Sawbones: A Marital Tour of Misguided Medicine - Sawbones: Pineapple

Episode Date: October 10, 2023

There is a claim on the internet that when you eat pineapple, it eats you back. This is actually true! Or more accurately, pineapple contains an enzyme that breaks down tissue. Dr. Sydnee and Justin dive into exactly how this works, as well as the fundamental question: what is an enzyme?Music: "Medicines" by The Taxpayers https://taxpayers.bandcamp.com/

Saw bones is a show about medical history, and nothing the hosts say should be taken as medical advice or opinion. It's for fun. Can't you just have fun for an hour and not try to diagnose your mystery boil? We think you've earned it. Just sit back, relax, and enjoy a moment of distraction from that weird growth. You're worth it. that weird growth. You're worth it. Alright, time is about to books. One, a metal tour of Miskite and Medicine. I'm a co-host, Justin McAroy. And I'm Sydney McAroy. And you know, we get great ideas from everywhere for Saul Bones.

But this one came from the most unlikely places. Yeah, can I say though, we do get great ideas from everywhere because a lot comes from either my work Or just the media or like pop culture just stuff we're talking about Most typically come from you wonderful listeners. I just shout out to everybody who consistently And you didn't mention the Jamie well you too I just mean most of our ideas these days come from you all and and I really appreciate it And I just want to say thank you that you didn't provide this one, so you don't get credit for this one. But typically, it's from all of the emails that I am the one who reads, not Justin, but

I do tell them, tell them about them. This idea came from one Charlie Mac or boy. That's true. That's right. I was at a loss as to what to talk about this week. I mean, Charlie stepped up. She did. That's right. I was at a loss as to what to talk about this week. Charlie stepped up. She did.

And she said that she saw a YouTube video. Now she has the YouTube that you pay for. Yes. I don't. Yes. How does she get to watch YouTube videos without ads and I don't? Because she's watching YouTube kids. Oh.

They don't do that. Well, on YouTube kids, they like to show her a lot of educational videos. Charlie will frequently recount historical things or science facts or something to us. The radium girls was one. Yeah, she learns a lot. She has crafted an algorithm that is teaching her, which says a lot about her, I think.

A lot of good things about her. Yes. It's like Anna and, if I may, credit to the algorithm too. I want to go ahead and get on in front of that, giving a lot of credit to algorithms and AI. Just so they remember me, it's like a good egg. You know what I mean? When they take over, especially when your profession gets dominated by AI. Yeah, which is just months away.

I would like them to think of me as like a friend, you know what I mean? Like a pal. They're coming for me too. You know, doctors, yeah, they're coming for us too. That explains the robo doc outside of Harmony House I saw. They're, I can't believe the government is paying robots to take care of the homeless population. No, you know what? Actually, I may be the last one standing,

like as actual human doctor, because there's just no money in what I do. Yeah. So there's no interest in that. It's not like for a robot. Robots ain't cheap pounds. No. Absolutely forget to sell you about robots taking over.

So he's got pay for these things. No, we've got robots in the hospital that surveil our patients. We saw a robot at the dang restaurant. Yeah. That restaurant you see there's a bus table. That's a little restaurant. Yeah, that restaurant you see, there's a bus table. Bus table restaurant.

Anyway, she watched a video about pineapples. Yes. About eating pineapples. And specifically, she said, did you know that pineapples, while you're eating pineapples, pineapples are eating you? Yeah, it was a really unhinged way

to start a conversation. Well, I titled this do pineapples EU um, and she said there's some sort of uh, she said protein which she was right in pineapples that eats you Sort of uh, have you ever I was sitting here thinking have I experienced pain after eating pineapples before? Absolutely, absolutely. I mean I get heartburn, but that's with a lot of... No, I feel like a sore achy burn in my mouth. Really?

Yeah, and it's good. I mean, it's remising of that cool time. I ate pineapple a few minutes ago, but... I feel like there's something wrong with me that I don't. I mean, again, but maybe it's just because I'm so like, I know the heartburn is coming, and so I'm in fear of that. And I don't know, like, the mouth sensation. I'm so into chunk out as much fear of that. And I don't know like the mouth sensation. I'm so much you chunk out as much as,

that's what I call it when you need a pineapple. I love pineapple. I don't feel like you chunk out as much as I do that. I love pineapple. But are you going to know? Anyway, I absolutely hall hog if you see a pineapple one of those beautiful, spiny boys

you're going to cut it right in half. And so I ate a bunch of it. I tried the, and I knew this didn't work, but I did it anyway when I was pregnant with Charlie and I was past eights. And I really wanted to go into labor. Do you remember that? You were. I tried the, and I knew this didn't work, but I did it anyway when I was pregnant with Charlie, and I was past eights, and I really wanted to go into labor. Do you remember that? I tried that.

I tried everything they said, like everything, and I knew it wouldn't work, but I did eat a bunch of pineapple, and got heartburn. If you've experienced this pain after eating pineapple, it is from a substance called, I double-check the pronunciation, and I got bromelain,

or bromelain, or bromelain. Apparently, whatever you feel like, just go with it. Yeah, with the spirit. Let it guide you. Bromelain, extract, is a mixture of, it's not just one enzyme actually, it's a couple different enzymes that are in pineapple, that break down proteins.

And so these enzymes that are in pineapple that are in the whole fruit, they break down protein. So are they eating you in a sense or they kind of digesting some proteins in your mouth? Yes, that is probably why you're experiencing that sensation. So are they, I don't know if you would call that eating you, but like, yes, pineapples kind of eat you. And so Charlie suggested this and I was like, well, that's a really interesting little fact.

I don't know if it's a whole episode. And then I started looking into Bromallon and it has a whole medical history all of its own. All right. So we're going to talk about the way that pineapples might eat you. Okay. Okay. And we'll talk a little bit about enzymes too.

Yeah. I would like some clarity on that. Yeah. So sometimes the word bromelain, and I think it's important to know like, so that term isn't an enzyme itself. It's like the word we use for the extract from the pineapple that contains a couple different enzymes and then some other substances too.

And it also has been used to refer to a lot of different, like similar plant enzyme kind of things. Really bromelain, what we're focusing on are these mainly two enzymes you get from a pineapple. And the two enzymes we usually just refer to as the fruit bromelain and the stem bromelain. One comes from the fruit. The stem. The stem.

The stem. Yes. The stem one is the one and we're going to get into some of the commercial uses of this because this has an application. We know all this about this extract because we extract it and use it for this. Most comes from the stem, probably for a very practical reason. Why?

We eat the fruit. Oh, right. So we just have all these stems lying around on the whole extract. Yeah, so if you're gonna, I mean, if you're gonna extract an enzyme from one or the other, I mean, if you're gonna extract an enzyme from one or the other, I mean, you could extract it from the fruit. No problem, but it's yummy.

So I eat the fruit. So you eat the fruit and then you extract it from the stem. We first figured this out by the way back in the 1800s and 1891. There was a Venezuelan chemist who figured out a lot of things. I actually found him as I was trying to dig into like, who was this person? I always try to do that, like, who found this? Vicente Marcano is his name. And he was on a list of like neglected scientists, people that like made a lot of discovery specifically in the field of like chemistry. He analyzed a lot of different like fruit and plant components, you know, to look what's in there and what do they do and how can we apply them and that kind of thing

But he was on a list of scientists who like make these important discoveries and it's specifically Bromeland is considered a pretty important discovery But then don't like you don't ever really hear their name or or know who did it in the first place. Well look at us Pat ourselves back. Oh, we should pat ourselves on the back. Now we're, we're history. We're taking note. We're taking, yeah. We appreciate it. Scientists. Yeah. I think it, well, I think it's important to take off the list. He got on sobones. The world's most popular medical podcast. He's huge. Well, and it's, it's one of those things where I was reading about it. And so in 1891, he had some fermented pineapple and was isolating different substances from it to figure out was in there and found this that there was this enzyme it did not give it the name bromel and that actually came like the following year.

Other chemists were building on the work. You know, that's what scientists do they build on the work of each other. Yeah. And we're repeating and confirming all of these findings and actually named it bromel and and that was. Russell Henry Chitenden who like that. Sorry. One more time we get that name again. That's a good one. Russell Henry Chitenden, who like... That's sorry, one more time, we get that name again. Chitenden. That's a good one. Russell Henry Chitenden. Who is considered one of like the fathers of biochemistry and stuff like that, who like is remembered, I guess, and not by me necessarily, this isn't my specific area of interest. So like there are doctor scientists people

that I immediately recognize. But when it comes to some of the like more laboratory-based scientists, I don't always know. But it seemed to me that like if that is your vibe, you would know this guy and maybe not have heard of the Centai Marcono. So there you go. Anyway, so anyway, they also found these substances, they found that they were enzymes and began to like formalize kind of what is in pineapple, what does it do, what could it be good for, what effects could it have, named it bromelain. And what they figured out is that these enzymes are proteases, meaning that they are the kinds of enzymes that break down pro teams. Okay, enzymes. Let's take a step back so that we can talk about enzymes, because I think if you understand what an enzyme is

and what like, a protease is as opposed to other kinds of enzymes, it would help you understand why it would do certain things, but would absolutely not be applicable for other areas of medicine. Right? Yeah, because honestly said, I'm a little embarrassed to admit, I don't know what an enzyme is. I don't know what an enzyme is. And when I, when I told you that, you looked at me like trying to figure out if I was messing with like, like if I was joking with

you or not, like you looked at me to see if I was serious about not knowing what an enzyme. Honey, I have no idea what an enzyme is. Can I be honest, when you first said that, I had already included a little bit about what an enzyme is in like my show notes, like what I was going to explain. And so I was more thinking, aha, I wonder if I should explain it in more detail. So that was more. Oh, okay. God. Yeah. No. I don't expect you to know what an that was more. Oh, okay, got it. Yeah, no. I don't expect you to know what an enzyme is. I took a lot more science classes than you.

This is fair. Like by necessity. Yeah. That's okay. And I don't expect you to know that you have to camp Dylan's star sign to find the last page of the test move in the year. I never crossed. So it's just different things.

That's a video game. There you go. I know that. Okay, so an enzyme is, it's something that your body naturally makes. So it's just in there. Your body's making lots of them. You've got lots.

You're just full of them. And it's a type of protein that's gonna speed up some kind of chemical reaction. So our bodies are big giant, not giant. There's big... I mean, giants are big giants. Giant spot, the bodies are giants are big giant. We're just big Kim labs.

Yeah. And actually, now that I put it that way, we're small Kim labs because. Weins are big Kim labs. Yeah, like my body is smaller than an average chemistry lab, which is like a whole room at least. Yeah, not a person. Not necessarily smaller than a meth lab.

A meth lab can really just be like a bottle. That is not a lab, it's a person. Not necessarily smaller than a meth lab. A meth lab can really just be like a bottle. That is not a lab, it's a bottle. No, but we say like meth labs, and like you can have like a meth lab in the trunk of your car. That's okay, that's the trunk of the car that's a meth lab. But like no, but like the components that make it the meth lab are some, can be small.

Anyway, my point is, are bodies are chemical? I'm set at certain point, if you can't call it a lab with a straight face, it's not a lab, right? You can't just put it in. I always thought when people said that they had a meth lab,

they found a meth lab in the house, I always assumed like, oh my gosh, they built a whole lab. But it's not necessarily. That's like saying that the windowsill where we're currently trying to get rock candy going is like a candy factory. Exactly.

Or like when we brewed beer in the guest bathroom, we didn't have... Welcome to the ALLs. We had a brewery. We had a bathroom. We had a bathroom with a big, so extremely low gravity. Giant glass.

Possibly tainted and graved in beer. That was supposed to taste like pumpkin. So anyway, inside our body, chemical reactions are constantly happening. This is important. Our body is always at chemical imbalance. We are constantly unbalanced and then unbalanced in a different direction, like going in a different direction.

And that is important because when you finally reach chemical equilibrium, we call that death. Right. So enzymes make these things go. So don't look for perfect. I think is the metaphorical thing here, right? Don't go for perfect. Okay. I like to live my life constantly in balance. Yeah. Not in balance out of balance. Out of balance. That's good. That's like you're gonna fall. Inzimes make these things go. Okay, there are different kinds of enzymes that do different things.

So for instance, an amylase breaks down carbohydrates, a lactase breaks down milk. Lactose, just sugar that is found in milk, that is a dairy, yes. You've probably heard of lactase because lactase is in the supplement lactade. Right, lactase breaks down lactose. If you need lactase because you don't have enough

to help you break down lactose, you take extra lactase in the form. Exactly. Lipease breaks down fats. There's sucrates that breaks down sucrose, which is another kind of sugar you can find it in like fruits and veggies. You get that ace thing on the end, you're seeing that theme.

And it tells you from the front part of the word, the first part, what it breaks down. So a protease, which is what we're talking about, these enzymes that are in brumelin are, they break down proteins. Exactly. And it's important to understand that. So like your body needs all of these enzymes, they're breaking down all these things. And a lot of this has to do with digestion that I'm focusing on. Are these enzymes alive? Are they chemical? They're a protein.

Okay. Yeah. But you're full of enzymes. What I just named were a bunch of digestive enzymes. Are proteins cells? Are proteins no? I mean, what is a protein then? What is a protein?

Yeah. Come on. I'm trying to get it down to the basic building blocks. Like a collection of amino acids. Okay, got it. Okay, does that make more sense? I mean, I could go another way or down, but I'm just trying to- They're proteins in cells.

Amino acids are the basic building blocks of life. Some of those form into proteins. Yes. Some proteins are enzymes, but not all proteins are enzymes. There you go. There you go. And like I said, I'm giving you examples of enzymes that are from digestion, because that's sort of like the world we're in right now. There are enzymes that catalyze, meaning make happen, all kinds of reactions in your body,

all over all the time. Inzymes are constantly doing things. And enzymes are helpful targets for us to know about in medicine if we need to speed up or stop certain things. Inzymes are a good target to do that. Right. So, anyway, for instance, there is a class of HIV medication called a protease inhibitor. Does inhibitor hit its... It is a breakdown of protein.

Yes, an enzyme that breaks down proteins. Yeah. Okay. So, we naturally make enzymes in our body. They do different things. And it's important to know that a protease, which breaks down, helps catalyze the breakdown of proteins, like that's how it makes the reactions that breakdown proteins happen.

Could it break down other things that aren't proteins? A lot of the basis of some of the pseudoscience that developed around, I mean, not just bromelom, but a lot of different enzymes really, has to do with this idea that if something can break down protein, it probably can break down fat, right? Yes. No.

No, that's a different enzyme. We have those. That's not what this is. It's a light paste. Yes. So, even though that doesn't really make chemical sense, it doesn't stop people from marketing it that way. So we figured out that what Bromland is, you get it from Pineapples, here's what it can do.

It's got these enzymes in it. And it wasn't long before. It really, I mean, by the mid-1900s, that people started saying, well, what else could this stuff do? So I want to talk about all the different medical, I don't want to say, applications, theoretical applications. But first, we've got to go to the billing department.

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So, I said, what are people using this, this, uh, protein for? Bromellan was one of the, because, because I think pineapple itself had been used in different like medical traditions, like folk medical traditions. So not necessarily what we think of as like evidence-based, you know, medicine. Because it was already used in those ways, I think once we started isolating these active substances, we have these enzymes that do something from pineapples. It was really easy to start seeing like, well, no wonder in this traditional use, you know, pineapples in this part of Central America have always been

thought to be, you know, good for digestion. Oh, it must be because of this. I mean, that's really how these things start to build. You start to assume that there's a causation where there might just be a correlation. Makes sense. Weight loss was one of the first things that it was thought, bromelain, I think by modern marketers, would be helpful for. In traditional focus, pineapples were not necessarily for weight loss, even though I would say that switch now. That was really the way it was built. And I think it's hard, weight loss is one of those areas where I feel like everything that has ever been marketed as a supplement,

they've also said weight loss at some point, right? I mean, it's just like people lie about what works for weight loss constantly and pray upon people. So the claims were based on the idea and they used to be like a popular misconception. Pineapple has stuff in it that can break down fat. Yes. That was the thought. It doesn't, but that's what people thought. So if you take this supplement from pineapple

It can burn. I mean, they used to say like 900 grams of fat Was what how one marbles? Yeah, how one supplement was marketed and This spilled over the idea of pineapple itself. So have you ever heard somebody tell you like if you want to lose weight Eat a piece of pineapple every day. Yeah, more grapefruit but yeah, for sure. Yeah, well, and again, a lot of different fruits have, so pineapple isn't the only thing that has an enzyme like this. Like there are other fruits like kiwi and papaya that have similar enzymes.

And so you see this kind of spill out to other fruits too. If you eat this fruit, it has the special enzyme. It'll burn on your fat instantly. So just eat this fruit all day. And you know, part of what makes these things kind of stick is that also if you eat nothing but fruit all day, you'll probably get diarrhea. Yes. And that might dehydrate you. Yes. Which may actually cause the number on the scale to go down a little bit. This is not healthy. No. This is not anything anyone would recommend. No.

In fact, if somebody tells me, and it's usually fruit juice, that they're drinking a ton of fruit juice, my first concern is you're probably going to get diarrhea. You're going to get super diarrhea. Yeah, you should not do that. But that's, this is where this idea that pineapple is good for weight loss. This is where this comes from. It's because it contained the enzyme.

It gives you the squirts. No, no, I'm not saying that the enzyme does. I'm not even saying pineapple necessarily gives you the squirts. I mean, it might. I don't know. Well, I've never heard you say that. I would say that there is probably a giant list of foods

we could generate right now that would be under the category. If you eat enough, this will give you the squirts. Right? Yeah. Like there's a lot of things. Let's start here. All food makes you poop by definition. So in terms of weight loss, the thought was really based on a misconception. So there was no like study done that said like we gave a bunch of people Bromelon, or we gave a bunch of people pineapple, and they lost weight. And so we think,

and so now we're marketing this supplement. Yeah, we just feel like this probably makes sense. And so we're gonna market it, and since, and you can, by the way, if you Google Bromelon, the first thing that comes up is a bunch of supplements that are still for sale, that are still on the market. This has not gone away. And now I'm gonna go through,

they will tell you it's for other things too, but weight loss is still one of the things that they will tell you you can take the supplement for and that is based on nothing. It's actually based on a misunderstanding of what the enzyme fundamentally does. It is, I will say that there are some actual outside of some of these other medical applications

I'm gonna break down. It is extracted and used for cosmetics. Like you'll find it in some, the idea being that it can break down and remove dead skin cells. So you'll find it in some like facial creams and things like that. It is also used as a meat tenderizer. This makes sense.

It breaks down protein. And meat's protein. There you go. And I started to wonder, like if you think about cooking like ham and pineapple together, I wonder if that's where. That's a common, that's not uncommon. You're discussing pizza.

Why do chicken and pineapple? But still, it's like it's a meat.uncommon. You're discussing pizza. It's similar. Why do chicken and pineapple? But still, it's like it's a meat. Well, but if you start thinking about like putting pineapple with meat makes sense, not only like, I think it's delicious, but also it would tenderize like the enzymes and pineapple do tenderize meat. They do. And we can extract this compound and it is sold as a meat tenderizer and used commercially

to tenderize meat. So it really does do these things. So this is why the discovery of Brahman actually led to real, real deal, real life commercial applications. However, in addition to investigating it for weight loss, a lot of alternative medicine has tried to find other things it could do. And this again is not unique to just this enzyme. There are lots of things that are sold as enzymes out there as supplements.

You will find lots of different, like, naturally derived or synthetically replicated enzymes out there that they will tell you you need to take for various things. When it comes to bromelain, there have been claims that it will help with osteoarthritis, with heart disease, with asthma. Sinus infections is a huge area of the thought being that it reduces swelling in your sinus cavity and in your nasal passages. So we'll reduce some of the inflammation in the symptoms associated. The idea that it can help with autoimmune disease has been floated, cancer, and obviously

the worst of all these things, diarrhea. Yeah, serious problem. That's what you really don't want to evolve this list that I just said, you know, diarrhea is the worst. And like a lot of supplements, it has very limited research. Like if you go through all of these claims, and a lot of people have, a lot of people have gone through piece by piece to evaluate like the different claims. If there is any research and sometimes there's none, sometimes it's like kind of like I said about the weight loss.

Well, it's got an enzyme. That sounds complicated. Maybe that breaks down fat. Go for it. Take it. Yeah. That's, I mean, that's really like the basis for some stuff. Other stuff, there is somebody tried to do some research at some point. Yeah. For the most part, they're either in vitro studies, meaning we put some cells in a petri dish and get and put some brawmolin in there and we observe this effect. Right. So that is interesting, but doesn't necessarily mean that it will do anything in your human body. So those are where research, that's where you begin to look for answers to questions, but that is never where you end your search for answers to questions.

Same thing, there are a couple where you'll find some like mouse models for a couple of these things. You know, does this do something in a mouse? Again, that doesn't mean it works in a human. Right. That's so much smaller than us and love cheese. That's, there are other differences between us and mice. But, because I also love cheese.

That's true. Yeah, so anyway, the point is, there aren't any huge robust studies for any of these things. I'm going to get into like, there is, there are a couple human studies that have actually been done. But when we talk about like, if we know a medicine works or not, it's based on a ton of research that started in a lab, started in a petri dish, moved onto animals, moved onto humans, was rigorously, you know, what we call double blinded, meaning the patients don't know what they're taking,

the doctors don't know who's getting what, randomized, controlled, make sure that your different study groups are the same and that there's not other confounders, and large enough to eliminate the possibility of coincidence. Cause stuff just random, like sometimes things just happen. Better, yeah. And if you have enough people that you're testing it in,

you should be able to eliminate the likelihood that that's why you're seeing that. But if you don't, then it's nothing more than, huh, that's interesting. More research is needed. That's the conclusion for all that. So I even found one that was trying to claim that it would probably have the ability to fight COVID,

which I feel like is gonna be the new, like this is now the trifecta. You find that when it comes to something that has no real basis in evidence that it does anything, people will claim that it does weight loss. That's like a big one, because that's very profitable. People will claim the cancer thing. Because they're butt heads. Yes, which is just the worst, but like people jump to it. Sure. And I think it's also because, again, you're praying on people who are really desperate,

because we know that there are a lot of stuff in cancer that we don't have the cure for. Of course, yeah. Not all cancers, but there are lots of cases we do. And so there's an opportunity to really exploit people. And so throw it at cancer. And then I feel like COVID is now the big, that's the big three right now. Now I'm assuming this is because of when we live.

Yeah. I hope that that will end at some point. But a lot of people just start throwing these supplements at COVID, like, well, I don't know, we don't understand this. It's like, well, no, they're scientists actually studying and seeking to understand it. We don't need to throw every weird fruit enzyme at it that we've got.

So anyway, none of that has really held up with any evidence. I mean, even the COVID stuff was sort of based on like theory. And again, like, we put it on some cells in addition. I don't know, seemed good. One of the human studies I found for this, I kind of wanted to break it down. So when I talk about like why a human study was underwhelming, I feel like it's helpful for me to give an example.

Yeah, please. So I found a study that looked at us, it's effectiveness on osteoarthritis of the knee. Osteoarthritis is what we kind of think of as like wear and tear arthritis. Like the arthritis that you get from, you know, it can be from just over use of a joint or depending on what your career was,

what your job was, what your sports you play, that kind of thing, right? Like type two diabetes, right? You get it later in life from lifestyle stuff? Is it the same thing? No, well, actually, no. Type 2 diabetes is highly genetic. But type 1, okay.

All right, that answers. But, I mean, age of onset, you're right. Type 2, people get later in life. And type 1, you tend to get younger, generally speaking. But type 2 is not, I think that's, well, I'm glad you said it, because it's always important when somebody says, like, will you eat so much sugar you're going to get diabetes? That's not really a thing.

Oh, really? No. Oh, good to know. No, that's not. It's not going to give you diabetes. There are other reasons to balance your diet and not only eat sugar. I'm not endorsing the sole consumption of sugar. Whatever.

I'm already partying it, really. But not for that reason. Anyway, so there was a study they did on arthritis of the knee. They had patients come in who were like my knee hurt. And they had about a hundred patients. They gave half of them an enzymatic supplement. So it was a supplemental pill that contained Braumelin as well as other enzymes, not just Braumelin.

And the other half of the patients, they gave something called Diclofenac, which is a prescription strength anti-inflammatory. It's similar to like ibuprofen or naproxen, but it's stronger in this country anyway. It's a prescription medication. I bet that one would definitely work better. So they compared the two groups after six weeks, they brought them back in and were like, so how's the knee?

And what their conclusions were, were like, it worked the same. Basically everybody was pretty great. Everybody's knee pain was better, not everybody, but the majority of patients responded. And they responded at the same rate. So what we can conclude is that this unregulated dietary supplement made up of a bunch of fruit enzymes

works just as well as a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory medication that has been rigorously studied and whatever. And the problem is like, I think one, that's a tiny amount of patients, too. There was no placebo. Everybody got something. Unless you include the enzyme as a placebo. There was no control group really.

There was no placebo group. You need that. You would need a lot more people was no control group really. There was no placebo group. You need that. You would need a lot more people to have this mean anything. And I also have an issue with the fact that if you've got something like chronic arthritis, it's something that you, because we can't cure it or fix it other than like replacing your knee. You learn to kind of live with it and manage it on your own. And you have good days and bad days.

And there are lots of things in your life that will exacerbate or help calm that condition. And so to ask people six weeks later about the pain is a wild. It's like maybe they've adapted to it more so they don't notice it is prominent. Or they're just having a good day. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Like before my dad got his knees replaced, they were both completely degenerated. I mean, he had knee pain all the time, but he still had days where he felt better

and days where he felt worse. And things he could do in his life that made it better and things he could do that would make it worse. I take pineapple supplements. None of that was really taken into consideration. So when I say like, it's a study that's like, well, okay, but that's fine.

You saw that. All that should do is make you want to do a real study. Yes. It wouldn't answer any questions. You can't conclude that this works as well as dieclothinac from this. Makes sense. So I take issue with that. There is one medical application that it does work for. Okay. This has been approved for use. This has actually been studied. First in the EU, it was approved something called nexobrid, which is basically it's a topical meaning

you put it on the skin application of enzymes, including bromelain, that can help debris, which means remove, get rid of, dead tissue from burns. So it has been used there, it was developed by a company, MediWooned, and used for burn patients. Yes, and in December of last year, it was approved for you in the United States as well.

So it's pretty new here. Anna Collace, gel is the name that it's used. So you see that ace at the end. You see that ace, that means it's an enzyme. It's breaking stuff down. And you can use it on deep partial thickness or full thickness burns. It should only be used in burn centers.

This is not something you're gonna buy over the counter and put on a burn you got while you were cooking. This is because you also have to put like other appointment on the surrounding skin like paraffin or something so that it doesn't break down all the skin around it. So you just want it to break down the burned area. So it can be used to breed or get rid of some of the burnt tissue, which is part of burned

care. You've got to get rid of the dead tissue. It eats the burn ins, it eats the crispy bits and then leaves the good flesh. There you go. There you go. It's kind of like maggots, except not as gross. Oh man. Which maggots can eat dead tissue and can be used in medicine,

as long as you get the right kind of maggots and their sterile maggots. So don't, again, just like you can't buy this stuff over the counter and slap it on your, you know, brunette. Just go harvest in maggots. Don't go grab in maggots and put them on a wound. You might get the wrong kind. And don't go chase them waterfalls as long as we're at it, just giving them a good advice.

So there is, so there is like a real deal medical use for this that has been studied and is approved by regulatory agencies that look at drugs and say, do they do what they say they do and do they hurt people? And no, this does what it says it doesn't. Yeah, there's some side effects, but it is as good as other things that we use to debris wounds or to bring to it. I'm sorry, to debris burns. But does it help with anything else? Like weight loss. No, there's no evidence that supports any of this other stuff. The sinus infection claims certainly COVID cancer or heart disease. There's just nothing. There's no robust evidence that would support any of it. So when you see

these supplements that you can buy over the counter, it's another one of those situations that we talk about a lot where like your best case scenario is you're wasting your money. That's the best case scenario. And it's the same with like taking eating pineapple every day. I mean, if you like pineapple, I think that that's good for you. Yeah, go for it. But it's not going to, it's not like you need to from a health perspective. Obviously, the other question is, are these supplements dangerous? Is bromelain dangerous? Well, if you're allergic to pineapple, it definitely is.

Good note. So, please don't take a pineapple supplement if you're allergic to pineapple. I think you know that, though. And it can interact with some medications, like a lot of these unregulated, herbal, natural, organic, whatever word they want to use supplements that are out there. Just because they don't actually do the thing they tell you they're going to do. They don't do nothing. Yeah, some of them do stuff.

And they can interact with the way that your body metabolizes some other medicines you may be on. So without going into detail, my caveat with any of these is if you really want to take one, and I'm telling you, I don't believe you should because it doesn't do anything, you really need to talk to your healthcare provider first so that you can go over your specific medical conditions, your allergies and what other medicines you may be taking, because all of this stuff can interfere with other medicines you may be taking because all of this stuff can interfere with other medicines you may be taking.

Yep. And you need to know that and so that you can go and inform generally it's not very toxic. It's just it's again, it doesn't pineapple is delicious. I love it. It's not long on a pizza, obviously. It absolutely belong. It belongs on here at Lumpkin. I tell you the best pizza.

Can I tell him my pizza recipe before we go? Yeah, please tell him your and sorry, I forgot you forgot the air quotes or perhaps my at least care quotes when you said pizza but go on. This is what I order on a pizza if it's just for me. I like a thin crispy crust. I like a lot of sauce. Yeah, I read sauce. Extra sauce. Extra sauce. No cheese. Don't and I hope I didn't have it lost to you yet. No cheese. They're already leaving the room.

I love cheese, just not on pizza. It's not where I want it. I want to just eat a bucket of cheese. Green peppers. Red onions, if they have them, I'll take regular. I'll take like yellow or white or whatever, but red if they have them. Grill chicken and pineapple.

All right, mine. And then if you've got some like, if it's chicken and pineapple. All right, my. And then if you've got, if you've got some like, if it's a place that does fresh basil, yum. If it's a place that will add some oregano, yum. And if a little bit of red pepper flakes could make their way on there, that would be perfect. Our daughter's eat, Charlie eats no toppings, just she's, Cooper eats no toppings, just sauce.

I live in a pizza, pizza criminal house. I live in a house of pizza kernels, please send help. Whoever you used to get El Chapo, just send them to my house, please, and save me from this, this pizza prison, that I find myself in. Thank you so much for listening to our show.

Thank you, Charlie, for this recommendation. She doesn't listen to our show, but I'm gonna tell her that I thanked her on our show for asking if pineapples eat you, because it turns out that come a little like sort of they eat you. Thanks to taxpayers, Feethasers' song Medicines is the intro

and outro program and thanks to you. For listening. Appreciate it. Until next time, my name's Justin McRoy. I'm Sydney McRoy. And as always, don't drill a hole in your head. Alright! Maximum Fun A work-road network of artist-owned shows supported directly by you.

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