Rotten Mango - #221: He Plotted A Murder With His Therapist & His Descent Into Madness

Episode Date: December 14, 2022

He was the college “simp.” His friends knew better than to ask him to go to a party with them. He would inevitably be too busy in his dorm room thinking about his girlfriend. Listening to audio clips of her telling her she loves him. But his best friend was the only one that knew the truth of what was going on. He had secretly recorded conversations he had with his dream girl on campus. Then he edited and spliced together clips of the audio to make her say “I love you.” He would listen to those distorted, unnatural clips for hours on end. His best friend finally had enough and brought him to a therapist. He had no idea that he would start plotting murder there. Full Source Notes: rottenmangopodcast.com To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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in all states or situations. Price is very based on how you buy. Betabing Betaboo Welcome to this week's main episode of Rotten Mangle. I'm your host Stephanie Sue. And college makes you do weird things. I'm just going to be honest. It does.

Most people can agree that college is a weird time. You're experimenting with your style. You're getting peer pressured into doing things that you would normally never do. Maybe you're doing keg stands. Like that's gotta be in some weird history facts later on because humans, they do hand stands on a giant barrel that's filled with beer and there's like a nozzle

that just squirts beer straight into the esophagus. It doesn't even make the beer tastier. We mainly do it because other humans stand around and clap while you do it. And it's just like a really nice feeling, I think. College is a strange time, like I said. And it's a time where you might even get made fun of for completely normal things, like having a girlfriend.

I find that a lot of college boys, a lot of them can be total bros. Like oh god, you're such a simp, you're still facetiming her. Come on, you don't need a talk, do I? Let's go out. Everyone's meeting at the Delta Phi chat house. Come on dude, it'll be fun. God, what a simp. That's probably what they thought of Prosenjit from UC Berkeley.

Okay, UC Berkeley is a little bit of a party they thought of Prosenjit from UC Berkeley. Okay, UC Berkeley is a little bit of a party college, but Prosenjit never went out. He stayed in his dorms studying, and when he wasn't studying, he was listening to these audio clips of his girlfriend. He was a man and a bob, you know, what could he say? His friends would pass by his dorm

and see the do not disturb sign on the door, and they knew he's listening to those clips again. She's saying, I love you, I love you, I love you, over and over again in the clip and he's listening to it on repeat. I mean the kid is such a simp, doesn't he know that college is the time to fuck around before getting old and getting into the workforce? I don't even know why he's so obsessed with her. You know, she's alright. And the guys would roll their eyes and walk past his dorm, no longer bothering to even ask him to hang out. But one of his friends, Jal, his best friend, really, would be the most concerned. He didn't seem concerned that Prozenji was a simp, that's not what he was worried about.

He knew things that the other friends didn't know. Like the fact that the audio clips that Prozen g listen to every single day were secretly recorded. And the, I love you, audio that he played over and over again while smiling up at his ceiling. It was distorted. It didn't sound natural. It sounded almost like an AI or something. Jell asked him about it one day, and he confessed.

He had used the secret recordings to splice and edit together. The girl of his dream saying, I love you. Hmm, so he pieced together, I love you. And he would skip class just to listen to the distorted, I love you. I love you. I love you. Over and over and over again. But what would happen if she didn't love him back?

This level of obsession, I mean it wasn't gonna end well. So with that being said, as always, full show notes are available at RottenMinglePodcast.com, but please go pick up a copy of Bad Karma by Deborah Beatriz Blum. It is such a refreshing book, if I can say that, not in the sense that the material or the subject matter is refreshing, but in the fact that the book is so full of raw emotions. I think that the author made it nearly impossible to not feel strong feelings for the people involved in this case. I mean, every single chapter, every page, you just feel so many different emotions. The book was mainly based on interviews with friends and family members and significant contributions from Tatiana's mom.

It was an incredibly tough book to get through. But in the end, this is a case that more people should know about because it was a case that changed laws in US history, like forever. Have you guys heard of the terror soft law? That's usually not what it's referred to by people that are not in the psychiatric field. But have you ever wondered where the duty to warn for psychiatrists and therapists came from? So the duty to warn means that a therapist must adhere to the normal strict standards of patient confidentiality unless their patient threatens violence or harm on a third party.

Then they are obligated by law to break that confidentiality and alert someone to potentially save that third party's life. It came from here. Yeah, because it didn't really exist before then. You could tell your psychiatrist you wanted to hurt someone and there was really nothing they could do about it. Ah, I see, I see, okay. Yeah, so today we're talking about Tatiana Tarrisov. Dr. Moore was far from a normal therapist.

Okay, he had some personal experiences in life that really cemented the way that he looked at his job. Dr. Moore was a certified workaholic. He was a capable workaholic at that. He earned his master's degree at Stanford, got a PhD, and while doing all of that, he married a woman named Inger and had a child named Karen, and when he graduated,

it's like his life couldn't even get better. He moved to San Francisco, got accepted into the prestigious Cowell Hospital. It was considered one of the best psychiatric training centers in the area connected to UC Berkeley, and he loved living in SF. He bought this amazing home, first-hole family, and his life was, I did like, I mean, anyone would be jealous of him. But as time went on, he's working a lot more, doing like 16-hour days. He'd really only go home to eat and sleep

and anger his wife. I mean, she's like, there's no end to this. It's not just, hey babe, let me get through my masters. Hey babe, let me get through my PhD. This is the rest of my life. My husband will always put his career first She felt so depressed and so abandoned and isolated. She had no one and by the time that Karen their daughter was two Inga was not okay. She started calling Dr. Moore's office on a consistent basis to threaten suicide and finally one day

She carried out the threat. She fed their daughter, a lethal dose of sleeping pills, and swallowed the rest herself. Dr. Moore came home to see his family laying their unconscious with a bottle of pills between them. He rushed them both to the hospital, Inger was revived, Karen remained in a coma for eight days, and she barely survived. Immediately, he divorced his wife, cut off all ties with her, took soul custody of their child, and I think because of these life experiences, Dr. Moore was really compassionate, Dr.

I mean, he took his job incredibly seriously. Okay, all of his colleagues do, but his own wife had been threatening suicide and then tried to commit murder suicide. Nothing was ever going to be taken lightly for Dr. Moore. That's just how he operated. So now he's sitting across from pros and sheet, a very, very smart college student from UC Berkeley, but he's starting to show these delusional beliefs.

He's obsessed with a fellow student at UC Berkeley. He felt like his own friends were out to steal his girlfriend away from him. But the thing is, she's not even his girlfriend. She was in Brazil for summer break and Pro Zenji told Dr. Moore over and over again how he had hoped that the distance would make her realize just how much she loved him, how much she had to go back to Berkeley and marry this guy. That's what he hoped for. Later, Dr. Moore found out that Pro Zenji was trying to buy a gun. He sat down and he was like, hey, do you care to tell me why? You were trying to purchase a weapon? Well, I did purchase a weapon, but it's not for hurting her like you think. I'm trying to save her. What do you mean by that?

The girl is selling her body, but I believe that she can be good again. I merely want to teach her a lesson. How will you teach her a lesson? I will pay up classmate $100 to ask her for sexual favors. And when she goes to their dorm to, you know, do the deed, I'm gonna burst in and rescue her with my gun. Then I'm gonna take her to my room and say, do you see what you've gotten yourself into? Don't you see that I have saved you from a terrible fate and a terrible life? That's horrible. That's a horrible plan. I've heard, I thought you was saying,

like, oh, I'm not a half-my friend. Pretend to kidnap her and I will save her. This is a bizarre plan. This is even worse than that. Yeah, pros and g, do you realize what you just said? That doesn't even make any sense. I'm gonna have to ask you to hand over the weapon. Wet weapon, doctor.

Pros and g, I know that you have a gun, and if you don't give it to me, I will go to the police. But I've said, I'm not going to hurt her. He accuses their epiths of being against him, trying to steal Tatiana away from him, just like all of his friends, just like everybody on campus. And with that, he stormed off slamming the door shut behind him, and Dr. Moore didn't know what to do. He felt like he should tell someone, but there's like no protocol on how to handle this type of situation.

When he went to his bosses, his superiors, they looked at him like he needs therapy. They're like, what are you talking about, dude? I mean, the guy just is a little bit obsessed, okay? He's in love. What do you want me to say? So against his bosses back, Dr. Moore wrote a letter to the police. He wrote,

The patient's mental status varies considerably. A time he seems rational. Then he appears quite psychotic. It is my impression that he is a paranoid schizophrenic. He is, at this point, a danger to the welfare of others and himself. He's been threatening to kill an unnamed girl, who he feels has betrayed him and violated his honor. He told his friend that he plans to buy a gun and kill her with it.

I request your assistance in this matter. Sincerely, Dr. Moore, PhD, clinical psychologist. In the end, Prozenji would kill. Dr. Moore was basically forced to watch his patient unravel and plot murder. And what's crazy is that by all accounts, Pro Zenji could have been a hero in today's story, but somewhere, and I don't really even know where, it just all went wrong. The scary part is you can kind of see him unraveling and becoming the villain, but you don't really have a specific pinpoint. When I first dove into this case, I was expecting to read about this crazy childhood

that you would typically create a cold-blooded killer from. I was expecting a self-absorbed narcissist, a highly disturbed individual, and I didn't really get that by textbook, if that makes sense. I mean, this is obviously a highly disturbed individual, but I don't get the typical stalker type of vibe, especially in his childhood, like this case is nothing, like what I envisioned it would be going in. That's not to say that he's not guilty. I mean, he absolutely is, but I guess it's just not what I expected, because Prozenji was a victim before he was a killer. But not in the child abuse sense.

He was a victim of systematic generational abuse at the hands of a class system. You're like, what? Okay, so the Padaar family was situated on a tiny, tiny little village, about 200 miles of Calcutta, India, so the Padaar family was situated on a tiny, tiny little village, about 200 miles of Calcutta, India, this tiny village, okay. I'm talking a few hundred huts, like not houses, but they were called huts, just sprawled along the banks of the river.

There are no running water. Children would be sent every morning to fetch buckets of water from the river. They would bring it back home so that their mothers could cook clean and wash themselves with it. There was no electricity. Almost every single resident took to cooking over a man-made fire that was fueled by cow poop patties. There were no lamps, no light bulbs.

If you were lucky, you had like a kerosene lamp, and that was it. It was a really depressing village. It was a flat, less view of rice farms. And maybe a few mango trees here and there, but that was it. There was no internet connection. The only connection with the outside world was this small dirt highway, but none of the residents used it. Because if you live in this village, you usually stay there. You really go anywhere, physically or in life, and it sounds depressing, and it is. Because the village was the village of untouchables.

If you've never heard that word in like a socio-economic context, it sounds kind of good. Like oh my god, they're untouchable. They're so great that you can't even touch them. You can't even be near them. It sounds like they're better than everyone else, right? No. So, in older Hindu belief, being an untouchable man that you were the slum of society, you were almost less than human.

Let's talk about the caste system real quick. The caste system in India was really intense. There were four main divisions. The top were the priest, not actual priest by occupation, that was just the name of the top class, right? This is like the top 1% of the 1%. Then you had the warrior cast, the merchant cast, and the servitors cast, and beneath all of those,

so low that they weren't even good enough to be categorized as a cast, were the untouchables. Yeah, I think I heard about these before. Yeah. And then there's also like last names dividing them, right? Yeah, and the only thing that determines which cast you go into, literal birthright. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like has nothing, nobody asked to be born The only thing that determines which cast you go into? Hmm. Literal birthright.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, has nothing, nobody asked to be born, and yet here you are, living your lives bearing the consequences or the benefits by who you are born to on a daily basis. The untouchables were destined for a lifelong existence filled with just pure misery. The untouchables would be assigned to the most degrading jobs imaginable, carrying off the dead. Cmating remains, sweeping, scavenging, tanning the skins of dead animals and eating their flesh, clearing latrines and disposing of human waste, that was the life of an untouchable. Practically every single person in the Padaar family was an untouchable.

Pro-Shengjit's grandmother had lived like this her whole life, and this was before Gandhi, this was before any human rights activist were around to tell her like, hey, you're more than just an untouchable, your cast means nothing. It was rough. She had to go through unspeakable things. People considered untouchables dirty creatures who would contaminate you just by being around. There was fear mongering. If an untouchable so much is looked at you, breathe the same air as you, drink the same

water as you, God forbid you even saw so much as their shadow, you felt contaminated. For this reason, they were all banished to live in these little villages away from the higher cast. The untouchables were only allowed into neighboring cities when the higher cast slept so that they could perform all the dirty work that nobody else wanted to do. Projan Jeet's grandma remembered working for a family where she would have to go in while they were sleeping to clean their bathrooms. She wasn't allowed in the kitchen because food was being prepared and even just her presence in that room would quote dirty the food. And to make

sure that she was never seen, visually seen by her employers, they made her bang on a small tin drum as she walked around their house. Can you imagine what that does to someone's just... psyche? Thankfully, times are changing and have changed, and it started with pros and gids dad, so his dad was really smart, naturally gifted, and he was the first untouchable in the entire district that learned how to read, which is insane. Okay, it wasn't actually against the law, but it was against like all the rules. Progenjid's dad went up against all odds

and started going to school, but he wasn't allowed inside. You're like what? Okay, so the teacher was one of the most progressive teachers in the area. This is what they considered progressive. He was actually risking his own career for Progenjit's dad. He let him sit outside on the dirt next to the classroom window. To ease drop and listen to the lessons, he never got any books like the other kids he never got anything he was just allowed to ease drop basically. This makes me feel so guilty of all the times that I hated going to school. He learned everything on the dirt outside of school. And because Progenjit's dad did this, he was the first in the family to get a very respectable

job. He worked as a court inspector in the magistrate's office in West Bengal, and he made enough money to make sure that his kids had more than he did. And so when Prosenji was born, I mean, he was focused in state one. He was sent to live with relatives when he was 9 years old so that he could attend a high school. And he just had this crazy talent for chemistry and math. He was like an engineering whiz.

He was always tinkering with stuff, building devices. He even built a miniature steam engine and a miniature telephone. Side note, he's doing this in another village that has no running water or electricity. Listen, I have Google and I still don't know how to build a mini steam engine. I don't even know what it is. This guy is so skilled at what he's doing, and at 16 he applies for the Indian Institute of Technology,

the best engineering college of all of India. Competition there, cutthroat. Every year, about 80,000 students apply and only 1,200 students get in. Again, Stallons, he was accepted. She earned about 80,000 students' apply and only 1,200 students get in. Against all odds, he was accepted. And around the same time, after Gandhi, laws had changed to benefit the scheduled cast, the untouchables, so pros and jeet could attend.

He was the only untouchable admitted, and he would graduate second of his class. Second. And this guy was driven. What he really wanted though, was to move to the US. That had been his dream since he was a little kid. Growing up, a lot of people around Progenji looked at America with literal star-spangled banners in their eyes.

And this is, a lot of people still do. I'm always reminded of this because living in America and being American, we're like, America, what's going on with our country? And I go to Korea and even in Korea people are like wow You're so lucky to have grown up there That's crazy like I think you know I'm gonna tell you every day Yeah, you just try to tell me every day even now with everything going on in US politics People would still die to come to America and so with pro genji that was him

I think it's a bit of a promise land to people where anything is possible and dreams can come true. And yeah, there is a chance of that, right? So he's like, let's go to America, but it's not gonna be easy. America's not handing out visas to everyone. So he's got to get into college here. Then he's got to get a student visa. Then he's got to make the money to get to America. He took a chance and he applied to UC Berkeley, not to be like a school snob. UC Berkeley is incredibly hard to get into, even the locals. It's hard to get into as an American. It is consistently ranked the number one public college in the US. Not a private college, but a

public college. It is an incredible school. Like people work so hard to get into UC Berkeley. It's an incredible feat to just even get admitted, even as an American, and even more so for Progenji. Like, once he gets in, his dad went out, got alone, $10,000. That's a loan. To give you some context, his dad only made $2,000 a year. Five years of his whole salary, not including how much he needs to just survive

and take care of the other family members. He was like, I gotta make this happen. My son got into UC Berkeley. And this sounds like the beginning of a motivational podcast, like a TED talk. And it ends with pros and gite graduating and starting his own unicorn tech company. Like, that's what you're imagining, right?

He would have repaid his whole family, move them to the States, but that didn't happen because he would meet Tantiana and then he would kill her. But we're getting ahead of ourselves. So he moves to America to California, and like a lot of immigrants, I mean, he's expecting like a super futuristic society where everything is clean and the cars are like flying

basically and everything is modern and everyone is thriving. And then he gets to California and he's like, guys, is that a white refrigerator? Like what's going on? America's great, but it's just not exactly what he imagined. It's not like this crazy futuristic land. Like a lot of people are suffering in America, but he's like, you know what, it's fine.

At least, Classism is gone. You know, America doesn't have a caste system. Gone is the stigma of being an untouchable. That's not really what happened. Because Pro Zenji landed in the beautiful free country, and immediately he started experiencing different types of discrimination. Like nationalism, racism, yeah, Classism was still here, so it's pretty rough. But he's like, you know what? It's fine. I'm going to be something. I'm going to make something out of myself. I'm doing it for

my family. That's back home. My little siblings. My dad can't take out more loans for them. It's up to me to graduate, get a job, and fund all of their educations. He's a man with a mission. And he didn't even have a lot of friends in India. He was just a very shy person. So yeah, when he walks up to groups of people in America, on campus, and they all either ignored him or they were very short with him and waited for him to walk away, it bothered him but it didn't really bother him that much. He just kept to himself, he would carry around to some sort of mechanical contraption with him everywhere that he went, he would tinker with it, so fine, nobody talked to him, he would

play with his gadgets. He was able to assemble a sophisticated sound system, tape recorder, a portable burglar alarm, a remote controlled cigarette light, a telephone answering device, I mean this guy is so smart, this is what he's doing in his free time, on top of a heavy course load. Fascinating. I don't even know how my brain would even start to create that." What you watch depends on what kind of majoring. Sometimes you're craving comedies like friends or South Park and sometimes you're more into dramas like HBO's Succession and House of the Dragon. There's also cooking shows like Chopped and Beat Bobby Flay and even movies like The Lord of the Rings and Shazam, Fury of the Gods.

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Eventually he even got interested in ship design and he started commuting six miles to this former World War II naval base that was now like a Berkeley student training ground and research facility. He starts going there and it sounds super cool and futuristic. It was not. It was not an aesthetic facility. It looks like it hadn't been cleaned or even maintained since World War II It was a pretty dingy place Everything was caked in sea salt and everything just smelled rusty in there But he freaking loved it. He even loved the 40-minute commute on the bus In India, he had never been inside of a vehicle

And now, he was constantly staring at the window daydreaming, just soaking it in. He loved working on any sort of broken machine. I mean, he loved it all. Now, technically, he wasn't supposed to touch any of the old propellers in the workshop, but there were no rules that he couldn't touch either. So he would stay behind while all the other students left, and he would work on the propellers. He just wanted to get one of them working again. But most likely, none of them had worked since World War 2

But even the attempt it was like meditation to him one day he's hunched over Elbow deep in Greece and his instructor walks by what's called Greg Greg had run had been running the field station for five years He's a 45 year old dude, and he's one of those macho chats. He loved to stand on all the Berkeley kids He called them all the Berkeley kids. He called them all pussies. Why? Because none of them went to war. They're sitting there with their textbooks,

but you don't really know the world until you go into a world war. Those is thing. He feel like every man should be in the army. Join the Navy, get yelled at non-stop. That's what makes you a man. Not some freaking degree piece of paper bullshit. He would non-stop complain kids

are so soft these days, too damn soft. All brain-nome muscles, I feel like I'm babysitting wimps in here. He was exceptionally hard on all the POC students. Yeah. He referred to Projanji as Little Hindu, which is incredibly racist. He was probably the hardest on Pro Zenjit than any of the other students. You would throw around passive aggressive remarks, microaggression after microaggression, and Pro Zenjit never responded. Ever. And that pissed him off. He wanted to get a reaction out of him.

But Greg, Greg, think about it. Okay. Try growing up as an untouchable and see if you care about some random balding teacher's snide racist comments. He didn't care. So one day, Prosenji does messing with the propellers after all the other students had left and he heard a voice behind him. What the devil is Greg?

Oh, sir, I was just restoring the propeller and the... Deianometer? Oh, really? Where are you now? Yes, sir. Whenever I find a broken-down machine, I feel like I must rehabilitate it. We're not gonna rehabilitate it. Where you're not going to rehabilitate that frozen piece of shit. President-ji just smiled and kept working. Greg turned and walked out the smirking. I mean, it was no good. If someone was going to fix that thing, they would have already

fixed it. Berkeley students and their confidence, these all brains, no muscles, pluses, he's thinking that. And he walks away. Oh, and he also called out. Shut out the lights when you're done. And he left. A few weeks later, Greg is in his office and pros and jeet comes in. Sir, could you spare a moment? For what? You remember previously I was keen on fixing the propeller housing?

Well, it gave me a good deal of trouble and I would like if you would come take a look at it. Greg got up and walked over. And another bash at it and, please, Greg if you could observe. And Greg watched, waiting for nothing because let's be real, it was a useless frozen apparatus. But after a few seconds to his amazement, the useless frozen piece of junk was now a brand new propeller.

The blades were spinning with ease. Greg said that this was the best mechanical engineer he had met since he was in the Navy. He pat him on the back and he said, how about some lunch, kid? Oh no, it's fine. It's necessary for me to log the results of the test. Now, I have a few more things that I need to clean first besides. Bullshit. We're having lunch. So he likes him, though? Yeah, and that's how the two of them would form a very unlikely friendship. Every Tuesdays and Thursdays, they would bring their lunch out to the docks and watch the cargo ships being off-floated. Well, they ate their lunch.

What a story! Yeah. And Pro Zenji was still shy, but Greg didn't care. In fact, Greg liked that he didn't have to share the talking time. He talked nonstop about his macho days in the Navy, and Pro Zenji listened. But he did gain something out of it. For the first time ever, he felt an interpersonal bond with an American. And he felt like, if I can win over one American, I can win over America. I can be accepted by America

as a whole. So he starts feeling more comfortable, more confident, and through his confidence, he starts deciding to be even better at school, putting in more effort with his presentations, getting to know his teachers. I mean, he was really coming out of his shell. He was even trying to make friends at his dorm. So his dorm was called Eye House for International House. A lot of the international students live there. You know, it's filled with them. But it's also located in the middle of fraternity row.

So people said it was kind of interesting. Because the international students were, most of the time consistently, a lot more academically focused, because they went through a lot to get here, to get in to UC Berkeley, and the middle of fraternity row, there would just be like drunk dudes everywhere, and IHouse would be like dead quiet on the weekends,

it would be really, really quiet. It was not a party house, it was rather calm. Okay, for example, they had functions. Every Friday, the dorm would host dances, but it would be a traditional folk dance from around the world. So instead of like... Parties? Yeah. Yeah, instead of like, I don't know who's a rapper, you know, in the music and doing keg stands and all of that, they would be learning like ancient Greek dances by an instructor who knew how to do it and everything was a little bit more formal, right?

And it was like a different country every week. I'm not even sure how it started, but I'm not even sure when Prosenji started attending. But he would, and it would change the entire course of his life because it would be the first time that he laid eyes on Tatiana and it was like a movie movie at least in his mind. As good as he was with all these small mechanical parts, he was really bad on his feet, okay? He wasn't really good with the dance steps.

His body felt a little bit heavy, a little bit unnatural. He didn't have the best sense of rhythm. He felt awkward also being in such close proximity to women. This would be completely unheard of in India. Like there was a strict separation between the sexist. Girls were yelled at by their parents where he grew up if they even looked at a young man in the eye in public. Okay, usually girls and boys would hang out, but most of the time there was like a shaperone holding hands and kissing before marriage out of the question. I mean, that's

blasphemy. There is no such thing as sex before marriage where pros and jeet grow up. He never even dared dream of kissing a girl before they were married. To him, it was given that both he and his wife would be virgins when they get married. And he also went to an all-boy school so that um, institute of psychology. In India, all boys. Basically the only woman that he had ever had any form or relationship with was his mom. And then it happened. Ow, his foot, his toe. He felt a searing pain. He looked down, and there was someone on his toe stepping on it.

He followed the toe up to her face. And to him, it must have felt like everything was moving in slow motion. She was unlike any woman he had ever seen. She had these wide cheekbones, full lips, you know, these bright, seagre-eyes, and he was captivated. For a second, she looked a little shocked, and then she let out a tiny giggle. Sorry, and then she rushed off to join her best friend, and he could hear her. I'm so clumsy.

God, I feel so bad. From First Clantz, he was completely captivated by Tatiana Tarrasov. For the rest of the dance, he couldn't keep his eyes off of her. I guess it would only make sense now to tell you about Tatiana Tarrasov. Her parents call her Tanya, and she had an impressive upbringing, too, similar to President

Jeet. So her dad Vitaly had a rough life growing up in Russia. So both of these are immigrants. He was working manually since he was a young boy. He married a woman named Lydia, they get married, and the two of them they start daydreaming. Let's move to the US. Come on, we got this. It's not easy to get visas.

I mean, they're barely making ends meet. What excuse do they have to get a visa into the greatest country of the world in their eyes at the time? Somehow they end up in Brazil. And then from Brazil, America. And they have three kids, Tatiana, Tania, Alex, their son, and Helen. In America, they settle in California near UC Berkeley, but they lived in a world that fell light years away from UC Berkeley.

It was a blue collar type of area. They lived close to campus, but nobody in that neighborhood had any association. None of them were professors or employees or staff members. And other kids went there. But it didn't matter. They had come here for the American dream. And Vitaly, he's like, I'm a hardworking man.

I'm gonna set up an auto shop. He's car mechanic. He finally gets enough money, sets it up with a business partner, and then it just goes to shit. He's a good, he's a really good mechanic, like a great one, but he was not a good businessman. They went bankrupt and he was depressed. He resorted to drinking all the time, he wasted the family's money at bars, he would drink to the point that he was incoherent, his kids would regularly find him passed out on the

couch, and he was so moody, and he was so unstable, he was like a tyrant in the house, especially with Tatiana. His first daughter, he was like super possessive over her. Like I get it, this is his baby girl, but he's a bit ridiculous. He would act more like a possessive boyfriend than a father. You're like, what? How? Okay, so he would get jealous at the idea that she was talking to boys, and if he suspected

that she was talking to a boy, he suspected that she was talking to a boy He would sneak into her room while she was at school and look for proof He would rummage through her desk drawers and trash looking for some sort of letter or a note or something He was constantly accusing her of dating someone behind his back and he would scream at her You the reason that I drink okay? Let me tell you about what happened during drama club This is when Tatiana was in high school. She's now in college, but senior year, drama club.

After school play finished, she's like, I'm gonna stay after and help clean up. Then she hears this commotion. Kids are freaking out, a girl's face is like tomato red. What's going on? There's a guy outside creeping around in the bushes. He's like shining a flashlight through the windows. Where's the drama teacher? Everyone gathered, scared, creeped out, and finally the drama teacher pulled Tatiana aside

and said, I thought I should tell you this in private. But uh, your father is outside. The girls say that he's been prowling around through the bushes, peering through the windows. I was gonna call the police, but seeing who it is, I just wanted to talk to you first. No, please don't call the police. I'll handle it. She was mortified. She ran out there and confronted her dad in the bushes and she yelled, God damn you dad, how can you do this to me? He came out of the bushes and he grabbed her arm and she said, why can't you just leave me alone?

Because you're my little girl. And he dragged her into the car. Listen, Tatiana's relationship with her dad was really complicated. On one hand, she felt super close to him, more close to him than she felt her mom. Whenever she saw him being vulnerable or hurting, she desperately wanted to comfort him. But at the same time, she was so terrified of him. I mean, he was a ticking time bomb.

He was unpredictable. He had to walk on eggshells around him. It was exhausting. Vitaly would later say that he and Tatiana were like soulmates. Just a very odd thing for a father to say. But their whole dynamic is strange if you ask me. So a little more context. Vitaly was the strictest on Tatiana.

More so than he was on her little brother, Alex. Alex was allowed to have a car and a driver's license. Tatiana wasn't even allowed to drive even though she was 19 years old. She wasn't allowed to have a job or even wear makeup, which was weird because whenever Vitaly was in a good mood, he would give her money. And he'd be like, go buy yourself something nice, do your hair. But then he wouldn't ever let her leave the house unless it was absolutely necessary.

And when they, the mom sat, the husband down and was like, what? Why do you want to put Tanya and Akala's closet? Do you want to just keep her for yourself? Why do you want her to be beautiful? For who? You tell her, go buy some nice clothes, have nice hair, but for who when she can't go outside. He just stared at his wife, grunted, got up and walked away. So a lot of people that New Tatiana speculated that her entire childhood was overly strict

and unstable so she grew up super insecure. And because she was never allowed out of the house, it was very hard for her to form friendships like a lot of other girls so she almost always felt like an outsider and it was really hard for her to have any sort of boyfriend and you know I get it it's not a big deal it's not the end of the world if you don't have a boyfriend but when you're 19 and everyone else around you has had so much experience with boys you start to feel like it's your problem. Like maybe I don't have a boyfriend because I'm weird. So she felt like something was wrong with her.

But she was pretty, I mean she had these wide, slavic cheekbones, these green eyes that tilted upward, everybody that knew her said that she was really attractive. But she didn't think that she was pretty. So she would spend a lot of time stuffing socks or tissues into her bra. She would over-analyze every single interaction that she ever had with a boy. She would stay up late, wondering if he liked her. She was kind of a helpless romantic. She felt like she was destined to find a prince charming.

So if a random guy was nice to her, she would immediately romanticize him. She would daydream about how they were getting married. She wanted a tumultuous relationship like the movie's aromance for the ages. She daydreamed about seeing her soulmate on the street, but then she would be too shy to talk to anyone because she was so insecure. She didn't think that she was funny, witty, or pretty enough, and so she never really got any friends. Okay, so even her choice of college set a lot about her. So Tatiana could have easily gotten into UC Berkeley. She had the grades, she was an over

achiever, all of her teachers were impressed by her. But her dad told her, you're too dumb. Even if you get into UC Berkeley, you're gonna fail out. What is going on? I'm so confused by it. I think he didn't want her to do too well. Yeah. He doesn't want her to run away and do big things, maybe.

He just wants to be in control of her, I think. I think also it has to do with his failures in life. Maybe he wants to feel like he's still the dad, he's still the smartest one in the room. So he's always like you can't get in and even if you did you're going to flunk out. Yeah, no wonder she's so insecure so she never applied. She ended up going to a community college nearby instead which nothing is wrong with community college. It can be a stellar education but she didn't even attempt to get into UC Berkeley when she really wanted to go to

UC Berkeley. That was her dream school. But at least she met her best friend in college. So her best friend was Cindy, and Cindy was like the opposite of Tatiana. She was an academic underachiever, she was confident, she wanted to just see how much fun she could have in life. She loved a good one night stand, she loved some drugs, she rented a dingy one bedroom apartment where all she had was a mattress on the ground and two bean bags. Cindy would leave the house with a sink full of dishes but she would comb her hair 20 times before leaving. So even though her apartment was a nasty mess, she never was okay Her priorities were right.

Cindy considered Tatiana like a baby bird of sorts. She was like, here, I'm gonna take you under my wing and I'm gonna teach you the way to live. You're like my little project. I'm gonna get you out of your shell. You're gonna have some fun. Vitaly hated Tatiana's best friend. Yeah, he would always say, you're going where?

With who? Yeah, no, no. You got another thing coming. If you think you can run around with that little slut, it was intense. But the two of them did go to UC Berkeley to go to an eye house dance. I don't know why, I don't know how they got there,

but maybe they were invited, maybe they were intrigued, but Cindy and Tatiana would end up at eye house at UC Berkeley, where she would step on Pro Zenjit's toe. And from that moment forward, Pro Zenjit made it his life mission to muster up the courage to talk to Tatiana. And I think this little tidbit is super important to the context of the story, but Pro Zenjit had gone to a little party at work. And Greg had spiked the punch bowl.

Super illegal. He's like a teacher. He put a lot of rum into the punchball. So all these college kids, they're getting drunk. I think most of them knew there was alcohol, but Prozenji did not. He had never had a sip of alcohol. Before leaving to America,

his mom made him promise three things. No alcohol, no beef, and promised me no American girl. You marry an American girl, and I will die. Like, that was basically her three promises and he was like yeah I'm gonna keep on promises right. And so you know the conversation at this party because Greg is a macho dude he's talking about women in a very demeaning way. Many goes what about you little Hindu? How many times have you crossed the equator? I pick your pardon sir. How many times have you been with uh you know know, I went to an all-boys school, sir, there

were no girls. Yes, you got to start from scratch, Len. Don't worry, I opened up a college of coxology in the Navy, I can teach you everything you need to know. I'm sorry, sir, but I made a sacred vow before leaving India. No beef, no alcohol, no involvement with an American girl. What you broke, two of them already? A bigger part in Sir?

The punch is spiked. Last week I gave you a hunk of my hamburger. Two down, what's the big deal about breaking the third? Oh my goodness. The more pros and g-thought about it, the more he realized he did want a relationship with Tatiana. The girl that had stepped on his toe in the dance. I guess I would like a relationship.

Ah, a relationship, my ass. A relationship is the one thing that campus chicks don't want. They'll jump in the sack before they even know your name. All you want is a quick in and out. Don't you worry a little thing though, I might help you get laid. And I don't know, maybe this conversation or the helpful tips that Greg gave. Pros and jeet had the courage that he needed. Because at the next dance, he walks straight up to Tatiana

Miss do you remember me? No, the night at the dance two weeks ago you stepped on my foot. Oh, okay. Sorry. You are American Yeah, by what name are you called? Tanya, that's a beautiful name Thanks, so Tatiana had to practice pros and jeet's name multiple times before she got it right. But honestly it's not like she was super engaged in the conversation. The whole time she kept glancing at the door to see if Cindy would be joining her. There was so much that she wanted to talk to Cindy about. But Tatiana knew Cindy told her

on the phone earlier. Hey, I think I'm gonna go meet up with this boy. If I don't, I'll come to the dance. But if I do, just know that I'm hanging out with him. Tatiana really needed her right now. She had gotten into a huge fight with her dad. She caught him going through her trash again. She was just so frustrated. And once the dance started, she realized that Cindy was not coming.

Cindy was out with a boy. Something that Tatiana wanted to do. And so she couldn't help it, but she starts feeling these tears streaming down her face. And it's not like she's not happy for her friend. She was just at a really low spot, and she was desperate for a company she wanted to not feel so lonely for once. And she looked around, and she thought, what about that nice guy?

She went to the little receptionist and said, do you know, is there a guy named Prozenji that lives in this dorm? Yeah, 607? Okay, thank you. And she starts making her way to his dorm room. He had no idea that she was coming. And in fact, their lukewarm meeting earlier probably discouraged him and he went back to his room pretty quickly after the dance.

And she knocked. Prosenji thought it was his good friend, Jal, another Indian exchange student. And so he said, just walk in, it's unlocked. It wasn't. Sir Tatiana heard grumbling and then the doors swung open and the look on Prozenjit's face, you could have thought that the president showed up in his door. How are you? Oh, sorry, I thought you were on.

Someone else? Were you expecting someone? My friend, Zhao. I think the fact that Prozenjit was so off-balance just by her presence, it started to give her a bit of confidence, right? She felt like she had the upper hand. Well, are you gonna invite me to come in? Sit down, we're friends, right?

I thought you wouldn't mind. Yes, yes, please be comfortable. I'm honored that you would pay me a visit. Only it's so messy, sorry. The room was not messy, it was super clean. Like it was obvious that Presengi was like a fanatic for an organization. He had his tools hung up on these tiny hooks.

Electronic parts were arranged in compartments. Technical books with random titles was like a fanatic for an organization. He had his tools hung up on these tiny hooks. Electronic parts were arranged in compartments. Technical books with random titles were lighting the shelves. The only chaos was his workstation where he was tinkering with something. I'm so sorry, generally my room is not so messy. You call this messy? You've got to be kidding me. It's so clean. I'm building a ship model. And he showed Tatiana his miniature ship model, and it was so detailed she studied in fascination. Wow, honestly I've never seen something so perfect. So you're telling me you made all of these? Yes, you're really smart. You should try to market these, I bet you can make a fortune. Presengi got more shy with her praise, but also the fact that

she was laying on his bed, he tried his best to not look directly at her, he wanted to be respectful. And after this in-promptu meeting, Prozenji'd asked Tatiana if they could meet again for a real date this time. She agreed, but she wasn't really excited about it, like she really tried to brush off his request. So she said yes, but she didn't give him her number, she was like, my name's in the phone book. There's only one terrace off.

Call me, I guess. And then she left. I think Tatiana was really hoping that he wouldn't follow through with the invitation. She just appreciated him for keeping her company at this time. She had like no intention of dating him. And then at the next day, she gets call. He said that he bought two tickets to the movies next weekend, and she felt super pressure to go. He had already paid what excuse could she make. So for the next week, while they wait for their first date, Tatianna tries to come up with any good excuse. Sorry, my dad.

No, that sounds dumb. I'm sorry, I have a family emergency. No. Sorry, I have really bad menstrual cramps and, everything she practiced sounded so dumb. It just sounded like an excuse. She don't wanna be rude. And you know what, Tatianna, you said yes, right? You should follow through with your obligations. This is what she's

telling herself. It doesn't have to be like a date date. We could just go as friends. The plan was that they were gonna grab dinner and then the movies and that would be that. Pros and G'd insisted he come pick her up at her home, but she was like, no. So they took the bus there instead, met up at the restaurant, and if you can really even call it a date, it never freaking go well. I think it was a huge cultural clash. Pros and G would say things like, I must place the order. When you are out with me, you are my responsibility.

She's like, okay. The two agreed to split up pizza, which yet never had a pizza yet. He did not like pepperoni. It burned his stomach and also he mispronounced pepperoni when ordering and that made Tatiana Giggle and they had some cute moments but it was weird So we had come with a list of questions prepared to ask her Sounds like something I would do to take I get so nervous

He had them all written down on the little piece of paper in his pocket and he wanted to have these really intense conversations like You know nature versus nurture, family planning, poetry, so he cleared his throat. Do you think it's a man's heredity that determines his fate or what happens in early childhood? I don't think it's like his genes or whatever, I think it's definitely what happens when you're growing up. That's quite different from the philosophy of my country, where I come from, there's a belief that the child must become what his parents are, and the ancestors before him. What if you don't like what your dad does?

Generally speaking, one does not have a choice. That's awful. I don't think I could do that. Prosengete was super happy with her answer. Side note about prosengete, he was not progressive. He was not like a woke person, but this validated that him being born an untouchable didn't mean that he was untouchable in America.

So to give you some idea, pros and gete just strikes me as someone who would not have a problem with the caste system if he had been born higher up. He definitely doesn't have an activist in him, that's for sure. He only hates the system because he got the shitty end of the stick. He just wasn't that progressive.

To give you an example, when the pizza came, Prozenji was shocked that Tatiana did not place a slice on his plate before taking a bite. Woman were supposed to put food on the man's plate before they even thought about taking a bite themselves. He didn't comment on it, but he did feel insulted and he hated the pizza, it was greasy. He thought the date was not going well until Tatiana asked him, so how come you came up and talked to me at the dance? You looked like somebody I knew from India.

Oh, like a girl from the past life or something? Uh, no, like a girl from my village, type of thing. Well maybe we did know each other in a past life and I've come back to hunt you. She starts laughing and she meant this is like a literal joke, right? But he thought, if she's thinking that there was a connection between them in a past life, surely that meant that she thought they were soulmates. But then at the end Tatiana opened up her person, loudly asked, so what do I owe you? And he was embarrassed. The idea of her paying for her portion of the meal was embarrassing, but the fact that she was asking so loudly in the restaurant made him even more embarrassed and he said, please, please, no, it's my pleasure.

And then during the movie, both of them rested their arms on the arm rest, and at times their skin would touch, and that was more physical contact than he had ever had with the girl, and the fact that she didn't pull her arm away, that was encouraging. He couldn't even focus the whole movie. He was just so focused on how close their arms were together. To ta-. To Tatiana, this wasn't even a date. She didn't find a romantic attraction to him at all. In fact, this date solidified to her that they were just friends. But to pros and jit, he was encouraged. He took the date seriously, and Tatiana's comment about them having a connection in a prior life, that was a sign. He basically thought that they were betrothed, that they were

getting married. Also, for more context, President Jeet was raised to believe that you go straight into marriage and love comes after marriage. He had grown up with the conception that he was gonna be in an arranged marriage that his parents would decide for him, right?

So after this date, he wrote a letter to his parents basically being like, hey guys, maybe you should hold off on finding me a wife in India because I met someone. She's not American per se. She's of Russian background, thank you. So he was really serious, like imagine telling your strict religious parents that you met someone even in Chinese culture, traditional Chinese culture, that's basically announcing marriage, like introducing them to someone, right?

Yeah, I'm serious. Meanwhile, right? Yeah, and serious. Meanwhile, Tatiana isn't even thinking about him at all. Let alone thinking about marrying him. Inside note, I'm not cheating on Prozenjiit for having traditional values, but nowhere in the traditional values does it say that you have to kill someone for not wanting to marry you. This is nothing to do with religion, race, tradition, or Indian culture. It has to do with Prozenjiite as an individual and nothing else. Why would you break into these apartments?

For money, for drugs, whatever was in there? Why aren't you afraid of getting caught at doing this? No, who's gonna catch us? What a police. It was the height of the crack era and instead of locking up drug dealers, some New York City cops had become them. I would suit up in my uniform and we're going to want some drug dealers, and I know how to do it really well. This is the inside story of the biggest police corruption scandal in NYPD history and the investigation that uncovered

it all. Did you consider yourself a rat? 100%. I saved my soul just like everybody else does. Listen to and follow the set, an Odyssey originals documentary podcast series available now in the Odyssey app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your shows. I'm not a big guy, man, but I love being that dirty mother f***er. podcasts or wherever you get your shows. So while he's laying in his bed daydreaming about his newly wedbed life together with Tatiana

Tatiana was at the grocery store in her PJs with her parents and she had heard this voice behind her Hey, can you grab me one of those and she turned around and her eyes went wide She didn't even know the guy's name, but she would never forget his face. A couple weeks ago she was at this very famous hangout spot in the local area. And Cindy, her friend was like, hey I dare you to go flash that guy. She went up to a random guy and flashed him. And now at the grocery store it was him and she was so embarrassed her whole face went running. She didn't know what to say.

He's like, oh shit sorry I was just wondering if you could pass the milk. I didn't mean to be rude. Oh, sorry. I thought I just... I didn't think I would ever see you again. Huh? The time at the med? The med? Don't you remember we met before? He did not remember. Like, not even a little bit. Oh, we met before? He didn't remember the flashing? No. And then he said this. I'm so sorry. Like, half the time I'm so wasted remember the flashing? No. And then he said this. I'm so sorry, like half the time I'm so wasted, I don't even know where I parked my car. Oh.

Yeah, too much weed. I think damaged the frontal lobe. Again, I don't know why he's saying this. Oh, um, that's... that's okay. So we met before? What happened? Tatiana's face went red. Nothing, really.

I didn't do anything rude, did I? No. What's your name? Uh, Tanya, tear herself. I'm Jeff Flanders. And that was how Tatiana found herself crushing on Jeff Flanders. And for the next few days, Tatiana was hoping, praying that Jeff would look her up in the local directories and see knew her name and find out her home phone number to call it. Yeah, back then it was really easy to give people's numbers and addresses. It was a crazy time back then. Okay, so every time the phone rang, she would number to call it. Yeah, back then it was really easy to give people's numbers and addresses. It was a crazy time back then. Okay, so every time the phone rang she would dive to catch it. Hello?

Oh, hello. Thanks for a pile of jolly good time. Who's this? It's President Jeet. Tatiana was super disappointed, but he didn't get the hint. You're quite the stranger now that there's no more dances during the holidays? Yeah, I was tired of those dances at I-house anyway. Really?

Well, I was wondering if you would do me the honor of coming along with me to a concert this Sunday? This Sunday? I'm sure I won't be... Better by then. I've had this terrible cough. You're not well? No, I think it's bronchitis. Is there anything I can do to speed your recovery?

No, nothing at all. I think I'm just going to stay in bed and rest. But um, yeah, you should go with somebody else. No, trust me, it's no bother. If you're in bed, I can grab something for you. I can bring you, I don't know, maybe a box of sweets. No, seriously, thanks, though. If I feel better, maybe I'll see you around at the next dance, and she hung up.

The last thing Ta-Ti-Anna was thinking about was another eye-house dance, but Pro-Jungie did not get the hint. He laid their thinking about how sick Ta-Ti, but Projhenji did not get the hint. He laid there thinking about how sick Tatiana must be, and how he felt like this was his chance to show himself to be a worthy husband. So a couple days later, he's standing in front of her front door with a box of cookies, and he's trying to hype himself up to ring that doorbell, but like, it was serious for him.

It's not just dropping off cookies, he might be meeting his in-laws for the first time. Like, this is how he's thinking, right? Because where he grew up, you don't go on a date without knowing you're going to get married. There's like no such thing in his village of casual dating. There's no like exploring your options until you find someone that you really click with. It's just like, you go on a date, you're basically married. So he's like, these are going to my in-laws. I gotta be really careful. He got so freaked out by meeting his in-laws. He just, he put the box of cookies down on the welcome door mat,

rang the doorbell, and he started running down the driveway. And in the driveway, there was this car parked, and I don't know whose car it was. It could have been the dad's. I'm thinking it was Alex's, the son's, who's unlocked, and something I'd caught his eye on the seat. And this sudden urge came over him, and as quickly and as quietly as possible, he opened the sentence, who's unlocked and something I'd caught his eye on the seat. And this sudden

urge came over him. And as quickly and as quietly as possible, he opened the door, grabbed a piece of fabric, shoved it in his pants pocket, and ran full sprint to the bus stop to go home. Will he open the car door? Yeah. That was parked. That wasn't locked. No. And then grabbed something out of it. It wasn't until he was back home in the safety of his dorm that he pulled the fabric out from his pants pocket, and there in his hands were Tatiana's red polka dot bikini bottoms. What? And he sniffed it.

It mainly smelt of chlorine, but this would be a constant reminder for his love for Tatiana, even though he had only interacted with her like three times in his entire life. So the next time they ran into each other at an eye house dance, you know the ones that Tatiana vowed to never go to again, was new years and she didn't have any other plans,

so it was either this or sit alone and this seemed less depressing. Pros and G was ecstatic when you ran into her. Hey, I've been waiting for you. Really? Do you still have your cough? No. I came over the other day, but nobody was home. You left the cookies?

Yes. That was really nice, but next time you should ask before you stop by. Oh, sorry. Yeah, my dad's really strict. He doesn't like it when guys show up. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to insult you. Silence. A lot of people are going on vacation for the winter holidays.

Maybe someday you can visit my country. Yeah, maybe. Silence. A lot of people are going on vacation for the winter holidays. Maybe someday you can visit my country. Yeah, maybe. The best time is after winter time when the monsoons are over. If you go, you will be a guest at my family's house. Thanks, but I don't think that's going to be for a really long time. Well, one never knows. More silence.

And while Tatiana tried to show him that she wasn't into that conversation, he just stood there waiting for his next opening. He was just staring at her, not even just standing next to her in silence, but like full blown staring at her. And so she said, please, if you keep staring at me like that, I'm gonna go crazy. I'm sorry. No need to apologize, just don't leave me like that. I'm gonna grab something I'll be right back. Instead of being right back, Tatiana used this as an opportunity to leave.

Pros and G waited a very long time for her to come back. And when it was clear that she wasn't, he ran the conversation over and over in his head. What did I say? Was it something the way I said it, maybe? Was it the, was she sensitive about something? Maybe, was she upset? He couldn't think of a single reason why she would be

upset by that conversation. So the next day, he called Tatiana to clear the air, but instead her mom picked up. Oh, sorry, Tatiana is not home, called again, and he had no idea that Tatiana was on the other side of the phone whispering to her mom, no, just telling her I'm not home. President-ji continued to call, till finally Tatiana picked up, and immediately he started apologizing to her that they were separated at the party. Well, I ran into an old friend, and they they wanted to leave so I couldn't really say bye to

you for a sorry. He really wanted to ask if he was a guy friend or a female friend but he was just like, when can I see you again? I don't know. How about Friday night? Sorry, I made other plans. When? Then?

Friday? Yeah. What about coffee tomorrow? I can't. I have to do something on Sproul Hall. I can meet you there. I don't know. Please, it would be nice to see you again.

Tatiana felt worn down, exhausted, she agreed, and they were to meet 3 p.m. at Sproul Hall. So, President-G, rushed to meet Tatiana who was holding this big envelope in her hand. At Tatiana, I'm so happy we could meet. Yeah. What kind of business brought you here? You don't even go here, right?

This. And she motioned to the envelope. It's an application to get into Berkeley. Oh, I didn't know you wanted to attend Berkeley. Okay, so inside note in India, in the areas that are not as privileged, and this applies to all over the world, let's be real, but women are not as educated. Parents don't find it as important to educate the girls, right? That's how he was raised. That's how he was brought up. And he said, Oh, the curriculum here is very rigorous, especially for a young lady. Why would it be harder for a girl?

It's not any more difficult, it's just that women do not need as much education as men. And she stopped dead in her tracks. I can't believe you just said that. No, no, no, I only meant that you need to be prepared for a very intense curriculum here. Silence. You-you seem kinda down today. Well, I'm not. You should be happy.

Be smiling, you know? I hate it when guys tell me to smile. Silence. And then Tatiana Ash who's walking turned and said, You really think I'll flunk if I get in? No, of course not. That's not what I was saying. I didn't mean to say such a thing. My grades are good enough, you know.

Yes Tatiana, it's clear that you have the aptitude. My dad doesn't want me to go though. And now, Pozongi felt powerful, he felt like he had the upper hand, she was in distress and he could help her. So he gave his advice. In my case, when I first spoke about pursuing higher studies in the United States, my mom was very skeptical. She said that I was a little kid dreaming about millions while sleeping on a mattress made of leaves. But all you need to do is trust

in yourself, Tatiana. You really think so? Yes. Even if my dad thinks I'm not smart enough to be here, he's probably just scared of losing you from home. That's how it was with my mother, but Berkeley is close to your house. Just give him time, he'll come around. And he used this opportunity to reach around her waist and rest his hand there. He was awkward, his movements were jerky, he was obviously nervous and she could see all of that. And I think she tried to turn him down in the nicest way possible. And she put her arm around his waist, gave him a quick squeeze and pulled away and said, you're a really good friend, you know. To pros and jeet, he didn't feel like he was friend-zoned.

He felt like this was the first meaningful interaction that they had ever had. He would think about this for weeks to come. Meanwhile, Tatiana would find Jeff Flanders numbers in the phone book and call him, see if he wanted to hang out, maybe go to dinner, a movie, but he's like, no, let's just Netflix and chill. So she went to his house, lied to her parents so that she was spending the night at Cindy's, but instead, she spent the night with Jeff. And in the morning, he was a pretty good gentleman, okay, he made breakfast, made some small talk

before Tatiana offered to leave, and he even offered her a bag of weed on the go. She declined, okay, and she tried to come up with another excuse to see him again, but it was clear to him this was a one night stand and he would never call Tatiana back. And she was really impacted by this. By the fact that after what she thought was a meaningful interaction, she was being treated like a booty call. She picked up every single phone call at home, hoping that it was Jeff, but it was always pros and jeet, and she always made up some excuse that she was sick and she couldn't

go. Tatiana felt frustrated. And now, some of you might think that when pros and jeet stole her bikini bottoms, that crossed the sick and she couldn't go. Tatiana felt frustrated. And now some of you might think that when pros and g stole her bikini bottoms, that crossed the line which he did. Don't get me wrong, but I think what he did next is more insane. He did this nagging suspicion that Tatiana was lying about being sick, so he went to her house, hid in the bushes, literally he skipped class to do this.

Wait until he saw Tatiana leave her house in jeans with her hair done, looking like she was going out Followed her for four blocks until she was stopped at the bus stop. Good day, huh? I'm happy to see that you're ever covered. Oh my god. What are you doing here? I was close by visiting the hardware store all the way over here Yeah, it's not that far besides I needed a particular tool. That was very hard to find. Oh Yeah, well still little sick. Do you mind if I stand, waiting for the bus with you? It's a free country, I guess. I thought you were too sick to live the house.

Yeah, but I still have errands to run. Then the bus came, they both boarded. Sorry, can't hang out, I'm in a rush to go meet a friend. No, I understand, Adriana, I'm on my way somewhere too. Who's your friend that you're meeting? No one you know. A friend from my house? No, what makes you think that everyone I hang out with lives in my house? Is it a boy or girl? What difference does it make? Well, I have something urgent that I need to talk to you about. Urgent? Yes, I've been waiting for a few days to talk to you about it. Okay?

My mother has been urging marriage. Marriage? Who are you marrying? I do not know. It will be arranged. Here, please take a look. And he handed her a lot of papers from newspapers called Times of India and there was a matrimonial section where there were photos and descriptions of women and his mother had circled a couple of names. Tatiana read it out loud.

Beautiful, convent-educated, East Bengali girl, 18 years old, good for well-established electrical engineer, 177 centimeters girl, 18 years old, good for well-established electrical engineer, 177 centimeters long, fair complexion. Wait, is this like a possible wife? Yes, there are only so many to choose from, my mother had made some selections. Your mother, that you mean your mom's gonna decide who you marry? Parent-plant marriage is a custom in my country. Oh my god, that's so dumb.

Pros and G was offended, he snatched the papers from her, and it's not for you to speak disrespectfully of my mother. Sorry, I'm not saying that your mom is dumb. I don't even know your mom. I just, I thought it was a weird custom, that's all. Sorry, I wasn't putting your mom down. Well, in my case, there will be no trouble fixing up a match. I will be in much demand.

I'm sure you will. But what about love? Don't you ever think about love? Love comes after marriage. OK, well, if that's what you believe, but what about love? Don't you ever think about love? Love comes after marriage. Okay, well if that's what you believe then you should just get married I guess. But I cannot ta-tiana. I've already committed myself to you. What? You don't even know me! I know you well enough. No you don't. Wait, are they on the bus talking?

So at this point they've gotten off the bus and they're like walking near campus. And she's like no you don't. It's you that I want to marry. Listen, we're friends. Good friends. But right now, the last thing on my mind is getting married. I can't go on like this. And he separated himself from Tatiana and started heading in a different direction.

He had hoped that she would run after him or stop him, but instead, when he finally looked back, she was long gone. Under normal circumstances, Pres and G was the type of student that liked to use any break to get ahead. But instead, now he was spending every single second in his dorm soaking about Tatiana. And when he went to class, he only half listened. He stopped showing up to work at Field Station. It's like everything that was the center of his life earlier, he lost complete interest

in all of them. And so after a while, you know, it seemed like President Jeet was about to move on. But okay, so listen, I know a lot of people might judge Tatiana for this, for what she's about to do next. And sure, you could argue that she was stringing him along or toying with his emotions, or that she didn't care how he felt. But honestly, she could have acted differently, yes. But nobody is perfect.

Like, haven't we all done things in our lives without considering other people's feelings? Like, we've all been selfish before. So when Tatiana was at a low point in her life, Jeff had never called her back. She felt really insecure and incredibly lonely and she just wanted some comfort. And it wasn't right, but she asked to meet Prozenjy again. And he met her at a gas station

where Alex worked as a car mechanic. I guess just in case she needed backup. And they had some conversations about, you know, what had happened. And she's saying, let's give it another try as friends, you know? And before Prozenji could respond, Alex's voice rang out from under the car. Fuck.

And they rush over. And Alex, the car mechanic is super frustrated. He didn't understand why the car wasn't working. And so Pro over. And Alex, the car mechanic is super frustrated. He didn't understand why the car wasn't working. And so, President Jeet is like, maybe I can be of assistance. Well, it's not the fuel pump, but I already cleaned that, and I've cleaned the carburetors twice. I don't know what the problem is. Well, it must be the distributor cap.

President Jeet started tinkering around under the car before instructing Alex to turn it back on. And when the car started, Alex was super excited. He was patting him on the back, telling him how he's welcome to come over at any time. Pros and Jeet felt so happy about this genuinely. And this renewed his determination to pursue Tatiana because Alex was Tatiana's brother. And if Alex approved at him, that meant that Tatiana did. He saw Tatiana's family as an extension of her.

Mmm, let's see. So this time to not mess up, at least he thought in his mind he came up with a plan. To secretly record all of his conversations with Tatiana so that he could analyze them and study them later. That's how his mind worked. He thought this was completely normal. He bought one of those fancy mics that documentary filmmakers buy. It's an intense mic. And he started recording all the conversations they had in his dorm. There was even a moment where Tatiana came up to his dorm room having no idea that she was being recorded, and she said, you know, I'm sorry if I was mean to you, I've just

been depressed recently. Instead of being depressed or upset or worried that she was depressed, Prozenji was overjoyed at the fact that she was confiding in him. Tell me what happened. It's hard to explain. You can tell me. I don't know. There's this guy that I really cared about and he never called me back.

What? What are you saying? A guy I liked. I mean, who acted like he really liked me too? And we spent the night together once and then I never heard from him again. Pros and jeet felt his ears go red. He felt ashamed, humiliated. I would have done whatever you wanted. And then she started hysterically crying and then she looked into his eyes and said, you're really good friend.

I knew that talking to you would make me feel better. And in that moment, all that anger just left his body. And at the end of the night, Tatiana thanked him again and told him he made her feel so much better and then she went in to kiss him, a French kiss before leaving. Pros and G's world was spinning. For hours after she left, he was replaying their taped conversation, analyzing every word, every pause, every breath, interpreting every little thing to try and see if there was a deeper meaning, and from that day forward, a pattern of sorts emerged. Any time Tatiana would be anxious or lonely, whenever she second-guessed her chances of getting into Berkeley,

whenever she fought with her parents or her friends, whenever she felt not good enough, she would rush over. Prosenjiit would serve her cookies and make her tea and listen to whatever complaint was on her mind. She talked a lot about Jeff and how she felt that she had blown it with him. She talked about her dad and Berkeley and if Prosenji'd ever showed any discomfort about her complaining about another guy, she would get mad and she'd say, I don't know why you're

so upset, you're not my boyfriend. She would run mad and she'd say, I don't know why you're so upset, you're not my boyfriend. She would run out. And then the process would start all over again. I don't know, so Tatiana had really low self-esteem and I think that she believed if a man paid for her dinner or like a ticket to a movie or was very nice to her that she owed them a good night kiss.

So yeah, occasionally she would French kiss him. Whenever she felt thankful, she felt like that was her payment for him being nice and being listening to her. But he perceived it as, okay, well she's ready to get married because no girls in India kissed like that unless they're trying to marry you. He felt like they were basically betrothed. He even started keeping a diary where he charted when and how much time they spent together, logging every minute and every second that she was talking to him.

He was obsessively writing down facts about her, little excerpts from the clips that he had recorded their conversations, he even had this rough drawing of the dance floor in eye house, and where Tatiana was standing when he first laid eyes on her. He was just so obsessed with Tatiana. He spent days laying in bed thinking about her, listening to the tapes. He started skipping class. He started losing weight because he didn't even bother eating anymore. He was literally obsessed with her and he became more obsessed and it became so toxic.

He started accusing Tatiana of trying to sleep with his friends and when she denied it, he would blow up. And he would say things like, I will pull a switch, invent a bomb and blow you up. Whoa, whoa, whoa. And she would say, what? Fine, go ahead, do it, I dare you. I'm going to. Don't worry, the only thing stopping me is I might injure an innocent person.

She would say things like, you're sick, you know that? And she would run out of his room, but she never took the threat seriously. She knew that he worshipped her. She never believed he would ever hurt her. But she also couldn't stay away. I think for the first time in her life, even her family life, friend situations, just in general, this was the first time that Tatiana had the power in any sort of relationship. But one day, President-ji showed her his diary that, you know, with all the logged minutes,

he didn't show the audio recordings, but she started getting a little bit creeped out. She didn't understand the gravity of the situation, but she told her best friend Cindy, who was like, we gotta go to the police! I can't, it's fine, and I'm going to Brazil for the summer to stay with my aunt. So a few months away from me, I'm gone for like two months, I'm sure he's gonna move on. So she straight up told him, I'm leaving for vacation and before I start UC Berkeley, I'm going to Brazil for two months, which by the way, she got into UC Berkeley. And at this point, he was not gonna move on.

I mean, he was way past that. He was listening to distorted edited audio clips of her saying I love you over and over again. He was losing everything in his life. He was on the brink of being expelled from UC Berkeley for his lack of attendance and his abysmal grades, all of his friends knew that he was, he was spiraling, but the only one that knew how bad it was was his friend named Zhao. He knew about the secret recordings, the edited I love you audios, he knew it all, and it

wasn't until Pro Zenji told Zhao that he was going to kill Tanya for going to Brazil that he felt like he needed to do something about it. Prozenji was losing his mind. He told Jal desperately, I'm no longer even a human being, I'm like an animal, there's no longer anything inside of me, I can't even help myself. Jal started trying to convince him to go to therapy. But I don't want or need electro shock therapy. That's your misconception, President Jeet. Electro shock therapy is a bygone era, the

doctor has new methods to help you. Now I don't need that, my mind is strong enough. Well, you can tell you, the therapist can tell you why she's behaving this way. That got his attention. You mean he'll tell me why she says one thing a few days ago in the opposite later? Yes, these doctors have so much clinical experience they can give you inside. Well, he's still a stranger. What if he tells people what I'm thinking? Rappish, everything you say is confidential. They take his sacred oath to take your secrets to the grave. Jald didn't know if this was true, okay? But it seemed like this was the only way to get his friend help. So with that, Jald dragged President Jeet to the local

Cowell Hospital and the first psychiatrist he was assigned was Dr. Gold. Dr. Gold was a strange one. First, Ja was in the room, filling the doctor, and on everything. The secret recordings, the distorted, I love you, everything. And finally, the doctor was like, oh, well, can I have a moment alone with President Jeet?

Where President Jeet said he didn't even want to be here. He only came because his friend Ja was harassing him about it, and Ja was a bad guy who wanted to steal Tatiana away from him. No way. Are you sure your friend seems to be helping you or at least wanting to help you? No. At the dance he came up and introduced my girlfriend to this boy because he wanted the boy to date her. He's trying to split us up.

Wow, do you know that? She told me about it. Are you sure she's telling the truth? I know that they're all laughing at me, that's what I know. It's all part of his plot to steal her away. Literally after the first meeting, Dr. Gold made his diagnosis. He said, okay, inappropriate smiling, check. Preoccupation to the girl to the exclusion of everything, check.

History of withdrawal from society, check, eating disorder, check, loss of sleep, check, delusional aspect to his relationships, check, all right, I'm gonna diagnose him with paranoid schizophrenia. Dr. Gold briefly thought about hospitalizing him, but decided outpatient treatment would be better. And at least Tatiana was in Brazil, the doctor hoped that his feelings would fizzle out during that time with the help of outpatient therapy.

But the more prosangit continued, the more alarmed the therapist would start to get. He would say things like, the thing is, I know that she loves me, but she just won't admit it, you know? I don't know, I just know. Dr. Gold was not interested in getting to the bottom of this feeling. He just prescribed some meds and threw proscenji to another doctor. Dr. Gold was a higher up, and he couldn't be bothered with treating proscenji to his

little girl problems. So income's Dr. Moore. And for a while, Dr. Moore was able to make progress with Prosenjeet. That is till Alex came back into the picture. Now Alex blamed himself for a lot for this, but there's no reason for him to because it's not his fault. He had no idea that Prosenjeet was this obsessed with his sister. Alex asked Prosenjeet if he could help him fix a car.

And when he said, yes, the two developed a friendship of sorts and they bought an apartment together. Well, they rented an apartment together. So they moved in and now they were roommates and President Jeet was over the moon. Strangely enough for him, being around Alex was nearly as euphoric as being around Tatiana. It was a connection to her, the closest one, family.

In his mind, he felt like, yes, he and Tatiana were separated in distance, but they were connected through family. Whenever he tried to slip in any questions or conversations about Tatiana, though, Alex would shut it down. He'd be like, bro, just go meet some other tricks. Why do you even care so much about my sister? She's not even that great. You know that she doesn't want you.

Stop bothering her. But he would always counter with, I would make a good husband and Alex would just roll his eyes All of this him moving in with Alex would lead to pros and g Believing that he had a strong chance in marrying Tatiana Dr. Moore noticed that pros and g It was always one step forward two steps back He would say things like I know that she's behind the plan that Alex and I moved in together

She put him up to it. I'm sorry. What are you saying? I just know how her mind works. She wants me to live with her brother, so when she comes back from Brazil, she can move in with us. Mr. Pudarr, you've got me confused. I thought we were making progress. Dr. Moore was exhausted. Meanwhile, Prosenji went with Alex to buy a gun, but because he wasn't an American citizen, he ended up purchasing an airsoft gun, which can't necessarily kill someone. It's like a BB gun. In most cases, I mean, it hurts a lot. You're gonna have a lot of waltz, and it's gonna be incredibly painful. And I'm sure it could cause lifelong injuries.

And I'm sure if you use it very specifically in a very certain situation, you could kill someone, but it's definitely not as deadly as a real gun, right? Alex even told him almost in a bragging way. If you aim the gun and hit the squirrel in the eye, the BB gun, the BB pellet, will go through the eye into the brain killing the squirrel. Pros and G even talked to his therapist about hurting Tatiana and teaching her a lesson. It was so alarming that Dr. Moore went against his boss's wishes and informed the police

department and the police came to interview Pros and Gete but he's smart. I mean the guy is smart. He joked around about how in India murder leads to decapitation and he had no plans to lose his head anytime soon. He showed off his mechanical gadgets, he talked about how he's overtotiana, it was just a bit of a phase. The police ate it up. They let the situation go.

Meanwhile, Prozenjit concluded that his therapist could no longer be trusted. Which side note, Dr. Moore was about to lose his job anyway. His bosses were pissed. They thought Dr. Moore had lost his mind, reporting all of this to the police, and now losing their practice a patient in return. Wow. So Tatiana gets back from Brazil and goes to a housewarming party at Alex and prosangite's

house. And she does not have to prosangite. He doesn't talk to her, he's trying to act casual, but she thought this was like the perfect time to show him that she'd moved on. She started talking to her friend loudly about how she had met a guy in Brazil, and how he was going to come fly to see her and she was very serious about him. And then finally Tatiana's friend Cindy had had enough. She stared at present Jeet and said, why are you always following her around?

She doesn't like you. She despises you, she doesn't want anything, Why are you always following her around? She doesn't like you. She despises you. She doesn't want anything to do with you. Leave her alone. President Jeet didn't scream. He didn't seem angry or heard. He just stood there like a lost puppy. He looked at Tatiana.

I just want to know once and for all how you feel about me. I told you I'm not interested. And Cindy screamed, Fuck off, you creep! And this was the beginning of the end. Alex came home later to find Prozenji completely broken, curled up in a fetal position. Maybe you can invite your sister to come and talk to me, I love your sister. What?

Even if I invite her, she wouldn't come. I'll be done with all of this once I talk to her one more time please. No, Prozenji, it's not gonna do any good. Prozenji pleaded and Alex started to get frustrated. You're upsetting my sister, you're scaring her, you're scaring my mom, everyone just let it go. And he got so riled up, he punched prosengi in the stomach and left the apartment in anger.

prosengi never fought back. He only laid their crying, whispering, no, please don't go. But Alex left and now he had lost everything. Later that day, he rushed to Tatiana's house and her mom opened the door. She refused to let him talk to her and even told him to go back to India

or else my husband will come home and beat you up. She was not proud of what she did. In the next day, Prozenji would come back to the house while Tatiana was completely alone and he would knock on the door. I want to talk to you. Well, I don't want to talk to you and my dad's gonna be home any moment you should leave.

He's going to kill you if he finds you here. I must talk to you. I said no. As she tried to close the door, he shoved it open with a violent shove. And he looked at Tatiana who looked back at him in fear and she started screaming. He was pleading with her, just stop screaming and listen,

but she wouldn't. And so he pulled out his baby gun and fired it into the air, which made her scream even more. But once he fired once, he couldn't stop. He started firing everywhere, not just at the ceiling, non-stop until the air was foggy. And Tatiana had been shielding her face with her hands. And finally, the gun clicked empty. He looked down to see Tatiana covered in waltz and she was screaming trying to run away.

He tried to stop her. He pulled out his knife and said it was like slicing something smooth. There was no resistance. And the screaming kept going. He just wanted the screaming to stop. He could feel something warm splattering all over his body and his face. And he could see blood trickling down her legs and onto the floor as she tried to run. There were bloody footprints everywhere and finally he saw Tatiana run out the front door

and collapse on the grass. He ran out and kept stabbing her until finally he got to his feet. Looked around, at the bloody footsteps leading out of the house, and a little boy was staring at him through the bushes. He calmly got up, walked into the terrace of home, called the police. He said he stabbed his girlfriend and she needed immediate medical care now. When the police came, he was calm. He said, handcuffed me, please.

I killed her. Tauting on the terrace of was pronounced dead at the hospital. She died from eight major stops to the chest, abdomen and back. She was six weeks pregnant at the time of death. She died from shock and hemorrhaging. Prozenji was arrested for first degree murder. He was found guilty of second degree murder and sentenced to five years to life in a medical facility for the criminally insane. He appealed his case. A new trial was ordered, but they would never have one. The authorities

compromised with him if he agreed to leave America and never return, they would not prosecute him. He moved back to India, whereas father arranged a marriage for him and he later moved to Germany with his wife to study at a prestigious institution, and according to his friend, Gell, he is leading a very normal life with his wife and daughter. Meanwhile, the Teresau family sued the city of Berkeley as well as the university for failing to warn them that Prozenji was threatening the life of their daughter to his own psychiatrist. At first the lawsuit was dismissed, but within appeal the case was taken to the California Supreme Court, and it was now known as Tarisaw v. Regents of the University of California. And it is actually a landmark case.

So every state has their own laws about this, but this is the reference case. Starting one. Yeah, so everyone references terrace off to put it into law that all mental health professionals have a duty to warn, a duty to protect. So if they have reason to believe that a patient may inflict harm, the mental health professional has legal duty to warn the intended victim, friends, relatives, and authorities without being worried that breaking the confidentiality of their patient would result in a loss license. So all the states have changed rules to say that now. That protective privilege ends where public peril begins. And this is the story that cost.

Wow, I've just never heard a story like this. Yeah, it's a terrifying case, honestly, and it's so unsettling. How does someone go from being so laser-focused their whole life to just snapping? And it was in such an unexpected way. You know, most people do think that he does have paranoid schizophrenia,

and it just started to show symptoms as he developed this obsession with Tatiana and the obsession was probably a result of his schizophrenia as well. What are your thoughts? And please stay safe out there and I'll see you guys on Sunday for the mini-suit. Bye!