Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine - Sawbones: Green Sickness

Episode Date: January 18, 2016

his week on Sawbones, Justin and Sydnee drop out of school and have some pre-marital sex to cure their pseudo-anemia. Music: "Medicines" by The Taxpayers

Saubones is a show about medical history, and nothing the hosts say should be taken as medical advice or opinion. It's for fun. Can't you just have fun for an hour and not try to diagnose your mystery boil? We think you've earned it. Just sit back, relax, and enjoy a moment of distraction from that weird growth. You're worth it. that weird growth. You're worth it. Alright, time is about to books! One, two, one, two, three, four! We came across a pharmacy with a toy and that's lost it out. We were shot through the broken glass and had ourselves a look around.

Some medicines, some medicines that escalate my cop for the mouth. Wow! Hello and welcome to Saul Bonesona's metal tour of this guy to medicine. I am your co-host Justin McAvoy Sydney I've been doing a lot of thinking about how I can contribute to the show more and to America It's about time and you know how you're a doctor Yes, I'm aware of that and you know how by being married you I'm sort of a doctor. No, that's not I mean honorary. No God not a thing if you are listening to this and you have a university Please I'll do anything to get an honorary doctor and you have a university if you own a you are a university

And you're listening to this whoa, there's some big headphones unless you're feeling online Which case you're just plugged into the grid anyway? I'm going to I'm going to contribute more because I feel like you are sort of like so you're just plugged into the grid. Anyway, I'm going to contribute more because I feel like you are sort of like, so you're a real doctor, right? Right, I'm a real doctor. So what I'm thinking is I wanna be more of like a folk doctor, you know what I mean?

Like folk remedies, no. Like, oh, I thought you meant like a folksy, like, you know what I mean? I know how you all do it. Yeah, that's like folksy like well like patch atoms. I how you all doing? Yeah, that's like a like a pumpkin patch Adams. No, I want to be like you like you know how people so like their legs are hurting because their arthritis when this About to rain or something like I want to do all medical testing that way. Oh So so like in order to diagnose arthritis, you're just gonna wait till it rains and then go door to door How are you feeling if there needs hurt or if they say I think I have arthritis doc

I'll say let me check that forecast and get you a diagnosis Peranto like I give let me give you one right now anemia, okay? Okay, if you rub a gold ring on some skin and it makes a black line Then they are anemic. There is one another test for me to do. No, that's actually not true. But I mean, I'll give you a little bit of a pass in that you're not, I think a lot of people think that. Well, how can it be true if I think it,

how can it not be true if I'm like, if I know, how would I know if it wasn't true? Where did you, where did you hear about that? Gosh, you know, folk has been passed down. Folk medicine, sinning has been passed down from generations to generations. The thing about stuff that I've been my nonny, my nonny's nonny, my nonny's nonny's nonny,

it's impossible to say. The thing about stuff that gets passed down, generation to generation is that as nice as that is, as comforting as that is, it doesn't necessarily make it true. It might be, but that one's not. That's not true. You're probably just reacting to the metal in the ring

if you have a black line on your finger from it. It has nothing to do with it. I mean, like, you know, to diagnose anemia, you need a blood test, right? Well, I guess. I mean, I can look at patients and sometimes say, like, hmm, I see some signs that maybe they're anemic, but like, I really need that blood test to be, you know.

I agree to this agree, but I think that it's, probably for the best since I don't know what anemia is, and I don't know how to treat it. Okay, well, maybe we should back up a little bit. Okay. Maybe we should talk about what anemia is, but maybe a little broader than that, because this is, you know, this is saw bones.

Sure. Right, this is a medical history podcast. Rough and raw. And we like to, we like to deal with the historical stuff that maybe sometimes is a little funnier. And so why don't we talk about something called green sickness? Okay. Like Herma had. Yes. Like Herma. And it wasn't easy, folks, but he dealt with that struggle every day.

You know what? I'm really glad. I knew that joke was going to happen in this episode, and I'm glad you got it out of the way right now. Joke is very liberal. You're very, very loose at the time. So we're going to talk about green sickness. Thank you, Crystal, for recommending this topic. And as we've kind of alluded to, when we talk about green sickness, which is not a disease that exists anymore, like you won't find that in medical literature. It's not like you're... We carried it.

Congratulations. No, no, it's... We eradicated it. Coming for you next, Gidewarm. No, well, good, but no. Okay, it's not that we eradicated it. It's that it was another example of us kind of seeing some sort of syndrome in patients and tagging it with a name that had all kinds of

connotations and all kinds of strange treatments, but really ended up probably being different diseases and having nothing to do with what we thought you know was originally causing it. So for instance, green sickness largely would be what we think of as a hypochromic anemia today, which just means it's a kind of anemia where if you look at the red blood cells underneath the microscope, they look pale in the center, hypochromic, less color, right? So they look pale and that's usually caused

the most common by iron deficiency. Now there are some other genetic disorders that can cause it, but for the most part, we were probably dealing with iron deficiency. Now, again, since green sickness also encompassed some other things, we'll kind of get into that, but that's largely what we're going to talk about is the anemia portion. It was also known as chlorosis, which comes from the root for green. Oh, chlorophyll. Yeah. And also called the pale or white sickness,

because the general idea is that people who had it would be very pale, right? Would have a very pale complexion, because most of them are anemic. And they may even appear a little green-tinged because they were so pale, was that's where the name comes from. Now, did we have an understanding

of what anemia was at this point? No. No. The, we really, when you go back, you can see like, Hippocrates and Galen making some references to something that may have been anemia to people who, especially women, this is, green sickness was largely a disorder of women.

Not that men couldn't get anemia, but it tended to be associated with females. And there was an association with women around the age that they started menstruating, that they might get green sickness. Okay. Which is not like a crazy thought, because. You do lose iron during your period.

Right, when you start having periods, you may some women do suffer from some iron deficiency anemia as a result. So that's not like a crazy association. But we don't really see anybody knowing that it has to do necessarily with blood loss. And we really don't see it defined as a disease until the 1500s.

And like I said, it was mainly seen as a disease to young women. Although it happened about the time that they started menstruating, it really wasn't associated with their periods as much as the fact that they were still versions. Oh, okay. So it was thought to have something to do with the fact that these were women who were now officially of child-bearing age, because they started their periods, but they had not yet gotten married. Got it. So it was also sometimes called the Virgin's Disease. Also, lover's fever. Sometimes you see.

I like that one. Green sickness kind of associated with the idea of love sickness. Sounds like a 1960s screwball comedy strong Tony Curtis. I'm into it. What? Lovers fever. Lovers fever. Yeah.

Coming to movie screens this summer, assizzling in their adventure. A bad. Tony Curtis. Lovers fever. Yeah. Coming to movie screens this summer, a sizzling new adventure. Tony Curtis, Judy Garland. About anemia. The streets are hot. And Judy Garland is very tired at a little short of breath. Dimper's a pale. Dimper's a high iron counts low. It was also described as a term for it was the disease

of made occasioned by celibacy. Not very catchy. No, but I like the idea that you were occasioned by celibacy. Oh, hello. It's just kind of. Just happened this way. It just happened to me.

It didn't set out to be solubit, it didn't do it. Oh, had opportunities. Shakespeare wrote a lot about green sickness referring to women as being green or, or sick and green or those kinds of references. And it, it was used as a way to describe a woman who may have been what they also would have called love sick.

Love sickness was thought to be a disease process as well. Mm-hmm. And it was the sickness you get when you're in love with somebody. The only difference is with green sickness, you didn't necessarily have to be in love with somebody. The only difference is with green sickness, you didn't necessarily have to be in love with one person. It was just basically, you had it because you weren't getting any. And so it didn't matter.

Like you didn't need a specific person to fix the problem. Okay, got it. Any person. And you see that association, like sometimes you would get, you see like Shakespeare references to this and other writers that anybody who's kind of squeamish about sex,

maybe they're just, they've got green sickness. Oh, we got the green sickness, okay. Yeah, I mean, that's a very, very, so it's kind of like some, I have you there. It's kind of like a, I don't know if like a feminine connotations would be the way, but like weak will or weak spirited,

like sort of connotations to it, right? Like, not just women, but there's an implication that like you don't have a strong stuff like something like that, right? Yeah, people, so people who had green sickness were thought to be kind of weak and puny. It was the syndrome you would diagnose in a woman who, you know, like we kind of talked about,

was of the sort of that age and a virgin and and whatnot, maybe sexually squeamish or whatever. But they also were usually pale, tired, short of breath, pretty weak. They might have headaches, they might just, in general, have an upset stomach and not eat very much. So yeah, exactly. The connotation of green sickness is that you're not full of like life and vitality. And of course, what goes along with this is the inherent sexism in it. The idea that women who are of child-bearing age who have not yet become sexually active are somehow sick. Disease.

Yes, that you have a disease and that you need a man to cure it. Yeah, I can see some, yeah, you know, now that you put it that way, I could definitely see a problem or two with that just from like an overarching point of view. And you could be diagnosed with this just for being like a young woman who's kind

of grouchy. Yeah. I mean, obviously she's got green sickness and you know, we know the cure for that. Yeah. Get married. Get married lady. So like, like, like, how we use to call people spinsters, then we just not a thing anymore. Right. We don't call people spinsters anymore. Like, definitely. Like the one thing, like on a side note, that's the one problem I have. You're gonna talk about the, it's a wonderful life, aren't you? It's a wonderful life, which is one of my favorite movies

of all time, and I'm not saying it's not. It's just that the absolute worst thing that he finds about his life, when he goes to the alternative universe where he's never been born. The absolute worst thing that happens is poor Mary, his wife is now an old spencer who works in the library.

An old spencer? Like, that's the worst. An old spencer, and like, let's be clear, Dona Reed looks horrific. She's probably 33 years old. I mean, it's absolutely madness. She'll never find love. Or are you talking about it's Dona Reed,

she's in her mid 30s, James. Maybe she just relax a little bit, dude. Oh, she's gorgeous. I mean, they did put the glasses on her. Oh, so it's like yeah, universal sign for like, oh, she's got, she's all thatitis. Exactly. She's got the glasses on. I don't know what you're saying. So sit there, Jimmy, maybe you take the glasses off and you know, must our hair are

a little bit. Who knows? Thanks Claire. You're not helping. That is the only problem I have with the boot. That's the only problem I have. the boot that the old problem I have So back to let's talk about green sickness again You should talk about its wonderful. I know. No, no, please green sickness So in 1554 you know, Honest Lang who was a German doctor described

Green sickness and that's where we see like the first really good description of what this is and Kind of like a from a medical standpoint Although it really isn't a thing at the time from a medical standpoint, although it really isn't a thing, at the time from a medical standpoint. He describes it, he notes it, it's a virgin problem, and as such, we see our first big treatment recommendation, which is, you know, get pregnant. Gross.

And then it'll, you know, everything will be okay. I don't mean to say pregnancy is gross. I mean, like it's gross that that would be a, or a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a gross. I mean, like, it's gross that that would be a or a the it was thought even just even just having sex even if you didn't get pregnant would fix it too. So just don't be a virgin or get pregnant. That would be the best thing. Now to be fair, I will say that like if you are having periods and you're losing a lot of iron and then you stop having periods, you.

So they were right. You heard it here first folks. But you could also get in the middle of your eyes with all time and deers. No, but anyway, that was what they thought a remedy for green sickness was. And there's a horrible poem that I refuse to reference anything other than that it's called a remedy for the green sickness. And if you are somebody who wants to read awful sexist poems from, you know, the 1500s. You know that's why I check that out. It's also suggested that this may be the result of poisoning that somehow a woman had her like she's poisoned herself. And a lot of this was thought to be

related to like a build up of blood and stuff within the uterus because you're menstruating. So now we know that's coming out of you. So we know that it's hanging out somewhere. They're just guessing. Right. They're just guessing. And so that maybe that's poisoning you.

And so it was it was advised to use something called mithradate. So mithradate was an anti poisoning. It was a mispronunciation. Mispronunciation a mystery date. MythRudate. MythRudate. MythRudate. MythRudate was an-

MythRudate. Is this something I feel like this is something that would have shown up in one of your like like those games that you play where you're like a wizard and stuff. Yeah. Has MythRudate ever shown up? You mean like a video game or like a video game like when you like have you ever heard of this I feel like this is something that should show up in one of your games. No, it was it it's a Like it was a very popular concoction that you used for any kind of poisoning

So it was it was used like across many many years. I'm sure it has been so one will treat it me Yeah, and I already that stuff. I just like to hit and pay boy swords It had varying ingredients up to 65 and it depended on which source you read and it include all kinds of things from just like Cinnamon and saffron and rhubarb to like both Murr and Frankenstein's Frankencens were in there Turpentine Parsley just all kinds of stuff was in this You pound that all up and take it with some honey about the size of an almond and it was thought to turpentine, parsley, just all kinds of stuff was in this. You pound that all up and take it with some honey

about the size of an almond, and it was thought to cure pretty much any poisoning that could happen. This is such a crazy cure that even Plenty thought it was kind of nuts, and this seems right up his alley, right? Like it's got a ton of ingredients, it makes no sense. But let me tell you what Plenty said about it. Plenty said, the myth-redatic antidote is composed of 54 ingredients, no two of them having the same weight.

While some of it is prescribed one-sixtieth part of one denarius, which of the gods in the name of truth fix these absurd proportions no human brain could have been sharp enough, it is plainly a showy parade of the art and a colossal boast of science. That is a that is so prophetic of Pliny. Even Pliny knew. Pliny saw the whole thing. So Pliny got plenty our old buddy Pliny the Elder got this one right. So in 1681, Sid and Ham who had a lot to say about a lot of stuff, classified green sickness as one of the hysterical diseases. Fake. Right, and it, well, I mean, at the time,

that's not what he meant, but it was, I mean. It's a useful classification, though. Yes, it means fake stuff that only happened to women. Hahaha. And he had, he'd now, to be fair, he did advise iron for it. The theory was that iron would, it kind of invigorate you and wake up your libido. But I mean, I don't know about that, but it is good for anemia. In general, at this period, the two culprits behind green sickness were thought to be laziness,

and then, of course, again, love is still a theme. So you could just give everybody a job and keep them really busy and that would prevent it. We see this common theme of that it has to do with fear of sex or sexual repression or something like that, and that continues. That was initially associated with it and that has not gone away. We see this repeated theme of green sickness and love sickness, and women can get sad and mad and desperate to be married and that they desperately need to no longer be virgins and you know a lot of associations with stuff

that just seems really convenient for men. Sorry to get them out. In the 1700s the theory behind green sickness was mainly that when women started to minstrate their humors would build up in their uterus. Kind of and get stuck there and they would be obstructed and it would make them very sick. They also had the suggestion that it's either that or it probably has to do with masturbation. Either way, there were some interesting case studies that came out of that time period where they talked about women who had green sickness

and one symptom of green sickness was, even though they didn't like to eat a lot of food, they would want to eat something like chalk or senders or dirt. Like with pica? Exactly. So they were really describing pica, which is associated with iron deficiency anemia.

Again, they didn't know that. They just thought, oh, they've got green sickness. They're going crazy and now they want to eat dirt. And then there was also this idea from the time period that I had to do some with some sort of blockage of your spleen. But again, the spleen was blamed for all kinds of crazy stuff back then.

And now I feel bad for the spleen. It got a bad wrap and then everybody just got rid of it. Nobody even knows what it's for. I mean, I do, but we'll talk about that in another episode. I don't believe you. I mean, I don't believe we'll talk about that in another episode. I don't believe you. I mean, I don't believe you. We'll talk about it. If I have tripled, I'll believe you don't need it for anything.

Like, you need your spleen. You absolutely, okay. There's no way you need your spleen. Yes, you, okay. Do you absolutely need your spleen? Do people have their spleen's removed? Yes, sometimes. Your honor, the defense rest.

But there are problems from that. Grind your rest, your honor. Okay, we're not going talk about displaying anymore. We're gonna go to the billing department Let's go So Cindy you were telling me about a green sickness before the break and I want to know more so That's right, Justin. We're talking about green sickness. And as we move throughout the 1800s, we see a theme of one treatment in particular of iron,

which makes a lot of sense. Because your eye intervention is the perfect treatment. 100% magic bullet. And you even actually see a French writer during the time period, Auguste St. Aramann write a recipe for people who have green sickness for a chocolate you could make them that included like iron filings in a chocolate. Iron chocolate, rock and roll.

So, you know, we don't understand why this is helpful, we don't even understand what we're doing with it, but we do see that iron is a common theme. Now, the only thing that makes it a little tricky, because usually we stumble upon this stuff by accident, right? We didn't know green sickness was anemia. Turns out it is. We gave people iron that got better, so we kind of figured it out accidentally.

But the weird thing about green sickness is that, while definitely a lot of cases were probably actually just anemia, iron deficiency anemia, some other weird things may have been thrown in there, which led to a lot of odd treatments. For instance, sometimes women would claim that this is one thought. Sometimes it would be reported that green sickness could cause you to stop having periods, which doesn't make sense right if we're tying it to anemia. Right.

Because you'd think more periods would make you more anemic. So there is some thought that sometimes women would claim green sickness when they were actually pregnant. Oh, it was like cover up. As like a cover up and it's also a way to be able to go to, you know, like a pharmacist or somebody who had medicines that might help start periods. And maybe if there was a pregnancy that was unwanted and they didn't want anybody to know about,

they were seeking treatment for that. So there's some thought that that was maybe some cases of green signals. There's also some thought that maybe sometimes, because when you see that lack of period, that doesn't really make sense for anemia. So sometimes it may have actually been the condition of anorexia nervosa, which has may have actually been a psychiatric condition.

So their iron was low because they weren't eating because it was a nutritional issue, which is why you would have anemia and not be having periods. You wouldn't be losing blood. But so you see all kinds of different strange treatments because we really don't know exactly what we're treating or what this entity is or like most of these things, it's multiple different things. So in addition to iron, we see, throughout the 1800s, steel filings,

you could powder them also and then boil them in white wine and add some spices and sugar. Yeah, I'm into it. It's like mold wine only with metal. I guess, yeah. And it fixes your green sickness. Sort of. Which one of your wine does not? A frequent exercise was a was a common treatment. So like you're tired and you don't have any blood. We don't know that's what you don't have. I mean, that is pretty much for looking like, it is a good way to get more energy.

Yeah, but if you're anemic, that won't fix it. Right, yes. The problem is now that you're, you know that anemia isn't laziness, right? It's laziness in obtaining and consuming iron though. People were telling you, hey, can you go to the iron store and buy some iron, just slam it

you know I'll get there later. No that's not that's not what that means. Another recipe that I found from the time period is that you could take half a quarter of an ounce of pearl in powder, an ounce of powder of steel, cloves, mace, nutmeg and each each half a quarter of an ounce of all those things. And then you dry them and you make into a powder and you sift it. And then you take a pound of sugar and beat it and sift it again. And then chop this all up with a knife and then take as much of that as you can fit on a six pence and eat it morning and afternoon at four o'clock and exercise while you do it. And do what?

I don't know, I don't even know. Like by the time you're done with this, you don't even care if you're anemic, right? I guess. Like whatever. I'm just exhausted from this treatment. You feel better, you do that for a couple of days and then you're like, forget it.

I'm gonna stop doing it and then you have so much free time and energy. Yeah, I feel great. They don't have to do that anymore. Bloodletting, of course, was a common treatment for everything. So why not also for what turned out to be anemia? Yeah. Oops.

I wonder how good it is to treat a fake disease or the fake treatment. Like if the two cancels each other out at some point. It will see what effect. That's not what that means, but maybe. No, well, I don't think in this case, treatment, like if the two can't switch to their out at some point. Placeable effect doesn't all that means, but maybe. No, well, I don't think in this case. Since these people are neem making, like,

you're bleeding them. Just true. That's fair. Another treatment that I saw a lot were tepid baths, which I mean, it would kill you out more. It seems like to get that that energy that you crave you want to jump in like an ice cold bath.

Well, but then, okay, again, this is anemia. So like, we're not, you want to jump in like an ice cold bath. Well, but the okay Again, this is anemia. So like we're not you can't like just will it Away you can't like take a cold shower and get on your anemia like I know city I'm not suggesting it like everybody with anemia is just really lazy. No, I'm the sank for the time period I'm not like seeing you're saying like here just since 2016 methods for curing anemia that really definitely work. Take you from him He knows what anemia is. No, yeah, well, I mean I told you and you seem to have already forgotten so it's when you're tired You know the fire Sort of

Bob Oxygen carrying capacity of blood Okay, do you know what he globebin is? It carries oxygen to your cells. Yes. Like, I explain this to you, right? It's the sticky part of blood, not the web part, but the sticky part. No. It carries oxygen to all your cells and your body.

And so you need enough of it to do that. And if you don't have enough, you're not getting oxygen. It blew usually, right? Oh, okay. Forget it. Some other treatments. It's a go along with Justin's fake theories. Iodine, Urgot,

Aloe, Mercury, we're all used. Riding a horse was recommended. Okay. Jumping rope. Because it's majestic and good for everything. Yeah, just because somebody was just like,

I like riding a horse of bridal horse. Maybe that'll help. Sure. Jump rope. Where's some flannel underwear? No. I don't want to do any of these things. Brisk rubbing with a coarse towel.

What? No, thank you. I would prefer not. Eat tender meat. OK. Or apply friction over the loins and abdomen. And like of the woman? Well, of the patient, but yeah, most of the patients

were mostly diagnosed among women. It's so unpleasant. It's like, is it an unpleasant way to spend your time? Yeah, I mean, what, okay, which of the, was it the mercury that you thought was really pleasant or the brisk rubbing with a coarse towel? That one actually bugs me the most. I think it seems very intentional in personal.

I don't like that. Malt liquor was a recommended treatment. Now we're back. Welcome story. And you're going to need some malt liquor. And after all of that brisk rubbing and friction over your loins and then jumping rope and eating mercury and iodine, I think the least you could do

is offer somebody some malt liquor after the red. Yeah, you've earned it. Take the ride of the hurricane. And just to top it off, why not some laxatives? Well, no, I'd rather not. I want to stop at the hurricane, thank you. Warm barley water was really common, especially just add some wine in that and then put your feet in a warm bath.

I mean, that sounds relaxing. Yeah, I mean, it's not gonna hurt, I guess. And we'll show you out about the fact that you have this great disease. And it's certainly better than one of the more radical options for treatment that I found for green sickness, which was quit school. Ah.

Oh, yeah. Obligable to women only. Come on, ladies. Yeah, just quit school. It's just that it's putting such a strain On your poor little woman brain. Yeah, you know to be in our right of the challenge that see the strain on your brain is making you Like anemic. It's all the iron that you need to think very complicated So you wouldn't understand man. mean, I wouldn't understand.

You wouldn't understand. Leave it to us, men. Go get in a tepid bath, eat some aloe, or mercury. No, we don't know the difference. If you think rhino-aloe is a reagent. Wear some flannel underwear. I'll be over later to briskly rub you with a coarse towel. It'll be okay.

Here's your malt liquor and your laxative. Just go home and stop. Stop studying math. We know you don't get it anyway. Here's your hurricane and the X-lax. Please enjoy yourself. Okay. So there were thought to be actually out breaks of this,

what they sometimes would refer to as a special women's enemia, which at least it's special already. Like, thanks, guys. You're going to give us an enemia and it's special. And you may have all your own like special lady enemia. Convis is the envy you whenever you want. Thanks. But they thought there were outbreaks of it in boarding schools.

And so that was, that was often what they would just recommend is like, oh no, we've had another outbreak of green sickness And this just happens when you get all these girls together. So just tell them all to quit school and What was the other drink Barley wine? Yeah, barley water and wine and take a nice bath just relax ladies. Yeah, and just like you know stop wearing Stop learning. That's the key thing. We finally, by the late 1800s, we start to tie the symptoms of what we call green sickness for the most part to anemia. Like I said, not every woman who was ever diagnosed with green sickness was anemic.

I've compared it to hysteria several times and that hysteria was a fake disease. It wasn't a real thing. It encompassed probably a lot of different medical issues. And I think green sickness also was different things, although the majority of cases, I think it would be fair to argue that they were probably related to anemia. And we figure that out in the late 1800s. It isn't until 1936 that we finally identify for sure.

Like green sickness is not a thing, take that out of the medical books, like the term is disregarded at this point. And we start to call patients with this disorder, iron deficiency inemia, and that's also when we, it kind of stops being like a woman's disease. Right. Because I mean, anybody can be iron deficient.

Does it, is it new? This is slightly autophobic, but is it nutritional? Iron deficiency. Yeah. It depends. It could be, and certainly we do supplement people with iron. It could be due to blood loss, actually. Like slow chronic blood loss. Got a whole sum of you doing that.

You don't have enough, you're not replacing those stores enough, fast enough because you're, well, I mean, you have a whole, you have a whole, you're leaking. No, you probably know, hopefully you would notice that. It's usually lost through the GI track. Or in women periods can be a source of this kind of anemia, certainly.

But men can bleed too. Like, is that, did I need to say that? Men can bleed too. No, men can bleed, I need to say that? Men can bleed too. No, men can bleed. We're not animals up here. We're not iron giants. We still cry at the movie, Iron Giant. What do you know from us?

So, but nutritional could be a problem too. It's, you know, usually there are storage or production or a loss problem when it comes to anemia, but, but we figure that out and then we can once we know that you're anemic, we can, which we can do through a blood test, right? That's how I, you know, like I said in the beginning, I can look for certain signs, like I can look at your palms or like, um, at your conjunctiva, kind of like the interlining of your eyelids. Like I can look at the inside there and see how's it looking? Their palm wise yours are fine nice nice and nice and rosy.

Thanks. Your rosy palms. My rosy palms. You don't have to be too rosy palms and you have liver disease. It's a whole other episode. Now I'll keep an eye on that though. If you're okay, I'm just kind of obsessively kind of check them. Well, either that or you're pregnant.

I mean, I'm gonna go with the prior probably, but either way. Now we don't have this. The idea of green sickness, of course, that's not a thing. And it just like hysteria, it is a, it is a, it was wrong, it's not a disease process. We just do a blood test if you're, if we think you're anemic and then, we don't give people blood just because they're anemic.

You have to meet certain thresholds, so if you're just a little low, chances are we're not going to, you know, I mean, they're accepting, but for the most part, I'm just going to replace your blood. Are you, I mean, the rectify the situation. Yes, give you tools to help your body replace the blood on its own. It is usually the goal. I mean, depending on what the cause is. But we don't diagnose green sickness anymore, but it's a legacy lives on. Anybody who reads Shakespeare has probably come across green ladies here and there. I was so sad whenever we say goodbye to disease for a record of a disease. You know what?

As a woman, and usually since these are diseases that were used to like, you know, keep women in like a submissive position, like, like, to use it to oppress us further, I'm kind of okay with saying goodbye to these diseases. Well, agree, as I say, to disagree. Am I using that right? No. Well, I mean, you're just wrong in this situation. That's fine. So that's going to do it for us talking about green sickness.

We'll miss you, green sickness. Sorry that you weren't real. Okay, no, we won't miss you, green sickness. Bye, green sickness. One of the main treatments for green sickness was to tell ladies to just go get laid. It's your drop in a problem. It was like a reverse. It was like a reverse at New School's special.

It's just like an endless series of women dropping out of school and having burmarels. Your problem, young lady, is that you cannot, you will be sick and incomplete until you quit school and get a husband. Yeah, and that's until then you're going to have your green sickness. Yeah. So, that's not then you're gonna have your green thickness. Yeah, so that's not true Stop that Want to say big thanks to Max Fun Network for having us as part of their family and Max Fun fun.org Find a ton of great shows including a member of the mother may which advice show that I do with my brothers and it's it's fun

We want to think the taxpayers for these're talking medicines is the intro and outro for our program. And I think that's gonna do it first. Until the next time we have a talk with, to talk with you all about, my name is Justin McElroy. I'm Sydney McElroy. And as always, don't drill a hole in your head. Alright!

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