Sad Boyz - We Tricked Ludwig Into Talking About His Feelings

Episode Date: August 11, 2023

Watch our full-length bonus episodes: ⁠Patreon.com/sadboyz⁠ Wanna hear even more of our takes and definitely not professional advice? Write into the show!📝 @ [e-mail] Use the subject line "Pen Palz" and we could read it on the next episode! ⏯️ ⁠Watch us on youtube⁠ ⏯️ ✨follow us✨  ⁠Instagram⁠  ⁠Twitter⁠  📺main channels📺  ⁠Jarvis⁠  ⁠Jordan⁠  ✨follow jordan✨  ⁠Twitter⁠  ⁠Instagram⁠  ✨follow jarvis✨  ⁠Twitter⁠  ⁠Instagram⁠  🎶outro music🎶 @prod.typhoon & @ysoblank

Welcome to sad boys a podcast about feelings and other things. Also, I'm Jarvis. I'm the old Classic Jordan. We're joined by a very special guest the one the only Ludwig actually many of us there's many Ludwigs and I'm not the most famous Ludwig right now. Yeah, I know I just watched Oppenheimer in the soundtrack was Ludwig Gronson that fucker fucker yeah he just had a huge coming out with bangers i he you almost did the soundtrack to black panther because you were saying you understand yeah yeah better and you almost produced all this child's gambino record then i did i did the subathon instead yeah and uh and he just kept making good music it's insane nate stands invites you around for dinner doesn't tell you that's black panther day yeah there's no respect for no i'm not an ally at all ruth gonda forever bombay yeah welcome welcome hello happy to be here ready to talk

about feelings yeah we'll do that at some point we usually start with you know the easy topics and then we do want to know what makes you tick sure just because we as creators don't talk enough about our feelings yeah and what makes you tick. And what makes you tick. All right. So we're going to start easy, which is Phil's Coffee. Oh, yeah. We're talking about Phil's Coffee.

I'm going to go to Israel, Palestine, and then a little later. The easy stuff. Yeah. I was dogging it. And then you said it was made by a Palestinian dude. And then I was like, well, now I feel like it should be. Yeah. I really pulled rank on you with that one.

No. So, okay. So Phil Jabber is the founder of Phil's Coffee, which is a friend of the show in that we have just, we used to get it in San Francisco all the time because we lived really close to it. And so now it's kind of a thing for the show that we just always give this free advertisement to this random brand that does not sponsor us at all.

Nobody owes us more yeah the ceo phil's does follow me on twitter and i've been waiting to make the call yeah i feel like they're big they're they have like a couple hundred locations i think which is big it's a lot of locations okay but we're you know in this grand scheme of things i think like coffee cultures is bigger sure you know and like that's but of things, I think like coffee cultures is bigger. 05.16 Scott Cardani Sure.

05.16 Scott Cardani I think that's, but that sucks. 05.16 Scott Cardani Yeah. I'm saying they can, they can look just free coffee. I'm not. 05.16 Scott Cardani

Yeah. That's all I'm asking. 05.16 Scott Cardani They give me like a little custom mug that I get to bring in. 05.16 Scott Cardani Oh, that would be sweet. 05.16

Scott Cardani Or like the Chipotle card, but phil's is one your coffee is actually phil's beans is it yeah because i did huh you made it for me i did i did i have a new espresso machine that i got myself as a housewarming gift and so i've been learning to do latte art i made you a sea animal on purpose yeah it was a really good looking turtle with a fucked up neck yeah i was inspired i saw tmnt last night. So I made a team. But the Phil's news is that the original location is closing. It makes me sad. 20 on 24th street,

24th and Folsom where all docs myself. I used to live right there on that corner would walk over to Phil's every day. Type a little video script, ignore my work at Patreon. Then would go down the street to the Patreon office, ignore my work at Patreon, export a video. 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00

00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00

00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00,00 00,00 a bad idea. Okay, no. Long day before coffee, by the way. You do a lot. No, it's kind of awesome. Well, that's just the power of Phil's. They make those beans extra strong. Yeah, it's closing.

Apparently, I was like asking. I do know some people who work there just like through the years who don't work there anymore. I was like, what's the tea? What happened? Apparently, they didn't renew the lease. I don't know but it's been around for so long that i remember like getting in a an uber like probably to work from one of those fills and that guy was the guy was like oh yeah i grew up around here this fills we used to come here

and play on the computers because they would have computers that you could use and back in the 90s you like could it like it after you go to the phil's you go like instead of the local library yeah one of those like uh oval backed imax yeah yeah that guy was double lift yeah this used to all be orange groves oh my god um zezima himself played there uh but yeah so apparently it's closing and that's the end of an era closes in october i read this on mission local uh a website i haven't checked since i lived in the mission as a local in san francisco ignoring your work um you can just do a lego like a way tougher version than like the ted and uh eddie video where you go to every fills now before it closes oh that's a good idea going to every closed Phil's close to one Phil's fuck I went to see the

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie last night with Eddie and in Chrissy and Tony and Isabel and Eddie bought my tickets but he bought them separately and it didn't show up in his app. And then we were at the front and he was trying to explain it to the guy. And the guy goes, honestly, for the Rainforest Cafe, I'll believe you. And it made me sad because I was supposed to be in the Rainforest Cafe video, but I got COVID. Wow. And now they have this like little adventure without you in it. Yeah. We talk about it a lot wow

yeah because it's like one of the most impactful videos on youtube yeah and before people don't remember before that eddie did the morbius video and i went to go see morbius at that same amc no one it just means nothing keep bringing it up no one i just keep trying it just means less than nothing someone please well i saw your your video on it was seen by someone huge oh yeah i was literally i was gonna make a joke that post malone canceled so we had to bring you on no uh weirdly this morning i get a i get an email from my business manager of all people this is the way i found out my business manager listens to joe rogan um he said he says you're on post malone mentioned you on joe

rogan 50 minutes in and it was all like you know when you get an email that's all in the subject line yeah it's like that and then nobody and i was like this has to be sent to the wrong person and then lo and behold i check and uh yeah they watched uh postman mentioned the video mentioned me by name i thought that was very kind. Posty on point. And then they did a Jamie pull that up and they pulled up the video. And it's like me and BB like doing, I don't know, one of the bits about the metaverse. It was very surreal.

And I don't know about you, but I don't like watching people talk about me. Oh, the exact opposite. Oh, really? Yeah. I load it up. I'll load up everyone who's watched me, you know, and then I'll just,

I'll just, it's Aspen gold reacts to mogul mail. And I'm just, and when Aspen talks and he pauses, I'm like, skip, skip, skip,

skip, skip. Right. Right. I just want to watch the guy in the chair. You're doing, you're doing like the research that like Facebook does when they bring in users and they scan their eyeballs and see like where they're retaining the video well i used to do this it's

i think a commentator thing because when i was commentating smashed you couldn't like look at chat and so i would always re-watch to see what was received well oh yeah and that was like an exercise in what is good what is bad because you can't know while you're doing it. That's good. And that's good that you were doing VOD review for your commentating because you clearly wanted to improve. Yes. It's like shit.

I actually was really bad. I definitely saw some of your commentary before I knew who you were because I just like am a casual Smash fan because at Patreon, Jordan and Stans would just play Smash all the time. We also ignore our work actually it was one of those yeah it sounds like patreon is going into the shit look

they got rid of us quick they're like these guys are not paying attention to anything we have to compromise and do this more embarrassing job um no but uh and like they would like go to genesis and stuff and like during lunchtime be playing. And I think I just like as a casual fan started watching Melee and I it's like I don't play the game. I'm like so bad at it, but I do enjoy watching it. Do you still play? Oh, no, it's the NFL.

I'm at best. I at my peak. I was like JV and then I hurt my knee or whatever but you could have gone pro I was you would want state champs oh yeah of course I'm tired actually was the thing yeah it's underage yeah I can't go you're over it um did you watch evo yeah of course dude it was so sick it was amazing I didn't know half of what was going on in any of the games but I was rooting for leffen and strive and then he fucking won that's exactly what my experience was and my my understanding was like okay the bar goes down

when it's all the way down that's good and then they have like a little meter and there's like the one meter it's like they get to break out to combo breaker yeah and then the full one they get to go crazy you know i was so my understanding was so basic i was like oh right okay so between rounds they're like conserving meters so that like right before they lose, they can like try to, they can do something crazy. And then there was some pretty crazy plays left and played really well. And the thing happened that happens in every fighting game where people say

that the character that's winning is really busted. Yes. And then the people who are responding are going, he's the only one in the top eight playing this character. What are you talking about? And then no one wants to hear it. Strive is just like, it's,

I enjoy it again. Too bad to play it now. It's just like not fun to play matchmaking. Loved it when it came out. It's a very, very, very well balanced game. Just notoriously well balanced.

It's just, I think a lot of people commenting on it were like, ride or die melee players or at least outside of that space. There's just a lot of Leffen haters. There's no zoning in melee. He tweets. People were like, he's doing that thing with Sheik where he's just needling.

Yeah, look, Leffen just tweets a lot and enough that he's developed maybe an equal amount of haters as he does fans right but i mean count me in the fan i'm a fan it's so weird too because i feel like it's my little secret that i like i'm because i'm watching the twitch chat no one's having a good time i'm secretly like eating it up you know the only nice response I saw from any of his peers was Cody. Cody was so nice on stream. That's like me.

I also, and you might hate me for this, is I'm a secret, not secret, but I'm a Hungrybox fan because of how much everybody hates him. Did you watch the Emp Lemon documentary? I did, but- That's why. No. Nope. This is a psyop.

No, because I- You've been psyoped the reason i like hungry box is because when i watched i watched the doc when everybody else did and i found out about hbox after that and he was at the university of florida which is in my hometown i was a massive hungry box fan yeah because i played jigglypuff and smash right then hungry box played jigglypuff and like him winning was like me believing it could be done right and so anytime he would get crushed i was like maybe i should switch maybe it's just it's impossible so i know his root for him i met him at uh this tournament called mvg stands a sandstorm a notoriously terrible event uh where the power went out during grand finals a whole slew of shit they They printed out shirts that said Phoenix, Arizona,

and Phoenix was spelled wrong. Oh, fuck yeah. And they just put a sticky note over that spelling error because it was like, like Fionics, and they kept selling them. But anyway, I'm at this tournament, and I'm subscribed to Hungrybox, and I go up to him, and I am the problem here, but I go up to him,

and I say, I'm like, what's up, Hungrybox? And he's like, yo, what's up? And I'm like, I, uh, I subscribed to your channel last week. Do you remember me? And he sits there with like the blankest stare and he's like, and, and before he can reply, I'm like, you don't remember. And then he's, he's like, as I'm walking away, he's like, no, no dude. I like I actually remember. I was like, no, you don't. I went home and I unsubscribed from him that day.

You remember that? No, I that no i i also didn't i mean i had a nice enough interaction with him i think i saw him at twitch con or something and i was like yo dude what's up or whatever because i think we're mutuals online uh and he was it was like he was about to he flew into twitch con for one day and then he was flying to a tournament the next day and uh i was like good luck tomorrow and he was like thanks you've always been you've always been a good supporter i was like cool dude he talks like a president to like a 11th grader yeah it's like all right man, he's like describing Cocoa Melon. Just leaning down. The hopscotch bunny went pip-pap-pop.

Oh, my God. How'd you get into commentating? It was because I couldn't play. It's like, you know, those who can't play commentate. Right. It's those who can't do teach or whatever. I learned that from School of Rock. That's like a quote in that movie.

Yes. In those who can't teach, teach Jim or something about the next line i've seen it too many times then schneebly kills everyone yeah exactly with jim yeah he uses his jim based powers no but that was it i i got into it uh and i got like a little better at it but i was always stuck in pools i was relegated to the more minor stuff. And then introduced me to streaming. And then that's kind of where I found out about streaming was from Smash. Yeah.

Did you like blow up during the pandemic or like when did it really like happen for you where you were like, this is like gonna be the thing? Yeah, I don't know when, cause I think like people blow up and then they blow up again they blow up again yeah and they're always like emerging right uh and so i don't think there's any finite point where it was like oh bam there you know for a lot of people it's the subathon okay but i think much before then like during covid uh i had played in pog

champs the chess tournament yeah the one that you just competed in, actually, which we'll get to talk about a little bit. Okay. Dvorsky's. You got the goat. I got my work cut out for me. Have you tried to read that, by the way? I started, yeah.

Impossible. They say you should only read it if you're an international master. Zugg Zwang. Oh, that was it. Yeah, wait. What did that mean again? Bro, you can't whip out that book

it's a zugs wong uh zugs wong is a german word which means you are in a position where uh no moves are good for you yeah and basically whoever has to make the move is going to make a losing move and so it's kind of about like tempo it's like it happens in connect four a lot it's kind of a zheng zhuang sort whoa no actually exactly right zheng zhuang-esque yeah what's zheng zhuang zheng zhuang-esque oh zheng zhuang-esque yeah oh yeah if you need me to define it i could do it that i don't know if you guys watch a lot of family guy like i did but um so much twisted sick sense of humor there's that there's that line where on the tv they go oh that's very shallow and pedantic oh yeah and shallow and pedantic when i was a kid i didn't i like just would say that i didn't even my first ever youtube upload was a family guy

funny clip oh hell yeah it was like uh i the blu-ray for the star wars one they did a screen reading of or like whatever you call that. They read the... Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like a table read. Yeah, they did a table read of the script and then I just ripped it from my DVD and uploaded it on YouTube.

Got like 100K views. We're doing it to this day. Come on, baby. That's what reacting is now. Yeah, for sure. Don't even get me started. Speaking of reacting... No, no.

I guess for people who aren't familiar there's a there's a discourse occurring right now capital d it's so funny by the way you said for people who aren't familiar as we went into the nitty-gritty of leffin's evo winning guilty gear which way less people know about and then you're like okay so there's this guy xqc yeah if you've heard of him yeah exactly imagine a streamer and you don't know what he's because i i wouldn't even attempt to try to explain any of the shit we were talking about before but now it's something that like you're an average person could understand i was putting faith in the audience on that one on the plus the five seconds yeah i also yeah zugs long as well oh do you know i couldn't explain he's as long oh no yeah

it's when you move around oh yeah okay um so yeah i guess i mean the history of reacting goes back to this like fair use um start to a youtube essay yeah h3 um w Reacting. We all do it. Yeah. Someone says something, you react to it. Okay. So XQC, big, huge streamer, $100 million kick deal man, is recently under fire for underreacting to the point of freebooting creators' content

and then posting that content online for profit. He's accused of filling time on his streams by doing super low effort content. People like Hassan and people who stream for long amounts of time, a lot of that time can be spent watching YouTube videos and reacting. A lot of my time is spent watching YouTube videos. A lot of my time is spent commentating on like things. So there's nothing like inherently wrong with it, but the XQC drama comes from, you know, him just like walking away during like a small creators video or something like that.

I'm not entire, I'm like not super keyed into it, but I wanted to get your, like what's your take on that sitch he's more like uh martyr's not the right word he's like the poster boy though he's like the poster boy for what is wrong and i think everybody understands like there is a line and reacting that people are then like that's too far right and and many people cross that line yeah but he is the biggest and and the one who crossed it the most like maybe obviously because he was out of his chair yeah there's a couple of very easy point to non-nuanced reasons it's an issue like he's uploading the entire vod of him watching it

as opposed to just highlight clips right third party channels do with hasan stuff but he doesn't do it directly right if it happens in the career just bothered by his son makes you know requests referencing hasan because he's like the third member of that discourse after yes he gets the most discourses he'll get and he does like i watch a fair amount of hasan and he definitely does leave the chair and like you know come back or like he's like oh i was watching it on my phone or whatever and it it's like, he does that all the time. Yeah. Uh, yeah,

I think it's not something exclusive to them. I think many streamers do this. It's, it's part of streaming culture. I do this when I stream and I'm not even a regular streamer. Yeah. Uh, and you know,

I think like everyone will defend their streamer. They'll be like, my streamer pauses actually a lot, like too much. Oh, well, they almost pause too much. Like,

can I say it? I wish they would react more yeah i can't watch this video myself uh and and it's what's weird is how you know still wild wild west twitches or any streaming site is right because they've been reacting to you know anime in the past movies in the past movies the super bowl that the Superbowl that's kick. Obviously. Yes. And it's a different platform than YouTube. So it's a lot harder to detect when it happens and like, you know,

copyright strike it or take it down. Yeah. And it seems to only really be an issue or maybe much more of an issue when you take that and then you bring it to the platform that it originated on YouTube. Right. And you're like taking from that pool of people. Right.

Because then you're kind of cannibalizing the potential reach and audience that that video may have had. Especially because the packaging is so much on YouTube. Like the title and the thumbnail is so much. And the React thumbnail and title of a video is so similar to the original video that it, like, the narrative that it could be taking away real, like, potential audience, I don't think is. I think it's a fact that it takes away some potential audience. And then the argument is, like, how much? And then, like, how much good is it doing versus how much bad is it doing because i mean yeah net more viewers overwhelmingly yeah especially for smaller creators i mean i know true crime jcs etc is from seeing reacts of them because i don't have

like the emotional palette to watch one of those without somebody butting yeah i need someone to hold my hand someone reminding me that there's like ponies and cute stuff yeah yeah when it's just like and the baby got eaten and for sure yeah jesus christ and this is where jenna knew that she had murdered seven men and would be in jail forever yeah and it's like fuck and then somebody else going damn that's crazy it is crazy yeah okay cool i'm glad someone else is on my side i love those clips whenever all i get those videos whenever they just go hard copaganda out of nowhere like this is actually a method that police detectives will often use that a bunch of libs think is torture whatever but it's actually so goaded and epic i watch one of those channels and recently they've been like actually this person's going completely off book and this

guy sucks actually interrogating wait go off yeah his name's josh he lives here yeah he's ugly he's busted um it is a really hard thing to tease apart because i can give a personal example of a creator i know gunner tv shout out gunner small was a super small creator one to 10k subs and charlie started reacting to his videos and was posting like stream cutdowns light stream cutdowns of his videos on his channel but the way that he treated it was like oh gunner's got a new video guys let's check out gunner's new video i'm gonna check out this new vid what's up guys what's up gamers um and then gunner grew and like now gunner has a couple hundred thousand subscribers you know and he would not deny that charlie watching his videos and essentially like freebooting his videos did have an important part in putting him

in front of a huge set of eyeballs that then when there were new videos coming out, there was a addressable audience for YouTube to recommend those videos to because Charlie's not going to react to every video. So like that's not in defense of XQC, because not every creator needs to be brought up. And for creators of a certain size or creators who put videos out once per month or once per couple of months, this could be their big, this could be huge for their income. This could be huge for their career to like not have anybody reacting to their video for it to stand alone. Do you know the argument against that? What? you're basically now playing a game where it's like the big creator is the one lifting someone from the crowd to like get a lot of views or subscribers

by, you know, maybe reacting to it and shouting that person out in the same way, like a billionaire can philanthropically pick one venereal disease that they want to solve in a country as opposed to like, what would the general audience want if that video didn't exist? Cause those views might go somewhere else. Right. Is, is the general audience want if that video didn't exist because those views might go somewhere else right uh is is the general argument which which i think has some legs also has some flaws to it yeah i don't think it's i i i do think it's a super great i think it's being

treated because of how black and white the xuc situation is people are painting with a broad brush about the entire argument which i don't't think is, I think the, the, the whole space is particularly nuanced. I think it's a, a dumb discourse that surrounds and like a moot point. There is no, like there are no winners in this conversation just as there never is. There are people talking about it.

People talking about it, getting views, getting impressions. The fact that it's about people that are fun to talk about is why it's being talked about. This is like not an interesting discourse if it's just about boring people the strategy for like 10 plus years to deal with reactors is to shame them and hope that somehow quells reactors which doesn't work obviously otherwise sniper wolf wouldn't be one of the

biggest channels on the website yeah and anyone who just like shoves their shame aside or anyone who's maybe like clawing on their way up who's not noticed who's like okay well you know excuse you got taken down but like i'll go it's like oh you see jewel fall and then elf bars like oh my turn uh that the same thing happens i think for reactors yeah so the shaming strat doesn't work i don't think you want a universe where somebody goes to court and then draws like a hard line in the sand on what isn't isn't okay no because i think that'll take down a lot of like the freedoms that exist on the website for me and by definition fair use isn't a line in the sand it's like something that needs that line

needs to be on a case-by-case basis in court based on the tenets of the doctrine and most people wouldn't be able to afford that anyway yeah not at all and that's all the time i've advocated for for youtube to give the tools to the creators who are clearly like not at all and that's all the time i've advocated for for youtube to give the tools to the creators who are clearly like not happy that their stuff's being reacted to and that they're losing money out on it to be able to claim that money back because they you can't do that right now you i feel like i've been like my monetization for videos before has been routed to other people i feel yeah Like you can get claims. Right.

But usually the claiming feature is exclusive to corporations, music companies, or like other groups. An individual creator, like I've looked, I tried. I was like, can I claim someone? Yeah. Sure. You have three options. If someone's using your stuff, because YouTube shows you, they're very accurate in showing

like, this person's using 100% of your video. Yeah. Yeah. I've seen that. Yeah. And then you have three options which is one like close it out stop thinking about it to send them an email and be like hey and then three send them a copyright takedown and give them a strike sure which is like it's so confrontational yeah it's like do nothing do basically nothing or do nuclear option yeah which is not like you know especially if it is a smaller creator even like medium-sized confrontation could destroy their lives oh yeah let alone destroy the channel that they're trying to save by doing it in the first yeah

channel with 10k strike somebody with a couple million like maybe there's a universe where they get some public support on twitter or something but most of the time like that there's a universe where they get some public support on Twitter or something, but most of the time, like that there's, they still don't want to deal with that. Yeah. Subscriber fan base. It would want a hundred percent rely on the target. It would have to be a, that would have to be like this consensus.

XTC would have to kill someone with his car that morning. Yeah. And then like, it would be like, Oh yeah, actually you'd have to wait until you just finished a gambling stream. Just watch. And I wrote it perfectly in general.

I think that YouTube needs more tools for stuff like that because i've been in a situation where i accidentally doxed myself or no no doc someone else in a like it was like not a docs it was like a phone number or something and it was disembodied like you couldn't tell who it was from but i still like would cut it out of the thing and then someone re-uploaded it including that piece and so and i don't think they were doing so maliciously but my tools for getting in contact with that person asking them to trim that part out or remove it or whatever like we're very very limited and it's weird that there's no in-product way to communicate with another creator yeah it

is very well they got rid of messages in like 2008 which they were dog shit but i did used to use them i used them too yeah we should start using uh posting videos again where it's like re this video yeah reply it's like quote retweeting yeah i can't believe that existed yeah it's crazy that and those would go viral like um i saw it a lot with song covers back in the day on youtube like somebody would do a song cover reply to another person's song cover it's kind of like um on the old internet when you would like link to your friends pages and stuff you'd be like hey check out my friend he makes dragon ball z videos or content i've not enjoyed the internet more since like 2002 that's the most fun i've had on the internet oh two i would i would argue a bit later on there

but yeah i do think the internet i i think it went from like here's cool web pages that do cool things to like just browse these five social media sites and do like cycle through them yeah i've smiled more on newgrounds than i have on twitter for sure that's definitely correct but you also like trick yourself into thinking it's valuable to spend time on twitter you've never tricked yourself into thinking it's valuable to spend time on new grounds right yeah especially in the space that we work in there is a trick to be like well i need to know what's going on this is universal i think people go to twitter and they're like oh i'm informing myself and it's like okay there's a bombing in kuwait and then justin bieber's canceled what did you learn something happened something kicked in this last week this week it's wednesday when we're recording this

i generally don't check screen time but i was curious i have an average of 16 minutes a day on twitter this week whoa is it because of the x transition something about i'm so tired i'm so tired of it i'm so sick of seeing an interesting like take or a joke and having to scroll through 50 comments that are all blue checks going, um, this, yeah, me likey. And I'm just like, I can't do this. Dude, yeah. I saw there was this group of ants who were carrying a gold chain and then I go to their replies and it's a blue check and it's like, wow, must be an ant eek.

And then that guy, you go to that guy's profile and he's like, wow, Elon just sent me-eek. And then you go to that guy's profile and it's like, wow, Elon just sent me $100,000 for all of my impressions that I get. Thanks for making the website better. I'm having so much fun. Pizzagate is real, by the way. I don't know if you guys knew that. Yeah, paying for impressions is dangerous.

Yeah. I actually don't. Those numbers seem inflated to me that people are getting paid. Oh, yeah. Well, inflated by them or inflated by Twitter? Like, I feel like it cannot be as valuable to Twitter to pay for those impressions as they are. Especially for how gamified it is, because you just like post really incendiary stuff and then you get more engagement.

I don't think they have nearly enough advertiser dollars. I guess the argument is that you only get paid out if you're a Twitter Blue subscriber and the people who are posting the screenshots are like the top 0.1%. And so everyone who might be subscribing to Twitter Blue to get paid is basically like, imagine if you had to pay 10 bucks a month to get paid on YouTube,

how many people would pay for that? Right, right, for sure. Yeah, and it's like, it still doesn't add up to any amount of revenue. But then the theory, I guess, on their end is that they are paying people who are in earnest going to be creating value. Yes.

But I think that the same thing exists on YouTube, but there's real advertiser dollars that are funding the money, where it's like, I just don't believe that's the case for Twitter. It's certainly not sustainable right now. Yeah. I am curious to see the journey. It's just the product is now draining the years

in a way that I at least, I don't know. I felt embarrassed to be a really active Twitter user, but at least the moment to moment it was fun. And I got the illusion of feeling like I wasn't informing myself. And now the for you doesn't show me anything i'm actually interested in doesn't even nominally inform me about stuff every time i see a trend it's like hasan is trending and i click it and he just went live and it's just like hasan is trending oh right uh for me it's i don't get why people watch a sign he just eats and watches videos i mean yeah that's that's content creators

it's like they just don't understand the like what a parasocial relationship is i don't get the dark night he's just doing this fighting crime i get on twitter uh a bunch of like fights and like horrible like like things it's like watch this person get their ass beat oh crazy clips oh yeah crazy yeah yeah vids that go hard and then it's like four pretty funny clips and then a guy dying yeah that goes hard yeah it's like i've had to more in my life you know when you um pull up something on stream that you're like oh i don't want to do that that might get me like in trouble i've done that just in my private life because of the stuff that shows up on my twitter home feed i'm like i don't need to see that right now yeah i've become more sensitized because i was very desensitized

when i was young yeah because you know you you just hear a name you're like yeah two girls one cup and then you're like what's the hammer one and you look all this up and you just slowly become more and more desensitized but as i've gotten older i look at it and it's like this is horrible this is this is gonna ruin my day yeah i cannot watch this i yeah i feel it's like the same way i feel about dairy it's just like i could i shouldn't have eaten it when i was younger but i was just fine yeah having my stomach hurt and now i'm just like okay we should all look out you're recently sad about this yeah you you gave up ludwig you are recently a lactose intolerant person yeah how did you how did you find out what was your journey

well okay it it started a long time ago actually he's crying no i was i i became an early almond milk enjoyer okay uh because i was ignorant to the to the environmental stuff and then when i found out i was still like it's so low calorie though and uh and i hit like a stinky 200 pounds and i was like i want to come down from this yeah uh and so i was big almond milk guy one day i'm streaming and there's like an arm chair it's like an office chair and i'm like leaning into the armchair to pick something off on the ground and it's like really low and i just keep going and then i do like a final third like big push to grab it i get it and then i hear and then i get back up and i like continue streaming and then like like an hour in a stream i'm like uh and i'm like that's weird and my ribs hurt i didn't click for like four hours i fractured my rib cage why just by leaning over and and that blew my mind that my ribs could break

on what i thought was one of the like lightest impacts uh And so right then, I was like, big milk was right. Big milk was on the right page. Yeah, my bones are too weak because all this almond milk I'm drinking. Right, I was failing to see the connection, which means that the years of got milk propaganda have failed me. Yes, and so I instantly started drinking milk. I got right back on the dairy train. Right.

And I was on that for a while. This almond milk has made me frail. Yes. That was my thought. Right. Broke my rib. You know how long it takes to heal? I have no idea.

It's like six months and you can't do anything. Like you can't do anything about it. Right. You just have to suffer. You just have to drink milk. There's no cast for your ribs. No. You have to drink so much milk.

You have to drink so much. And then recently I've been drinking drinking milk as i do right and uh and in my in can we get graphic in the show please my shits are what like a elephant toothpaste experiment i don't i only understood some of those words my elephant they come out like an elephant toothpaste oh they oh it's not fun yeah and i and i was like it's the coffee or it's the milk right so i isolated the variables yes and i've been having coffee with with substitutes and it come out fine yeah and so i think i'm lactose intolerant just choose between your stomach and your bones. Do you? So, yeah.

So you're upset about it. Yeah. You miss milk. Well, I still ice cream. You're like, I'm still drinking it. Okay. And that's been fine. Okay.

I think it's just like milk. I think it's like hearty. Because, well, I don't know, man. I also believe that if you stop drinking milk, you become lactose intolerant. You're taking a tolerance break. Right. I think so. I think it's a real thing.

I drink so much milk and I still do drink milk even though I am. I'm not as lactose intolerant, but I just get gassy. I get really bad gas. I was going to say, do you understand your options moving forward? Like, are you familiar with lactaid? It's to punish myself and enjoy it or to not punish myself and not enjoy it. There's like medication. I don't do that.

Okay. Nice. I don't trust it. Oh. It's what your anti-vax, right? Yeah. Thank you. Right.

Pure blood. So you got to get a jab for this lactaid? Just a tablet. What are the, what are the, how does it work? Enzymes. Yeah. what are the how does it work enzymes yeah so there's an enzyme lactase that you cannot like when you're lactose intolerant you cannot process

in your body and so like I get a milk called lactate where they just took that out and so it just tastes the same but it doesn't have the thing that makes you grumbly oh you get a milk I thought you were talking about well there's both so that's what I do but then there's also these lactate tablets i could go grab you some uh that if either of us are going real ham on some dairy we might pop a lactate beforehand and it works yeah i mean

maybe i it's the funniest because with the lactate it's you know the milk and like okay well it's not in it i'll just have it yeah with the pill i don't know i don't know how the lucked out i don't know if i because like take it with your first bite of food okay if i did it just not work because i did the second one or did it never work or was i just gonna shit myself anyway right whatever reason today i don't think i trust it i it's a risky proposition do you mean like you don't want to enjoy it so that you're not eating too much ice cream you want there to be a penalty hey you wait i haven't been punished with ice cream look here's the thing i might not even be lactose intolerant this might be appropriation this is the dirty truth it might just be that i the caffeine ran

through me badly a few times and i overreacted because the ice cream hasn't done me too wrong he's done it lactate enjoy dairy again fast act all the guests get this by the way yeah i i went for one you know appreciate that of course i i you know what i'm i'm worried about i feel like a conspiracy theorist what about my gut biome how much do you. What about my gut biome? How much do you already know about your gut biome? It's one of the best. Are you doing prebiotics? Are you doing probiotics? I do the whole not.

I have a, I think I have a healthy ecosystem in there. Okay. I have based on the diarrhea or like some other. I will. Your gut biome controls like what? How many subs are you? Speaker 1 And it's better. So well, yeah, yeah, I can't imagine. Yeah. People think

XQC deal is dollars. It's actually like intense gut health. Yeah. Hundred thousand pound a gallon easy. No, I have, I have such a fierce lack of knowledge on food but i'm very passionate about what i don't know yeah and so i was talking about it on stream i was like yeah i have an idea of like some some foods are god foods and some foods aren't god foods and they're like what's a god food i'm like vegetables it's a god food fair can't go wrong with vegetables true they're like rice i'm like no not bad for you yeah this is bad for you which sucks it's like no fair yeah and and so i have this list and i'm like salmon they're like mercury poisoning i'm like not worried about that yeah yeah because you have to eat so much yeah yeah to worry about that but then rice i feel like there's a difference between white rice brown rice

you know i anti brown rice anti brown rice it tastes icky it has for god food has to taste good it's the color you don't like the color of it. Oh, so you like the taste of it. No, I wouldn't say that. Oh, yeah. You just hate brown. No, no, no. I close my eyes when I eat rice regardless.

Oh, yeah. No, you did say that before. I've heard you say that before. The way you described brown rice was you're happy for it to be around, but it is scary. Yeah, you want the rice separated and you want nothing. I wouldn't separate. I would keep all the rice on the plate together. Oh, wow.

Oh, my God. Yeah, this is incredible. Yeah, I actually like mixed rice the plate together. Oh my God. Yeah. This is incredible. I actually like mixed rice. We all applaud. Half brown, half white. I always ask.

They all say no. I'm like, we don't do that. I have a dream actually. I'm not going to walk out, but I would. Yeah. Right.

I think you were saying you like black Panther earlier. Thank you so much. I do this sign everywhere. Yeah. Right. I think you were saying you like Black Panther earlier. Thank you so much, dude. I do this sign everywhere. Yeah. Big Lord of Goranson fan too. What a hilarious period of time that was to work in tech

with mostly white people and just like, I just saw Black Panther. Oh, wow. It is, it's like cool from like a representation standpoint and everything,

but it is at the end of the day a Marvel movie.'s still a cop yeah so black panther yeah he's just a cop that's also the president it's like people are talking to you like you had something to do with the movie they're like wow i had no idea that's tough i am not the black man uh can i tell you a secret please i've never seen it hey put her here yeah i've quit on marvel too scary that's okay i quit on marvel a long time ago and and it's now it's basically like spider-man only good exception yeah good exception consider it different enough and i think sony does a enough job. Yeah. But I think that's the easiest thing to hate. This is like the most lukewarm take. Yeah.

I don't dislike a Marvel movie, but most people who talk negatively about Marvel feel like they're being forced to watch the movies. I was. Oh, okay. I felt obliged at one point, for sure. Yeah. So I was invited to a screening of Thor Love and Thunder. And it was something shrouded set up.

So we got this whole theater. He had a bunch of friends come out. Me and Cutie go. And we're sitting in the back. And the movie starts. I'm like, you know, I saw the first Thor. This could be fun. Right.

And like 10 minutes in, I'm like, oof. It's going to be tough. Yeah. This is the Taika one that nobody liked, right? Yes. The most recent one. But I couldn't leave. I couldn't shroud who got this theater, who's invited me.

So I couldn't leave. And so I wait for it to end. And I'm ready to commiserate. You know, the moment a movie ends. It's a sad thing to be in a movie waiting for it to end. Yes. Yeah. And I just thought it tried to be funny and and i and i just i just thought it was it

tried to be funny and did not make me laugh once and that was its failure i just didn't laugh yeah there's something like i feel like people always talk about fatigue with marvel movies which to some extent i guess i can align with but every single time there's then a great superhero movie everybody is instantly rejuvenated the issue for me i whenever i watch a marvel movie now i'm used to seeing something i like or something that was kind of mid dr strange 2 is one of the worst films i've ever seen in my entire life they're just dropping sneakers it's distractingly bad and i it's there's single digit number of people including myself that don't like it and not it's not even bad and like let's make a commentary youtube video about it how it's cute and funny and coy trash it's bad yeah it's just

i felt about thor the moment it ended i was like ready to commiserate talk to everybody be like that sucked so i go i go up i'm like go to shroud i'm like what do you think he's like loved it i was like oh dude me too yeah you can't go there the shroud i'm sorry i'm sorry it just wasn't my cup it wasn't my cup of tea yeah i also really loved how loud it was and how many jokes they did that didn't land that shit was fire oh that's funny how's teenage mutant ninja turtles i liked it i don't want to spoil too much about it um the fuck you're gonna spoil it's four turtles they fight crime well choose it up how old are they well you know what it is i don't want to give my opinion to people and then have them like adopt it. Sure. That makes sense.

But, but I will. There, there were two woke, like one of the things that Eddie told me that the, the, it's like four teenagers who play the turtles, which is cute. And then they recorded together,

which is non-traditional for voice acting. Usually they don't do ensemble recording. So that is cute. Like they have good chemistry. They do a lot of talking over each other, but it feels like very true to like how teenagers would be. Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg, and then some other guy,

sorry, wrote the script. But you know, they're the famous writing partners, you know. I believe it was Raphael. It is so full of pop culture references that it

almost took me out a little bit of the movie because they were making they're making references to marvel they were making like at one point the kid is like talking about like his riz and then i learned that was an ad of mine and from a teenager and i was like okay now i'm okay with it but there was this like kind of push and pull where i couldn't tell like what was from the writers versus what was like improvised and that intent ended up mattering to me because for some reason I could imagine like Seth Rogen writing a line and that like could be cringy, but if a teenager says it, then it's fine. I don't know. But overall it's very sweet. It's very cute. It felt shorter than I was expecting because the movie started wrapping up and i was like

it's over like i wasn't expecting that i don't feel like we had a real you know end of act two kind of like all this all this lost moment and maybe that's just me metagaming the hero's journey into movies right but uh but overall it was like a fun experience i didn't love it as much as everyone else and it was that thing where i was like oh what'd you didn't love it as much as everyone else and it was that thing where i was like oh what'd you think and loved it and i was like okay i mean i liked it i did like it i'm curious to like i do this thing now where one of my favorite things about watching a movie is like watching uh the 50 easter eggs you missed in this movie like i don't know why i just like it's like brain candy like spending more time so i haven't done dark souls lore videos then playing yeah oh when i watched oppenheimer uh a full day

of world war ii documentaries for me yeah yeah it was yeah what did they do with the ball i'm like wait it was real yeah hold on what did they do this is crazy i'm so glad they didn't use it yeah that's crazy oh my god it's like not in the movie right they don't there's no they put it no they put in they no not oh they they put the trinity test in but they don't put like uh they're just dropping the they talk about it on the radio yeah i see um but uh you do a cartoon voice there's a bunch of like science oppenheimer has the funniest amount of like sciencey easter eggs where they'll just reference like scientists where if you're a nerd you're like oh Fermi oh Niels Bohr

yeah there's a really good have you seen Oppenheimer no I don't want to see it at all that's fine you don't have to see it there's a funny almost Marvel level cameo at the very end of the movie where.

Oh, I might know what that is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where there's this guy who's like up for a Senate seat who was an enemy of Oppenheimer, essentially. A guy that destroys bombs. He doesn't get a Senate confirmation. And he was like, who are the people who voted no? And it was like, there's this senator who's trying to make a name for himself. Kennedy.

John F. Kennedy. And everybody's like, oh. And I'm like, why did that? That's like so random. His whole head is together. Because it's true. It's true. Which is cool.

It's cool. But the wink and the, it felt like a wink and a nod. You know what I mean? Where it's like Iron Man iron man basically it was like the guy who said no i well that took me out less than josh peck showing up oh yeah that's crazy yeah that was crazy would you watch it again it's three hours long that's what i'm in a dilemma okay you were in pogchamps five yeah the chess event that i ran and uh and connor c-dog who was in japan right got to the finals okay cool so he has to fly to america for two days and he has to go right back to japan and uh and he was like yeah man i'm coming do you want

to watch oppenheimer with me because it's not out in japan yeah and it probably won't come out in japan yeah uh there's been like some opposition online uh to like right not really the movie as a whole but like the marketing around it yeah uh and and he's like you want to watch it again i'm like bro like we we see each other infrequently i love hanging out with you yeah a second oppenheimer viewing sounds crazy but connor is a sweetie pie he is a sweetie pie and i and i and i love him a lot yeah but i would i would do it. I'll go see it with him. This is what I'm asking. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I will put on my Ludwig mask. You do a dynamite impersonation. And you say the N-word. Wait, did he lose any more games? Or am I the only one who took a game off? I believe, I thought you were the only one who took a game off him. Because he 2-0'd his match. Most inconsistent chess player

in a yeah actually well it's just because uh i'm i never got i had i was working on the metaverse video right and i never got to practice and i kept like putting off my coach i felt so bad who's the coach uh it was nemo oh and she was the sweetest and available and everything and then um uh levy also like reached out and i just couldn't like it was i had this huge pokemon brand deal on the video also and i was like this is the biggest brand deal i've had of the year it's an amazing huge video so i like had to prioritize things so it's a it's one of those things where i kick myself so hard but i shouldn't you know what i think you prioritize it correctly you know what I mean? I think you prioritized it correctly. You know what?

You know when you- Joe Rogan didn't watch the chess tournament. Maybe you're- I don't know if you're like me, but I know some people are out there where you expect to be good at things despite not putting any work in. Well, I think we all like to believe we'd be good at things. Yeah. You know? I like beat myself up real bad when I don't do according to my-

When it doesn't come true? Estimation of myself myself i'm firmly in the camp of saying that the thing is bad yeah the thing is bad it's not you yeah because if it was good i would be good at it we hide our egos in many weird places uh and and i used to do this with my age because i used to watch football and i'd be like i'm younger than him so i guess if i tried starting now yeah yeah i'd probably be like, not my homes level, but like just under. I would be in the NFL.

For sure, that's not a question. Not first pick. I'm humble, not first pick, of course. Third pick. But I do go to the best team in the league. And I start. I choose. I did the same thing.

I genuinely felt sadness and a depressive episode when I came to terms with the fact that I was 19, which is the same year that Mark Zuckerberg founded Facebook. And I was not going to found Facebook. I was in my Georgia Tech dorm room studying computer science, thinking that that was the only like success metric. Yeah. And i like genuinely like felt bummed out about it i was not silly sad but i felt weird about missing the 27 club not dying yeah i was like well now what if i die at 29 that's embarrassing how embarrassing i was

27 and i was like oh 27 club and then i mentioned that to someone they're like you wouldn't get on the wikipedia page and i was like fuck yeah not even Club. And then I mentioned that to someone, and they're like, you wouldn't get on the Wikipedia page. And I was like, fuck. Not even the most famous Ludwig anymore, you know? Yeah, and that's why I was really happy to get through it, because it would suck to die at 27 and not make it to the Wikipedia page. It would have to come up. Do you know what I mean?

If you died at 27, you'd be like, well... Yeah, you're like in sea also, and it's like less important deaths. People who died at 27, but it was just like whatever yeah but we ran out of space but it felt weird to put up next to kurt cobain don't know if we put that in the episode people that died at 27 but were very effectively replaced with ai yeah no one noticed well speaking of places we hide our ego um what like I want to like shift into talking a little bit about mental health, because you you're a very like people externally would see you as like a very productive creator, very high energy, very kind of always on. Right. But I imagine that is not the full 360 degrees of you as a person so like how do you you know keep your

spirits up how do you like care for yourself compartmentalize those two halves yeah how do you hide your ego in other unique places yeah i i think i am the more i realize very uh lucky because i feel like i got a like a pretty good situation going on up in my skull. I like I like being in my brain. Yeah. I like thinking of being alone with my thoughts. Yeah. And and so I think what I do explore, though, is I've gotten a bit into like like, OK, what are things that would make me feel like a good person, make me feel like I'm doing good in the world. And so I shift that, like most of my goals are aligned with what that is. And, and it's like, usually a selfish endeavor attempting to be selfless. And so I like, you

know, we'll make a goal. Like, so my most recent one that I achieved was like, I wanted to do the podcast to make my friends rich, to give them a level of financial comfortability that they could you know settle down get a house whatever right which i achieved and i was like okay maybe that was too narrow perhaps this is too maybe selfish of just the group around me this is what most people do in life uh i would like to expand it now to like like larger local community people around me uh so that's my next goal but like i think i'm very just focused on that stuff and i don't get too i don't get too sad boy that's good uh yeah it's pretty good uh i got into philosophy for a bit yeah that helps me get through it i think for for me for a long

time i don't know if you guys were like this i was scared of death oh yeah not scared of death for me yeah whatever i think it's just weird but but where does that like maybe in the abstract but like the abstract more of dying yes the the absence i like not that you know i think everything going dark whatever but right i have a the impact on the community around me as well that felt that's a weird obligation i realized i wasn't afraid of of death in a very stupid way. I was flying to Seattle to interview for Microsoft and I was really nervous about the interview. And I was like, honestly, if this plane goes down,

I don't have to do the interview. You were more scared about the interview. Yeah, I don't know why. Wow. It was very weird. That's insane. It is insane. Yeah.

To be fair, you can't screw up dying in a plane crash. Yeah. You can screw up the interview real bad. I think there's a part of me that really wants to achieve my potential. And the weight is off if I die. Sure. And that's what I work on. It's like something I'm aware of.

Were you always feeling that until a certain point? Yes. Or at a certain point you started feeling that? you started i had massive fears of death growing up when i was young it was like like debilitating at times because i would try to think of what you think of after death which is nothing and i'm like 11 yeah it's like that was like a lot for an 11 year old yeah uh and so i think i carried that for a while and then uh kind of the inverse of i think a lot of people's experience where you feel like you literally can't die yes because also when you're 11 you can fall over split your head open and just be fine the next day yes whereas now if

i stub my toe i'm just injured for the rest of my life yeah i think i just realized what death was earlier because i had death and family uh and then i was like well that sounds so shit yeah uh and don't want that and then like had to come to grips with it much earlier and for me is the opposite of you where once i like now i feel really cool with it and like i try to put myself in the headspace that i was scared of when i was young and i feel much better about it right that's good it's a good way to like kind of put yourself through that same stimulus and go, Oh, we've grown. Yeah. I don't have the same experience here. Yeah. Cause what I would do when I was young is like, Oh, I'll watch one piece and then I'll stop

thinking about it. Cause Luffy's going gummo gummo. And now I'll do the opposite where I'm like listening to music and I'm like, let me pause a song on my walk and think about it, which is psychotic in a way but helpful i think that's like you are you when you're doing that kind of like challenging yourself like it's like oh let's do this exercise it's like a little brain um exercise yeah i'm trying to make sure i'm not always hiding in a distraction yeah because like it's very easy to like always be listening to a podcast while you're cooking or doing laundry or music or watching a YouTube video on the side. Watch a video as you're turning your face from the food you were eating to the TV where you're watching something.

Yes. And oftentimes people's only silence in thoughts of their own is like deciding what to watch. Right. And so like very active time spent like just in your own head I think is good. Yeah. To have control over that. So that's, it's like an exercise to do that. And, and doing that, I've become not scared of death, which makes me feel not scared of most things.

Yeah. Which is funny. Cause you're like still scared of the Microsoft interview. I don't know if you're still scared of the Microsoft interview, but then I, but I became too confident in my old career. And then I like went to something where i was like not confident in and then some of that stuff like came back um but but that's great like do you have a like fears of heights or anything like that because even though i'm not afraid of

death i'm still like well that's not cool i get like a spidey sense in my gooch when people lactose and dollars yeah yeah drink a lot of milk yeah it's gonna come out point growth style when people are in high heights and they're like leaning over like a railing yeah that puckers me up more than if i were to do it because i'm like i'm not gonna jump like i'm gonna right firmly grip this yeah but if someone else is i like for some reason i'm like they're gonna fucking fall off yeah it's gonna be the most horrible thing ever uh and that that gets my tingles going i'm getting sweaty thinking about that that's i'm grumpy about it like i'm now at a point where i'm like oh come on what are you doing yeah enjoying that yeah you're like the kids you're wrong

you're wrong to enjoy that speaking of your good skull uh let me let me measure that yeah uh i yeah we always close with phrenology yeah that's like one of our things um i watched some of your anthony padilla interview and you talked about like i don't know if it was like alluding to being bullied like when you were kind of a kid or like kind of being different you know pronouncing your name differently uh but did you experience any bullying at all like growing up or any like not differently. But did you experience any bullying at all, like growing up? Or any like not belonging? I think if there was any bullying, it was like friend bullying.

And my friends were like, you know, they weren't bullies, but they were hard on each other in the way that guy friends I think are. Yeah, yeah. Were they trying to calcify each other, make each other a little less? Yes. Maybe add some defenses, a little bit of armor for the future so i had a lot of that because i like you know i had a couple easy targets one was my chest hole you know oh or do you not have a sternum yeah i have a chussy oh nice the other was i made a youtube channel when i was 16 and uh and like that's very embarrassing yeah because that is very vulnerable yeah you're

not allowed to try things or explore and you're bad too yeah so it's like you are exploring but you're also exploring poorly because you're just making your first couple youtube videos it literally like if you you start learning the guitar but you can only do it on stage yeah you are learning chords in front of all your friends really good way to put it and then and then all your friends are there at the open mic and they're like oof yeah it's bad um and you're like i know i know but i want to keep doing it maybe uh my first youtube video when i was 14 went viral and then i never made a video after that until i started my youtube channel really it was just me dancing high school musical too like i learned the choreography but um but i was so afraid of not being able to like i was i was afraid of like flopping so early this seems

consistent with you yeah yeah where you're very not you're very worried about not hitting some potential exactly yeah but see and so like i was 14 then so it like i think i was still working through the exact same thing that i was working through when I was like 20 on the plane to Microsoft or whatever. And it still sucks. Like, like, like I'm frustrated, but I think I've gotten better at like getting back up and kind of trying again at like those failures. Do you have like a similar feeling when you upload a video? Like, do you have an expectation for it to hit a metric that maybe previous videos have hit uh i think i think i have like a realistic expectation so like when things are unexpectedly low i'm like is everything coming crashing down but uh usually i think right now things have kind of i don't know i've been in like a

Holding pattern I think for a couple years While I was like working on some like mental health and life Stuff we're only now I'm like getting back to like really like Going for it on YouTube And so it's funny because I get Like I saw somebody Tweeting today because it was post my own thing that was like

Oh Jarvis is finally getting the recognition Like I'm still like a underdog to people Even even though I've been in the game for a couple years now, just because I don't feel like I fully applied myself because I've always had other shit to focus on. Like with mental health and health and stuff like that. But yeah, a bit, a little bit. Yeah, it's funny how you can be always emerging because you're always being discovered by new people yeah and it's like you know unless you're taylor fucking swift right who can't be emerging well there's safety in that i think you know the reason i

started i i have like a bunch of channels and i think part of the reason is mitigating failure because uh it's also content strategy but mitigating the failure of like when i made my second channel i was like oh i can just post on this because the numbers don't matter here you know what i mean oh to an extent to an extent and then and then eventually they you know it's like now my second channel is about to hit a million subscribers and i'm like okay yeah now i care if this does well or not so i gotta got to start a third channel. No, you know, but it's like you realize like, oh, I've fallen into the same trap. Yeah. It's very common in streaming too.

People have alt streams and it's like, I don't care about my average viewership number here until they do care about their average viewership number there. Yeah. And then oftentimes alt channels become main channels because they can't even go on their main channel because what's worthy of a main channel now. Exactly. Yeah. main channels because they can't even go on their main channel because what's worthy of a main channel now exactly yeah and that that's definitely something that i've like gone through and have now like started to develop a like content strategy around but i mean it's it's such a abstract it's

to the same degree where like the most agony i see in any i'm i feel very isolated from the my channel just because numbers are good I engage in just when there's a brand deal or something because generally sad boys is the thing I enjoy doing the most I like making videos for my channel just fine if I couldn't do sad boys that would be a wage you know it's not it's nice as insurance but because it's a shared project

I was never the editor for it I've always liked having a little bit of distance from it A wage, you know, it's nice as insurance, but because it's a shared project, I was never the editor for it. I've always liked having a little bit of distance from it. Its performance is interesting to me, but I have no ego attached to it. If a video does well, it is never because I tried harder on it, because ultimately the things that we value are vibes. It's, I, man, I'm so disappointed in the lighting in this section and i've never in my life seen a comment about it or like the

standard for like acoustics for example the amount of echo you could have in a video versus the number of people that would notice or care it's a joke it just doesn't matter to people audio fidelity is like there's just a floor if you just hit the floor it's fine joke it just doesn't matter to people audio fidelity is like there's there's a floor if you just hit the floor it's fine yeah yeah okay both your both your channels died sad boys dies you followed off no one cares about you you're old ace yeah you're old now sick very old i'm free everyone's saying this yeah what do you do now um diet 27 i get a time machine um well i like making stuff i think i've always like be it like apps or like like i think there's a chance that i like start a company someday that's like i don't know do built solving some problem i think i'm confident my ability to like

solve problems and stuff so i've never been afraid of my channel dying because i'm like i could just do it again if i needed to if i wanted to like even if um it's a completely different market or it's a completely different thing uh even creatively less satisfying maybe a little bit more cynical i mean if i if i needed to like if i'm it depends on whether or not i'm uh trying to survive or if i'm trying to be fulfilled but um if I'm trying to be fulfilled, I think solving challenging problems in collaborating with people is something that I enjoy. And I also enjoy telling stories and stuff.

So I find some way of doing that. But I left behind a successful software engineering career to do content on a lark. So I think I've been confident enough in my ability to like uh follow my curiosity i guess in life so i just probably just keep doing that oh me uh it's all kind of shit i would celebrate i'm free i am no longer i don't keep pretending to be british that's the hardest part i mean to be fair that is kind of tied to it because my presence in America I'm still on temporary work visas it's like seven years of being

nominally American but not ever if I don't have the job I can't be here right so there is this anytime I've had an idea for a company a a project, an alternative path, dual wielding is really hard. Like, oh, I'll try out this thing as well. I can't. I'm not allowed to make money from other stuff legally. And I just associate it will always just be a case of like the gray matter hasn't spent enough time spinning. I've spent so many years having an idea and then immediately putting it away because I know I can't do it. Right.

Whereas there was a point maybe five years ago where there was a little bit more like, Oh, I don't know. Maybe I'm still in tech. Maybe jumping off a tech, I'll start this thing. I'll throw something around.

Then I started a company in 2019 and the visa transition didn't work and I got deported. It was, I tried it one time and it didn't work yeah so now i am firmly in the camp of in this hypothetical let's say i just am a citizen or something i feel kind of the same way i think i would just do a similar i'll do whatever i have the bona fides for i think personally it would be easier for me to keep doing stuff like this than to go back to tech because i was doing partnerships administrative stuff that's not so much a like marketable skill or like a hey I'm here to do engineering I'm like oh great we have a bunch of slots you can fit into and moving backwards also bothers me even if it is a good thing or even a better position than i am in there's something uh yeah intuitively uncomfortable to me about my life in 2025 really resembling my life in 2015 with this little gap

in the middle that like isn't wouldn't be included in the movie explain this gap on your resume yeah your life memory resume what would you do when you fall off? Yeah. I want to start a bakery. Oh, fuck yeah. I want to bake really good bread. I like that. Have you baked bread before? No. Okay. I relate to this.

I used to say I was going to start a sandwich shop when I retire, and I still think it might happen, like a little neighborhood sandwich shop, and I've never, I couldn't make a sandwich to this day. Do you bake anything? I can make a fire sandwich. Okay, I've baked a lot of banana bread. Okay, that's a start. You the i've actually yeah i've made that cutie's a proficient baker i just love bread's my favorite food good i just love bread yeah sounds like you want the job of eating bread yeah right now i'm i kill it at that yeah not many better than me uh and there's a lot of dog shit bread needs in the u.s of a and i feel like

if i started like a local bakery true because the way they have it like when i would go to europe that's all i'd eat is just bread and they all have like a little corner bakery yeah i never understood how that works you go to europe everybody's just eating bread and cheese because they have a they have a local freaking boulangerie yeah making a hundred loaves a day yeah they sell out but i'm like there's no vegetables here like i was studying abroad in spain i was like everybody's just eating fucking ham cheese and bread at all times it's because they nap they all walk like 10 miles a day they walk so much you need that starch you need that protein makes sense my mom used to live in uh the super super super remote

rural town in france and i don't know if this was a genuine like municipal law that allowed them to do this but because they're constantly drinking wine and napping and there's one store there supposedly is a constitutional style law where every citizen is entitled to bread and wine like you have to be able to get it like access or like it's free access to it okay like in you can't get it for free but you can't be physically prohibited from accessing it yeah there should be a human right yeah it's like a walk score when you're like buying a house because of that and there's a lot of drunk driving on the rare occasion where somebody gets caught drunk driving and they lose their license, they get given this hilarious little car that peaks out at like 20 miles an

hour. And you are allowed to drive it on main roads to go and get bread and wine. That's great. Not allowed to not do that. That should say like, I'm a dumb ass, but you can still ride it. It's just like a glorified bird scooter.

Right. I feel like you like little weird vehicles uh yeah i do i have a i have a vespa uh i have a k truck yeah yeah which are getting massively popular now oh yeah you you think you brought him brought the popularity i wouldn't credit myself that much it's good to be right i think i think it's gotten popular because i think there's just a general pushback to big truck bigger truck bigger truck ram week rant ram truck it makes your truck mad i get so mad on the road i'm like this truck should not be this big you can't fit in the lanes and i think in the parking lots when you see them park like assholes and it's like also most of the time they're like

squeaky clean ford f-350s that aren't even being used for construction. Yeah. And, you know, you see like, hey, the real work vehicles are like, you know, smaller Toyota trucks or whatever. Yeah. And like the truck beds of K trucks are oftentimes as big and fit as much. Right. You know, with less torque and less whatever.

I guess if you're moving steel, that's fine. The K trucks are like the little trucks you see in Japan, right? Yeah. K is just like for small cars cars so there's k cars for small cars so a k truck is like a small truck uh and yeah i see them all the time now they're very popular because you can't use them depends on what you get but oftentimes you can't use them on the road i was gonna ask you imported one yeah yeah uh is the steering wheel on the right side of the yeah okay steering wheels on the right side of the... Yeah.

Okay. Steering wheel's on the right. The blinker and the windshield wipers are flipped. Always fucks me up. Yeah. I haven't ridden it much this summer because the AC's kind of bunk on it. Also, I get stopped so much in that car. Really?

So, it's like what I imagine it's like to own a supercar because on the like red light someone will roll down the window right and they'll be like hey hell of a car huh what's the gas mileage you know and it's like i got like this list of like gas mileage how much does it cost is that from japan right that i have to go through well your feet are sticking out the bottom like a flintstone car's how you power it yeah it's it's actually a free i have to be able to get wine yeah um this is how i eat all this bread and it's doxxed like exactly what it looks like yeah where it is so i i worry that you know it's too recognizable because i sent i sent everyone on twitter.com to find it after it got stolen. Yeah, that was wild.

That was a fun saga, but also made it maybe one of the most recognizable cars. Yeah. You put everybody on watch. Yeah. Yeah. I guess it benefits you if it is becoming popular. Yes. You at least have some false targets.

Yeah, I need more people to have K-trucks to hide them. Right, right. So it can be street legal if you get one of the older ones like mine. Because there's laws for antiques. Just general citizens. It can or can't be. Can. Oh,

okay. The newer ones I don't think can be road legal, like street legal. I see. In certain States, California won't let you, Arizona will, Texas probably will,

but, they just go cause. Yeah. Uh, 27 years or older. I think any car can be, um, so you,

you got like a model T on the highway? Model T, I think so. Yeah. If you're able to get it moving at highway speeds, at least. You know, I didn't realize, I didn't know that Henry Ford was like a Nazi sympathizer. He was? Oh, he was an empath. I learned this during my...

He couldn't help it. Yeah, he was a neurodivergent minor. He was anti-Semitic for sure, right? Yeah, he had contacts with Hitler. Really? Yeah, or at least according to the video essays I was watching during Op and Hummer Day. Sure, yeah. Who's this Hitler?

What's all this about? It was like he was in contact with Hitler until the war broke out. And then he was America? He couldn't... He was afraid of being seen as a spy or something like that. And that might not even be true, but it's something I saw on YouTube and I didn't fact check it. Probably lost a lot of fake homies when he started the war, Hitler. Yeah, Hitler's like, yo, where my homies at?

I keep my circles small. And it's like, well. Call me Fortnite. To jump back to that previous topic, you have like come out and said like 10 years and i'm done or i can't remember the time scale but like you would fit you would quit streaming but does that is that all content or is that like you move into um maintenance mode and start the bakery uh yeah i think it was originally five years when i first started which was 2017 yeah so that we've passed right 20 23 the lord of our savior uh and so i extended it because initially i just wanted to do it for that amount of time then i was

like oh it's enough time i can do something else after uh but i have too much responsibility to leave because i have like a company with 18 employees and so if i leave they all lose their job yeah it's not like a traditional job where you can just swap out the CEO. Right. Unless someone were to make YouTube videos on my channel instead. Yeah. So I'm trying to make it through Off Brand, another company I started. Yeah.

Sustainable enough by doing content with other creators and making events that aren't exclusive to me uh make that company big enough that everyone who works for me can like transition to that company and then they will have a job if i fall off or if i quit or whatever yeah do you want to get out or is it just like you want a future proof uh i think i don't i'm very short-term thinker like i have goals for like a year or maybe two in the future. So my goal is to be able to stop. Yeah. My goal is not to stop inherently,

but like I could not stop right now without sacrificing too many people's jobs. Yeah. And that responsibility is too high to, to like make that selfish, selfish decision. Yeah. So it's like,

what I have to do is make offering big enough. Yeah. And so that's like, that's my thought. You want the decision to not be selfish or to not have an obligation. Just to be impacting me, not impacting other people's livelihood.

Yeah, does that weigh on you at all? Well, it pushes me. Yeah, it pushes you. Cause I'm like, cause there's, you know, coming from a, not devil's advocate, but coming from another angle, it's like totally okay to want to stop. If you didn't want to do this anymore and it was mentally taxing, it doesn't sound like it is. But if someone else were in the situation and were like, I don't want to keep doing this.

It hurts me too much to keep doing this. No one would fault them for stopping even if it meant you know people losing their jobs because ultimately like you can't you can only run yourself so raw yeah i think you could probably like salvage it based off like hey this is impacting me too harshly but like i had made a decision to scale up my team to that point so that i have a responsibility because that was my choice i did not have to do that yeah most youtubers are one two men team or yeah you know they have a couple contracted editors for sure um i didn't want to do that and so i i think i bear that responsibility yeah so like like i probably could salvage it i probably could stop and they would understand yeah but i don't think

it's fair it sounds also it's like a version of the building out lifestyles and income for the community as a goal that you were describing yeah yeah i think i would like um when's this podcast air soon right friday probably oh friday yeah i'll tell you off pod my bigger idea sure but that is part of it yeah um and so i think it has to scale up to that point do you feel any and you you shouldn't feel obliged to because this was not by any means a choice but you have a very broad audience. I don't know your demographic, but there's young enough people that watch you to be heavily influenced by like your worldview or not necessarily political, just ideological, emotionally, like what you'll express, words you will or won't say, things like that. Well, I think I'm very honest about my points of expertise. I think I know a lot about streaming and YouTube uh and i know a lot about esports and that's like my main areas of expertise

and and i try to be very candid if i'm talking about something that is outside of my area of expertise and and i don't want to come off as an authority on anything because like i try to be you know uh politically knowledgeable like i try to know what the fuck's going on in America, in the world, in California, in Florida, whatever. Yeah. But like at a surface level. Sure. And so to then come out and be like, dude, like this just, this is the issue right now with California. We need to do this.

Yeah. I don't fucking know. Right. There's a lot of value and power in acknowledging shit you don't know yes makes you seem less alien to people yeah and people are very quick to make definitive statements on things they have a surface level understanding of and they they often have the highest confidence yeah uh and and then experts will have way less confidence yeah and also way way smaller than a megaphone. Yeah. Like for example, some people may make statements about their gut biome and really not know

what the hell it's talking about. This is a perfect example. Literally while I was talking about God foods, I was like, understand I'm only good at e-sports and streaming, but I still have like firm beliefs. Yeah, sure.

And everyone feels things strongly. It's just understanding the filter or having the filter. Yes. It's a mask. It's a lot of Zugs Wong is is all food is bad right you can't eat anything oh yeah it's a comic of you with food and it's like zugs wong that is like a new york times very sophisticated joke but it's not funny so they have to write what everything is that's the economy it's the dog um but i think i do a bit of that on mogul

mail more than my main channel because i understand my main channel is more so like hey you are watching this on a lunch break or yeah you know after school or whatever it is uh i don't need to like inundate you with with what i believe yeah and then mogul mail is like you've clicked this because you want my opinion on the thing i'm talking about. Right. You have signed up for this. It's okay for me to give my opinion. So I try to do a balance. Because if it's like, hey guys, I'm going to do like a tier list stream. And then in it, I'm going to tell you my political beliefs.

That's a little bit of a bait and switch. Right, right. And it's like, I totally know what you mean. Like you're not trying to bait. Any creator can share their opinion at any time, but, uh, you're,

it sounds like you're more a purist about like, I want this to be what it is and nothing more. Um, you have an outlet for those two wolves, right? Yeah. Yeah. And I think I,

like I've gotten pretty, uh, like honest about what I think about on, on mogul mail. Like I talked a lot about when threads came out cause I made a video about it. Like just general issues I see with like social media as a whole. And like this, this, you know, way we trick ourselves into consuming it because it's beneficial and we're learning about stuff around the world. But it's like, Hey, what is the real value of knowing what is happening in this area of the

world? When like, we are only able to control something local around. I mean, and this has been, there's been discourse about this since, you know, 24 hour news cycles.

Yeah. Because there's so much alarmist like stuff about things that you can't do anything about. And it just creates the sense of distrust and fear that something's going wrong all the time. And there's nothing you can do about it. No agency. Very difficult to have a take on a sensation. You need like something tangible to say yes or no to.

That's why every take you see is contrarian. Because you can't have a take of, yeah, I am afraid all the time. Yeah. Actually, if you can believe it. But I don't have anything to say about it. It's actually because of the theory. I've been reading theory? Yeah.

I've actually been reading a ton of medium articles so I can pretend I'm theory. I've been reading the headlines of medium articles. Well, Ludd, I think this is about the time we land this sad boys plane for the main plane episode. I wanted to rhyme, but I didn't. Sure. Go ahead.

Hard landing? Actually, hard landing. Please put on your seatbelt. Actually, a rock hard landing on the nose of the plane. We will be jumping right over to our Patreon exclusive podcast, Sad Boys on patreon.com sad boys ludwig thank you so much for joining us today um is there anything you want to leave the audience with uh yes um word of advice if you um don't buy starbucks you will you will become a millionaire right it's a latte problem yeah everybody issue. That's the issue.

Millennials aren't buying diamonds. Not a finance expert. If we just solve it, we'll all be rich. Right. We have to stop Starbucks. They're keeping us all down. All right.

We end every episode of Sad Boys with a particular phrase. We love you. We're sorry. Boom. Are you on a visa or where are you from? I'm from New Hampshire.

Oh, okay. Oh, you're on a visa. They give us a visa. Yeah. Oh, okay. You're from New England. They. They give us a visa. Yeah. Okay. You're from New England. They consider it a different country. Yeah, that makes sense.

You're like not quite in the union. Well, you have to prove that you're not too close to Boston because otherwise you say too many slurs to go to California. Yeah. You're Irish. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Moving girl, moving girl How she delicate, that future girl Future girl, yeah we on now Take my money, go away

All you wanted Girl too rich for me