Sardonicast - Sardonicast 153: The Dark, Sad Life of Boogie2988, Leo, Aguirre, the Wrath of God

Episode Date: December 11, 2023

Support the Show for $2 a month and receive all future episodes early at https://sardonicast.com and https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast. Buy Sardonicast T-Shirts, and other merchandise at https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast. Merch: https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast Website: https://sardonicast.com Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/sardonicast Twitter: https://twitter.com/sardonicast Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sardonicast Sardonicast Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8AhJ0bzQgs5fb9m_ZCRqkw/featured Alex's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/IHEOfficial Adam's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/YourMovieSucksDOTorg Alex's Twitter: https://twitter.com/IHE_OFFICIAL Adam's Twitter: https://twitter.com/2gay2lift Adam's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/YMS Intro music by: https://www.youtube.com/user/anUnkindnessvideo Timestamps: 0:00 The Dark, Sad Life of Boogie2988 33:52 British whipped cream 35:30 Leo 1:11:41 Aguirre, the Wrath of God 1:47:10 Questions 2:19:42 Outro + recommendation

Three, two, one. What's up, ladies and gentlemen? Cut in the... That you lie from the power of the internet. This is Adam 2,988, and I am... I did that fine enough, and that is... This is Sardana cast. Yeah, I could be that.

I'm Adam from your movie sex, and I should have got more sleep, but I didn't. I'm Alex from I.E. 2988, and that sucks about your sleep, and sorry to hear that. Yeah. Stressful time, stressful months. Yeah. I'm in a, I'm in a room where I've set up my desk and I can record this. There's a little bit of echo and a lot of stuff that still needs to be done. A lot, a lot of shit.

Always is moving. I hate moving. Moving sucks. It sucks. And it's expensive. If only I had, what, like $300,000 in crypto right now that I just don't want to take out in case it gets bigger. Was that the figure? I think it was like it started at a million and he still has like somewhere between

150,000 and 300,000. But he's just like, you know, he could withdraw it and probably fix a lot of the issues he complains about in the documentary. But instead he's kind of just keeping it in crypto and just hoping that it goes up again. Oh, I didn't realize he's still in it. That's bizarre. Oh yeah, he chose his phone. Interesting choice.

Yeah, there's a lot of it's kind of. It's kind of fascinating. There was a documentary. What was the title? The Dark Sad Life of Buggy 2988, official documentary. Okay. Boogie Knights, right?

Boogie Knights 2988. Sad. I'm trying to find the IMDB page. There it is. The Dark, Sad Life of Boogie 2988 by Mike Klem. This got a lot of attention on the internet. This guy, everybody was talking about it. Yeah, exactly.

This was like his premiere for his channel, which is cool. I don't think I know this Mike Clumke. I think it's his first doc. I'm pretty sure he like, he lived with Bougy for months and worked in partnership with him to get this made. Yeah. Only Bougie would allow this to happen because I feel like most people want to hide how embarrassing some of the subject matter is. But I guess he counts as a quote unquote lol cow and the attention currency is what he's after. Yeah, he has a mental problem where he just, I don't know.

Probably more than one, I expect. He just wants to explain to the world how pitiful he is and that is how he advances through life or something, or that's how people donate money to him, I guess. Maybe he gets off on it a little bit. It's hard to know. Yeah, I'm not sure. I mean, like, I'm not, I'm trying my best not to be devoid. of empathy.

Because I do feel bad for the guy, even though pretty much everything that's happening to him is his own fault. And he continues doing it, even though he seems conscious and self-aware enough to be able to address his own flaws and issues, but kind of just chooses not to do anything about it. I think that's what frustrates people about Buggy, right? Yeah.

Because he's always looking for that feedback from the fans of people to prop him up, but he always was putting himself down. And whenever he gets into any drama, he like just goes on his back foot or I don't know, he's, he's all over the place this go. Yeah. The documentary, he definitely delves into it. It just brings up a lot of confusing asked questions, but I suppose we should just start with like, what did you think of the production of the documentary? Because that's what, that's kind of what kept me in. I went on this video when it had, I don't know, maybe like 20,000 views. It had like just been uploaded. I was like, yeah, I'll see what this is about.

And the level of quality of it was kind of keeping me going. Like, oh, they clearly made a real documentary, not just like a Shane Dawson, you know, pretend documentary. And quote, pretend YouTube documentary. Like, it's an actual documentary. There's research and you can dispute certain facts and figures that I've heard after the fact to maybe not accurate or been exaggerated, but that's a problem with many documentaries. So I thought it was interesting.

just staying all the way through. It's only 55 minutes. Yeah, interesting. And I'd watch something else from this, this Mike Lum guy. Yeah. This is what he wants to do. I think he worked in some sort of film production before this, like, I don't know, doing commercials or something, or at least with some other team or something. I like this route, and I'm interested to see what he covers next. I don't know if that's necessarily just going to be like, oh, let's find a YouTuber who fell off. I don't know if that's necessarily going to be like every project. But I do appreciate that there's content on the platform that tries a bit harder. And sometimes it's kind of interesting because I got to thinking about like, okay, well,

you can still make something technically that's more. effortful than that that's not considered like a real documentary in a sense right you there's there's a kind of stigma and a kind of interesting way that we categorize certain media especially with new internet media and so I think of something like okay I did like a two and a half hour Kimba documentary I guess but I don't call it a documentary I made a YouTube video. It would be a documentary if I got a camera out and did some like interviews with like lighting, right?

Then it would be a documentary, I guess. Or maybe I can still call it a documentary, you know? Like there's people that release films and film festivals that they say are documentary. Like room 237 was barely a documentary. That was more of a YouTube video than a documentary to me. But yeah, it's kind of interesting. I do like that the director really kind of got into the source material, despite the weirdness of Boogie approving it,

because you don't necessarily want to do that with the documentary, like have the subject be approving the end result, because then that makes it biased. But I think with this particular, doc, Boogie is just so not self-aware and thinks that everything that's in the dock will make people feel sorry for him and give him money or something and help restart his YouTube career. And maybe he's just looking for attention just so he gets the numbers back up. God, it's so weird and kind of frustrating.

Sorry, I'm rambling a bit, but the, I think what pisses me off the most about him is, that he's not even really creating good content, but he acts super entitled about it. He's literally just, like, his entire popularity on YouTube has been, be a fat guy, pretend to have a lisp and, like, flip a table. That was his first phase. Then his second phase was interject on every single popular thing that was happening on the internet, some drama, and then take the most absolute centrist take possible to the point where it was so consistent where I didn't even believe that he had real opinions and he was just making things up because it was just like, okay, you have the most centrist take on literally everything and you never really did, okay,

right? And so it's like, okay, you're getting in front of a camera and just talking, right? You're not even like, you're not even putting effort into your content. Like no fucking shit, your channel's dying. Yeah, yeah. He's a confusing one because, he's what like mid 2010s people were starting to quite like him he was more of like uh i don't know philip de franco type figure you know granddad of youtube he's been there the whole time and he's like giving his opinion on everything but yeah the more he gave his opinion and the more middling it was people kind of started getting frustrated and seen through it uh and yeah they kind of delve into that with the documentary there's there's like a point where the the narrative and the way it's being presented

kind of like breaks or something. Spent a few weeks since I've seen this, right? And he's got to like go more into the investigative part. Like the director breaks the fourth wall and closes his laptop and that was my favorite part. I think that that was the best choice for the documentary is like him becoming a character in it, which is not like, you know, other documentary filmmakers have done it, David Ferry or Michael Moore, etc. but I feel like his inclusion really gave it a much more relatable and kind of like empathetic

lens to view the film from because he's like literally just making it like I don't want to make something that's just like depressing like everything he says is just the saddest shit I've ever heard like I love that that made it a bit funny and it it makes the documentary pretty self-aware too yeah yeah and gives it a focus after that halfway point where it's just the most dramatic things that have happened with the, you know, the gun incident, the crypto stuff, the hookers, yada, yada, yada. And then it's like, so what's he doing now? What prospects does he have? And there's the whole like mock job interview thing. Yeah. Also, it's kind of funny. Yeah, where he just shoots himself in the foot intentionally because he doesn't really want a job and he, like,

wasted everybody's time. That's the frustrating part. Yeah. Because it's like, you're clearly playing this up for the camera in some way. Yeah. You're not being earnest in the way you're engaging with this idea because you know this would be juicy for the doc. It's like a toddler thing. Yeah. So it's more like where what is the motivation?

Is it just like craves the attention or needs money or both? I think it's just like a mix of all of it. Yeah. I mean human beings, the way that our brains work is the, the patterns of. both emotions and behavior in response to things in our lives, if you make that a consistent thing in your life, then it starts to become something that's more difficult to break away from. Something that can at first be a conscious choice

can wind up becoming essentially a reflex as your life continues on if you're doing the same thing over and over. It seems like, you know, I'm trying to psychoanalyze a guy through a fucking YouTube documentary, but, you know, It seems like boogie is just the type of person who saw that as some sort of solution, maybe consciously, maybe subconsciously. Yeah. And now it's just what he knows how to do.

And so he just does it. And he just, you know, I've met a bunch of people before where, you know, you try to help them out of a situation and they'll do everything in their power not to be helped. And they just want to be miserable and complain about it. And they don't actually want to succeed. And they don't actually want to fix their life. and they just

their pattern of behavior is just being miserable and sabotaging themselves and everybody around them that tries to help them there is a long pattern because he's been online for a long time it must be close to like

two decades at this point it must be getting there nearly yeah it is just a continuous pattern and there is just like a this is just like sad and pathetic at a certain point and it's almost like weaponizing people's sympathies at a certain point.

Like, I've spoke to Boogie once. Same. And even in that call, he was, like, whipping out the references to his traumatic childhood and, like, in detail that might not be appropriate for someone you've, like, just started speaking to. Yeah. But I think, I think, you know, there's certain people that will say those things is, like, knowing that putting that out is a prerequisite to a relationship. will give them some sort of advantage over them.

Even if that just means a sympathetic. I don't even think it's necessarily consciously like malicious. I don't think that boogie thinks he's like, he, I get control over them. No, no, no. But it is one of those things where it's like, okay, well, they know that people will treat them more cautiously

or, you know, with kid gloves or, you know, be nicer or sympathetic. There's some people who are particularly vulnerable to that kind of thing in the sense of there's some people who are easily manipulated by that kind of thing and even if it happens to them many times in their lives and even if they come across many of these characters There's people that will like go out of their way to like take advantage of that type of person and kind of seek that person out and it's been a very long journey for me trying to like not fall into those patterns because I have been very susceptible to that kind of thing which is also why this kind of pisses me off in like a personal way. You know, there's people that will literally if they find out that you're a person that has been abused by other people

or manipulated by other people, they will use that information to try and manipulate you and be like, oh, I'm sorry that you, like, and it just reminds me too much of that type of person. So I don't know exactly. I think I'm being pretty charitable when I say that he's not doing it consciously,

but I would rather assume ignorance over malice for those people. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, to talk about the production of this documentary, I really liked what it was doing with the tone. It was well edited. I liked the music choices.

I thought it was a great concept. You picked the perfect subject to make this, and hopefully now with the success of this documentary, he'll be able to explore different options, but I just don't know what those options would be. Yeah. Yeah, I think that part of this documentary's biggest problem is that it is, it is something that everybody who knows who Boogie is watching

because they're like, oh, yeah, this fucking guy or whatever. It doesn't do a great job at giving context for people who aren't kind of already familiar with the lore. So this is a film that is under an hour long, and it easily could have been an hour and a half plus. It easily could have talked about how Boogie bought a Tesla and like begged his fans for money for that out of nowhere. And he was like, he was talking about how, like there's so much to the lore that I think would be important information to include in this documentary, especially given the angle at which this documentary is coming from, the fact that, the entire thing just seems like a fucking greatest hits collection of this guy's fuck fuck ups right so you might as well include all these other things um i kind of appreciate

the restraint there in that respect because like considering how i dread to think how many like pages i've just opened like his kiwi farms it's like what 2,536 pages worth of material just on there that's not even talking to the guy the dramas the history there is a lot of lot to cover there. Yeah. I can understand that at least from his perspective why he'd maybe want to start where he does with like him in the bath going to sticking to the numbers. I quite like that angle of it because that's been like one of these questions up in the year people know about his investments. Like this financial situation? Yeah. But then that also adds to the frustration and kind of the impact of the documentary for me where it's like he's talking about how he needs a certain amount each

month and to pay off this and that meanwhile he's living in this like pretty luxurious like giant house. He owns property and refuses to rent out half of it. Like fuck you. Yeah, true. Rent it out. You own the property. They can pay your fucking mortgage. Supposedly in when one of his family members passed away, he was, uh, he inherited like a house or something as well that he refuses to sell and the whole, all the crypto stuff. And it's like, whenever he's been, he's been challenged on it. He was asked like, when, when the crypto earnings were up, why did you not at least take out enough to just pay off your house there and then, to which She just says, I was so depressed at the time that dead people don't need a place to live.

Yeah, you can use that as an excuse for anything. It's just like, oh, I'm depressed and I do this self-destructive thing because I'm depressed, and I'm making myself more depressed because I'm doing these self-destructive things. Same for the hooker stuff and all of that. Yeah, it all feeds into this one inconsistent character study. I deserve an LA-10, not an Arkansas 8th. Oh, my God. That's what I should have opened up with.

That's the quote. You don't want to be hearing that. That's maybe one of the more controversial parts of the video speaking on that kind of stuff is there's a big section on his girlfriend, his 20-year-old girlfriend. He could be like her dad, I guess. They dance around that just enough, but then it kind of leans a little bit into what you're saying

with this weird sort of manipulation. it can come across us where there's that whole scene where he sits there down and it's like I'm old and I'm so obese I'm probably going to die soon there's nothing I can do about it I can't start making life choices now I've accepted my faith so she's in bits and like hurt by it yeah it's like fucking just torturing this poor girl and just showing her do like the fucking the montage of her doing all of his yard work and shit I'm like damn you know if she wasn't doing all this shit for you for free maybe she could get a real job and help paid some of your...

Yeah. You know, maybe it could be 50-50 on the house. And then, like, when he is talking about the budgeting, like, he's going through his list and he's like, oh, yeah, Boulder's Gate just came out. That's, I have to play that. I know, it's like, come on, man. Like, what are you talking about? That's funny.

Something, like, very unsurious about a lot of the misery that's being presented. And that's not to, like, downplay any of the actual trauma and horrible stuff he's gone through, but it's also like, man. You're how old now and this is the state you're in? A lot of people will be set for life if you kind of played your cards a little bit smarter, you know? Yeah, yeah. It's it's it makes me want to avoid that. It makes me want to avoid having that happen.

but I think I'm not that shitty. So I guess I think I'll be fine. That's what makes it so intriguing. It's like I feel like most people in his situation would not make a lot of these decisions. It's kind of what makes it the crazy story that it is. Don't buy a fucking Tesla for no reason. Yeah. Literally for no reason.

Like you have poor impulse control. You just have poor impulse control on spending. And that must have been what in the mid-20s? tens so it'd be like top price like 100k if not more so yeah you're like the most expensive model and he was he was literally asking for his fans

to cover it he was like he made a video about it he's like guys I just I need to buy this Tesla and I know that it's like expensive but he oh my god the way he was trying to frame it was as if he was doing the world a favor because he was helping to

make environmental cars better like Like, like, he was, he was framing it like he was doing a good deed to society and that this was a thing that, like, needed to happen. Which is crazy. Like, fuck, that's so expensive. That's so expensive. Like, I, if I make a video asking my fans for money, it's going to be for some real shit. Like, not, not for a Tesla.

No. It's going to be for, like, a medical bill. No, it's ridiculous. I don't know why that was such like a. stereotype but I don't know if it is quite anymore because it tells us they're not really the status symbol in the same way they were a few years ago but like so many YouTubers were just hop in on the Tesla bandwagon I remember scarce driving around one it's just look at the self-driving look at all this just flagrantly wasting money yeah and I mean if you have the money to waste fucking go for it yeah that's a problem a hundred thousand dollars doesn't mean anything to you if I can go for it but if you have to if you have to make a YouTube video to you your fans and the subject matter of the YouTube video is you need to help me buy my Tesla. Maybe you should think a bit about whether or not you need it. Yeah, exactly.

Because then when it comes around to him being like, yeah, 800 bucks for medical insurance, 500 bucks for medical bills, 750 bucks for doctors visits, 950 bucks for physical therapy. And it's like, well, Tesla could pay for that for that long-ass time, bugger. I was on Amazon a couple days ago. And I saw, I saw like a new, like, SSD card. And I was like, fuck, I could really use some more memory for this PC that I'm setting up. And it was like a Black Friday deal. And it was like between $100 and $200.

And I was like, you know, I'll need this eventually. It's a good sale price right now. But then I thought, you know, this has already been a really fucking expensive month for me, moving and not being able to work as much while I'm moving. so my paychecks are lower. And so I decided not to do it. Yeah. I decided that even though it's something I could use for my work and would make my work,

I'm like, no, I'll just keep moving things on to the external drive for now. This is probably like I'm going to try my best to not make like stupid unnecessary purchases right now. I'm not going to buy like a fucking Tesla ever. No. Damn. No, forget about it. Yeah, it's just a weird environment because the barrier to entry, I guess, is so minimal on YouTube that, yeah, these people are going to rise to the top for being, for making bad decisions, basically. So then what do you do when you're buggy and you're kind of as famous or infamous, depending on you ask, as you are?

Like, what can you even do at that point? I mean, he probably could turn around, but as you're saying, these patterns, everything's so deeply rooted. It requires such a like Oh that reminds me Yeah like the part towards the end where He takes like What does he take? He like goes into the woods with the guy and takes a

Oh he takes mushrooms That's it. He takes mushrooms Not even really like necessarily What you should be taking for your spirit journey or whatever And also it's just some fucking like dumb hick And like what do you You'd call in him a shaman

It's just like a redneck with like some Pabst blue ribbon or what Like I don't know Yeah, that's right, that's right. That was my mental image. Yeah, he, it seemed like it was... Got to do drugs now. That was kind of placed at that point in the documentary to, I guess, try and end it on a more hopeful note for the future, whereas supposedly that happened before, was it before the fight? That's right.

It shows his fight with the wings of redemption or whatever. Yeah. The law here is just crazy to keep track of, and they loses that fight. But I guess they didn't want to end there, so they ended on the drug thing. instead. So I get a bit of creative license. I think, well, they did the drug thing and then I think like most of the ending was the relationship, the girl thing.

And I don't know if the documentary said this or if I just found this out. Because I started, after I watched the documentary, I, um, I watched Mudahar's take down and I watched Charlie's take down and both were, like Moodahars was particularly, um, vicious. Scading? But, but needed, you know, it was like, yeah. I get it. I get it. It's funny how the result of this documentary that Boogie approved is like,

okay, you got some attention back, but everybody's kind of like everybody thinks you're a massive piece of shit. Now a lot of people are just learning about like how much you suck is basically the result of it. I think he's just trying to lean into the no such thing as bad publicity. He's like he's got his new podcast now. Yeah.

The local podcast, whatever it's going on, all this kind of stuff. I don't know. Yeah, I don't, what else do you do if you're desperate for money and don't want to put any effort into anything and just kind of want to get money for existing and being a personality, then I guess you kind of have to lean into the law cow shit. Yeah. But even then it's like, see, I can't empathize though because I have some sort of like humility.

So like if I'm thinking my brain in his position right now, it's like, like how do we sort this problem right here right now? Okay, downsize the house, sell the other one, get that money out at the Ethereum. Right there, you've got like hundreds of thousands of dollars, you know? So when he's like, he's kind of complaining in it about how hard done by you is, it's hard to stay on his side with that kind of stuff. Yeah, most people don't have the amount of money that he currently refuses to withdraw from crypto.

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know if he's just blind to that or thinks it would be more. get more engagement or what? I don't know. He's kind of an enigma. Mm-hmm. So I, yeah, I liked Mike Klem as a character in the documentary. I hope that the success of this encourages more people to try and do things like this, because I think that having this kind of like extra effort content, it's a lot better than what he says he was inspired by.

I don't know if he saw this credit at the end, but he was like, inspired by Sunny V2. I was like, oh, that's interesting because that's maybe some of the worst content on the internet. I find Sunny V2 absolutely unwatchable. I don't understand why that's a huge channel, but...

I don't even think I know who Sunny V2 is. I've just searched them. You've probably seen the Twitter controversy that... They basically, after Mr. Beast's friend came out as trans, they did this whole, like, hour long, like, is this going to ruin Mr. Beast's career? Like, what? And it was just like a weirdly speculative, like, kind of inappropriate.

Like, you don't even know these people and you're making all these weird judgment calls about their relationship. But, like, so much of their content is just, like, exaggerating things that are not big deals into weird drama farming kind of formats. Oh, I have seen one or two of these. I've been scrolling through the most intense arguments on Joe Rogan's history, this kind of stuff. Yeah, and just like the commentary that they offer is just so fucking substanceless. And they don't really say anything.

And I just, I don't understand why anybody likes that channel. It's very bizarre. I've seen like maybe two or three videos, but not all the way through because I just found them to be unwatchable. And that was the inspiration. That is interesting. Yeah, I find that fascinating because that content's like actually shit. It's like it's really bad. It's sunny V2. They don't present it like a traditional documentary. Do that?

No. And what Mike Klem wound up doing is he, at the very least, because of him actually going to the person's house and filming them and getting to know them and be interacting with them. I think that that inherently kind of. provides the opportunity for what you create to be done through a more empathetic perspective inherently, because I think so much of people covering other people that they don't know or will never meet in real life or, you know, just kind of making a video about someone through the internet, that can really easily devolve into something that's just like a little more malicious than it needs to be or like, yeah, you know, that sunny V2 video about like Mr. Beasts

like, you wouldn't make that if you went to their house and filmed them. Like, you wouldn't make that if you interviewed them. You wouldn't make that if you, like, had ever seen them in person. It's just something that can only be made when you're, like,

so detached from the subject matter that you're making these, like, absolutely baseless, weird, wild speculations that are just completely inappropriate and just absolute cringe, right? So, I don't know. I like that Mike Trump kind of avoided.

I thought it would be more maybe inspired by, I know, Idubs has done a couple of the, Yeah, I rewatched full force after this too because I had a hankering for it and my boyfriend hadn't seen that. Shout out to the I-Dubs documentaries, those are good. Getting away with it's pretty interesting.

But yeah, I don't know. That is weird to learn. Because I'm just kind of curiously how he must have lived with him for like months or at least darted backwards and forwards. Yeah. Like a lot of time. How did he fund?

this how did he you know like uh i'm curious about that well it said that boogie was not compensated so that would save some money and then uh i don't know just depends depends on how much time you're investing into something you can it's just a weird project because it's like not only did he have to invest all that time like living or really spending a hell of a lot of time with boogie but boogie also had to approve it and like who's like who approached who like what the it's just a very weird thing where it's come together yeah interesting project i'm excited to see more sorry for shitting on your inspiration mike club i know you're listening they sent me an email after i subscribe to their channel no funny um yeah sunny b2's shit

bad content bogey's shit bad content documentary was pretty good. Yeah, I'd like to see more high effort stuff. Six out of ten from me. There's a lot more that they could have included. And I don't even think that it necessarily would have changed the outlook or perspective or the degree of empathy that it's approaching the project with. I don't think that including more information and context would have changed that. There's so much more you could have done with it. I think that this documentary could have at least been another like 30 minutes. and just even only just for context and it doesn't have to necessarily be about

like all the greatest hits and fucking Tesla shit it could, there's tons more context they could have provided in all aspects of like Boogie's life and etc. I felt like this was a great, very thoroughly interesting watch that, you know, a little rough around the edges here and there,

but could have been more and was very entertaining, very solid first feature. Yeah, I'm pretty much so that with you. give it a six out of ten or a three star. Yeah, a very solid first documentary. I like seeing this stuff in the YouTube space specifically because I'm sure, I mean, what is it? It's just past four million views and I'm sure that's probably more than a vast majority of documentaries

on Netflix or Amazon Prime or whatever. Why do you want to pluck? Like, there's definitely an audience where there's a hunger for it, so I hope can keep this going. Maybe it'll just make boogie documentaries forever if there's that much content on it. Yeah, everybody gets to make one boogie duck. Damn, I should get in on that. I can make a boogie duck. Everyone gets one Kiwi farm page. Yes.

Oh, I was also going to mention, I don't consider Kiwi firms to be like a trustworthy source on anything. They kind of just, they don't really care about very, it's literally just like a drama forum and they don't care about verification or accuracy. see. So it's like the people populating someone's page are all people who have a vested interest in

shitting on that person. So they're willing to believe like any rumor or post or if somebody else says like I heard that this happened to this person then they'll just run with it as fact. So yeah, I'm not a fan of that as a source for any kind of reliable information.

I don't consider it to be at all. No, me neither. Yeah. I was told to ask you what British people call whipped cream in a can. I would just call it whipped cream, to be honest. Well, fuck. Somebody on the subreddit. I don't know.

Somebody on the subreddit was acting like I should ask you that. Maybe I feel like I've been like Americanized over the years. Maybe like, I swear it's ripped cream. It's not like something I really buy. Okay, the first thing that's shut. I was up in my Google search from the daily mail. They call it squirty cream. Squirty cream.

Oh, is that like the... Hold on, let me find this. It might be a... I guess maybe enough. Asda does squirty cream. Okay, what if I search up just the word squirty cream? Wait, might not allow it results. Yeah.

Okay, no, it's dictionary. is the first the first result is Oxford squirty cream British whipped cream dispensed from an aerosol can a hot chocolate

with squirty cream used in a sentence Yeah so there are four results on like Tesco's website Okay Supermarket chain here Squirty cream President squirty spray cream

That's good Food heaven whip spray cream vegan Yeah yeah Nice So President Squirty. I got to keep my eye for that. Yeah, I got to get me some squirty spray cream.

Damn, I thought Bill Clinton was President Squirty. True. All right. We saw a film called Leo, 2023. And although there is another 2023 film called Leo, apparently, this one's the Netflix one. This has got Adam Sandler, it's got Bill Burr. And the reason why I was. was kind of drawn to this and decided to watch it a couple different reasons a there was only time for

like you know one movie i could watch with my boyfriend before he leave for thanksgiving and then i was fucking spending three days moving shit um and i didn't want it to be something that he would maybe fall asleep through uh this looked decent enough and the fact that it has a notably higher audience and a critical score than Disney's current new film in theaters Wish, which I thought at least some people would like because of the animation style, the art style choices or whatever. But it seems to be being like very poorly received. Yeah, it's the same. Well, it looks very boring. Whereas this one seems to be catching people off guard. And I think to a large extent it did for me as well. Although it is it has a lot of issues

but I kind of fucking like this movie and even holding myself back from like I want to be careful not to overrate something just because I was pleasantly surprised by it and had worse expectations

but I did I did like enough about this movie that I feel like I could watch it again um there's there's I liked what it was doing but I can tell from your tone that you don't feel that way and I'm interested.

I don't know if I'd watch it again. I'd put it on for like a child or my child or whatever. I think it's appropriate for them. You have a child? I got so many children. I'm like Drake over here. Oh shit. Kids everywhere.

Yeah, I don't know. I got a few thoughts about this movie. I was surprised that you messaged me about it at all, to be honest. This is when you checked out. But Adam Sandler and that Netflix duo, I guess. It's like a big thing. It gets stuff made. It's got Tuatara as the lead character.

I'm a big Tuatara fan. Who? So I don't know. It's just the breed of lizard. Oh. But yeah, whatever. I don't know how much... Okay, let's just reel this back of me.

I'm getting lost. Adam Sandler, right? He's done a lot of voice acting over the years. There's lots of different characters. That Christmas movie that's unbearable. It's the Hanukkah movie, you fucking racist. Oh, sorry, yeah. Oh, of course.

I haven't actually seen it to be fair. I've only seen the critic video on that one. It's hazy in my mind. Then you've got like Hotel Transylvania or whatever, and he's fine in there. He's got to do that Transylvanian Dracula voice, so I think it like holds him back from doing some of his. They're actually all right, at least the first one from memory.

But anyway, that was the first thing that I, the big hurdle I was trying to jump over was that his voice that he likes to whip out. It's okay. And I feel like for the first half of the movie, he's just, he's just going 15% to Adam Sandler. I know that's why people like love him. That's why they watch him, but he's doing that fucking voice, man. It's so, it's so grating. It's so annoying.

And he's supposed to be this old as lizard. He's like screaming. What was that line? He screamed. Because, of course, it's an Adam Sandler, happy Madsen production. so it's got to have product placements absolutely everywhere. Cheetos. That's right.

He screams like, Cinnamon or whatever, you know. I can't be doing with the screaming Adam Sander. So that was hard for me to get over. It's just kind of frustrating because I quite like this character of Leo, to be honest. I think it's kind of a fun, cute premise. It doesn't take itself too seriously, well, really seriously at all. It's like goofy as hell.

and it got some like kind of hearty laughs out of me at points that and that was what I was not expecting at all some genuine human mostly about Bill Burr Turtle Bill Burdle because Bill Bertel because the whole the whole premise is it's like these two these two animals are stuck in what's it what do you call it in America is it kindergarten a bit older elementary school elementary school I guess yeah primary school in the UK These animals, they've been stuck in this cell, basically, for like decades and decades and decades, watching generations of kids come through. And Leo hears that he's nearly 75 years old, and that's the age that Tuotaras lived to. So he's going to die.

So then he has this existential crisis, and he's like, I'm going to become a nice teacher for the students who's better than the horrible teacher who comes in as a substitute. And that's kind of the thrust of what's going on. It's lots of scenes of him, giving advice to the kids with their various problems. And that's when the funniest scene with Bill Burr comes in is because he gets jealous of Leo getting all of this attention from the kids. They keep taking him home. And he's given this advice. And then Bill Burr manages to sneak in with Leo one night and goes home and gives his go at giving advice. And it's a very funny sequence.

And then if it's a mix of the writing and just Bill Burr's delivery, he's obviously, I really find Bill Beyer funny. I love Bill. I love Bill. And his delivery was really funny when he said, yeah, I picked you because I like his style. Now tell me your problems. I'm talking Turtel over here. And all this guy's stuff. That was like really funny to me.

That was hilarious. That was probably funnier than anything Leo does himself. He's not supposed to be the Bill Bear character is not supposed to be the heart or anything. So I don't think that matters. Yeah, that was like the most memorable scene to me, to be honest, that whole, and anytime the turtle's doing anything. Because of course there's like the standard kind of saccharine kids movie stuff where it's like, you know, a really cute. It's got a bunch of annoying kid characters doing their thing. Yeah, it sucks.

I was so mad when the first like 10 minutes of the movie, I'm like, just the kids and they're all singing. I'm like, the fuck is this shit? I'm like, I wanted to see some musical angle. I wanted to see some scaly. I thought it was a scaly movie, not a kid, dumb human kid movie. That's right.

You're saying that they were singing. That was another surprise. The songs were like a kind of musical, but not a very good one. If that was, if that's what it was going for. It couldn't find the balance for me where it's like, I'm fine with the songs, but you've either got to make them good songs

So you're going to make it funny. And a couple of them are funny. A couple of them are funny. The one towards the end where it's like one of the last lines is like... It's talking about like the fucking endorphins from crying. There was that one but it's more that that's right. It ends with him like commenting on how I'm somehow not going to die alone. That was it.

Yeah. It was like it has this little sprinkle of like, oh, this is actually kind of like funny for an adult. Like it's not just slapstick. It's not just dumb. there's some there's some stuff clearly in that like the billboe character you're like looks at the camera at one point dick joe he's like I was talking about his tail that was so funny to me it it wouldn't have been funny or as funny if they didn't do the zoom in like the musical cue that and the the raising eyebrows like I like that moment of

self-awareness what I found fascinating about this film is you know there's a lot about it that just I hate doesn't work. But I liked, the stuff that I liked about it, I liked so much that it kind of made up for it. And also, the average Disney movie, or let's say most animated movies or kids movies or just movies in general that are trying to like get laughs out of me

or be interesting or weird, it just doesn't work in any way whatsoever. So for this film to have, I don't know, like at least five to ten, different parts in it where I'm like genuinely laughing and I'm like enjoying it and you know it I'm impressed by it in in certain ways that's a lot more than most animated movies that come out in here you look at like I pretty much watch every Oscar nominated animated film and then some yeah right and I enjoy that this one seemed like it was trying in a lot of

different ways. It felt like from the writing. Sorry? To be an Oscar level. No. But, well, I mean, maybe somebody. Maybe. So I was going to say, it seems like between the writers, there's probably one really talented

writer and then a couple shit writers. And they're almost kind of arguing with each other over what the film should be or which direction it should go or, you know, what lines should be in which places? Because there was a moment where, I guess, like, during one of the songs, one of the characters rhymed one word with the same word. And after she's done singing, the character Leo, Adam Sandler, he literally just calls it out. He's like, I don't know if that was more. That wasn't really a rhyme. You were just kind of saying the same word again. I feel like, you know, maybe I'm wrong about this, but I feel like whoever wrote the lyrics was probably a different person than the person writing the dialogue, or at

least that part of the dialogue, and that when maybe it was just Adam Sandler himself writing this part, because he did produce it, and I think he has a writing credit. Yeah, he does. He is credits at his right, too, yeah. Yeah. So he, in my head canon, Adam Sandler, Sandler looked at those lyrics and was like, that's shit, but I'm just going to call you out for it in the movie and then add that level of self-awareness. And I feel like that sort of thing was done like a few different times in the movie where it seems like one writer was just writing something really shit. And then Adam Sandler or somebody on the writing team was like, I'm going to call you out a bit for that. We're going to change it into something self-aware here. That's a good observation because I noticed that when I was looking at this film on IMDB that it does have three directors and three writers. And I think, yeah, I looked up one of the writers, Robert Smygel. She worked on late night with Conan O'Brien and like S&L and stuff. And I noticed there was like a Conan Easter egg on the shelf of one of the kids' rooms.

They had like a bunch of pop vinyl or whatever. one of them was Conan so I don't know if that was I don't know must be the writer getting that in there but that's kind of like they were batting like one for three for me that's kind of how it felt every one of the three jokes. It genuinely feels like that we're like one writer is really talented and the other two suck but the talented writer shines through in such a way that like I was just happy to connect with something and just happy to be into something, even if it was only for one third of what was happening writing-wise.

But yeah, there were some really funny jokes and really good ideas in here, too. I think that it was refreshing to see a movie aimed for kids that was a bit more kind of explicit and risk-taking. There's weird kind of graphic violence in way, like his tail gets cut off. twice. There's someone like missing fingers that you can see and like... There's a pink eye joke. Yeah, there's some weirdly adult stuff in there. And I don't know.

I felt like it wasn't the standard paint by numbers, you know, pretend to be Pixar thing. No. The main character is like 75 years old. You don't really see that often in terms of like for a kid's movie in terms of the trying to be a relatable kid. The only other one I can think of is like up. And even then up, it's like, well, you know, you have the little boy and it's more of a dynamic duo of like, I'm so grumpy because, you know, which turns it more into the standard formulated, okay, you've got the two characters on an adventure and one of them's serious and one of them's goofy. Like that, even up is like way too hard into the formulaic kind of area.

Whereas this film, even though I could tell where it was going structure-wise for a good chunk of it, you know, as soon as he got to the first kid, I'm like, okay, so he's going to have a pep talk with each of these kids, and they're each going to have, like, a different moment. It did enough that was just so wacky and kind of like out there and weird

that I couldn't see coming that it kind of gave me almost like Madagascar three vibes in terms of just like, it was just kind of just doing shit and not giving a fuck. and it was doing what it wanted without necessarily feeling like it had to constrain itself to what a kid's movie is supposed to be or what a narrative is supposed to be. And I like that it went into something that was a bit more free form.

And it wound up creating an experience that I was like, okay, this this connects with me more because I'm not just watching the same thing that I've already seen a billion times. I'm seeing something that feels a bit more refreshing and new. The whole like this weird. plot device where they're all mad because they find out that they're all his side hose. They're like, I thought I was your special friend. Shit like that and like the bus lady like killing him and like or trying to and like there's just so much weird shit that happens in this movie that I just find so bizarre that that's what

they wanted to do. And even though every choice didn't work, I was at least appreciating that it was a choice that I wasn't familiar with. And just, yeah, I'm seeing a new choice. You know, I like that. It's interesting you bring up Mad 3 over here because that's, I guess that's kind of of one of the X-Factor things I was missing here because every time it was doing something a little bit crazy, a little bit mad, I was like, oh, this is cool.

I like this, like what you're saying. The more kind of edgy humor is playing with like death and, yeah, this gore and all this kind of crazy stuff that I was into. It was more the formulaic stuff. And it never like, it doesn't. pickets lane in terms of that stuff i feel like madagascar three it's just it's just doubles down on the craziness you know you got this woman running through walls jumping on helicopters you got bears falling in love with lemas and crazy it's just mad it's just nuts yeah it's not quite that

level because it does want to have that admittedly quite nice like uh point to it to the character you know so everyone needs to find your leo and it's like a good message for little kids You're like a mentor. Don't keep it inside. Like, communicate your feelings and the stuff about crying and talking about the scientific stuff with the endorphins that are released and all that. So that's cool that you manage to sneak that in there. I do appreciate that. But I guess one of my bigger issues is kind of the visuals of the film.

I think the character animation is pretty good. I think a lot of that animation is fine, but I don't think it fully utilizes the medium. No. A lot of really, really flat stuff going on here. Yeah, especially when it comes to... In terms of like texture or movement or... No, it's more... The main characters, I was kind of okay with the character animation and the character design

and a lot of the way that worked. That's where obviously most of the work went into. It's more like background stuff, environments, all super generic, flat, boring. Yeah, some of the backgrounds are not. And especially color as well. I thought like the use of color, was pretty, pretty flat. So I don't know.

I just feel like there's so much you can do with animation and just have it be, yeah, it's a talking lizard in a school. And it's a school that looks like a school. I, the way you're describing it would, the way you're describing it is almost like what my expectations for it, what it was, were. I don't know. Yeah. I did get more out of it in animation, especially.

because I like that with each kid, even though like the songs are like kind of not great. I like what they were going for in terms of like, okay, each song, they're going to try and do like a little bit of a different genre. And they also did a different kind of animation style to it. Some of these styles worked better than others, but they were definitely trying.

They were definitely trying to do something at least visually interesting for certain sequences in this film and showing that they weren't just. just like one note like, okay, we're going to make this bland movie that, you know, you, I didn't, I didn't feel claustrophobic and I didn't feel like, oh, that the setting is to the same the entire movie. I was also impressed by the amount of character models that they had because that's, you know, a huge time and expense when it comes to animation. I was actually shocked that we saw so many different

animal characters and it wasn't just like you know the human characters a lot of them you can kind of like copy and paste and tweak especially like the toddler weird things running around those little minions or whatever kindergarten yeah I thought that was kind of a fun design yeah that was that was

terrifying and fun but yeah all the different you know they have the birthday party or whatever and then all the animals that escape and then all the animals in the forest later and Um, each one of those is a different, new, unique character model. And I remember being impressed thinking, like, wow, they really didn't cheap at.

Like, the Cheetos money actually went somewhere. Um, so I don't, I don't think that it was like a lazy, um, or bad looking animation in any way. Uh, sure, there was nothing that I loved or that stuck out to me about like the backgrounds. I wasn't really focused on that too much. but I was impressed in a few different ways with the animation in this film. I think lazy is really the right word. I'd be very curious what the budget is on this

because, yeah, it is definitely, it does not look the same level as a Pixar, as a Dreamworks. No. Anything like that. It's honestly nowhere close. And I think they use a lot of that. I'm still struggling to find the best way to describe it,

but a lot of animated movies, especially the ones with more of a budget, restrictive budget to use this kind of like frame interpretation stuff I don't know to like do it in-betweens or something that my eye just catches it and it's like I can just tell and it looks a certain way that the actual character movement yeah it's not every short of it is not great especially the animal characters like like the way that they were running I was like yeah you didn't have they didn't have give them the time to properly use references or you know yeah Yeah, yeah, exactly, but that makes me, I'd criticize that harsh or less depending on the budget, and it's a Netflix production, so we have no clue what they were working with here, so I don't know.

They might be spinning silk out of shit for a we know. I don't know. Yeah, that was notable to me, whereas, like, I don't know, it's just such a creative medium. You can do so much. And the only time I felt they were, like, getting towards that was there's quite a good shot where, I think it's the first night Leo has taken home, and it's like locked to his perspective. Oh, yeah.

Reflection of his face, and it's going through a bunch of environments. That was cool. That was creative. That's more of what I was hoping to see. I remember that. Yeah, that was probably the best shot. Yeah.

And you can just see his face kind of hovering there in the reflection. Yeah, that was good. I like that. But overall, I don't think there was, I don't know. I just want to see more when you're picking animation as your medium. I just want to be able to reference at least a, couple sequences or creative ideas or something. It's a lot more kind of standard.

Yeah. You know what I noticed about the animation? It was horny as fuck. They were like, what the fuck were they? There was so much ass in this movie. Even the, even the teacher,

even the substitute teacher, it was just like her butt for like so much of it. The yoga mom, I'm like, you're trying to get on like a subreddit of like hot moms and kids. Like surely there's a subreddit like that. right? This is one of the hornyest

this was like hey there's a fetish for everybody and we're going to make sure everybody's represented here. That's what it felt like watching the movie. That's kind of an Adam Sandlerism there as well is it. Elizabeth's comedies just will have a really hot actor doing something. I don't know. I haven't seen that many but that's the love I get. Yoga mom in this movie

was like you're trying to do this. Like you're in you know what you're doing and you're actively trying to get the pervert audience. They're trying to get the perfect demo. They were not trying to obscure that at all. Not at all. They had everything front and center.

Yeah. There's a lot of weird shit. There was vore. There was consensual vore in this movie. Oh, what was the vore? He was eating the bugs, and the few of them flew in his mouth. That's right.

That was right. That was some consensual. I don't know. I'm not a vore guy. I'm just. There was water sports. That was a weird one. No.

Bill Burtle peed all over himself and then it showed him in like in a jock strap that was weird at the end it showed like he was wearing jockstrap

I always wonder with these is it like yeah it's what you said earlier about contributing things to ignorance other than like actual malice but like these kids movies designed for like pretty young kids and it's got this like

crazy imagery going on yeah I wouldn't there's some there's things that I would not put in kids movies, water sports being one of them. I don't care if it's for humor, right? But there's like, depending on like the age that you're watching something at, these things get imprinted onto your brain in weird ways. Like, furries can trace back like which movie caused their affliction or whatever, right? You, we, we, if you're introspective enough, you can figure out,

like, oh, what did I watch as a kid that caused me to be attracted to this sort of thing, right? So even if it's not explicitly sexual or, you know, trying to be attractive, these things are happening in some way that people haven't really figured out the details of. So there's some things that I would probably just not include in kids movies just to be safe, but, you know, I guess nobody, everybody's kind of, we're all just kind of doing this experimentally. Just making it as we go along. Also, now every kid's all. on the fucking internet so who cares. They're screwed.

Fortnite skins. Every kid's on the internet anyway. You can't protect them from anything. So just give up. Whatever. I got to shout out the, probably the worst joke in the movie. The whip,

nay, joke. Oh, yeah. He sucks. Just beneath the movie. Yeah, it was like, what year is it? He didn't need that.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, that was some old out-of-date shit right there. Yeah. Don't be, don't be done. Um, I liked, I liked that they again just adding to like the level of

weirdness and memorability for this even moments where the film is like tropey and they do the whole like you know she's about to get caught for her plan and she's like no he's lying I like that that scene is taking place and on paper it's a trope

but in practice it's like okay well this is happening with an old substitute teacher lady versus a turtle and a drone like Bill Bertel on a fucking drone and the only people spec dating are children and there was just something

there's something funny about that to me just like that as a scene like just there's things about this maybe that stick out to me that I just like well the fact they had like that drone thing I thought was like lame at first but they kind of committed to the bit enough and they kept like they almost did do a bear

lemo love thing with the drone own actually come to think of it. Like it was kind of going that way. And there was like a COVID joke where it like pushes someone two meters away and puts a mask on the go. But there were the more tropey resolution to me was like the whole, there's some lie that's going on and it has to crumble at the end of the second act. Yeah. So everyone can be mad at Leo for a bit. Yeah.

That's more the like, okay, here we got to get through this then to get to the next. It wasn't so overly drawn out. again, I loved the fact that it was just, I thought I was your special. Like, conceptually, the way that that drama was injected into the film, like, I found that to be more funny than dramatic. And so maybe, maybe just watching it through this lens of like, part, maybe partially the low expectations helped me to watch it like with a semi-ironic lens. But yeah, that was just, was just.

just the part I wound up enjoying. I was like, I liked that I was in the movie. After the fallout, there's like a kid who makes a comment the next day when they come into school. He's like, I couldn't sleep considering what Leo did to us.

It was really earnest and goofy like that. That kind of was memorable to me. But yeah, a lot of plug-in play stuff. It's mentioned to death with like every Adam Salmon movie, but the product placement is pretty egregious. It's about, as bad as a David Fincher film.

Maybe not that bad. Yeah. Maybe it's a little less than a David Fincher movie. Maybe I, actually, I, maybe I dig that, like, the killer going after Leo or something. Oh, crossover? They're both Netflix. We can do it. We can make it happen.

Oh, you know what pissed me off about this? This is like, there's, I need to find out exactly how many movies they've done this with. maybe if somebody can help me make a list and fucking shame them for it. But fucking Netflix release this in 1080P. You own, this is a Netflix property. Put it out in 4K. There's clearly, there's clearly some dumb old fuck at Netflix going, well, this is a kid's movies.

They're not going to be able to tell the difference. It's just kids watching. That's clearly what's fucking happening. Why else would you do that? this movie was released in fucking 1080P. The Sea Beast Oscar nominated film last year released in 1080P. Like, is the only kids. It's a Netflix thing.

It's a Netflix thing. And it seems like the only times they don't do it is when there's like another studio slash distribute. Like, I think Ori in the Dark might be fine because it's a DreamWorks Netflix thing. Yeah. Right? Yeah.

I'm pretty sure Pinocchio was released in 4K because that was done with, I forget who, but another production company plus Netflix. Like, I don't, I don't, it pisses me off because the movies are not made in 1080P. They're made in at least 4K. And you just have to press a different button when you're exporting it. They also, they like charge extra for 4K.

I know. It's one of the late tears. They charge extra for it on your fucking service. So if you made this content Netflix, you own the rights to this content. content, release it in fucking 4K. Why don't you do that? It doesn't even have to be HDR. You don't even have to put effort into the 4K. It can be non-HDR 4K. Just put it out in a higher resolution, you assholes. I think I'd take the HDR over the 4K. I don't know.

I feel HDR makes quite a different. But anyway, that's just the minutia. I mean, yeah. That's crazy. I didn't even notice that. Yeah. I'm pissed. Man. Yeah, that's stupid. That's so stupid. Oh, well, it'll probably be like deleted from history and like a year anyway. Yeah. With the way this is going. We need physical media.

Speaking of the Pinocchio Netflix, Guillermo del Toro recently put out a tweet saying that it was our moral duty to buy physical media because of the lack of certainty and, you know, cinema preservation when it comes to streaming and digital. And I completely fucking agree. So, hey, everybody. who's not me, get on it. I'm doing my part.

Yeah, I'm bordering on the edge now. Because I've been, I've liked the whole idea of having a digital library, like, not having to take up all this space for storage. But now it's like, oh, so regular occurrence stuff just disappears. You can't even argue that it's like cheaper now anyway. Like all the streaming services are just, like, it's as expensive as cable, more now, even. Depending on how many things you have. So, yeah, I might as well.

I might as well join up. Yeah. Join us. Get some 4Ks. I guess going back to Leo. Yes. There's one of the thing I wanted to mention. Um, a big question up for me for the beginning section of the movie was like, how are they going to, uh, or are they even going to bother to address the talking animal side of this? Oh no, this is like the main, this is the the plot pretty much. It's just animals, I guess. I can tell if it was like all animals or if it was just the lizard and the turtle. It seems to be all animals. But they have like a pact where they won't talk to humans. Kind of funny. Yeah, it's like Toy Story. It's just you, you accept it.

Yeah, it's like Toy Story. It's a kid's movie thing that you just accept. And once they say it, it's like, oh, we're operating on this logic, I guess. Okay. Yeah. You can talk? Yeah. They're just consciously deciding to not do it.

And then it don't. Until he gets to the age of 75 and he becomes the first animal ever in the history of animals to ever do this and it yeah who cares yeah it's not really a film to break down like so i just want to i just want to express to anybody who hasn't seen this movie yet i have not seen wish but i can pretty much guarantee you that i'm that i'm going to enjoy this better than wish because wish looks so fucking bland i'm not going to get any like genuine laughs at a wish yeah who cares right i wonder if that would get an oscar on just for being i know right is this is this the year word what is it what was the Pixar movie this year it was

elemental will that get into oh elemental i haven't even seen that yet uh so this this year we've got spider verse two we got elemental we got wish we got leo would be fun to just throw in there's no way man i know there's no way but we'll see we got fucking boy in the heron

ruby gilman teenage crack and alert that's the oscar winner the mario movie oh mario movie so yeah there's six already that are like expected contenders sorry five not including Leo so I would like to see Leo there but I don't think it's going to happen at this point oh and that ninja turtles oh yeah ninja turtles there's six that seem obvious um yeah so unfortunately I don't think Leo I'd be very shocked if Leo got a norm over any of those to be honest but I mean there's no reason why there has to be only five but yeah no you're right they can just make if they wanted to promote

more movies they could. Anyway, I want to make it clear to anybody listening who hasn't seen the movie. I don't think this is a masterpiece or anything, but I liked it. I liked it overall, and I will say the first eight or nine minutes is absolute unbearable cancer. Yeah, yeah, that's the worst part. You have to get past the first, like, eight minutes, and then once it gets to the dick joke, which is about nine minutes in and it starts getting pretty good.

Yeah, it bears its teeth a little bit. I kept getting confused at first. Like, when you first message you'd be saying like, oh, let's do Leo on the next episode. And I was like, at first I was getting the wires crossed and thinking like, what, Rio? There's like bird movies of Anne Hathaway. Like Rio back. I remember enjoying the first Rio to some agree. I remember nothing about it.

Yeah. There was a good villain song, I think. Will I am? He was in this. Oh, I forgot about that. So I give this one a five out of ten. I enjoyed it as much as a six, but I am also self-aware enough and trying to keep myself in check enough to know that there's so much about it that is just so bad that I don't think I could justify giving it a six. but I enjoyed it a lot and so I think it's like a high five for me

I just I really loved it it was risk taking it was balzy one of the writers was really talented and was able to do enough that they were able they made something that I connected with even if not all the way through and even the parts that were cringe

I'm willing to put up with it and I'm willing to suffer through that again to see the parts that I like honestly I'll watch this movie again I can understand that and I think I actually give it the same rating two and a half stuff five out of ten but it was pretty standard for me it was more yeah the one out of three jokes was actually getting to me making me laugh more than I was expecting but I was expecting like I wasn't

expecting anything to be honest so there you go well thanks for watching it was all right yeah yeah I enjoyed my time with it for what it's worth I would I'd not protest like a child watching this it's very appropriate for its demographic and they might be hungry for Cheetos but Who isn't? Yeah. I feel like that should be illegal is product placements in children's entertainment. There's some countries where that is illegal. There's some countries where they've decided like, no, kids can't, they don't even have

any comprehension of what they're seeing, right? Like, this is completely unfair. Again, though, it's too late, though. They can see a million ads on TikTok. This is the real grooming, really, is ads on, like, oh, yeah, you need this. Right? Kids are going to watch this fucking movie being I want Cheetos now Fucking groomer

Adam Sandler Jesus Christ Literally It's bad it's like they can't They don't even know what's going on They can't consent to like watching it I mean they can't consent to fucking anything but still it's like That just seems so malicious Yeah it's just greedy

Product placement and a kid's greedy greedy greedy greedy greedy I recommended a film called Aguirre Aguirre The Wrath of God directed by Werner Herzog. Yeah, I learned how to pronounce it by watching the movie. Nice. I'm so glad you have to say the title.

Yeah, 1972. There's a couple different versions, I guess. There's an, well, so they were, the actors were speaking English when they were recording the film. And so I think the English dub, even though some of it's dubbed, I think a good chunk of it is just audio that was recorded there, too. So that's the one I watched instead of the German dub, which apparently, like, they didn't even get Klaus Kinski. Like, they got a different person to dub over. Okay, that's the version I watched. I watched the German version.

Okay, I'm glad you watched the other one. How was it? Yeah. Once you get over that, I think it's fine. I was able to engage with it fine. But it's more just confusing that it's the characters are Spanish, speaking English, dubbed German. So once you get over that, once you get over that, that's fine. Yeah.

So what was your version again? What was the difference, sorry? Mine was an English dub, but I mean, most of it didn't seem to be dubbed. There were some parts that were like really obviously dubbed. But I mean, a lot of it, see, I was watching the version that I think had the most amount of dialogue that was recorded on set. Really? Because I was reading what was recorded on set was pretty much entirely scrapped. because it was such low quality.

Well, then maybe they just did a good job dubbing over it. A good dub. Okay, that's interesting. That kind of makes me want to... Yeah, maybe the entire thing was dubbed. But, I mean, it wasn't distracting for the most part. It was just only a couple parts that were like really obviously dubbed. And it was also two channel.

I think the German one is 5.1. But if you care about that sort of thing. Yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't know. It's up, man. So this is in the... filmmaking landscape, Werner Herzog

is quite the character. Oh, I love him. He's a very interesting man. And he's done a lot more documentary films more recently. But at this period in time, he was creating some very bizarre, very high effort kind of madman

projects where he decided to, you know, he's kind of like a renegade filmmaker in the sense where he does a lot of crazy things to get what he wants out of the movie, to get his shots or to get his concepts on film. Even to get a camera to film it. Exactly. I was curious about that. Oh, he stole it.

Oh, yeah, he totally did. Was that for this? I think so, yeah. There's a quote from him saying It was a very simple 35mm camera One I used to make Many other films So I do not consider it a theft

For me it was truly a necessity I wanted to make films and needed a camera I had some sort of natural right to this tool If you need air to breathe and you're locked in a room You have to take a chisel and a hammer And break down a wall It's your absolute right Damn

You know if If I ever need someone To testify for me in front of a judge I'm going to get Werner Herzog because he'll be so poetic you'll forget that it is actually theft still. He'll be so poetic about it.

He doesn't even need to be poetic. He can deliver any dumb shit and it sounds like intriguing. Do you see that audio clip of him going around talking about eore? Oh yeah, that's from his new audiobook, a memoir, which the title is very funny.

I think it's like, I think I listen to the first chapter because he does the narration on the audiobook. Every man for himself and God Against All, a memoir. So he, yeah, there's somebody clipped on Twitter. There's a part where he references the Winnie the Pooh character. He's like, Christopher Robin, Piglet, and Eeyore.

Yeah, it's like so dramatic. Good clip. I love the man. I love listening to him talk. I also kind of hate him a little now. Tell me about it. there's so much, we've had this conversation before in films about animal abuse. And in his film, Nasferatu, the Vampire, I think was the title, which I absolutely loved.

There was the whole behind the scenes about like, just what he was trying to do to get all the rats there. And he's like, nah, we'll dye them a different color. And then, like, he boiled them and die. And like, most of them. died and like, okay, this is like kind of shit. It almost seems like, at least in that example in that film, he was just really uncaring towards, you know, rodents, which we can go into moral philosophy, but blah, blah, blah, but A, rodents, B, it seemed to be for some purpose in the film for like the aesthetic

environment. C, it seems like, you know, if. if he knew that, I don't think his intention was to torture and kill the rats. It was just to, he had bad ideas of how to get the job done. Whereas in this film, it seems like, I don't know, half of it. It's just like you're going out of your way to abuse animals. And it seems like there's no real good purpose for it in the movie. Like the end of the fucking, the spoiler discussion anyway, everybody.

The end of the fucking movie, I can just imagine him behind the camera telling Klaus, like, okay, now try and step on those monkeys. I'm like, why do we really need him trying to step on the fucking, and then he tries to kneel on them. He picks one up and he tosses it.

I'm like, I don't understand. Like, we can make some kind of an argument about, like, oh yeah, this is about showing that the colonizers are the most savage of us all. I don't know if that's the only way to communicate that is to just, like, abuse animals on screen like that. That was making me uncomfortable.

The horse thing, you just kind of, like, tossed it in the river and, like, oh, good luck. Hope it gets to the other side. It's, like, if anybody understands, like, the body language of animals, right? With horses, when its ears are back down against his head pressed back like that, that means it's under a lot of stress and uncomfortable. And it was like that pretty much the entire film. and you can just like its tail almost caught on fire for like like fucking you big piece of shit you know i love i don't even know how they managed to do that because it's like an enormous

raft like in the middle of peru yeah had like multiple horses and not only that they started a fire on the raft and had the horse interacting with the fire yeah they kind of just tied it up next to it and just you know forced it to be there like he was literally like the horse was being absolutely abused and tortured for like the entire movie. They push it over like several times and then like fucking push it in the water and it's like its foot is like still on the fucking raft as it's like, like it makes me really uncomfortable. Claus screams at one in the face, yeah. And I just, I don't see a good, I don't really see like a good artistic purpose for it,

especially when it's like just so blatantly torture. So I've, I've defended Michelle Hanukkah killer. animals in his films where he, you know, there's a film where he goes to like a pig farm. Well, not he, but I mean, maybe you could say that as the director. There's characters like at a pig farm, they use a nail gun on the pig's head. I'm like, that's one to one how they die for our food anyway, right? Yeah. That's like one to one the ethics of how we consume their meat.

Another movie, chops the chickens head off. That's one to one, right? That's literally just what we already do by consuming me. Who cares, right? Like, if you eat it after, who cares? Whereas, like, this is like, you're going out of your way to, it's not even just killing an, like, I would rather you slit the horse's throat than abuse it throughout the entire length of your film's production.

I would rather you just, like, kill it on camera. I think Michelle Hanukkah did that in one of his films. I think there was a horse throat slitting in one of his films. This is just like, what the fuck is your problem? What's your actual problem? I think it might have been an oversight of just how chaotic and crazy this production is. Because this is one of those films where there's a lot to gleam from the film itself, but almost the more interesting part is the story of how they even made this,

how they got it together and how enormous the scale and ambition is matched to what the actual script or stories. Because that was kind of one of my bigger takeaways was like, I was really into a love that was shot on location. I love that ambition. I love like, especially like right at the beginning where it's tens and tens and tens of people in the Peruvian highlands, all in the gear with the costumes on and everything.

And it's like, wow, this is, this is crazy ambitious. And I, I couldn't find any, like, good information on the budget,

but I'm pretty sure it was fairly shoestring. Like, Herzog was, you know, he sold, like he pawned his watch and stuff to pay for food. and it was like pretty, pretty scrappy in that regard. Oh, it's completely scuffed.

And I love that quality. I love that energy. And that doesn't excuse how they treated the animals, but that's probably why it happened. It was a tunnel vision. I've got to get this project done. I want this, that and that to happen here. We're going to do that.

And I guess I found a bit more meaning in the use of the animals than perhaps you did with what it was trying to do or say with that. And you did get some good shots out of it. And there were examples where I don't think there was like abuse going on necessarily. Like there was a shot with the, that beautiful butterfly on the man's finger holding out to the camera. I don't know how that would be an abusive thing or the,

yes. There's like a shot of the, I think it's a mouse that's like saving its children. Yeah, like possum or whatever. Yeah, oh, and that thing as well. I like that. So there were a few instances of the animals coming in there being an interesting bit of dialogue or imagery.

Like, I don't like what they did to the horse, but I think the image of abandoning the horse at the side of the river was quite a memorable thing, Sid, into my mind. Yeah, the end result of that. It's just like... I completely agree how they get there. The entire production of this, and what is, you know, what's interesting about it

and why they talk about this movie in, like, film school, is that essentially what's happening is... It's almost like the actual context. because a lot of this is man versus nature. Yeah. It's not even just it's not even like an imagined conflict. It's not something you have to translate narratively. You're just doing it.

So in that sense, it's really cool. And as long as, you know, I feel I feel less bad about him torturing actors a little who signed up. Consenting to it. Yeah. To some degree, even though they probably didn't know what they were getting into and were underpaid. And, you know, seeing all that those people on the raft with all the full. armor I'm like I'm it seems really unsafe like when you falls over I don't know oh yeah you're getting out one of stuff like reading about this was one of the

other compelling things about it to me was this lead performance from Klaus Kinski who reading about him you see what a nutter this fellow is like what a what an insane character like he he hit someone on set with one of the swords and if that extra hadn't been wearing a helmet he would have been killed by the sword He was like firing his Winchester when they were playing like a game of cards and he shot the end of the Assaulting finger off. Yeah, yeah, like the guy is actually unhinged. If you read his Wikipedia, he's like kind of notorious for this kind of stuff. And that is like fascinating to me. He's like an egomaniac. And he has this certain intensity to his performances because it was the same in Nosferatu. And even his character for a few dollars more. Like he he has this kind of scream presence that maybe. be only a psycho of his level can bring to the screen. Yeah.

It's a very... It kind of holds it together for me. It's a very commanding face. He's got a very, uh, defined facial structure. And his eyes are like kind of Steve Bishemi eyes. Yeah, they're huge. And yeah, he like you, you, just him on screen is entertaining. Just him on screen is like, there's something interesting about that.

Just seeing him like look around or do fucking anything, right? I get that. And the lack of, there was a script, I believe, but there wasn't like storyboarding, they weren't rehearsing. There's like an improv kind of nature to what's going on that does dance between like capturing something brilliant and something a bit like, you had to present it this way because of the restrictions of try to film this kind of stuff in Peru. Like they're just living in the middle of nowhere. So a lot of the A lot of the way the story moves, the way the plot moves can be kind of A little bit confusing to follow or presented in kind of an awkward or clunky way simply because they didn't have stuntmen

They didn't have a bunch of this stuff They didn't have like pyrotechnics and stuff I think it was like a crew of eight people I was wondering how they did some of the effects like the violence Yeah Like did they just they just shot like projectiles at people and what they had like a two by four under his chest? or something like what it how do they do that that was crazy yeah that got speared and like fell into the water that was an insane shot that's the thing that comes with the the restrictions i think

like you get the that scrappy creativity like the the beheading scene the decapitation it's pretty fun um stuff like that but then there are there are other instances where it is yeah just kind of difficult to follow what's going on there's supposed to be this whole angle of it's very simple the whole framing. It's just these conquistadors trying to find El Dorado. They're looking for gold. A very simple. Yeah, and it's just man versus nature going through the environment.

But then there's this whole angle of the natives kind of picking them off one by one. And just some of the way that's presented is a little bit like, oh, I guess, that happened. Cool. And then there is a reliance on narration to keep you kind of up to pace with what's going on. Because I feel like just the nature of how it was filmed, how it was put together. You almost have to have some form of narration or some structure to bind it. Because it's kind of jumping around and like things are advancing in a way where it's like, oh, there's a prison in the camp and there's someone in the prison and then they kill the guard and escape.

But you don't see any of that. You learn it through exposition from the Klaus Kinski character who reveals. feels it in a cool creative shot where he's like hunched over the rock and he's following like the hand blood prints love that um but just the communication of information i found to be a little bit i don't know a little bit all over the place i just think because the nature of how how scrappy it was like i don't even know what you could really do otherwise yeah this this current team but that's kind of what happens this this movie to me falls into the category of uh vibe movies where You know, if you're really loving the aesthetic of it combined with the soundtrack, like the tone and like, I guess just the overall, like, nature of the film, then that can do a lot and that can help you to be more attached or invested or,

you know, probably easier to follow the stories and all the nuances and details and get all the extra bits of metaphor. and statements out of it, etc. I really did like this film as a vibe movie to an extent. I did like a lot about the soundtrack, didn't love it overall as much. I remember liking the Nospheratu score a lot more, although I think that wound up using some existing classical pieces too.

But anyway, there's things that I really, really loved about the music in this film. I loved that electric guitar when that came in. Yeah. That was like my favorite part about the score. And there's, you know, there's memorable striking shots and scenes and sequences. But I'm not really that interested in it narratively as a whole. Like I don't really give a shit about

the characters or what they're doing or if they achieve their goal, you know. I found watching this movie, I think it like three or four different times, I was just like looking at the aesthetic and like just the overall kind of, I don't know, it's not the same vibe, but I was reminded a lot of the film Godland, which is, is the guy Norwegian? I don't know. But it was a movie that I saw at Tiff like a few years ago. It's on Criterion now. And I absolutely loved it. I think it's super underrated. I'm looking to actually, yeah, it was 2022. It wasn't that long ago.

Yeah, I haven't seen this. Oh, it's fucking great. So I'm like eager. It's so good that I'm eager to check out his other film. Heelner, Palmison. Yeah, whatever his name is. That I was reminded of a lot watching this, but that movie is just so much more impressive and engaging and just breathtaking in terms of how it's shot.

Don't get me wrong. There were some breathtaking shots in this movie too. Yeah, I thought that was one of the best parts was the cinematography. I did find it pretty consistently stunning and breathtaking, especially knowing that there was not rehearsals and not storyboarding. So some of the stuff they managed to achieve, like really making a good use of foreground and background and keeping it in the same shot and changing the subject matter. Loads of cool stuff like that really utilizing what they had in front of them. And I think, yeah, just how. having that natural environment adds, add something too. But then there's like, I don't know, there's other character building stuff, like the emperor when he sat on the cannon, like where his groin is, so that kind of imagery and it's like perfectly centered. There's like lots of like memorable imagery used really well,

used to express character, probably better than the actual dialogue and plot in and of itself. Like I'm kind of there with you. I was never bored, I was never uninterested, But the, yeah, the main drive of what is happening and the narrative is not really what I was attaching myself to. No. It's kind of everything around it, the scope of it, the scale of it, and thinking like, oh, this, this, I wouldn't be surprised if this, like, inspired, like, Apocalypse Now or those kind of movies. Yeah.

What year was Apocalypse Now? 1979, yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I like that about it a lot. I was actually thinking about, and the reason I made this connection was because I think they have nearly. the exact same runtime. I was thinking about the seventh seal, Ingmar Bergman. Yeah. Because it's a, well, that's set in the 14th century and this is 15th century, 1560. Oh, it is the same right time. Ish. Um, yeah. 90-ish minutes or whatever. And I was just thinking about

how much I was connecting with what was happening in that movie. And it's not like an age or restriction thing in terms of that because that was what 57 7 seal but it had certain hooks and it had certain uh framings to it that kept me engaged even though it did it did have the late man versus nature thing it had uh the the religious angle it had yeah the period piece angle better conceptually yeah just probably a more solid script there um yeah but yeah i i want to emphasize i i feel like when you say vibe movie it can I don't know for a lot of people can hear that as like oh it's long and boring or something no no there's yeah that's not what I mean

but yeah I was never I was never dulled by it I was yeah it almost went by too quick like I almost feel like I could have have had more of this story or an extended version of it where I felt like I was more engaged in the narrative yeah like it is kind of weird it's a 90 minute movie not much happens within it like really if we're to put it on paper yeah and I was kind of they start delving into things

maybe think like oh that would have been cool if that was more of a through line with the film like how it towards the end when they're really up against it and they're going around in circles and they're running out of supplies and they're all going a bit mad and they start

they're not really sure how to interpret things in the environment and they're like is that real like is this what is going on here and they see that that boat up in the trees. It's like, oh, what a, that was a stunning image to get in there. And adding that angle of, like, the characters don't even really know if it's real, and you don't know if it's real as an audience member too, because you're kind of exhausted there with them.

And I don't know, there was some, despite not really engaging with the narrative, there was definitely a peril to the environment. Yeah, 100,000%. Yeah, I bought that it was, like, difficult for them to traverse through. They're just doing it. They are dropping light flies. You don't have to fake anything. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. Like it's stressful when they're stuck on the raft. Let's go into the forest. Let's get these guys to like drag around this, even if it's a prop canon, it looks heavy as fuck. I don't know if Werner hurts it. Like, I guess his entire goal was like, let's find the swampiest, wetest part of this environment and get them to just walk through it. Everybody's going to get trench foot, right? Everybody, like, you're just walking with water.

and like probably organisms in your feet. They talk about how the river, the rivers like flooded in a certain part of the film. Yeah. And like that was not planned. Like the river actually did flow. So they had to like quickly scramble to get it in and make it make sense. And that's, yeah, I do love that kind of thing.

I think that's a certain creativity is brought out of people when they're just shoved into such insane environment. And I think that is very respectable. Yeah. I do like the idea of kind of going where you're necessarily forced to go in a sense, the serendipitous filmmaking. And when you're doing this, you know, if a lot of what you're showcasing is man versus nature and you're just doing it, then you do have the opportunity to just kind of see where it takes

you. I like that. Don't get me wrong. I was deciding. So there's like two big ones from Herzog in this, I guess, generation of his films that everybody insists that you need to watch to have like an understanding of his filmography. This is one of them. The other one's Fitzcaraldo. And I am still very much looking forward to Fitzcaraldo. And I feel like that probably would have been the

better choice, although it would have been impossible because I only really had time for a 90-minute movie right now. And Fitzcaraldo is the one that has. the companion piece documentary with it. So it's not only a three-hour movie, but it would also be an hour and a half documentary if you really want the full experience of it, right? So... You're talking about my best friend or a different one? What is it called? I wrote it down. Hold on. It's called the burden of dreams is the documentary about it. So it's like... Oh, interesting. So there's another one. Oh, there's so what is it called? Because I was looking at this one, my best friend, which is about Herzog's relationship. Oh, yeah.

lead in this film. Okay. Which looks very interesting. Klaus Kinski. So that seems like you could almost have a four-film marathon with all of these. All that. Or even more. Because you could, yeah, all of the.

What year is that? Together like 12, 15. That was 99, my best friend. But they, Klaus Kinski has worked with him in a lot of films. So I think he's known him since he was young or something. I cannot find it on IMDB. Seems nuts. It's because the original title is in German.

and mine leapsch the fiend. Oh no, it's not my best friend. It's my best fiend, sorry. I've been saying friend this whole time. Yeah. That would do it. When I, yeah, no, I noticed that when I, I was reading it as my best friend. But that's like the joke of the title is that the man is a fiend.

Okay, interesting. I wonder, okay, so I wonder, are you sure it's necessarily about specifically with Fitzcarralo? because in the plot summary on IMDB it's talking about Aguirre also. So I think that might be like a more of an all-encompassing doc on their relationship with multiple films probably covered in it. Oh yeah, it's about the,

yeah, it's not specifically about this one film. There's a lot of discussion about how he behaved on the rather than. Okay, cool. Yeah, that should be interesting. I'll watch that for sure. But yeah, the companion piece documentary that I mentioned is like literally

just about the production of Fitzgeraldo, which people are saying is kind of like a necessary thing to check out. And I'm still super interested in it. And I, you know, I do find a lot of value and interest and I do appreciate the discussion and conversation around the filmmaking and the situations that they were finding themselves in the particular way that it was filmed and just. you know, the scuffed nature of it. I like that for sure.

But the film itself still has to do a bit more for me in terms of like a connection personally. And it wasn't quite there. And even though there are things about this movie that really stick out to me and I'm like, wow, that's fucking beautiful. I wish that it was at service of something more. I wish that those same shots

and those same really cool, great ideas and pieces of the film that work together were in service of a narrative that I cared about a bit more or in service of characters that I cared about a bit more or in served, just some kind of story that I felt more attached to and didn't really feel like I was kind of having to force myself to pay attention despite it being like a 90-minute movie, you know? Whereas I found, I guess this is where the vibe thing you're saying about

kind of connects a bit more with me where I don't get bored but my mind gets lost down what it's inspiring me with what it's showing me in terms of like well this was 1560 it's not that long ago people did just like this operate like this but they're looking for gold in in Peru the historical angle yes is that's like really interesting to me I did I did find that interest that was my interest yeah and apparently it's not even too bad with a certain uh accuracy and i don't know that the naturalistic kind of way it's presented doesn't feel like they're lapping you know doesn't it's it's not like embarrassing yeah true that's a good way to put it yeah you buy that it's you know

they're actually there they're in the environment there's only one or two times i was like pulled out and reminded that it was shot in the 70s someone like looks at the camera at one point but then afterwards you read that like most of the extras are just like random people that I guess Hurtsoog managed to convince to be part of it's like a very very unique movie and I just feel like I don't know I don't know what to point at to say to even compare it to in terms of like something like this it's kind of like the 70s revenant almost yeah there is a comparison there for sure yeah although they're you know the revenant was done more safely with a higher standard of ethics and

You know, like probably they had a storyboard Yeah There's some laws that were protecting a lot of people Less exploitation You know I get it It's interesting in the scope of film history And I understand why it's important to talk about

and for it to be a part of a conversation. That doesn't mean that you are incorrect for not connecting with it, which some people is kind of weird that some people don't understand things like that, but whatever. Yeah, there are certain films people get funny about if they have a certain standing or pursuit.

Oh, yeah, you know, you know, you know the concept of art, right? I believe that with art, there are sacred institutions that you should not challenge and that there are there's a correct answer to uh whether or not you vibe with or experience or enjoy or what you rate a film and it's because it's taught in film school and it's part of film history and so this is the correct answer it's like math you know art's a lot like math there's there's an answer you can study for it and you just want to repeat other things that other people have already said about the movie and not have your own experience with it

because there's a correct answer and you have to learn what that is. That's what art is to some people apparently. Very weird. What do we call them? Like film fascists? Like what it was? Like trying to understand these people.

It seems like it's coming from a lot of the same place of just like, oh, this is not. You're going against the norm. And that inherently is bad. Like, okay. I don't know. No, I hear you. Yeah, so with that, I give this a,

Five out of ten. I probably would have given it a six. I was feeling a six for like a lot of the film. But then just closer to the end, just being bombarded with like the horse abuse and the fucking monkey abuse and like. And just coming to terms with like not only that being in the film and so much of the film prominently being shit like that. But also coming to terms with like, okay, well, the overall narrative happened, I don't find it to be particularly profound in terms of like, ideas that I've never thought before even what you're getting at with the subtext. Like, it's fine. Like, narratively,

I just didn't connect with it. I love and appreciate a lot about it. Fucking pan flute guy was the only likable character. He was a fucking, he was a fucking Chad. Wanted to see more pan flute. Agreed. But yeah,

just a personal level. It was only ever going to be as high as a six anyway, but I'm giving it a five because I just got pissed off by it. I think, yeah, A little bit higher than you. Seven. At least in how it sounds.

It would either be a very low seven or a high six for me. I think I'd need to see that other cut you're talking about with the English. I'm curious about that now. And I don't know if I really want to see this my best fiend documentary too and see how that frames all of this. I feel like I need to watch Fitzcaraldo before I watch that because I'm worried there would be spoilers for the movie in that. probably. Yeah, I would watch that first too. Yeah, so I'm still, you know, I'm still hyped to check out Fitzcarraldo. I'm still hyped for Herzog and I find him a super interesting character in the same way that I find like Lars von Trrier an interesting character in the same way

they find Harmony Carin an interesting character. Yeah. There's some people that are just weird enough that I'm happy they're making art and if the art is reflective of themselves then it makes it interesting enough because they're weird. Yeah. I was, have you seen that clip of him getting shot in that Mark Commode interview? Like, I'd forgotten about that.

It was not a significant bullet. It's just like, wow. I just, like, I'm just compelled by him whenever he's on screen. Yeah. Like his bizarre cameo in the Mandalorian as well.

It's like, yeah. What are you doing here? There's, um, I guess you are. Yeah, he's like a character for the fucking ages.

Oh, yeah. He's, forever, like you can parody him and know exactly who. Yeah, it's like a Simpsons character who's like stepped out of the screen. Exactly. Living with us. Yeah.

Yeah. Him eating his own shoe and like him doing a sequel to a movie and pissing off the director of the original because he said he didn't watch the first one. He's like, how do you know? Just being like this big fucking troll and just like clearly just not giving a shit about other people and kind of being a psychopath but like a lovable psychopath where you're just like, yeah. Yeah, I get that.

Oh, Grandpa. He has a fascinating body of work. If you look at his IMDB, it's just like everywhere, all over the place. You've got drums, you've got documentaries, you've got this random stuff. He's like acting and stuff. Yeah, he's always interesting to me. And yeah, I had a lot of fun going and fill in this blank in. Yeah.

Yeah, hopefully we can do Fitzgeraldos soon, although I'm not, it's not going to be my next recommendation. maybe something next year. No, yeah, yeah. Especially with that 2 hour 38. Yeah, three hour movie and two hour and a half long documentaries. We need to, if we do it on the podcast, and I might just decide to do it, not on the podcast.

I might just do that in my check. Who knows? Who knows? But I'm excited for it. Herzog, I love you, but also go fuck yourself. Is the how I'm feeling right now. Yeah, fair enough. All right.

Thanks for the discussion, I guess his question. time. Yeah. Let's do some questions then from the Saldonikas community. Head over to the suggestion thread over there on the subreddit, just like Gazabata did, who said, hi, IRS and YMCA. Do you guys, by any chance, partake in YouTube shorts slash Instagram reels? If yes, and I'm pretty certain the answer is yes, what does your feed look like? I for one can never get enough of that fellow Ben Jarman Shapiro. I don't know why they spent, spelt it like that, destroying feminists with facts and logic. I also like it when the bottle full of orbies goes down the stairs and then it breaks.

And then the orbies come bouncing out of the floor in a magnificent display of color. Yeah, so shorts or TikToks or Instagram reels or whatever you want to call them. You ever find yourself looking at these? Are you in the doom school? Well, so YouTube kind of just like integrated shorts in a way where you couldn't avoid them anymore. Yeah. Because they needed to compete with TikTok. And so it's also kind of funny that YouTube essentially just was it I heard something.

Sorry. No, I was whipping up my shorts to see what type of stuff would be on there. My audio was on. So it started blasting a short really loudly. Okay, great. Keep that in. So eventually I was kind of just watching shorts over time. And it's like, I understand the appeal because it's like a quick fix.

I also don't like it because it reminds me of like the same type of like a addictive personality shit of like a slap machine, you know? Whereas like you're kind of gambling with each press, you're like, will this one be good? Will this one be a good video? It's like it reminded me of like back when fortune was like the only entertaining website. And even though B was shit, like every once in a while there'd be a good post. You're just like scrolling forever. Like will there be a good post today?

Sort of thing. It's like I don't, it just whereas like I also like YouTube as an art form. in terms of like high effort video content or like documentary or like you know just essay or you know a skit Joel Haver you know like fun stuff um i find that a lot of shorts content is scams whether it be lying about the content of your video or stealing did you see that guy on twitter right now the new main character of today no no there's a dude unironic i got show you this. I'm sure I could find it.

I get a lot of like fake Joe Rogan ads, like AI mimicking like Joe Rogan like this. Oh, that's fun. It stops me snoring. You know, it pisses me on. So I started doing, I finally bit the bullet and installed TikTok on my phone. Oh my God. Because I was like, well, okay, I'm watching shorts anyway now. Like, whatever.

Yeah, there's no difference. Whatever. If I'm watching YouTube shorts already, I might as well have a better algorithm. I hear the algorithms better. And so, yeah, I finally install TikTok on my phone. Within three scrolls, I have, like, an unofficial medical diagnosis of, like, something that I've been talking about forever, about how, like, I hear a song, and it just constantly loops in my head,

and there's a woman like, have you ever felt like this? There's actually a form of autism that people, I'm like, what the fuck? And I'm like, this is exactly what it has been happening in my head forever. And so that was weird. Like the third scroll that happens. And then I haven't, I've only done it, like, maybe a total of, like, three nights for, like, 30 minutes each on TikTok. So I haven't gotten, like, that much.

But I'm pissed off that seemingly, from the best of my understanding, there's no way to tell the algorithm I don't like something. Because sometimes I watch something and I'm disgusted by it, but I watch through the whole thing. where someone's literally, they have this scary music and they're like, just saying like, the Simpsons predicted

that we'll all die in the year 2,800. And I'm like, this is just to scare children. Like, what the fuck? And I watched through the whole thing in disbelief that they're actually doing that and they're just lying

and they're just getting views and lying in it. And then I'm like, fuck, I'm contributing to the problem. And there's no button I can press to say, I dislike this. And so then I'm scrolling a bit more and then I get another one of those fucking things.

because I watched her the first one. I'm like, fuck, how do I... I want to be able to curate the algorithm like in a... just add like little bits

of manual curation to the algorithm. Because sometimes you watch something all the way through and you hate it. And you're like, fuck this shit. You're just pissed off.

I'm not, yeah, I'm not sure. I'm not savvy enough with TikTok to know that there probably is something you can do, but I know a lot of them work by,

yeah, it's your engagement with it. So if you like it, comment on it or whatever, that it sees that as, oh, you like this. You need more.

of this or or watch time. If you scroll immediately off it, it won't do anything. Let me see. Yeah, this is the new, this is the Twitter main character today. Oh, I saw that, but I didn't watch it. Let me see. It's fascinating. And I scrolled down his Twitter profile and there's like a lot of the same.

He just, he's trying to promote his like, I'm a genius for reposting stolen YouTube content. And it's like, come to my free discreet. scored and I'm sure eventually he'll be selling some sort of seminar or some shit. Yeah. Like how can you post that and be like, wow. This is so weird. Just lack self-awareness. Oh yeah, he's like, here's how you make it big on TikTok.

I'm making $20,000 a month. And then just unironically goes like, first you just search for a popular YouTuber. Then you screen record that on your phone. Then you search for GTA footage of cars rolling downhill. Then you screen record that. Then you use this app and blah, blah, blah, blah. He has an office for some reason. He writes down his list of goals at the beginning.

He's like, I want to make a million dollars. So let you go whatever the fuck his stupid goals were at the beginning. Then he sits down in front of a computer and then whips out his phone and does like two, let's say 10 minutes of work on his phone. Whoa. He's like bragging about the money and stuff. He's showing it on screen. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. And the way his phrasing, too, he's like, when I start my shift, you don't start your fucking shift you fucking asshole Jesus Christ I work with stealing other people Sneco Jesus

if I had no self-respect I could be making $20,000 a month yeah you just got to for like an additional 10 minutes of work per day I like the community notes

they're attached to that portrayed in this video is intellectual property theft it's a legal underworld intellectual property organization treaty so yeah hopefully you get some trouble

for that people were calling him out for it and he's like, he's doing the typical ex-QC, like, no, people, people want me to do this. They get more money from it somehow. And then also one of his classic responses, he tweeted, I'm going to say this verbatim because I'm not going to search it up, but I read this earlier today like a few hours ago. He was saying like, oh, well, if it's illegal, then so what? Who's going to sue me over it?

Like, you're just waiting. Eventually someone's going to do it. eventually someone's going to sue sniper wolf or xQC or this fucking dumb turd please yeah it's not like it's not like it's not like case law doesn't exist for this by the way it's like it's like a level below like this shorts format it's like a level below the sniper wolf thing because you know she's there she's stealing people's content but at least she's in the corner like reacting she's pretending to make a transformative piece of yeah whereas these like if you're new to tick-talk and you don't I haven't seen some of the the engagement bait is insane on there it's like every

everything is just designed to like trick these reward cycles in the brain yeah exactly kids who are all addicted they're given their smartphone when they're like eight or nine yeah I I would I would be a puddle of goop on the ground if I was like nine and I was given this stuff if I would I wouldn't stand a chance if I was hands at a phone with TikTok right now I would be I'd have like two IQ I'd be like Yeah, I don't, I, um, I think I was born at the right time. Yeah, just missing this. I'm very happy about that.

Yeah. To remember my childhood without this stuff intruding. Like, man. Because it is crazy. There's just, they're just trying to trick you. It's literally just scams, the whole fucking, like, I got one that was like, um, make sure you, if you press more and then go to share, you can see which apps are tracking you. Oh yeah.

That's what that fucking. I swear that scary music guy did something like that too. Like, if you do this thing, you press like, then this will happen. And then just, I guess, enough children who are gullible and new to like everything will press that and then either not know how to undo it or just not care. And be like, wait, damn it. Or like, maybe I have to wait 10 minutes. If you go to, if you go to the screen where you can press to share on TikTok, TikTok measures that as an engagement metric. or boost the video more.

Yeah. It's really dirty. Yeah, it's gross what they're doing over there. And then they do obvious stuff. A lot of my feed is just like, Amazon finds you would never think of. And it's like a bunch of these random, like pointless stupid like kitchen gadgets or whatnot.

But they'll have like, they'll put some vague sexual imagery in it somewhere. So then all the comments are like, oh, did you see it two seconds? Why is nobody talking about blank? You know? It's all engagement-based stuff. That's crazy.

Yeah. Yeah, it goes deep. Human beings are fucking stupid. Where does the buck stop with this? We just unleashed this beast. We're just like poisoning people. It's owned and operated in China. They don't give a shit about copyright law.

And so YouTube has essentially had to like change their stance on copyright for shorts. So you can still monetize a short if it has copyrighted music in it, unlike if it was not a short. Because they're trying to compete with TikTok, and the reason why TikTok is huge is because it's just a bunch of other copyrighted content. And I agree, I agree that like, okay, if let's say there's a time limit to it, it's under a minute and you're using part of the song. And like, even if you're using the song for a minute,

if what you're doing in the video is transformative enough. Like, I agree that you should be able to monetize that content. Don't get me wrong. Like, I believe in fair use. But I think it's funny that YouTube is essentially just kind of given up on that for their shorts. They're like, no, we're just, it can still detect it through content ID, but you're still making money off of it. And we're just, we're abandoning it for this format because they need to try and catch up to

TikTok. It's funny. Because it's the only competitor to them. It's the only real competitor. Yeah. That's probably why they love Sniperwolf is because she's stealing, TikTok content. So much a TikTok content is stolen YouTube content. I think TikTok's actually passed YouTube as far as minutes watched and overall engagement on the

internet. I saw a data sheet of that the other day and I think it's passed it now. What's funny is I probably I would not have installed TikTok if it weren't for YouTube shorts because I was kind of like, well, I'm already doing it. They all have it like Facebook has shorts. I'm pretty sure. I know. Instagram has reels Yeah Yeah I'm not I don't use Instagram really

Nah if I can hate Instagram I have three pictures on Instagram Maybe two pictures in a video Yeah I lost my password so I'm good on that Yeah who cares

Yeah It's like man It's just too much at a certain point Especially the TikTok stuff It's just Yeah so I'm trying I'm making a conscious effort That if I see a furry video

in my feed that I watch it all the way through so that eventually over time it'll just be mostly just furry dumb shit. And even if it's cringe, I will enjoy it. Even if it's bad, I'll be like, you know what? It's this bad, but it's my fucking community, I guess. I would rather have that than scary music scams for children and just scams in general and lies and bad information, no fact checking, just saying things and just a bunch of gullible fucking idiots that are willing to eat up anything. It's just, it pisses me off. Like, we, misinformation's already bad enough.

Yeah. It's already bad enough. Leave the kids alone. Like, come on. No, they're the ones who are getting the brunt of it. Yeah. They're getting the worst of it, you know? Like, you mentioned the, when you first went on TikTok, you got that, like,

the mental health type thing. If you look at the, like, the searches on, like, mental health search terms on that, it's nuts. Oh, yeah. Everybody self-diagnosing. Me included at this point. It's like, well, yeah. And it's like where kids go to find information.

They don't use like Google or whatever. They just search on TikTok. Oh, yeah. Every zoomer in Gen Alpha is like TikTok is where they go to find things. And learn things. Yeah. Yeah. I'll search it on TikTok, which is like the worst idea.

because like everything is either a scam or like an ad or just some kind of like manipulative content that is trying to it's literally just trying to get you to buy something or to get you to click on something and it's all just dishonest nonsense yeah that's that's the that's the overwhelming majority like 99.999% of like what exists on on that platform and to a large extent YouTube shorts but not nearly as bad as TikTok I think yeah I think with my engagement of it, I'm able to keep it under control, because I don't, my rule is, like, I'll just scroll until I get annoyed, so I normally watch like two, and then I just want to go on it for, like, days. Yeah, but maybe it would have, yeah, I just know I would have

been helplessly addicted to this, and I dread to think, well, like, my younger cousins, like, what their engagement of this stuff is like, because I can, I can just imagine it, like, just doom scrolling eight-year-olds, like, just, watching Fortnite fails for like 10 hours, you know? Yeah, there's something dystopian about it. Yeah, I got to make my algorithm better or something. But I guess if I did that, then I'd want to spend more time on it. So maybe it's better that it's all shit.

Yeah. Just dip your pinky toe in every now and again and vomit in your mouth and go back to what you're doing. Yeah All right Well This one is From some total rando

This is for Alex to ask Adam How many roars Could one scar roar Until his throat Got scarred and roar Would the answer become Part of the Lion King

Law Or would that violate Some sort of copyright law Well I understood that Believe it or not But I don't have an answer I get that Only God knows

How many? I like that. That was nice. But we have a real one here from Real Big Dog 2. I know Adam is a Silent Hill fan, not sure about Alex, but do you have any interest

in the Silent Hill 2 remake being done by Bluebird team? The guys behind the medium and layers of fear. Also, have you guys heard anything about the train wreck that is Silent Hill Ascension? I've always wanted to play Silent Hill 2.

I've heard nothing but good things. Do you? I, if you need, if you want to play Silent Hill too, I will give you instructions on how to do the PC version with, um, all the fixings. Just let me know later. I will, yeah, they're, well, because it's like, what have they done to? All right. So the big meme about Silent Hill within the fandom and community is that every other, um, successful like horror game IP, the, the, the, their community actually. gets things that are worthwhile.

Like Resident Evil's got new games and like the good remakes of the old games are at least serviceable. You know, all these other IPs. Whereas Konami just decided to stop making games for the most part and instead are doing slot machines because it's way more profitable. Oh, the Pichinko stuff. Yeah.

And so they've abandoned the IP for a brief moment. They released something called the HD. collection, and that was like a decade ago, I think. And it was Silent Hill 2 and 3. And it is plagued with just like you shouldn't, there's videos on this. It's a train wreck of like, you did that is not how you want to experience those games. Silent Hill 2, the best way to play it, I mean, like, sure, you could always do like the PS2 version if you wanted to.

But the best resolution and the best way to play it is on PC with something called. called like, I think it's the enhanced edition, like, and it's a mud that you can install for Silent Hill 2 to allow you to output in higher resolutions. There's like improved, um, like textures and lighting and stuff in ways that like for the most part is very true to the intentions of the original. So they like clean up some of the audio and some parts like it's, it's one of the better fixes you could make like mods in terms of

something. And that's what the Silent Hill community is forced to do is have the community itself make the games playable on PC. Silent Hill 4 is available on Gog, G-O-G or whatever. There's a PC version for that. Silent Hill 3

can play on PC. Silent Hill 1 I think is on maybe PC. Yeah, it's for sure. on PC, but I think it's also, you can do it on, like, PlayStation Network or something. Anyway, I'm not looking forward to Bluber because they suck. They honestly suck. They're terrible. The medium is one of the worst games fucking ever. Super boring. Can't, unplayable. Like, even on a good PC, it's one of the most, like, unnecessarily resource chugging, poorly optimized games ever. Layers of fear is one of the stupidest fucking most awful

pretend scary games ever. It's a walk-through simulator. It was just a rip-off of like fucking PT and anti-chamber in the sense that every single notable thing

that happens in the game is just you turn around and it's different. That's the entire game. You turn around and it's different. Wow. This is like PT on drugs, man. It's so stupid. It's not scary.

It runs at like fucking 10 frames second. I installed it on three different... I was going between like PC and like Xbox One trying to find a version because I thought there was something wrong with my copy. I was like, why is the frame rate so bad? Nope, that's just how the game runs. That's just how the game runs. It's like 10 frames per second. Fuck these people. They've never made anything good. I don't know why they're responsible for this franchise. It's because Konami doesn't give a shit. And yeah, I've heard about Silent Hill

Ascension. I'm not sure really what it is. It's like an interactive movie. movie thing. Like, I was, I was thinking, like, it's, it's not a game. Like, it's not something I can stream, is it? Like, no, right? A thrilling new GenVid Interactive Streaming series where you, along with the rest of the audience, can impact the Canon of Silent Hill. What?

Yeah, I don't know what it is. I've only just heard people complaining about it on the subreddit. And I think people were saying it has, like, weird predatory micro-transactions or something. Yeah, it does sound. like that kind of thing. Maybe they're trying to turn into a live service or something maybe. I don't know what the fuck it is. Can somebody please make a post in the subreddit telling me what it is and how I should watch it? Because if I want to do something that I know is going to be bad, I want it to be something I can make some sort of content out of.

And whether that means streaming it or doing like a watch along. But if it's interactive, I can't really do that. Like maybe I should just stream it on kick or something. Like I don't know what I should be doing. I don't know, I don't know what a, somebody tell me what it is and what I should do with it. Because I, uh, I've been very busy and so I haven't really had the time to, uh, check in on it. Yeah, Bluber fucking sucks. Anybody that's like optimistic about that in a non-cautious way is just coping. Yeah. Because I was, when I, when the stories started circulating of a Silent Hill 2 remake, I was like, kind of enticed.

I was like, oh, cool. Like the Resident Evil remakes have been awesome. Um, so much love. an affection put in. Dead Space was really good this year as well. I want to check out that remake. But then, yeah, Bluebe Team attached. Couldn't put like Blue Point on this.

Someone who's like really good at remakes. Yeah, like why? Why? Yeah, because he did Blair Witch in 2019. That was the only one that I kind of enjoyed. I liked things about that one. And it ran fine for the most part. I forgot they did that one.

That one was fine. That was the only thing that wasn't the worst biggest piece of cancer ever. And then the entire last chapter of that game just turned into fucking layers of fear again, which was annoying, but whatever. Oh, that looks I've got to go to the community for this one. Help us. Help! Help!

I'm too busy. Why don't we end on this one from Roe Moan? Chris Tuckman recently made a video discussing his concerns about the changes in the movie theater industry as superhero movies are driving less people to theaters. How do you see the landscape changing? Are you concerned about movie theaters going away without big, tempo movies? If superheroes are done what type of film replaces them? I'm concerned it's going to be video game movies.

Would much prefer to see a big budget or two project from filmmakers like Nolan and Villeneuve. Love your podcast, keep up great work. I'm screaming from the rooftops about the video game onslaught for years now, and it's coming. That's been my theory for ages. Zelda. Yeah, Zelda's coming now. FNAF was just a huge success for the Mario movie this year. There's the audience like capture with video games is like the older like our generation gets or whatever.

And as the boomers fall away, every new childborn is basically a new little gamer. True. Much bigger industry as far as turnover than film. So I would not be surprised if. That's just kind of where things settle. Like, it's IP, it's less risky. Everyone knows these things already. Like, the Mario movie is just a dream come true as far as advertisers and product placement.

And all of this is concerned, merchandise. Yeah, it's like a dream come true for this. It's like, it's easier than Subira's stuff because at least you've got to like, you know, like a... It does seem to expletable at the moment. Yeah, it seems like the, yeah, the direction. Seems like an easy answer. But that's not to say I'm not like revel in and what's happening with like, not that I ever want to film to do bad, but sometimes it is deserved with like how you've pushed audiences with like the marvels, how that's doing with just the litany of Disney failures this year. I can't say I'm shedding a tear over the billions they're losing on their misplaced franchises.

I'm actually really curious to see what this like Lion King prequel is it? the John Favreau's style like like who knows yeah what the Barry Jenkins everybody that's the only thing but man they've they've they've had plenty of good directors before and like oh it's not gonna be no no no no chance in hell it's but also I feel like more people are turning on that Lion King movie the more years pass like I'm constantly seeing like people mocking it and scenes from it being shared of how bad it is and it's almost like I was right the entire time and everybody else was fucking pretending for something.

It's actually crazy. The member berries were strong at that point, but people, I don't know, they're turning on the member berries a little bit, unless it's Marrier. Well, people are starting to see through the cynical veil, right? People are starting to, when it gets done enough times, people start to clue into what's fucking happening, right? And, yeah, it is a... When you get two or three of these live action remakes a year, like, they were getting a bit too big for their britches on that, you know?

Yeah, that and also, you know, all the billion... 2,000 movies and 800 TV shows of Marvel per year that they're putting on Disney Plus or whatever. Like, I need to watch all this for the kind of text. Well, they're major brands. Yeah. It's insane. And now, yeah, Disney. Plus is like put them in quite a predicament so well now what people we've trained our audience to

wait for things to be put on Disney Plus and we've also trained them with how we've like split up these stories between these two different formats of films and shows and like tried to merge it they've just yeah they've really fucked it for themselves and I feel no sympathy it is a very um like like many profit driven companies it is a very short short-sighted plan that they had. It's crazy. Make a lot of money really quickly and then, oops. Then panic.

What the hell? What do we do now? Oopsie. Damn. Yeah, we're running out of other IP to buy and ruin. We only know how to do one thing. Yeah. And even then, that one thing used to be like animated stuff.

They're getting into hot water now with like tweeting AI or people theorized to be like AI. It's 100,000% that's AI. I've seen that image. That's definitely AI. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, for sure.

And like, yeah, some of the Disney shows using AI for the intros and stuff. It's like, they're a money company. Creatively bank. They're not an animation company. They're a money company. No, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What you expect? Yeah, I don't know if there seems to be like kind of a big trope of like true story things happening right now.

I don't know how long that will last or how much. many of those will be successful. A lot of those seem to be like dumped straight onto streaming anyway, but who knows? I feel like that was a Bohemian Rhapsody's fault. That's so successful. Either way, I guess it just shows a general lack of creativity in the industry when people have to just follow like these trends of like, oh, well, this did something successful, so we're going to try this.

It's like, you know, look at like, without Spider-verse, we wouldn't have animated movies in theaters that have interesting styles right now. But even then it's like the way it's been Like I like Puss and Boots and the Ninja Turtles and whatnot But it's like It's so obvious what they're doing You know it's like it's our Spiderverse now We Spiderverse now

Yeah yeah Yeah yeah I get it It's like you can do so much more I just I just want to see more original Concepts driven by artists and talented people I hope that I hope that the What is that? the metaphor, Canary and the Coleman?

I don't know. That's probably not even more. Yeah, that's right. I hope that what they pay attention to is the Barbie movie. Yeah. And not in a way where it's like, oh, Barbie is the IP. But we've already had this conversation. And we know that that's what they're going to take away for it.

They're going to make a fucking Hot Wheels movie. Right. So it's just going to be the Mattel Cinematic Universe, the MCU. Yeah. They'll take away all the wrong conclusions from the Bobbenheimer thing. Yeah. And we'll just wind up having the same conversation for, Ever.

This is just how things go and we can only try to make our voices heard and hope that the people with the money get a fucking clue. Yeah. Yeah, it is. I don't know. People get, they get quite dumer about it, but I don't know. There are plenty of good movies still coming out. Exactly. You just got to filter it a bit more.

Yeah. Support the ones you like. I would go even as far as to say. to buy them on physical media if you like it true there is there is always a hunger though for I feel like something in that more middle space like the things do come and go in that space depending on yes and I don't I don't know the best way to like phrase it I guess that sort of a more of a mid-budget instead of these ridiculous inflated 200 if not 300 million like blockbusters it's just

just unsustainable. It's like kind of mimicking the the video game industry with that. We're like, just everything is taking so long and it's so expensive and the budgets are so inflated that there is something unsustainable about it. So hopefully this kind of middle market can rise up.

Yeah. We only want to make, we only want to make movies that need a billion dollars to break even. You need to make a billion dollars at the box office for this to even be worth your time. Like that's what you're shooting for? Fuck off. I do hope we get more medium budget movies after like marvels being a flop and probably a bunch of other shit. Like wish seems to be a flop. I don't know how much they spent on that. Less wish more. Yeah, it's been a crazy flop. Yeah. Lots of the big tent poles have been like flopping left and right. And I don't know. I'm kind of laughing in the corner of here.

Yeah. I don't feel bad about it. It was so fucking greedy, you know. It's not like they're good. No In fact some of them are like Historically bad Oh you know what I'm Did you see the Madam Web trailer I'm so hyped I did

Oh man Sony's Sony's the only one Like just They got no fear Hell yeah They're just I'll watch that one in theaters

They're like Oh man I actually couldn't believe that shit That was crazy What a great trailer It's like And that's not even it though Because there's Craven as well, like that we're swimming in the Sony shit. Yeah.

See, that's fun. That's almost, that's almost self-aware because of how like egregiously exploitative is. It's like, yeah, it's the most extreme example of it where it's like they're not even trying to hide it. Yeah, I love that. You know, Craven's going to make like $5, right? Yeah, but they get to advertise all their Sony products in it. So it's worth it. It's like it's the same as buying an app.

on TV except people pay you to see the ad. That's their market, that's their strategy. I find it a very ingenious thing to do. As a business, yeah. Genius, man. Yeah. Nice one Sony. More Papa John scenes in your movies, please.

Yes, please. All right, I guess that's it for questions. Those were some good, meaty, awesome questions. Had a lot of fun with those. Thank you. Want to make a recommendation? So it's my time for a wreck back down. to me I'm not recommending rec.

I'm not recommending something I know you're going to be upset about and I know I'm going to be upset about but I feel like there's a conversation that you had here. I haven't seen us, I don't know the level of torture that this is, but I want to talk about the Oscar winning 2004 film Crash Paul Huggis. I want to have this conversation. All right, great. Thank you. This was an inevitability.

We had to talk about it at some point. Yeah. This was a required. movie for i knew that we were we would talk about this on the podcast yeah it's been on my list for a long time yeah we're like now right before we crash before christmas we can crash into this yeah infamous movie like i'm kind of excited actually to see what there will be a discussion okay there will be a discussion of this film nice one all right looking forward to it if you don't want to be spoiled for two thousand

is Crash. Best Picture-winning film directed by Paul Haggis. Watch it before the next episode comes out. These episodes come out every two weeks. You can listen to them early by going to sardonicast.com

signing up for premium. It's only $2 a month. You get to download the episode early. You can listen to it on whatever you want. Any device, you just get the episode. Patreon.com slash sardonicast. you can listen to it through the platform there as well if you prefer Patreon.

$2 a month also. We got merch link in the description. Christmas is coming. It's coming. Last chance. I think the episode after this is going to come out on Christmas Day. That's right.

There's a first. Is it? Yeah? I don't know. I feel like I remember a Christmas Day episode. I don't know. Well, it could be the first time we've noticed. Just smile and wave.

That's what I see. Just smile and wave Was that from again? You don't know It's so On the tip of my tongue But come on you must know this Just smile and wait boys

Just smile and wave It's Oh wait No come on come on It's so It's so close We mentioned We mentioned the franchise

It's from in this very episode Oh it's from Madagascar Yeah It's the penguins All right thank you All right, have a happy Hanukkah or Christmas or... Or, Cuanza.

Sit at home and be a fucking miserable atheist if you want. Grinch over here. Be a fucking pagan about it, which is also Christmas. I don't know, be a... Have a happy holidays. Oops, getting canceled now. I can't say that. Oh, God.

They're trying to take away our freedom to only have to say one thing and not be able to see it say whatever you want. Have a happy holidays and a happy Shrek year. Next year. Next year of the Shrek. I can see it coming. I guarantee it. All right.

Thanks for listening. Bye. Bye. Mate.