He never once said, I apologize, brother.

Nothing. Absolutely nothing. He just acted as though he was as white as they were. Like, this could never happen to him. For now, what's the name of this store? Meijer. M-E-I-J-E-R. Meijer. Chain store, locally owned. Meijer is a big box national retailer. So a lot of these grocery stores,

you have different names in different cities and states. So, like, are they, who else are they tied to? Like, what company are they tied to? No, Meijer Incorporated is the national operating store literally across the country. Got it. There are, I mean, it's like, you know, some of the other ones that we know, Walmart,

Walgreens came out. I mean, it's just the same. My understanding is that's what they operate in across the other ones that we know, Walmart, Walgreens came out. I mean, it's just the same. My understanding is that's what they operate in across the country with that same name. So what has been their response? Well, before we filed suit, and this happened in January of last year, before we filed suit, obviously, you know, we engaged the city of Westchester as well as Meyer. They were very nonresponsive and pretty dismissive, even since we filed the lawsuit.

Oh, it's just a brief intrusion. He could have walked away. Let me tell you something. I was a judge for 13 years, and I was a prosecutor for much of my career before I joined the firm. There's something called obstruction of official business. If police officers confront you in the state of Ohio and start asking you questions about an investigation that they're involved in, try to walk away. Try to walk away. They will charge you with an offense that can carry 90 days in jail, and

they'll take you to jail. And can I add something also? We saw this man who they actually were looking for be arrested. We heard later that there was allegations that he had a sharp tool or device on him. This man was, all of this stuff happened. That man was cited, given a ticket and released. He wasn't even taken down to the jail to be processed after all of what he was accused of doing. And I'll just suggest to you that my thought is if he had been black, that would not have been the way his charge and his allegations would have been handled. That's just straight up unbelievable. But it's not because, unfortunately, it is the reality for us in this country. Well, gentlemen, let us know how this moves forward, what happens. I'm sure y'all now have their attention now that this lawsuit has been filed.

And, Eric, have you been back to that store? Have you been back to that store since? No. No, I have no reason to go back there. There's plenty of places, other places that spend my money. So I'd rather go there. But no, you know, you started this whole story by saying that you wonder why black men have or black people have high blood pressure. And I mean, this has taken some time to really get get. The anger, even when I watch the story now, like the local news here did an

in-depth report on it. And even when I watch the video, you know, I can still feel the anger welling up in my chest over this. Because, you know, I'm 61. At the time this happened, I was 60. And I've been through this so many times. Even in a United States military officer uniform, I've still experienced stuff like this. And I'm saying stuff to be kind on your show. And at a certain point, it just gets to the point where it just comes out. And what you saw in that video was me reaching that boiling point, that point where, you know, I just had enough. And so if anyone sees this, by all means, listen, I would hope that they would not react like that

because everybody knows this thing could have ended much differently and a much worse case for me. But at that particular time, what you saw was raw emotions. I did not step back and go, here's this bullshit coming back again, you know, that we always face. I didn't look at that at all. The first thing I was thinking is, you know, what's about to happen to me? And then after that, I just couldn't believe what I was hearing.

Yeah. Totally understand. Well, first of all, thank goodness you're okay. And again, we've seen these situations happen where they go left real quickly. And so thanks for joining us, Eric, Lindsey, Fadon Rucker. Thanks a lot. Thank you so much.

Thank you. I'm going to go to my panel, Recy, Greg, and Larry. And Recy, we're trying to find a video. I think it happened in Houston. It was a black woman. The cops rolled up on her and pointed guns at her. Pointed guns at her. Wrong person.

And the sister was like, and said well you know what this is a learning opportunity for the cops involved go ahead play the video play the video so this is a learning curve for you putting guns to it and it's a person bag that's a learning curve. You put guns to my back. That's a learning curve for you? That's a learning curve? You put guns to my back.

That's a learning curve? I could have died. And that's a fucking learning curve for you? A learning curve? A learning curve? Really? A learning curve. A learning curve? Really? A learning curve. A learning curve? That's a learning curve, bud. They put goods to my back. That's a learning curve? A learning curve? Really? A learning curve? A learning? This is my life.

And you want to talk about your fucking education? A learning curve? Why are you wiping the surveillance video? Ma'am, I can't elaborate on our investigation. Why are you wiping the surveillance video? Watch it. I just heard you say until you finish wiping the surveillance video? Watch it. I just heard you say,

until you finish wiping the surveillance video. Hey, uh, the female that came out of 225 was running a... They had guns in my fucking bag, y'all. I'm not a one-head gun. See, the thing that, Recy, you hear her friend telling her to calm down, but you ain't the one who had guns pointed at you. And so just like Eric Lindsey, he just his attorney said it. This happened

14 months ago and even when he watches that video now it still is triggering and traumatic. That is what these people don't understand when they say, oh man, you got through

it, just walk away. Your ass ain't the one it happened to. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, being in that situation, I think we put so much emphasis on the videos where people behave so well and so respectable and so cool, calm, and collected as though that should be the standard. But the reality is when you're being mistreated, when you're being caught off guard, when you're doing

absolutely nothing wrong and you're being abused, because that's what it is, it's abuse, by the police, it's very hard to keep your cool. I've been in that situation, not with guns, but I've been in a situation where I was doing absolutely nothing wrong. And it went from me having a calm conversation to my hands behind my back being hauled out. And everybody's like, what the fuck happened? You know, and I went absolutely berserk. I went ballistic. I was irate.

And, you know, my friend was saying, calm down, Recy, calm down. You're gonna end up in jail, da, da, da, da. And, you know, but I was just boiling with anger and the danger didn't even sink in in that moment to myself because I was just so aggrieved and just so pissed so I appreciate the energy that Eric Lindsay brought now like you said is that advisable I wouldn't advise my act how I acted but we need to to stop expecting, you know, you know, putting the burden on us to act in this perfect manner to try to just survive these encounters. So I appreciate the friend and

I appreciate her for now that she felt somewhat out of danger confronting them. And, but it's, it's a shame that you have to assert your humanity. And I'm sure Dr. Carr will say, no humans involved. And these people look at us like we're not human, like we're just test dummies, like we're just a little brainless people in the cars to be ran into the wall at their leisure and for their entertainment. So it's typical. It's traumatizing. It's not to be diminished.

But this is the stuff that we have to do. But also to Eric Lindsay's point, sue their asses off. Sue them. Make them uncomfortable. Make them accountable and see what you can get out of it. Because it's unacceptable to continue to have to be abused in this way. You know, Larry, you know, I talk about this and I say this to people. We talk about the reality of what it means to be black in this country. And it is a constant state of harassment. What I always tell people is, especially when I'm having this conversation,

I love when white folks try to tell me there's no such thing as white privilege. I said, part of the problem with that phrase is that when we hear privilege, we think rich. And my response always is, how does it feel to be white and to walk around knowing you're not going to get followed, knowing you're not going to get pulled over because you're white. I said, think about that. How does that feel? The reality is we have to, every day, we literally have to wake up, put our clothes on,

and then go, okay, what am I wearing? Do I got all my stuff? Do my wallet, my license? Do I have this, my insurance? If I get stopped, am I going to have this whole deal? Are my tags in order? Okay, okay, well, damn, hold up. Is my car full of gas?

Because if it gets stopped on the wrong damn road, I'm going to get... I mean, we literally got to go through a 48-point checklist. All because we black knowing full well the bullshit we're going to have to deal with when we walk out of the house. You know what, Roland? What Brother Lindsey was experiencing was race-based trauma, right?

So he's reliving that experience. And we're all reliving those experiences, and we're constantly bombarded with these videos every day. You know, as a Black man and as a father of a 19-year-old, when I see videos like this, it upsets me to a level I don't think most people who are not Black can understand or experience. The other thing I want to note is

that when it comes to people not seeing our humanity, right, that Black people in our society are not valued and you just don't see us, right? And for Brother Lindsey, this, as you said, Roland, it could have went left really quick. Yeah. And he could have been another hashtag.

And I don't think people who are not Black don't understand. The other thing you should have added to your list is had a business card or phone number to an attorney, right? Every time I get in my car, I need to know where exactly my driver's license is because you never know when you get stopped. And I tell folks all the time that I don't always walk around with a bow tie on. And if I did, I'm still going to get stopped. And I know that, right? So we have to really talk to people. When we talk to people, explain to them what it's like in terms of dealing with anti-Blackness in our society, because we're talking about anti-Blackness. It is the 24-7, 365. And you talked about it earlier, Roland, in terms of the stress,

the high blood pressure, all the other diseases associated with stresses like that, we deal with race-based trauma. And for folks that look like us, this is what our lives are. And it's tiring. And so when you see Brother Lindsey's response, and Rishi talked about heart response, it is this, you're exasperated, right, because you're tired. You know, I'm tired of dealing with this every single day. Everywhere you go, your blackness is being magnified a thousand times over compared to other folks who just who are doing actually doing something wrong. And they just kind of walk by while the cops are harassing you. And look, we got to put an end to this because we're losing too many black lives because folks

want to criminalize black folks and don't see our humanity. And Greg, this is why some people criticize, I've had some people criticizing me, some white folks, you got this segment called crazy as white people. Yes, because I'm exposing individuals

who call the cops on black people for selling lemonade. who call the cops on black people for selling lemonade, who call the cops on black people for delivering packages, knowing full well that black people are on the end result of getting shot or beaten by cops. And yes, our reaction can't even be the reaction that white folks get. White folks. I remember the video we show of the white guy who got indignant with the cops. He said, now you ain't stopping me, and drove his ass off.

Yeah, we got examples of a black person driving off, and they pumped fitted bullets into the car, and they said, oh, you were fleeing the cops. I mean, this is what, this is why we talk about these things. And this is why I ain't got no problem when one of these racist white folks lose their job because of what they have done to too many of us, because it literally is life or death with us when the cops come. And these cops, they want the dispatch said, Caucasian man in his 30s in a green jacket. This was a 60-year-old black man in an orange jacket. Absolutely.

It was, Roland. I mean, I don't have a good answer. I agree with you, Dr. Walker. You know, this stress, the impact of stress, as you said, as Rishi said, as you said, Roland, and I forget where I heard this first. Maybe our colleague Jules Harrell, who was a psychologist at Howard University, long-time Jigna of ours. You know, every time you get seized with that panic moment,

it could be if you're driving and you see the lights, the cop lights go up in the rear view mirror. That constriction of your heart takes a few seconds off the end of your life. Now multiply that by a lifetime. And I forget whether it was Ralph Ellison or James Baldwin that said from birth to death, there's something very personal about being personable,

very personal rather about being Black in America, from birth to death. And, you know, thinking, just reflecting again on Judge, soon-to-be Justice, Ketanji Brown Jackson. Every time Ketanji Brown Jackson answered a question from one of those racists, that smarmy-ass Ted Cruz, that chinless Tom Cotton, that punk Josh Hawley. She could not do what their fellow white man, Brett Kavanaugh, did, who feels like he was born with an entitlement to sit on the Supreme Court. So he starts snotting and crying and yelling. If she had even breathed in that direction. But the thing that ties these two things together in my mind right now is that every time they, the more ridiculous they got, you watched her, and a couple of times,

especially with that punk Josh Hawley, who's a purebred punk, she went like this. Thank you, Senator. All of that feeling that we saw in that brother a second ago, that was Judge Brown Jackson as well. And finally, you know, you could see Brother Lindsey clenching as you were interviewing him. We've all felt that. Yeah. We all felt that we've all felt that and in that video there was a look on his face not of surprise as much

as resignation and a bit of sorrow he had a mask on but we could all see in his eyes and the other thing I'll say is I'm going to give this brother kudos for this brother Lindsey brother Lindsey put on a clinic which shows you how prepared he was because he didn't

have time to think. Anytime these damn patarolas stop you, he showed you the three things you should say first. Number one, as you said, who do I sue? Number two, get this on film. And number three,

what do you want me to do? I promise you man, if that was on a card uh look can you saw for me uh who do i sue get this on film what do you want me to do boom boom boom back them up that that's why that video went by you about to lose your job you about to lose your job that's what it's all about y'all hold tight one second. I got to go to break. We come back. We're going to tell you about it again. Brother in a car in New Jersey.

Get stopped. Reaching for a T. What did Larry just say about reaching for your driver's license? That brother is now paralyzed because he got shot four times. We'll talk with his legal team next. You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered on The Black Spot. I'm sorry. Hi, I'm Dr. Jackie Hood-Martin, and I have a question for you. Ever feel as if your life is teetering and the weight and pressure of the world is consistently on your shoulders? Let me tell you, living a balanced life isn't easy.

Join me each Tuesday on Black Star Network for Balanced Life with Dr. Jackie. We'll laugh together, cry together, pull ourselves together, and cheer each other on. So join me for new shows each Tuesday on Black Star Network, A Balanced Life with Dr. Jackie. Hi, I'm Eldie Botch. Hey, yo, peace world.

What's going on? It's the love king of R&B, Raheem Devon, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. All right, let's go. All right, folks. We mentioned this story just the other day. I want to talk about it right now. And that is, of course, brother. It happened in New Jersey, y'all.

Man who is now paralyzed with a chest down. He was shot by plainclothes officers in front of his own home. Last month, Jawan Henderson was ambushed by the officers and shot four times while he was reaching into his vehicle. He's paralyzed and facing resisting arrest and obstruction charges. His attorney, Greg Zeff of the Zeff Law Firm, joins us now from Mount Laurel, New Jersey. Glad to have you on the show, Greg. Thank you, Roland. Glad to be here.

Okay, so first of all, why were the plainclothes officers going to his home? They weren't going to his home. We don't know. They won't tell us what they were doing there. But I can tell you, Roland, that just this afternoon, for the first time, I was allowed to view body cameras.

They should be released tomorrow to the public, but it's awful. It's worse than you described it, actually. Okay, wait a minute. I'm confused here. Yeah. Jawan's at home.

Yes. Is he outside? What is he doing outside? Jawan is visiting his child and the mother of his child. There's an iced tea that's left outside in the mother's car. He goes outside, gets in the vehicle to retrieve the tea when three or four plain clothes officers, all dressed in black, approach the vehicle and shine lights on it and demand his identification. Wait, wait, wait, hold up, hold up. Yep. Give me, soso...so Juwan comes outside, and he's going to the car, and he's reaching into the car.

Nope. He gets in the car and closes the door. He gets in the car and closes the door. Yep. All of a sudden...was this daytime or nighttime? Middle of the night, midnight. Okay. So all of a sudden...

Blackout. nighttime? Middle of the night, midnight. Okay. So all of a sudden, three or four people roll up with flashlights demanding his identification. So no flashing lights? No flashing lights. Nothing? Just out of the blue? Yes. Okay. Now what happens next? What happens next is you see his hands, which I think is very important. He's got a cell phone in one hand. He calls for help. Right, because it's midnight, and three or four folks rolling up with flashlights wearing black,

he don't know who the hell they are. He's terrified. He's terrified. On the video, first of all, does the video they are? He's terrified. He's terrified. On the video, do you, first of all, does the video have audio? Yes. Do you hear them say, we're police? Do they identify themselves? In fact, they do identify themselves at some point. And you know when they identify themselves? When he says, I'm going to call the cops. Hold on. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

So they walk up. Flashlights. Need to see your ID. He says, I'm going to call the cops. He rose the window down a little bit. They say, I need to see your ID. He rose the window back up. bit. They say, I need to see your ID. He rose the window back up. They see him rummaging around. They tell him to stop rummaging around.

They say, we're going to break the window if you don't give us the ID and get out of the car. And he says, I'm going to call the cops. We are cops. I know you're cops. I need a lawyer. I need a lawyer. I need a lawyer, he says. You have no probable cause to do this. Okay, hold on.

It's three or four. Are these cops white? Are they black? There is one person of color that is a police officer and two white officers. Okay, hold up. Okay, let me... Three cops roll up. It's midnight. Ju. Hold up. All right. So let me, let me, let me, okay. Let me. Yep.

Three cops roll up. It's midnight. Juwan's sitting in his car. He's going to get the iced tea. All of a sudden three folks walk up, two white guys and a person of color, flashlights, dressed all in black says to him, yo, need to see your ID. He's, or who the hell are these people, roll the windows up. They didn't say we're going to break the window. He says, yo, I'm going to call the cops. They say, we the cops. And they're not acting like people that are there to serve and protect, are they?

Okay. So then what happens after they say, hey, we are the cops? What happens next? He asks to call a lawyer. And he asks them why they're stopping him. And all they keep saying is, roll the window down, get out of the car, or we're going to break the window. You can't break this window. You can't break this window. You can't do that. That's not what police officers do. And so my client is frozen with fear, terrified, and they break the window. Now, this is a four-door car rolling okay which window do they choose to break they break the driver's window where my client is sitting there as the glass flies in and he screams and he raises his

hands again and i want to make it clear they see his hands he has no weapons he never had a weapon don't know why they stopped him in the first place. And from the five minutes when the body cameras go on, first minute from the body camera goes on to the fifth minute when they shoot him, there's almost nothing done to de-escalate the situation. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. They shoot him. Five minutes after they roll up, they shoot him? They shoot him. Five minutes after they roll up, they shoot him?

They shoot him. They break his window. And once they break his window, he turns the car on and tries to get out of there. And as you said earlier, the white guy who drives away, nothing happens to. When he tries to back up and get out of there, again, no police were in any danger of being hit by him. One of the white officers shoots him in the neck. Did, okay.

Have they stated at any point why they approached him at the house? No, nor will they. Because the investigation is ongoing. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold up. I'm, I'm, okay, no, no, no. I'm, I'm, I'm terribly confused right now.

You should be. You should be. You should be terribly confused. They have charged this man. They've hit him with charges. Oh, yeah. But they haven't said to you or to him why they were there in the first place? No, they haven't. There has been one leak, though, Roland.

One reporter has indicated that maybe, just maybe, the car was illegally parked. Don't know if that's a fact. Don't know why they stopped him. But somebody has told a reporter that. Okay.

Don't you find it strange that, first of all, when did this happen? This happened February 14th, February 12th. I'm sorry. So it's been 40 days and in 40 days, no one can say why they initiated the action against joan you are correct attorney general guidelines also say that the video is supposed to be released in 20 days and when you see this video and i hope to have it for us today but it hasn't been released when you see this video, and I hope to have it for us today, but it hasn't been released. When you see this video, you're going to be asking the same questions

you are right now and shaking your head further. This literally sounds eerily similar to the story we covered in Houston, Texas, where a young man, college graduate, two degrees, was accused of theft by a known felon. The cops didn't even, they got, called a guy, they said, hey, he said, look, I'll turn myself in. They sent a group of cops to the house, rolled up, planes closed, car, roll up on this dude. They start shooting out the window. Same thing. No identification, no lights.

That was actually in broad daylight. It wasn't at midnight. I mean, first of all, if Juwan, let's just be clear, if Juwan had a gun and if he was actually lawfully carrying a gun and somebody just rolls up on him out

of the blue, your natural reaction is to shoot somebody who never identifies themselves, you know, who the hell it is, it's midnight, and they're telling you to do something. Larry, you got a question? Yeah, you talked about them releasing the video, So is it, you assume that they're going to release it tomorrow? Is that clear in terms, and talk about the state law in terms of releasing the video if you can for a second. Sure. This has been an unusual case. I am the NAACP legal redress chair in New Jersey. And with the help of Richard Smith and Todd Edwards and many others, there was a law passed in New Jersey that all police shootings are to be handled by

prosecutors outside of the jurisdiction that it happened in. And so this case, which happened in Trenton, was transferred to another county for investigation. That investigation didn't begin for five or six days. And the attorney general guidelines say that within 20 days, the video itself should be turned over to the public. It's been 40. I, because I am the lawyer, was allowed to view the video today. I've been told it's going to be released sometime this evening or tomorrow. That doesn't mean it's going to happen, but that's what I've been told. I expect it to be released to the public then, but we shall see. It's not a law that it must be released in 20 days, but it is the guideline. That is, it shouldn't take more than 20 days for an investigation to be

completed in a shooting. And it shouldn't take more than 20 days to be able to look at the video and say, all right, the public has a right to see this. We're still waiting. I'm pleased to say I saw it today. I'm pleased to say that Juwan acted as I expected him to act, as he's told us truthfully. And I'm pleased to say, and just mortified actually, to say that he was asking for help. He asked to call the police on the police. And instead of de-escalating the situation, the police broke his window and tried to pull him out. Instead of saying, wait a minute, he's confused. He wants to call the police. He wants to call a lawyer. Let's talk to him a little bit longer. Let's explain what's going on here. There was nobody in danger. There were no weapons involved. Why are you rushing to judgment and execution? Why are you doing that? And Roland, you mentioned something else. They shot at a

moving car. We've known since the 70s, police have been told, don't shoot at a moving car unless that car is shooting at you. That there's nothing good that can come from shooting at a moving car. They shot at a moving car as well. I, I, Resea, Greg, any questions? Yeah, I have a question. You know, did you get any indication as to what even unit these plainclothes officers were for?

Are they detectives? Are they narcotics? Yeah. And then the other question I have is, do you get the sense or do you have any concern that they might be fishing for something to charge your client with beyond, obviously, the absurd charges of resisting arrest? Because the secrecy behind their intent from the beginning and the presence of plainclothes officers just seems suspicious to me. Yeah, two questions. There is something in New Jersey called the Jump Out Boys. They're well known. It's in many jurisdictions. It's in the major cities in New Jersey for the

most part. What they are is usually some type of elite squad. They're dressed in black, unmarked vehicles, and they go into, quote, high crime areas. And I use that in quotes. And they're known in the community to jump out and arrest, jump out and tackle. And it's a shame, you know, when police officers in a community, people used to give them a glass of lemonade and say hello and know their names and they'd know your name. But in black communities, when the jump out boy vehicle is driving by, dark, unmarked vehicle, most people know what it looks like. Grandmothers tell their grandchildren to run into the house. I suspect this was a crime unit prevention group, all detectives. That much I know. Their names have not been released. Don't know exactly who they are. And as to your other part of your question,

Jawan was charged with the holy triad of charges that every person I've ever been involved with that's involved in a police brutality case is charged with aggravated assault against a police officer obstruction of justice in resisting arrest and because he lived I get to tell you about this yeah the average case where someone's ankle is broken or their nose is smashed in and they get all three of these charges, you don't get to hear about it. But before I can come in and sue the police, someone has to come in and defend someone. And it's pretty intimidating to sue the police in the first place. It's a lot more intimidating when you're facing aggravated assault, resisting arrest and obstruction of justice, which carry years of sentences.

So for the average person who had their nose broken by the police or the average person who had their arm broken by the police and is now facing all of these charges, the last thing on their mind is getting justice and suing civilly. The only thing on their mind, and rightfully so, is their freedom. So these charges are always intimidating, but they're not intimidating here because we have a video. Crazy. Great. Do you have a question? If not, I'm going to break and go to the next story. Well, no, just right quick. Thank you, Roland. And yeah, the D.C. well knows the Jump Out Boys counselor. Yeah, they well known. They dress like people in the hood. They roll up on you and you think it's somebody from the hood if you're not paying attention.

But I want to ask you about the civil complaint. I read the complaint and the fifth and sixth counts that you're asking for involve the New Jersey Civil Rights Act and the New Jersey law against racial and gender discrimination. How important are those as potential tools at the state level to try to get at some of this, since it seems like federal protections are damn near non-existent these days? Doctor, that's a great question. The reality is that the Jersey legislature does better than most states. Jersey law is better for discrimination Discrimination, is one of the strongest in the country. And the Civil Rights Act in New Jersey, while it parallels federal law, is still pretty good. So the answer is those are fantastic tools for lawyers in New Jersey that every state should copy, especially the NJLAD, which is one of the finest in the country.

Unbelievable. Real quick, Juwan is paralyzed. Is it neck down or is it waist up? From the chest. Chest down. Still getting better. He's still getting better every day. How old is he?

He's 29. 29. How many kids? He's got two. Man. Jeff, keep us He's got two. Man. Jeff, keep us updated on this case, please. I sure will. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate it. Thank you very much.

We look forward to seeing that video. Folks, real quick break. But man, when I tell y'all what these Republicans did in Georgia, we told y'all about stealing elections. We told y'all, what these Republicans did in Georgia? We told y'all about stealing elections. We told y'all. How?

They're trying to do this. Wait until you listen to this next reporter about what they did that can literally lead to stealing elections and freezing you out and making it where your vote doesn't matter. That's next on Roller Mountain Unfiltered. ДИНАМИЧНАЯ МУЗЫКА Nettopp I'm Chrisette Michelle. Hi, I'm Chaley Rose, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. All right, y'all, put this in the category of are you out of your day of mind?

In Georgia, judges who are at risk of losing an election can literally say they are resigning many months from now, which cancels the election, but also cancels any challengers chance of beating them. then the governor can turn right around and appoint who they want to the bench. Daniel Lachanian, editor-in-chief of Votes, joins us right now. We saw this story, and he wrote this article called Dystopian Loophole for Georgia Judicial Elections. It gives Brian Kemp the last laugh. Y'all, he jokes from D.C. I, Daniel, I have never, ever in my life heard of anything like this ever.

Explain. Well, it is a pretty shocking situation in Georgia. It's a bit complicated, but the bottom line, you know, in Georgia, uh, it's a bit complicated, but the bottom line... You know, in Georgia, Supreme Court justices are elected, and, um, unlike U.S. Supreme Court justices, for six-year terms. But there's this bizarre loophole, bizarre rule,

that says that if a judge resigns within six months of the election, the election is canceled, the governor gets to appoint someone, and that election then happens two years later. Now, that's bad enough. And historically, it has been abused by incumbents who want to game the system, resign just before an election, effectively canceling the election, which is bizarre enough. But then in 2020, Republicans really escalated this because there was a prominent Democrat who was running for Supreme Court in Georgia, and the justice announced he was resigning six months later, since six months after the election,

and the governor and secretary of state said, OK, the election is canceled. And the Democrats sued to take this, to force the election to happen and lost the case in the state Supreme Court that he was trying to join. And now it just happened again, actually, a couple of months ago with the chief justice announcing he was going to resign in the fall. And that being enough to cancel the election that is supposed to happen in May. And, you know, this is concerning, obviously, for a whole host of reasons, but exactly as you said, it makes it very hard for anyone to run because you could be running, for instance, as an outsider who wants to change the system.

You could be running, be ahead, be about to win, and then suddenly the election is canceled, the rug is pulled from under your feet, and you have nothing to run for anymore. Okay, so let me unpack this again. All right, so first of all, I'm familiar with running for state Supreme Court. It's the same way in Texas. How many Supreme Court justices are there in Georgia? There are nine Supreme Court justices in Georgia. Okay, so there are nine Supreme Court justices. Republicans hold what?

Nine-zero edge? It's technically a nonpartisan court, but Republican governors have appointed eight of the nine justices republican judges have appointed eight of the nine okay got it so let's say let's say somebody's running and let's just say they're progressive. And let's say the polls are showing that progressive is beating that incumbent Republican.

So six months before the election, the incumbent judge can announce, I'm quitting. I'm resigning. before the election, the incumbent judge can announce, I'm quitting, I'm resigning. And then if he or she does that, that means that there's no election and then the governor gets to appoint somebody to sit in there for another two years, and essentially they become the incumbent?

So, yes, but it's also worse than that. So what you said can absolutely happen. But what happened in 2020 is that in the conditions you described where an incumbent judge was facing a prominent Democrat, a former member of Congress was running against them, that judge in a May election, a June election, that judge said, I'm going to resign in November. I'm going to resign five months after the election was supposed to be held. And that was enough, and the governor canceled the election. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, right there.

Which means that, okay, hold up. Which means that, okay, so A judge can say in June, I'm going to resign in November. But the election's in November. The election's in June in this case. But the election was in June. The judge announced they were going to resign in November, and the June election was canceled. So they can guarantee, frankly, that there never will be elections if they play this game. That's right. And what is remarkable is that, you know, the fact that there are eight of nine who have been originally appointed rather than elected shows this has already been happening constantly. But now we know what's really what's really crazy. And it's just hard to resign, and technically nothing even really prevents you from then taking that back

once the election that was cancelled has passed. So when there was a legal case around this in 2020 and the state Supreme Court allowed this to happen, but the two justices who were in dissent said, wait a minute, wait a minute, the person who says they're going to resign in the future could then take that back. And then the election has been canceled, and they're still in office. The system is just so perverse, and the consequences are so illogical that it becomes

a little hard to just spell it out. But you're absolutely right that the end game, the logic, is to create a perpetual cycle. The people who hold office are in a position to be able to control their departure, to be able to control whether or not there's an election for their seat and who appoints them. And that allows this continual cycle of being able to hold on to power. You know, it's really the same thing with gerrymandering, right? The people who have power get to make up the rules of how they themselves are going to be reelected. So the state Supreme Court ruler is, how in the hell has this not gone to federal court? I mean, I mean, this is I mean, I'm just trying to understand how any real court would say, sure, screw the voters.

This is legal. Well, not only that, but the chief justice wrote that opinion in 2020. And then that chief justice was up for reelection in May, this May, on May 24th. And he just announced in February that he was going to resign in the summer or the fall. So his May election was canceled. And Governor Brian Kemp is gonna get to appoint the new justice that is gonna replace that person for two more years. So again, the very judge who wrote that opinion then used the same maneuver now

to cancel his own election. I... Wow. Go ahead. Before I go to my questions, finish your point. You know, there's two different problems. There's the problem of elections being canceled, right, which we're discussing. But then there's a problem that even when elections aren't canceled, it's very hard for anyone to run. Because I talked to multiple people in Georgia who have run tried, or know no people, and they said,

you know, like, it takes a lot of work to run for office. You have to take time away from your job. You have to convince your family. You need to spend pretty much all day trying to raise money. You need to be on the road all day for a month. Like, taking that... taking all of that without being sure that the election is going to happen, because the incumbent could just try and play this trick on you, is a lot. It's a big ask. It's very hard for

people to do that. So someone, actually the candidate named John Barrow, who I was just saying tried running in 2020, told me it feels like a gamble to run for office, because you're gambling that they're not going to play this trick on you. You're gambling that if you're ahead, or if you feel like you're going to win, they're not going to suddenly take, you know, they're not going to suddenly pull the rug under you. And that's a big ask, so that both cancels elections, and even when they're not canceled, it keeps other people away from running. Greg Carr, I've heard some crazy-ass things. I have

never heard anything like this. Hmm. Yes, you have, Roland. You talk about it all the time. It's called the period after the end of Reconstruction. This is what they're doing. And I, for one, sometimes people will say to me, why you seem so happy?

I'm very much encouraged by this. They're going to destroy their country. And because the only way this stuff is going to be fixed is that it's going to have to collapse. And that's why. And so, no, you've talked about this, Roland. This is the type of corruption that ultimately, although it took decades, led to the freedom movement of the 20th century, the so-called civil rights movement.

When you have taken away everyone's opportunity to do anything other than fight, they will fight. And I guess what I'd like to ask our guest, Brother Nakania, you know, and reading the article, reading your article, seeing that there was a former judge who then went in the damn legislature and weakened oversight because he himself had been investigated by a judge. This reads like it's the 1890s, 1900s, 1910s.

My question is a kind of global question in this sense. How much longer will there be legitimacy of the courts in the state of Georgia if this is not only allowed to stand, but becomes pretty much not only standard practice, but the way they do politics? I mean, how long before people just decide the courts are illegitimate in your mind? I mean, this really gets to what you're getting at is just the sheer number of things that are happening at the same time, right? And we will I know you were just on the show earlier. You were all speaking about the Supreme Court nomination, the confirmation hearings this week. And we all are watching the U.S.

Supreme Court and the confirmation hearings. But under, if you look under the federal court system, which already has a lot of, we could say a lot of things about it, right? Under that, there's all these state court system and local court systems that are under watch, that are full of shenanigans like this, or just plain anti-democratic poise. As you just said, there was an oversight commission in Georgia, an oversight commission that was charged with overseeing judges, reviewing ethical complaints.

And there was indeed a judge who was investigated by the commission, I believe, for harassment allegations, and then joined the legislature, convinced, and then an amendment was passed, inspired by him, to gut, to weaken the Oversight Commission. So now there is no longer, I mean, there is still an Oversight Commission, but it's no longer independent. But that plus what I'm describing at the Supreme Court, plus the fact that voting rights are being weakened in Georgia, especially in a lot of counties with a lot of Black voters. The county commissions, as we speak, in Georgia are being changed by Republicans in a lot of counties, taking away some black

officials from county-level seats of power. Obviously, the Supreme Court, the court system has supposedly should be overseeing the election law. The Supreme Court technically has jurisdiction over election laws in Georgia. But, you know, all of these things are happening at the same time. And the weakening of democracy at one level is connected to the weakening of democracy, you know, at the other levels. And the whole oversight system is evaporating. Larry? Yeah, so first of all, kudos for writing this story because this is critically important. But I want to know, a question I have is, what is the reaction for people in the state

of Georgia who may not even know this is happening? What has been the response at the state and local level on your story? The problem with state Supreme Courts and judicial politics is that it's so invisible. And that's a major reason why this kind of stuff happens so routinely. I mean, 2020 is the same year that Joe Biden won, that Senators Warnock and Ossoff won in Georgia. It was a year of so much and so much other wins by Democrats in Georgia. And this all happened, you know, in the midst of all that. And obviously, it didn't create much outrage. And, you know, there was some coverage of it in local news in Georgia at the time.

The fact that it just happened again in 2022 i uh has has barely been covered i i was trying to cover something else while suddenly realizing that this is happening again um and um so the worry i guess is that you know it's hard to pay attention to this and it's hard to care it just seems so like it seems so technical. Like another reason it's technical is that technically the judges are nonpartisan. I mean, obviously, the Republican governor is like doing all this to keep power on people he can appoint. But it's harder to get visibility on this. So I haven't seen I haven't seen that much. But, you know, there's a governor's race in 2022.

If the governor's race flips, it would change already the politics around some of this, but it's a tough road in part because of the voting rights issues that we were just discussing. Racy? Yeah, I don't have a question so much as a comment. First of all, thank you for this story and for shining light on it. This shows how Republicans use power, and they subvert democracy to maintain that power. As you said, with this election coming up, this could be an election that probably almost, if you bring more attention to it, or if it becomes a gubernatorial issue, might even energize Republicans, because they tend to vote based on the judicial branch much more than Democrats do.

So I just wanted to say more so to the viewers out there, these are the kinds of things that we have to understand. Republicans leave no stone unturned. There's no lever that they're not willing to pull to maintain their power. And we do way too much pouting and taking our ball and going home as opposed to really mounting a forceful defense. Part of that defense is being on offense and informing people and understanding what's at stake with these elections. So, again, thank you for bringing attention to this. This is, again, unbelievable. Daniel, a great story.

Hopefully there are some folks who are going to sue, who are going to try to get this changed. This is just, I can't believe it hasn't been declared unconstitutional. It is indeed an election scheme and it defrauds the voters, their opportunity to actually pick their own representatives. So Daniel, we appreciate it. Thank you so very much.

Thank you for having me. All right. Thank you so very much. All right, folks, let's get in our black and missing for the day before we leave. Kalani Hillman disappeared on March 16th from Lutz, Florida. The 15-year-old is 5 feet 4 inches tall, weighs 140 pounds with black hair and brown eyes. Anyone with information about Kalani Hillman,

please call the Hillsborough County, Florida Sheriff's Office at 813-247-8200, 813-247-8200. And real quick, the U.S. Department of Justice has filed a lawsuit against Galveston, Texas, to challenge the county's current redistricting plans. The county adopted the plan on November 12, 2021, after the release of the data for the 2020 census. Kristen Clark, the Assistant Attorney General for the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division, says the action is the latest demonstration of the DOJ's commitment to protecting the voting rights of all Americans, particularly during the current redistricting cycle.

And so the battle there certainly continues. And so we're going to keep you abreast of all of these changes that are actually happening around the country as well. It continues. Folks, also five Pittsburgh police officers will be fired following an internal investigation to the death of a man who was shot with a stun gun multiple times by police. 54-year-old Jim Rogers died a day after police used a stun gun on him. Rogers was suspected of stealing a bicycle. Pittsburgh Mayor Ed Gainey says he hopes the decision will be the first step towards repairing a broken system there in Pittsburgh.

The deaths of Jim Rogers is a stark reminder about the work we have in front of us to make our city the safest city in America. We will begin the process. We started dialogue about violence in the city last night and today sets us on the pathway to continue to improve police community relations. We need to all work together to honor the life and legacy of Jim Rogers, to create a healthier, safer, and equitable city for us all. And I hope today is an important step forward in showing that we can begin to build the police community relations that we want to have for our city. And so that's what's taking us a minute to be able to talk about it.

We wanted to respect the process because we understand how sensitive this is. And we will not do nothing nor answer any questions that jeopardizes that process. We are here today because the public safety director has concluded and we wanted to share our findings. Pittsburgh Public Safety Director Lee Schmidt did not release the names of the officers

or details of the investigation. I don't understand why we keep sitting here protecting these cops. I'm sorry, if you're going to fire them, release their names. You release any other city worker's name. All right, y'all, that's it for us today. Larry, Reesey, Greg,

I certainly appreciate y'all joining us today on the panel. Great conversation. Thank you so very much. It, man, some of the stories we did today, crazy, crazy. But we appreciate the commentary. And folks, don't forget, please support us in what we do. You know, it's a whole bunch of people out here calling

themselves New Black Media. They love talking about what they're covering. But if y'all notice, they don't actually cover anything. They bump their gums. That's what they do. You never see them out there on the scene. You never see them talking to real people. You never see them actually advocating.

You never see them having guests bringing the light to these stories and shining a light because all they do is run their mouths. See, we don't waste our time with that. We do real news. So y'all can call us old. You can call us new. You can call us used. You can call us whatever you want to. But there's a difference between people who are journalists, who cover the news that we matter, and other people who are YouTube wannabe revolutionaries. So you support what we do, and that's the most important thing,

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PO Box 57196. Washington, D.C., 20037. Cash App is dollar sign RM Unfiltered. PayPal is RM Unfiltered. Venmo is RM Unfiltered. Zelle is Roland at RolandSMartin.com. Roland at RolandMartinUnfiltered.com. So thank you so very much, folks.

I'm going to see you guys tomorrow. A lot of things happening. We're going to continue covering what happens with Supreme Court Justice nominee Judge Katonji Brown-Jackson. Some other stories that we're covering, giving you updates. And we're also trying to schedule Dr. Kimberly Crenshaw. I want to have a conversation with her for a full hour about critical race theory because you saw with the hearings what they're doing.

There's a whole rationale behind what they're doing, and that's why we're going to keep the focus and give you, again, the news and information that you need. That's the most important thing. We don't waste time, y'all, with the trolls. There's a whole bunch of people, like somebody out there talking about it. Oh, by God, y'all irrelevant. OK, boo, you can move on with your 38 followers. What we're going to do is keep on sitting here covering

the stuff that matters to our people. So I'm going to see you guys tomorrow. Y'all take care. Ho! Today's her 23rd birthday. Is that her 23rd birthday? Right, today's her 23rd birthday. Another niece, Anna, her birthday is coming up., today's her 23rd birthday. Another needs Anna.

Her birthday is coming up. So I got to get a whole bunch in March. So shout out to Mikayla on her birthday. I'm out. Holla!