Sad Boyz - Hollywood Is In Danger (w/ Demi Adejuyigbe)

Episode Date: June 16, 2023

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Welcome to Sad Boys, a podcast about feelings and other things also. I'm Jarvis. I'm Jordan. And today we're joined by, I would say, a special guest. He's a writer, performer, comedian, general funny man, musician also randomly. What's that about? Dibby a didgy weeby. Hello. Honestly, a special guest. Yeah. Thank you so much. All your other guests are shit is what I'm here for.

Yeah, that's right. We're really excited just to have a guy. We've been pulling people off the street and they're not interested. How do you feel? Yeah. Tell us about your feelings. Hey, look over me. How are you doing, bud?

I'm doing all right. June gloom. June gloom. It's embarrassing to walk around just being like, shouldn't it be sunny? i feel like i just started getting up earlier which is as an adult just an embarrassing thing to admit it's like i'm trying out this new thing of being awake in the morning we hang out with a bunch of degenerate streamers who like wake up at 2 p.m right it makes me feel very well adjusted for them to just be like hey they have i can't remember who said it they admitted to having gay nightclub hours of getting ready at midnight to head out at about 2 a.m that i i mean i i've never done that level

of it but i feel like there will be times where i'm like well this party's not gonna start till 11 so i'll just you know i'll roll up at 11 and now i'm like i'm going to bed at 11 waking up at 9 30 and i'm like great the world's gonna be open and everything's gonna happen like happen for me and then i go out it's like it's still cloudy i don't yeah i was promised right going crazy this is not right it's not this is wrong it's so great it shouldn't be like this in los angeles it's not it's still like what a beautiful place but it's like give me some right i do feel like this is a very like la inside baseball conversation but la weather has been kind of weird for a year i i feel yeah it's been like rainy strangely my house flooded in january oh you know okay yes i so i uh end of january i had to go to puerto rico for work for

three months and four days before i left i went to see a movie with friends came home and saw my dog on the lower level of my house. Just like I was. And I saw some water. I was like, how'd you get down here? And why are you, did you pee?

And then I looked up and was like, Oh no, there's a lot of water. Did you pee a lot? I was just like, buddy, what happened? Then he looks up at me like,

almost like he's like, I don't know what's going on. There's a lot of water. And then I, I walked in. He's on a plank of wood. Yeah. He's just like,

I, I've never drank this before. But then I walked down the hall and I just see there's water everywhere and i i think i have this sort of panic response where something is so bad that it's like uh i it's like it should break me down i just start laughing i'm just like this is insane this is right you have to believe this is hilarious and i just couldn't stop laughing and i was like taking photos and sending it to my girlfriend she'd be like well i'm i'm living in fucking titanic now like it was wild and i just couldn't stop laughing and i was like taking photos and sending it to my girlfriend she'd be like well i'm living in fucking titanic now like it was wild and i was like well i guess i gotta because i was hopping on a plane to take my dog to texas with my parents like in four hours oh and then i was like okay so i'm gonna come back quickly after that just to deal with the

house and then go off to puerto rico but yeah houses in la aren't built for the amount of rain that was happening in January. The coldest winters I've ever had in my life were after moving to LA. Because indoors is the same as outdoors. Nothing's insulated. So my old Pico Union apartment, I was just like, I just... Also, I think they illegally just didn't have heating of any kind. But I just had two heaters right next to me and was editing podcasts, sat on the couch with those heaters for, I would say, three and a half months.

Just sat. It's insane. Unsustainable. Nothing flooded. I'm not like a loser. No, that'd be crazy. Yeah. Because that's like a you problem.

If things flood. Kind of cringe. Kind of? What? It was very much like. In my defense, I saying Poseidon. Well, yes,

I did. You know, I pissed off the, the Navi and they sent a flood. I will say days before that I had watched, uh, I watched avatar and this is, it's not related.

I watched avatar. And you're like, this is the way of the water. And this, I try, the thing is like, I watched avatar in theaters and then the screener for the WJ came. I was like,

I'm gonna just watch it in my home. I know James Cameron wouldn't like that, but I'm going to do it. And then the next day it flooded. And I was like, I watched Avatar in theaters and then the screener for the WJ came. I was like, I'm gonna just watch it in my home. I know James Cameron wouldn't like that, but I'm going to do it. And then the next day it flooded and I was like, oh, he knows. He sent the water. He knows. Dammit, I know you watched it on your phone in low light. You're not supposed to do that. It's 3D.

You go to the theater. You knew I was in my little submarine. What do you do in the event of a flood? Great question. submarine what do you do in the event of a flood great question uh so for me the first thing was checking to see if my insurance covered it my home insurance specifically said we do not cover floods and i was like to point that out it's fucking insane like let's just get this out of the way no flood it's like okay i'm always like did you send did you say that knowing you were going to send a flood open the document real fast and it like popped in yeah like it was just you see the cursor miss phil yeah no flawed um but i and then i was just like okay i'm gonna call like a

remediation team to come in and drag the water out and then they got a test for mold and the the thing is like they had to like rip up the floorboards too and they were like we don't put floorboards back in so i had to call someone else to do that it truly was like they're like oh no mold i was like great are you gonna put it back whoa hey that's not that's a different guy toothpaste in the tube bro yeah sorry it's a different union um but and then i had to it was all like, cause I was in Puerto Rico just making calls like, Hey, can you do this? How much? Okay, sure. And then, uh, yeah.

And then I had no choice in this matter. Really? Yeah. And, uh, and then later, like it happened a few more times over the course of the next two months. And I just, like, I had friends staying there at that point and I was just kind of like, uh, Hey, if this happens, take photos and send it to me, I'm going to get new insurance that specifically covers floods.

Yeah. But then I just bought like the last time i happened i bought like four dehumidifiers and a bunch of towels and just fucking put them down being like this will fix it and kept having to have people come to the house and be like what why did this happen and every person told me something different and i was right i just didn't figure out what it was yeah wow they're very experiences uh like that with professionals like true true trade professionals or even medical professionals and it's so messy that it almost feels like a cure for imposter syndrome yeah i'm like oh you don't know we're like a guy in a suit comes like weird i'm like what weird this is your job that You see, it's all time. I agree.

It's weird. Yeah. I had upstairs some issues with my light fixture, and someone came out to fix it. And I was downstairs here on a call with Anastasia, and I lost internet connection. And my router, the modem is plugged in upstairs. So I was like, oh, they must have taken out power temporarily because they were working on the light that made sense to me and then as they were leaving they're like all fixed and i was like hey the power's out and he was like huh no it's not no it's not yeah i was like wait no it is and then he kept, and I, like, the guy was from Russia,

which isn't relevant except for the fact that, like, there was a bit of a language barrier where I, like, didn't fully understand what he was saying. But he just came out of the room going, I don't know. I didn't touch it. And I was like, what do you mean you didn't touch it? It's literally what you were touching. It's also like, if they're just like, you're going to have to call someone.

It's like, but I, you, I would call you. You're supposed to know. You flooded it. Yeah. You did this. You did this, James. You came in with a big bucket of water. Yeah.

Yeah. That was, that was wild. And then fortunately it was an easy fix. But for a time I was concerned that they were going to leave me without power. And I was going to leave me without power and i was going to be like uh who now who would i call the one thing i will say is i do feel like when you get enough of those scenarios you start to learn more about a house and like how to work it and i feel like i just i've become like like a diy genius or i'm just sort of like no i can figure

this out without killing myself accidentally like electrical stuff but i i do feel like like just the other day i had a problem with my gas and some guy came and was like i'm gonna tell you something that i shouldn't tell you because it makes us a lot of money people don't know it but do this and i was like good to know and i'm just like mentally going oh here's all the things you got to do right that's no that i am starting to watch toilet tutorials when my toilet is how to use yeah like i'm where is it i keep missing the toilet and that's why i don't think i got potty trained as a kid well it's the opposite of basketball you don't want to aim for the backboard right yeah i keep trying to lob it in even when it's just creating a mess

be honest you can just go straight i just go straight in okay if you don't want the extra pizzazz points there's there's you have the dunk contest for poop um the i'm getting or i've learned that there are so many toilet youtubers or plumbing guys on youtube who have a plumbing business like a local plumbing business but they're like people always have these problems let me just make a video and it makes sense it makes perfect sense and it's just it is exactly the same as somebody with a bunch of camera knowledge explaining the new sony cameras yeah but somebody with a ton of plumbing knowledge going let me show you how to break open a gibraltar 5000 or whatever i think

that's cool like that's the good side of the internet like the democratization of information where it's someone just being like i know a lot about this and i live like in this area let me just get online and spread this information to people who need it and it's like and you make money that way and it just feels like you can learn anything you want to off of youtube so i'm just being like yeah i know how to clean gutters on this specific car and you can just look it's great yeah it's no it's very cool it's yeah i do think there's generally an assumption that if a skill set's very specific and niche yeah then it is impossible to learn or get access to as opposed to just to have it's niche because there's fewer people that need to do it.

But like complicated cottage industries, it's still complicated. Totally. That's also the benefit. Yeah. I mean, even camera YouTubers. Oh yeah.

How many fucking people need to figure out the logistics of a camera? Right. A couple hundred in the world. Yeah. It's really not that many. It's really interesting one time i uh was watching a small camera youtuber whose footage on youtube looked incredible so i just dm'd him and i was like what are your settings tell me about your specific setup i want it for myself my favorite youtube tutorials are the ones that it's all breathing

it's about five minutes of so what do you guys first what you need to know is um so the computer is i think maybe the volume is low i'm just gonna it's the um it's the bit and then you put it on 2x and you start speaking faster anyway so then it's too fast. They always have an intro that's like very intense. And you're like, this doesn't match this. Steven Tech Tutorials. What up, guys?

It's Steven Tech Tutorials. Make sure to hit that like and hit that subscribe. And by the way, we have a merch giveaway going on right now. I'm like, why do you? Can you please just tell? It's like. You scan forward and it's like anyway thanks for watching what the fuck we're in this is the information there's that uh it's like a

super old tweet where it's it's like a suit you know like you see the screenshots that have aged over time oh yeah they're like super deep artifact it was uh yeah the artifacting um it was like at youtube uh why are you putting a pre-roll ad? Why is a pre-roll ad playing right now? My grandmother is choking. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. Signing up for premium.

I mean, in their defense, like, why are you looking that up? Why are you looking up a video as a joke? Oh, God. Oh, God. How to Heimlich. How you spell Heimlich? Oh, Godimlich oh yeah hey what's going on guys welcome to heimlich camera tutorials yeah i'm about to lick a ham today

what do we keep watching the same one do you ever get um speaking of talking to experts i would much rather like look up a guide myself or watch a video than talk to a human being on the phone. Yeah. I, that's very generational. I think I'm the same way, but I realized in, maybe this is like a little bit of the older generation of me, like seeping in when I was a child, I would call the Nintendo hotline to get help in video games so i was clearly when i was motivated enough i was willing to talk to somebody or i didn't have any social anxiety as a child where i was just like i can't find the great fairy fountain can someone please explain also there's like no resources yet yeah you can't go on the internet because i had like

terrible dial-up totally someone was on the phone and i wasn't allowed to use the internet calling up asking how to like find an easter egg and win wake up but being like my grandma's joking i don't have time tell me where it is right now yeah i feel like i i've always been someone who prefers to look up and i don't know where that comes from maybe it is just i feel like as a kid i would be worried that like talking to it's like there are rules you are almost just like when you socialize it's like you're supposed to do this and this and this and i was always afraid that like i'm gonna miss one of those rules and make someone feel bad or something like the schema of like the the recipe of a conversation where you're supposed to end up learning wrong things exactly but i think that i really do think that and i'm like

i think that is extended to me as an adult being like, if I have to talk to someone in person, it's like, it's not this thing that's like, I hate doing it, but I do just, the anxiety comes from, I don't want to leave an impression of being like a dick on accident.

And then I start thinking like, okay, what, what are the things I need to do to leave a good impression here? And then it just starts to feel like, well, all of these interactions are a weight. Yeah.

I think we all work in spaces and industries where you do have big focus chunks of having to communicate as like concisely and successfully as possible. But then you also have a lot of solo time where you're relying on yourself for delivering the thing you needed to do. And you alone have to do it though. It's really a way of reaching out. And sometimes I,

it switching gears is a little challenging. Like, well, I've been at home only thinking about this project for 10 hours. I guess now I'll check in and send it to someone and they can give their feedback. And I'm like, but,

but there'll be so pissed. I'll send them something. Are you serious? But I'm scum'm i haven't showered i'm dirty yeah how you uh compose the email in a way that's like sorry to bother you yeah i'm an idiot and i'm so stupid and bad hey by the way i'm insane but could we like move the meeting by five minutes or whatever yeah it's like always a small ask yeah uh oh yeah 15 minute intro section yeah uh dimmy like so for the people who don't know you, would you say you're a writer by trade?

Yes. I do feel like that's the thing that I define my career by. Because, yeah, you've written for countless shows that people know and love. And an important part of the current moment right now is that there is a writer's strike going on. Correct. Yeah. And you don't agree with this stuff. Yeah.

I think they should let us write. Again. AI should replace. I'm tired. Yeah. This strike's too scary. Yeah. I don't want to stand up.

I'm not supposed to be outside. I'm supposed to be in a basement somewhere. This sign is heavy. That's what it says. I mean, that would be a good sign i won't give you credit for it i don't know oh shit it's ai um the the back has like a executive producer of like a billionaire like doesn't do any work they're all made by so yeah like we've talked a little bit about the writer's strike but like if you could like maybe give like a little brief synopsis in your

own words or what your own experience has been like. Yeah. It's hard to give the briefest synopsis cause there's so many different things that every person is like, here's why I'm striking. But in general, it's like there is a guild of the bait major studios called the AMPTP. And they basically,

it's like all of the theatrical or big releases are, are like produced by them. And at the bottom of the chain of like creation, everything starts with the writers. And so you think it's like, okay, they're getting fair compensation for their work. They are being treated well and like given the respect to create work well. And just be, I think with streaming as like a new invention in the industry things that were decided back when it was like we had networks and we had ad buys where it's like you know how much a show is being watched and therefore you can be compensated right according to your success all of that is kind of like died yeah and so uh as the industry

has changed over like last 15 years the writers have not been compensated well because streamers don't want to reveal their numbers. And they are like, well, we have so much- Streamers, which in our space might mean a little different. Sorry, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is like your Netflix is your Hulu. Yeah, Netflix, Hulu, even Apple, Amazon,

all of the streaming networks, basically. And their whole thing is like, we have data. We don't need to rely as much on writers and we don't need to take as many risks and all this stuff. And it means that basically writing as a profession is slowly being like pushed out or smushed so that the only people who can continue to like work future of like our career and not have it be sort of pushed out by them using ai as a tool to not just replace us but just kind of be like we don't need as much of your input we're just going to give you like an outline or an idea of what we need and just write that uh we're striking for more people to be hired on shows because

there's a lot of times where they do this thing called a mini room where it's basically like when they're like we like this idea but we're not sure about it we're gonna put together a room of people to basically write the season and then we'll decide if we want it and then it's like if they do decide they want it they don't have to hire those people they can just be like well you wrote the outline so we're gonna just hire this one guy and he'll write the entire show which means you get worse shows that way and yeah like they they are basically making people write these long seasons in very short amounts of time so you don't get a lot of uh good work out of that and it's like i think a lot of people look at the industry over the last couple of years and they're just sort of like god everything that's coming out now is just reboots and remakes and all this shit and it sucks

and i they should just replace writers with ai because it's all like crap anyway and i'm like i think if you don't like what's happening in the industry right now then you're probably on our side as well because a lot of that is the result of them being like right risk averse and scared of like they're like we have data that it's like first of all when you think about the entertainment industry it's like a lot of these things are happening because back in like the 90s there weren't as many options for entertainment as there are now. So it's like, yeah, they'd be like, well, yeah, make a movie. We don't care what it is, but now it's like, they're like, we need a guaranteed hit. We're going to just do another star Wars. And everything is like, so it's almost like over-indexed on analytics. It seems like the

outside looking in because it is so much like, if you look at movies like, it seems. Yes, absolutely. From like the outside looking in, because it is so much, like if you look at movies like, or if you look at Netflix, it seems like they're especially bad for this, where they niche down to such a specific demographic that they're going for for a project. They're like tall girl. It's going to be a movie about-

Totally. Four tall girls by tall girls. And even the way that movie- Written by a short guy, actually. Probably. I think it literally is, because I worked on a video on it that I scrapped. And who knows better about tall girls than tall girls. And even the way that movie. Written by a short guy, actually. Probably. It, I think it literally is. Cause I was, I worked on a video on it that I scrapped.

And who knows better about tall girls than short guys? Yeah. Yeah. That's true. They know them from a different angle. Correct. The lowest. And it's like,

also just like all that stuff is very, it's data driven to the point of like them being like, here's what you need to capture an audience at this point. And in 15 minutes, it needs to be this and this and this. Yeah. Cause like they have data data of when people stop watching and they don't want to make things anymore

that feel like it is based on creativity or even just the idea of someone having a vision and making a thing. Or cultural cachet. You can't. So we used to work in tech. And one of the things that I remember from a meeting about, this is the first job of my career was like at yelp and i remember looking it was like some sort of product

meeting where we were looking at graphs and someone was taught i said the phrase you can't iterate yourself to a product vision because the whole thing was like oh if we just slightly tweak the color of this button and the way that this looks it'll slightly get us a tiny little lift in user engagement but like that doesn't create an overarching vision in much in the same way as if you're trying to take an individual episode of a show and just get engagement you're gonna no offense to what mr beast is doing but you're going to like MrBeastify it where it's like only trying to like, like grab attention at all. And it doesn't like, that's where it stops because that's where the metrics stop because we don't have metrics for how good something makes someone feel or how much something, someone endears someone to a story or something like that. And they don't really, the thing is they're not caring about that anymore because they are just

kind of like, well, we got the, like we have the numbers and we're you know we're selling to our investors based on the idea of how many people are watching we need subscribers and all this thing and what they want now is something called a second screen experience where it's like they want content that can just be existing in the background and it's not doesn't require investment to watch i remember reading about emily and paris being a good example of that for netflix like this is from the investors side yeah where they with regard to the second screen experience because it's a low it was like a low budget show to create but it like sits in the background for a lot of households a very reliable demographic rely for a reliable demographic

and it's like a silent it's like a sleeper like young sheldon type hit where it's like okay this is extremely popular but i have never met someone who's like actually watching it and it's like it's one of those utility of a csi absolutely that's what they want a fifth of the price on with a slightly more i guess slightly more neat niche audience totally and it's like it's the kind of thing where it's like someone will probably watch it even if they're like this sucks because it's like it all comes out at once it's such a low investment it's just like it's content that they will watch and it's like i i want to reiterate there's nothing inherently wrong with that like content is valuable as is television but it's like the idea of like once things become more of a content like driven industry, then it just starts to feel like,

well then the creators are being pushed out when it's like, we don't need as many of you guys. Yeah, absolutely. The first thing to be sacrificed is always the creative portion, especially since like Netflix really benefits from being so decentralized to the point where like they're just net. The corporation is the thing we point to.

Totally. Never is like a name of an executive or something reference because a most people don't know and b that team is so big and vague yet when we have to criticize a streaming platform we kind of just criticize streaming platforms as an ideology and then you know you go on imdb if you want to do criticism and the first two listings are the top build and the writer slash everything above the line and then you just have to be yelled at because the the rise of skywalker script was made when a project is bad the writers get blamed when a project is good it it rarely is like oh those writers hell yeah it's

very much like the people who get blamed when something sucks is the writers. Yeah. And unless you are like the biggest name, you rarely get credit for a project success, even though it's like, it starts with you. And when a project is bad, it rarely, it's like no one writes a script and then they send it off. It's like, we're going to shoot exactly this. It gets changed so many ways.

And it's like, a lot of people are like, well, I'm glad that this thing sucked because that writer sucks. And it's like, I don't think that what you saw on the screen is what they turned right also something was good to have gotten here yeah it doesn't mean everything they've done is incredible but it is not it is serviceable material and sometimes they're out shit something happens sometimes they're easy to work with and that's why they continue to work and it's like because they won't uh like fight when a producer is like what if this scene was set to a rap song or whatever um yeah i guess i i don't want it to come off like we're sort of doing the like content elitism where like some content is better than

others it's more about the the sort of analyticsy thing driving all content to be like more cookie cutter and less risky. And I think you correct me if I'm wrong, but you know, historically, especially in the age of Netflix, there's been a huge, um, there's been a huge growth in shows that people become invested in getting canceled before they resolve because show shows in these third seasons or whatever don't end up getting the engagement in numbers as much as the first season and so I feel like a lot of Netflix shows that people love like your sense eights and stuff of the world end up like getting cut early without any because they're just kind of like well we put them all out at once and so we have the data of how many people are watching it immediately and if it's not enough they're not going to sit around and wait just being like well

we'll hope it picks up steam in a couple months they're just like well we see the data it's not enough you can do something cheaper at least a little more transparency for the creative teams as far as the number no they they do not we do not get numbers we do not get engagement at all there's none and it's uh frustrating and i that's one of the things that i think is the reason this strike is still going on is because a lot of people are like a lot of the things that we are asking for uh i think that for studios to do it easily does require them to be up front with their engagement numbers and they just don't want to right my theory is because they've been lying about it for a while but i think some of it is also just them being like we don't want to say what's a success and what's not because then we have to like we're

responsible right to our advertiser to our investors to all of these people that we don't we would rather just sort of be able to control it's a very opaque industry even in our space with like yeah numbers and pay for like advertising and stuff like that deliberately so as well like don't get me wrong we do have specific restrictions on what we're allowed to talk about especially when it comes to private advertisements and stuff which makes complete sense yeah but on the other side i think they're uh for as long as i've been watching youtube there's a little bit of like kind of deliberate ambiguity as to like yeah hey i'm just a regular i'm just playing some video games just a guy like i put out a video every single day with 500 000 views because i'm playing sonic every day but hey man i'm just a gamer that's just multi multi billionaire right you're

like the camera's gotten better over the course of watching this. Why is Ryan Reynolds guesting on this video? There's a big echo on your thing. The room is larger. I guess Tom, like Hayden Ross streaming to like in his $20 million mansion with no furniture. So the echo is insane. It's to no account if you taste with that kind of stuff. And it's with like streaming networks also,

they like, because they don't have advertising, all of the like decision of like what counts as a success or like what they're looking for is just on subscribers and it's so weird because it's like they release three shows a week and if the subscriber count goes up it's like well how do we know what's responsible for it and it just feels like there's no concrete way for the creators or the audience to understand what a success is besides them saying, yeah, it was big. And you're like, okay, okay. So can we, and it's like, great. Does that mean we get another season? It's like, maybe.

We don't know. Who's to say? Hey man. I remember seeing some posts from like some of the like oranges, the new black actors who were like and oh and i should say that so the writers guild of america was the first to start striking yes and then sag the screen actors guild uh began or at least uh voted yes i'm also a part of sag although i act way less uh but yeah we voted to authorize a strike which basically means if they go to the table and a deal is not reached, then they will strike, I think, at the end of June. The DGA, the Directors Guild, they did not vote to strike, but they did reach a tentative deal.

But I think the way the DGA works is now all of the members of the DGA, the Directors Guild. Sorry, I feel like I start using acronyms and then I'm not like, is someone to this being like too many letters no no no it is it is like tech in that way yeah once they once they lock in you know because the ga is always the same there's too many yeah um but the director's guild basically votes after a deal has been reached if they want to ratify the deal or if they're like no this sucks get a better deal um but yeah it is a very tumultuous time what is the sentiment right now is that one i mean i think the general sentiment is fuck these studios trying to screw over people uh and it's like they're it's so we're very lucky to even have a union and like it feels like i'm

very glad to be part of multiple unions that are fighting for our rights as creatives and performers because there are so many there are parts of this industry that still are not unionized and that really sucks like there is there's a very very large uh a brand a big union called iotsy basically that it's like pretty much every other part of the industry it's like not performers not writers not producers not directors but then there are different like sub guilds within that and uh like there it's like every other person that's on a set is usually in IOTC. But then there are even within IOTC, there are people who it's like VFX people are not unionized.

And there's multiple heavily abused, heavily abused. And it sucks. And I feel bad because it's like, you see a lot of the sentiment from the writers or with regards to the writer's strike from people who work in vfx being like oh why why are they like getting to do this and we aren't and it's like it's first of all i want to say like i think a lot of people look at the writer's strike and they're just like oh they all get paid so much anyway why like why do they think they deserve

even more money and it's like i think everyone deserves to be paid way more like i think teachers like i'm glad whenever i feel like a teacher's union goes on strike i think vfx i wish they could unionize i think that they can't unionize because a it's a lot of remote work so there's no having to be in person and b if they did unionize all those jobs would be shipped overseas and so it's very hard for them to find the motivation to be like let's stop working and try and make sure we're getting treated fairly even though they are very heavily, both on set and after production is done. Well, the sentiment of if them, why not me is just, that is the most successful corporate propaganda in human history.

The number of guilds that have voted against themselves or just refused to be formed or the number of states or I just say like uh constituencies that pushed against say bernie yeah because they got their health care through uh like three generations of striking for that health care as opposed to just getting better free health care totally but but everybody gets it or an industry of uh an industry dedicated to busting unions or like corporate infiltration of like these uh of people trying to uh uh collectively bargain it's wild that it is legal like like yeah you can literally do corporate sabotage they can send a 007 in to pretend to be a part of the guild and then just start like the same diarrhea and all the food the same people that uh that wizards of the coast oh yeah sent to

that one guy this is a story we talked about like uh a couple weeks ago months ago where um this small creator who like just opens up magic the gathering cards online was uh mistakenly sent an unreleased box of cards uh early by like a month so like not even that big a deal and uh he made a video about it and they sent the pinkertons to his house oh my god and like the pinkertons have a history of like violent union busting right and like assassination of like uh leaders of of um of unions and stuff they sound like the watchman jesus christ yeah so so they got a bunch of backlash for that obviously but still um yeah it's a it's a wild time but it is cool to see so much um attention being brought to it yeah Yeah. It's fantastic. It really, it's like

the change that's happening. Like, I think a lot of people do have the feeling of like, okay, the higher paid writers are striking for more money. And it's like, not really, we're kind of striking for the new generation of creatives. It's like, I'm not out there because I'm like, I want more money. I'm out there because I want the ability, like you go out and you talk to people and it's like, how do I become a writer? And you kind of go like, I don't know anymore. It feels hard to get in. And you want the door to be open and you want the opportunity for more stuff to be made. And you want it to be made fairly.

You don't want to sort of have this feeling that it's like, you're going to get in here, but it's going to fucking suck. You're going to get your dream job and you're going to hate it. Also, you want, I mean, I don't want to put words in your mouth but like i personally would like to see uh more people working in these jobs having a share of the absolutely yes equity residuals and equity is a big part plus yeah i mean the demand which has been the demand of like a lot of different guilds and a lot of not even just the entertainment industry is not like so there was a very long and still unresolved uh nursing strike in the uk or general nhs strike around a lot of industries and

the nurses and the trainee doctors get blamed by the uk public because they may be like even more manipulable when it comes to work conditions and rights and the like because you know thatcher spent her entire disgusting existence like like informing the north that they should breathe in chemicals for fun like eat coal they it it the response from uh richie sunak and the conservative government has literally just been like shut up man i don't fucking hey you're being really scary right now you're being a little rude actually it's it's a frustrating result to any strike where people are just like you're making trouble and like stop making trouble and it's like that's it's the point of a strike and i know it's inconvenient for a lot of people but it's just like it's supposed to be it's supposed

to be and it sucks and like the strikers don't want to be doing either. Like they want to be working. The nurses want to be fucking working, but they want to be working fairly. They ask from them. They ask from the rail strikes. They ask from every girl. The first one is basically just,

but inflation happened. Yeah. We're not, it's not, it's not a living wage anymore. It was, but like, also I can't be paid as a writer.

Like I was in like, if I wrote Casablanca, will they give you a, like a single penny? Yeah. I was like, thank you so much. If you made a net,

if you made friends, you make like $550 million. You have to work again. Now, if you make a hit show, it's like, Oh, maybe a couple thousand.

And it's like, we don't want it. We're not saying let's go back to the level of friends. We're just saying like, there should be some in between. Yeah. you see we talked about this on a bonus um patreon.com slash sad boys we talked about this last week did you see that vanity fair article about lost yes oh and i i bought the book off of that and yeah it's great yes um the i guess because we did only talk about that on the patreon

episode patreon.com so sideways um but five dollars you get it yeah five dollars you get all the episodes it's fine it's cool it's just it's just paying for jordan's visa it's fine um but uh the there are horror stories of like the only like some of the only black people in the writer's room or harold perrineau like the one black star with like all of the pedigree kind of being shelved and and sort of feeling misused and then being harassed essentially by like abc when he went on an interview and alluded to there being some racial like connotations to his treatment. Which was very like charitable. Charitably charitable.

Could have just been like, yeah, they just made jokes about lynching me. He didn't say that. Yeah, no, but they did allegedly make jokes about lynching Mr. Echo,

but the, and obviously that was 20 years ago, but it speaks to the foundation that a lot of like culturally, the foundation that this industry kind of sits upon and has sat upon for, you know, 100 years. So, yeah, I mean, it's crazy. Yeah. I mean, it's no secret that Hollywood is just like a cesspool of abuse. And I think it's frustrating that whenever we try to stand up for at least the like part of the abuse that it feels like we can fight against people

are just kind of like well you're making trouble now and it's like a rising tide lifts all boats i think there should be a general strike i would love if all industries were like we all want to be treated fairly yeah we can be it's not a it's not a pipe dream right it's not like i was gonna say it is a zero-sum game in the way that the people who are making 90 of the profit do have to share some of those profits downstream. But like, do you need the second yacht? It's like always the like argument because truly that's how big the margins are. And also you can still get the second yacht.

You can probably get the second yacht. You can probably get the second yacht, yeah. Is there a, as far as the like audience or listeners, viewers go, is there a, as far as the like audience or listeners, viewers go, is there a thing that consumers and non-guild members can do in support? A lot of people have asked that and I don't know because the WGA has said that they don't want to like tell everyone to like cancel subscriptions or whatnot. And I think that's true.

I know a lot of members themselves are like no fucking cancel the subscriptions i think just you know being sub i really don't think that there is i know that a lot of wj members have gone out to strike at studios and like found secret shoots and have been picking them to shut them down because luckily like we're very lucky that the teamsters uh who are basically you know the guys who drive in the equipment and load and whatnot have a rule where they will not cross picket lines. So if you create a picket line at a location shoot, they can't cross it. Um, but outside of that, I really don't think there is anything that the general audience can do. I think just staying aware of it and yeah. Being mindful about your consumption, just like, like it sucks to be like, oh yeah, you know, like the things that you take for granted and appreciate

are the product of like hard work and labor. And being, what's the word? I'm losing my words. It's being understanding of the conditions under which those pieces of art and content are created yeah is you know goes a long way yeah um sympathetic is the word i was looking for there it is being sympathetic um well thank you for talking about that dimmy i know it's probably like tiring i'm sure you it's not i always great it's like also this is the only thing going on in my life right now so

i'm always happy to be like well well, I have a thing to say. I just feel bad. Cause I, I can almost feel the people tuning up being like, okay, I don't, this, Hey, I don't know what this is. I mean, we're engaged and, and, uh, don't worry. We got this. Okay. Um, we're engaged.

No, let's talk about baby Gronk. No, I actually, just reading baby Gronk, by the way, makes me really happy. Livvy raises up baby. Gronk is the funniest collection of words. I think I've read all my refused to go on a deep dive about that because I, I think my brain's already just on its last legs, but I, I just,

I was, I don't understand the baby Gronk thing. Cause it sounds like he's not related to Gronkowski. He's just like, or Groot. It's like, if i just had a kid and i was like baby lebron it's like he doesn't know lebron it's just yeah no relation i just chose lebron has his own children but yeah yeah but so this is so optimistic when it comes to like what the next generation of players will be because they will have robot legs like they're going to be yeah insane i'm gonna be old it's it's truly um maybe i we

didn't plan to talk about this uh in the form of grabbing resources but i might have my god it's baby gronk's phone number i might be able to call him in you know what a what a bg how i i'm taking this way too seriously now but how old is is Baby Gronk? Nine. Okay, wait, wait, wait. Livvy just convinced Baby Gronk to commit to LSU. Baby Gronk is the number one college football prospect in the country. Livvy rizzed him up. Livvy even hugged Baby Gronk. He might be the new Rizz King.

Do you think Baby Gronk will lead LSU to a national championship. So you risk it never fails to get. So this guy is like, he, he makes like a satirical tech talks and stuff, but it is a real thing and it's sadder. The reality of it. So like Livvy is a LSU gymnast who's like very popular on social media. And then Baby Gronk is truly this nine-year-old kid whose dad keeps like getting colleges to like, his dad is kind of manufacturing all this.

Like he's having him meet all these influencers. He's got an entire life. His entire life has to double before he's even in's having him meet all these influencers he's got an entire life his his entire life has to double before he's even in college exactly yeah and also you you just shouldn't have that clear and that action shot of footage at a child no like that was a cool shot of him running to the end so yeah you shouldn't have that on your phone i think this is all it's like dark from a funny perspective of like what is the world come all, it's like dark from a funny perspective of like, what is the world come to? But it's also dark from a like, this is a child who's not getting to be a child.

Exactly. Yeah. And it gets even worse when you look at some of the interviews that Baby Gronk has done. And I hate that I have to keep saying Baby Gronk. Every time you say that, it feels like one of those like baby Bjorns. It feels like a tool. It's like, I want to go buy a baby. Baby Gronk. Yeah. Yeah. I'm getting a bespoke like baby Bjorns. It feels like a tool. It's like, I want to go buy a baby. Yeah.

I'm getting a bespoke Swedish baby Bjorn. Baby Gronk. Baby Gronk. Yeah. The two dots over the O. One of the interviews I saw, the dad off camera is like flex on him, flex on him.

And he's like, and then the Riz King is a whole other thing i hate it it's all very dumb but that's it's also like the way the guy delivers it to camera it's like his face doesn't move it feels it's like very dead-eyed i don't yeah i think that guy's that's his little shtick you know on tiktok you're like you do a shtick that pops off and then you have to do that exclusively or else uh no one watches that's a lot of content and i think why i sort of was just like i don't think i can do anything anymore it's like you get tired of doing stuff then people are like you're the guy who does this stuff i'm just like yeah no thanks i don't

want to is it just a case of when it comes to content outside of what is now like what do you focus on writing writing right yeah is it a kind of brain real estate thing where if you had the time and the resources you would want to get back into short form content or something that's not career oriented i think it's like i like you did vine and stuff back yeah yeah podcast like a loser the thing like a big fan of uh the dimmy podcast era oh thank you so much i think it's it's partially just me going i can make this my life and have like a very like cushy existence but is it what i want out of like my career and like what what are the things i feel passionate about and also just feeling like i think that the content world at least in experience, is very like you make a thing and then you're beholden to this audience that wants to go.

We want more of this thing from you and they're not interested in anything else. People like make September every month. Yes. And I just kind of like, well, I like doing so many different things. I don't want to. It's like I kind of just like I like doing a thing and then doing all these other things. And I want to be known as someone who does so much and not just someone who's like, you do this one thing and I like this one thing, can you do this one thing?

And so I get very burnt out. But it's like, I think I still, I'm not like out of the content game. I think I'm just, I like it as a thing that I don't create on demand. It's like, if I have an idea, I'll do it. Yeah, absolutely. Which is also just a privilege to get to that point.

So yeah. But to get to make content the fun thing yes as opposed to but well i'm having fun but i am beholden to dropping something in three days yeah i think that so when i initially started my like content like i was gonna say career but it was really just a hobby your bullshit my content bullshit you initially got on your bullshit when i was on but i began to be on my bullshit, I was making videos that were tangentially related to the tech industry. And it was because that was getting views like that little niche,

you know, people say you should niche down and stuff. But then what happened was that everyone wanted tech info from me. They wanted to know how to work in Silicon Valley, how to like work at one of these big companies. And that's not at all what I wanted to be like known for or talk about. And even it took years for me to stop getting comments that were like, when's the, like, bring back the tech videos. And I never even made that many of them. It was just the first things that popped. And so they were the first things that people knew me from um and i feel like now uh

there's definitely a lot more leeway in this space that like we occupy um you know sometimes you do have to play the game where it's like i feel like most of our thumbnails are presented in a way that it's like oh you probably have a goofy take on this weird thing that happened. We can stick Gronk in this one, for example. Oh, for sure we could. Yeah, exactly. And, but for me, like knowing that the substance of it, you know, it's like, oh sure. Let's say baby Gronk is on the thumbnail, but then there's like a substantive conversation

about the writer's strike. I feel more comfortable with that. Yeah, absolutely. You know what I mean? But, because fortunately, you know, I had never never like, because a lot of the content I made is in a longer form context. I've never had that much issue retaining the audience once they're in the door. So that's cool. You know, it's like people stick around, like for this podcast, people stick around for some reason. And, and so, yeah, but it is a dance and it is like there that equation i think exists at

at all forms in all kinds of spaces even when you look at like how netflix ab tests their thumbnails for their shows and shit like that but um is there any of that kind of it could be frustration or or just experience but do you get a lot of that in your space as well like does the room present some of that stuff because i know you have to negotiate and compromise and it is like a totally uh but like what do you mean if you're like working in the room or working directly with netflix do you ever feel as though there are like pride swallows and creative compromises for the benefit of marketing and getting eyes. Totally. And I think, I mean, any creative collaborative industry is going to be a lot of swallowing your pride force, either someone else's vision or someone else's

insistence of like what will work. And I think when it's not your baby, when it's not your thing that you're making, there's a little bit of that and you just, it comes with the territory and you're kind of like, all right, it's not my thing. thing i'm gonna do the best within these parameters but you also hide me for a reason right at a certain point you are just kind of like why what am i doing here if you do feel like you are sort of just like giving me guardrails to push me away from what is my take on things but i also think the more that uh you the more that baby Gronk, he actually became the Riz King and wanted to hit me. Yeah.

I can't, I can't let him call me too much. Cause he's asking for tips. I want to be a writer. I don't know how. It's my field. He wants to cross the line. Oh no,

baby Gronk. He's a scab. I totally forgot. forgot will baby grunk join the pinkertons oh no i honestly forgot what i was saying but i just like kind of like pride swallows and they hired me for a reason yeah they they hired you for a reason but also like you you are sort of working to a point where you do feel like you'll get to have your full like idea of what your voice is on display and i think that's the thing i struggle with a lot because i i think that as a writer i am very like uh and i don't know this is gonna sound like i'm i'm like blowing my own horn but like i think i think very logically and i i think it's like when i'm writing i'm sort of like okay

there is a puzzle to be solved here and i'm filling the the the blank with a thing that works right like from a structural standpoint or like i'm being like it works for this and this and i think a lot of times when i get pushed back on that i'm just like but it's the right thing you're asking for a circle and it needs a square yeah um but of course you're right to give your feedback and i welcome it hey you know your idea gets us the idea but you're wrong objectively i was right the first time what i said yeah haven't you seen story theory by debbie did you even right uh no and i say this to them no i i think i i try often to sort of like quiet that voice in my head and just kind of be like it's not my baby it doesn't matter

if it feels wrong to me or if it's like it's just i think until it becomes a thing that you are creating you sort of put up with the idea that like this isn't your vision and you can give your vision as much as you can and some of it will get in but you do have to sort of relinquish the idea that you're making work for someone else essentially um which is hard to do as a creative person because you're like but i i know i can do this and you saw that i can do this and that's why you hired me. So what,

but anyway, they're peppering so much with, with writer questions. I, I think it's just interesting for a good chunk of our audience, especially with what you said of, Hey, how do I get into writing and being as ambiguous and kind of like

deliberately inaccessible and community oriented or nepotism here and there it's it's hard but like the where's your imposter syndrome at it's it's weird i think that with regards to i think in general as a creative i do generally have imposter syndrome but something about writing and i think it's because i do think very functionally and have like a very formula math brain I don't feel like as much of an imposter there and I do think it's like I've gotten to this point where I kind of look at my work and I'm like I think that's good or I will be like I think that doesn't work and I think it needs to be fixed I think with everything else full-on imposter syndrome um I I like I'm, I'm trying to be a director more.

And it's just like, which is hard because it's just so much like you can write, anyone can just sit down and write. But I think to direct on any scale that feels a little more like real, it takes so much work and so much involvement. But I think I have so much imposter syndrome there of being like, well, if I'm directing, it's gotta be, it's gotta be perfect or else I will be laughed out of the room or whatever. And I think it's so hard to fight against that. They'll take away my credit. They won't even call me director. Exactly. And it's like, I've directed stuff that turns out and I'm like, it's not as good as it could be. And I think that just makes me feel a little worse. But I think also just in the virtue of getting to direct and getting to feel like I did some stuff that was good. I think I don't have that much of imposter syndrome, but I think

in general, it's like, I know, I think I'm so reserved in general that when I do have an idea that I am like out with, and I just sort of like say, and like, feel like I'm expressing, I am like, I'm saying that because I believe in it. And I have sat with it for so long. And I'm like, just thinking about it and being like, no, this is it's gotten to a level that I deem good that I think I'm confident in my writing. But I think that's another reason why I sort of feel like I've pulled back on content is because like I think that when I make stuff for an online audience, there is a thing that in my head I am doing it for. And I'm like, I'm doing this to show off this aspect of my talent or this thing. And this thing that I think is good. And I think a lot of times it's like something else gets seen as like the highlight. And it feels like you're losing your, your vision of being like, here's what I am,

or here's what I'm trying to show you. I can do. And they're like, right, this guy loves this song. And I'm like, that's not what this is about that's uh uh john green the author had a i like grew up watching his videos like on youtube and one thing he always said is like once you put something out like because he you know writes like young adult fiction for primarily yeah uh once you put something out it like belongs to the audience it's no longer yours it's no longer because and i'm sure he didn't get that quote from you know himself but but uh because yeah you can't control what aspect of people what aspect of something people grasp onto and uh there's a vulnerability in that because you have to put yourself out there knowing that you cannot control just like in life you can't control people's

perception of you you can't control the aspects of your personality you can be like i'm the guy with the cool haircut and everybody's like i really like your shirts yeah you know what i mean and it's like but but i i spent so much money on the haircut and it's also hard because i think we now i think culturally everyone wants to have the right impression of things but also to not hurt anybody and i think that there's a lot of times where people do something and it unintentionally comes across as bad and you're like well i spent so much time trying to do this and everyone's like what the fuck is that like you did this awful thing and you're like what hey no i i spent a lot and so i think yeah in that process of like trying to create and not be in that zone you spend so much time thinking about every little thing and

being like right how do i make sure this like goes exactly down the right lane and i think from that you create something that is just a little like, I think that's part of where you get to like the Netflix of things where it's like, it's just so safe. It's so safe. You put up so many guardrails. Yes. I definitely experienced that. I call it creating and relief where it's like, like how they make a sculpture where it's

like, you're cutting things away. You are no longer like making something. You're not molding it. You're just sort of being like, well, it's not this. It's not this. It's not this. It's exactly exactly this you can't misinterpret it as anything else which is part of why it's impossible to give somebody a narrative on how to become x or y because it's not what we thought it was going to be not even close at all i mean we have a friend

uh lauren former co-worker of mine and then a friend who, she writes mostly or did write audio fiction, primarily YA audio fiction, and then got a three book deal a handful of years ago and now has concluded that series. Yeah. Which is insane to think about. She's a fucking animal, dude. She was like writing,

like the speed at which she was writing full ass books was insane. We were making two seasons of the audio fiction show and pitching four more shows this is all in 2019 and she wrote a book and a half in that time yeah because she's deranged not bad it takes me so long to write anything yeah i i i'm always just like how do you do it when i think also some people just have a brain where they they can just wake up and be like and today i'll write 10 more pages i always just like, how do you do it? I think also some people just have a brain where they can just wake up and be like, and today I'll write 10 more pages. And it's like, nope.

But she is very open about that. As far as like letting it go. Yeah. She has always encouraged fan fiction writing of the production, but also to the actors and people involved is like, avoid this. Don't let it inform your performances.

But now the show's concluded i think there's like a little bit more lucy goosey stuff because briggan has concluded his story as caleb he's done acting that character for now now you can indulge in like some some you can let go of that character kind of let them graduate yeah and i don't i i feel as though i have so little attachment creatively to the to the videos i do at the least because they're just they're fun in the moment and yet it comes back and i'm like i don't even remember doing that great that's right whereas oh man if i if i nurtured a baby for a hundred hours a script baby it's so hard and then give it to someone else that's like that's another thing i think another reason i'm trying to like get a foothold as a working director is because there's like projects I want to make where I'm just like, I want to direct this.

And the idea of writing something and thinking about it so deeply and then handing it off to people, knowing that there are things that I didn't write in there that I'm like, well, I just, I need this to be done this way. This is important to it. Working right is just, it scares me. Man. Yeah. I have like two primary YouTube channels. Like I have like the main Jarvis Johnson channel that I started and then I have Jarvis Johnson gold, which is just me like riffing and then an editor, like editing it down. And I get so many

comments that people can't tell the difference, which is great. Uh, but the real difference is that I spend a lot of time on the videos on my main channel and I like labor over the wording and the presentation. And the fact that people can't tell the difference is really just, I guess, an example of the kind of creative circle jerk that goes on in your mind where you're like, I need to prove something to myself just as much as I want to put something on the page or something out there. And I guess it's good that people can tell the difference because I still get to have the satisfaction of like doing something that I felt was like cool or interesting. Or I mean, I'm writing the first video I've written in like a long time

right now. And I'm, I've like been extending the deadline I'm giving myself for it so much because I almost forgot how to like do it um and it's like never done and there's always and i'm such a completionist i want to include everything that i think is is relevant and that i need but i end up needing to kill darlings or else it's like the longest video in the world well that's the that's the thing right it's not having too much affection for any part of it because it's not if it doesn't serve the product yeah and it is a product and not even in a cynical way it's like you want to produce it you want to i mean even though we're content it's so reductive but it's like yeah it's crazy how we've all accepted content by the way as the term

i remember hearing that the first time that an influencer terrifying, both like such dystopian terms. And now we're just like, yeah, it's so removed. And I, it's, it does feel weird because I think people, it's like everyone takes in content,

but you do just feel weird about it. It's almost like sort of, it's very dystopian, but it also just feels like this thing in your brain where you're like, this isn't real. It is. It's, it's something that is filling a gap between real things. it's like that's it sucks to think of it as that

right right can i ask we touched a little bit before the show and we can cut this if you don't want to get into it but we talk about it like a fair bit on the show um you talked about adderall earlier yeah i'll get into it because we were uh discussing shortage you know which is like our version of talking about the weather yeah like hey so what's going on with these damn can't put my prescription hey i went down to cvs i asked if they have and they ran away my culture is so cold it pulls down that shutter and said no no they had that they're bullying me yeah um but that you i don't know what it is treating in particular sure Sure. So I was.

What's wrong with you? Oh, many a thing. And, you know, I'm still trying to wait on some diagnoses. No, but I was 24 and working on a TV show. It was like, I was in a good place. It was my dream job. And I was falling asleep in the room. And it had been something that had happened a few times throughout high school.

And I think college a little bit, and I always just kind of was like, man, I just hate this class or I'm lazy or I'm not getting enough sleep or whatever. And then like, I was at my dream job feeling like I'm well-rested and I want to be here and still happening. And it was just this weird thing where like, I would be like, oh, okay. I'm trying to stay awake, trying to stay awake, paying attention. And then suddenly would wake up not realizing i had fallen asleep and i was so panicked it felt like my first like time being like an adult where i was like i don't know what's going on i don't know how to get help for this if i'm falling asleep here something's wrong yes this is not class it's not i'm not bored i'm engaged i'm it's i'm looking around i'm with my heroes and it just feels like

i'm still falling asleep and it felt like this weird thing that I just didn't know what to do about it. And then when the show ended after the damage had been done of like, okay, this guy is, uh, this guy's falling asleep on the job. What's his deal? Yeah. What's his deal? His first writing job. Um, I, uh, went to a doctor, a psychiatrist who was just kind of like, maybe it's ADHD. And, you know, looking into ADHD, it kind of made sense to me. And so I got a prescription for Adderall. And for like four years, I was like, yeah, this, this is it. This totally makes sense. And then I had switched therapist and was getting her up to speed on like, what was going on with me? And just being like, and, you know, fall asleep because of ADHD. And she was like that's not what do you mean that's not how that works and she was like it sounds a lot like narcolepsy

uh shut up you quack yeah i've never seen this lady i know what this is i've already found this i've got my normal adhd burps yes i figured it out the guy who didn't look at me once in our session gave me the drugs i'm fine um but Um, but, uh, so then I went and did a sleep study and it's funny during the sleep study, they basically are like, you're going to go to sleep overnight and then we'll wake you up. And you basically are gonna every two hours be allowed to go to sleep again for like 30 minutes. And over the course of those two hours, every time I was just like, God, I can't fucking wait to go back to sleep. And then there was one time where they measured and it's like, yeah, you fell asleep in 26 26 seconds that's not like you were in rem sleep in 26 seconds that's not

supposed to happen you absolutely have narcolepsy i was like oh crazy uh i need to i don't want to interrupt this story much but i need to get a sleep study we can bookmark it dude i'll give you the info oh my god the sleep study i got the stuff right here man bed right now go take this drug um but let me study you yeah actually yeah record it on the podcast yeah if you give us patreon only jarvis sleep for eight hours i would i desperately need one also let's genuinely do both do one and then we can report back it's wild i feel like since talking about this i've realized how many people like are like yeah i think i also need I'm like, this should be something that more doctors are just kind of like, because it feels like you go to a doctor and they're just like, oh, maybe it's this. And you're like, you're the professional. We should teach taxes in high school and we should teach like general, very simple diagnosis. fatigue stuff right now. And one additional complication is that I'm a mouth breather. I have like an deviated septum and stuff. And I learned that like mouth breathing can like

shave years off of your life because it can lead to like sleep apnea and things because you're just not, you're like breathing isn't consistent as, I don't really know the reason, but it's just bad. And so I need them to like break my nose into a word, my nose works. But I want to get a sleep study first to see what's going on there. Cause I sleep for eight hours a night, but I wake up and it sucks. Oh yeah. I was, I was saying before the podcast that like, I will sleep well and still wake up and like just continue sleeping. Cause I'm like, Oh, I'm still tired. And I had to like start forcing myself out of bed to not just feel depressed and like in bed until 4. And I think it's like, part of that is the narcolepsy of just feeling like my body's not

getting enough rest or is not taking in enough oxygen or whatever. So I, it's constantly just feeling like, well, we're fatigued. Let's go to sleep. And I wasn't until I was 28 that I got like a diagnosis of like, it's narcolepsy the adhd meds were working because it's treated the same way i might also still have adhd because i tried other narcolepsy drugs and it felt like well now the focus thing is a problem or like my mood is shifted which also maybe just i got addicted to adderall at that point that's the worst is that like you're you're trying to diagnose something about your like something that's wrong with you but you also go through the ebbs and flows of a normal human existence yeah and it's

sometimes hard to like nail down what's what's just variance in life and what's like an actual medical oh and like they also especially with adhd medication it feels like and bipolar medication in my experience a little bit, but that one's way more, hey, it's all jazz, baby. You're going insane still. But in the case of ADHD medication, I feel like there's so many unique experiences with the, there's so many treatments with so many possible complications.

And so I've never had a side effect from Adderall. Not just a few of them a one ever and everything else i found really unpleasant when i tried them totally and i was under the impression that like okay well this is just this is all good i've gone up and down over the years tried different dosages okay this is fairly stable oh my limo stream's gone up let's see how this fits with that one you know tweaked it but then recently with the shortage i just was not actually and also when i went back to the uk over covid i just couldn't get it yeah like getting control medications there is so much harder it's like you're not allowed like allowed or no they don't have is it they don't have vivants in the uk just any uh amphetamine uh or stimulant is it's the equivalent of like getting a tank like it's just

insane but the the you must forget that getting withdrawals from something like adderall makes you depressed yeah and you mix it i always mix it up because i'm like well i'm not getting my adderall so i'm not functional like well part that but i'm also just very sad yeah part of i uh i'm bad at taking it regularly and my girlfriend has started being like set an alarm you're gonna take it at this time every day and sometimes i'm just kind of like i'm not working today why would i take it and it's like because at the end of the day i'll be fucking depressed and just like start a fight for no reason other than like i don't know i'm just not feeling it today yeah and it's like why set goals in the morning that you don't achieve

i'm gonna do the laundry this evening no i'm doing do nothing set goals in the morning that you don't achieve? I'm going to do the laundry this evening. No, I'm going to do nothing. And then you're depressed that you didn't do it. And you're just beating yourself up. Like all I had to do was fucking do the laundry, walk the dog. And I can't do that. You piece of shit. And it's like, yeah, your, your body needs a medicine that you're not taking.

Right. Please take the medicine. And for how many years do we have to know that and do that before this, uh, anti mentalmental health propaganda we're able to shut it i think the answer is like never really there will always be people who are just kind of like it's the same thing as like the strike where it's like uh well but that's not how it is for me so you're probably just there's something else wrong right well people probably hear that you're a writer with youtubers whatever and think well they're on their rise and grind. That's why.

They can't be relying on any kind of medication or be getting help. I need to be not lazy either. I need to be able to write. Writers are medicated. They're all doing very well. Most of the money goes to therapy. I told my psychiatrist this morning that I'm so lucky that I work in this career because in no other career could I sustain the amount of lying in my bed that I need to do to like feel normal.

Yeah. The hangover period of being like manic. Dude, I'm going straight to bed after this podcast and it'll be like, I'll probably be in bed from like 4 PM for the rest of the day. And it's a problem and I need my sleep study. Okay. I'm going to do it. You're just an eepy little guy. I'm just eepy. Also, I just want to clarify. It's being very sarcastic when I said no writers are taking,

no creators are taking medication. Absolutely they hella are. And also your quality of life, once you can set it up from getting some kind of mental health insight is only better there's literally no either you get some kind of guidance and you can work on something

which is most likely everybody's got something going on or you get peace of mind because you check there's not like there's no world where you go in they give you a diagnosis you're like

well now I feel way worse we're not experts we're just sharing our experience please do talk to experts if you have access um because it can improve your quality of life i'm realizing now that there's so many little things wrong with me that i have just been ignoring for my entire life oh yeah yeah oh my

god it's just well you adapt and then the first instinct when you want to do something about it is well no i'm just being just being, just rise and grind. Just need to work a little harder on that. I saw my psychiatrist about a week ago and I was just like, hey, have you been trying out that new medication that we started? And I'm like, oh, yeah, no, I had to get a refill. And he's like, well, that one's available and it will probably help a lot. I was like, oh, sure.

He's like, something's wrong it's weird that you're not doing yeah this this is not how a person should be i feel like i i didn't i i hit a wall so quickly with like socializing and for my entire life it's always just felt like i don't know i just i it's i lose friends over like after like five years or whatever i'm like getting to be an adult and being like that's not how it should be and just, it's, I lose friends over like after like five years or whatever. And I'm like getting to be an adult and being like, that's not how it should be. And just realizing it's like, oh, because it's hard for me. It's like, I have a level of anxiety and like genuine, like stress around socializing and the idea of it, like having to do it properly or like having to figure it out or like what

I owe to people or what I'm supposed, like just the, the sort of like, uh, just the functional stress of trying to figure out how to be a person properly in a way that you're like, well, no, one's going to tell me what they're expecting of me. So I just have to assume or like give all of myself to people. And then it's like, you get burnt out and it's like all this stuff. It's like, I didn't realize until I was an adult going to therapy being like, yeah, I find it hard to talk to a friend. I have to, I like to see all of my friends at once so that I can just sort of bounce between them and not feel the stress of like focus. And then it's like, what's going on in your friend's life? It's like, oh, I don't know. Cause I don't have

intense conversations with them. And it's like, and you're stressed with your girlfriend's like, yeah, cause she's kind of getting it all right now. It's like, oh, uh, maybe you shouldn't, maybe you're getting burnt out because of the way that you do these things. And just you, you start to feel like there are so many things you don't realize that you're doing wrong or that it's like, Oh, your quality of life can improve if you just talk to someone. And it's not like there's like a way that you're, that everyone's supposed to do something, but there is like, you have stresses in your life that you start to feel like, uh, you've just lived with for so long. And it's not until you talk to someone about it that you can kind of go like, well, how do you balance this? Or like, what are your expectations? Can I quell

the idea that this is how something should be and just tell you like, well, there's also this other alternate way that you maybe don't talk to other people about because you don't feel comfortable doing so. The answer isn't universally. I just don't like my friends. Yeah, exactly. Keeping yourself open-minded to change or the that there might be a different way of doing things that's healthier for you or feels better i think is just a good outlook to have totally i i i've always resented people who have all like you know older people who are almost calcified in their like belief system they're like i'm not going to change this is just how i am oh man it's like such a pet peeve for me because i feel like i i've changed so dramatically like year over year and i think we also may be as incredibly youthful uh elder millennials yeah

i think we we maybe have a little bit of that it's just just just just just a skosh of well when people are old they can't change old dog new tricks can't it's not your fault you know oh the olden days you weren't allowed to learn back then right just simply not the case you're taking new things now i that's not the case at all and there are plenty of old people who are like happy to learn and change and yeah yeah and those are the cool ones so true it's like jarvis like hold on wait oh okay yes i don't think it's cool but yeah yes okay i before we wrap this story i i need to talk about um have you have you heard of the bagel gate situation i don't this is equivalent to

grunt man well like i okay insane sentence by the't this is equivalent to grunt man where like i okay i insane sentence by the way this is equivalent to grunt but i i it's i have five to ten percent of the information and everything else i felt overwhelmed i think demi-org you're working with minus five this is very much like becoming a segment of like jarvis talks about a weird niche internet drama but they're um are you familiar with geoguessr no okay geoguessr okay i'm at 15 so geoguessr is a game where they show you like a screenshot of google street oh yeah okay and then you try to figure out where it is and some people are like preternaturally able to do it or some people have like sort of gotten really really good at it to the point where they're like pro they're the pro gamer

equivalent of geoguessr oh wow where they can look at the soil or the street signs or whatever just and this is not a joke this is like legitimately how they do things they'll give you tips for like oh well you know italy has these types of street signs except for in this region it's cool yeah yeah it's very it's very cool this 480p google maps image from 2006 and so one of the best geoguessr players is this guy named rainbolt and uh i actually sat next to him at mogul money live randomly but he was like a few seats away and i was like is that the geoguessr guy anyway where are we and then he pulled it off anyway um so rainbow on his tiktok he will like people will hire not hire but there will be these challenges where someone's like this is a photo i took as a

child with my mom on a beach and we just can't figure out where this important life event happened and he'll be like do do do this important life event happened and he'll be like do do do do do figure it out and he'll like find the ocean side that they like took the photo it would be like a wholesome moment uh recently there was a tiktok creator who so we have some of these maybe i don't maybe i don't want to give too much background because i think we might have prepared some stuff i will try to find it but i'll tell you the the the spark notes this guy makes a bagel he's like this is the best bagel i've had and you'll never try it you'll never have this bagel and then people were like what is this dude is he like keeping a bagel like why is he doing that and then as a bit rainbolt was like i, I'm going to find this bagel. And so he spends 40 hours

analyzing the area around the TikToks, figures out, not figures out, the guy had his university listed on the page. So he looks at bagel places near that university. he ends up finding the place but it was closed or no excuse me he ends up finding the place this place called bagel market but bagel market wouldn't open for two weeks so then he um he dms the original creator and goes hey was it this type of bagel from bagel market and the guy goes no even though it was pretty close he just got the ingredients of the bagel wrong and um and so then uh so then he enlists he basically tweeted out like i need help i'm 40 hours into looking for this bagel and i can't find it another insane sentence i know

but for him it's like it's first man that that's ever happened to yeah so then this is a guy i'm not kidding he will do challenges like using in five frames flashing on screen in black and white pixelated to the corner of a Google maps image and go like a koala lamp. Just like instantly. Wait, I'm, I'm confused.

Is this, it's just, it's just like a random person who was just like, I have this great bagel. It wasn't a random person. It was like a content creator on Tik TOK with a few hundred thousand followers. Okay.

Uh, and, and he kind of, you could kind of see it in that one Tik TOK or where he called it said like not on my watch where sometimes he'll take like in,, in almost adversarial relationship, like, as a bit. Yeah. So I think that's what was happening here, where he's like, you're not going to gatekeep this bagel on my watch. I'm going to find the bagel.

But it went a little bit too far. So I'm going to be vulnerable. I've spent 38 hours this week, 42 hours last week, looking for a bagel on Google Maps. The bagel is in NYC. I have all possible bagels narrowed down. I will find this bagel and I will not give up. And then he found the bagel because he, I saw this in the article I read this morning.

He found the bagel because when he posted that tweet, a guy who does bagel tours in New York City recognized the wrapping of the bagel market restaurant. So then he was able guy who does bagel tours in New York City recognized the wrapping of the bagel market restaurant. So then he was able to find the bagel. And then through that guy, ended up getting in contact with the owner of the bagel market, found out that even though that location that he originally found in in the first day hadn't wouldn't open for two weeks they actually did a soft opening two weeks early so it was at that location and then he because he was in contact with the owner and because it was a viral tiktok thing

he got the bagel named after himself so then he was basically like oh you wanted to get keep the bagel now in order to get this bagel you have to order the rain bolt that's very funny sick um but then go to order the gronk but then uh of course because it's the internet i think it took a turn man i just i have no idea how tiktok even works like even with stitching and stuff i'm just kind of like uh okay i've never i open the app literally when someone sends me a tikt stitching and stuff i'm just kind of like uh okay i've never i opened the app literally when someone sends me a tiktok just because i'm like it's easier than watching a thing but i've never made one so so i did see this image so then the secret is out x marks a spot

that like it said that it's like his face on the the bagel and then he makes this tiktok where it's from i will it egg, cheese, and avocado bagel from Bagel Market on Wednesday. Yo! Why you riding my dick? Go get a job at the CIA, bro. Use your time. Why you, you using it?

You, you rather look, you searching the internet for, I'm never going there again bro you just ruined it bro i will never show my face in the bagel place again you might have got where i ate it at correctly you might have got the restaurant correctly but your ingredients are wrong you'll still never be able to taste the sandwich so haha jokes on you get a job saying get a job is actually a job is that cut surprisingly deep when you have a super bow it was like he seems to have a job i bet he's making a lot of money off this yeah also i'm like you were in it for yourself don't post a video

being like i got the best thing and i'm never gonna tell it like you're taunting people yeah people to do that here's a photo of me at a mountain range. I guess, could you find out where? And then they do. What the hell? You stopped writing my dick, bro? Yeah, because if you really wanted it to be your secret place, then you wouldn't post about it at all.

We never talk about our secret place. I did meet a patron there. Did I tell you that? Yeah. And I didn't ask him for any cash. So I guess I'm a pretty good guy. I got asked for a photo there, and I took them to a ndiscrete wall to take the photo so that you couldn't see it's against

the ground well also now i you kind of have unfortunately you know people are going to watch this and be like secret place and then you tap the box yeah so congrats yeah i know get on it geo guest or now i'm gatekeeping a secret place. Oh boy, I want nothing to do with this. Keep me out of it. I am just kind of like, why doesn't this guy work for the CIA? Yeah, I mean. Because content pays more.

That's a good point. Okay, so unfortunately, the sad ending of this is just that this kid got harassed because people on the internet are annoying. They were racist and stuff. But I don't think it was like, in Rainbolt's defense, I don't think it was like right in rainbolt's defense i

don't think it was his audience i do think that it's just like sort of random people who saw this like story blowing up who just are always looking for an excuse to be racist yeah this is what i fear for gronk i worry that he will finally get signed to the nfl probably within the year he's never gonna live a normal life no imagine being it's just the name that's crazy your your name is someone else's name like your legacy is i'm a small version of that other guy that's so weird is this legal name no no but also like people won't know his legal name yeah maybe in that way it's some sort of anonymity there are a lot of sad stories of people who are

like memes as children who like grow up and then like it kind of sucks i think that's another thing about the internet and why i feel like i sometimes step away from because it's like i think you take the good with the bad and a lot of the bad is any sort of success or like high visibility means that you do not control who sees you or what people think of you anymore yeah and so it takes a huge toll on your mental health when you're like i made this thing and it's like you want it to be seen but at a certain level of it being seen it's like it is now just with every like a good thing there's like a million bad things in between it yeah and i you just start to think like i think with what i do now i do sort of weigh

the pros and cons of like i have to like something enough that i that i'm accepting all the bad shit that comes with it and with a lot of content i'm just kind of like i don't like it enough to put in all this work and just be like satisfied with it and also accept the stuff that comes on the back heel of it and also except that it might not do well it's just like you spend a lot of time on it and it just doesn't do anything so for sure um it's the double-edged sword of actually getting the data yeah uh well uh that about wraps it up i think for this episode of now we will uh be recording right after this a patreon exclusive bonus episode on patreon.com slash sad boys oops guilty lock me up i don't know what

we're talking about what are we talking about my court case lock me up oh shit uh yeah i who knows i think i have oh oh there's something embarrassing that happened oh i think we're gonna watch a like a cutter a jubilee maybe too oh yeah yeah we're not one of those out. But the... Oh, the Cliff of You? Yeah. Oh, yeah. I want to explain it. It was a bit. There's an embarrassing Cliff of Jordan floating around the internet. And he needs to... Beautiful. I need to make sure more people see it.

That's the wise move, right? But Demi, it has been a pleasure having you here. Thank you so much. It's been so nice to be here. I know you... I want you to shout out stuff you got going on. I know you've got a show. I know you've got an Everything's Great show coming up. Oh, yeah. Yes know you got everything's great oh yeah yes end of the month june 30th uh if you're in la uh dynasty typewriter it's me and my friends nick kocher and addy wyrich we do

a show not with any regularity anymore but it's always a very fun good time just like a variety show where we'll do different bits and what great show good times yeah i've seen it it's a good show it's a good show good venue yeah very good venue maybe hypothetically you might one day hypothetically at some point see a sad boys live show there maybe it's already in the works who knows it is oh i get i shouldn't i should ruin it yeah that's why you're going to jail hey there's a jail is there anything else you want to shout out nope there's so many things that I worked on that I'm like

I don't know when that's coming out I got nothing I'm not working right now I'm just hanging around shout out to the writers guild shout out to actors receiving fair compensation and fair terms yeah Demi I don't know if you remember this.

The year's 2018 XOXO Fest. You did a performance. Afterward, I asked you to come on the show. On this show? Yeah. Oh, what did I say? It was at a time when we were doing it remotely. And so I think we just were like, actually, I think you were like uh i'll do it in person yeah

but and so we were like we don't have that yet that sounds right yeah yeah um but yeah so we finally did it hell yeah it only took five years and that's what you'll get from me if you ever ask me to do something for you five years down the line guarantee yes guarantee i'll put it in the calendar ask it now um no but we end every episode of Sad Boys with a particular phrase. We love you. And we're sorry. Boom. Boom.

Dipper. Good boy. Good boy. Touch. Oh, wow. Good boy. Good boy. What a smart guy.

What are you talking about? I wouldn't be on the couch. There we go. Look at that guy. What a clever go. Look at that guy. Look at that guy. Thanks for coming down, buddy. Go to rich for me.