Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine - Cereal

Episode Date: April 19, 2022

Remember when the Cheerios box said it would lower cholesterol and prevent heart disease? Well, it doesn’t say that anymore because cereal isn’t medicine. But this is just one example in a long history of breakfast cereals claiming to be beneficial to health.Music: "Medicines" by The Taxpayers https://taxpayers.bandcamp.com/

Just a heads up this episode of Salbones contains discussions of restricted eating and weight loss. So if that's not something you're into hearing, you may want to try one of our many other episodes. Thanks so much. Salbones is a show about medical history and nothing the hosts say should be taken as medical advice or opinion. It's for fun. Can't you just have fun for an hour and not try to diagnose your mystery boil? We think you've earned it. Just sit back, relax, and enjoy a moment of distraction from that weird growth. You're worth it. Alright, Tommy is about to books. One, two, one, two, three, four.

We came across a pharmacy with a door and that's busted out. Hello everybody and welcome to Sobones. I'm Ardol Turf, Miss Guided Medicine. I'm your co-host, Justin McRoy. I'm Sydney McRoy. Every podcast, I think, is just like Sobhones and that they do the Wayne's World five for Silent Count and then point to the other person to start talking. You've got to kind of do a little twist,

like scoop the finger as you point. That's a key, that's key. I am. We're in our basement, but it's not our basement. Isn't that weird? This is a normal podcast. We are in our basement. We are in our basement.

This is where the Macrooi studio, Macrooi, the police will Macrooi family studios is a small room in our basement. We're going to be, that's just one of many secrets, close to the heart secrets, that will be revealing about things that we care a lot about this week, isn't that right? Justin, this episode, I feel like I could have come up with this topic and then just said, hey, why don't we make this one of those where you research something and I don't have to this week because I'm so busy. I could have done that, but I didn't.

I did it for you. This is a gift for you. Wait a minute. You're letting me do those because you're busy have to this week because I'm so busy, I could have done that, but I didn't, I did it for you. This is a gift for you. Wait a minute. You're letting them you do this because you're busy, not because you think I'm great at it? No, it's definitely because you're great at it. Oh, good, okay. Justin, this is for you.

It feels targeted, it doesn't feel like, I know the kind of podcast that you do and I feel like just looking at the subject, it's more targeted. It doesn't feel like I know the kind of podcast that you do and I feel like just looking at the subject, it's more targeted. Well, it is, it is perhaps more targeted. This is, okay, you are the one who inspired this, not just because you love what we're talking about, but because of something you showed me. Yes. We're going to talk about. Which is something that Dan told me about. Yes. Sorry, I'm a co-host of a meditative serial podcast called The Empty Bowl. And on our last episode, my co-host, Dan Cabare, who makes a blog called seriously.net

was telling me about Grape Nuts ad that he has always had an affinity for. So Justin showed me this Grape Nuts ad, which we will talk about Grape Nuts. And I started thinking about like a lot of the health claims that serial boxes make. Are you going to talk about this specific ad or should I detail what it? You can detail that ad if you want to. It is a box of great nuts, literally holding up a human, a box of great nuts holding up a human man. Yes, and what it says is that a steady zaman. Grape nuts steady zaman,

and it is literally just a box of grape nuts. And it's like, I'm not gonna say it's like homoerotic, but it is like a sort of platonic. The grape nuts have like gladiators sandals. Yeah, the great nuts have gladiators sandals. And like the great nuts, arms and legs are incredibly defiant. I mean, they're like the artists spent way too much time. Like the arms and legs on this great nuts box are, you know, they're hot.

They're hot. It's a sexy box of great nuts. You heard it here for my wife. Sit. Okay. Sexy box of grape nuts. You heard it your first from my wife. You're telling me right now that you're trisexual, men, women, and boxes of grape nuts. No, I'm just saying that this grape nuts box is supposed to look fit. Sexy. So anyway, I wanted to talk about health claims on cereal boxes.

Now, the most obvious connection we have done a whole episode on and I'm not going to, I'm not going to trudge through the swamps of John Harvey Kellogg's. What are our grodier guests here on soft phones? Yes. and practices. One of our grudier guests here on soft phones. Yes, so if you, I mean, this is probably, it is important to mention as part of this story. Like, why is, why does, why do cereals have so many health? Why is that a thing?

Why is that a thing on a cereal box? It says, especially as we're gonna get into, this is across all kinds of cereal. Like the cereals that obviously don't look healthy have still tried to make health claims. But John Harvey Kellogg, who invented cornflakes and then tortured people into abstaining from sex and masturbation in a variety of horrible ways, there's a whole episode.

You've read the side of the Cornflakes box, folks. You all know this, you all know this parade of Satan with me. We're abstaining from sex and masturbation and told them to avoid all medicine all together. Yes, so that is the kind of stuff that Kellogg did, and he was not, I would say, great guy. I think that's pretty easy. Anyway, you can listen to that whole episode

if you'd like to about the history of cornflakes. The point of cornflakes, is that they were- What is the point of cornflakes? I don't know, I've never liked them, but a lot of people do, that's fine. I'm a little sugar on them, I can mess around. There you go, you put sugar on them. To make't know, I've never liked them, but a lot of people do, that's fine. I'm a little sugar animal. I can mess around. There you go, you put sugar on it.

To make them edible, I mean, it's like not tasty without. So that was the point of cornflakes because they were bland. And so they were obviously good for you because they're bland and it wouldn't get you all hot and bothered. But even the cornflakes that we have, like that is in the stores, like that was the innovation was the like sugar on the outside like the the fact that there is more sweetness like that is the improved version of the original cornflakes were just cornflakes

Just cornflakes just flakes but like puffed like exploded piece of anyway. Also, he was into animus. That's another big thing. He liked but This is not the only cereal that ever made these sorts of claims, like, eat our corn flakes. It will calm your libido and you'll be healthier overall. That was sort of his thing. You need these bland foods to do that. There were lots of cereals that did that. There's even a cereal that was classified as a drug.

Really? We'll get there. So I found a great mental floss article that talks about, it was called masturbation and mascots. So immediately I was like, what is this article by Michelle Debsack? And anyway, details of history of cereal, if you're interested in more of, you probably know a lot of the mascots stuff.

I didn't, I didn't get it. That's not part of this podcast. Some of the early stuff. Do they got what Pikachu? I don't, I didn't read all of the masks. I was mainly looking at the very beginning of it covered some of the early stuff. Do they got what Pikachu? I didn't read all of the masks. I was mainly looking at the very beginning of it covered some of this health stuff. Because he is a thinly veiled anti-masturbation

because his arms are too short to reach. That's not true. You made that up. That's true. No, you made that up. No, I read it. I read it. You know what I mean? Well, then is a Tyrannosaurus Rex too? That's true. No, you made that up. No, I read it. I read it. In a moment.

Well, then is a tyrannosaurus Rex too? Well, that was made by... That was made by Christ Almighty. So I don't know. You're reading into that a lot? No, not science person. Anyway. Let's go to the paleontologist.

Where are the crop brothers? It's in terms of... I'm filled out by the science guy. The dolls of D it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, it, popular and regular are both a mess for us now. But there was a guy named James Caleb Jackson, a really like religious vegetarian sort of strict in the Kellogg sort of mold of life, like abstain from things that might get you excited, like keep a very sort of bland diet, like that kind of, you know, person who invented

granola, who invented granola, but he called it granula. It was like little, I think it was actually like graham crackers that were like crumbled up into a bowl, like pieces of stuff in a bowl, and he called it granula, as like probably the first sort of cereal-ish thing, right? But Kellogg stole it and called it granola, which sounds better to us, I guess. Granola instead of granola. Who's granules, granola, but it's granola. Anyway.

I had a Japanese cereal this week that I listened to. It was called Fugura. Fugura, Fugra. It's like fruit and granola combined. Yeah. That sounds good. That was good. It was earthy but good.

Yeah. And then he made cornflakes and he got more popular. And Kellogg served his cornflakes to William Post. You know where this is gone. Mortal anime. And post, is there an episode of that show you like the food to build America? Probably, yeah.

I think there is. How would you do that without covering how incredibly problematic Kelly is? So anyway, this guy was a real wild bird. And we're not gonna get it. We're just gonna pretend he's not. I mean, he didn't listen to the episode. He did some bad stuff, guys.

This isn't just like he looked blowing food. No, I mean, he, there's some. He's, he's, if I remember correctly, that episode is staged as a point counterpoint between the two of us. In the, in our book, that's how the chapters, yeah. I think it was based on the episode where it's like, yes, but on the other hand.

Now, so, for loops, think about it. Post thought this breakfast cereal idea had some legs to it. He, and he wanted to run with it. So he, he created a lot of cereals. Great nuts was among them, which is the inspiration for this episode. And in addition to this ad that Justin has already told you

about, which by the way, I wanted to talk about you, you described this great, hot sexy grape nuts box, holding a man. Steadying. He's studying them. That's what he says. All of a man's real power comes from steady nerves

and a keen clear brain brain. By the way, grape nuts is written as grape equal sign nuts, which is very, I don't know. I keep looking at it going grape equal. It says on it, it contains just the food elements nature has stored up in wheat and barley, including the phosphate of potash, which or potash, I guess potash is how I would say it. Which combines in the blood with albumum and to repair and build up the cells. I think that is a wild thing to put on a food.

Who reads that and is like, yes, that is for me. But he says it's food, not medicine. Don't get in trouble here. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. I don't want to get in trouble here. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it.

Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it.

Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it.

Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Please. It's like, oh, no. And the tagline at the bottom in quotes is, there's a reason for great nuts. There's a reason. I looked at a lot of great nuts ads because post was all about advertising the health benefits of his foods. That was a big part of it. There are tons of different ads that start off with, how does Mrs. Berk stay a slim as her teenage daughter? Yeah. Yes, there's a lot of a lot that are all the most of the ones featuring women alone are

sort of saying that this is a way to lose weight. Great nuts is a way to lose weight. There are lots, the other ones that feature women, their moms and they're feeding them to their babies in this one. Here's a, here's a baby eating some great nuts because it will help develop like their bones, vital minerals for teeth, bones and blood. So that was a big selling point.

And then for men, business men, they will be steady. And- By the box of things. Their brains will work great. There was a whole other one that was, what is meat, Stan Jones, the 12 o'clock wolf.

And it was basically that by, like he wasn't eating a healthy breakfast, so by 12 o'clock he was a wolf. Yeah, because he needed grape. I mean, that's basically the premise of the Snickers commercials that are like, you're not you and you're hungry. That's that exact, exact premise.

Your stand-gones, the 12 o'clock wolf. Yeah. Where's that? That's really good. It's really good, right? It's really good. Yeah, and again, in addition to that, he would say, like I said, like weight loss, dental health,

give it to babies, it can fix an appendicitis, grape nuts. Like, post-release took it and ran with it. Kellogg was like corn flakes are good for your libido, they will kill it because like who feels, who feels like sex after a box of corn flakes, post took it a step farther. He also made a version by the way of corn flakes his own, have you heard of Elijah's mana? Yeah, but only because I'm mean. Have you heard of Elijah's mana? Yeah, but only because I'm me. So I had not, it's just, it was like cornflakes.

Yeah. But it had a picture of the prophet Elijah feeding a bird on the box. And he got in a lot of trouble for that. Why? Because church groups, they found it blasphemous. Are you kidding me? Did you put a picture of Elijah on a box of cereal?

I was wondering what man I was like. We used to hear about a lot in Bible class and it's like, I wonder if it was good. Like, you think it was good? It's just food falling from the sky. Some stope. I wonder if it's good though. Or if it's just like the protein bars in solitary,

like just keeps you going. Do you want to know, I've thought about this. Do you really want to know what I've thought about? Or is it, is it, it's like a boring scientific answer? A lot of cultures have developed some sort of like starchy base that they build their foods around, like whether that you add a saucer, a meter of vegetable component.

There's like a starchy base to it. And rice being a really well-known one, potatoes, depending on where you live and what grew there. You'll find like, like, in SEMA, which I ate when I was in Malawi, it's like a starchy based. Anyway, I always think manas probably that. It's got a lot of calories, it's sustaining,

doesn't have a ton of flavor, but like it will keep you going and you can add things to it depending on what grows around you. And with you. This is a side note, but I thought about this. Oh yeah, yeah, on a gripping one. Anyway, he eventually changed it to post toasties. There you go. Yeah.

That nobody's thinking, that's blasphemous. So you know what, like Kellogg's is not founded by John Harvey. We just to clarify, we understand this, right? John Harvey was the founder of Battle Creek and did all the centering and stuff. Will Keith, his brother, wanted to keep their process making cereal secret. John Harvey brought in post and showed him how they were doing it while he was at the sanitarium and post was like, oh, dunk. I'm going to get out of this. I'm going to get out of there and still this. And then Will Keith was so mad about that that he went on to found Kellogg's, the company that, well, Keith Kellogg was the founder

of John Harvey Kellogg, was didn't want to profit off of it, didn't want to add sugar or stuff that would help the serial sell. There is so much drama in the serial world. That's the best. As I was reading this sort of, and I am just trying to focus in on the serial

that have made health claims through the years. And there is so much about. Serial is fascinating and captivating subject because yeah, I'm with you. Other companies of course would follow this trend. There are, there's one that you may know called Wheaties. Yeah. Do you know the story of how Wheaties supposedly came to be? Like how did they create their first Wheatie? No. This story is probably not true. But this is the... By all means, let's, let's, let's, uh, help it propagate. A lot of, and you find this, it's interesting. The other place you find these sort of, like, uh, can anyone really prove that this, that this is how it happened. Stories are when we

talked about a lot of like supplements and natural apathic, homeopathic, herbal, holistic, whatever genre we're in, remedies that we've talked about on the show. They have a story like this, right? Like some sort of accidental discovery of I was at Death's Door and then I ate a plant and now I'm better. So my rationale for these stories and and there's several of them, and like, I don't know if we eat these is the one where they're like,

somebody just dropped brand on a hot thing. And it made we eat. This is the story. They dropped a, there was a health clinician who dropped a brand rule on a stove. So that is, my theory on that is that, that is people telling that story to attempt to circumvent a patent

or possibly utility patent that Kellogg's or post had where it's like, no, no, no, this isn't like your thing. We did it, we just, this happened. Isn't it weird said that this accident just happened to happen? Not at any other moment in linear time? Just then.

Just then when so bizarre that nobody dropped brand gruel on a stove until 1921. Yeah, we're and when the Washburn Crosby company Crosby stills Washburn and then eventually this is general mills. Yeah. And they initially they originally called it gold metal whole wheat flakes. It was later changed to wheaties. Yeah, that's a better name. Reout, actually part of the reason that they did this is that it was a time where doctors

were telling people that consuming too much white flour was harming their digestive tracks and they should eat less white flour and so sales were dropping and the mills needed something to, you know, do what mills, they needed something to mill. Got a mill. And this was a great solution. Wheaties was the... So this is probably why they started pushing wheaties, not because they dropped a brand, grow a lot of stuff.

Anyway. But the key was marketing, right? I don't think I personally am not a huge Wheaties fan. You can be, that's fine. We can disagree on the flavor. You must have a Whedys. What sugar? Little Michigan.

Yeah, that's the sugar. There's a theme here. Anyway, so they tied it to athletic performance, right? So this is sort of that vague health claim. Like Whedys will make you better at sports. How? Well, sometimes they would say like things that were direct, like putting an athlete on a box of weedy saying, I eat weedy's, it implies that weedy's makes you good at

whatever sport you play, right? Right. But they would also say things like there's one ad where they talk about the heat producing elements in weedy's and how these heat producing elements will help you be better at whatever you're doing. They introduced Jack Armstrong. Is that a real person? I believe Jack Armstrong was the fake person, because they had like a, Jack Armstrong was this fictional like all American boy

who Wheaties made great at basketball, I believe. So anyway, and Wheaties made great at basketball, I believe. Anyway, and Wheaties started that trend of like, let's connect a breakfast cereal to sports, performance, athleticism, achievement, you know? Like that sort of general sense, you'll be stronger, faster, better without saying specifically what it's doing to do that. You know what I mean? It's sort of healthy Jason. Yes, and that has perpetuated,

right? We still look to Weedy's boxes for like the current athletic superstars. I assume. I guess, right? I think. I think that's still happening. The next one I want to tell you about is wild. So I'm going to need you, like, let's take a little breather. I wish I could go eat cereal because I'm freaking starving. I do. This is going to kill that urge. But first, let's go to the building department.

Let's go. The medicines, the medicines, the escalate my car for the mouth. Max Fund Drive 2022 starts at just one week. Monday, April 25th. We'll have exclusive Max Fun Drive gifts, awesome episodes, bonus content, and you know what else? You'll just have to tune in. We have some tricks of our sleeve.

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really aren't going to change the world, we're here to take that stress off of your shoulders. We take care of it for you on We Got This With Mark and Owl. That's right, howl! If you have a subjective question that you want answered objectively, once and for all time for all of the people of the world. Questions like, who's the best Disney villain? Mac or PC? Or should you put ketchup on a hotdog?

That's why we're here. Yes, I get that these are the biggest questions of our time. And we're often joined by special guests like Nathan Filion, Orlando Jones, and Paget Brewster. So let Mark and Howe take care of it for you on We Got This With Mark and Hal weekly on Maximum Fun. Grape Nuts is the cereal I would eat, by the way. If I could go eat cereal right now, that you've driven me mad with desire for grape nuts. No, I'm going to kill that with shredded Ralston. You've never heard of shredded Ralston,

you told me. No. No, okay. Ralston. I heard never heard of shredded Ralston, you told me. No, okay. Ralston, Purina. Okay, yes. This was from the Ralston Purina company, shredded Ralston. And it was like a whole wheat cereal, right? Okay. And eventually they would go on to make checks and cookie crisp. So like a cookie crisp is a good cereal. I like that one. Oh no. See, the pieces are too big. I don't enjoy cereals with big pieces. Rolston was for the movement Rolstonism, which was created by Webster Edgily. The reason that you had to the reason this cereal was made is because they had a very restrictive diet. If you were a follower of Ralstonism. By the way, the word Ralston stands for regime activity, light strength, temperature,

oxygen, and nature. Honey, this is a wild thing. And this food was created for followers so that they would have something to eat that would fall within the, it was like I said, there were very few things they had to stay away from. I sure love that when somebody's like you can only these things and as luck would have it for just you know 30 cents a box You could have these exact things exactly. So so they made this cereal for people that the followers could consume is also important to note Incredibly racist Rostinism. Oh my white supremacist movement rostinism. Oh my! White supremacist movement, Rossinism.

Oh my! Yes, only white people could be. I did not expect that. Included in the movement, everyone else, he advocated for a castration. Oh no! Yeah, so bad guy, bad guy, Webster, Edgerly, who created Rossinism, created Shredded, Ralston, and worked with

the company that would go on to make cookie crisp. Sorry about that. Sorry about that. Sorry about that one. And they made all kinds of cereals, by the way. I didn't realize how many co-branded cereals. So that's another story. But again, the point was healthy. This food, this cereal was created specifically to meet a dietary regimen for this group of people that was supposed to be the health, healthiest, most pure dietary regimen, right? Again, super racist also. Eventually, as you have... I think that's also interesting when Ralston, Purina, was sold to Nestle. That division is now called Nestle Purino.

Yeah, get rid of the Ralston. Just don't happen to have a relationship with Ralston anymore. Get rid of that. Eventually in the 50s, as you have noted, it was like we should sell this to kids, but kids don't want to eat it. Why don't they want to eat it?

They want sugar. They need sugar. This is why we all had sugar to these things. So there's an easy way to get around that though. The common idea at the time is that your doctor would advise you to give this to your kid because sugar is important for energy. That is something that you see in a lot of like 50s and 60s serial advertising.

It's like, it's packed with energy. Like to keep kids going, it's like, you mean sugar. Yes, and that's it. That was the way that your kid needs sugar for energy. And so sugar is a good thing. So give your kid sugar. Kids don't need sugar for energy. I, a man, I have a lot to accomplish in a given day.

I need sugar for energy. And as you move into not in the 50s and 60s, but like in the decades to come, we would have studies that would come out that would help with this narrative, right? Like not that sugar necessarily was good for you, but what was bad for you then? What did we come to understand as bad?

This is probably, I would guess, for all the time where fat became the enemy. Fat and cholesterol was the enemy. I mean, look at the food pyramid. You have a giant cereal base on the food pyramid. I mean, if you're talking about grains, like forget that there's sugar in there, there's grains.

You need these. This is good. And so a breakfast of bacon and eggs would be the worst thing you could eat in this, you know, dietary era. So, you know, that's what all the doctors were saying. Fat is bad for you. cholesterol is bad for you. Grains are good. These cheaply produced, easy to produce, cash crops are really the, where are the money that? Exactly. Exactly. And I mean, you can get into, I'm not going to get into like,

there are many books written about who paid for these studies and who promoted these ideas. And hopefully we're all at a point where we realize that like, we need all kinds of foods, you know. We need protein and we need grains and we need sugar and we need, you know, we need all of these things in moderation. But cereal would continue at that point. we need sugar and we need, you know, we need all of these things in moderation. But cereal would continue at that point.

And this is, I feel like as we move into the decades of cereal that we ate as children to be colorful and sugary. And generally something that you would not look at and think of as a health food, right? Like I don't ever remember looking at a box of, you know, cap and crunch is my favorite and thinking like I'm eating a health food. Yeah, right? But what's weird about that is like even in that time, cereals were still making those kinds of health claims. Like even though we were looking at cereals that you wouldn't necessarily assume were healthy. Things like vitamin D were often promoted. Like this is a, and like you can use certain language like good source of.

Right. Yeah. Part of the complete breakfast is always one of my favorite ones. Part of the complete breakfast, that's a good one. It's a bowl of cereal with an orange and a glass of milk and some toast. And with the fear of high fruit toast corn syrup that arose, that was a popular thing to start putting on cereal boxes. We don't have that. No high fruit toast corn syrup.

Don't pay attention to how much sugar is in this box because we've put this claim on the top that sounds very healthy. It's like when you see bags of rice, it's like gluten-free, like, yeah, I mean, yep. Another thing they would do is say like the main ingredient, like it has more whole grain than anything else. Like whole grain is the number one thing. That's it.

But like, one way to get around that is that if you have a bunch of different sources of sugar in it, then each one of those sources is counted separately. Right. Because that you have to list the ingredients in the frequency with which or the proportion of which they appear. So your first ingredient is the one that is most prevalent. But if you divide the sugars up, then maybe it doesn't shake out like that in the list. So you might see them advertised like whole grain is the first ingredient. Like I've seen that like word mark on boxes before.

Some will say like Apple jacks used to say they have fiber. It's like, yes, that is true. There is some fiber in there. That is true. Or like cocoa crispy's for a while said that they support your child's immunity. Because of the vitamins in there. So there, they got vitamins and antioxidants, so it supports your immunity.

Coco Peppas though, amino suppressants. We're literally no one knows this. Which, you know, like I said, like you would not look at these foods and think of them as health foods. And I don't even think at that point, when I think about like my parents giving me cereal, I don't think my parents were under the impression that I was eating a health food. No. No. But the cereal boxes continue to exclaim, and especially as we move into the 90s and 2000s, because that is when you started to get sort of the rise of, first of all, concerns about sugar, right? Secondly, the organic food movement, fear about preservatives, fears about, as we've talked about in previous episodes, artificial

colors and artificial flavors. All of that starts to come into play as we move into the 90s and 2000s. And so I think like some of these cereal boxes are probably making these claims to compete with the rise of cereals that are made to be health food products. You start to see specifically organic cereals and organic foods of all kinds come into play for kids, right? Like now you can find all those aisles. Every food you get at the grocery store, there's an organic, I mean like for kids, obviously for everything but like for kids specifically.

But then you see stuff like special K and Kashi, which are like, these are healthy cereals that are now out there for you to eat. I want to use the Loeb's Kin My Rice brand, that'll make that any more of that really good. I like when the special K has chunks of chocolate in it, and they're like, good, special K, still, right? Oh, fine. It's just chunks of, literally,

the chunks of candy bar we threw in here, this is fine. It's just chunks of literal sense of chelped up candy bar. We threw in here. This is fine. It's really wild too because I mean I would treat myself to special case sometimes as like a dessert because it's like there are some of the special cave flavors that are delicious. And they they have a lot of sugar and that doesn't mean you shouldn't need them, but we're still sugar. And that doesn't mean you shouldn't need them, but we're still marketing these things as like, clear, we're not shaming any of these foods. No. Everything in moderation, it's the marketing that is lying to you and saying, like, you should eat a lot of this. This is good. This is good stuff. Good for you. Yes. And I think that it's, okay, then this leads into the story of cereal as a medicine, the cereal

that was branded a drug for a while. This is exactly why food is food and drugs are drugs and when you put these claims on cereal boxes and lead people to believe like you need to eat this, add this to your diet because it's a health food. Not you should or shouldn't, you know what I mean? Like if you're already eating you should also eat this because it's good for you. Cheerios, which has been around since 1941. Classic, classic cereal.

Cheerios got on on this trend with the claim that they could, everybody knows this, what do Cheerios do? They lower your cholesterol. Exactly, they lower your cholesterol. I feel like this is one of the most well-known claims that a food is made, right? As far as health. This is law.

This is the way. And there was a clinical study that they would talk about that showed this, that two servings of Cheerios a day would lower your back cholesterol 4% in six weeks in parentheses as part of a diet low in saturated fat in cholesterol. Ha ha ha ha. So cholesterol. So, so good. So they marketed it this way.

And I mean, that is my, like, when I think of Cheerios, I still think of it as healthy. Yeah. I used to take a bag of Cheerios with me to snack on all day in high school. I thought of Cheerios as like a healthy snack. I will say if you're someone that pays attention to sugar content, you could do a lot worse than standard chariots.

They are not, besides the fact that they're oat and that makes them good and better than most other cereals because it's more expensive to do oat cereals. So you're seeing a lot of cereals move into like corn and rice because it's cheaper to brews than oat. For example, did you know that the monster cereals used to be oak based? So if you think the monster cereals used to taste better than they do now, oh, they do. It's not your brand planter on you This is a bad substandard bad version of the cereals. These are these are I should note these are your flavor opinions

Yeah, what else is there? I mean, we're just, we're not making you know, I'm a professional cereal reviewer, so like, I would say it's more like flavor law. But you're basing it on like the taste and flavor of the cereals, and now how good they are for you. Because the idea of like, we're talking a lot about foods that are healthy and unhealthy, and instead, that's not really a concept we should discuss. Foods aren't inherently healthy and healthy.

Yeah, so why are you... You need a well-balanced array of foods That's not really a concept we should discuss. Foods aren't inherently healthy and healthy. Yeah, so why are you- You need a well-balanced array of foods that provide your body with all of the things that it needs. Why are you getting on my case and saying that the monster cereals were better before they were all corn? Well, no, I was just clarifying that you mean flavor, not some other factor.

Yeah. Yeah, okay, I was just clarifying that. Yeah. But I'm saying cere would just clarify that. Yeah. But I'm saying Cheerio's are lower in sugar than a lot of other Cheerios. Yes. That's what my love is. No, that's fine. Now I'm talking about how the monster Cheerio's used to be better and now they're bad.

However, in 2009, this claim from Cheerio's got them into trouble. Oh, why? Because the FDA doesn't like it when you put a medical claim on your food packaging, right? Which is why grape nuts knew all those many years ago to say this is food, not medicine. This is food, not medicine.

What does it do? It steadies a man, come at us. What, yeah, it's got phosphate of potash. Food and drugs are regulated very differently. We've talked about that. We've talked about that on the show a lot. If Cheerios wanted to bring a new drug to the market, if Cheerios was a medication,

the general mills was introducing, then they had a whole process they had to go through. They didn't do that, of course, because it's serial. Basically, the FDA said that your're marketing your serial as a medicine, and either you have two options, either pull it from the shelves and go through the process of getting it approved as a medication or change your packaging, because you can't. Right now, you're marketing it as a medicine, but it is regulated as a food and that doesn't fly The result was that as you can imagine people started suing

Because they you know well I ate Cheerios and I still had I still have heart disease What I ate Cheerios and my cholesterol still high the way that a lot of people get around this now and serial packaging is they will have text describing the theoretical value of certain ingredients or whatever, like whole grain. Talking about why whole grain is so important. And then like new paragraph, this has whole grain in it. So I don't know, what do you think? Like they don't say this serial does this. They're saying whole grain does it. So I don't know. What do you think? Like they don't say this serial does this.

They're saying whole grain does this thing. By the way, whole grain is in this serial. So it's like they're not drawing that direct connection. Which is exactly what. So Cheerios did change their packaging. I don't know. I haven't bought a box Cheerios recently. So I don't know exactly what it says. I know that that that is still in my head that Cheerios lowers cholesterol, but that is still in my head that Cheerio's lower school esterol, but that is still and like and they they made that case general Mills made the case like no there are many studies on soluble fiber that talk about the health benefits like we don't have to rehash that because there it's out there But either way they changed the packaging because it wasn't worth all the all the legal headaches but There was a paper published in the journal of public policy

in marketing 2019 that looked at like kind of a meta analysis, well, not meta, four different studies, looked at several different studies on nutritional claims on cereal boxes. And it was wild because this 2019 out of 633 different breakfast cereals, 460 had some sort of health claim on them. So this persists to this day. I just think that's interesting. And you can, we could all debate, I mean, I think the idea of like, again, there are so many different, they're not all medical professionals, but they have varying degrees who will try

to tell you that they have the exact way of eating that is best for everyone. And I think we've talked a lot on this show about like, that's not really, there is no one thing, you know, you need to eat a wide variety of foods that give your body all the different things that it needs. So, you know, I don't wanna quibble with every single one of these health claims. Sure.

The larger point is that cereal is still marketed quite often for its health benefits, which I think is a wild legacy of those early Kellogg and Post and people making cereals in the beginning that cereal still has that when, you know, for me, cereal is delicious and I love it and it's more of a treat is what like I think of cereal. Like if I'm going to eat a bowl of cap and crunch, it's more of a treat is what like I think of cereal like if I'm going to eat a bowl of cap and crunch it's like a treat for me. Yeah. But it's not marketed that way. It's not marketed as a treat yourself. It's marketed as a health food. I would be willing to bet that cap and crunch sorry. Sorry.

Cap and cap and cap and cap and cap and quenilla is crunch is not currently marketing his product as a health food in any way, shape or form. I would have to call you on that. There is no way. There is no way. I don't know. Look at a, pull up a picture of a box of cabin crunch.

I'll just pull one of the many I have underneath my desk. And let's see, are there any, any claims on it? Okay. If I, uh, crunchitized me captain, that's what I'm seeing on this current box art. That's not a health client. I mean, crunchitization has been proven to improve levels of pleasure.

What are the, what are the, what are the, what are the, what's in the small print? Sweetened cornonote cereal, crunchitized me captain. But in large to show texture, you have no, what's the point? Okay, I just wonder. Giant texture, you have no point. What's the point? Okay, I just wonder. Giant size, that's because I'm looking at the giant size box.

Now, I have not seen the side. And now they're advertising great flavors. Oh, they're following on on social media. That's all good. No, see, it's just fun. It's just a fun. Okay, all right, there we go. Well, then my favorite.

Cap and crunch is on the level. He knows it. He knows it. He knows fun, it's just a fun. Okay, all right, there we go. Well then my favorite. Cap Glitch is on the level. He knows what you're saying. My favorite cereal, Cap and Crunch. He's a straight dealer. It is going to tell you exactly what it is. He's a delicious cereal. Yes, then that's it. And don't get up with those oops.

Now, I'm not sure yours. Right there on the box. What is it? Can help lower cholesterol as part of a heart healthy diet. So they've softened that language quite a bit. So anyway, I, again, I just think that it's fascinating that we have continued to market cereal all these years in many, not all, cases, as a health food. Yeah.

I just think that that's an interesting legacy that, that continues from the early days of cereal. And those early claims of it being a health food weren't backed by any sort of science or evidence to begin with. They, I also, one that you see a lot on cereal, which I get a huge take out of is fat free. Don't worry. Cornflake, frosted flakes says that on the, on the curgur description, it says, it's a healthy fat free cereal.

And right above that, it says crunchy flakes of corn sprinkles with sweet frosting. You're a noodle KERGER! Well, they're not lying. They're not lying. It's not lying. Well, they do say it's healthy, Cindy, which is pretty subjective, but it's also not something that you can you can sue somebody over, right? Healthy healthy is Healthy is very subjective. Yeah. So, but at the end of the day, again, cereal can be part of a healthy diet. Thank you so much for listening to our podcast.

We hope you've enjoyed yourself. Thanks, the taxpayers used the song Medicines as the intro and outro of our program. And thanks to you for listening. That's gonna do it first this week until next time. My name is Justin McRoy. I'm Sydney McRoy. And it's always don't draw a hole in your head. Alright!