Sardonicast - Sardonicast 161: 2024 Oscar Wins, Moulin Rouge!

Episode Date: April 1, 2024

Support the Show for $2 a month and receive all future episodes early at https://sardonicast.com and https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast. Buy Sardonicast T-Shirts, and other merchandise at https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast. Merch: https://teespring.com/stores/sardonicast Website: https://sardonicast.com Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Sardonicast Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/sardonicast Twitter: https://twitter.com/sardonicast Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/sardonicast Sardonicast Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8AhJ0bzQgs5fb9m_ZCRqkw/featured Alex's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/IHEOfficial Adam's channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/YourMovieSucksDOTorg Alex's Twitter: https://twitter.com/IHE_OFFICIAL Adam's Twitter: https://twitter.com/2gay2lift Adam's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/YMS Intro music by: https://www.youtube.com/user/anUnkindnessvideo   Timestamps: 0:00 Twitter drama 29:16 2024 Oscars 55:52 Moulin Rouge! 1:33:21 Questions 2:07:18 Outro + recommendation

Three, two, one. Roxanne. You don't have to put on the red light. That's one of the best covers I've ever heard from the film, uh, moulin Rouge, with an exclamation mark. Well, um, yeah, how do I follow that one up? I'm Alex from Ritche.

I thought you were going to go The easy one and whip out the old My I see Sardinacast Or something like that, you know Yeah Whatever But now you went for Moulon

Is that he said Do we decide how you say it It's like French obviously They say mule In the film I don't That seems a bit right Mule

Rouge Le I'm just not even going to try With that one Moulet Rouge Rouge Tabernak.

Um. So are we in that time of the year then where you just have like a huge controversy on Twitter? Is it just time with the Oscars now? Is that just like what your reality is or what? Well, it's always just shit from like six plus years ago and it doesn't seem like anything really like sparked it. We're just outside of it just being like Oscar seasons. So there's a bunch of like film discussions going.

That's the only like connection I can think of. Yeah, I don't know. I have no idea at this point. Yeah, I don't know how you do it with Twitter at this point. I just... Yeah, you know, sometimes they just block it ignore, but sometimes I clap back and I feel like if people are literally saying that they should kill me,

that maybe that's an opportunity to be like, hey, this is not cool. Like, this is so obviously not. not cool that you should be on blast for this? Excuse me? Mm-hmm. Yeah, Twitter. It's like, it's always been unhinged, but this stuff, it's like, it just feels different now, you know?

So I don't really like saying stuff on Twitter anymore. I'm more of like a lurker nowadays, but. Yeah. It does just seem so, like, hostile. Like, it's just. It's like that's so aggressive. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Almost, you know.

Everything kind of just inevitably turns into its most exaggerated version of it. We've seen this politically, you know, like, what is what is politics anymore? It's all just like the most extreme attention-grabbing nonsense possible now. Yeah. And so, you know, you take the defining characteristics of anything, like a website, what is the most extreme thing about it? All of a sudden, over time, it just morphs into only being that. And, you know, of course, with how these websites are designed and the algorithms that

encourage these sorts of things, which is why it's the case in the first place, a lot of people, you know, with reasonable opinions or that don't really want to be the center of attention all the time and don't necessarily get a boner from just tweeting 10,000 times a day and every single one is a quote tweet trying to dunk on someone being like, I'm more moral than this person and I'm smarter than this person. And they get, you know, some people just get a massive boner off of that. they kind of drown out everybody else. Yeah, it's a classic vocal minority problem.

And then other people just don't want to participate. Yeah, yeah. They kind of just watching. And it was a slow, like, decline. There was a time where I did kind of rate Twitter. It was like a nice way to interact with your audience, and it did kind of stay a little bit more in that pocket of your audience instead of, yeah, the algorithm takes message and then delivers it to a bunch of groups

that obviously are going to not like it. it, so then they engage with it, and then you get the dunks, and it's just this maelstrom of shit, like that absolutely whole website. Yeah, it's fucking weird. People, people, like, it's, it's so bizarre. Like, people really gravitate onto, to that sort of thing. Oh, yeah. Like, they just jump in from, like, other communities and shit.

Where it's like, you don't even have, like, any kind of accurate idea even close of, like, what I am. All you've seen is, like. It always boils down to these talking points. They're just like parroted and they're like, they don't normally have much backbone. Well, yeah. Like, there's literally a significant chunk of people that all they know about me is like a brain fart that I had six years ago.

Plus, like, someone's uncharitable interpretation of another thing 10 years ago. And then they've built their entire mental image of like me and my character based off of just those things. And it's like cycling through the same fucking like 10. things forever and it's like okay well I guess I understand why you think I'm this if that's all you're exposed to but you know you can't win them everybody and yeah it goes elaborate like some of the like fiction that gets like well it being made you know the game of like Chinese whispers by the time what they're sharing it's just like such nonsense and it's like easy to disprove but it's more fun I guess to like just throw logs on the fire than the

figure out what's actually going on. It's, yeah, it's not only, like, more fun, but, like,

if somebody had to come to terms with the fact that they're being, like, an asshole to someone who doesn't deserve it, then the cognitive dissonance is going to have them prefer the reality where I am a bad person. So they latch on to whatever they can to believe that,

so that they don't have to feel as though they're being an unreasonable person when they say that they should legally be allowed to kill me. Some weird... It seems kind of extreme, you know? I think that's a little much. Very extreme. Very hyperbolic. When we're talking about like disagreeing with someone's experience on a piece of art,

maybe like get a fucking reality check at some point. Yeah, why is the stakes so high? Yeah. I feel like I've said that a lot lately. It's like, man, we are talking about movies here. Yeah. There are real things to get upset about it. And then one person does it.

and then people like quote tweet or retweet or whatever and then everybody just joins in you know because they're like and they'll start the sentence with like oh while we're dunking on yMS here's this other random unrelated thing and then it'll just be like complete like i don't understand the minds of these people one of them was talking about they they included my review of uh what was that cohen brothers like shakespearean thing and i was saying like hey I don't. I prefer movies without Shakespearean dialects. Still gave it a positive review.

Love the cinematography, et cetera, et cetera. But I'm like, yeah, I just like, my brain doesn't process it well. And I have a difficult time understanding what's going on. And their interpretation of that was like, oh, yeah, wow, they should like change it to normal dialogue in a Shakespearean thing. I'm like, I didn't say change it. I'm saying that affected my experience. Like, what, so if I show you something like the human centipede and you're like, I don't like scat. I'm like, yeah, what, you want to change the scat movie into not a scat movie?

It's like, it's still a legitimate thing to mention about your experience. There are some things inherent to the, to what the movie is trying to be that you can still say you don't prefer. That's not saying that you can't make a movie like that, right? Like, I just, there's a very, a lot of people that talk about art don't understand the fundamental concept about conversing about art. is that other people can have different experiences. Like, that's a fundamental thing.

That's square one before you start your conversation is being like, oh, some people have different tastes and might experience things differently. But it's also just like how bad faith is. Like, why, why are they assuming, like, they're approaching it as if they're coming across and come to these conclusions as if, like, you actually don't like any movies. and this, you're just trying to prove something. Well, because all they've seen is just these clips on Twitter. Yeah, exactly.

So they form this whole idea from like these two like clips that you have no control over the, it's not like all the other clips from every other inverse thing you said about other movies are being shared about in the same way. It's just this small handful. But like when enough of those are linked together and it's on your timeline and there's the algorithm and all these numbers, like people like, yeah, it just like makes people go mad. Yeah. Well, I think it's also like partially people have built this idea up in their heads about me that I am insisting some sort of authority on how I talk about movies.

The only authority that I insist is the authority over my own perspective, over my experience on the film. Constantly, every single fucking review I make, I'm like, hey, maybe this is fine for you. Maybe check it out. The one that like I got death threats over, Joyland, I like gave it a positive review. And I was just like, yeah, this is not for me, but it's well made in this sense. and, you know, I didn't like this or blah, blah, blah, check it out if you want. It's got some awards at Khan.

It's, you know, it might be up your alley. She fucking, like, one of the people that worked on the film. Like, issuing death threats against me, saying, saying they want my head on a pike and should legally be allowed to kill this white boy. I don't know what that has to do with anything, but. What, it's very weird. Like, what, what world, what reality, like, it, I just, I can't. It's so bizarre.

And I want to point out, there's a lot of people on the internet that I don't like. And there's a lot of people that I'll notice on Twitter. I'm like, oh, you're the main character today. Right? I don't use that as an opportunity to be like, ooh, since I'm in this safe zone where I can dunk on this person because they're the main character today, I'm going to do that too. Do you know how much of a fucking turd you are? Like, look, I don't like Quentin reviews either. I'm not going to just look at the fucking the, oh, everybody's dunking on him and be like,

hey, here's my two cents about this guy. What a slimy piece of shit. You all have to realize just how fucking awful you are when you participate in that shit. And when you do participate in that shit and you're like, ooh, ooh, this is my opportunity to dunk on them because I feel safe doing that. I just like, you deserve it. You deserve it. I hope it happens to you.

I hope you learn your lesson the hard way. You know, like... Yeah, it's so like juvenile in high school. You have no idea. Yeah. We live in a society. Come on. Come on.

What is wrong with you? It's like everybody turned into baby brain. Is everybody just a baby now? Like, yes. Or a Russian bot. Yeah. Well, here's the thing. Is, you know, we just mentioned this earlier.

It's not that everybody's a baby. It's that that's what you see on the time. line is that everybody tweeting is a baby. And there's a lot of normal, rational people that don't want to be involved in that kind of drama. And so you just don't see them tweeting. You just don't see them. And so all you see it's and then it affects your perception of reality in the world.

And then to a lot of people, it becomes like, oh, this is an acceptable thing to do. I feel safe doing this. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It's like manufactured outrage. Yeah. Yeah. It feeds into it. itself. Yeah, what's that stat where like nowadays in the first half an hour of our day we're getting bombarded with more information than like entire generations previous? You know, it's weeks or months it would take for you to absorb this kind of level of information

so of course we're just going nuts. Yeah. Yeah, a lot of... The internet's funny. The internet's funny. The internet's funny. Yeah, when it's not being scary, it can be pretty funny. Yeah, yeah, I mean, done it how many years?

I think I'll be okay. Well, here's the thing is the more, the more that it happens, the more comfortable I am knowing that these people are just like, they're fucking nuts and that they're, you can't get through to them and, you know, it's not, it's not about like... So it doesn't bug you, it doesn't bring down your day seeing you. It bugs me less every time. Uh-huh. Yeah, they got nothing on the line, or yes, they got, you know, it's just random, randos, anon's on Twitter, like how much, really, how much credence can you give?

It's just anonymous, like, shit, but it could be a 12-year-old. Even if it's not randos, it doesn't even matter. Well, yeah, yeah. You know, like, if someone wants, if I had a brain fart six plus years ago and someone wants to dunk on it or whatever, like, there was like a part in the, like, I did a review of game night. and yeah yeah this is one that just people like again this is like six years ago three for one joke right yeah yeah

and so I would have to rewatch my review and rewatch the film to like really get into like what exactly my criticism was and what exactly was wrong about the criticism people are saying I miss the joke I think that that is entirely possible but I just I would have to like rewatch both of those things to

to be like okay was my was my criticism that it wasn't to joke or was my criticism just that it was like a bad product placement? Because even if it is a joke, which it seems like it is, it's still a bad product placement, right? So either way, you know, I watched that clip or at least parts of the clip that people are reposting, I come off as a little like, you know, like, come the fuck on, you know, like my, I don't know if I do that to that extent anymore, right? Like everybody's kind of like a changing, growing person. There's no set style that is, forever and there's you know and things that I create I'm always finding ways to like improve and

correct upon myself and be introspective and self-critical etc etc with that clip the director found it that day and retweeted it with just some like crying laughing emojis which I think is funny and I think is totally justified because if I were a director and I saw you know at least his perspective of me is probably literally just through those like weird dunks on Twitter, right? Like, I don't know if he's ever watched like an actual video. I would totally retweet that shit. That seems funny.

And that would be like a satisfying thing if I like made a movie and like, ha ha, look at this. Someone looks stupid and they had an issue with my movie. Then that makes the movie look better or whatever. Ignoring the fact that I gave it a positive review said it was, you know, great cinematography, surprisingly great cinematography. I think I gave it a, I don't remember the rating I gave it. But it was a good movie.

Yeah, it was a good movie. Yeah, it's cute. So that's not a rando nobody for sure. But I don't like, I don't have any ill will or resentment towards the director for retweeting something like that because he's directly involved. Like, that's his movie. And that seems like, you know, I would do that. Yeah.

And well, like the comments were just like emojis to us. It's not like he's calling for anything extreme or. Yeah. And what's kind of funny is like these old, these really old reviews of mine, I can look at some of these out of context and kind of get at what people think of me because it's almost like a stereotypical thing that remember how I was saying everything becomes its most exaggerated version of itself over time. Yeah. There's a lot of like channels out there that because I've been doing this for so long that I've inspired some for good, some for bad. There's some people that have taken inspiration

for me and done like really great things. There's some people that have taken inspiration for me and, you know, maybe have been kind of turds on the internet. But there's some people that have taken inspiration for me. but there's a certain type of like idea of a reviewer that's like only looking to be negative for clicks. And I got in as soon as obviously as soon as all this like recent Twitter outrage or whatever we want to call it happened. I was getting a bunch of comments being like, well, you know, people brigated the subreddit. And we're like leaving comments like, oh, you're just going to have to come to terms with the fact that you're a hack and that you you make fake opinions on videos for engagement or whatever. I'm like, damn, some people really believe that.

Like, I'm really passionate about the art that I connect with. I'm really not passionate about the art that I don't connect with, for sure. But I mean, like, that's a part of having strong opinions and strong experiences and being at least confident about your own experience is, you know, like you're going to connect with some things and not others. And, you know, like, it's whatever these people think of me, it doesn't change the fact that, you know, I've got like countless directors that have thanked me for covering their work that continue to give me screeners because they're confident enough in their own work that they're not scared of what I have to say about it because they know that they're making art that connects with me and they're consistent. And they actually, they know what their style is. They know that I connect with it and that I appreciate these things about it. You know, Disney is not sending me screeners. That's for sure. but there's independent artists that appreciate the fact that I'm putting a lot of eyes on them that have thanked me for you know pimping it out at the right time and saying that it was like the

best financial decision for them to not sell their film and for them to own it independently so yeah it doesn't you know if the director of game night has a version of who I am in his head that's not the real version of me it doesn't really matter we're probably not never going to interact in real life ever. Most of my issue is just with people who, I don't understand. It seems like it's more personal to them with how they interact with me than the director of an actual movie that I criticized, right? Like his comment was just like lying, crapping, lying, crapping, crying, laughing emojis,

whereas like other people are like literally like trying to paint a picture that I'm bad person who deserves to be harassed or killed, which seems like crazy because a lot of these people are just not even related to these. They just hate that I exist based on like these false ideas of who I am or like maybe just uncharitable ideas of who I am. Like it's very bizarre. That's the part that like bugs me. It's the bad faith uncharitable interpretation of it. where it's like, yeah, it does become just these grand narratives. And I suppose it is kind of like, I don't know, people like equating all these kind of channels,

because it's common to see on Twitter, like people go on brigades against like cinema sins. That's like a big example in the movie community as far as like content that's concerned. And people, they're like criticizing cinema sins with for the formulaic nature and kind of the hollow criticisms and this kind of stuff. But like it bleeds out sometimes and people just because cinema sins exists and these types of channels exist and because there are bad faith channels that are kind of like more machines that just are on the content ground for the sake of it.

That doesn't mean every channel operates that way or, you know, like it's. Yeah, and even Cinema Sins gets a lot of really over exaggerated criticism. Like, people will say that he ruined film criticism. I, like, what? That's hilarious. Like, as if he's controlling other people to feel certain ways about films. And as if people take his opinion seriously and don't just watch his videos to just see an abbreviated version of a movie that they don't want to buy.

Right? Exactly, yeah. People get really hysterical over this sort of shit. And they'll look at my community and, like, the fact that, like, I don't know, the comments during some watchalongs or, like, some responses in my subreddit about. like certain things and you know there's a lot of fucking movie like people people we've already posted the new sardonic cast you know people disagree with me on dune part one they're a part of my audience they disagree with me that's totally fine that's valid but there are a significant amount of people

in my audience that will because they agree with me not because i'm some sort of like authority that they have to believe but because they already agree with me and that's probably why a lot of these people are watching my channel is because i feel like a breath of fresh air to them that might not enjoy the new Pixar movie or you know that might uh really love fucking tar you know and that might place that higher than something like killers of the flower moon or something right yeah you know it people people have this weird sense of like action versus reaction or like causality what is the what are the words uh fuck what am i i'm looking for that word um people should know what i'm talking about but like it's it's it's

It's a misunderstanding of what is causing what. Like, my audience doesn't necessarily agree with my opinions because I said them, but because I've grown an audience of people that agree with me, right? Like, if you, like, imagine, imagine somebody saying that about, like, political channels. Obviously, people that are more left-leaning are going to follow left-leaning political channels. It's not like, ooh, you only agree with this take because you're subscribed to them and that this enforces all your beliefs. It's like, no, they've built an audience of people that, you know,

trusts their opinion because they already agree with a lot of what they have to say, and it connects with them. So, yeah, it's, it either reveals some sense of, like, ignorance or stupidity. It either reveals some sense of ignorance or stupidity about, like, just this naive idea of how people's brains work, or that's how their brains work, and they don't understand that other people, brains don't work that way, right? Sometimes an accusation can be a confession. And if they think that

everybody's brain works in the sense of like, ooh, you just have an authority figure and you just listen to daddy about that, then I have to believe that either they're like really dumb and just don't understand that that's not how their own brain even works or their brain works that way and they just don't understand that other people's don't. Yeah, yeah. In a way you can almost read the response and the obsessive behavior of your opinions as a compliment, you know? Like the fact that your opinion on a movie, which we have established in this conversation, it's fairly low stakes as far as things are concerned, to have these people incense making threads talking about your opinion on it.

Oh, yeah. I mean, like, they're the ones that are making me an authority figure on it. Exactly. Yeah. They're just reinforcing the exact thing that. By acting as if my opinion, like, is having some sort of weight, right? Like, I'm a guy on the internet. I feel strongly about my perspective and I will argue my perspective. And most of my arguments with

people are about them trying to invalidate my perspective, not necessarily me saying that a movie is objectively this or anything like that. It's about people trying to invalidate my experience with the movie. No, I will fight tooth and nail verbally about my own experience with the movie. and I feel strongly about that. And people can either take it or leave it. Nobody has to watch my videos. And there are a good chunk of people that do value my experience.

I get messages all the time from people saying, you know, like, there's a handful of like comedic film review channels or meme channels or like, you know, overall sort of like negative vibe on movies or not necessarily even overall, but like that's the main selling point of the channels.

Like here's my breakdown, the fucking, I'm going to go full, on the Lion King here. And I'm going to, like, I'm going to talk about fucking everything. That's the selling point. But I've gotten so many fucking messages from people. And, you know, we know that this is the case.

Just everybody in my community can vouch for me on this. Well, maybe not everybody, but a good enough amount of people that, like, what separates me from a lot of these other, like, I'm just going to, like, dump on a Marvel movie sort of channel things is, is that I'm, is that I'm promoting a lot of. of like really great valuable independent film that a lot of people would not have heard of otherwise and that I'm actually helping a lot of smaller artists. Am I helping smaller artists that I don't connect with? Not really, maybe debatably if it's a movie that people never would have heard of anyway and I'm putting it on some people's radars even if I'm shitting on it. That's some sort of

promotion but I I yeah for for the things that I really connect with I think that my experience and my overall, I guess, impact on that type of media has been positive. And I've, there's, yeah, there's artists that I really connect with that if I go to one of their shows, it's like just a bunch of my fans. Well, not just, but like, you know, I'm more likely to see one of my fans at a screening for like hundreds of beavers or like a Matt Johnson film or like a Jim Cummings film or, you know, like a lot of these artists that, you know, you know, you know, you know, I'm not. You know, they don't owe their careers to me.

It's them doing it. It's them making the films. Perhaps maybe them being successful would have taken slightly longer. It doesn't really matter. But either way, there are genuine artists that appreciate me covering their films. And that, yeah, whatever version of me people have on Twitter, it doesn't change that fact. And I am confident about who I am. And my favorite screenwriter said he likes my videos.

that he thinks that I'm smart. And I don't know. I think there are some people that look at something like that and look at the fact that there are respected artists that don't hate me. And they feel some sense of perhaps insecurity about it because there's a lot of people that are trying to be artists that don't know how to be and are upset that nobody is taking them seriously. You know, a lot of these, you know, if you go to the Twitter profile,

files of a lot of these people. They're their own people with their own reviews that have like 50 subscribers and are kind of butt hurt. So it's a like, oh, my letter, nobody takes me seriously on my letterbox. It's like, okay, you might be projecting a little. You might, you might be upset that people don't take you seriously and that might be influencing your perspective of me. When I'm, I'm not insisting any sort of authority other than the fact that there's some people that connect with my shit and that in of itself, if we consider that to be an authority, sure. but certainly not like an academic one or anything. Yeah, and that that whole like Twitter overlap, I know depending on the year and what what conversations are happening, people feel more like Twitter's real life or not real life.

But I don't know. It's this kind of thing that does remind you. Yeah, it's like a siloed off like place that doesn't really exist. It doesn't really affect a lot of what's actually happening. Nobody says this shit to me in person. Exactly, yeah. Like, it feels real in the moment and when you're seeing these numbers attached to these things, but yeah, then you close your phone and don't think about it again.

So, yeah, the people in my life are not saying this stuff. Like, it's just completely silent. It doesn't exist anywhere outside of this digital plane. It does and it doesn't. It can. It can get to the point, you know, like if you people are canceled for like some serious shit, you'll see them get doxed and shit. Like, that's when it enters, like, your real life.

I don't think, I should hope that that's not going to happen to me over me saying that I don't connect with Shakespearean dialogue or that I misinterpreted a joke six years ago on a movie that I gave a positive review anyway or like whatever. I don't know. It's going through these motions of just like, oh, okay, it's this exact clip again. And I guess it's a slow day on Twitter and somebody needs a main character today. like I don't know. Yeah.

It seems so silly. Yeah. Oh well, free promo, I guess. I guess. I guess my subscriber count went up, so. There you go. Yeah. Okay.

The Oscars happened. We can give a little quick. We did it. Yeah. Yeah. What's kind of bullet point? Yeah. Yeah.

You don't have to go through like all the nominees. Let's see. If you, I was going to go through the winners and the air category. The Oscars winners. Let's go through those Oscar weaners. What does it say? The 96th Academy Awards, 96 years in a row.

So yeah, actor in a leading role, starting off with the Killian Murphy. Not really a big surprise. I feel like a lot of people saw this coming. He was winning in the award shows beforehand. So it wasn't too shocking to me. Yeah. It's been a long time coming. Honestly, like, top level, like, as far as like a list of Oscar wins, like, this is such an inoffensive, like, if not fairly solid list of films, I thought, in the end.

Nothing too crazy. Yeah. In all the years, like, there's nothing really stands out like previous years. Like, what? That's odd. Yeah. Well, I, my, Maestro should have won all the awards. I was always very happy about that.

Yeah, that was a fun one. No, mystere. But no one was, is anyone been mad at you about what you said about mystere? No, I like that. Everybody feels fucking vindicated, right? If I said that about a movie that people fucking loved, then I'd have another Twitter thread. But, you know, it's just, sometimes it's just whether or not people are agreeing with me at the time. The one, this is the film that can bring everyone together.

Yeah, yeah. My general feeling over the entire Oscar winners this year was there was there was, there was list of things that were expected to win, out of the things that won that weren't expected, it was the better choice anyway. Yeah. The surprises were nice surprises. There were no bad surprises, which was nice. Yeah, that's good way to burn it.

Since we're on the best actor category, Leo's performance was my favorite thing about Killers of the Flyer Moon and he didn't get a numb. Bradley Cooper got a numb. It didn't take anything in the end, did it? Bradley Cooper did get a numb. No. That is embarrassing and I definitely know which performance I prefer but of course. I'm raining it in!

They played that clip during the Oscars. They played that like in the lead up to like one of the categories for the film. Embarrassing. That's crazy. It's really funny. Just completely embarrassing all of that. But unlike the winner of actor in a supporting role, Robert Downey Jr. Also expected, yeah.

Again, expected, not surprising. There was, speaking of Twitter, there were a few, like, kind of desperate attempts of, like, trying to force some kind of, like, drama around events from this year's Oscars. Oh, well, not for that category, though. Well, there was something around, like, people were trying to make out that Robert Downey was being disrespectful to... Oh, yeah, because he missed the guy's handshake key, quick one. Yeah, yeah, from everything everywhere. My God.

You take, like, a tiny... fucking moment of someone's life. Like, you're on camera. How much of your life, right? Like, I'm streaming fucking 24-7 or whatever. How you're so confident to put intent on that? Like, you don't know, you don't know shit. They're looking for these, because I think it makes them feel better about themselves, you

know? There must be something like that. Yeah. If they can just, like, create that reality. And, yeah, on the kind of similar lines, there was a mini non-traversy about, the actress in a leading role who was Emma Stone who won for that for poor things very deserved to my opinions. Same.

I probably would have picked out of that list there but of course the minor controversy was that Gladstone didn't win was yeah, was yeah somewhat expected. But I don't know I looked at like the betting markets for this and they were like pretty much the same. So like I don't know if like Emma Stone wasn't unexpected. I think that people were just really hyped for Lily to. win because of the, you know, topic of the film and the fact that she would have been the first Native American actress to win. Like, people love milestones like that. I don't think that it's never going to happen, right? There will be plenty of opportunity in the future for Native American actresses to win best actress. So I don't think it's like, oh, this was the only time or anything. And she did a great job in the film. She did do a very good job. And I hope she's able to get more gigs in the future as a result of being in the film and being nominated. Maybe. Yeah, I'm sure. Sure she will. Maybe the win could have helped, but I mean, at the end of the day, to me, if what we're talking about was an award show celebrating the best performances, I just thought Emma Stone was incredible.

Her role required so much care for what she was portraying. What was required of her for the role easily could have turned into like one of the worst performances of all the time. Yeah, yeah. It's like fucking I am Sam or some shit, right? It could have been looked back on as like, what the, right? Like when you're portraying a character with like essentially a child brain, like baby brain adult body for a significant portion of the film and you're trying to navigate the physicality of that and the mannerisms and the voice and having like a consistent growth of the character in those ways over the course of the film. not to discredit Lily Gladstone or anything because she did a great job and if Emma Stone wasn't there then I mean like she would have won. It's just Emma Stone's performance in this year was just that there's it's not unjustified at all.

People that are acting like oh this was just some sort of scam like I did there's legitimate reasons to agree that she was the best performance of those. Yeah and poor things did I don't know, won a lot of awards. So now it's like it quickly became the race of like when everything everywhere started winning a bunch of awards. Yeah. We got to like go against it now in some form like oh now there's all these weird conversations about the poor things being like a pro pito movie and like. I mean I expected that much of people from the moment I saw the movie. I'm like this is a this is a challenging film that's clearly not promoting that's the part that's crazy to me. I agree it is challenging, but that part of it is not challenging as far as like any complexity or question marks,

as far as to what it's like pointing to or like endorsing. To have enough comprehension and know that that's not like the goal of the film or what it's saying. Like yeah, that's not a challenging thing for people without baby brains. But I don't have that much faith in the average audience. member and so this was completely unsurprising. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, it was that one. There was, I don't know, this has been going on for years and years. The three billboards drama that happened with that film. What was the drama? The Sam Rockwell character is, he was like racist or something. He's got racist. The character is racist in some form.

So people were getting upset that by depicting a racist character. That's the, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's kind of an ongoing. theme, this kind of media literacy thing, we're not allowed to talk about anymore. But, uh... Well, fuck, if we're gonna go that route, then fucking Scorsese wrote characters for himself to play in his films to say the N-word.

So, all of his movies should not win awards. You can't give it a word to Lily now, sorry. Because it's directed by a racist because he wrote the character to say the N-word, and he decided to play it. Right? Yeah. Right? How far are we going to go?

Like, I like, don't get me wrong, I like being angry over things. but I like being angry over things that matter. It's like, can we just outrage over it? Let's just, let's just chill, man. Can we just relax? Nah. God, it's so annoying. But, yeah, actress in a supporting role next then,

winner being divine. Joy Randolph for the holdovers. Devine. Daveine. So, yeah, I mean. She was great. She did do a good job, yeah. She was my pick, honestly, for that category with all the nominees.

She was definitely my pick. Yeah, she'd probably be my pick too actually that or Emily Blunt. I think I only would have had raised my eyebrow at the America Ferrera. Yeah, I don't, that was a weird one to even nominate, honestly. Yeah, weird nomination but didn't win, so whatever. And some people disagree, but yeah. Next one, animated feature film, Boy and the Heron kind of unsurprisingly took it away, but, But not as deserved in my opinion.

I've rewatched the Boy in the Heron since seeing it in Canada. I lowered my ratings slightly. There's a lot of love about the film, but man, the plot is like really difficult to figure out like what it's going for, what it's what it's trying to say. And that is probably the main reason I would still heavily be like, across the Spider-Vos is a better film in my mind than the Boy in the Heron. Spider-Vers is the better film for me. I liked Robot Dreams a lot. I know you didn't connect with it as much. Yeah, I didn't like Robot Dreams.

Glad I got a nom. Yeah. Elemental is one of the worst movies ever made. Elemental being nominated is, yeah. There was a better Disney movie to nominate that year that was still also shit. Yeah, agreed. Agreed. Did you watch it?

You watched Elemental? Oh, I saw Elemental. God, yeah. Now you put me in the position of trying to remember anything about Elemental. I definitely did watch it. So, yeah, just the worst setup. Like, they used to be, like, Pixar used to be such, like, masters of, like, concept. Yeah.

Like, the concept was the movie, in a sense. Like, they had, like, they're just, like, in one image, they could, like, sell a film. I'm like, oh, that's a fun concept. It's the bug story this time. We have a hook. It's the fish. I don't know. We have a hook.

But this is, like, what, you got to sit someone down for, like, 20 minutes to even describe what the concept even is. Or, like, what even, there isn't anything cool about it. Even with the concept, they don't do anything with the concept other than puns. No, nothing. That's really nothing, yeah. So, stupid. It is just straight at puns. The visual, the character design, like all of it was just like, what?

This is, this does not feel like Pixar, but... We're gonna make an allegory for prejudice again. No one's ever done that. The, yeah, the metaphors and the, it all like flashed really badly. Yeah. And just that character design. It's just... lead to characters, the fire and water characters, this.

God, they sucked. There were no great voice performances. There was no voice talent in the film. No. Yeah, I really don't know what they were going for with that. And it wound up making a lot more money than the good dinosaur, which is that director's previous Pixar outing. So somehow I managed to wind up making some money in the end. not deserved but did did you clap when Clyde came on the screen uh of course yeah well

after all that marketing build up and hype I was dude glad my clawed pop vinyl I got my clawed posters hopefully Disney Plus Claude show comes out comes together yeah yeah yeah what we talking about uh your your funco Clyde oh very embarrassing International feature zone of interest is worth mentioning if only for the fact that there's now like an open letter condemning Jonathan Glazer's acceptance speech, which I mean was probably the most uncontroversial way he could have framed the whole, you know, Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Yeah, because I hadn't seen that clip when I woke up on the day of the Oscars because

it airs at like three in the morning. for the UK, for the Brits out there, whatever. So when I wake up, I see all these articles like Jonathan Glaze's comments at the Oscars are causing controversy and Eli Roth is getting upset and people are all signing this thing. It's like, oh my God, what could he possibly have said? How bad is this? And then you watch it and you're right. It's very just like, oh, this was very like, I don't even know how you could get upset over this.

It was extremely kind of bureaucratic and respectful. Yeah, like he acknowledged the victims of October 7th too. didn't like he's not like a fucking one of those crazies that like you didn't seem to hold up any flag or anything he was just kind of like yeah the point of the movie was this you know dehumanization yeah he kept up on the dehumanization angle yeah we're seeing some of that today it's not it's not something that everybody is like exempt from and that is like in the past historically and like we could see examples of it what the fuck like Eli Roth you dumb piece of shit.

He's so stupid. Yeah. Yeah, he's been very embarrassing when Instagram. He's made one good movie and even that movie is not like a masterpiece. Which one's that? Cabin fever I liked. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I like cabin fever a lot.

I know you didn't. Yeah, I remember, remember hating. I recently went through your letterboxed. I saw it was in the one. Through my Yuley Rusk rankings. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh interesting, yeah, maybe I'll have to recommend that at some point. It's been a while.

Yeah, next up, actually maybe I should just throw out the sound win of course for Zon of interest, if you really throwing that out, which I thought was very deserved. I actually rewatch Zone of Interest a weekend or two ago. Yeah, I need to. Yeah, I think it hits better a second time, you know what it's going for, you understand that kind of detached style, what it's selling. much more with much more immediacy. Yeah, the sound design is like haunting.

It's, yeah, technically, uh, it's just so foreboding, so horrifying, um, subtle. Yeah, on a technical aspect, the sound definitely did deserve one there. You know, it's fucking crazy? No cinematography nom for zone. Yeah, whereas I've just got that up now. You know what got a nom? Meestro. Yeah, true. That is the big like the big standout I guess. It's just Maestro, what are you doing here?

Every snub you can easily just bump out Maestro and you have you have a good list. There's a yeah, there's a very good option for every place Maestro is in. But the actual winner of cinematography was Oppenheimer. Again, not too much of a surprise. I probably would have given it to poor things in that category, but I can't really get a set over Oppenheimer. either I did like the presentation of it. Uh, costume design. Again, not surprising poor things coming in there. That's what I would do.

Yeah, people were anticipating Barbie for that and, uh, production. Yeah, there was kind of a lot less Barbie than I thought it was going to be. And I don't know, I'm fine with that personally. I don't think it necessarily was Oscar winning or needed to be jerked off to that level. There's some fun things about it, but I mean, again, costume design far better and poor things in my mind. Mm-hmm. It won a song and it was for the wrong song as in I liked I'm just Ken a lot more than what was I made for.

I actually remember that song. I don't remember the Billy Eilish one. Exactly. Remember we had fucking Jay McCarroll on our podcast? Like a great composer by the way. That was the song that stuck out to him too. Like it's so much more catchy and memorable and like so much more of like an actual musical number.

But like damn, I get people are fans of Billy Eilish. It doesn't have Billy in it. The Billy song is like, it's like we've heard it before. Like, oh yeah, a lot. I would have, I would have been cool with Killers of the Flower Moon song, a song for my people. Yeah, that would have been cool. I thought that was like a really interesting challenge for a composition

is essentially creating a new song that still felt like authentic and traditional to that tribe. I think that that was, yeah, I think that that's like a pretty, unique pick in there and I would not have been upset with that win. Yeah, I'd definitely prefer that over the Eilish win, but again, not surprising. Nolan coming in, snapping up the best director or directing award. Again, not surprising. It's kind of the Oppenheimer sweep. Documentary future film, any thoughts on 20 days in Maripole? I mean, taking them? My favorite from the list would have been four, sorry, the eternal memory and then four daughters.

Yeah, four daughters was very good. And I didn't watch To Kill a Tiger or Bobby Wine. Bobby Wine looked boring and To Kill a Tiger, I just ran out of time. Cool. Editing, another win for Oppenheimer there. You know, probably not what I would have given it, but, you know. Yeah. I think it's fine.

The editing is like one of my criticisms. Not that it's like unprofessional, but just like the choices of what like the whole thing was edited like a trailer for the first like 30 minutes like breakneck yeah yeah I get I get what you mean it was like a kind of mess in a way um I could yeah yeah I'm torn because I only seeing it once I didn't notice that but he also did kind of like the breakneck pace it did add to the movie that is just like just constant science constant exposition we got so much to communicate with yeah it's weird but I'm torn yeah I'll see how it

flows on a rewatch. Makeup and hairstyling then another one for poor things. Not surprising. Again, what I would, yep, suggest myself. Music original score, Oppenheimer. Nah. I like the score of Oppenheimer and I can't be upset about this. Poor things was fucking way better.

Yeah, I think poor things are probably perhaps edge it out if I was voting on it myself. But the name's not Ludwig. It is not Ludwig. And that was another little mini-drama with him saying in his acceptance speech about the, his parents, thanks parents for not buying me video games. So then, so then gamers got mad. That's great. Excuse me. Yeah, and then you got the original song.

Best picture as well for Oppenheimer. Just totally sweeping here. Production design for poor things. So it was mostly Oppenheimer and poor things. Yeah, we did sound zone of interest. Visual effects, the one Godzilla minus one. I still haven't got around to seeing that, but I'm excited too. I think you'd like it, probably.

I liked the previous, I liked Shin Godzilla a lot. I love that design. It's very different. Okay, interesting. Yeah, Godzilla minus one is kind of like an homage to like the original Godzilla. Okay, cool. It was like old but modern at the same time. Yeah.

Yeah. And like the visual effects are great, especially for the budget. Like they definitely had like a solid understanding of visual effects. Yeah. Wes Anderson won for short film and didn't show up, which is great. He was busy. He was a Miyazaki for the boy in her. Yeah, yeah.

There was like a like one of those like parody article things they made a tweet and they were like, Wes Anderson reportedly did not show up because he was busy building this Lego set and like listed a specific one. That's a good one. There was writing adapted screenplay of which American fiction won. I've seen about half of American fiction. I like what I've seen. It's fine.

Okay. It's fine. Exactly. It's kind of what you expect from the trailer. I did though like called Jefferson's speech with his comment on because we've been talking about these movie budgets and getting inflated, inflated to this obscene level. I liked his comment saying instead of one, $200 million movie, why don't we break that up and, you know. Sure.

For $40 million, so on and so on. It's a good idea to put out. Let's experiment with that. Because, yeah, it does just feel crazy, unsustainable. And I feel like, yeah, a $40 million film, you know, like in everything everywhere type, doing well, doing something creative, doing something risky. and making a nice amount of money instead of all the money. That seems to be the thing. It's like they want all the money.

So everything has to be these big make or break investments. It's like, yeah. Of course, if you have a string of them, then you're fucked. And that's like, what's happening.

Disney's track record last year is not great. So it's like, yeah, you don't need to be spending those numbers. That's, and with Jefferson on that, let's chill. And,

And I guess finally, yeah, writing, original screenplay. And that's me of a fall. Hell yeah. Got a nod there, which I'm glad it won something. Yeah. And let's thank the French government for not submitting it for international feature, which is fucking annoying. Oh, is that way it's not in there. Yeah, I didn't consider that.

Yeah, you're right. So the Justine threee during her con speech said some things that were like critical of the French government and so then they were like but hurt and then they well because that's how international feature works is the government of the country submits the film and they can only submit one per year because there couldn't possibly be more than one good movie per year from a country that's not America that you would want to include on international future so this would have been that every single fucking year for the past like 10 years the international feature film it's

always been like oh I know which one's gonna win because it's the one that's nominated for best picture. This would have been the one fucking year where two of the nominees were nominated for best picture so there would actually be some debate over which one would win. Which would have been nice for, you know. That would have been nice, yeah.

Yeah. But yeah, I loved the screenplay. I thought it was great. May December, its only nomination was screenplay. I think easily could have gotten a bunch of other nombs. I loved that movie. It took me by surprise, honestly.

It was like... You loved it. Really yeah, yeah, I loved it a lot. Really substantive, really meta, but like purposefully meta, not like Deadpool meta, you know, a lot to chew on and think about. Yeah, did you find I was saying a lot of people finding it sort of humorous. Did you find humor in there? In like a dark way. A dark humor.

A lot of people have been commenting on it. I've seen it. I mean, that's not really what my takeaway was as much. I thought, yeah, the way it was dealing with this complicated subject matter and, yeah, the meta layers. were interesting in the lead to performances and that kind of arc of the especially a younger guy something disturbing about that and something yeah true that it's commenting on I don't know I didn't I definitely didn't love it though sure can quite put my finger on it I was just like I like what it was doing I did like some of

that coldness I liked a lot there was a lot of great dialogue and a lot of great conversations and acting but as far as like an emotional punch or impact like it But didn't stay with me. It hasn't stayed with me compared to some of these, like a past lives, which you could cause fairly snubbed or, uh, I even think like Bo is afraid, like as far as 2023, like, I don't know. We're going to be talking about Moulin Rouge soon. It's like, well, if that's allowed to have like six Oscar homes. Why can't. Anyway, I'm getting ahead of myself.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, we already talked about everything for the last year, yeah, yeah. So overall, not a bad Oscars, I guess. Yeah, I can't get upset really over this list. Like, pretty solid group of movies. A bunch of winners are deserved.

Did you watch the Best Picture reveal with the... I did. My I see Oppenheimer. My icey Openheimer. And like just nobody knew if he was doing a bit. I love that. Yeah. Not until the music kicks in.

Yeah. I guess that's it. Okay. I guess that's off at I AMR. Okay. I love that phrasing. Like that's been really locked in to my like brain. Like my,

my time I see my internal monologue now is just yeah, my eyes see. Yeah. My cup of coffee. My eyes see the steering. They should, they should only allow best picture to be read by somebody that's under the age of 80 from now on because we've had too many problems here. No,

I like it. I think you should be only 80-year-olds. Maybe they're trying to recreate the magic of the, the year that moonlight won, the year that Emma Stone won best picture for one second. Oh, that was. Trying to create another controversy. They know that they get clicks and viewers maybe. I don't know.

They should, they should have like a, like a curtain where like, we know, we know Will Smith is behind it. And if something, like, if somebody says something crazy. He'll rush out. They'll free him, yeah. Yeah. Like don't release the beast. Like a three strike system, three strikes and then will is let out and someone's gonna

get slapping. Yeah. Yeah. Oh no, he's getting angry. Yeah, I say choose even older actors and make the text on the letter smaller. Just see what happens. Can somebody help? Cool.

All right, let's get on to mule. Rouge. Right, yeah, that's... You recommended this. Why? I did, and I'm sorry. But why did you do it, though? I'm so sorry.

Well, because I don't know that this is one of those movies where it's kind of been in the periphery. I remember having, like, friends around 2001 that, like, loved Moulin Rouge. And, like, they always, like... How old were they? Talking about it. Uh, they would have been, what, seven or eight, probably. Yeah.

What? Well, yeah. No, so, wait, no, I'm just trying to just get into the mindset here. So your friends that were seven or eight years old loved this movie. And so you, they love Mulan Rouge. You were curious. It was in the periphery. You're like, I got to figure out why these eight-year-olds loved this movie.

Well, it's more like, as the decades go by, there has been like a Bazelerman film kind of, again, in the periphery being talked about. I remember when the Great Gatsby came out, again, like friends seeing it, talking about it, being in the zeitgeist, having conversations around it, Leo's in there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever, whatever. And each one of these movies seems to have just like, I've dodged it. The latest being Elvis, I think even an episode or two ago, I proudly said I'm never going to see Elvis. That's one I just want to never see. But I thought, you know what? Mulan Rouge, that's supposed to be the good one at Baz Luhrmann's film.

That's like the one where this idea these ideas of juxtaposing Some some some something old was something new like the only other Basleman film I've seen the Romeo and Juliet he did in the 90s again with Leo with the gimmick being His contemporary setting and the Romeo's got a gun But they're speaking Shakespearean English isn't that a fun juxtaposition and isn't that doing something and here Moulin Rouge is kind of the inverse of that where you have the 1890s French setting, as I'm sure you guessed by the name, juxtaposed against this was a musical and there's, I don't know, they're singing like, like a virgin remix pop things. Like the whole soundtrack is like, I wrote down the term for it.

It was a term I'd never heard before to describe, but I guess this. style of musical. Oh, I don't know, I've just lost the fucking term. Duke box musical. Yes. By which it means, like, what it implies,

the jukebox is just a bunch of really existing popular songs kind of squished together, remix, redone, put a vibrato in there, even if it doesn't belong. And that's just put together the worst soundtrack you've ever heard.

I was really not anticipating that part of it because to me I've never done much research on this movie read much about it I see the setting I see the 1890s Paris I see the poster with the big the big windmill and all this kind of imagery I think oh this is I don't know much about musicals I thought perhaps this was a musical that existed and had some kind of established storyline or bunch of songs that people know already so like one of the major things really fast was when that music starts playing it's like wait these That was just like a bit of David Bowie. Why are they, why are they singing heroes for a few minute? What? And then it's all this like clash together music like from the 2000s.

It sounds like all like MTV like hits that now is weirdly kind of like aged the film. Cemented it in a time frame even more. I just got where to even begin with this movie? because like there's some things I like about it, but it like undercuts itself and it trips over itself again and again and again. And by the end, like you just, you really don't have nothing much left to play with or to be entertained by. I was, yeah, this is not what I was anticipating. This is really not why I hoped or wanted it to be.

What did you, what did you think was best case scenario? I thought best case scenario this was like gonna be a fun campy over the top kind of like owed to you know the vaudeville 1890 like aesthetic but injecting this like modern lens onto it like man I just couldn't get into that aesthetic or style I guess you would yeah it's like this ultra over the top campy maximalist style, which you know what part of it, part of the production, I quite appreciate I quite like as far as the costumes, some of the set design, even some of the over the top light lighting and energy, I appreciate the energy. But the way it's strung together, the way it's presented, it's like it doesn't want to

give you a chance to even engage. It's like such an audiovisual bombardment. Like from from the word go you don't like get a chance to sit or Experience the atmosphere or take in what it's even trying to show you because it is this like frantic You think like Oppenheim has got that music video editing this is this like that times 10 But every single scene feels like a Not just a music video but a music video on like times two speed on YouTube Oh, it's like head yeah, it's like it's like

It's what it like if you watch it on two times speed you might develop epilepsy. It genuinely kind of is that level. Yeah. And like at the heart of it, like each one of these things could be something interesting to me, right? Like at the heart of it you have this love story, super crazy saccharine love story between Yeh McGregor and Nicole Kidman who are doing their best, I guess, with this corny, very like two-dimensional plain love angle where like I note it down I think they say

some form of the word love like 140 something times yeah that's like the the core of the story and it's like well I'm not really connecting with that so well at least it's a musical right the what they're fun musical numbers is there like a fun like level of theater to all this and again like every single thing has a caveat with it like yeah It does have the big flamboyant musical numbers and craziness, but you can't enjoy them. You genuinely can't. The presentation of style destroys itself. It like eats itself alive.

It's like something that if it were released today, we would be accusing it of trying to capture the TikTok audience. Like we would be accusing it of like trying to capture ADHD baby's attention. Well, yeah, which is crazy to say, and I guess I didn't expect, you know, like how with Elvis, for example, a big part of that is this same kind of gimmick, the whole like juxtaposing, oh, it's Elvis, but like we have Doja Cat doing part of the music and remixing something old and making it new. And it's like, oh, so that's just kind of been this director's gimmick, I guess, the whole time. Because it's like taking Nirvana lyrics and putting them in this film. Yeah, that was a weird one. It's like the turn of the century.

Like, Navarna's everywhere. We have to include that in the movie, right? And they're trying to do this thing where it's like, yeah, we're recontextualizing pop lyrics by juxtaposing it on. Yeah. 1980s Paris aesthetic and like yeah the the songs have different meanings now or better better better look at look at this like crazy aesthetic we've created by putting these things against each other and it's like very uninteresting it's yeah that's ultimately I guess my point it's like well what is that actually what is actually in service like what does that

create you know like juxtaposition can be fantastic way of creating a uncomfortable mood or atmosphere or something intentional you know like a classic one the the ear scene from reservoir docs with the song playing. You know, the juxtaposition is that it's a kind of cheery, atmospheric song that doesn't really match the violent imagery you're seeing, which kind of makes it more disturbing and freaky. Then, like, here, like, what does it actually embody the film with

outside of, like, just making it more, like, toe-tappery in terms of, like, oh, I know that song. I really like this song because I really like this movie because I like this song, type thing. I was also thinking about Quentin Tarantino earlier today when remembering the fact that I watched Moulin Rouge. And what separates Quentin Tarantino, because he makes like playlist movies. They're not musicals, but he makes movies where he likes a lot of songs. He'll hear it like fucking the whatever song you put in the Kill Bill with the 5, 6, 7, 8s is what they were called.

He was like, oh yeah, I heard it like in a mall in Japan and I asked him like, what's this band? I figured out how to put them in the film. He literally put the band in the film even. When he does that, and he does that in like pretty much every one of his films, you can tell that there's a vision there. You can tell that he was inspired by the song and used the song in a way where he was thinking of the best possible setting for the song to appear in. Like the juxtaposition of that ear scene in Reservoir Dogs is, you know, that's a great

usage of the song. He understands the tone of the song. He understands how it would work in the context of what he's showing. There's other films like, I don't know what you think about, Happy Feet. I love that movie. I really do. I need to revisit, yeah. Yeah, that's an actual jukebox musical where they're taking other preexisting tracks.

But you can tell that there's a different context towards how they're used in each scene. And each song kind of helps the story to flow. And it moves along in some sort of progression. There's a, you know, it's slightly different setting for each song or like a different context of like which characters are involved and how they're involved in this fucking movie it's the same throughout the entire fucking movie it's just the same shit it's just a bunch of fucking weirdos dancing and it's like some of them are about love I don't know why the Nirvana song was in there because that one that was just really unfitting like that that didn't make any

sense including that in the film I felt that way about most of the song choices like it just it just seemed like a 2001 playlist Like a lot of these songs, yeah, would be on there. But there's no vision. No, no, I don't get why. There's no vision there. And you can't, you could interchange the songs at any other point that they're shown in the film. And it would work just as well because it's just one repetitive, amorphous blob of just like,

we're all partying for two hours. And some of these characters are in love. And that's what it's about. It's love. Love! The thing that you used to sell movies. to people that... Yeah, that's the only thing they got, yeah.

You're not really engaging with anything. It's just a really... It's just a word. Love. We all like love. We all love, love. They're in love. Love. Love's cool, am I right?

Dog, that's relatable. It's like trying to do this... It's trying to like fuse high and low culture. And like really failing at it. Yeah. It just feels kitsy to me. Like, I know you've seen a bunch of his other movies. Have you seen the Romeo and Julia, I mentioned from the 90s?

I am, I am, I am not willingly watching another Baslerman film for the rest of my life. Fair, fair, but it had a similar problem. I haven't seen it in a long time, of course, but from my, what my memory serves, that whole juxtaposition angle, again, I feel like, what, what is that actually enhancing? Like, what is that, how is that really improving the story just by having that in place, you know, like the contemporary setting with the guns and the dialogue? Like, what, what is that adding? I don't know. It's cool or something. It's like, it just seems like a, yeah, it's almost like gimmick filmmaking.

It seems like very gimmicky filmmaking to me. And it's, it's weird because it does feel like such a waste because a lot of it, yeah, does feel like. like all of this work has gone in just to be wasted with this presentation of style that doesn't it like doesn't justify like what you're doing because like yeah you have you have these actors you have you and McGregor you got your Jim Broadbrens

you got I guess you got John Liguizamo in there as well I guess we can get into but he's there you got these capable actors but like that it's not interested in the character it's not interested in even traditional like fun musical beats you'd expect there's kind of an I want song in there that Nicole Kidman whips out which is one of the more solid parts to me so like on the rooftops and

all of a sudden like the production like calm down it wasn't cutting some like it cuts like sometimes multiple times a second in this yeah so to have a scene where it was like oh my god it's like I get like three or four seconds before a cut and it's like the mood is different it's like oh this feels like oh we're really back for a second, I could take a breath and actually look at what you're showing me. But even then. Yeah, I feel like I was denied taking a breath for most of the film. Like even, even when the music like slows down and there's supposed to be some sort

of dramatic moment of like, oh, something serious happened. And it's still going like, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut. But even within that sequence, it undercuts itself with, uh, yeah, you, McGregor, like, is watching her in secret and kind of sneaks up behind her and then starts singing with And the second they start singing together, that whole scene's ruined and just becomes another, like, it just feels like a string of references. It's almost like ready player one style except for the songs instead of the random references to a visual idea. It's just like, remember this song?

And now Beck is singing thing. Yeah. They like introduce them and like it as if you're supposed to fucking clap. They're like, oh, they start saying like a virgin. I'm like, are you going to play the song? They're like, yep. You could tell they're very proud. of that scene like this like the film feels like it's presenting as if it's being

clever with that especially with that one they felt like very proud of that they just didn't fucking tie into anything other than the fact that like she said she was gonna see a priest they're like oh she'll be absolved of her sins like a virgin yeah there's nothing really that justifies these tracks not at all especially with how I don't know there are a lot of them too maybe if there were A billion. If there were like seven uses of like songs, that you pre-established songs that each time was like a really well-intended reframing of something to do with the pop song and the lyrics. And there's there seemed to be like some kind of real intent or purpose to what they were doing.

There may be. But they're like, God, the director, he had to spend something like two years just getting legal permission to. to even use the small sections of all these 200 odd songs or whatever it is. And it's just like, why? That seems like the only part you're actually passionate about in terms of like a story or an aesthetic. Like that that's the important part. Everything else around it is just like, that's the only thing it's in service of.

Yeah. That's the entire extent of the vision is just the aesthetic of just the, them being in that place and people wearing silly costumes and everything cutting really quickly. And then just all of the songs existing. And that's the extent of the entire vision. And it's the exact same throughout the entire fucking movie. Roger Ebert liked this film. He gave it three and a half stars.

But what he said in his review is one of those like, oh, you're just describing every reason why I didn't like it. So he commented on saying that you don't have to start from the beginning. You can just jump in at any point. And you know exactly who loves who. who's the bad guy and everything. He said that the cuts feel like the film was fed through a fan blade. Wow.

Yeah, the reasons why I don't like it is basically why he liked it, I guess. That's an awesome way of that fan blade comment. That's a great way of summarizing the editing of the movie. Because it really, was Elvis that bad? Was the Great Gatsby that bad? I didn't watch the Great Gatsby. Elvis was very bad. Like the editing was that level of like multiple cuts within a second.

Yeah, I was doing the exact same thing watching that movie. I was just like I couldn't absorb anything about like the sets. It wouldn't give me a fucking chance to because it's cut to the next fucking shot. I'm like having a fucking aneurism watching the movie. It's pain. It's pain. It is pain. And I guess I'm just extra surprised because from what I could pick up from the sidelines,

Baz Luhrmann directed a film Australia I think also with Nicole Kidman which is known as the oh that's that's the Bazz you don't want to watch that's where it went a little bit wrong like Moulin Rouge is the apology for Australia or whatever type thing you see people say and it's like

what if Moulin Rouge is the the good Bazz I don't want to know what bad Vaz is like you can keep bad Bazz away from me because bad Bats because this is another one of those examples where I feel like I look at the the rating and I read some of the reviews and I'm just like I die I'm sorry

I don't know what you're talking about because I know and I know this is a this is quite a like mar mighty movie and I just have a bit of a reputation for that and Baz Luhrman does have that going for him I suppose but man it really is it's like pretty much unwatchable at points Um, especially with the runtime too. Like, I don't know, I'm, I'm, I'm not against like some of the ideas. That's part of what's so frustrating is you can, you can almost see like buried layers in that there is like the potential for like a fun 90 minute musical that kind of knows what it is and is more breezy and vaudevillian in a way that's actually kind of like fun or had like a bit of buildup or like jokes that worked. or like a location that was fun to exist.

Like original songs or something, you know? That would be, yeah, that would be nice, wouldn't it? Like a- Just get a good composer, good team or something, good lyricists. Yeah, that alone would have been a huge, an enormous improvement to have a, just a different take with the music entirely in that whole. Because it does undercut everything,

because that's what they're singing about, like they are, it is, most of it is, like, are references to pop, songs that exist so they're like limited that everyone already knows so like you're limited with what you can express with that anyway unless you're like really trying to get clever with like new meanings of lyrics and like reframings of things which I think it's attempting at points but I don't think it's really achieving or I don't think it's really pulling off anything particularly powerful with that as a statement or anything I was when reading about it I thought it was interesting that a

inspiration was Bollywood and you can see a few of those nods in the film it's like I guess yeah that that does I can see that inspiration as far as like some of these things that we we are clearly looking for we're not we're not getting and I don't know I was the RRR defender like I'm there for silliness I love goofiness I don't need the tone to be serious necessarily that's not the problem but I just need it to be not this I like I don't want a musical I just don't like the concept of this type of musical I think it's like it kind of defeats the whole point of what makes musicals

interesting or cool to me yeah to begin with and it doesn't feel like it's celebrating the the the 1890s setting it's not really no it doesn't seem particularly French outside of the title no I I Some of these choices, like, just undercutting itself again and again, I gotta keep reiterating because, like I mentioned John Liguzamo and his character in this, like, please help me explain. He's like, he's already, so what were they doing with him? They did all these like special effects to make him like a tiny guy, I guess, for some reason. Like, why? Why did they do that?

I don't know, so they could have him dangling from the fucking window upside down and so they could carry him, he could swing back and forth and go like, oh, they're so in love. And every time that that character screamed every line, there was, yeah, there was a point where in my notes, it was like two or three, yeah, two or three wrote notes in a row that would just end with like, John then screams. Well, like, screams his line. The greatest thing is to love and to be loved in return. I only speak the truth. Oh my God, it's just like, just give me a second.

I can't breathe. This film does not let you breathe. And it's like, good time doesn't let you breathe. But that all feels like intentional and like there's an atmosphere and something building up. And it's like, it's not that. It's not that it's like, too much. It just stylistically just kills the movie. I don't know if I've seen it quite this.

the self-sabotage be this intense just from like a pure stilessic level where I feel like even if you had the uncut shots you could edit something better as long as there was like more real estate to work with like you could put something more enjoyable than whatever they chose to do with the kind of montage action editing they they went with here because it's it's unsufferable to sit through and it makes it it makes the whole movie just feel like one long scene like nothing is distinguished like you never really you can't pick things apart it just feels like yeah there's one overbearing aesthetic just drowning the whole film yeah the whole point is interpretable from the first five 10 minutes and then nothing changes and then it ends eventually yeah and I think it's interesting even like just looking at it through the lens now of like it was nominated for like eight Oscars,

a bunch of Oscars. Yeah. Yeah, I think it was seven or eight Oscars. But interestingly, look at, look at the awards it was up for, not many of them to do a writing. No. Basically not a single one to do with that script or the writing because it is all about the theatrics and production design.

And that's like the only thing that really got rewarded. And that's the only thing I really would say, kind of liked about the movie and even then like the intent of it and the way it's used it's like so It doesn't create a world I want to live in Even with like some of that goofiness like you know there's the scene where they throw the They throw something out the window and the scales all off and it like bounces into the Eiffel Tower and it's all like very Cartoony and goofy and that's all very intentional. There's like heaps of cartoony sound effects and

over the top visuals and and jaw harps and it's like really goofy and over the top. And again, to reiterate, I don't have an inherent problem with that, but it's just, it just none of it feels like it's in service of anything. No. It's not building a world. It's not building an atmosphere. It's not telling a story outside of this really bland love thing.

And even then, they don't even have fun with the antagonist character, this Duke character that's at the heart of this kind of like love triangle. he's he was one of the few performances I was kind of like oh the there's something there's like trying you can't really see it because it's like being chopped up like a fan blade so you don't you're not really but you're seeing little hints of it like oh this guy he's got something behind this character there's something he wants to say with it but that character doesn't doesn't really get much to do there's not like a fun a villain a song he gets to perform or any or any of this any of the kind of

theatrics I want to see from a big goofy musical I just feel like I don't get any of it. Yeah, all the creative choices, all of it, like, including the play within a play kind of like trope and just going nowhere with it. It just kind of makes the characters seem dumber, like them improvising this poet, improvising this story right in front of the Duke

and the Duke can't see any of the parallels. It's like, I'm fine, cartoonie, I love over the top, I love, I love that kind of thing, but this packaging, poison. It's, it's very boring and very exhausting. Yeah, because I was, for the first, I don't know, 45 minutes or so, I was kind of mindlessly entertained by just like, this is crazy. Like, the fact that not only they thought this was a good idea, but like they, they, they followed through and committed to this awful stylistic. vision but the problem is that exhausting over stimulating nature does become an exhaustive

like difficult to sit through a challenge of endurance by like the hour mark when yeah you're just not like invested in anything that's going on you're not you're not waiting for the next musical number you're not waiting for the next big set they built the next set piece it is just yeah plodding and feels pointless there's like no sense of flow. No. No, like, yeah, it doesn't feel like it's building to anything that you get the, towards the end where it is presenting the scale of the musical numbers as if this has all been building to this moment or this, this setting, this kind of conflict. And yeah, it's, it's saying it all through the production, but it's saying it in every way except the story. Like it, you don't feel any of the emotion behind it or. Yeah, it just feels so misled and misguided. In a unique way to me, like, this kind of bad was like, at least kind of interesting,

not being the biggest Baz enjoyer. No. Kind of expecting something quite different than what I wound up getting. To me, this movie is like indistinguishable from something that we would be talking about that ruined the career. of everybody that participated in you know this is just a movie that happened to be a success but I just I don't like it's yeah well I could have just been like the biggest fucking flop in terms of what the movie is like I don't get it yeah especially

when like when Kylie Minogue appears as like that green fairy and being voiced by Ozzy Osbourne it's like oh my god this is like movie 43 just level type shit right here like the bad green screen the yeah i've been praising some of that the the real sets and the costume design and whatnot but there's a lot of like bad visual effect work and uh just poorly kind of thought out i guess blocking or storyboarding but like the it's just obnoxious honestly like the the the maximum of style of the camera is always moving it's like in visual effects shots it's flying through the streets of paris in ways that just like they know it's not

selling an aesthetic, it's just like key jangling, it feels like, like, I, yeah, I just, every decision just feels like, oh my God, that thing has a caveat, that thing has a caveat, maybe there was a good idea there, you know McGregor's trying, blah, blah, blah, it was, but none of it comes together. It all just, yes, all overshadowed is suffocates itself and all clashes. I can't stand quick cuts. It just, it pisses me off. I can't stand it.

No, it nearly always hurts, like some of the more notable recent memories, be it beaemian Rhapsody or a promising young woman, I remember having some really bad, quick cut at its scenes. It really does hurt everything in a way that's, I don't know, it's not, it's not that common to see it like that in a way where it's like, what, you're supposed to be like a bunch of professionals or tours over here, like this stylistic choice. is hurting the 50 million dollars you've invested into this whole enormous project. Well, it paid off, I guess, I don't know, if I... And yeah, I guess like in the end it didn't matter.

It really paid off, yeah, because I guess this is the BAS playbook, like, he's still doing this kind of same schick to this day. Like, I didn't realize it was such a like, dependable formula. It's so weird that he did that with the Elvis movie. It's so weird that he did the same thing. Because in that sense, you have to expect that some, you know, you're making a biopic essentially. Mm-hmm. And there's like a level of expectation that comes with that of people maybe, I don't know,

liking the music of the musician that you're including in the film. Maybe they don't want to hear Doja Cat. Do you get it? Baz? Buzz? But that's the thing, though. So I think they do want to hear Doja Cat. I think he's found the formula, you know?

Like, I just looking at, what, $85 million dollar budget for Elvis gross world wide, 288 million. People saw that because it's an Elvis biopic, though, though, right? Like, Moulin Rouge, like, that's not based on a big pop style we know. I think people saw it, I don't know. Remember, I don't know how conscious you were at the time. That cover of the, Vue le vu queje abet moi. I think it was like Christina Aguilera. That was like a hit.

That was a tie-in to the film and that was a hit. So they probably made a lot of money off of that, and that probably did a huge promo for the film because that was a huge hit that was on on the radio. Yeah and like pink was in it as well right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that that did a lot of marketing lifting especially for this film.

I don't know, you know, there's a lot of people that connect with it. So I'm not- Yeah, those people love it. Not invalidating their experience. Just keep this cancer away from me. I never want to watch a Buzz-Lerman film ever again. Yeah, it was it was tough not quite as expecting, but I'm not going to be jumping into the other Baz movies with any urgency, that's for sure. Yeah, just a weird film, another one for the pile of the, I guess I'm the odd one out here. I don't know what I'm supposed to take away from this or be inspired by with this.

Like, is it just like an Australian director work? Because what, like George Miller, he, he does like similar things in like the Mad Max movies and his genie movie and whatnot. You're using this sped up photography and like crazy maximalist stylings, but like when you just mentioned happy feet as well. But there is intent to this more over the top these choices. Purpose. Yeah, the purpose of it.

And that's it can work and it's not just. work and it's not just the craziness on its own that I have an issue with it's just none of it yeah fuels and purpose in service of anything or like it's building to something or yeah that that main dynamic is just not interesting the Nicole Kibman character was not very interesting the manic pace dialogue like embarrassing like it's not good dialogue no like the stuff they're saying Yeah, the weird clash of like the Nirvana cover that was supposed to be like Marilyn Manson, but then Courtney Love was beefing with Marilyn Manson.

Oh, that's funny. Recover it and change it and then get, yeah, all these different permissions. Beck doing David Bowie, Christina Aguilera, Fat Boy Slam. It's like, you've just, you've almost unintentionally created this, uh, this time capsule of all the all the worst stuff from 2001 I just like never wanna I don't want to exist in this little pocket that's been created by this movie it's like oh this is all the reminders of the stuff I don't want to see and like uh it's like if you throw a jukebox through a fucking blender yeah or like I've

not to bring up the fucking AI topic again but on on Spotify like now they've got this built in like hey it's your AI DJ guy yeah Yeah. And I tried it out the other day and it was like, oh my god, like if you think the radio can be bad, this thing sucked. And it's like, yeah, it's like that level. I just don't want to engage with any of this. This is clashing.

This is not why I watch movies. In fact, it's the complete inverse of what I like about, especially musicals and that whole, you know, background of theater and I love. love that but not here I'm sorry Baz this was like a one and a half star um to me very difficult sit through I get people like it I guess I like the cast on paper they're trying their best you know McGregory he's got he's got a crying scene he's got I know we know he's capable he's got range so does Nicole Kidman but yes not not here not these characters not this story quite an insufferable

unlike a war film. Uh, yeah, one out of ten, fuck Buzz Lerman, down with Buzz Lerman, up with Buzz Punperia. Okay, we got a better boss who directs movies. He made a movie called One For the Road. That was great. Uh, bad genius we covered on the podcast. So watch some Buzz Punpria movies instead. One out of ten, fuck Buzz Lerman, never watching any of your films again, unless you decide to

recommend one for me on the podcast at some point. Or unless it's got so many Oscar nominations that I feel like kind of, unless it's kind of like a best picture nomination then I have to fucking watch another one oh yeah they don't speak too soon they just keep handing them best picture nominations yeah yeah I don't know they love them so that's yeah no no more Baz facade I'm afraid is that a promise I think so yeah like I'm I'm I'm with you I'd be I'd be never seeing another Baz film until the day I die what one of my notes was did I do something mean to Alex. I was like, why is this happening?

Yeah, no, that's one of the few things that made it possible to sit through. Oh, it's just imagining my pain. It's just picturing you like, oh, yeah, you're gonna be enjoying. No, no. John Ligazami is screaming. Tell I make a living. Being upset. Everybody loves it.

loves it. All right, question time. See some questions then from the Sardincast community. Head over to the suggestion thread over on the subreddit. We can ask questions for future episodes just like Eddie 245 did. What are your thoughts on Journeyman filmmakers? I dislike this term because it seems to diminish the work of filmmakers such as James Mangold or Christopher Macquarie who have made great films.

So this was a, this was a term. I wasn't really familiar with, but in reading about, it was like, oh, no, I've, I've had kind of my interpretation of what they're getting at with this, but I guess I tended to refer to them more as, like, uh, opportunists or director for hires or, uh, I don't know, there's a, there's a bunch of, like, directors that sit in this pocket. Um, not, not really James Mangold or Christopher Macquarie that come to my mind as far as that, that brutal, uh, description of a opportunist or a director for hire. But I really do feel like people like Peyton Reed or David Yates, these people where it's like,

you got a big, big Hollywood production. We need someone who's not going to push the envelope who's going to deliver, hopefully even ahead of time, ahead of schedule, keep the budget slow. And they're just, I mean, Peyton reads the perfect one because he literally directed that film. Yes, man. Yeah, true. He's always the one that pops to my head as far as the journey man filmmaker is concerned. John Favreau is actually another good one. These people who, it's kind of the inverse of an alter, you know, someone, like as much as we just were going on about Baz and his stylings.

it's not it's not for a lack of character or lack of artistic expression where the problems kind of come from him whereas yeah a paint and read or a John Favreau what is their director calling card what is their what is their kind of stylistic voice that they bring you know Brett Ratner's your I prefer to watch films from directors where I'm able to tell that it's them even if I didn't know beforehand. My favorite directors are ones where like even if I didn't know they directed it, I could watch a movie and be like, oh, this is their voice and see how they made something and connect with it in that way. Because then, then, you know, part of the art for me is being able

to look at something and ask myself questions about why something is filmed or presented in certain way. So even though sure, Buzz Lerman is one of those doesn't connect with me at all. The types of artists that I generally gravitate towards are ones that have a style and a voice and a vision. Is there one of these filmmakers that does like pop into your head when you think of that assembly line kind of yeah, paint and read, gray goop. kind of directed. Yeah, I mean, I think I've described James Mangold this way before. Mm-hmm. Because I'm like, I'm not like rushing to see a movie because he directed it because we don't

really know what the fuck it's going to be like. Yeah. And he's, yeah, he's got that whole like, uh, dad movie thing on James Mangold. Um, yeah, I think that's fair. Uh, I kind of, I like James, Mangold probably more than a painting reed or a David Yates or one of these but yeah I do agree mm-hmm yeah there's not a big strong so what's the list of like uh yeah call the james Mangold calling cards um or like references in his filmmaking uh yeah not not much and there are I don't know there they're countless they're probably more of these types of figures than there aren't. They're probably more of these than altutas. So if you click them and count them up,

you just don't really know who they are, you know? Yeah. Just industry people. Yeah, people who work well within the confines. They're good at navigating through it. They get their shit done. They don't press too hard. Yeah. Nothing wrong with that because, you know, there's a certain type of people, sorry, there's a certain type of person that that's what directing is to them. It's not really expressing a part of your soul, but doing the job in a technical way. And if that's what they want to do, then there's no issue with that. And they're technically showing things in their film, and they're technically capturing the information and the tone and whatever the film calls for

in a certain way. If that's what they want to do, that's fine. I just don't. It's not something that I feel strongly enough about to seek out. Yeah. What's that classic balance of the soft and bored down into the one for them, one for me type attitude of like, yeah, I'll do the artistic statement and then I'll do the thing that makes it so I'm greenlit for future projects. So I can keep continuing in this space. Yeah.

But I mean, these guys are. one for them, one for them, another for them. Yeah, that's the thing. Yeah. Like when it becomes a, when you look at like, I'm really just zoning it on Peyton Reed right now, but when I, yeah, I look at him, I feel like the balance is like way off and it's like, I don't see a Peyton Reed movie. I feel that I see an enormous paycheck from Disney, normally.

Yeah. Whatever is, yeah, coming from him. But yeah. These are these people are everywhere like random one just popped into my head like the the fellow who directed like men in black international and like let's see who that is fast and furious a it's called like I always name I always read his name as Gary Gary but it's like Gary gray or something he he directed like gay gay I think you did the straight out of Compton movie that Italian job remake

Yeah, men in black international fast and furious eight like just those type of filmmakers sort of say. Law-biting citizen. Yeah, there you go. That was a funny movie. There you go. I don't know, yeah, there was countless of these kind of tiers of directors. Yeah, why not? Let's do this one from James Marsden, 0472.

What was the best movie that you were shown in school? Just asking because I watched three identical strangers in psychology. class. The best one I remember being screened to my class was threads probably. Nice uplifting

nuke movie. Yeah, that's set in England too, so that probably also explains where they showed it. It was mostly like shit, though, as far as as like films that they showed in school. It was like, oh yeah, the last week before Christmas, well, let's put cars two on or whatever, you know.

Yeah, yeah, it's always some bullshit. It's always some bullshit. I think my English teacher in high school put on Hero. And I don't remember how I feel about that movie. So I have to rewatch it. But I remember enough about seeing some of the like wire foo stuff that that like, it's good that I can remember shots from it. Like, that's a good thing.

Yeah, I haven't seen this one. Yeah. It's just so like not the environment. Like it's bad enough when you go to like the cinema and you got to compete with the people that like are also paying to be there. But in like classroom environment, it's just, I don't know, it's not conductive to. Yeah, you don't want to show something too controversial. Yeah, well, actually speaking of Buzz Lerman, I'm pretty sure we wound up watching that fucking Roman. Juliet adaptation like three or four times in English lit like because I guess so many

people struggle with the dialogue like I did as well it's like it must been like year nine year eight like what are they what are they saying you struggle with a dialogue what you want them to change the movie and just too stupid okay want them to not have Shakespeare in dialogue and a Shakespeare movie you want the you want them to cater to you what the heck yes it's mostly a lot of bad, what kind of comedic associations? Like my, my same English lit teacher. The only thing I remember about her is she was obsessed with X-Men Origins Wolverine.

Nice. She had like the poster on the wall and this always still- That's great. Hugh Jackman in that movie, but it's like, who, yeah. That's all my associations. Mm-hmm. Let's do this one. from Frosty Story 887.

Hi Sards, I know you guys are a fan of Kill Bill Volume 1 and 2, and many Tarantino fans have been hoping that his 10th and final film would be Kill Bill, volume, however, it's been revealed that his last film will be called The Movie Critic. Are you upset as much as I am at Kill Bill 3 will never happen, or do you think it's a good thing to leave Kill Bill as a duology instead of a trilogy? Do you think Quentin Tarantino should break his 10 film rule or write the screenplay for someone else to direct it, thank you. Sards. Well, I don't know, would we be bringing back Uma Thurman and are they like cool with each other? Because like the during volume two, he like

permanently injured her. And that's probably why. That's right. I'd forgotten about that. Yeah. Some of the stunt work right. Yeah. He was like insisting she kept driving the car faster. And you could only see the back of her head like he easily could have had a stunt double. Like there's a there's a good lot of legitimate reasons for like them to be. have some not, you know, not wanting to work with each other again. So that might be the biggest reason why that's not happening. You know, there's room for some kind of a sequel maybe with like, Viveka A Fox's character's daughter or something.

Yeah. Trying to get revenge. But it's like, then it's like, if you don't have Uma Thurman, then like, do we want that? I don't know. Like, Kill Bill Volume 1 and 2 are incredible. I think that so much time has passed. Like, there's a lot of nostalgic member berries and there's a lot of like trying to unearth the past

or make a prequel or a requal or whatever. They don't usually capture the magic when so much time has passed. So, I don't know. I'm not, I wasn't upset or surprised. I'm interested in whatever his last film is and we'll see what it is. Yeah.

I don't think it's like aching. It doesn't feel like, oh man, we're never getting that story we're owed. So I feel like part one and two are pretty complete. Yeah, there's little threads you can you could put that here and there or expand on. But yeah, why even risk it at that point? We've got the good thing. Why not just when Kilbo ends, when part two ends just start part one again. We've got that.

It's good. I don't get why he has to limit his stuff to 10 films. I kind of don't believe him. I feel like when he finishes, he might just, I don't know, just go into a different style of production or a different avenue, you know, books or TV. I'm sure I'll come back to film one day. Like, why stop? He could pull him Miyazaki.

He can pretend retire a couple times. I guess he's, I've heard him in like interviews and whatnot before. He's like scared of the concept of being one of the directors that can't maintain the string of quality, which I understand to a certain degree, but it's also like, I mean, you haven't really had a miss as far as like commercial and critical to the degree where it's going to even remotely hurt your career or your standing as a director's. Or your legacy or whatever. Or legacy, yeah. Yeah. I mean, do whatever makes you happy if, you know, you got to be making movies. then keep making movies.

Yeah. If you want to sip margaritas, then sit margaritas. And part of it does feel like a marketing type thing. Like Jonathan Glazer could make it part of his thing where it's like, 10 years of, I'll do my next thing. And every 10 years is going to be one. And it's going to be huge. I don't know.

Yeah. Yeah. Just big in yourself of marketing all this. Hmm. I'm curious on this one from Gordon Morgans. Is there a running joke you guys created on your channels that you're not sick of? I really don't care. Like I still get like dumb emails to this day.

If you hate everything, does that mean you hate yourself? Hmm. But like I didn't really care. I mean, that must kind of suck if you, if it really bothered you every time someone referenced Cool Cat or something if that really got you down or annoyed you, that would be kind of a bummer.

Well, yeah, sometimes there's some, there's none that I'm like, oh yeah, get this out of here or whatever. And also I'm the type of person where, you know, I can look at my past and not feel the need to, denounce it. I can look at my past and not feel

the need to... I can look at myself and just be like, okay, wow, that's a person that I was and who cares, and we all grow. There's some that are kind of like inkling in that territory where I'm like, okay, I don't know if we've moved

past the heart of what the joke was. So like there was some of the commentary things. It's like there was an earnest, I think it was Scoot where he was like, or was it, Guy L? I don't remember. It was one of those. to. And they were like, it's the Asian guy from 13 reasons why. And we're like, it's not.

And then it turned out not to be. And then we kept referencing that as a way to poke fun at the fact that he got that wrong. And so then it's just like, oh, an Asian person comes on screen. Hey, it's the Asian guy for 13 reasons why. The context of the joke is that we're making fun of the initial mistake, the initial misconception of what that was. But I'm like, I'm like looking at some, it's not like the biggest meme on the channel or whatever, but sometimes I, look at, you know, someone will, like, post something like that. I'm like, do we really, I don't know if we really want just, like, see an Asian person and then say a thing sort of thing, right? Like, in the same way that you wouldn't want to go like, hey, it's Jackie Chan,

where it's like, is it losing the spirit of what the original joke was, which was making fun of a, like, you know, perceived, like, ha ha, that means you're racist sort of thing. The butt of the joke shouldn't be the Asian person. The butt of the joke should continue. to be the initial confusion of I even forget which one of them did it right so in that sense there's you know I'm constantly thinking about things and being self-critical so there's something there so I just want to like make sure that it doesn't turn into something that it shouldn't I guess but so far nothing nothing has crossed that line yeah we can't be completely unaware of that can you yeah exactly because I don't

like comedians they they reassess sole material or like I remember I think it was like a Dave Chappelle story where he was on about like he had this this material that was like the gag was racist and he was noticing in certain crowds that like so certain subsets within the crowds were laughing a lot more than everyone else and it was like this pattern it was like maybe maybe we should like kind of a reassess some of this and uh see how this is being interpreted. Yeah, it's something to at least be aware of and see where it goes or see if any kind of

community policing is necessary. Yeah, like the, as far as policing your community and the responsibility that comes with that, because some people on like YouTube really don't think there's any responsibility like none and there's like a firm line and then I disagree with that. I think that, yeah. I think that there's a, people see things in such a weird binary way where I do agree that like, oh, just because someone from your community did something shitty or like, let's say you make a video and it's like, oh, somebody's harassing this person. Like, that wasn't the intention, right? I do agree that to some extent, you know, you can't necessarily blame the content creator for things that are out of their control. but I think that following that same line,

I think that the content creator should do whatever they possibly can to not give people ammunition that want to make that claim. You know, like in my Kimba video, like I blurred out like a lot of the names of people unless it was like an actual professor who wrote a book that you published

like I was blurring people's names. I'm like, okay, like there's no reason to like put this much heat on someone in this thing that people are going to get like really fired up about right you know and i usually you know on twitter don't clap back unless people are justifying death threats or justifying death threat like language or shit like that so i think i there there's somewhere in between there's a nuance to it like a lot of my opinions on things it's not completely one way or the other so i i think that i think that policing your own community is important and you should try to curate your community into something

that you're comfortable with and something that you, you know, like I know that I know that I have a good community and part of that is because I've banned a lot of assholes, right? And so, yeah, there's certain things that, you know, you can't prevent either being brigaded or other people showing up trying to, you know, represent your community in a way that's not accurate. But you can police it in a certain way where you can make it clear, like, hey, I don't tolerate that kind of language. I don't tolerate, you know, you saying this about, like, trans people or whatever.

Like, hey, here's your warning. You're going to go. You know. And I think that that does help build, like a better community, at least from what your standards are for what you would like to see in your Yeah, it definitely, I don't know, it seems like a naive thing to say or think that you don't have some kind of effect on an audience and what they are interested. Like, why else, like, it's just turned, the term is influencer at this point.

Like, if you had no influence on anybody, like, why would that even be the, you know, yeah, and I mean, like, even to the extent where you necessarily don't, it's not like you have the ability to, like, control everyone's minds. in your audience, but you have the ability to ban people. You have the ability to have them not show up like on your stream or at least have to create another account to do so. I'm sure you realized it at a certain point because I did too. Just with the nature of video editing and putting it out there and the understated power

of presentation and like just what you can sell, like ideas you can sell. the stakes are low in the way like we're talking about like movies and movie opinions and whatnot but when you kind of twig on that there is like a huge element to like just the way information is presented can make you sound like you know more about what you're talking about or this or that and it's like there's so much going on with that um I don't know that it kind of opens this whole new world of like just thinking about like as someone who makes video the potential for propaganda, the potential for influence. And I don't know, there's like a lot of craziness in there and it feels,

I often go back to this like Pandora's Box concept of like, yeah, there's a lot of craziness on YouTube and a lot of crazy stuff, a lot of crazy opinions, a lot of crazy stuff being said. But we have just kind of been handed Pandora's Box in an open state. It's like, where does the buck stop at a certain point? Like we've just allowed, we've, we've opened it and we've allowed this to influence the culture and without really understanding it. So yeah, it's like a very complicated subject. And trying to treat it as if it is a black and white, like, easy thing to navigate or there really are rule.

There are more rules now, but like, man, early social media was like a lawless, wild west type situation. It was fun. Like, it was definitely fun. But like, I was definitely like seeing shit and saying shit. I definitely shouldn't have been engaging with or seeing. Like, well, like the early 2000s. Like the, man, it was just a different time, different. Different landscape.

Different landscape. And just, yeah, seeing over the decades as well, like the, the way it has seeped out. I was saying earlier about how there is that disconnect between like, online and Twitter and real life and whatnot, but there is, there is a change in people that has happened over the, the more exposure to, uh, this stuff and information communication technology and all this stuff, like, I don't know. I kind of feel like we're just, we're just beginning. I think we're just getting started. Yeah. You can sell the ticket for part two now. Sedona cost part two Yeah

Yeah I don't know The most often I see the response of like You what you can't do anything about your community Those are usually coming from people that have like comparatively toxic communities Yeah Well they know they can't take responsibility I think that they fucking for sure know that And that's their excuse that they tell themselves so that they don't have to appear like

I don't know soy or something or whatever they're afraid of like appearing as like oh I can't be I can't be lame I can't be uncool to to not allow constant N-words and and constant and like knowing that like people in my community are like brigading other communities and blah blah blah I think I think that they know that they are tolerating that and actively choose not to do anything about it because they know that that's, you know, it makes up like either a significant chunk of their audience or they're maybe worried about like appearing lame or something. Sometimes it is as simple as just maximizing audience capture.

And of course, like, well, yeah, if you have a channel, this has a certain audience saying certain things and it's making loads of money, what incentive do they have to stop saying the thing that's making them loads of money? You know, it's kind of as simple as that sometimes. Yeah. Yeah, some people gravitate towards these communities. they know that that's tolerated and that's just the type of thing they like to do. Yeah.

And speaking of gravitating towards communities, should we do one more here from? Sure, one more. Cynic docky 239? Do you guys have any advice on how to stop yourself from seeking validation from people online beyond having thicker skin? Or do you have any advice on how to grow thick skin in this context or not obsessively attach yourself to an IP? So this kind of, yeah, brings it all together.

what we've been talking about almost the entire episode. People just kind of attaching themselves to movies, characters, political movements. How do you keep it in check as far as engaging online? A lot of mine, my approach is going to just take a step back and, yeah, remind myself, a lot of this is just online discourse and it does begin and end there a lot of the time. And so much of it is just fake, like, I don't get much validation off the random people I see on Instagram or whatever, because it's like, it's not real to me, I know. I see the angles they're using, the ringlights they're hiding, the face app, like, blemishes their cover. It's like, none of that bothers me because, yeah, I feel like I can just intellectualize my way out of it, like layer by layer.

But I, yeah, I, I'm just speaking from a, I, I'm just speaking from a, a place of privilege it feels like because this wasn't an issue in my life till I was like 17 18 already. So a big chunk of my development that this would really impact was already kind of over. So yeah, God, God forbid if you're like 12 years old and you're trying to navigate this, I feel like that's kind of a different challenge and you probably need some kind of guidance. Well, it depends. It depends what you're seeking out and what like you value, right? So my experience growing up was one where I felt very, like, alone and like I wasn't able to connect with the majority of people. And, you know, my opinions and my personality and the way I think and the

way I communicate with people is kind of like neuro-a-typical, you can say. Like, I approach conversations in a different way than you might expect the average person to or relationships, etc., etc. But my experience with that has also kind of formed the types of things that I value and want to put out to the world because it was never, you know, bright eyes doesn't make music to be heard by everyone. It makes music to be connected with by a small amount of people. And that connection is going to be so strong that it's going to be much more meaningful to them than if it was just something that literally everybody can connect with. Yeah. And so what I'm selling on my channel and throughout the other things that I create, my music, is authenticity. And that's what I strive to do.

And so if there's like a movie that I don't connect with and I know that like everybody's fucking loving it or whatever, there's a part of my brain that might put a bit more like preemptive criticism into what I'm putting out and I might like want to fact check something and I'll be like even if I saw it in theaters I'll like okay like maybe I should tortilla a cam rip or something just to like confirm whether or not this thing that I remember happening happened in that sense I'll be a lot more careful with those sorts of things but I'm not going to like lie about my experience and I'm not going to like pretend to enjoy something that I didn't or pretend to hate something that I enjoyed and I think that the people that do connect with that sort of thing,

like that's the reason why I have an audience and a core fan base. I don't know how much of my audience it makes up, but it's definitely something that is, you know, people are expecting. So, yeah, I mean, I mean, I don't, even within my audience, you know, they know that they would rather, well, enough people know that they would rather have an honest perspective that they disagree with than a fake perspective that they agree with. And there's enough people in my audience that feel that way.

And so that I, yeah, that's just how I live my life. Yeah. And I feel like a lot of people struggle with, um, they get all their validation externally, all of it. Um, and like everything, if that balance is off, it can become a, really negative force in your life like I've known people that like throwing themselves away to chasing sources of external validation yeah in ways that yeah that doesn't make sense people get so lost in comparison games or especially

if we're talking you know social media the validation you can get when it does turn into Instagram likes or YouTube subscribers or a bit of a bit of a bit of a bit of a. It can get quite inhuman and like detached and, uh, yeah, kind of psycho. Mm-hmm. If that's your entire axiom or like world view is all about external validation, I feel like there only goes one way. Um, so.

I, I call it being cucked by society. You know? Yeah. Like, seriously, like, we kind of touched on this. of just the idea, like a lot of people are really concerned about like whether or not they come off as like cool or something like that, right? Like a lot of people, that's a huge concern to them. Do what makes you happy. And if it's not harming anybody else, if you're in a safe enough environment, I guess, then be open about it.

Try to not hide things about yourself that would ruin your life if the secret ever came out sort of thing. I take comfort in the fact that like there's there's nothing that people can really use against me that's not already just like out and open and a part of my character. Own your shit. Don't get society cucked. Yeah. Well, you know who you are and you have a sense of self. Whereas, you know, a lot of these people are desperately seeking external down of the external validation don't know themselves. They've got no foundation.

So, of course. It's not even a question of building up like a thick skin, really. I don't think that's even the way of think about it. It's just more to know. It's more about knowing yourself. Like, what is it about you that is encouraging this behavior, looking for constant external validation? Maybe that's where the thought process should be going. Maybe you should be looking a little bit more internal.

or maybe you should, yeah, think about it as far as yourself instead of, yeah, all these random people all over the world projecting out there, the perfect little slices perfectly created for social media. Like, it's just meaningless. Yeah, and also if you're like a self-critical enough person, hopefully not to the point of it being like detrimental, but, you know, people that keep themselves in check in some way can receive criticism. And part of the, you know, it's a bit of a challenge sometimes, but part of the experience of

being a person on the internet and sharing your perspectives and being, you know, comments turned on and all that shit is eventually trying to figure out like what is the valid criticism, what is the invalid criticism, right? Yeah. Because there are valid criticisms to every person. And sometimes those criticisms can be helpful. and you can agree with them and be like, you know what, yeah, that's not a bad way to look at something or a bad trajectory to try and navigate towards. But yeah, I mean, as we mentioned earlier, this episode will be, you got to be able to distinguish that.

Part of being healthy about criticism is distinguishing that from people who literally, it doesn't matter what you say and they just want to hate you. people that are just being bad faith that are holding you to standards that they don't hold any other person to. Yeah, absolutely. All right. I think we did it. I guess it's time to recommend a movie. You got a wreck? Yeah.

What have you got? Well, so I spent a good chunk of the runtime of Moulin-Rouge plotting my revenge. And so we're next. We are now in the Sardonicast arc of revenge-based recommendations. So it's really going to get better now. Yeah. This is, we can break the cycle at any point, but I have decided today it's too good of an opportunity to pass up.

Hate begets hate, I know, but I had to watch a Bazelerman film, so this is what happens here. So I found two movies that I think neither of us have watched. It's a double feature. And the total runtime is under three hours. Don't worry. They're both under 90 minutes. They're both from 2013 from the same director, David de Cotto.

One of them is called a talking pony. With exclamation mark, question mark, and exclamation mark. all there and I realized the same director had a film called A Talking Cat? From the same year. From the same year, same director, two different writers and I think so I post, I gave you the IMD

links in there and I figured it was a good opportunity because we, A, we have a little bit more time before the next episode, we'll be back on the regular schedule next time. Although I guess one three hour movie could have been a wreck anyway. And also, I was able to find both of them on YouTube and HD, like, legit copies. So I don't know if you'll need a VPN or not, but I downloaded them so I can give you a copy of them. Okay. Awesome. We're going to see what the fuck these things are. So the same

director? Same year. Yes. Same director, same year. He really loves the exclamation mark, question mark exclamation mark formula there was another film that he released that I think that year also it's Duffy the talking cat and a talking pony right hmm there's a two there's two movies okay yeah no I'm just getting confused because I think I've seen a talking cat like I've got it rated on 9db um yeah I must have like a long long but you don't remember it um I'd remember nothing okay We haven't seen a talking pony! I haven't seen the pony one. Okay.

But I'm just seeing on IMDB for the talking cat one. It's like, well, original title, a talking cat. But then it's got a new title, Duffy, the talking cat. Is that what it says on IMDB for you? On I MDB, yeah, yeah, because I was like, where's the other... Oh, it doesn't say that for me. Oh, okay. Did you click the link that I gave you?

Where did you put it? I put it in the, in Zoom there's on the bottom, click the chat. Because you might be on the wrong, there might be more than one movie. called a talking cat. Oh, sorry, I accidentally posted the wrong link for the... Yeah, I can't see it. Hold on. I can do it in...

I'll just give you the telegram. Yeah, send it on telegram. Hold on one second. Yeah. There's a talking cat. Hold on opening it. And then here's the talking pony. And I don't know which one to watch first.

I don't think they're related. Just released it, I reckon. Yeah. Well, they're both 23, but I mean, Talking Cat came out first. Okay, these look pretty far. So that wasn't the other one that you have seen then? Was that a different Talking Cat movie? I think it's the same one.

What? I just sent a screenshot of like what I'm looking at. It's the same poster, same. Oh, just Duffy the Talking Cat, maybe just for the UK. Probably this is a Zoo-Tropolis situation. Oh, yeah, yeah. So the director also released a film called, My stepbrother is a vampire?

But I thought that that would be too much to include, even though that was the same year. And it was the same combination of exclamation mark, question mark, exclamation mark. And I was like, oh, interesting. You see how many directors credits they've got on. Yes. It's another, uh,

Bayoden Stevens situation, which somebody pointed out on the subreddit, here's a correction. I think they're a woman? Yeah. They had a blank IMDB there, to be fair. They apparently found their photo on letterboxed. Yeah, they had no description on IMDB and no picture on IMDB. So we made some assumptions.

Sorry for misjudgering Bayid and Stephen. If we are to believe that that is actually their picture and that's who they are. Yeah. Because there wasn't much information we had to go off. All right. Well, and you remember nothing about this movie. but you have it rated. Nothing.

I've got it rated there. Okay, this will be fun. Yeah. Maybe something will be triggered that we'll see. And remember, you promised never to recommend another Bais Lerman film. Okay, so if you feel like you got to get revenge again, you got to get a bit more creative. Or you can break the cycle and be a good person. No, I've already got my revenge plan.

Oh, shit. But I've had one, like, just save in the background for so long. This is the arc. This is the arc. We're going to bring it out. Yeah, I mean, I am asking for it. So whatever. All right.

If you don't want to be spoiled for a talking cat and a talking pony, directed by David Dukuto, 2013 films. Watch them before the next episode. These episodes come out every two weeks. You can listen to them early by going to sardonicast.com signing up for premium or patreon.com slash sardonicast. $2 a month will get you these episodes early. you can support the show

and yeah we got merch in the description link in the description on the YouTube we got a Sardonicast Highlights channel check that out subscribe

it's on YouTube also and yeah I guess I guess this is where we're going I guess this is the podcast now I'm talking Alex we'll get out of it one day But this is, this is, I was, I was like, that's why I was looking through your letterbox.

Oh, right. What's something that I could tolerate that he would hate? And then I just like stumbled across this and I don't even remember. I don't even remember how. I'm going to like wind up loving these or something. Yeah, maybe. I mean, we both might wind up loving them. These might be some great films.

I did it to freedom. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Thanks for listening, everybody. Happy Shrek or some shit. I don't know. Bye. Bye.