Sardonicast - Sardonicast 111: The Northman, Shark Tale (Feat. Cam)

Episode Date: May 2, 2022

Support the Show for $2 a month and receive all future episodes early at https://sardonicast.com and https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast. Buy Sardonicast T-Shirts, and other merchandise at https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast. Merch: https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast Website: https://sardonicast.com Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/sardonicast Twitter: https://twitter.com/sardonicast Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sardonicast Ralph's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/ralphthemoviemaker Alex's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/IHEOfficial Adam's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/YourMovieSucksDOTorg Alex's Twitter: https://twitter.com/IHE_OFFICIAL Ralph's Twitter: https://twitter.com/ralphsepe Adam's Twitter: https://twitter.com/2gay2lift Adam's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/YMS Ralph's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/ralphthemoviemaker Intro music by: https://www.youtube.com/user/anUnkindnessvideo Fan art: https://old.reddit.com/r/Sardonicast/comments/tkgag3/this_is_a_fanart_that_i_made_for_the_boys_i_just/ https://old.reddit.com/r/Sardonicast/comments/tnvj0v/found_an_old_vhs_in_my_family_home_titled_speed/ https://old.reddit.com/r/Sardonicast/comments/tjm51n/no_movies/

Three, two, one. Hey, bus, big butts, ha ha, oi-ve. That was a, that was a quote. Just I searched up shark tail quotes because I forgot to do an intro. I wasn't going to spend the whole time trying to find a good one, so I just went with that one. Hello, I'm Adam from your movie. Oh, but there's so many.

I know, yeah. Well, I scrolled down quite a lot. I don't know if they just put the whole script here or what happened, but. I was going to say curse you shark slayer. I don't know. Anyway, hello. Does it start out again? Curse you, shark slayer?

I'm Ralph. Cepi. Yeah, I'm Alex from the number one DreamWorks fan site. And there's still someone else to introduce here. I feel like you should be it, Ralph, though. I have a guest. It's a friend of mine. His name's Cam, but yeah, you can introduce yourself.

Hi, hi, Kim. Hello. Hey, everybody. I'm Cam. Hi, how are you? How are you doing? Thanks. Hello, Adam, Alex, and Ralph.

Thank you all for having me. Thank you. Yeah, it's our pleasure. Yeah. Tell us about yourself. Yeah. We know each other a while. We do.

Yeah. So, my name's Cam. I like movies. I think it's obvious. Uh-huh. And Ralph and I are good friends. We met at Emerson College, which is a film school in downtown Boston. We met there, our freshman year in 2016.

what we do, I don't know if they still do this, but we met on a, they call it the 48-hour film festival where students come together. They have to make little short films. I don't think they do. I don't think they do it anymore. Yeah, they might not. Because of COVID are too stressful or what? Yeah, maybe COVID. Yeah, both too.

Honestly, it is stressful, yeah. Yeah, they said it was stressful, but it's fun too. And so we made, the other two guys in the group, like, kind of bowed out. But we made a movie about a bread monster because, you know, there's like certain criteria. you have to follow. You need like a prop. You need to say a certain word. Yeah, we need to make a B movie. Yeah. So we didn't win anything. But yeah, we did well and that's how we met. We got like paired together. Oh, that's dope. Yeah. Just like by coincidence. Yeah. And the other two guys are like fuck this. So. Yeah, that's funny. And then like the year after, I didn't do it the year after because I was at a wedding. But our roommates did it. And they did well. They did like a Wes Anderson themed one. That was their prompt, I guess. And then the year after, Cam, you didn't work on it, but then we made sauce, which I made with them.

And sauce is, you know, that's a movie I directed. It's good. People like that one, I mean. So, yeah, and you also do work, right? You worked for Boston casting for a while. I did, yeah. And some of the films you worked on also. Sure, so Boston casting is a casting company, it hires extras.

In case people don't know, say, like, if there's a movie scene set in the shopping wall, you know, we need, like, 50 people. people in the background. So hi everybody, get the list together. Tell them to know they have to be there at 8.30 on Tuesday morning, all that stuff. We're at a park. And so the projects I worked on there come out in December were spirited with Will Ferrell and Ryan Reynolds.

It's Christmas movie. Okay. Yeah, which I haven't. I'm going to definitely. I wasn't aware of, actually. Yeah, yeah. It's got big stories. Yeah, Octavia Spencer.

And also Whitney Houston biopic called. I Want to Dance with Somebody, which I think they just had a poster for today. Yeah. And you guys, they've done some good stuff. You guys have covered a few projects they worked on like Knives Out and Sound of Metal, some good ones. And Coda, which they worked on this one best picture. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. They did Cota. Yeah. They did, they do like some location stuff for a free guy in Boston. Because some of free guy. Yeah, free guy. Yeah, because there's some scenes of Free Guy that are filmed in Boston. The presentation is very important in that film.

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. It was just like a city. You know, they just needed like cityscape for the video game world or whatever. Could have been Vancouver. Yeah, I just thought that was funny. Yeah, so cool, cool. I've got a question.

That's a good portfolio. Sure. Just so we know who we're dealing with. What's your favorite and least favorite movies? Oh. If you have one. Yeah. You can give some five stars, yeah, that you think.

You guys have covered quite a few. my favorites. Like, I love the Godfather movies. I just like, you know, I like the scope of, you know, how like, you know, it's kind of like a big epic, but they're very like watchable. Like, you can kind of like revisit them any time. I love, you know, the writing and the acting. And, uh, yeah, I love, you know, like, Great is a Lost Doc and Empire Strikes Back. Stuff, like, you know, like a lot of like big, like, we're in agreement a lot, Cam, in terms of like movies, like, almost famous. That's one. Yeah. We both really liked that one. Yeah. There's a few. Yeah. The Godfather ones are.

great, yeah. Yeah, Shawshank. Yeah, Shawshank, yeah. What about some of the worst? Aside from Shark Tale. Yeah, we'll get some of the skin. There's some bad ones. A lot of the really bad ones, Ralph and I have watched together.

Like, we love watching Gaudi. Godd has watched a lot in college. We watched that a lot. It's not even like my least favorite. It's just like a funded dog. I showed that movie to everyone I knew. Did you watch Going Overboard with Ralph or no? I did not.

He started at it. And then I'm like, what the fuck is this? We didn't finish it. Yeah, you lucked out then. That one's not, that one's not a fun, bad movie. Yeah, that was a miserable one. Legitimate torture. Supergo, though, right?

Yeah, it was definitely not a sign of the great actor that Adam Sandler would become. It was an auspicious beginning. And we also, we mentioned the nostalgia critic, are you familiar with? He actually made some movies, you know, he basically didn't retreat as actors. very well and they made like three hour movies and they're awful. Oh yeah. Well, I watched those for you. Of course. Only the finest keynote.

Those don't even count. Those don't even count. It's like movies barely. I mean... Yeah, very barely. By the broadest definition of a movie. They're longer than Lord of the Rings. Have I watched any Steven Seagall with you? Lord of the Rings. Steven Seven Seagal, Lord of the Rings? I heard someone say Lord of the Rings. Sorry.

It was like... Oh, I love those movies. There's not... I'm trying to think of some other least favorite. I'm not a big fan of the second Transformers. That's not one of my favorites. Yeah, that one's pretty notoriously bad, although I haven't watched the ones. That was the right to strike one, wasn't it? Yeah, that was when I was like actually angry, and then I just never watched the rest of them.

No, no. No, it's not worth. And Adam, I like your review. Ralph and I watched Megan's Missing. That's a half star. Oh, God. You watch the actual film? Yeah.

Yeah, we always watch. watched the whole thing. Yeah. It's so weird. It's like the fucking director. Like, I don't know. Michael Goy.

The director's an oddball. He's a real character. There was all, there was only like a tiny amount of like interview footage of him, but like, even just that small amount. I was like, this is, um,

this is really something here. Unique. Sure. Kind of a strange ego that doesn't match the product of, that he made, you know? Very bizarre. RIP Megan.

Yeah. Oh, Yeah, it's crazy. That film got like big on TikTok, like, in the past year. So, like, you thought it was dead in the water and then all of a sudden. That's the thing now. Movies just go viral on TikTok. Yeah. It gets this weird resurgence of Zoomers going, like, is this movie actually real?

Did you know that this is a real thing that's happened and it was a real footage? Just found the scariest movie yet. Yeah. That's so funny. And it sucks because, like, a lot, there were some people flocking to my review from it. but not nearly enough because like I don't know my review for it is like kind of uh what's the word like um shadow band it's like it's difficult to find if you just search it even if you include like all the keywords like yMS make it is missing you have to scroll down so far to find it

and it's because it's age restricted and demonetized and so uh oh yeah like a bunch of my top videos unfortunately but oops um one bad one we've seen in like class for some reason It was Bride Wars. Remember that? Oh, yeah. Yeah, we were discussing the theme. With Bride Wars at school. Yeah. It's kind of a sub-teacher.

Like, the teacher or other teacher, professor. Replacement, yeah. It was our replacement, yeah. He was out for, like, the whole semester. Yeah, the second half, right. Yeah, like the second half of the semester. So we got a new teacher and showed us Bride Wars. I'm like, oh, okay, it's kind of a change of pace from, like,

what we were watching before but that's kind of funny I never actually watched it you've never see Bride Wars no yeah I almost like I'm confused with that other movie that what was it the one that kick started Melissa McCarthy's career oh bride Brides maze that's that one's funny yeah that's I saw that which is much better I think I mean but yeah I'm looking at Bride Wars right now I didn't know this movie existed uh-huh and speaking of Brides's maze I never saw it but I was I was an extra and the Ghostbusters reboot, the Paul Feet. I was wondering if you were to mention that, yeah. Did you get screen time?

Did you find yourself? Ralph, you know, made the review, so he was looking for me, but he couldn't find me. That tried it also in Boston. No, I didn't see you. Yeah. You know, I was looking for you. It's like a scene toward the end. I was an extra in the Andrew Dominic film, the assassination of Jesse James by the coward

Robert Ford, but there was so much in that film that was cut, and I'm for sure not in it. But it's fine. I was like 13 That's kind of cool So it would Yeah I don't know I was a I was A child holding a newspaper basically

Yeah Wow It's a fun one It was a cool experience though Yeah yeah yeah yeah Yeah it's definitely fun to do at least one You know if you'd never been on a film set before it's cool To be heard around like cattle

Yeah Yeah sort of yeah And just try not to get in anyone's way Fuck Yeah there was a there was like a really there was like some some weird kid there

who was like I don't know what was wrong with him or like how he was raised but he was like he was mad that I was like sitting at the spot on the train next to him where the camera would see me but not him he's like yo the director told me that he wants me to switch places with you

I'm like no he didn't shut up he was just like lying to me it was like the weirdest thing he was like close to buy he was like 12 or something and I was like so mad that this kid would exist. I'm like, you've... How did you find out about it if you're only 13? There was an ad in the newspaper, I think.

Because it was filmed in Edmonton at Fort Edmonton Park, which is like this place that, you know, they... What is this thing even called? It's like, you know, almost like one of those, like, Renaissance fairs, but it's like... It's kind of like heritage of, like, early Canada, sort of thing, settlers and blah, blah, blah, blah. So I keep all this old architecture and every once in a while a movie decides to film there because it's all the infrastructure is already set up.

It's like, oh, okay. So Ginger Snaps 3, the prequel was filmed there. And yeah, this assassination of Jesse James. And so, yeah, not many movies get filmed at Edmonton. So when it happens, it becomes like a little bit of a, you know, newspaper thing. And so I got some head shots. I sent in a thing and then took the day off school when I was 13. it was a cool experience.

That's cool. Yeah, yeah. That is fun. And that is a common thing, Adam, you know, people fighting for the spotlight when they're extras, you know, everybody wants something on camera. So you're an extra. I remember seeing an ad for being extra for that movie, doubt when I was like a kid. I do remember that.

So, yeah, those are common. Like, yeah, I didn't end up going. Maybe I should have been in doubt. It was a pretty good movie. You work with like a casting agency for extras. Yeah. So is there, have you noticed any, like, big difference or discrepancy in terms of, like, obviously, um, higher budget versus lower budget films? Is it just like less people to have to do paperwork for?

Is it just like the volume of people or is there like an entirely, is there like a different process that people might not be familiar with? I guess in terms of like, um, if it's like a bigger budget, like, just like the scope of it, you know, more like crowd. Like the one in Houston one had like a lot of big crowd scenes. You know, some nights we need like, you know, 300, 400 people. And, um, wow. Independent stuff. Yeah. Independent stuff is more.

How recent was that? That the shot, like, in the winter. Oh, come out about soon. Still using like real people in like 300, 400. Yeah, wow. I'd assume like a lot of crowd shots would just be CG nowadays. Yeah, right. Yeah.

For like a big movie. It's kind of like a combination. Yeah. I think what they do, they might have like, you know, certain people on the four ground and then like fill in the rest with CGA. Yeah. Yeah, sure. But still like 400 more people in the movie. Yeah. That's crazy. That might be a crowd of

like thousands of people in the movie though. Yeah, that's the kind of duplication. Yeah, they're just the best. Copypays. Right? Yeah. Uh-huh. You start seeing twins if you zoom in far enough. Well, if you have more people, it's harder. Yeah. To see. Yeah. Yeah, like certain movies

if it's like a smaller budget, you might see like the same extras more than once. True. I'm sure like you can do. point that out. Good movies are like good low budget. Like they hide it really well. Yeah, it was kind of interesting. Just like one of the things for the assassination of Jesse James,

the assistant director basically for people walking in the background of a shot, like I guess presumably we would have been out of focus anyway. We were just like we would walk from one end of the frame to the next end of the frame. And then one of the assistant directors would be like, okay, now go back and like give us a slightly different direction or like a different prop or like a different hat. So to create the illusion that there's like far many more people than there actually are in the background. And again, this shot never got used. There's a lot of like deleted footage for this film.

But I found that pretty interesting. It was so funny. I was like I have this weird kind of like cringe memory of just being like 13. And I like the assistant director was like waiting for the proper sunlight. There were like some clouds we need to do the clouds to move out of the way or whatever. And I remember just like say. I was right next to him, but ready for my cue. I was like, oh, yeah, I made some, I made some movies with my friends, and I remember how

the sunlight was, like, I was like trying to relate and just being like, oh, yeah, I hate when the sunlight gets it, you know, it's not consistent. He's like, yeah, you kind of just, like, looked at me, like, giving me this look, like, shut up, kid, you don't, you have no idea what this is like, or maybe I just, like, overinterpreted it, but it was just one of those, like, weird cringe memories of, like, he didn't like me. Yeah, the ones that stick. Yeah.

Yeah, I think it's just long hours, people get crabby. And also, like, you know, when you work on sets, you realize just how much goes into, like, what might be like 10 seconds of actual screen time, you know, like, you know, certain, like full, you know, 12, you know, could be 14 hour days. And then it's like, yeah, it's like one scene in the movie. Yeah, everyone's stressed behind schedule, trying to hit deadlines up against the budget. It's like a horrifying environment. And that's why 48 hour film festival is. are so cool is because they prepare you for that to work under like intense pressure. I think that that's like a very valuable skill to learn if you're like interested in filmmaking. That's why those

like constrained time limit concepts are so good to teach filmmakers. Oh yeah. You know, you should learn how to work with a little instead of a line. You're very restricted. Yeah. You're to work under pressure. How to edit under a crunch. You're restricted in time and also the kind of movie, the kind of movie you can make. Yeah, you can't make the movie you've always wanted to make. You've got to make a certain kind of genre or something. I think they all kind of do that. You have to pick a genre or they pick the genre

for you also. Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, I love those kind of festivals. And then, you know, those limitations you guys meant, that could also be conducive to creativity because if you're limited, you know, you can say that in like great movies too, like with low budgets, you know, if you can only show so much, you know, like with Jaws. Yeah.

Oh, yeah, Jaws is a good one. But like Whiplash, they made that like 18 days, right? And that movie was a really low budget. Yeah. It looks awesome. Yeah. Jaws, yeah, that's one too. That's a classic. And it was fun. One more thing about the 40-hour film festival. Ralph and I, it was the first time we had met when we were walking back to our dormitories. Ralph's like, I'm making this movie called Lover and I need this character. I like the way you talk, so I think you can play it. And I said, okay. And then we, yeah, I was in this movie.

Nice. Yeah, that's basically it. And the rest is history. Yeah, the rest is history, right? Speaking of is history, what's up with Netflix cucking themselves so bad? Yeah, get some news. What are they doing? Yeah, did you hear about this? Yeah, it's about time.

Is everybody informed? So yeah, what the fuck's going on? Their stock, like, tanks. Yeah, not that I care. In, like, a day, it was like, oh, the public perception of Netflix and, like, their viability of a company is just, like, desivated a day. Like, they're still probably going to be fine, but, like, shareholders are, like, freaking out. Netflix is all of a sudden

doing this whole like, well, it looks like we have to stop people from sharing passwords to make up for this lost revenue. I'm like, this isn't going to be good. Now they're saying like they're actually implementing commercials now, like, what? So did anything happen specifically? It was a response to them losing subscribers

for the first time. Yeah. They've never lost or reported losing subscribers and this is the first time. So, yeah. It was a negative. They're going to add commercials now. Really? Yeah, I was complaining about this on one of the competitors to Netflix called Now TV. Like, it was so bad and it had all these different tiers for, like, ads and all this.

And I was just thinking, I'm never, I only got it to watch Succession and then just dropped it as quick as possible. If Netflix's going down that path, forget about it. Like, yeah. Did they just think they could be kings forever? Yeah, it's so funny. And just like, keep doing the same business model, keep, like, producing two seasons of a show that's potentially interesting, then dropping it and just filling up the catalog with a bunch of, like,

reality TV stuff that's easy to make. and like murder like documentaries. Their content got really... They can't compete. You have to also think of this from like a realistic, like actual marketing perspective of like, where is the cap for growth and streaming services anyway? So it's like this is the first quarter where they've actually lost subscribers. There's a bunch of other competitors in the market.

People can only afford so many streaming services, right? Where is that cap anyway? You can't like, I know companies love to think that there is never a limit to how much growth there is. And especially in the United States, like they have a contractual legal obligation to put their shareholders' interests above everything else, even if it's only in the short term, right? And so it's like, okay, well, we got to do something to make up for the shareholders. It's like, ah, like, you can't, I don't know, the idea of this like constant never-ending growth is like, it seems unrealistic. Yeah. They've reached saturation point with this style of business, too.

Yeah. They can't compete with something like Disney Plus. They just let it exist in the background, building momentum. And the difference between it, like, a Disney and a Netflix, is Disney has that back catalog of IP. What does Netflix have? I guess it's got, like, stranger things in the old show, but there's nothing that rivals that intellectual property.

Yeah. They can't maintain it, especially with them dropping shows. Same with fucking HBO now. It's like they have all... Yeah, HBO. I was going to say that... Yeah, HBO Max. Yeah, the content they makes great.

And it's all like Batman. And, like, yeah, it's fucking awesome content. I don't know. Netflix can't really compete with that, yeah. They pulled all the Marvel stuff off Netflix and put it on Disney Plus. Yeah. That was crazy. We might still have a bit of it in Canada.

The contracts are different per country. I think it expires soon. Oh, interesting. Yeah. Yeah, probably well. Their other response, of course, was to gut their future animated projects, because, of course, that's the first head to roll. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I was reading apparently their numbers that they expect for their animated shows. So compared to like the boss baby dream work show that's on there. And if it doesn't match, then, you know, it hits the chopping block. Weird animation is too risky. It's not going to get enough eyes unless it's a DreamWorks boss baby picture. It's so depressing.

Especially, I was thinking about it this morning when I started watching your part one Lion King review of all those clips talking about like just the state of animation and what the average person thinks about animation. It's just so sad. So a bunch of like promising projects, 2D ones coming from Netflix, they've been kind of pushing animation in a good way for the last few years. Like I know Arcane isn't 2D, but that was like a, that went into more of an adult market. It seemed like that was really popular. Yeah, we still got a new season of Love Death and Robots coming out, but I wonder what the fuck's going to have. That seems already made.

But I don't know what they do. I just feel like they've really been lacking the content. Here's the real kicker on top of this. According to the Wall Street Journal report, Netflix apparently spent $30 million on each episode of the show's upcoming fourth season of Stranger Things. 30 million. Which is double what HBO paid for each episode

of the final season of Game of Thrones. 30 million per episode for the new season of Stranger Things, according to the Wall Street Journal. When was the third season? Like 2019? It's been a couple years. Oh, I have no fucking idea. It's just funny how they're bleeding money. I don't know how much. I haven't even watched the new episodes of Stranger Things.

So I don't know how much one is supposed to cost from a perspective of like production value or if I would see the budget in it. But it's just, it seems crazy that it's double what Game of Thrones final season was in terms of a budget, right? That seems crazy, right? Just on that alone. It seems much. smaller scale, but I guess they have the CGI. I don't know if it's like act as salaries.

Yeah, that seems like an astronomical amount. Definitely. What'd they have this year even? Like they had Squid Game. Squid Game, yeah. Yeah, you'd think that would be like a really big enough hit that it would gain subscribers. Squid game was everywhere.

But is there season two of Squid Game? Yeah. Maybe. Maybe the future. A lot of people are turning this into like a conversation about the quality of Netflix's content. I think it's more of a conversation about the viability of just growth in streaming platforms. We might just be reaching that point where like Netflix as the biggest...

But you don't think the content on there is like kind of crappy. I mean, most of it is, yeah. Like a lot of it. Yeah, yeah. Most of it is. But you also have to remember, like, just because the content's crappy doesn't mean people aren't watching it. Yeah, that's true, too.

Like the fucking Adam Sandler movies, it's like people are watching those. Yeah, sure. Yeah. But I feel like people watch good stuff. People want to watch good stuff. And there's like a market for that. And there's also a market for like Adam Sandler kind of junk. I just feel like that they need to, you know, invest in like content and making good content

or at least content that people want to watch. Like that Irishman movie or marriage story, those movies are great. They should be making shit like that. I don't think they've stopped. Like Klaus. I think they've still got like good stuff on the horizon. I feel like it's been a while. And the thing is like even if they do, they have a lot more competition now, like you said.

Like, with HBO, like they have all those great movies too. like all these Oscar-winning movies and what have you HBO, Amazon, Hulu, they all have new shows like the Halo show, I don't know which one that is. That's Paramount. That's Paramount. That's Paramount. I have yet to start that, Alex, but I will.

Don't worry. You know, they all have, they all have these like Magnum Opus shows coming out, basically. And, you know, that's what I mean, the content. Like, you need something to compete with Halo. Otherwise, you're going to become, like, completely irrelevant. and like after stranger things what do they have like what's what's the next Netflix draw show aside from Squid Game maybe the other streaming services also weren't already on top like they have much more room for growth in terms of like what the

the full potential of the market is right so they wouldn't be reporting losses unless they're CNN Plus which it existed for like 20 days and then they just gave up but you know oh really oh yeah that one's a funny one yeah exactly yeah that was very recent but yeah HBO Max, Amazon even, maybe, you know, Apple TV or whatever, Apple TV Plus. Like, these are all going to be reporting growth because they haven't, they haven't come close to reaching, like, the potential of their market cap, if that's the word, their demographic. Yeah, they're still in a gathering phase where the monthly price is low. Yeah, whereas Netflix was already on top. Yeah, whereas Netflix is raising that price each month.

Yeah. Because, yeah, they can't squeeze the growth out of just collecting. Yeah. as much as I love their UI, it's like, the content's not, you know, that's what's most important to me. And in terms of like what content exists on each platform, I've said this before, HBO Max is like easily the most interesting one for me. They've trapped themselves because while they're kind of relying on this squid game kind of virality where they just hope it just takes off and gets memed and just sits in pop culture everywhere,

but something like Squid Game, it wasn't the writer like it took in, 10 years to get it done. He's been work tinkering on this story for years and years. It doesn't seem like the type of thing they can really serialize that easily because you kind of need that for these like leading keeping people subscribed shows like a Mandalorian type shit, you know, where it's like a never ending story that's going to keep people around. Like stranger things. It's been the same season for four seasons basically. There's like the same thing. There's not much to it. That's funny. And these are like the leading shows like that meanwhile like they have like a really diverse like interesting. universe set up with like the the dark crystal they invested a bunch of money into that all this world building all this time drop it after one season what do you think it like we mentioned breaking bad that took multiple seasons to get that ball rolling you got to invest like grand level you can't expect everything to just take off like it's so frustrating to me that side of it all these are potential stories that were dropped definitely how do you feel about this Cameron uh it's just i think it's inevitable. Like you guys said, like you can only

get bigger and bigger for so long. I mean, Netflix was like the only game in town, I think for a while with the streaming. I mean, I don't even know when that, I remember even before they had like House of Cards, you could watch movies on there. But now there's so many, like you guys mentioned, Disney Plus and HBO Max. Like, I don't even know all of

them. There's, there's so many factors now. Paramount Plus. It's just such a different landscape. Like, all these things are talking about, affected. They licensed a lot of content from other studios and it was easier for them to retain the rights before other companies had streaming services of their own. Yeah, exactly.

I find it absolutely insane that, like, Netflix has a company. They exist because they took advantage of this previously existing landscape of media company as being like, we don't have to adapt and change. We can just do the same thing forever. And it doesn't matter because we're on top forever. And it seems like Netflix is now falling, into that same trap of just...

Yeah. Yeah, like, I don't know if it's because they're like a publicly traded company. Maybe that's just an inevitable part of that or like how that works. Too big for its bridges. It's a mindset. Maybe they're just getting old, whoever's, you know, managing it. Fucking boomer brain. Like, I have no idea what's going on.

But I find it like kind of ironic at that sense. It's just like, wow, you're really... You're really allowing this to happen to you. Did you know that Blockbuster could have bought Netflix? like Netflix wanted to sell to Blockbuster. They provided them with an offer in like the late 90s or like early 2000s maybe. No, probably the late 90s maybe even, yeah. I don't even remember what year,

but they were small enough that Blockbuster basically laughed it off. Like they could have bought them for like a million dollars or something like insanely cheap compared to like what their market value is today. Yeah, look he's laughing now. Yeah. They missed out on that one. It's like the producers that turned down the Beatles were lost out on that profit. Yeah, it's just like that It's like the assistant director

On the assassination of Jesse James Who didn't like the kid next to him That said, talked about the clouds Exactly I'll show you Yeah, you made sure your shot was cut out So much of Netflix's like original content Is such like junk

Like horror movies Like I can't stand that kind of shit Like Snyder movies It's fresh But I believe that it's fresh because people watch it though. I believe that it's just because they are the most subscribed service that it's trash because most people love trash.

But fucking, what was that called? Red Notice? People love that shit. Yeah, yeah, true. Was Army the Dead? Yeah. All sorts of these big streaming movies. That won the Oscar.

How can their stock be tanking now? Like, wasn't that, wasn't Red Notice the biggest movie of last year? Like, how is their stock tanking now? And like Squid Game, it's because they reported a loss of subscribers, but that doesn't mean that, like, they're still number one, right? So, I don't know. A lot of their stock, stocks are speculation, right? Like, the market reacts to the public perception of the company that may or may not be accurate in terms of, like, what potential they have in a market, so. Yeah, but this, like, perception, like, that's, that's, like, what we're

talking about. Yeah. It's not good now. Yeah. It's like people just realize. They're reflexively reacting to it. People just realized like all the pieces, yeah, all the pieces came together. Like, yeah, there's like a million other streaming services, like their content sucks. Like, there's all these problems, like, that we address and that we set. And it just like comes out. Yeah. Yeah, people just reacted to it now. Have you stopped paying for it yet?

That's the question. Because I haven't. I'm still, I'm still paying. I'm using my parents account. Yeah, I use my parents. So if they crack down, then, no, oops, I guess, maybe I'll just warm up some tortillas. He is. Right, that's why I still have it.

There's no reason to, like, not have it because, like, you know, they have a good thing on there every once in a while. It's way too expensive to justify for me watching, like, one series every, like, four months, maybe. Because I don't really watch a lot on Netflix. There's, like, a couple things. HBO I use all the time. Yeah, I pay for HBO Max, even though they're trying to make me not because I'm in a different

country, but I'm splitting the cost with somebody in the United States. Yeah. Yeah, same. I'd love to pay for it. for it. I'd love to have the option to pay for it. I'm using a VPN. Yeah. I'm going out of my way to pay for a service I actually use. So. And HBO Max has way more movies, more like classic criterion collection. Better show. Better catalog. Best of the best. An endless catalog. Less fucking junkie horror movies and like filler. Yeah. They have way more real movies. Adult swim. Fucking HBO original programming. All this stuff. They got the Snyder cut. Even better.

Exactly. Well, they have the new bad. Batman, which people want to see. Yeah, Batman. Nirvana Man. That's good. Easily accessible. Yeah. The Nirvana song.

Yeah. That's how it should be. I don't think it's still the case, but I think there was like an inherent bias towards Netflix. This because it was so easy, you know, it was on streaming. It's like, you know, if it's not on Netflix, I don't really care. But now, like, there's so many streaming services now, I don't think that's really the case. Yeah. With Disney Plus, you know, that Star Wars and Marvel, so much.

It was about convenience, so. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Well, we saw a movie in a theater called The Northman. It wasn't convenient to leave my house, but we did it anyway. So how is that for everybody? Oh, the Northwood. Pretty good.

Pretty good. The new Eggers joint? Yes. The new Eggos? My igos? Yes. Strangman. Um, it was, I thought it was great.

I love his movies. I thought it was great. This is good. This is what we want. This is what we want to be seeing. And we've just been complaining about the same IPs, like being reused and recycled. And here we have. Well, actually, in a way, it's like a story as old as time.

If we're talking about myths and, uh, Norse mythology, the, the original stories of the humanity. It's kind of writing a trend, I'd say, of like, um, it's like Vikings are kind of in. There's like the Vikings show. Oh? Is it a Assassin's Creed game that's like Viking thief? Like, I think people like Vikings or whatever. Yeah, people like the aesthetic, don't know. Yeah, I think that's like a big part of this film or like the Nordic mythology and the religion,

which I thought was all pretty well integrated into the story. I thought, like, I actually really enjoyed those parts of the film that were more trippy or, uh, what's the where I'm looking for? Like the religious stuff. They were like flights of fancy kind of. Yeah, yeah. It's a hero's quest, but with, you know, like certain. touches of, you know, Eggers, you know, filmography, like mysticism.

And it feels very grand. Yeah, the mysticism. It feels very like, oh, it's his destiny to defeat this character and get his revenge. Yeah. It feels like a very epic story in that way. And I do like how you see him his whole life. It's a story about it. You see him as a young boy, innocent, and then you see his whole life basically play

out in this film. And it's pretty, like, you know, an epic story in that way. Like, it's quite powerful. I feel like I got a lot of out of it in that way. I don't know if we said spoilers. We should. I mean, spoilers, everybody. Spoilers for the Northman.

Somebody left a comment on my Lion King review saying I should have said spoilers. I'm like, this is a two and a half hour breakdown. No, that's one way you can see. I don't know what you expect here. That's ridiculous. Yeah, it's been out for a couple years now. And it's funny. You mentioned there are some similarities between the Lion King and the Northman.

A kid gets portrayed by his own. Yeah, it is very Hamlet story. It's the Hamlet. Sorry, Kimba. It's a very Kimba type story. Yeah. It reminded me, like, you know, like, there were, like, biblical elements, like, later in the movie when Amleth is trying to, like, take down his uncle.

He kills certain men one by one. It kind of reminded me, like, the plagues coming down, like, in the Moses story, you know, how he's kind of systematically taken him down. Yeah, I was actually reminded of that during that same sequence, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's, to me, it reminded, it had elements. of like the Green Knight and the Revenant. I don't know if you agree.

Yeah. It felt like both. I like The Revenant a lot more. I'm just going to throw that out, but I still enjoyed this for sure. I was going to mention The Revenant, too. Yeah, very similar, the revenge story. Yeah. Some good character stuff in this film.

I really like the acting for the most part. Yeah. It's funny, Nicole Kimmel plays his mom in this film and big little lies, I think, I think the same of the show. They're like husband and wife. Oh, yeah. Alexander Scars Guard and Nicole Kimmel Kimmel. Yeah, yeah.

But, you know, I like when they took that character. It was a little, it was kind of unpredictable. Yeah, and I felt that way about, like, most of the characters. Like, I didn't really know where it was going necessarily. It's just a lot of moving pieces. And, you know, like the religion element, like the whole scene where he fights the Viking ghost or whatever and reclaims his sword. Like there's all this, um, the mysticism. made it a little more interesting for me.

I felt it was very well integrated into the movie. Classic Eggers. Yeah. But also just, it just works well as a revenge tale, like just surface level before you engage in any of the themes or the myth angle. It is just a solid revenge tale that does pull back the curtain at a certain point and explore the very concept of revenge. And how it's kind of fleeting and there's like a self-fulfilling circle that just leads

back to itself. And it's, I know it's like a controversial, like, game and story, but, like, I kept thinking about The Last of Us Part 2 and what he was trying to do with revenge. And I just felt like, I wish I could have contrasted to this movie at that time just to be like, yeah, these ideas are, they're solid, but it needs to be kind of framed in something like the North one to pull off that kind of story. And people who played that game and know the controversy or know what I'm talking about. But yeah, I think solid revenge tale.

And just this thing he's got going on where each movie is very unique and pace totally different on its own. But they're all very clearly Eggers and his style integrating the old mythology and just his style is so unique. And I think the escalation of it too, having like action scenes and the scale of the Northman compared to the bottle like one location, like isolation of the lighthouse. It's a good, well, I don't think it's as good as the lighthouse. It's a good, I think, progression for his career and where to take it, working with that bigger budget, the bigger cast of one and actors. I think people are enjoying it, too. It's one of these more kind of indie, well, it's not indie, but from egg is that kind of

production. It's a $70 million budget. But more the presentation of the story. Yeah, yeah, it does feel like kind of artful in a way. Nobody look up the budgets. I'm going to, we're going to do a guessing game here. So the which, what do you think the budget was? For the witch?

Oh, well, I know. Well, then, people who don't know. Oh, for the witch. Yeah. I'm going to guess a couple hundred thousand. I'll say, uh, two million. It was four million. I think it looks, I think it looks more, like more than four million, just baby, the cinematography alone.

I think it looks excellent. Yeah. The witch. Yeah. Anyway, uh, the lighthouse. Some of that might be marketing too. Like, um, yeah, a lighthouse. Yeah.

That one actually don't know. So I'll guess like, I don't know, 8 million. Yeah, between 5 and 10? 10 million. It's 11 million. Okay. The Northman. Yeah, this one I know.

70? Yeah, 70 sounds probably. It says 90 million on the Google search. Not really. Okay. Oh, wow. Okay, this is almost a $100 million movie, which is crazy. It feels like it in a way.

Because like... Yeah, that's why I like it more than... Not the lighthouse, but the witch. I just think it's like a much more epic film, like, in terms of that presentation. Like, it does feel grander scale. Like, he doesn't have to kind of restrain himself in any way in terms of his vision of, like, what the story is. It's like basically exactly what's in his head. That's the sense I got.

And it feels really cool, you know, like visually, I thought the movie was excellent. Yeah. It was pretty perfect. So much like location shooting. And the way they'd, like, shoot the action, like, keeping it on the character. The lighting's awesome. The mist of it and like the flames and a lot of natural

lighting too, sure. The violence was really brutal and well shot. Yeah. All that was excellent. The sound too and the music and you know, all those elements of the movie. Like it's a really technically well-made movie. Yeah. It had like a good crescendo, like a good kind of

climactic buildup with the music especially. I think the music got a lot better as it went along. Sure. There was a bit more subtle in the beginning. Yeah. I think my favorite scene was when he first confronts Nicole Kidman, and there's that reveal of how she, well, supposedly, like, called for the death of his father and, you know,

it's like tarnishing his idea of what his father is. Like, I really like that angle of the film. I think that brings a lot to it. Yeah, the movie escalates after that scene. That was a great scene. I thought she's great. It was just acting, you know? Right.

That's something that Robert Eggers is really great at, is making like really compelling scenes of just people talking. Like, I thought that that was better than any of the action, honestly. As much as I appreciate, like the gore and the, you know, the spectacle of things, like, Robert Eggers is very, very talented at like characters and dialogue and performance. And that shows throughout his film's catalogs. So, yeah. Yeah.

That's my favorite for sure. And you get really engrossed in the landscape. You know, he doesn't rely on green street. You know, especially like something like the lighthouse. You really feel the rain and the cold. This is the case for this one, too. Like, they're like an unhellish environment and you kind of get swept up in it. Because, you know, it's like, it seems like this is not a school.

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. For sure. I mean, all the characters were like really strong, I felt in all their performances. Anya Taylor Joy's character, I saw some criticism about her. I thought she was good in the film. I enjoyed her character just fine. What did people criticize?

Yeah. about it. She's not in the movie, like, they wanted her to be in the movie more, maybe? I thought she was in the movie just enough. It was just, like, perfect. Yeah, I thought that was balanced quite well, actually, outside of it. Just, like, the one part of his life that's, like, not total hell, basically. Yeah, that hope.

And, you know, I enjoyed the imagery of, like, the family tree and that how that ties in later later. Later into the film involving her. Yeah, and, yeah, that was super cool. And, like, yeah, that imagery is not something I expected, really. Yeah, that was one of my favorite sequences. Yeah, seeing like the Valkyries as well. That image was cool. And almost felt like kind of the fountain or like Aronofsky-esque.

Yeah, although I don't like the fountain. I don't really. It's okay. I like this better than the fountain. But I felt the influences. There's a lot of different things, the Shakespeare and Revenant, Revenge Tales, the Vikings. But it's all these things kind of, it felt very focused to me.

And it was always focused on that main character and his perspective. and you're like telling that story and yeah it's it's a long film but I enjoyed it like you didn't feel too long to me like I enjoyed being there and I enjoyed the spectacle of it the violence and like it feels kind of like um I don't know trash here's the word it's not trying to be like an art film like the lighthouse it's not it's not as subtle it's not as vague it's it's far more conventional and accessible movie than than like those movies are yeah for sure it feels like myth. It feels like a timeless story. But it still feels like an Eggers movie.

I was thinking of all the elements that come in a lot. Like his use of animals and like the paranormal stuff. And his dad is like the raven spirit or whatever. Like that felt like an Eggers thing. It felt like the seagulls or whatever in the lighthouse or in the witch. There's something similar to the crows. Yeah. And the goat.

Yeah. And like the animal violence or whatever in this movie too. And especially like the great. gross out humor too, like the fart jokes and the burpice and that's... Yeah. Is that one of your criticisms? I found that kind of weird in this movie, in the lighthouse. This is kind of weird in this movie.

Half comedy, right? You open up the movie with a fart, but it continues with that tone. It sets the tone. This film is like completely serious outside of like the fart. And it's just so weird that it's in there. Outside of like Willem Defoe's character, yeah, it's like completely bleak. I heard that there was studio interference with this film. I heard that this had to be like recut a few times.

Maybe some extra shots were added. Maybe some were cut out. And so I'm looking at the film with that in mind and thinking like, man, it's so weird that like out of all the things, if, you know, studio executive trying to make this like the most like appealing film ever or like universally appealing to like modern audiences. But it's still at the end of the day feels like a Robert Eggers art house film, like a weird movie that's not really going to appeal to a lot of people. and it's crazy that like the burp and fart part was kept in the movie when you could still cut that and have like the same scene and communicate the same ideas but it's crazy that like that stayed in the movie

even though there was supposedly studio interference it just felt like that was like an eggers trademark to me the farting is like an eggers trademark farting and like people acting like dogs for two movies in a row yeah I thought the one of the foe scene was funny though when he like slapped his um whatever hot dog whatever he's holding his oh that was great that was that was funny i recognized him immediately from his hot dog yeah well defa fe was good in the film

um he's not in a lot he's not in a lot his skull his skull pops up later on i love it yeah and it's so distinct too you can tell it's him yeah that was like a good yeah yeah a great prop and a great casting choice because it's like even though you don't see the character much people are familiar enough with, like, Willem Defoe that you can immediately tell what the character is, what is he see the prop? So, I like that a lot, yeah. Yeah. Now, immediately, I didn't even remember that scene, because there's just so many, like, there's so much stuff and characters in those movies. Yeah, look good scenes to choose from. And there's not, like, entirely focused on all of them. There are some striking visuals, for sure. Yeah. And even the villain, like,

I like how they develop him and they make you not sympathize with it. I mean, maybe empathize with him somewhat to a certain degree. Like, he, he's just kind of a farmer now, and he has a son, Like you care about his son Like son didn't do anything wrong just in his Just a few slaves And you have the revenge ultimately gets to him Yeah it's like yeah It's fucked up

Yeah I find it kind of weird Like I understand the purpose Artistically for like the end fight scene To be like fucking Star Wars episode three or whatever I was sick of that too But it is kind of weird that they were like In the like I don't know

I get it but it felt weird to me of just like okay kill the wife kill the daughter and then the guy's like carrying them away he's like I will meet you at the gates of hell and then it's like okay scene transition we're gonna we're gonna fight in the cool fire zone now it's like it's cool I like the background

yeah that's cool and they set it up a lot yeah you see the volcano the whole movie it was weirdly dark too I don't know if you felt that way like the it was just weirdly dark during that scene too you could barely tell the well it's a volcano I get that I like I love that scene I thought it was cool.

And like, I love the silhouettes. Like, all you can see was just their silhouette. Yeah. Yeah, I think they were fighting naked too. It's like a fucking crazy scene.

Yeah. I quite like how skilled it was. Yeah. It kind of works thematically too if it's, if it is this cycle of revenge and they're just kind of, the muddy imagery of them is fighting. Because at that point, like the story is kind of over.

Like, I consider the story kind of over. Yeah. Once he makes that decision on the boat to have back, where he's, he's confronted with heaven. basically he can escape but he decides to go back to hell and and end it all yeah yeah so it's a tragedy it's the hamlet hamlet apparently it's the story that inspired uh hamlet or the tragedy of hamlet

originally so it's like yeah that's cool history of the dane like story so yeah the more movies like this we get like you mentioned green knight and i was thinking about that movie too it's like a nice companion piece they're not linked in anyway but going back to these these ancient stories, I think that's a really, really fun way to explore history even, like through cinema. It's just a great,

creative way to do it, because it is core of storytelling myth and retelling the same stories and adding your own flirt to it and modernizing it. It's, I really like what he's doing with this style filmmaking. Yeah. Me too.

He, it's a really well-made film. He, with the, uh, the issues he was having with the studio, although there's not a lot of specifics to learn about it. He was interviewed saying that he probably won't work with this high of a budget again.

I'm fine with that because honestly, I haven't seen The Witch in a while. I probably prefer both of his other films to this one. I still liked this, but I don't know. Maybe I'm just like a little biased. I have like kind of a preference for, you know, medium budget or small. I don't know, if we're going to call him small budget or medium budget. films. But I guess what's really going to solidify this, even if he hadn't made those comments, just as of today, the numbers are out. Robert Eggers, the Northman bombs at box office.

Oh, really? I was about to ask, how's it doing? Making 12 million domestically over its opening weekend. It has to make about 200 million to break even, which probably is not going to happen. So, oops. That's wacky to me, that they're willing to drop that amount on a movie like this. Yeah. It's an expensive, beautiful movie and it's like definitely what I'm looking for, but that's not necessarily what general audiences are looking for. Yeah, exactly. I don't know what executive is going to look at this and be like, yep.

It's a beautifully made film. Yeah, like, it's pretty perfect in my mind technically. Like, that's definitely what I gravitate to. But they're expecting like superhero numbers from this or something. It's like, man, I don't know if you're reading the room quite well. And like, I guess other two movies, it has that very period, specific dialogue. It fits really well, but like, he loves the dialect. He does, yeah.

Might not be able to understand what people, the characters are saying is because it's so like, it's that vernacular. Yeah. I could understand it better than I could understand the lighthouse if I didn't have subtitles for that on the first time. Yeah, yeah, true. And the witch, I guess. The studio might have interfered with that too. Like, you better make it so people understand what they're saying. That was like the first, um, I met him very briefly after a screening of the lighthouse. in Toronto. And that was like basically just the one question I asked him.

I was like, are you going to, are you planning on making another film where you research like authentic dialect and just decide to like do it in that? He's like, yes, I love doing that. I'm like, oh, cool. So, yeah, he was a very nice and humble person from the small interaction I had. Everyone had a pretty good accent in the film too. I thought everyone did go with the accent. Oh, yeah.

Maybe Ethan Hawke. Really? I thought it was nice seeing him actually try. I don't, like, maybe I'm just not an accent. expert on the accent, but he seemed like he was really... Yeah, I'm not an expert either. It was like, it was a very different performance that I'm used to seeing from him. Not saying he's never done a good performance, but like, he was actually trying in this movie.

I kind of really appreciated him. I thought it was good, definitely. He just reminded me of like Harvey Keitel in Last Temptation. Oh, yeah? I was like, oh, it's Ethan Hawke. Oh, wow, yeah, it wasn't really thinking about that. Yeah, I mean, he is, he's a good actor. Certainly a familiar face.

I don't know if he was doing anything with the accent that bugged me too much. I loved Scarsgaard's performance in the film. I thought he gave a really great, like, physical performance. Yeah. He got ripped for the film. Yeah, yeah. He did. Yeah.

It's a good, um, character. And like you said, he's a bit of an anti-hero because that quest of revenge is ultimately, like, pointless. Mm-hmm. You know, he plays that, the rage, like, all that comes across really well. It's, like, never laughable. Anguish, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Sure. I have one other criticism with this film that, like, I don't know, it might just only bother me kind of one of these things. In terms of like the fight choreography, I enjoyed what I was seeing. I enjoyed the brutality of like how a lot of it wound up.

But in terms of like the actual motions of the fight, a lot of it felt like a little too much of a dance, too much of a choreographed. Like the motions were too slow as in like, I'm waiting for you to do this and blah, blah, blah, like we were watching like a interpretive dance rather than a real fight scene. And it's like, yeah, you're never going to, like, a real fight scene with swords is just like constant wailing in one spot.

Like, of course you don't want to do like that for a film. But I think that there's somewhere in between that this, this movie didn't just, it didn't quite get for me. I wish it would, like, maybe the motions were faster. It just like, I was seeing through the, the veneer of the fight versus dance. It might be just like the editing of it too. Like there's a lot of long takes in this movie, especially with like the action. I think that kind of like, you know, if you're editing or you have like quick cuts, that helps a lot with that kind of stuff.

But yeah, the long takes. Yeah, I could see that too. There's like some motions that seem a little slow. But not really toward the end. Like that volcano fight, I don't have much criticism with that really. I thought that was one of the best parts of the movie. In the beginning, yeah, when they're raiding the town, I saw a bit of slow, a slow, a slow. there.

Yeah, I would just mainly say, like, I think it's a bit of a broader film than, like, the Art House Lighthouse or whatever. The Art House. Art House Lighthouse. It's just, yeah, it's a bit more conventional than that. That doesn't mean I don't like it. I like what he did here. I think it's a really good action movie.

And, yeah, it's really good performances in it. It's beautifully made. Yeah, it's a shame it did poorly, but I don't know. I could see how they might. think this would have an audience. I mean, it's like a revenge action movie. That's like a period piece, almost like a Ridley Scott kind of thing. But, I mean, every, yeah, his first two films made, like, you know, made their money back and then some, I would have to. Yeah, because they were small budget. Exactly. Yeah, they were very small, yeah. You know, if this movie costs nothing,

it would be considered a hit. Yeah. You know, it costs almost $100 million. Yeah. Make it again. Um, so it's different, yeah. Um, maybe he could find a middle ground and make like a 30 million or $20 million movie. Even with his, like, a fucking $11 million movie,

he did a lot with that. So, yeah. I'm, yeah, I'm not going to be unhappy if he, you know,

I would love him to have whatever budget he wants at the end of the day, but I don't, you know, especially after hearing his comments, saying the stress involved and the amount of money

behind something, you know, makes it not as enjoyable to work on. I'm like, you do what you enjoy, and I'm sure it'll turn out great. I like the guy. And it doesn't feel like a compromised vision, even if there was studio interference.

It definitely feels like a Robert Eggers movie. And I love how sincere it is. Yeah. I wonder what they interfered with, right? I wonder what that was, because I couldn't tell where it would come from. Right. The posters look like shit. I know that much.

The marketing was bad. Yeah, those aren't great. Yeah, the posters are awful. Yeah, they're terrible. No wonder nobody saw it. Did you see that? They put up like a big ad. like the subway and forgot to put the title of the film on the ad.

Really? Yeah. But it's just like shirtless Alexander Scars Garden. That's weird. Very funny. I like the title cards in the movie. I thought that was a cool part of it. I really like those.

Yeah, cool structure. Yeah, had a cool structure. It's just like the way, the graphic design of them, those title cards, I thought it was super cool. It was a bit of a like a shake to them, almost like a, you know. Like very filmic. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, there's a lot about the movie I love.

Technically, I think it's, like, basically flawless. Like, I have, no, like, maybe one second of, like, one action scene. I'm like, yeah, that looks kind of weird. But, like, I thought the movie looked absolutely immaculate. And, like, in every part of it was, like, beautiful. Like, the music and the, yeah, the editing and everything. Cam, I think you mentioned there's, like, some cuts that, like, feel a little jarring. But I think that was purposeful.

full. Oh, sure, yeah, sure. Later on, when he's, like, confronting that skeleton thing and get the... Ghost, Viking or whatever. And then it edits so, like, he's right in front of it again. But I think that was deliberate. It's meant to be kind of, like, yeah. Dreamy. Yeah, yeah, I love the execution of that sequence. Yeah, yeah, very dreamlike.

Yeah, that was super great. Yeah, it was very trippy. Yeah, um, I love the film. If we want to get into ratings, I don't know. Yeah, yeah. Green Knights would go want to bring up. I love the Green Knight, too. They're very similar to me. I like this film maybe a bit more just because, like, it's more of an action film.

Yeah, I like that dark tone, and it's about that rage and, like, vengeance. Yeah, it really focuses on, like, the darkness of not just those, like, feelings, but, like, the period itself. Like, it was a brutal period of history. And, yeah, they really get that across with just, like, the constant violence and, like, the ritual sequences, which we didn't talk about much, but I love those scenes. Like, they really, it felt very authentic. like when they're sacrificing people or what have you. The funeral for the villain's son. I love that scene.

Yeah. But, you know, there's so much to get into, so much I love about it, like the lighting and the themes of it. I'd give it probably 9 out of 10 for now. I'd like to see it again. And my rating might change, maybe go down. But I really liked it the first time. I really got a lot out of like the core.

experience, which is like very epic and emotional. You got like this guy's whole life, basically. I felt like I got a good picture of like the character and the story felt very conclusive. And yeah, I thought it was a great like epic tale. I really liked it. Good job,

Egos. Yeah. I mean, I'm pretty much there with you, Ralph, maybe slightly lower for me. The four star. I enjoyed everything technical.

I enjoyed the story, where it goes, the twist and turns it takes. I really liked the costumes actually in this the whole, the scene with Bjork and that whole is very memorable in my head. That whole part of it, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's just lots of memorable scenes, memorable imagery. I love that it's on location, just, all the creative choices that you want to see in modern movies that we just complain about so much all here. And I just want to encourage that as much as possible. So, yeah, full start. Like you maybe not work with this big budget again quite to this scale. But I'm glad we got to see it because there's so many directors that never really get the chance to deal of this kind of money.

But it's cool. You managed to complete it. Came together really well, even with the tinkering. And, yeah. I think I'd also probably give it a 9 out of 10. I really appreciate the creativity and spectacle. Yeah, I'd like to see it again. And I'm glad I saw it instead of Morbius.

I didn't have the wrong choice there, man. Yeah, you didn't see Moriative. Although you saw Sonic 2. I did. When the Northman ended, I joked to my friend. I'm like, that was a terrible sequel to Sonic the Hedgehog. All right, cool. Yeah, I'm giving this one a 7 out of 10.

Really enjoyed it. Not quite as much as his other films. I haven't seen The Witch in a while. I need to rewatch that to really compare which one of these I prefer over the other. But yeah, I loved it. I'll definitely be watching it a second time. I feel like it'll solidify how I feel about it. What you made me realize just now, Alex,

is that this is going to be one of those films where next year's Oscars, it would be very reasonable and logical for it to get like a production design nomination, and then it just won't. And it'll go to some like random, dumb movie. This will be one.

one of those frustrating zero nominations movies. Yeah, this is April. It'll be forgotten by then. Didn't make enough money for the Oscars. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it'll be one of those. It's too challenging for them. Yeah. Oopsie. Oh, well, who gives a shit? We liked it.

Yeah, yeah, I really liked it too. I'm excited to see his next thing. For sure, yeah. Very good. Yeah. He's very good director. Um, Edgar's next movie, I think, is like some movie called The Night. Really? He's been attached to like a Nosferatu project for ages now.

I don't think that's going to happen. Really? He said that's not going to happen, yeah. Ah, okay. Which sucks, yeah, I was kind of looking forward to that. Yeah, yeah. I thought that was going to be his next thing. Mm-hmm.

That, I feel like that would have been really interesting. There wasn't really much horror kind of tinged to the Northman as much as Lighthouse and Witch, which is cool. Mm-hmm. You're talking about how he's, the Nosferatu thing? Yeah. He's not going to do that now, right? Right. Yeah.

Yeah, I'm just looking on as IMDB. I don't even see it there anymore. Yeah. I think it's some night movies working on now. It would probably be more like this, but... Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Like an action film.

Yeah, that sounds cool. He'll make a... He'll make a Dark Souls movie one day. Yeah, fuck. Oh, that was great. Yeah, I was thinking of, like, Skyrim a little bit. You know, there's that, like, faction of enemies in Skyrim that will wear, like, the skulls. stuff.

Sure. It was making me think of that. He could do a Skyron movie or like an elder school. Well, I guess it's that time to talk about the most epic keynote film that Cameron decided

to recommend. And so we are giving you the responsibility of introducing the film. Tell us a bit about it. You brought this upon everyone. Let's do a shot toe. Right. Without further ado, I am holding my copy, my Criterion Blu-ray.

No, I'm sorry. It's a full-screen DVD from back of the day of Shocktail, the DreamWorks animated film. Full-screen. Full-screen and all its full-screen glory. Can you explain to, like, the kids out there what full-screen is? Because I don't think, like, people understand it. It doesn't mean full-screen anymore. Yeah. I used to think full-screen was inherently better. Like, well, there's more of the movie.

You know, it literally just fills up the TV screen, whereas ride screen's a bit more appealing. You can see more of what's going on. Yeah, but I guess it's made for like TVs back then were more like box shaped. Most televisions were like four by three or whatever it was. Was it four by three? I don't know. Just as, yeah, more of a square-ish aspect ratio. And then movies in movie theaters were filmed in like widescreen, cinematic widescreen.

And so for the emergence of home video They were like well We don't want black bars on the top and bottom of the screen So they just did like a cropped zoom basically And called it full screen Which was inherently worse Because you saw the less of the image But it's like oh it fills up the screen nicely

Yeah They either did a crop zoom or some movies have They film open mat And then like in post production They like put top bar You know the bars on the table top and bottom. Yeah.

Or like they, they, they, they, they, they still have, they still have the film of like, you know,

the top and bottom and then on the TV, the TV version, you see that, like you see the top and bottom of the frame. Some movies have it, obviously,

not all of them. But like, if you find, like, most big movies, like, probably like Spider-Man has it or something. But,

like, Shark Tail is probably one of those where it's like, because it's a big enough movie. Yeah. Yeah, what's the plot, Cam?

Yeah, what's the plot? of shark still. I'm going to read from the back of the DVD. That's good. Yeah. No, no, no, it's fine. It's a good description.

Oscar, Will Smith, a lowly tongue scrubber, the local whale wash, becomes an improbable hero when he tells a great white lie. Oh, I see. Oh, smart. Really? Ocean pun? Nice. I hope there's more of those.

That was a good one. To keep his secret, Oscar teams up with an outcast, vegetarian shot. Lenny, played by Jack Black, and the two become the most unlikely of friends. I'll say, when his lie begins to unravel, it's up to Oscar's loyal friend, Angie, played by Renee Zellweger, and Lenny, to help him stand up to the most feared shark in the water, Robert De Niro, and find his true place in the reef. The most feared shark on the water, Robert De Niro. Perfect.

Academy Award nominated. So, I have to imagine that both yourself and Ralph were probably irritated by Jack Black's accent, right? Yeah. Sure. Kung Fu Panda is a much better. I'll say yes. It seemed very inconsistent.

Oh yeah. Well, I totally forgot. Yeah, he's in Kung Fu Panda. Yeah. He's great. Yeah. And Angelia, Julie. Yeah.

What I like about his Kung Fu Panda performance is he's just kind of Jack Black. Like, he doesn't need to play up like a voice or anything. Yeah. He's not particularly good at it. Yeah. And that's like what every character in this movie does. does. It's like, or at least him. Yeah. Yeah, it's very silly. And also, it was nominated at the Academy Awards for Best Animated Feature alongside Trek 2 and the Incredibles, which are both five better movies.

Oh, my double dream work. Reminded me it came out the same years the Incredibles. That's funny. Yeah, that was, didn't stand a chance. The whole Pixar thing, it's, it just gets more and more embarrassing. So it wasn't the same year as Nemo? Nemo was 2003, so it was the previous year. No, they needed to copy it. Yeah. Needs a time. Yeah. It needs a time to ride off the coat tails. That would be really funny.

It's not one of those they found out like right when it got out of the pipe, like when they were writing the script. Like, oh, we got to copy it like right off the bat, like ants or something. Yeah. Yeah. That happened a few times. And also, you know, since we mentioned finding emo, I think one of the best things about to find emo is the fact that it's literally set in the ocean, you know, that not too many movies

like that. And that's, you know, it's like so immense and dazzling, whereas Shacktail this takes place. It's like our world, but underwater. I find that much less compelling, especially for kids. Yeah, it's like a parody, like almost pop culture kind of thing, like a mockery of all culture. Well, the entire film is just, what if Will Smith was a fish? That's the selling point, right? You take his existing charisma, his existing public perception of everybody being like,

Will Smith's hot right now, and just, yeah, you throw him in a movie, you get him to, like, play up all of the aspects about his character or his, like perceived a character in real life just being like, be the most Will Smith you possibly could be. Yeah. It's what they told. It's just Will Smith. Yeah. It's very exaggerated.

He's just Will Smith. And, you know, that's a lot of characters in this movie like Angelina Jolie and that was fucking weird. Yeah, another Kung Fu Panda actor. That was weird. The Sharks are attracted to her. Also, like, her character, like, they introduce her with, they just flat out say, like,

in the song lyrics, they were talking about, like, her being a gold digger and it's just like that's her character yeah and he falls for it and like it was so poorly communicated because i thought based on the conversation at the beginning that he was already dating the other fish character because like one of the things that he says like he picked up the phone he's like sorry she's busy getting freaky right now i'm like oh they're dating right but then it's like oh no they're not and she has love for him that she didn't admit to yet and so that's why He's all like, oh, I need this Angelina Jolie fish so badly in my life. But how would a kid like get any of these jokes?

No, I mean. They're too out there for a kid. Ralph and I were in second grade when this came out, so I had no idea what a gold digger was. Yeah, exactly. Like, how's a kid supposed to know what a gold digger is? Like, that doesn't, it's... The underlying kind of core of the movie is, it's like a mob flick, or at least parodying it. Yeah.

So you got De Niro in there, you got... of Italian actors from like the Sopranos. Yeah, Scorsese. He's voicing a puff of fish. Yeah, he's acting in the film. Yeah, that's fucking crazy. Like Martin Scorsese, you know, along with like De Niro. And yeah, like, they don't add much to the film ultimately.

Like they're just kind of cameos for like a kind of like to pander to me ultimately like a little nudge, like, hey, it's the guy from the Sopranos. That was a popular show at the time, right? But there's nothing like more to it. It's just like DreamWorks again with their reference humor. And this is like when it gets really lazy. though, like with them. Yeah.

It's just like throw in celebrity cameos, throwing like references and like bad puns like in the ocean. Yeah. Yeah. It opens on a jewels reference. Uh-huh. Finding Nemo is an excellent film. Like I saw that movie as a kid and I loved it.

I watched the special features like religiously as a kid. Like I love that movie and it's educational. You do learn about the ocean. You're right, Cameron. Like you see the ocean and and that's an emotional film. like it's not so kiddie fluff like the first part of that film you see the main characters like family get eaten and his wife get eaten and it's like yeah their oceans are rough place and it's like a very powerful scene like in that film especially for kids like everyone makes a big

deal about the first scene of up but like that scene into finding nemo like that struck me hard as a kid I'm like wow that's a really dark way to start the story and as far as visually pushing it with like like the animators and the artists like trying to do something something new, visualized something new. Finding Nemo was really impressive with the lighting and the textures and everything. Lots of different fish. And they move like fish, like you said. Yeah, yeah, it's aged beautifully too.

That film still holds up. The turtles, like, they move like turtles and the fish swim. And in this movie, they all, because it's trying to do that dumb, like, pop culture parody thing, it's just the fish like walk around. They have feet. They have legs as fins. Yeah. Yeah. We got to talk about the character design.

Like, like, what's a tongue scrub? scrubbing place. They did a fucking car wash remix. It's like a car wash. Oh my God. Yeah. It's a car wash parody, but it's with whales. They put like as much effort into the soundtrack

as like Space Jam. Like the quality of the songs aren't as good. Yeah. But in terms of the money and like the licensing and star power that they threw in here, that was like basically a space jam soundtrack. Like they had so many major artists. They had fucking D-12 do a song for a kid's movie. What the fuck?

Right? Like all these hot celebrities. They all they cared about. Celebrity is like the biggest fucking pop stars Let's see if I can pull up everybody that was on this soundtrack I should have had this ready let's see Yeah, go ahead Like Dreamer should stop we have this we have the stars

We have like the you know we don't need to try on the story This dream works at its worst like Conceptually I'm it's only rivaled maybe by B movie You know you take just like Jerry Seinfeld And then it's just a bunch of puns Like that's all they are like the environment is like the joke You know And that's it

There's a bunch of puns puns on punch, fish puns after fish puns. Oh my God. They're everywhere. A shark tail motion picture soundtrack includes Newly features newly recorded music by various artists including Christina Aguilera, Mary J. Blige, Sean Paul, Timbaland, the Pussycat Dolls, Ludacris, Missy Elliott, and Justin Timberlake.

And they didn't even mention D12 on the fucking wiki. Like, there's a shit ton of artists. I remember the Car Wash song was actually like, it was it did well on the radio. It was a playable song Yeah, I remember hearing it I mean it is a remake of an old song But older song I believe

But yeah, wow Like it's It's crazy that they did that What a way to wrap up your movie For a movie that's just so shit Yeah It's not great And Adam I wanted to ask you

Like in terms of a death scene scored by Hans Zimmer I don't think this compares to them like Yeah Han Zimmer doing the soundtrack for this like it was awful it's an awful so I don't know what your DVD was like but I got the Blu-ray and hearing that that music loop

on the menu while I was like I was like grabbing some water or something I was like I can't handle this actually like I had to mute it I was like this is just very annoying I could not stand the music was like do do do do do do do oh my god yeah yeah

so terrible that was fucking awful I can't get over like the you know it's like that Martin Scorsesea like yeah or it. Like, they don't need to be in the movie. Like, it's just all, they just throw in all these people, all these celebrities, all these songs, but it's not in service of a story. It's just like, the story, fuck that. Like, we don't need to think about that. Like, the jokes, we don't need to

think about that. All we care about is just like, crispy cream is what's important. Throne in crispy cream product place. Calpby cream. Uh-huh, exactly. It's just like the, it's a producer's movie. It's just like, throw in all these elements to market it, but don't have, like, a core. Like, it's not in service of anything. It's all just, you know, know at the end of the day it's it's crap yeah it's like even for kids like it's awful it's not something i would show it's scary the animation is like uncanny valley the faces are terrible yeah we can get into faces are genuinely the animation is awful yeah the character design is so it's one of it's one of the go-toe in my mind of like nutchack shark tail big mouth it's like the trilogy of shit

it's almost nut shack level it's almost that level it's like almost worse in my mind when it's like this is dream works like what was the budget on this 75 million that's not cheap you know like you have to commit when you're telling an animated adventure you know you have to be confident in those character designs you got you got to you got to be ready to like yeah painstakingly anime i kept thinking about what the poor animators working on this because they would have known they would have known like you're just handed a shot you got to compile and like plot out an animate and you got you're just working with this oscar model when it's like this weird he's got like a human face and he's kind of got legs.

Make him look like real. Just compare it. We keep mentioning like finding Nemo. Like that's how you do character design in 3D. Like they're still fish. They're recognizably fish, but they're also not so fish like that they're scary. Yeah,

just fish with teeth. Done. Still like anthropomorphized. Yeah. Whereas, whereas this, I don't know like what they're trying to do. It's crazy.

And it's aged horrifying. Maybe one of the worst age of movies ever. Like, It's really up there in terms of how it's very dated. Oh, yeah, unlike Finding Nemo, which is aged beautifully. Yeah, and they really focus on the beauty of the ocean. Yeah. And Alex, you mentioned all the puns.

I feel like it just uses like the pop culture references and puns as like a crutch, whereas at least in Shrek, you know, Shrek has a lot of culture references, but even like, you know, Lord Farkwater, it's like the match game. He's like looking at Fiona. At least like it's in, you know, it ties into the plot, whereas this like, And Shackdale, he's just, like, quoting, like, Jerry McGuire and a few good men. And what the fuck does that have to do with Shack?

Yeah, and how are kids supposed to get these references? Yeah, you get a good, like, fairy tale parody out of Shrek. What parody, like, what do you get? It's not a good mob movie parody. And then throwing in Will Smith and all that. So what is this then? What are you actually trying to achieve with this? And they even address, like, how nonsensical and bad it is at points in that kind of, like,

dead bull oh this is the part in the script that sucks or whatever like moment and that whole betting on the horse the sea horse right in it's like oh he tripped over at the end how did he even do that because he's underwater that was infuriating it and just like uncut gems yeah yeah but yeah written as if they think it's like funny it's like like how's a kid's supposed to like connect to this film like where are they supposed to implant themselves because there's no child characters. There's no in a sense, there's no themes of like... Kids love batting.

What are you talking about? They love betting on horses. Yeah, they love adult characters dealing with like, yeah, like a city. Like it's just really dull, yeah. Like it didn't need to take place in the ocean. They didn't need to be fish, right? True. What did that add to the story at all?

Pons. This is like a really cynically made like corporate nonsense movie and this is coming like fresh off of Shrek. Absolutely. And so, like, obviously, so you imagine what they thought the success of Shrek must have been. It's like, oh, okay, well, there were, like, jokes for adults. There were adult jokes in that movie. So we just got to make a kid movie with some adult jokes in it that adults will get.

Yeah. We'll have, you know, like, the pussycat dolls and D12 in the soundtrack? Like, that's kind of weird. Like, we're going to market the soundtrack to adults, kind of, with still child-friendly lyrics. And then the whole, yeah, like, oh, finding Nemo's popular. that must mean that there's an interest in seeing fish characters. It's like, that's not why it was popular. You know, it's not just, oh, people want to see fish characters.

So you combine all these elements, this boardroom full of people of like, okay, how do we make a successful film? You got all this mishmash of like just things that are that are being successful around them in the past few years. Like, let's just mash them all together. And you get this, Will Smith. That was another one. Will Smith's hot right now. Every movie he had been in at that point was like, he was, he was, he was, on such a fucking role.

Like every movie had starred in would gross like over. I forget what the, what the number was. He had like an eight movie streak of like a movie grossing like over $100 million or some shit. Like I don't even know what it was. Yeah. He was, he was, he was everyone. Yeah, that was definitely high in his career. He had an insane streak.

And yeah, much like, much like the seahorse he was betting on. He's now tripped. and kicked himself in the face. True. And I know, you guys were wondering whether we picked this because of the Oscars. We actually had it in mind already, and then obviously that incident, he slapped up. Yeah, it's a perfect film to talk about it now. Absolutely.

He slapped up, Marty. His name is Oscar. He did, exactly. It's the DreamWorks crossover I always wanted. Yeah. It's like the Avengers. Exactly. And did you guys like the jellyfish characters?

Oh, God. Yeah. I forgot about those until you just mentioned them. That was, um, that was more problematic than any of the characters in finding Nemo for sure. If we're gonna use that word, I guess. Right.

Yeah. That was a little, uh, that was a little weird. They're on the disc for the movie. Like they're the best characters or something. They're on the DVD itself. Yeah. And also like, the way that they were treating like the fucking, the crab guy that was like,

I'll be your manager or whatever. like yeah they were treating him as though he was like actually an effective comic relief character I don't know if you any of you stuck through the credits but uh every like minute or something the crazy Joe would like pop up and be like be be you know some fourth wall break to the audience and say some nonsense line that was never funny and just like wow they actually they actually think that that this guy is like a real comic relief character like like as if he's a lovable character that people want to continue seeing in the film, like, beyond the credits. Like, wow.

Yeah. It's just that classic thing. Just pace it like a joke and just hope people will treat it like a joke, even if there is no joke. If the joke is just like a reference. If you just get a voice actor to say it with a sunny voice, funny voice, then yeah, kids will love it, right? Which is amazing because I was looking at, like, who wrote this? 10 people credited. One of the writers also worked on the first Ice Age, which I,

probably like a little better than this. Yeah. Ice 1 is far superior to Shart 2. It's far superior. It's, yeah, different, different ballparks entirely. But eight of these 10 writers are credited for additional dialogue. That's very so loud. Which probably just means, like, just riffing in the writer's room.

Yeah, it's probably just all the different, like, puns. You could tell. It doesn't, like, it doesn't, it's not in service of anything. It's just a bunch of jokes. It's like, what is the point of this? A room full of nepotism and a bunch of cocaine, probably. three directors as well that's crazy yeah one of the directors worked on the first shrek holy fuck i forgot about that yeah this is three directors that's crazy i couldn't even finish it this time i've seen it

many times but yeah for this recording there's a point i'm like yeah fuck this one of one of them the director of monsters versus aliens detective piquishu and goosebumps you know the new ones oh and gulliver's travels of jack black that's that nearly destroyed his career i think that maybe it was so bad. Yeah, that's career low for him. I hate that fucking movie. So, you know what's really fucking weird about this movie? So they have a character called

Katie Currant, who was supposed to be a parody of real life I believe, like, journalist or reporter Katie Couric, but they didn't get Katie Couric to voice her. They got an Australian woman named

Tracy Grimshaw. And you can see that in the end credits. It shows up on the screen Tracy Grimshaw, but on IMDB, you go to IMDB and you see Katie Couric is credited. So that's just wrong. So the IMDB is wrong. It's not Katie Currie. Because I was wondering like, why does she sound Australian? Because I don't know much about Katie Kirk, but I don't think she was Australian.

I look at it. Yeah, like it's not, it's just not the same person. And I don't know why they did that. They just, they got an Australian journalist named Tracy Grimshaw. So that was very confusing. Yeah, that's funny. And another side note, I was a weird kid. so I would like look up, you know, I would go on the Pixar website and the Dreamerks website.

I remember when this was called Shark Slayer. That was the original title. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I guess cats, apparently Katzberg thought the title sounded too violent. Probably, yeah. There's not a lot of action in the film, so. It's such a boring name, shark title. It's not even a, they couldn't even get a pun on the title.

It's a pun. It's one I'm missing. Sharks have tails. Yeah, it is a pun. It's like a story. It's like a shark's tail and then a shark tail. Yeah, it's not a good pun. Oh, that's what I, I thought that's what the pun was, but I was like, that can't actually be like the Joker. Like, I thought I was, is that is it seriously supposed to be like a show? Yeah, it's so lame that like, like, you can't even processing. Oh my God. Yeah. That's funny. Dude, did you guys like the characters? No. Is there anybody? I was like, I kind of like the Scorsese blowfish.

You like Scorsese? I didn't like anybody in it because you just can't, I can't, I couldn't get into the design, you know, like. No. There's so, such ugly, open. film. Every character was in the real. That that I thought it's as bad as food fight, but yeah, just, you know. There's like no expectation for food fight is the thing, you know? It's like not coming from a production company like a dream works. It was like, what? Sure. Yeah. What do you doing? This feels very lazy. I still haven't seen food fight. I'd imagine it would be less painful than this movie. Um, food fight? I don't know. Food fight's worse than this. Yeah, it is. Yeah, I would say it's awful. And the animation's worse too. Um, but Sharktail, yeah, it doesn't have good animation, especially compared to, um, The, you know, the finding Nemo, like, when, um, Oscars breakdancing or whatever, like,

with his fins, like, it doesn't look right. It's just like its fins or legs, you know? It's terrifying. Yeah, it's kind of creepy. And yeah, like, he has that human face or whatever. Did you notice that towards the end, uh, Scorsese's characters dressed like a pimp? What was that about? Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, like a gold tool. It's stuff of it. A nice, like, time capsule movie, though. for just weird decisions. I could never imagine DreamWorks releasing a film like this now.

Yeah, you shouldn't. Yeah, that's something that's so disjointed. You know, like an ocean movie that's also a mob movie. Like, the mob elements of it were so poor. Oh, yeah, they suck. Why even try to do that? You're just not going to commit.

So, yeah, right? I don't know. Like, the Incredibles has like stakes to it, I felt like. That's not like a crime movie or anything. But there's, you know, there's like bad guys. You know, if you're making a movie with, like, cry, like, you want some mistakes or, like, some consequence to it. It's just so, again, it's just devolved into the dumb jokes.

It's just, like, it's obligatory. I don't know why it needed to be a crime movie. Why it needed to be in the ocean? So many of these elements just feel so disjointed. No reason. Yeah. I'd like to point out that this movie is 2004. Gile is 2003.

So, like, very, very close together culturally. Um, they both had a segment of the film where someone played Baby Got Back and it was just a joke in of itself that the song, I like Big Butts was played. That was the joke is just that's a song that we're playing right now. That song was released in 1992. But movies in the early 2000s were all just like, ha ha ha the butt song. That was the time to do it. Was that something to do with YouTube? Like bringing it back up and. The existence of the song being referenced in a film is supposed to be a joke, apparently. That's so early 2000s, I hate it. I was so mad. Yeah, yeah. Two movies in a row that we talk about on the fucking podcast today.

Yeah. It's a hot streak. And one thing, I don't know if you guys, like, what are even the consequences for Oscar lying about being a Shacks Slayer? There are none. He doesn't learn anything. Yeah, what's the message? There isn't really a character arc.

No. It's not like uncut gems where they were like, clear consequences for him taking too far. It's like any film. Yeah, even finding Nemo, like any Pixar film, right. Yeah, he lies his way to the top, but then just lies out of it. If this had the same ending as Uncut Jens, I would love it. Yeah, no, I was thinking the same thing. Yeah.

And Adam, I said that, but about Deervin Hanson, because that's also about a character who lies. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I saw the play, I haven't seen the movie. I saw like the stage thing. Oh, it's so bad. Yeah, it seemed funny. I'll watch it at some point.

Yeah, like, what was the message of this? There's, yeah, it's really, uh, there, there is no good moral to the story. No, and like, you know, not every story has to have a moral, but maybe kids movies probably should, you know? You're, if you're a kid's movie, maybe you should have some sort of like moral. It never hurts. Kung Fu Panda has a moral. Just pick a lane. Maybe, maybe just a lane or two instead of trying to do all the other.

If you work hard, you could become the Dragon Warrior. Uh-huh. Like, that's a moral. You know, work hard. Like, this movie's like, yeah, it's like nothing. And what was the emotion? What was the, when the brother died in that scene, played by Michael Imperialioli. Yeah, the character is a dick.

Like, why do we even care that he gets killed? He's a gigantic asshole. And the millisecond, the millisecond Angelina Jolie fish shows up. He's like, no. no, no, no, no, no. It's just like, dude, get over yourself. Like, fuck off. I need to be rich so I can impress this girl who's, like, just going to take my money and doesn't respect me. That's the character. Yeah, sure. And he's all for it.

When she pops up for the first time, like, what was she doing? She just had her back turned, and then all of a sudden, then it goes into the gold digger. And it plays for so long. That's a very long, like, romantic sort of like, oh, she's hot with playing a song sequence. That goes on for forever. That's so weird that they played it for that long. That was so odd. Maybe it was because that song was created for the movie and they had to play enough of it just to like sell the song. Like, oh, you're going to buy the soundtrack after, right?

Maybe that's why it went on for so long. I don't know. Just the laziness of like, yeah, you got the mob stuff going on. But what are they going to give Oscar is his main, like, conflict? Oh, the classic main character has some kind of lie. They trap themselves in a lie like a bug's life type thing. works out for them at first, but oh, it's their undoing as well, and there's a little argument, but it all wraps up kind of nicely at the same time.

Yeah. I'm going to get whacked by the mob. Elisha. Yeah, for a kid's movie. Yeah, that's kind of funny. I mean, like, it's funny that it tries to be, like, fun and edgy in a way, but it just fails miserably, and it ultimately just devolves into being like a boring. nonsense mess that nobody gives a shit about.

There's two... Exactly. There's two very minor things that I like about the movie. Incredibly minor. I like that they called the money clams. I like that. Okay, yeah. Nice part.

Kind of cool. And then for like a very brief moment, one of the characters is reading a newspaper. And you see the branding on it. And it's got a parody poster of the ring and it's the hook. And it was like a... Yeah, I liked that. I liked that parody poster.

Whoever did that, whichever, what are you, 10 writers? Maybe it was just one of the animators that threw in that joke. Good on you. That's about it. Did any of you like anything about the movie or no? No. No, not a single thing. It actually is one of those movies for me where, like, the first time I saw it is like a groundbreaking, oh,

like this is like where it can go. Because I remember. What? Like, I was in Australia visiting my family. This is how bad it could get at it. Yeah, yeah. Wow. I was, I was, love finding Nemo, and I was, I found this, like, video.

How old are you? It was a videotape, because I guess it was, um, if it was 10, I guess, yeah. Or I guess it would have been 11 if it, yeah, you need the time for the movie to come out, be on VHS. Yeah. So about that kind of age. No, I see the cover and I think, yeah, it looks shit, right, but whatever, I'll give it a chance. Put it in, and there's Sharktail, there's no movie, like, just, that gets as shit as it does as quickly.

It's literally like the first frame that the sound is like it starts playing jaws. It's like so bad. It's so memorably bad. That opening scene is seared into my mind by watching that as an 11 or 12 year old. Just like, whoa. It's just so funny.

This is year after finding Nemo as well. That always gets me about it. And the font of the opening credits doesn't match the tone at all. When the real song comes in, when the Hans Zimmer shit comes in, that's dumb like car wash or whatever that when that starts playing then then the actual font fits but they went for this jaws like oh it's like kind of parody scary where you know like tongue-and-cheek

scary like have the font match it you're so lazy the font didn't match that at all i was like conflicting aesthetics right at the beginning of the film that's so lazy every creative decision every one of them bad every single one it's stunning and not that that's why like as much as much as I despise this movie I've been drawn to it again and again over the years I've seen it too many times wow because I think it's just such a great example of of of this the pure like cynicism how far it can go like just seeing that it's what I'm so drawn to these B movies the shark tells or it's like yeah let's just give jerry Seinfeld 200 million dollar animated movie why not where dream works we can just shove in

every celebrity in hollywood and it's going to make money we'll be right? Shartale made money, surely. Yeah, it did. Oh, yeah, of course. It wasn't like the biggest hit in the world or anything. I think it probably made a good amount from the soundtrack, honestly. I think the soundtrack helped it out a lot. Probably, yeah. No, they're like big products.

It was just... So overt. Just at the end where people were still buying CDs. They barely got in in time. Yeah, it's like a train wreck. You can't look away. And I guess the Academy, it has more nominations in Senecta Key, New York. Yes.

Yeah. Yes, it does. The Academy loves it. It's kind of baffling. Picture the Academy is just watching this film, yeah. And it got nominated. You guys covered the SpongeBob movie. That came out the same year.

That wasn't nominated. Oh, that's better than this. That's definitely better than this. Maybe there was some weird technicality in that year where it's like, you can't have a live action scene in this movie. It's not animated anymore. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Maybe. Maybe. And also, there's a, on the DVD, one of the, the Finntastic special features. There's a short... Is that what it says on there? Yeah. Yeah, it says that.

Oh my God. There's a short cut called Club Oscar. It's just a parody of Saturday Night Fever. Oh, yeah. I can't believe you watched that. I was going to watch that. I didn't have time. At least it didn't end on Finn, did it?

It didn't say Finn. Or did it? Fantastic. That's what it says. The end of the movie, though. Oh, my God. Yeah, the actual. end of the movie. I'm surprised they didn't.

That's actually surprising they didn't. That's a funny joke. Yeah, why not? They did that on Find an Emo, uh, Finn, I think, right? Oh, so they couldn't. The one good joke was already taken. That's funny. As if they care. Yeah. The Blu-ray that I have, so it's a four movie pack.

There's four Blu-rays, and it was cheaper to buy it that way than to buy Shark Tail just outright by itself. It's a DreamWorks pack, but B-Movie Monsters versus Aliens, Shark Tail, and I think over the hedge. Oh, some of the worst ones. Yeah, well, it's a good collection.

They're all related. So I put in the Shark Tale Blu-ray, and, like, as I already mentioned, like, the awful looping music of just like, oh, please stop. But the, the Blu-ray menu is, like, literally so lazy that I was, like, concerned that this was, like, a bootleg. Because there's no words. It just has, like, there's, like a, there's like an asterisk symbol for, like, like, you. special features. Yeah. And like the subtitle symbol, like something you would see like maybe like a phone keyboard symbol or something. That would for subtitles. And then like I think there was like a music symbol for

audios. It was like you didn't even like type words. It was it felt like one of those like programs you can buy for like 80 bucks or even like a freeware thing of like create your own Blu-ray and then they just use the default and didn't change anything. And this is this is dream work. Right. And not even that. Like they just. didn't put any, like, art artistry into, like, designing the, the Blu-ray cover. They're just, like, or the Blu-ray menu. Oh, yeah.

They're just, like, fuck this. Yeah, it's, like, who cares? Yeah, put it out. Yeah, it's like, I was looking, I was shocked they even had a Blu-ray of this. I thought they, like, just never even bothered printing a Blu-ray. Like, you know, I bet if you looked at the Shrek menu, it would be, like, much better done.

Like, of course, if you bought, like, the Shrek Yeah, because they should give a fuck about that. Right. It's a four movie pack. Yeah. You can find Shark Tale, like, the Blu-ray for $8 on, like, Amazon. All four of them are like $8, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. There you go. It was like nothing. It's just not even a movie. Like, I don't want to watch it in HD. Like, the DVD, that's fine. Like, I don't want any more detail. Full screen.

It definitely wasn't designed to be watching HD, that's the show. Yeah. Oh, no. The animation's worse when you can see more of it. Imagine fucking pain to see this, like, in a theater. My God. Like a whole family. I mean, I guess I did.

That was my experience. I'm pretty sure I saw it at the theater. Although I'm like, Alex, this movie wasn't burned into my memory of like being like, oh, this is the worst thing ever. I just forgot everything about it. It was one of those movies where it's like, I know I saw it as a kid, but I just didn't remember, I didn't remember anything about it because it was so boring. There's a few movies like that where it's like, I revisit them just being like, I wonder

if I'll tap into any nostalgia or, you know, have like some weird memory or flashback or something. Nope, I watched through the entire movie. It's like, wow, this is like. It's like I'm watching it for the first time again, but it's just really bad. Yeah. It's just I've had more of an appreciation for Dreamworks recently, because we've watched a lot of their good stuff that come from pandas and so on. And yeah, just like this, it's like, then when you see something like this or another bad one,

they made, like Madagascar 2, you just like, yeah, they had some, they had to iron out some kinks, for sure. Like, they had some things they needed to. Yeah, it was a really kinky film. Yeah. Well, they were into that Angelina Jolie fish. They had those shacks were hot for her. They were trying.

They were trying to do something. Yeah, that was fucking bizarre. That's like such a big part of the movie. It's just like, yeah, she's like, Angelina Jolie. Like, she's a hot actress. So, are you trying to tell the audience to fuck the fish? Like, what are you doing in that scene? It's so rude.

I don't know what it's doing. Like, is it supposed to be funny? It's supposed to be funny. They were trying to do like a Jessica rabbit type thing with her. Right, yeah. Yeah, sure. It's like that. Yeah.

Jessica, it's definitely a Jessica Rabbit kind of thing. They were trying to do a space jam. Lola. Well, Lola Bunny was trying to be Jessica Rabbit too. Her name was Lowe. It's like, that's a classic. Yeah, that's true. Lolo, lo, lo, la. Yeah.

And my copy also includes a preview for Madagascar 1. I don't know if you guys are excited for that one to come out. Oh, yeah. Oh, God, they were really on a role when their dream works around this time. Right. They were just pumping out. They had a formula going with this Because this was their fourth CG movie

They had other, you know, they did like Rotel Dorado But like these kind of, there was like ants and Shrek 1 and 2 They kind of had like, you know, they wanted to do like edgy Like these movies have like cursing like hell and damn I guess they wanted to like stand out for Pixar in that way But this is like a prime example of like how badly it dated They're cursing in this

I don't even remember Um They said the N word No They didn't You know I guess there's like Edgier jokes

Like you know The whales like It's mating season And I'm feeling lucky Whatever Like stuff like that Oh okay yeah But yeah

They don't say like ass Like I would say more like You know Because there's some DreamWorks movies They say ass or damn or something Like The Shrek movies can get pretty raunchy And so there was a lot of swearing

Oh yeah There's that creepy comment That shock makes We're sick If I wasn't married I mean they Like, he picked up the phone saying, like, she was getting her freak on. It was like, what do you...

Yeah, like, that kind of stuff. That's weird. And, like, yeah, it's more like, kids aren't going to understand these things, but they're not funny for adults. They're not funny anyway, yeah. Like, yeah, it's not funny at all. It's kind of creepy. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. Like, the Shrek movies are genuinely funny. Like, that's why they can get away with jokes like that. Like, the jokes are actually funny. So, I wonder, um, so this, there's a lot of films that existed, especially in this time period, that their entire concept was just to ride off of the marketability of Will Smith as a charismatic public figure.

This is obviously one of the worst ones of those where it doesn't really... The current events of Will Smith are not going to impact it because the film doesn't work either way. And now I'm just curious, are the films where... So if people like hitch,

if people generally like hitch, will people be able to watch that anymore and be like... Because that's another film that just rides off of his charisma. Like, is the current event of him slapping Chris Rock and being like a complete fucking psycho,

is that going to tarnish and negatively impact people's abilities to be sucked into his previous films in the same way? To watch Sharktail? Yeah, Sharktail? Is anybody going to truly be able to love Sharktail anymore? The suite of films that can be ruined,

I guess Men in Blacks. Pretty fun. That's probably his best movie, right? I like that one. Yeah, sure. Probably. But what you're saying about his charisma that's interesting because, you know,

that's usually why you get Will Smith is because he has a look and his acting and yeah, his his charisma. Exactly. And in this film, they don't utilize it really because it's an animated film and you don't see him really. It's just his voice. He's not like the best. I mean, he's not a bad voice actor.

It's just not enough. Yeah, it's just not enough to really save the movie. Mm-hmm. Right, exactly. He seems like he's talking, he's talking too kiddie. Like he's talking down like little kids watching the movie almost. Like, hi! You know, like, yeah, I'm Oscar the Fish.

Like, it's not. Let me some fin or whatever. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Like, he knows he's in a kid's movie. He's not really putting on much of a performance ultimately. Yeah. Yeah.

And so much of the movie, I feel like so much of the dialogue is this like yelping and yelling. It gets really irksome. It's like shouting back. It's a very shrill film. Yeah, shrill, yeah. Yeah, very loud and obnoxious. What was even the point of that scene, like, with like, you know, the indigestion and then like the whale gets soap and inside? It was just like, that just felt like filler.

To show that he hates his job, he's got the goop on his face. So now he has to, has motivation to be rich, so he doesn't have goop on his face all day. Bingo. And like, why, why do you let the jellyfish up in his, you know, bachelor pad? They were torturing him like a day before. Yeah, I don't know. There's no real, like, consistency. Why does he get to be the manager as well at the end?

He's like, for a bolder. This is no logic to any of it. There's no moral compass to this film or the character. No moral compass, no reason. Yeah. Yeah. Not really. And, you know, when I'm watching SpongeBob, like a 2D cartoon,

I don't really care about like the logic of the ocean or whatever. Like they have beaches on that show like Kulakoon. I don't give a shit. This movie, it's a film. I'm looking for a little more logic than like them being able to spray paint like something underwater. Like how does that work? Like you spray paint something underwater. And it's just constant logistical things like that.

Yeah. It's just like they didn't give a fuck. They really didn't care. They do that but also have jokes where like they try to pour a cup of tea underwater and have that punchline. Right. Just just yeah, you pick one. She's Elaine. It doesn't work.

Yeah. It's one of the, pick one or the other. Why are you taking the elevator? You can just go off the belt. Like, you can swim. Just go off the balcony. Why do you go in the elevator? That's slower.

You just fall down. Uh-huh. Float. So why don't we even like Oscar? At least like Shrek, he's a curmudgeon, but like... Exactly. Shrek is far more likable. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, you want to follow Shrek, unlike Oscar. Yeah, he has no moral compass. He doesn't learn anything. He has no arc. He's a piece of shit. Genuinely, he's a bad person. Fish.

But so is like everybody else in the movie. Like, was anyone in the movie a good person? His girlfriend was like trying to pressure him. Oh, yeah. Yeah, to be like, you should tell the truth. He's like, no. Okay. And everything worked out.

She's trying to help. Yeah. Everything worked out anyway. She's a B movie as well, isn't she Renee? Yeah. That's weird. There's some overlap. She's a lover.

interest in Disney Pixar and Disney DreamWorks movie, sorry, that's weird So is this the only like Will Smith DreamWorks co-lap? Yeah, he was also in that Blue Sky movie which I didn't see. Oh yeah.

Oh yeah. Yeah, the pigeon movie. Yeah, it looked terrible. Spies in the skies. Wow. I heard it wasn't too bad. I forgot that was the thing. Interesting.

Yeah, it looked really bad. Oh. Tom Holland as well, right? Tom Holland, yeah. And I wanted to ask you, Alex, because this, you know, movies burned in your brain. Which scene do you think is the worst?

Um, oh, good question. I do have a couple of choices, I guess. The crispy cream scene is horrendous. Like the first one. That's particularly bad where it's like... Kelpie cream? Yeah, yeah, Kelpie. Where they, it's not just in the background.

They actually highlight it in dialogue even. So I hope Krispy Cream got this fat paycheck. That ruined what could have maybe been considered a joke. Yeah. Yeah, so, oh, okay, you just want to make sure we know it's a sponsor. product plays. Yeah. That's awesome.

Make that clear. If not, though, that opening scene, like, I think, perfectly sets, sets the tone and the expectations of what you're not seen. Like, your, your passion for this film is contagious. I'm mad. Yeah, it is truly, like, one of those, like, I think it is the worst DreamWorks movie I've seen, honestly. Yeah, I can't think of one.

Uh-huh. I think it's pretty bad. I can't think of one worse. Uh-huh. And it's topical because of the Wolf Smith thing. I think that was a good reason to recognize. But yeah, it's shockingly bad. And, uh...

Shockingly bad, dude. Shocking. Something fishy about this one. It's getting as bad as the movie now. Right, yeah, the bad fun. We could have written a movie better than this shit, probably. Abmeas is a right run of the movie. I get it.

All right. As much as I'd love to talk about this movie forever, we should probably give our ratings. Go into questions. Sure. So what, 10 out of 10? This is a, this is a, the easiest one. out of 10 I could give. Wow.

That's fucking low. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is shockingly terrible. This is just, this is just so fucking bad in every way. This is awful, an awful experience. I am a worst person because of it.

You can't, what would you give it? I don't know if I'm quite at a one, maybe like three or four at a 10, Clive shells. Yeah. Okay. Not out of five. I'm more like a two out of ten because I think food fight is worse.

It is. To me that's a one out of ten. This is a two out of ten. This is like everything you guys said, you're right. I mean, it's pretty irredeemable. I mean, I can't think of a single aspect of it that I thought was good, honestly. Yeah.

I would never watch it again. I'm glad I watched it now. I'm never going to see it again. I have no interest in ever revisiting this. Maybe 30 years from now when I forgot about it. This is, yeah, okay.

That's Shark Tale. Did you give you a rating, Alex? I kind of snuck it in when you were saying, honestly, it does sort of just speak for itself in terms of how shit it is like, yeah, half a star. Okay. I'm shocked by how low I get it, but I'm shocked by how low, like you guys give it.

I get the thinking with the food fight comparison, but to me, it's equally as bad because it's like, it is dream works doing it. It's got the money behind it. It's got the resources, you know, where it's like a food fight doesn't even have the resources. So you've got no excuse. Yeah. It's not much better than food fight, you know? Like, I say the animation's slightly better. The character design is like a constant grading irritation.

It is a constant pain throughout every frame of the experience of the film. And it's, it's a very, uh, but it's just that it's the design and the story. Like, you're watching a shark sit in a chair, like talk on a phone. Like, you know, it looks fucking ugly and unnatural. It's very, obviously. It's very bad. Like, you know, yeah, there's tons of shit like that. No, sir.

I don't like it. No, sir. Cool. Yeah, I'm glad we talked about Shark Tale. Thank you, Cam. Yeah, thanks, Cam. Thank you, Adam, Alex, Ralph. Yeah, it was a...

That was fun. Fantastic discussion. What a movie. All right, we got time for a few questions here. Okay, let's do some questions from this othercast community. If you want to leave your own for us to answer in future questions, head over to the suggestion thread in the subreddit and ask whatever you feel like,

Just like Vince is depressed did. He's going to start us off here. What would you consider by your definition or example as being overrated? My friend just saw the godfather for his film class and thought it was overrated. I countered his argument because he loves the MCU and pointed out those movies are just as popular. So what do you think constitutes as overrated? Friend is stupid. I'm more likely to consider something to be underrated than overrated.

I don't think I often think of things as overrated. because even if something is, you know, like, it means a lot to someone else. I'm never going to be like, oh. Yeah, it seems so subjective. Yeah, whereas if there's a movie that I think more people should see and they've just never been exposed to it, that's an easy way to be like, oh, this is underrated. Or like if people are judging it on a surface level and no one's really, you know, appreciating aspects or even acknowledging aspects that I appreciate them, I might consider something underrated.

I don't really consider a lot of movies overrated. Just. Me either. Yeah. maybe on a subjective level I could be like well I don't like this as much but that's not really what that is yeah I don't find it to be a very meaningful way of describing movies over hype

maybe if you're like literally talking about like the scores on IMDB might say this is overrated slightly sure but that's so like mathematical and it's I just don't really think about it that kind of way Yeah, underwrite is much more useful Yeah, it's more fun Because you're drawing people's attention to something

They might not have seen something that's really good Yeah, I think that's more Yeah, useful Maybe the case of everything all at once There was constant like Twitter love for that movie You could say like overhype a bit Maybe not that I thought it was I mean the movie's great

I don't even say overhype But there was a lot of hype behind it That could get annoying I guess it's like constant people saying like the same shit about the movie it's the greatest movie ever made it's the greatest movie I've ever seen it's a lot of that when that movie came out I feel yeah yeah it's a great movie there's kind of this human thing where like everyone wants to be the first person to find the like great thing exactly yeah but then the contrarians once they hear everyone

who's already seeing it like you know some people just have that switch it's like yeah Yeah, I've heard everything everywhere is awesome So I'm gonna go in like ready Knowing what everyone loves about it Like looking for the for the weaknesses Yeah, it's like this whole mind game With this point is even thinking about

Yeah But I, you know That's part of the experience Like I think you can genuinely feel that way That's why I try not to look at the ratings or anything So it doesn't affect my opinion Or like the tweets of people overhyping something Whatever

Yeah Yeah Like yeah Let me just watch it The way you know, I want to look at it. Mm-hmm. Okay, let's do this one from Butter 467.

What are some of your guys' favorite and least favorite character designs in animated movies, shows, and video games? Oscar. Yeah, Oscar's a good one. Fucking Lion King and Lion King. Best worst. There we go. Yeah.

Guess which one I'm talking about it, each one. Two different Lion Kings. Yeah. My favorite shows is Simpsons, so I always love, you know, like, you can pretty much, like, identify every character, even, like, by their silhouette. Yes, I love those. Yeah. Toy Story, you know, I think all the toys are, yeah, they still look, you know, they're always very appealing, like everybody's distinct from each other. Pixar is really great with the designs of their accident.

The characters, like Monsters Inc. We always do. You know, all those Monsters Inc. movies are the shorts. Yeah, the monsters look great. They're all so different. Some of them are fluffy. Some of them look like snake-like people. creatures like reptilian, like, is perfect variety.

It's like so good, yeah. They clearly put a lot more thought in their design than like Dreamworks did with Shark Tail or, I don't know. Yeah, yeah. Something like that. Yeah, I love the designs in Miyazaki movies a lot. I was really creative. Sure. There's so many in video games, like, um, quite like Psychonauts.

There's like a weird off-the-wall one that I kind of played recently. Psychonauts too has some weird character designs. in there offbeat, like, reminded me of like 90s, Nickelodeon or something weird, kind of Tim Burtony as well a little bit. I like, I like me some, yeah,

if we're going to talk about video games, yeah. Hands Labyrinth character design. Oh, sure. Yeah. Those are excellent, yeah. Yeah, Guillermo's, yeah, really talented. Gwilermot.

Designer with that kind of stuff. We were talking about, like, designs and video games. Those, um, those from software games have, like, really good design work. Yeah, they do. with like the environments and the bosses. They do a really good job with that. Like really sticks out to me.

There's one in Eldon Ring. Like I just played it. I'm like, wow, that's like a really good, like just the design of like the boss or whatever. I was like, wow,

that's like really creepy. His name is Reichard. Like, so people know what the fuck I'm talking about. It's like a serpent with like this like head on the back of it or whatever. And it has like this fucking creepy voice like, join my family. It's like, oh my God, what the fuck?

It's freaky. Like, it's hard for a video game to get like that kind of emotion out of me. So I do commend that. Yeah. Yeah, the soul's games are a good choice. Just the other day, I was like watching a YouTube video that was like just a compilation of all the freakiest designs from Blaborn, the series. Oh, yeah.

Really creative. They're really creative and creepy. I know I'm probably forgetting something. I know there's a movie or something I'm forgetting. Yeah, there's so many. I mean. I like Katman. He's a funny.

I like the distance design of a lot of the South Park character. So it's like instantly funny. Yeah. Sure. Yeah, I like their triangle smile, that like default little. Mm-hmm. Yeah, sure. All right.

Another question? Let's do this one from R slash JAR Media. Question mainly for Alex and Ralph. How do you feel about the MCU shows? that have been released thus far. I believe Wanda Vision was mentioned before, but how about Falcon and Winter Soldier, Loki, Hawkeye, and Moon Knight?

Moon Knight, yeah. Cam, have you seen any of these as well? I've watched a little bit of Wanda Vision, but that's about it, and I keep getting Moon Knight confused with the movie Moonlight. I joke about it, but I think they're much different. Yeah, I mentioned that to someone too. They're like, Moonlight?

I'm like, no, Moon Knight. The Wanda Vision ones, that's probably the best one. That's probably the best show, seen Wanda Vision and Loki. Wonder Vision was okay, but they just always do the same thing where they're like, oh, they start off with the spark of like, this is kind of interesting

and weird for the MCU, but by the end of it, it's like, oh, yeah, this is very much the MCU, I don't know what I was expecting. Right, by the end of Wondivision, right? Yeah, it just evolves into the big, like, one villain fighting the good guy who's like the same as the, yeah, just that typical shit. Yeah. Yeah. And

Loki, I guess, was okay. I just, I don't know. I don't find these that. interesting they seem like like the movies already feel like filler sometimes so this is like filler for the filler it feels like yeah yeah i they don't do much for me either i don't like i don't hate them or i don't even think they're average like they're pretty well done they're just like so bland like just quite forgettable yeah yeah like what you're saying they they devolved into the same kind of um tropes the the villain the they fight at the end but in a movie it's it's it's so much different, like the structure.

Like, they don't keep you going episode by episode, like, in quite the same way. Like, you do see, as the show goes on, it slowly, it, like, slowly gets worse. Like, it slowly gets more and more, like, a conventional show, and less unique, which is, I feel like that was the case for Wanda Vision

anyway. And yeah, so many of the shows, like, at least Wanda Vision had a hook, and at least it needed to be a show because that's kind of part of that story. I'm like, oh, okay, they integrate it really well. You know, Falcon and Winter Soldier, that felt like filler to me. That's probably the worst of the MCU shows I've seen

just because it didn't really serve much of a point really. And yeah, like that could have been a movie too. Like it doesn't need to be a show. It honestly felt padded out, like really patted out. And it was just about getting, you know, what's his name, The Falcon? It's just about getting him into the Captain America suit, basically. Like you're watching six hours of like this shit just so just for that like just for this one

little nugget of like lore for the MCU it's like yeah it's kind of lame like you keep people going and I think they've disappointed people too with like how little they actually explore in these shows like they don't want to introduce too much because they don't want to affect the films in such a profound way yeah because I don't think a lot of people watch the shows not nearly as many So it's just like, yeah, it's like they like that that Wanda vision show there, there's so much like potential there. Like we thought they were sent up like the mutants with the X-Men. We thought like, well, Quicksilver's in the show. Like Evan Peters is in that show.

Like we thought they were sent up something with him. But like it goes nowhere because they can't step over the toes of like the Spider-Man no way home or whatever fuck. Like the big Marvel movie. So it just, yeah, it becomes like, you know, Evan Peters. is actually just an actor hired by the bad guy and his name is Ralph Boner. Like, that was awful. That's, like, the stupidest fucking twist I think I've ever seen in my life. Yeah, because they know what they're doing, too.

They're like playing with your expectations to make you think something and then pull the rug under. That episode format, like they're sent up, like, aerospace engineer. Like, that's one thing they say. So people are like, oh, is that Mr. Fantastic from the Fantastic Four? Like, is Mephisto in the show? Like, this all this shit. And then, like, yeah, nothing. Like, because they can't, there's only so much they can do, I guess.

So what else of, what other fucking shows are there from them? This, this is like five. Yeah, yeah, but there's a lot of the screen shows from it. Which I barely remember Loki. Like, it was fine. I like Tom Hiddleston, but yeah, Moon Night. I like the directors of Moon Night based on the one movie I've seen from them. They directed a film that I saw earlier in the year called Something in the Dirt.

and it was just so like two dudes making a movie together and that was like the whole point sort of thing it was so much fun it was like kind of like creepy but funny it had a great tone

and they've just been doing this for a while so now I want to check out their old catalog but yeah the fucking Disney gave them this show they directed every episode

of the first season also like one of the main characters died in real life like after they finished the first season season. I think it was like a skiing accident. In no. Yeah. In that Russian guy, that young, was it Russian?

I don't remember. I think it was French. French guy? Yeah. I think he was a French. I'm not familiar with this person, but I just find that, I guess, kind of unfortunate and also interesting that it's like, okay, well, this is like a pretty pivotal character in this show supposedly and just fucking died. So that sucks. Yeah, I missed that. I didn't see about that. Yeah, I wasn't wearing a helmet. It's not done yet, I don't think. Moonnight's fine. I mean, it's

maybe slightly better than some of the other ones just because, like, that director, like, at least you have that one vision, right? I think that kind of helps a lot. Like, it feels very focused. And, like, some of the bad ones, like Falcon and one of the soldiers all over the fucking place. Like, they're setting up all kinds of shit,

like, uh, uh, winter soldier with the Wakandans and, like, all this crazy shit. Um, Moon Knight's, like, It's kind of a fresh start, too. It's not focused on anyone. What's the hook of Moon Knight? What's the hook of it? Well, I guess the hook is that.

It's a new hero. That's like the first thing, right? It's someone you've never seen. And it's Oscar Isaac playing him. And there's like this whole, it's almost like Venom where he's like, he's got different versions of himself that he's like, he's got voices in his head. You know, he's trying to like battle kind of like Venom too. Is it goopy? Is it a goopy movie?

No, no, it's not really goop. It's more like Egyptian. Yeah, mythology, yeah. But I think it works well in the show. Like, Oscar Isaac definitely is really good in the show. Like, he plays these two different characters or I think three, maybe. I don't know if he's Moon Knight or not. He does it all really well, like the different portrayals of the character.

And, you know, he's good in the show. And the show has, like, a bit more of a style to it, like I said, than like a Falcon and the Winter Soldier, which is easily the worst of those shows. But it's just like at the end of the day It's like I don't know It's like you said Alex It's the same Marvel shit Like I haven't seen the full thing yet

Hopefully it gets like I think they'll do something A little more interesting Maybe later on Because it's kind of Like this last episode was pretty good I think like most people Really like the fourth one

The fourth episode The most out of like any of them But You know I don't know I could just fucking devolve Into the same crap again At this point There's nothing about it that's like, it's not like succession or anything.

You know, it doesn't stand in my mind is that Marvel is still not really nailed, like the television part. Yeah, it always seems additive. It's always like a chariot. Yeah, it feels like an extra supplemental. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Right, supplemental. Yeah.

I wish I liked them more. Yeah, they're fine. I think I like Wanda Vision probably the best or like the moon, even Moon Knight. Like, I would recommend those. was there another one? Oh yeah Hawkeye like the same way we're talking about yeah it's fine like I wouldn't recommend it to you guys

no I don't think you'd like it it's like it gives Jeremy runner something to do he was good yeah do you want to do one last question let's end on this one and a kind of simple one from a Swiss to fur 2000 what are your favorite snacks to have at a movie theater

I feel like we've probably answered some form of this before but it's been a while I like chocolate-covered raisins Because they're easy You're not like You don't like this It's just not too messy It's fucking gross

I like chocolate-covered almonds Like yeah And uh Checksmex or popcorn I like those Yeah checksmex is all right Yeah You like Skittles Yeah

They're kind of sugary I like sugar I got like a sweet too I like I like loud food I like celery I like pop ross I'm one of those dickheads I like loud food and I like food that's like hot.

Bags of chips that I have to like crinkle. The people like working at the movie theater they have to fucking like heat something up for me. Like that's the kind of food. I'm like that kind of asshole. Like I want warm nachos. Yeah.

I don't really snack much during movies but if there's a like if I'm ever back in a state that has the Alamo draft house, I'm definitely going to like order some food there. I was in a theater in a, in Georgia recently and I just ordered their like, it was one of those dine-in

things and I forget what the chain was called but it was like a very it had some personality to it but I ordered the just like this appetizer platter to share with like a couple friends it was like it was an insane amount of food they brought it in like a big pizza box

and it was like the portion sizes in the states I'm so not used to Georgia especially getting your money worth yeah Yeah, it was good. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, you do that, like you get the food brought to you at the theater. I've never done that.

I've seen people do it. Yeah, a couple times. It's pretty nice. Some chains that do it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, like the AMC near me does it. Alamo Draft House is awesome. Yeah, yeah, Alamo Draft House, yeah. I mean, I usually try to get a snack, though, sometimes.

Like, I usually get a soda, like a, you know, the giant fucking gulp of the soda. Yeah, get like a big gulp, basically. Yeah, every time I go. Yeah. That's like the only time I have soda, really, is when I go to the theater. What was it about popcorn that made popcorn settle as the cinema snack? Especially considering the fact that like the onomatopoeia pop, it's like part of, it's like a loud noise. It's like part of the product.

And it's allowed to eat too. Probably the price markup. It's easy to keep it going through a theater. Like, you know, literally just like in order for a theater. theater to produce it, it's like nothing. They can make it really quick and easy, have a constant flow of fresh new popcorn, just like soda, yeah. Popcorn and soda, it's all about the amount of money they can make off of it. 99% profit margin. Yeah. That's a good reasoning. That's good reasoning, Adam. Money is always a good. It's like cotton candy. Yeah, you can just like make an

infinite amount of it, basically. Right, exactly. You just need like the machine and the, whatever. Yeah, I like popcorn. Movie theater popcorn is always like a bit too like greasy and like too salty for me. It's like it's always, it's a little bit too much. I prefer something like a little bit lighter. Sure. I usually get it for the novelty. Not always. Yeah, fake butter. Imitation butter. He can pour on it at AMC.

Yeah, yeah, imitation. I'm more likely to bring a snack in if I know it's going to be like a louder movie. If I know it's going to be and quiet, contemplative, dialogue-heavy thing. Maybe not going to get the huge pile of these. Salary and carrots. Yeah, maybe not those kinds of movies. And oysters. The Northman, that was snack.

Yeah, an entire crab that you have to like, yeah, lobster, just crab and butter and crack it open. I thought it was funny. Bill Hayter mentioned he used to work as like a theater Russia and some guy tried sneaking in a wedding cake to a movie. I snuck in an entire pizza Oh cool Yeah that's nice

You should be allowed to bring in just like water bottles though Like the fucking price mark up for a water bottle Well if they catch you they're like yeah you gotta hide it like in your Can you don't take it back in? Yeah well you can hide it they're not gonna like go through your stuff but yeah You can't just like openly walk in with a water bottle which is like you know The price mark up there it's like a fucking eight dollars for a bottle of water like that's crazy That has I would assume that's against some

sort of law here because like you're allowed to bring water into a place you could at least at the very least bring an empty bottle and get it filled up for free for sure they wouldn't be able to prevent you for doing that AMCs are these exclusive places my experience with movie theaters is like yeah I'll like bring a backpack with some stuff

in it but like they never searched my backpack but over the past like 15 years or whatever I've noticed that like employees just like give less and less of a shit like they can they can assume that you have food on you or like a drink or whatever but they're not going to do like in my experience they've just stopped giving a shit like maybe 15 years ago they'd be like hey you can't bring that in but like sure i don't know it seems over time the employees care less and less is what i still wouldn't

walk out openly with like a water bottle or some like food that's not from the theater because because i would you know they tell you like throw it out or something that's usually what they did like when i was younger that's what they thought this was america not in amc yeah then you're not in america then you're in AMC. Are they self-governing? Yeah, basically. AMC's their own, they have their own laws.

Yeah. I'll have to bring in any kind of H2O. All right. Those are, yeah, those are some good questions. And I guess the, there's a movie film recommendation

from Alex, I think. It's me, I think, yeah. I believe. So I've got one, I assume we've all seen.

I'd be shocked if all of us, since it's correct now, I'd not seen this movie, but it's one, I feel like deserves an episode its own podcast. I want to talk about James Cameron movie. Uh-oh. Avatar. Oh, shit. I want to do Avatar.

There's no 4K Blu-ray yet, but sure, let's do it. Oh, shit, right. Okay. I'm also torn on that there are different cuts, I believe. There's an extended version. There's like added. Oh, no. Yeah, so maybe just...

Oh, interesting. Yeah. Have you guys ever seen that extended one? I would watch the extended one like this time Just because I've never seen it Okay So you know what's really funny I bought a Blu-ray for this movie

When it first came out And I got it for like kind of cheap Because I worked at Blockbuster Yeah same here And this will be the first time I put it into my Blu-ray player That's funny This is like 12 years in the making

And I knew I would play it eventually Oh funny I was gonna hang on to it In less of 4K came out I added it to my um My Sardonercast recommended list because I kept seeing people like spreading the like meme of like name one character from Avatar.

Yeah. I agree we do have to talk about this for sure. Yeah. Natiri. Yeah. Got them. Yeah. Cool. Cam, have you seen this movie? Have you heard of it? It's kind of like an obscure. Yeah, kind of a niche one. Yeah, I actually like Avatar. It's funny, you know, because the sequel's coming out. I do too. I remember my, I think we're, what were we in like seventh grade? My friend was like, it might be like 10 years before the next one. I'm like, now he's married. It's so funny. Yeah, crazy.

He'll de-age everybody. Yeah, I'm looking forward to the next one. I mean, it should be interesting. Yeah, this will be a good conversation. Yeah, it'll be interesting. Yeah, sure. Thank you for the recommendation. If you listening at home, don't want to be spoiled for James Cameron's avatar.

We'll watch the film before the next episode. Excuse me. These episodes come out every two weeks publicly. You can listen to them early. If you go to Sardonicast.com, sign up for premium. It's $2 a month, or go to patreon.com slash sardonicast.

Also, we've got merch. Link in the description. Also, fan art, posted on the subreddit or hashtag on Twitter, Sardonicast fan art. Also, there is now someone managing a Sardonicast highlights channel that we're trying to get monetized. Oh, yeah.

So go search that up. I guess we'll put that in the description. We should probably do that. Um, yeah, well Sardana cast highlights. It'll be easy to find. Also, thank you for joining us, Cam. Thank you for having me, guys. This was fun. I wasn't going to forget to say that, but I, of course. I didn't figure you wouldn't, yeah. Um, yeah, thanks. Uh, had a good time, as always.

Yeah, thank you for joining. Thank you guys. Yeah, it was a lot of fun. Cool, cool. Thanks for the movie pick, Shark Tale. I'm glad that you did it, so I wouldn't have to live with the shame. of doing it. Yeah. Because I was considering it at one point. We had to talk about it eventually. Yeah.

I'm glad somebody else. Perfect timing. It's an Oscar nominated film. We can't ignore it. Yeah. The Academy watching that. Oscar, Oscar, Oscar. They're like, yeah, this is good, actually.

This deserves to be nominated. All right. Thanks for listening. Everybody, have a happy Trek Tale something. Bye-bye, everybody. Bye, bye, bye, bye. Thanks for trucking. Bye, bye.