Saturn Returns with Caggie - Why Saturn Returns isn't a crisis, it's a rite of passage into a more authentic version of yourself, with Krista Williams

Episode Date: September 21, 2026

In this episode, Caggie is joined by Almost 30 co-host Krista Williams for a conversation on transformation, self-acceptance and continuing to evolve through different chapters of life. Together, they reflect on giving up alcohol, rediscovering spirituality and the experiences that brought them closer to themselves. Krista opens up about body image, why real change begins with accepting where we are, and how following our joy can lead us towards greater purpose. They also explore relationships, femininity, subconscious patterns and nervous system regulation, offering an invitation to let go of who we think we should be and make space for who we’re becoming. Topics covered in the episode: 🪐 Giving up alcohol and the spiritual awakenings that can follow 🪐 Body image, food and learning to fully accept ourselves 🪐 Finding purpose through joy rather than one grand calling 🪐 The subconscious patterns that keep us attached to what feels familiar 🪐 How our nervous systems respond to change and resistance 🪐 Relationships, femininity and learning to receive At its heart, this episode explores the gap between the life we say we want and the patterns that can quietly keep us from it. — A special thank you to Pandora for supporting this season. Inspired by the milestones, experiences and personal stories that shape us, the latest Pandora Talisman collection celebrates who you are and the journey you’re on. Discover the Talisman that speaks to you in store or ⁠⁠online⁠⁠. If this episode resonated, don’t forget to follow, share, and leave a review. Your feedback helps us reach more people seeking clarity, growth, and self-understanding. Discover more from Saturn Returns: 🪐⁠⁠⁠ Instagram⁠⁠⁠,⁠⁠⁠ YouTube⁠⁠⁠ and⁠⁠⁠ TikTok⁠⁠⁠ 🪐 Order the Saturn Returns book:⁠⁠⁠ Click here⁠⁠⁠ 🪐 Join our community newsletter:⁠⁠⁠ Sign up here⁠⁠⁠ 🪐 Explore all things Saturn Returns:⁠⁠⁠ Visit our website⁠⁠⁠ 🪐Follow Caggie on Instagram:⁠⁠⁠ @caggiesworld⁠⁠

Hello everyone and welcome to Saturn Returns with me, Kaggy Dunlop. This is a podcast that aims to bring clarity during transitional times where there can be confusion and doubt. This season is sponsored by Pandora, who have launched a new chapter of the Pandora Talisman Collection, inspired by the milestones, experiences and personal stories that shape us. Each piece is designed to celebrate who you are and the journey you're on. To mark the occasion, I'll be choosing a talisman at the start of each episode that reflects the guest and theme of our conversation. In today's episode, I am joined by the wonderful Krista Williams,

co-host of Almost 30. For those of you not familiar, almost 30, is, I guess in many ways, the American version of Saturn returns. And it is an incredible podcast. I've listened to it for many, many years. And in this conversation, we discuss transformation, self-acceptance and making space for what comes next. We reflect on the experiences that have brought us closer to ourselves,

from giving up alcohol to discovering spirituality, to questioning the patterns and identities we can unconsciously hold on to. Krista also opens up about her relationship with food and body image and why meaningful change can sometimes begin not with trying to fix ourselves, but with fully accepting where we are. Together we explore what it means to find purpose without having everything figured out and how following our joy and taking action can gradually reveal the path ahead. We also talk about the discomfort that comes with change, why resistance doesn't necessarily mean

we're moving in the wrong direction, and what happens when we begin to create space for a new version of ourselves? For me, this conversation feels deeply connected to the crossing arrows talisman, which symbolizes towards better things. The crossing arrows are a symbol of moving forward and trusting the journey, even when we can't yet see where we're going. And that feels so relevant to Krista's perspective on purpose that we don't always need to know the final destination before we begin. There's also something in this talisman that speaks to a question Krista asked in our conversation, are your patterns matching your ambitions?

Because moving towards better things isn't only about what we hope for, it's about becoming conscious of the choices, patterns and attachments that might be keeping us where we are and having the courage to choose differently. So if you're stepping into a new chapter, celebrating a milestone or navigating a period of change, what would your talisman be? To discover the Pandora talisman that best reflects you, visit Pandora in store or online. Thank you so much and I hope you enjoy this conversation with me and Krista. Krista, welcome to Saturn Returns. I'm so excited because you run one of the biggest podcasts in

the world in the state, which is so connected to Saturn Returns, almost 30. So this is a real moment for me to have you on and sit down with you. So I'm super excited for you to be here. I'm so excited. I feel like we've been orbiting each other with our work. So almost 30, we started the podcast when we were in our Saturn return. We found out like three years in doing the podcast that that's what it was. And so then we kind of have talked about. talked about it more in the book and stuff, but you've just been such a pioneer in talking about it and how important it is. And I think once you know about the Saturn return, you can't unknow. And it was such an unlock for us. So I just feel so grateful to first be at your home and be in London

and then to talk about everything. I feel like we've already dove into so many topics. So it's going to be a good one. That's what I do when you're a podcast. You're like, can you halt that please? Like if anyone laughs, I'm like, save that joke. Like do the joke again. But let's talk about the origin story of almost 30. Because I'm, I think that that's so crucial to the whole thing. And it's interesting because when I was reading the book, I was like, oh, you guys started it before the Saturn return, when you were like going into it.

And then you discovered three years in, did you just say that it was the Saturn return? Whereas for me, I was like, I was just way too chaotic in my Saturn return. I knew it was happening, but I was just so consumed by the chaos of it all that I was just like, what the hell is going on? And I don't think I would have been able. to do the podcast until I've gone through the other side. I hear you. What was your rock bottom moment of your Saturn return?

So I'd say there were kind of, there was one that was like the beginning of it, which actually was when I was living in L.A. So like that's when I first discovered Saturn. Exactly. And we were just talking before we started rolling about L.A. and the kind of people that it attracts. And I feel like the veil is quite thin in L.A. It's got the kind of mystics, the dreamers.

And that's when I left London. I was very drawn to L.A., but I wasn't on a spiritual path. I'd kind of closed that aspect of myself down because in London it was like not cool, it was weird, it was still very much that. Go to the pub, get wasted and, you know, that's what it was all about. And I did that very well.

But then when I moved to L.A., the kind of sobriety journey started and recognizing aspects of myself and patterns that were just keeping me, in not a good place and started meeting all of these weird and wacky and wonderful people but I never ever saw

a career for myself in it. It never landed of like, oh, this is what you should be doing. It was more, I'm weirdly drawn to these crazy. I mean these flute players that like, it's just like, it's such an odd place. They come from a small town in Ohio. And so moving to L.A. was such a thing.

And just being around people that have no limits. It can get overwhelming. Like when you're at, every dinner is a gratitude. Every dinner we're talking about the moon. Every dinner's an intention. Like I remember my first month moving to Los Angeles or the first couple months. I went to this new moon circle. I was like, I'm at a new moon circle.

I was meeting new friends. And I came home to my partner at the time. I was like, I've got the new moon circle. And then a few weeks later, they invited me again. And I was like, why are they keep inviting me to these new moon circles? I didn't realize that the new moon happened every month. I was like, I don't want to go to more new moon circles. But my rock bottom, it's interesting that you got sober because that was a huge part of my awakening.

You know, in my process of, you know, us starting almost 30 and kind of the Saturn return journey, I think one of the first aspects of my spiritual awakening was getting sober. Yeah. I think I was around 25, 26 when I stopped drinking. And I was living in Chicago at the time. And Chicago is a city in the States that is really heavy drinking. I would kind of compare it to London. Like, it's really drinking.

culture, really eating culture. It's just kind of what you did. And I was drinking every weekend. And I think my drinking style wasn't like casual. I was either not drinking or I was drunk. Like it was, I was like all or nothing. Same. And I remember one morning I was out in the morning. I was so hungover and I saw a friend and she looks at me and she goes, do you remember seeing me last night? And I was like, no. She's like, oh. And her face was so disgusted. And she's like, oh. And her face was so disgusted. non-judgmentally. Like, I don't think she was trying to be like, ew, freak. But I think she was just like, shocked.

Yeah. She was, and I just saw myself in that moment where I was like, first, this is dangerous. Second, this isn't who I want to be. Third, this is like, what is that? And to be honest, I never liked drinking. Like, I did it to fit in. I did it to get along with people. I did it because I was bored.

And so it kind of gave me this moment where I was like, I'm going to stop drinking. And I think stopping drinking led me to a deeper spiritual path, but it didn't mean I didn't have my rock bottom in my, you know, Saturn return period. So you had it. You feel like that was a kind of huge part of my weight. Also the shame that comes with it. Yes. That's true. It was kind of led by shame. That's a good one. Yeah, which can be like a powerful tool, but I'm going to raise my kids. But do you have dreams about drinking? That's a crazy ask. No. My dreams are about sharks, oceans and houses. Houses is your psyche. Sharks is emotion or sharks is like dangerous emotions and water is, water is emotion. So I have the same cycle ones. Oh, wow. Yeah. Because I still have

drinking dreams and literally, I think it must have been last night. I had a dream where I saw someone and they said, do you remember seeing me last night? And I was like, I don't. And I was trying to piece together the night. And I still get them so regularly that it's like, my friend gets him as well. and he calls them phantom hangovers. And it's like you wake up with that shame. Because I like you would kind of go on these, I guess, kind of benders. I'd be walking, talking fully animated, but I couldn't tell you. It wasn't there.

Yeah, I wasn't there. I think it's like a spiritual purgatory a little bit. You know, I kind of, when I had my awakening, I was sort of seeing things more spiritually and energetically. And I remember being at the bar one night too. And I was like, we're just like wasting time. Like our souls are clocking out. They're leaving our bodies.

bodies are having this experience. And then we're kind of clocking back in the next day. And when I was becoming more consciously aware and, you know, usually right before the Saturn return, your prefrontal cortex comes online. So your prefrontal cortex is consciousness. It's the frontal part of your brain, your frontal lobe. And it's really responsible for you sort of seeing the world from a conscious lens. So whereas before I was just getting wasted and drinking just because everyone else was, I was now actually watching and looking at myself in it. And so not only what did I see people's like souls like leaving their bodies, but I also just saw and realized that the best times I had were pre-gaming with my friends. So us laughing and playing and, you know, and then

the next morning when we'd be recapping the night, we'd be like sitting on the couch, you'd be like, oh my God, remember you dipped your phone in the salsa bowl because you thought it was a chip? And we'd be like talking about the guys, you know, it was like those moments of actually me being conscious was when I enjoyed myself the most. But the time in between when I was drunk, I didn't even really like. We didn't even really remember. No. No. So in terms of the spiritual perspective of sobriety, you said like our souls kind of leave. What do you think takes over? I don't know if I would say, I mean, it definitely leaves room. So this is like a kind of a deep spiritual concept, but I definitely think it leaves room in your oric field for entities, thought forms, and beings to sort of take over,

to come in. Whereas that could happen. I just kind of think the soul is just kind of hanging out, waiting for us to be conscious again. Because you're really putting your body. in this state of psychosis or just like a, you know, it's a depressant. Like you're not really mentally there. Your body is slowing down. Your mind is slowing down. You're not really present. And I've noticed in life, you know, in the spiritual journey or the human experience,

our soul is more present at times and less present at times. Like there's sometimes where I'm just really clocked in and I really feel deeply connected to my soul. And then there's other times I don't. You know, earlier this week, my dad's really sick. So I was with my dad last week and then I'd been traveling and doing it. a lot post book launch. And all week I just felt out of my body. I just felt like my soul was just kind of like hanging out on my body. I didn't feel good. But now I don't see that as bad or good.

I just sort of get curious about what's the experience right now where I feel like I have to protect myself. I feel like I'm tired. I feel like I'm exhausted. And how can I just create an experience to invite more soulfulness into my body and to invite my soul back into my body to have an experience where I'm a soul having this beautiful human experience rather than feeling like I have to pretend, or stay in the mind or get out of my body because I need to protect myself some way. And you guys in the book spoke about how when we drink, the place that we're drinking from plays quite a big part. If we're feeling fearful or anxious,

that that actually affects the way we metabolize alcohol versus if we're feeling like we just want to enjoy the moment a little bit more. Because do you drink, what is your relationship now? So at 20, so I was like 26. 27, so similar age to you. And it was, it was a process. And it was probably 25 where I was like recognizing him. This is, this is not, this is not working out so great for me, but I could not stop it. And it was very all or nothing. And then it was a journey probably for the next five years. And it was around during the sort of core part of my Saturn return, which ran in tandem with me having a very

big relationship breakdown that caused me to go completely sober for a few years. And then now it's like, I have a glass of wine, but that's it. As soon as I feel a little bit drunk, I'm like, yeah, I'm not enjoying it. And I'm very aware of the environments that I drink in for me, weddings are just not a great idea. Anything that makes me feel socially anxious, drinking is just bad idea. Because I know that I'm not immune to the behaviors that I was once kind of victim to, I will fall back into those patterns. I love to see a little, but,

little tipsy case. But, you know, I speak with Africa a lot about this. Yeah, I just think about her. Yeah, she's got her sober journey. And in a way, it's harder having like a little bit, but it's what I've kind of landed on that works for me. What is your situation? Yeah, so I'll answer your first question.

Then I'll speak to my situation first. So 26, I quit. I think I stopped until like early 30s, maybe or maybe 30 around that time. And then with everything in life, if I just want to see if I'm being dogmatic about stuff or if I, if that's my truth. So I kind of started to bring alcohol back in. And I think at this point, and then I maybe drank for a little bit and then stopped again. And I think when I started dating post my divorce, I kind of started

to drink again. Like I just love a moment having a little glass of wine with someone you're meeting. And so I'll have a glass of wine like once a month, maybe. And then when we're talking about environment, so our body's actually very responsive to our environments. And, you know, if you're a human design lover, the human design app has a really beautiful exploration of what sort of environments we eat best in. But the way that we looked at it in the book was our body responds to our environments and if our body is in a state of stress, our body will not be able to metabolize the alcohol very well. And especially with food, our body actually can't metabolize both alcohol and food at the same time. So it actually has a detrimental effect to your digestion if you're

eating alcohol with food. So not only does alcohol and sort of reducing your alcohol are quick, putting your alcohol support you and feeling better and looking better, but it really helps support your body. But if you are in a place and space, say you're in Italy with someone you love, like your response of your body's digestion is going to be so much easier than when you're at the pub and you're crying about your boyfriend that just dumped you and you're stressed about something. Like your body is listening and it's responding to you. And I think that's the biggest message of it all related to alcohol and even food in general. Like it's listening to what we're saying consciously and subconsciously and responding.

Because you touched on something that I wanted to get into a bit later, but I feel like now we're kind of going in that direction. Obviously during one Saturn, I feel like our relationship with our bodies is such a huge lesson. And it was for me and it very much ran in connection with my relationship with alcohol. Because it was, I guess, about having an abusive relationship with myself, which I also used food as a kind of way of punishing or, you know, there was deprivation or, kind of having too much. Similar to alcohol.

I didn't know how to have like a harmonious. I've been so disconnected from my body for so many years that I remember thinking, if I don't address this now, this is going to be the rest of my life. And people can, you can deal with it, you can live with it. No one would even know. But I was so affected by that internal voice in my head that I was like, this needs to change. And I feel like that was a big chapter of the book.

in your journey, and would you be able to speak on that piece? Yeah, I'm so glad you shared that because I think so many women have related experiences. And I actually had a moment similar to that, you know, on my body journey. So just for background, I'm someone that grew up in the 90s. You know, we were eating all the diet, low fat foods. I think in the States, it's a little bit different than it is here. I think, and I'd be curious of what your experience is. My experience was like really heavy diet culture, really heavy thin culture, really heavy diet food. Not that I'm saying that you guys don't have that here, but I think we have our food is just worse, like the way we're in relationship with food, the processing, like the fake food.

And so I had been on a diet most of my life. You know, my family was really prioritized thinness, really prioritized physical appearance. And so, you know, my mom's biggest fear when I was little was that I'd be fat. You know, her biggest fear as a mom was that I'd grow up to be fat. So I heard a lot of different messages from a young age about how important it was to be thin or to look a certain way. And so when we're a child and we hear those messages, both from the media, from our parents,

we take that in and it becomes our internal voice a lot of times. So a lot of times the internal voice that we hear to eat less, to diet, to go work out, to do all these things, is our inner critic. And a lot of times our inner critic voice is the voice of our mother. So for me, that's a lot of what it was. I had the voice of my mother sort of running in the background in my life. I should eat this.

I should eat that. I need to be thinner, all of those things. So a lot of my life was kind of like a prison. You know, I would be places and we'd be here right now and I'd be like, oh my God, I need to go work out after this. I have to eat this. I can't eat that. And what I would say is I was almost doing like a Tetris game of all the numbers related to food. Okay, I had, you know, 1,500 calories I could eat in a day.

That's only if I worked out and burned 500. And then I could have this and this was this many calories and I had this many steps. And I weighed this much, but I should weigh this much. and so much of my mental capacity and my energy and, you know, really my life force was spent in this game and in this conversation with myself. And I remember walking across the floor of my Venice one bedroom apartment, you know, I don't know if we had started the podcast yet then, but I remember walking and I was unconsciously doing the math in my head of everything. I think I'd worked out that day. I was eating a protein shake. I was vegan keto at that time. You know,

I was like doing all this stuff. And I remember just being like, I think I'm going to die having hated my body and having felt like I never was happy and I was never satisfied. And I think that's just going to be my path. I don't think I'll ever figure this out. I don't think this will ever be something that I get over or master. And it was almost in that moment of surrender that I was able to let go and then eventually transform.

And, you know, Carl Rogers, who's the father of therapy. as we know it today has this really beautiful concept called the paradox of transformation. And the paradox of transformation talks about in order to transform something, we need to first fully accept it. And so I was fully accepting where I was and where I was at. And, you know, now I can say I feel really good and I feel just so settled and at peace in my body. But what I'll say just for the audience, because I know there's a lot of people that struggle, the things that supported me were first going to therapy and learning parts work. So internal family systems, parts work is the most powerful, profound thing. We can talk about that more if you want, but that was really the most

helpful thing. I think the second thing was finding purpose outside of what I looked like. So because I didn't have purpose in my life and I'm someone that's really driven by purpose, you know, a lot of your audience might be as well. I thought my purpose was to be beautiful and be thin. I had no other idea of what I was supposed to do here on Earth besides be beautiful and be thin. Whether people think I'm beautiful or not, that's what I thought I had to do. And so internal family systems, parts work. And then the third thing was really stopping having conversations about my food and body with people in my life. I think as women, we can really talk a lot about and connect on our bodies and food. We're like, oh, I feel fat.

I should go work out. We shouldn't eat this. We should do that. And I just dropped all of that. I let my friends and the people in my life know that I was no longer going to be engaged in an external conversation about that because it was just kind of affecting me too much. And that gave me this frame where I could really approach life a little bit more free and not have it as something in the foreground of my mind to think about all the time. Because I think with friends, it's kind of this toxic bonding, isn't it? Oh yeah. That you like perpetuate the issue. So when you had, because it's quite similar to me in terms of having that recognition of self and that internal voice, can you talk a little bit about internal family system therapy? Because we have,

we've had Gabby Bernstein on the podcast. She's talked about it. but just in case people are like, like, is that. Yeah, Gabby's a great teacher of it too. I'm going on a retreat with the founder in a few months, like as a small group, which is great. But internal family systems is founded by Dick Schwartz, and he was just an amazing therapist, and he actually founded it through working with people with eating disorders.

So he would have sessions with people with eating disorders, and he would sit down with them, and, you know, if you have an eating disorder or a problem with food, you have a desire to be healthy. You're like, I want to feel good in my body. Like, I want to do this. But for me, I was a very. binger. So I would binge at night. I'd be like, I'm going to eat 400, you know, like bars or

peanut butter or whatever I would binge. And the next morning I'd wake up and I'd be like, I really want to do well today. I really want to like get my steps and I really want to feel good. And the founder of Internal Family Systems, Dick, he would have these sessions with these women and he would notice that they were having two simultaneous experiences. One of them wanted to binge and then one of them wanted to do really well and feel good in their body. How could one person have two different experiences. And so the way that he worked with them was by getting to know both of these parts of them. So if you're a binger, there's a part of you that binges. So for me, my binger part, I would go to a long day at work at a job I hated. I would drive home, stressed out. I wouldn't

have eaten a good lunch. And I'd be like, oh, I need to soothe. I need to relax. I need to switch off. Food is an amazing thing to do all of that. It numbs you. It numbs you. So there was a part of me that was really dissatisfied with my life and was using food to binge, to numb, to soothe, to escape, and to not feel. And so food was actually really helpful for me. Like, although I had a bad relationship, it was soothing me, it was numbing me, it was helping me escape, it was helping me not feel. And so this part of me really had a misunderstanding. And in parts work, it's really like the parts misunderstand that there was other ways to soothe, there was other ways to not feel, There was other ways to escape, you know, if we needed to kind of, you know, take our mind off of things.

And so when I could be with that part and teach her, like, we could go on a walk. We could call a friend. We could feel our feelings. Like, there was other ways outside of food. Then that part would know that we have different ways of operating rather than just food. I could then be with a part that wants to be perfect and wants to get me on the diet and wants me to do all the things and be like, hey, girl, you are loved even if you're not the perfect weight. And I have to be the internal mother. And by working with these parts, you create a self. And that self is the most loving, undeniable aspect of you. It's like your soul. It's like your internal mother. It's the part that never turns away. That's kind, compassionate, curious, caring. And when you create that part, you know, that sort of family system within yourself is what they call it,

you can really like, it's just you can really do anything. And it's just such an unlock for the deepest self-love I've ever had in my life. Yeah, because it can feel. very confusing if people don't have that sort of terminology because it's like on one hand this voice is telling you to, you know, be really restrictive in your eating. So like go to the gym and you'll do all these things. You'll tick all these boxes. And then at the end of the day, it's like this voice is something like eat the entire cake. You feel possessed. You're like, I felt possessed. Like I was like, oh no. And whenever you, are you avenger or were you what?

Just restrictor. I was like, I'd overeat because I didn't, I'd lost that sort of intuitive eating ability. from a very young age because I was deprived myself around like 18, lost loads of weight. And then I normalized, but I never normalized upstairs. So I was always like very obsessive, very like, oh, I've eaten this, therefore I have to go to the, you know, kind of like you said, that kind of game in your head. And I looked normal. So you'd never know. But I think it was like the shame that built up around that over years. And there was one moment with the boyfriend I had during my Saturday.

return that kind of put me on the pass, not through like guiding me. Not through love. Yeah, literally. We really move with love. I'm like, this has to be painful for me to move. Yeah, it really was like, oh, okay, but that's another story. But I remember I was with him by the seaside and it was the first time I'd been in like a bathing suit and a swimsuit in front of him. And for me, that was always something that I felt like quite embarrassed about. It was always like quite conscious of my tummy and stuff. And we went into the sea and it was really cold. And he was like, oh my God, I can't go and it's too cold. And I went in. And I remember he made this comment to me as I got out. He said, oh, the reason you've like been able to go in is you've got all that

blubber on you. And Christ, I'm not joking. Like, I went. It was a horrible thing to say. No, that was a horrible. That's diabolical. It's a horrible thing. He thought it was funny. It was not funny. But my reaction was like hysterical. Oh, yeah. What do you mean? No, but I think that. came true. I put on the bathing suit. He said the thing that made my nightmare come true. But it made me realize that that's what I thought about myself. That's what I told myself. So it was just someone saying back all the horrible things. And it just affirmed the way I viewed myself. And I just was like, I couldn't even look at him. I was inconsolable. I couldn't stop crying

for hours and hours and hours. And I was like, wow. That was a nasty thing. I'm not saying that people should be able to like just water of a duck's back for the comment like that. But my reaction was disproportionate to the comment because it showed how I thought about myself. And that was one of the moments where I was like, oh, God, I need to address this kind of internal dialogue. For sure. It's, it's what. You know, one of my greatest teachers, TikTok says, if you're hysterical, it's historical.

There you go. I feel like Mark Groves coined that term. Maybe he just uses it a lot. Literally it's so funny, Mark's a friend. And I'm like, you know, TikTok told me. I just disregard my actual. friends thing. It's, I think it's written places too, but it's, it's true. And we've all had those moments. I've had those moments in relationship where, you know, this is funny with my ex, he would be like,

hey, could you pick up something? And something would set me off if someone would ask me to clean out the house. Because I feel like my mom would always be like obsessed with cleaning and keeping place. So if someone would be like, hey, put your shoes away. Like, oh my God. You know, like, it would be like a demon. Like I would just be like, whoa. And it, you know, you lose that trigger. And then you come back to like your senses. And a lot, and from a part's work perspective, that's a part of us that kind of takes over. That's like a firefighter part that's kind of like, whoa, this is like something that we've dealt with before. This is something that sets us off. And the more we can really understand ourselves and even you understanding yourself in that moment, the better. But that's a

really painful comment. Like it is, but I feel. I swear. I swear. Like saying something like that is so crazy. I know, but I feel like now if someone said that to me, it wouldn't, it would, it would hurt. but it wouldn't cause that response. Of course. But, okay, kind of moving on to, I feel like it's such a big piece of the Saturn return journey and the thing that a lot of our audience is struggling with is around purpose.

And it's such a big word, it's so loaded. I feel like a lot of people are walking around thinking, but I don't know what my purpose is. Is my job supposed to be my purpose? It doesn't feel like it. Does that mean I need to quit and, you know, start something totally new? and I'm sure you've experienced it with a lot of your audience. You guys have founded in what you do.

And that's kind of through expressing the struggles that you were navigating and realizing that there was a whole community of people that felt the same. But how have you navigated it when people are like, I don't know what my purpose is, and I, if I'm feeling that I'm out of alignment, what should I do? I think I'm going to answer this in a few ways, but if I was dear to someone just say what you said,

I don't know my purposes, I don't know what to do. I would say to them that a lot of times people are waiting for the perfect thing to happen at the perfect time, at the perfect place with the perfect job, to be like, I'm on purpose. I have an idea. I'm going to be YouTube creator and that's my purpose and that's the only purpose that I'm going to do. And until then I'm going to wait and I'm going to just sit around and da-da-da-da. You find your purpose through taking action and doing.

Like you really cultivate and sculpt a purpose through finding out who you are through service, through being yourself, through finding your joy. So I would first say that I think a lot of people use the belief that they have to find a purpose that is this very grand thing to keep them from doing anything and from taking any action. Like it's going to suddenly land for them if they're just sitting there thinking about it. And they'll be like it has to be the perfect thing. Like I have this idea of what my purpose is. And honestly, too, a lot of us, you could think your purpose is, you know, I just brought it up again because it's one of the most popular careers now is a YouTube creator. But until you're in it, you don't really necessarily know.

And is that coming from the right place? Yeah, exactly. Are you just seeing someone else who's on purpose and really lit up by that? Like, what are the things? So just a background from my journey. So I'm someone who grew up, small town, you know, really small idea of life. Like everyone just kind of had normal jobs, normal things, which is totally fine. But for me, I was like, I didn't really have any dreams for my life when I was little.

Like there was nothing that fit what I wanted to do. So whenever that's what I wanted to do, I would, I had no idea. I got into the corporate world. I worked in the corporate world for a long time. I was absolutely miserable. Like I just was so unhappy. I hated the lights.

I hated the gray. I hated the cubes. I hated the fake talk. I hated that there was this whole world that I got dropped in that felt in authentic and forced to me. Like when we started emails like, dearest Eric, like best regards.

You know, I hope this finds you well. Like something about that was just like triggering for me. Like I just, I hated the whole experience. I did. well, but I hated it the whole time. And later in my path of my corporate world, I was like, I need to find my purpose. Like, I need to find what I'm here to do. And actually, my desire and quest to find my purpose made me crazy. Yeah. I was so unhappy. I was like, what am I here to do? What am I doing? What's the point of my life? Like, you know, it actually made me hit my rock bottom of

being my most depressed and my most anxious I've ever been. I remember waking up one morning in Chicago where I lived. I was at my corporate job. And I woke up in the morning and I was so anxious at all times. The only reprieve I could get was sleeping. And I woke up in the morning and I had three seconds maybe. It was like before the loop thoughts came. And I remember just having this moment of peace before my anxiety kicked back in. And my anxiety started again. What am I doing here? What's the point? What's my purpose? All this stuff. And I just was like, I cannot. I cannot do this anymore. And that's when I had, you know, suicidal ideation and all that kind of stuff. Like it was, it was so bad. It was so bad. And so I got to a point where I hit that rock bottom and I

knew I had to do something. So then my life really started to shift. I stopped drinking. I sort of like started to explore different career options, different things. I really took my, took my, myself seriously because I knew I needed to get out of it. It was that bad. But the reason why I bring that story up is because I don't think finding purpose should be something that makes people miserable. I think we're born on purpose from God, like I'm very God. It's not religious, but I'm very God. From God, we are born on purpose, for purpose, with purpose. God does not do or make anything without a purpose.

So our existence is a purpose in itself. Like for other people in your life, you are a purpose. Like being a mother, being a partner, being a wife, being a husband. Like there's so much more to our life than just having this grandiose experience of being seen by the world in some way where you're perceived to be on purpose. Like, our purpose could be smiling at a barista to make their day, being kind to someone, like being really loving to the pets that you have, like creating a beautiful home. Like it actually doesn't need to be grand.

It actually doesn't need to be big. It actually doesn't need to be nothing. All that to say. I can say that being someone that lives and works and makes money on purpose. So I know and understand if you want to be someone that makes money on purpose. Some ways to support you and finding your purpose, if that's something that you want to do. I think astrology and human design are really helpful. I think they're really powerful tools. I know you know for really understanding yourself. A lot of people don't have purpose in their life because they

don't know who they are. Totally. If you know who you are, you know your skills, you know what you're good at, you know what you're not. You can go into the world and cultivate and sculpt those skills, craft what you're doing, figure it out. So really first knowing yourself through human design astrology is going to be really helpful. Something that you can also do is ask three to five, five people in your life that you love. Like, how do you see me? What am I good at? Where do you find me naturally excelling? Make sure there are people that like, you know, don't secretly hate you. Like, you know what I mean? Like, don't ask the girl of your friend group that secretly hates you. Like, it's like, well, you know, like, or your mom. Like, maybe mom's not the best one.

For me, mom's not the best. I asked her and she's like, well, you're a really good liar. I'm like, okay. We're going to roll it back and ask someone else. She's like, you could be a lawyer politician. Like, okay, bye. So ask people that you love to understand yourself. And I think third, try and experiment and do new things. You know, we did almost 30 with no intention of it becoming anything. We were on the closet floors. We just loved each other. We wanted to talk and we wanted to connect. And eventually it turned into my purpose because I really just followed my joy and followed what I loved. That's so powerful. And I think that piece around asking people, because like you said, in the astrology, the human design, so much of it. And when people are on this question,

for purpose is not like that they seeking this vocation necessarily. It's more that they're so conditioned to be someone other than who they really are. And we just have a lifetime really of that, whether it's from our parents, our school system, the friendship circles, we're around. And often we get to almost 30 and we recognize I've been living for someone else entirely. And my experience and many other people says, I have no idea who I really am. I want to be who I really am. But they don't know where to begin on that journey. Who were you being before you became who you are? Everyone and anyone in order to fit in and be loved and accepted.

I remember when people say, oh, you can't be for everyone. I'd be like, watch me. You haven't seen me in action at a party. And that's why alcohol was like my favorite tool for just being this chameleon. I could just adapt to any situation. Whereas then when I kind of took that mask off and then realized that I didn't connect with everyone, but realized actually that gave me this little anchoring in one. sense of self and I was like, oh, this is who I am. And then more and more people kind of started to

come in. Like you guys, it was very in tandem with the podcast because that held me accountable on my own spiritual past because I couldn't put out that work and then be going off and like slut dropping in the club. I'm so grateful for having an audience and a podcast because I remember at the end of my marriage, you know, we have this fight and like I just was like, this is so, if my audience knew Krista Williams, whatever, you know, knew this person was in this relationship, they would be shocked. And I just was like, I can't do this. Like it actually, I love that it, I was just agreeing, I love that it holds you to a standard of yourself where you're like, oh, actually, and especially being a coach now, I work with women one-on-one and in retreats. Like, the standard

that you have to hold yourself to is so deep. And I actually am very grateful for it because I think the part of me that's always a little codependent doing stuff for everyone else is like, if I'm not doing it for me, I'm doing it for them. You know what I mean? I've got to get a line for them. But because I want to get into the relationship piece because that's, I feel like a big part of your journey and chapter, but just another thing on the asking people what they think of you. Because we get so muddied in our own heads like, oh, but I think I'm this. Oh, actually I'm good at that. Like, I still do it sometimes now. And it doesn't have to be necessarily the people that are closest to I almost find people that know you from a bit of a distance, but admire you, perhaps.

They can, there's a girl called Rochelle and she's come on the podcast. And she said to me, she was like, to me, you're an artist, like very clearly and would say all these things. And I was like, oh, wow. I didn't know that I was perceived that way by someone, but it's really helped guide me now because, you know, our Saturn return is this huge pivotal moment, but it's not the only one. And how old are you now? 35. Yeah, so I'm 36. So I'm like at that next sort of Saturn maturation where I feel like...

The Saturn Square. Yeah. And I feel like a lot of the lessons kind of coming back. Mine too. Which are... Mine's burnout. I'm like, I've dedicated myself to this work. No, honestly.

Please. I'm being merciful. When I was reading the chapters on some of the chapters, like I was like embarrassed. Oh. I was like still working on this one. So which one did you set the burnout? Burnout. The burnout chapter.

Yeah, there's a whole, we started this out in return. I was ill. I was so burnt out. I was working a full-time job in the corporate world. We were building the business from the ground up, you know. And I was just trying to make it something because I really wanted to leave the corporate world. So we were on a world tours. We were doing retreats.

We were just killing ourselves. And I was burning out so bad. And I just, I'm still at that place sometimes where I'm, I would say that I'm burnt out. I'm on the edge five days a week. I feel like Americans are a slight different. When I've ever spoken, done any business with Americans, I'm like, I'm exhausted just speaking to you guys. My friends are like, are you, what's running you? I'm like, I don't know.

But what is running you now? When you've built something. Plug into a socket. What's running me? I think probably when you realized that this was going to be something you could have a serious career out of you're like, oh my God, I'm not letting this opportunity go. So it's like, pooh, wow. But then you don't allow yourself to actually take a breath and go, this is now established enough that it's not going to collapse if I look away for 10 seconds.

Yeah. But that's 10 seconds. I'm just kidding. I've metabolized that. I think now what's interesting is that my work, I don't know if you have this, my work and my play is so mixed. I don't know what's what. Like this is the best.

I get to hang out with you. We have the most fun. Like this is the best. Like what is this? Am I working? Am I playing? You know, so then you're like, I'm with. friends and they're all creators and influencers and we're creating content or whatever. And I'm like,

are we working? Are you playing? And then I'm like doing or talking, you know, I'm like, it just gets a little muffled with for me. And so I think that's where I get confused. I, I, because there's no like clear end of day. Yeah, there's no like I'm turning off 5pm. I'm all done. And then also when you, when you love what you do, you do it a lot more. I think for me, what is running me to do so much? I think I'm, I'm saying yes to too much. I think I need to get clear with my nose. I think I still, I have a deep desire for success and I still have programming around working hard is the way that I get successful. And I think that's sort of it where I'm like, the harder I work, the more money at me. Yeah. If you're not working hard, it's not working.

Yes. It's like kind of puritanical type thing. It's like the work harder you work, you know, which I guess is really what fuels the burnout because then when you are burn out, you're like, I must be doing something right? Oh, 100%. I like the end of the day. I'm like like my friend, I was, I had to work a little bit later last night after some stuff. And she's like, wow, you're just, you know, you're just working so hard. And like a part of me is like, yeah, I'm working. Like I was like, yeah, you'll see me watching Love Island at midnight working. Like, it's so embarrassing, like back in like 2000 grind days. But in the book we wrote about burnout because, you know, it's very American thing, but I think it's happening more because people are not switching off.

You know, when we're online, we're on our phones all the time, your nervous system is still really activated. So where you think that you can just lay on the couch and have a dirty scroll and just hang out and do your thing, we all love them. Your body is still responding to you as if you are actively engaged in something. So it's actually not relaxing to your body. So where your mind may go into like a trans state, your nervous system is still activated. So I wasn't really resting really well. I think most women are getting really burnt out because women take on so much. I don't know what it's like here, but in the States, you know, women are out-earning men. Women are more educated than men. women are now really taking on the role in the household as the breadwinner. Women are now also,

or women have always been sort of the place and space for the children and the family. Like there's no other co-regulation like there is with the mother. So we're wearing all the hats. Yeah, you're wearing all the hats. And I think women are naturally people that want to help, they want to support, they want to do. But it's almost like being taken advantage of a little bit in the modern day. And women are just absolutely burnt out. They're doing the most. And so where I see so much of my audience and the women that I support having this experience where they want a really beautiful life. They want to be rested. They want to be in relationships. They feel safe. They want to be mothers. They're not really able to because they have to earn. They have to hold it down at home.

They have to be the emotional support for everyone at work and then everyone back at home. You know, it's just a, it's a very unique place and space and time that we're in for women. On that, because I feel that it is so important to talk about because it's so new, really, that women are at this position where they're out-earning a lot of men. And there's this, it's not like the in-cell composition that, like, 80% of women are interested in 20% of men and therefore 80% of men are, like, feeling discarded or, and it's creating this kind of friction, I guess, and that's why there's the Andrew Tates of the world, and that's a whole other thing.

But it sounds like you speak to a lot of women that are in this position where they're super successful, maybe they're seeking a partnership, but they kind of feel like, struggle, perhaps struggling in that area. Where does it, where does it all lead? Because it's obviously thrown up the typical dynamics of like what a man represents and what a woman typically represents in the history of how it has been in society. Like, where is it, where is it going, do you think? This is a good one. I'm curious what you think too. For more information on this, Scott Galloway has really great work on it. So Scott Galloway, Yogan, Logan Yuri have really great research on sort of what we're talking about when we're talking about

this divide between men and women. Where I see it going, I actually see women having to sort of negotiate what they're looking for in a way in relationships to be with men. And I hate to say that because I don't think that we should negotiate. Like, I feel like we should have our standards. Do you mean compromise? Compromise, I think, a little bit. You know, I think it's going to be looking for a teammate more than like someone that's a provider maybe. I'm exploring this too. So I'm sort of in this space and place and my dating and in my process of understanding what it is. But I do think for the lot of the women that I work with and support, I think it's finding a place where they're not over indexing or they're not doing the most and they're not over functioning from a place of lack.

And it's really like what can we take responsibility for. I'm going to feel regulated in my nervous system. I'm going to feel like enough is enough. I'm going to know when to say no. I'm going to know when to stop. I'm not going to over function or do all these things because I feel like I'm not safe. But I think we'll only time we'll tell with sort of what's going to happen. I do also believe that men, I love men. I'm in a beautiful relationship and I love men. I've, you know, had really great men in my life. But I do really think that men are at a really deep place of needing spiritual, you know, awakening and nourishment and support. And what I've seen in a lot of the men in America, is just a real lack of purpose, a lack of drive, a lack of motivation. And I think a lot of that is

due to the internet and social media. A lot of that is due to changing jobs and landscapes. A lot of that is due to like a lack of spiritual foundation for their life. You know, women are more spiritual, usually, especially in the Jewish tradition, women are just naturally more spiritual. And so we have this foundation of spirituality and light and truth and guidance that's really leading us forward. because we have that connection. And my hope is that men can find a deeper spiritual connection to themselves or God to support them in finding that anchor so that they can be the men that they came here to be. Because I think also women will sit and have a coffee,

even if we're not doing a podcast and have exactly the same conversation that we're having. I think a lot of men want, but they just don't feel that that's accessible to them. And so they kind of stuff it down. That's why I'm obsessed with communication and the voice. So a lot of my work is on communication and the voice. So it's a perfect example. Men don't have a lot of vocabulary for emotions and feelings. Men don't have a lot of access to an understanding of the lexicon of language to describe how they feel.

And in that process, it's not like they're not feeling, but in that process, they're missing out on such a beautiful aspect of connection and of healing. I had a conversation yesterday with two of my friends where I was given the space to process something that was so messed. didn't make sense, but we went through and I was able to just work through something and just come out completely new on the other side. Because I had access to a safe space and also the words and language to process and work with my emotions, I'll never forget I was in therapy with my ex-partner. And, you know, at no shame to him, we were going through how he was feeling. And he had to look at a poster board of different types of emotions and point to the emotions to what he was feeling like sad, angry, whatever, because men have just really lost touch with their emotions

and then also their ability to speak. And so a lot of what men are missing is the ability to communicate and the ability to speak on how they're feeling and really express it because that's such a way to alchemize, to feel, to really own who you are and own how you're feeling instead of just stuffing it all down and letting it fester, which is what's happening with a lot of different men. And come out in a way that's really unhealthy. Yeah. With the women that you work with then also from your own experience. I'm curious to know what is the thing that they are seeking now

more than ever from partnership if there is one through line. Yeah, I would say they're looking for someone that's a masculine man. What does that mean? It's a great question. I have so much to say about this. So I would say,

and let me answer what they're going to say and I have thoughts on it too. So a lot of the women I work with will say they're looking for a masculine man, they're looking for a man that will provide, they're looking for a man that will take the lead, they're looking for a man that's strong, they're looking for a man that will allow them to be soft, allow them to receive, allow them to rest.

They're looking for a man that is very clear. They're looking for a man that will lead in plans, lead in the family, lead in all of these things. So a man that's really like holding it down from a masculine perspective. So when we talk about masculine and feminine dynamics, the masculine is more of the 3D. It's the material world. It's the frame. It's the leadership. It's the strategy. It's the organization. it's sort of like the clarity, it's the guidance of the family unit, if we'll say between a man and a woman. And then so the woman's really looking for rest, respite, receiving. She's looking to be her softer self.

She's looking to be taken care of. But if you'll actually ask men, a lot of men nowadays would love to rest. They would love to receive. They would love to be taken care of. So we actually have two different sexes of people that want the same thing. Both people want to rest. They want to receive. They want to be taken care of.

And it's not wrong for men to want that. And so what I'm noticing now is women's desire for men to be masculine is really their desire for rest, their desire to receive, their desire to be in their feminine more. And not that I'm saying that it's not, it's not easy for a woman to be interfeminine naturally in the frame that we're in the states. A response to feeling unsafe is putting on a masculine shield. A lot of women feel very unsafe. They have to work a nine to five. they have to take care of the kids. They're driving. They have groceries. They might not make their bills that month. They maybe don't feel safe in their relationship. And so they put up a masculine shield.

Their desires to feel out of that masculine shield and in the truth of their femininity. So they're really looking for a safe space in their relationship to be with a man who can take care of them. Do I feel like it's possible? Yes, for sure. But I also feel like right now I'm noticing sort of an overindexing on having the man be masculine and really leaving out the beautiful parts of the feminine. You know, the person that I'm with right now, he's very balanced in the masculine and feminine. And it actually has taught me so much about the beauty of having a man that has more balanced than just being masculine. He's an amazing listener. He's emotionally available.

He's great at attunement. He holds space. Like, he's helpful with processing emotions. He asks a lot of questions. Like, he's just got these beautiful elements of the feminine. And so I think in that desire for men to be more masculine, I get it. It makes sense. But I also don't want women to forget about the beautiful ask.

of an integrated feminine in a man. Beautifully answered. And it sounds like women are actually tired of wearing the masculine mask more than anything. It's rather than just seeking, they want someone else to carry that. And is that not a dysfunction of our society versus a dysfunction of our relationships? It's like that's causing our relationships to break down because now most people need two incomes for the household to just run. Yeah. And therefore women are having to go to what they can't like soften and surrender.

And I think also you see online these trends like the trad wife. Like I'm with a provider therefore I, you know, my Friday morning looks like making sourdough bread and like each to their own. But you can see this kind of shift in that direction. Because I think there's a fatigue in women. But it feels more. And I guess America is, you know, I've navigated it recently since having a baby that, you know, maternity leave, paternity leave. America is like crazy in how little paternity thing.

It's like really bad. Yeah. And it's just like get back to work. Like keep hustling burnout. So it's like I think it's more to do with looking more broadly at our society and how the culture is functioning as opposed to on a more individual level. I completely agree. And I'm usually always someone and I'm sure you are too that's like self responsibility.

What could we do? You know, I'm very much about that. But in this conversation, I'm very much aligned to. you're saying that I do think it's a broader cultural symptom of what's going on. In America, you know, when first wave feminism came around, it's like the women started to work and then we became a double income earning household culture. But yet if you look at the natural or the, if you look at the amount that household incomes are making now, it's not much more. So we have two people working, but people aren't making much more money. So now, and now women have to work. It's almost like

have to now. And so it's just creating this opportunity for not only the relationship between man and woman to be stretched and strained, but also with the children. You know, we also have moms that have to put their kids in daycare that can't be with their children very long, that are creating this space in place for a lot of the problems that we're seeing from a relational level, from a cultural level on attachment styles, on like mental health issues, like Gabor Matte's, work is really powerful. I'm sure you know of him. And he talks a lot about the first three years of life are the most important. That's where you create the attachment. That's sort of where you learn to regulate your emotions. That's when a lot of the trauma happens. Exactly. The trauma and your nervous

system. And so we already have a system that's not creating the best environment for children to grow up in already. And it's really sad. Yeah. In America, it's just really next level. The business of birth, the business of birth control. Two really good movies if anyone wants to watch. I watched that before. Yeah. Which ones? I watched the business of birth. Yeah. And I was quite, yeah.

It's quite shocking because here we have the NHS, so it's very different. Totally. But it's still, I think the America is particularly bad in terms of like this get back into work. And for people that are now more aware of these conversations and follow Gabel-Mate, for instance, like, well, that's all good and well. But if they can't take three years to prioritize looking after their child, and they're forced to go back to work, then what can one do? I know. You know, speaking from, and this is just me speaking as a coach, healer teacher,

but someone that doesn't have children yet. So it's almost one of those things where, you know, whatever I said is with a grain of salt, because you know as a mother that I think your whole world gets turned upside down and you just have things, realizations and an experience that you never, you saw coming, but you didn't in such a way. So what I think that people can be supported in doing, I think for me, you know, I always go back.

to my spiritual foundation. And I know that seems trite and it kind of seems like a platitude, but you having a deep understanding and that cellular remembrance of who you are and why you're here and just the peace that you can find in having a relationship with God or source or universe or Allah, whoever your creator is can just really create a space where you just kind of can prioritize and simplify everything. I think that's the beautiful purification of being in a spiritual relationship with your creator is the purification it provides. Whether it's, you know, helping you in a relationship with your partner, you both feel stressed, you both working full-time jobs. And maybe that relationship just creates a peace in your heart. So you don't bring up the thing that's annoying you and you just

let it kind of, you know, go by and you just kind of end up talking about something else. Or you look at your child with loving eyes because you know that they're a child of God just like you are. I just feel like, you know, for me, that's the only thing that I can say that on like a global level is a deep, powerful thing that I think a lot of people are hungry for and a lot of people are missing. And that they can access at any time. The last thing that I want to get into, and it's a big, it's a big one, but we kind of danced around it a little bit. And you put up something on Instagram that I was like, oh, that's powerful. And it was to do with relationships. And it said, are your patterns? What was it? Are your patterns matching your prayers? Matching your prayers.

And I found that so powerful. Would you be able to like, expand a little bit about what you mean and also, yeah, just open up the conversation around relationships. It's obviously just a huge one. I want to know personally where you're at with everything. Yeah. So do your patterns match your prayers? Is a quote that I just had hit me the other day. I was walking through my day. We launched our book almost 30 in June. And I knew I wanted to take July off a little bit. I wanted to rest and relax. And my resting and relaxing in July meant turning on Love Island at literally 6.30 a.m. And I'd watch Love Island for four hours. Then I'd go lay outside in the grass. And it was beautiful that I was allowing myself to rest. And there's nothing

wrong with that. But I was just kind of in this pattern in my day of watching TV, being on my phone, you know, eating food that wasn't really making me feel good. And I was just sitting there doing all this stuff. And then I'd go to my end of day and I'd go to my visualization. And I'd have my visualization 10 minutes and then I'd be manifesting and then I'd be praying like God, please bring me this amazing career and all of these things, you know, like all this stuff. I'd be asking God like God's a genie and God's just going to grant me my wish of whatever. And I was just like kind of evaluating my day and I'm like, none of the patterns I'm in today match what I'm praying for.

Not that I'm saying you can't rest. But if we're really truthful about how we live our lives and what we actually do in our day, And then what we pray for. We pray for, you know, my dad's sick. So I pray for my dad to be well. I'm like, I pray for my dad to be well. I pray that he's healthy. I pray that, you know, he feels good.

Okay, if that was my prayer, what would my pattern be to match that? I'm going to call him and pray with him. I'm going to call him and ask him what he's eating today. I'm going to call him and just tell him I love him. You know, whatever you're praying for in life, if it's your purpose, what are the actions and the patterns you can be in that bring you closer to that? If you're asking for deep love in your life, what would you actually be doing for that? I have a really dear friend who wants love more than anything. She wants to be married more than anything. It's her deepest wish. She's also struggled in relationships. She had a really bad breakup recently. And, you know, she's not dating anymore. She's shutting herself off. She's just closed for business. It's been like, six months. This is actually my sister. So I can be a little bit harder on her. So I'm just kind of blowing up her spot. And, you know, she's like, I really want love. I want to be married. I'm like, what are you doing today? What have you done?

anytime this week to, like, show that you want love. You don't go out. You don't say hi to people. You're not on dating apps. You're not trying. You're not like loving yourself anymore deeply. Nothing about your life is showing to God or the universe that you want love. Zero percent. And if we get serious with ourselves about what we actually want from our lives and how we can actually show up for what we want, our whole lives change. And that's what was happening to me. And I think it's just a question that we can ask ourselves every day. That's so powerful. And particularly, like when I read it or I saw you, speak about it, I thought, particularly in the context of relationships, because our patterns and

relationships can be so sneaky that we're like, hang on, this is the same situation with a different person, I've got the same outcome, what's the common denominator here? And it's usually ourselves. But we find it very hard to recognize what our patterns of behavior are and how that doesn't match with what we're praying for in a partner, you know, and you're like, I want this kind of person but I keep going towards this and I think that that such important work. So in that breath,

where are you up with your relationships? Because I was also listening to one of your podcasts and I think he mentioned this before he started recording and I was cackling away because you were talking about dating a billionaire and you guys were saying like, no, billionaires unwell. We want a mid-middy?

I want a mid-y, oh my God. A midi millionaire. A midi millionaire. Billionaires are unwell. Dude, Billy was unwell. So on the show, but I think it's quite a U.S. tone.

It's very U.S. term. It's just like, it's not working. He's not good. No good. No good. You're just no good. No good.

But on the show, it's just be my best friend. So we'll just say stuff that's like unhinged. We're just like, you know, we're just ripping. But yeah, I dated the billionaire for a little bit.

and it was a very interesting experience. What was the story about? I was like kind of driving and then I was like, I missed the bit about the girls. Oh my God. Okay, so this is tea. So in the States, there's matchmakers that you, they'll reach out to you and they'll be like,

hey, if you're online somewhere, they'll be like, hey, do you want to be part of our matchmaker network? You'll be interviewed. You have to like do submit photos and all this stuff. So there's a few like high end matchmakers that exist that reached out to me in Los Angeles. So did the interviews, went through the process and they would for a while when I was dating they were setting me up with

men and one of the men happened to be a billionaire and a lot of these men are super super they don't have time to date don't have time to date they also want like they want they want to order off a menu like for real like they're like blonde tall they're maybe like short brown hair you know whatever they want to order off the menu and they you know also too if you've online dated it's kind of hit or miss so it's helpful for them to have it already pre-screened through these women. So bizarre. It's so bizarre.

It's so bizarre, but actually, you know what, I'll say, I online dated for a few months. I did online date here. I really liked it, but I online dated for a few months. And the way that men showed up when they were matchmaker men that were very wealthy and versus online was completely different. The online men were like, let's go on a walk. Let's meet a coffee. Like, you know, just so lazy and like no effort.

And then the billionaire or the rich men for the matchmaker, they were serious about finding love or a partner. So they would like get you a car. They would send you a gift. They would pay for everything. They would like, you know, just really show up. And so it was actually really nice for me to recalibrate my nervous system to be like really in my feminine and receive.

Well, also there's more accountability in a way because there's someone that's actually connected you. And the matchmaker team like coaches them a little bit. So they would check in with me. They'd be like, hey, what did you like? What did you not like? And then they'd talk to them about it. They'd like, you need to ask her more questions.

Like you need to, you know what I mean? All that stuff. Because otherwise, if you have a bad review. few that like this, you know, they've got to give him that feedback. I was like their darling. Because I would just go on these dates and just whine and just like, how many did you go? Oh, I went on like probably, I dated the one for a minute and I probably went on 10. 10 from the matchmaker. Yeah, it was like over months. Wow. It was the best. Honestly, it was so much fun. That must have been fascinating. I love them. It was just great. Like I, I love, I, the way I approach dating was so

different from before, like, before I'd be like, every date, I'd be like, are you my husband? And I'd be like, are you six to in my husband? And I'd be like, are you six to in my husband? And I just would only go in with an outcome. It would be transactional. I'm like, are you my husband or not? If not, my energy is different. And now I'm just like, what do you have to teach me? What do you have to learn?

What kind of human are you? What's going on with you? Like I would treat it almost like a business meeting in a way. So I could just come in with a little bit more lightness and a little bit more ease of like getting to know someone friendly. So I would just approach them friendly and nice. And yeah, it was great. But the billionaire was he's done.

Well, he's done. The story that you're referencing. So we were dating and I just knew it wasn't for me. He's not very spiritual and wasn't very deep. And so there was a point where I was like, I think I'm done with Billy. And we'd call him Billy. And I was like, I think I'm done. I think I'm complete.

And then I had one day and I think he messaged or I told him I was complete. And he was like, tried to get back. and I was like, okay, we'll try and get back. And then he's like, will you come visit me over New Year's? And I was like, I don't know if that feels right, but I'll think about it. And I didn't, and I told him no in the end. And so New Year's happens. And I got, I was like, I should look at what he's doing on New Year's.

And I looked at his thing and he had some other blonde chick visiting him on New Year's. And I just was like, you're like insane. Like, why are you posting about this other girl? Like, it was just like an insane thing to be like courting other blonde women. but then posting about other blonde women on your page that you're you invited because I said no, whatever. And then he mess. And he like, call me after New Year's. He's like, hey, how are you doing? Like, da-da-da-da. I was like, how was your New Year's? He's like, great. I was like, how's the girl? He's like, what girl? And I'm like, dude, you post it. I was like, what are you talking

about? I was like, you can't be doing that. He's like, you said no. I'm like, it was childish. Anyways, he's done and over. But the only thing I'll say about him, he was a great person. He really taught me a lot about wealth and really taught me about how wealthy people move and I'm actually very grateful for that experience and how money was like a game to him. Like it was really interesting how we talked about money, how he moved with money, how we would move because he had money. Like I just found it. I learned so much. Like what gave me an example. An example, we would go to every restaurant and at every restaurant his team would call and pay extra for us to get the best seat in the house. And so we'd always had the best seat in a corner spot in

the house with like the best staff member, the best place. And then he'd have security a lot of time. So security would be there and ever, whenever he would move, the security would move to and just like wherever we were going. And so it was an experience of there was no sense of no. No one ever said no to you. You want the best seat in the house. You pay for the best eaten house. You want to go here. You go here. Everywhere we would go like you would make it happen. One of the restaurants was closed, you know, that I loved. I was like, oh, I love this restaurant. And he was like, it's closed. Got it to open. You know, like, there's just no. no knows and you move through life at this really, really fluid, easy pace. You walk outside,

the car is waiting, you get in the car, the car takes you there, the car doesn't talk. Like, it was just, I was really fascinated. I was, it was really beautiful experience. Because you also, I can't remember whether it was the book or I was watching something you put up about how the best way to get into the timeline that you want is to actually experience the thing, as opposed to just like doing a Pinterest board, mood board. whatever of like, oh, I want this kind of life to actually be in it. And I guess that's kind of 100%. So suddenly in this past lane, you're like, oh, wow, I didn't. No, I was like, this is what I choose. I was double clicking on that. I was my little like, my Sims character, Krista, was like double

clicking to like continue. So the timelines. Yeah, I talk a lot about timelines and just briefly, timelines are the experience of being able to choose the outcome of your life. I think in the experience, you know, example now, a timeline that we had was me, you know, being more late to our podcast and us starting later and us talking about something different and us being in a different energy, a different timeline could have been like, I missed coming. I didn't come to London. That leads me on an entirely different path. Every choice we make leads us on a certain path. So in life, being on a timeline, if I'm visualizing that I want to be living in a life that's really luxurious and abundant and beautiful and with someone that's very wealthy, being in that

experience gave me the cellular feeling in my body of what that would be like. So I could be like, Ooh, I remember what that was like. I felt at ease. I felt peaceful. I liked this. And so I always say with retreats, you know, I know you have your retreat too. I do retreats as well. And retreats are the most beautiful experience to experience a new timeline because you're actually

in the experience of what most people's dream day is. I want to rest. I want to be in nature. I want to be surrounded by women I love. I want to eat really good food. I want to be talking about spiritual topics. I want to be traveling. You know, whatever the feelings is, like it happens on a retreat.

And so retreat. has been for my girls, and I know for yours, some of the biggest opportunity for a quantum leap in their life. And it's such a joy to see. That's so true because you're really taking that time out of your day-to-day life. But it made me think about, I actually put up something yesterday because I was on my phone looking for a picture from the day Lolo was born. And you know how you scroll like that and it sometimes goes like a whole year? And I went a whole year back to the same day and it was the first time I babysat my nephew Tristan and that was the first time in my life where I suddenly was like oh my god I want to be a mom wow like I was looking after him and I just

felt like someone that was like not that into babies was kind of like yeah lovely give it back and when I was looking after him I just was like oh my god I love him like this is the best thing ever so that obviously just put me on a timeline that then a year later to the day I was taking my baby home from hospital which for me is just nuts because it was just not where I thought things were going. Tell me about that. I think a lot of women can relate to that feeling of being like, you know, I'm not really a mom person. I'm not really a baby person. What was that for you from an identity perspective? I was just like, I'm not that maternal. And I think certain women I know me and just motherhood

was a clear, like that was their, you know, purpose in a way. And that's, they knew that they wanted that and that they couldn't compromise on it or wouldn't compromise on it. And for me, me I was quite indifferent. I was like, it doesn't feel like a big calling for me. It was kind of like a little whisper. And I think I would have felt like my life was very complete without it. And then, yeah, it was very much Tristan, my nephew coming in. And it's interesting because I, I listened back to a lot of tarry readings I have, a lot of psychic sessions that I have. Because obviously, when you're hearing stuff at the time, we're looking for what's going on in that day or in that month or whatever. I'm like, tell me about the guy I'm doing.

Exactly. You're not thinking about like, they'll call out stuff that's perhaps not happen yet. And all of them would say they would kind of do it gently, but they'd be like, do you want to be a mom? And I'd be like, ah, and I didn't want to say, no, not really old. I'd be like, yeah, I think so. And they go, okay, we'll just let you know, like, that will happen very easily. And that's in the car. It's like right now. And I was listening to one the other day from June last year. And she was like, just gently saying, this is, I think she pulled the Empress card and she was like so like that is kind of something that's potentially happening and I just be like, no, that's not. Wow. And then a year later. So I guess for people listening that are quite like indifferent about whether they want or not, I think to an extent you've got to trust what's meant for you and meant to be because it's one of those areas that there seems to be no rhyme or reason.

You know, people and I've been. introduced to this world that I wasn't aware of before. And I think the age that we're at now where people are, it's a very loaded topic. And I try and tread carefully with that. But, you know, I think spirit babies kind of choose when they want to come in. Did you read the book? Yeah.

Spirit babies? Yeah. It's a good book. It's a beautiful book. It's such a good concept and it's so beautiful. But yeah, I think also, too, it's like letting yourself evolve. you know, letting yourself grow. You know, there could be a period of time in your life where you're like,

I don't see myself as a mother. This isn't a part of my path. But then in a year being like, I'm going to be a mom. This is who I am. I think that freedom of evolution and that freedom of not holding too tightly to the grip of who you are and who you think you should be is such a huge aspect of creating a beautiful life, creating a joyful life, creating a life of, you know, a multi-volume set. Yeah.

of your experience in life. And I think that's been a huge unlock for me as actually being like, no, it's okay if I change my mind. It's okay if I evolve. It's okay if I think differently than I did before. And it's okay if I just am a completely different person every two years.

And also trusting the unfolding of things because I didn't realize how much I was trying to control my life. And we have a view of how we want things to be. But often the most magical things happen when we're not planning them. And they're things that were like, oh, I actually didn't see. see that coming at all. Because there was a part in the book that I wanted to touch on and maybe this

can be our final point was around resistance and resistance to change and even things sometimes that are really good for us and expansive for us because we are so wired to keep ourselves safe that when something feels too big or too different or too much of a jump, we kind of tighten up. And then we can confuse that with thinking that it's wrong. How do you discern between something that's wrong and out of alignment versus resisting because it's actually calling you to your higher self and expansion. I think that's one of the great questions in life. And I think right now at this point, I can explain to how to get here, but at this point I see, I kind of get curious and I see almost everything as an opportunity for more expansion. Like I'm like, when I see something that's

uncomfortable, I'm like, okay, I need to go there. Like I need to push. And I think I'm at that point in my life. You know, we just wrote a book and I'm kind of at the next phase in my career. and everything sort of feels crunchy and uncomfortable because I've never done it. But I think when you start on the path, when you're doing things that you've never really done before, you're going to have resistance to any type of change. You know, our subconscious programming is interested in keeping us safe. And that means not changing the status quo. That means not putting ourselves out there.

That means not using our voice. That means not expressing ourselves. That means not trying things that are new because usually in the back of our mind, in our brain we have, you know, these memories lodged that create stories. You know, mine was that I wasn't worthy of being heard. Mine was that other people are better than me at stuff, you know, whatever those things are. So for a lot of people, those subconscious beliefs are really running the show and making them not speak up or do what they want or express themselves in life. So we have to get curious about our beliefs to really understand, you know, what's true and what's not.

First of all, any belief that's telling you that you can't do anything is not going to be true. And in, you know, the journey of really creating a life that you want and really being okay with working with resistance, it's loving yourself and honoring yourself and accepting yourself even if you fail, even if you make the wrong decision. You know, I've made wrong decisions. There was a big business decision that I made a few years ago that I really just completely regret. It was not a good business decision. What was it? There was, we had a really big opportunity with a really big agent for something. And I, was at the point where I didn't understand Hollywood. I didn't understand entertainment. And I was like, they don't really care about us. They don't really like us.

Or for some reason, I had to have every relationship be based on a deep soul connection rather than money. And in the entertainment industry, it's money. You like each other, but I'm making you money. It's a commercial decision. It's a transaction. And I wasn't comfortable with being in transactional relationships, but that limited me us and I said no to a business decision of working with someone that would have

really been really helpful for our careers because I was so ego tied to non-transactional relationships. But if you're in integrity, if you both are in integrity, it can be fine to be a transaction. You don't have to like each other. And so that resistance in that case was my ego where there has been some resistance for other places that's actually really helpful, like where it's actually stopped me from doing something in business. Like as an example, we did merch. Merch was beautiful.

It was clean. It was organic made by women, designed by women, sold in recyclable packaging, really cool labels. It did well, but not really. Like it was kind of hard to get shipping and labeling. And there was just more resistance than I wanted. And I was like, this resistance is telling me no. Yeah. But right now in my work in my life, I'm like, I have some resistance to doing some things in my business.

And I'm like, it's because I'm holding, I'm playing small. Right. And how do you know whether it's the playing small or it's not right? I think the way that I know, I think first of all, trying. Yeah. Trying and seeing how it goes, seeing if it fails or not and loving yourself even if, I think is really huge. I think how I know that mine is resistance is because I think if I did that,

because you have to go the next step. Okay, I really, as an example right now, me and my business, I've built my personal business really well in the past couple years, but I still treat it like a lifestyle business. I make money, I spend it. I don't really pay attention to systems, to processes, to tech. And I was thinking about that,

I'm like, okay, is that a true desire for me to grow my business? Yes, it is. What's a way that I could grow my business these ways? What's stopping me? I'm afraid that if I do that, I'm still going to fail. I'm afraid that if I do that,

it's still not going to work. I'm afraid that I'm going to work too hard. Okay, so these beliefs are limiting beliefs and they're not actually truth. So what if I did do that and it works? I like the outcome. So I just get curious. It's continuing to ask yourself drill down to more and more questions. If you have resistance to something, what is that resistance? Is it fear? Okay, what is the fear? I'm afraid I'm going to fail. Okay. What if I didn't fail? You know, it's like you have to really just continue to like put everything on the table and just be like, what is the resistance? Okay, what if I fail?

You know, you just sit and you non-judgmentally look at things and then decide what to do. And also, I think nervous system work is so powerful. Yeah, it's a great one. It's a great one. We'll kind of guide our decision-making, but not necessarily from the right place. That's a great point. Yeah, what is your nervous system accustomed to? That's a lot of the work when you were talking earlier about expansion or, you know,

Gay Hendricks has this really beautiful book called The Big Leap, and he talks about our happiness set point. And most of us have a happiness set point where we reach a certain level of happiness. And it's almost like, whoa, it's too much happiness or too much joy. In Kabbalah, they talk about it being too much light for your vessel. They say that you need to build your vessel to have the capacity to hold more light or to hold more abundance. And we have that same nervous system. Your nervous system can only hold so much wealth, can only hold so much joy.

And so a lot of the work of creating a life that you want or expanding or growing is like, working with your nervous system, working with your vessel, working with your, you know, happiness set point to increase it slowly over time. Otherwise, you're just going to blow your system. You'll break your vessel. You'll just kind of get really, really happy and then it will feel very uncomfortable, and then you'll kind of come back down. And you'll sabotage.

Yeah. Totally, exactly. That's when sabotage comes in to get you back to the set point. What can we do? So what's the ways that we can like slowly and gradually expand our vessel and our capacity for abundance or love or. the things that we truly want to call in without sort of overloading the system. Yeah, great question. So the way that I expand my vessel capacity, it is an example,

I'm in a new relationship. So I was in a, I was married for a while. I was in a long-term relationship for 10 years, got out of that. And then a lot of my dating was expanding my capacity for love again because I was really, you know, fearful to get into relationship again because of the ending of my relationship. And so I started to date and started to like open up more a little bit. okay, got a little bit more comfortable, got a little bit more comfortable, maybe shared a little more more of myself, maybe shared more of my life, and just had each relationship bring me closer to the relationship that I'm in now so that I can actually expand to my capacity and relationship. So in the moment it means, you know, he's complimenting me and I'm like sitting there and I'm just like

sitting in my body with it and letting it resonate or letting it land. As an example, we were together last weekend and before bed he's like, what do you want to do tomorrow? And in my previous relationship, this is very silly, but he hated plans, hated planning, which is the opposite of my whole core. So having someone be like, hey, what do you want to do tomorrow? I'll make plans. What should our schedule be? Was so shocking to me, shocking to my nervous system because I got scared. I was like, oh, no, I was like, we're going to plan the next day. Because I was scared of being like, oh no, why do we always have to make plans? Like I almost had a nervous system shut down, thinking about plans because I had been trained.

So having this man asked me, what's our plans for tomorrow? I had to sit and like let my nervous system calibrate to my new experience of being in a relationship where I was with someone that was a partner. I was with someone that was deeply interested in our, you know, what we're doing the next day or interested in keeping me happy or interested in taking control or leading. And so I had to sit with my body and just kind of like percolate. you know, regulate and just like, this is my new experience, this is my new reality. So a lot of it is at the core, breathing into the moment, having the connection of, ooh, this is a new experience and it

might feel uncomfortable. And then just allowing and feeling your nervous system, mind, body, and soul regulating. So it's conscious awareness, it's breath, and then regulating your nervous system in the moment to your new reality. And also being, you know, we touched on this a moment ago about women wanting certain things and wanting to soften, but are they allowing themselves to actually receive that? And I notice it a lot with women is we reject. So we want all these things, but when they come, we're like, oh no, I can't accept that, not letting that in.

And even I had it recently, like I said to this girl on Instagram, she put up like a makeup video and I sent like a message for the story that she shared of it saying like, Oh, this makeup, like, looks so beautiful on you. And she responded saying, oh, thanks, I need all the help I can get. And I remember being like, that must be what it feels like when a man says you look so beautiful. And a woman goes, oh, no, I look, I look disgusting. You know, because I kind of felt like I tried to, like, offer something.

And it had been rejected. And that's not what she meant to do. But I was something like, but I'm saying you look beautiful, not that you need help. Yes. And I think that that's what women do the whole time. because we're always doing it to ourselves. So when a man tries to say something, we're like, oh, no, no, that's not true.

And that's because you have high self-worth, too. So you were truly like, no, this is something I see in you. It's not about you, it's not about us being on the same level. Because what's happening in that is, you know, she's trying to like, it's, they do this so much in the States and they do this so much where I'm from. It's, there's an experience of like you just kind of cut yourself down whenever someone does that.

And it's really normalized. It's almost like that is more acceptable than being like, thank you so much. But because you have health, Seth Worth, you're like, no, I actually literally think you look beautiful and I think that's good and I want you to receive that. But I had that experience a lot in my life. I remember I had a really beautiful friend reflect back to me. She's like, you give so much that it's like this. She's like you're giving and you're giving and you're giving and you're giving that.

It's almost like your hands are keeping everyone out. Wow. And it was such a beautiful reflection. Oh my God. I'm so grateful for my friends in their reflection. Like it's, I'll never forget it. And I was like, wow. And just seeing that visual experience of when you're doing the, oh, it's all the help I can get. It's like, stay out. I don't want more. And so we have to work with our nervous system. Work to make it safe. Work to make it okay. Work to like believe what they're saying. Because a lot of times it's, I don't believe what you're saying. I have to do something for you. I can't just receive. And for women that want to receive more love, more abundance, more of the life that they want. It really starts with the small things. Receiving a compliment. receiving help, receiving support, you know. And what I'll do to help rewire that is when I'm in the moment of receiving, I'll be like, I'm receiving. It is safe to receive. So if, you know, the person that I'm

with is complimenting me, I'm like, I'm receiving it's safe to receive. I'll put my hand on my heart and I'll just kind of tune into my body to feel the experience somatically of receiving to make sure it's okay for me. So really just consciously being aware of how you deny receiving in small moments helps you to build to the more macro moments of receiving. And the last thing I'll say, I was working with my, I work with a Kabbalah teacher regularly. And we were talking about people that were really wealthy. And I was like, I know so many wealthy people in my life.

And this is shadowy for me to say, but I was like, I feel like I'm so talented. I'm as talented as them. And I do well, but I think my Achilles heel is always more success. So that's always my thing. That's why I burn myself out. But he's like, they're not any more talented than you. they're just more receptive.

And I was thinking about that quite a bit with money. I'm like, wow, because you know in life, you know people that are very wealthy, that are not any more talented, any more interesting, any more nice or kind. It's not about that. It's about people being receptive. So the more receptive you can be to compliments,

to love, to abundance, it sets you up to more, you know, receptivity and everything. That's so true. And often they're kind of mirrored, aren't they? Yes. Yes. Okay. There's so much more.

I know. I've had the best time. Oh, thank you so much. I've had the best time. And this is my first, my first, my first pull cup back from. I'm having a favorite. I feel a little, I feel very special. Oh, well, thank you so much.

I was, I was saying, I was seeing you and she's like, oh, she's just the best. I was like, I can't wait to see her post baby too because, you know, my best friend in college, she's had a baby. And I just know how special this chapter is. Chapter is and this portal is. And your brain changes. Your cells change. Like everything about you changes and it's just so unique and powerful.

And I'll never forget one woman said on the podcast. I was like, I'm afraid to have kids because I'm afraid I'm not going to be myself and I'll lose myself. And she was like, I've become more of myself. And I just see that with women that I know. And I'm just like, oh, it's so good. It is. It's quite a transformation.

But yeah, I'm finding a new normal with it all. Yeah. What would be a word to describe how you feel? I think the initial coming out of the hospital did feel like I was coming out of a portal from another realm. I was like, what the just happened? Like that was, you do kind of go to a different dimension to bring your baby into the world. And now I'd say that she's two months. It's things kind of have calmed down. But then it's like I can't imagine my world.

without her. I don't know what the word would be. Actually, the word would be tender. Yeah. It's very, like, I've had so many tender experiences because you feel so raw and exposed that you, and you've got this thing that depends on you, but also you need people that you can depend on.

And I think postpartum depression is largely tied to the fact that people don't have the support network versus the hormonal crash. Because the hormonal crash is crazy. But it's like it doesn't feel depressive to me. Totally. It felt more like these are emotions that are from the hormones. I can like rationalize that even though I'm being totally irrational. And the fact that I had support for my partner, my mom the whole time, I was like,

I can come undone and I know that they're going to carry the slack. And I think women, you know, we've taught, it's been a big theme. If you feel like you cannot come on done at any moment, you're going. to burn out. Go insane. Yeah. That's a really good aspect of burnout, too, is the ability to like take the mask off. Yeah.

You know, to be yourself. Like, because a lot of times you burn out when you're not being yourself. Exactly. When you can't just like, yeah. I'm so glad. So thank you so much for coming on. You can't have you on almost 30. It's can be gay.

Yes, I would love that. But it's, you know, we said at the beginning it's like two worlds collide. I feel like we've been in each other's orbit for quite some time. So it's such a joy to have you on. Thank you. And where can people find you resources, the book now, the podcast, just for anyone that is discovering you for the first time? Welcome. I'm excited. I'm so grateful to be here. And I know your audience is so savvy and sweet and, you know, just great. So almost 30's the podcast. You can listen to the podcast wherever you listen to the show. Morning Microdose is our Clips

channel. You can listen to like just an inspiring motivational quote from the pod. I'm on Instagram at it's Krista. It's ITSK-R-I-S-T-A. And then I host retreats all over the world. and I work with women one-on-one, and then most importantly is the book, Almost 30, is out. So it came out in June, and it's really a guide to living a life that you love. So if you're in your set and return or out of it, it's going to help you navigate your life in a really beautiful way. Yeah, I'm loving it. Oh, thank you.

I'm so proud of it. I feel really proud. It's amazing. Yeah, it's good. All right. Well, thank you. Thank you, guys. I love this conversation with Krista.

It was actually filmed quite a long time ago, and it was when she was over doing the promotion for their book. and so I seized the opportunity to have her on but then life started lifing and yeah we've kind of put it together in this season but I'm so happy that you guys get to listen to it because she is such a wise woman she speaks so eloquently and I absolutely adored getting to meet her and it was a big moment for me because as I said at the beginning of the episode almost 30 is I guess an inspiration for what I've wanted to create with Saturn Returns. I can't remember when I first discovered it, but I think I discovered it Lacey Phillips through almost 30. And I think a lot of their

guests and they have a lot of similar themes and yeah, they've just gone from success to success with it. So it was a great moment to kind of have that when we're both in the same room and, you know, having these conversations, but particularly about this conversation that I found interesting and something I've definitely been navigating over the last few years is how do we discern when something is simply unfamiliar or when something feels wrong and how are we able to notice in our nervous system which one that is? And it's definitely been something I've had to refine in myself as a practice to know when there's discomfort because, I'm expanding or because something is just actually not right for me. And I just want anyone to know

if they're listening and they're struggling with that yourself. Give yourself grace, give yourself kindness, be gentle with yourself, because the worst thing we can do is when we feel like perhaps we made the wrong decision or we pursued something when actually our body was telling us it was wrong, is to berate ourselves in the process. So I hope that this has given you some food, thought and you are enjoying the season. Loads of you have been messaging me about it, which has been just so lovely because it's so good for me to be back and doing what I love. And thank you for sharing it with each other as well. If you could and if you haven't yet, please subscribe to the show because that helps us to get these amazing guests coming back on and allows us to keep growing.

So hit that follow button of the show. And thank you so much for listening. And as always remember, you are not alone. Goodbye.