Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine - Sawbones: Charcoal

Episode Date: November 10, 2017

Grilling season is over in our part of the U.S. and Justin wants to know what he's gonna do with all this left over charcoal. The answer, according to Dr. Sydnee? EVERYTHING. Music: "Medicines" by The Taxpayers

Saubones is a show about medical history, and nothing the hosts say should be taken as medical advice or opinion. It's for fun. Can't you just have fun for an hour and not try to diagnose your mystery boil? We think you've earned it. Just sit back, relax, and enjoy a moment of distraction from that weird growth. You're worth it. that weird growth. You're worth it. Alright, time is about to books. One, two, one, two, three, four. I'm your co-host Justin McAroy and I'm Sydney McAroy It's not like a you're doing a DJ thing there doesn't sound like I'm doing a DJ thing

Yeah, are you gonna play some? Rockley you gonna play some hits of yesterday and today and tomorrow? All right, well You're gonna play some hits of yesterday and today, tomorrow? I'll play hits from every era. All right, well, what else have you been up to? Well, Sydney, you distracted me by making me very aware of how my voice sounds, and now I had to have a sip of. Yeah, you took an extended sip of your tea away from our podcast, that's not great,

but I thought you were professional, but I'm the professional. I'm the professional. No, here comes the thing I was going to say. Today was the first day. It's always a bittersweet time of year. The first time I had to cook a steak indoors in the pan. Now Gordon Ramsey, she listen to Gorda. He'll tell you this is the way to do it. I love that grilled flavor. Right. But today it was too cold, too cold to grow. It was cold and rainy.

Yeah, it's kind of miserable. Yeah. But anyway, I still made the steak. It was good. Thanks. It was yummy. One girl good, but it was good. My only problem is this. Now, what am I going to do with all this charcoal that I got? Is that a problem? Thanks. It was yummy. One girl good, but it was good. My only problem is this now What am I gonna do with all this charcoal that I got is that a problem? It's a problem We will accept it as a problem problem for the premise of the premise of the intro The problem is I have too much charcoal. Well Justin There's a lot of a lot of people would tell you that there are medical uses for charcoal. God that's convenient Yeah, all right, so we going to do an episode about it.

We're going to do an episode of charcoal. I had a problem about charcoal and you had an episode about it. I know. It's crazy how that worked out, like not planned at all. And the conference like that a lot in our interest. Have you noticed that? Like pretty much every time we do an episode of solvents. Yeah, it's almost a little creepy.

A lot of people have recommended this topic throughout the years, honestly, but even more so recently because I think this is trendy. I didn't know this was trendy, but this is trendy. So thank you to everybody who recommended this, including Gina and Beckett and Jay, and Julia and Ellen and Riley and Leah and R and Megan and Kira and Allison and Ashley and Brian and Mariah and Kristi. Wow! Yes. Kind of like the lady from Romper Room at the end, 80s kids will love that one. Yeah, I don't mind these over here. Yeah, so thank you everybody, and for making me aware of things that are trendy, because

that makes Keesame cooler. Yeah. Sure. Yeah, plugged in. There is an actual medical use for activated charcoal and we'll get to that. Okay, but we got a lot of other stuff to get through first Because the use of of charcoal as medicine specifically activated charcoal and I'm gonna tell you what that is dates back to ancient times So are you Justin have you heard of that difference between charcoal and activated charcoal?

So are you, Justin, have you heard of that difference between charcoal and activated charcoal? Working in medicine, I know that activated charcoal is something we use and charcoal is something I've never heard of being used. So that was as far as I knew initially. Yeah. Okay. So activated charcoal is just charcoal that has been chemically or physically processed in some way usually to like add oxygen to it to create more surface area. So like if you look at like activated charcoal it's like a pile of like powdery looking charcoal. Got it. And the idea is that the more surface area the more little pores that you have, so the better at like absorbing material. Okay.

It is. Yes, that makes sense. Yes. So that is the actual like medical charcoal that I will tell you about there's a use for activated charcoal. Like a charcoal like brichette. I don't really have a great use for. Okay. Does that make sense?

So that your so your grand solution won't actually be that helpful to me. Now, well, I use activated charcoal in all my cooking. It's extremely pricey and unsafe. No, here's the great thing though. If you're interested in making activated charcoal, you can. There's a YouTube video for that. It is something you can do at home. Okay great.

I found multiple descriptions of how to make your own activated charcoal in your house if you desire. I might, that sounds so good. I think I might actually throw it off the balcony and forget about it. Forget that it makes sense. Just leave it and we'll use it next year. It doesn't say fresh, I'll go rock. That's not how that works.

Yeah. The ancient Egyptians were already using charcoal for the smelting of ores. So it was a substance that they were familiar with. But over time, I guess maybe if you just have something and it's handy, you start to look for other ways to use it. Like you just have that like out and brown urge to have a multi-tasker. Multi-tasker, yeah. So, so they would they would started taking it orally for any kind of stomach problem. So. Orally just eating the chart. Right.

Taking small amounts of it by mouth, if you're stomach hurt or you were nauseous or you had diarrhea or any kind of GI problem. They also use it for unpleasant odors. I, you, yeah, I know, this makes sense. Yeah, right. It does, it makes sense. Now, it doesn't make sense if you consider

that the number one cause of unpleasant odors for which they may use charcoal was an open infected wound. So dumping charcoal in an open, you know, festering sore. If you look tough. Yeah, and I mean, I'm gonna say this, like, I don't know that it necessarily makes it worse. It makes it dirtier. Right. It's not, it's, it doesn't help.

Yeah, I don't know that it's helping, but,'t help. Yeah, I don't know that it's helping, but, but you know, I don't know that's healing in either. Probably did make it smell better. Sure. It smelled like charcoal. That's pleasant. Yeah. It's a good way to hide it. It was also used for embalming purposes as well. By 400 BCE, the Phoenicians were using it to purify water, which is again a theme that you see. I mean, basically up until the 1800s. And that works.

I use the brittabotels that we have used charcoal, right? Yeah, charcoal is used as a water filtration. So that's not for this old time, you feel. Isn't it? And the way they would do it is not just to like purifier filter water But they would also char barrels to store the water in For long trips like overseas so on ships. They would have big charred barrels Full of water. Yeah, so and like I said that continued as a method to preserve water on ships up until like the 1800s

So that stuck around Hippocrates of course had a Variety of uses for charcoal because once you find something that works just use it for go for it Everything so excited when they found something that actually did something He was he he agreed with the water purification idea. He also thought charcoal might be good for epilepsy because we didn't understand epilepsy at all. So, why not? Anything, really.

That's one of those that you'll find like anything is listed as good for it because we have no idea. We don't understand. We think something either magical or demonic. Yes, is happening to you and we have no idea. So eat some charcoal. We do have a barrel of charcoal. Well that help. Would you like it? Anemia, it was recommended for again for stomach issues. This is like a continuing theme like all throughout history. Like eat this charcoal if

your stomach's upset. Which seems really counterintuitive. I know, but if you say convenient, you finish your grilling, it's like, what am I going to do with all this charcoal? You'll just a macrame problem. Well, good news. You can just eat it. There are people who will tell you still to this day that it does. Oh no.

We'll get there. Not in the oven. And also for vertigo and for Anthrax. Is that a persistent problem? Anthrax? Yeah. Yeah. Okay, I should do an episode of Anthrax.

We'll do it. I'll teach you about Anthrax. Yeah, it's more common than you would think. Well, I mean, I don't wanna say more common, but like it's. Thank you, Sydney. What a good one. No, I don't mean that. I mean, it's not this completely like unheard of never

happens occurrence that I think is as many people's perception of anthrax like nobody ever gets. Well, no, people got anthrax people, people get anthrax. Uh, Galen was the original title for this podcast. People get anthrax. It just happens. It happens. Sorry. Deal with it.

As life, Galelyn followed suit. He liked the idea, like Hippocrates' idea that there are lots of uses for charcoal. In fact, he wrote 500 treatises on the use uses for charcoal in medicine. Wow. He was really into charcoal. He was really into charcoal. I got my new book. I think it's going to be a best seller this time.

Feel really good about it. Uh, Galen, is it, um, is it another book about charcoal? Well, thematically, yeah, it's, there is some charcoal stuff in there, but I thought we talked about this, Galen. It's just all over and over again. It's 500 treatises of all charcoal and no fire makes Galen a cold boy. Just over and over and over again. 500 treatises worth.

I didn't read them all. Sorry. Plenty, plenty. How did I get against? He does have like a dark period. There's a blue period. There's this is, this is his sergeant pepper of charcoal tree. There's a part where he's like,

why do we even care anymore about charcoal? It's like an angsty teenage charcoal period. Is anyone even reading the same word? I'm gonna charcoal, we'll make you a forever. There, whatever, it was panties. My wife left me. Plenty the elder recognized. Oh boy. Yeah. And he actually, he was right on this one. This is something Plenty got right. That he recognized that it had to be processed in some way in order to work. So he talked about

that he actually talked about like burning charcoal would imbbu it with properties that gave it benefit before, but didn't have it before. Which is kind of right. He's talking about activated charcoal. He discusses methods of creating activated charcoal. So he's not wrong. However, he then advised mixing charcoal with honey and putting it on carbunkles, which are like big infected abscess like sores that have multiple heads, using pus. Well, we've talked about this before, honey.

Honey, honey. Honey has its uses. The honey was probably more beneficial than the charcoal. Okay, I know honey has these uses. They love honey. Yes, they did love honey. And also ingesting charcoal for ulcers and cold source. He specifically thought it was helpful. I'm going to eat some charcoal because they're ingesting enough that makes you think that maybe they just super duper duper like the way that charcoal

tastes or everyone had pica or everyone had pica. Yes I don't think they did Oh, we kind of cracked it wide open you and me For a while charcoal kind of disappears for medical literature despite the fact that probably people were still using it I mean these are this is one of those things that was probably widely available. So it was still persisting This is one of those things that was probably widely available, so it was still persisting. But you don't see a lot of novel uses for it for quite a while until the 1700s. And a lot of that, the popularization of charcoal comes up because it was being used to decolor sugar so that it looked like cleaner and wider.

So it becomes like this more popularly used substance again, and then you start seeing it pop up in medical text for things again for stomach problems and also again for things that smell bad specifically wounds. And I mean, you got to wonder like in that case, are you putting it on the smelly wound because you think it will fix the smelly wound or because you think it will fix the smelly? will fix the smelly wound or because you think it will fix the smelly. Hmm. Then one of those angel questions. Just because you covered it up, then mean it ain't there.

And if you're asking them, they probably say, don't interrupt me. Mommy's much more cool. I love it. That would be a really terrible way to practice medicine. If any time you didn't know how to fix something, just like put the patient in this room and just shut the door. And we're done. if any time you didn't know how to fix something, just like put the patient in this room and just shut the door. And we're done. We're done. We don't know what to do.

Sorry. We'll come back later. We're dead. That wound, that wound, we're going to cover up so we don't see it or smell it anymore. There. It's better. Have a nice day.

Sorry, we did our best. This is about two-nice. That'll be three chickens and some wheat. I don't know. In the 1800s, things got really exciting for charcoal. It really took off. Charcoal, a lot of substance on the growl. It really did. You see endless uses pop up throughout the 1800s for charcoal. Partially because it started showing up in like official pharmacopias, so like big giant books of medicine. Big charcoal got into the game, yeah. Yeah.

With their literature. Well, they didn't like fund the book, but like they got the book. They didn't like a little bit deeper. They follow the money. Follow the money. So, and again, it was for a variety of illnesses. You see it specifically added to all kinds of poltuses. So like one specific recipe was like, add breadcrumbs and yeast and charcoal together and like make it into like a paste.

That's pretty close to my red sauce. I'll set a maker on Christmas time. That's pretty close to my red sauce, that I make on Christmas time. And then smish it onto an ulcer or something that has gangrene, like a big open, festering wound or any kind of open skin cancer that is very painful. Oh my God. And the recommendation was that it would be on it. It would fix it. Later, something would happen. It. Later, something would happen. Later, something would happen.

Then it would, it was thought to fix the pain. It was thought to reduce the inflammation. It was thought to fix it without, again, it's hard to say what they thought it was going to do because they didn't really understand what was going on, but there you go. It was also thought to be good to stop bleeding. Weird about that is like, you see that a lot with powdery substances. So if you think about a powdered form and you dump it on an open wound, the idea that it's going to like fill the wound or like absorb the blood or something,

like you see that over and over again. And it's not like when you think about it physically, it's not this ridiculous idea. It doesn't always work. I'm not saying it always works, but it would look like clotting. Right. It looks like it's coming up the work somehow. And there are things that kind of work like that as diptics to stop bleeding. That being said, one of the recommendations for bleeding was that you ate charcoal, which again, I don't know. And I certainly don't want somebody who is bleeding out to take time to go find charcoal and eat it.

Don't have a snack. It would often be prescribed for a nose bleed for that reason. So your nose starts bleeding and just start taking some charcoal by mouth and hope Something yeah Again for the for stomach uses, but that was expanded at this point in history to bad breath burping diarrhea flatchelence

acid reflux and Anything that any of the common GI symptoms of pregnancy, so constipation or nausea, they would recommend for pregnant women just eat some charcoal. Sure, why not? Yeah, baby loves it. Baby says, gotta have my charcoal. A mixture of charcoal and syrup and water and ether was advised for sick headaches, which I think sick headaches is pretty much migraines.

They were called sick headaches at the time, but if you read the description, that sounds a lot like migraines. And, uh, Bismuth and charcoal was advised as a sedative. Um, I'm not sure that would work. No. Yeah. But there you go. The things like sedative bothering me, because like, try it once. Like, never matters. It doesn't matter. The things like sedative bothering is like try it once

Like never matters. It doesn't matter. It's like it's obviously doesn't it's mr. Nusplit pain does it? Because it seems like when you put it on you would know well, and then you're also up against which we should probably do an episode on at some point to the placebo effect which Everything everybody there is somebody who thinks everything works. There is somebody there for everything out there for every for every cure for every treatment for every symptom control thing. Someone will think it worked for them. Right. I guarantee you. Please see with hiccups all the time.

Anyway, what's next? What else? Give me the next exciting step. There's there's charcoals journey to now. There's more for the 1800s. We're not done yet, but before we finish out that chapter in charcoal history, let's go to the milling department. Let's go. The medicines, the medicines that ask you lift my car before the mouth.

Tame you back Sydney. Tame you back to the 1800s. Tell me more about charcoal. So we're not done. We were still and the thing is. I never done with charcoal. The nice thing about this is that like as we're heading to the apex of when we finally figure out what charcoal is good for, we just had to try everything else before we got there. So charcoal was mixed with rhubarb and used as a laxative. Charcoal was mixed with burnt brandy for gallbladder disease. Okay. Fine, sure, go for brandy.

Yeah. If you are bleeding from the boughs, this is one of my favorite descriptions. This was directly from a medical text. It has been used in anama, finally powdered to four ounces of water, thrown up the rectum. Just toss it up there. Throwing up the rectum.

Check it right in. So there you go. That's not how for the record, we do not throw up the rectum. I mean anything. You basically do very little throwing in medicine. If you think about it, throwing in the rectum. I mean anything. You basically do very little throwing in medicine. If you think about it, throwing in medicine. There isn't a lot of throwing.

I'm a lot of throwing. That's fair to say. And we definitely are not trying to throw anything up or down or into an orifice at any time. Yeah. Because that's not very well-tested skill in Buddhism in terms of jumping stuff at people. There were other bleeding issues that other than I've already mentioned that were treated with it as well like heavy heavy periods. It was a common

treatment for bleeding from the lungs or from the kidneys which those seem like bigger problems than you know charcoal can even charcoal than even charcoal effects bleeding related to typhoid fever So Think the typhoid fever would be the biggest problem there and in addition it was used in tooth powders from the era to clean your teeth That might work right That has a ring of truth to it Another one that persists today. Yeah, I don't know if you're just looking for something abrasive. I mean, that's me, yeah.

I don't know. Maybe. I don't know, it sounds good. If you rub charcoal on your teeth though, you know they'll, like, they will temporarily be black. Yes, but maybe it's like. And I like permanently, but like your, your mouth will be black. Maybe it's a contrast thing.

You get used to that. Then afterwards you're like, wow. Look how white they are. They're so white. Now that all that charcoal is off of them in 1813 French chemist Michelle Bertrand swallowed five grams of arsenic along with some charcoal now he did this because he had a theory that charcoal would be good for treating poisoning. He had a way to test it.

And so Michelle went for it. And he survived. In order, and this should have been a lethal dose of arsenic, but it wasn't. He was fine. That's a big swing. That is, yeah. That's a big swing for Michelle. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

And if that wasn't enough, as we, as we go on to like really, uh, tough French scientists in history in 1831, Professor Pierre Flores Torre, a pharmacist, swallowed charcoal, along with ten times the lethal dose of strict nine. In front of the French Academy of Medicine, as in not like in the front yard, like he had gathered the French, I'm picturing all of these very like stoic French scientists and doctors, and they're all sitting in like a big like almost like an operating theater and they're all sitting in like a big, like almost like an operating theater, and they're all like lining the walls, and they're all like leaning forward,

and they've got their notepads, and they're watching as he like stands there, and he's like, watch me eat this stuff, and then he eats the strict nine, and he eats the charcoal. I wonder if he told him what he was doing, or if he just started eating strict nine. I don't know, because I mean nobody,

there's no like documentation of somebody trying to stop him and say like, don't, don't eat strict nine. Don't please, no, they watched him, they took notes. He did fine. He was all fine. That's impressive. And so this led to the adoption of many people, by many people in Europe, of charcoal as

an antidote to poisoning. Okay. So you see, we were going somewhere in the 1800s. All this weird experimentation with charcoal took us to a helpful place. When you get to the 1900s, you can find in the British pharmaceutical codex in 1911 a list of uses specifically for charcoal. And they talk about the use internally as an antiseptic and an absorbent, which does speak to like, if there are poisons

or something in there. But you're still seeing mentioned for a lot of other things. Things we've already talked about, like acid, what they would call acid indigestion or dyspepsia, diarrhea, dysentery. They thought that it would remove mucus and stimulate the movements of the stomach and intestine.

They thought that if you applied it externally, it was a good deodorant. They talk about still using it for poltuses for things that smell bad. They've just been happy with the poison thing. That's the thing, like we're still, the powder may also be administered on buttered bread in the form of sandwiches

That was a mention. Yeah good If you think about it if you administer anything on buttered bread in the form of sandwiches like that's yeah Laws and giz of charcoal and biscuits were popular forms and then there were of course like I mentioned tooth powder still in use It wasn't until the 1900s that US doctors started to take note of what those bold French physicians had done. And also in Japan, they had done some experiments with using it to treat poisonings. And they attempted it several times in the US

when there were not intentionally, like I don't have stories of American doctors, swallowing arsenic and charcoal. And you already did it. You'd get up there and be like, everyone, look, I have an important science thing. I'm about to do it. Like we saw it already, do something more.

Two, one each time is the least little, that was a straight line. And they didn't do that and said they waited till somebody else like was poisoned and said, waited till somebody else like was poisoned and said, look, you're going to die. But why don't you try eating this charcoal? I really want to see what happens. I'm proud to be in the car. So so at several times when there was a case of toxic exposure or poisoning, they tried it and they had some success with that. When they did that, what they would do is they would take charcoal and flour and salt

and mix that all together. And then bake it. And then put that in some water. And then drink it down. Why? There's just the way they administered the charcoal. Okay. And they had to, I mean, if you think about it,

like a school. That ancient Greek guy's like, you're crazy. Don't write your waist to it. It's all a great charcoal flavor. Just eat it. No, I mean, they were putting in brandy and stuff before. So, I mean, but if you think about it, like if you're talking about like,

first of all, like something that's hard or like charcoal that is still a solid, and you've got somebody who's been poisoned, are you expecting them to be like, you know what I'm saying? I don't know why we got so wimpy. But it would also be hard if it was in a powdered form, like you put a spoonful of that in your mouth And it's just everywhere. Yeah, you know, yeah, it's just everything

I think you're like trying to eat coffee grounds. That's what I imagine it would be like just like everywhere So you know, you make it with some flour and salt water What make it into a loaf of bread spread it with butter eat it is a sandwich again butter bread So in the 1930s a, I found this one mention of this very specific, and I found kind of upsetting use for charcoal, which was that if a woman had had either an elective abortion or a miscarriage, or if a person had had an elect abortion or a miscarriage, afterwards

they would take like a charcoal, basically like a pencil, like a long thin rod of charcoal and insert it into the cervix to, as the thought was that it would prevent infection. Yes. Afterwards, which sounds highly unpleasant. Yeah. Afterwards, which sounds highly unpleasant. And they expanded this use to any time after a delivery, if they would start to notice an odor. We just put a pencil in there. Yes.

I am minister. Oater thought to be the like, harbinger of what they used to call like, childbed fever, or purple fever, which is really like an infection inside the uterus after birth. But if they smelled something, they would put charcoal up there, which again, this sounds like, oh, we're trying to fight infection, but you're kind of just trying to cover up a bad smell. It's just like the wounds we talked about before.

You smell something bad, you don't know what to do about it. Let's just cover the wounds we talked about before. You smell something bad, you don't know what to do about it. Let's just cover it up. Yeah, you must trial tiny doctors. But now, today, as I kind of already mentioned, activated charcoal is supported by studies to be used in lots of poisoning situations. It is not an antidote for every single poisoning. It will not work to absorb everything you can

overdose on every toxic substance. But there are a lot of things that you can use it for. A lot of times it's just a single dose that they'll give you. It's usually in an emergency room situation. It's actually like a suspension. So it's like a liquid. You just be a mystery IV. No, no, like oral liquid. It's like a suspension you take. I mean, I guess if you're awake in alert and you can swallow things, you could do that. Or if you're not, let's say you're unconscious or altered or something like that, they could put a tube through your nose down in an atomic called a nasogastric tube.

Deliver it that way. Anyway, so they do use it in some poisoning situations. There are some medications that we have some evidence that maybe multiple doses of charcoal might be more effective, but again, it's not used for every single poisoning, but there are a lot of times when activated charcoal can be helpful for that. Now, that being said, there are still a lot of people who tout its benefits for GI problems. You'll see a lot of recommendations to take charcoal if you have gas or if you have stomach cramping or diarrhea or anything like that or just to like keep you regular. You should take charcoal every day. There have been studies on this,

you should take charcoal every day. There have been studies on this, but they're not very consistent. It's really hard to see like a routine response to taking charcoal on a regular basis. I can't ask a stupid question. If it's... So, you eat the charcoal juice and it takes out the bad stuff. Like, it sucks up the bad stuff. Like it sucks up the bad stuff. So why wouldn't that work for stomach acid? You know what I mean?

Like we're talking about. Well, part of what we're dealing with is that it's not going to bind everything. It's not like it has, it's not like charcoal's magic substance that knows what your body needs and doesn't need and can carry it out. And you do need stomach acid. Sure. I mean like, you don't need a straight nut. No.

You know, stomach acid is very, it's important. And yes, there is acid reflux, which is, I mean, not even necessarily like the overproduction of acid so much as acid where it shouldn't be. You need acid and your stomach, not your esophagus. So I don't know that absorbing it with charcoal would really make a difference. But I mean, the bigger thing is that I think because it does specifically work to eliminate poisons, it starts to become this detoxifying agent in kind of pseudo medical circles. And anything like that, you'll start to see,

like, well, yeah, use it for anything. Like I saw mentioned for hangovers. I saw for high cholesterol. I saw mentions of it for teeth whitening. So recommend it for teeth whitening. All kinds of skin and hair preparations that you'll find of it, like put this charcoal-based lotion on your skin

or use this for your hair. And it will make your skin clearer and glowy or something and it will make your hair thicker and fuller. Lots of cosmetic kind of claims from charcoal. And then of course it is like you said before, it is used in water filters that actually works. If you look all over goop,

oh, it's like all over there. Yeah, I go in with Paltrow's lifestyle website where she does push again like pseudo medical type products you will find lots of lots of lots of products like bars that contain like soaps and stuff that contain charcoal sprays that contain charcoal Like just charcoal sticks that you can like put in your bath. Sure, why not? It does a cool thing, why can't we just all be excited? It grills, it grills stakes and can get rid of poison.

And it can save you if you put, if you poison. That's enough. So, but charcoal is very trendy. And not only that, but you'll find find because it is trendy and because it is being associated with this like wellness kind of lifestyle brand thing, you'll see it incorporated in like cool food and beverage type things. So for instance, you can find places that sell charcoal ice cream and it is black ice cream. It will make your mouth black. It's wild to see it.

You can find these YouTube videos, but there's charcoal ice cream out there, charcoal lattes that are very popular in some places, all kinds of charcoal smoothies and things like that. Again, all kind of aimed at trying to bring you wellness or balance or detoxifying you or something. Some sort of non-specific, but sounds pretty good, medical claim. Yeah, a club that are building on the fact that like it does actually do something. It does. I don't know if this counts as one of our curals, cure nothing, because it does, in fact,. Yeah. But if you are actually poisoned, please do not buy charcoal ice cream or lattes. Please go to an emergency room and let them treat you appropriately. Gwyneth, that is going to do it for us.

Folks, this week you could enjoy yourself. Thank. Thank you the taxpayers for letting us use their song Medicines is the intro and outro of our program. Make sure this week you go listen to another great show on the maximum fun network. I'd recommend still buffering it to show that Cindy does with her sisters about how teen life has changed over the years. Last week was about sexual harassment.

And it's a- Pen sexism. And sexism in general. And it was a really, it's a great discussion. And I think it's a really great show. And there are fun ones and more serious ones. So pick one and just go, go, go listen to the whole thing. Because I think you'll like it.

Well, that was swell of you. Well, Sydney, I only endorse products I believe in. Sorry, that's me, Mr. Integrity. That is going to do it for us folks. Oh, one thing, actually, I don't think we've mentioned this. We're going to be a pod con, along with Stillbuffering and my brother, my brother, me and a bunch of other great podcasts. We're going to be doing live shows there all weekend. Well, I mean, we won't, but there will be live shows there all weekend. We'll just do the one. But if you want to come see a live sawbounds and a ton of other shows, go to podcon.com. It's going to be in Seattle, December 9th and 10th at the Washington State Convention Center. And it is going to be a really fun time.

Tickets are 100 bucks. And usually totally come. It's going to be great. Yeah. Anyway, that is going to do it for us folks. So until next week, my name is Justin McRoy. And I'm Sydney McRoy. And as always, don't drill a hole in your head.

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