#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Chris Christie decoded; Hospital staff quits over vax mandate; Art teacher says OK to use N-word

Episode Date: September 14, 2021

9.13.21 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Roland deconstructs Chris Christie; Parole board votes to commute Julius Jones death sentence; NO babies to be delivered after hospital staff quit over vax mandate; GA art teacher says OK to use N-word; Rayshard Brooks' family sues the City of Atlanta and the two cops involved in his death; Missouri state rep. suggests the nation should remove the statue of President Abraham Lincoln at the Lincoln Memorial; Lawsuit filed to the remove of a controversial Confederate monument in Alabama; Archbishop Carl Bean has died; #FitLiveWin: Surgery or exercise?#RolandMartinUnfiltered partner: CEEKCEEK is a streaming platform for virtual events and Virtual Reality experiences featuring the biggest names in music, sports, and entertainment from around the globe. Check out the VR headsets and 4d headphones. Visit http://www.ceek.com and use the discount code RMVIP21Support #RolandMartinUnfiltered via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered or via PayPal ☛ https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfiltered#RolandMartinUnfiltered is a news reporting platform covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Today is Monday, September 13th, 2021. Coming up, a Roland Martin unfiltered breaking news out of Oklahoma. Well, the partner parole board recommends commutation for death row inmate Julius Jones. Now it's up to Oklahoma Governor Kevin Stitt if Jones will be sentenced to something other than death. We'll talk with folks who've been fighting for his commutation. Many of you saw my appearance yesterday on ABC's This Week with George Stephanopoulos, where I challenge former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie on the role that he played in Donald Trump coming to power. Well, we're gonna dig deeper today and show you some of that speech

that Chris Christie gave at the Reagan Library. Many praised him for his forward-looking comments regarding the Republican Party, but no, I'm not done with Christie and why he and others need to apologize and be held accountable for their actions in supporting Donald Trump for the past four years. We'll also talk on the show with former Congressman Joe Walsh, a former Donald Trump supporter, acolyte, who now says every Republican who supported Trump should be apologizing for what they did.

You do not want to miss this Chris Christie deconstruction. Rayshard Brooks was shot and killed in a Wendy's parking lot by a white Atlanta police officer on June 20. In June 2020, now his widow is suing the city of Atlanta for the two cops involved. A Georgia art teacher is caught on video asking her students when it would be appropriate for her to say the N-word. Now parents want her canned.

In North Carolina, Governor Roy Cooper vetoes the anti-critical race theory bill initiated by Republicans in that state. And we'll talk with fitness expert Jim Jones about the best way to sculpt your body. Traditional diet, exercise, or surgery the option for you. It is time to bring the funk on Rolling Mark and Unfiltered. Let's go.

He's got it. Whatever the mess, he's on it. Whatever it is, he's got the scoop, the fact, the fine. And when it breaks, he's right on time. And it's rolling, best belief he's knowing. Putting it down from sports to news to politics. With entertainment just for kicks, he's rolling. It's Uncle Roro, y'all.

Yeah, yeah. It's Rolling Martin, yeah It's Uncle Roro, yo Yeah, yeah It's Rollin' Marten Yeah, yeah Rollin' with Rollin' now Yeah, yeah He's broke, he's fresh, he's real the best You know he's Rollin' Marten now Martell! Martell!

Breaking news out of Oklahoma. Where? The death penalty case with Julius Jones is now in the hands of Governor Kevin Stitt. Today, the Oklahoma Partner and Paroles Board recommended Jones' sentence be commuted. The board voted 3-1, with the fifth member recusing himself in favor of Jones' commutation. This is a story that has gotten lots of attention over the last several weeks as he was nearing an execution date. Joining us now is Reverend CeCe Jones-Davis, Justice for Julius Campaign Director, and Julius' sister, Antoinette.

Glad to have both of you on the show. First and foremost, y'all were there in the room. Take us through exactly what happened as the board discussed this. How long were they there? How much time was actually

spent discussing this commutation? So, it started with the Howe family and every party had up to 20 minutes and then after the 20 minutes was up then the partner parole board would ask questions and so there was no time limit on the questions asked. So after the Howe family, then the state presented their case for 20 minutes. And then after the state presented their case, there were a few questions asked by the Pardon and Parole Board. And then there was Julius's defense team. And after that, there were questions

asked. And then after that, they took a 15-minute break. And then they came back, and they brought down the rules of how things were going to go, how the victim's family, after the votes were counted, then the victim's family would leave first, and then we would leave second. Excuse me, the partner parole board would leave first, and then the family would leave and then Julius' defense team and members would leave. So, sorry. So after that, I will say after they voted 3-1, it still hadn't clicked in my mind. And so the very first thing that I thought was I need to pray for their family because they had to go back all the way over this. They had to go back and present their case.

It was rehashed for them. So I know it was very hurtful. So me, us getting that win, it was still like I still felt pain in that room. So this was a statement from the chair of the board, Adam Luck. I believe in death penalty cases, there should be no doubt, and put simply, I have doubts in this case. I cannot ignore those doubts, especially when the stakes are life and death.

Now, Julius has maintained his innocence after he was convicted of killing insurance executive Paul Howell in his driveway more than 20 years ago. So now, explain to folks what this vote means. First of all, when you say a commutation, does that mean that Julius can be sentenced to something other than death? Does it mean that Julius is going to be freed? Does it mean that this leads to another trial? So exactly what does

this commutation actually mean? Yeah, great question. So it changed. Commutation simply means it changes your sentence from one from one sentence to another. And so, of course, we were asking for a commutation of Tom served. The board today voted to to recommend life with the possibility of parole, which I believe Julius is already eligible for. And so that's still good news for us. It's still good news for Julius. And so what happens next is that this recommendation goes to Governor Stitt's desk. And there's not, as far as I know, there's not a set amount of time where, you know, a time frame for him to respond to this or sign off on this.

But now he deliberates over the issues in the case, takes the recommendation of, hopefully takes the recommendation of his board and commutes Julius's sentence. But, so this is, I guess where it's confusing. So if you have the chair who says that he has doubts in this is, I guess, where it's confusing. So if you have the chair who says he has doubts in this case, okay, what did he have doubts about? Doubts as to whether Julius should be sentenced to death

or doubts as to whether Julius is actually guilty? Yeah, he had doubts about whether Julius was actually guilty. I don't think you could have sat in that room today and heard Julius's defense go through every detail of the case, of the issues, and not come away with doubts about Julius's innocence, or I'm sorry, Julius's guilt. And so I think they came to a conclusion in their own minds and hearts today, the same conclusion that the supporters, we have been, we've had for quite a while now as we've been fighting for Julius's life, that Julius Jones has been on death row for 22 years for a crime

that Julius Jones did not commit. And I think his defense made that perfectly clear in that room today. And I understand that Mr. Luck had to put out a diplomatic statement, but anybody with eyes to see and ears to hear could have heard today that Julius is an innocent person. Now, the family did speak, the Howell family. One of the folks who spoke was the sister, Megan Tobey, and she said, quote, I know beyond a doubt Julius Jones murdered my brother. The governor does not have to follow the parole board's recommendation. He can follow it. He can amend it. He could or he could simply ignore it. And so so explain to the audience what's next. What's the next what's the next step?

Is it waiting to see what the governor does? Yeah. The next step is to, you know, turn our attention towards the governor's office and to try to talk to the governor's folks, if they will allow us, about why this case has been so important to us, why we feel like he should take the recommendation of his board. One of the things that the governor said when Julius's case was really starting to make national news, was that he was listening to the people and that he was going to deeply consider the recommendation of his board, and he was not going to act without the recommendation of his board. And so I just have to trust that Governor Stitt is going to do what he said he was going

to do, which was listen to the people and take the recommendation of his board. Listen, you know, Oklahoma is a hard state, particularly when we're talking about an issue like the death penalty, when we're talking about issues of criminal justice reform in any way, right? It's a challenging state. But I am just believing that we've come this far by faith and we're going to go the rest of the way. And so, and obviously there's been so much attention that has been around this particular case. Did y'all get the chance to actually talk to Julius today? And what did he say? How does he feel? So I talked to him this morning.

He called at 7.01. The first thing he said was, are y'all ready? And I said, we're ready, bro. We're ready. We're ready for you to come home. He said, I'm ready to come home. I've been waiting on his call, just giving thanks to God for us coming this far because they could have executed him 22 years ago but god

but i'm waiting to hear his voice i'm waiting to hear his reaction um i'm thankful that uh one of his other lawyers was actually down there and able to talk to him after the ruling so i'm i'm just waiting to hear his voice and what he has to say. Well, we certainly will continue to watch this case to see what the decision is. And you say that there's no timetable on the governor's decision. So he could decide in a matter of days or he could literally sit on this for months. Right. Absolutely. Absolutely, he could. And so we're hoping that he decides quickly. You know, time is of essence.

This man has spent 22 years in prison for a crime that he did not commit. And so it's time for him to come home. It's time for us to expedite this, get the man home, and let's all move on. All right, then. Well, we certainly appreciate both of you joining us to give us this information. Reverend CeCe Jones-Davis, thanks a lot, as well as Antoinette Jones. Thanks a lot. Thank you for having us.

All right. I want to bring in my panel right now to further talk about this. Joining us right now is Kilib Bethea, communications strategist also. We're joined by Omokongo Domingue, professorial lecturer at the School of International Science at American University. Glad to have both of you here. Folks, the thing about these cases, first of all, Oklahoma, yes, very much a red state, Republican governor, Republican-led legislature.

What's interesting is that this governor has actually been wanting the parole board to have broader powers when it comes to criminal justice reform in the state. Omokongo? I think it's going to be interesting because you see, one of the things I didn't know until you said it tonight was what was the family of Holmes saying? And so when you talk about what Stitt originally wanted, we have to realize that there are going to be people, MAGA folks and all of these guys who are going to be fighting so hard for Justin to not be released that we have to make sure that we keep our voices up as well. Because I'll be very honest, I mean, what reason do we really have to trust him to do the right thing, you know, outside of actual real pressure? And so I think that right now, you know, you've done such a great job of bringing this to so many people's attention, and we really have to make sure we keep up the fight. Because you mentioned the comment about the parole board, but what is he going to do now? I mean, you look at DeSantis and all of these guys just doing everything to flex their muscle to say that I got this.

I'm in charge. I rule over whatever is going to happen in this state. And so it's got me nervous. I know that the family of homes are going to be just as active. And so we really have to speak up. I'm praying for the family, but we can't just pray. We got to pray and fight because as the reverend said, we're not done yet. The thing here, Kelly, is without the public pressure, we're not at this point. Let's just be honest. If you did not have the public pressure, if celebrities were not getting involved, you would not have the level of attention on this case. Absolutely.

And that was one of the points that I was going to mention, mainly because there are so many people in prisons who have a very similar predicament as Julius Jones, such that we can't keep up with it all as the public unless it is in our face. So shout out to Kim Kardashian West and other celebrities who have put this at the forefront of our minds so that we know and can keep up with and keep track of this case. I'm sure that, like you said, the Howell family is adamant that Julius Jones committed this crime. But the evidence allegedly just simply does not show that. But I also have to remain empathetic in some regard, because at the end of the day,

they still lost a loved one. And I keep that at the forefront of my mind as well. But at the same time, so did the family of Julius Jones for 20-something years, especially if he is proven innocent of these charges. We have to keep that in mind as well. I would only hope that I personally would feel more guilty as a family member of the Howell family if I were to find out that this man has been in jail for 20-something years for a crime he did not commit. So I would, you know, even though, yes, this is painful, I would also keep in mind that, keep an open mind in that it's very possible that he did not commit this crime. No one checked out his alibi. There's a lot of racial bias in Oklahoma. There are factors at play that simply go outside of the black and white facts of this case

being the murder itself. So to the Howell family, keep an open mind and make sure that you're on the right side of history when it comes to this matter. You know, again, there is a victim at play, but there are two victims at play here. So just, again, keep that in mind. All right, then. So again, folks, we will stay on top of this story and certainly keep you abreast of what actually happens.

All right, let's go to our next story. Yesterday, I was on ABC Networks This Week with George Stephanopoulos. We talked about a range of subjects, including a speech that Governor Chris Christie, former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie, gave last week at the Reagan Library. This particular speech has been lauded by a number of people because he talked about a path forward for Republicans and what they should be doing and what they should be doing when it comes to dealing with the conspiracy theorists and things along those lines.

And so before I play the clip from the show, I think it's important to, first of all, lay out what he actually said. And then we'll get to exactly the exchange he and I had on ABC this week that's been burning up social media for the past 36 plus hours. And so the speech took place at the Reagan Library. This is where a lot of conservatives go in order to sort of plant their flag, to stand in the glow or bask in the glow of Ronald Reagan, the aura of Ronald Reagan, of course, the Republican hero to so many people. And many believe that Chris Christie is planning to run for president in 2024. Donald Trump has already made it clear that he is also going to be running in 2024 as well. And so

let's deal with this here. So he lays out this vision of where they're going. So he talks in the speech about Republicans falling into quicksand. So listen to this.

As Republicans, we need to free ourselves from the quicksand of endless grievances. We need to turn our attention to the future and stop wallowing in the past. We need to face the realities of the 2020 election and learn, not hide from them. We need to discredit the extremists in our midst the way we've done it before. And we'll discuss that a little bit more in a moment. We need to renounce the conspiracy theorists and the truth deniers, the ones who know better and the ones who are just plain nuts. We need to give our supporters facts that will help them put all those fantasies to rest

so everyone can focus with clear minds on the issues that really matter. We need to quit wasting our time, our energy, and our credibility on claims that won't ever convince anyone of anything. We need to learn to win, both as Republicans and Americans again. Now, the only way to push back against policies we know are wrong is to focus on alternatives that the American people will see are right. Nothing else, nothing else is going to win Congress back for Republicans in 2022 or the White House in 2024. Enough with the wishful thinking and the self-delusion. We are also so long and overdue to stop wallowing in the past. We need to be the

party that embraces the truth, the truth, even when it's painful and unacceptable. Grievances and conspiracy theories always die hard, but they can only live in the darkness. Their days are numbered once the light of truth shines down on them. Now, it is clear Chris Christie is talking about Donald Trump, but you notice, nowhere in there he actually names Donald Trump. He's laying out all of these things that Donald Trump has literally's laying out all of these things that Donald Trump has literally created in the last

several years. 2011, the birther drama, that racist crap, him launching in 2015, then of course running in 2016, winning, and then four years in the Oval Office. And so,

Christie, of course who ran it in 2016, and who Trump trashed left and right, then says, here are the changes that we must be dealing with within our party. Truth is, I see it, and I let the chips fall where they may. We need to talk about issues that are uncomfortable, but scream out for leaders to take them on. We need to go places we rarely go to see people we rarely see. To bring our ideas to new voters who are thirsting to be inspired.

In short, we want to change the Republican Party. We need to be unafraid. Our party should once again be for telling our fellow citizens the hard truths. Because you see, the Democrats will not be defeated without sound alternatives to their flawed ideas. Let me make this clear. Hating the other side is not enough. Calling them wrong is not enough. Calling them names is immature and it's ineffective. Ah, Christie, sounding like the reasonable Republican that we've always had in the past. And then he says, this is our vision as a party moving forward.

But our party itself is in peril now, and we need to look to pave our path forward. The best way to combat extremism then is still the best way to combat extremism now. Bad ideas are still bad ideas. They have to be confronted directly with clarity, with confidence, and a commitment to who we are, just like Buckley and Reagan did 60 years ago. And what about that media narrative? Well, here is the ABC News contributor talking about controlling that. We have to push back against the mainstream media, and we need our own persuasive messengers

with the credibility to call out the falsehoods and the biases of the corporate media. We have a winning message, everybody, but sometimes we're just not being heard. And there's only one way we can credibly tell it like it is, making sure we also push back against the lies in our own party that have been wrecking our credibility. The elite media are not on our side and never will be. Believe me, I was covered by The New York Times and The Philadelphia Inquirer at the same time. I know what I'm talking about. Only if we tell the truth about everything,

though, will our critique about the liberal media's bias be believed by the voters. If you don't lie about one thing but say, believe me about this, you're not going to be believed. We need to be the party that questions and takes on the New York, Washington media power structure. We need to stand up for the American people who are working for a living every day instead of those who just want to continue to dole out money in order to maintain power. Only if we tell the truth about everything.

Y'all saw how he slid in there, that whole comment about the mainstream media. They'll never listen to us and we're not there enough. You do know the highest ranking cable network is Fox News. Chris

Christie's literally being paid by Disney ABC. He's on ABC this week, every single week. It's on ABC this week every single week. It's a little hard to say we must tell the truth at all times, which brings us to yesterday. See, Christie gives this speech because Christie thought he was going to be lauded and praised for his tone, for the balance,

addressing Trump without naming him and addressing the critics and the things that they do. And that's what he thought. So yesterday, George Stephanopoulos brought up the speech and then he raised the point, which then led to Christie answering, then I got my opportunity to weigh in. Chris Christie, he was referring, of course, to former President Trump,

also went to a police station in New York yesterday, complained again about the rigged election. He gave a major speech at the Reagan Library this morning. He said, Chris Christie, he was referring, of course, to former President Trump, also went to a police station in New York yesterday, complained again about the rigged election. You gave a major speech at the Reagan Library this week where you said it was time to face the realities of the 2020 election, renounce the conspiracy theorists and the truth deniers. So you're in a collision course with former President Trump. No, I'm on a course to try to make sure that my party remains rather relevant in the political conversation in this country. Maybe it is becomes.

You're seeing more and more Republicans are now saying they're buying in to the conspiracy theorists. In the end, I do think that's moving in the other direction. I think it will continue to move in the other direction. And what that speech was all about was to repeat what I said with you on election night. You know, at 2.30 a.m. on election night, when the president made the speech that he made, President Trump made the speech that he made, I said it was unfounded and that there was no evidence of anything like what he was talking about. And he needed to stop. And since then, it's taken hold among Republicans. It's taken hold among some Republicans, George.

But I think what you're seeing over the course of time as this continues to move past election night and the emotion of an election is that more and more people are saying that that's not true. And by the way, it's also incumbent upon all of us in the party who don't believe it's true to speak out because you're not going to convince everybody overnight. The same way we're having the conversation about vaccines and you're not going to convince certain people of certain things.

I can't tell you how many conversations I've had with friends of mine who are smart, good people who aren't vaccinated. So are you getting blowback? I mean, listen, a little bit, but much more praise than blowback for the speech. And so, you know, but in the end, that's not why I gave the speech, to either get praise or worry about blowback. You say what you believe. That's what I try to do here

every week when I'm on. Hmm. That's not why you gave the speech? That's exactly why you gave the speech, Chris. No one gives a speech like that, and you don't travel from New Jersey to go all the way to California to give a speech at the Reagan Library if that was

not your intention. Then you also said, I try to be truthful here every week on ABC. Well, first of all, either you try or you do. Continue. I said what I believed on Thursday night, and it's what I'm going to continue

to believe. I just think for four years, we watched Republicans either be silent or be complicit in the building of the monster that is Trump. And even post-Trump, there are still Republicans who are bolstering him, supporting him. So I feel like too little, too late. The reality is, is real leadership is stepping up to the man at the time he was in the seat and saying that we won't budge. And there was none of that. And unfortunately, I don't know what the future of the time he was in the seat and saying that we won't budge. And there was none of that. And unfortunately, I don't know what the future of the Republican Party is.

There's so many folks who are now swinging closely. We think about the 47 states that have legislation trying to keep people from voting based on the big lie that we know was not true. We think about January 6th and the insurrection that happened on the structure of democracy itself and democracy. And there are Republicans who don't want to have an investigation into that. So this Republican Party is way far gone and unfortunately too little too late. Hold on.

I want to get another Republican perspective here from Sarah. There's a debate there. Chris believes the party's over time moving in this direction. Yvette disagrees. I think that perhaps we will finally see what we didn't get to see in 2016, where there were 17 candidates. Nobody dropped out so that you could have the one-on-one versus Donald Trump. Perhaps it looks like Donald Trump is going to run again. We're certainly told that by all of his advisors and by all accounts from him. If it is Chris Christie versus Donald Trump in the Republican primary, Republicans will have a choice. And certainly Donald Trump is in some ways at his weakest that he's been since he left the White House.

And in other ways, certainly what he has said and Trumpism has picked up within the party. It will be up to Governor Christie to make the case that there is somewhere else to go. But I do think if Trump runs, he may be alone in that lane. And that could be helpful. I'm sorry. Republican Party, they made their choice. And I appreciate the speech, Governor. But the reality is this.

You have to admit, Sarah, you have to admit the role that you played in putting the person in leadership who is driving conspiracy theories. It's one thing to condemn them after the fact, but you have to own up to the role that you played in putting the person in power. We both ran campaigns against him. No, no, no, no, no. First off, I don't have anything to you. Can I finish? First off, I don't have anything to you. And second, I ran against Donald Trump in 2016. You ran against him. But when a person has principles, morals, and values, they do not support them even if you lose. And what they say is, I choose patriotism and the country over party and power. And the problem was too many Republicans chose power in riding with Donald Trump as opposed to patriotism in America.

I'll sleep fine tonight with you judging my morals. Well, guess what? As a voter who has 13 nieces and nephews, what I also want to see in America are Republicans and Democrats who have the guts to stand up to narcissists, to folks who lie, to folks who see them and live a country in the wrong direction. And what that man has unleashed on this country, any Republican who stood with him has to own it and accept the role that they played. Yeah, well, that's fine.

I'll accept the role that I played in the 2016 election running against him. And I'll accept the role. Let him finish his point now. Let him finish his point. And I'll accept the role that I played in my belief that Hillary Clinton was not the right person to be president. We all get to make choices, Roland, in this democracy. I made my choice. I'm on record of my choice and I'm not walking away from my choice. But it does not preclude me from being able to be critical when the person that I did support does things that

I am against. And so this false choice that you're trying to set up, it's a false choice and one that the American people are not going to buy either. Let me just press one other point. Right now, I would argue that the fact that so many Americans can't buy into simple facts is probably the biggest existential threat we face to our democracy. So when somebody speaks up for that, isn't it something to be praised? Facts are critically important. But again, when you support someone who said fake news, who when you were truthful and then push that, then when you have the networks and the conservative radio talk show host, that whole

echo chamber driving that, that's the problem. I am a native of Texas who is still registered there, and I'm dealing with Greg Abbott and Dan Patrick who is consistently lying and making things up, and you're dealing with that. I'm dealing with people who are changing textbooks. Do you think that you're going to persuade people? Well, here's the deal. I have a very basic principle since I've been a journalist. If you do good, I'll talk about you. If you do bad, I'll talk about you. At the end of the day, I'll talk about you. If you do bad, I'll talk about you. At the end of the day, I'll talk about you. And somebody has to say what others are afraid to say. Sarah, you get the last word.

If you want to persuade half the country that voted for Donald Trump in 2016 to move to your side, then you've got to stop villainizing them. You've got to stop having these conversations where everyone who is not with you is against you. And when someone says that Donald Trump did something wrong, you may want to consider praising that and trying to use that to persuade the people who are not going to be persuaded. That is going to have to be the last word just to make it obviously continue. I'm sure it will. Oh, since my good friend George Stephanopoulos said it's got to be the last word. We're out of time. I got time. See, here's the thing that y'all have to understand. When Sarah says you should be praising them, hell no.

I'm not going to praise somebody who is unwilling to admit their involvement. I'm not going to praise somebody who is trying to pull the wool over somebody's face because they don't want to speak truth. Chris Christie sat there and talked about the role I played in 2016, but what he would not deal with, the fact that he helped Donald Trump in the debates against Vice President Joe Biden in 2020.

Here is a photo of a tweet that Chris Christie sent out where he talked about voting for Donald Trump in 2020. This wasn't 2016. This is the tweet. Two things to say this afternoon. First, I have now voted, and I voted for President Trump. Second, no matter where you are in public, please remember to wear your mask.

This is the same man. He voted for a man who refused to tell people to wear masks at the White House, which led to Chris Christie getting COVID, which led to him being hospitalized. We talk about leadership, and you voted for a man who said, no, I'm not wearing a mask, but tell folks to take their mask off.

You voted for a man who trashed people, who dogged people, and then led that insurrection? Yes, he led the insurrection on January 6th, and you still cape for him? See, Chris wants us to forget those things. Sarah wants us to forget. See, y'all didn't, we didn't play the part

when I talked about when George brought up domestic terrorism. And I said white domestic terrorism, and I called out the Trump DOJ because when Sarah's boss, Jeff Sessions, was attorney general, they pulled back on the resources to fight white domestic terrorism and shifted the money over to fighting Muslims and terrorism. Oh, excuse me if I've got CBS-sized receipts here. See, what I need y'all to understand there's a game being played. Alison Farrow, Sean Spicer, Kellyanne Conway, and all of the folks who work for Trump, what they want you to do is to be cleaned up and dusted off, and they want to wash

the funk of Donald Trump off of their bodies. They don't want you to know. They want to retell the story. And see, mainstream media is real good at this. That's why Newsmax has given Sean Spicer a show. That's why you see these folks trying to write books and you see all of a sudden the stories being done. Oh, I was trying to be the voice of reason on the inside. You're seeing the secretary, the former press secretary, dropping her book and how she was critical of Melania and others. So y'all got to understand, gang recognize gang. And see, the reason I'm wearing this shirt, not the right kind of black, y'all remember when Soledad O'Brien said, an executive at CNN, said that to her about me? Because see,

I could have easily gone on and played the game of, oh no, I don't want to hurt Governor Christie's feelings and I don't want to get too tough. First of all, that wasn't tough. Y'all have seen me go in on people. That was a scale of one to ten. That was a four. But what you have to understand is what's really going on here. See, they want to wash themselves. See, I mean, see, he was at the Reagan Library. Go watch that docuseries on Showtime. I know a lot of conservative Republicans love Ronald Reagan, but you don't understand what Ronald Reagan was saying in the 60s and the 70s.

He opened his campaign, the same place where those three civil rights workers were found murdered in Mississippi. Gave a speech on states' rights. He knew what he was doing. He knew what he was saying. But see, we're so good at let's just, no, we don't want to talk about that sort of stuff. No, no, no.

We're going to talk about it. And see, Chris Christie has refused to own up to what he did. He has refused to own up to the advice that he gave Donald Trump. He has refused to actually say what he did. He played a role because Chris Christie had an option. He could have not endorsed Donald Trump. He could have not campaigned for Donald Trump. He could have not advised Donald Trump.

He could have said, I'm taking a pass. But why did he do it? For the same reason the rest of them did it. Power, party, read the New Yorker, James Baker, Lord, and ask this distinguished gentleman and diplomat, former chief of staff and secretary of state, where he said, doesn't matter, I'm bothered by some of the things Trump did, but I will always vote for the Republican. Well, James Baker, the so-called distinguished gentleman and diplomat, his saying is,

does not matter how despicable and evil and nasty and callous the person is, as long as there's an R in front of his name, I will support them. But no, I'm sorry. When your mama and daddy has taught you values and principles and morals, you say I can't stand with you if you simply violate those principles.

And that, folks, is Chris Christie. That, folks, are so many other Republicans. And what they want, they want the free pass. They want us not to bring those things up. You saw how quickly he was triggered. You saw how he interrupted because he couldn't handle somebody sitting in his presence and challenging him to his space. Well, Chris, I saw this ad today that was put out by the folks with Act Blue that lays out how folks like you and Lindsey Graham and Ted Cruz and Nikki Haley, all of y'all, what y'all really said about Donald Trump before he got the nomination.

And if y'all want to see some hypocrites, watch this. I want to talk to the Trump supporters for a minute. I don't know who you are, and I don't know why you like this guy. Whatever he does, he accuses everyone else of doing it. The man cannot tell the truth, but he combines it with being a narcissist. A narcissist at a level I don't think this country's ever seen. And my concern is that he would grab up that power and really treat the country as sort of his little bully fiefdom. Donald Trump is everything I taught my children not to do in kindergarten. He's been exploiting working Americans for 40 years.

He's a race-baiting, xenophobic, religious bigot. He says he's for the little guy, but he's actually got a lot of his businesses on the backs of the little guy. Donald Trump the other day said that, quote, if he tells a soldier to commit a war crime, the soldier will just go do it. I don't think Donald Trump has even read the Constitution, knows what's in the Constitution. A toxic mix of demagoguery and mean-spiritedness and nonsense. I just cannot support Donald Trump. Donald Trump is a delusional narcissist and an orange-faced windbag. Donald Trump is a con artist. He doesn't know the difference between truth and lies.

He lies practically every word that comes out of his mouth. I think he's a kook. I think he's crazy. I think he's a kook. I think he's crazy. I think he's unfit for office. Nikki Haley went to work for him as his ambassador to the United Nations, and she is sucked up to him. Who's carried more of his water in the U.S. Senate? Lindsey Graham, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, and Rand Paul. Folks, there are so many other videos out there, so many other videos out there that we could play.

I came across this tweet today, and I'll be honest, somebody who I never thought I would have on this show because of a lot of his past comments. Former Congressman Joe Walsh of Illinois, a mediaite, posted a clip of my segment on ABC this week. And Joe Walsh tweeted this. Spot on, Roland Martin. Every one of us Republicans, former Republicans, moderate Republicans, and conservative Republicans, must publicly acknowledge and apologize for helping to put that unfit madman in the White House. Every single one of us, Chris Christie and most, never will. Joining us right now on Roland Martin Unfiltered in the Black Star Network is former Congressman Joe Walsh.

Congressman, glad to have you on the show. You were, if I had a camera on you while I was going through all of that, you were putting your head down, you were nodding, you had this sort of state of disbelief as you listened to Chris Christie give that speech and then saw that exchange between the two of us on ABC. Hey, Roland, I am so, by the way, it's an honor to be with you. I am so freaking pissed off right now, but I want to start by saying thank you. I mean it, man. Thank you for what you did yesterday on ABC calling out Chris Christie. My God, Roland, all of them know who Donald Trump is, and none of them have said anything. I'm listening to Christie at the Reagan Library.

It's infuriating. We need to do this. We need to do that. What they need to do is call out him by name. But, Roland, you know, and you said it beautifully, none of them will, because if you do, you end up like this former congressman. You're done in the Republican Party. If you call out Trump by name and say he's an unfit madman, then you're done in conservative talk radio like I was. And Chris Christie, what a bunch of bullshit. What a bunch of cowardly bullshit.

He can't even enroll in. You did a great job because Christie kept going back to 2016 yesterday. Oh, I ran against him in 2016. For four years, he sucked Donald Trump's feet. He tried to help him get reelected in 2020. Look, Roland, I screwed up. I voted for Trump in 2016. In a nanosecond after that, I realized how unfit he was and I lost everything. Chris Christie was still trying to help this guy get reelected. I get it. I'm not naive, Roland. I get it. You said it. If you do what I did, you're done in the Republican Party. And screw Chris Christie and Rand Paul and all these other guys because they've sold their soul. I'm sorry. And that right there is the biggest thing for me, because, you know, they love talking about integrity and honor and principles and valor and value.

They love touting their Christianity and their faith. And they stood with a faithless ghoul, a man who has no bottom, a man who will throw anybody under the bus. Chris Christie kissed his ass after losing. Endorsed him. Trump put him in charge of his transition team. What happened? His son-in-law, Jared, I don't want him. Trump dumped him because Christie prosecuted Jared's daddy. After trashing this man, Trump would talk about the man's weight in public

and how he would just do whatever and would just kiss his butt. Christie's still going back, still going back, still going back, still going back. Hell, he caught COVID by kissing his butt by being at the Amy Coney Barrett super spirited event at the White House, the same one where Bishop Harry Jackson was, the same guy who was preaching the Oval Office on Easter Sunday and died a few months later of COVID. And Trump never even mentioned the man's name, never even sent a tweet out. And these folks, see, I would just rather Lindsey Graham and Rand Paul

and Ted Cruz and Christie and the rest of them just come out and say, hey, I'm here to kiss his ass because I want to get paid. I want to have power. I want to have proximity to power. That's why I'm doing it. But don't sit here and act as if we don't know what the hell is going on. Hey, Roland, when I was in Congress, I was the poorest member of Congress. If I had a dollar for every time a Republican member of Congress over the last three years told me privately how bad, awful, god-awful bad Donald Trump was, I'd be a wealthy guy.

But you nailed it, my friend. They all told me that privately. Chris Christie has the nerve to say the Republican Party has to tell the truth without calling out the biggest liar this country has ever had. Roland, as far as I'm concerned, if you're a Republican and you can't call out him by name, Donald Trump, and we've got to get rid of him or this party will never grow, then I don't even listen to you anymore. Right. And that point you just made there, when you talk about what they say privately. Look, I can tell you, I know of people who overheard conversations that Rudy Giuliani and Lindsey Graham have had,

who were sitting right there, and they were ridiculing him. They were making fun of him. They know he's stupid. They know he can't read. They know he's an ignoramus. But they know, oh, he had the power? Boom. We're going to suck up to him. That's the only reason.

And, Roland, they know he's bad for the Republican Party. More importantly, they know deep down he's bad for this country. My God, some of them have told me privately what I've said publicly about Trump. He's a treasonous guy. He's disloyal to America. Roland, they know that. My God, and they don't say it publicly. See, and that's why I had no choice but to check Chris Christie and to check Sarah. Because don't try to sit here and go, oh, let's bring us together and a vision forward and these things are important

because here's the deal. If 200,000 votes went a different way, he would be sitting in the Oval Office and Chris Christie would be sitting there kissing his ass because Chris will be trying to make money for his lobbying shop or whatever he's doing, because that's what this is about.

Principal. By the way, Roland, the other really great point you made yesterday is about the party. The Republican Party's done. And Christie knows that it's Trump's party. Stick a fork in them. They're done. He's party. Stick a fork in them. They're done. He's running.

And if he wants to run, Roland, and I think he will, no Republican's going to challenge him. Chris, Chris, there's not going to be a choice between Trump and Christie. Give me a freaking break. Well, you've already heard Nikki Haley. You've already heard Nikki Haley go say, well, if he runs, I'm not running. And here's the crazy thing. Trump has exposed how much of a fraud she is. He's like, oh, she talks about me bad one day, and the next day she walks it back,

and then she criticizes me. Even he knows she's a fraud. Hey, I respect the hell out of you because you speak your mind, even if it costs you TV gigs. I spoke my mind three and a half, four years ago, and it cost me everything. Lindsey Graham, Cruz, Christie, they all suck up at the altar of the king, and they're not going to change, Roland, because you nailed it. It's all about power. Right. And that's just, and we got to call it what it is. And now this whole polishing act of

no, no, that wasn't us. We were not one of those people. No, you were, and you wanted it to continue. And that is the problem. And here's the whole deal. If you're sitting here and then when Christie goes, well, you know, I just believe in 2016, uh, that, uh, Trump was better than Hillary. He knows it's a damn lie. He knows that. He knows. And see, this is where I don't want to hear any crap about the good of the country. This is where you say, because let me tell you something.

I go back to Jackie Robinson. Jackie Robinson was a black Republican. Jackie Robinson supported Nixon over Kennedy. And Jackie Robinson was angry because Nixon was not doing more to speak up to try to reach African-Americans. Then in 1964, when you had Senator Barry Goldwater, who ran and opposed the Civil Rights Act, it was Republican Jackie Robinson who said, there is no way in hell I'm supporting that man

and actively campaigned against him. And that's what you do when you say that person is simply not good for the country. Damn my party label and I cannot support it. I've got to fight against it. That's what Jackie Robinson did. Bingo, Roland. I look, I have stood on the public square for three and a half, four years publicly apologizing to the country because I helped create Donald Trump. And I'm profoundly sorry about that. Chris Christie did, too. Rand Paul did, too. Ted, every single Republican helped create that narcissistic, unfit traitor.

We have to own it. And if you're a Republican and you can't own it, I don't want to hear from you. So when we talk about this whole path forward, and look, you have a number of folks in the Lincoln Project. They've got their issues with John Weaver and what he did and what they knew, and they're going through all of that.

And that should actually happen. Sherry Jacobus, I spend a lot of time with her on CNN. And she's talked about she's fighting cancer. But she talked about how the Trump people went after her and, yes, destroyed her life as well. And that's the thing right there. They are about destroying your life. This isn't like, OK, we disagree politically.

No, no, no. They want to destroy your life. They want all your money cut off. That's the reason why Reince Priebus, Trump just slapped this man around like a little child and just abused him. Fired him on the plane in a tweet and then he had to catch a ride with somebody else. And Reince Priebus still walking behind kissing his ass. And then now he's trying to sit here and have this recount

in Wisconsin leading that. And I'm sitting here going, man, do you have any integrity? Any? Like, are you sitting, like, you, that man disrespected you. Ted Cruz, the man called your wife ugly. The man called your wife ugly.

No, you're right, man. But then there are all these other Republicans who just kept their mouths shut for four years. What has Paul Ryan ever said? John Boehner, my former speaker, wrote a book and came out and said how bad Trump was. He still voted for Trump in 2020. They kept their mouths shut. And that, to me, right there, is the fundamental problem. Because you know what?

Look, I got a problem with a lot of Democrats who said, I just can't vote for Hillary Clinton. You know what? They didn't. And she lost. She lost. Had those Democrats who did not like her said I gotta put that aside and vote

for her, I personally think they screwed up because what they didn't do was what Republicans actually did. Republicans said it's about power. But the issue for me was this here. The issue for me between Hillary and Donald Trump, black, and I said, we knew how bad this man was. We knew how pathetic this man was. Black women absolutely knew how

awful this man was. And I said, if the country listened to black folks and not voted for Donald Trump, we would never have gotten those four years. But what this man has unleashed, and that to me, Joe, is why I was even more offended. I'm looking at Chris Christie going, how dare you stand there and talk about the conspiracy theories and how we can't listen to him when you supported him? And the man was thrown out conspiracy theories the day he walked into the Oval Office. That wasn't brand new because he lost to Biden. Christie empowered that. He empowered that.

I think we may have, did we lose Joe's signal? It may have frozen. Okay, y'all let me know when we get Joe back. I want to pull up Omicongo and Kelly. And that to me, Omicongo is just, and again, I went real easy on Christy yesterday. But to sit there and go, dude, don't try to act like you like you all you all pious. And now you want to look forward when you you wanted this for four more years. Oh, absolutely. And like you said, you were like level four out of we've seen the 10. You know what I'm saying? Look, it's ridiculous, because one of the things we also didn't mention that just in May of this year,

Christie told Sean Hannity that he would give Trump an A on his presidency. And then you all are coming off of your panel just the day after what Trump pulled during the 9-11 when he ceremonies, when he made it all about himself, went to the police the 9-11 when he, uh, ceremonies, when he made it all about himself, went to the police and talked about, you know, stupidity, like, oh, I know we can't say back to blue anymore or whatever. And it hinted about running. This man has always been about himself and Chris Christie needs to be on the spot, put on the spot every single day. You've been talking about principles this entire time. You know, my mom, she's watching, hey mom, she always talks about the importance of standing on your principles.

And just like you said with those Democrats who said, yeah, I didn't like her, I'm not voting for her, these guys, Republicans, have no spine. Let's also add the fact that with Ted Cruz that Trump accused him of being involved in the assassination of Kennedy. His dad. His dad. His dad, right, his dad. And so, yes, Christie cannot get it passed, and the fact of the matter is the fact that we have this time to be able to do that when some of these

other networks are only going to give it about a minute and a half. We need to do this every single day, and that's why I'm just glad that you're on the air making it happen. Kelly, at the end of the day, it is about being honest. Let me tell you how I roll. If I don't like your ass, I don't like you. And when I say I don't like your ass, I don't like you.

And when I say I don't like you, I don't speak to you. We could be sitting at a table of ten people. I'll speak to the nine people and ignore your ass. I don't play that. So, I don't know how these people

can go home every single night and look themselves in the mirror and suck up to this man knowing how awful he is. I don't either. And for me, what Chris Christie did was actually what I was. This is what I'm expecting more Republicans to do as the years go by, in that they are basically perpetuating this revisionist history and more or less, for lack of a better term, band-aiding the tragedy that is the Donald Trump presidency. I mean, where were these Republicans on January 6th? Where were these Republicans on June 1st of 2020, when Donald Trump literally made way for him to just stand outside of a church to hold up a Bible? No sermon, no anything. Literally had people beat and tear gassed for a photo opportunity. Where were Republicans for that? Where were Republicans for October 6th of 2020

when he basically became a bioweapon and stood outside on the balcony of the White House to remove his mask after he was just hospitalized for COVID? This man is a monster. And for four years and counting now, they have been supporting a monster for the sake of party. And it is unfortunate that the roles weren't reversed as far as the Republicans versus the Democrats and how they treated 2020, meaning instead of Republicans saying, do not vote for this man, like Democrats said, do not vote for Hillary. Instead of doing that, they united together for the sake of party as opposed to country. And ironically, the Democrats disbanded in the name of country instead of party. So that's what I mean by the roles being reversed. But what Chris

Christie did today or, you know, last week is really just lie by omission, meaning he is saying what, you know, we should be hearing, but he doesn't really mean it. He's just trying to save his face, you know, cover his ass for future elections, future engagements, future anything regarding the Republican Party, as if, you know, the internet doesn't exist, as if everything he's been doing for the past four to six years is just going to be wiped out and forgotten about. And that's just not going to happen. It is incredibly disingenuous for you not to own up to what you've done. Like, you literally made your bed, lay in it. This is where, we got Joe back. Joe, and this is where, Joe, you have far too many people

who are in the media, who want to be clubby. Yeah. In bed with these folks, chummy with them, and they don't want to press them too hard. That's just the real deal. People have to understand, it is a major inside game for all the folks in Trump world that exist out there, and that's the game.

And I'm sorry, I'm just not going to play that game and let somebody sit in front of me and just say this crap and they've never owned up to it. You can't go to an AA meeting and make any progress unless you have to say with your own mouth, I'm an alcoholic. I'm a drug addict. You can't, look, I'm born and raised Catholic. You can't walk in confession and not say, forgive me, Father, for I have sinned. In fact, these same

Christians are the ones who say you've got to profess with your mouth that Jesus Christ is your Lord and Savior. These folks want to say, oh, no, no, no, I wasn't with that. I wasn't done with any of that. No, I was privately advising him against it. Yeah, but you watched it and then you said nothing. And Roland, and by the way, your guest beautifully said it. Trump is a monster. He's a treasonous

monster. And please don't take what I'm about to say wrong. I almost have more respect for nuts like Matt Gaetz and Marjorie Taylor Greene, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Lauren Boebert, who really believe Trump's bullshit than I do Chris Christie. Chris Christie knows that Donald Trump is a lying, treasonous monster. I have less respect for Christy and Lindsey Graham and Cruz because they know the truth. Marjorie Taylor Greene's an idiot. She believes it. These guys know the truth about Trump, but for power, they won't call him out.

Well, it is important to own up to it. I mean, you've talked about that and what it has cost you. And in Republican circles, you are absolutely persona non grata. You've talked about losing the radio show because your radio show was on how many stations? About a couple hundred stations. Lost them all. But you know what, Roland? Because you can't be anti-Trump in conservative talk radio. Here's the other thing, though.

You have to apologize. Sincerely. Right. And I've spent three and a half years apologizing. Yeah, because before, let's be clear. Before, I mean, you said some stuff in the past about Michelle Obama and other folks, and you were a flamethrower on the right, and Fox News loved you, and every time you put something out there and you had to own up to the role that you played in creating and fostering the environment

that allowed a Trump to come onto the scene and grab it and then take hold and become president. A. Roland, I helped create that. You agree with me, I think. The GOP base has been radicalized. Oh, absolutely. When President George W. Bush said on Saturday, he was talking about the Republican Party in terms of the similarities between the radical, I call them domestic terrorists in the United States and the folks

who attacked us on 9-11 in terms of what their goal was. I mean, so he didn't name Trump. He didn't name party. But everybody knew exactly who he was talking about. And all of us Republicans and people like me, Roland, we helped radicalize the base so that when Trump came along in 16, the demagogue he was, they were primed for him. We got to own that and apologize for it. So what are your last question for you in terms of moving forward? I think you're going to see more speeches like this, and I'll give you a perfect example.

People laud Senator Mitt Romney. I don't. You know why? Because he gave that speech all at hoopla before Trump got elected and then was kissing his ass trying to meet with him to become his secretary of state. And see, that's the same thing. See, I'm sorry. You don't play with evil. You don't play footsie with evil.

I got to go to church. You can't sit here and pray to God, but then you want to kick it with the devil. I mean, you simply can't do. Lightness and dark cannot coexist at the same time. And so that, to me, is, again, the same same thing. So sure, now Romney wants to say the right stuff, but even Romney has not apologized for, for trying to get in and, and, and, and, and play footsie with him and try to, try to become his secretary of state because that was the same thing. It was power. It was power, Roland. And Mitt Romney, I respect him.

He didn't even say who he voted for in 2020. Come on. Here's the deal. The Republican Party is Trump's party. He's got the party by the balls. It doesn't matter what people like Chris Christie say. Donald Trump owns the base that is now radicalized. If he wants to run, Roland, the nomination is his, and nobody will challenge him. And the fear that I do have, the fear that I do have, is that his radicalized base, because he lost, will be even more fervent, too, unless Senators Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema

get off their asses and pass the Four-to-People Act, what the Republican legislatures are doing, they are literally positioning states to steal elections. And this thing is real in terms of what's happening. Hey, Roland, you've got Larry Elder out in California today who refused to say that he would accept the results of the election win, lose, or draw. This is now the Republican mantra. They will never lose another election fairly.

It will all be because of fraud. That's Donald Trump's Oh, I gotta watch my language. That's his legacy. The show's called Unfiltered for a reason. Go ahead. That's his fucking legacy. Roland, that is Donald Trump's fucking legacy. He has stuck a stake

through the heart of our democracy. I'm sorry. It's all truthful. Former Illinois Congressman Joe Walsh, we appreciate you. I've been on the democracy. I'm sorry. It's all truthful. Former Illinois Congressman Joe Walsh, we appreciate you. Thank you, my friend. I've been on the show. Thanks a lot.

Thank you. For everybody who's watching, the reason I need you to understand why this is so serious, because we are talking about future elections. There are a lot of people who are sitting here, oh, Joe Biden's this, and the Democrats are this, but I need y'all to understand, they have no intentions on losing any elections. were severely undercounted because Trump wanted it that way. These people are preparing to gerrymander seats in Florida and Texas and North Carolina

and other states where they control both chambers of the legislature as well as the governor's mansion. You need to understand that they gerrymandered the state Supreme Courts. And so what we're talking about, when people say our democracy is on the brink, that's not a lie. And so a lot of y'all can get caught up in, oh, Biden this and Kamala that and Democrats this. Y'all are seeing the audit in Arizona.

They're trying to do one in Pennsylvania. They're trying to do one in Wisconsin. You know what the Republicans did in Wisconsin? When they elected a Democratic governor, they stripped the Democratic governor of his powers. You know what they did? When they had a Democratic attorney general, stripped of his powers because they control the legislature. Because they gerrymandered the seats. Pennsylvania, they were so pissed with the state Supreme Court and their decision on the election.

They want to move to single member districts to elect Supreme Court justices. Do you know why? Because outside of Philadelphia and Pittsburgh in the suburbs, Pennsylvania is Alabama. And they want to guarantee they control the state Supreme Court. They say never again. North Carolina, they tried it. Same thing. I'm trying, Florida.

They are to control the state Supreme Court in Florida, all Republicans. Texas State Supreme Court, all Republicans. Louisiana, they control the Louisiana Supreme Court. Mississippi Supreme Court, Alabama Supreme Court, Arkansas Supreme Court. Y'all need to understand what is going on. This thing is bigger than me taking it to Chris Christie.

You need to understand what the strategy is. I need you to listen to me clearly. You need to understand what the strategy is. Because folks, they are meeting right now. Listen to what I'm trying to tell you. The Federalist Society is meeting to figure out how can we get nine conservative Supreme Court justices. They are plotting to figure out how can we further pack the appeals court? Donald Trump appointed 25% of the federal judiciary.

I just need y'all to understand what's going on here. While a lot of y'all are caught up in these games of who's perfect and who's saying the right thing and who's doing the right thing and they're not doing everything I want. The other side is sitting here saying, we want to control it all. We want to run it all. We want to put our people in place in every position and you will have nothing to do with it. When you start saying, oh, but I want to focus on the mayor. Guess what? They will start challenging laws. And if they control the federal courts, you lose in federal court. I need everyone listening to the sound of my voice to understand that what the Republican Party

is doing today is complete outgrowth of what we achieved in the 1950s and 60s. Listen to me clearly, please. I need you to understand the Scaife Mellon family and the billions they had funded many of these conservative think tanks. They are funding the Heritage Foundation. They're funding all of these groups. It's not just the coke money, folks.

They are funding the Manhattan Institute. They're funding the Daily Wire and the Daily Signal and the Daily Caller and Breitbart. They're funding Salem Radio, which controls conservative talk radio. They are funding all of these things. They are funding all of these things. They are funding all of these. They fund Media Research Center also,

which has Newsbusters, a right-wing group that actually put out a clip. They thought it was going to fire their base up. That clip has been seen nearly one million times on Twitter of my segment, and it really caused other people to respond. Y'all don't fully understand what's at play here. Democratic billionaires don't understand. Don't y'all know they are hoping George Soros would just die because they can't stand that a billionaire progressive is using his money to fight them.

Y'all, yesterday was way bigger than Chris Christie. And I'm telling you, I know Chris Christie, his buns were hot because he thought he was going to get and it never dawned on him that I would be sitting across from him and would light that ass on fire. And I would do it every single time. Oh, I'll be respectful. I'll be respectful. I'll be truthful. But I am not going to sit idly by and watch what these folks are doing. See, you might be sitting here saying, Roland, where does all this come from? I need you to understand

that I am from Texas and I need you to understand that there's something in that water in Texas that causes

us to be unwilling to accept the BS and to accept the nonsense. And I remember a sister from Texas, the first black woman elected to Congress since Reconstruction. I remember when she sat in the midst of all of those white men in Congress in 1974 and said this. Not to exceed a period of 15 minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I join my colleague, Mr. Rangel,

in thanking you for giving the junior members of this committee the glorious opportunity of sharing the pain of this inquiry. Mr. Chairman, you are a strong man, and it has not been easy, but we have tried as best we can to give you as much assistance as possible. Earlier today, we heard the beginning of the preamble to the Constitution of the United States, we the people. It's a very eloquent beginning.

But when that document was completed on the 17th of September in 1787, I was not included in that we the people. I felt somehow for many years that George Washington and Alexander Hamilton just left me out by mistake. But through the process of amendment, interpretation, and court decision, I have finally been included in we the people. Today I am an inquisitor. And hyperbole would not be fictional and would not overstate the solemnness that I feel right now.

My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total. And I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution the subversion the destruction of the Constitution I will not sit here and be an idle spectator She said that in 1974. And I will not be that in 2021. Go into a break. You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. I believe that people our age have lost the ability to focus the discipline on the art of organizing. The challenges, there's so many of them and they're complex. And we need to be moving to address them.

But I'm able to say, watch out, Tiffany. I know this road. That is so freaking dope. Ha ha ha ha ha! I hope our younger generation don't ever forget that nonviolence is soul force. Right? Hello, everyone. It's Kiara Sheard. Hey, I'm Taj. I'm Coco. And I'm Lili.

And we're SWB. What's up, y'all? It's Ryan Destiny, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. Well, folks, cringing testimony seems not to end on day 16 of the R. Kelly trial. Today, a former dancer testified that she walked in on R. Kelly performing oral sex on an underaged Aaliyah. The dancer claimed she attempted to perform a prank on Kelly when she caught the two entertainers

engaged in sexual acts. On Friday, one of Kelly's former employees said the R&B star reprimanded her after one of his girlfriends escaped. Diana Copeland, the singer's assistant from 2004 to 2018, testified that Kelly was upset with her for allowing a woman identified as Anna to escape his Georgia

home after an argument. The trial will continue tomorrow. Let's go to my panel. Kelly, I mean, it's sort of like day after day after day with the testimony that we're hearing. And, of course, you've still got these people who hit me,

talking about, oh, Free R. Kelly, I'm wrong, I'm not giving his side of the trial. But prosecutors are just, it's just like a relentless number of people. And, again, having a former employee testify is all about bad acts, has all been critically important to the prosecutor's, frankly, strategy. No, absolutely. My biggest issue with this trial is, frankly, how long it's taken for us to get to this moment.

And I think that's the frustration of a lot of people out there who have either been part of the Mute R. Kelly movement or simply just believe the young Black women in the first place almost 20 years ago, or over 20 years ago at this point. It is incredibly disheartening and really just angering to me how we still have supporters of R. Kelly right now,

how we are listening to testimony, reading testimony, we have documentaries on the fact, we have sometimes coming from his own mouth that he has an attraction to, you know, underage girls. And yet, it's almost as if people just do not care. And for 20 years, 20 plus years, people did not care. And finally, we are at the point where we care in that this case is finally in trial and he's being prosecuted. For those who are still part of the R. Kelly team, I don't ever want to hear, you know, protect black women coming out of your mouth, like, ever again. Because at this point, it's clear that not only are you a hypocrite, you're a liar, because this entire case

is about protecting black women and upholding the law in regards to black women and black girls. And here you are supporting a man who not only doesn't care about either category of demographic, but also would still be doing it who not only doesn't care about either category of demographic, but also would still be doing it if it were not for the people over the course of over 20 years trying to bring this man to justice. So I really hope he gets what he deserves.

He needs to stay in jail. He needs to be up under the jail if the death penalty were part of this jurisdiction. I'd say he'd get that too, because what he has done has been absolutely disgusting. But for the culture of music, it is incredibly sad how an entire body of work, not just his, but artists who have worked with him, now frankly have to die and never be played again, or at least not nearly at the level that it used to be, because one man decided to be disgusting.

Omokongo? I, you know, when I was reading the articles today, one of the things that really bothered me when I see these people coming out and testifying is they should be on trial with him because they are accomplices. me when I see these people coming out and testifying is they should be on trial with him because they are accomplices. You said that the one assistant, 14 years. Maybe you could talk about, well, I didn't really know what was going on. It was a year. I was there six months. We're talking about 14 years. There are so many people who aided and abetted what was happening, and they need to be on charges as well. If these girls girls were white women there wouldn't have been one victim without this man

going to jail and it's really sad that we continually i'm thinking about people like sparkle as well how we can continually diminish and try to destroy the voices of black women who are speaking up because at the end of the day the only reason R. Kelly can do this for so long was because he saw these women and young girls as expendable. We're talking about, you know, Uber's coming and he's saying, oh, no, it only has to be a female driver. The woman on the stand is saying, using terms like escape, at the end of the day, as it was just said, yes, he needs to go away for a very long time. He is not the only one. And when are we? Look, we came out.

We can go to BBD backstage, all of that. We came out of a culture where the music talked a lot about these things. And maybe we didn't really know and understand back then what was inappropriate. But we sure as hell know what's inappropriate right now. And R. Kelly needs to be the prime example made, and we need to start looking at it all. But this man and his accomplices need to be in prison, period, bottom line. Well, again, the trial is going to continue,

and we'll certainly see what happens next. All right, folks, y'all know what time it is. illegally selling water without a permit on my property. Whoa! I'm uncomfortable. Well, let's go to Georgia where parents are calling for a teacher there to be fired after she says the N-word in a viral video.

Watch this. Girls say I date a viral video. Watch this. Girl, say I date a black guy. Okay. Then I can say nigga, cause I got a nigga. I would have missed that. Play it again. Girl, say I date a black guy. Okay.

Then I can say nigga, cause I got a nigga. Alexandra Boyington, an Alcovee High School art teacher, sitting on the desk discussing when it's okay to use the N-word. Two years ago, Boyington was named Teacher of the Year. Now students and parents are calling for her job. The art instructor is currently on administrative leave. She says in the video that if she starts dating a black guy, she can say nigga.

Really? Yo, homegirls, you can tell this is part of her daily vocabulary because she was just all too comfortable, just the way she just put it out there like that. And so, look, people have all of these debates and conversations. I was just talking about it at my students at American Today in class. People can have honest conversations about it in the classroom. And I believe that teachers who are mindful and sensitive to the conversation of all backgrounds can spearhead that type of conversation but this

woman she was sitting there acting like she was just all world all too cool well and i'm glad that those students responded hell no because really at the end of the day they think that these students are going to be like oh you cool i'm with that and they're like hell no and i'm glad the video went out i'm glad the parents are calling for it because we need to have real conversations about the usage of this term throughout. But this type of nonsense from an educator trying to be down, she needs to be down and out. Kelly, yeah, she was a little comfortable there. She tried it. I mean, there's not much to say here other than the fact that she was wrong and that she tried it,

and she was still wrong when she tried it. At no point should you even—any profanity in the school should be, you know, banned. I don't know how schools are set up now, but when I was in school, profanity in any regard was prohibited by students and especially teachers. So the fact that she was a faculty member at this school and still said it, regardless of what the word is, I'm just trying to get to the basics for the moment. The fact that she used profanity in school towards students in reference to herself in a personal manner, which also should not be talked about on school grounds, there's just levels of inappropriateness here that needs to be addressed. And we're not withstanding. Again, she was way too comfortable

with that word. But just from an administrative perspective and just getting to the point, she was wrong just from being a faculty member. And I don't know whether it was because she was an art teacher and she thought, you know, she has license because it's more creative space and more liberal. But again, you tried it and you failed. And as far as administrative leave, she needs to go because it was just unprofessional to do that at all. Well, there's another. Oh, boy. No charcoal grills are allowed.

I'm white. I got you, girl. Illegally selling water with our permit. On my property. Whoa! You don't live here. I'm uncomfortable. So,

let's go to Nebraska where this woman's in the grocery store, and she's a little upset. She's like, I'm not wearing my mask. I have allergies. And then she does this. That's a, um, excuse me? Excuse me. I'm coming through. She's coughing at me.

No, look at you guys, you're so cute. You're such a parent. Okay, whatever, you're such a sheep. Why don't you have a mask on? Because I don't need to have one on. I'm not sick and neither are you. Okay, but you don't have to be coughing. You don't know who's sick or not.

It's my allergies. You don't know who's sick or not by looking at somebody. Oh, you got, yeah. And so two years ago, before anybody started talking about COVID, you were okay with that, though. Going out, not knowing you were sick. Right? You don't know anything about my health. I don't.

Yeah, she's coughing on me. I have my allergies. And she got all freaked out because I'm coughing. No, she's coughing. How do you know? You don't know anything. She just said, I don't know anything about her health. You don't know anything about my health.

I actually, maybe I have a medical. Okay, everybody. I don't need to wear my health. Actually, maybe I have a medical release. I don't need to wear a mask. Why don't you have a mask on? Because I don't need to have one on. I'm not sick and neither are you. You don't know who you are. It's my allergy.

I have allergies. Oh, you've got, yeah. And so two years ago, before anybody started talking. Well, it did not take long to find out who she was. Y'all know Twitter don't play. Her name is Janine Haskovec, and people found out that she works for the company SAP. Let me take that back.

Coughing Karen used to work for SAP. This was issued. This tweet, we have reviewed the incident and confirmed that the individual in question no longer works for SAP. I keep saying, Kelly, every time one of these crazy white people lose a job, a bunch of black people should apply. And I really think we can close the unemployment gap because it's a bunch of crazy people who just. And again, this is it's just. Oh, my God. I have out his note. You are coughing on people on purpose. That video was uploaded to Reddit and it's received more than 4 million views.

Now she's looking for a J-O-B because she lost her job. She lost her job. She lost her job for being stupid. She was absolutely stupid. For me, even if we weren't in the age of COVID, what she did was unsanitary and straight wrong in any grocery store, any setting. But the fact that we are in the middle of a global pandemic, as far as I'm concerned, she's a bioweapon and she should have gotten

tackled by anybody within her vicinity. Because at this point, there is no excuse for the stupidity, for the naivete. There is no naivete as far as I'm concerned. This was dumb and this was callous and this was insidious. This was just mean for her to do something like that. And again, we're in a pandemic. You're supposed to have your mask in stores in any public setting. And you're purposely not wearing it because you allegedly have allergies.

I'm sorry, I have a lot of allergies and the mask actually helped me not get sick from pretty much anything last year because my mouth was covered and I wasn't, you know, sniffing in pollen and mold and mildew and God knows what else is in the air. So that wasn't a valid excuse either. But like I said before, she was a bioweapon. And if it were me, I mean, on a bad day, she would have gotten some hands. On a good day, she would have just gotten dragged. But it couldn't be me in that video. Absolutely.

The thing for me, Emma Congo, is these people are so, okay, fine, you don't want to wear a mask. Walk around the damn store, mind your business. When you start coughing on other people, we've seen this happen in other cases and folks were fired. And I have absolutely no mercy whatsoever for any of these people. Not one of them.

Not at all. Look, that's assault, man. I remember when the pandemic first started and there was that in Ohio, that bus driver was talking about this lady getting on and coughing and not caring. Then he died a few days later. She's doing that intentionally. And as Kelly was saying, you know, I'm surprised that more and more people are not reacting physically to these guys. But at the end of the day, it's the pandemic. You don't want to get close to these guys and we don't want to see the violence.

But we definitely need to be seeing these consequences. And so I'm glad that that SAP did that. And now our face is going to be out there. Her name is going to be seeing these consequences. And so I'm glad that SAP did that. And now her face is going to be out there. Her name is going to be out there. And just like you in the first segment, we're talking about calling attention to what Christie and all of these guys are doing. We can't let people forget the ignorance of these people. So the video's got to be retweeted.

They got to go viral because we're going to be running into these guys in the next grocery store. And if the only way they're going to learn their lesson is to lose some money, then let them lose some money. Because really, at the end of the day, there should also be some criminal charges. Because who's to say someone in her area when she was doing that, what if she did have it? And what if somebody did catch it? Wouldn't she be liable for that if it was traced back to her? They don't care about any of that

type of stuff. But hit them in that economic pocketbook. That's a good start. Sometimes a little more may need to be done, and I'm talking about charges being filed. Absolutely. What if she caught it? You know what I'm saying? It's not even about if she spread it. What if she caught it? But in their minds, they don't care. I mean,

because, look, I'll show you this here. So this is from Raw Story. They posted this about 14 minutes ago. Colorado pastor who mocked AIDS deaths and spread vaccine conspiracy theories. He's dead. COVID-19. Good riddance. COVID-19.

Wow. COVID-19. And so, oh, no, he's not the only one. Let me play this here. I'm trying to find it here. This is, again, I just want people to understand, again, these people who are putting all this COVID stuff out there, they make no sense whatsoever.

There was one woman who was, same thing, she was in a store. She was in a store. She absolutely was against mask mandates. She was in a store. She absolutely was against mask mandates. She didn't like them. She was upset. If I can find the video, man, it would be great. So she, this woman here was caught on video in a mask and was going through a medical condition. I'm not wearing a mask.

I don't care. I have it. She's an anti-masker. Oh, she's dead. She got COVID. She got COVID. So to Kelly's point, you're absolutely right. These folks who, right here, QAnon conspiracy theorist, conspiracy, conspiracist dies from COVID-19,

and Trump loving attorney accuses hospital of medical murder. Okay. I mean, but that's where we are. And so it goes beyond Kelly. These folks just, you know, stay in their lane. Just the coughing on people and flouting the rules. That's why folks are going to mask mandates because you can't trust people to do the right thing.

It shouldn't have to come to this. But unfortunately, we're here. It shouldn't take, you know, the government making you be healthier to do the right thing. But I'm all for a mask mandate. I'm all for, you know, making sure that people are getting vaccinated. I'm all for a mask mandate. I'm all for, you know, making sure that people are getting vaccinated. I'm all for a vaccine mandate because at this point, the it's not about what's the word? It's not about you just being scared at this point. It's not vaccine hesitancy. It's vaccine refusal at this point. And I don't understand why this vaccine over all the others that are likely already in your body, because you have to get them in order to work

pretty much anywhere or go to school anywhere. I don't understand why the COVID-19 vaccine is the one that people are up in arms about and ironically are saying, my body, my choice. And yet these are the most conservative people on the planet saying, my body, my choice. And further, I understand Hippocratic oaths amongst doctors, but at this point, this is like everybody's saying this is a pandemic of the unvaccinated. And at this rate, people are dying not because of covid, but because of already existing conditions. And they're not in the hospital. Ninety eight percent of the deaths, the covid deaths right now are unvaccinated. This one is 98 percent.

This woman named Veronica Wolski. This is her. This is her. She died this morning, y'all. But this is her a few months ago in a grocery store. Down here, so it's not real obvious that I'm videoing. Hello. I have a face mask on, honey.

And I have a medical exemption and a doctor's note. So I have, um, uh, somebody sent me an email. I'll get the manager, please. I have a medical exemption. Down here, so it's not real obvious. First of all, you're dressed like Zorro. You play dumb games, you get dumb prizes. I'm sorry. You've got a mask over your eyes,

but you don't want to wear a mask over your mouth. I'm sorry. But again, I'm not trying to mock her, but she died this morning of COVID. It's wow. It's wow. Look, I'm picking up where Kelly was leaving off about how these ignorant folks who are out there not caring about people are making it hard for everyone else to be able to use these hospital beds i saw a story in alabama where a man was having cardiac arrest and contact tried

to get into 43 different hospitals and couldn't get in and then and ended up dying and so these guys are so ignorant so rude and so disrespectful but now you and i'll never forget this role and i guess the name i forget you had weeks ago who said there's a difference between freedom and license. You know, you don't have the license to just do things to make other people sick and jeopardize other people's lives. And so it's unfortunate when anybody dies, we don't wish it upon anybody. But damn it, what the hell did you expect? And now you're at a point. So, yes, we got to get these mandates going. New York kids are going back to school. How many of them are going to be shut down in a week? At least they have the mask mandates right now. But we also got to protect our children as well, man. And these folks just don't care. And this is what's going to

happen. And so, yeah, we don't care that much about them. But look, they're affecting entire communities and something has to be done. And Biden needs to step it up with the mandates, period. Bottom line. And just one more thing, and it's a controversial opinion, but I'll say it anyway. I really do feel like if you are unvaccinated by choice and you contract COVID, you lose your right to get hospital care just off bat. Like if you really had every avenue at your disposal to get this vaccine and you choose not to get it because of whatever reason, I don't think you should be getting medical care. You should not be getting a hospital bed. There are people who are having heart attacks still. Other diseases still exist. Cancer still exists. Emergency still exists.

And you put yourself at risk by not getting something that is not only free and available, but is literally created to save your life and you opt out of it. You basically gave yourself a DNR by not getting the vaccine. So you should not be getting a hospital bed. So I feel like that should be taken into consideration as well by hospitals and doctors, because they are overwhelmed by people who are frankly being dumb. And it's not about shaming them. They are objectively speaking being dumb by not taking something that is for them. It does not make sense to me. And then we've got to deal with this silliness right here. Let me just hold on.

I got to... Let me just... I'm really trying, y'all. I'm really trying to deal. So Nicki Minaj is now trending because Nicki Minaj posted this on Twitter. My cousin in Trinidad won't get the vaccine because his friend got it and became impotent. His testicles became swollen. His friend was weeks away from getting married. Now the girl

called off the wedding. So just pray on it and make sure you're not comfortable with your decision. Make sure you're comfortable with your decision not bullied. 5,297 retweets, 41,100 quote tweets,

26,300 likes. Okay. Okay. Okay. Wow. First, I'm a Congo. Your cousin actually believed that bullshit? Your cousin actually believe that his boy caught COVID and now he impotent.

I think, Nikki, Nikki, Nikki, I think your cousin's boy caught some other shit.

And it's not going to clear up in time for the wedding. Real talk. Come on. Come on, dog. Come on. Wow. You may need to come at it like you did with Busta Rhymes, man. I mean, these guys, we talked about earlier in the segment, we were talking about Julius Jones and how celebrities have been stepping up.

I've been so disappointed with how celebrities have been speaking out ignorantly about the vaccine, about the mask and so on and so forth. You know, understand if you're not going to be forced, just don't say anything. All people are going to see is Nicki Minaj says the vaccine is making you impotent. And that's it. And people are going to run with that. I can't believe it. And, yeah, it's probably going to be taken down, but it's already too late. You said it was like forced.

She's trending now. Come on. It's going to be a million retweets by the time the night's over. It's all over the place. I mean, it's all. But again, though, here's my whole deal. My cousin told me his friend got the vaccine and now he impotent and the girl called away and off. Here's the deal, Kelly.

And this is just. I'm sorry. I need to fix my face. I'm sorry. This is just me. This is just me. Nicki Minaj has 22,600,000

Twitter followers. Okay? If I go to Instagram right now, right now, let me check. Nicki Minaj has 157

million Instagram followers. If you... I don't even know what she has on Facebook. If I had to pull up Facebook, I would say... let's see here. Nicki Minaj on Facebook.

I'm going to assume she's on Facebook. Nicki Minaj has $48.5 million on Facebook. Okay? Okay. So, Roland has $3.3 million between Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, YouTube. If a cousin of mine told me that his boy got the vaccine and now he's impotent and the girl called the wedding off, my ass is going to say, put your boy and his doctor on the phone

before my ass tweet that out. Because I ain't trusting my cousin's boy to inform my 3.3 million followers. In her case, her 200 million followers. I'm just saying. I might ask a couple of more questions before that tweet gets posted. Go ahead. Two things.

One, she doesn't have the journalistic integrity that you have for a plethora of reasons you ain't gotta be a journalist oh i mean you can you can be that's just space that's some hood stuff yo boy i'm talking about right now. If somebody in the hood going, hold up. Yo boy got the shot and now he impotent. First of all, has your boy shown you his vaccine card? Which shot did he get? If your boy came back and said that he got the Eli Lilly shot,

you probably, is it the Pfizer, the Moderna, or is it Johnson & Johnson? Which one you got? I'm just saying, even in the hood, you might ask two more questions before you put it on Twitter. I agree with you. And, you know, trust but verify, I agree with you. But again, this is also the same woman who is married to a convicted rapist and cannot frequent certain establishments with her husband because of the restrictions of movement that he has on his person while he's on parole or on the sex offender registry list, one of the two or both.

This is also the same woman whose brother is serving 20-something years for the rape of an 11-year-old that allegedly she is still trying to pay off the family to not talk about anymore. I say all that to say, even though it's not necessarily related, there's a couple tools missing in her toolbox, in her noggin. So this does not surprise me that she would say such a thing. It is unfortunate that she has such influence and reach and is still that dense. But here we are.

Somebody on YouTube said that boy got that hot sauce. Y'all know! Y'all know he's got a burning sensation and it's not from the Eli Lilly shot. Let me, y'all, let me go to a quick break. I'm going to

a quick break. I'm coming back. We got Jim Jones next. Let me just because I can't. Y'all watching Rolling By Unfiltered on the Blackstar Network. White supremacy ain't just about hurting black folk. Right.

We've got to deal with it. It's injustice. It's wrong. I do feel like in this generation, we've got to do more around being intentional and resolving conflict. You and I have always agreed. Yeah. But we agree on the big piece.

Yeah. Our conflict is not about destruction. But we agree on the big piece. Yeah. Our conflict is not about destruction. Conflict's gonna happen. What's up, y'all? I'm Will Packer. Hello, I'm Bishop T.D.J. What up?

Lana Well, and you are watching Rolling Martin Unfiltered. on Flutter. All right. A lot of people, of course, doing their best to get fit. We're coming out of the summer. We're now going into people, of course, doing their best to get fit. We're coming out of the summer. We're now going into winter, of course, and folks are about to really get themselves going, trying to work through their workout routines.

But there's questions here. There's some people who are questioning, should they actually, what should they do? Is it workout? Is it change diet? Or should they actually, what should they do? Is it a workout? Is it a changed diet? Or should they actually get the surgery to actually reduce your weight? I was just joking on a live stream a couple weeks ago with Pastor

Jamal Bryant and Pastor William Murphy, also a senior. And Pastor Murphy has gone from two, I think he said in the video, 278 down to 225. And he said, look, I just could not, I couldn't do it as a result of weight loss and changing my diet. He said, I had the surgery. And he also said people need to be open and honest.

If they have a surgery, don't front like they just lost it themselves. Watch this. said people need to be open and honest if they have a certain no front like they just lost it themselves uh watch this some of y'all don't know this but i recently had a weight loss procedure i went from 278 pounds to 225 pounds turn up what i'm about to come off of these diabetes pills, coming off these high blood pressure pills, and I will never have another battle with gout. So are you on liquids? You only on liquids? No, but I had to eat because I had to take medicine for the gout. Okay, so where are we now?

This is where we at. And get this, I'm eating salmon fillets, I'm eating eggs, and I'm eating sweet potatoes, and what else? Peppers and onions. All right, joining us right now is Jim Jones, of course, a fitness guru. Jim, glad to have you on the show.

First of all, I need to send a ticket to your house because that shot right now is really horrible. I don't know whether it's a cheap-ass computer camera you're using or whatever, but it looks foggy as hell. I mean. Roman, you switched over to Skype today. You threw me off a little bit. We usually do the other, you know, the Apple software. We're Skyping today, so I don't know what's going on, Roller, man. You do know they have Skype app on the phone.

Yeah, yeah. I'm just saying. I just want to let you know, it's a horrible ass shot. You look like it's foggy. I don't know what's going on. Yeah, me neither, Roller, man. I'm traveling right now. I'm on my home Wi-Fi. So, man, you got to go.

Oh, right, right, right. It's the Wi-Fi. No, it's not. It's the Wi-Fi? No, it's the vaccine. The vaccine. The vaccine, like, like,. Yes, yes.

Oh, the vaccine has infected your computer, and it led to your raggedy-ass picture. OK, got it. All right. OK. So let's talk about this here. So look, there are a lot of people and it led to your raggedy-ass picture. Okay, got it. All right. Okay, so let's talk about this here. So, look, there are a lot of people who have actually had the surgery.

What Murphy said was, he said, I tried. He said, I tried to do the dieting. I tried to do the workout. He said, I needed this to spark me. And he said he's focused with his eating plan everything like that. And so just your thoughts on it. Yes, I think is wrong. First of all, I'm not against the BBL so I want to tell you I'm not against it. But what I want

people to know when you get his weight loss surgery is the real cost behind right. So we're all average about $6,000 for BBL the weight loss surgery. People factor into it if you don't change your lifestyle in 5 years to pay that $6,000 over and over again. So people, they're actually taking out a mortgage, right? If you don't make that lifestyle change, you're going to get to get that same weight loss surgery over and over again. And second, I tell people more than likely, you don't know how to work out properly for the surgery. So you're going to have to hire a trainer or a fitness professional to show you how to work out. So that's another $5,000 a year.

So people don't understand that. After these surgeries, there are more costs to them. If you don't change your lifestyle, it's pointless to get the surgery. You'll be paying the bill over and over again, Roman. people to say, look, if you get the surgery, you're still going to have to make eating adjustments in order to keep the weight off. Because if you start adding that weight, depending upon

that surgery, it's going to show up in some other areas of your body. Absolutely wrong. People are understanding that, yes, you can get the surgery, but if you go back to your same lifestyle, if you don't make that lifestyle change, you're going to be, you just wasted that money, right? You'll see people, they'll get the surgery, but if you go back to your same lifestyle, if you don't make that lifestyle change, you're going to be – you just wasted that money, right? You'll see people, they'll get the surgery like you said, and they'll gain the weight and weight and go places that you – it'll go back to places that you don't want it to go to. So eventually, you're going to have to go to that gym.

You're going to have to change that diet. You cannot avoid the gym and the diet. You can delay it, but you cannot avoid it. And so that's how I want people to know. When you get these surgeries, these Brazilian butt lifts, these different weight loss surgeries, understand, you're still going to that gym whether you like it or not. And you're still going to have to eat right whether you like it or not. Or you're going to be paying that bill over and over again,

$6,000 every three years for the surgery. But I do want to talk about, though, that if you do have the surgery, and I take it you probably have had clients who've had the surgery. And let's just be honest. There are some people who that is the only option they have. And you know what? If you make that decision and say, I'm going to get that particular surgery, former Congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. and his sister, Santina Jackson, both of them had the particular surgery.

I think I remember former Jackson, then former Congressman, he and I were having breakfast. He was talking about I think he had gotten up to 254. And he was just like, yo, I just couldn't. He was like, I had to have the surgery. And then after he did, you know, intensive workouts, things along those lines. And so that is a reality. But there still is a plan that you're going to have to follow for the rest of

your life after you have the surgery. Exactly, Roland. That's the thing. People don't understand. So what I always tell people is contact a fitness professional before you get the surgery to kind of get that plan for that rollback to recovery so you know. I want people to really know that it's fine to get the surgery. I'm not against the surgery.

I'm like you said, that's the only option for a lot of people with the thing is though contact the fitness or health professional have a plan surgery with no plan that's what I'm against rolling out surgery with the plan, okay with the future to go to the surgery and not really have a map that hired a change in life that's the problem I have. Questions from my panelists Kelly first for Jim Jones. Sure.

So in full transparency, I am one of those people who had weight loss surgery. I had the gastric sleeve almost 10 years ago. And from my heaviest to my lowest, I lost like 130, 140 pounds. You know, have I gained all the weight back? No. Am I as small as I was? Also no. But there are factors at play with that. But at the same time, you still have, before you even get the surgery, one, you have to lose weight on your own before you get the surgery. And two, you have to go in with a plan. That includes a mental plan being therapy, a physical plan being the exercise, and you need a support team, all of those things. I guess my question to you is, when it comes to weight loss, anything, how do you think we can break up the stigma

of weight loss surgery, not BBL, because that's more cosmetic, but like people who really actually needed it, because I needed it, because I also have PCOS. And there are people out there who have underlying conditions where you so much as think of bread and you gain five pounds. So, you know, how do you break the stigma of not only weight loss, but weight maintaining? Absolutely. No, that's a great question. You know, I tell you, in the Black community, I think we got to focus on education, right? People go for BBLs. That's at the forefront of when people think of surgery. But like you said, there's healthy weight loss surgery. So what we have to do is educate people, right? And I tell people, get on social media. Those people who are just popping back out saying they lost their weight,

they went in a gym, that's a false narrative, right? So I tell people, get on social media. Those people who are just popping back out saying they lost the weight, they went in a gym, that's a false narrative, right? So I really, I try to just rail down on the education. Like, listen, there are different types of, like you said, different types of surgery. Let's get away from the BBLs, right? Because that's looked at as a quick fix. But let's look at, like you said, the weight loss surgery that you had that a lot of people should get and have a plan, right? So we just got to just focus on education and changing that Instagram narrative, right? I think that social media sometimes can taint our community and have us focus on the wrong thing. On the Congo. So keeping it in the social media realm, because you're out there crushing it in that world as well,

I want to ask about the young kids, right, who are seeing some of their celebrities and the like coming out, looking a particular way, not knowing that they had that type of surgeries. Do you think that it's an obligation on people out there who are influencers to speak openly about it? Because some of them are just coming out with this look as if they did it all on their own. And maybe they can share some lessons with young people about this. What are your thoughts on that? Yeah, so my thoughts are, I think with the surgery, we got to have full transparency. Like I said, there's nothing wrong with it, right? So I think that we have to get to a space within the Black community where it's looked at to be comfortable to talk about surgery, right? I think people do it now. They kind of do it like it's a magic trick, like, oh, here I am,

I'm popping back out. I'm back out here. I'm back outside, new body, new being. But it's okay to be transparent. Let people know because this is the thing. If we don't have the education and we're not giving the youth the truth on that, they're going to think that they can just go get a quick BBL, pop out, get Instagram followers or be liked or be accepted. So I think, like you said, it's just like mental health. There's got to be full transparency with people who have had surgery, right? And people who have had it are going to have to come out and say, like,

hey, you know, I had the surgery. This is how I did it, but I have a plan, right? And be kind of realistic about the recovery. All right, Jim Jones, let's be breaching. Listen, if they need a surgery meal plan, they can holler at me, Jim Jones, G-Y-M-J-O-N-E-Z on Instagram. If you need a meal plan, I'll give you a free one. Just get a plan if you get the surgery.

All right, then. Jim Jones, we certainly appreciate it. Thank you so very much. All right, folks. That is it for us. We appreciate it. Kelly, I'm a Congo. Thank you for joining us on our panel today, as well as all of our guests.

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