#RolandMartinUnfiltered - No-knock warrant ban in Louisville; NY Gov signs police reform bill; Black biz destroyed by COVID-19

Episode Date: June 18, 2020

6.12.20 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: No-knock warrants banned in Louisville; NY Gov. Cuomo signs major police reform bill; Lawsuit filed over Black Lives Matter mural in DC; Black biz destroyed by COVID-19 pandemic; Trump rally attendees must agree not to sue if they get the coronavirus; More crazy a$$ folks caught in the act; Comedian Donnell Rawlings is in the house + Delroy Lindo talks Spike Lee's 'Da 5 Bloods' Support #RolandMartinUnfiltered via the Cash App ☛ https://cash.app/$rmunfiltered or via PayPal ☛https://www.paypal.me/rmartinunfiltered #RolandMartinUnfiltered Partner: Ceek Be the first to own the world's first 4D, 360 Audio Headphones and mobile VR Headset. Check it out on www.ceek.com and use the promo code RMVIP2020 - The Roland S. Martin YouTube channel is a news reporting site covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Glott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of starts that a little bit, man.

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We asked parents who adopted teens to share their journey. We just kind of knew from the beginning that we were family. They showcased a sense of love that I never had before. I mean, he's not only my parent, like, he's like my best friend. At the end of the day, it's all been worth it. I wouldn't change a thing about our lives. Learn about adopting a teen from foster care. Visit adoptuskids.org to learn more. Brought to you by AdoptUSKids, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, and the Ad Council. Thank you. Today's Friday, June 12, 2020, coming up on Roland Martin Unfiltered.

No-knock warrants are now illegal in Louisville, Kentucky. We'll tell you more about Breonna's law with one of the council members who made it happen. In New York, Governor Andrew Cuomo signs major police reform legislation. We're joined by the Speaker of the New York State Assembly with the details. And in D.C., a lawsuit

has been filed against D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser because of the Black Lives Matter mural on the street. Plus, a survey shows that black business owners' ranks have collapsed by 41% as a result of the coronavirus pandemic. Donald Trump is going ahead with his plan, rallies with one catch. Attendees must agree not to sue if they get the coronavirus.

I thought this was no big deal. Plus, we have two crazy-ass white people for you. One, a continuation of what we showed you on yesterday. Plus, comedian Danelle Rawlings is here with our Friday comedy break. Don't be ashy. And I'll show you my interview

with Delroy Lindo, who's starring in Defy Blood, Spike Lee's new film that drops today on Netflix. Plus, we remember two of our own who passed away, Bonnie Pona of the famed Pona Sisters and former Bengals player Ken Reilly. It's time to bring the funk on Roland Martin Unfiltered. Let's go.

He's got it Whatever the mess, he's on it Whatever it is, he's got the scoop, the fact, the fine And when it breaks, he's right on time And it's rolling, best believe he's knowing Putting it down from sports to news to politics With entertainment just for kicks He's rolling, yeah

It's Uncle Roro, y'all Yeah, yeah It's rollingin' Martin. All 26 members of the Louisville Metro Council voted yesterday to pass a ban on no-knock warrants. The measure, known as Breonna's Law, is named after Breonna Taylor, who died in a police raid on her apartment in March. Joining me right now, one of the council members who pushed the bill forward is Councilwoman Barbara Sexton Smith. Councilwoman, glad to have you on Roland Martin Unfiltered. Obviously, this is unfortunate. She died as a result. But these are sort of the type of changes that Black Lives Matter protesters and others wanted to see before somebody died. And are you hopeful that other city council will be proactive

and then not require a Breonna Taylor to die to stop these warrants? Well, Roland, absolutely. We're going to be proactive. And on the three-month anniversary, which was March 12th, that was the day here in Louisville, Kentucky, that the five no-knock search warrants were issued, and some of those were executed. And during the execution of one of those, as now the entire world knows, our Breonna Taylor was killed whilst resting in her very own home and unarmed. So three months later, my message to the grassroots and to the other cities around the nation, this has to start

at the local level. And as you have stated, 26 members of our bipartisan Metro Council here in Louisville, Kentucky, voted unanimously to ban no-knock warrants. And Roland, we took it a step further. I don't know if you've been able to read the law that we passed last night. It's just a simple four-page ordinance, and the fifth page was just for signatures only. And included in this banning no-knock warrants, we lay out and specify what shall be done in the execution of all search warrants. And then we went as far as to include what shall be done in the use of executing a search warrant, how the officers must have their operating body cameras on them and they must be activated. And we went as far as to say those cameras have to be activated five minutes before the execution of the search warrant begins while you're on the premises, and they must remain activated five minutes after the completion of the execution of all search warrants. That point is important because we had the president of the Louisville City Council on

when David McAtee was shot and killed. And one of the things that he told us then was that officers that night did not have their body cameras on, which led the mayor to fire the police chief. But what he also said is that the problem in the Breonna Taylor case, that the supervisor never updated the warrant. How did two months go by and you don't even update it? You don't even check. That's kind of basic.

Right. So what happened, and it has, you know, in God's great big world, a lot of things surpass all understanding. And so many things fell in place and were and were not done since January of this year, 2020, that took us to that night when Breonna was killed in the wee hours of the morning on March 13th. And what we learned was the officers that were requesting the judge to sign those five no-knock warrants on March 12th, they were using information that they had gathered over the last couple of months. For example, they had written that they were looking for a particular automobile, and they associated that automobile with Breonna Taylor. She did not operate and own that automobile at the time of the execution of her warrant.

And then they were looking for a particular individual that was not even at the address where Breonna happened to be living at the time. And then the other thing, Roland, that troubled me so much when I saw the copies of the search warrants was that they used a cut and paste method. And you could see where they took language and just pasted it, the same identical language, in a number of those search warrants. So it wasn't any specificity of any great measure that could be relied on, especially when they're going to go do a no-knock warrant, which what officers tell me, and many have told me in the last several weeks, that the most dangerous moments in a police officer's career are at that moment when they're getting ready to breach that door and go into a space without knocking and identifying. So, Roland, the whole objective of Breonna's law here in Louisville, Kentucky, is to save lives. We want to save the lives of our citizens and save the lives of our law enforcement officers also. Well, to your point there, I mean, Kenneth Walker, of course, he responded. He was a gun, a lawful gun owner,

and he's thinking somebody's breaking in to where he lives with Breonna Taylor. It could be a home invasion and responds. And then what does the DA do? The cops arrest him and charge him with attempted murder, and he was trying to defend not knowing who the hell was breaking in. And this is what is so frustrating for the public. This is the argument that I make. That the actions of a police officer can end in death.

This is not a sanitation worker. This is not somebody filling potholes. This is not somebody who isotholes. This is not somebody who is working at Parks and Recreation. That police officers have guns. They can lawfully kill

people. You know what? If I got into an accident because a city truck hit my car, more than likely, I'm going to survive it. Breonna Taylor can't come back. And this is where police officers have to understand why the public says we hold you to a higher standard because death is involved. Right. And you mentioned Kenneth Walker. And I think it's always important to mention Mr. Walker's name because he did what

anyone I know would do. All right. And Roland, I can't speak for you, buddy, but, and I do not own a gun, but if someone, if someone were to break into my home in the middle of the night, I would want to protect everyone in my home. So Kenneth Walker did the thing that any sane individual would do. And do you realize that when he fired his weapon, he fired his weapon pointing down, which tells me, with what little I know about firing a weapon, is he was not firing to kill. Mr. Walker was firing to stop whomever was coming in. And so the officer that was struck with the one bullet fired, he was struck in his leg. And then now we know that Breonna Taylor took eight bullets. I don't know if you know yet, but the incident report was

released just yesterday here in Louisville. It was a big day for us because prior to our unanimous vote, the incident report was released. And in that report, it states that Breonna Taylor was unharmed, not injured. Are you serious? Eight bullets? It states she was not injured. How can that be? She took eight bullets, and she died on the floor of the apartment where she lived. And see, this is also the last question here for me. This is the other thing that I keep saying. You have officers who will willingly and knowingly lie on reports,

lie in testimony, that right there by itself is an abomination. How can a woman be shot eight times and then the report is no big deal? That's the question. And, you know, it's, you know, the old cliche, we talk about, oh, that's a $64,000 question. Let me tell you something, Roland. For me, the question you just asked, that's a 401 year old question. Because putting 100 percent of our attention as a nation on all law enforcement and trying to put them all in the same group, I think would be a tragedy

because there's a lot of other institutional oppression and racism that is rampant throughout our nation. And yes, we need to have law enforcement reform. At the same time, we need to lift up the law enforcement officers who are the good guys, the good women who are trying to protect us. And one other piece of information I wanted to share with you tonight is in that we also know there were approximately 100 officers at one time or another on the scene at Breonna Taylor's home where she died. And to our knowledge, not one bit of body camera footage. That is why we put that in this ordinance. And we use the word shall throughout this ordinance. Another important component of this ordinance here in Louisville regulating all search warrants is how that warrant will be executed.

So any search warrant from now on in Louisville, there has to be a knock loud enough on the entry door that the occupants inside can reasonably hear that. The second component is there has to be an announcement by the officers that it's minimum of 15 seconds or a reasonable period, whichever is greater, before entering. And I think this is key language to put in place. It'll save lives if we do this together. Louisville Council. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. And I was going to say, you know, this, I wanted you to know that it is formally part of our law now and part of the Louisville Metro Code of Ordinances. This shall be known legally as Breonna's law. That's not something that we just call it as its other name, because the one thing that Breonna Taylor's mother, her name is Tamika Palmer, has asked us all to do is say her name,

say her name. And when I heard her mother on television, I'm a mother and a grandmother, and I heard Ms. Palmer say, please say my daughter's name, Breonna Taylor. My husband looked at me and he said, you need to get that ordinance written, work with Jessica Green, and you need to name it Breonna's Law. And that is how we came here. We're going to remember her name, and she lived her life saving other lives as an emergency technician and a first responder when the global pandemic hit. And we're going to live our lives saving lives and fighting for her. Yes, we will. So she's going to save folks even in her passing.

Councilwoman Barbara Sexton-Smith, we certainly appreciate it. Thanks for joining us. Thank you, Roland. All right, folks, let's go to our panel. Rob Richardson, he is the host of Disruption Now podcast. Also, we have here Dr. Neombe Carter, howard university department of political science uh and we'll be joined a little bit later by leah wright uh riguerre associate professor of public policy at harvard kennedy school i want to go to uh you first uh dr carter this is first of all black lives matter louisville also played a huge role so we want to shout them out for making this possible as well. It took activism in the streets as well as politicians in the suites to make it happen.

But this is what needs to be happening across the country. All of these different cities. And this is the point I keep making. We can't just focus on federal legislation. OK, that has to go through the House and the Senate. City councils can act right now to implement exactly what they've done here with Breonna's law. Absolutely, Roland. And this is why it's so important to pay attention to what happens in our localities and in our states, because there are a lot of things that can happen in your community in fairly short order. Unfortunately, it took this young woman to die for us and for those in Louisville to address no-knock warrants.

But this is a problem with this policy writ large. Not only is it a violation of civil liberties, we know that when these no-knock warrants come to pass, it usually harms those people who are having their homes raided. Unfortunately, we've seen it all over this country, and it shouldn't take something like this for us to say, who are having their homes raided. Unfortunately, we've seen it all over this country and it shouldn't take something like this for us to say, this is an issue and we need to take a step back.

But that it did and that we did have a city council with a conscience and a community of activists who were gonna hold them accountable makes a lot of sense. And I think you're right, Roland, we often fetishize the federal government, but the federal government has real limits. And when we look at things like police control and things like that, that's a local issue. That's a state issue. And that's something that you can get a lot more fast acting policies put through than you can with what you have to deal with in Congress. So, you know, I hope more

people recognize the power of local action and start thinking about that more often. And it's often a set of offices that many of these young people who are active in the streets can also aspire to and reach. And I think that's something we should also be encouraging as well for this cadre of activists and others to also think about those local communities as places where they can have a seat at the table and really think about and push forward policies that they want to change and get the people elected that are actually going to work in their best interest in their everyday lives. Rob, it just shows the power of a moment and the

power of the people really on the ground. And you guys have already really stated that, but I do want to just make sure that it's just amazing that we've gotten to this point. You know, no-knock warrants are a common thing that happen everywhere, and people were accepting this as if it was okay. I mean, obviously, the people on this panel were. I've been talking about it for years. You know, Roland, you've been talking about it for years.

And we know about it. It happens in our communities. But most people are like, huh, this is something that law enforcement needs to do. And it was always on... It was always aired on the side of law enforcement needs to do this in order to protect people, but they don't. And this has not been about protecting people, this is about abusing their power, and people can see that.

And it's so sad that Breonna Taylor had to die, but there's a lot of Breonna Taylors that have died too. And so at least there's somebody who's recognizing that our lives are valuable, these things need to stop. And on the second point, the protest has definitely made a difference. And now we need to continue. And on the second point, the protest has definitely made a difference.

And now we need to continue to move forward for policy because protest only works when it's connected to sustainable policy. And this is the beginning of that. And I hope people see that they can make a difference at their local level. We need them to get involved. And you know what? It's more important who your mayor is,

who your prosecutor is, and who your president is. So our voices matter. Our votes matter. I hope people understand that in this moment and keep pushing forward because a lot more reform is needed. Well, I won't say it's more important. I say they all are important because they all serve different purposes for all of us. Speaking of that, in New York, Governor Andrew Cuomo signed police reform legislation into law on today, more than two weeks after the death of George Floyd in Minneapolis, sparked not a nationwide but an international movement.

Governor Cuomo signed into law a bundle of police reform bills passed by the legislature this week. Here's exactly what he announced. The New York State Legislature has quickly passed the most aggressive reforms in the nation. I'm going to sign those bills in a moment. 50A reform, so there's transparency. We're banning chokeholds. Attorney General, Special Prosecutor. Ending false race-based 9-11 reports.

I want to applaud the leaders who have done great work. These are tough times to be in government. There's a lot of issues, a lot of crises, a lot of demands, and they got it done and they got it done quickly. I want to thank the bill's sponsors who have done a great job and actually came to resolution. The truth is this. Police reform is long overdue. And Mr. Floyd's murder is just the most recent murder. This is not just about Mr. Floyd's murder. It's about being here before, many, many times before. It is about a long list that has been all across this country that always makes the same point in justice against minorities in America by the criminal justice system. And today is about enough is enough. It's about Fannie Lou Hamer. I'm sick and tired of

being sick and tired. How many times do you have to see the same case before you do something? How many times? This was Eric Garner. This was Abner Louiema. It was Amadou Diallo. Same case over and over and over. Joining us right now is Speaker Carl Hastie of the New York State Assembly. Speaker Hastie, listen to the governor there mention all those cases. But it just, it took this case for it to happen.

And I think what black folks in New York State are asking is why couldn't this happen four or five years ago? Why couldn't this have not been passed and signed into law after Eric Garner? You know, Roland, you're probably, I'd say, the third person who's interviewed me to ask me that question. And I would really say, you know, I've had one of those cases that happened here in my own assembly district, Ramali Graham, who was my constituent. But I just think on all of these cases

that we would have thought, it could have been Amadou Diallo. It could have been Sean Bell. It could have been Eric Garner and many, many others. And Ramali Graham, like I said. But I just think something in that video, when we watch George Floyd beg and call out for his deceased mother. I think it just touched the nerve, not only in Minneapolis, not even just in New York

City, but all across the entire entire. I agree. No, I agree a thousand percent. I agree a thousand percent. But I think what we struggle with, we struggle with is all of the response. And I agree 100 percent. What people are saying is, why does it why do we have to continue to spill black blood for people to respond. If you go through our history, you go through whether it's, again, today. Today is the 57th anniversary of the assassination of Medgar Evers. Today.

And folks are saying, why do we have to die for folks to then respond with changes in law? Again, Roland, that's a great question, and I'm not sure I even have the answer, but all I know is that in all of the years that I've been protesting, all of the years that I've been outraged,

even before I was an elected official, because when Abner Luima, I mean, when Amadou Diallo was shot and killed, you know, I wasn't elected yet. But when you just see the collective, the collectiveness of people taking it to the streets, people around the world, I think it just, it moved people

who probably it wasn't even on their radar as much as it was to us in the black community. Because a lot of times in some of these protests, it was just us protesting. But this time around, we saw every race and creed saying that, you know, enough is enough. I feel bad that it took us this long. And I apologize that it took this long.

And I wish we had never had to get to this place where we actually have to pass legislation like this to try to stop the bloodshed of more black and brown people. But I'm pleased that we are here where we are today. But I don't think we're done, Roland. No. We also have to deal with other social issues. Yes.

Economic issues in education and health and income inequality. All of those things I think we have to touch on. It's not just police and community relations that gets us on the level playing field that we should be on. Which is why I believe we should be looking at this moment like this is the third reconstruction. The first reconstruction took place after the Civil War, 1865 to 1877. The second reconstruction, even though Manny Marable says in his book, 45 to 2006, I really say the second reconstruction really was 1955 to 1968. That this is the third reconstruction,

which means that we should not be looking at it as what can happen in a month or two months or three months or six months with the election in November. We should be saying, no, we know exactly why the first reconstruction did not do so well. We know why the second one fell short. Here's the opportunity to confront it in the third reconstruction.

Because what the George Floyd death has unleashed is a focus on police reform, education, health, white supremacy, statues. Now you've got corporations are now dealing with the reckoning inside of their own corporations from their black employees and from their white employees. I think thinking about this as a third reconstruction now causes us to think a lot more larger and bigger than solely police reform. No, I absolutely agree. And in my comments today at the press conference when the governor announced he was signing the bills,

I did say that this is not the end, that we do have to start to concentrate on all these other places that we know that we've had racial injustice and places where there isn't equality and where black and brown people are still not on the same level as many of the others are in America. And as you said, this needs to be the next phase. And that phase should not start a month from now. The next budget cycle that we have, that next phase needs to start today. New York State Speaker Carl Hastie, I certainly appreciate it. Thanks a lot.

Thank you, Roland. Rod Richardson, I want to go to you. The point I made there, and this is what people keep saying, why do we have to wait for people to die for politicians and others to do what's right? Well, and it's more than that, because we've had lots of people die before this, as you said. We have a collective grievance going on here about how we've been treated in this country,

and people didn't want to pay attention. We were told before, Roland, that, oh, when we get body cams, people see the evidence, they were going to be able to see everything that happens, then maybe people will be able to see. And we've had so many examples. Philando Castile, you went through all the other examples. The example of Tamir Rice, Sammie DuBose. I mean, there's a lot.

We would be here forever talking about the names. And nothing really got people. They could always find the shortcut. Oh, there was something wrong with them. They did this. They smoked weed 10 years ago. This was undeniable. I think this did rise the conscious.

And it's a horrible thing that happened at the right time. Because with COVID-19, people were captivated in front of their cell phones, in front of their TVs. And then they were sympathetic. And also, a lot of people had nothing else to do. So there was a moment at this time where people wanted to get out and vent their frustrations, and this collective grievance came.

I hope no one else has to die for us to do this. And I love the way you framed it in terms of this being the third reconstruction, because policing is a microcosm of everything that's going on. The fact is that the officer who killed him and the officers who participated in it, they felt so empowered, they knew they weren't going to be held accountable. To take a man's life and take his life as he pleads and begs, and you just sit

on him. And for him to feel that empowered, that tells you how far we've gone in a society in terms of the devaluing of Black life. So that's the answer to your question is our lives aren't valued and we need to make sure it's valued. And that's why I'm so glad people rose up in the streets, because this is enough. I mean, I was extreme. I was extremely angry. I'm always angry. But I think this one made everybody even that much more angry because I'm like, had this not had they not rose up, they weren't even going to charge any of these officers. The prosecutor wasn't going to do that. We talked about this on the show. They weren't going to do it.

And I think people just got frustrated, and the collective grievance at this time just led to a boiling point. Neomby, this is the thing that, againadou Diallo, Abner Louima, Eric Garner. He could have moved after Eric Garner. But they didn't. Well, I mean, I think this is that point that everybody is speaking of, that frustration. Like, this has happened under multiple administrations, right? This is not about party. This is not about any of this thing, any of those things, right?

All of these deaths that we can catalog, as Rob rightly pointed out, we can keep going, right? This is not about a party issue. It's not even about having greater controls, because remember, body cams are supposed to be the savior of these moments. And yet police officers regularly abuse people with the cameras on, or they have the power to turn them off, and then we have cities that won't even release the footage

like they did with Laquan McDonald in Chicago. And honestly, had this child not recorded the death of Mr. Floyd, God knows what Minneapolis would have done. Probably nothing, right? And so I think what's happened over and over and over again is we see what happens when you have this sort of reverence for an institution like the police, and then you let them do whatever they want

because they're supposed to be these sort of vaunted members of the public, and all they are are bullies with guns. And we sit by, I mean, the only time I think it's really funny for Americans to really be into unions is when we talk about police unions. And finally, somebody decided. I'm sorry? I said preach. I was agreeing with you. Yeah, yeah. You know, finally somebody decided to stand up to these guys. And we saw how poorly O'Meara and the rest of them took it when all they're going to do is now make your personnel records public like any other person with a job. Being a police officer is a job. It's an occupation. None of us get to behave badly on our jobs and then go out and expect to find another job doing the same thing at a different firm unless you're a police officer.

So I think this moment is a really important one. And I think it's time for all of us to actually, you know, listen to Black people for once and not need our bodies in the street as evidence when we tell you these things are happening, that police do these things with sort of unbridled and unfettered brutality. Yep.

On screen, everywhere. Leah Wright Regure, journalist right now. Leah, glad to have you back on Roller Mart Unfiltered. Yesterday, Donald Trump sat down with Harris Faulkner at Fox News, and he said this. I'm going to tie it all in, too. Go to my iPad, please. We are at one of those historical moments

where future generations will look back and they'll decide who we were. Are you the president to unite all of us, given everything that's happening right now? Well, I certainly think so, and I certainly hope so. And the relationships we have are incredible. The spirit of this country, and especially considering what happened. I mean, we had out of nowhere a plague come in from China. It just came in and it came to all over the world. It went all over the world. You look at 186

countries and they were devastated. And we were certainly hit very hard. Some were hit harder than us relatively, but we were hit very, very hard. And now we're making our comeback. And then on top of it, we had the riots, which were unnecessary to the extent they were. If the governors and mayors would have taken a stronger action, I think the riots would have been more. Come on.

So, Leah, we were talking with the Speaker of the New York Assembly, and I said, great, the governor signed these new laws. He signed these new laws. But you could have signed the laws before. Trump says the riots were unnecessary. I have never wanted to advocate violence. But I can study American history. And American history says,

tear up shit, now y'all white folks pay attention. Burn buildings, burn cars, now we've got your attention. That's our history. And if you look at all of those bills that were passed before, they were all

followed by black blood being spilled for little girls medgar everest dr king i can go on and on i have i don't i don't know a period in time where black folks where things were passed because folks were simply benevolent you know so first things first, right? Let's put aside what Donald Trump has to say, because there is nothing that Donald Trump has to say about riots that actually meshes with any kind of real history. You know, H. Rap Brown, SNCC, Black Panthers at one point,

said that violence is as American as apple pie. And he was absolutely right, because violence is a central component of America. The questions that we have to ask is, who gets to be violent and why do they get to be violent? Right, I'm always struck by those images of the men in paramilitary gear who are protesting the quarantine, protesting the fact that they can't go to the gym,

that they can't go out to eat at Applebee's, who are standing and screaming in police officers' faces. And we say, oh, those are very fine people. Those are people who deserve to be out here. They're just fighting for their rights and their freedom. But let Black people actually rebel because of actual real grievances with a system that has consistently failed them. And all of a sudden, it's no, no, no, no, no.

We don't want to talk about that. But I think too, Roland, you're absolutely onto something. Violence actually does beget change, that we do see a lot of these initiatives historically going back that have to do with civil rights that are related to violence. I mean, even if we put aside for a second, the idea of urban rebellions and riots and things like that, when we look at something like Bloody Sunday and we look at King and we look at the marchers on the bridge, that was a violent incident, right, that was surrounded in this idea of nonviolence. But what we see is that the state, right,

that when we push the state and we use forms of violence to push the state, that we actually do get results. So nobody is advocating for violence, but to suggest that violence is not part of American history is just... it's ludicrous. Well, and the thing that's just laughable to me is all these people just, you know, we just saw that video.

And I totally, I get it. But Flannery Castile happened in Minneapolis before this. It was an awful video, too. There were, the brother who was a, Jonathan Farrell, Charlotte,

Samuel DuBose, Cincinnati, Stephon Clark, Sacramento, Kojima Powell. St. Louis. I can start all over. John Crawford III. I mean,

Dave Chappelle last night, Leah, dropped his 846 comedy special. I won't call it a comedy special. And he nailed it, and he did it in Beaver Creek, Ohio. And Dave Chappelle tells a story where the cop who shot and killed

John Crawford III, who we rarely mention because he got killed in between Eric Garner and Michael Brown, the cop who killed John Crawford III pulled Dave Chappelle over the day before. Oh, wow. I didn't know that. Yeah. You remember

that. Again, a white person made a phone call and got John Crawford swatted and murdered. And this is why the Amy Coopers of the world and the rest of them need to be brought up on charges because when you call the police on black people, you could very well be killing us. And I don't believe that's an unintended

consequence. I believe it's actually very purposeful. That's why people can do things and say things like, I'm going to call the police and tell them a Black man is attacking me and threatening me, because they know what it will do, right? That the police force will be activated on the word of a white person against a Black person. there's virtually nothing that any video can do that will ever prove to white people, many of them, that the black person did anything other than resist, misbehave, threaten, or some other such thing.

The video in many cases have been evidence, right, against our own, the rationale for our own murders. In many cases, they don't, you know, prosecute the police and show their guilt. It shows evidence of our guilt. That's why lynching photos were so powerful because it was believed that good white people would never just kill some Black person.

They had to do something. And these police videos are that modern version of they had to do something. I don't know why it was just this one. I think Rob's hunch that it's because of COVID, that it finally shocked the conscience. But when a child like Tamir Rice can be murdered within seconds with an air gun,

then something is really rotten in Denmark. So it's been wrong for a long time. And Americans are just catching up. And we've seen it. We've experienced it. We go through it every day. And I'll just say this to your earlier point, Roland. When the focus on,

the focus has been on violence to allow some people who don't want to be sympathetic or understand our humanity, that allows their exit ramp. But I don't buy that. Here's the thing. So a lot of times

when they talk about the violence, they're talking about the, they're talking about the destruction of property. I'm not advocating that, but I don't equate that to the same level. So when you hear people say, like, it's horrible that black men are being killed, but why are you destroying

property? Your priorities are backwards. Priority is not on property. It's to be on lives. That's the issue. That's why we're out here. Well, actually, I would appreciate if white folks would go to their old perspective. Because if you cared about property, we used to be seen as property. Oh, well, I don't know what their perspective is.

I just know that. Well, I'm just saying they've also torn up Wilmington, North Carolina, Tulsa, Oklahoma. Just saying. White people can ruin all kinds of things. To your point that you had on your show before, Roland, we know there are crazy white people in this world. We need other white people to check them.

Black people have been doing this for a long time. It's time for them to check them. That's what they got to do, these indifferent, moderate people that say, I don't want to do any of this stuff. I don't believe in what's happening. Then step up and be anti-racist. That's what we need right now. And I believe we are seeing that. I'm going to speak about that in a minute. I'm going to speak about that in a minute.

I'm going to speak about that in a second, but I do want to play this for y'all because we got Danielle Rawlings later in the show, at the end of the show. We always have a little comedy on Friday, but I got some comedy right now, okay? Watch this. This is truly an epic comedic performance.

Revitalization in black communities, the focus of the opportunity zones that you put into place, I think it was late 2017. Tim Scott, great senator. Senator Tim Scott. How does all of that fit into talking with the protesters and people right now wanting for the black community, and not just blacks

but communities of color people who are disadvantaged in general i mean the economy is the great unifier right i think i've done more for the black community than any other president and let's take a pass on abraham l Lincoln because he did good, although it's always questionable. In other words, the end result. We are free, Mr. President. You did pretty well. You understand what I mean.

I'm going to take a pass on honest Abe, as we call him. But you say you've done more than anybody. Look, criminal justice reform. Nobody else could have done it. I did it. I didn't get a lot of notoriety

and the fact the people I did it for then go on television and thank everybody but me and they needed me to get it done. And I got it done and I got five or six Republican senators who had no interest in getting it done and they were great. And we got it done. We did that. The historically black colleges and universities were not funded. They weren't funded. I got them funded on a long term basis and took care of them. I became friendly every year for three years. You know the story. They were the heads, the deans, the heads, the presidents of the universities and colleges would come up. I got to know them. Forty four or so people would come up to the Oval Office. First year was normal. I said, all right, let's do it.

Second year, I said, why are you back again? Don't they? Third year, I said, why are you here? They said, because for many years, we've had to come back here every single year. One of them, great people, he said, we have to beg for money. I said, you shouldn't be begging.

You should be back at your colleges or universities and you should be teaching and doing the job. I got them long-term money, more than they had. Come on. Much more than they had. Okay. I'm going to start with... Where shall I start?

I don't know. I'm going to... Yeah, let me pause for a second. Let me figure out. So, Neonby, since you're at Howard University, I'll start with you. I got them long-term funding. First, he's talking about the FEATURE Act.

$255 million. Funding that was made permanent for, uh, minority targeted colleges. Of the 255, 85 million specifically for African Americans. For all of y'all who are watching, and I just want to be as clear as possible. To listen to Donald Trump say, I am the reason for it. You are a damn liar.

Donald Trump is not the reason that was made possible. It was made possible by Congresswoman Alma Adams of North Carolina who pushed the bill, who dragged it over the finishing line. Donald Trump wants to present it as if it was his idea.

No. You just signed it. That's important for people. Now granted, presidents do take credit for stuff they signed. Reagan took credit for signing the MLK birthday that he opposed.

That he opposed. But I don't want anybody to somehow think that Donald Trump somehow is just this major advocate for HBCUs when that was on my Adam's bill. Naomi, go ahead. I mean, we know Donald Trump has no use for black people. But what he does have use for is is stating his claim and putting his name all over everything, like those gaudy buildings that have his name everywhere. So this is not surprising. And you know he wants to bill himself

as some sort of champion of Black people and keeps telling Black people that he is their pick. He should be their guy. I mean, the fact of the matter is, whatever this funding is, we know it is woefully inadequate. More importantly, Donald Trump doesn't have a care for any of these Black

institutions or minority-serving institutions or the people that go there. It's just something to say, just like he keeps trotting out that Tide First Step Act, right? It is the same thing. The hyperbole and the false claims are useful for him, right? He thinks it gives him some credibility with the Black community and Black voters, and he tries to stave off his racism and his sort of nods to, and footsie playing with,

you know, white supremacist sympathizers and Nazi types by doing this kind of stuff and saying, see, I don't really hate you because look at this thing I've done, you know, for HBCUs over here. But it's very clear that Donald Trump has no care for these institutions

and doesn't really care for much more than the photo-wop and the claim. I gotta laugh, Leah. Let's just sit Abe aside. I mean, you... It's the bravado, it's the gusto, it's the hyperbole

of Donald Trump. I mean, I saw the other day someone pointed out, they were like, he may not actually know of any other Republican presidents to reference. So therefore, he keeps coming back to Abraham Lincoln. Remember, this is the same man who was like, people are, you know, just discovered Frederick Douglass, like people are going to be learning a lot about this person. But I want to pick up on something Niamh said that I think is really important, which is that you can't, you is that you can't take claim or credit for things, one, that you had no involvement with. You can say you signed your name to it, but you did it kicking and screaming the entire way.

And now just because Kim Kardashian and Kanye West think it's cool doesn't actually make it a reality. But it's especially not true when the very things that you are championing as policies and in your rhetoric completely invalidate the kinds of acts that we're talking about. So when we think about the First Step Act, for example, you can't be an advocate for the First Step Act and be out here talking about law and order, protect our police unions and things like that. You can't be saying that you're an advocate for racial justice, but you're out here talking about law and order, protect our police unions and things like that. You can't be saying that you're an advocate for racial justice, but you're out here saying that, no, we should honor our Confederate monuments and our Confederate leaders.

You can't be out here saying that, you know, you stand for HBCUs when you're cutting Pell Grants left and right. That just doesn't add up. But I think part of this is a strategy to cushion these kind of accusations of racism. It's a strategy to really reach out to his white base and say, look, the things that you're saying are OK because we've done all this other stuff with race. And so you can just use this as a shield or as covers. And then I'll say one more thing, Roland, and feel free to push me on this.

Feel free for the panel to really discuss this. But I do think there is a small segment, and Donald Trump's campaign has said this, there's a small segment, cross-section of black men, not black women, because black women are not in support of Trump whatsoever. But there's a small, small cross-section of black men in swing states that can either be pushed in terms of supporting Donald Trump or pushed not to vote, so not to come out and vote. And so he is aiming some of that,

some of this language around criminal justice reform and HBCUs at that very, very, very small segment. But let me say this here, it's not small. The fact of the matter is this year, in 2016, there was a 13 point gap between black women who voted for Hillary Clinton and black men. In 2012, there was a nine-point gap between black women and black men

who voted for Obama and Romney. Now, why am I saying that, Rob? Because it was evident with the black president. I can tell you, because the White House told me, and when I say the White House, I'm talking about literally the second most important person in the White House. Told me point blank.

We believe we can get as high as 20% of black men to vote for Trump in November. Rob, the reason they're talking about Tulsa is because Trump wants to make a black economic argument that their deal is will appeal to black men. The Republican Party told me, I'm sitting there with Rice Priebus in, it was actually, it was in 16,

black women hate them more than any other group in America. There's no group that hates Republicans more than black women. That's their goal, Rob. Black women are smart. They are trying to appeal to the pocketbooks of black men who also feel as if the Democratic Party has ignored them. Yep, and there's no question. And it's not small.

I think that percentage is about 15% in Ohio, if I'm right, if I remember. But they say they're polling nationally at 15% with black men. They want to get that to 18 or 20. And if they get that, game, set, match, election's over. So I think what we need to do, and I'm talking about we Democrats, because it's important not to elect Donald Trump. He is a racist. I agree with everything that everyone has said.

At the same time, Democrats are going to have to put forward a bold agenda about what they're going to do because, you know what, he did pass the first step act. And, you know, he might not have been responsible for pushing it. It might not have been his idea, but he could have vetoed it, and it did pass under his administration. So he's going to be able to talk about that. Right. No, no, no. He can talk about it,

but let's also remember the House version was driven by Hakeem Jeffries. Yep, absolutely. But the version that was signed was greatly strengthened because when it went to the Senate, you actually had Dick Durbin who said no,

but you also had Charles Grassley who said absolutely not. They fought off Ted Cruz, fought off Tom Cotton, so actually Democrats actually made the First Step Act far more meanier, and that's the version that was signed into law. But yeah,

he can sit here. I completely agree. Right, right. But it goes to the point, but you're saying we're getting lost in the sauce. People don't play that inside baseball. Of course not. So he's going to use that. And what I'm saying Democrats should be doing, Joe Biden campaign should be doing, is making sure that they're not only

reminding him of how racist people are. We kind of know that. I think people build that in and say, OK, that's built in. But they need to build in being bold platforms about what they're going to do, not just saying they are not Trump. I think that's really important. Right. Again, you saw him talk about the economics piece.

The reality is here, black businesses are being greatly impacted by COVID virus. 41% or so have collapsed. This is according to, now here's the deal, the National Bureau of Economic Research shows that, again, COVID-19 has hurt black businesses more than anybody else with a 41% decline of black owners from February to April. Ron Busby is president of the U.S. Black Chambers, Inc. Ron, when you see those numbers, what areas are we talking about? What parts of the country at 41 that's a huge number that's about 440 000 black owned businesses it's primarily in five industries

rolling if you look at the revenue of all black businesses that it primarily is in restaurant ownership luxury industries such as hair salons bar barbershops, beauty parlors, and so forth, sports, entertainment, and retail. We lost those businesses, and a lot of it had to do with policy that was slow to be enacted. There's still $130 billion sitting there for PPP, which many of those businesses that have closed,

had they had an opportunity to participate with that payroll protection plan, they would still be open today. There's primarily five reasons of that. One of them is the $130 billion that's sitting there. The first tranche of money, we all know that there were $349 billion that were being discussed. Of that $349 billion, literally $250 billion of that went to 50 publicly traded firms, which only left $99 billion left. What you're seeing today is a lot of corporate America is writing checks to nonprofits, to civil rights groups, and even to business groups. In reality, those are dollars that they received doing that payroll protection plan and giving it back to organizations

like the U.S. Black Chamber to help facilitate that. When you talk about the idea of a payroll protection plan, you and I, Roland, know that that was never intended for Black-owned businesses. If it is really related to payroll, and you and I both know that the majority of Black businesses don't actually have employees, but we do have 1099s. We do have subcontractors. And when we weren't able to participate and have them participate in that payroll protection, it eliminated a lot of our

flexibility. Third, when you talk about going to banks to get your funding, only 30%, roughly 31% of Black-owned businesses have that type of relationship where we can actually get credit. We have banking relationships. We have checking and debit cards. But the majority of Black-owned businesses don't know their bank officer or their loan officers. We just don't have the credit. And so it was also difficult for us to establish the banking relationship. And so for us, we're trying to do a great deal of things.

One, you will see that we're now providing our own funding opportunities for our businesses. We're also educating them on how to make sure that they understand what the future of these businesses and industries are going to look like when we get through this pandemic as well. Now, you heard in that clip, Donald Trump keeps touting empowerment zones.

Yet I've had black economists on my show who says there is absolutely no data to even show that these empowerment zones have improved black communities. Have you seen any? No, Roland, this is just an old game with a new name. We've heard empowerment zone before, opportunity zones. It's really a way for white America to come inside black communities, take advantage of great opportunities that are set up by the government, buy into our communities, buy our properties, have very low interest rates, great productive programs, and get tax-free money to take advantage of it.

I have seen a very few of our businesses that have been able to take advantage of it, but the majority of it has been a loss for our community. But I was told by the experts that it hasn't even really even started. So this, oh, they're improving, they're doing great. Here's my whole deal. Show me the data. Show me something that shows a level of investment. I haven't seen it.

Data is the key ingredient in all of these conversations, Roland, and we have been fighting hard with government, the SBA, to show us true numbers about where we think the money went. If you remember that $250 billion that went to those 50 companies, there was no accountability. There was no transparency. And so when we were trying to fight to see who was getting the money, the size of the loan, even when we partnered and asked, they could tell you the size of the loan, the location of the loan, but they were never able to tell you the nationality of the race of the business owner, which is important when you're talking about creating this whole new wealth

and you don't have data to be able to demonstrate who's getting it and what the real impact on America is really coming out, not only today, but when we come out of this pandemic. What the U.S. Black Chamber is doing is we're asking both the government to set aside funds to provide some equity. We're asking corporate America as well as just regular American citizens to do all of

our parts to make sure that there's some transparency. And at the end of this, there are still Black-owned businesses. All right. Ron Busby, U.S. Black Chambers, Inc. We appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you, Ron, for having us on.. Black Chambers, Inc. We appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you, Ron, for having us on. Folks, Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority Incorporated has announced today that they will provide scholarships

for George Floyd's daughter, Gianna, and granddaughters, Talia and Journey. In a letter to the family, a.k.a. international president, Dr. Glenda Glover, says she hoped the contribution would assist them on the path to success. The service organization issued a public statement and joined millions around the world

in denouncing Floyd's senseless death while being arrested by Minneapolis police on Memorial Day. Fellow state authorities arrested John Malcolm Bearswill of Catawba, North Carolina, on charges of threatening to burn down a black church in Virginia. Bearswill telephoned the church in Virginia Beach, Virginia on June 7th, several days after one of the church leaders

took part in a prayer vigil and demonstration related to the death of Virginia Beach, Virginia on June 7th, several days after one of the church leaders took part in a prayer vigil and demonstration related to the death of George Floyd, according to court documents. Two people in the church who heard the call said the man told them, you N-words need to shut up and threaten to set the fire to the church. He now is, of course, in jail.

Mm, thank goodness. Panel, I gotta ask you this here. What do you make of all of a sudden all these people just loving themselves some Juneteenth? The NFL has announced that Juneteenth is going to be an official holiday also. Twitter made that announcement

as well. Other companies are making this announcement. Juneteenth has been around for a long time. First of all, of course, it first became a state holiday, Rob, in Texas, led by the late Al Edwards. It's a state holiday in Texas. But ain't it interesting, all the folks who now are saying, ooh, let's embrace Juneteenth. Let's embrace Juneteenth.

Let's say Black Lives Matter. I mean, a month ago, all of that would have been controversial, even though it's not. So it's not. It's at least the beginning because we don't ever talk about Juneteenth. It's not something this country ever talks about, so we can at least talk about it and make sure that it should be. Those of us in Texas do.

But here's what's interesting. But here's what's interesting. What's interesting, though, about Juneteenth is it actually has spread to a lot of parts of the country. And it has been embraced by more African-Americans in other parts of the country. I've spoken at Juneteenth events in New Jersey. In fact, there's one coming up I recorded a speech for as an event happening tonight.

I'm going to be participating in Zoom as well. And so you have seen sort of that embracing, Nyambi. Absolutely. participating in Zoom as well. And so you have seen sort of that embracing, Neomby. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, being born in Maryland, it wasn't something that we talked about a lot as a kid growing up. We didn't necessarily celebrate it. And the only reason I knew is because I had parents that made me learn about Black people. So I actually learned about Juneteenth fairly young, but it wasn't a part of our lexicon. But I think what all these companies and corporations are realizing is that we want to hold on to these Black dollars. And so if we have to signal that we are with you and that we think that your money is still green and we want to collect it, then now Juneteenth becomes

part of our conversation. Black Lives Matter becomes part of our conversation. But I think what more people are asking for and what more people are wanting is accountability inside these firms. And it's not just, you know, NASCAR and these other spaces, it's also universities, it's also corporations, right? That we're actually asking people, don't just send these signals, tell us what you do in those organizations.

What does your leadership look like? How do you treat the students and the people and the faculty and the employees who work there, right? I think people are asking a lot of questions about these same people that now all of a sudden have figured out that Black people exist and that we have our own special holidays that we celebrate as communities, and now they want to embrace it. So I think there are some real questions here. Leah? Sure. So I've been going to Juneteenth celebrations since I was a toddler and I'm from Hartford, Connecticut, and we have a fabulous Juneteenth celebration every single year where

thousands of people come out. So it's been something that I've known about my entire life. But I actually really agree with this idea that Niamh brought up, which is that a lot of these companies and corporations really do depend on black dollars or at the very least depend on black adjacent dollars. So white people who really do care about this or don't want to be seen purchasing from racist organizations are now beginning to pay close attention to these organizations. And one of the easiest things to do and one of the fastest things to do is to come out with all these symbolic gestures, whether it be black squares and Blackout Tuesday, whether it be saying Black Lives Matter or we stand against systemic injustice,

or declaring that company holidays are going to be, you know, Juneteenth. Which, by the way, most corporations in America, particularly profitable corporations, have, you know, Fun Friday. So you're actually not losing anything in the trade-off right there. Perhaps the acknowledgement is nice in terms of symbolism, but you're not actually losing anything. You're actually gaining from this engagement. But I think that you do have to look inside. So what does your C-suite look like? What does your executive look like? What are your employees feeling, right?

I've been saying and I've been telling everybody, check on your black employees because your black employees aren't doing okay right now. And most corporations haven't done that. The other thing to think about is what are the policies, what are the programs, what are the initiatives that these corporations have done that have actually done harm to black communities? So one of the things that we need to be thinking about is not simply what's going on internally or what are they doing symbolically, but what are you actually doing in terms of rectifying the harm that your corporation has done to black people systemically over the course of history?

And many of these corporations have horrific records when it comes to actually doing harm to black people. Let me say this here, and, uh, this is, um... I really believe where our people need to be. Um, we're seeing this unbelievable reaction all across the country. We're seeing, you see the DC mayor just outside of our office paint Black Lives Matter

on the street, rename the plaza Black Lives Matter Plaza. In fact, she's also being sued by some people because of that. We've seen Comcast, $100 million. YouTube announced yesterday they're creating a $100 million black content creators fund. Adidas had an uproar among its black employees, and they created a $100 million fund. They're going to be giving away to social organizations, and they also promised what the next 30 or 50% of hires will all be black and Latinx. Philadelphia newspaper editor resigns

because they ran a huge story that said buildings matter too. Black staffers revolted. Staffers revolted at the New York Times and James Bennett resigned as the editorial page editor because of the Senator Tom Cotton editorial. The Bon Appetit editor quits

because he was accused of racism. The co-founder of Refinery29 resigns because of accusations of racism. The CEO of Second City Comedy Troupe in Chicago says he didn't do enough when it came to racism, so therefore he resigned. You had Anna Wintour, who is like the ice queen, who never comments, who releases an internal letter saying she did not do enough to advance black employment. That comes on the heel of Andre Leon Talley's book criticizing her. We're seeing today an advertising agency

dropped a letter where their upper echelon numbers were leaked. Only 3% of staff there, African-American. 600 black ad agency workers released a joint letter talking about what's happening. University of Texas players are saying rename buildings. Clemson University, Deshaun Watson plays for the Texans, went to Clemson.

They want John C. Calhoun building renamed on their campus. You're seeing the statue come down of King Leopold there in Belgium. All of these things are happening. So this thing has gone beyond police reform. It's now really at the heart of white supremacy, which means that I believe as African-Americans,

our focus really needs to be, again, on thinking about this in terms of not the next day or the next month, not a check for a contribution, not a donation, but an actual investment. Truly look at this as the third reconstruction. That the opportunity right now, and follow me, the opportunity that we have, where we got folks on their heels. Companies are calling their ad agencies and their PR agencies, like,

what do we do, what do we say? Starbucks said you can't wear anything with Black Lives Matter on it. Folks are now saying boycott Starbucks. All these things are happening. This is a moment, Leah, for us to seize and ask for it all and begin to target this entire system.

If I believe, if we as African Americans, you got white allies now, and see, let's be real clear, the reason these companies are responding the way they are because they see these white kids saying, yo, I'm riding with the black folks. That, Leah, is what is scaring the hell out of them

more than anything else. Absolutely. And I think you're absolutely right in terms of thinking about this is a moment to seize the opportunity for investment and not just short-term investment, but long-term investment. And I think one of the things that we can talk about

is how at each of these moments and times where we've seen something similar, not the same, because I would argue that what we're seeing right now is at the cusp of transformational, but where we've seen these other moments, whether it be like the black college student movement, black power movement, 1968 through 1971, whether it be like the peak of the civil rights movement in the early 1960s, you know, during this very corporate America kind of multiculturalism moment in the 1980s and 1990s, what we see follows across industries is this real push and real push towards integration. So we can actually count. And I've seen, you know,

there have been a couple of interesting things on social media, particularly as people say, I can recount the time that I was hired based on, you know, what moment we were in this various social movement, because all of these corporations are now moving to be inclusive. The difference, however, is that most of those movements were temporary, meaning that once, you know, a couple months had gone by, a couple years had gone by, these white-powered corporations say enough is enough. We've done our duty. We've filled our quota. This time has the potential to be different, particularly with this idea of a multiracial movement and kind of continuing pressure that this has to be long-term investment, long-term change.

Not days, not weeks, not months, not years, but decades of change in investment. Nyambra. Yep. I was going to say, and I think it's also a moment where we get to set the terms. So people can talk about what they're willing to give, but we get to make also a counter, right, to those offers and say, this is actually what we want, and this is what

we're demanding. Anything short of this is not going to be acceptable because if we want these long-term investments, we can't just be taking money for these corporations to make these corporations look good. We should also be getting something on the back end for our communities and building our institutions and our skill sets and our capabilities, right? You know, if the point of these dollars is because we can actually generate something that is going to be long-term for our children and our children's children,

then we can't just be happy with what they give because if these companies have $100 million to invest, they have 200 and 300 and 500 and we can't go to the table scared. We have to demand what we want and we have to be clear about this being a negotiation, right? You don't get conciliation with Black people on the cheap. And I think part of what these organizations are doing, or at least we have the potential to do with these

organizations, is take their money and actually make something worthwhile for our communities and try to grow that money. So it's not just this sort of one-time payout, like, hey, I did this thing and it repaired the damage. And so we're done from here and forevermore because, you know, this thing happened. We have to keep talking about what the issues are. We have to keep talking about why we still need these changes because these problems didn't pop up in a decade. These are centuries-long grievances. And it will take that long to undo. Well, Rob, and what I've been saying to Black folks is,

there's no better time for your ass to open up your damn mouth and not get fired. Absolutely, or to open up a business, or to actually organize and do things. This is a moment in time, and we've had them at certain points. So this is a time that we can hopefully have longer sustainable change. We have power. We don't always value it. We don't always recognize it. Money often flows through us, but not to us. But we are often the conduit of a

lot of money in this society. We are. Our pop culture sells. Everything sells. We sell a lot. We just don't always value it. Now people are recognizing that and seeing that. So we do have to take this moment. And really, I think hone in our A. Philip Randolph, for all you nerds. He was a labor leader, black labor leader, helped organize the March on Washington. A lot of people don't know about him. He's behind us. He was behind the scenes a lot. But he said a quote that I think people should really, really, really take to heart. He said, look, in the banquet of life, there are no reserved seats. You only get what you can take and you only keep what you can hold. You can't keep or take anything unless you're organized. So we got to use this moment

to figure out ways to get more investments to be organized because we have power and we shouldn't just settle for a check here or there. We need to settle for long-term investment. We need to settle for structural change. We have that power. We need to demand it. We don't have to beg. We have power. We just need to recognize it. Folks, as I said, today is the 57th anniversary of the day Mecca Edwards was slain in his driveway by the racist Byron Della Beckwith. We want to remember that this was something I did a couple of years ago when I was in Memphis, just outside of the home, exactly where he was killed on this day. Hey folks, Roland Martin here. I'm at the home of Medgar and Murley Evers. Of course,

we're in Jackson, Mississippi. And this is where on June 12th, 1963, Medgar Evers was gunned down by the white supremacist Byron Della Beckwith right here in this driveway. Della Beckwith was across the street there. Folks, Medgar Evers was fighting for us to have the right to vote. He was trying to get black folks in Mississippi. He was an army veteran who came home, who fought for his country, bled for his country, but his country would not treat him like an American. Many of us out there, we say that, well, voting doesn't mean anything. But voting didn't mean anything. Why did this man give his life in order for you to be able to vote?

Folks, it's very simple. You need you to stay woke, be woke, and vote. Camp Bin Laden, Joint Base Al-Zarqawi. We wouldn't name American military bases after enemies who attacked our country. But ten military bases still bear the names of Confederate Army traitors, enemies who took up arms against the United States in defense of slavery. Names that dishonor those who serve on those bases today. And you can add someone else to that list. Donald Trump dishonors our service when he stopped the military

from removing those Confederate names. We need to rename these forts for American heroes, men and women who served our country honorably. But serving honorably, Mr. President, is something you'll just never understand. The men who followed this flag 150 years ago knew what it meant. Treason against their country. The death of the United States. America defeated the men who followed that flag. Those with honor surrendered and cast it aside forever. So why does it keep showing up today at events supporting Donald Trump? And why does he call the folks who carry it very fine people? I think there's blame on both

sides, but you also had people that were very fine people. What does it say that they're all in for Trump? What does it say that he won't condemn a flag of hate, division, and losers? Do not replace us! For us, it says this is a time for choosing america or trump bottom line uh nianbi those ads are very powerful in terms of framing to have veterans going after don trump over his refusal to rename Confederate bases, and also his embracing of these folks.

Look, I keep saying it, every vote counts come November, and when you got NASCAR ticket saying no more flying on the Confederate flag, and then you got a guy who does not want to rename these military bases, could make a difference.

Absolutely. I mean, who else makes monuments to losers, right? Who else says that, hey, I want to be a dual citizen to an empire that doesn't exist, right? Only we do... Only do this in America, right? Like, this idea that we have to pay back, right, these reparations, because that's what it is, in a form, to people who tried to overthrow the government. And this is a way in which we have sort of been conciliatory to white efforts to

overthrow the government. We saw it in Wilmington, North Carolina in 1898. That was a coup, right? And we saw it with the Confederates in the 1860s. And the fact that we are still building monuments, and not just in the South, right? They're all over this country to a bunch of people that we defeated and sort of paying them back for the privilege is insane. what you did was build monuments and name these places, these military installations in universities and on university buildings and all these things after treasonous people, right? These people tried to overthrow the United States government and they lost, but you still revere them. I mean, it's insane. And so I think this does a really good job. Rob, the contrast is vital because Trump is literally defending it. And so the one, and so it's like, oh man, oh, keep going. Keep, keep defending. Yeah. He's making, he's

making people have to decide just like Drew Brees had to decide whether you're going to publicly, you're going to say, okay, am I going to support white supremacy now when everybody sees it, when everybody, when there's a light shining on it, or am I going to stand on the side of equality? I'm going to stand on the side of what's right. And this is the reason why I talked about when we talked about Juneteenth and talk about some of these symbolic measures, they're still important because we need to frame this narrative because there are people that either don't know or have been so infected by white superiority, they don't even see these things. They don't recognize the fact. And now that people are talking about this and framing

the issue, just like they just did in that commercial, is so important. Because if we don't even acknowledge that white supremacy is behind a lot of this, that people have been honoring traitors. And they did it after, by the way, after the Civil War, a lot of times to intimidate Black people. This is how we got these statues. They were way after the Civil War. So people need to know how we got here and really appreciate that because people don't like to appreciate it. We like to pretend it was like a long time ago. And there's really racism has evolved. It went right after Reconstruction.

We had Jim Crow right after Jim Crow. Now we opened up the war on drugs, and now we have mass incarceration, and now we have policing in the way that we do. So we need to end this, and hopefully this is the dent that will bring this to an end and we can throw white supremacy into abyss and make sure that it never rises. That's my goal. Leah, the Lincoln Project, the group of Republicans,

they're very good at messaging. That last line, America or Trump? So there are a couple of things about that. One, which is that the Lincoln Project, which is, you rightly pointed out, are a group of Republicans who are, you know, anti-Trump and are committed to getting Trump out of office. What's interesting there is that they are breaking with their party and they are breaking with this kind of standard rhetoric of the, not just only the party, but of the party standard bearer. So here they're coming out and essentially saying and going against something that has been Republican dogmatic canon for quite some time, essentially saying, you know, no, Confederates were treasonous. Now, we all on this panel know

that. But for to have that kind of a break, it's just put that line in the sand is incredibly powerful. But one thing that I want to want to point out, Roland, and I'd be interested in hearing what the panel has to say about this, is that it appears that Donald Trump is doubling down on these things in order to appeal to his base, because he knows who his base is. He knows the audience of his base. So when you see things like NASCAR saying we're going to ban the Confederate flag, or NASCAR drivers saying I'm going to wear I'm going to wear like Black Lives Matters on my uniform or I'm going to put it across my car. One of the things that Trump is well aware of is how NASCAR's base is going to react to that. And they are not going to react well to that. And so I think part of what he's trying to do is drum up that kind of red meat, that anger, that fear for his base.

And that really sets up this kind of dynamic where it pits one against the, you know, one America against the other America. And then the last thing that, the last thing I'll say about this here, one, I think all of these things are going to come out to play in that Tulsa speech that he's giving on Juneteenth, right, the site of one of the worst racial massacres of American history. But also, it's going to be a really, really fine line tension or fine line that Trump has to walk, because he's also going to try and mix that in with this message about black capitalism and the economy and being the great uniter. So on one side, he's the great

divider, and he is happy about that, and he is playing to his base with that. On the other hand, he's doing this kind of, I don't want to call it outreach, but this rhetoric around, I am the great uniter. I will solve. I think that's what he said today. I will solve racism. It will be very easy. And oh, yeah, black capitalism. And it sets up this really kind of tense dynamic, particularly in a nation that's in crisis. All right, folks. Now, remember the Karen of the Year candidate from yesterday? Well, her crazy ass is back. I'm white. I got you, Carl. I'm illegally selling water without a permit. On my property. Play the video after this. Play the next video.

I'm uncomfortable. Great. Did you just make a racist comment? You know what? I am not a racist person. You just made a racist comment. You know what? I am not a racist person. You just made a racist comment. But you know what? You need to go home. I am from here.

Look it. Go home. I am here from here. Go home. I don't care about your Facebook or your video. Oh, okay. You're making a racist comment right now? Do you know how many people can't stand you being here? Oh, great. You play games. We don't play games. Oh, what kind of game are you playing?

I play games where you get fucked to death. Oh, okay. Well great Let me let me take your card. Then you So this lady I'm calling just made a racist comment I can't afford this Well great you are I think you're going to real jail now. You understand me, China man? You understand me, China man? You understand me, China man? Respect. Respect. Respect. I don't understand your language

in China, man. Respect. Then you move your car. You're way too close. Get away from me. You don't even know how to park the car. You don't even know. to park the car you don't even know there you go do you know who my family is do you know who your family is go home to your family this is from your government respect

lady go home get educated and respect. You're going to get fucked. Your kids are going to get fucked. Get respect. This is my country. Get educated and respect, lady. This is my country. Did you finish college? And this is from my government.

Did you finish college? Go home. Did you finish college? Put that on your Facebook. Did you? You know what? Did you? You are nothing.

What did you say? You're nothing. Exactly. You're nothing right there. Lady, get educated and respect. Little boyfriend. But we've got a new contender. This crazy-ass white woman tried to use tears to get a black woman arrested.

But this sister had time today. You want to tell South Highland you calling me a nigger? Come on, let's file a hate crime. Here's the idiot who thought it wasland you calling me a nigger? Come on, let's file the hate crime. Here's the idiot who thought it was okay to call me a nigger. Here's her license plate and she want to drive to the police station. Let's see what we're going to tell the cops today. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. No, no, no, no. Don't tell me you're sorry. I'm sorry for the looting. I'm sorry for everything. What do you want from me? Why would you call me a nigger yeah because you want driving so fed up with all this this is her she lives in south holland this is the lady and we got cameras

today please i can't take this anymore i'm trying to move out i'm trying to move out no she called me a nigger and then she drove here to cry she She passed me. Yeah, so that's what we're dealing with. On the left. She passed me on the left. Okay. That's what we're dealing with. This is what we're dealing with. Well, I witnessed the lootings.

I witnessed the lootings. I can't take anymore. I'm trying to move forward. It's okay to call somebody a nigger because you're tired of looting? Yes, I'm tired of this. Did you hear this? You guys call each other that all the time. I hate all this.

Shut the fuck up. Call the police. Tell them what you want to tell them. You're on camera. You're the white lady who called somebody a nigger. It's fucking 2020. You're pathetic. Take this anymore.

Please call her an officer. Please. Call her an officer. I got caught. Call her an officer. And what do I do if I don't call her a nigger? Is there any crime for that? Sorry.

I'll file charges for that big crime, too. Because you want to call people niggers today. I got time, lady. I'm so tired of this. I that big crime too. Because you want to call people niggas today. I got time, lady. I'm so tired of this. I'm tired too. Black people have been tired for 400 years, lady. What the fuck? I lived here because I wanted to get along.

Come on, Kyle. I wanted to get along. Call the police you want to call so we can file the crimes that we want to file. Because y'all got time today. I have time, lady. I can't take this anymore. I'm going to get my purse. Oh, my purse.

Oh, my god! Leah, these white people are losing their mind. Well, I think one of the things that this highlights is just how much technology has changed the narrative and has changed the story. We now have Instagram and Twitter accounts devoted to Karen's Gone Wild. There's no more hiding in secret. There's no hiding your racism behind closed doors. It is on blast for the world to see, and people have time,

especially right now, and this is not going to go unchallenged. So it is a remarkable thing to see. Rob, I love the shooting of the license plate. I love, again, getting a real clear shot of their face. I just keep... Y'all, just do me a favor. Can y'all just please, when you shoot your videos, go horizontal, please. Go landscape. So that way, we don't have the black bars on the side.

That way, we can fill the whole screen up. We can see all those white tears in full 16-9 glory, Rob. Yeah, look, I want people like this to get as outraged at racism as they are being called a racist. You know, people say, I'm not a racist, and they say racist things. What do you think racism is? I don't even understand how people think that in their mind. But what we need, again, I've said it once, I've said it five times, I'll say it again. We need to make sure that, okay, we keep filming this. I like that, that we have, that we are doing this, that people of color are doing this, but also we need other white people. They hear the racist jokes. They hear it when we don't. They need to make them feel

uncomfortable in their own social, in their own social circles and start making themselves be vulnerable. That's how we're going to end this because when people don't feel like, when people can't be in their social circles and can't be comfortable being a racist, this will go away. This is the opposite of a virus. In order to make a virus go away, we have to social distance. People have been social distancing away

from racism and that's the problem. We need you to be up close, we need you to be personal, and we need you to take account and really hold other white people accountable. It's how we're going to solve the issue. Look, look, now, I just keep making a point. Every time one of these white folks lose their mind, just roll tape,

and then when they get fired, I keep saying we need to have a group of black people go apply for their job. Well, you know, the thing is they haven't lost their mind. This is what they do. This is how they act. This is how they behave when the cameras are rolling. God knows what they do when the cameras aren't rolling. And let's just be clear. As funny as

these things might be, this is really serious because white women's tears are dangerous. White women have been inoculated. They have been given a pass on the ways in which they support white supremacy. Those Klan robes don't sew themselves. It was white women on the other side of those robes helping to make sure that their men could go out and even going out with them.

We see white women in these pictures at lynchings. We see white women at Trump rallies. They are right there, right next to the men. Yet we seem to talk about racism as if it's a male phenomenon. But white women uphold this. White women like Carolyn Bryant and others tell the lies like the women in these videos where they're going to F you to death and they're crying and pleading and want somebody to feel bad for them. I think the time to gain some sort of

aversion to white women's tears is now. We need to be inoculated against white women's tears and know that behind those tears they're not crying for us. They're crying because they got caught. They're crying because somebody wasn't afraid of them. They're crying because nobody responded to their distress in the way that they wanted them to. And this is what they do all the time. It's whether you've been in sleepaway camp, you've been at work with women like this. We know these women. So they just got caught out there. And now, you know, I know some

people say, but this is, they're older. They're from a different generation. No, it's also young white women too. They do this stuff. And so I'm happy to see it's out here. And they need to keep checking each other. What I'm saying is she's got somebody in her family that knows this is not okay, but they probably say, oh, this is just, she's just being, you know, she's just older. She's doing that. As you said, people in your own circle, your social circles have to stop this.

Everybody knows who these people are. They know who they are, and they need to be on the outs, and they need to be outliers, and they need to be uncomfortable, and that requires other white people making themselves uncomfortable in their own social circles. They have to do that in order to end this. And don't forget, go to my iPad, this white woman, her white tears...

That's right. ...led to Emmett Till being lynched. That's Carolyn Bryant, who is still alive and has never been held accountable for perjury, for absolutely lying on the witness stand. I'm just saying. All right, folks, gotta go to a break. When we come back, we remember two of our great heroes.

You're watching Roland Martin Unfiltered Daily Digital Show by going to RolandMartinUnfiltered.com. Our goal is to get 20,000 of our fans contributing 50 bucks each for the whole year. You can make this possible. RolandMartinUnfiltered.com. All right, folks, Black-owned company Mary Spio, she created these amazing headphones, 360-degree headphones, 4D. Gamers love them. I love them with music. She created these amazing headphones, 360-degree headphones, 4D.

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And again, promo code is R-M-V-I-P 2020, R-M-V-I C-E-E-K.com. And again, promo code is RMVIP2020, RMVIP2220. Folks, our community has lost two important folks this week. First up, Bonnie Poynter. She, of course, Grammy-winning singer and songwriter, also founding member of the Poynter Sisters. She died at the age of 69. Her death was announced in a statement from her older sister,

Anita Poynter. Now, the Poynter sisters evolved from the Pointers pair, a San Francisco-based group Bonnie formed in 1969 with her younger sister, June. The Dio performed R&B covers in Oakland clubs and was part of the Northern California State Youth Choir. Anita Poynter saw her sisters singing with the choir at the Fillmore West and immediately quit her legal secretary job to

sing with them. The Poynters grew up singing in the choir of their father's Oakland church and listened to secular radio when their parents weren't home. Bonnie Poynter made an amazing contribution to black music and she certainly will be missed. Former Bengals player Ken Riley has also passed away. He died of a massive heart attack

at the age of 72. Riley was a cornerback who spent his entire career with the Cincinnati Bengals, first in the American Football League in 1969 and then the National Football League from 1970 through 1983. Riley recorded 65 interceptions in his career, which was the fourth most in NFL history at the time of his retirement, despite his accomplishments in 15 seasons. Riley was never selected to play in the AFL All-Star Game or the AFC-NFC Pro Bowl, and to date has not been voted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

Many people believe that this HBCU legend should indeed be in the Hall of Fame. Our thoughts and prayers go to other friends of Bonnie and Ken Riley. Also, Jazz Fly, this was a shocking story. 39 years old. She was a writer for the show on NBC. And, man, folks are just shocked. Go to my iPad, please. She actually passed away. 39 years old.

Took her own life. Sad, sad, sad case. She, of course, was a TV writer, was a journalist as well. And so condolences also go out to her. One of the things is, for our panel, final topic, and one of the things that we also have to deal with, Rob, when we talk about this, what we're dealing with. We're dealing with trauma, and and i'm gonna find it for a

second there was a young girl this might send me a video this morning with a young girl uh who just bust out in tears when a police officer rolled up and actually uh the cop was a white female was simply just trying to speak to the girl and then she began to console her um what covet is But what COVID has also unleashed is not only the issues we're dealing with with George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery, health issues that we're dealing with. I know a lot of African-Americans who are having a difficult time handling this moment. And that is the pressure, the depression, all those things that come with it. I don't think people really understand all that black people are carrying around just to be black in this country. No, most people don't. I had a I had a talk on my podcast with a mega pastor about this and let them know. I quoted the quote that we all know from James Baldwin, to be

conscious in America and to be Black is to be constantly enraged. That wears on you. And then you do go through modes of depression. Hell, I can tell you, when I watched the George Floyd tape, and I really didn't want to watch it, but I needed to watch it. I watched What Happened to Ahmaud Arbery. I watched that. And just to think about all of this stuff, it wears me out. And I'm generally pretty blessed to be where I'm at. And so it's been very taxing. And this is this has been a tough time for it's always a tough time for African-Americans. But people can people people can see it now a little bit better. But even what they see is much worse because we have to live. It's one thing to experience it as a third party. It's another thing to do it every single day. So, no, I don't think people have a level of

appreciation that to really appreciate what African-Americans are going through. And I want to say this for us. We also need to give ourselves a break. Sometimes we feel like we always have to push past it. We always have to just ignore it. We have to be bigger than that. Sometimes that's impossible to do. You need to just take time to yourself. Get help, seek help, take time, because it is hard. Mm-hmm. Nyambi. Yeah, and I will also say,

let's also consider the least of us, because two Black trans women were killed this week, and that's something that's gotten very little mention. So while we're in the midst of talking about Black Lives Matter, let's not forget these women also who have a life expectancy of 35 years old. That is sad. And that's also part of this agenda of Black Lives Matter to be inclusive of all of us. And I think Rob is exactly right. The mental health needs that we have as a community are deep. This trauma, it's not just in our heads and in our

bodies, it's in our genes and it's in our genes for generations. So these aren't things that you can just sort of get on with, right? You pass this on to your children, your grandchildren, and we've inherited a lot of trauma and they're not always physical. You can't always see it. And I would encourage black people to think about themselves and what has happened to us and sit with that and not treat it as this thing like, oh, if I just say that I've been a victim or something has happened to me that I'm a loser. I have a loser's mentality. No, something real has happened. And it's OK to sit in that and grieve that and deal with all of that. And absolutely right, if you can find a therapist, get one, because I think many of us need it. And it doesn't mean you're going to be put on drugs and you're not crazy and nothing is wrong with you. But sometimes you can't just talk to your mom or your dad or your auntie

or even your pastor. Leah, here's that video I was talking about. It's okay. We're not all bad, right? How old are you? I'm only 9 years old. I saw you. I knew I said it.

I don't want you to be afraid. You look good in here. I don't think people can fathom what it means to be a young black girl. And the moment you see a cop, you begin to break out in tears because it's traumatic. I mean, I know I can personally empathize because I had a traumatic experience with a police officer when I was at a formidable age of 13 years old. I will never forget the feeling of a gun pressed against my head and seeing my father with a gun pointed at his head and him begging for his children's life, saying, please don't shoot me in front of my children. That is something you will never forget.

It is traumatic, it is scarring, and it is deeply, deeply, something that is deeply internal within you that you can't just get rid of. So I want to do something for a second. I want to highlight the work of two black women who have done an exceptional job at really exploring a lot of these issues. The first one is Francois Hamlin, who is a professor at Brown University. And she really studies trauma, particularly amongst black children, of the civil rights and black power movements. And so one of the things that she finds is that many of these children, particularly those who participate in movements or who had parents who participated in movements, who were constantly exposed to violence on their bodies, on themselves, but also seeing it, had many, many issues

later on. And so they grappled with that for the rest of their lives. And then I want to highlight the work of Courtney Cogburn, a very brilliant woman who works at Columbia University, who actually studies the relationship between racism and exposure to racism and health inequities. And one of the things that she finds is that racism, both implicit and explicit racism, when black people have exposure to it, it actually has direct correlation to their health outcomes. So racism, quite literally, is killing black people. And so one of the things I think we can point out is that it's not healthy.

It's either mentally or actually physically for this constant exposure to racism. We now see black life being snuffed out on our smartphones, on our computers, in just constant, constant steady stream of images. That's not healthy. And I think one of the things that we can do, and I want to point out what Nyambi said, is seek mental health interventions. We can look for therapy. Therapy is not something that is about weakness. Therapy is about keeping your resiliency and your strength. And then the other thing that we can do is also take moments, take moments of joy and recognize the small moments of joy.

Everything when you're a black person in this country is a win. It is a victory, right? Black girl magic, black boy joy, all of those things are part of this kind of continuing resiliency and part of the project of mental health and supporting mental health. So, you know, I want us to really think about what racism does to us, but the ways in which we can be resilient and the ways in which we can be strong in the face of that kind of trauma. All right.

Leah, the Ambi Rod, we appreciate it, folks. Thank you so very much. Thank you. All right, folks, when we come back, comedian Danelle Rawlings. Y'all know that boy, Ignant. He'll join us right here at Roller Mark Unfiltered. You want to support Roller Mark Unfiltered? Be sure to join our Bring the Funk

fan club. Every dollar that you give to us supports our daily digital show. There's only one daily digital show out here that keeps it black and keep it real. As Roland Martin Unfiltered, support the Roland Martin Unfiltered daily digital show by going to RolandMartinUnfiltered.com. Our goal is to get 20,000 of our fans contributing 50 bucks each for the whole year. You can make this possible. RolandMartinUnfiltered.com.

All right, y'all. Friday. You know we always have a little fun on Fridays with comedians. Joining us right now is the assiest comedian in the land, Danell Rollins. What up, my man? What's going on? I don't hear... Am I supposed to see you? No. That's not how it works. I'm not...

I'm just looking at a black screen. Right. Well, first of all, you're looking at the... You're looking right. You need to look like you're cross-eyed. You should be looking directly in the damn camera lens. All right. Is that looking at a camera lens? Yeah, that's much better. Also... Also, just some advice. If you're gonna do video, never have the light behind you,

because when you dark-skin, you look like a damn silhouette. All right, all right. I know you're going to do video, never have the light behind you because when you're dark-skinned, you look like a damn silhouette. All right, all right. I know you're a little director. I see you went to Africa with all your drones. I see you with all your extra cameras. You get cameras shipped to you before I come out. But don't disrespect me and my technology. No, I'm not disrespecting you. I'm just trying to offer you you always shoot with the light, not against the light.

Well, maybe you need to work on how you communicate those thoughts to me. Because whenever you start a sentence, first of all, you know it's going to be some drama, Roland. So maybe, maybe I can't get your message because the tone in which you talk to people like you're about to whoop somebody every day, man. Everybody don't need to get a beating. All right? Look, man, that's how I roll. My niece says the same thing. She's like,

she's like, why you gotta be so hard? I'm like, damn it, just do what I say. Exactly. They won't listen unless you have that tone. I respect your tone. You know I respect your tone. But I want to say one thing. Thanks for having me on the show, especially the time that we're going through. And I really do think it's important for people to be able to figure out the way to laugh.

And then your last guest we had on, she said something at the end that it kind of stuck to me. She said, we do have to have time to be joyful and celebrate. And that's even with the small things, Roland. And we do, I say, I do a podcast. And, you know, when the protests and everything started with George Floyd, everybody was like, why aren't these other cops arrested? Why aren't they behind bars? So the first small thing we need to do is get them locked up.

And then, oh, my gosh. But are you still there? Ryan, why is somebody calling you in the middle of the show? I don't know, because I got friends. You're not my only friend, Roland. But when it happened, when it happened, when they arrested the other three cops, I was so happy that day, man.

Not that the mission is over. Not what we got to do is over. The fact that we could celebrate in that moment, it made me feel good. So it is important to be able to find some joy, especially in dark times like this. I'm celebrating because clearly your ass finally got out and went to your barber.

Yo, no, I didn't do that. I did it. I felt like last week was a good week for me. I felt like Britney Spears. Remember when Britney Spears was going through a transition in her life and she just cut everything? I had to do it. My son was upset because he was like, Daddy,

what happened? Because I had the George... You saw what I was doing. I had the George Jefferson going on. It was awful. But I felt closer to myself. I felt like a woman going outside for the first time without makeup.

It's a rough thing to do sometimes, but you feel so good because that's who you really are. So, you know, I was growing the hair out. That's who I was. But now I got to fake them out. I'm back to my ashy elbow. They say I look like Idris Elba when I do like this. What you think? No.

Come on, man. You hate. Hate ain't going to get you nowhere, man. Hate ain't going to get you nowhere. What What kind of bullshit y'all advanced that stuff? You were just saying, oh, I got closer to myself. I was identifying with myself more by growing my hair. That's some

bullshit. Okay, Roland, you know what? First off, the level of disrespect you have for your listeners right now, I cannot explain this because this is not what we do when we see each other. You know what I'm saying? Like, tell the people how we really connect. Tell the people about dancing on the table in Toronto

and eating chicken and waffles at 3 o'clock in the morning. Those are stories that people really want to know. Not this petty stuff you're trying to start with me. Hey, hey, hey. It was a Dave Chappelle after party. The music was bumping. I was like, let's go. No, on the table, bro.

That ain't my first time I danced on. And enforcer, all the stereotypes. They had fried chicken dancing on the table. I was like, man. And a ascot. And a ascot. I think you had on kenty cloth boxers or something because you kept bidding over. I was like, he's really down with the African cause, bro.

Really? Really? Yeah. Really? I'm going to take my chances any way I can get. First of all, how you going to sit here, man, come on the show with a dead ass iPhone? It just showed up low battery. It's not. It's not. It just showed up low battery. It's not.

It just showed up. It showed up on the screen. Well, don't do this. Don't let white people see you act out like this. Please don't do this. I got black people who watch. Okay, for the couple of white people that watch. Listen, this is not a time for us to do this, Roland.

This is our kumbaya. No, I need you to charge your shit before you come on my show. I'm sitting here saying, low battery warning. But listen, the producers didn't tell me this was the type of shit I was going to have to deal with. They said it was going to be informative. They said you was going to be nice. They said you're finally in a good mood. They all lied.

And I said I'm excited to do it. They lied. They all lied. They said, you nasty, man. They lied. You nasty, it. They lie. They all lie. They say, you nasty, man. They lie. You nasty, man. They lie. This is not the Roland that my mother respects.

No, this is the Roland your mama respects. Your mama going to be like, Donnell, he got in your ass. He wasn't lying. Charge your phone next time, Donnell. Well, I'll take a note of that, and I will do that. And I will do that if we could have some type of black unity. And that's what I'm here for, Roland. That's what I'm on this goddamn show for, for black unity.

And I'm here to apologize. Yo, you know another thing I hear in front of all your fans? I'm here to apologize for the white chicks that I slept with years ago. I feel so bad about that. But I want to be a better person. For who? Them white chicks. I wanted to apologize

from some of the white chicks I took down in my past. First of all, don't be talking like I took the short yellow bus to school. Don't be sitting there talking slow to me. Well, that's what my audience, I had to slow it down for. No. Because, alright. I wasn't clear because I've never slept with a white woman,

so I don't know. I know you haven't. I wasn't clear because I've never slept with a white woman. So I don't know. I know you haven't. I know you haven't. Sorry. I know you haven't. I know it's in your tone, bro. It's in your tone, man. I know you haven't.

I know it would be totally disgusting. That ever pop up, if they ever had a scandal, if that come out, that'd be the end of you. It would be over, bro. But I apologize. I apologize for those Brussels sprouts. I apologize for drinking tea with no sugar in it, drinking unsweetened tea.

I apologize to my people, Roland. I apologize. I bet you got a bottle of mayonnaise somewhere, too, huh? I don't do that. I don't do mayonnaise no more. I don't do it like that. Oh, operate the phrase no more. No more. That was my past. I don't do it like that. Oh, opera de phrase, no more. No more.

That was my past. I'm trying to tell you that I'm apologizing because Black is back. And in a big way, we got white people apologizing for everything right now, son. Everything. Yo, Roland, I was in a grocery store the other day. I cut this white dude off with my cart, right?

We tried to give him $10, 10 item or less. I cut him off. He was like, oh, my God, brother, I'm sorry. And pulled the, right? We tried to get him 10 items or less. I cut him off. He was like, oh, my God, brother, I'm sorry, and pulled the check out and tried to write a check to the NAACP just because I cut him off at a grocery store. If his white people listen, listen, there's more than the NAACP to donate money to. It don't matter what problems that we have,

the first thing white folks want to do is write that check to the NAACP. Quit! Right. What you should do, you should have said here's my cash app. See, you're so foul, man. Why? You're getting away from the message, Roland.

How? This is what's the most important thing I want to say right now. The most important thing is don't eat white people's potato salad and don't let them bring potato salad to a barbecue. That's what the people want to know. That's important. I thought you were about to say don't let them

DJ. You don't think so? Nah, DJ, well, they're going to play Electric Slide and you'll be right there getting busy if they play Electric Slide. You're Electric Slide anyway. You could be in the middle of a protest, Electric Slide coming, you're going to play Electric Slide, and you'll be right there getting busy if they play Electric Slide. You're Electric Slide anyway. You could be in the middle of a protest, Electric Slide coming. You're like, hold on, no justice, no peace. Let me go ahead and get this line going real quick. You did see some of those protest videos

where they were out there doing Electric Slide, the Cupid Shuffle, and the Wobble. Yeah, and then nobody could do it the way you do it, though. I was expecting to see you in those videos. You are a good dancer. You're a great dancer. My philosophy is your legs work, your hips work, your pelvis work. Go ahead and use it. Yep. And you

are always a good example of that. You show the world that you like to dance. That's how we do it. That's how we do it. Yep. Anytime. What's this shirt you got on? What is this? Dance? What is this? Cool Dance. One of my friends, he started this line. I thought I mean, yellow's good. What's this shirt you got on? What is this? Dad's? What is this? Cool Dad's.

One of my friends, he started this line. I thought I'd wear it for him. But it was funny because now I'm looking at it. During this pandemic, every one of these haircuts I had, I've had these haircuts. I think it might have been kind of a joke. It's just a shirt that represents Dad's. Stand the hell up.

We can't see the shirt. All right, man. What? The hell? Can you see it? So we got Dr. Phil, we got George, we got Wayne,

Bernie Mac, I don't know who that on the left, is that Mike Epps? We got Reginald Van Johnson. Alright, okay. You sit your ass down now. You know what? Hey, Roland. Okay.

First off, this is going to stop right now, Roland. This is going to stop right now. I heard you can dance, but I don't know nothing about no fighting. Now, I know you can make up any time you tell stories better than Charlie Murphy, R.I.P. to my brother. But this negative energy you got to me, you don't treat your other guests like that. You don't treat your guests the right books because I ain't wrote a goddamn book. You're going to talk to me like this?

You're going to talk to me like this because you know how stressed out I used to be when they called me to read out loud in school? That's what you want to do? You want to stress me out? That's what you want to do? I was on the yellow bus, Roland. I was on the yellow bus.

I do want to do that. Okay, so let me tell you what happened. Let me tell you what happened. Apologize. Apologize, please. No, let me tell you what happened. Let me tell you what happened. Apologize. Apologize, please. No. Let me tell you what happened. What happened is we had these segments, and we did it with News 1 Now.

And these comedians would come on the show, and I guess they thought I was soft or something. But don't take that on me. What that got to do with me? So, no. So, they would come on, and I remember, like, Arnaz J came on, and I started cutting their ass. And then I was like, yo, I'm wrong one. And then it got to the point where the other comedians would pass the word, look, when y'all go on Wild N' Out Wednesday, y'all better leave his ass alone.

He too quick. He quick. But see, that's what you do. See, you can't do that, Roland. You can't do that because you had issues with other communities do that to me, alright? I got love and respect for you. I don't go to those people. So this whole thing was a setup for you to prove to everybody how funny

you look. Stay the journalism. Stay with the journalism stuff, right? Let me do the comedy, Roland. Somebody said, Kiana Williams said on YouTube, get out your feelings. You know why they say that?

Because they think I'm sensitive, Roland. They think I'm sensitive. No, she just said, she said, tell his sensitive ass to get out his feelings. Yeah, I guess you're right. That's what, you know what,

you know what, Roland? You know what? I am sensitive. Damn it, I'm sensitive. Why? Why you so damn sensitive? That's just it. I have emotions, Roland. I have sensitive. Why? Why are you so damn sensitive? That's just it. I have emotions, Roland.

I have emotions. You think this, don't get this handsome, Idris Elba face confused. No, no, no, no, stop. All right. I need you to stop dropping Idris, because that's not it. Roland, you don't think that, for real,

hold on, wait a minute. Let me get my light skin and laugh. Nothing? No, no. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Let me get my light-skinned laugh. Nothing? No. No. Wait, wait. Wait, wait. Let me do this.

I mean, it ain't Idris or Avery Brooks. Ask your elbow. You don't see no ask your elbow. You don't see it. No. You don't see it. I don't. You don't see it.

You're so disrespectful, man. You ain't going to just keep disrespecting me like this. No, I don't. I see Ike Turner. What? You see Ike Turner. What? You see Ike Turner? Yo, you... I ain't got nothing but some jewelry.

I ain't got nothing. I ain't got nothing but some... I ain't got nothing. I ain't got nothing but some jewelry. Danelle, Danelle, Danelle. You going to eat that cake? You going to eat that cake, Danelle? You going to eat that cake?

No, you... I ain't messing... You ain't getting me. Yo, they going to come at me. They ain't going to come at you. I am not doing it. God, not today, devil come at me. They ain't going to come at you. I am not doing it. God, not today, devil. Not today.

My God is a good God, Roland. He is a great God. I don't care what you try to do. Anime? Tell me. Anime? You need to kick anime. I'm not messing with you, bro.

I got the wrong one. This is not what I thought. I thought we was going to talk about some social issues. I thought you was going to ask me what my position was on stuff. I did not know that Roland Martin got me on this goddamn show to roast me. Goddamn it, you set me up. This was a set up.

Roland Martin set me up. I didn't bring it in, but tell everybody about the lotion. I got to, I do, I am going to, I got, I i'm gonna start a line of lotion um and like in june it's gonna be all natural no animal cruelty it's gonna be a very very very very very good product uh we're still going through the test process of that right now i'm gonna sit i'm gonna send you something that too man Just to get your honest opinion You already said it That wasn't lotion, that was my candle

You didn't even open my shit up You so rotten man You told me it was lotion I told you it was a candle called black Why the hell are you going to send me a candle My lights on No I sent you a candle Because I heard that you go in them strip clubs

This candle eliminates Twerk odor So I'm sent you a candle because I heard that you go in them strip clubs. This candle eliminates twerk odor, so I'm looking out for you. Also, you know with COVID going on and everything, the first thing that goes is your sense of smell and taste. So if you burn this candle and you don't smell my black ash, then you need to go get that swab. That's why I sent you that candle. That candle will remind you of the 70s. That candle reminds you of being in the... You sent me a candle that smelled like funk? Did you smell

it, Roland? No. You didn't even smell it? No, because we had a professor from North Carolina A&T, and he told me, if you get any packages, open the package outside in the middle of the yard because COVID might be on the package and you don't want to bring it into the house.

So the package you sent me is still on the porch. I put your package in quarantine, so after 14 days, I'm going to open the box. You're so disrespectful. Let me tell you about COVID altogether. You know what I'm saying? And I know it's real. I know it's a serious idea.

But after all these goddamn protests, Rolla, if this shit don't spike in the next three days, man, I think it was a conspiracy, bro. You can't tell me nothing else. No, it's going up. It's been going up. So it's been going up. It's been spiking? It's been going up.

So we're seeing reports. But again, let's be safe. Let's been going up. It's been staking? It's been going up. So we're seeing reports. But again, let's be safe. Let's wash our hands. And please apply some damn lotion because I'm tired of y'all walking around looking like you kicking flour. And what's wrong with you? You got a problem with asking people rolling? You that good? I can't stand it.

You getting that much money? Dog. You getting it. Hold up. Did you not see that video of me doing the alpha A-step, and there were two large bottles of Nivea lotion on the kitchen table? I don't mess with ash. Yo, you so disrespectful.

Your people, man, they should be ashamed of you. You got little nice little hair on the side. You got your little curls. We know that you got little curls on the side. Waves, too. Dress night. You do your Windsor night knots and all that. Waves, too. You got passport stamps down. You got a problem with assy people.

I can't stand ass, dawg. Come on now. Look, I. You. Hey, hey. I tell a family member. Everybody around you classy. Roll it.

Everybody around you classy. Everybody. Look, you can look at this. Everybody around you classy. You got no assy people. When we got a family member, we got a family member. Everybody around you classy. Everybody. Look, you can look at it. Everybody around you classy. Let me explain to you. When we have the panel here, we do ass check.

I look down the line. I look at them knuckles. And I will slide the lotion down like, hey, hit them knuckles. Well, you know what? I'm going to let you know what comes with ash. Ash is a way of life, Roland. Some people, when you went to Africa, did you walk around with your lotion when you was in Africa? You damn right I did!

And who's you pissed off over there? So there were no ashy Africans over there? Hey, hey, shea butter, shea butter, shea butter, shea butter. Moisturize, damn it. Your people should be so sad. I'm sick with you right now. I'm sick of you right now, Roland. I can't even let you know the level of disgust

I have for one of my heroes, okay? I watched you celebrate black people for years, Roland. And was it ashy? And was it as... I And was it ashy? I watched you and I told you one of my finest moments when Barack got reelected and you was on CNN. True story.

And them white people was trying to bust your bubble. They had no goddamn balloons. It was inauguration night. It was inauguration night and they kept talking. They kept, Campbell Brown was hosting. And they kept talking about, oh, hey, no, but, you know, he's got a lot of work to do. I said, hey, hey, we got four years to talk about all that.

Can we please, like, have some fun? And they told me, y'all, true story. You said, no, this was the funny part for me. You looked around that studio. You was like, we can't get a balloon or something around here? Right. You said, we can't get no balloon? And then.

You was looking, you acting it out. And then Campbell Brown said, oh, no, Roland. You're not going anywhere. She's like, we're going to be here until 2 o'clock. And what did I say? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. But when you was like, ain't no goddamn balloons to pop around here, I was like, get him. And that's, see, that's right there. See, this is how I bond with people.

And I said, I respect that man. I said, one day, I'm going to be lucky enough to be on his platform, and we're going to share those good moments, bro. And this is what I said. I said, we're going to hug and show love as black on black love. I said, we're not going to argue. I said, we're not going to roast each other.

We're going to sit there and just relish and feel good about being brothers. And what the hell did you do to me? The only problem is... Black on black. No, the only problem is... Black on black. I didn't sign that contract. Sorry. Black on black. I got to go that contract. Sorry. It's black on black.

I got to go. It's black on black. What's your cash app? You so disrespectful. But I do got an OnlyFans page. Boy, you stupid. Danell Rollins, y'all. Give it up for him, man.

I appreciate it. Always good to see you. I hate you. With all the love I can share, bro. All right, cake. Great to have you back on the love I can share, bro. All right, can't wait to have you back on the show. All right, man. All right, baby, now go charge your damn phone. All right, y'all. Let me give it up

real quick here, y'all. We got to read the subscriptions real quick. These are the people who've given 50 bucks or more. They always get a shout. I certainly appreciate their contributions to the show. Angela Swint, Anita Smith-Ethridge, Annette McFarlane, Anthony Brown, Cassandra Alexander,

Kalina Burton, Danielle Salifu, David Barnes, Dwayne Walker, Dwayne, Glenn E. Smith, Hope Wright, Jacqueline Spady, James Baltimore, Jamie Jenkins, Jay Bailey, Jonathan Robinson, Crystal Lacking, LaTosha Spratley, Leonard Wilson, McKella, Mello, Paula Davis, Randy Williams, Robert,

Rose Hewitt, Smith, Sonia, Stephen. I want to thank all of them for giving. Folks, if you want to support us at Roller Martin Unfiltered, we have fun, we do the news stuff, we do all this sort of stuff. It's all about, man, trying to make y'all happy. Support us via Cash App. Dollar sign RMUnfiltered,

paypal.me forward slash rmartinunfiltered, venmo.com forward slash rmunfiltered. Don't forget, also send a cashier's check. Do me a favor, y'all. You gotta make it out to New Vision Media. That's the company. New Vision Media, Inc., 1625 K Street, NW, Suite 400, Washington, D.C.,

20006. We are not done. We are not done. Y'all, tonight, Defy Blood drops on Netflix. Starring, directed by Spike Lee, starring Delroy Lindo, Clark Peters, Norm Lewis, Isaiah Whitlock. Unbelievable movie.

My Conversation with the great actor, Delroy Lindo. Now the time has come! linda black g.i. is it fair to serve more than the white americans that sent you here nothing is more confused than to be ordered into a war to die without the faintest idea of what's going on. I dedicate this next record to the soul brothers of the 1st Infantry Division. Be safe. Time has come today! Young hearts, go their way!

Can't put it off another day Gentlemen, welcome back to Vietnam. Look what I found. Better man in all his glory. Who was that guy? That brother was the best damn soldier that ever lived. I have no place to stay. Hey! We bury it.

Made a home, we come back and collect. The love has flown away. Hey! My tears have come and gone. Hey! Oh, my lord, I have to go. Hey! I have no heart. I shall resign the presidency. Hey! I have to go. Hey! I have to go home.

I shall resign the presidency. Hey! I have to go. Being back here, it is not easy. Now the time has come. Time is no place to run. You broken man. Time!

So what, you blaming yourself? You don't even know. Time! No! Time! You're a broken man. So what, you're blaming yourself? You don't even know. No! We've been dying for this country from the very get-go. Time! Now the time has come. Time! There are things to really care about.

We give this gold... Time! ...to our people. Time! Hold up! Time! In my line of work, I have to be very careful. And that means knowing exactly who I am in business with.

Finally! Delroy, we finally get to talk. We met at the National African American Museum a couple of years ago. We finally get to talk. We met at the National African American Museum a couple years ago. We finally get to chat. Indeed. Here we are. Man, let's, first of all, unbelievable role in this film. First time you and Spike connected in 25 years.

Did you tell Spike, by damn time? No, no, no, no. I mean, I was, you know, what I've been saying, Roland, is, you know, if I had to wait 25 years to work with Spike after Clock is back in 1996, this was a good one to wait for. This was one of the things that I,

that was just amazing about this film, and it's something that you rarely see in movies. This really was about black manhood, brotherhood. That's what jumps out. I think about the wood. I think about the brothers. There are some movies that it's really about, but that's what spoke the loudest as I watched this film. And the fact that it's set in context of the Vietnam War and that these are Vietnam vets

is another component that makes this a particular kind of a film because, as you well know, black contributions to Vietnam, World War II, conflict, are either marginalized, traditionally, just in terms of the entertainment industry, stories that are told, they're either marginalized or explicated altogether. So here we have this film in which we are front and center. And that separates this film further from a lot of war films that one has seen in the past. But the fact that you pick up on the fact that, because for me personally, I think it's a love story

between these men. And the fact that you picked up on that is important, is critical, because that component is essential to the manner in which these men are presented. And so I'm glad you picked up on that. And one of the things that also was different for black soldiers... Look, my uncle served in Vietnam, is that here they were, even during that period,

fighting for their country, and the country was fighting against them. You had brothers and sisters who were at home trying to fight for rights, and how Spike was able to fuse that together. So you had Vietnam and Mexico City and Tommy Smith and John Carlos and civil rights movement, all these things going. So for black soldiers, that was a conflicted time.

Black GI in Memphis, Tennessee, a white man assassinated Dr. Martin Luther King. Dr. King also opposed the U.S. war in Vietnam. Black G.I., your government sent 600,000 troops to crush the rebellion. Your Seoul sister and Seoul brothers are enraged in over 122 cities. They killed them. Why you fight against us

so far away from where you are needed? It was profoundly conflicting. I have two cousins who were Vietnam vets. And one of my cousins in particular talks about the betrayal that he felt coming back after having been drafted at 19 years old and coming back and feeling like he was the problem, being called a baby murderer, et cetera.

And so we cannot underestimate the damage that that did psychologically and emotionally to a lot of vets, and certainly the black and brown vets. And that's even before you talk about or start to consider the impact of PTSD, which is a whole other reality in and of itself, as you know. I see ghosts, y'all. I see... ghosts. What happens to all of us, man?

Oh, you seen them too? Yeah. Dad come to you at night. Storm and Norm come to me every night. He talk to you like he talk to me. Come on. Thanks. What also I thought was amazing,

and I think one of the things that I guess for me, the reason it hits a little bit different, being a life member of Alpha Phi Alpha Fraternity Incorporated, we have brotherhoods you have that sort of that connection that bond that is separate from other brothers you may know what i really loved was no matter what happened with the friction with the fight that the infighting that may happen y'all were forced to put those hands in the center, to say, look, sit at the side, we still bros? I don't think they were forced.

I'll take it. I don't think they were forced. I think that putting our hands together in that circle in the scenes in the film that we do is an organic manifestation of the love that we feel for each other. Right. Sometimes despite ourselves. What I mean by forced is that It's an organic manifestation of the love that we feel for each other. Right.

Sometimes despite ourselves. What I mean by forced is that that, I'll use the word force, that force causes you to say, look. A component that is missing. Right? Lack of ability suggests the component is there, but you don't know how to utilize it. Right. Right? So I really want to make that distinction just because you know what I will tell you as a father.

First of all, well, I'll say this as a father. Sometimes all I can do to communicate with my son is to hug him. That's all I can do sometimes. Because the words either do not suffice or I don't have the words. I cannot, the words do not present themselves that I wish to articulate. So sometimes I'll write it down. I'll send him a text.

I'll send him an email. And sometimes when all else fails, it's a question of just hugging him and saying, I love you, man. You know what? As I listen to you talk... Let me just say one other thing. Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.

Let me just say one other thing. For cats who can't even do that or don't do that, you know, I have that to lean on in the final analysis. And, you know, sometimes I'll hug my son and, you know, most of the time he will hug me back. But sometimes it's like, Dad, come on now. Right, right, right. You know?

So I just want to make the distinction Come on now. Right, right, right. You know? So I just want to make the distinction between inability versus lack of ability. Well, it was interesting you talk about hugging, because for me, I have a, I have nine nieces, I have four nephews. And the way I roll is this here. When I go back home, my folks are mostly in Texas.

When I walk into the house, I don't give a damn what y'all doing. You are going to come and hug me. Come on. Now, the other thing is this here, and again, I know some people may say, dang, Roland, you watch movies a little bit differently. What I also notice is that how y'all hugged also mattered. There are some cats who will grab hands

and they'll have the arm between the chest, pat the back. No, y'all had full hugs and embracing. Now, I know some people may think I'm crazy, saying there's no big deal, but there is a difference. There is a difference in that type of hug. Come here, you. Whoa, whoa. The point is this.

As a result of having that dinner, then Jonathan and I, he sent me a couple of texts. He hit me up with a couple of texts. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, We just connected. We just... Um... And for the folks who are watching, Jonathan plays your son in the movie. And I'll tell you, Delroy, I, you know, Spike went to make this soon after he wins the Oscar. And so I knew... The following morning. Right.

He left the ceremony and got on the plane and went to Thailand. And I knew it was the story of these brothers who served in Vietnam, but I did think it was a very interesting twist having the son, because what it also allowed, I think, for the audience to have to deal with

is the pain the children of Vietnam vets had to deal with, and not really understanding what those brothers went through in Vietnam. And so you have these people who have, who are upset. I mean, my dad, you know, Clark Peterson's character in terms of, you know, a child, all those different things. And people don't really want to understand how hard it was for those men serving in Vietnam

and you're trying to come back and be a father. And that shit wasn't easy. how hard it was for those men serving in Vietnam, and you're trying to come back and be a father, and that shit wasn't easy. Look, man, there's a whole confluence of dynamics at play here. There's a whole host of dynamics at play. The fact that PTSD as a medical, as a clinical condition was not identified until when? I'm not sure, but it was relatively recently. So here are these cats who have been traumatized

by the experience of being in war, traumatized. Then they have this, they come home with this condition that they can't identify, that they can't get to grips with. And I think it manifests most acutely with the people that you're closest to. So there is a disconnect on top of a disconnect on top of a disconnect on top of another disconnect. And it creates profound pain, profound neuroses, profound pathology. And if you are not the kind of human being, and we know our people generally, generally, and this is a broad, this is a very broad generalization. But if you are not the kind of human being who is apt to say to yourself, I need to go get some help, that creates then another issue

in terms of not addressing the issue. On top of which, if somebody doesn't come to you and say, I can get you some help, or here is some help for you, right? So this pathology just runs rampant. It just runs rampant. These various pathologies just run rampant

throughout these lives. And in prepping to do this film, the first two people that I spoke with were two cousins of mine, both of whom were in, both of whom struggled with PTSD. One of my cousins in particular continues to struggle with PTSD. And they gave me a wealth of information, a wealth of knowledge about the condition. If you add to that the kind of pain that exists when you can't get close to your child, the kind of pain when you can't get close

to your child in the way that you feel you want to get close to your child, and add to that just culturally the rejection that these men suffered, you have a recipe for disaster. And that is what we have seen played out over and over and over and over and over and over again with our Vietnam vets, Afghanistan, Iraq. You know, the last person that I spoke, I spoke with a number of vets, Roland. The first two were my cousins, and then I spoke with a number of Vietnam vets. And the last person that I, all of whom gave me wonderful information

in terms of educating me, informing me about the experience of NAM and specifically in the case of my cousins, PTSD. Then the last person that I spoke with is a retired major, a female African-American lady who retired as a major from the military. And she was an Iraq vet. She spoke with me at length about her experiences, specifically with PTSD. So I had a wealth of knowledge. Knowledge is not the correct word.

I had a wealth of information that I had, that I had gathered, that I now had to attempt to start putting, infusing into my creation of Paul. But I'm saying all of that to say this. There are so many unanswered questions, so many unanswered conditions that one is grappling with. And that's what creates the pathology. Well, and I think as...

Even though we were talking about war, as I think about what's happening right now in this country, the George Floyd video, Breonna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery, and we could go on and on and on, Black folks are dealing with this life of trauma in terms of what we have to experience.

And you know what? Spike just added something to that. Post-slavery stress syndrome. I mean, look at Chicago. 18 people were killed the other day, the most in 60 years. If you... Black youth and adults in Chicago are dealing with that level of trauma every day, not just shootings, but economic violence,

physical violence, what's happening in the community, and again, people go, oh, get over it, but you can't get over something unless you've got to work through this thing. Just like a soldier can't just get over it, whatever that experience was. Listen, A, you can't just get over it. And I want to stress, and again, you know this clearly,

that it's not just a question of us getting over it. It is a question of the other folk acknowledging our humanity, acknowledging us in our humanity. And that is a huge component that has been missing, that continues to be missing. And that lack of willingness to acknowledge us as human beings in our humanity is the direct, one of the direct reasons why we're in the situation that we're having the kind of turmoil that we're having

right now. And that lack of acknowledgement of our humanity, as you well know, is historical. Right. That is 400 plus years in the making. So folk can say to us, you know, get over it. And certainly we have a, there is work for us to do as people of color, as African descended people. There is plenty of work for us to do in terms of addressing ourselves and addressing our pathology. But there is the pathology of racism and how that impacts people of color. I would say to those other folks that there's work for you all to do. There's a lot of work for you all to do.

And acknowledging, looking at this tradition of lack of willingness to accept us in our humanity is a major, major, major piece of the pathology of racism that we are subjected to that they should also take responsibility for and do the work and begin to do the work necessary to, I'm not gonna say correct it, but to do the work necessary to address it. Mm-hmm. Normally in movies, when you have flashbacks, you typically will have the younger actors, and then you're playing yourselves.

I asked Clark this, did y'all say, Spike, what the hell you got us running around here, man, with these guns and all this shooting stuff? No. I don't know specifically what Clark said, but I'll tell you this. What Clark said was, he said, I got bad knees. I was like, I can't be doing all this damn running.

Yeah, but guess what? Here's, did he said, I got bad knees. I was like, I can't be doing all this damn running. Yeah, but guess what? Did he say that for real? Yes. Here's the other piece of that. We did the work. We did it. Because for me personally, when I read those flashback scenes in the script, I saw that we would not be de-aged,

that we would be in those scenes with Chadwick as we look right now. It made sense to me. Reading it, it did not jar me. I didn't say, oh, wow, how's this going to work? No, it made sense to me. And for me personally, filming those scenes also made sense. And the process for me was this.

First of all, Chadwick did not arrive in Thailand until probably four or five weeks after we had been working. And we had spent those four or five weeks talking about Norm, talking about what he meant to us, discussing the impact, his impact on our lives and what that meant. So when Chadwick arrived and we were now filming those scenes, for me, it made total sense that we were now reliving

those moments as our present-day selves. And for me, there was no, um, breakage in my ability to play the truth of those scenes the way I look right now. And I don't think Clark, bad knees and all. I have bad knees, man. My knees ain't as bad as Clark's. But I'll say this. I'll say this. I'll say this. I don't think he's giving himself enough credit because Mark Peters, Isaiah Whitlock, Norm Lewis,

we all applied ourselves to those flashback scenes fully. And I'll say one other thing before I have to leave. One of the scenes we were doing in which I got to... I was in one part of the scene, and they were in another part of the scene, and I got to watch them as they were firing those guns and running through the underbrush. And these were not doubles. I got to watch Norm Lewis, Clark Peters, and Isaiah Whitlock Jr. run through that bush. And it moved me, man. It moved, it was very, very moving.

Because those cats, they were applying themselves to the work in the way that the work needed to be applied to, in the way that the work needed to be done. They did it. So I don't think Clark is giving himself enough credit. I have to go, man. My next call is here. I'm glad we got to do this. And God bless.

And without... I know you have a very large audience. I want everybody to see this film. I want everybody to see this film. Black, white, pink, whomever. Because it is such a presentation of these men in their humanity. And I hope that that, in turn,

by extension, creates a wider acknowledgement and acceptance of these men in their humanity and, by extension, people of color all over the world in their humanity. Okay? De Rolando, I appreciate it. Thanks a lot. God bless. Take care.

Take care. God bless. Take care. Take care. God bless. Thank you. I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad.

Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Lott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Yes, sir. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of star-studded a little bit, man.

We met them at their homes. We met them at their recording studios. Stories matter, and it brings a face to them. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. We asked parents who adopted teens to share their journey. We just kind of knew from the beginning that we were family. They showcased a sense of love that I never had before. I mean, he's not only my parent, like he's like my best friend. At the end of the day, it's all been worth it.

I wouldn't change a thing about our lives. Learn about adopting a teen from foster care. Visit AdoptUSKids.org to learn more. Brought to you by AdoptUSKids, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, and the Ad Council. This is an iHeart Podcast.