Saturn Returns with Caggie - Chronic Fatigue, Acupressure, and Astrology: Giselle Boxer on Building Her Spiritually-Guided Wellness Brand, East Healing

Episode Date: November 4, 2024

​​In this inspiring episode, Caggie speaks to Giselle Boxer, the founder of East Healing—the wonderful Saturn Returns brand partner for this season. East Healing, formerly known as Acu Seeds, is a luxurious destination for holistic health enthusiasts. Their curated collection of acupressure products blends Traditional Chinese Medicine healing practices with modern elegance. You may know Giselle from her appearance on Dragons’ Den in January 2024, where she secured investment from Steven Bartlett, as well as being offered investment by the other five Dragons! During this insightful episode, Caggie and Giselle discuss: ✨ Giselle's diagnosis and experience with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome in her mid-20s, as well as her journey to recovery through alternative healing practices, specifically Traditional Chinese Medicine ✨ How Giselle's recovery and the launch of her wellness business, East Healing (formerly Acu Seeds) coincided with her Saturn Return ✨ The importance of integrating astrological transits and spiritual practices in Giselle's decision-making process, both personally and professionally For a limited time, you can enjoy an exclusive discount on all East Healing products with the code ‘SATURN15’ at checkout! Visit easthealing.com today to explore their full range of acupressure products and start your journey to enhanced well-being.  — Follow or subscribe to “Saturn Returns” for future episodes, where we explore the transformative impact of Saturn’s return with inspiring guests and thought-provoking discussions. You can follow Caggie Dunlop on Instagram and subscribe to her Substack “You Are Not Alone" to stay updated on her personal journey. You can also find Saturn Returns on Instagram, YouTube and TikTok. Order the Saturn Returns Book here

I have long been a fan of Chinese medicine healing tools, so I am delighted to share our partners for this season of Saturn Returns, the amazing East Healing. Formerly known as AcuSeeds, East Healing is the UK's leading ear seed brand and a luxurious destination for holistic health enthusiasts, blending the ancient art of acupressure with modern elegance. You may have seen them receive investment from Steven Bartlett on Dragonstone back in January. My mum gifted me an AcuSeeds ear seed kit for my birthday this year and I've been a fan ever since. These small beads are placed on the ear to stimulate pressure points, helping aid stress,

anxiety, headaches, sleep, and improve overall wellness. I love their luxury take on this ancient healing tool. Their collection includes 24 karat gold Swarovski crystal, pearl, and nickel-free options. Visit EastHealing.com today to explore the full range of acupressure products and start your journey to enhance wellbeing. For a limited time, you can enjoy an exclusive discount with the code SATIN15 at checkout.

Hello everyone and welcome to Saturn Returns with me, Kagi Dunlop. This is a podcast that aims to bring clarity during transitional times where there can be confusion and doubt. Today I am sitting down with our brand sponsors, ONA, which is the wonderful Gisele Boxer. And she is the founder of East Healing, formerly known as AcuSeeds. So you guys might have heard AcuSeeds in this season's episode and I am obsessed with this brand. My mom gave me some for my birthday and they're these little seeds that go on your ears,

acupuncture pressure points, and they stay on for a couple of days and you just give them these little pushes and they have these trigger points that kind of set off different parts of your body for anxiety, stress, all sorts of things. And we get into it in this episode. So when I was connected with Giselle because of her own Saturn return journey, I was super excited about this partnership.

And it's a wellness brand that essentially has a mission to share the benefits of traditional Chinese medicine with the modern western world. Giselle was asked to go on Dragon's Den which kind of catapulted the brand and her story is a very interesting one because it stems from her own struggles with chronic fatigue syndrome and how she was trying to figure out how to heal herself when Western medicine failed her. So I hope you enjoy this very inspiring conversation with Giselle. Well, hello Giselle. Hi, how are you? I'm very good. Welcome to the Saturn Returns podcast. Yeah,

I'm excited to be here. I'm excited for you to be here too. So for the audience that might not be familiar with who you are, would you be able to explain a little bit about the work that you do? Yes, so I'm Giselle Boxer. I am 32 years old from near Birmingham-ish and I owned, well, I own a brand called East Healing, which is formerly known as AcuSeeds. So most people will know the business as AcuSeeds as we only just changed over sort of the last week or so. And you might have seen me on Dragon's Den in January when we had received investment from Stephen Bartlett. So, yeah. Very exciting stuff.

So, to kind of bring it back before that whole thing happened, which is obviously a very exciting moment, I wanted to get into how you got into this healing, to Chinese healing, and because you had quite a challenging time in your late 20s, which is how we connected really, it was someone told me that you'd gone through this crazy Saturn return experience, and then this kind of led you to this business venture. So could we take it a little bit further back into your sort of mid 20s and what was going on

then? Yeah, so it was when I was 26 years old that I was diagnosed with a condition called chronic fatigue syndrome, which is also known as ME. And at the time, prior to that, I was living a pretty normal life as a 25, 26 year old. I was living in London, working in advertising, was really social, exercised all the time. And unfortunately, basically within a couple of weeks, had to move back home to live with my mom, could not get out of bed, and couldn't walk really for more than five minutes at a time without having to sit down.

Wow, because you'd just be exhausted afterwards. Yeah. So had a plethora really of like debilitating symptoms. The worst was the chronic fatigue. So doing anything, showering, walking, cooking, would going to work would then mean I would have to spend a prolonged period of time in bed. But there were also like loads of other symptoms like digestive issues, brain fog, muscle pain, joint pain, the kind of list goes on really. It's just about awful. How quickly did it come on and was your health, you know, great? Before you didn't have

anything and it just suddenly started and came on very quickly? So if I was to look back, there were probably signs of that about two or three years prior. So a couple of years before, so I was maybe like 24, I had glandular fever and I was quite unwell for a couple of weeks, but then sort of got better. weeks, but then sort of got better. I would say that I've most of my life, I've lived it in quite a, I've had like kind of a subconscious high level of stress because I'm very much like a perfectionist. I want to do well at everything. I want to have a busy life. And yeah, I kind of, as I said, was living on in quite like a high level of subconscious stress. But then also, if you also bring into the mix like childhood trauma, so my dad passed

away when I was 16. I think it was like a huge mix of those things, which then it was basically the catalyst of getting diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome. My whole body just basically shut down overnight. So yeah. And for those that might not be chronic fatigue and ME, it's one of those ones that I feel a lot of people do struggle with, but there's still not a huge amount of understanding of treatment, where it comes from. So from your understanding of it, when you got diagnosed with it in the medical space,

what happened and what did they tell you? Yeah, so I, at the time before the diagnosis, I was experiencing all of these symptoms and I went to see, I think I saw about 10 different GPs in total. Because? Because no one would give me an answer or tell me what was going on. As if they would dismiss you or they would, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Most of them would dismiss me, some of them said that I was just depressed, others did multiple blood tests and they all came back as what they considered normal. So then they just said, just go home, there's nothing really wrong with you.

And then eventually after really breaking down in front of one of the GPs, they said that you've probably got a condition called chronic fatigue syndrome. And unfortunately, people, most people diagnosed with that because they exclude like everything else. It's a sort of last resort. We don't know what's wrong with you. So yeah. Yeah.

And then unfortunately, because of, as you said, there's not much research into it and people don't really understand it in like the Western medical world. They tell you, I was told personally, that there was no cure, there was no treatment, that I would have it for life, that I would probably never go back to work and never have children. So... Really?

Yeah. So to hear that at the age of 26 is quite traumatizing. And did you have to stop working? Because if you were working in the advertising world, it must have been incredibly fast paced being in London. So how was that? That must have been such a challenging time for your identity and development. Yeah, massively.

Yeah. So I moved back home with my mom and didn't work for a period of time. And then as I started to feel a little bit better, I then went back on like a kind of phase return, like part-time basis. Yeah. And what were you doing to start to feel better? Because when they said to you that this is a lifelong thing, why did they say that you wouldn't be able to have children?

Honestly, I don't know. It was just something that I was told by one of the fatigue specialists in the hospital. It was, yeah, quite a shocking conversation to be honest that I had with her. She even told me to not put that I had chronic fatigue on my CV, which I found quite a bizarre thing to say to a patient. Because it would put off employees? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Oh, wow.

Yeah. And why do you think they don't know how to treat it? I think there's probably just not enough money in that industry to research that sort of illness. That's what I think, yeah. Which led you to do your own research. Exactly, yeah. But I guess since COVID,

and a lot of people have now got what they call long COVID, which is basically the same thing, chronic fatigue, ME, there has been a lot more research into it. And I do know from speaking to people that there is more support available now on the NHS for people that have the condition. Because so many more people have it as long COVID because it sounds like the symptoms are pretty much exactly the same.

And I've got a lot of friends that have struggled with that. So when you were told all of this and given that very difficult news, what did you then start to do to kind of re-empower yourself? So the best thing I probably did was to move back home with my mom because she's a very positive person, she is a reiki healer, she believes in all things, wellness, spirituality, astrology. And she really gave me that boost to take back control of my health and wellness and to start looking at all the alternative things that I could

do to feel better again. She kind of said, right, we're not listening to what that doctor has told you, because that's just going to send you into a downward spiral mentally and physically. And yeah, we sort of just, she put me in touch with loads of different friends who were nutritionists, homeopaths, psychics, mediums, yeah, the whole shang. All the alternative stuff. And then what started to happen? So I started making like really strict changes with diet supplements, had homeopathic remedies,

started meditating regularly, journaling, doing breath work. It was crazy. It was like I was just spending all of my time just learning as much as I possibly could about all these other alternative ways to heal. And amazingly within a couple of months really I started seeing improvements, but I would say it took a whole year from diagnosis to when I considered myself fully recovered. And that was just from doing these practices and daily rituals that had that impact? Yeah, absolutely. But it was also traditional Chinese medicine,

which had a massive impact on my recovery. So I was diagnosed January 2019 and started the Chinese medicine healing. It was around June time. And the six months from June to January 2020, my recovery just, it just absolutely skyrocketed. I just could not believe the impact that it was having on my health. And was that something your mum also introduced you to? No, it wasn't actually. No, funnily enough, I met one of my husband's friend's brothers, used to have Emi, and he was in a wheelchair. He was very,

very unwell. And he met this Chinese doctor in Sheffield and started seeing her and he was able then to go back to full-time work. He's no longer in a wheelchair. He's doing really, really well. So yeah, I was introduced to her and she just completely transformed my health. And what did she start doing with you? So acupuncture weekly, so I went to see her weekly and then that sort of reduced down then to like bi-monthly and monthly. And then she gave me some Chinese herbal remedies, which at the time I was like, what on earth are these?

Pouders and potions. Yeah, and different pills. And I was taking, I think daily, it was like 32 different pills. It was like 32 different pills. And she introduced me to ear seeds as well. And was also doing other bits and bobs like moxer and other traditional Chinese medicine, like healing practices. And where do you think the sort of where Chinese medicine can come in where we Western medicine might fail? Yeah, so with Western medicine, and I think growing up in the UK and obviously, if you have a cough, if you have a cold, if you've got a headache, you go see your GP,

generally they'll give you some medication or you're at home and you take paracetamol and you expect to then be fine, right? And I think with Western medicine, they tend to treat symptoms, whereas with traditional Chinese medicine, they look at the root cause and they look at where there's like imbalances in the body. So that's sort of the main difference between them.

And what was she able to notice within you in terms of imbalances? Was it also looking at it holistically from an emotional spiritual perspective as well? I would say so, yeah. In TCM, they believe that the mind, body and the spirit is really connected, so absolutely so different from how the Western medical system see it. But she pretty much immediately found out, like said to me that the one of the root causes was the glandular fever that I'd had a few years prior. Because it had just set something off that hadn't fully healed.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. In a similar way to when people have COVID and other like viral issues. And then when did you start implementing these practices and deciding that you wanted to create a business out of it? So it was, oh gosh, so January 2020 is when I'd like considered myself fully recovered from the condition because I had started running, I was back in full-time work, had a busy life again. And then April, 2020, I fell pregnant pretty much immediately. And when I was, I was working, that was actually during lockdown as well.

So I was working from home for the majority of my pregnancy. And I remember we were doing this walk every day around Alexandra Palace Park. And it was every single day the same walk, the same walk, the same walk. And me and my husband would like put the world to rights when we're having a walk around there. And I kept saying to him, when we're having a walk around there. And I kept saying to him, I don't think I want to go back into my previous job once I've had Lola, once I finished maternity leave. Were you still in the advertising space at this point?

Yes, yeah. And I kept saying to him, I really feel like I need to do something in the wellness space because I'm so passionate about it. And I've got so much knowledge now. And I feel like that is just what I need to be doing. And yeah, it was one walk one day, I remembered the ear seeds and I was like, I wonder whether I could sell a really beautiful version of these ear seeds because the traditional ones that they use are, they're literally a small black ball and it's got a sticker on it.

So it looks like you've got plasters all over your ear, which aren't like the nicest looking thing ever. So I started looking into it and realized that in Japan they have these beautiful like 24 karat gold and silver plated ear seeds, which exactly the same thing but look like jewelry. So that was the moment that I decided to set it up. I mean it's such a genius idea. For people that might not know what they actually do for the body, would you be able to explain? Yes, so there's two perspectives really. So from a traditional Chinese medicine perspective, the ear is seen as like a micro system of the whole body. So most people know about reflexology with the feet, but they don't know that the ear is actually works in a similar way. So it's like a micro system for

the body. So there's points on the ear that correspond to different body parts and organs. And by using the different pressure points, you're kind of like clearing energy blockages within the body. And then from a Western medical perspective, our ear has actually got like so many nerve endings running through it. So you can actually stimulate the vagus nerve through points on the ear. And that's been like scientifically proven. So by stimulating those points, either with needles or with massage or with seeds, you can actually help the nervous system basically work in a better way.

And you can then sort of bring healing into the body, whether that's through better sleep, better digestion, reducing stress as well. Yeah, because we were, before we were introduced, my, I told you that my mum got me a pack of acu seeds for my birthday and she's now got quite into these sort of alternative practices and she bought me all kinds of things and so I put them on and they do, they stay on your ears for ages. Yeah. Which is fantastic. And does that mean that they're continuing to do their thing? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So we recommend wearing them for five days and then removing them, but they are quite sticky. So they will tend to stay on for a bit longer than that

time. But they just work to bring the body into balance. So even once you've taken them off, then they, you will still sort of see effects from them for the next few days afterwards. So what kind of things that someone might be struggling with, would they really help aid? So we have like a mind blowing number of testimonials from people who are using them for headaches and migraines. People love using them for that because they're natural and there's no side effects. And there's something that you can literally have in your

handbag. And then when you when a headache or migraine starts to come on, you apply them and give them a gentle stimulation. Yeah. It's just to boost the effects of them. So and it's quite instant. I mean, for most people, yes. Yeah. I would caveat that with like, everybody's different, everybody's bodies are made up in a different way. With all medicine, with alternative medicine, with pharmaceutical medicine, you cannot say that they will 100% work for you. But yeah, it's been quite incredible hearing feedback from people that no longer have headaches and migraines. And what other things have you got feedback from?

Period pains are a big thing as well. Menopause, so hot flushes, sleep as well, and anxiety. Yeah, chronic anxiety, people that have panic attacks or even just like low level anxiety, people are finding them to be really useful. And I wanted to ask in terms of the ME and the chronic fatigue, do you know whether that's something that affects women more than men? Or does it not? I've been told that it does. Do you know why that might be? Do you know why that might be? I don't know. Yeah.

It's really weird because when I was diagnosed, I went onto Instagram to try and find a community of people that were also struggling. And it was bizarre because everybody was like me. Literally, it was crazy. In the sense that they were in the mid 20s, they were female, they had good jobs, they were like ambitious women, women who wanted to do things to a high level. And yeah, sort of their dreams have been crushed really. And they were just, and like just ended up in bed and were unable to

move forward with different careers and and have a normal life so. Yeah because just thinking about it when we were talking I realized that everyone that I know that struggled with it is also a woman so I just wondered whether you'd kind of looked into that at all or had any philosophies on why that might be? No, but it's interesting, an interesting question, yeah. So on to the business, when you, so during lockdown, you suddenly realized I need a pivot. When you're pregnant, you're like, I'm going to go into the wellness space. From sort of conceptualizing the idea, what were the stages that then you had to go through to actually end up on Dragonstorm, which is obviously such a huge milestone in your career and a really brave thing to do.

Yeah. So I always say that like my business journey has just been a complete whirlwind and just completely mind blowing to be honest. And I think, I honestly think that I've done so well in my business because I am now aligned with my true purpose. In terms of like my Saturn return and the health journey that I went through, I truly believe that the universe literally gave me that illness to put me on a different path. So I was given that illness, I got really into health and wellness,

I started looking after myself more, then I set up a business in that space. And ever since, because I'm like on that path, the opportunities that have come through have just been absolutely mind blowing. And I set up a business with 5,000 pounds of savings. That was like all my savings wiped out. You know, I didn't grow up in a really wealthy family that had big networks

in business or anything like that. And all of the people that I've met along the way and all the opportunities that have like fallen into my lap have just, to me, seem like just complete chance. Like, it's been really, really crazy. But yeah, so I set up in November 2021. And I think I was trading for about 18 months and was like slowly building up the business. I realized that I'd hit a real niche and that people were just so curious. And with the product that I sell with the ear seeds,

they're a product which can go viral really easily, I think, especially on like, on TikTok, especially because people are like, what on earth is that? Like, it looks really cool, but what the hell? How does it work? What are they? What are the benefits?

And it created so like a social media frenzy really. And because I was one of the only brands that were selling the seeds, that also like benefited my business massively as well. So yeah, just like slowly built it up over the first 18 months and had some really cool opportunities come through with like big lifestyle brands that I partnered with, worked on some like really cool events as well. And then one day when I was just sat at home, I get an email from the researcher at Dragon's Den. And I genuinely thought it was a spam email. It's not real. So I emailed the guy and said, can you call me please? Cause I'm not sure if you're real or not.

And he called me and he said that, because what some people don't know is like, 50% of the people that go on to Dragon's Den apply directly. The other 50% are found by researchers. So these researchers, yeah. So these researchers look online, look to try and find small businesses to approach to encourage

them to go on. He found me and went through a really rigorous application process where I had to provide like business plans and all the financials and had to do a video, like a pitch on video, which I had to send him and yeah, eventually like, I think it was two months after I applied, I was pitching in front of the Dragons. So that again was a whirlwind. That is crazy. So before that, everything was just flowing very organically. Social media was kind of taking off. Did you have much of a team in place at that point?

No. So it's just been me the whole time up until the day after Dragon's Den aired. Then I realized this is too much. I'm six months pregnant. I've got another child and I need a team. What about the production element of actually getting it made? Because I think that that sort of aspect of things for people can be overwhelming. Where do they begin? With a product.

Yeah. Honestly, I just, as I said, I don't have any like contacts or anything in the business world and it was literally just a case of Googling. Really? Like Googling packaging designers, Googling photographers, like just feeling my way through it and yeah. And you had a vision, you knew what you wanted it to look and feel like. Yeah, yeah. And I think my background in social media advertising was like amazing for my business because most business owners don't have that background and the social media advertising part of it is literally a full-time job. So when you actually appeared on Dragon's Den, what was that experience like speaking in front

of them, pitching the business? Was it terrifying? It's funny because everybody asks me this question. And they're always really surprised because I tell them I wasn't scared at all. How? How? So we've spoken a bit about the way that I use the astrological transits to kind of plan out my life, right, like personal and professional. And prior to the couple of months before I went into Pitch, so from like when I got that email with the application, I have this astrology app, which I look at every single day. Which one?

Chani. Oh yeah. And I listen to the weekly reading every Sunday evening and plan my week and she's, I've got the full year reading as well so I like kind of know what's coming each quarter and all the messages that were coming up prior to going into pitch it was literally like you are going to get funding, you will have a new business partner." It was message after message after message. I was like, this is absolutely insane. And the day I went into Pitch, it literally was the astrology for the day was amazing. And I was like, you know what, I've got no fear because this is happening.

Like this is literally going to happen for me. So it was bonkers, absolutely bonkers. And then also it was predicted as well by a psychic that I was going to meet a man called Stephen and that he was going to transform my life. So when I went in, I was like, okay, I'm getting Stephen today. That's literally what's going to happen. And you did. And I did, yeah. So how much does astrology play a role in your life, both personally and professionally? A huge like it plays a

huge role. My friends, some of my friends who aren't into it are just so fed up of my chat. Because you use it for launches for for everything. Everything. Yeah. So I launched AcuSeeds during or just after the lunar eclipse in Taurus, which for me as a Sagittarius rising was in my sixth house of work and health. So it was literally the most perfect day ever because my business is in the health space. The launch that I've just had with East healing with the rebrand, I wanted to make sure that it was like after Eclipse season, because that was quite hectic. And Pluto was it like, has just gone direct in Capricorn, which for me is like the last part of the transformation phase with my money, assets and resources.

And I was like, well, that was good. Like that would be good. So do you allow one to sort of govern the others and you'll go, okay, I want to do this. What's happening in my chart? What's happening more collectively, astrologically and then plan or do you sort of plan and then look? So it's funny because sometimes I'll listen to a reading

and it will be like, you are doing this on this day and I'll be like, oh, I actually am, without even planning for that to happen. Do you know what I mean? It just like aligns. But then with like the bigger dates and the launches and partnerships and events and stuff like that, I definitely look a couple of like weeks or months in advance to plan those times.

And you've kind of spoken about how you've used it for sort of big abundant moments, but what about when you have trickier transits coming up? Do you pay equal attention to that? Oh, 100%, yeah. I just strap in and just sit at home and don't leave. Has anything gone wrong that you sort of predicted? In all honesty, I can't really remember because I'm not the kind of person to like dwell on stuff that's gone wrong generally. And I think this is like the Sagittarius rising in me. I'm

just like always striving to the next thing, like for the next thing. And like, I generally have quite a positive outlook, but don't get me wrong. I'm sure there's been like awful times, like really, really challenging times. And with owning a business, it's literally up and down, up and down, up and down all the time. So after Dragon's Den, so you kind of went into that knowing it was going to go well, knowing Stephen was your guy, that all happened. Then what happened after that? Because your life must have turned completely upside down. Yeah, so the pitch was in June 2023, but then the show didn't air until January 2024. So there was like a long six month wait. And I was kind of like, planning basically for the for the showing in January, but nothing will ever prepare you for that.

Nothing. They told me it was going to be crazy, but it was crazier than even they thought it was going to be. Because people connected with the product and the brand, do you think? Absolutely, yeah. Because it's new. It's not new. It's an ancient practice, but not many people have heard of it. So they were really, really intrigued by the product.

And yeah, I achieved the highest level of sales of any Dragon's Lair business like post the showing. That's incredible. Yeah. How did that feel? Overwhelming. Yeah just crazy and especially with it being just me. That night when you know my inbox was then full with 4,000 emails from people all over the world who had seen the show. I think 5 million have seen the episode. My DMs were just completely swamped. I remember sitting in the bath and voice-noting Stephen and just saying, he messaged me, are you okay? I said, I don't know if I'm okay right now. I don't know if I'm okay.

Like I've never experienced anything like it. And I had to, the first thing I did was get a customer service team on board because I could not handle the amount of people in my inbox, it was nuts. And then in terms of putting a team in place, was that something that you found quite easy and you just got on with, or was it challenging?

So the kind of weeks or the month after the show aired, I was in a bit of a haze, like it was a bit of a crazy overwhelming time, to be honest. And luckily I was introduced, Stephen introduced me was a bit of a crazy overwhelming time to be honest. And luckily I was introduced, Stephen introduced me to a couple of people and then a family member knew someone who thought could really really help me. And at the time I just was like okay, I hadn't even met them. I didn't even really know what their backgrounds were. I was just like, I need help. I really need help right now.

And they came in in what role? So helped with operations, finance, fulfillment, customer service, even like Facebook ads and yeah, all of it. All of it. Yeah. And for people listening that perhaps are going through their Saturn return, I know a lot of our audience want to have a change in their career.

They might have been doing something for a really long time that is a great job, might pay well, but they just don't feel like it's their calling or their purpose. What would your advice be to those people listening? Just do it. Just stop the job. Just quit the job. I mean that's a little bit irresponsible but I just think there's obviously a reason why you're not fulfilled and you're not happy and there's going to be something else out there for you and yeah just like listen to your gut and intuition,

I think. And then also use, use, use different spiritual practices. And I mean, I personally love to see psychics and mediums. They've really, really helped me still now. Yeah. Yeah. So my dad passed away when I was 16 and my mom was really into speaking to psychics and mediums after he passed away. And for me, it was when I was eight, sorry, when I was 18, I saw my first like medium. And they connected with my dad. And I was like, wow, this is really crazy. And it just allowed me to like, keep that connection with him and to like process grief really. So yeah, I'm all in with the psychics and mediums of the world. They've provided me with like so much help and advice and support.

Yeah. And for, you know, on the sort of topic of your purpose and following your calling, do you still feel like maintaining that connection to, you know, coming home to yourself, seeing these practitioners or healers is an important practice to maintain in order to help you navigate where you're heading? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I think what I've always thought was like, healing is not, healing is not linear, firstly. So like, your whole life can just be full of ups and downs when it comes to like your health, your emotional health, your mental health, physical health. your emotional health, your mental health, physical health. But then also healing is like a lifelong journey. So just because I'm healed from that condition, and just because I don't feel any of

those symptoms anymore, doesn't mean I don't have other things that I need to work on. And yeah, I just love the fact that I can just tap into all these people as and when I need it. So like with TCM, I still see my acupuncturist and she helped me so much throughout my pregnancy, throughout labour prep. I was going to say actually for your pregnancy did you lean on these alternative practices more than perhaps the traditional Western ones? Or did you combine the two? I mean, I went to see my midwife every now and then for checkups and stuff. But yeah, it was my it was a traditional Chinese doctor who I saw really regularly for pregnancy.

Nausea, back pain, pelvic pain. When you're pregnant, you get a lot of tension in the jaw area. They say that the jaw is really connected to the pelvis. So I had acupuncture in that area as well, general aches and pains, everything really. And with my first daughter, I had acupuncture two days before my due date, and I gave birth on my due date, which is very, very rare. Yeah. Because only 2% of women give birth on their due date.

I didn't know that either. Yeah. And for the final thing that I wanted to ask you about, because I know you spoke about how previously in the job that you were in, it was very stressful and you had a lot of subconscious stress. Now that you're running your own business, which everyone knows can be incredibly stressful,

especially when you have the sort of growth that you have in a very short space of time, how are you managing that all emotionally and not kind of falling back into previous habits? Yeah, so I have like a full toolkit now of like all of the things I know are going to make me feel good. Which are? So recently I've been really getting into somatics. So I do sometimes feel like my nervous system can get a bit frazzled. And I don't want to go back into that like freeze state where I couldn't get out of bed. Now

because I can physically do everything and I've got so much going on. I do sometimes feel like I can get in that fight or flight mode. So it's really important for me to have those like tiny moments because I don't have much time at all now with two kids in a business. Take those tiny moments to do things which are going to like reset me. So somatic exercises, a little bit of yoga, meditation, journaling, I have like a really amazing group of women who live near me in

Sheffield and we're all into all of that stuff and all the wishy stuff too and we get together on a full moon and we drink cacao together and yeah, just like tapping into those like little moments of time that I have, I'll use that time to do all these things. And when you say somatic exercises, for those that might not be familiar, what does that actually look like? So it's things like, I mean, it looks pretty weird, but it's just laying on, sometimes just laying on the bed

and doing very slow movements with different parts of the body. A lot of the stuff is hip opening. So many people carry a lot of trauma in the hip lot of the stuff is like hip opening. So many people carry a lot of trauma in the hip area. Especially women. Yeah, absolutely. So a lot of those exercises incorporate trying to like loosen up the hips, like shaking, shaking the body, rocking, giving yourself a hug. I'm really into like ecstatic dance as well. So putting on music and shaking out the anger and the fear and the shame and shaking everything

and getting out of the body. Yeah, because as a Capricorn moon, I'm not like, I'm not that open with emotions. What's your sun sign? Taurus. Because you're the same. My boyfriend's also Sagittarius rising in Capricorn Moon. I'm Taurus Sun as well.

Nice. I know you've just done a rebrand, sort of a rebrand. What is the plan in the next year for the brand? So the rebrand to East Healing was basically so that we can start releasing other Chinese medicine products. AcuSeeds was very much like pigeonholed with just ear seeds.

So as of Sunday, we released a full new range of other ear seeds, like Swarovski Crystal and Pearl, as well as Nickel Free. But then we've also started releasing other acupressure products. So we've got an acupressure ring, which is like amazing for focus, relaxation, when you're like sat at a computer all day

and just stiff fingers and circulatory problems. We've just released a comb, which is acupressure comb, which is really good for anxiety, panic attacks, pain. Amazing in labor. I used it during my second labor and it was life-changing for me. Really? Yeah. During the labor? Yeah.

Yeah. Where do you use the comb? So you just grab onto the comb and it activates an acupressure point in the middle of your palm. Oh wow. So it helps you to relax. But then also there's a theory called gait control theory, which basically redirects pain. So the pain was being redirected from that area

where it was all going on with the contractions to the point here. And it was absolutely, it was completely life-changing, that birth experience, it really was. Because of the using those tools. Yeah, yeah. And I use something called a TENS machine, which is very similar. What's that? So that sticks onto different parts of the back and you turn it on, kind of gives you

an electric shock. Whilst you're in labor. Whilst you're contracting. Yeah. And that also helps redirect the pain. But I've been incredibly lucky and I've had two amazing birthing experiences, both fully natural and quick. Very fast. Were you in hospital? Yeah, in the birthing center. So I gave birth in a pool both times. Interesting. I want to ask you a bit more about that. To go back a moment, what would you say like your characteristics as a Capricorn Moon are? Well it just doesn't process emotions that well really. I just make a joke out of most things to be honest, but my best friend is cancer rising

and she cries all the time. And whenever I cry, she's like, this is amazing honey, well done. Well, because you can be a bit stoic. Yeah, I just need to cry more and I need to let my emotions out more. And with the ecstatic dancing, it has been bizarre. Because I just cry. I just cry and cry and cry. And I want to scream, but I can't because I'm down in the basement of my house and my husband might think I'm weird. Having some sort of breakdown down there.

Yeah. Oh, I love it. Well, so thank you so, so much for coming on the show and sharing everything about your story and the brand. I think it's going to resonate with our audience very, very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks so much. I hope you enjoyed this conversation between myself and Giselle and if you want to check out these teeling, please do. They are offering a discount with the code Saturn15. Thank you

so much for listening to this episode and as always remember you are not alone. Goodbye.