#RolandMartinUnfiltered - The System Rejects Idea Of Justice For Black People: Day Of Outrage Planned For Atatiana Jefferson

Starting point is 00:00:00 This is an iHeart Podcast. by going to RolandMartinUnfiltered.com. You can make this possible. That brings us to the tragic case of Atiana Jefferson. Of course, the black woman who was shot and killed by a former Fort Worth police officer as she played video games with her nephew. In cities around the country, they're planning a day of outrage next week to protest her killing inside of her own home. Joining me right now to talk about this is Tamika Mallory.

Starting point is 00:00:43 Of course, she is longtime co-president of the Women's March and civil rights attorney, Lee Merritt. First off, Lee Merritt, first off, Tamika, why is this day important? Why this day of outrage on behalf of Autiana Jefferson? Well, first of all, thank you so much for having me on. And I apologize for the noise in the background. I'm getting ready to run to a panel at the Revolt Summit. I think the day of outrage is important because people expect us to sort of go on to business as usual. You know, the killing of a black man or woman has become so normal to America that, you know, we only focus on it for a short period of time. And when you have something, you know, when you have an arrest, as you had with Officer Dean or former Officer Dean, the man who murdered Tatiana, what happens with an arrest and him being charged

Starting point is 00:01:35 is that people feel like there's some form of justice and they don't necessarily need to pay attention. But that couldn't be further from the truth. We know, Roland, from being in this, obviously you longer than me, but me for 25 years, that the idea of justice is something that is a long struggle. It's something that we have to keep our eyes on the prize and be consistent and committed to for the long haul because the system constantly rejects the idea of justice when it comes to black people, but particularly black women. And that is the larger point here. Even when fighting the case there in Fort Worth, which we are going to say and be a part of,

Starting point is 00:02:16 but when we think about when black women are killed by police officers or killed in any type of violence situation, we do not, this country does not treat it in the same way with the same type of outrage as we have with our fallen brothers like Mike Brown and Trayvon Martin and even young Tamir Rice. And the list goes on and on. We don't have the same amount of uprising. With Sandra Bland, we did, even though that situation was, you know, really one that really hurt our people and hurt folks in general. And we believe that the Justice and Sandra Bland situation still has never really been realized. But we did not see a major uprising in the way that it should be.

Starting point is 00:02:58 So for our Tatiana Jefferson, we're not going to let that happen. For her and for all the other women who've been killed, particularly at the hands of police brutality and police abuse. We will stand up and stand firm for Tatiana on Monday. And we're asking everyone go to until freedom, until freedom, that's U-N-T-I-L, freedom on Instagram, on Facebook, wherever you, all social media platforms, and get the information that you need about where to connect with someone in your city. And it's not too late. If there's not a city that you can connect with, you can organize your own rally. 530 Eastern Standard Time all across the country.. Over 25 cities have signed up. All right, Tamika Merritt, I know you have to go to your pound.

Starting point is 00:03:50 We surely appreciate you joining us. Thank you so very much. Thank you for having me, Roland. I want to go to Lee Merritt now. Lee, first of all, we know there was some drama there in Fort Worth when it came to the burial of Artiella Jefferson. Did everything go smoothly with her funeral? It did. It was a beautiful service, and the family was able to come together. And I think it highlights the importance of this day of outrage. It's really to refocus the

Starting point is 00:04:13 community on the common enemy, which is the system that is rampant with brutality and lack of accountability. And a lot of people were deeply engaged in this case until the family drama began to play out in the public and a lot of people began to drift away. It is important that we take this moment and do what we can to change the culture of policing. This day of outrage, how does the family feel about the focus on the death of Auton and Jefferson with these events? Well, the family is, and I can say both sides because we know that this is a family that has expressed sort of different views on some personal things. But both sides of the family are deeply committed to accountability, not only for this police officer, but accountability for the city of Fort Worth, the Fort Worth PD.

Starting point is 00:05:06 And they realize that it exists in a greater conversation throughout the nation, that they are now, as is often said, a part of a fraternity or an association with folks all around the country, a group that no one has ever asked to be a part of, but who have lost loved ones to police brutality, that 1,100 people a year who suffer from the loss of a loved one as a result of brutality, making our country one of the deadliest for police brutality in the modern world. So, Tatiana's family are focused, and they're hoping that the world will be focused on a just outcome in this case and a change in policing in general. All right. Well, Lee Merritt, we really appreciate you joining us. Thank you so very much.

Starting point is 00:05:59 Thank you. We've got our panel here. I want to start with you, CJ. When we talk about this day of outrage, this case speaks to horrible training. It speaks to bad policing. And I think such days are important because we have to question exactly what is happening with these cops. There is no reason this woman should have been shot and killed in her own home with cops and essentially sneaking around her home not even identifying themselves well I think it is a tragic situation that took place I think there needs to be more police accountability as around training but it's also in a tough spot as well. You know, I do have members of my family that served.

Starting point is 00:06:47 And it's that unknown factor when you go into a situation, you don't have the details, you don't have the information. And, you know, you're running on adrenaline hoping that, okay, it's them, not me. So I'm hoping that Congress, as well as the governor of the state of Texas, really come in and have a serious conversation, ask for some data. The police chief down there, she's a wonderful woman. And I think if everybody comes together, not just the community, but law enforcement and our elected officials, I think they can get some proper answers. This is, Dr. Carter, something that's critically important, that any time these happen, police departments across the country should be assessing their strategy in terms of what is going on with training in these departments. Absolutely, and I think in this particular case, I think the thing that causes most people dismay is not whether these officers should have been concerned because the neighbor called a non-emergency number and called in a wellness check.

Starting point is 00:07:53 And I have family who are police officers past and present. Several members of my family are police officers. And the thing is, when you have a non-emergent situation and you have them approach the home the way they did, as we could see from the police cam, right, from their own body cam footage, they didn't announce themselves, they didn't knock on the door, they were going around her house in the dark at that time of morning. The neighbor called in the non-emergency number,

Starting point is 00:08:18 I think precisely because he did not want them to come to the house with guns blazing. If he thought it was an emergent issue, he probably would have dialed 911, and he's even expressed as much. not want them to come to the house with guns blazing. If he thought it was an emergent issue, he probably would have dialed 911. And he's even expressed as much. And so I think this idea that police get a pass because they took a dangerous job,

Starting point is 00:08:33 they volunteered for a dangerous job, and therefore get a pass to shoot anyone who looks suspicious or may be dangerous is a problem, especially in a place like Texas where most people have guns in their homes, Texas where most people have guns in their homes, or lots of people have guns in their homes. I can't say most. And it's expected.

Starting point is 00:08:50 And she was in her home. I probably would have thought that there was an intruder or someone skulking around my house at that time of morning when I can just see lights, and nobody's announced themselves. No one has come to my front door. No one has even tried to say from the curb, excuse me, can you come out of the house?

Starting point is 00:09:06 Or is everyone okay? Nothing. And so I think in this particular case, trying to hide behind, oh, we might be afraid, or our training tells us that if we feel afraid, shoot first and ask questions later is a problem. Now, I do agree that this is a time actually for law enforcement communities to not be defensive and start really taking stock of what they teach. And one of the things I don't

Starting point is 00:09:29 think they do an effective enough job is of is teaching de-escalation. That gun should not be your first resort. Michael Brown, that is, I think, again, what should be happening, a constant assessment where police chiefs are reminding folks how they should behave but unfortunately we see this uh again this woman is dead her nephew is traumatized and every time police say you know what well you know this was this was a mistake yeah this cop no matter what happens to him he's still living and we had this a lot of these discussions when I was in office, and with the police it is a very challenging discussion because as elected officials, no matter what jurisdiction you're in,

Starting point is 00:10:13 you never want to show that you're not being supportive of the police. And so that's one challenge. The second challenge is until the standard is changed in the law, it's going to be very difficult to stop these kind of things from happening. I'm not suggesting police officers are thinking about, oh, I can shoot anybody and it won't matter because all I have to do is claim that I was in danger.

Starting point is 00:10:35 But there has to be some different level of consciousness when they're in that situation where they maybe, as Dr. Carter mentioned, won't use their gun as their first line of defense. And that's going to continue to happen until the standard changes. Deontay, and that is what I think is important. And unfortunately, you have police unions who are blocking a lot of this. And look, you have a Department of Justice that also does not want to hold police accountable, that wants to pull back from consent decrees, that is not being aggressive at prosecuting police officers.

Starting point is 00:11:18 You know, Roland, I don't think it's necessarily that the Department of Justice doesn't want to hold the police accountable. But I think we have to remember that the Department of Justice still has a duty to make sure that our law enforcement system in America is still taken seriously. And so, but... But wait a minute, but they're not. Hold up, hold up. I got to stop you there. Jeff Sessions, one of the first things that he did when he came as Attorney General was try to withdraw from the consent decree in Baltimore. They tried to withdraw from the consent decree in Baltimore. They try to they try to withdraw from the consent decree in Chicago. He actually gave a speech where he said we will pull back from these consent decrees because it was hurting the morale of police officers.

Starting point is 00:11:54 Barr followed him up by also reiterating the exact same thing. So the Department of Justice is actually done exactly that. They have been unwilling to hold police accountable because they want to be cozy with cops. Those are facts. I mean, it's not necessarily being cozy with cops. It's necessarily making sure that they remain leaders in our community and making sure that people realize that the cops still have a job to do.

Starting point is 00:12:20 Now, yes, there does need to be a reform. But DOJ isn't. There does need to be reform when it comes to isn't there does need to be reformed when it comes to our police officers making sure there's proper training making sure that seems like earlier does not happen but we still have like i said make sure that we know that the police are the leaders in the community yes there are bad apples but we still have to make sure that they keep that same presence in the community no i will say this here the police are not same presence in the community. No, I will say this here. The police are not the leaders in the community. The leaders in the community are the elected officials

Starting point is 00:12:49 and the police commissioner or the police chief who's over them. But again, until you have accountability, these cops will continue doing what they're doing. And unfortunately, there are too many excuses coming out of Washington and not having proper oversight of these police departments just one moment All right, folks, in a few weeks, we're going to be in Cabo for the second annual Life Lux Jazz Experience. Gerald Albright's going to be one of the performers there.

Starting point is 00:13:54 14 different acts performing over three days. If you want to attend, go to lifeluxjazz.com, L-I-F-E-L-U-X-E-J-A-Z-Z.com. But if you cannot make it and you want to check it all out, there's a live streaming pass courtesy of GFNTV.com. That's GFNTV.com. Guys, let's put the website below me. And that is, of course, concerts over three days, 14 acts. Of course, Mark Curry, the comedian, is one of the folks who is confirmed for this event.

Starting point is 00:14:23 In addition to Mark Curry, it's going to be great concerts by, again, Gerald Albright, Alex Bunyan, Raul Madon, Incognito, Pieces of a Dream, Kirk Whalum, Average White Band, Donnie McClurkley, Shalaya, Roy Ayers, Tom Brown, Ronnie Laws, and Ernest Quarles. I'll be doing Roland Martin Unfiltered that Thursday and Friday from Cabo. Looking forward to it. But again, if you want to watch the live stream, go to gFNTV.com. That's GFNTV.com. Now back to your Roland Martin. this is an iHeart podcast

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#RolandMartinUnfiltered - The System Rejects Idea Of Justice For Black People: Day Of Outrage Planned For Atatiana Jefferson

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