#RolandMartinUnfiltered - Sanders wins NH; Yang, Patrick out of prez race; Black clergy respond to Trump's Bloomberg attack

Episode Date: February 16, 2020

2.12.20 #RolandMartinUnfiltered: Sanders wins New Hampshire primary; Andrew Yang and Deval Patrick drop out of 2020 presidential race; Black clergy respond to Donald Trump's attack on Bloomberg; Graduates of HBCUs may be paying more for student loans. #RolandMartinUnfiltered partner: Are you looking to enhance your leadership or that of your team in 2020? Join Dr. Jacquie Hood Martin as she engages others to think like a leader. Register and start the online course today! www.live2lead.com/Leesburg #RolandMartinUnfiltered is a news reporting platform covered under Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Glott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of starts that a little bit, man.

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Sometimes as dads, I think we're too hard on ourselves. We get down on ourselves on not being able to, you know, we're the providers, but we also have to learn to take care of ourselves. A wrap-away, you got to pray for yourself as well as for everybody else, but never forget yourself. Self-love made me a better dad because I realized my worth. Never stop being a dad. That's dedication.

Find out more at fatherhood.gov. Brought to you by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services and the Ad Council. Thank you. Thank you. Today is Wednesday, February 12, 2020. Coming up next on Rolling Martin Unfiltered, Senator Bernie Sanders wins in New Hampshire. White folks can actually count votes in New Hampshire. White folks can actually count votes in New Hampshire. Iowa, pay attention. We'll talk to surrogates

and campaign officials from the Sanders, Warren, as well as the Buttigieg campaign. You will not hear from the Joe Biden campaign or the Amy Klobuchar campaign because I don't let people on my show when the candidate has yet to come on first.

I'm just saying. All right, folks, Nevada's up next, then South Carolina. Why are white Democrats so desperate for black people to come to the rescue? Also, Andrew Yang and Deval Patrick, they have dropped out of the race Democratic nomination. Today, Mike Bloomberg, a day after

audio recording, revealed him talking about slamming black men up against the walls for stopping frisks. He met with 20 pastors in New York and dropped the endorsements of three black members of Congress. We'll tell you all about it. Plus, graduates of HBCUs, they're paying more than their white counterparts for tuition. No shock there.

It's called white privilege. It's time to bring the funk on Rolling Mark Unfiltered. Let's go. He's knowing, putting it down from sports to news to politics, with entertainment just for kicks. He's rolling, it's Uncle Roro, y'all. It's Rolling Martin, yeah. Rolling with rolling now. He's funky, he's fresh, he's real the best, you know he's Rolling Martin. All right, folks. Last night, New Hampshire, Senator Bernie Sanders won nine delegates with 25 percent of the vote coming in first.

South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg, former mayor, he got nine delegates. Amy Klobuchar, she gained six. That's how they ended up. Sanders first, Buttigieg second, Klobuchar third. Elizabeth Warren from the neighboring state of Massachusetts came in fourth, surprising to many people. Vice President Joe Biden came in fifth, then Tom Starr, then Tulsi Gabbard. Of course, the results led to two folks dropping out of the race, Andrew Yang, as well as former Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick. He had put lots of time and energy and resources into Massachusetts, got like 0.3 percent of the vote, didn't do well today. He announced that he's out.

Andrew Yang dropped out last night, saying it made no sense to keep running and taking resources and time away from the other candidates. And the focus should be on Donald Trump. Coming up next, of course, is Nevada. That's the next caucus taking place. The next primary is going to be in South Carolina a week later. Of course, the debate next week is also in Nevada. It's going to be the first time that Michael Bloomberg is going to be on stage with the other candidates. Trust me, they're all gearing up to go after him.

Joining us right now is Breonna Joy Gray, national press secretary for the Bernie Sanders campaign. Got to ask you, Breonna, first of all, glad to have you here on Roller Martin Unfiltered. Got to ask you, I mean, what do you make of all these folks in national media who say, oh, my goodness, Bernie Sanders, he squeaked out a win compared to 2016 when there was only two people running in 2016. You literally have seven or so people running in 2020. It's pretty incredible. There are nine candidates. Well, at least until yesterday, there were nine candidates in this race.

So, of course, the vote's going to be a little bit more fractured than before. What's really remarkable, the story is here, is that Bernie Sanders managed to win despite millions of dollars in oppo ads being put against him, despite the fact that the health care industry has been running ads trying to muddy the waters around what Medicare for All means. They're terrified, right, because the majority of Americans and the overwhelming majority of Democrats support Medicare for All. So what's remarkable is that even with that onslaught, he managed to win a decisive victory. And what's even more incredible is that we won by a bigger margin in Iowa, but that isn't being considered a win in the same way as this win in New Hampshire. But never mind. It is almost, it was unprecedented for a candidate to win the popular vote in both of those states, not go for it to win the general election. So we're pretty,

feeling pretty good about it back at HQ. And so obviously Nevada is next. You've got a major culinary union there. They are not happy at all with Medicare for all. You look at the polling data from the folks at 538, the average Joe Biden was leading in Nevada, but he has dipped in the past week and a half. Sanders has gone up. So you pretty much have Biden, Sanders and Biden at the top and much further down. You have Buttigieg, Klobuchar and Warren as well. And so how are you going to deal with that whole issue where a lot of unions are not supportive of Medicare for all?

They want to protect those hard fought health care plans. So how are you dealing with that in Nevada? Well, what's important to note is that Bernie Sanders has more union endorsements than any other candidate. As Bernie is known to say, he's walked more picket lines than most people in the race combined, right? So the reality is that there are some people at the culinary union and leadership who are, again, engaged in this conversation that's muddying the waters about what it means to have Medicare for all. But what's important to note, and for anybody who's in a union who's listening, what's important to note is that Medicare for all means that you no longer have to spend all

of the time and resources negotiating for those health care benefits. And those benefits, there is a provision in the transition program that makes sure that any benefits that you negotiated for, that you might have traded some pay or other benefits for, will be grandfathered into any Medicare for all benefit going forward. So you will not lose out on anything. I think there are a lot of people who know that are making pretty disingenuous arguments. But what's really exciting about Nevada is that we are number one with Latino voters. And you see the scrambling that's happening right now in this misinformation campaign exactly because other candidates haven't put in the work to be number one with non-white voters the way that this campaign has done. There's been an incredible investment there, and you can't erase that by

playing some of the rhetorical games that are being played right now. You're also going to deal with the whole issue of how do you pay for it. That came up in the last debate. Senator Sanders still has not actually answered that question. I would fully expect that's going to be a barrage of questions that come up in the Nevada debate before the caucus is there. Is he going to provide a breakdown of how he is going to pay for Medicare for all? Well, I've got to push back against that a little bit because the reality is we are paying twice as much for our health care than every other industrialized country in the world and they are getting free up point of service care in many cases and we are getting still having to pay ten to twenty thousand dollars a year in premiums plus people are paying a thousand to seven thousand dollars in deductibles so you're

paying a high monthly fee that's adding up to $10,000 or $20,000 a year. And there are people who have health care but are not using it because they don't have enough money to pay their deductibles. And moreover, they don't have enough money to pay for the subscription, the co-pays and their subscriptions, that they actually go to the doctor and get filled. So the question that should be asked is of every other moderate in the race, how do we point to the system that we have currently, which is estimated to cost more than the system that we have right now? And how are you going to answer to the tens of thousands of Americans, tens of 40,000 Americans who die every year

because they cannot afford health care? That is the question that has been asked and has answered the question of how we're going to pay Medicare for all over and over and over again. What isn't clear is how we're going to maintain the system, because the answer to that question is it goes in the back of the average American voter. But you just you did what you just just did what a doctor does. They diagnosed the problem, but you did not give a remedy. You laid out what the costs are. You laid out how much we spend. You laid out other countries as

other countries do. But the reality, though, is when you go to a Medicare for all, there's going to be a cost associated with it from the government side. Whether or not you also pay for it when it comes to a tax increase. I understand why there's reluctance to put a number on it, because when Senator Warren did that, she was nailed by folks left and right over the summer. And so again, if you talk about an annual cost, though, do you have a number in terms of what it is going to cost the American taxpayer to fund a Medicare for all? So when we're having a conversation about the budget and where things come from, then we also can say how we actually pay for it. What happened with Elizabeth Warren wasn't that she gave a number

and people beat her over the head for it. It was that she was obfuscating about the fact that it's going to require a small tax increase, something about which Bernie Sanders has been very direct. So again, he said this on the debate stage and in numerous interviews over and over again. Yes, there will be a small tax increase for Medicare for all, but this ultimately is a program that is designed to lower healthcare costs for average Americans. So the small tax increase, and we're reluctant to put a

number on it only because the math is very difficult and we don't want to mislead anybody or have anybody upset in the way that they were after the ADA was implemented, if you recall. And Obama made certain commitments that it ended up not being able to follow through upon. So we're wanting to be really deliberate and considerate about this. But the point of the matter is a small tax increase. Some people, some scientists have estimated about 4%, but it wouldn't start until a higher income bracket. So people paying, I believe, under $30,000 a year would see no increase and it would gradually increase in a progressive fashion, right? So the wealthier you are, the more you're paying. So that instead of paying $10,000, which is the average amount

a single American pays for premium, or $20,000, which is the approximate amount a family pays for premiums, you're paying a few thousand dollars, whatever the percentage of your income about, you know, a small, single-digit tax increase. But ultimately, you're paying less. And again, what you're getting for that is to be able to walk into a hospital, be treated, and walk out. And we can't underemphasize what we're talking about here. When we talk about the maternal mortality rate,

we can sit around and say, we really care about Black women, but you can't say you really care about women dying and babies who are dying if you aren't taking to the fact the number one predictor of the maternal health gap, the racial health gap there, is that Black women aren't able to get prenatal care. They are less likely to be insured. They are more likely to be on Medicaid and get substandard treatment. And they're less likely to get postnatal care. And they're also more likely to have to go right back to work without taking the time they need

to care for themselves and their children. So we want to solve these problems holistically. And it's going to require these kind of universal programs that Bernie Sanders is proposing. But you also said we are reluctant to put a number on it. Then you also talked about what some experts could say that's not specifically coming from the campaign. So, I mean, so, but that's, trust me, that that's going to be an issue that moves forward because, again, as you're talking about it, you're going to have other candidates who do

not agree with Medicare for All, and you do have people who are leery about that. I've got to ask you this question. This is the last question because I have gone to two other campaigns as well, and that is obviously Senator Bernie Sanders does extremely well with young African-American voters, but you look at what is happening with Vice President Joe Biden. He does well with African-Americans who are middle-aged and older. How is Senator Sanders going to make this appeal to older black voters going to South Carolina where African-Americans are likely to make up 60 percent of all voters in the Democratic primary in that state? Well, I'm really heartened to have read recently that we closed the gap in South Carolina already to only five points. So I think that what we have successfully managed to do is make people a little bit more aware of what Joe Biden's record on the issues that Black Americans have said we

care about the most are. And chief among those issues, in addition to health care, which is what we hear door to door, is that Black Americans are disproportionately suffering, as I'm sure you know, from a whole host of health care concerns that are coupled with the economic pressure. And Joe Biden has tried to kind of skate around this, but over and over again, over the course of his career, he has voted to and run on the promise of cutting social security and raising the retirement age, both which would enormously disproportionately affect Black Americans. We know that upward of 90 percent of African-American seniors rely on Social Security for almost all, sorry, 50 percent of

African-American seniors rely on Social Security for 90 percent or more of their entire retirement issue, retirement income. So this isn't an issue that can just be poo-pooed away. And we're seeing that our ground game, our 90% black staff in South Carolina, the fact that the senator has done 60 events in South Carolina already, all of these are making people there much more familiar with him than they were in 2016. And we're already seeing the results. These are both things to earn, not just to count on as a firewall without really doing the work. All right, Breonna Gray, we appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you. Let's turn to Lyncia Johnson.

She's National Director of Public Engagement for the Elizabeth Warren campaign. Lyncia, welcome back to Roller Martin Unfiltered. Hey, Roland. Thanks for having me. New Hampshire, neighboring state of Massachusetts. Your candidate came in fourth last night. She expected to do better.

You're now moving to Nevada as well as South Carolina. How is Senator Warren going to break through when you have in the first two states, they have at the top of being Senator Sanders as well as Pete Buttigieg? You know, I think one of the things that we haven't talked about is that Senator Warren overperformed in Iowa. We had a very strong ground game in Iowa and New Hampshire. And to your point, we are now focused on Nevada and South Carolina. And the bigger point of this is that 98 percent of the electorate has yet to vote. And so I understand the conversation about Iowa and New Hampshire, but we have built a campaign to last.

We have over a thousand staff in 31 states that are ready for Nevada, South Carolina, Super Tuesday and beyond. And so, yes, it was a test. And I think like any other campaign, you win some, you don't do as well as you think in some, and then the next day you get right back to work and continue to move forward. And so we're excited to engage with voters in Nevada and South Carolina, especially states that are really diverse and have a lot of people of color and young people who are energetic about Senator Warren. Yeah, well, you look at the polling data, especially among African-Americans.

She is sort of stuck at a certain place. She's plateaued, if you will. You have a vice president, Joe Biden, at the top among black voters. You see Senator Bernie Sanders gaining steam there, five points down. But also among black voters, you have Tom Steyer, who is now in second place as well. Now, you have, of course, even though Bloomberg is not on the ballot there. And so, you know, the way it's looking right now is that among black voters themselves, she's in fourth place right now. And that's that's like as largely because Buttigieg is at two percent among black voters.

And then you have Amy Klobuchar, who's at point five. What what is she going to do to to rally African-American voters to her side? Of course, she has black women's groups who have endorsed her. She shouted them out. But she's sort of sitting there. What is your plan for her to make a move to win South Carolina or at least come in second or third, as opposed to the fourth place finish like in Iowa and New Hampshire? That's a fair question. I think one of the pieces, though, that we're not talking about is there's still a high percentage of African-American voters who are still, one, undecided. And we also have to think about, too, there are candidates in this race who there's a lot of name recognition and they've been around for longer than Senator Warren has actually even been an elected official. There are some career politicians. We also have, unfortunately, billionaires in this race able to spend over

$100 million on ads and flood networks with ads talking to Black voters. And so we're going to continue to ramp up what we've been doing. We have seen that when she is introduced into communities, when her surrogates, people like Ayanna Pressley, Black Woman 4, D.A. Rachel Rollins, who is one of the most progressive D.A.s and one of only nine Black women D.A.s in the country, when we have these folks, in addition to our high number of credible Black women staff who come from so many different movements talking to folks, we see the needle move because it's an introduction. And so, yes, we're going to continue to double down and meet people where they are. But I think we also have to bring into this conversation

the piece of name recognition. You know, Senator Warren, on a lot of her plans, there's the Working Agenda for Black America. And we are really proud of that plan because it is evolving as we take more insight and get more feedback from community leaders. And we have scored high on a lot of race and equity scorecards when it comes to our plans to improve the lives of Black Americans. And so as we continue to make the case, as I'm heading out to Nevada this week, and then I will be in South Carolina, along with so many of our other campaign staff, in addition to our diverse leadership in both of those states, we're going to continue to make the case and show that she's the best candidate.

But again, I think what we are not talking about is the amount of money and influence of name recognition that is also something for folks to break through. But here's the piece. The reality is she has more name recognition than Pete Buttigieg, more name recognition than Amy Klobuchar. Of course, she led the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau under President Barack Obama, got elected to the United States Senate, has been a national figure for some time. And so, I mean, that's just the reality there. But I also got to ask you this here. One of the areas where she is not doing well is among black men. I was talking to a pollster a couple of months ago who was doing some focus testing groups who said that when her name

came up, the groan that came out was reminiscent of the groan with Hillary Clinton in 2016. I talked to a lot of black men and that's one of the issues there. And so are there black male surrogates who are also vouching for Senator Warren. And how can she connect with those black men? That's also an important category there because, of course, everybody talks about black women. In 2012, there was a nine-point gap between black men and black women who voted Obama over Romney. That went to 13 points in 2016 with Trump. The White House right now, they think they can get as high as 18 or 20 percent of black men What will Elizabeth Warren say for black men to listen to those equity reports?

You're talking about to say why she's a better candidate for them than other people. I Hear that role and absolutely and I think you know to that question of our set of our surrogates we have Frederick Joseph, we have Maurice Mitchell, we have Sheriff Tompkins from Massachusetts, Reverend Culpepper. We just had Darnell Moore and Wade Davis, who are very prominent in the space of intersectional movement building, who are surrogates for Elizabeth Warren. And they are out there stumping for us and talking about issues from criminal justice reform, from black entrepreneurship to health care, to closing the racial wealth gap through student loan debt forgiveness or free two and four year college tuition. A lot of these

plans and how they connect to black men particularly. And we are having more conversations with black men. She will be having many conversations with black men in South Carolina. And so, you know, I understand the question and what people hear. And, you know, there has been a strong focus. I wouldn't just say on our campaign overall, as we talk about the Democratic Party, about black women and how strong our voting block is and how powerful our voice is. But we're not taking black male vote for granted. And we are having those conversations and we look forward to having more of them, especially heading into South Carolina. All right. Alencia Johnson with the Warren campaign was really appreciated. Thanks a lot. Thank you. I want to go to my panel right now. Pam Keith, attorney and activist. We, of course, have a Scott Bolden, chair of National Bar Association Political Action Committee, also via Skype. Adrienne Ermer. She's a fellow with the New Leaders Council in Chicago. First off, folks, we will have

someone from the Pete Buttigieg campaign on the show tomorrow. The reason you have not seen any campaign officials of Vice President Joe Biden or Amy Klobuchar on this show is because I have always had a standard rule, and that is I do not allow any

campaign officials or surrogates on any of my shows until the candidate comes on first. And so Vice President Joe Biden has not been on this show. If you take Pete Buttigieg, I did interview him on the Tom Jordan Morning Show. We played that on this show. And so you have that. That's why we're doing that. And let me say this about Amy Klobuchar. Amy Klobuchar has been going around talking about how she can win in red states when she's polling at point five percent among African-Americans. This is important. Amy Klobuchar and her entire team. You cannot ignore black media and somehow think you're going to also get black votes. We have consistently reached out and called and emailed Amy Klobuchar's campaign, and they have not responded to our request to come on this show.

There are other black journalists and black media folks who have done the exact same thing, and they have absolutely no contact at all with the Klobuchar campaign. And so every single day that Amy Klobuchar does not return our phone calls or emails, I'm going to call her out on this show as well as on social media so she understands that you are not going to run around saying that you can win the nomination and beat Donald Trump if you think that you're going to ignore black people.

Pam Keith, I want to go to you. Let's talk about that because, again, for black folks, it's like we got next. White states, Iowa, New Hampshire, fine, they out of the way. But now you're going to have a much more diverse state in Nevada. You're going to have African-Americans in South Carolina. Then you go to Super Tuesday. The race now changes. And I think that what you're going to see is I think you're going to see, obviously, Senator Bernie Sanders still there.

Biden move up. It's about to be a tough road to hold for Pete Buttigieg and Amy Klobuchar. And to a certain degree, Elizabeth Warren, unless they can do something significant in the next 14 days that speaks to the interests and concerns of black people. I'm not going to disagree with you, but I want to throw in a separate wrinkle, a different wrinkle, based on what the feedback that I'm getting from the folks down in Florida, whom I communicate with most frequently, black folks in Florida. And I cannot tell you the number of people who've told me they're excited about Mike Bloomberg, not because they like him, but because they like what he's doing. Okay, so I want you to hold that. I'm gonna get the Bloomberg in a second. I want to stick with

senators. I want to stick with Sanders, Biden, Buttigieg, and Klobuchar. I got a separate segment on Bloomberg. Go ahead. But I will say this. Bernie has the strongest hand because his supporters are most faithful to him. It's a big difference between being really certain of what you want and being very certain of what you don't want. All of the rest of the field is not Bernie, and all of Bernie's team is Bernie, right? But the rest of the field is now divided between all these different people who bring different things to the table

and have different things to recommend them. But the punditry keeps saying, well, Bernie's really not ahead because there's all these people who don't want him. Yeah, but they're not in agreement. That's just stupid. Yeah, they're just not in agreement on who they do want. First of all, Donald Trump won the Republican primary sky

with around 30, 35% of the vote. It don't matter that he got 30 or 35 and everybody else got 65. Bernie is certainly a movement candidate. In the last three or four presidential elections, movement candidates have certainly been the way to survive and succeed. Barack Obama was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate.

He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. He was a movement candidate. In the last three or four presidential elections, movement candidates have certainly been the way to survive and succeed.

Barack Obama was a movement candidate. Trump was a movement candidate. And Bernie Sanders has the same kind of feel. In fact, many people think in 2016 that Bernie Sanders would have been a better opponent for Donald Trump because he was pulling from the same kind of level of anger, except he was pulling from the Democrats. First of all, that he was pulling from the Democrats. The reality is, though... First of all, that don't mean nothing. If you can't win a nomination, have a discussion, what you could have done in the primary don't mean jack.

It was a side note. I wasn't done yet. No, it's the equivalent of somebody saying, Oh, we could have won a Super Bowl had we gotten there, but hell, you didn't. It wasn't dispositive of my point. My point is, it's all about people of color, black people, black Democrats and brown Democrats now going forward. The real America.

And these candidates who do not connect and don't have a relationship with people of color and their issues, haven't touched them, haven't talked to their issues, to show up over a 14-day period and believe you're going to change the dynamic of black women and black men voting, you're really facing an upstream battle. The reality is this is a two-person race now over the next 14 days, whether you agree or not. And that's Biden and that's Bernie Sanders. And only Bernie Sanders because he's ran so strong in Iowa and New Hampshire. Nobody's giving those victories back. They'd all take them. But they're running hard. One's running hard into the next 14 days. That's Bernie Sanders.

One's running weak, but with a big upside given the diversity of the voters over the next 14 days. So we'll have to see. Adrian, bottom line is this here, and this is real clear. I love these people who keep, and some of the people on social media right now, my YouTube channel, saying, oh, you're defending Hillary. No, Bernie Sanders did not beat Hillary Clinton in 2016. He didn't. Simple as that. He ignored black people. Had he not ignored black people, he could have done better. So here's my whole, all the Bernie bros and brunettes and whatever the hell, get the hell over that shit, okay? It ain't 2016. It's 2020. Focus on the race at hand. And I think, again, what's happening now is the question now for Senator Sanders.

He's won Iowa. Well, actually, somebody won. First of all, I don't even mean shit. They can't even count in Iowa. We still don't actually know today who actually won Iowa. But based upon the last tabulation, he got more of the popular vote, but Blue Judge got more delegates. Gotcha. But the reality is this here. He now has to figure out a way

to cut further into the popularity of Joe Biden among African Americans. He does that. He is in the poll position to win the nomination. No, I would agree with that assessment. I think he's actually made really decent headway with young black voters, particularly under the age of 35. And as millennial and the Gen X and Gen Z generations become larger in number in the electorate than even their baby boomer ancestors, you know, the young vote matters. And his message is absolutely resonating with young people.

I'm an elder millennial myself, being among the first of the millennials born into this world. And his message around college debt, health care, I just I'm a new mom. So health care is a very big deal for me. And making that accessible and affordable is a really huge deal going from now and into the future. And that's something that's resonating with young people. I waited to start a family because in large part due to health care. So I think that when you're talking to young folks who are ultimately going to be, you know, families and have children in the future, it's resonating with them. You know, my granny on another point, he's not resonating so much

with her, but she's not one of those senior citizens who's relying 90 percent on her social security. But see, but that point right there, the reason that is important, because look, and I have said this repeatedly on this show to young voters, you can be excited about Bernie, but your excitement has to translate at the ballot box. Oh, I agree. All black people are going to vote. And I'm and I and I and I just keep and like all these people keep saying, yeah, yeah. But Bernie, I'm like, look, you can be excited about a candidate, but it means nothing if that does not translate. So the question is, are you going to see this surge of young voters in South Carolina? Then comes Super Tuesday where you're talking about Texas and North Carolina

and about a dozen states. I mean, that's the key. If he is able to cause a massive surge among folks 18 to 35, that actually makes up if he doesn't do well among older voters. Absolutely. It's what carried President Obama to the finish line in 2008, the young turnout. I would also say, though, that, you know, I was a volunteer for Bernie in 2016. And to see the difference in sort of his staff and his base of volunteer support today, there is a lot more diversity, particularly from Black and Latinx folks on the campaign trail. Say it again. Say it again. No, no, no. For all these people out here rolling you hating on Bernie,

no, Bernie's leadership was white as hell in 2016. And it has changed. And he wasn't listening to black people. And the black staffers, and I've talked to them, they were frustrated, they were upset, and they were like, say, bro, this is how you could win. But his white staffers didn't know black people, he learned the lessons. All the people keep saying, oh, Hillary, so Senator Sanders learned his lesson after 2016.

And that is I better have black people at the top, the middle and the bottom of my campaign. Surrogates in the field. no he has he's absolutely learned that lesson and there's a lot more people of color um right now even in illinois acting as surrogates on his behalf on the south side of chicago in particular yep um so that's that's heartening to see that he's learned this lesson i mean campaigning is iterative iterative i've been involved in you know dozens of campaigns um in my political lifetime so it is is iterative. I've been involved in dozens of campaigns in my political lifetime. So it is an iterative process, and he is learning quickly. I mean, you have entrenched Democrats to this day who still haven't quite learned the lesson

that you have to employ black people beyond the field on a political campaign if you're trying to win a large coalition-based election. Yeah, black people not trying just to be political sharecroppers. Let me, before I go on, remember I told you about them dumbasses in Iowa who can't vote? Well, guess what? The head of the Iowa Democratic Party, Troy Price, he's quit. He's resigned. That's no shock.

After the debacle in that state, it was embarrassing. He should have quit. I want to finish this round dealing with these candidates here. Again, I think what's about to happen is you're about to see also a shift in what people are talking about. But also, I think what's about to happen is, this is where I'm about to bring in the Bloomberg piece, you're about to also see candidates who have been getting a pass on these issues. You saw it in the last debate when Lindsay Davis, ABC, really challenged Pete Buttigieg on his record there in South Bend.

We played yesterday Sonny Hostin being very aggressive and going after Amy Klobuchar on her record as a district attorney in Minnesota. But the other piece is this here. You know, the Biden campaign, I know that, you know, all these people are gearing up because Mike Bloomberg is going to be on the stage. But here's the piece. These campaigns have not gone after Joe Biden when it comes to the 1994 crime bill to force him to even address that. And so it's been very interesting how folks have been dancing. And so to me, this is going to be a moment, I think, over the next two weeks where an Elizabeth Warren actually has an opportunity to where she could really set herself apart.

Because she can stand over here and go, Pete, you got a problem. Amy, you got a problem. Michael, you got a problem. Joe, you got a problem. Hell, me and Tom Steyer over here, we good. And so, I mean, again, that's gonna be a big issue there, folks. Today, the Mike Bloomberg campaign, they unveil three endorsements of Virgin Islands, Congresswoman Stacy Plaskett, delegate,

also Gregory Meeks of New York, and also Lucy McBath of Georgia. In addition to that, in addition to that, you've also had, he had a meeting today with about 20 black pastors. That was quite interesting. Meeting with them as well at his headquarters there as a part of his faith outreach program. But part of the problem here, and we're going to do this in a minute, we're going to interview somebody who was there, is that I still need to understand, though, he's getting the problem here, and we're going to do this in a minute, we're going to interview somebody that was there, is that I still need to understand, though, he's getting the endorsements, he's dropping the money,

you're seeing the increases in black support. He's still, what I keep telling people is, he's been flying at 30,000 feet. He hasn't been, he has not been dealing with the people. Right. You've got to deal with the people on the ground. Right. Pay on that, Adrienne. Go. The great advantage of Bloomberg being in the position that he

was, is that he could spend all his money on name recognition and attacking Trump because he wasn't actually on the stage with anybody. He wasn't taking any questions. He wasn't being challenged by any of the other candidates. And the truth of the matter is, you're 100% right. Elizabeth Warren has the best story in terms of, I've got the least

downside. She's the one who has the least to apologize for on that entire state. The numbers are in the toilet for black people. No, no, no, no. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold on. First of all, wait your turn. Go ahead. Calm down. Wait your turn, Kappa. Go ahead, Pam. So I think that on that next debate, she's going to have an opportunity to really land punches. And I know she can. So that's the truth. But I also think, and I think this is really important that people understand, is that most black people that I speak to, Roland, don't expect any politician to be 100 percent kosher on race. Especially if it's not a black politician.

Right? They're not. And we don't expect that. So I think that black people actually have more tolerance and have a bigger space for what they will be willing to forgive or talk through or whatever than people actually think. Because I don't think black voters really have the opportunity to engage in cancel culture, especially if they don't have any black candidates of their own. I don't know if they do. But Adrian, I'm going to go to Scott.

But Adrian, I got to look at 2016. And I'm looking at literally the damage that was inflicted upon Hillary Clinton because of the super predators comment. I mean, that was, and so you had significant numbers of middle aged and younger African-Americans who were pissed off. Yes, you had Russian troll farms that did amplify that as well. But there were people and I talked to them who were like, yeah, like that just it resonated so much. And it was a constant drumbeat.

The question that I'm now wondering is, are we going to see over the next three weeks, are you going to see that sort of emphasis on Michael Bloomberg? Because what's interesting, you haven't even seen that sort of emphasis on Joe Biden and the 94 crime bill. And so it's very interesting to me that she made a super predator comment about the 94 crime bill and she was vilified. Yet the dude who wrote the 94 crime bill has essentially gotten a huge pass.

Adrienne. So there's a lot to unpack there. But let's start with the crime bill and sort of that piece around Hillary Clinton. Her adherence to and sticking her ground and sort of digging her feet in and doubling down on her sentiments, I think is what sort of drove the wedge in deeper and continued to dig that grave for her and make it more difficult for young black people in particular who probably have, you know, elder family members, you know, young cousins and brothers and sisters who are in the criminal justice system because of that bill. It's a much more personal, visceral attachment

and connection to a piece of policy, which I think is why it lingered with Hillary for so long. And now as we pivot to the Michael Bloomberg comments, you know, I went, it's so funny, I had just gone to an event to hear him, to hear one of his surrogates speak and to get an endorsement from Congressman Bobby Rush. And Congressman Bobby Rush said, well, you know, Mike, I like Mike because he apologized for stop and frisk. And if we can't apologize for our mistakes and move forward, then what can we do? I apologize for voting for the crime bill, et cetera, because I had people calling my office about the crack epidemic and the gang violence. And I had to do something. Fine. Mike Bloomberg apologized days before launching his presidential campaign, which is disingenuous in and of itself. But let's say we want to create space for somebody to apologize and grow in their future actions.

When this audio resurfaced from not 1994, not 2000, but 2015, four and a half, five years ago, involving language that is viscerally violent to black people and Latinx folks being slammed against a wall. That's, again, that really taps into something super visceral, to a super visceral level for anyone who has had either a direct connection with the carceral system, who has had a negative experience with policing. it hits home and it hits home hard. So when you're talking about the actual individual voter, they're going to perceive that way differently than perhaps somebody who's agreed to endorse him. And, Roland, I think you had it reversed.

He's been giving out the dollars and then getting the endorsements because when people have already committed to make an endorsement, there's been an exchange there, and they won't necessarily reverse on that because they have a self-interest either tied to an organization or some sort of initiative they're trying to launch and dollars that are connected with Mike Bloomberg. But like at the end of the day, we're talking either the endorser or the individual voter. And from an individual voter standpoint, that's a very visceral, visceral reaction that you're going to have to something that was not from 1994, but 2015. Scott, perfect example.

Scott, hold on. Hold on, Scott. Hold on. Hold on. Wait. You just have the Ava DuVernay movie that came out on Netflix dealing with the whole issue of Central Park 5. Not called Exonerated 5. Michael Bloomberg fought that settlement. The only

reason they got a settlement was he got out of the mayor's office and de Blasio was elected. That was in 2014. So, do you believe that once he hits that debate stage, this is no longer running ads, once he hits that debate stage, that he's

going to be questioned. Not, forget the other candidates, but the moderators are probably going to be jamming him up. Not only with that in Nevada, on February 25th, CBS has the CBC debate in Charleston, South Carolina. What then happens when Bloomberg has to answer to those questions? He answers it. If he's a great debater, he's got a great answer.

He's apologized, and he may apologize on stage again. Well, he apologized at A.R. Bernard's. Well, he apologized at A.R. Bernard's. He apologized in December at A.R. Bernard's church. The bottom line is he apologized. Scott, a federal judge ruled it unconstitutional in August of 2013. Yes. He didn't apologize in

14 or 15 or 16 or 17 or 18. And as early as... And as late as January... Wait a minute. As late as January as, and as late as January, and wait a minute, as late as January 2019, he was still defending it. Even when the data,

even when all of his data was proven to be wrong, he was still defending it. You're absolutely right. And he's absolutely wrong to defend it. He's not defending it now. But here's the problem. The core issue,

if stop and frisk is a core issue and you're not going to vote for Bloomberg and instead you're either not going to vote or you're going to vote for somebody that can't win or a Democratic socialist and Trump gets in again, how are you going to feel the day after the general election saying, I stood my ground, you know, Bloomberg could have beat him, but because of stop and frisk, I didn't vote for him. Are we really going to do that? This is not a dispositive issue. It's one dispositive issue in this race for Democrats,

and it'll never stop being that. That's beat Trump. And I got to vote for Bloomberg because he supported the bad policy for Stop and Frist. So be it. He's better than Donald Trump, and that's what's going to be on the mind of the voters, young or young or old? Yeah, he's got to be I've got to agree with my brother litigant over here. I think the reality is that There's nothing that anybody on the democratic side not bloomberg not biden not anybody that has done That is anywhere in the ballpark of embracing the in-your-face clan flavor of the Trump administration and the Trump campaign. Right. So we know black people have bread in the bone when there's an existential threat to us. That's no discussion about stopping.

Bloomberg is not an existential threat to black people. It is not going to determine this election. But it's a real issue. And it just stops you from voting for Bloomberg. No, no, but it's a real issue. It's a real issue. Dr. Kevin Johnson, his founding lead pastor of Dare to Imagine Church in Philadelphia, he was, you can call it BS all you want to, but it's real.

Dr. Johnson, I'm talking right now. I'm talking right now. Dr. Johnson, you were in the meeting today with Michael Bloomberg. How significant was this audio and also his past support of Stop and Frisk, when he met with the faith leaders today in New York? Yeah, we met with him on yesterday. It was a great meeting. Let me just say, I am not a one-issue voter. I was well aware of this particular YouTube clip because I've researched all of the candidates and none of the candidates are perfect.

All of them are flawed. And I knew about this particular audio clip, but that did not discourage me from giving Bloomberg a fair shot. And when I look at what is my number one priority, my number one priority is to make sure that Donald Trump is no longer president of the United States of America. The reality is, is that we all have to make decisions. And I made a strong decision by looking at someone who had the best campaign operations, somebody whose presidential plan aligned with my values and what I believe in. But also, I had to look at some critical issues,

particularly stop and frisk, because that's something that I have been strongly against. I have been out there with so many activists. Al Sharpton, when I was there in New York City, marched with Dr. Calvin Butts. But when I look at the totality of the record, and what I know about what Bloomberg has done at the City and Baptist Church when I served as assistant pastor, and when I look at his record as a whole,

and the fact of the people who are black and brown who are part of his campaign. There is a reason why we need support Michael Bloomberg. I'm telling you, Joe Biden is done. Elizabeth Warren is done. And when we look at this general election, there has to be somebody who's going to go toe to toe, who is going to tell it like it is and who is not going to hold any punches and make sure that Donald Trump is not elected again. We have a critical issue that is before us, and that is getting rid of Donald Trump. And I'm not going to sit up here and to just vote for just anybody, but I'm going to vote for somebody who's going to get the job done. Now, was that meeting with the pastors, first of all, so you've endorsed Mike Bloomberg.

Was yesterday's meeting a group of pastors who have endorsed Bloomberg, or was it just a faith meeting? It was a meeting that was actually called last week. We were reached out to by the campaign, asked to come to meet with Mike Bloomberg. What happened yesterday just happen in real time. We were hearing about everything that was taking place in real time, like everybody else. The video had surfaced, the audio clip had surfaced. And so there were some people who were not on board. There were some people who were on board. I was one of those persons who I needed to, I had read everything about Michael Bloomberg, his plan, et cetera.

Of course, I knew about stop and frisk. That was not an issue that prevented me from going to the meeting. But I actually made a decision at the meeting while everything was breaking loose because I actually heard and met with Michael Bloomberg myself. This is not the first time I've met with him. I've met with him before. But to meet with him under these particular issues and to begin to deal with critical issues that are important to us, I made a decision. And I told the campaign, I said, listen, you're in a battle right now. This is probably going to be the worst day of your campaign today. I said, because of the firestorm, I said, but I'm in. I said, I'm in because I believe in his Greenwood Initiative, $70 billion that are going to be invested in our communities, helping at least one million people become homeowners.

When you begin to look at the totality of what Michael Bloomberg has proposed, Joe Biden hasn't done that. Pete Buttigieg hasn't done that. Elizabeth Warren hasn't done that. And so we can have the debate all that we want. But what I'm very clear about is that Mike Bloomberg is the person who can beat Donald Trump. And Mike Bloomberg is the person who I believe has a plan for black America. So I got to ask you this here. That was that was a statement that was released.

And it said that from the campaign, it said that in response, the African-American faith leaders in the meeting issued the following joint statement. So did all of the pastors in that meeting agree to this particular statement that the campaign released? Look at the statement at the end. All of the pastors whose names are listed, they signed on. So where it says attendees at the meeting included and list all of the intent attendees, all those pastors sat on to that particular statement earlier. All of the pastors who are listed, they went around and asked people, do you want your name? I was actually the one. Let me just be straight with you. I was the one who called for the statement. I was the one who was a part of writing the statement with the communications person for the Michael Bloomberg campaign. And every pastor whose name is listed, they had to

say that they wanted their name listed. This was not the Bloomberg campaign just putting people's names there. Those pastors agreed to have their names listed, and I am one of those persons. And the statement was, go to my iPad, while Donald Trump was calling Mike Bloomberg a racist, Mike was continuing his conversation with African-American clergy from around the country. He expressed regret over his past insensitivity regarding policies like stop and frisk and showed a continued interest in restorative justice. To be clear, none of us believe that Mike Bloomberg is a racist. Actions speak louder than words. And Mike has a long record of fighting for equality, civil rights and criminal justice

reform reform. Pastor Johnson, we certainly appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Thank you, sir. Adrian, I want to go to you. Then I'm gonna go to Scott. So, Adrian. So here's what is interesting, Adrian.

I think when you begin to look, analyze what is happening here, when you look at the, uh, that pastor and these pastors meeting with Mike Bloomberg, when you look at, uh, the, the endorsements he made today, when you look at polling numbers as well, uh, how do you, what do you, what are you hearing? What are you seeing in terms of how people are making their calculations as to whether or not they would even consider Mike Bloomberg as a part of this? Looking at how Joe Biden came in fourth in Iowa, came in fifth in New Hampshire, now has to do well in Nevada. He desperately, of course, last night he actually spoke from South Carolina about the results in New Hampshire. What are you hearing and seeing about Mike Bloomberg?

So I think Pam hit a nail on the head earlier when she said black folks have been conditioned to swallow stuff when they go to the ballot box on the general election day. And that's our history and sort of our interaction with voting in general. The candidate that we always end up undoubtedly at a 90 percent rate voting for has some sort of problematic instance or relationship with racial equity and racial justice. But we swallow it because the alternative is the Klan. And in 2020, it is the Klan, like legitimately. And so what we have as right now is an opportunity in this primary cycle is to say early enough on that, no, somebody who can

very casually use super violent language to describe the unlawful stopping and fristing of black and brown bodies on the streets of New York with a smile on his face. You know, if this is not something, this is not like generic, you know, sterile language around policing. The words themselves were violent and he was easily, you know, taken to the point where he could say these violent words and make these violent and make this violent imagery. That is a very that that that is something that is going to resonate and stick with young people specifically. And anyone who's had any sort of negative interaction with law enforcement and, you know, he can trot out. And what what usually happens when when a candidate makes a gaffe like this or something, services like this, they go and they find Black folks that are going to look at the other aspects of them without drawing attention and really unpacking the violence of the words, okay? And that's what's

problematic for me. That's what really sets me off about, you know, turns me off from a vote for Mike Bloomberg in a primary race. And I think it's going to be the same thing for a lot of voters, honestly. Elderly voters who look to their clergy folk and their pastors for, you know, electoral guidance, perhaps they can, you know, they can not decouple that visceral reaction from what they actually do with the ballot box. But, you know, young folks today where we're seeing, you know, a black and brown body dead at the hands of the police on an almost weekly basis or, you know,

I just don't see this playing well for him in the under 35 range at all. And, Scott, and the point I said yesterday, the point I'll say again today is this here. For all the money Mike Bloomberg has spent, $350 million, he said he'll spend a billion dollars. The critical issue for him is... To get a Democrat elected, he said. The critical issue for him

is can he actually win? I'm looking at polling. I'm looking at 20 and 22 percent. I'm looking at cutting in. But here's the deal. If Mike Bloomberg doesn't win five or six of those states on Super Tuesday, and if he comes in second or third,

you spend a hell of a whole lot of money to come in second and third. He's going to have to actually win. Hold on, Scott. There's no question about that. But he's got the money and he's putting the money behind it. You know, people who are billionaires, when you tell them, well, he spent a lot of money to not win anything,

well, he's got a lot of money to spend on it, and that's his choice, basically. No, no, no, no, no. I'm not questioning how you spend your money, but what I'm saying is you can spend a lot of money, but he also has to win. He certainly does. He's got to win. But I tell you what, he's not going to lose over this stop-and-frisk issue because if he gets the nomination, how many Democrats out here are not going to vote for him

See, here's the problem right there. You're jumping to the nomination what the argument I'm making is I agreed with you no no no no no wait wait but here's my point when I say he has to win some states you're saying it's not gonna be over stopping frisk here's the problem this issue can keep him from getting 10 or 15 or 20,000 votes. And in a fractured race, 10 to 20,000 votes matters. Black people care about stopping frisk. Listen, I've been abused by the police. I'm a former prosecutor, and I'm a criminal defense lawyer. Stopping frisk is not going to stop me and my circle of friends from voting for somebody.

That's you. How old are you? You can't speak for all the young people. No, but I'm asking how old are you? I'm 57. And that's my point. And what I'm saying is this here. If young people want to stop it, but don't want to vote for him. No, no, I'm telling you, Pam, get over it.

If you look at, first of all, pull the graphic up from last night in New Hampshire. Pull the graphic up in New Hampshire. Pull the graphic up, okay? Because what I'm trying to say is this here. By the way, the Democratic Party is far more moderate and conservative than the media. Like you, make out. First of all, I know about the Democratic Party.

Hold on one second. Are you talking about individual voters of the Democratic Party? But I want to show something. I want to show something. Guys, pull the graphic up because I need people to understand what's happening here. If you analyze the last six or seven Democratic primaries,

if you look at the last one, if you look at 2016, there were really two. Martin O'Malley didn't count. It wasn't three. It was two. If you go back to 2008, folks, by the time Iowa

hit, it was only three. It was Obama, Hillary, and John Edwards. Okay? So now, so the race where, and I keep saying this, that you have to look at is 1992. When you had five or six candidates, you had Bill Clinton, Bob Kerry, Tom Harkin, Jerry Brown. You had Paul Songhus, and there's one person I'm leaving out. And what happened there was Bill Clinton did not win his first state until the sixth primary. He then lost seven straight before he won South Carolina, and I think it was like Wyoming. Okay, so he only won three out of the first 14. So what I'm saying is, when you look at right now,

10 or 15 or 20,000 votes can make a huge difference between first and fourth. Absolutely. So Paul's number's up. You look at their Bernie Sanders. What's that, 75,000 in New Hampshire? Almost 76. Pete Buttigieg, 72.

You have Amy Klobuchar, 58. So 58 and Sanders, that's some 20,000 votes. What I'm saying, Pam, is if you're Bloomberg and this can be an issue that will keep a certain segment from not voting for you, which will be the difference between you coming in first, like Sanders, and coming in third, like Klobuchar. Go ahead. Right. I just want to make a couple quick points. First of all, one of the reasons that Hillary got so badly damaged by that super predator comment

is because, A, she didn't respond quickly enough to it. B, it was multiplied by all these right-wing bots. And then, C, she's a woman. Let's not forget that when women say things or do things that seem to be denigrating of men, it takes on a whole different patina. The thing that Mike Bloomberg is going to have going for him in addressing all of this is he is a guy and he has a whole lot of money. And that whole lot of money allows for him to reset the programming with a lot of people because it's just a repetition thing. But I want to say this, there are two approaches here that we as black folks are going to be weighing as to how to win.

There's the old school way, which is actually Bernie's way because that's how black people got anything back in the day-to-day. We didn't have the money, so all we had was movement. We had churches and we had grassroots. That's how we got stuff done. And it worked for us back then, but our community has become more fragmented.

It's become less centralized around church. It's more sophisticated. And it's for us back then. But our community has become more fragmented. It's become less centralized around church. It's more sophisticated. And it's also become more sophisticated. And so now we see that the way to victory and the way to get anything is through money. And what is happening with the Bloomberg thing is that people are starting to say to themselves, I want to fight fire with fire. If Trump is rich and ruthless, then I want my own flavor of rich and ruthless. And that's kind of the dynamic that's going on. Their own form of political gangsterism.

Exactly. Personally, everybody who knows me knows I'm a progressive. I do believe policy matters. If Bloomberg becomes president, am I going to have to work really hard to get him to where I want him to be? Yes. But the bottom line is this. You have two horses approaching this in two different ways, and either one of them could work. And it's just a question of— I don't think a socialist could beat Trump. But what the socialist has is the votes to win primaries. Right. Like, that's what he has.

And that is the point. Even so, if he's a nominee, I'm going to tell you, the Democrats are sold out. I don't agree. I totally don't agree with that. I don't agree with that. I don't agree with that. You think a Democratic Socialist could beat Donald Trump? I think a Brillo pad could beat Donald Trump. Absolutely.

All right, they're going to hang. You know what? You're a Socialist, Brillo pad. You know what? We're going to have another four years of Donald Trump. And Adrian, for everything that Scott is saying, for everything that James Carver is saying. It makes sense.

It's thoughtful analysis. That means sense. Here's a piece. It's thoughtful analysis. Here's a piece. That means nothing. Bernie has to vote. Your thoughtful analysis means nothing because, Adrian, it's about winning. Exactly.

It's about can you get your people out. And I keep saying, again, I still fundamentally believe, and I'll say this right now, and, Adrian, I want to get your thoughts on this if joe biden finishes second in nevada okay well and then here's a piece right now if you look at existing polling data sanders is at around 30 biden's around 27 buddha judge is like around 16 and then warren is below warren is like like right below him and then you got Klobuchar. So that's like a 10, 12 point gap.

Here's what the deal is going to be happening. If Joe Biden wins, comes in second in Nevada and wins South Carolina, this entire conversation changes. It changes because the person who last won actually also is like, oh my goodness, they're back.

Your thoughts? No, I agree. It's going to take more than four states to determine who's going to be really on the path to the nomination. I mean, with all the people that we have in this race, for one, and how splintered current voters on the Democratic side are with all of these choices on their ballot. You know, they're relying on the performance of the debate two nights and one night before that primary to make their decision. That's how Amy Klobuchar had this windfall in New Hampshire. And she's not even a consistent debate performer. Are we forgetting my friend? I mean, her name is. Thank you.

I mean, like this is what our voters are going. A lot of voters are going through leading into a primary ballot casting. So it's not like two states aren't enough. Four states aren't enough. A lot of voters are going through leading into a primary ballot casting. So it's not like two states aren't enough, four states aren't enough. Maybe after the end of Super Tuesday, we can really start having real conversations. But like the analysis on CNN is saying, oh, you know, Bernie has skyrocketed to a 5.5 percent chance, 5.5 out of 10 chance to win the nomination. And Amy Klobuchar went from 0.1 to 0.5. This is a huge leap for someone like Amy. But I'm like, no, because she's polling at basically 0% with black voters. I mean, we don't have enough data to rely on currently to start making these sorts of projections. But at the end of the day, if the DNC believes in their process,

right, and they believe that the nomination should be determined by elections and who wins the most delegates, we cannot then go to a convention and broker that and give it to somebody who did not win the majority

of the delegates. That will be catastrophic for its outcome and turnout, despite how terribly awful Donald Trump is. Here's Scott Boland. No, you got to go. You certainly can. Hold on, Scott. Scott, she knows that you can. She's saying it's going to be crazy if you do. Here's the piece here. Here's the piece here. This is why, and this is why, unlike these other people out here, unlike these nuts I keep seeing on CNN and MSNBC and the rest of these networks.

They're good people. No, no, no, they're nuts. Just like all these nuts who are hardcore Democrats who are losing their damn mind, here's the deal. These are the states voting on March 3rd. Alabama, Arkansas, Colorado, Georgia, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas, Vermont, Virginia. That's a lot of votes. It's 11 states. By that time,

by that time, you would have already had Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, South Carolina. That means on March 4th, 15 states would have voted. What I keep saying is Democrats, and let me say this unfiltered, calm the

fuck down and wait until March 4th. Say that on the internet? My shit is called unfiltered. Yes, I can. I'm like calm the fuck down and just breathe and just be patient and wait till March 4th and then

it's like, okay, now I can assess, okay, who's done well, who's done well. I got 35 more states plus the folks in Guam

who are also voting. But all of this, oh my God, Sanders, he's a socialist. Oh my God, Bloomberg, he's a socialist. Oh, my God, Bloomberg is buying it. And I'm like, yo, calm your asses down. But I ain't no calm-ass guy because he got to go.

Okay. So you remind me, before we had the Iowa caucuses, three, six months into the campaign, either these Democratic nominees, Rowley was saying the same thing. We haven't even voted yet, and you all calmed the F down.

It's not over. You're absolutely right about it. I think the debate is interesting. I think the analysis is thoughtful, and nobody's wrong

about any of this, quite frankly. But in the end, when the rubber meets the road, you know, do you connect with the voters? Do you get the votes out to the polling?

And either you win or you don't. Excuses go home, and bad candidates go home. Yes. Amen. Thanks, everybody. We'll be back. Roland Martin Unfiltered, man. Thank you, Roland.

Hold on, Adrian. Stay right there. Why you let us stay there? All right, guys, go. You want to check out Roland Martin Unfiltered? YouTube.com forward slash Roland S. Martin. Subscribe to our YouTube channel. All right, guys, go. And don't forget to turn on your notifications so when we go live, you'll know it. Whatever the white man has done, we have done and done better. Educator Mary McLeod Bethune.

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Trust me. So if you're looking to develop your leadership skills, this is exactly what it is that you want to do. Okay. I'm telling you, these people are killing me when it comes to all this crazy politics. They just need to really calm down. Okay? And just wait. Just wait. It's like, y'all

will be okay. The Student Bar Protection Center, a watchdog group, says that loan companies are charging higher rates to graduates of historically black colleges. For comparison, NYU's loan interest rate is 16.34 percent APR, while Howard University's is 21.29, and New Mexico State is 19.23. Of course, Howard is mostly black, and New Mexico State is mostly Hispanic23. Of course, Howard is mostly black, and New Mexico State is mostly Hispanic. Adrienne, you still there?

Yeah, I'm here. Okay, so I'm going to go to you, then I'm going to come to Pam here. Here's why this, that this is what I think people don't understand. We talk about credit all the time. I have John Hope Bryant, founder of Operation Hope. He always talks about you never seeing a ride

in a neighborhood with a credit score of 700 or higher. When you look at that interest rate, that is largely a result of bad credit. And what happens is when you talk about those interest rates, that can be applied to houses, to car loans, and we can go all down the line. And this is also the point that I keep making to people, while we have to understand this system that is in this country of how these credit agencies and the algorithm that they use determines so much because if you are a white student and you're going to NYU and you're paying 16.34% and Howard is five points higher, that translates into a significant more

debt uh down the road and and i'll just use an example i remember when i when i filed for bankruptcy it was crazy because i didn't realize that when you file for bankruptcy i you know i'm i never filed before so you you i'm thinking you pay you have to pay back what you owe on the car. No, no, no, no, no. You pay back what the blue book value is. And I sat there and went, wow, I think I had owed something like $16,000 on the car, and the blue book value was around $9,000. That's what I had to pay off, and the $16,000 was because of that interest rate. Interest rate.

And that's where race plays a role in this whole deal. That's why this is important. Yeah, yes, it is. And I think it's, you know, I love the technology industry for how they're disrupting sort of business as usual, but they don't realize that when you've got a whole bunch of folks doing tech in the background and they're mostly white men, that there are going to be blind spots in the backgr white men, um, that they' spots in the way they bui

right? If you're, if you' to determine credit worth a university, they're pro okay, well, where, what k get? What is the average, that they get coming out and their ability to pay this back. But they're looking at data that's already implicitly biased, right? Because when I go and apply for a job, you know, I've got

MIT on my resume. That's something I worked very hard for, but that speaks louder to a potential employer typically than, and unfortunately more than what somebody from a Howard or a Hampton would have, someone with Howard or Hampton on their resume, that would change their experience, right? So these are the blind spots in these algorithms that they are not noticing because most of the folks in this financial tech industry are white. And we just, I like that and I'm glad

that we have watchdog agencies that are looking and constantly measuring bias and holding accountable financial institutions and technology that has these blind spots so that they can be better players in this space. And they're not going to continue to amplify the harms that have been perpetrated by sort of contemporary financial institutions. Pam, this is why data is important. If you don't have the data and you're unable to study the data, then you can't discover things like this. Exactly right. And I also think that it's more than just data.

It has to be a cadre of people who are actually committed to these issues and know where to look. It's a matter of expertise and it's a matter of interest. And the way that we in America police our institutions and our systems is through the private rights of individuals to sue when something goes sideways or is fundamentally discriminatory or unfair. Right. We have what we call private attorneys general where you can go under a statute and say I'm suing you because your facially neutral policy actually has a disparate impact on people who look like me or people from a certain zip code or people from a certain age or so on and so it's really important that you get the tools and the information to bring those kinds of lawsuits because you can bring it but you're not going to win unless you got

data to back you up right and so that's why i think it's really important that we have this kind of aggregate information to bring into play and see this this agent right here is see this is why i was so critical of james carville this weekend when he was all over msnbc and all these networks touting mich Bennett, who, by the way, dropped out last night, who got who had less black support to even Amy Klobuchar. And hell, that's damn near impossible because all of these these these these Democrats who think that free college tuition is this pipe dream, but they don't understand it's a bunch of broke-ass white people, okay,

who are sitting there going, how's my kid gonna be able to go to school? And so this notion that that idea is just Pollyanna as he kept using it, I think it's where it's wrong. Because if you're at, and what I keep saying, and he actually was talking about how black folks are not going to buy into it.

I'm like, dude, black people have the highest student loan debt. You damn right we're going to buy into that. Thanks for the people in the back. Yo, and I'm just sitting here going, yo, James, you're the one who lives in a mansion in Louisiana with Mary, and you made a whole bunch of money. But guess what? It's a bunch of broke-ass white people in Louisiana, his home state, who are sitting there going, you know what? Ain't a bad idea.

And let me just go ahead. Oh, my God. this is this is why it pains me when i listen to white people talk about things as if it didn't happen to white people yeah i just said for you the nyu is long interest rate is 16.34 percent adrian the number of people who have no clue that in the 30s 40s and 50s they could go to city colleges in new york city for free for free you had whole generations of white people in america who went to college for free who then were able to go work in corporate America and work in government who didn't have debt who were able to then buy homes and guess what if they didn't have student loan debt that means

their credit report wasn't screwed up which then meant they can get a much better loan at better interest rates when it came to buying their home. But this whole notion that, oh my God, this is crazy, when literally that was policy in America. Adrienne, hold on, Adrienne. No, you're absolutely right. My grandfather told me he went to college for the round lump sum of $2,000 after he did his tour in the military during the Korean War. And to hear that number, $2,000 for a whole entire college degree, right? Meanwhile, I'm going to be paying probably well into my 50s or 60s for my undergraduate degree.

That's not even counting my CUNY master's degree, to which I still have $12,000 in debt for, right? And so this is what literally keeps young people from making families, from buying homes, from buying new cars, right? And what economists would say making large life purchases, which really have a larger reverberating impact in the in the economy as a whole. Right. And it's also going to be probably the next bubble that bursts. Is this college loan? Yes. It's at one1.5 trillion. Yes. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And then we also have really bad actors in this space, like these proprietary for-profit institutions who literally swallow federal dollars for tuition for people who have no business

or who don't have the proper prerequisites and training to be in certain programs. So they literally take out the tens of thousands of dollars in loans on degrees they will never be able to use because they probably won't finish the degree. But Pam, I got to read this here. I got to read this here. Okay. This is for political fact, political fact, Pam. Okay. Cause they were fact checking something Bernie Sanders said. Okay. Go to my iPad. For example, California offered free tuition to in-state students until the 1970s, although it charged an incidental fee starting in 1921. Baruch College in New York was founded

in 1847 as the Free Academy. That's my alma mater. The first free public institution of higher education in the nation, according to the college, which is now part of the city university system of New York. At least some students were paying by the early 20th century and 1976 marked the end of any tuition free policy. Your state at the University of Florida, a school catalog from 1905-06 stated, quote, no tuition is charged to students whose home is in Florida. All other students will be required to pay a tuition fee of $20 per year. According to Roger L. Geiger, public higher education was often free

when a very small percentage of students attended. And then he went on in Vermont. In Vermont, to your point, the senior class tuition in the 19th century, the University of Vermont, was $8.34. So, Pam, America has its history, but here's the thing here. When Florida allowed free tuition, we couldn't go. When California had free tuition, we couldn't go. When New York City had free tuition, a few of us't go. Right. When California had free tuition, we couldn't go.

When New York City had free tuition, a few of us could go. So, I mean, I think you hit on a really important topic is that for those in those early years, higher education was for a tiny, minuscule percentage of the population. We had this massive industrial and agricultural economy, where the overwhelming majority of people, they're living off the land or in some factory. And higher education was really reserved for these very elite few. And so the legislation around that reflected that these were the wealthy people who were educating their own kids. And then when we started to democratize education, of course, that GOP instinct, that Republican instinct was, I don't want my money paying for other people's education. And so that's when we started. Who looked more black and brown. Who looked more black and brown, but also just look like poor white people.

Right. And also look like immigrants. And just, you know, so it's Jews. Well, no, they were immigrants. But when they got here, they stopped being immigrants. But the bottom bottom line it was more of us who all of a sudden came in and like now we ain't paying for y'all right and that is fundamentally what is that base and this is one of the things i didn't get to chime in on earlier that you were talking about how are you going to pay for medicare for all and i keep saying to what what a cheap question it is in a certain

way because we don't ask how do we pay for uh pharma ceos golden parachutes right we don't ask how do we pay we don't ask no no no no no that's two separate things here because the first one when you say paying for a pharma ceo first of all you're talking about a there's a difference between what is a what is a private company in the federal government the reason here's the piece i ask on this show how in the federal government. The reason, here's the piece, I ask on this show, how in the hell are we paying for the $30 billion Trump has given to them largely white farmers

because of his terrorist deal? The $22 billion that we paid for the loan bailout, for the trillions that we're now paying for Pentagon, I'm saying that the reason it's a valid question is because you do have to have an honest discussion about, OK, to pay for this. Where is it coming from? Yeah. But what I'm saying is that the underlying assumptions of a capitalistic structure around health care that is baked into literally every single solitary micron of that system from the bed,

the sheets, the nurses, the sheets, the nurses, the doctors, the education, the medication, everything, right? We've built in a capitalistic for-profit, right? And what we're saying is when we say a system of universal health coverage, we're saying not only are we going to change that to a certain extent, but more importantly, what we are doing in making it Medicare for all is that the profit side of a lot of these sort of administrative institutionality of health care goes away. The cost of a lot of underpaid over underused. I get it. All of that goes away. I get it. Bake that into it. I get it. But you but the reason you have to the reason you still have to deal with the number and the last debate

it came up is that we're also talking about. And the one thing that's kryptonite, Adrian, to any discussion in America about public policy are jobs. And Bernie Sanders was challenged on that. OK, what then do you do with the hundreds of thousands of people who work for health care companies? Right. And what then happens to those people in those jobs and so but you still have to deal with because you when I asked Brianna the question you heard her say well you know the reason we don't really want to put a number on it no it's not the real no no no no the real deal the reason you don't want to put a number on it is because it is so large, it's a scary number.

And the problem with that, you don't want to scare the voters. And what Senator Sanders is doing, and look, like it or not, Senator Warren made the biggest mistake when she put a number on it. Yeah, but here's the problem that I have, is that we're comparing a number that somebody puts out against an entire economy that you would never put a number on. We don't have a number for what we spend on health care now because we don't have a number for all the bankruptcies and all the consequences and everything else. But we don't have a number for that. But once you go to a Medicare for all or a free tuition, you're now dealing with government. You do have to deal with that. You have to do it.

Because when you say free tuition, right now our education is really a state deal. It's not a federal deal. It's a state deal. So now when you say free tuition, somebody has to say who gets the bill. Well, so I think there are innovative ways that we can shift money around where we're not leaving people destitute. So, for example, if we shift to Medicare for All and we have these large insurance companies full of people who have to say no to sick people because they don't want to pay for it, they can then become government employees and help administrate the Medicare for All program. Or they can go and become medical billers and coders and work in hospital administration

for all of the influx of people who can now actually have real healthcare instead of utilizing emergency rooms for things like physicals. But you have to talk about it, because here's the deal. If I work in a state and there are 30,000 people who work for health care companies

and then that state has 50,000 and that state has 30,000, guess what? Those are voters. And those people are sitting there going, oh, shit, hold up. Medicare for all? Am I going to have a job

if he or she gets elected? And that's real. I mean, so we can talk about costs, which, look, I had to file for bankruptcy because my appendix ruptured in 2000 at the Democratic National Convention on the night Al Gore took the nomination and led to nearly $100,000 in health care costs,

did not have insurance. I know exactly what I'm talking about here. But I'm also looking at people who are voters who are sitting here saying, I don't know about that because, hold up, I got a family, I got kids. Is my job going to be in jeopardy? Yo, I ain't sitting here.

I'm down for that. And so it's real. I'm just acknowledging the reality of hundreds of thousands of people who are going to vote on this issue. Yeah, but they're also not all going to lose their jobs. I don't think anywhere. What I do think is they're doing a bad job of is telling the story about all of these workers and what their potential future.

Because they're not telling the story. That's the problem. Nobody's talking about getting rid of private health care at all. No one's talking about getting rid of private health care at like in totality what what we're talking about is making the government the largest purchaser in this space so that we can cost control and it doesn't become something that's like and that and that we can increase access so that people are getting actual health care um and access to preventative health care and not simply using utilizing the emergency room as their primary care physician so folks folks, it's not about doing away

with private insurance altogether because let's be clear, Baker McKenzie, Goldman Sachs, Northern Trust, they're not going to let their employees have Medicare for all. No, they're going to purchase private employment employer health care for their employees

because they deserve Cadillac health care. But there's one thing I want. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Remember, we were talking about college tuition. I still believe when we're talking about this here, we have to also factor in how our system is set up. And school tuition is not a federal deal. They're set up as state institutions. So now you, so when you still say free tuition for all, you still also have to deal with how do you fund that? Of course you do. But I, but the bottom, I think the important thing is always thinking about this as trade-offs,

right? Because you're right in a, in a federalist system where every state funds its own state institutions, but still, it's huge numbers of students who attend those universities on federal dollars, be they Pell Grants or loans or whatever else. So the federal government plays in that space by funding the kid who gives them the money to actually go. But doesn't fund all of it, yes. That's a mechanism that's already in place and that can be expanded. But I want to make one last point. Every time that we talk about how much is it going to cost,

we always say, how much is it going to cost in dollars, in money? And what we don't ever ask is, how much is it going to cost in lives? Because every other plan besides Medicare for All or everybody getting covered is a certain percentage are going to die because they're not covered. And we don't ask them, OK, so what number of dead Americans is OK with you? Is it, you know, under Joe Biden's plan? Is it 13 million or 30 million or 20 million or whatever? But if you start from a position of empathy and love for your fellow man, the answer to that question should always be zero it is the number that is okay for me in terms of dead Americans who could have been alive because if they had insurance is zero but I'm and

we don't ever put it that way and I think but we also still have to deal with this and that's the and that's the point but in his deal we can have the most intellectual discussion or whatever, but this is what we're dealing with. We are dealing with a capitalistic system. We're dealing with a country that is not my backyard. How does it impact and affect me? That's what it is.

And we have to understand that's what I'm also dealing with. And so when i'm having to talk to somebody about something i'm fat i'm looking at everybody's not going to be some university professor who was sitting here having an intellectual conversation who could pull out some charts and break these things down average person in this country is not thinking that way and that's what i'm saying you have to factor that in which is why unions are so against Medicare for all because the unions are like look and we saw how long it took to get the Affordable Care Act well look hey hey

hey you know what y'all that you can because at the Congressional Black Caucus found a pack their African American Leadership Summit, Lee Saunders sat on that stage, who was the president of AFSCME, the American Federation of State, County, Municipal Employees. And he was like, hey, we can have this conversation, but we can do both. What he was saying is,

if people cool with the existing health plan, that's fine, and then you can have this option. And because you know why? He represents American Federation of state, county, municipal employees. Guess what? Those are people who work for county, state, federal. So people have interest in all of this. And the problem is acting as if they don't have interest. And that's why I'm saying when I listen to these candidates and how they are talking about these issues, they're not

actually dealing with that. Because also, as somebody who has covered city government, who has covered county government, who has covered state government, who has covered federal government, people have also realized, yes, all of this attention is lavished on the presidential race. But the reality is here. Right. That is not where most of the sausage is made. And so you still are going to have to contend with what happens on the state levels, which is why what I think the candidates should be doing is saying, OK, let's examine what Tennessee did when it came to free tuition and how that has gone. How many people have actually been helped?

How many folks have been assisted? That's why let's look at these other different states as opposed to acting as if, no, no, what? We're not going to discuss any details. We're going to just focus on the idea. No. You got to go details too. No, and see that i actually

disagree with that when you talk about a presidential election because what you're really talking about is electing somebody who's giving you a vision of a direction in which to go because you're absolutely right your previous point was 100 correct all of the sausage making gets done at the state house and at the at the congressional level where they actually make legislation but you when you are voting for a president, you are voting for a directional leader. You're saying, I want this vision to come to pass, and we're going to roll in this direction.

So no, I do not actually need every micron and atom of their detail. I need to know where they want to go. Is that someplace I actually want to land? No one that I may never get there. Yeah, but the reality, Adrienne, is this here. You can say all of that, but you're still dealing with federal rights and states' rights.

And so you can vote for whatever vision you want to from the president. It doesn't mean it's going to actually happen in your state because they don't have all power over the country. Agreed. Oh, yeah, we learned that with the implementation of the ACA when states like Kentucky refuse to expand access. I mean, like, so, like, Pam is right in that, you know, we do look at a precedent to set a vision and sort of steer the Titanic in a direction where we think we can be in agreement with and will make us our day-to-day lived lives better. And knowing full well that everything that they campaign on may not be feasible, may not actually be able to be done legislatively in four or eight years.

But we need to have sort of this existential philosophical ideals to latch onto because the alternative is the KKK right now. We do eventually want to live in a country where even though we're a capitalist society, empathy matters. And Pam was hitting the nail on the head. If we measured this in lives, the conversation would be a whole lot different on the congressional floor because no congressman wants to be caught on camera saying oh these 30 000 lives don't matter except for the fact that they pretty much do say that when you're talking about you're talking about public policy and so uh as i said folks you have um the nevada debate taking place uh february 19th um i don't know what no i think i think i think nbc has that one but the february

25th debate is going to be in chareston, South Carolina by the Congressional Black Caucus Institute. We'll be broadcasting from there on that night as well. And so looking forward to that. I want to thank our panel. All right, folks, if you want to support Roller Martin Unfiltered, go to RollerMartinUnfiltered.com. Be sure to join our Bring the Funk fan club. You can, of course, support us via Cash App, PayPal and Square. Why is that important? Because that keeps us being independent, black on, where we can say what we want to say and don't have anybody else telling us what to do and what to cover.

And so go to RolandMartinUnfiltered.com for that. All right, folks, I'll see you tomorrow. Holla! I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future

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