#RolandMartinUnfiltered - DeSantis Map Sued in Florida. Tennessee Targets Black District. FBI Raids Louise Lucas

Episode Date: May 7, 2026

5.6.2026 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: DeSantis Map Sued in Florida. Tennessee Targets Black District. FBI Raids Louise Lucas Florida Democrats are suing over the congressional map that Governor Ron DeSantis signed into law. I will speak with the founder of the organization that filed the lawsuit. Tennessee's proposed map splits the state's 9th Congressional District and divides the only majority-Black congressional seat in Memphis. I will talk to two Tennessee lawmakers about this illegal gerrymandering effort. The FBI has executed a search warrant on the offices and business of Virginia lawmaker Louise Lucas, who led the state's redistricting effort. We will examine a new report highlighting that Tarrant County, Texas, sentences Black individuals to death at a disproportionate rate. A Black pastor claims he knows the real reason Christians disapprove of the twice-impeached, criminally convicted felon-in-chief, Donald "The Con" Trump.  You will not believe his reasoning.  And we will pay tribute to former Oklahoma State Representative and civil rights leader Don Ross. Download the Black Star Network app at http://www.blackstarnetwork.com! We're on iOS, AppleTV, Android, AndroidTV, Roku, FireTV, XBox and SamsungTV. The #BlackStarNetwork is a news reporting platform covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Folks, so that's Wednesday, May 6, 2026 coming up on Roland Martin Unfiltered, streaming live on the Black Star Network. Republicans in their war on Black America continues when Florida Democrats are now suing over the congressional map that Governor Ronald Santis signed into law. We'll talk with the founder of the organization that filed that lawsuit. In Tennessee, they're proposing to split Shelby County, where Memphis is, into three congressional districts and split Nashville into five congressional districts. I'll talk to two Tennessee lawmakers about this illegal gerrymandering effort. The FBI has executed a search warrant on the offices and business of Virginia lawmakers, Senator Louise Lucas, who led the state's redistricting effort. We'll examine a new report highlighting that Tarrant County, Texas sentences black people to death in a disproportionate. rate than anyone else.

And a black pastor claims he knows the real reason Christians are speaking about twice impeached criminally convicted felon in chief Donald Khan Trump. Hmm, that's gonna be interesting. And we'll pay tribute to former Oklahoma State Representative and Civil Rights Leader Don Ross, who passed away.

It's time to bring the funk. I'm Roller Mark Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. Let's go. Article concerning the new congressional maps signed into law by Governor Ron DeSantis. Democratic voters and African Americans, plus a voter rights organization are challenging, the map, which could potentially allow Republicans to gain up to four additional seats. The National Redisting Foundation and the Elias Law Group filed a lawsuit in Florida's Second Judicial

Circuit Court on Monday. They are representing the Equal Ground Education Fund and several Democratic voters shortly after the Sanders approved the map. Jasmine Bernie Clark, the founder of Equal Ground, joins us right now. Jasmine, glad to have you on the show. What is the basis of a lawsuit that y'all have found? What legal argument are y'all making? New congressional map that was proposed here driven by Governor Ron DeSantis and then passed by the legislature, which they chose to go along with in a partisan fashion. It clearly violates Florida's Fair District amendments. If folks are not familiar with that, Florida is one of the most unique states in the nation where voters put on the ballot in 2010. Two amendments, the first one requires that you cannot dilute the political strength of a group of individuals based on.

on their race. They should be able to vote for the candidate of their choice as a group. And the second one is that you cannot draw maps for partisan benefit or to benefit one party over another. And so what Ron DeSantis did was he published a map that essentially made its way on the Fox News that was red and blue, all red and a few speckles of blue.

It was a clearly partisan map. It has a 86% projection. that Republicans will win congressional seats this coming fall, 24 to be exact, and four Democratic seats. That's down from eight original Democratic seats to four Democratic seats, increasing the Republicans' chances of winning those seats this fall. And so our primary basis is that it's unconstitutional. It's partisan gerrymandering. The lawsuit argues that it violates our state's fair district's amendments by being drawn to favor one political party over another. So here's what jumps out. They're also screwing over Hispanic voters in Florida.

What are they saying? Because I'll be honest, Jasmine, all I've seen so far, and maybe they're speaking, all I've seen so far are black folks who are challenging this. You know, we have residents from across the state of Florida who represent a diverse network of individuals. They aren't just black folks. They're black and brown people.

There are some white individuals who are. part of this lawsuit, but everyone is impacted by this lawsuit. Whether you are white, black, or brown, Democrat or Republican, you are impacted by having your voices diluted at the polls and also having our state pick its elected officials versus voters picking their elected officials. The governor made this decision in secrecy and in private without citizens to tell you who's going to represent you. And that's not the way this process should work. So it's, the lawsuit is made a number of different individuals, and the work we do is in coalition with Brack and Brown folks across the state. Now, explain the people about this Florida law. You say that they have broken.

When did that start? When did that go into effect? So in 2010, a citizen ballot initiative was introduced on our ballots. In order for a ballot initiative to be introduced, you have to obtain a percentage of signatures across the state of Florida, upwards of million signatures in order for them to be vetted by the Supreme Court and then for the Supreme Court to also approve that language. And then once it makes it onto the ballot, you then have to obtain 60% or more of the vote in order to get it passed. That's more than what is required to win governor in the state of Florida. And more than 60% of voters said we want fair districts. We want these amendments. And so again, what they do is they ensure that you do not create or the legislature does not create a map that

favors one political party over another. And it does not create a map. map that dilutes or takes away representation from a very specific group of individuals based on the racial demographics. So that is what the amendment is. And let me also be clear, the United States Supreme Court points to Florida as an example of what other states should and could be doing to help protect them around the gerrymandering that is happening in their states, or at least that was the previous reference. We now know legislatures across the state or across the country are doing quite the opposite.

of what was previously recommended to them. Well, the issue that doubt, was the lawsuit filed in state court or federal court? It was found in state court because the fair districts and amendments are here in the state of Florida. And obviously, the issue you have there is that you have a Supreme Court that is packed by Republicans. And when Rhonda Santis ignored the legislature and drew his own maps in 2022, wiping out two black districts, the Supreme Court allowed him to move forward with that. Yes, that is correct. I think what we really should take a look at this time around,

and I've been saying this to a lot of different folks is that I don't think all is lost. This map is a map of a projection. It is not a map of ultimate outcome. This is what Florida Republicans are projecting that they will win this fall. They will win 24 of the 28th, congressional districts in this state. However, voters have an opportunity to flip those projections

on their head. They have an opportunity to change the direction that Governor Ronda Santos thinks that this election is going to go in. They have a ton of evidence and reasons why they should not be supporting a governor who has taken away their ability to elect the candidate of their choice. In addition to the fact that Florida is now in its second month of unemployment below the national average under a Trump. Pride is like love. You feel it in your heart. IR. Radio.

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country and the war that tore America apart. This is for Vietnam. I've taken a hit from Japanese ground fire. They're pouring petrol all over him. He's holding matches. Saigon, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Rob Benedict. Sting, here's madness. The world should hear about this.

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You meet the president? You think Canada has a president? You think China has a president? Does that all the cruzette. God, I love that thing. I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus.

Yep. It was a good one. I like that saying. It is an actual Polish saying. It is an actual Polish saying. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift who said that for the first time.

I actually thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick Dick and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We are dealing with a housing crisis, insurance costs. We're dealing with what everyday folks in Floridians have been dealing with for a long time under this administration. My hope is that they will take those issues and concerns with them into the ballot box. And again, look at this as a projection, not a final outcome. All right then, Jasmine, Bernie Clark.

We appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you for having me. Bringing in my panel, Rebecca Carothers, President, CEO, Fair Election Center out of D.C., Robert Petillo, Civil Rights Attorney, the Batilla Law Group out of Atlanta, Joy Cheney, founder, Joy Strategies out of D.C., glad to have all three of you here. Robert, I'll start with you. Look, the Supreme Court is doing all they can.

These six right-wing Supreme Court justices to do the work of Republicans, they're aiding and abetting of them left and right. But the reality is, you still have to abide by laws. Now, in the case of Tennessee, they're trying to actually change the law that stops them from doing mid-decade gerrymandering. and Governor Ron DeSendant has to go up against this

as the point I made to, I guess. The problem here is this right-wing Supreme Court typically goes along with whatever the governor wants. You're completely correct. And the problem with the voting rights issue that we have right now is many of us have been yelling into the void for the last 25 years that this is coming. My first major action as a civil rights activist

was working with Reverend Jackson as a college intern on the reauthorization of the voting rights set back in 2005. And even back then, we were telling people that they are forming this failings to bring down voting rights. We told them after Shelby v. Holder, we have to pass legislation that will buttress the voting rights at. We told them during the Biden administration. We have to pass the John Lewis freedom to vote at right now because this is coming.

Well, now it is here. And the Republicans have been working for the past 20 years, one, to stack state and local legislatures. The same way that Donald Trump interfered with the Indiana state house and state Senate primary yesterday is how we need national Democrats coming in to buttress these state and local races so we can start taking back these state houses. The same way that they have been pushing the judiciary on the federal level to stack it with young Heritage Foundation MAGA-aligned judges, people who are 29, 30 years old who will be on the bench on the federal bench or remainder of their lives, we need to be doing the exact same thing because now we're in the uphill

battle. Now they're in the catbird seat and we're going to have to fight back. And the only thing that beats this is massive levels of voter mobilization. You want to split up Memphis, you want to split up Nashville, you want to split up New Orleans, you want to split up every single black district. Okay, we will go and we will get black registration numbers up to 70 or 80 percent. We'll get turnout numbers up to Obama 2012 or Biden, 2020 numbers. And we will make you come and campaign to these communities and explain to them while getting rid of DEI, while firing 300,000 black women, while ending criminal justice reform is in their best interest. Because guess what?

The next time Democrats are in power, we are going to be expecting them to wield every tool of the federal government, the same way we're seeing the extreme mega project 2025 agenda do so, because we have to pass the type of laws that will prevent this from happening for another 50 or 100 years. We see now that everything that we told everyone was true the whole time, as you will say, we tried to tell you that this was coming. And that was no time to sit, no time to cry, no time to talk about what had happened. We need people to pay as much attention to the destruction of the voting rights set

as they paid attention to destruction of Meg Nostalian and Clay Thompson's relationship. We need to have a massive social media presence, a massive media presence. And we need to be fighting right now to win in the midterms this fall, to win in 2028, and to get these laws reversed before the end of this decade. because if we allow this to become entrenched, we will have a permanent maga majority at every level of government. Rebecca, you were the Fair Election Center.

You want fair elections, what Republicans want are guaranteed wins. You know, Roland, I was up in Hill last week representing Fair Election Center, testifying, testifying in support of full-throat voting rights in this country for everyone, regardless of political affiliation, regardless of race,

regardless of what zip code you live in, because we firmly believe that if you are eligible to vote and you register the vote and you cast your ballot, your ballot indeed should be counted. Full stop. Every person in this country also want that. This is a nonpartisan issue. But what we're seeing is this is a power grab issue. Something that I also want to remind folks is remembering Rahm and Manuel's part in this in the 2010 census and redistricting effort that he led on behalf of the White House of convincing black elected officials across the south to give up some of their parts of their district in order to grow the Democratic map.

And so what happened was you saw an increase in Democratic Sikhs across the South up and down the ballot, but you also saw a weakening or a dilution of the concentration of black voters in those respective districts. And so as a result of that, you saw an increase, over, what, 40 percent increase, and CBC members across the country. So yes, that was a good thing, but at what cost? Previously, we had CBC districts

that were 65, 70% black. Now we have some CBC districts are 40 or 45% black. And it is those CBC districts are in danger. One thing I do want to point out, Robert is right. This has been decades in the making, but I want to point out that this is

the Chief Justice Roberts Court. And under this Roberts Court, we know in 1982, that Roberts wrote him saying he wanted to end the voting rights act. He wanted to get rid of it full stop. So now we see as a result of 44 years of planning and cunningness, we see that the voting rights act is effectively no more.

You know, Joy, the point Rebecca made there, Cornell Belcher often talked about that in terms of how do you expand the map for Democrats, because if you do that, yeah, you lessen your black voters in those CBC districts, but if that then wins Democrats to House, those CBC members actually have more power than they are in the minority. What you're seeing here, though, is what you're seeing are Republicans who want to completely wipe all those seats out. They're not weakening.

They're not weakening congressional districts. They're wiping them out. We're going to talk a little bit later about Tennessee. Again, they're trying to split Memphis into Shelby County into three congressional districts. Nashville, where they previously gerrymandered that, Nashville was split amongst three Republican districts, Now Nashville will be split among five Republican district, district if this map goes into effect.

And I just think that from the Democratic side, you have to play absolute hardball. You cannot, you cannot try to be nice and fair about this. And if Republicans go to the mat, and if Alabama wipes out both districts there, if Mississippi wipes out Benny Thompson, if Tennessee wipes out that district. South Carolina is saying they're not going to move on Clyburn District now,

but they might do it in the next cycle. I think California has to go 52 to zero. I think California, Illinois, New York State, they've got to go complete, do the exact same thing because what we also got to recognize is that 2030, when the census is taken, it's projected that those blue states, California, New York State and Illinois are going to lose congressional seats,

and 11 of those congressional seats are going to move to the south. So this is really this battle is a 2026 battle, but it's also a 2030, 2032 and beyond battle. That's right. So we, you know, Roland is his usual completely zero to end of what the issue is. For those out there who are like me who don't like to see this partisan germaneering. I'm from Florida. So I'm glad that we have the law in Florida, and I hope that the Supreme Court in Florida

will uphold it. Of course, we already know that they may not. But at the very least, they have the possibility of doing so because we have a law in the books that disfavors these partisan maps and says that they are unconstitutional. That said, moving forward, we are going to have to have some partisan gerrymandering just to make sure we do not have a power grab that is complete by the Republican Party, which thinks it has the corner on who votes and how they vote. I'm not sure sure that's correct.

I'm not so sure this is going to work out for them. You made the point earlier about the fact that they might be losing some Latino districts. They might be losing some other districts that might actually have gone for them. I think that they are going to also upset some white people who may vote in a surprising way for candidates in those areas who may not look like they're always expecting. I think the CBC is making the case that there are many districts where white people, where black people can absolutely win in majority white districts, and we cannot leave anything off the table.

But what their intention is is to make it impossible to have black and Latino leaders at the CBC and the CAC at the numbers that they are now. They see that as an existential threat to them. And so that is what they're going for, and Democrats have to respond in kind. And then after that, I do think we have to look at how we got ourselves in this situation. and how we get out. But if we wait, if we try to play the high road, if we try to pretend like the, you know, they're not gonna have since the shenanigans

that are going to mean that they shift more power to the South, you know, we will never catch up. Right. They cannot win on their ideas. They have to steal the election. Yep. And we have to be willing to overcome it. All right, I gotta go to a break.

We come back. We're going to talk more about what's happening. We're gonna talk about what's happening in Tennessee. Alabama is also making their moves as well when it comes to these districts. Lots to break down. You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. On a next, a balanced life with me, Dr. Jackie, a relationship that we have to have.

We're often afraid of it and don't like to talk about it. That's right. We're talking about our relationship with money. And here's the thing. Our relationship with money oftentimes determines whether we have it or not. Balancing your relationship with your pocketbook. That's next on a balanced life with me, Dr. Jackie, here at Black Star Network. This is Bill Duke, and you're watching the Black Star Network.

Boy, be shameful, despicable Donald Trump, Department of Justice continues to do what they do. This morning, the FBI raided the offices of Senate, Virginia Senate President Pro Tem, Louise Lucas, the Democratic leader who played a key role in the redistricting effort there, facing allegations of corruption. The FBI executed multiple search warrants in Port Smith, Virginia, targeting both her office and the cannabis dispensary. She co-owns next door. Lucas has been a strong advocate for marijuana legalization.

However, in 2022, her business was found by the Virginia Mercury to be selling Delta 9 THC, which is illegal to sell in Virginia. Additionally, many products in her store were discovered to be mislabeled. Now, Lucas is known for her. combative presence on social media where she shares means supporting Virginia's democratic efforts and engages in strong confrontations with Republicans, including Donald Trump and Senator Ted Cruz. Now, they conducted this raid.

Now, of course, Fox News was present, which means that they were tipped off by this before. Now, you have different statements that have been sent, than posted, And so I want to share some of those with you to see what is being said by folks. Now, Abigail Spanberger, the governor of Virginia, her office declined to comment because of this investigation. Now, according to the Washington Post, the DOJ claims that this investigation began under President Biden. Again, we are talking about the Don Trump White House, and so frankly, it's hard to believe anything that they say. Don Scott, who is the Virginia Speaker of the House, issued this statement.

Let's start with the he said Speaker of the Virginia House of Delegates, Don Scott, released the following statement regarding today's FBI raid involving Senator Louise Lucas. Let's start with this. Senator L. Louise Lucas has not been charged with anything. I am deeply concerned by today's FBI raid, given the politicization of this. administration, and FBI led by Cash Patel and the Justice Department run by President Donald Trump's former personal attorney, I think people should take this with a grain of salt and allow the facts to come out before jumping to conclusions. At this point, we simply do not know what this ultimately means. Right now, there is far more theatrics and speculation than actual information

available to the public. It also raises important questions. How was Fox News, a national media outlet, first on the scene. A national, do they know about the raid beforehand? If so, who approved that? And what more information is there about this raid was actually about. Virginia's deserve answers before anyone rushes to political conclusions. Again, that was Virginia Speaker of the House, Don Scott with his statement regarding this raid of the home and the offices, the cannabis business of Senator Luis Lucas.

Now, that was that statement. So other statements were released. Congressman Bobby Scott of Virginia. He said this, while we await the full facts of the investigation, it must be acknowledged that this FBI raid occurs in the broader context of President Trump's repeated abuse of the Department of Justice to target his perceived political opponents. It should be noted that this is occurring just two weeks after Senator Lucas helped lead the successful effort by Virginia voters to reject President Trump's attempt to rid the midterm

elections. This raid on Senator Lucas's office and businesses also comes. as President Trump has pressured the Department of Justice to pursue investigations and prosecutions against New York Attorney. No, God, go back to my iPad. Thank you. The raid on Senator Lucas's office and businesses also comes as President Trump has pressured the Department of Justice

to pursue investigations and prosecutions against New York Attorney General, Latisha James, former FBI director James Comey, and Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell, and multiple Democratic members of Congress. Like all Americans, Senator Lucas has a right to due process and a presumption of innocence. Look, both of them are absolutely correct.

I can tell you right now, I trust nothing, absolutely nothing from this Department of Justice. Donald Trump is all about targeting his opponents, and Rebecca, there's no doubt that he is seething at Senator Louise Lucas for what happened in Virginia? Yeah, you know, he's Big Mac, and guess what? If I was a betting person, like maybe some of his family members in betting the polymarket, I would bet on the senator.

I think she's going to be just fine. She understands that this is a political attack because of the work that she's doing in Virginia. I find it really interesting. Like even last week, there are folks who didn't really understand that she's the reason why there's going to be the type of representation in Virginia that, that, you know, it will now be as a result of those maps. They didn't realize it was a black woman behind it. And so, you know, this administration has shown its willingness to attack and go after black women, to malign

black women, to call black people, period, low IQ. And in this, you know, I think the person with a high IQ is the senator, and she'll be just fine. Joy. Robert. Look, brother, and we all know what this is. This is a brazen political attack on his enemies. And we've seen that above all else, the one thing the President Donald Trump is afraid of are black women. You can see him going after Latisha James, going after Bill and Mosby, going after Fannie Willis, going after Stacey Abrams, going after Kamala Harris. This is part of his ethos. This is part of the white nationalism budding directly into misogyny that creates kind of the cornucopia of bigotry.

than is Trumpism. This idea that there's no way that a black woman can talk that to him or criticize him or stand up to him because he believes they are fundamentally lower than him. Look at the 20th century philosophers, Simone de Beauvoir in her similar work, Second Sex.

He talks about the fundamental othermism of women within the society at that time. This, of course, is coming out of the school thought of Kantism, which is also spurred upon by John Paul Sarder and Franz Fanon. But in her work, the second sex, she talks about this fact that even within these spaces, even with the same accolades, even with the same achievements, the white male power structure will still see women as being fundamentally other to all aspects of society, not so much as being less than, this idea that they can never be fully part of the group. If you put that together with the teachings of Phenon, when they talk about the need to break apart from the fundamental shackles of oppression, you'll see what of this feeling.

complex is created around white nationalists or around misogynists where they are terrified of the idea there's someone who does not come from their great western civilization pride is like love you feel it in your heart iR radio Canada's number one streaming app for radio and podcasts including iHeart pride Canada your favorite hits and must have party bangers plus personalized and curated playlists like back in the day pride come together celebrate love take pride with you anytime, anywhere. Just ask your smart speaker to play IHeart Pride Canada.

Stream us on your phone or listen now at iHeartRadio.ca. Number one hits, millions of records sold. Awards, sold out tours. You think that Jonas Brothers are satisfied? Nope, it's podcast time. We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired

of being asked questions. Hey, Jonas is available now and their first guest is a big one. Paul Rudd. You know, Steve Carell is a great singer. Can you tell you not to audition at the office or something? told him.

Whoa. We were filming Anchorman. Clearly, I was the idiot. Thank God he didn't listen to me, right? Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Saigon, the story of my family and of the country that shaped us. The United States will not stand by and allow any power, however great, take over another country. From IHeart Podcast, Saigon.

Please allow me to introduce Joseph Sherman. You don't think I'm seriously. about a free Vietnam? I should stop talking so much. I like hearing you talk. One city, a divided country, and the war that tore America apart. This is for Vietnam. I've taken a hit from Japanese ground fire.

Do you rate me? They're pouring petrol all over him. He's holding matches. I'm on a landmine. For free time. Let's get out. Freedom from Vietnam. Saigon, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Rob Benedict.

Sting, here's madness. The world should hear about this. There's a fire coming to this country, and it's going to burn out everything. Listen to Saigon on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the future of humanity, the hosts always act like they know what they're talking about, and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll Show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Coogler did that I think was so unique. Who's he?

He's the writer-director. Who do you think he is? I don't know. You meet the president? You think Canada has a president. You think China has a president? The law crusade. God, I love that thing.

I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. It was a good one. I like that saying. It is an actual Polish saying. It is an actual Polish saying.

Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift who said that for the first time. I actually, I thought it was.

I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And as they call it, come from their same

Northern European genetics can actually stand up to them, intellectually, stand up to them legally and beat them. This is why they go after DEI. This is why they go after programs of affirmative action.

It's not that they want the meritocracy. They simply think, they are too good to even be part of this conversation. I think these charges will, of course, be dismissed out of hand. This idea somehow that you're going to go after this woman for a CBD, Delta-9 business, while we're giving billions of dollars the tax breaks to the marijuana industry, I think we know exactly what this is, where this will go,

but it's very important that it does not deter us. It does not scare us. It does not stop us from launching these fights against the extreme far-right MAGA agenda, because at the end of the day, they can't arrest us all. If we all stand united, then smoke your Delta 9, smoke you delta 10s. Go ahead and support this senator because we have to stand up against this agenda. Well, look, there's no doubt. And listen, they're going to try to do all they can.

And again, I don't trust anything from this Department of Justice. All right, folks, let's talk about what's happening. Tennessee. First of all, I would say Tennessee is ground zero, but it's not really ground zero because these nutcase Republicans are doing all they can to attack black folks all across the South as a result of the Supreme Court decision in the Louisiana v. Calais case. In Tennessee, first, they are trying to subvert a law that doesn't allow mid-decade gerrymandering. Yeah. Now, what they've done today is they've released a map that splits the states. 9th congressional district and divides Tennessee's only majority black congressional seat located in Memphis. Now, the new map designates three districts in Memphis, or Shelby County, with two extending all the way to Williamson County, some 200 miles away just outside of Nashville. As a result, Nashville and its surrounding areas have been divided into five districts up from four. A special session convened by Governor Bill Lee began on Tuesday.

Lawmakers are expected to move quickly as the timeline for adopting a new congressional map ahead of the 2026 midterms is very tight. Procedurally, bills must be discussed on multiple days, making it unlikely they will be adjourned before May 7th unless rules are suspended or modified. And Republicans, well, they got a supermajority because they can do whatever they want. Journal of us now is Tennessee State Representative Gloria Johnson. We also have London Lamar, Tennessee State Senate Democratic Caucus Chair, who, who, represents the state's largest black population. Let me have both of y'all here. The thing that just jumps out at me,

that jumps out at me, when we look at this here, London, is that they don't give a damn about the people. They don't care. I mean, their whole deal is, we don't care what y'all say. Y'all could come here, protest, do whatever. We do not care.

We do not care. and they would do whatever they want and you've had people coming to the coming protesting and doing all that sort of stuff those things have been happening and so they've got to feel maximum pressure on this issue absolutely and one thing I want to tell you

is we're going to bring all the pressure and the smoke this week especially tomorrow when this final vote's happening look I am appalled at the decision of my colleagues to call us back to a special session just over a week after we already dismissed regular session to do the unthinkable. Before the ink is even dry on the Supreme Court decision, they're already chipping away at Memphis

voters for their own benefit. And this is one of the most racist actions that is ever being taken in modern legislative history here. To simply act like and deny that you are stripping away a community's voting power for your own benefit is egregious. But I'm not shocked because my Republican colleagues are heartless. This past legislation, they already took

over our school system. They already took our airport authority. They already sent the National Guard in our city. Now they stripping away our votes. This is a pattern of diluting black political power in our state for a greater white agenda and for control. And what I

want to say to the people is why the numbers may be stacked against us, why they may have already decided in the in the rooms that they're going to pass this bill. That doesn't mean that we can't raise hell while we are here. And that's all the attentions we have tomorrow before this vote is placed. We want the world to know that we are not walking away quietly, that we are going to call them out on this racist political power graph

that they are implemented on the Memphis community. Representative Johnson, you literally call this white power. Yes. I mean, I don't call it a special session. it's a white power rally. It's about them collecting as much power they can for our white supermajority. I mean, that's what it is. Senator Lamar is correct. And she, you know, she was questioning someone. I was watching her committee from a TV screen because they didn't even allow members in the Senate Judiciary Committee to be present when it was happening. So she was asking pretty simple questions of another senator,

and he was so arrogant and basically refused to answer the questions, a simple question with a simple answer, and trying to deny all culpability for maps that he drew. He did admit to drawing the maps, but just playing dumb on what they were doing. It's disgusting.

These are folks who cannot win a fair fight. And so they want to rig these maps. and they want to rig these maps by taking away power. And as Senator Lamar said, diluting the power of the black voters in the Shelby County area. And that is egregious. It is absolutely disqualifying. It is absolutely racist.

And, you know, our speaker in the House today this morning, before we all even got here, printed out what he called the new map for Tennessee. and it was just a solid red map. You know, he's completely denying that 30 to 40% of voters in Tennessee are Democrats. They have no representation. According to him, everything's red. It is remarkable.

The arrogance and the feigned ignorance they have about these maps that they're presenting and trying to pretend as if we are not seeing, what's happening right before our very eyes. You know, with more than 35% of the vote in Tennessee, out of non-congessional districts, we should have three. But they have gerrymandered them all away. In this last ditch effort to cut up Memphis is so blatant and so racist and so devious,

it is disgusting. It's disgusting to be in a room with these people. The Tennessee Holler posted this video here. This is, this is Representative Justin Jones challenging the Speaker of the House, Cameron and Sexton. Listen to this. I know you feel like speaking about talking to Cameron Sexton. It is wrong, Cameron.

It is wrong. And he's going to talk. Not well on what you're doing in this moment. It's racist. It is racist. It is racist. That's not my chairman. Oh, you hate that.

I mean, they're literally just a ocean I hate. Just an ocean I hate. I mean, they're literally just laughing about this here. I want to play this. I want to play this other video here. Disposed. Give me one sec. Guys, pull the audio down, please.

I want to play this other video here. This is literally, State Representative William Lambeth actually saying that, oh, that he didn't know Memphis was majority black. Oh, my God. Listen to this. I'm not privy to those demographic cameras. DCA2-16-102.

This says we are allowed to enter into this conversation. Now here's what's all so strange here. First of all, I'm not privy to those demographics. Like, where in the hell have you been living? But London, let me explain to me this here. How does the Louisianaverse-Cale case, how does that impact Tennessee? So actually, the night congressional district wasn't necessarily drawn to aligns the Voting Rights Act. It was drawn because that's the way it's been for over 100 years.

They try to keep one community continuous. It just so happens that the people of Memphis over the years are predominantly African American. And when we exercise our vote, we are actually deciding to vote Democratic. Now, being black doesn't obligate you to any level of political party. Let's make that very clear. The reason black people vote Democrat in the night congressional district and in the Memphis area is because a Democratic party has aligned with the issues that they most care about. So right now, the decision shouldn't have impacted their ability to redraw the lines at all

because it's not about any of the things that they're claiming. Let me also go back to that video clip that you just talk about. about. There are plenty of times Leader Lambert has known or is stated around the black population in Memphis. So he is downright lying on the record. And in the Senate, when I asked my Senate colleague

does he know Memphis is black? He is downright lying because he went to law school in Memphis, Tennessee. So if you actually lived in Memphis, Tennessee, you actually know Memphis is predominantly black. So the downright lie on record and in front of people is just egregious and it's disgusting

And it's even more reason the world gets to see what the Republicans and the Tennessee General Assembly are actually doing. They are downright deliberately lying. They are trying to cut the black vote. They are splitting this district in three parts with even numbers of black representation in each, the difference of one or two points, so that they could dilute it with white voters. They're even breaking some of the law around the 14th to 15th Amendment around racial bias. with this intent. So the Republicans are going to do everything they can in front of everybody to get this done.

And they don't care if it's racist. They don't care if it takes away our vote. All they want to do is basically kiss Trump's ass and they want to do whatever he says to make sure they can try to maintain some power in Congress because the policies that they push aren't good enough to actually win the hearts and the votes of the American people. It's disgusting. It's voter disenfranchisement. and they're going to have to answer somebody one day. And if they don't answer to us in these next couple of hours, they're going to answer to a greater power. And I feel sorry for them on that day. So Professor Sekew Franklin, middle Tennessee state, testified, laid it out very clearly of what does that play here. Now, obviously, they don't give a damn what a black professor has to say.

But I do want to play his remarks. Here we go. This proposal is racially discriminatory, unconstitutional, and undermined the existing election administration system. First, if enacted, the proposed plan will be the most devastating attack on the Voting Rights Act, both the letter and the spirit of the law in modern Tennessee history. Simply put, the proposal that's something that we have not seen before, and there has no precedent in modern America.

It takes away the voting rights and meaningful political power of a cohesive jurisdiction that a majority black voting age population resides in in a city that is the same size as Boston, Las Vegas, and Baltimore. Furthermore, unlike other minority majority districts that have been litigated, in court from the early 1990s to the Calais case, the ninth district is not a politically engineered district or drawn under the mandate of a federal court order. It is an organic congressional district naturally emerging

by virtue of location, geography, and shared interests, of which its main hub of Memphis is the second most populated black city by percentage in terms of urban municipalities in the country. The proposed plan, in other words, is black boat dilution at an industrial scale, and it undermines the voting rights of Shelby County voters, Shelby County voters and the equal protection of them under the 14th Amendment.

There's additional evidence that patterns of racial discrimination are shaping this effort to abolish the ninth district. And in the last round of redistricting four or five years ago, Shelby County, I want to emphasize this, lost one seat in the state of House of Representatives. Shelby County also lost an opportunity district or a biracial seat in the state senate that would have given black voters a chance to let the candidate of their choice. And as well know, there's a recent decision to overtake the school board. and we know that race has been front and center to congressional redistricting due to an internal leak of an email several years ago

in which some opponents to racial justice and racial redistricting and civil rights openly discussed race Memphis and congressional redistricting this proposal I mean bottom line here one by them having a supermajority they can do whatever they want they don't care about local control they want to completely control and dominate any area that's Democratic, which is why they split Nashville up. Now there's screwing over Memphis. And what I keep saying to people is that the only way this

changes is that we have got to see the most aggressive voter turnout since 1965 when the Voting Rights Act was approved. We've got to see people of conscience. And listen, when I look at Tennessee Holland, look at their, I see a lot of white folks. out there protesting. I see Latinos and others. I mean, you know, the only way to stop these people is that they're going to have to be completely overwhelmed at the ballot box in November. Absolutely. And I'll tell you this, Roland,

they piss me off enough. I'm going to be on the ballot too. So watch me turn out some bowlers. These new district sits in my Senate district. They drew other members together. And one of the districts, they specifically carve out to make sure one Republican senator is guaranteed a seat in Congress. And so what they're going to do is they think they are killing one Democratic seat.

They may end up getting three new Democratic seats of what they're doing. So you're going to have people like me putting ourselves out there to make sure we let the people know what's going on and we're going to turn out voters ourselves. And that's one thing. Yeah, go ahead, go ahead. That's one thing in Tennessee. You can run for a state office and a federal office at one time. And so people are going to do what they need to do. They're going to open up the filing until May 15th.

So you're going to see other people stepping up. And we know that when they first did this in the 2021 census to Nashville, they split it three ways. The seats that they created, what they're going to run into is within a couple of cycles, we're going to have three seats instead of one out of Nashville. So, yes, the voters are going to get out. We're going to turn out. I'm in East Tennessee, and I told folks on Mayday,

I said, you guys, pack your cars, pack your tents. We're going to go to West Tennessee, and we're going to get out, and we're going to knock doors and make sure we get every voter out there. Because we are going to show them that Tennesseans do not want to see this. The supermajority does, but even the majority of independence, Republican voters, and Democrats, don't think this is fair, don't want this to happen, and not one of those Republicans ask their constituents what they wanted. But the only problem there is that what we've often seen before is that Republicans say that when it happens, but when it comes to the ballot box, they do not penalize those same individuals.

Listen, those same Republicans, they were against. They were against it happening in Indiana. Well, last night, Donald Trump's preferred candidates wiped out several anti-jerrymandering Republicans in the primary there. And so that's what, I just think that we have to understand that and what's going on here. And I also, and I made this point here, I made this point here Senator Lamar last couple of nights, that when I say we have to see that massive turnout, we have to see how people are being driven to the polls. You know, I got to remind people that Tennessee, when you talk about the Nashville movement, When you talk about what took place there with Reverend James Lawson, I got a chance to interview him a few years ago when I was in Los Angeles. We talk about those SCLC workers. We talk about John Lewis and Diane Nash.

Guys, pull up my iPad, please. That's Reverend Lawson I'm talking to. We talk about Diane Nash and those folks right there. And we talk about them. You know, they were trained there in Nashville. And so you have that long history. Vanderville, Fisk, Mahary. And I just think that what I've been saying is that starting now,

this is Freedom Summer 26. This means that in May, June, July, August, September, we are driving people, we're educating, we're enlightening, we're teaching them about what's going on. And this has to be a hardcore grassroots movement. And that means hitting the ground. That means, you know, if this thing passes, studying these maps, seeing where the voters are, and taking these folks out. Because, yeah, I would love nothing more to see this map backfire on Republicans in Tennessee, on Republicans in Florida, on Republicans in Mississippi and the other states.

Absolutely, 100%. We are already working with grassroots groups on the ground to make sure we are educating people, let them know that their voices needs to be heard, the consequences of these decisions. We're hosting a town hall in 10 minutes with Stacey Abrams because the public was denied the ability to submit their own maps or have public comment on the maps that are being proposed to pass tomorrow. So we're doing everything we can to empower the people, uplift the people and give them a voice in this process. But you're right, they are going to see people like me, Senator London Lamar, potentially be Congresswoman Lumma. because the maps are getting bluer by diluting Memphis. Instead of allowing them to have eight strong red districts, they are now creating nine more blue districts

because they are impacting the vote of Memphis. So this will absolutely backfire. Absolutely people are mad. Absolutely people in the rural areas are also going to vote in arms. They are just as broke. They are just as hungry. Under Trump's administration, their lives have not improved. They are losing business to the urban areas.

They don't like each other. The local governments don't have no money. So the Republican Party is doing all they can, not only just try to dilute our vote as black people, but they also doing what they're doing at the expense of their own people who lives are freaking suck. Their lives are not good.

They are living terribly in the rural areas of Tennessee. And so what you're going to see, you're even going to see Republicans who are frustrated with their own leaders, who are focusing on callous, pity fights with black people and poor people in Memphis rise up in arms to say, I want something different, and I'm willing to give them a chance. And so what we're going to do is do our best to challenge every Republican that dares run for these new districts with a Democrat who is capable, and we will see victory at some point in time.

Representative Johnson, when Senator LaVar just said about there having that town hall, this is what I have been saying. Every week, every week in the cities in Tennessee, whether it's Memphis and Nashville, there should be a citizenship training program every single week. I don't care whether, and I'm talking elected officials, non-prudgeoning. profits, activists, every single week there should be something because that's what it is going to take. This is going to be a data race. And the thing that I've always said to people, we were in Kansas City with the Urban League there, and they were talking about an initiative there.

And I said to them, I said, we got to stop hoping people show up at the ballot box. We got to stop praying they show up. I said, we literally have to go out in touch. I said, go look at the last election. And when I was there, I said, go look at how. How many votes did the mayor get last year? I said, if he got 40,000 votes, I said, you should go out and touch 60,000 folks who agree with you and then say, hey, mayor, we got 60,000 who stand with us. That means that comes election time, you're going to lose.

That's how we have to approach this. And again, it has to be every single week between now and the election day. That is the only way to break the backs of these racists that you're dealing with there in Tennessee. Now, that's exactly right. And we work really hard. There are a few of us in Tennessee. But, you know, I've already been to multiple counties across this state. And anytime that someone asked me, I go.

And I know that Senator Lamar does, too. A couple of times we were both up in Upper East Tennessee on the Virginia line because we will go wherever we need to go, to talk to people, to educate people, to get the message out there of Democrats, to work for Tennessee families. We are the ones that want to raise the minimum wage, want to take the sales tax off groceries, want to make sure that everyone in this state

is healthy and has access to affordable health care. And so we've got to get out there and we've got to do better. And what we really need tomorrow is a whole bunch of people to show up down here at 9 a.m. tomorrow when these votes, we need to show them how many people care deeply about this. this because you know a huge majority of this state are independence and I have a good feeling which way independence are going to go this year and they're going to go with the

folks that care about affordability and that care about their families not the ones spending all their time knowing that they've got nothing to run on and they're going to lose but they're going to spend their time stealing the vote the voices of black voters nobody in this state likes that exactly except for the Republican supermajority elected officials. Absolutely. Senator Lamar, we appreciate it. Last point here.

Okay, so the town hall are y'all having there? Are y'all streaming that? I'm not sure if it's being streamed, but it's at First Baptist Church Capitol Hill. Okay, so. At 6 p.m. I got it. So here's the suggestion.

Look, I'm always a digital first person, and I'm a fundamental believer that, listen, you might have 100 or 200 in the room, but when you are using digital technology, you can be speaking to thousands as a part of whatever strategy you all do, every single time there's one of these town halls, they have to be streamed. They've got to be pushed out all across the state.

And so YouTube, Facebook, because what that then does, and that's what happened in Virginia. When we helped Don Scott, because of Speaker, the House, we did five shows in Virginia. There were people who said, hey, I can't make it, but I saw the show. And so that's the thing.

Digital has to be a huge part of this strategy to get the word out. And that's also how you bypass local media who may not show up. Absolutely, 100%. All right. I appreciate it. Thanks a bunch of good luck. Thank you. I appreciate it.

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Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Saigon, the story of my family and of the country that shaped us. The United States will not stand by and allow any power, however great, take over another country. From My Heart Podcasts, Saigon. Please allow me to introduce Joseph Sherman. You don't think I'm serious about a free Vietnam? I should stop talking so much. I like hearing you talk.

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When you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the future of humanity, the hosts always act like they know what they're talking about and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll Show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Kugler did that I think was so unique He's the writer-director Who do you think he is? I don't know You mean it's the like the president? You think Canada has a president

You think China has a president La Crosette God I love that thing I use it all the time I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at life It's like the old Polish saying Not my monkeys, not my circus It was a good one

I like that saying It's an actual Polish saying It is an actual point. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time.

I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Becca, when we say, I said the other night, this is war. And you have to create a war plan,

a war battle plan to defeat this. I don't want to hear thoughts and prayers. I don't want to hear, oh, my God, this is a shame. I don't want to hear, man, this ain't right. No, no, no, no. This is about going to war, activating ground troops to combat these thugs all across the south. You know what, Roland, I was on a radio show earlier today,

and I was talking about what a post-Calais world looks like in this country in terms of dilution of black voters, political power, Latino delusion of power as well. And the whole start talking about, oh, you know, this is like science fiction. It's the end of the world. It's dystopian. I said, no, this is Afrofuturism. And let me remind you what I mean by Afrofuturism.

My ancestors fought back the last time this happened. When we look after the, when we look after what happened right after the Civil War, when we started to see a rapid increase in black representation, especially across the south, and we started to see U.S. senators and state senators and local elected officials who were voted into office after the end of slavery. We then saw by like 1883, the Supreme

Court said, no, we're going to roll all this back because we can't have black political power. We can't have black people in this country making determinations on things that also impact white residents in this country. And it took about 80, 90 years until the civil rights movement for those, for many of those regressions to become undone. And here's the thing. We don't have 80 and the 90 years under this type of Jim Crow. We don't have 80 to 90 years the weight. And the reason why I say is Afrofuturism is because we're looking at back to see what happened

last time and we're preparing for our future now because we're not going to do this for generation after generation after generation. But people have to get ready to suit up, get in the fight, because now it's go time. And people have to really understand that. During this last segment, Roland, I was looking at voters, registered voters in Tennessee. So I pulled up the 2024 numbers. And what I saw that there was close to 4.7 million people registered in Tennessee in 2024. And guess what?

Only 3 million showed up to vote. That's 1.7 million that stayed home. So even as we see with these new districts in Tennessee that are likely, to go into effect for the midterms. There's well over 1.5 million people in the state of Tennessee who need to show up, who did not show up in 2024. And of course, all of those who showed up in 2024,

especially those who actually support democracy in this country and support the right to vote in this country, we need you to show up. I don't care that it's a midterm. I don't care that it's not sexy because there isn't a presidential line on your ballot this fall. You have to show up.

Robert, everything that we're seeing, I predicted in white fear. Every single thing that we're seeing. And, you know, when these things happen, I saw some comments, people like, man, you know what? It's the same, it's a shame that, you know, we don't have Reverend Jackson. And, well, guess what? We don't have Reverend Jackson. We don't have Reverend Lawson. We don't have

James Orange. We don't have we don't have September Clark. We don't have Fanlou Hamer. And so what I have long said to this generation of black people, this generation of black

Gen X people and millennials and Gen Z and Gen. Gen. If 30 years from now we are still calling out Reverend Jackson, Reverend Lawson, Scepter McClart, Constance Baker, Motley, Thurgood Marshall. That means that this generation

of black people weren't shit. That this generation of black people when we were facing what we're facing right now did not rise up and stand up and swing his heart. as we can. And so I don't want to hear these people whining and complaining on social media. I'm saying what, as Joe Madsen always would say, what are you going to do about it?

And that's really where we are. This is an existential threat. Today's Republican Party is an existential threat to the future of black America. That means folks, children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren that are not even born yet. And so if this generation doesn't stand up in totality, then it's not going to happen. Look, this is the, these are the times of tribe and souls, essentially when we're dealing with this fight. We are on course to be the first generation of black folks

to take a step backwards for our people. We had a continuous incline for about 150 years, stepping off of the plantations, fighting back through Jim Crow, establishing the simple personhood, then citizenship, then the right to vote, building black businesses, creating a black middle class, putting together the legal framework that ascended us all the way to the presidency to record numbers in the Congressional Black Caucus,

CEOs across the board. And then we took that moment for granted. And we dropped the baton. And if you look at where we are currently, The most striking part of all of this is the mass silence that we're seeing in media. The mass silence that we're seeing from our intellectuals, from our people who have these large followers, people who are our celebrity class.

Because even if you think back to when Malcolm X was discussing the fact that the... Robert, I got to get 10 more seconds. I've got to get the joy of that. I've got to get on my next guest. So please, go. Well, the point is that we... We need to have our people know that they are in the middle of a fight already and that they are losing. Yep.

And if they don't know they're fighting, they don't know who to save. Got it. Joy, go. Let me just say, the only thing I've been thinking about is how's the Democratic kind of party going to respond. I have not heard enough from them, which is why people are frustrated with Democrats. It is go time. It is fight time. I'm hearing from all of our civil rights groups. What I have not heard from is the party that's ultimately being attacked.

here as well, right? So that is what we've got to. We've got to see them fight, and we also need to see that they are going to back black members. So that's the D-Trip, the D-SCC. How are they going to invest in black members? How are they going to invest in black members and Latino

members and Asian-American members who may be running in majority white districts? Because we're going to have to, if we want to keep our representation, if we want to keep black people in office, we're also going to have to be saying in those districts that remain how are we being represented there?

Listen, listen. Where are you? Here's a whole deal. Okay, first of all, right now, to me, this is not Democratic Party conversation right now. This is a legal battle because first of all, you don't know what you're going to be facing until the maps actually get passed or not.

So you don't know that. What I'm saying is, I don't give a shit what they're doing. I'm talking to black people, and one of the black folks who is fighting, who is battling. And they have been doing the work, NAACP Legal Defense Fund, their leaders, Janette Nelson,

she joins us right. now. She tweeted this today, and she said, Breaking. Scotas just about our motion to recall the judgment in Louisiana v. Calais, which the court transmitted prematurely and in contravention of the procedural rules that typically affords litigants 25 days to request a rehearing of a case that was wrongly decided. Janay, they also lied. Sam Alito literally lied in which you pointed it out when they said, oh, no, well, these folks, you know, that they haven't even shown any interest in appealing. Listen, sometimes you got to laugh from, to keep from doing some. some other things that are not as productive.

So listen, the court has already shown itself to be as complicit in this hostile takeover of our democracy as every other institution, sadly. There's really no way to excuse this decision and what you saw most recently in this order that suggests that the Robinson appellants did not indicate that we would see. Yeah, it's right here.

Go to my iPad. Go to my iPad while she's talking. Y'all see it highlighted. Yeah, go ahead. Read what we said in the second sentence of our reply. Here the court is saying, while the Robinson appellants oppose it, they have not expressed any intent to ask this court to reconsider its judgment. Now, if you go to the papers that we filed before they issued that order and you read the very second sentence after we introduced our arguments, you will see.

that we say quite clearly that we should be afforded an opportunity right here this court should afford appellants the opportunity to consider seeking rehearing in the ordinary course which is 25 days from the date of the decision we got the decision last wednesday it is just one week fresh today but they but they were insisted jane they were insisted on louisiana y'allel go, go, go. Even though per sale, which they've been a buy-and-by, which they used against Alabama

three years ago and Louisiana, now all of a sudden, no, no, no, no, they got to go. They got to have time to go right now. That's right. That's right. In an election, where they had already mailed out ballots to military personnel and others

early in April. And at the time that the election was stopped and canceled, it had already been 42,000 votes cast. So what we're talking about here is hypocrisy. Let's just call it what it is. It's hypocrisy, it's complicity. It's frankly a crime against our Constitution.

And when we try to rationalize it and we try to make it make sense within the rules, we are doing ourselves a disservice. What we're up against are a number of lawless actors, and we have to do exactly what our answer, did, what my founder did, Thurgood Marshall, and the incredible lawyers and clients who got rid of racial segregation. And that is to be as ingenious as we can possibly be to use those very rules and those very tools against lawless institutions. And it's not going to be easy because the landscape has changed dramatically.

We're dealing with mis and disinformation. We're dealing with algorithms that that blinker your understanding of world. We're dealing with people who don't understand truth from lies and a resurgence of white supremacy amid a generation of people who don't really understand how far this country has come and what black people in particular have delivered to this country. All that people enjoy the music, the culture, the freedoms, the rights, the protections came from the civil rights movement, came from black culture and other cultures that we opened the door. to have become part of the mosaic of this populace. Sadly, we are at a crossroads,

and right now it is incumbent upon all of us, and not just those of us are going to be most acutely harmed, but every single American who believes in this fantasy of America, it is being ripped apart, and we have got to stand up and rise up as a people. I mean, look, Thurgood Marshall and the lawyers in that area, they had to deal with racist judges. They had to deal with folks along those lines.

But you also had judges who truly believed in the law and executed the law. When I think about that book on those Fifth Circuit judges by BAS, and we talked about that. This is different. I mean, we are literally watching individuals just make up stuff as they go along. I mean, that's what is absolutely insane here.

I mean, to sit here, and I kept reminding people that they made this decision regarding a second congressional seat in Louisiana, which is the one that they allowed to go forth just three years ago. I mean, that case went to the Supreme Court. Correct. We won that case. Right. We won. And it's like, it went to them, and they were like, yeah, Bob Lange is, yep.

We agree with what. the lower court, then it went back in the Fifth Circuit, tried to do all another little game, and they tried to send it back, no, we already ruled on that. And now to come back with this decision, and then now to say Louisiana, hurry up, oh, it is so important. Alito, they have to be allowed to redraw right now.

When not only, Junae, did they send out ballots, ballots were returned. Some 80,000 ballots had already been cast in the election, and the governor goes, Oh, no, we're going to sit the House. The election, the rest will go forward. We're just going to carve this one out. And you're like, I'm sorry, but my ballot has the House races on here.

What the hell? Listen, that's what I'm saying. We are up against absolute lawlessness. And I just want everyone to stop for a moment and think about what was the major intervening event from 2023 when we won Allen v. Milligan, when Chief Justice Roberts himself wrote the majority opinion, the five-four decision there, and he wrote so eloquently and poetically

that without Section 2, the 15th Amendment, which is the amendment that gave black people the right to vote, that the 15th Amendment is a mere parchment promise. So beautifully put. What happened in between 2023 and 26? I'll tell you, a presidential,

election, where we have a tyrant who has put fear in the hearts of anyone within his reach, except those people who never feared him from the beginning. And what we're finding is that we have a culture of capitulation in this country. And for many, a culture that actually wants to go back to a time when white nationalism, white supremacy, governed. And I'm telling you, we're done with that. That chapter of our history has to be over. We have changed too much. And what I don't think people fully understand is how much other people have become invested in the freedoms and protections and the society that we've been able to build under the Voting Rights Act. We did not have a multiracial democracy. We didn't have a society

that resembles anything like what we have today before the Voting Rights Act. And people are about to find out what it means without those protections. And hopefully they won't find out too late and we can still snatch it back. I know we are doing our part of the Legal Defense Fund. I know so many other organizations

are absolutely activated and mobilized and ready to go and have been even before this decision. We've been working on so many other tracks to ensure that we have other. avenues to continue to build power, but we should not in any way, shape, or form think that this loss of the Voting Rights Act is not catastrophic, that this is not a cataclysmic moment in our lifetimes, and it is up to us to turn it around. To your point, and I have been saying this for years, whether it's LDF, Laws Committee for

Civil Rights Under Law, Equal Justice, I mean, just transforming justice coalition, so many others, I mean, y'all have been, people who are not paying attention, obviously, they're not in courtrooms, do not understand the legal warfare that has been going on. I mean, I'm talking about y'all have been engaged in legal warfare, guerrilla warfare, courts all across this country. You still got that case out of Arkansas where these conservatives want to keep third-party groups like yourself from filing these suits by suggesting that only the Department of, of justice can intervene and file suits in voting rights cases. That's the extent that these people, they want to stop you and ACOU and other groups from even being able to do this work. That's right.

That's right. I mean, one way you can look at this is that we are unfortunately experiencing the backlash from the tremendous success of all of those who came before us, of all the work that we have been doing and advancing rights and protection. But what happened, sadly, is people got too complacent. And I'm not going to put that on black people's shoulders. I'm putting that on everyone's shoulders. People got complacent.

They didn't understand the deeply racist origins of this country that will always try to pull us back and pull us asunder to those ignominious impulses to dominate, to to dehumanize. That has been, sadly, the traditional. of this country from its founding. And here we are in the 250th year, since the Declaration of Independence was written. And it's time for us to reflect on who we want to be for the next 250. And whether we like it or not, we are the ones who hold the pen.

Yep. We are the ones who are writing that first chapter of the next 250 years of this country. And I can tell you one thing, we are not going to write a story that ends in tragedy for black people. That is not who we are. It's not who we've been.

And it's not what I certainly, and the people who work at the Legal Defense Fund and at the ACL Unit and lawyers community, all the lovely organizations that you named, that is not what we were built for. We were built in worse times than this, and we prevailed. And we expect to do the same,

but we need to mobilize, we need to pull every possible resource we have and bring it to the common, that we are experiencing right now because that's what it is. There is a war, there is an assault on our ideals, on our principles, and we need to fight for it with every lawful tool we have. 30 years from now, your name will be one of the names that's called where folks if they stood up as well as the LDF.

And folks, do me favor, go to my iPad right now. Y'all, this work cannot be done for free. I need y'all to go to NWACP-LDF. or just type in engage. NWACPLDF.org. Donations are critical because, again, we need folks, civil rights lawyers. We need people who are on the front lines. This is not free work. And so our freedom ain't free.

So please support the LDF. Janae Nelson. We appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you, Roland. All right. I'm going to breaking news, y'all. Folks, this just Dan.

Sen Louise Lucas posted this on her social media. She said, quote, This is regarding the FBI raid on her home office, as well as her cannabis business. She said, today's actions by federal agents are about far more than one state senator. They are about power and who is allowed to use it on behalf of the people. What we saw fits a clear pattern for this administration when challenged. They tried to intimidate and silence the voices who stand up to them. Just two weeks ago, Virginians sent a powerful message when they voted to stop Trump's scheme

to manipulate the 2006 midterm elections. Voters across this commonwealth made clear that power belongs with the people, not with politicians who try to take power away from them. I was proud to help lead that effort, and I have never been afraid to stand up to Donald Trump or anyone else that has tried to undermine our democracy. I am deeply grateful for the love and support of my family and friends and for the many colleagues and constituents who have reached out in recent hours. I will have more to say in the days ahead, but know this. I am not backing down, and I will keep fighting for the people of Portsmouth in the Commonwealth of Virginia. That was a statement, folks, that's posted on her social media account for Virginia State Senator Louise Lucas after today's Donald Trump, DOJ, FBI raid on her home and cannabis business located next door. All right, got to go to a break.

Quick break. We come back. We're going to talk about how Tarrant County, the last large red county in Texas, how they disproportionately sentenced black people to death in that state. On top of the fact that the number of people who are dying in Tarrant County jails because they're MAGA sheriff. On top of that, the MAGA district attorney there is still trying to put Crystal Mason in jail for trying to vote some nine years ago. Elections are happening in Tarrant County. Folks, black folks, we should be leading a fight to oust those folks from office.

We're going to talk about the death penalty issue. Next, Roland Martin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. Support the work that we do, folks. Like I said, with the LDF, our work ain't free. And so support the work that we do, join our Breene the Funk fan club. Our goal is to get 20,000 of our fans contributing on average, 50 bucks each a year. That's four hours and 19 cents a month, 13 since today. You have fun this show, the five other shows in the Black Star Network,

the other shows we want to launch. But guess what? It ain't going to happen because we ain't got billionaires and millionaires sending us checks. It ain't going to happen unless y'all support us as well. So if you want to support this. show do me a favor cash shop use a stripe QR code cash app changed their rules to with to cancel our account if you want to contribute via cash app use the stripe QR code click the cash app button to continue to contribute that's also for credit cards checks and money

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It's right there all on the website. We'll be right back. I'm Brittany Noble, Midwest-born, HBCU educated with experience in newsrooms across the country. I've teamed up with Roland Martin to bring to you the breakdown. This isn't just news. It's our stories, our voice, our community. Join me for the breakdown Monday through Friday at midday, only on the Black Star Network.

How you doing it? I'm Mark Curry, and you're watching the Black Star Network. That's why I got these glasses on, that Black Star is bright. Folks, my second job on a college was at the Fort Worth Star Telegram there in Tarrant counties. I know this county very well. And a new report reveals that this county

is exhibiting excessive use of the death pill with death sentences predominantly pursued against people of color. The report called an extreme outlier, race and the death penalty in Tarrant County, the third largest county in Texas, was published by the Texas Defender Service. It reveals that 92% of the death sentences sought by Tarrant County prosecutors since 2012 have been against racial and ethnic minorities, even though 40% of Tarrant County's population is white. Estelle and Hepburn Jones, the director of special projects for the Texas Defender Service, joins us right now. Estelle, glad to have you here. So we talk about these 92 percent, okay? That's a percentage.

And so how many cases where there were white defendants, and how many of those cases, how many actually got the death penalty? Well, let me back up and thank you for having me. So our report outlines how. the death, how death penalty is used in Tarrant County, you know, even compared to Texas, the rest of the state just in a way that is extreme. It has 7% of the population of Texas, but over 20% of all the death penalty trials since 2020 have come from Tarrant and almost entirely against people of color. And along with that, we reviewed 431 capital murder cases that the office charged over a 20-year period and found that more than a third didn't result in any homicide

conviction and that black defense were twice as likely as white ones to walk away with no jail time at all. We looked at a period starting from 2012 to look at the capital cases that had taken place, and there were 13. 12 of the 13 were people from irracial or ethnic minorities. and so there it's overwhelmingly clear that the death penalty is impacting people of color, but in particular black people in a way that you can't really ignore that pattern. And so when we look at this here, so are they simply not pursuing death penalty largely against white defendants? Yes, when it comes down to it, that's the, that's the result. So when we looked at that broader period of 20 years, where we looked at those

431 cases, you know, people from different ethnicities and races are included in that. And so, for example, if I take people who charge with capital murder in the course of a robbery, a third of those people were white. But when it comes to who actually ended up going to trial, all of them were black. And so, you know, a lot of people would look at this and say, okay, don't these disparities reflect who's committing these offenses. But so we asked that question and the data answers it. So something like that with a third of the people who are charged with robbery are white,

but then in the end you don't see that. It's not crime patterns. That's charging patterns. and the capital murder statute, it's broad. It covers a wide range of conduct. But because of that, because of that discretion, it allows there to be these kinds of disparate outcomes in the capital cases that we were reviewing.

I mean, it's fascinating when you look at this, and it goes to show you what's going on. And let's be clear, this is the same district attorney. Matter of fact, let me just go ahead and pull this up because you talk about, this office. One, it is important to note that Tarrant County, third largest county in the state, it also is the last red county in terms of Harris County, Houston, Dallas County, Dallas, Bayer County, Austin, Bayer County, San Antonio, Travis County, Austin. Those are Blue counties.

Phil Sorrells is the longtime district attorney there in Tarrant County. This is who he is. This is the man who is leading that office and making those decisions. And Estelle would also, again, we've been covering this here, the MAGA sheriff there in Tarrant County. They have an exorbitant number of jail deaths in Tarrant County that they've done nothing about. Then, of course, this is the same county where they gerrymandered Elisa Simmons out of her seat. She's now running for Tarrant County judge. That leader, Tim Clark, is crazy as well. and this same DA.

So it again, y'all, to Phil Sorrell's, this man is nine years later, he's still trying to put Crystal Mason in jail for casting a ballot in an election, nine years. That goes to show you the mentality of the people who are leading the district attorney's office there in Tarrant County. Since y'all published this,

what has been the reaction from others? Are they picking the story up? Is it causing people to raise questions? What's going on? Yes, so, you know, in putting together the report, we did talk to various people involved in the community in Tarrant in Fort Worth who, you know, when we talked to them about our findings, they were not surprised, but seeing the actual numbers really disliked. Pride is like love. You feel it in your heart. IR. Radio. Canada's number one streaming app for radio and podcasts, including IHart Pride Canada, your favorite hits and must have party. plus personalized and curated playlists like back in the day pride come together celebrate

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Phil Sorrell's, he's been active in Tarrant County judicial system for a long time. But in in 2023, that's when he was sworn in as the DA there. I'm aware of the jail deaths. And so kind of all these things coming up at the same time

have really gotten people motivated and talking more about this. And yes, so we've had a lot of interest from different news outlets. Tomorrow, actually, in Fort Worth, we're going to be having a press conference outside of the old courthouse there. We've been having a lot of conversations with faith leaders

in the Fort Worth Terrant community, and they'll be there with us. And then, you know, we haven't, we sent a copy of the report to the DA by email. He did not respond to us individually. We reached out with the report and offered to have a conversation about our, findings there. So he didn't respond to it directly, but I didn't interview with the Fort Worth

Star Telegram, and he did offer a statement in response to that. So he's aware of these. But in that statement, to pull up what he said, he mentioned that they do not take, but he doesn't know the race of the defendant in making decisions about capital. charges. Right. The job is seek justice and give voice to the victims and in the decision to seek death considered facts for the case, defendants' criminal history, defendants' likelihood to commit future crime mitigation and input from the victim's family. But you know, from that response there are two things there to think about. So yes, the DA does have, you know, the role

is seeking justice and responding to crime. But the other part of it is about maintaining integrity in the judicial system. And so with the patternings we found that calls into question whether that is being maintained. I'm not going to make any conclusion about whether he knows the racist of the defendants or not in these cases. But he mentions, you know,

mitigation and the victim's family taking that into consideration. And those are two things that race is very much implicated and it would be great to have the opportunity to talk to him and his team about that and educate his team about that. Because when you look at capital punishment and who is most affected, in terms of the actual receiving the death penalty, it's been shown in multiple studies

in other diverse states like California, Ohio, Georgia, that the race of the victim does play a role in whether a DA decides to seek death in a case. So even though he may not agree with our findings, I think that there are still obviously places in which he could maybe examine whether race is influencing those decisions. We know that people don't like to be called racist.

And that's not what we're saying. We're saying that the office's practices produce racially disparate incomes, outcomes that can't be explained by anything other than race. If 12 of the last 13 people that the offices tried to execute are all people of color, if all the people who've been acquitted of capital murder by a Tarrant County jury were black, that, you know, that, again, is indicative of how black people are impacted disparately. You know, whether it's conscious bias, unconscious bias, the record is there, the pattern is there, and that's what demands of response. And so it's really about, you know, we would, we and other and members of the community want to see, he needs to earn the public trust there, and that's

definitely not there. Okay, well, yeah, I'm not going to call it racist. I'm going to call it full of shit. All right, let me go to my panel. Robert, you first. So on this, what is kind of the broad-based actions that the community can take to have input on this? But clearly, the evidence is there.

Clearly, you've been able to bring attention to this. But what to people who are in the community do? They want to make a difference in this? Yeah, no, that's a great question. I think one thing is continuing to be active in local politics, continuing to, you know, people always ask, what can I do? It's like when you receive a jury summons, don't try and get out of it. But, you know, both in Terran and any other place, what people can do is request information

from the county. So a lot of what we got is, or actually pretty much everything is based on public record or things that are available, that the public can request. You can do your own Public Information Act requests. It's not always, I think it's made out to seem that it's very burdensome to do, but a lot of times you search the agency plus, you know, public information Act or PIA, and you'll find a page or an email where simply you send that request. for the information you want. We do have a couple of recommendations that involve really just more transparency on the part of the DA and then some possible collaboration with the commissioners court who, you know, they are involved in the budgeting and planning for the city.

So people can also attend those meetings and voice their concerns and that they want action taken to address what's going on and to kind of audit what the DA is doing. Rebecca. So if in Tarrant County, they're saying that they are colorblind, they don't see race, what exactly is the criterion that they use in order to determine which cases will become capital cases? Yeah. And that's exactly the question that we want answered.

You know, again, the DAs, they have discretion that is part of the job. But from what we've done, we've been able to show that that discretion is producing these disparate outcomes based on race. So while we can't identify exactly what is going on and where it is, you know, at some point they're going to be. things that are indicative of race in deciding charges. You know, it really calls into question, okay, if you say, if you are colorblind in that, again, explain or at least be curious about why these are the outcomes. If that were, if it were my responsibility and somebody informed me that the work I was doing was resulting in harming certain, um,

groups of my community, I would want to investigate that. Joy. So if we had a justice department and a civil rights division that was really doing their job, what kinds of, you know, engagements could they do on this? What kind of interventions? And is it still a possibility two to three years from now when we might have a different electoral outcome, a different person in the White House, a different person leading the Department of Justice?

Yeah. I'm not sure from, you know, I don't want to speak on something that I'm not certain about, but, you know, for us in Texas, you know, the capital murder statute already exists. And so this really, again, is about the decision making of DAs. And what Terrant is doing differently than other counties in Texas actually is using that burglary or robbery aggravator to make something capital. So, you know, whether to have a death penalty, that's a whole other conversation. But perhaps, yes, if there is a different leadership federally that could have an impact

on what's going on, it's unlikely. One of the things that affects... In investigation, I guess, for what I'm looking for. Yeah, like could we have an investigation into this and the different impact on communities of color, intentional or not, like, right, let someone else decide that? I mean, I feel like that's the, you know, former federal perspective. That's the kind of intervention. That's the kind of evaluation that we would be looking for the Justice Department to do

because we know it's not going to necessarily come from Texas. Yeah. The problem, though, or one of the problems is that legally, so there's a case. McCleskey v. Kemp where what was presented to the Supreme Court was there are all these disparate outcomes based on race with respect to the death penalty. This is a problem. The court, five to four, said, actually no, this is not a problem. So it is kind of up to us in our states, in our counties to really take control of that because constitutionally there's not much not much we can work with but yeah perhaps a different Department of Justice could be interested

in and looking at what's going on especially with Terrant it is acting differently than the other counties in Texas and that's pretty clear well I'm Again, I'm going to say it. You don't have to say it. The reality is a Democrat Department of Justice will look at it differently because that was an investigation of the jail conditions in the Tarrant County, the Tarrant County jail under Biden, Harris, under Christian Clark, who was a hit of the Civilized Division. Yeah, that was all wiped away when Trump went there. So, yeah, I think it absolutely will be a different look. Still, where can people go to action to see the report? So you can go to our website, Texas Defender.org. There's a, on our home page, you can see a link to it, but also under that resources menu, there is a link to the page about the report.

And if you are in Fort Worth, tomorrow at noon at the Old Tarrant County Courthouse, we will be there with faith leaders and other community leaders to discuss their responses to the findings of the report. Okay. All right, we appreciate it. a lot. Thank you. All right. Let me thank my panel for being with us. Let me thank Joy, Rebecca,

and Robert. I still appreciate your insight on today. I appreciate it. Thanks a bunch. Folks right now. Black Star Network headlines are Brittany Noble. The Department of Justice recently requested the names and contact information of every election worker in Fulton County, Georgia, who was involved in the 2020 election. This request was disclosed in court filings this week. The Fulton County Board of Registrations and elections is now seeking a federal court in Atlanta to quash the grand jury subpoena issued by federal agents. The subpoena demands the names, addresses, phone numbers, and email addresses of any staff member who worked during the 2020 election.

Attorneys representing Fulton County officials argue that the purpose of the subpoena is to target, harass, and punish the president's perceived political opponents. A recently removed black sheriff from St. Louis is asking a federal judge to dismiss criminal charges against him, claiming that the case is motivated by political opponents. political bias. Former St. Louis Sheriff, Alfred Montgomery, filed motion seeking the dismissal of charges related to handcuffing of Deputy Commissioner Tammy Ross from the City Justice Center. Montgomery is accused of tampering with and retaliating against witnesses connected to the incident that occurred back in February of last year. His attorneys argued that prosecutors relied on false testimony from

the grand jury and properly reviewed privileged emails from his attorney and targeted Montgomery after he refused to resign amid efforts to remove him from office. In contrast, prosecutors assert that they have evidence showing that Montgomery abused his official authority. These motions come just days after Judge D. O'Mare removed Montgomery from his position. And the white mother has been arrested in Fort Myers, Florida. After being accused of attacking a 13-year-old black football player during a youth game, a viral video of the incident has sparked outrage online with many questioning just how, how an adult could physically assault a child in such a setting.

That incident took place during a game for the Southwest Florida Panthers youth football team. 34-year-old Renee Lambert is accused of repeatedly hitting the player. She told the police that she was defending herself after being struck with a helmet, but officials discovered that this claim was false. Video shows players from both teams getting into a scuffle with referees blowing their whistles. Lambert allegedly runs onto the field and appears to kick a player while he's on the ground, prompting several adults to rush in to intervene. Lambert now faces charges of cruelty toward a child and resisting an officer.

Parents say this was not the first time that tensions escalated at a game involving her. She was recorded in a heated moment days earlier at a different event. The Fort Myers Youth Football Organization has permanently banned Lambert from all events and activities there. Residents in a historically black neighborhood in Indianapolis are opposing a proposed data center development on Monday. the City County Council unanimously passed a resolution calling for a temporary halt on new data center projects in the Martindale-Brightwood community. Their objective is to pause data center projects in Marion County until May of next year. Proposal 158 introduced by white counselor Jesse Brown advocate for a moratorium while the city studies the potential impacts

these facilities could have on local neighborhoods. Brown has expressed significant concerns regarding how data centers could affect the local power grid, water infrastructure, and even residents' quality of life, citing issues such as noise and environmental impacts. Currently, many of these concerns are not specifically regulated, and the Department of Metropolitan Development is still drafting a new special use district known as SU47. It would establish oversight and regulations for future data center developments in Indianapolis. This proposal seeks to prevent developers from take advantage of outdated industrial zoning rules that could facilitate the construction of the data centers.

And Donald Trump is once again threatened to bomb Iran, this time stating he would do so at a much higher level and intensity if the country does not reopen the Strait of Hermuz. This straight is one of the world's most critical shipping routes for oil and natural gas. The warning comes as tensions rise in the Middle East and growing concerns about the impact on global fuel prices and the cost of living. According to Axios, the White House believes that it may be close to reaching a possible agreement with Iran and expects a response within the next 48 hours. Reports indicate that both sides are discussing a 14-point more random of understanding to pause the conflict and initiate a 30-day negotiation period under the proposed framework. Iran would temporarily halt its nuclear enrichment efforts, while the United States with ease sanctions and release bill. of dollars in frozen Iranian funds. Additionally, the Trump administration is urging China

to leverage its relationship with Iran to help reopen the Strait of Hermuzh to combat growing fears of potential disruptions to global energy supplies. All right, Brittany, I appreciate it. Folks, don't forget, watch the breakdown of Brittany Noble every single day at noon eastern right here on the Black Star Network.

Again, noon Eastern of the Black Star Network. All right, going to a quick break. We come back. Remember, former Oklahoma State Representative Donald Ross. A champion of civil rights who passed away yesterday. You're watching Rolla Martin Unfiltered on the Black Star Network. If in this country right now, you have people get up in the morning,

and the only thing they can think about is how many people they can hurt, and they've got the power, that's the time for mourning. For better or worse, what makes America special, it's that legal system that's supposed to protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority. We are at a point of a moral emergency. We must raise a voice of outrage. We must raise a voice of compassion.

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I'm Mark Moriall, President, CEO of the National Urban League, and I'm watching a Black Star Network. Former Oklahoma's representative Don Ross, a champion of civil rights during his decades-long career in public service, passed away at the age of 85. Yesterday, I got a phone call from his daughter and a text message from his son, Let him be known that he passed away. Ross served 20 years in the state house and played the key role in urging Oklahoma to remove the Confederate flag from the state capital grounds in 1989. He also spent a decade as a chairman of the Appropriations and Budget Subcommittee on Health and Social Services.

He was instrumental in securing more than $45 million for his district, according to uncrowned community builders. Ross is recognized as the principal fundraiser for the Greenwood Cultural Center. He also, of course, led to creation the Tulsa Race Riot Commission. Five years ago, when we were in Tulsa for the 100th anniversary, we had the opportunity to meet him. He told me that he was a huge fan of mine, and so he also gave me an autographed copy of his book, Pillage of Hope,

a family history from the Trail of Tears, Slavery, Segregation, the 1921 Race Massacre and Beyond, a memoir by Don Ross. And so it was certainly sad to have his daughter call him and his son text me. And so again, they said that he thought, of me and the show. And so we wanted to pay tribute to him by re-airing that interview that I did with him when we were in Tulsa in 2021. Of course, I have been covering this Justice for Greenwood Town Hall. And you've been hearing the stories come right on in. If you were watching the live stream when they announced that a former state official, Don Ross, was in the room.

and so I had to let him know he was not coming to the town hall. He was actually coming here to chat with me, and that's why he's here. And he joins us right now on Roland Martin Unculture. Doc, how you doing? I'm fine. I'm fine. My back hurts, but I'm old.

How old are you? You'll know what I mean when you get there. I'm 80. You're 80 years old. I'm old. I'm old. I've talked to your son. I've talked to your daughter, and they said, growing up,

this was the thing that you were focused on getting justice for Greenwood. Well, you know, I don't know what justice is anymore. You know, there were a lot of things we didn't have, and we tried to get them. Justice, I don't know we ever got that. Still ain't got it. Right. Yeah.

So now, this is my focal point on Greenwood was the creative facility. Right. That's where I'm proud of it. To take us back, I mean, how difficult was it to get, how difficult was it to get this commission even approved? To take us through that. I mean, you actually... I asked an interesting question because it was a question. It was a trick.

It was a trick. See, in the legislature, they don't give it half of what you want, but they'll let you study it. All I wanted was a study, because I could open the door from that. Right. So when I presented that I demanded this, this and this, he said, no, we'll give you a study to us. And so it all came out of the study, you know.

But that was part of my problem. I've been there 20 years. I know what they do. Right. It's like, game recognized game. Yeah. Now when you were in legislature, how many other African Americans were there? Five. It was total of five of y'all. Let me count them.

One, two, three, four, five. Yeah. Had to be a little lonely. Huh? Had to be a little lonely. Oh, oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. They isolated us. They treat us like stepchildren. You know, sometimes they make you not like white people. I mean, the way they treat you. They're just dumb. They don't, they don't treat us right.

What do you make of, so first of all, I've heard people who not here don't know. Did the state of Oklahoma or the city of Tulsa ever actually formally apologized for what happened in Greenwood? That's the interesting thing. During the anniversary, I forget which one, we had all these politicians on the stage. The governor was there. U.S. Senator was that born, and all of them. And they're all talking about what a great job I was doing. I said, well, I haven't done anything because I hadn't been able to invoke you into an apology for what you have.

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Hey, Jonas is available now, and their first guest is a big one. Paul Rudd. You know, Steve Carell is a great singer. Can you tell you not to audition at the office or something? I told him. Whoa. We were filming Anchorman. Clearly, I was the idiot.

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Who do you think he is? I don't know. You meet the, like, the president? You think Canada has a president? You think China has a president? Those law crusette. God, I love that thing. I use it all the time.

I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. Yep. It was a good one. I like that saying. It is an actual Polish saying. Yeah. It is an actual poem.

Yeah. Better version of Play Stupid Games win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said. that for the first time. I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. For them to apologize for what they did to market you. I still haven't forgiven them. I'm still

a little bit bitter. I hope I didn't detect it. You say you're still bitter. Why? Yeah. Well, there's so much that could have been done. that should have been done. But white people and some of the black lackeys hid behind that. And we never

get done, but we could have gotten done yet. You know, there's just some work that's just going on in this building that would never be done now. Mm-hmm. You know. So, yeah. I'm a little bit, eh? How do you feel about, you know,

city of Tulsa builds this $30 million museum, Greenwood Rising, you know, they're trying to create this sort of this tourist thing around Greenwood, and, you know, you've got the lawyers and fighting for the survivors and the descendants, and truth be told, I mean, I've covered stores all of America.

$50 million is not a lot of money to create a victim's kind of, compensation fund. Federal government created a multi-billion dollar 9-11 fund. That's not a lot for an oil-rich state. Well, it's just as you say that because one thing you have recognized is we are a wealthy state. We are wealthy. We got money. Right. And you can squeeze the damage to my folks. You can't get none of it. And anybody say we're getting it line. The Chamber of Commerce, all of them, live. They're not right. And this building's a fluke, you know.

They needed me, and I needed them. So that's only the reason is here. They needed my boat and never been built. Mm-hmm. So I'm trying not to be better, because you're such a nice person. But every time I get talking about some of those shit, I get better, man. I understand. Yeah.

I know it went down. And, you know, they'll pat me on the back and all that shit. Hell, when I need them, I couldn't even find them. You know? So, let me tell you. When I put out, when I put out the call for reparations, not one sorority, not one fraternity, Not one church or any group stood with me.

I stood by myself. By myself. And soon as it looked like I was going to get some attention, everybody was fought to come out of woodworks, man. So I'm glad I retired, but I'm still a little bit bitter at my community. Right. Yeah.

So we could, oh, we had them. We could have got our own. There's a lot more that we could just band it together. But that's, I know it's not just don't work everywhere. Right. That just us. Well, because there are, there are folk, there's a lot of folk who's scared. Look, I mean, look, people, people come up to me and they're like, man, Rojas, did you really say that?

I mean, you know, aren't you scared? I said, look, I said, the white folks ain't giving me nothing now? I said, why am I going to be quiet? And in the home, I'm not going to get something tomorrow. I said, hell, I might as well say something. Then I actually might get something. What's the Billy President? So, nothing from nothing leaves nothing.

Yeah. Then you know how I feel, don't you? I understand. I understand. Yeah. And many ways I'm proud of my community, but more ways than not, we've been disappointed ourselves because so much we could have done, man. much we could have done man so much but all that jealousy city councilmen fighting the state

reps and they're fighting the state standards egos are all around so finally I just quit mm-hmm where's you were tired in 19 I've been in why did you ask me that in 19 I've been in it 21 years okay 21 years I was in Well, you figured out. My math isn't that good. So you wrote a book, Pillage of Hope. This is the book right here. Because you wanted your story on paper.

Not so much my story. But a story of how things evolve. Right. I think I'm not in that much. But how it evolved. The ride and all that stuff evolved is in there. And that's where I was writing for, really. I was reading the tweet from Jelani Cobb earlier,

and he's been going around Tulsa. And he said he shocked a number of white folks today who actually believed the massacre never happened. Oh, I believe that. I believe that. I believe you can go 30 feet outside that front door and find, you know, they said, man, this is a racist town. I know we say that about Chicago.

See that about everywhere, but I think, I think if we compare records, we got it. You said, you compare notes. Yeah. You ain't never had no ride to kill. They say 300, it could have been many of thousands. Right. threw them off in the river and Samoan pitch and art now.

It's tough down. I've run into a lot of young brothers. We've been here since Thursday. I've run to a lot of young. Oh, yeah. You might have to move in. We've been covering stuff all over. I've run into a lot of young brothers and sisters.

A lot of them are starting businesses. and they really are taking hold of Black Wall Street. I hope. I hope. Don't get food by this affair. Tomorrow they want no shit. I'm telling you, man. Well, in fact, I told, so DiMario now,

we were at dinner, and that was last night. And I said, DeMario, I really believe that this can become an annual four days, I said, but, but I said, like I did a panel called Reimagining Wall Street. I said, I appreciate been asked to do it. I said, well, there should be actual business workshops on how to build the business, how to market, do financing. I go to a lot of business conferences, but this could really become an annual four-day deal that is a grassroots business conference, teaching our funds. how to build and sustain businesses.

They started that, started off well. Then Black Eagles got in the middle of it. I just quit. I saw it. No. I mean, I didn't knock it at anything. I just got away from it. Got to keep ego out of it.

Yeah. But, man, I love my community. Don't get me wrong. I got you. I know how you feel. but I just don't know. What can... Oh, look, look, I get black folks

who come on my YouTube channel, dogging me, talking to me, you're not down for black people. And in fact, I had some cats yesterday yelling and screaming. You ain't, dude, you're a disciple of the white man. And I laugh. And I just yell, you young and dumb,

just move to hell on. You know, I only sit here in, we're about these fools, because I know the folk who I've talked to who have impacted, who we've helped. And so it's going to always be a new fool. Yeah.

I just kind of said, when I became ill, I just kind of take it away from everybody. Because I don't want to argue anymore. Right. Man, you don't know, I spent 20 years arguing with these new girls. Oh, yet you wouldn't know. I do know. I had it from the white boy, but it's too late. You can press.

Lord. I don't know where. I'm going to leave a negative. If you asked me in my private facility. Oh, absolutely. Because I pretty much sing my hand and they did this. Mm-hmm. Tell you, how cold blood my people are,

I hid the funding numbers for eight months until I got it all locked down. Really? Yeah. They want to make us a gym. I got a gym across the street. Got a gym over there. Every time to get open space, they want to put some goals. Cute basketball.

Man, we got about five games I know about it. Uh-huh. Yeah. So you hid the money? I hid the money. They didn't know what was coming up with. Me and Senator Horner. When they found out about it, it was half-ass built.

Yeah. We hired our own architects the whole bit. But they were... I mean, I said what this would have been if I turned him a loose for a community meeting. Mm-hmm. So you kept it quiet, kept it to yourself. Silence. Nobody knew.

They kept seeing stuff going, so I don't know what that's going to be. I said, man, I don't know. Man, you got to know these brothers. And we had a couple of brothers. I ain't going to call the name because we might be on TV. But they cut my throat every chance they got. every chance they got, you know, so I wasn't about to let them have an edge on me. But then all of a sudden it gets built, and you sat back and said, see, I told you all I was going to do this.

How'd you know? I could tell. Yeah. I picked it up in your spirit. Right now. I can call it name, Jack Henderson and what is the other boy's name? Oh, I forget his name. I think of it.

Yeah, it was two of them that brought me. Down the line, man lied on me. Man, we had a chance. And on my mama's grave, him. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. We had a chance to get $30 million. Really? To develop this whole area.

The two black city councilmen killed it. Are you serious? My mama's in a grave, and I hope she come up and die again. The two black, not the white ones. White ones for it. Wow. Cold town, man. Jack Henderson and what's the other boy's name?

I got to get strangled him. I forget his name. And then he just got beat by that girl to sit president now. Mm-hmm. That was wonderful. Well, see, I know she's something because she keeps her gun on her hip. Oh, did she have gun? Oh, she stood up in here.

Vanessa had a gun. She said, I don't go nowhere without my gun. She's a special. She's a bad sister. Yeah. And the ball we beat is one of the guys that's always after my ass. But it's a cold town, man. Cold town.

And it has so much it could be proud of. But our leadership, including me, we're so thin. indifferent. Mm-hmm. I can include me in there because I'm tired now. No, but you, no, no, no, I'm just to be real clear. But you did your job. When I'm on the board of National Association of Black Germans,

we went after CNN, there are no black top executives. So I called Bernard Shaw, long-time anchor at CNN. This is what he told me. He said, Roland, every generation has had, to do their part is now your time. Mm-hmm. So you ran the race. You passed the baton.

Yep. You can't, you ain't supposed to run the race forever. Thank you for saying that. Because even my kids had me, did you, why don't you go do this? You got a name, I ain't got no name. You know, I did what I was supposed to do. And now I'm through.

You do something. Right. You know. That's what my kids I'm talking to. Right. They won't demand them me before they demand themselves. Mm-mm. Yeah.

No. My parents are 74. They did their job. That's right. That's right. So I'm not as bit as I appear to be, but I'm also not very comfortable. Mm-hmm.

You know, because you know what it could have been. Oh, God, man. And that's what, when I, when I, and I know how that feel. I ran the Chicago Defender, and I knew the vision I had. And I was adding podcast and magazines and we were going to do events. And they came to me and they were like, what's it? And he had this historic black newspaper. B, and I was, and I'm talking about, I mean, I had the vision.

And I said, man, look, these are all black millionaires. I said, look, if y'all would just get out my way and let me do what I've been trained to do, this is going to be one of the biggest black-owned media companies in the country. I sold them. They sat there and said, we just want to be a small community newspaper. I said, I got to go. Yeah. I left.

I sold that newspaper and the black dispatch. When I was a kid, I guess 18. No, young than that, young and that, I don't know how old I was. I've been gone 14 years, and it still hits me what could have been. You know what I'm talking about. Oh, I'm telling you. Look, I've done a lot of other things. I got my own company now.

But I'm sitting in like, if y'all would just gotten a hell out of the way. And to let a young brother do what he was destined to do, what it could be for our people. So, no, I... They were jealous of you. They were jealous of it. You had the vision and the energy. And I'm saying, I'm telling you, I know it because I feel that's the way they treat me. You know, you had the vision and the energy to do it.

Right. You're created. Right. Yeah. What are your last question for you? What would you like, just visually, what would you like, or hope for this place to look like in 20 years?

I'm gonna say this, and I don't mean to be negative, but just have to be, I don't see including my kids, I don't see any creative energy coming up, are willing to invest. It takes a lot of time and energy. That's right. A lot of time.

Right. And I don't see, see, as long as my son is driving his Mercedes, he could give a shit less. You know what I mean? And the other one, other than got him a one of those big ass truck, so you can give her down. My daughter, it probably cares her most,

and she got the lease. She's a teacher. She's a teacher. How do you know? told, I interviewed him. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah.

Russia, me, don't care. She really does care. And she saves on my ass and keep me care. But, uh... Well, I've talked to a lot of cats. I've talked to a lot of them and... Some young folks, they got the vision and they got the heart. Oh, I hope you're right.

I think what has to happen is you're 80. I'm 52. some of these cats are 20s and 30s. And so we got to be able to have these intergenerational conversations, sharing knowledge, sharing expertise, to be able to help them. I think you're right. I don't know if I have the energy anymore, though. No, but you ain't, what you did.

That's what I'm saying. See, you're 80. I'm 52. So 28-year gap. And so the reality is, my job is to operate as an elder to the person who's 25. That's 25 year gap. So the responsibility is, it's like, hey, you enjoy your life, go have fun. It's like, no, we got it. You can, boy, you got a vision. Boy, I wish you had more Negroes like you. Well, the reason I launched, the reason I launched

this digital company, because we're streaming this all over the world right now, is to be able to read somebody who's watching. And they listen to you, and they listen to me, and we're teaching every single day. We're broadcasting every day to create a bunch more more needs. What do you do? We do advertising on it? Yeah, we do that as well. Okay.

Absolutely. But the fan base also gives to help us. They gave last year $672,000 for us to keep broadcasting. Oh, good. You have arrived. You have a rhyme, man. Well, we would like to give, we would like to give a million. give a million, but look, we're going to take every single dollar. But the point is, is to use it and to teach and to give information,

because information is power, and then we do that. Look, it's not all I can do is give it. They've got to be able to take it, but you've got to have somebody who gives it for you to take. Boy, you understand it. You sure do understand it. You do, man. Man, you give me hope. It's a lot more of me out here.

Man, I haven't met him. But I'm locked up in this country down here. And he said, ain't that country? I can't be in front of now. Well, we're going to stay on this wall. We're going to keep hitting him. When I asked your daughter, I said, well, I said, is he coming? You're coming tomorrow?

She said, no, you're not coming. And she said, well, he might come talk to you. And then when she told me, she says, they called me this morning and said, he coming just to talk to you. Oh, you're talking about kicking me in my ass. I didn't want me to come to something. My back, she'll hurt. She was kicking me in my ass hard. I'm glad you did.

I am, too. You know, I watch you all the time. And had it not been you, I wouldn't have come. I know it. Because I didn't feel like it. I didn't. Well, I appreciate that you did. Yeah.

And I'm glad that you signed up. book. I'm definitely going to read it. And let me touch him a man's hand. He lives here. He's a videographer here in Tulsa. We hired him. Have we met before? What do you do? He's a video guy. Oh, okay. And he's up my team from D.C. Oh, yeah. The big shots, he's of my team from D.C. Okay, a team D.C. Well, I'm an easy him out of here, good friend and let you go do what you got to do.

Everybody who's watching, the book is called Pillage of Hope of Family History from the Trail of Tears, Slavery, Segregation, the 1921 Race Massacre and Beyond memoir by Don Ross.

Don, brother, I appreciate it. My pleasure. My pleasure. I appreciate it. Y'all can take them away. Your charity awaits. Well, I wonder who's going to be long winning

you and him. He ain't. You got to drag him here, kicking a screaming. He told me, he said his back still hurting because y'all would drag them here. I appreciate it. You'd be well. You did the right thing. I appreciate it.

He told me to the right one. I can wear them out. You can't wear me out. I was one on your case. You're doing this to me. You got to take credit. I appreciate it, my brother. We appreciate you.

You be well. All right. You take care. Yeah. I want something even, I don't know what. Got it. Folks, y'all get, go ahead. Bookstores, Amazon.com.

Former state. Over the fan club. Look, your dollars are important, for us to do what we do, so your support matters. If we contribute to our fan club, please do so. Use a Stripe Cura Code.

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