Sad Boyz - The Dark Side Of Parasocial Relationships (w/ Miles Bonsignore)

Episode Date: January 24, 2026

Head to https://cozyearth.com and use my code SADBOYZBOGO to get these pj’s for you and someone you love! Find Miles Find Ashleigh ⁠100+ bonus episodes⁠⁠ ✨⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠find us everywhere⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠✨ Write To Us ▸ [e-mail] | Use Subject "Pen Palz" P.O. Box ▸ 3108 Glendale Blvd, Suite 540, Los Angeles, CA 90039 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our Discord ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠▸ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Play Sad Boyz BINGO⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ▸ 🎬 CREW 🎬 Hosted by Jarvis Johnson and Jordan Adika Produced & Edited by Jacob Skoda Produced by Anastasia Vigo Thumbnail design by @yungmcskrt Outro music by @prod.typhoon & @ysoblank 00:00:00 Welcome, Miles Bonsignore! 00:03:08 Expedition 33 00:07:23 Work/Life Balance 00:09:17 Sponsored by Cozy Earth 00:10:52 Actor Press Junkets 00:13:43 Parasocial Nature of "Perfect Person" 00:24:07 State of the Hot Dog 00:25:56 Heated Rivalry Stalking, Harrassment, and Threats 00:36:02 Milk 00:40:36 Supriya Ganesh on The Pitt 00:46:16 Seeing A Celebrity IRL 00:51:16 Mile's Series: "Graveyard Shift" 00:54:29 Finding Joy amongst Tragedy 01:06:30 Feelings Are Not A Meritocracy 01:10:37 SF Chronicle Review of The Matrix 01:30:15 Sports Chat 01:49:42 Sad Boyz Nightz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Sad Boys, a podcast about feelings and other things also. I'm Jarvis. I'm Jordan. And we're joined by a very special guest today. Hello. We call Miles. We found you. Miles.

Bonsignore. Thank you so much. I don't know how to say your last name with a regular accent, so I pretend to be Italian every time. When I was growing up, I would say it was Bonsignor. And then after doing the drags by guest, they would call me Miles Bonsignore, which is how it is actually pronounced. And now I go is that.

That is beautiful because not a lot of people think they can change it up later in life. And I did. Wow. And my wife actually said, I'll only take your name if it's the cool version. And you've talked pretty extensively about how Italians have been depressed

more than anyone else in the nation. And that's why I came on today. Right. To correct us. Your guys is ignorance. Pasta is a forbidden food. Oh, no. A lot of people don't exist.

A lot of people don't think about that. Right. It's whenever I was eating spaghetti when you walked in and you said my culture is not your costume. I said you're not one to have that. Yeah. You slapped it out of my hand. Um, Mamma Mia, brother.

Here we go again, is what I said. And actually, Mama Mia, deeply offensive to me. Oh, fuck. Deeply. It's the M word. The devil M word. Flip it around. Oh, wow.

Don't play Mario. It's it. I don't want to get into it, but he's... Who? Yeah, you can't, that's the other M word. How many times did you just have to tank an incorrect Bonsignor? Honestly, I just sort of stopped carrying how people said it. When I introduced myself, I'd be Miles Bonsignor.

day, but... Yeah, at Patreon, I stopped caring when people will call me Jordan by accident. Because of the spelling. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Sort of a difference. Yeah.

There's something, I guess people were matching us up in some ambiguous way. Yeah, I can't really, I can't think of a thing. Yeah. Probably our hair. Miles, I have to thank you because, well, we have it in the shot. Our, like, little gear cabinet here. Husky? We stole the husky idea from you.

We recorded a perfect person, and I was like, I need a husky in my life. And then I got a dipper, and then I said I need another one. Yeah, you've got double. Is that, no, that's one giant husky. I was talking about my dog who's also a husky. You guys got the premium husky. I mean, a husky can really, it can send you into a spiral. I love my husky.

Jacob and Anastasia went to go pick it up one time and didn't realize how big it was. I didn't realize how big it was. Colossal. And we were like, oh, this doesn't fit in a car. Honestly, at this point, oh, sorry, you were about to say something. We got to Home Depot and the employee was like, you're not going to be able to take this home. They took one look at us. They were like, do you want to see how big it is?

I mean, it is humongous. But then we saw it was on a palette and we're like, oh, no, we won't be able to take this up. Yeah, can you, can we hitch it to like, do you guys have a trailer we can attach this to? You called me at the time and you said, please, please, Hercules, I need you to come and help me. I was busy picking up a really big weight.

That's not true. I was picking up, oh, you didn't know, I was thinking a really big weight. I was picking up, I think it was a million of the, what's it called? The husky. I was picking up a million of that. You were figuring out of a million of that.

You were figuring. I have a million huskies. That's awesome, actually. Husky, yeah. You were filming Snow Dogs, too. I was, I was picking a moose. And then Jacob 3D printed labels. Jacob also helped me print as a gift, a eight-inch so-and-so,

my owl from Expedition 33. Yeah, baby. Full figurine, which I primed, and then my partner painted. You played? Oh, yeah. Oh, hell, yeah. But did you get the themes? Oh, I thought it was about like a France.

Yes, it was no France. No, but I love it. In fact, I just yesterday on my to-do list was uninstall Exhibition 33 because I need to move on. For your children. Right. For the benefit of... For those who come after. For those who come after.

In the end game of Exhibition 33, I was like, I have to stop. I can't keep doing like math games where I'm like, let me add one picto. Right. And then, like, try and hit the fucking... Yeah, because maybe I could hit six-seven. Yeah, maybe I can hit the sex number. It's unbelievable. but I loved it so much.

It was my favorite. Anastasia is playing through it now and I'm experiencing it all over again because Anastasia will be like we were in the ice area and there were those big guys and I was like what? And then we couldn't remember

what the grandes were. I couldn't remember what the grandest were called and I feel like... The stalact or whatever or no. No, no. The stalact are there as well. The stalact are there. Oh, the guys.

The guys. The guys. The nice gestals, essentially. Yeah, but I forgot they had a whole different ass name and it feels like I'm I'm losing. access to my culture. You got to replay.

I got to get back. It's a DLC I haven't played. Oh, I see I just played the DLC. Honestly, okay, I feel like I can talk about this foible on this show because this audience, what, all gamers? It's a show of foibles. Okay, so it's a show about foibles?

It's a show about foibles. It's a show about foibles. I've had this done so many times where I'll play a game, right? I'll put fucking whatever, dozens and dozens of hours with it. I'll get to the end game. I'm loving it.

I'm going to go new game plus. Start the game over. Everything's way difficult. And then they drop DLC. Yeah, that's what happened to me. I'm like, are you out of your fucking mind? You're being punished for your enthusiasm. Correct.

I was being punished for being so. This happened with the album with the Elber Ring. I had to replay the whole goddamn thing to play the DLC. I think you are someone who doesn't track as a guy who reads manga or plays video games. I've got flown under the radar. Yeah, and that's. You're a jock. You're a jock.

Yeah. Oh, brother. Kind of like a super husky style picking up kind of guy. I actually really appreciate that that's the vibe I give off. You give off? I give a joke's friend. But like kind of fun guy who like, when he leaves, when you leave you like disappear into the ether, you like don't have a home. Like you also don't talk gomage.

You go mage. I go mage for like. Flower. Yeah, you rose petals in your weight. But yeah, no. It's profound. I appreciate that when I came in, I, yeah, obviously I'm sure people talk about your shelf all the time. But I was so psyched to just look at all the shon and jumps I used to have.

Yeah. It's nice to say that they talk about the shelf. You want to. It's appreciated now. People talk about it. That was the most enthusiastic. Well, I'm looking around and I just- Garrett got really excited too.

You know, yeah, it's like my childhood all in one. Yeah, that's kind of what I'm going for, because it's also my childhood. Another thing you don't track as is a guy with a wife and kids. By the way, because I'm so horny all the time. Yeah, so horny all the time, always turning into rose petals, playing video games, picking up huskies. No, I do have a wife and children. Yeah, it's kind of funny that, yeah, thanks, dude. We're still trying to figure that one out.

I get two kids, a three-year-old and a seven-month-old. Which is just like a huge part of my life. I don't know, maybe I have good work-life balance. Somehow. It's like... Well, that's why... You're uninstalling Exfinition 33. That's how I know...

No, I like... The Bachelor version doesn't... We don't uninstall. No, the Bachelor version is me moving on to Final Fantasy 7 remake. Yeah. I was even like, look, I gotta grow up and play a different kind of similar game. Yeah, there's like a lot of things in my life now where I have to start a game and I, and there's too much lore.

I'm like, I'm never going to play this. Like, if it's too much all of a sudden. But I did uninstall it because I was like, my office was like, oh, you put the, you know, one of the kids to bed, and she put the other one to bed. And she was like, where did you go? And I was like, oh, in my head, I know that I was like playing pictoporne on X-V-R-3. You burst into pedals in a way. Exactly, right, yeah, yeah.

Is it a, maybe this is naive. I sort of always assumed that I sometimes having a kid enforces the work-life balance at necessity. I would say that one of the reasons that I've had any sort of success is because I had kids and then had to figure it out. So are you recommending that we have tactical children that might improve our I'm in the way that you employ technical children. You deploy them actually. You sort of you play them you play their you know. Loximize that Pokemon. You summon your children but I when I had my material for a five year old. When I my first son Julian was born I was still working at Dryguise and I had started a person so I had like effectively two full time jobs and I was doing the Patreon for a person.

So it was like I was working. working all the goddamn time and I kind of was like okay I need to work really hard on the other thing because I want to leave my job and just do my own thing right and so it has actually you know somehow worked out that the kids made me way more productive and enforced that like oh I have six hours to work I really need to work I can't just like fuck around I that is how I feel when in college I had like an exam in like let's say two hours and I hadn't studied for it at all and so I was like well now I need to make use of this time. The exam is way shorter than two hours.

There's no way you need more than that. Learn the exam. Learn the exam. Cheat off of it. Me failing. Me whiffing every test. I would convince myself that, well, I have photographic memory. I don't.

What if I did? But if I did, then I could easily learn this material quickly. Apparently, Gait and Monterazzo has a photographic memory. That's how we memorized all the lines. Oh, yeah, supposedly, get to monologue locked in out of nowhere or whatever. Wait, is he the guy from stranger thing? Holy shit. The boy.

You guys are not actually in my algorithm. You're not fucking with the new season of Strangers. I haven't seen the season. I did see one of those insufferable GQ interviews where they talk about his photographing memory. That's exactly what I said too. And then he says something like, yeah, you know, sometimes we're actually able to,

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So for people who don't know, when celebrities do these interviews, they are kind of, a lot of times they're in the same place and like a rotating cast of publications is coming through interviewing them, giving them the same questions over and over. Zoe Dichannel is, and it's an exhausting thing. Of course, being an actor, especially one who's getting work, it's, there's a lot of privilege to it. But this is an aspect. It's physical hours either way.

It's grueling and you're getting asked the same like monotonous questions over and over. She gets asked at the end of one of these days, I have to assume, are you on the naughty list or on the nice list? Holy shit. And then she's like, and it feels like a trap because if she does naughty, then everyone's gonna take it the weirdest way, right?

So she's like, nice, of course. And then later, like very shortly after, she's like, I don't fucking know, man. Give me a shotgun. She's like, she's like, that's not. That's no one. I've talked about it before, my favorite part of any of those interviews is always the, uh, why does Sebastian Stan always wear a white t-shirt or, you know, the Google search ones?

Yeah, right. And then their faces when they bring out a third board. Oh, yeah. And they're like, oh, oh, I thought I was one and done. That's, uh, I'm ready for lunch. Oh, why would Steve? That's when there's an extra phase to the boss that he did. You're like, I beat it, but there's a cutscene.

Oh, no. I don't like this. I used all my esters, but the big text didn't come up. You didn't get the big thing. Walk over and grab the item. I'm pretty upset about how the music seems to have gotten more hype instead of relaxing in a climax. Have you guys ever done like a day of press like that? Like that feels never done a day of press.

It feels like such a specific like archaic form of journalism that only just for like, oh, I'm in a movie and we're doing that. Right. I guess it's all it is all of the like establishment Hollywood presses that are doing it. But I can't even imagine the feeling of, okay, I need to lock in right now. Oh my God. Because no matter the publication, I don't want a clip circulating from my interview

with Esquire where they said like, what's your favorite movie? And I just said the one I like and not number one. And what's your favorite Marvel movie? And I blank and I say like, um, Batman. Yeah. And that does happen. Loser!

He doesn't know anything. No more movies. Miles, so first of all, we first like work together when you were working on Try Guys podcast Yes, yeah yeah, because you did the show Yeah, but you were the Try Guys guy That was the Trig Guys guy

And then you left and then came back That's right You tried to not be a Tri Guys guy And then you went back to Try Guys Exactly, well I left as like a full time guy And then I came back as like a part time guy As a part time try As a part time try

Yeah, exactly right And so yeah I got to like be talent in videos After I already was just working there full time And then I left doing my thing And on my way out like in the the exit interview. I was literally like, you guys should hire me back to do videos because the audience already knows me to be so stupid

to not do. And they were like, okay, yeah, great. Power move. Maybe later. Actually, I hire me back for a different job. Yeah. And I make the rules. I only come in sometimes and they were like, okay. We've already filled the role. Yeah. Oh. Ha ha. Ha ha. Outplayed. But so. Yeah. It worked out. Concurrently with that, you've been doing perfect person. Yes. Your advice show. Call-end advice

show. Live tour of it. Live tour of it. You're a freak and a devil. I'm a little freak in the devil. And I think the craziest factoid about Perfect Person, which is a show that we've also been on. That's right. If you want to try it out. So you were simultaneously doing this with your other job. And then it got to the point where you could, you know, pursue that. Yeah. Now you're a part-time try. So you're kind of balancing. One of the crazier factoid's about this is that you get a lot of call-ins. If you review them all yourself. Yeah, oh yeah.

That's insane. This is why we said you're a twisted, fucked up joker style. I'm a fucked up kind of guy. I still do, though. I get in a couple hundred usually before every episode, and I go through all of them myself. And thankfully, you know, because there's a bit in the live show where I talked about that, but thankfully the Google transcribes them now. So I'm able to like read them quickly.

Yeah. But previously I was just, I was listening to all of them. But yeah, so I get to, and I see this is a part of the documentary, which you guys are very kind to watch the documentary. but a big part of it is me talking about how I like will recognize people from their problem and make their contact list. So my all my contacts are problems like fuck my ex's best friend or like whatever. Yeah, I still do that. Well, yeah, I guess let's get into it because you and Ashley.

And obviously there were other people involved, but you guys edited the doc. I would say there was only other people involved when we shot it. But otherwise me and Ashley made it. It was just the national. And I think you guys did an incredible job. The question of how much should you insert yourself. Oh, yeah, yeah. Into someone else's life when their relationship with you is that you're the host of the show they listen.

Yeah. Are you really like my favorite part of the doc and probably the part where I look the worst is the end where basically the premise is someone has called into the show, talked about somebody else through this musician. And then I decide to have that musician open the show in Brooklyn. and it is kind of like the fallout feels like too big of a word but it's like the repercussions from doing that and from inserting myself into an anonymous color's life and like I still I think that like there's a world when I was you know me and Ashley were talking about like do we include this like and I I think I just was like okay it is maybe in a messy territory it doesn't necessarily make me look good but I actually think I'm happy to represent somebody struggling to figure

out what the right call is. Because there's not a, you know, in fairness, there's not a manual for how to navigate this. And also, like, it's one of those things where like, yeah, I got to give this musician, this awesome opportunity and people are singing along to her songs. And she's like, an independent musician that's like, I've never done the show this big. This is by far the biggest show ever done. And people in the crowd know her song already. Like, it's like that's, and I was like, to give her that experience is so good, but it means.

But at what cost? Because it's like, oh, what's the song about? Why do they know the song? So I like, I, uh, I, uh, And I say this in the document stuff, but I don't think that I will ever do anything like that ever again because it was this messy territory. And I think that what I, you know,

what I learned doing that whole thing was like, you know, this show was started out and it's supposed to be this very goofy thing. And as I've done it for longer and longer, it still is very dumb. Don't, you know, don't get twisted. It's a bad show. You know, exactly.

It's a badger bonner. It's a shitty show. It's a shitty show. But it kind of has this heart where people really are listening to it, wanting a genuine thing. And so it's that funny. It's like, you know, funny, funny, sad.

It's like, I'm like goving around, go around. Before I end the call, almost exclusively, I go like, oh, and here's like probably what I really think. Right. I guess it's a little peculiar

because when somebody says something, like very, very open to you. Yeah. It is like implied intimacy. Yeah. Like when you say the words, I love you, those, it's just a bunch of letters.

But we have like coded that into meaning a certain type of relationship. has just, it must be established, they said the words. I, I think there's this weird, like, uncanny valley parasycial relationship thing, where if someone doesn't know you at all, and no matter how much they may know you from content, just doesn't have any connection to you whatsoever, then it is even easier to tell you something tragic

than it would be if they knew a little bit, quite a bit, a lot, or really well. Like, like, I have to assume, that a lot of people sending truly traumatic, you know, DMs or emails our way or voicemails or mails your way. I would struggle to say that to the people that they're very close to far more. Oh, certainly. It's too hard.

It's too hard. It's too hard. When you go to the doctor and you're like, I'm not going to show my best friend this weird scab that's developing, but I'll show it to my physician. Exactly. Yeah. If the doctor just went like, are you okay? Yeah.

I would be like, whoa. That reminds me of like, well, two things you said. To call it, I think so I take calls on my show. I call them back and I sell their problem. To call it parisocial, honestly, I think lets me off the hook too much. Because I am quite literally calling them back to talk to them about their life. It's just social. I think that there's an element where like, yeah, like that thing happened and part of me wanted to brush it off and be like, well, it's just a per social relationship.

They don't really know me. It's like, no, I am really involved here. You know, I'm calling them. bring it back to parasycial because for a person to make that initial contact they need to have some comfort and that comfort is born of

seeing your interactions so it's this it's got to there's a weird social graph of like parasycialness because people who listen might have parasycial relationships to other random strangers like who just happened to also be callers into the show and I'm curious

about what you guys are speaking about this but like you know people are like, obviously, you know, excluding the insane people, but like, I love, like, meeting people that listen to the show. It makes the world feel like such a small, like, we were on tour and people were coming up to me being like, I'm the girl who banged her friend of me's dad. And I would be like, oh my God. Like, it's like, because of like, hot goss. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It depends on the audience. But like, I am so psyched on that. And like, I'll meet people and they'll be like, hey, like, we've talked on the phone before. Like, it's not just like they like my content.

It's like, oh, we actually have, because at this point, you know, what? We're at episode 180. We take about two to three calls. So it's like, you know, let's call it a thousand people. I've talked on the phone. And I'll meet those people. The Zoom a nightmare. No.

I was just saying, I think I've adopted the Zoomer mentality of being afraid of phone calls. So that's why your show is, it's like a wish fulfillment. It's like somebody who's not afraid of talking on the phone. I love it. I fucking love it. I do thank you again to everybody that just came to the life show we did a couple weeks ago. Oh, yeah, I understand. Specifically because I went to meet my partner in the lobby and then head out and a bunch of people stuck around saying hello.

They were very starstruck by Jacob, which I found very wholesome. And with peeps. It was very sweet. And with Anastasia, actually. They were crazy for Anastasia. Cuckoo. Except I ran away in it. You do you flat.

They were like, he's Anastasia here. I was like, oh no. That's the last. I don't know if she was ever here. But that's like, I think Ashley has the same experience where Ashley will be like setting up the cameras and people will be like, whoa! Yes, notoriously. Oh my God, there's one time we're in Boston and the venue is massive. It's like a thousand, fifteen hundred people.

And I'm going from the merch booth to backstage just to get like, we have people write down problems on cards. And so I'm doing that. And the, I have like security detail, which is crazy to me. And I'm walking by the entire theater goes, Ashley. And I get so nervous. I go into the wrong wing. Oh, no. You go back and go around.

You go into the crowd, sit down. I was like, who was actually? I'm so scared. There was somebody at the life show who specifically referenced a joke I had forgotten about, but a joke I was in love with and it has put it back into my vernacular.

Much of the chagrin of everyone in my life is the, for those, I don't know, the joke where I got really obsessed with the song, Wicked Game, by Chris Isaac L. And I got obsessed with under any circumstances looking at something going

what a wicked game we play what a wicked game and this very very sweet very shy person was like can we get a photo and I was like yes this are next I went wicked game we play I'm like yes that's that's that's

that's social that's the best it's like your are like yeah I was at a you know I was at my friend's birthday and like all my close friends do the show but then also do like the Patreon episodes and somebody like ran it to us

at a brewery and was like, oh my God, it's like all, like, because it was just my home. It was like a friend from college. And they were like, I know, you know, that experience I fucking I love. I do love hearing about what the show means to people and stuff like that. It's always tricky in crowd situations because you don't want to create a safety hazard, especially when you don't have security detail. If I go to an event like MagicCon, there's no such separation. And so I have to be the bad guy a lot because I am like really exhausted and going somewhere

going somewhere or need to sit down and recharge but I can't go back to my hotel so I like eat a hot dog in front of a wall. That's the best. Yeah, just like so that no one can see like because it's not that I think I'm like, you know, so important. It's just that I need to recharge for the next thing I got to do. You eating a hot dog, man, though. If I'm a big fan of you and I see you sneaking a hot dog, I'm like, that's my best thing.

It's like a photo of me just staring at a wall eating a hot dog. So imagine you facing a wall eating a hot dog. Very time, the idea that the hot dog has somehow gained some cultural footing as the portable meal. Oh, I love it. I understand it in theory. And then as soon as you're halfway through a bite that includes the bun and the condiments, you go, this isn't for outdoors. It's not so portable. I get hot.

Are you eating hot dogs now? Where are you at now with hot dogs? You're still at a basketball game, maybe. Yeah, I'll eat them at an event. But you're not buying a hot dog pack. There's not, I don't have a hot dog in this house. Yeah. Because I don't eat hot dogs much, but I did recently, on like a July 4th,

we got hot dogs to make on the grill or whatever. Yeah. And there was a whole pack left over and I was like, let's toss one of these in for lunch. End of the day, no more hot dogs left. I, okay, snacked on those puppies. It's a little pringly with it. It's just, because it's microwave with a little mustard.

I, so that was like my, Look, I didn't grow up with a lot of means, and so you could go to Sam's Club and get like a 48 pack of Oscar Meyer microwavable dogs. Yeah, boom. And that was like multiple weeks of meals, I must say. I love it. That weanomobile. Yeah. They sell in hot dogs?

No. No. They're giving out hot dog whistles. It's promo only. Excuse me. They're giving out hot dog whistles. What is it? Have you received?

If you get attacked by a hot dog. Yeah. I don't know. You can see a hot dog, you whistle like a bear? That sounds, by the way, like a key item that summons the wiener. Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? Sorry, get in there through the shadow gate, blow the whistle.

And especially, one of them later really weird resonables. Hot dog whistle. Rotate. There's a number. Speaking of being mobbed after a show, what? And that being like a potential dangerous situation. Are you doing a segue right now? Really liking this.

Yeah, go for it. Imagine getting mobbed by a hot dude. No, no. Yeah. Instead, hot, dog. How about hot dude? That happened recently to Hudson Williams, star of the runaway hit show. That is so how you're doing.

Wow. The posture you took on, you were doing the, like, the Hamilton. Well, I knew I was killing it. But he. Not throwing away a shot. He was on Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon. He leaves the venue out the side door, like thinking I'm okay. And there is a mob there freaking out about him wanting photos and autographs and stuff.

Obviously, he's done nothing wrong, but it is funny to be like, oh man, there'll probably be a lot of viewers outside. I'll take the side door where no one will check. Yeah, no one's going to be on the side. excessive scary fans, they'll probably think I'm coming out of the front of the building. You just have to leave at some... You should hang out. Helicopter. What do you want to play hockey?

I mean, you know, this is not, like lots of celebrities go to the Tonight Show. And so they actually have security detailed that help people get into a car. And, you know, I think, I think it was just very, like, it was worth noting because a few weeks ago, this kid was, had no fans. Yeah, he's now huge, all of a sudden. It doesn't have any of the, like, that's one of the weird things about celebrity in our modern age is that you, it takes a while to catch up infrastructure wise. You're even money wise.

Like, if you're not, if you don't have one show like first season. He was famous. He probably was a streamer. Like the stars of that show live in apartments. One of the stars Connor's story said that he had to move out of his apartment because because there was no fence. And so people were like coming up to his apartment. They all had to sleep on the ice.

Yeah, that's crazy. It's cold as hot. It's unbelievable. But so. That's for the steamy scene. It's melting. I sent Jacob a few clips of Hudson Williams talking about this, fan behavior.

And we can go into other crazy stuff fans are doing. He's so good, dude. He's on Evan Ross Katz's podcast recently and talks about how wild it's been. Never really struggled with social anxiety since ninth grade. For the first time in a while, I was just out to get some lighter fluid at my SkyTrain station in Vancouver.

And I was like, and I remember like looking down, planning my exit. I was trying to like avoid the masses of people because I'm in gym shorts, like a hoodie, a hat, like look gross. I think I'm in like dusty ass sneakers. And I remember for the first time, I had like just a huge amount of social anxiety of just,

let me get to the car because I just, I'm not in a social mood. I don't want to be rude. And if someone stopped me, I would talk to them for six minutes or however long they chatted my ear off. But that's not exactly what I want to do right now. I want to get home. Wait, so how did they know?

Is he being tracked? So he literally is having a like Beatles mania moment. He's one of the main two. He's one of the main two. So it's Hudson Williams and Connor Story. And both of them are like people are making fan pages for them. The club shallomay lady made a. Oh, I saw that.

Storytime. Yeah. This is what she's calling it. And people are saying like, you know, spotted over here like paparazzi. you're following them. Hudson Williams has been compared to Princess Diana because of the amount of like paparazzi that follow him around.

It reminds me of like, yeah, how do you diffuse that? Because that would suck too. Like if all of a sudden, like it's nice to have attention, whatever, but it would suck to be like, oh, I can't do any of the same shit that I was doing. Yeah. It reminds me of Robert Pattinson had that thing where his super fan was waiting outside of the set every day

and would be like, Robert, Robert, Robert. And they would like follow him to his hotel. And so one day he got coffee with her And just talked about all his problems And she never came back Whoa It's like an iconic Robert Patton's story He was like I think if I sit down with her

And I just am like I'm depressed I'm like feeling about this Like I'm worried about how the movie's gonna do whatever And then she just saw him as a person Didn't come right It's like because that's the issue Is that you're not being seen as a person Yeah you're just like

She's cultivating relationships with strangers Because they filled in the blanks With everything perfect He's so perfect And he's like, no, I'm like, a fucking mess. He cut me in a bar once. And I was like, dead to me. I haven't gotten to become the kind of actor that does weird voices in every movie yet.

He's a movie. He loves a voice. I love it, dude. He's the best. Hudson Williams talks about that, like how we don't see celebrities as people, that they're this kind of other thing that only exists, like, for our entertainment. Doesn't it feel a little bit like kind of an arms race? A little bit, yeah.

Don't we have enough exposure to, like TMZ following someone around feels like a relic of an era where it was the only time you could see them at. I don't know if you're right. They weren't posting on social media. Constantly published. I don't understand what you would need. So one thing that happened to Hudson Williams was that he was walking through JFK airport. Everybody knew he was at the Tonight Show and now he's going to the Golden Globes. And so people were like waiting for him at JFK.

and people started taking, like just regular people, not paparazzi, started taking photos of him as he's like walking to his gay as he bent over to like grab something. And these, he's like, it feels weirdly violating that someone is like publishing a photo of my ass

online. Oh yeah. And tagging like TMZ and stuff. And I don't want this photo out here. I don't look my, best. I don't feel my best. The fact that that needs any qualification, as opposed to like, which is bad.

Yeah, yeah, like, you should just be able to be like, that's fucking insane. People are taking photos of me anywhere. That's been bad since cameras. I will say, there's a TikTok trend right now that is, it's about like couples or something. I don't know what the trend is, but I started getting tagged with like me and my ex

from six years ago. No. And people were making like fan cams of us. What? Someone was like, they were my Jalina and shit like that. And I'm like, bro, what the fuck is going on? It was a bad, I tried to turn off like tagging because I, and I was getting like collaboration requests and shit on Instagram.

Why is that the time they don't tag phase Jarvis? Yeah, no, literally, dude. Really confused phase Jarvis. This is so, it's so bizarre. Like, because in what universe would you think that that's like an okay thing to do? Well, you don't exist. We broke up five years ago. That is really crazy.

It is because you don't exist. Right. So that's the thing. It's like, it's like you're actually in character, you're the character on the screen. So there's an even more insidious element to this. So people are watching this and now they're shipping the two main actors.

Right. Which one of them is in a relationship with a woman, right? No. None of them are sharing about their personal lives. All of the actors are being. You just have an inside scoop. I literally, okay. Did I heard one of them has a girlfriend.

Badass. Well, so they, they haven't shared anything. So maybe he does. I don't know. But there are people stalking them. So it's like they might have put two and two together from like unofficial means. The two younger guys, Connor Story and Hudson Williams, they are like, we don't want to talk about our sexuality. Yeah, totally.

We don't want to talk about our personal lives in that way. These guys like, what, 20? 24, 25. Oh, that's, yeah. And the older star of the show, Francois Arnaud, is 40. And he came out a long time as bye. And so he lives in L.A. Connor Story lives in L.A.

They've become friends. Who knows what their relationship is. But now Francois Arnaud is getting death threats from fans saying, stay away from Connor. He belongs with Hudson. Right. But is that that, that's so crazy. Do we think that's like,

a 16 year old? Yeah. So he actually, he essentially has said, I think these are very young fans who don't understand the difference between fantasy and reality. Totally.

Yeah, or if they do, they haven't learned to like humanize someone. You know what I mean? Like even if they understand the difference, there's a certain amount of empathy that has to like come in. The craziest part about it is,

again, no confirmation that they're actually. dating their friends they've been seen hanging out and and traveling together and people are saying because he's 40 and Connor Story is 25 that he's grooming Connor story yeah sorry he's 25 they're on the same set every day suspicious since we're on the topic I saw you hanging out with a three-year-old and a seven-month-old and I think that's it's problematic age parent it's yeah I have young children like what the fuck did what do you have in common with a three-year-old much what

I'm always crying. Yeah, yeah. I get an ice cream. Shut up. The baby loves milk and so do I. I drink it every day. Whole milk. Terrifying.

Well, he am. You drink the whole milk? I'm a whole guy. A whole type guy. Glass. Glass. I like, I like, I like, I like,

I love a piping glass of cold hole. Piping. A piping? It's piping with cold steam. It's like you put dry ice in. I like it to foam out. You gotta be careful, man. Not the Suvius.

I fucking love it, man. I drink whole milk. What can I say? Justice for Whole Milk drinkers. This is all, this is all whole. All whole, wow. Suck the whole thing down. Whole is bad.

I'm tired of, me when I'm Courtney Love. Yeah, I'm not just intolerant. Whatever. You are realizing for whole milk. I am, I am gonna, and I'm gonna say something that maybe is not top of mind for you right now. That, uh, RFK Jr. Oh, my God. Sorry.

Wait, wait, yeah. Sorry, cut the cameras. We should, don't love the end. We could edit that so it's, you saying whole milk. You were saying raw milk. No. So we should. No,

let it. Can we pull up the Robert F. Kennedy milk thing where he has the milk mustache? Because it's so crazy. Is he doing the gold milk? Milk?

They're doing like a Make America drink milk again. But it's like an AI video of him like drinking milk at a floor or something. An AI video of drinking milk. This is crazy. What James Fangerwe? Well,

why is he there? Yeah, these ads. I don't understand why. Like whole milk. I saw like some conspiracy theories that this was originally going to be about raw milk.

But then I've also seen arguments to the contrary. So is that a Stardew Valley with Trump in it? Was that one of theirs or was that like a meme? Do they like have owned like milk stock? Get out of here. Oh my God. They put POTUS in Stardue Valley.

So what are, sorry, go on. What is that for? What are his items? He has an American flag. He has a lot of more milk and Diet Coke. He has a Maga hat. He has a police badge. What you, and an iPhone.

A Diet Coke? That's not really how the inventory looks. No, no, no. You have a lot of items of that for one. And they're about farming, mostly. Yeah, it's a video. Yeah, seemingly, here it is. Jesus.

When you first take that first sip of whole milk. Oh. God, I hate this. That's humiliating. Yeah, it sucks so bad. It's definitely AI, obviously. It's 100%. Because he no longer looks like himself in that.

Yeah, he looks like a person, I know. Also, he doesn't have a regular mustache, so he's not going to have a milk mustache. Yeah, he's just bad at drinking. Is that from the official account? Yeah. That's from himself. Dang, everything so. Kenny.

Man, I hate. It's all sucks, bro. It all sucks. So anyway, I'm gonna actually stop drinking whole milk after watching that. Yeah, I think I'm done. I don't drink whole milk in massive quantities, I should say. But I will, like, drink a little bit, like if I'm eating a cookie. And I'm like, oh, you know, it would go good with this.

I'm like Santa Claus. Yeah. You think Santa Claus is disgusting? Yeah. Before the show, after the show, on my way home, in the car. Right before bed. And then a tall glass of milk, sprinkle a cookie. I think it's rude that he leaves a little bit on the plate where my cookies's not good.

Yeah, I think so. My Santa eats all the cookies. My Santa ate all the cookies. So did I when I was... Not like a tasteful crumble. I will say, I was a skeptical, Santa Man. I was skeptical about the existence and all of that. And then someone said to me, you know, that's just your dad doing it, right?

And I went, ha ha ha, ha. He lives in Kenya. You've been owned. And then I... It reactivated my belief. I went like, well, it can't be my mom. Yeah. boy.

Yes, for the dads. How would he carry all the stuff? So whole milk is, it's a fabrication, it's a farce. When I was young, I knew about 2% milk and I knew about whole milk. Is it wrong that I thought that whole milk was 100%? No, I also thought this. It's 100% of what it promises to be. And it's 4% by the way.

Yeah, because the idea being that it's only 4% milk fat, they're taking half of that and then they're taking half of that, yeah. Yeah, and it's like, and then like you get into the cremate. you know, when you go up in milk fat percentage. There were no, it's, in the UK, I don't know if it's changed now, but similar to how we don't have like egg descriptors. There's no over-easy, you know,

it's scrambled or fried egg. There is no, the- That's a failure of the English language. Semi-skimmed, sometimes skim milk, very rarely and just whole, whole semi-skimed, skimed. Yeah. There's no numerical breakdown. Yeah, I don't know why we do with a percent.

2% is such a weird, it's a weird time to introduce. Yeah. It makes me against it. That's really small. And then by the way, don't get confused because half and half is a totally different thing. That's a good point. That's crazy.

That's crazy. That's good. There was another, so I haven't seen a heated rivalry, but I am going to watch it. I started watching Succession randomly because I never seen it. I'm working my way through.

Yeah, so I just finished Better Call Saul. I'm working my way through some shows. But it's on my list, but one thing I am caught up with is the pit. So shout out to the pit. But Supriah Ginevna. one of the actresses on the pit. I saw a clip that's relevant to

to pariscial relationships. I didn't tell you where this clip was, so maybe we can, you found it, perfect. This is why the snobics. I can love the pit. It's so good.

I will watch a million seasons of it. You know what's really good? And gave me an option to watch another, to watch the season again is that Dr. Mike did a reaction for every single episode. And I'm like,

yeah, I want to see what a real doctor thinks about it. And the whole type of him going like, It is. And I'm like, yeah. He's the best. He's on this podcast?

We reached out, mostly because we were watching us The Pit Reacts. And I think maybe next time he's in L.A. Because he doesn't, he doesn't live here. And he's a doctor. He's a fucking doctor.

I love Dr. Mike. I fuck with Dr. Mike so hard. He's so lazy. He's always hanging out of the hospital. You're not sick, bro. Yeah, come on. If anyone is Dr. Mike listening? If anyone is Dr. Mike listening.

Sorry, if any doctor Mike's are listening. If any Dr. Mike's are listening or if anyone knows Dr. Mike, please tell him we're huge fans and we want him on the show. I think we did reach. We reached out to his reps and they were like, he doesn't live there. That was the first one. I feel like,

I feel like Dr. Mike will remember the times that we shared. Yeah. One time we were in an elevator with Tommy Init, me, Dr. Mike and Tommy in it, strange group. Dr. Mike walks in, looks at Tommy In it, goes, how are your balls? That's right, yes. Holy shit.

Oh, it's because of Dysicular Torres. He had a sticular tour. Did he have been Dr. Mike talk about it or something? Maybe publicly now, but it started in that elevator. Well, he had the balls. Man, honestly, the biggest flex would be if Dr. Mike was my, like, primary doctor. I think he's a primary doctor for children, maybe. Well, then my kids have to get in there.

Yeah, got to get in there. I could. You should, like, toss one of your kids to him, and if he catches it, then he's like, well, you got to be their primary care position. And if he doesn't catch a release. He fails his oath if he doesn't catch the baby. He better do no harm. I just was worried about, I don't know, I felt like the. show was going to be a success, but I'm wrong a lot. So I was like, okay, just in case I'm wrong,

I'm going to keep my day job, and I'm going to tutor, and I was touring through season one. She was a MCAT tutor, so like the for med school. Oh, that's so, by the way, of course med students love the show. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's good. Wait, that does have to be an uncomfortable position to be in, though, if, you know, actors, though they might, they most often will be making plenty of money and be in relatively comfortable positions of privilege on a show, they are still tools and utility and like kind of tossed around as like, yeah, they don't know how to live. There are little things to play with.

And having to be like, that's not, I'm in MCA too. That's not how that. Yeah, don't worry. Like, seeing something that's obviously wrong on the train being like, I just, mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. And even after the show started airing, I was still tutoring.

And I kind of realized it was maybe a success when people started signing up for my class just to see me. And I was like, oh, okay, maybe I can't do this anymore. Yeah, you'd be like, I don't know what an MCAT is, but we got the next hour. I'll give it a swing. So I was thinking character development's impeccable through season one. Do you think there's anything that could be healed with a kiss? By the way, if anyone listening to this is Supriah Ganesh, I am not an MCAT tutor, but I do have a degree in computer science and was a teaching assistant. Maybe we should talk some time about teaching people stuff.

Or marriage. Yeah, she rocks. That's so fucking good, dude. New episode Thursday. But don't do that, by the way. Parassocial lights. Oh, yeah, that's crazy. To sign up for a class top by somebody

who, like, it's like... Not only want to give you what you want, is it like, it's going to be scary and weird and they're just going to leave. But it's also like, okay, if they don't immediately kick you out. Yeah. You just want to learn about medical stuff?

Yeah, what is your goal? You're like, and then she'll see you. me and be charmed by my obsession. It should be like, oh, that's strange. Goodbye. That's the question, though, right? Is like, what is the goal? Well, it's the dog catching the mailman.

He doesn't have a plan once he actually gets there. Somebody that happened like... Except for me, by the way. If Superior Kinesh is listening to this, I've got... I'll have a plan. And I know. I'll find a plan.

And I know what I'll do. I'll take all the mail. That's why I'm chasing him I won the Amazon packages. I'll obscure some of the details of the story, but I was working at a place. Somebody had found the address. and showed up. And they had no plan.

And they were so embarrassed. Oh, man. They knocked on the door and they were like, um, hey, so I found the, and I was like, hey,

you cannot be here. Like, what are you doing? This is totally about, and they were like, I'm really sorry. And they got there. And it was like,

you had no plan. You didn't need to do this. And you just did. It was like, what is that plan? You think we're not going to be weird. Like, we're not going to be like,

hey, get out of here. Yeah. I think it's just supposed to fulfill whatever watch. It's, it's going to be. a super video. They're going to watch it

and it's going to give them all they get from watching a video times 10. Because every... You do be way less. There's so many videos going on when they're not on my YouTube. If I could just get in the room

I'd see so many extra videos. You guys would probably think like, it's probably like lying about your, like dramatically lying about your height on a dating app. Yeah. Where it's like, okay, you'll get you to the thing.

Maybe. It's like, okay, so like I love seeing a celebrity IRL. Like it's my favorite thing. Thank you. Thank you so much. And I actually wasn't talking about you. Okay.

But no. But I love it. It's my favorite. Like me and Ashley were at a coffee shop recently and right behind her was Josh Hutcherson. Oh. And I loved it. But you know, it's like it was awesome because it was organic. It was in the wild.

It was like, oh, shit. And like, we didn't say shit. And it was awesome. I do love seeing them not saying shit. Yeah. I actually have things to do. Stephen June. No.

I saw him at a fucking oh. I've seen him everywhere. We saw him at, um, cron-fricing the place. Oh, we can't, no, not there, but I actually don't want to say the place. I was going to say, do you? It is, I shouldn't docks the place. I've seen him like three times in the wild. And I'm like, he's the best.

Wild. It's so fun every time. One time I was in a line and I was with Dipper. He was just like sniffing around. he starts sniffing somebody's shoe and I'm like, oh, I'm sorry. I look up and it's Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Whoa.

See, honestly, I will say like having young kids, that has happened a couple times where like, you know, LA celebrities will see like our cute kids or our dog and be like, oh my God, like whatever. And I'm like, yeah.

That's what I thought. And also LA schools are full of celebrities. Oh, that makes a way. And it's super funny to be like, oh yeah, here's so-and-so who's huge and we're just like, oh yeah, hey,

Oh, yeah, yeah. It's Jack Quaid Jr. That's who you. Right before the live show, the previous show that was at Typewriter, we're Dynasty. Dynasty. Yeah. The Hayworth.

Also. What the people from the previous show were leaving and me and my partner walked in and we're like getting ready to set up or whatever. And this woman, she was like, oh, hey, you guys here for the next show. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, what are you guys doing? oh, it's Jarvis and Jordan, they're sad boys, it's a podcast.

And she was like, oh, cool, have so much fun. I was like, thank you, hope your show went well. And then they left and me and Cam go, she look, wait a minute, do we do. It was Darcy Cardin from. Wait, you told us. About us? Yeah.

Let's go. And we were like, she looks so familiar. Darcy Cardin's so sick. Darcy Cardin's awesome. I met her at a One Direction concert. What is going all? You're more excited about it. When I first visited L.A. before I moved here, we have a mutual friend, and I was like, I had been in L.A. for maybe 20 hours. And we were walking. And then it was like her and her family.

I was like, oh, my God, I, whatever. My first 20 hours in L.A. involved me seeing Pete Holmes. No way. Being in line behind Pete Holmes at the same place that I saw Jesse Tyler Ferguson. This is maybe. I also saw Rachel Senate there. Name dropping people. We've seen them. We've seen, which I love because I'm okay. I don't talk to them. People being like, I want to see a person I want to follow.

It's like, don't follow them. See them in the wild. See them in the wild. Don't engage. Like notice all these examples of us not even saying anything. Don't say anything to them. DM them later and tell them the coordinates of where it happened. It's like, go to the zoo and you see a flamingo.

It's not exciting. You go to the wild and you see a flamingo? If you got a grip and bark and you see it was flamingo, there's maybe this is two, niche a I get the most excited when it's like relatively niche celebrity that I almost forgot I was excited about

I went to a bar relatively near my place with a friend that I've not seen in a really long time and it was very much a been a long time dynamic getting on decently well enough but having to kind of socially lubricate a lot of it, some dead air to try and

negotiate and all of that completely disappeared after we both got very excited about seeing Subod from love on the spectrum. Mm. Who was just, he was just like strolling around the bar with his family, didn't say a word the entire time he was walking around. And we just kept going like, he's so sweeties, one of my favorite characters in that

whole season. And then I think we both stopped at the time we went like, oh, we're weird. What we're doing, this is what we think would be weird. Yeah, right. Is seeing Stephen Newton and then while he's still there going like, walking dead. You remember? Remember? He got...

Who, sleepy. Man, dude, I am a Walking Dead head, by the way. I feel like you and I, me and you to talk to about Walking Dead, maybe when you were on my podcast. I haven't seen Walking Dead, but maybe it was another show. Like, lost. No, because... A couple deadheads.

Oh, no, no, no. Last time I saw you, it was... Oh, we were at a... Organic in a coffee shop, forever. And you were talking about how the Sons of Anarchy characters are like in the Walking Dead. Oh, yeah, yeah. I was like, where am I getting this from?

Anyway, no. You're similarly fucked up sick individual with a Joker-style South Park mindset. Yeah, I brought like an edge lord kind of vibe. Right, right. You know, like, whoa, somebody, somebody watches family guy. He's actually really fucked up.

I just included some fucked up little tidbits here. Actually, wearing a Harley Quinn t-shirt with chew sleeves and little holes in the side that she poked through with her thumbs. Yeah. You can't see me, but I am dressed like Harley Quinn. Yeah, yeah, swirling a baseball bat. baseball bat. Not the newer outfit.

The jester black and white leotard. The jester, old school. Old school. Ashley's not on camera right now, which is simulates the experience of Ashley in your videos because I was watching your new series.

I was watching your new graveyard shift series, which I love. I think it's an amazing premise. I text Ashley about it. And I was about to ask if Ashley was involved and that I heard. behind the camera and go, yeah.

You can hear my little laugh. Also, if you notice, I'm very tall, Ashley is not very tall. And so the angle is almost always like pointed up at me. Ant-eye view. I thought you'd gotten one of those little delivery robots to shoot. Just me. But we just, it's very sweet if you say that,

we just shot another one, and then we're shooting three more, I think. So we're going to do a season of four. So for people who haven't watched that, because I do really recommend it, I think it's like a very cool. It's a cool piece of content. And it's very like grounded and human and interesting.

It reminds me a lot of like older school YouTube in a way. Oh, thank you. Yeah. So it's called graveyard shift. It's basically we review 24 hour restaurants after midnight. And the goal with it, I was like, I want to interview people who work there and people who are dining there in a sort of like, I mean, I fucking love Anthony Bourdain. I think that's obvious if you watch the thing.

I'm way dumber than him. But I think that the idea was like, how can we, much like perfect person where we get real people with their problems. I was like, how can we like romanticize real people who are out late at night? And then also like try the food and just that like, yeah, it's also just a type of thing that I am curious. Because if I'm, if I'm out in the middle of the night, I don't talk to anyone. No, I'm, I'm very focused on the, if I'm, if I need a donut, I'm getting my donut and I'm going or I'm getting whatever I need. And I'm not ready to talk about the situation that has landed someone else in exactly the same place at the same time. Which has.

to be something. I feel like thematically there's kind of a tight, a perfect person also because it's like a little, there's always a story if you ask someone kind of thing. Because everyone's has to be kind of weird because they exist. Yeah, and so it's correct. And also

we just shot another one where we interview one and then the person who works there at the first one. In the second episode, we interviewed like three or four people who were out and all of them were just like, oh yeah, we're like out dancing. Like I just found that how did you all get to be here at midnight. It's a really interesting, you know, problem.

Yeah, turning up at a, being in a diner at 3 a.m. is not like the result of, I'm just doing homework. Yeah, like, it's like, usually someone's like, oh, I just came from this thing, or like, oh, I couldn't sleep and I was working on X, whatever. Yeah. And I think that's a theme in a lot of my stuff is just like romanticized the everyday whatever, which I think is good.

I feel like we should do that more. Yeah. I'm very much, you know, we're living the good times right now. so we've got to appreciate it. Yeah. Because even though everything is also terror and horrible, there is going to be some amount of romanticization of this in retrospect. Yeah, definitely.

It's happening even with COVID now. It was like the worst of times. It was a global pandemic. We were all inside. But there's a little piece of everybody. It was like, oh, but there was this one little silver lining that I missed. I mean, I've got to say. Of lockdown, which again, I think it's a very human thing to do.

I'm not actually saying COVID was good. I think it's a natural. A natural human psychology to, in retrospect, take kindly to whatever situation, even if it's... I mean, how would you ever be able to carry it? It's like, again, to make it really dark, when my mom passed away, I remember having a really good sandwich in the hospital. You know what I can't do what? It's like, there's always going to be a little bit of... Sorry, you had a good sandwich at the hospital, really.

I know, and it shouldn't be... Hospital food is so seldom. It faintly bad. But I think it's like my palate was underdeveloped enough at the point. You're like, fuck. Where I'm like, whoa, I never had shit like this before. That's so interesting you say that because I, sorry, I interrupt you. Well, I was not going to say, maybe this is too dark about it.

I had, the first time I ever had a Big Mac in my life was in the room, like, kitchen, like, two hours after my mom died. Really? And she was in the other room. And you were like, you're waiting, you know. I guess I'll get it with the bun in the middle. Well, the person I was there, you know, I was, I was in a funny mood. Yeah. I was like,

I was like, it's a funny sandwich. It is one of the biggest cheering up kind of, there's a smile in the box. You go happy. By the way, you couldn't be pitching it to their correct audience

because when my brother died, so when I was 17, my brother died in high school. And after he died in her house, he was like in hospice and stuff, he's sick for all. And these two men showed up who were going to,

you know, take him to the crematorium or whatever. And I can only describe their look as looking like pimps. One was in a, orange zoot suit and was a humongous. And the other one was a very thin man in a purple zoots suit.

That's crazy. No, both gentlemen were bald. Both were bald. Wow. Well, they had hat, but they had braimed hats. Right. They took them off and they said, my condolences. I'm not even lying.

That is quite literally rural North Carolina. That's who's coming to your door. Big of the hat, feather. Don't fucking out of it. Not even making it up feather. Sorry, I hold my cane from it. Like spirit Halloween. It was fucking thing.

And you're not supposed to last. No. You're not loud. They didn't expect me to laugh. No. Did they have the classic leader sidekick? What is that they have the leader sidekick dynamic? They did. It felt that the thin purple man was the leader and then the large or the muscle. You know what? Okay, yeah boss, I'll pick it up. Okay, while we're here, I need to tell you the image that's being conjured in my mind as who's the the pit boss of this situation and you might not have seen it because we were talking about Dragon Ball earlier. And this is from Dragon Ball filler.

Can you, can you open up a new tab and type in Krillen Garlic Jr.? Yo! Yeah, this is similar. Very, yes, purple and orange. Yeah. Yes, this is it.

Same face. Maybe try Krillin in. Maybe Krillin in Hatt. Because I do think there's another one of this. Krillin in Fedora. Yeah. Sorry, this is my search term. Prilin, Fedora.

Yeah, there it is. That third photo is what I'm thinking. Yes, correct. Exactly like that, but purple and orange. They're here to take my brother's body away. I'm like looking at the other people in the room like, are you? Yeah, they're supposed to be dressed like necromances.

No, it was so fucking crazy. And like me and my parents still talk about it. We're like, and I think that that, you know. It was just, you can't mention it. They were like, I'm so sorry for your loss. And I was just like, yeah. It's okay.

It's happening right now. Why are you dressed like that? You're helping. I think that that's just like the humanity. It's like the human experience. And I think that. given how much negativity and stuff there is in the world, finding little things to romanticize.

Totally. I think is really awesome. I think it's a cool mission. And I feel like your podcast and your videos keep a very bright, fun element to them, regardless of the substance or topic. I like never walk away like feeling bad. That's really nice of you to say. And I think that's certainly the goal.

I think also like, yeah, I get so. tired with like when I watch the content, when I watch content, it being about these like influencers that have really unrelatable lives. And I think that one of the things that I like about graveyard shift is like, you know, whatever. There's all sorts of great food in LA and I love fucking fancy food. But the idea being that it's like, the audience is probably more similar to someone that's getting a donut at midnight than they ever would be to being like, I'm trying a million dollar burger and like I have a fucking cyber truck. Yeah. One dollar burger and a million dollar burger. One burger for you, Scum.

For me. You know me. Person. I'm going to ram my cyber truck into the walkway house. The face when you back over someone's head. Like I think it's like the audience probably is like, oh yeah, that's more like, you know, something that I know. There's a specific moment in the in the dock actually.

I think about it a lot. There's like a very, you know, like we don't, the English language doesn't have the substance to like let us articulate everything in the emotional palette. Like it tends to fall into the buckets of like, Tabby, it's sad, it's guilt, it's bad. And you kind of, those little pathos, I guess, is a really hard one to kind of throw in there. Yeah.

Poignant, I guess. And there's, billing the space in my head for that a lot has been, there's a point in the dog, not spoilers, I guess, but in the live show, you talk about your brother. And then as the, like,

that's obviously like a kind of, the, in your presentation but darkest moment and then you pivot near it to the end of the show into a dance sequence and there's like I think like rhythmically very sph that's like that's like the case study for pathos yeah it's like inverse severance right it gives you the opposite vibe well I end the in this is at every life show I end I say like it was the hardest moment my entire life like I've never felt that way I don't want to feel it way again and then I play a fart sound effect yeah and with reverb and I just am like A lot of reverb.

A lot of reverb. But I think, yeah, my favorite shit has always been like, yeah, yeah, like, you know, happy, happy, sad, sad, sad, happy or whatever. And I feel like that's, like, tonally something that we relate to. Yeah, definitely. When we started this show, it was about being able to bounce between these, like, very, like, emotionally sensitive, emotional sensitivity or dark stuff with, like, just goofs and gaffes. Yeah, right. probably like just like it's hard to relate to some aspects of something too distant in the past to hold on to all the details of. I could be wrong.

I sort of feel like that's a muscle that develops because I sometimes like people have said it's not how do you guys talk about things openly with people? Yeah. And the only thing I can ever think to say is, well, I didn't. Yeah. Yeah. for a really long time. Oh, no. And then I did a little bit, and then it hurt, and then it got a little easier because

I was doing it more and more. And we're privileged to be afforded the opportunity to do that. That's obviously the big thing. But, like, I think we talked about it before really this era of sad boys, because we used to do the show just like purely recreationally together. We still live in San Francisco, still office job, nothing kind of in the same vein. And I remember us talking about how we had to. start structuring the show in a way that accounted for how

fatiguing it can be to talk about that. Totally. Oh yeah. Because it just, if we free flow in person, you can, that's fine because your intuition will kick in and you'll be like, hey, anybody, you want to get a coffee or something. You can pat it.

Yeah. But in the structure of a show where you know that you need to be on and you're avoiding dead air, but also you're filling that dead air with some kind of like, slightly heavy and weighty topic, we would get to end of recording and just be like, I'm sure people who,

you know, we talk about therapy a lot. And if you've done therapy before, sometimes it'll be extremely draining. Totally. And in adding like a performance on top of that is like not ideal. No. But I totally, yeah, I relate to the feeling and I,

with my stuff, whenever I, because I've talked about grief before on the show, show, I get a lot of calls or like, you know, people who reach out and be like, you talk about creep that was helpful and I always, you know, appreciative of that. But I also on the show when I get the voicemails and I go through them, a lot of them are like, hey, my like, you know, partner died, my this person died. And I am hearing them and then having to be like, who move to the next one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're screening those out. I can't do that every episode because it's like not really what the show is, but it can be sometimes. But if you even extend, and this is a, it's a very

human thing and it's a practical reality of existing in the space that we do if you extend that olive branch unfortunately there are going to be a lot of people who are like want to continue the dialogue or get help or whatever and it's like you just don't have a limitless source of energy or time to be able to help everyone in the whole way that you would like to if you know you had infinite of every of those resources and so that's another tough like like aspect. Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah, and I, I, I, I, I have taken calls before on the show that I have not aired because they were too intense and the person was not, didn't really feel ready or whatever. And then we've, like, I basically would just stay on the phone like, hey,

uh, we're actually not going to put this in the episode, but I just hope you're okay, whatever. And then we'll just kind of cut it from the episode. But yeah, it's interesting. Because I also, when I, like, you were just saying, like, you weren't ready to talk about it. You know, for me, I went to, uh, college orientation, like the day. day after my brother died. So I literally was like in transit from high school to college, went to high school, all new people. Nobody knew.

Right. And so nobody knew for a while. What's up, man? Let's do an icebreaker. I had a really nice sandwich yesterday. Yeah. Well, literally, do you have any siblings? Is an icebreaker question in college?

So constantly I was being like, and I actually remember talking to like, you know, whatever, my grief counselor, like, what do I say? And she was like, you should probably just be like, yeah, I have a brother. because if you're meeting someone new over and over are like I grew up with a brother is what like oh yeah I grew up with a brother is usually what I would end up saying yeah it is interesting that

how like nuanced people's backgrounds and lives are and how unnuanced some of our like set phrases and things are they just don't account for any of that and so I find myself like wanting to lie because if I don't lie then I have to explain a lot of stuff. And also 17-year-olds, 18-year-olds,

most people who are that age have not gone through something intense. So they really don't have a language or communication. I think it's like as you get older, it's like, you know, now I'm in my 30s. Like most of my friends have had some sort of tragedy. You know what I mean? Like as you get older,

it just becomes more likely that you're going to have that. And have probably encountered, at the very least encountered, the thing you're going to talk about in some way from someone else. Totally. It's not, not Santa doesn't exist right out at the game level.

It's just like, oh, you know, you know Santa doesn't. Yeah, exactly. I'm going to express a feeling. Yeah. Sometimes when someone later in life is going through a horrible tragedy, because I went through some horrible tragedies as a child, I find myself having to remind myself to have empathy for them in a way. I'm like, purity testing.

I'm like, get over it. That's not the actual feeling, but it's like. It's your gatekeeping tragedy. Gatekeeping tragedy. Oh, you had 15 years of maturity to deal with that. They're letting fans in. Yeah,

no, but it's, yes, I agree. It's like a, it's a gut reaction that you have, that I feel that I have to like catch before it escapes. No,

certainly I feel that way. And especially in college, I felt that way, because somebody'd be like, he just like, I thought he liked me and he doesn't. And I'd be like, I,

like, okay. My brother died of cancer like two months ago. Right, right. Like, but it would just, and like, obviously, I think the thing I had to learn in college was like, oh, tragedy and hurt feelings are not a meritocracy. Like, the person who has the thing where their crushes and lank them back, it might hurt the most it's ever hurt. It's the same brain chemicals, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's like so it might literally feel the same way. Yes. To them, you know. And with no, on some level knowing that they, it is a little bit invalid. Yeah. So there is, they're kind of self-consciously. It's a kid. screaming and crying

about something that is worth a sigh because they don't have the vernacular like it's like the baby doesn't have words so it's crying to express a lot of stuff that I mean my three-year-old like sometimes the things that trigger such a large emotional response like me and my wife will look at each other

and just be like because it's so funny he's just like he doesn't have the tools yet to be like okay I can't have you know whatever ice cream right now and that is the biggest tragedy of my life. And that is so awesome. Yeah, like, it's so, like, that's how you learn, like, it's, there's something very beautiful. That I agree, I agree, it's very beautiful that the biggest tragedy of your life is no ice cream.

Like, on his knees, like, throwing your feet outside. Throwing yourself to the ground. Like, on the, you know, industry just, like, wailing to the sky because that's his experience. Right. It's like, I mean, the truth is, is similar to how we're violent. away and memory-holling some of the more traumatic experiences of a difficult time and then kind of like reconstituting rebuild, recycle, whatever, something we, I guess, not positive memories, but like banal tree of life.

Yeah. You know, I've kind of felt the same about any time that I find myself cycling and spiraling on something that I know, I know is absolutely worthless. as I get older I am starting to laugh a little more at it but at the time the cortisol isn't changing in any way nothing nothing is actually changing in my brain I am sat there going like I fucking suck at Tekken and it hates me

and they put something in the Balatro code that makes the diamonds not come up when I need a flush and very sincerely having that feeling and then like going outside of me like oh my god the glow oh my god we're on a planet No, I will sometimes have to math out my anxiety loop to be like, oh, it doesn't, it's not equating something. Right, right. Like, I'm feeling nervous.

Okay, let's check out of my personal life, doing awesome. Career, also doing great. Why am I nervous? Oh, is this like not a, I'm not being stimulated by something to be nervous? I just am nervous. Right. That's the, that's the, that's the checklist that my therapist gave. It's like, it's like, eat, I can't remember it's the five pillars, but it's food, water.

I'm seeing. Like, I think community. There's a couple of them, but it's like checking off all those things before you go into like problem solving mode. Totally. I recently showed someone the Matrix or the first time, a movie I love. Great movie. And I. He wakes up in that big pool of whole milk.

It was, he does. And he goes, mm, delicious. He has a big mustache. He's a big mustache. Careless, but as a big milk must sense. Now, I sometimes, I have a few, like, things about me that I think are bad, but I do them anyway. One is, I love reading replies on Twitter. Like, I just love seeing people, like, just getting down and dirty and, like, arguing and stuff like that.

Another thing is, I like reading things that'll make me mad. And those are in the same things. And so I went to the Metacritic for. The Matrix. And then I sorted by negative reviews. And I found a review from 1999 from a guy who fucking hated The Matrix. That's so funny. And I thought it would be fun to read this, this, uh, SFGate slash San Francisco

Chronicle review, uh, because it's, I think SFGate owns the Chronicle. The Chronicle is the newspaper. And when the internet first started, they were like, we're going to create our news website SFGate. I see. Cool. It's the same thing. It's the same thing.

But this was in the paper. This was in the paper. This was in the paper. San Francisco Chronicle Senior writer Bob Graham. I am going to talk his ass though. Who may be dead. Who knows? He's probably long dead.

His time has come. We can only pray. Yeah. And I think it would be fun to read this review. Can we blow it up? Blow it up. Okay. So wait, look.

It opens with a non-functional image that was captioned snoozing viewer. That's awesome. What could that have been in 1999? It was probably a deeply offensive. It was a pre-911 Matrix review. It was a guy that looks sleepy. Yeah.

Okay, he calls it an opera. It's not. Cyber space opera. What would make it an opera? Like a space opera though, like, is like stromatic. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm like, they don't see. No, no, no. It's like, like, Calway Vibop or, or Star Wars. But the Keanu Reeves' cyberspace opera, The Matrix, is a wonderful movie to chew up and spit out. Oh, Jesus. Someone else read the next line. The Wachowski's, the hot shot, well, the Sez Brothers.

Siblings. Yeah, antiquated. Writing and directing team clearly set out to astonish with this dude. They certainly did. It's astonishing that so much money, talent, technical expertise, and visual imagination can be put in the service of something so stupid. Paragraph breaks between all of it. Get to the review. By the way, I like the rotating thing we're doing.

I have to say that if you aren't aware of the cultural impact of The Matrix, it is known as one of the greatest science fiction movies of all time at this point. It was a movie chewed up and swallowed and preserved in the stomach by the industry forever. I think I was just saying it's DNA is in everything that exists. Yeah. It was injected wholesale. It has permanently affected our culture by creating the term red-pilled. And now everything is pilled. Everything is pilled.

My friend loves to barbecue. Came from the M&M song. Yeah. My friend loves to barbecue and we call him grill-pilled. He's grilled-pilled. Folly on such a monumental scale is almost exhilarating. So this is what? more.

So this is what more than a hundred years of cinema, history has come to. Special effects with no movie. The Matrix is about nothing less than the nature of reality heaven help us. The Wikowskis have discovered that there is a real world behind the apparent one. This may be a tremendous subject in the hands of somebody like Plato. Filmmaker. That's the craziest sentence ever. But when the Wikowsky'd get their mitts on it, watch out.

Somebody ought to adjust their medication. rhetorical argument here is that any, if you were ever to talk about another world, if you're not Plato, then you are not in the, you are not adequate, you cannot adequately handle such a subject. I don't think Plato avoided using special effects, filmmaking techniques because he was so smart.

I would actually say that he did use special effects, the cave. Yeah. That was one of, Alex, he built it out of, I was gonna say his, The allegory was really a special effect. The allegory in the cave?

Sorry, shadows from the fun. Which is, like, explicitly reference in the Matrix. So you can't even, like, reference Plato when it counts, I guess. The thing is, it's like, I, I, I'm not saying the Matrix is the deepest movie in the world, but I do think the Matrix is a quite deep. It's really, the whole point is it's like, culture has pulled the wool over your eyes and you're like, everything's perfect. Not to mention the, like, trans allegory and stuff that this person is clearly not privy to because at the time, the Wachowski's had. talked about it.

But anyway, if anyone, if anybody else wanted to see, Reeves shaved naked and covered with slime, now's the chance. We all want to see that. We all want to say. This would not fly in a 2010's onward article because we are aware of a huge dynamic of people that that would have replied to. Oh, yeah.

People, you love that. You think there's someone out there that want to see him slimy. Oh, yeah. Are you crazy? That anybody ever wanted to see someone that's a furry. Yeah, right. On your left, it's all people that love them. Slime.

He plays a computer hacker who stumbles into a vague awareness. With him, everything is vague, epic, that this world is but the dim reflection of a controlling cyber world quote, out there. The Matrix is the film that asks the question.

Have you read the feeling you're not sure if you're awake or still dreaming? Frequently. Characters, I'll just see this one too. Characters have names like Neo-Morphius, Trinity, and Cypher that take us into the quagmire allegory and the unfortunate actors attached to these names have to deliver speeches accordingly.

Their names aren't with the major allegory. There's parallels, I guess, but that's not like, oh yeah, Morpheus, like the time guy. I'm going to interject after someone reads this next line. It's like a splinter in your mind driving you mad, someone says. Splinters in your mind will do that. Is your issue with figures of speech? This is such a Twitter post. Is your...

This is Twitter before Twitter. Like, is his argument there? Because it's also a metaphor when they say it in the movie. He's not saying there's a literal splinter in his mind. So you really think you can turn off your targeting computer and use the force to blow up the Death Star? Yeah.

That never happened. This review feels like the entire thing was screamed at Game Night. Yeah, this is written by the person who claims that the Matrix was stolen from them. Yeah, they wrote a spec and it didn't go. Then walking out of the Alamo Draft House, double-festing beers. This movie's so pretentious that it invites speculation in kind. The Neo-Wagnyerian Scoundrack score falsely raises hope that the Matrix has aspirations of becoming the all-encompassing multimedia philosophical artwork that the German genius.

Okay, easy. Might have created if only moving pictures hadn't waited so long to be invented. It's funny that they like, they're like, this movie thinks it's going to become something of itself. It's not like me. They really think this is going to be an enduring piece of work that people read my review for and make fun of me in 30 years. Good luck. In fact, the Wakowski seemed to be masters of the Wagnerian art of transition. In one stunning shot, the camera closes in on a static TV monitor view of Reeves in an interrogation room.

The camera seamlessly merges into the shot on the monitor and then independently moves around the interrogation room. Okay. That's just, wow, this is actually more like a game review from the 2000s. All of the points are like, and then you can press B to jump, and then you can pick up a mushroom. I will say watching this movie like last week, the cinematography is so good. It's incredible. And the special and the special effects almost entirely hold up. Oh, I agree.

There's like a couple of entirely CG shots that look like PS2 cutscenes. Yes. But all of the composition shots of CG and real stuff. They look so good. And this is like two years removed from Toy Story. It's like jumping in the air and then the camera swirls around. It's like the sickest. And the way they did those shots with like all the cameras.

It's really cool. It's so sick. Did they have a rig like that for 28 years later? I don't know. There's a shot of somebody running. Because now there's a, that's a technique. They pioneered that technique and now that's a thing you do. Countless other techniques.

It's like, yeah, if you have an array of cameras. Strobe almost. Yeah, strobe of cameras. It's a very act to just like, it's almost like an ad hominem, I guess, style argument when like the thing you, the criticism is that. they're doing something that someone else has thought about ever. Like that's, that's the thing is that other people also thought about it, but didn't make a movie?

It doesn't seem interested in engaging with the substance of the movie because it opens with it having no substance. And I think that that is like, regardless of, I think that that's a bad judo move. If you're, if I'm supposed to follow your argument, you open with this movie has no nuance.

That is provably false. I know just reading things that happen in the movie. It is it is breathtaking and there are other displays It's an incredible film After everyone's been quiet for a little bit No it is it is really good It is breathtaking If you guys like it, I love it

And there are other displays of visual virtuosity That almost equal it, including a shot Into a fiber optics cable To say nothing of the insect And that's not even the like coolest shot in the body Like a really boring. Yeah. To say like, okay, I'm like, okay, whatever.

To say nothing of the insect-like monsters, among them, one that enters Reeves' belly button. Okay, not to pathologize this person. They seem to really like when stuff goes in stuff. It feels like a child recounting something to you. And then there's a monster and then it goes into the belly button. Yeah. That's the bit where Linene McQueen goes so fast.

If only a German genius had made this or Plato. The cause is very well, though, as. as he moves back and forth between this world and that the Matrix Reeves materializes at one point as a Kung Fu artist after the audience gets through

digesting that one he flies through the air like a refugee from some Hong Kong fantasy oh okay they're just saying like transplanted from that genre they go right different connotations

I guess like some refugee from some Hong Kong fantasy more empty technical Rasmataz in what way is it empty though? Yeah, it's just so, it's such a good, but also

just the thing of like, this person was just grumpy when they watched it. Also, stray caught by Hong Kong movies. Yeah, right. Like some bullshit Hong Kong movie. Yeah, is he like saying like Jackie Chan's empty technical rat for does? Yeah. Yeah. Maybe the DVD version will have an option to eliminate the dialogue, but

in the meantime, we have to put up with oppressive acting here. He thinks he's being tongue-a-cheek's because DVDs are new, and he's like, maybe the new technology gives us a track where they shut the fuck up. Yet he didn't even realize that the DVD menu

for the original Matrix was awful. It was actually sick. When he goes, I know Kung Fu, the Wakowski's knew what they were doing with that line. So I was watching it

with someone who had seen like little clips like that just like the cringe moments or the things that were lasting jokes. And in context, that feels like a joke that lands.

Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah. It's like, this is all very above bored. Nehner was a weird person. Yeah. He's a strange, maladjusted guy. Same in like John Wick.

His performance is not like emotive, but John Wick's a freak. He's a creepy guy. Yeah, it's a dude who's fucking lit. He's on the internet all the time. Like, they didn't know about Discord mods back there. He's sort of as a pre-in-sell. He's in a

forum in 1999. This is because he's weird. We know that. Reeves is puzzled about which reality he currently occupies because he squintes up his eyebrows. Okay. Okay. Are you an actor? Lawrence Fishburn has the chore as a mysterious cyber world overlord of making absolute

nonsense sound like he believes it. He does this by enunciating every syllable. Okay. What do you want? These are like artistic choices that, okay, it's like, yeah. I don't get it, man. It's like. Also, the, the stylistic choice.

of this film were so influential. Oh, yeah. Like, you know, again, this reviewer doesn't know that, but the over-enunciation, the, like, very stylized shots and costuming and, you know, acting, it all was very influential on later films and filmmakers. This is a kind of telling line. In a throwback to the Voktowski's bound,

Carriand Moss in black leather plays the Gina Gershon Ambiguous Lesbian character That is the end of the paragraph Nothing about her acting In a set about how everyone's performances are Feels like AI wrote it too Also

This is what the AIs were trained on AI was trained on this So I've seen Bound Bound is an incredible film that the Wukowski's only made because they needed to prove their directing chops so that Warner Brothers would allow them to

direct matrix. Oh, wow. What's an ambiguous lesbian? So she's not ambiguous. She's very much a lesbian. Like, what's ambiguous about it? And the name was androgynous? Maybe androgynous. If he's using the wrong word, that's such an embarrassing mistake. But ambiguous.

She's sort of an ambiguous lesbian. She's kind of a mask. You know? Yeah, yeah. And the interesting thing about this sentence, too, is that Um, again, Bound is a film made by women. It is very, you watch it and you're like, oh, this is made by lesbians. Yeah.

And, you know, they weren't out yet. So it's understandable that people wouldn't know that. But when you watch it now, you're like, and same thing with Matrix. You're like, okay, yeah, the clothing is very and it's. Oh my God. I mean, like there's so many things that like they couldn't. do like the stuff with like switch. Yes.

But but yeah it's like it's super it obviously there's a lot of depth in retrospect that this per this reviewer doesn't have access to. But on the surface if you didn't know any of that stuff it feels like they came into this with a dismiss like wanting to dismiss it. Yeah. Well it's also I mean this is such an obvious you know maybe obvious take but it is so awesome that the movie that created the term red pilled being. like you that you know everything.

And that was like the most awesome action movie that dude bro's love is made by two trans-year. Yeah. Like that is so good. It just is like the sickest shit. That's the like, I have a fight club poster. Yeah. I love the movie.

It's all about how Helena Bonham Carter is an annoying lady. And IKEA is bad. It's like, holy fuck. It's the point. It's interesting because it's like, I feel like there's a self-awareness to the Matrix that this reviewer wants to assume is not intentional. Yeah, right.

So they don't know anything's an homage. Right. Or it's kind of like Hong Kong action. Like, yeah, this, yeah, these, these, this dialogue is supposed to be like this. Or this is like a joke that, I don't know, it's like insulting to the audience. Okay, can we zoom back in? Australian actor, Hugo Weaving, the Adventures of Priscilla Queen of the Desert, is a men in black style special agent.

No, he's just a guy wearing black. Yeah, right. His mannered performance is briefly fun until it becomes apparent that all that's all there is and he tends to go on and on with it. It's briefly, it's fun until he realized that it's not. This is so funny to me. As one of the overlords underlings,

Joe Pantoliano, the fugitive, at first seems to be the actor who will rescue the honor of the profession. What an insult, right? He is the only one who has a spark of, also an insult. It's also fucking Cypher, bro. The only character he likes is the one of like,

yeah, I think I would want to eat steak and ignorance. No, I know. Finally, finally someone with some sense. They're the ones are they like, Agent Smith and Cypher. Agent Smith was awesome, of course. I think, though, I really connected with the sentinels as they spun around.

Yeah, he really identified with the LCL, like, fluid. They were cool. But the human batteries existed. He does like the wires and the bug. He loved the bug. I loved a mouse, but even he is eventually swathed by the hopeless muddle that the Matrix becomes.

Thank you, Bob. Wow. Hopeless muddle. March 31st, 1999. Yeah. A different world. Different world. Really?

No. Different month. I was going to say. Same Gregorian calendar. Thank you for humoring me. I do want to watch a bunch of film classics and then find really snarky negative reviews. Well, have you seen there's an amazing review

of Baby's Day Out? And it's, oh my God, what are the two? Abbott, what are the two? Castella. No, not Evan and Costello. Oh, Roger Ebert and Ebert and Ciskel. Ciskel. And I think Siskel fucking hates Baby Days Day's out.

It's so funny. That's funny. And he's just like, I don't think it was funny. I didn't think it was good. And the acting was bad. I thought the set, like he fucking goes off on it. And if an ape grabbed you like that

and then threw you and bent the bars, it would go to jail. It's clear that like they had a personal argument or something. Oh yeah. He's like, come on. Are you kidding me? Like it's like crazy. They had a private Twitter argument.

They like hated each other apparently. And there's so much good like cutting room footage of them between takes being like, come on, let's just do it, you idiot. That's so great. Wow. Are you a sports guy? No, not at all. Okay, so...

I understand that sports is sort of sweeping the sort of community and my producer as well. I tried to bring sports into the perfect person wrong. We can make it happen because I feel like you have all of that... Can I be honest? Sports is a poison and I'm sorry and I get that that's like... And I actually really respect sports. Okay. You did just describe it as a poison.

Let me finish. I actually do respect it and I think that I'm honestly on the verge of being into it. Because I'm being pure pressured not only by Ashley, but by my other. other friends. Yeah, we need you to be surrounded. And also I feel like you have all of the like latch points, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, oh, I can fit this into your life. I trade out reading manga in the bath for a little bit of. Name a sport. Dude, oh, so I got a basketball manga I could enjoy to do. Right, by the way. Actually, no, I was reading, sorry, a shout out to my manga heads out there, Blue Box. You ever

fuck with Blue Box? No. No. Every once in a while, I'll get really into like a really, like, romancey Like teen romance Like this kid plays basketball He plays badminton or something I mean I mean I love a Stock cross lovers Exactly

I mean back in my day A little Oran high school host club A little fruits basket You know shout out to my My Oh we did fruits basket Yeah But the reason I was actually bringing that up

Is related to these interviews There was recently a So the Similar thing to These interviews that actors do, these press things that actors do, is the press conferences that coaches and players do after a game. Love those.

Where they have just a sea of journalists, all barking questions at them. Yeah. And they just did sports. They're exhausted. Yeah. They just sort of like covered in sweat. They need to shower.

Chris Evans didn't just do a marathon and then gets into the GQ. I honestly love that idea. We should translate to the other, because I have seen lots of these clips, and I do love them. And I will also say, like, you know, I know I said sports is a poison and I'm sort of coming back from that. Okay.

And you're a big fan. And I'm a big fan. And I think one day I will be into poison. I, by the way, agreed. I watched Friday Night Lights and I loved it. And I was like, oh, this is what when people watch, you know, a football game, this is what they see. Like, they see the story that I'm not privy to. They see, oh, this is the running back from so-and-so team.

And now he's here and he was injured. I think that that is. That is the missing piece, I think, for so many. And I feel that way about many communities. that kind of gatekeep. Yeah. They, they, uh, I feel like, um,

communities will use terminology or what have you to obscure, obfuscate what's really happening so that they can be the in-group and the out and those who don't understand their special language are cast out. And I think that's like very exclusionary. Yeah, sure. And I, I don't think it's that hard. Like some of the storylines are just interesting. You know what I mean?

Oh, fascinating. And, um, fascinating. And, um, fascinating. And, but the reason I brought that up is, Jacob, I don't want to spend too much time on this because we have a lot to get to. And it's a little bit old news. But can you pull up Liam Cohen, Lynn Jones question? So. It was like the winter soldier.

Yeah. Seven. Peep stands up and leaves the room. So Jacksonville Jaguars, they lost in the playoffs, but they had a pretty good season. expectably good. It was also the first year or second year of their coach Liam Cohen. And in general, Jacksonville's always sucked. I'm from Florida.

No one gives a shit about the Jaguars. And they're starting to actually like pick up some steam. And there is a reporter who is with the, uh, with the Jacksonville free press, black owned newspaper, has been in the industry for 20 years, uh, is not a sports exclusive reporter. they're just a general, like, journalist or whatever. They gave, they said this to the coach, and you'll never guess why it became, why it became a big deal.

I want to tell you, congratulations on your success, young man. You hold your head up, all right? You guys have had a most magnificent season. Thank you. He did a great job out there today. So you just hold your head up, okay? And ladies and gentlemen, Duvall, you're the one, all right? You keep it going.

We got another season, okay? I appreciate it. Take care of much continued success to you. you and the entire team. Thank you, ma'am. Okay, so sort of kind words. Kind words, it goes viral for a wholesome moment. And then the sports journalists started retweeting it

and was like, this person's being, you're supposed to be impartial, I didn't know they were letting fans in the press box. They started getting on their high horse about the journalistic integrity of giving a compliment. Be giving a compliment. It like got so out of, like it was insane. Got the rabid hunger.

for a reason to be angry. Angry and, like, vindictive, but also have some kind of moral victory. Oh, God. You were asking questions than me. We worked so hard to get these press credentials and this, you know, sets us back. Like, that's, like, truly, all that stuff was happening.

Yeah. And, um... Did she just say it because he had a bad game or something? She was like, keep your head on? Well, they just got eliminated her from the playoffs. Oh, so she's like... And they're all, they're all upset. But then, oh, yeah.

So this is also a space where people were getting like really high and mighty about the role of journalists in these press boxes. But 99% of the questions are like, so, oh, when you guys threw the football, how does that feel? Yeah, right. They're not asking like complicated questions. No, they're never asking. In fact. I feel a loose.

Why did you do that? Yeah, why did that happen? And like, this was a 22nd thing that was like in and out. And people were like, you need to be respectful of people's time, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, it took crazy. So little time. Like, I, and it's one of those things that. they knew that the public would never be on their side,

but they had to speak up for their journalistic integrity. But my issue is that assumes that everyone was asking good questions all the time. And it's not a waste of time to go. So when your player got hurt, is that sad? Is that bad? Is that bad, actually, for the team? You need your wish you that are too big, too small. How many points did it happen at the end?

Where is the ball? Where's the ball now? Yeah, where's the ball go? Where's the ball right now? Does someone get the ball? Is it? One of the guys fell over, is he okay? It's one of those things that I cannot help but imagine, like,

I just feel like if a dude asked that question or said, didn't ask that because it gave that compliment, it never, because that exists time and time again. Certainly. You know what I mean? Because it's like a female reporter. It might even, under the right circumstances, generate a little bit of, wow, we're all people, kudos.

You know, truly. Like yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's like, yeah, okay, I don't want to keep keep on that because I can go all day. I was just reading. Trust me. That, like, became my algorithm for a while. It was just journalists takes on this thing. And everyone was trying to, like, step around it in a tactful way and no one was succeeding.

Because all you have to do is not take, not be self-serious for two seconds or 20 seconds. Yeah, right. And, like, let it go. And also people were, like, shitting on the reporter not knowing that they were like, an institutional figurehead in their community. And they're like, oh, I can't believe they let a fan back here. It's like, oh, actually, they've been with this paper for 20 years.

Now what's your- That's the mayor. Yeah, the mayor of the town. Regarding the playoffs, have you guys seen the little girl that is like, oh for 10 at guessing? I said TikTok to Jacob. You're a bully.

You're a big bully. She sucks. She sucks. She sucks. She sucks. She sucks. It's America. You know, in finance Jim Kramer, how he's famously bad at predicting the economy. And so if you inverse Jim Kramer, you actually make a lot of money.

If you bet a, if you did a parlay that was the opposite of this girl's guesses, you would be a millionaire. She got one right, the last one. She got one right. And people are comparing it to like Spider-Verse. when he turns in his test and she's like the only way you could get 100% is that if you like you could miss 100% if you know the answers and so I feel like she's just like fucking with her dad this little girl might be cursed holy look at her they lost failed yeah lost though oh oh nope oh close oh what I want well no but listen but let let me

yeah So pause. Her pausing on that, can I just say, what happened in that game, was that the Broncos, she held up the Broncos, put him down, and then chose the Bills.

Now, she was wrong, of course, the Bills lost. But then in the press, what I just call it? The press bot, or in the post game interview. Yeah. In the post game interview,

the coach comes out. We've just found out that our quarterback has broken his ankle and he will be out for the rest of the season. Oh, no. So in a way, she felt something.

She hesitated. She's in this. Because truly, the Broncos did lose because now they have to start their backup quarterback who has not played a snap in the NFL in two years. Just like, and the way she gets like her last one that she guessed right,

the game was tied and they went into overtime. So like the last one, everyone's on the brink of their, like on the edge of their seats and they're like, is she going to be over time? We make fun of her right now. I don't.

empath, but we make for that right now. Transport this 200 years into the past. She's considered some kind of aged oracle who at least is like interpreting, and then it just turns out there's like an oxide leak coming from like the ground or something. Black mold. Did she say anything about the Patriots?

Go Pat's, big Pat's fan here. Well, I was gonna, I was actually gonna. Ashley Lawless is a big Pat's fan and after a brief. You're calling in from Riyadh, is that correct? That's right. Thanks for you're calling into the show. After a brief, what was it, five years of not having Tom Brady. Oh, no.

The Pats are now back in contention. They're one of the last four teams in the playoffs. I mean, they're going to their conference championship game this weekend. And if they win, they're off to the Super Bowl. And it's second year, Drake May quarterback, first year, Mike Rable, head coach, former player for the Patriots. Is your sweater? Tom Brady's era. This is a Tyler of the Creator's sweatshirt.

I'm related to the past. Just change it will it's green. Well, okay, not even the past colors. The Bears. And the Patriots are red, white and blue, because it's the Patriots. In my mind, what is it, Seahawks, the green? Seahawks have a little green. Sometimes. They have blue.

It's Eagles, maybe you're thinking. That's what I am. It is Eagles. Red, white and blue, because the only Patriots have to be American. Oh, wow. Okay. In a time like this. Wow.

Speaks volumes. But, yeah, I will say, so Jarvis got me into fantasy this year. And in our fantasy group chat, I did say, like, let's go paths. We're so back, we had a drought and we have Lions fans in there. We have every other team. Yeah, go ahead. That it, like, nobody's ever won a Super Bowl or, like, people haven't been to the Super Bowl since the 90s.

And I'm like, guys, it's been five years since I've been. I got chewed out so bad at my eye to put my phone down. It's funny because I don't have, like, a real pro team allegiance because I grew up in college town, but it's funny to see how everyone's got their blinders on for their own biases and then have to remember, they'll be like, fuck Josh Allen. And then like Alex would be like, tear. And it's like, oh, no, I'm sorry. I forgot he was your favorite guy. Yeah, I had to say, I was like, guys, I'm sorry. I forgot that I used to skip high school and stuff like that to go to Super Bowl parades. And you guys, you do have the same haircut as that little girl. Do you think

you have the same predictive powers? I don't want to know what she predicts. I'm wondering where you get those tiny little helmets. Honestly, I was wondering, I was like, there's a lot of tiny helmets this guy purchased for his daughter. Was she wearing multiple jerseys during that? Outrits is this family. Oh, they have money. His family's got cash.

Honestly, though, the fantasy element is the thing that might get me into football. Yeah, well, so. Because then it's like math slash tactical. It is. It's like an RPG. Exactly. Then I'm min-maxing my pictos.

You are trading this character. Free-a-billed. Yeah, you are. You are min-maxing, though, because you're like, okay, like, I may need to go to the waiver wire and pick up new players, or you're looking for players that flew under the radar that you might want to pick up because they're diamonds in the rough, they're gems, or a starter gets injured, who's the backup on the depth chart?

Nobody's got him. I can go. I'd be trying to moneyball every time. Oh, 100%. I'm going, what if I thought in a new way? What are I? I love that movie. It did not.

It really didn't seem to help me at all in my. performance in the fantasy leagues. Because that all make it up in aggregate things seems to require pretty good knowledge of the sport and the players. Yeah. I was making it up in vibes. Jordan went 0 in 14.

Well, no, that's not true. That's not true. He, he, uh, the one week, I helped them with this lineup, and then he beat me. And that was, that's real friendship, I think. But yeah, I think that fantasy is probably the outlet that I need to get into for football.

It's just so much time, though. Well, football is easy. It's like a full-time job. Football is easier to get into as a fantasy sport because the football season's very condensed. They play such so few games that you can kind of watch everything, which is unique compared to baseball where it's impossible,

basketball where it's impossible. So I did grow up, by the way, I know I said it wasn't sporty, but I grew up, I went to UNC Chapel Hill, so I was like a Tar Heels fan growing up. See, yeah. And then went to like the games when we beat Duke and stuff like that. But I don't watch games anymore.

Yeah. But I could see it coming back into my life. I just, I'm starting to get back into college because I obviously followed Florida Gators when I was a kid. And then I went to Georgia Tech followed, you know, I went to all the home games because it was like really cheap to get season tickets as a student. It was like 15 bucks a game or something like that. And Georgia Tech just signed Fernando Mendoza's brother, who, Fernando Mendoza, it won the

Heisman this year. He just won the national championship, and he is a hilarious person. Like, he's, he's a super religious, all-football Boy Scout type personality, which I love those guys. And his little brother was his backup at Indiana, but he's going to be number one in the draft. He's going to go to the Raiders, minority owner Tom Brady of the Oakland Raiders. He's African American. Right. Tom Brady?

Yeah, he's a minority. Miles, I will say Drake May went to UNC. Drake went to UNC. Drake went to UNC? Drake May, Pat's Q&A. Drake May. There are a lot of people that kind of came through,

especially in professional basketball, that came through the heels that I remember watching like I remember watching a teen. Tons of UNC stuff just because they were so good for so long. And then college basketball is so fun because like the state.

are arguably the highest stakes ever where you're like, oh yeah, if their team doesn't do well while this person is at this school, they may not go pro, and they're like, they're gonna be a gym teacher. That element is so... They're going to hate the sports so...

No, truly. Things have changed because now they have, they've changed the way that name image-likeness stuff works, so players are allowed to make money. Oh, okay, see, I agree with that. I agree with it as well, because they're basically putting their bodies on the line. Yeah.

They may never make the pros, but if you can be... If you can be, there were tons of, and I'm sure you remember this, there were tons of, um, huge celebrities in college who their game maybe didn't translate for one reason or another to the pros. And they never were able to benefit off of any of that. Like their best bet is to buy a car dealership in their hometown and run commercials for the rest of eternity. But it's also like buy a car dealership for with what? Yeah, no, you, you show your face card and you say, I would like a loan of $5 million. You pay for it with the revenue you generate from front-facing videos in your truck

where you get angry about like Mendocino Farms taking the word like injured off the menu or something. No, now I think it's like, yeah, you would just make content or you would like try to pivot into an influence. It's almost like the bachelor. The Washington football team? Yeah. Oh, no. It's like, yeah, you pivot into influencer and then like you can get traditional brand deals and

stuff and you can actually take that money. Like back in the day, Reggie Bush had to give back. They took away as Heisman because he. you made some money like selling side jerseys or whatever under the table. And they eventually, eventually the Overton window like shifts and they're like are bad actually. That was kind of like the optics of like, you know, these like big prestigious universities like signing like usually like poor kids to come do

like basketball and then kind of dropping them. Utilizing them. It's so draining them of older. Draining them of the research. Yeah, literally. Like it's such a bad. Why would I keep the orange rind? I'm all done.

There's nothing I can do with this. I can't make this into juice. I'm with the opinion that if you win an award, you can't take it from me. I already won it. Yeah, I already want it. It's mine, I agree. By the way, Michael Phelps.

I was just saying the only, the only time I disagree with that is with Donald Trump's Nobel Peace Prize. Holy shit. What a fucking crazy thing they get. I can't believe. So much crazy shit happens like so frequently these days. All the time, dude. That is the craziest.

I know. I was like, did I? Yeah, I feel like I scanned by the headline. It's like so fucking insane. Have you seen me interview, the leaked, um, so apparently McCrone like films everything. And Trump had leaked some text messages or something. And so his, and so McCrone's camp leaked, leaked a phone call that he was having, I think it was McCrone, that he was having with Trump where he's like, yeah, the serious stuff is done. No bell please

He just says it like on the calm Oh my god By the way I have a question How often to guess not wear socks Realize they have to take their shoes up and show their dogs on the show I know socks I think that's never happened because in those instances They're like can I leave my shoes on and we say

We want you to be comfortable Because I literally almost didn't wear socks I'm wearing Birken socks and I was like should I put my dogs out Well I also we've got extra socks if you need them No no no no what if I want to put my dogs If you want to I mean that's your prerogative It's not just like that it's in the end We will, we will.

Because it's an option. Look, if you put your dogs out, we will censor them and then have them uncensored on the Patreon for more money. That's good business. Significantly more money. That is good business. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Look, we run a tight ship around here. I think I would be too conscious, self-conscious about the piggies to get them out on the show.

You guys are probably, you're definitely on FeedFinder. I'm sure, have you looked? We were there, but never from Sadboys. Well, so that's the thing. I would have sworn up and down that I've never shown raw foot. Also, what I thought, yeah. And then FeetFinder proved me wrong because there are some eagle-eyed feet freaks that have, like, there's like one video of mine from like 2018 where I had a wide shot where I happened to not be wearing, like I just, it's like you just didn't think about it because it's not the focal point. Like they're at the very bottom of the frame. So fun.

Shoutouts to the to the feet snipers though. It's got to be so fun. It's got to be like birdwatching. Yeah, you're that. You're doing the menu. I don't have service, but I would pull it up, but I looked myself up. I was like, no, I'm surely not a feed finder. I've never showed my feet. And I looked my profile up, and there was literally a photo of me with both feet going,

Oh, no. Like, sponsored link to Mendo. In some podcast episodes of the TriGai guys, like a million years ago, but I just was like, surely not. And it's me going like, hey. Bye guys. It's like a full photo roll. It's like you privately in your house. Well, Miles.

Thank you for joining us Thank you so much boys Before I went to do this earlier Almost forgot where can they find you Where can they find the dock Yes you can find me at Miles Bond on everything At Perfect Person Or at Perfect Person pod on social platforms

Watch social clips And then on Patreon Is where we release the dock It's like on the shop tab You don't have to become a member You can just buy the doc That's also where you can get our live show On our Patreon not Miles's

Liddy get the live show for them And get the docs for me Choose which one you like more. One pill. Just have the red one, please. Yeah, watch my documentary. Yeah, showing you how deep the rabbit hole goes is anologue for ADHD.

Just getting hyper-focused. And you see Ashley there too. You can get all of the lynchian camera angles. Yeah, yeah, I'm in there. But yeah, you can find me on TikTok at Ashley Lawless. It's A-S-H-L-E-I-G-H. and then same thing on Instagram but with a dot

in between my first and last name and actually blowing up actually going vye actually blowing up and going vye you go by you're going by you blow up and believably by I went by on accident in a jester hat

so you can find that there we end every episode of Sadboys with a particular phrase we love you and we're sorry boom bye on nights today

we're watching that Reddit mod video you know the one and also playing games having fun it's an extra long night so you can head on over to patreon.com

out boys to check that out for as low as $5 a month using only your discretionary entertainment spending and the live show is now available and you can buy it for $3 if you'd like or if you're a patron it's available included with your subscription so go check it out we had Drew Good and Eddie Burbank in our live show at Dynasty's Hyper and it was a grand old time thanks to Jacob for editing that we'll see you over there or we won't no worries Future girl, future girl, yeah, we're on now. Take my money, go away, oh you want it. Go too rich for me.