#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Kabul airport attack; Black vax numbers increase; Clyburn, protesters clash; Capitol cops sue Trump

Episode Date: August 27, 2021

8.26.21 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Kabul airport attack; Black vax numbers increase; IL. COVID vaccine mandate for educators and healthcare personnel; Texas' governor bans government vaccine mandates; Investment in infrastructure could create thousands of jobs by 2030; Majority Whip Clyburn clashes with protesters; Capitol cops sue TrumpSupport #RolandMartinUnfiltered via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered or via PayPal ☛ https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfiltered#RolandMartinUnfiltered is a news reporting platform covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Glott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of starts that a little bit, man.

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We asked parents who adopted teens to share their journey. We just kind of knew from the beginning that we were family. They showcased a sense of love that I never had before. I mean, he's not only my parent, like, he's like my best friend. At the end of the day, it's all been worth it. I wouldn't change a thing about our lives. Learn about adopting a teen from foster care. Visit adoptuskids.org to learn more. Brought to you by AdoptUSKids, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, August 26, 2021. I'm Amisha Cross, and here's what's coming up on Roland Martin Unfiltered.

Over 100,000 patients are hospitalized with COVID-19. This is the highest number of hospitalizations since January. And in Florida, an emergency room doctor was selling mask exemption letters to students. The governor of Illinois issues a statewide vaccine mandate. And in Florida, the Texas governor, he has vaccine mandates as well, but he's going against all of them, even though we have school districts that are pushing so hard to make sure that students are protected. And a new poll shows African Americans are getting the vaccine at 10 times the rate of white Americans. And the state of Mississippi is now nearly 2,000 nurses due to COVID-19 burnouts and stress. Nationally, lone applicants of color are 40 to 60 percent more likely to be denied than their white counterparts.

It's time to bring the funk on Roland. Whatever it is, he's got the scoop, the fact, the fine. And when it breaks, he's right on time. And it's rolling, best belief he's knowing. Putting it down from sports to news to politics. With entertainment just for kicks, he's rolling. It's Uncle Roro, y'all. It's Rolling Roro, y'all It's Rollin' Martin Rollin' with Rollin' now He's funky, he's fresh, he's real

The best you know, he's Rollin' Martin Now Martin Now. We're starting off with things on a bit of a somber note today. Two suicide bombs went off outside Kabul's airport, killing several United States service members and Afghan civilians. According to a senior U.S. official, ISIS-K is likely behind the attacks. Over the last few weeks, thousands gathered at the gates of the airport, which has become the epicenter of the evacuation. President Joe Biden was briefed along with Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and Secretary of State Antony Blinken. Several U.S. officials have released statements

on the gruesome event, including Representative Val Demings of Florida, who said in part, quote, My prayers are with the families and team members of the U.S. service members killed and injured in the line of duty today. Those we lost today will not be forgotten, and we will do all in our power to ensure the recovery of the wounded. I know that the rescue mission that they gave their lives to protect will continue. I ask that all Floridians join me in prayer for the fallen leaders, their loved ones, and continued safety of all Americans in Afghanistan and around the world.

Tens of thousands of people have been evacuated in the U.S. military and NATO allies from the airport. And Joe Biden, President Joe Biden, spoke to the American public shortly before this broadcast. Take a listen. A tough day. This evening in Kabul, as you all know, terrorists attacked that we've been talking about and worried about, that the intelligence community has assessed, has undertaken an attack by a group known as ISIS-K, took the lives of American service members

standing guard at the airport and wounded several others seriously. He had also wounded a number of civilians, and civilians were killed as well. I've been engaged all day in constant contact with the military commanders here in Washington and the Pentagon, as well as in Afghanistan and Doha. And my commanders here in Washington in the field have been on this with great detail,

and you've had a chance to speak to some so far. The situation on the ground is still evolving and I'm constantly being updated. These American service members who gave their lives, it's an overused word but it's totally appropriate here, were heroes. Heroes who have been engaged in a dangerous, selfless mission to save the lives of others. They're a part of an airlift, an evacuation effort unlike any seen in history, with more than 100,000 American citizens, American partners, Afghans who helped us, and others taken to safety in the last 11 days. Just the last 12 hours or so another 7,000 have gotten out. They were part of the bravest, most capable, the most selfless military on the face of

the earth, and they're part of simply what I call the backbone of America. They're the spine of America, the best the country has to offer. Jill and I, our hearts ache, like I'm sure all of you do as well, for all those Afghan families who lost loved ones, including small children, who have been wounded in this vicious attack. And we're outraged as well as heartbroken. Being the father of an Army major who served for a year in Iraq and before that was in Kosovo as a U.S. attorney for the better part of six months in the middle of a war. When he came home after a year in Iraq, he was diagnosed like many, many coming home with an aggressive and lethal cancer of the brain.

We lost. We have some sense, like many of you do, what the families of these brave heroes are feeling today. You get this feeling like you're being sucked into a black hole in the middle of your chest. There's no way out. My heart aches for you, but I know this. We have a continuing obligation, a sacred obligation to all of you, the families of those heroes. That obligation is not temporary. It lasts forever. The lives we lost today were lives given in the service of liberty, the service of security, the service of others, and the service of America. Like their fellow brothers and sisters in arms

who died defending our vision and our values in the struggle against terrorism. Of the fall on this day, they're part of a great and noble company of American heroes. To those who carried out this attack, as well as anyone who wishes America harm, know this. We will not forgive. We will not forget. We will hunt you down and make you pay. August 31st is the deadline for the final exit from a 20-year war in Afghanistan.

20 years, $2 trillion. Joining me now is Risa Colbert from Black Women Views, Dr. Greg Carr, Chair of the Department of African American Studies at Howard University, and Faraji Muhammad, radio and TV host. And I'll start with you, Dr. Carr. We're seeing so many new developments out of Afghanistan.

It's been unfolding all day. What are your thoughts on the evacuation as it stands and some of the detractors that we've heard thus far, particularly on the right, who are arguing that this was ill-planned, ill-fated, and are really, in many cases, even asking for President Biden's impeachment or resignation at this point? Well, I think, Amisha, we can immediately dismiss all of those warmongers. If Donald Rumsfeld were alive and not on the ground, he would be joining them. But everybody from Bolton to Dick Cheney, the warmongers who got the United States in Afghanistan in the first place, and then in Iraq as well on a pretense. They can all be dismissed because it's all politics. They are trying to wash their sins. The sin, some people would say,

Barbara Lee being the one who had the courage to say it in the federal legislature, was going in in the first place. There's no good way to leave an occupation like that. And whether it be Afghanistan, Iraq or Yemen or Somalia or Libya, there isn't a country the United States has occupied or partially invaded during the so-called war on terror over the last couple of decades that has been improved as a result. There's no good time to leave. Remember, Donald Trump, in fact, enabled the Taliban, in fact, released one of the leaders of the Taliban who's over there right now. And these same people were not clamoring for any resignation. Now, that's just domestic politics. But as far as developments today, they're entirely predictable. The government that the United States tried to stand up

collapsed. Could it have stayed a little longer? Perhaps. But let's be very clear. What happened today is the unintended consequence of a terrible occupation. It had to end sometime. And as you said, $2 trillion, it's enough. It's time to get out. And Recy, I know that you've spoken about the refugee crisis as it relates to a lot of Central American refugees and other groups on various networks. When it comes to the Afghan crisis that we're seeing right now, we know that getting out American troops and Americans from Afghanistan is the number one priority for President Biden and for the United States. But what are we seeing

happen on the ground when it comes to these Afghan refugees? Well, I mean, let me start by saying that the Biden-Harris administration inherited a large backlog of these special immigrant visas, the visas, over almost 18,000 of them. Actually, the Trump administration was sued because they were slow-walking the visa processing. And then when you add on the coronavirus pandemic, that obviously also led to a crawl when it comes to processing these visas. And so right now there's a catch-up game that's happening because the Afghan government that was stood up has collapsed.

And so there's a scramble to get as many people out as quickly as possible before the August 31 deadline. And we have seen over 100,000 people have been evacuated up until today without any bloodshed. And that was a remarkable, extraordinary feat, considering that there is still a war going on. Just because the Taliban was able to stage a coup and disrupt the Afghan government doesn't mean that they have full control over the country. And that's what we saw today, with ISIS-K attacking or purportedly ISIS-K attacking the Afghan citizens.

The U.S. Embassy or the State Department put out a warning that there was a security threat. And so, at this point, the people who were mostly attacked were, you know, there were some Marines that died and there were some Afghan civilians, including children, that died. It's because of the chaos from these terrorists that are still there. And so there is absolutely still a threat to them. I think the U.S. government is staging a remarkable diplomatic feat by working with the Taliban,

not giving credit to the Taliban, but they are the de facto government at this point, and getting as many people out. And so I think we can't talk about the situation without acknowledging how much effort has to go into this and how much the Trump administration neglected this program and our allies prior to the Biden-Harris administration taking over. Good points. Faraji, we heard some very strong things from both Dr. Carr as well as Risi related to how this actually built up and what some of the expectation is further. As it relates to where we go from here, not only in terms of drawing down and getting as many of our people out as possible, but also ensuring the safety of the Afghan people, we also think about the politics, what this looks like here in America.

How do you think this could possibly affect the overall Biden agenda as well as elections going into midterms? I mean, this could be a very serious situation. I want to go back to something that Dr. Carr had spoken about. I mean, the United States of America, the presence has been in the Middle East for many, many years, going back to even George Bush, you know, Jr. We can go even further back than that. But when we saw that level of presence, this is not an isolated incident. The slippery slope that I think President Biden has to consider in this situation is, is America, as we currently stand right now, as we currently stand in the world, as we currently stand with troops, with the number of troops that we have available,

as we currently stand with the sentiment, the political sentiments in this country, are we able to have a very tough talk? Can we have that tough talk and then be prepared to follow up that talk with any type of military action? That's going to be the big question that I think that is going to be challenging the Biden administration right now. If things continue to escalate the way they are going, should we expect a war on the horizon or some type of military action? And I would go to say that where this country is right now, I mean, we're getting upset about masks, let alone talking about missiles dropping on trying to find members of ISIS-K. So there's a lot of things. And I think it's very important that as we have this conversation, that it's important for us as black media that we don't fall into the trap of creating a narrative as if this is an isolated incident, in such that, as Dr. Carr said,

if we don't look at the history of America and going into places and going into countries and destabilizing governments, sending in jackals, sending in all types of folks to destabilize governments, and then trying to prop up leadership that is in the best interest of the foreign policy of this country, and then when things fall apart, it's like, oh, man, we now want to put out the lives of the American troops. We want to put out the importance of the American interest. And I think that we need to make sure that we don't fall back into that trap, because we've seen this playbook time and time again. And, you know, we got to ask the question. I'm with Dr. Conway Recy. We got to get out,

get out of the situation as it is. That way, we don't have to continue to spend an exorbitant amount of money. We don't have to lose any more lives of our troops, whether they're black or white. And we can get on the business of getting our country together because we're not together to create, to wage any type of military action against another country. And before we have to move on to another topic, Dr. Carr, I want to come back to you on this. The United States has largely had an image that was disrupted over the past four years with the previous presidency. And internationally, that set us up in a very bad place on a world stage. Today, how are our European allies specifically, as well as other

allies who have helped us during our occupation of Afghanistan, how are they feeling about how all of this is shaking down? Has America created its own detriment in terms of those allegiances and those partnerships? Well, of course it has. The global map is being redrawn. I think to understand Afghanistan, we have to put it, as Raji just said, in a context, a long view of history. Well, not a long view, maybe the last century, three quarters of a century. We're still dealing with the fallout of World War II. World War II was the last time you saw a unified global effort against fascism. That was, of course, the Nazis and then Italy. And then even Japan gets pulled in there.

That's a little different. But post-1945, which is when you see the creation of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, NATO, and the Warsaw Pact countries around the Soviet Union, that's when the fight really has to be anchored. The Europeans, these are the former empires that are the reason why we're having this conversation in English. England, France, even Germany to a limited degree. But these are the folks who had invaded other parts of the globe and who saw their empires shrink and crumble.

So after World War II, you see the rise of anti-colonialism. You see the independence movement in Africa, the Caribbean, Latin America. And you see the Soviet Union attempting to maintain some control in that region of the world, playing the quote-unquote great game in the so-called Middle East. And you see the United States then begin to engage in this Cold War with the Soviet Union, with the allies from NATO. What does that mean? What does it have to do with today?

Well, remember that the United States fought a proxy war in Afghanistan against Russia, using the Mujahideen, using Osama bin Laden, using folk who then felt themselves betrayed when the United States, having neutralized what they thought the Soviet Union and then Russia, withdrew. That's directly what led to 9-11, 2001. And so what we're facing right now is the simple fact that people live in the world. And nowhere these empires, either the early empires for England, France, Germany, Holland, or the ones that came after, including the United States, anywhere these empires go to

invade, there are people there who will resist them. The simple fact of the matter is no one in Afghanistan was begging for the United States to come in. Those people want to be self-determining. And at the end of the day, now that the United States is going, guess who is shoring up their power? In fact, they've been there for quite some time. Russia, China, Pakistan. And did the United States sell out NATO? Well, Great Britain is like, yo, y'all leaving? Did we get the memo?

What the hell's going on? At the end of the day, the United States has to get out of there because there's no way to win a war of occupation. Every war since then, Korea, Vietnam, every war since World War II has been an army of occupation. The United States has been an army of occupation. And the people who do the living and dying in those wars are the people who look like us. Joe Biden, Donald Trump, they ain't going to fight no war. Mike Pompeo, who met with the Taliban, they're not going to fight a war. It's going to be our sisters and brothers, our cousins, our children. So no, I think that the Europeans are feeling a little disgruntled. They're a little put off. But guess what? Who cares? Who cares? It's time to bring those troops out of that country.

Absolutely. I think that many across America would actually agree with you, especially those who, as you spoke of, look like us, who have lost many, many brothers, sisters, generations in this endless war. Switching gears, the number of COVID cases are steadily rising as the highly transmissible Delta variant rips through the United States. There are a total of 39,160,967 reported cases and over 649,000 reported deaths in America. Over 100,000 patients are hospitalized with the virus. This is the highest number of hospitalizations since January. Pediatric cases are at a record high with over 50,000 children hospitalized since August. And medical experts are recommending

vaccinations as the best tool to help slow down the virus. A new poll shows African Americans are getting the vaccine at 10 times the rate of white Americans. 10 times. The NBC News poll shows 76 percent of blacks claim to be vaccinated, while whites are at 66 percent. This number comes as a surprise when blacks have been getting blamed and slammed for low vaccination rates from Republicans in states like Texas. The poll also showed 91% of Biden voters are vaccinated, while only 50% of Trump supporters received the vaccine. Let's bring back our panel. Recy, we've heard time and time again of the targeting, the micro-targeting to get African-Americans to get the vaccine. We've also seen a lot of, and kudos to you for actually resharing a lot of this on your Twitter, a lot of the anti-vax

campaigns and anti-vax memes that have been directed towards African-Americans. Are you surprised by these polling numbers? And can we dig a little deeper? What does this actually mean for the success or the progress of vaccination in our community? Well, I'm not surprised by the numbers, but I'm going to say something a lot of people are going to be pissed off about, but the numbers are BS because this is polling data that is completely out of step with all of the public health reporting that's been done by individual states and by the cdc and so people don't lie about being vaccinated go get vaccinated get the shot if you only want one shot get the johnson and johnson vaccine um you're gonna have to do a booster in eight months, regardless of which vaccine that you have.

But, you know, to me, what the poll shows is that people understand the societal impacts and maybe perhaps the way it looks to say that you're unvaccinated. And so that's why you see such large numbers of people saying they're unvaccinated when the public health data just does not support that. There's no reason for the CDC or for the individual states to lie about the vaccination rates by race and by demographic. And so I think people are more incentivized to not tell the truth in a poll. But I am encouraged to the extent that it seems like people are recognizing that being vaccinated is something that they should be doing. And if they haven't already done it, perhaps they're making plans to do it. This Delta vaccine, I mean, the Delta variant is incredibly serious. And the ramifications of not being vaccinated outside of the possibility of getting COVID, being hospitalized or dying are starting to be much more financial in impact in

terms of higher insurance costs or losing your job. And so I am encouraged, at least, that some people are recognizing, hey, I should be vaccinated. At least I'm going to say I'm vaccinated. But it's not encouraging if people aren't, in fact, following through and getting vaccinated. And so, yes, you mentioned the disinformation campaign that is playing a huge role in the hesitancy or the resistance to it. And it's something that we are being targeted with. So we still have to continue to scale back. I don't agree with blaming Black people for the rise of COVID. Obviously, we don't make up a large enough proportion of the population to be the cause of the spread. But we still have a responsibility to continue to talk to our family and our friends and make sure that people are

following through and actually getting vaccinated instead of just saying they're vaccinated. Absolutely. And Dr. Carr, we know that one of the big reasons that a lot of people said they weren't vaccinated was because the vaccine was experimental. Now that the Pfizer vaccine has full FDA approval, we've seen places across government, from city government to state government, that are now requiring employees to actually get vaccinated, as well as many, many schools requiring teachers and such, and students who are old enough to actually get the vaccine to get the vaccine. Same thing that we're seeing at university levels. And to Recy's point, we've also seen, we've also seen in many cases people lose their job or have the threat of losing their job should

they not get vaccinated. Do you think that this approach, this move from the carrot incentives approach that started off a couple of months ago or so to now a more punitive stick approach, do you think that this is going to work and it's really going to help set America on pace with where we should be in terms of our vaccination efforts? Yeah, Michelle, I think it's going to have to be the stick. I mean, and we've been saying that from day one. Every expert, every medical expert that's been on this show has let us know well over a year ago that when this thing finally got developed and then late last year when it was unveiled, that there was going to be a stick. We were talking about everything, the possibility of COVID passports to COVID sections and restaurants or vaccinated sections and restaurants. We knew this day was coming. I mean, right there, your homies in Illinois, I mean, the governor,

as we know, said, you know, you're not coming to teach, you're not coming to go to school, K-12 or higher ed without being vaccinated. We knew the stick was coming. And I agree, Reesey, 100 percent. You're absolutely right. In the war of misinformation, folks at least saying they're vaccinated, even if they're not, understand you should get vaccinated. And we, of course, know, Lieutenant Governor of Texas Dan Patrick, white nationalist, is saying you don't blame black people and your shovel-mouthed boss is out there trying like hell to ban people from making decisions at the local level about approving or requiring people to be vaccinated,

that means that it really isn't about whether or not the FDA approved the vaccine. That's really probably not going to move the needle one way or the other. But the stick, the possibility that you about to lose your job might be the thing. But it's not going to be because people say, I'm waiting for the FDA. Really? Now you for the FDA. Really? Now y'all trust it. Oh, you trust the FDA now. You know what? Just just bring the stick. Some people only. And Faraji, I also have one for you. We know that to Reese's point earlier, at the end of the day, there are many people who just aren't being honest in these polls when asked have they gotten the vaccine or not, be it whether it's shame or otherwise. What we do know from CDC data, from hospital data, from clinic data, from pharmacy

data, is that one of the largest portions of people who have not yet been vaccinated are African-American young males. How can we push up those numbers? How can we get more young Black men, millennials and otherwise, to actually get this vaccine? Stop lying to people. I mean, it starts there. This whole process. And I think that also there's this huge fear campaign against the quote unquote the unvaccinated. It sounds like something out of a Walking Dead type of, you know, post-apocalyptic type of film where now you're unvaccinated, you're vaccinated. You know, if you're unvaccinated, we don't want your kind here. Look at what is happening in this country and look at the damage that it's doing to

the American people. And it's interesting that these numbers are coming out with this poll showing that Black folks are at the top or more vaccinated. But we're still not having a conversation around the fact that white people are choosing not to get vaccinated, not just Trump supporters. I'm talking about liberal whites as well are choosing not to get vaccinated. This campaign cannot just be focused on getting black people vaccinated. And I just got to disagree with the fact that you got to bring the state. This is the this is going to be a problem, folks.

This is going to be a declaration of war. People should not have to feel like they want to lose their job because they are deciding to make a health care decision that's, yes, that affects other people. But if they're wearing a mask, if you're staying socially distant, then why should you have to lose your job? For example, you know, there was a CNBC put out a report just a day or two ago saying that Delta Airlines was planning on pushing up the insurance costs for the unvaccinated by $200 a month. What in the hell is that about? So you're going to penalize somebody for vaccinating that shows that Dr. Fauci said just recently, he said this in an interview, that because of the Delta variant, folks, I'm not making these numbers up. He said that the Delta, the vaccination effectiveness against the Delta variant went from 91 percent to 66 percent.

But for Raji, that doesn't mean that doesn't elicit the response that I think that you might be alluding to. That should not make people not get the vaccine. What we do know is that the more people who don't have it, the more often these these mutations can occur. And that's how we got something like the Delta variant. That's how we will get more variants. What we have to do is ensure we get more people vaccinated. Therefore, there won't be enough body hosts for these variants to actually attach to and morph into things that make it harder for us to control. I hear you. And what I'm speaking of, really, Arneesha, is that we're talking about the cost that now is taking place in the workplace, the cost that's taking place among the citizens of this country.

And that has to, we've really got to look at that. Do we want to go down that road? We already have. Faraji, we already tax people. We already tax people who are smokers at higher rates. That's part of their insurance. We also tax people at higher rates who have obesity and other things that, you know, many in the medical profession could consider preventable. So this isn't exactly a new trick.

Here's the problem. Here's the problem. Does that stop people from smoking? Has that stopped people from gaining weight? No. So if we're talking about having an approach about this, you're saying you asked me originally, how do we get black men to get vaccinated? Empower people to make the right decision to afford their, for the best, for their I WANT TO SAY THIS, I WANT TO SAY THIS, I WANT TO SAY THIS, EMPOWER PEOPLE TO MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION. TO AFFORD THEIR, FOR THE BEST, FOR THEIR HEALTH CARE NEEDS AND

FOR THEIR FAMILY'S HEALTH CARE NEEDS. YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BEAT PEOPLE OVER THE HEAD. AS LONG AS PEOPLE, LOOK, I'M A MASK ADVOCATE. I DOUBLE MASK. I STAY AWAY FROM PEOPLE.

I DO ALL OF THOSE THINGS. EMPOWER PEOPLE. AND LET'S PRESENT OTHER INFORMATION OUT THERE THAT WE'VE empower people. And let's present other information out there that we've been talking about. I know the CDC came out with two big announcements, one saying that pregnant women can be vaccinated, the other saying that those who are immunocompromised, how come we're not having conversations about strengthening the immune system? How come we're not having enough conversations about making sure that the numbers that we just presented here, that those numbers, you still have a lot of people that have survived COVID. Let's look at, well, what did you do to get into a better space? How were you able to survive COVID? So all of these things are important. But if you keep beating people over

their head about this vaccination, you're going to create a war in this country that the country is not prepared for, whether socially, economically, and hell, we're now seeing it educationally, bringing our children in. This is not the war that we need to be waging against each other at a time where this country is already, is under great judgment and is already dealing with the issues. There should never be a war on experts. There should never be a war on science. With that being said, we're going to go to the next story. Illinois governor, the Illinois governor, J.B. Pritzker, my home state governor, he issued a statewide vaccine

mandate for education and health care personnel. Democratic Governor J.B. Pritzker's executive order extends to eligible students and includes an indoor mask mandate for everyone over the age of two. Those who choose not to get vaccinated will undergo weekly testing. In a news conference, the governor responds to a reporter attempting to spread misinformation. Take a listen. complaining about mask wearing. I'm going to take the podium again and just respond to that. Let me just say this. You are spreading misinformation. I wish you would stop spreading misinformation. You come in here with a political agenda and you spread misinformation. And I just think you should stop. We now need to protect our children. We need to protect the people in our communities, parents, grandparents, teachers.

You are working against that. And it is extremely upsetting for all of us who are trying to keep the rest of the state safe. It's important to note that 95 percent, 95 percent of COVID deaths in Illinois were among the unvaccinated. The American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees Council 31, the state's largest union, is challenging the mandates. The state's biggest teachers union is in support of the new executive order. Illinois currently has 1,503,063 reported cases and over 26,000 reported deaths. Over 50% of Illinois residents are fully vaccinated. Meanwhile, taking a deep dive down to Texas, Texas governor bans government entities from issuing vaccine mandates at all. And we know how things are turned out in Texas.

Governor Greg Abbott, who recently tested positive for COVID-19 himself, signed this executive order while the Lone Star State has over three million cases and 56,000 reported deaths. Last month, Abbott issued an executive order stating government agencies cannot mandate vaccines under emergency use authorization. Abbott, who is fully vaccinated, wants the legislature to decide on vaccine mandates and exemptions. Of course, to bring back our panel, Recy, Recy, Recy, Recy, what is happening here? We're seeing the the we talked about the carrot and stick approach. We talked about some of the punitive measures that are being taken. But now that we have a covid-19 vaccine in the Pfizer vaccine that has gotten beyond emergency use at this point, they are fully FDA approved. And now you're seeing more states push towards mandating the vaccine for various reasons

and in various entities across the states. But we're watching pushback, particularly from southern states in places like Texas, where not only did Governor Abbott actually get COVID-19 himself, but this is also a guy who is vaccinated, a guy who used the monoclonal antibodies and a guy who has absolutely no problem telling his constituents basically to ignore masks and to ignore the vaccine in its entirety? Well, this is where politics trumps science, unfortunately. And the demographic, the specific demographic that is the most vaccine hesitant is white Republicans and Trump supporters. I mean, even Trump was booed for

mentioning that he was to take the vaccine at his own rally. And so the right wing media has just ginned up all of this anti-vax sentiment and exploited it. And now the chickens are kind of coming home to roost on that end. But unfortunately, the right wing media and their talking points are permeating in the black community. When you hear somebody like Busta Rhymes saying things like we can't breathe and likening what's happening now to the civil rights movement, those are right wing talking points. Things that have originated from things like 4chan memes, which is certainly not a place where black people congregate. And so that's part of what's happening. It's the politics of it. The politics is truly trumping science. And I think we even saw a little bit of that with the CDC

earlier, you know, a few months ago when they said that if you're vaccinated, you don't have to wear a mask. That was somewhat of a political decision because I think they wanted to incentivize people to get vaccinated. And then what you ended up having, as polls have indicated, and I know I just said I don't go by polls for certain things, but I but we do have some polling that suggests that the people who are most likely to wear a mask are actually vaccinated people and people who are not likely to wear a mask or unvaccinated people. So I get that the unvaccinated camp is always trying to say wear a mask and social distance. But that's not the attitude that we've not the the attitude that we've seen expressed

the sentiments that we've seen expressed in pollings that uphold them and so unfortunately the whole um honor system and the whole we're all in this together system does not work you have to have um you have to force people to do the right thing or maybe it's not right to them but it's the right thing for society and you know, we've had 5 billion doses administered throughout the world. China has administered almost 2 billion. In America, it's been over 170 million doses have been administered. This is a safe vaccine. It's safer than Viagra and Cialis and flat tummy tea and all this other shit that y'all are out here doing and you don't even know if a vector meant a vector of edmonton i don't know how to say it but horse de warmer that you guys around here people are on themselves in grocery stores and they're talking about they

don't want to go to the to the hospital and they don't want to get a vaccine they don't want to get regeneron but they're taking horse de warmer give me Give me a break, people. It is time to just kind of get a clue. And I just want to say one more thing, too. You know, listen, I love the way Dr. Carr says, take the shot or not. And I say I like to say that, too. He says it better than me. But here's the thing. You have a right. We are a free country. You have a right to make decisions about your own health. That does not mean that your decisions are without consequence. They're not without consequence to those around you when we are all sharing the same space and air. And that doesn't mean that they're without

consequence to you financially. The reason why Delta raised the rates for unvaccinated people is because they say, and I don't see why they would lie, but okay, you have conspiracy theories all around. But according to them, 100% of the people who have been hospitalized, not 100% of the people who've gotten COVID, have been unvaccinated. And those hospital stays are $40,000 a pop. And so what Delta is saying is if you want to take on the risk of increased hospitalization rates, then you're going to pay for it. I have absolutely no problem with that. You have a right to take on whatever risk that you want to take, but that does not mean that that risk does not come without consequences. And so people are relying on the vaccinated to get us to herd immunity and for us to do the

heavy lifting on that while people sit back and say well i'm i'm not going to get back saying i'm going to do vitamins and other stuff it's it's it's you gotta you you you gotta have some skin in the game just like everybody else and so that's where these mandates are coming in that's where these financial incentives are coming in and you you didn't take the free donuts you didn't take the free beer and the $100 gift cards and the raffles and shit. So now you got to take the mandate. And Dr. Carr, what about the kids throughout all of last year? We know that the pandemic of 2020, COVID-19 of 2020 and COVID-19 of 2021 are two very different things. COVID-19 of 2020, our greatest risk and our greatest concern

was our elders. A lot of seniors were quite frankly, dying and dying in droves. And we had a president at that time who was absolutely fine with that and sacrificing everybody's grandparents. Now we have a president who has gone out of his way to develop a pretty comprehensive COVID-19 outreach and engagement strategy and make sure that the vaccine is readily available

to honestly anyone who wants to take it. Now we've moved into a phase where we're seeing children incubated. Five, seven, ten, toddlers even, and in some cases babies. What will it take for the American public to realize that your personal liberty, though you have it, does not mean that you also have the ability to infringe on somebody else's health rights? Well, Alicia, I don't know. Because, you know, sometimes maybe some folk may get tired of me

saying it, but this isn't a nation. There's no such thing as the American people. We live on the same continent. We live under the same government, federal and state and local government. But there's no common culture. We have to understand that. And I think what Faraji said, I don't think that metaphor is too strong when we use that three-letter word war, because now you've got children whose parents are hardcore anti-vaxxers who won't wear masks, as Risi said, and the reports of those children going and breathing on other children. See, that's an ass-whipping for you. That's an ass-whipping for you. That's an ass-whipping for

your punk-ass mother and father and anybody else, because this isn't a country. Understand that shovel-mouthed governor of Texas, who my mother and you and all of us paid for the vaccine that went in his arm. There are no free vaccines. The pharmaceutical companies are making billions. In disaster, people make profit. In Afghanistan, Bessie DuVal's brother Eric Prince is charging $6,500 a pop to get on charter planes to leave Afghanistan. Nobody misses a crisis to make money. That shovel-mouthed governor should never have put that needle in his arm if he thought that he was the governor

for the common good. But there is no common good. That's only him running for president in 2024, trying to rally his white nationalist base and gambling that enough of them hillbillies will be alive to vote for him in 2024. Just like that cosplay governor of Florida in those intentionally ill-fitting suits playing a country bumpkin is betting that when he runs for president, enough of his hillbilly supporters will be alive to vote for him. They are literally putting their politics ahead of anything because there is no common concern, because there's no American people. There's only politics and individuals with their individual agendas. And so I don't know what it will take.

It might just take death. It might just take death. Because as you said, the governor of Illinois said this is a pandemic at this point of the unvaccinated. And Dr. Carr, since you led into it, we're going to get right to it. In Florida, an emergency room doctor gets ousted after selling $50 mask exemption letters to students. Dr. Brian Warden, physician at Capital Regional Center in Tallahassee, offered letters to medically excused students after the mandate was required. Warden's services come after Leon County School District superintendents wanted a stricter mask mandate after an increase in COVID cases.

Nine Florida County school districts are fighting Governor DeSantis' mandate and requiring masks in their classrooms. I'm going to lead off with you on this one, Faraji. When it comes to the defiant student leaders, the superintendents, the teachers, the principals who literally want to protect the kids in their classrooms, we're seeing the standoff between those entities and the governor. How do you see this playing out? It's not playing out well at all. This is not going to play out well at all. Here's the thing I don't understand. Last year, my son went to school, and they had decided to do in-person and online learning. And when we decided to put him in, they had a smaller number of students in the classroom. Eleven students or a little bit less than 11.

They socially distanced the space. Parents could not come into the classroom. Eleven students or a little bit less than 11. They made socially distant the space. Parents could not come into the building. All the students had to wear masks. I'm talking about at seven years old. So this can be done. This can be done. And it's and it's and it's disheartening that we do have in states like Florida and states like Texas and in some other states PARTNERING THAT WE DO HAVE IN STATES LIKE FLORIDA AND STATES LIKE TEXAS AND IN SOME OTHER STATES THAT YOU GOT THIS BIG PUSH NOT EVEN TO WEAR MASKS. THAT'S ABSOLUTELY INSANE. AND I'M WITH, YOU KNOW, I LISTEN TO BUSTER. I KNOW WHAT HE SAID. TOTALLY DISAGREE WITH HIM. TOTALLY DISAGREE WITH HIM. YOU NEED TO PUT THE DAMN MASK ON. YOU NEED TO PUT THE MASK ON. AND I THINK THAT AS WE HAVE THIS CONVERSATION, I REMEMBER JUST report earlier this week from the Washington Post. And on that report,

family, it said Biden receives inconclusive intelligence report on the origin of COVID-19. And that report that the president had asked to do over a 90-day period, they cannot, and this is the intelligence community have said, that they could not determine the origin of COVID-19. Now, what does that say to you? Because I'm putting it out there to folks to really, you know, to let it marinate and analyze. What that says to me is that this country does not have a real grasp of where COVID-19 has come from. They can't even say it's from Wuhan. They can't even say if it's from Fort Detrick or any other place. They don't know. The intelligence community, some of the brightest minds of ourRY, RIGHT? THEY DON'T KNOW.

AND FOR ME, AS I READ THIS REPORT AND I READ HOW THIS THING PLAYS OUT, I'M SAYING IF THEY DON'T KNOW, THEN FOLKS, THEN THAT PUTS US IN A VERY, VERY SERIOUS POSITION WHERE WE CAN'T DEFINITIVELY SAY THIS WILL WORK AND THAT WILL WORK BECAUSE WE DON'T EVEN KNOW THE ORIGIN OF A SITUATION. where we can't definitively say this will work and that will work because we don't even know the origin of a situation. So I just wanted to put that out there. No, I think the masks are one of the best tools that we can use. We can teach our children to use masks and we can be smart about it in schools. We just have to have the political will and just come to the point to say we got to figure something else out because this thing is totally in a space where we don't know what's going on. We don't have a full handle on it yet. I think that those are good points. I want to bring

Recy into this. Recy, we know that masking has been something that most schools want to see happen. The schools that are designated that don't have students old enough to be able to be eligible for the vaccine specifically. But we also have to acknowledge that there are other things that that school districts, particularly those who are those who are union representatives for various public school districts, are asking. One of them is about class size. The other is about a lot of the ventilation standards and other things that make it very difficult to mitigate a COVID crisis. What we know is that masking isn't all that we can do. And because those young people under 12 cannot get vaccinated, at the end of the day, we have not met the standard that even the CDC has

actually put forth in terms of making sure that class sizes are smaller, particularly in black and brown schools where we know overcrowding is something that happens on a daily basis, but also ensuring that they have the necessary items for cleanliness. A lot of cases, teachers are bringing those things in themselves. They're not supplied by the state or by the school district. But just in terms of ensuring that these buildings are safe for students, let's scratch mask for a minute. Let's say all the students wear masks. At the end of the day, if you have 30, 40 kids in a room, how helpful is the masking even if everybody is abiding by it?

Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, masking is one tool in the toolkit. It's not the only tool that should be deployed. But I saw a picture today, my sister-in-law shared a picture of her, my niece, in class, and their desks were facing towards each other. And I'm like, what the hell is that? That is not social distancing when you have two kids that are facing towards each other. And I remember the CDC went from six feet to three feet being social distancing, and then they're supposed to be plexiglass. The fact of the matter is, these schools are not ready for these kids to come back. And it's incredibly scary. And parents are having to make very difficult choices, because, as

Faraj pointed out, we're not dealing with the coronavirus of 2020. Or maybe it was you, Amisha. I'm sorry. One of you guys said that. We're dealing with a totally different situation. We're not having distance learning. We're not having social distancing. We're not forcing minimal contact between parents coming onto campuses and students and things of that nature. And so we are very, very ill-equipped. And it just seems like there's been this rush back to schools to try to this rush back to normalcy. And, you know, I actually read a study that suggested projections are suggesting that up to 80 percent of school students can get COVID within the next two months. And it's just an absolutely astronomical number that seems unconscionable, which is why I haven't tried to repeat it or to share it.

But there are some very, very dire warnings out there about the implications of sending these kids back to school without all the appropriate measures in place. And one other thing I want to mention is, you have governors like Greg Abbott of Texas and Governor Ron DeSantis of Florida that are touting these monoclonal antibodies like Regeneron as these cures, and let's get as many doses out there for people as possible. But children are not eligible for those treatments. If you're over 12, kids are allowed to get the vaccine, but that is not necessarily the case for those treatments there. If you're over 12, kids are allowed to get the vaccine, but that is not necessarily the case for Regeneron. And so there is still a gap in

the ability to really fight this. And still the most effective treatment is is actually preventative measure, which is the vaccine. But we have so far to go outside of masks to get these students ready. And, unfortunately, we have shown as a country that we don't really care about students. When you have Sandy Hook where elementary school students were gunned down, and instead of gun control being passed, we started having gun drills. We just are not a country that cares about our children the way that we need to. And my heart really goes out to parents that are having to make the very tough decision as to whether to send their children to school or, you know, try to homeschool them without the resources

that are available for last year. It's a very scary situation. That's not fear mongering. That's just the reality of what we're dealing with right now. The state of Mississippi is down nearly 2,000 nurses due to COVID-19, burnout, and stress. Hospitals across the state are overwhelmed with sickly COVID patients. State officials report 63% of ICU beds are filled with COVID patients. Nurses in the state report long hours, burnout, and watching preventable deaths are causing them to resign. Mississippi Governor Tate Reeves reports

1,000 healthcare personnel have arrived to help hospitals statewide. An investment in infrastructure could create thousands of jobs by 2030. That's a good thing. A report released by S&P Global shows that a trillion dollar investment in infrastructure will alone create 833,000 more jobs by 2030. Experts say an investment of this size and impact of COVID-19 could create millions of jobs on the

market. S&P also projects total economic activity will increase by more than $1.4 trillion over the next decade. There's been historical growth in jobs numbers as the nation added 4 million new jobs since President Biden took office. This is the most by any president in the first six months of their term.

Chew on that for a bit. New data suggests unemployment benefits don't actually play a role in hiring challenges. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, states that withdrew early from federal unemployment programs didn't actually push people back to work. Big surprise. Even though Republicans told us it would, it hasn't. Experts warn this decision could hurt local economies as the September 6th deadline for the pandemic unemployment assistance programs looms. Officials say nearly 7.5 million Americans will be affected. However, the Biden administration

is encouraging states with high unemployment rates to use those federal funds provided by the American Rescue Plan to keep benefits flowing past the September 6th deadline. And researchers say that seven in eight people struggle to find jobs after being forced out of unemployment. Joining me now is Kristen Brody, Ph.D., fellow in the Metropolitan Policy Program, the Brookings Institute. Welcome. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. So we would like for you to break this down for our audience. We know that there have been several conservatives across multiple states, pundits, talking heads, political leaders and the like, who honestly believe that the Biden administration was providing too many

gimmies in terms of extended unemployment benefits for individuals. They thought that that was keeping them from work. They saw the hiring signs in front of bars, restaurants, retail shops, and the like, and decided that they were just going to not take the state unemployment benefits because the idea was that these people were basically living high off government funds and would go immediately back to work after those funds were gone. That is not what we're seeing. Can you explain what is happening and how are these people surviving now that they no longer have extended unemployment benefits? So there are a couple of issues. If you think about this, this pandemic started last year,

right? So during that time, people left where they were. They moved in with family members. People couldn't afford their homes. They had to go and take care of loved ones or they wanted to take their children somewhere else, especially in very expensive metropolitan areas. Think about New York, Chicago, San Francisco. If you don't have a job there or if you don't have to go to work, if you're working remotely, why would you stay there and pay that expensive rent if you could go somewhere else and live with family members, right? A lot of people relocated. And so they're still there. They have obligations in these other places. It's not just

that people are still sitting at home waiting to go back to the same job that they had. Some of those small businesses closed down and don't exist anymore. People left where they were. There are people who weren't able to get vaccinated, who don't have broadband anymore, or who their children aren't back at school, or there's not a mask mandate at the children's school, and they don't feel comfortable sending the children back to school. There's so many reasons why people haven't gone back to work that have nothing to do with unemployment benefits. And I think the other issue is when we think about losing these benefits and talking about like people are being lazy or that they're making too much money money if the unemployment benefits

if that amount is more than they were making that says that there's a problem with wages right like the minimum wage hasn't increased to keep up with the prices of goods and services of education so yeah that just doesn't make sense economically and those are really great things that you point out kristen and when we're looking at moving forward, we know that the infrastructure package was basically a core function of the Build Back Better plan that President Biden has for the United States. When it comes to the black community and infrastructure and the millions of jobs that this infrastructure infrastructure package could actually create, how would that hit the black community and what types of jobs are those? We know that this is going to involve a lot of retooling and reskilling. But what does this actually mean in progress in play? What can the black community expect from these infrastructure jobs? So my research has focused on race and jobs at high risk of being automated.

Black and Latino people are overrepresented in jobs at high risk of being automated. The number one job is cashiers. There are 3.6 million cashiers in 2019. Black people are overrepresented in that job, along with Latino people. And so if you think about going to your local Walmart, CVS, Walgreens, or whatever other store you may go to regularly, think about how many cashiers there were before the pandemic, and think about how many cashiers there were before the pandemic and think about how many there are now. We're seeing a lot more automatic checkout machines, right? We're seeing at restaurants wanting to do takeout or encouraging Uber Eats that many restaurants

are still doing social distancing or they're not open inside as much as they were. So many people are being encouraged to order food at home, right? So that's Uber Eats drivers. That's not servers in restaurants. So if you look at the five jobs that employ the most people that have high automation risk scores, we see that black people are overrepresented in those jobs. Many of those jobs are customer facing. They can't be done remotely. So you can't go back to that job if it's been automated. And if that's your skill set, then what are you supposed to do now?

You don't just automatically transition into some other job. There's training that has to be done, right? There is the job even in your neighborhood? Do you have a way to get to it? Do you have a place to, a quality child care for your children while you're there? These things don't happen automatically. So we need to create pipelines for people to get to jobs that are currently available. And that doesn't happen by magic. Absolutely. What are some of the best ways from your research and from the work that you're doing that would benefit or create some pathway to economic uplift for Black Americans

who are currently unemployed or looking to switch careers to avoid what you just said in terms of the automation that we can't stop. It's actually only occurring at much faster paces right now. Yeah, so I think one of the things that I encourage is for companies to partner with HBCUs and minority-serving institutions and public institutions overall to provide training if that's the thing that's keeping people from jobs. And I don't want to suggest that a skills gap is the reason why people aren't working. But if someone needs to take a class or two, if there needs to be some training, HBCUs are perfect at that. They've been doing it for more than a hundred years now. And other groups. I'm thinking about the Kingsley House in New Orleans

that pairs people with training, with jobs, with child care and other resources that they need. We need more organizations like that that can then help bridge the gap for people to get them back to work, to pair them with child care, to get them transportation or whatever it is that they need to get back to work. But the main thing is wages. We need to see an increase in wages so that people can actually earn a living wage at whatever the job is that they're doing. And the reasons for unemployment or underemployment for Black Americans typically differ among Black women versus Black men. Can you speak to some of those differences and how

those groups overcome them? I know that you talk about child care, which is obviously a huge one for women, but not necessarily at the same rate for Black males. What are some of the impediments that Black men have and what are some of the pathways or, you know, some of the ways that you see them being able to overcome them and what types of resources are available? Yeah, so I think that historically Black women have been the caretakers of this nation, not just of their own families, but of white families, of white corporations, that we're the ones that are in HR. We're the ones that are taking care of children, elderly, disabled people, right?

We're the ones that are in all of those caretaking jobs. And we're the ones that are kind of seen as not really a threat, right? I think about Melissa Harris-Perry writes about this in her book, where some people see Black men as a threat. People, you know, would call them lazy or shiftless. And of course, they're not, right? So I think that a lot of that is discrimination, right, which is wrong. I think that everybody needs to be given a chance.

If it's a matter of training, transportation, whatever the case is, that we need to provide opportunities for everybody that is ready and willing to work and find individual policies for different cities and states to figure out why aren't people going to work? Is it wages? Is it training? Is it transportation? Is it that the job doesn't exist in their neighborhood anymore? It's not just a national policy. We need to look at individual areas and figure out why people are not going back to work and build up black communities and black businesses to help bridge that gap. And Chris said we have to go to break, but we love to have you back on. Definitely going to be in contact still to come on roland martin unfiltered hip-hop icon fab 5 freddy will be here to talk about his directorial debut the grass is greener in an m-depth look at how the war on drugs was really a war on people of color and are there really hidden biases and home mortgage approval processes? Stay with us.

You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. I believe that people our age have lost the ability to focus the discipline on the art of organizing. The challenges, there's so many of them and they're complex and we need to be moving to address them. But I'm able to say, watch out, Tiffany. I know this road. That is so freaking dope. Seek.com.

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Hopefully put another nail in the call for the racism. You talk about awakening America. It led to a historic summer of protest. I hope our younger generation don't ever forget that nonviolence is soul force. Christ's sake. Christ. It's injustice.

It's wrong. I do feel like in this generation, we've got to do more around being intentional and resolving conflict. You and I have always agreed. Yeah. But we agree on the big piece. Yeah. Our conflict is not about destruction. Conflict's going to happen.

I'm Chrisette Michelle. Hi, I'm Chaley Rose, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered. The American dream, purchasing a home. There are some hidden biases in the mortgage approval process in turning that American dream into an absolute nightmare. Nationally, loan applicants of color are 40 to 80 percent more likely to be denied than their white counterparts. And in certain metro areas, the disparity was greater than 250 percent. Joining me now are Sabrina Lowry of Sabrina Lowry Enterprises and Legacy Realty and Tanya Branchard, senior mortgage advisor of Madison Chase Capital. Good evening.

Hello. Good evening. Hello. Good evening. Sabrina, I'll start with you. We know that there is a crisis in home ownership in the Black community. This is nothing new. But the numbers are a lot higher now than they even were during some of the civil rights era. Can you break down to us why this is and what types of tools are in the chest that are even available to minorities that are actually looking to specifically black people who are looking to own homes? Because it seems like this is quite systemic. Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me here today. And the pandemic is not the first problem to prevent black home ownership. I've been a realtor for 18 years and I've been a homeowner for 19 years. Before becoming a homeowner, I watched my grandmother and my mother. So we're

talking about generational home ownership. I learned that there were stigmas and there were issues even back in the 70s when my grandmother purchased her home for the first time where interest rates were in the 20 percent, y'all. And that's like credit card rates. That's above what even an auto loan would go for. And when I purchased my home 19 years ago, the interest rates were below 7%. Now, here we are in a pandemic and the Fed decides we're going to keep these interest rates low. They're at the historically lowest they've ever been, 2%, 3%, and 4% across the board. And not only that, but as the broker, I'm the house hunter. I'm totally reliant upon the bankers, the lenders, the mortgage brokers to approve our population and our community because affordable housing is not a major factor.

It's just not there. It does not exist. I'll give you a perfect example. In the month of June, I placed a house on the market below 200,000. That is considered affordable housing. I had over 70 showing requests on the listing. Talk about a bidding war. There were over 19 contracts submitted. More than half of them needed to get financing. And the cash buyer wins. So that's the problem. And Tanya, to bring you into this conversation, we know that the housing market in 2021, to Sabrina's point, is something out of the wild, wild west. It is cash on demand in many cases. It is also the dying of a dream for a lot of particularly millennials, folks who are now that, I mean, some people think millennials,

they think super, super young, but there are millennials that are turning 40 this year, who are out in this system trying to buy homes, trying to get their families kick-started. And at the end of the day, Black millennials are kind of left out, hung and dry. We know what the numbers are. We know what the disparities are. Why are they so vast? And in what types of climates do you see there to be opportunities for engagement? How can we stop this astronomical difference in lending? Well, I think the biggest thing is really education. And I think that when people are going to purchase a home, if they were pre-qualified, pre-approved before they went in, that would make the process a lot easier. But you also have the different types of loans and down payments that the client will

have to come up with. So you have that to take into consideration too. Are they credit worthy with their credit score? Do they have enough money in the bank? Do they have reserves? So those are things that we look at when you get that application. And in today's market, because it's so competitive, you really want a pre-approval letter. You know, I don't give a letter out until I've verified assets, I've verified job employment, not with a phone call, just their W-2s and paystubs, just to make the process easier. And what else has happened in the market is that I really feel bad for FHA buyers, because that's what's happened. A lot of people don't even want to take a look at an FHA buyer. So what I've been doing is doing to-be-determined approvals, having the file come out of underwriting approved, and giving them not

only an approval letter, giving them a loan commitment, letting them know that the underwriter has looked at all their information. And it really is unfair because a lot of times people hear FHA and they think, oh, the client can't qualify. They have bad credit. It might just be a simple fact of their debt to income ratio was too high. On a whole, Fannie and Freddie stopped you at 45. FHA will let you go up to 57. So there are a lot of different pieces to the puzzle. It's just not name, address, social, and oh, I make a good living. And I think, unfortunately, a lot of people, when they get on the phone, they say, well, I make good money, but it's more than how much money you make. It's your overall picture. I want to stay with you for a minute on that, particularly as it relates to young people who

have student loan debt, something that is not easily eradicated, something that most people are going to be paying until their death. And then they're, you know, whatever is left of them is going to be paying it in perpetuity. How does someone who has that level of astronomical student loan debt, we know what those numbers are. How are they able to finally be able to have that dream of home ownership? Even if they have a good job, as you stated, even if they have a decent salary, they're still going to have this debt ratio in the majority of cases that is well above their earning potential. Well, I will say that I was so thankful that in the last two months, FHA changed their student loan requirements for payment. They've mirrored Freddie and Fannie now. So the biggest thing, especially, unfortunately,

even with the student loans, the student loan house, the Department of Education, Navia, they automatically put everybody's student loan in deferment. So now when I talk to a client, the first thing I say is, yeah, I know your loans. I think it's about to come out this month. I think everybody by September will have to start paying again. But what happened was they automatically put everybody in forbearance. So what we have to go by is your income-based repayment. But if on your credit report it says deferred, then that's a whole other ballgame. Now I've got to count 1% of that balance against you. And if that balance is $160,000, that's $1,600 I'm counting against you, and you're making $75,000, opposed to that income-based repayment, which would be $125, $140.

So I will say that I really feel like we had a victory with the student loans when it comes to FHA, because now we're on the same playing field. I literally started calling clients and saying, hey, now you can buy. At one point, I was really, I just was, I felt I was just despondent because so many people had everything, but then they had that high student loan debt and I had to count 1% against them immediately. So that has changed for the better.

But, and I'd just like to touch on one other thing with conventional and FHA. You know, in the article that came out today, I think it was U.S. Market and Housing Wire sent it as well, they talked about conventional finance requiring a 620 credit score. That's really a fallacy. It's not true. Although it only requires a 620 credit score, The chances of me running you through automated underwriting with a 620 credit score,

I would say nine times out of 10, I know it's gonna be a denial, but even take that, let's just say I got an approval. Mortgage insurance for conventional is based on credit score, and we do everything in 20 point buckets. So a 620 credit score, even if I got you an approval, FHA monthly MI is 0.85. With a 620 credit score, the monthly factor for MI would

be well over 2%, well, probably be 3%. And so that's another disparity that they don't talk about. Don't tell me I can qualify for a 620 conventional loan when in reality, now that's another disparity that they don't talk about. Don't tell me I can qualify for a 620 conventional loan when in reality, now that's where I'll say the algorithms are really off and you don't really get a qualification. But then if you do, I have people with a 700 credit score and sometimes I have people in, let's just say 660. 660 is a solid score. It's really fair, but nobody with a 660 wants to hear that. It's a solid score. But in reality, the mortgage insurance is higher than FHA, so it makes your payment higher. So sometimes you have to go FHA just so your mortgage insurance is lower. So there are just a lot of factors. And I know, I'm sorry, I went off on a little tangent there. But there's so many more things that we have to take into consideration. It's just not about credit score. Because a 620 on a conventional, the only person

that would really get that approval. And see, even with Fannie and Freddie, with a 620, they want two, three years of trade lines. And with a 620 score, most of the time you don't have three years, you're just starting out. Can I piggyback on that, ladies? I absolutely want to let Tanya know because we are business partners and we have been in this industry for years collaborating and seeing how deals can fall through in the ninth hour. And I have had very bad experience, y'all. When I have a client, I am the house hunter, remember? So they see Tanya first. And if Tanya says they're approved, I'm banking on a win. But when they go through that underwriting process,

which is them flipping through your papers and digging through your assets, and they pull your credit again the day before closing, and then you get a denial letter, which means I'm not going to closing. They're not going to closing. And that's yet another black home owner that does not exist. Sabrina, with the work that you do, are you going through and also doing educational workshops and trying to get people abreast of what some of these challenges happen to be? Because there are a lot of folks who are entering the housing market who may not come with all of the tools or the understanding of how this works, who may not have had relatives or family members, a mom or dad who actually was a homeowner. We have to be honest that a lot of people within our demographic, they have been lifetime renters. So just going through this

process for the first time can be quite overwhelming. What types of resources have you been providing for those individuals? Thank you for asking. They get a legacy toolkit from me. And any home buyer that is interested in learning, how do I purchase a home? How do I fix and improve my credit? How do I work with a realtor? What does it mean to have reserves and closing costs? And how much is an inspection and an appraisal? And are these things I have to buy? Title insurance? Nobody talked about that in college. So yes, I am a housing counselor. I am a housing advocate. And I am a realtor, which means I stand by the code of ethics to educate and inform the consumer. That is you, every single one of you on the other side of this room. You have the

ability to be a homeowner. You have to lock arms with those that have done it before and know how to do it again. Sabrina, Tanya, before I let you go, I want you to give our viewers some contact information so that they can get up to speed on what it is you're doing out here. Sabrina, you go first. Absolutely. Sabrina Lowry dot com. If you wish to get a free legacy toolkit, Sabrina Lowry dot com and follow me across social media at Sabrina Lowry. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Thank you. Hi, and I'm Tanya Blanchard with Madison Chase Capital Advisors, and you can find me on Instagram, Madison Chase Capital Advisors, and my website is mccappleadvisors.com. Thank you so much for having me. I hope it was helpful. Great to have you both. Majority Whip Jim Clyburn has some choice words for protesters outside his office today. Did you read the American Rescue Act? Well, do you read it?

Read the Rescue Act that is already in law. Quit lying. Trump is going to all of you. You just lie. You should be happy. Quit lying. I'm very happy with my constituents. I want my constituents. I want my constituents.

I want my constituents to be out there using your energy to get more progressive people to vote. I'm more progressive than any single one of you in this room. So go out and get more progressive voters. Don't waste your time out here for getting everything that we need done in this country. You're wasting time. Yes, you're wasting time. We're all progressive. We're all progressive.

And I am more progressive than any single one of you. So why are you wasting time? Go down to Joe. Go down to Joe, go down to Joe's office. Go to Joe's office and see if you can get a chance. And you haven't. So someone's trying to embarrass my staff. I read your newspaper, your news release. You were someplace in North Carolina yesterday, and you're here today, all around people who are doing everything all day to try to get this agenda passed. And that's what I'm doing every day. I'm catching hell for it every day.

And I do not appreciate people who should be out supporting this agenda And that's what I'm doing every day. And catching hell for it every day. And I do not appreciate people who should be out supporting this agenda misrepresenting it. Read the American Rescue Act, and you will see all the climate stuff in it. Read the bill that we got for the Congress now. Just let me talk. Just let me talk. Just let me talk. If you are reading, you just talk. If you are agreed, you just talk. If you are agreed.

Still to come on Roland Martin Unfiltered, we'll tell you about day seven of the R. Kelly trial and more. Stay tuned. I believe that people our age have lost the ability to focus the discipline on the art of organizing. The challenges, there's so many of them and they're complex. And we need to be moving to address them. But I'm able to say, watch out, Tiffany. I know this road. That is so freaking dope. I'm Chrisette Michelle. Hi, I'm Chaley Rose, and you're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered.

The war on drugs has been primarily directed towards people of color. On Netflix, there's a film that explores the racially charged history of the war on drugs. In The Grass is Greener, hip-hop icon Fab Five Freddy, in his directorial debut, examines the connection between music and marijuana. The growing legalization efforts is a springboard used to show how the criminalization of marijuana was used to devastate black and Latino communities across America. Let's take a look at the Grass is Greener trailer. My name is Fab Five Freddy.

I'm a long time cannabis advocate. The history of cannabis in America has long been tied to the history of music in America. Louis Armstrong. Bob Marley. Cypress Hill. Snoop Dogg. That's the sound I was looking for. The era before me was on PCP, heroin. My mission was to get everybody hooked on chronic.

You know what I'm saying? As cannabis goes mainstream, it's easy to forget the past. Marijuana, from its easy to forget the past. Marijuana, from its entry point into the U.S., has been associated with African Americans and Mexicans. Marijuana, a Mexican weed smoked in cigarette form called Reefers, a one-way ticket to the nuthouse. This is where drugs becomes a proxy to race

because you could no longer legally write race into the law. You could write drugs into the law. You could write drugs into the law. America's public enemy number one is drug abuse. The dangers of marijuana. Psychiatrists and sociologists knew that there was nothing wrong with weed. Our decision makers chose to ignore the science. They chose propaganda. They chose racism.

There is something to the fact that we, the public, not pushing them to do the right thing. We have sat around too long. Marijuana, pot, grass, whatever you want to call it, is probably the most dangerous drug in the United States. Dangerous drug, dangerous drug, dangerous drug. We're not the war on drugs. We're fighting the war on drugs. We're fighting the war on drugs.

Joining me now is the director of the documentary, Fab Five Freddy. Welcome. Hello. Thanks for having me. How are you? Absolutely. Thank you for being here and thank you for creating this most amazing work of art. We know that the move to legalize marijuana, to make as much money off of marijuana as possible is happening at the state level. A lot of white men across the country have dug their heels into it and are now making money hand over fist. It seems like there's a new dispensary popping up every day, everywhere. But black men specifically still are under the guise of criminality as it relates to marijuana. How does your film, this documentary, unload some of the impact of the war on drugs and its lasting effects?

Well, I think, you know, for those that haven't seen Grass is Greener, go to Netflix, check it out. Basically, it shows that a parallel with the development of America's music, jazz, specifically born in New Orleans, Louisiana, there were—back in the early 20s, there were, you know, it drew different—black folks, white folks came together to hear this music and have a good time. Cannabis was something that was used at that time among people in the jazz scene, the blues scene, black music, and it brought people together. Racists didn't want that to happen.

And leading that fight was a guy by the name of Harry Anslinger, the first drug czar, sort of like a mini-me, J. Edgar Hoover, targeted jazz musicians and, you know, painted this crazy story that, you know, it was the reefer madness era. And that led to cannabis being criminalized in 1937 with a specific focus on people of color that have been disproportionately criminalized for this plant for over 80 years. Absolutely. And thank you for creating this enlightening piece of work. When it comes to now and the conversation, you know, fast forward, we saw what happened in the 80s and we saw again what happened in the 90s, the early 2000s,

and now the mid 2000s, we're still seeing the criminalization of marijuana, even in places where it is now become legalized. That doesn't mean that the slate has been wiped clean for those who have been serving time or who have served time for marijuana offenses. How do you think this documentary could change the narrative around issues like that, particularly as they affect the African-American community? Well, Grass is Winner, it just lays it all out. It was a deep dive historically with documented evidence of like, you know, who was targeted and why. But really, which was the kind of light bulb that went off in me was like, from jazz, all the cutting edge

American music, leading proponents have all indulged in cannabis, which, by the way, has killed no one. OK, alcohol, which everybody's got some wine, some liquor somewhere in their crib, is killing hundreds of a hundred thousand people plus die from alcohol poisoning a year. But whatever, you know, like cannabis, boom, it's just been demonized to an unbelievable point. And that continued into the hip hop era with people like Snoop and Cypress Hill, people that I introduced to a national audience when I was hosting Yo MTV Raps. They

were proponents for cannabis, just like some of the leading jazz people, specifically Louis Armstrong. And let's not forget Bob Marley and the reggae artist Peter Tosh that really stood up for this plant, which is now a multibillion-dollar growing business. And we are not yet doing what we should be doing, which is participating in that green rush. And so that's what, by learning all of what I learned in the movie, I decided, wow, I wish I had a blast of entrepreneurial activism to kind of put some good quality cannabis on the shelves, but also raise awareness about the criminal justice issues.

And that is this product called Be Noble, which I came up with with a team that I work with to showcase a brother that we focus on in the film, a man that was given 13 years hard labor for two joints of cannabis. He served seven years. And that's a part of the Grash's Greener story. And that motivated me to get busy, to get involved. And so I hooked up with a company called Cure Relief, which is a big cannabis company with all over the country, but they wanted to do the right thing.

So we became partners and we launched this product, which is a two-joint pre-roll reflective of the two joints that Bernard Noble served seven years in prison for. So we just launched this product in Massachusetts and Maryland, and we're looking to launch in other states in the not-too-distant future. And we're going to donate 10 percent of our proceeds to organizations that are helping people that have been victimized and criminalized get their records expunged, invest, donate to programs that are helping brothers learn how to participate in this business. So that's what this that's what I'm doing. And it all blessed. It was a blessing

that it all came to me through what I learned in making this film Grasses Green. Absolutely. And it all blessed. It was a blessing that it all came to me through what I learned in making this film, Grasses Green. Absolutely. And what are some things that you would hope that viewers take away from your film? It sounds like it's extremely impactful, obviously goes through the history, the legacy and the work that you've been doing in terms of highlighting the disparities in marijuana prosecution, but also where things are going now and where they stand in terms of this being big business. What are some of the hopes that you have that viewers actually take away from the film? Well, the focus, once again, which is the focus of the product, Be Noble, is to raise awareness. If you go to the be-noble.com website, you'll see some

information about Be Noble. But also just in the process of watching Grass is Greener, it's an entertaining yet educational look at what's going on with this potential huge business. It's called the Green Rush because there's so much happening. Just within the last six months, New York, Connecticut, Virginia, New Mexico, like all these states have gone legal, I mean, recreational. And then there's many other, so there's over 34 states that have recreational

and or medical cannabis. And I'd like to see more of us learn what's going on with this plant. There's so many business involved from the cultivation side into the resale side. So to get informed, get educated, understand, see what's going on in have one of the most progressive cannabis legislations that just got passed that will soon be, you know, a couple of years when they work out all the specifics on the business side. But once again, we're hoping to see more of those victimized for all this time be able to now participate in this business.

And it starts with educating yourself, knowing what's going on. You know, Grass is Greener is a big help. Google, dive in, see what's going on. You know, if you're in the state of New York, you can go online and read the legislation. The intent is for a large number of people of color to have a significant piece of this pie. So we've got to understand what's going on, dive in, and that's it. And also on the criminal justice side, we would like to raise awareness and to change. In the South, they're doing this continually, giving people these unbelievable sentences for small amounts of cannabis using mandatory minimum laws, and it's so criminal. Absolutely. Fab Five, Freddie, it was great having you.

Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with our audience. And everyone, make sure that you catch The Grass is Greener on Netflix. Thank you. New York's first ever woman governor selected state Senator Brian Benjamin as her lieutenant governor. Benjamin is the state's second black lieutenant governor. Previously Benjamin served as a state senator for New York's 30th district which includes Harlem where the senator was born and raised. Governor Hochul was sworn in on Tuesday after disgraced former Governor Andrew Cuomo resigned due to sexual misconduct allegations.

Here to tell us more, we're bringing back our all-star panel, Recy Colbert of Black Women Views and Dr. Greg Carr, the professor of African-American studies at The Howard University. Well, I'll start with you here, Dr. Carr. When it comes to New York, it was in the news basically nonstop before the chaotic troop withdrawal in Afghanistan. We've heard all of the stories of Governor Cuomo's allegations and the reasons why he is no longer there. The star is now shining for Hochul, who is effectively now the governor of New York. And she chooses her lieutenant governor, senator from Harlem, who is going to basically work with her in reshaping and changing the course for a government that a lot of people stopped believing in under Andrew Cuomo, specifically those who felt that there were abuses that occurred during his during his reign and in his administration. What does this mean that she is not only the first woman who has been governor there, but also her choice in her lieutenant governor pick?

Well, I think we'll see. As we all know, the lieutenant governor of New York is often a perfunctory kind of ceremonial position. People are put in that position when the governor is running to try to get votes from other parts of the state. I think we probably all remember, was it Elliott Abrams got in trouble, had a zipper problem? That's how David Patterson ended up the governor of New York, the brother, Harlemite. But in the case of Senator Benjamin, he wasn't the only person that she approached. We can trust the reports coming out of New York, Jamal Bailey out of the Bronx, Ruben Diaz Jr., the outgoing Bronx borough president, because she's got to run for governor on her

own. And I think it's strategic. She says she's going to give him a portfolio, give him policy issues to work on and look for a partnership. But I'll be quite frank with you. While the center of Black political power really doesn't shift back to Harlem with this appointment, it's still probably Brooklyn in New York. You got to look at who the matchup might be against her. And I'll be interested in hearing what you all say about this, particularly, Recy. But you have to say because you might be looking at Hope running against the current attorney general.

And who is Tisha James going to beat? I don't know that he helps her that much if Tisha James is at the top of a ticket running for governor in a couple of years. Recy, Black women views. Let's hear your take on there, not only being a Black male lieutenant governor, but also what this means for the future of New York, because we know that she, Hochul is governor now. That doesn't mean that she's actually going to win when she has to jump into a race and garner votes across the state of New York. To Dr. Carr's point, this could be a very stiff challenge with someone like the AG. What are your thoughts? Absolutely. I mean, you know, I'm loathe to ever characterize

a black elected official being classified as a cosmetics pick because I'm all about credentials, not cosmetics. And I think that state senator and now Lieutenant Governor Benjamin, Brian Benjamin, is very qualified for the role he's been selected for. But I think it would be naive to not recognize the strategic political strategy behind this, knowing that, you know, the AG, Letitia James, is very, very a force to be reckoned with, even though she hasn't publicly come out and said that she is going to run. She polls very well in terms of prospective governor candidates. And so this definitely is a pick that, at least on paper, helps shore up Hochul's, you know, ticket for those who might have an appetite to make history at the top of the ticket, you know. And so we'll see if this is another repeat of what the Democrats did in 2020. Even though

my girl did end up as VP, I was for the top of the ticket being a Black woman. We will see if this is good enough for New York voters. But I think that it does recognize that Black voters are a demographic, an electorate that is very powerful, and you have to have representation. And I believe that regardless of the political strategy behind it, representation is always important. And there are all the evidence supports that Brian Benjamin will be an asset to our community in that role. Absolutely. And I'm for Tish James. Not that we would have expected anything else. Not for number two.

If we get number two, okay, but I go for number one first and foremost. Dr. Carr, I'll save this one for you. We know that Hoko came into the office basically swearing that she was going to change the, she was going to change the landscape. She was going to make this a more, a more positive tone,

specifically for employees of the state, that she was basically going to change a lot of tone, specifically for employees of the state, that she was basically going to change a lot of the structure and get rid of many of the people who were involved in the Cuomo scandal. What are your thoughts there that that was one of the edicts that she basically said out of the gate? She's a nondescript politician. Again, I think Recy just put it that way. And it'd be interesting to see what you think about it, Farage. I really think, you know, if she's going to win election on her own merits, she's going to have to make a hell of a splash, a hell of a splash. I mean, you know, and I don't know that Jamal, sorry, Jamal

Bailey, that Senator Benjamin, even his appointment, and he came in fourth in the city controller race. Maybe he helps her statewide, maybe not. But at the end of the day, she is going to have to, to what you've just raised. She's going to have to come in there and attract city controller race. Maybe he helps her statewide, maybe not. But at the end of the day, she is going to have to, to what you've just raised. She's going to have to come in there and attract a whole lot of attention very quickly because the guy who made her lieutenant governor was a big personality out of a big family with long, deep roots in New York, stereotypical New Yorker, and she's an undefined quantity at this point. So whatever she does, she's got a swing for the fences. And y'all know we could not get through this show without talking about the Pied Piper.

Today marks day seven of the R. Kelly trial. In a testimony, Tom Arnold, Kelly's former studio manager, testified that the singer docked his pay because he booked a male tour guide for Kelly and his girlfriend when they attended Disney World. Arnold told jurors that he finally got fed up with the singer's bizarre rules and quit in 2011, stating that Kelly always requested a female tour guide when on trips. The former employee added that the troubled singer would fine staffers for minor infractions, such as eating his donuts. R. Kelly is charged with nine counts of racketeering in violations of the Federal Man Act. The stories that we're hearing coming out of here, both Reesey, Dr. Carr, the stories we're hearing coming out of this trial have been devastating, to say the least. This is a lot bigger than the Lifetime special that we saw, that everybody saw about R. Kelly. At this point, you're having people speak

about very, in very grave detail about sexual deviance, about physical punishments, about basically being held captive, about the rules of people who they weren't allowed to contact, that they had to let R. Kelly know and get permission before they went to the bathroom, that they couldn't go outside without a male escort. We're hearing more and more details, gruesome details in many cases, coming out of this trial. What are your thoughts thus far with what you've seen and heard, Recy? First, I don't know if you know Faraji is still there, but I will say it's horrific, number one. And, you know, one of the things that I really hate, to be honest,

is the way that Aaliyah is being dragged into this. You know, yesterday was the anniversary of her passing, or no, I'm sorry, her birthday. And, you know, it's just, she's not here to defend herself. So it's just really horrific to hear her life being talked about in a way that, you know, she had completely moved on from that chapter in her life. But, you know, just because she's famous doesn't mean that her trauma or what she suffered from is any worse than anybody else. I mean, he's a predator. He is a predator.

And he took advantage of people not just sexually, but with his power. I mean, he can go to jail for labor violations. He's just an all-around scumbag and piece of shit. And I don't see how anybody can watch what's happening here and listen to the stories that are just so plent know, plentiful and still manage to defend him and still manage to come up with crazy notions that there's a conspiracy against him. And, oh, why are you going after Black men? You know, where's Harvey Weinstein and this, that and the other? You know, he needs to be held accountable for his atrocities

that he has conducted over and over again. And it's actually amazing that he isn't on trial for even more crimes. I think he's getting off quite easy with what he is alleged to have done. Faraji, I'm going to get you in here before we have to move on to our next story. What are your thoughts on the most recent developments in the R. Kelly trial? First, I appreciate you, Recy, for making that for bringing that to the light about Aaliyah. I think that it's interesting that the prosecutors decided to use her story. And I mean, I'm glad that they used her story because so many of us probably were still in the dark

about really how deep that rabbit hole goes in terms of, you know, him starting to even look at Aaliyah at the age of 12, and then having sexual, you know, relationships with her, you know, you know, shortly thereafter, then the whole scare about him getting pregnant and then leading to the fake, the fake documents and the whole nine about her age. And I mean, when you get to it, and I'm with Recy 1000%, absolutely sickening. I mean, folks, when you read, when I read the account of the testimony from what they classified as Jane Doe number five, I believe, which is Azriel McCleary, who was a part of that great, that historic conversation with Gayle King when

they had that major interview, you know, and how she said she was, she lied during that interview, how she even, you know, R. Kelly was in the room and had coughed a couple of times if he felt like the answers were a little bit too incriminating for him, about him. I mean, when you read these details, there's no way in the world that you can have a conversation and still say, oh, he's a musical genius. I can separate him from the music. Well, you know, there's no way in the world that we can look at even the story of Aaliyah. and I'm with, again, I'm with Recy 1000% on this, she's not here to even defend herself. We celebrated or we acknowledged the 20-year death anniversary of our dear beloved sister. 20 years she lost her, she was not here with us,

and she can't defend herself. And I don't know, you know, it left a bad taste in my mouth that the prosecutors used her story in such a way that you didn't bring the parents in, you didn't bring any other close friends or relatives of Aaliyah into the conversation, onto the stand. But R. Kelly, I mean, folks, he deserves everything he gets. And if you sit there and tell me to this day that R. Kelly still should not get what he deserves because you don't think you're absolutely insane. Absolutely insane. I'm telling you, there's nothing else to it. You're just insane. Dr. Carr, I know you have predicted before how you thought that this trial was going to go.

Has anything shocked you or changed your mind in terms of believing that R. Kelly just might get off? No, no. It's just, it's a tragedy. It's a tragedy. I mean, you know, first of all, there's no moral standard in this country, just like there's no moral standard in Western civilization. And the rich hide their crimes. There was a president of the United States caught on tape

saying, I moved on her like a bitch. You can grab them by the P word. And he sat in the office and was elevated. This isn't defending R. Kelly at all. This is saying that the madness runs deep in the human spirit. And people who are looking for an excuse will find one. Now, it's more likely than not that he will be convicted. And as we know, he's not just facing the New York court. He's got charges in several states. And as we just heard from everyone, these witnesses, I mean, no human can hear that and not be moved. But the deep thing about this, I think, is that when we look in the mirror, when it's just us, we have to confront the fact that somewhere in every human being, there's something in our spirit, in our psyche that must make us wonder, what kind of society

do we live in? And do we really know the people we're talking to? Do we really know who we're dealing with? Because somebody, look, any lawyer will tell you, I just need one in the box. I don't need to convince all the jury. I just need enough to get the guy off. What are the odds? What are the odds? We just have to wait and see, y'all.

At least that's what I think. Hey, Doc, can we also just, and Risa, I'd love to get your thoughts on this. People have been saying, look at the parents, that the parents are to blame. But I don't think you can blame the parents necessarily. And I get it, but I understand it's easy to quote unquote blame the parents for wanting to, you know, your daughter to be associated with this man. But I don't know. It's hard. And I would love to get, you know, just that I know that there's a lot of conversation that we should we should blame the parents. We should we should charge the parents. We should punish the parents because they put their daughters in that position. Now, Faraji, we had to ask Amisha.

R. Kelly put their daughters in that position. And I think that it's very frustrating to see in any case where there is molestation, where there is rape, where there is sexual violence of any kind, parents get blamed for that. Because at the end of the day, this was a grown man making adult decisions. And the adult decisions he made was to prey on middle school kids and to prey on early high school kids. This was a guy who literally parked his car outside of middle schools and waited for young girls to come out. This was a guy who went to the very well-known hangouts of teens in the city and would try to entice girls. He would buy them clothes. He would buy them shoes. He would tell them that he could make them into superstars.

He could make them into Aaliyah. He made dozens upon dozens of promises to these young girls. And then like many people who are manipulative, like many people who are abusers, he abused them. He scared them to death. He segmented them from their family and friends. And at the end of the day,

they were stuck in basically a torture chamber of sorts for years. I think that the only person that we can honestly blame here and put a lot of the blame on it lands squarely on R. Kelly. Now, if we want to look at some other people, look at the people around him who made it happen, the people who were his transport staff, the people who bought plane tickets for these young girls, the people who ensure that R. Kelly's no reading tale would be able to create fake IDs and a whole bunch of other things for these young girls the people who ensure that r kelly's no reading tale would be able to create fake ids and a whole bunch of other things for these young children because that's what happened he didn't do this solo he had a whole team of people who made it possible that's what makes it satanic that really i mean that's what makes it satanic you had grown-ass men and some women who allow this to happen and we know it we hear the

stories and we see those level of enablers and i don't and i'm gonna just tell you honestly it's 2021 if you find a consciousness in 2021 after years of this and you finally say i had to say something on the stand man get the hell out of the damn my damn face man like you finally had a damn heart now they finally tried to not get massive charges is what they did we have one more story that we got to get to before i know that the time has gone by so fast and i'm so thankful for this panel this is a step away from the creepiness of R. Kelly. But three former Philadelphia police officers are now charged, charged in connection to the wrongful imprisonment of a black man. Officials say Frank Ustromski, Manuel Santiago, and Martin Delvin have been

arrested and charged for perjury after their testimonies led to the conviction of Anthony Wright. In 1993, Wright was convicted of the 1991 rape and murder of 77-year-old Luis Trilley. He served 25 years in prison for that crime. The Philadelphia district attorney says this is not Wright's wrongs of interrogation, some of the documents that he's never read. So when we know that there was a man who spent over two decades in prison, convicted, sentenced to over two decades for murdering someone that at the end of the day, we know that a lot of that, a lot of the information that was brought forth from those police officers was not true. How does this leave

everyone feeling? I want to start with you on this, Dr. Carr. This is one of those harrowing tales, again, of police officers going out of their way to commit illegal activity, to lie, and it resulted in someone getting penalized to the extent of over two decades. Absolutely. Everyone, turn off Chicago PD. Turn off law and order. Turn off a special victims unit and law and order, criminal intent, whatever. Understand that the police are out here hunting. And if you don't think voting is important, understand that in 2016, the damn prosecutors,

I lived in Philadelphia 17 years. Many of those years, the district attorney was Lynn Abraham. They trying to put everybody in jail. They wanted to retry the man, even though there was no DNA evidence. You know the difference between now and then, a few short years ago? Larry Krasner. The DA that you put in Philadelphia, you voted in, who said there's no evidence in here because the police act like their job is not to find the truth. Their job is to war on the citizenry and the damn prosecutors be in them. The beginning of Law & Order, that TV show, is true. The people

are represented by the people, meaning the white people and the rich people, are represented by two forces, the police to lock your ass up and the prosecutor to put your ass away. These are their stories. So you better move a different type of prosecutor. Did not see that coming. Faraji, your take on this. For me, the police are still being the police. It's it's it's you know, I mean, it's unfortunate. But again, I'm an advocate of I'm an advocate of policing. I'm an advocate of, you know, having black officers on. But at the end of the day, you know, just because you've got a badge and just because you carry a gun does not mean you're a good human being.

Absolutely. And Reesey. I know this isn't very Christian, but I'm all for eye for an eye in this case. If you put somebody behind bars for 20 years, then your ass needs to be in jail, too. So I'm actually happy to see these officers being charged. Hopefully they get convicted, because we know that there's a large gap between prosecutions and actual convictions when it comes to police officers. But it's about time to put these people on notice that even 20 years later, you're gonna be held accountable for your crimes. And we're gonna have to leave it there.

Recy, Faraji, Dr. Carr, thanks so much for joining me. Thank you, sis, good job. Awesome job, girl. Woo! Yeah. Such breaking news day. And thank all of our viewers for joining us right here on Roland Martin Unfiltered. If you'd like to support us so we can continue bringing you the stories that matter the most, make sure you're donating to Roland Martin Unfiltered.

Roland will be back tomorrow live in studio from Atlanta. I'm Amisha Cross, and it has been fun to be with you all. Thanks, Roland, for giving me this amazing opportunity. Have a great night, everyone. Football bands and one of the best fan experiences in the country. The Cricket BX Swag Challenge kickoff returns to Atlanta on August 28th along with special guests. College game day.

Then Alcorn State takes on North Carolina Central with conference bragging rights on the line. Center Park Stadium is the place to be on August 28th. Come tailgate all day before enjoying a primetime matchup on the gridiron. You don't want to miss this. Check out meaxswagchallenge.com. And of course, folks, join Roland Martin on Filtered in Atlanta Friday and Saturday for the SWAG MEAG Challenge. Friday, we'll be broadcasting live with the Atlanta Braves baseball game.

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Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We asked parents who adopted teens to share their journey. We just kind of knew from the beginning that we were family. They showcased a sense of love that I never had before. I mean, he's not only my parent,

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