Scamfluencers - Frédéric Bourdin: No Country For Old Men

Episode Date: January 20, 2025

In 1997 Beverly Dollarhide hears miraculous news: her missing son, Nicholas, has been found in Spain. But the person she thinks is her teenage son is actually a grown man, a well known French identity scammer named Frederic Bourdin. And, after Frederic is brought back to the United States to be with his pretend family, the mystery of the real Nicholas Barclay’s disappearance grows deeper.Be the first to know about Wondery’s newest podcasts, curated recommendations, and more! Sign up now at https://wondery.fm/wonderynewsletterListen to Scamfluencers on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen early and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/scamfluencers/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to scamfluencers early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or Apple podcasts. A listener note, the following episode contains depictions of drug use and self-harm, and mention of suicide. Please listen with care. Sachi, are people ever shocked by your age, and do they think you're older than you are or younger? I feel like they probably think you're younger.

Good save. Uh, it's funny you ask because the other day a man told me that he thought I was 26 and I laughed in his face. I mean, hey, that's awesome. I'll take it. Honestly, I did ask you this to brag a little because everyone thinks I'm a little baby. But I do think it's probably really hard to lie about age now that everyone's so online versus back when no one had to know if it was your birthday.

Yeah, I guess I've never thought about that. But yeah, it's really hard to lie about your age now. Yeah, like I get maybe shaving off a year or two to seem slightly more youthful. But I'm gonna tell you today about someone who was so brazen when it came to lying about their age, they never had to grow up. -♪

-"Can a crew please be seated?" It's mid-October, 1997, and a plane is getting ready to land at the San Antonio airport. One of its passengers, Frederic Bourdon, stares anxiously out of the window. It's hot in Texas this time of year, but you wouldn't know it from his outfit. He's wearing a thick jacket, gloves, and a scarf that covers the bottom half of his face. His eyes are hidden behind big sunglasses

and a hat covers his head. Frederique is flying from Spain and has felt nervous the entire flight. And now, as people start to disembark, he's downright panicked. The woman sitting next to him, Carrie Gibson, reaches over and squeezes his hand. She promises there's nothing to worry about.

Everyone is excited to see him. Three and a half years ago, Carrie's teen brother, Nicholas Barclay, went missing from his neighborhood in rural Texas. Carrie and the rest of her family spent the last few years worried they'd never see him again. But a few days ago, they got incredible news. Nicolas was found safe in Spain. The whole family has gathered at the airport for a reunion with a now 16-year-old boy. But Nicolas isn't coming home. Because Frédéric is pretending to be Nicolas. He's actually a 23-year-old French man who just lied his way into the country by stealing

the identity of a missing child. He was able to convince European authorities easily enough, but now Frederick will have to face the boy's entire family. When he walks into the airport, a large group is waiting to welcome him. Frederick recognizes one woman from the photos he studied, Beverly Dollarhide. Beverly is in her late 40s, and she's Nicholas's mother. As she walks towards him, Frederick takes a deep breath. He's sure that once Beverly sees him up close, he's gonna get deported, or worse, imprisoned. But to Frederick's surprise,

Beverly pulls him into a hug and squeezes him tightly. She tells him she's happy to have him home. What an evil thing to do to this woman. I'm locked in, I'm terrified. Well, Frédéric Bourdon has spent most of his life pretending to be other people. But this is a new low even for him, manipulating a grieving family who's desperate

to have their son back and taking his place in their home. Frederick thought he'd be exposed the moment he met Beverly, but for some reason, this family seems to believe him. While he wonders why they seem so invested in an obvious lie, he'll have to really commit to impersonating Nicholas to stay out of jail.

It's only a matter of time before the truth comes out, but whose truth is another question entirely? Choose to join the world every morning with Up First, a podcast that hands you everything going on across the globe and down the street, all in 15 minutes or less. Start your day informed and anew with Up First by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts. The Grinch is back again to ruin your Christmas season with Tis the Grinch Holiday Podcast. Listen as his celebrity guests try to persuade the Grinch that there's more to love about the holiday season. Follow Tis the Grinch Holiday Podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Grown-ups, enjoy bonus content of Tis the Grinch Holiday Podcast

exclusively on Wondery+. From Wondery, I'm Sarah Haggi. And I'm Saatchi Cole. And this is Scamfluencers. scamfluencers. Frédéric Bourdon has taken on hundreds of fake identities in his many years as a professional imposter.

But when he steps into the life of Nicolas Barclay, he'll have to pretend to be a real life missing child. But a fake son isn't the only thing that feels off in Nicholas Barclay's home. The more Frederic settles into Nicholas's world,

the more he suspects he's not the only one hiding something. He starts to wonder what could have happened to the real Nicholas Barclay, and realizes that his own crimes may have gotten him involved in something much bigger and much darker than he could have ever imagined. This is Frederic Bourdain, No Country for Old Men. Before we dive into Frederic's many false identities,

let's start with who he really is. Frederic is born in Paris in 1974. His mother is only 18 years old and struggling to make ends meet. Frédéric never meets his father. He just knows he's an Algerian man who's married to another woman. Frédéric's family thinks his mom is more focused

on drinking and dancing than raising a child. So when Frédéric is only two, child services places him in his grandparents' custody. But his grandparents live in rural France and and as a half-Algerian kid being raised by white grandparents wearing thrifted clothes at a time before that was cool, it's impossible to blend in. From a young age, Frederic feels like he just doesn't belong. He's desperate for love and acceptance.

So he copes the way many little kids do, by making up tall tales. He starts telling his classmates that his dad isn't around because he's actually a secret agent. A very common childhood lie from what I gather. Yeah. I don't think I ever really lied about anything my parents did for a living, but I did invent fascinating backstories for them.

Yeah, I mean, I lied about my sister getting free Pokemon cards when she worked at Walmart, and that fell through very fast, as you know. Well, unlike us, Frederic has a natural talent for lying. Once he realizes that his lies sound better than the truth, and that people are willing to believe him, his lies get bigger and more outlandish. He acts out in other ways too, like stealing from his neighbors. Frederic's grandparents can't deal with a misbehaving teen.

So when he turns 12, they send him to live in a juvenile facility where his penchant for lying and drama only grows. He starts roaming the streets pretending to be lost, and he fakes amnesia to get attention and sympathy from strangers. He realizes that people will go out of their way to help a child in need and shower him with the attention

he's craved his entire childhood. About four years later, when Frederique is 16, the juvenile center gets fed up with his antics and they move him into another group home. At this point, Frederique has spent his entire life being displaced at the whims of others. So now, he decides it's time to take control. By running away. Frederic hitchhikes 200 miles to Paris, but once he gets there, he's scared, alone,

and broke in a big city. He could go back to his group home, but he doesn't want to return to his old life. So instead, he decides to lie his way into a new one. Frederique walks up to a Parisian police officer and pretends to be a lost 14-year-old British boy. He's hoping that the police will be sympathetic and send him home to England,

where he can start a brand new life for himself. Unfortunately, there's one massive problem with his plan. Frederic barely speaks English. The police can tell he's lying, and they send him back to the youth home. Not a great plan, but I do have sympathy for him not wanting to be in a group home. It's terrible. Of course, it's very understandable.

But Frederick isn't discouraged. He decides that playing a British kid was too ambitious. He needs to pick more convincing characters. So once again, he runs away from the group home and hitchhikes to a new city. Once he gets there, he pretends to be lost and sick and is admitted to a children's hospital. But instead of faking amnesia,

this time he pretends to be mute. He communicates by writing and gives the hospital a fake name. He says that all he wants is an education and a loving home. But he runs away after a few months when the doctors start to dig into his past. These are like soap opera plots. Yeah. These are not well thought out plans even for a teenager.

No. And in June of 1992, Frederic turns 18. And as a legal adult, he's set free from the foster care system and is able to do whatever he wants. The problem is, Frederic doesn't want to be an adult. So he decides he doesn't have to be. He'll keep pretending to be fictional children to get sympathy and shelter. Over time, Frederick fine-tunes his routine.

First, he goes to a phone box and calls a police pretending to be a tourist who just found a lost child. He almost always pretends to be 14. It's young enough that people want to help him, but not so young that he won't be believed. Then, when the police show up, Frederic pretends to be the lost child. He's pretty convincing.

He has a small build, and he softens his voice to sound younger. Inevitably, he gets taken in by an orphanage or shelter. And the minute people get suspicious, he skips town for some other European city and starts over. Here he is, years later, talking to 60 Minutes Australia about running this con. I've been more than 500% more than 500. Because you had to imagine that for 15 years, every week, I had to be somewhere else and being someone else.

Hey, this sounds like a terrible way to live. Like, it's not even worth it. You may as well just get a part-time job. It sounds really difficult, especially once you are 18 and don't have to be a part of a care system. Yeah. Like, I understand wanting to escape that as a child, but once you're 18, like, you can do whatever you want.

Mm-hmm. Well, Frederique has found a way to get the attention he craves and the freedom he never had as an actual kid. But when the authorities threaten to put an end to his act, Frédéric will have to stoop to new lows to avoid facing grownup consequences. It's November, 1993, and the now 19-year-old Frédéric is in a town in the southwest of France.

He walks into the middle of the street and just lays down. When the authorities investigate, he refuses to speak. The story of an apparently mute child with amnesia catches the attention of the local newspaper. They publish a few articles about the strange, silent, lost kid. And when Frédéric pulls the con again in a nearby town, they follow up with an exposé about his ruse. This leads to even more coverage by French journalists.

But the press aren't the only ones paying attention. The police are also onto him. He's wanted for lying about his identity to court officials and police officers. But so far, he's been able to slip away before ever facing any real repercussions. At some point, the police do manage to fingerprint him, and Interpol, the world's largest international police organization, opens a file on him which keeps growing as he hops from town to town. You'd think all this attention would make Frederick more careful, but apparently not.

After Interpol catches wind of his scheme, a French TV show invites him on for an interview about his criminal escapades. At this point, Frederick is 21 years old and still pretending to be a lost 14-year-old boy. It would be wild to say yes to an interview like this. I don't see any incentive if he's managing to evade Interpol. Well, the thing is, Frederick kind of wants attention.

In Paris, he sits on stage in front of a live studio audience and goes through a long interview, repeating the same thing he always has, that all he wants is love and a family. And afterwards, he simply walks out a free man. Somehow, even under the media spotlight, Frédéric is able to move on with no firm legal consequences. The interview boosts Frédéric's notoriety in France.

Eventually, he gets a nickname in the press, the Chameleon, and he leaves France behind to travel through over a dozen European countries, including Belgium, Germany, Denmark, and Sweden. But Frederik is about to learn that some places aren't willing to take in a missing child without asking tough questions. And when international authorities demand an explanation, Frederik will tell his biggest lie yet. It's 1997, and years since Frederique appeared on French TV.

He's now in Spain, running his usual routine, claiming to be a lost kid, even though he's 23. By this point, he's pulled his con hundreds of times. He's impersonated missing boys from all over the world and used fake names like Benjamin Kent, Peter Sampson, and my personal favorite, Michelangelo Martini. Oh, well, I love Michelangelo Martini. Just stick with Michelangelo Martini and you will become a star.

No one's ever gonna arrest you for anything. They can't have an inmate Martini. Of the Martini family. Well, Frederic's scam works in Spain, and he's sent to another youth home. But not long after, the Spanish authorities start to catch on. Frederic is sent before a child welfare judge who doesn't believe he's a teenager.

She gives Frederic 24 hours to prove his identity, and if he can't, he'll get fingerprinted and photographed. Frederique's stomach drops. Remember, Interpol already has his fingerprints. He's convinced that once they discover who he really is, he'll go to prison. Frederique pleads with the judge and comes up with a new lie. He's an American boy separated from his family.

He asks for a phone and some privacy so he can call his parents. And he promises that by the next morning, he'll have proof of his identity. So the judge agrees to let him use the shelter's office phone, unsupervised. Is everyone insane? Is anybody paying attention? He has already done television interviews about the scam he is actively pulling.

But what if he's really a child? I think we should be meaner to children. I agree. Well, the minute he's alone, Frederic looks up phone numbers for American police stations and starts calling them. He tells them he's a local Spanish police officer

and he needs help identifying a lost American child. Eventually, he gets patched through to a woman at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. When the woman asks for a description of a lost American boy, Frederick describes himself. Short, with brown hair and a gap between his teeth. The woman says she has a potential match. A boy named Nicholas Barclay,

who went missing from San Antonio three years ago when he was 13 years old. The woman faxes over a photo. Frederick is looking down at a black and white missing poster. He decides that he and Nicholas look enough alike for his plan to work. Frederique tells a woman on the phone that he has good news.

Nicholas Barclay is no longer missing. After years of pretending to be fictitious lost children, Frederique is stooping to a new low, stealing the identity of a real one to avoid facing consequences for his crimes. Extremely evil, very spooky, dark-sided. So evil. Bad, bad, bad, bad.

And to Frederic's surprise, people believe his new lie. He manages to convince shelter employees and Spanish authorities that he is Nicolas Barclay. But what he doesn't expect is what comes next. They start the process of reuniting him with Nicolas's family. To keep his freedom, Frederique will have to pull off his greatest impersonation yet.

The Center for Missing and Exploited Children overnights an envelope to the Spanish shelter filled with everything they know about Nicolas, including a full color photo of him. Frederick intercepts a package and opens it in private. And the second he sees the photo, he freaks out. While Frederick has deep brown eyes and dark brown hair, Nicholas is blonde and blue-eyed. And Nicholas has a tattoo of a cross on his hand.

But it's too late to back out now, so Frederique decides to commit to the act. He has a few days before the big reunion and spends it trying to physically transform himself. He bleaches his hair in the bathroom and asks one of the other kids in the shelter to give him the same tattoo as Nicholas. Sachi, I have a picture of the real Nicholas Barclay

next to Frederique post-transformation. What do you think? This die job is atrocious. His nose is seven, eight times the size of this child's nose. He has the most punchable jaw I've ever seen in my life. This is supposed to be a minor. He looks like he's 37 years old. It is so beyond crazy to me when you see this photo, when you're like,

wait, this guy was pretending to be a kid? Forget comparing him to Nicholas. This is not a child. This is a man. His neck is like a tree stump. You could have a picnic on it. It's mind-blowing how crazy this is. Well, Frederique also studies the file on his new identity, memorizing details about Nicholas and his family. He knows that he needs to explain where Nicholas has been the last few years. Since no one knows what happened to the real Nicholas Barclay, Frederick comes up with a story that he thinks will get him boundless sympathy. He says he was kidnapped from his Texas neighborhood and brought to Europe where he became part

of a child sex trafficking ring. He says that for the last three years he's endured unimaginable abuse and torture, but he finally managed to escape. Sarah, I think there is something especially evil about lying about sexual abuse. That is super evil. So awful for this kid's family, who like best case scenario, they have their kid back, but their child has had immeasurable harm done to them.

No, it's beyond twisted. And that this is an adult man making up this lie is just beyond words. Yeah. Well, after a few days, Frederick is told that Nicholas's half-sister, Carrie, is on her way from Texas to bring him home. Frederick assumes that the moment Carrie sees him,

she'll realize he's an imposter. So he makes a plan. Right before she arrives, he'll bundle up in a scarf and sunglasses to hide as much of his face as possible. When Carey finally arrives, Frederick prepares himself for the worst. But he's about to learn that when people are desperate

and grieving, you're willing to believe almost anything. It's October 1997, and Carey is standing in a courtyard at a children's shelter in Spain. Carrie is 31, twice Nicholas's age, and has two kids of her own. Despite the big age gap, she was always close with her little brother, and she was devastated when he went missing.

In some ways, it felt to Carrie to keep the family together afterward. And that's exactly what she's doing here today. As she stands in the courtyard, she's flooded with anticipation. She's dreamt of this reunion for years. Carrie comes from a sheltered background. Before today, she'd never been on a plane

or even left North America. This whole process has been strange and scary, but it's worth it to finally be reunited with her brother. Finally, she sees Nicholas walking towards her. He's bundled up in a scarf and sunglasses, but she doesn't question it. She simply runs up and pulls him into a hug. Here's Carrie explaining her reaction years later

for the documentary, The Imposter. Just this sense of immense relief, just seeing, touching, kissing, holding him. He wasn't the same Nicholas that disappeared four years before. He had been held and tortured and God knows what else. He wasn't that same person. It makes a lot more sense, too, about why then they didn't know that it wasn't actually their family member.

Because this is someone who's gone through this life experience that would change them. And he looks different, he feels different, he seems different, they're not going to question it. Yeah, you're not going to be like, wait a second, why are you like this? Like you're going to think everything is a trauma response if he had gone through all that, right? Yeah. Well, Carrie tells the Spanish authorities that this is, without a doubt, her brother. They start the process of getting him an American passport and a plane ticket back to the U.S. Carrie is desperate to believe that with Nicholas back, they can start a new chapter. Instead, she's about to bring a brand new set of problems home with

her, including an international investigation with her family in its crosshairs. Hello, ladies and germs, boys and girls. The Grinch is back again to ruin your Christmas season with his The Grinch Holiday Podcast. After last year, he's learned a thing or two about hosting and he's ready to rant against Christmas cheer and roast his celebrity guests like chestnuts on an open fire.

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Spotify or Apple podcasts. Hello, it's Dan Harris from the 10% Happier Podcast. Is the whole new year, new you thing getting a little overwhelming? Wondery's new year, new mindset collection has the essentials to help you have your best year yet and to do it simply and sanely. From 10% happier and daily stoic for personal growth

to unruffled for parenting wisdom, we've got you covered. Boost your creativity with the best idea yet. Get inspired by baby, this is Kiki Palmer, or dive deep with armchair expert. Listen to New Year New Mindset right now on the Wondery app. Deep with arm care expert. Listen to New Year New Mindset right now on the Wondery app. The month after Frederick arrives in Texas, Charlie Parker is sitting in his office in San Antonio.

He's reading up on Nicholas Barclay, the local teen who was abducted in 1994 and just turned up in Spain. Charlie's a 56-year-old private investigator with a slight southern drawl. He recently retired after three decades of selling lumber, and now he's following his true passion, investigating. He even runs a murders club, where members try and sometimes do solve cold cases. Here's a photo. Can you describe him? He looks exactly like Anthony Hopkins if he did a stretch on NCIS.

Oh, totally. I mean, he's wearing suspenders. He's sitting in a diner with a cup of coffee. Like this guy's an investigator. Yeah. Well, a few days earlier, a producer from a national tabloid news show called Hard Copy called Charlie. They'd heard about Nicholas' story and want Charlie to help him track down the boy for

an interview. Charlie's able to find Nicholas and his family. He learns Nicholas is struggling to settle back into his life in Texas, and that he's not the only one having a hard time adjusting. Nicholas's family has never been the most stable, even before his disappearance. His mother, Beverly, raised him while struggling with an addiction to heroin.

She worked hard to stay clean and sober throughout his childhood, but fell back into it after he vanished. Now, even though she's ecstatic that her son is home, she and her family know she's not quite equipped to look after him. Plus, she works a night shift at Dunkin' Donuts seven days a week, so she wouldn't be home

to watch her son in the evenings. So Nicholas goes to stay with Carrie in the trailer where she lives with her husband and two kids who are around Nicholas' age. The FBI has a lot of questions about how a kidnapped boy from rural Texas ended up in Spain. But for now, they're giving him time to settle in. They only ask one thing, that he not talk to the press.

The feds are worried that publicity could jeopardize their investigation. But soon after returning home, Nicholas agrees to multiple TV interviews, including that one with hard copy. The hubris is overwhelming. Like, he doesn't give a shit. It's so crazy. He cannot stop.

And just two weeks after Nicholas arrived in Texas, the hard copy crew arrives at Carrie's trailer. And as the investigator who made it possible, Charlie is invited to watch the interview. Nicholas wears his usual bulky getup, but adds a splash of Texas, including a leather cowboy hat, sunglasses, and a five o'clock shadow. He recounts his story methodically. He was at the basketball court, he called home for a ride but was told to walk home,

and then he was abducted. And then he shares that for the last three years, he was part of a sex trafficking ring with dozens of other missing children. He says his abductors drugged, beat, and even performed experiments on him. And he says he was forbidden from speaking English the entire time, which explains his weird French accent. While Charlie listens to this shocking story, he spots an old photo of Nicholas on a nearby shelf.

Charlie looks back and forth from the picture of Nicholas to the person sitting across the room from him. Here's Charlie describing this moment in the imposter documentary. As I looked at the picture, I noticed that the boy had blue gray looking eyes and this man had brown eyes. He was a moment where the hair stood on the back of your neck and there was just something wrong about it.

Yeah, what's wrong is that this is an adult man pretending to be somebody else who went missing. That's what's wrong. Yeah, is an adult man pretending to be somebody else who went missing. That's what's wrong. Yeah, and it takes one guy to be like, that's not the same person. Just someone's got to look a little harder. Well, Charlie once heard that ears can be used to identify people because they're as unique as fingerprints. So when no one's looking, he slips a photo of the real Nicholas into his pocket.

Later, he compares it to that day's footage of the interview with Nicholas. He confirms his suspicions. The ears aren't a match. This guy is not Nicholas Barclay. When the hard copy segment finally airs, it shares a heartwarming story of a missing boy returned to his family.

But Charlie smells a rat, and he won't rest until he figures out who this Nicholas impersonator really is. Around the same time that hard copy is interviewing Nicholas, FBI agent Nancy Fisher is sitting in a waiting room at the Texas Children's Hospital in Houston. Nancy has brown hair and has a vibe of your most intense math teacher. Though Nicholas's family has welcomed him with open arms,

the FBI still has a ton of questions. Nancy met him shortly after he arrived in Texas to hear his disturbing story. Nicholas recounted some of the most grueling torture she had ever heard of and also the strangest. For example, he said they injected his eyes with different fluids to make them change color, which is why they're now brown instead of blue. Uh, that's nonsense. That is sci-fi nonsense. Why would the kidnappers waste their time doing that?

In what world? Because they are scientists doing experiments. Okay? Fine. Nicholas claims a sex ring he was part of involved dozens of children. And if that's true, Nancy wants him to find the abductors

and to save the children still trapped. But every conversation she's had with Nicholas has gone nowhere. That's why she flew with him to Houston today for an interview with Bruce Perry, a psychiatrist who specializes in working with traumatized children. Through simple conversation,

Bruce can help kids recall more about what they had lived through and uncover buried memories that can be crucial in police investigations. Nancy is hopeful that Bruce's interview with Nicholas will turn up a few leads she can follow. And she's probably also hoping Bruce can put her mind at ease. Nancy recently got a strange call

from private investigator Charlie Parker. Charlie made a shocking claim. He believes an imposter is posing as Nicholas. At first, Nancy mostly dismissed Charlie. She doesn't feel right about questioning Nicholas's family. They've already been through so much and they're convinced this is their son. Plus, no one in the US has ever lied

and claimed to be a missing kid before. And why would they? What Charlie is suggesting seems ludicrous. Then again, Nancy has picked up on some red flags. Like the fact that Nicholas, with his deep set eyes, chin stubble, and dark brown roots, doesn't look like a naturally blonde 16-year-old. Oh, word? What is up with these people? You're like, it's crazy his hair is turning brown as it grows. With frosted tips. Like, it is crazy.

But he thought he was a teenager. Well, finally, Bruce, the psychologist, steps into the waiting room. He asks Nancy if the two can talk privately. Bruce explains that generally, his patients display clear markers of distress when they talk about their traumas, changes in their heart rate, posture,

and even their pupil size. But he doesn't see any of that in Nicholas. And then there's his accent. Nicholas spent his developmental years speaking American English. So it should be coming back now that he's home. There's no logical reason for him to be stuck with a thick European accent.

Bruce tells Nancy that, in his professional opinion, the boy he just talked to has never lived in the US and is likely from France or Spain instead. At the very least, he is certainly not Nicolas. Nancy is shaken. Right away, she calls Kerry to break the news. The person you brought home from Spain, he isn't your brother.

Kerry freaks out, screeching on the phone in confusion and anguish. Nancy warns her that the imposter is likely dangerous and that Carrie shouldn't welcome him back into their home. But once Carrie composes herself, she insists that Nancy hasn't wrong. The boy is her brother. Nancy also calls Nicholas' mother, Beverly,

and is met with the same denial. The family forms a united front, unwilling to entertain the possibility that this boy isn't Nicholas. I have empathy for the family here. What a brutalizing experience and you want to believe, but like, this is an adult man. Yes. And after this, Nancy and Nicholas fly back to San Antonio. And when they arrive at the airport,

Carrie's there waiting to take him home. Nancy feels queasy as she watches Carrie and Nicholas hug. But Nancy and the FBI aren't gonna let this rest. And they aren't the only ones who are getting wise to Frederic's charade. Because he's about to meet the one member of Nicholas's family who does not seem ready to fall for his act.

It's late 1997, about a month after Frederique spoke to the child psychologist in Houston, and he's trying to settle into his new life. He's gotten closer with Nicholas's family and found a comfortable routine. He goes to high school where he's made a few friends. He plays Nintendo with Carrie's son, and they all watch movies together as a family. Frederic worries that the real Nicholas might show up and expose his ruse, but in the meantime, he's finally living the domestic life he's always dreamed of. Except, the family isn't actually his. Frederique later says he starts to feel guilty.

He's used to making up identities, but stealing someone else's feels different. Still, he doesn't feel guilty enough to turn himself in. I don't really think he does feel that guilty. I think he was gonna try to get away with this for as long as he could. I mean, who knows? He's in deep.

I do not know what someone like him could possibly be feeling. But there's one member of the family who Frederique has yet to meet, his half brother, Jason Dollarhide. Jason is 11 years older than Nicholas, and he was living with his brother and their mom at the time of the disappearance.

Last year, Jason checked himself into rehab for a long-time drug problem and finally got clean. He was still living there and working as a counselor when his brother miraculously resurfaced. Frederique thinks it's strange that Jason hadn't already come to see him, and on the day of Jason's visit, he paces the trailer back and forth, nervous to finally meet him. When Jason shows up,

he gives Frederique a hug in front of his family. But the hug itself is stiff, awkward, and brief. Frederique feels like something's off. And as the day winds down, Jason asks Frederique to join him outside for a private chat. He takes out a gold necklace with the crucifix, puts it around Frederique's neck, and tells him, good luck. Then Jason says his goodbyes and leaves.

As Frederique watches Jason go, he has a gut feeling. Jason knows he's not Nicholas. But for some reason, he doesn't want to alert his family, which makes Frederic wonder, does Jason know what happened to the real Nicholas Barclay? Before this day, Frederic worried that the real Nicholas would reappear and expose his fraud. But now he's more worried that the boy is dead and that Jason had something to do with it.

I guess I can see why he would be like, oh, this guy is not behaving like the rest of the family. There must be something up with him. He must know what happened to this kid. But also, I can't trust him because he is pretending to be a child. Yes, but also, you have to remember that this guy thought he would be figured out instantly.

And the fact that he hasn't been and that it's gone this smoothly and weirdly is probably the craziest thing that ever happened to him. So yes, it is a drastic conclusion to jump to, and it's hard to know whether or not Frederique really believes this. But either way, here's what he said in an interview with 60 Minutes Australia two decades later. I knew they knew I wasn't Nicolas. I knew that they were pretending I was Nicolas. I knew it very deeply in my heart and I knew they were pretending that I was pretending

that it was a never-ending game. Over the next few weeks, Frederic's behavior becomes more and more erratic. At one point, he goes into the bathroom at Carrie's house and mutilates his face with a razor. The family is freaked out, but as far as they know, he's struggling to cope with three years of torture, so it makes sense that he would act out. Still, Carrie worries about the safety of her own children, so she sends him to live with their mom, Beverly.

At Beverly's house, Frederique doesn't feel the same warmth he got from Carrie. Instead, she seems suspicious and wary of him. Frederique is sure something is wrong, and he starts to believe that Beverly might have been involved with whatever happened to Nicholas. After all, how could a mother not recognize her own son? Frederique's new reality is turning into a nightmare.

As he starts to wonder about the secrets his new family is keeping, the authorities are getting closer to discovering his scheme. And soon, they'll grow suspicious of the Dollar Heids as well. It's early 1998. Private investigator Charlie Parker is sitting in his car outside of Beverly's

apartment building. He's watching closely as the fake Nicholas leaves the apartment and walks to the bus stop. A few months ago, when Charlie first started suspecting Nicholas was actually an imposter, he went to the San Antonio Police Department, and they immediately wrote him off. Since then, Charlie's become obsessed with proving he's right. He's poured countless hours into interviewing Beverly's neighbors, following the fake Nicholas around,

and telling anyone who will listen about his ear theory. At one point, he even contacted Beverly directly to warn her, but she shut him down. A few days after the call, the fake Nicholas apparently called Charlie and angrily asked, Who do you think you are? I obviously don't trust fake Nicholas, but I feel like I don't fully trust Charlie either. Like he has his own motivations for wanting to be right and being this aggressive with a family that might very well still be in grief. I mean, maybe he's so sure that something is wrong

that he doesn't think this family is grieving. And luckily for Charlie, he does have one person in his corner. FBI agent Nancy has come around to the reality that Nicholas really is an imposter. Charlie feels relieved that the FBI is running a parallel investigation. And Nancy and Charlie have actually started sharing their discoveries with each other. It's a cute dynamic.

A buy-the-books FBI agent and a rogue PI who'll stop at nothing. Charlie's been finding clues by learning everything he can about the real Nicholas and his family. So far, he's discovered that before Nicholas disappeared, he was known as a bit of a troublemaker. He and his mom were always very close, but their dynamic shifted after Jason moved back home. The three of them would often get into explosive fights that resulted in police visits to the house. Charlie also learns that in the months

after Nicholas vanished, Beverly and Jason were at each other's throats constantly, and the police had to step in again when it turned violent. Jason claimed these fights were prompted by the stress Beverly was under after Nicholas's disappearance, which wasn't helped by the fact that she was usually drunk.

Jason's addiction issues also intensified around this time, so between the two of them, the household was volatile. Some family members believed Jason's drug use was spurred by his guilt about his brother's disappearance. He was the one who refused to drive Nicholas home from the basketball court. If he picks Jason up, then maybe his brother wouldn't have vanished.

Charlie tracks down one final breakthrough. Three months after Nicholas went missing, Jason called the police station with some exciting news. He'd spotted Nicholas trying to break into the garage, but he ran off. The police swept the area, but they didn't find any signs of Nicholas. And Charlie now fears that something dark happened. His new theory is that Jason lied about seeing Nicholas to cover his own tracks

and make the police believe Nicholas had simply run away. The more Charlie looks into it, the more he's convinced that something is off. And while he doesn't think Beverly would hurt her own son, he does think she knows more than she's letting on. To Charlie, it's the only possible motive they'd have to let a stranger impersonate their son. I thought the story was so dark,

but the idea that the family is like in on it because they did something to this kid is beyond. I don't even know what to make of that. Is everyone in this story evil? I mean, you're about to find out. Charlie's excited about where Nancy's FBI investigation is heading. Nancy's about to ask Beverly and the so-called Nicholas

for a blood test to see if they're actually related. For months, Beverly hasn't been cooperating. She seemed angry that the FBI would even suggest Nicholas isn't her son. Now, Nancy has a warrant. But even with the FBI at her door, with a warrant in hand, Beverly still refuses to allow her blood to be drawn.

She actually throws herself on the floor, saying she's not going to get up. Nancy simply replies, yes, you are. And while she's at it, Nancy gets Nicholas' fingerprints. She wants to see if he has a criminal record with Interpol.

The FBI has finally gotten the one thing Frederick can't lie his way out of. And with their new suspicions about Beverly and Jason, it's only a matter of time until someone gets exposed. From Wandery, I'm Raaza Jaffrey, and this is The Spy Who. This series, we open the file on Eamonn Dean, the spy who betrayed Bin Laden. In 1994, 16-year-old Eamonn wants to die. I'm Jake Warren, and in our first season of Finding, I set out on a very personal quest

to find the woman who saved my mum's life. You can listen to Finding Natasha right now, exclusively on Wondery+. In season two, I found myself caught up in a new journey to help someone I've never even met. But a couple of years ago, I came across a social media post by a person named Loti. It read in part, three years ago today,

that I attempted to jump off this bridge, but this wasn't my time to go. A gentleman named Andy saved my life. I still haven't found him. This is a story that I came across purely by chance, but it instantly moved me. And it's taken me to a place where I've had to consider some deeper issues around mental health.

This is season two of Finding and this time if all goes to plan we'll be Finding Andy. You can listen to Finding Andy and Finding Natasha exclusively and ad free on Wondery+. Join Wondery plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. I feel like a legend It's early March 1998. Charlie Parker is sitting at a classic San Antonio diner. It's got yellow walls, a Tex-Mex menu, and an American flag used as decor. Charlie is sitting in a booth with bright turquoise upholstery during the breakfast rush.

And sitting across from him is the man pretending to be Nicholas Barclay. After living as Nicholas for almost five months, Frederique finally got fingerprinted and had his blood drawn a couple of weeks ago. Charlie knows that Nancy and her FBI colleague should be getting the results any day now. But that's not the only reason he's at the diner with whoever this is. Yesterday, Charlie received a phone call from Beverly. For months, she's held firm in her belief that Nicholas isn't an imposter. But last night, a panicked Beverly called,

begging for help. She told Charlie that earlier that morning, she'd driven Nicholas past his elementary school and he didn't recognize it. For some reason, that was her breaking point. She now feels certain that the man living with her is not her son. Maybe the fake Nicholas sensed that Beverly was onto him

because this morning he agreed to meet with Charlie. Charlie starts by telling Nicholas that he upset his mother, and Frederique immediately looks up and snaps, she's not my mother and you know it. Oh, chilling. Super villain behavior. Well, it's worth noting that Frederique

completely denies this version of events. He admits that he and Charlie met for breakfast, but says he never confessed to anything. He says that Charlie made it all up for unearned glory. That being said, between these two men, one of them seems a little more credible than the other. So we're telling Charlie's version of events. Charlie asks the imposter who he really is.

And to Charlie's surprise, he finally comes clean. His name is Frédéric Bourdon. He's wanted by Interpol, and Charlie's eyes grow wide. He puts his fork down and excuses himself to the washroom. As soon as a door shuts, he immediately calls Nancy with the big news. Their suspicions were spot on. As it turns out, Nancy just received the results

of Frederic's fingerprints, which confirm the same thing. Nancy's trying to get a warrant for Frederic's arrest. It might take a few hours, so she asks Charlie to stall and keep him at the diner for as long as possible. Charlie walks back to the booth, heart pounding. The two men sit and talk for an hour, with Frederick recounting every detail of his scams. Finally, when he feels like he can't stall any longer, Charlie drives Frederick home to Beverly. And as he pulls away, he sees Nancy and a convoy of FBI cars descend onto the house.

With the joint efforts of Charlie, the FBI, and Interpol, it seems Frederick has finally been pinned down by law enforcement. But still, the question remains, what happened to the real Nicholas Barclay? As Frederique sees Nancy and her FBI colleagues pull up to Beverly's apartment, he knows this is the end of the road for him.

He doesn't put up a fight, he just puts his hands behind his back and ducks into the back of a cop car. Naturally, Frederique's arrest becomes a massive news story. Once in custody, Frederic admits to lying, but he says he's uncovered an even bigger lie that should interest the police more. And that's when he accuses Beverly and Jason of killing the real Nicholas Barclay. He thinks that's why Beverly accepted him as her son, despite all the evidence otherwise.

I guess he has nothing to lose anymore, so he may as well just throw out whatever accusations he can, even if they are mostly unfounded. Yeah, I mean, Nicholas's entire family says they're heartbroken by these accusations. They say that Frederick gave him hope and wormed his way into their lives when they were at their most vulnerable. Plus, this person is a noted liar. Why should anyone believe him? But authorities gear up to launch a murder investigation with Beverly and Jason as its two suspects. Though they know Frederick isn't reliable, they do think Beverly and Jason's behavior over the past few months, like refusing to take a DNA test, has been suspicious.

The police bring the two of them in for questioning. And shortly after, Jason says he refuses to speak to the authorities again without a lawyer present. Jason struggles with the weight of all of this. He's facing accusations from multiple directions. The police, the FBI, a private investigator, and the public are all looking at him skeptically. Jason has been clean from drugs for over a year

and was seemingly doing well prior to all of this. But a few weeks after the police investigation launches, the family is rocked by a piece of devastating news. Jason has died from an overdose. Beverly is left heartbroken to grieve both of her sons. And after Jason's death, Nicholas' case gets dropped and his disappearance goes cold one last time. No clear evidence is ever found

tying Nicholas' family to his disappearance, despite Frederique's insistence. But now, Frederique will finally have to face the music for his own crimes. In 1998, Frederique pleads guilty to perjury and obtaining and possessing false documents. The judge sentences him to six years, more than three times what was recommended

under the sentencing guidelines. But clearly, jail doesn't teach him anything. For some reason, Frederick has a phone in his prison cell, which he uses to make hundreds of phone calls to the families of missing children all over the world, pretending to have information on where their kids went. I don't understand how this man keeps getting away with this shit. This is so crazy. What is his obsession? I don't know.

He is really fixated on giving people fake hope, it seems. Not just pretending to be a child. It's so evil. After serving six years, Frederic is finally released and sent back to Europe where he continues his decades-old act over and over again. In May of 2005, a 31-year-old Frederique spends a full month at a youth shelter in southwestern France where he pretends

to be a 16-year-old boy named Francisco Hernandez Fernandez. Also, here's a photo of Frederique from around this time. Okay, a couple of things. Just one at a time. But Michaelangelo Mortini and Francisco Hernandez Fernandez, everybody falling for these names needs a lobotomy. Also, this guy's fully bald. He looks like Moby. He looks like an adult. But what I don't get is all of this is happening

during the age of at least Bing or Facebook. Yeah, this is 2005. The internet exists enough for people to be like... You have enough internet. Well, listen, soon enough, someone at the shelter does recognize him from a TV show that covered his many lies and crimes. The shelter calls the police and Frederic gets taken away.

When asked about his motive, Frederic repeats the same line he's used for years. He just wants to be loved. On top of making up fake identities, Frederic pretends to be another real child, Léo Ballet, a French boy who'd tragically gone missing nine years earlier. Luckily, a DNA test catches him before he can trick another grieving family, and he gets sentenced to jail once more in late 2005.

For reasons only Fredri can understand, he finally decides to live as an adult after he's released. Maybe he's learned his lesson, or maybe he's just too old and bald to convince people he's a child. Around 2006, a law student named Isabel reaches out to Frederique. She heard about him on TV and she really gets him. Sure, he's done some pretty bad things, but she understands his reasons. He just wanted to be loved. And she thinks she can offer him just that. They get married in 2007 after a year of dating.

This might be the most severe case of I can fix him in human history. You know, there's someone for everyone, apparently, which never ceases to amaze me. Frederick and Isabelle soon move to a quiet French city where they can escape media attention. They have five kids together, and after all these years, Frederick Bourdain remains a household name in France. Strangers on the street still recognize him as the Chameleon. I think this is one of the most upsetting episodes street still recognize him as the Chameleon.

I think this is one of the most upsetting episodes we have ever covered because really tragic and terrible things happen, but this guy is a cartoon. It's like, how do you keep doing it? At a certain point, there's something wrong with you. There's something pathological about you. You need to like get help. This is a sick person. It's really hard to talk about this

because there was a very tragic thing that happened, but also at the same time, he is just such a weirdo. First of all, he doesn't look childlike at all. How does this one guy gaslight everyone for so many years into thinking he is a child when he is so clearly a grown-up man? I guess the problem is that generally people want to take other people at their word, and you just can't really do that anymore.

This to me is like suspension of disbelief on a level that I've never experienced in my life. The other funny thing about the story is that narratively in our pop culture so much, like there is a Law and Order episode that is like almost a scene for scene of this story with a bit of a different ending. This is the story for me where like, you know, every once in a while I feel broken by like how stupid this is. I feel broken not only by how dumb it all is, but that it led to like a family being destroyed.

This family had already dealt with so much, and now they're being totally messed with. People are determined to believe what they want because they want to feel comforted in the world, and it does not help them in the long term. I guess the lesson is, don't get sloppy, be uncomfortable. Maybe the lesson is, do whatever you want. Do whatever you want, who cares?

I don't know, hold on. You can be whatever you want and someone will freaking believe you. I don't know that we wanna lean into nihilism this far. I don't know, who am I, who are you? You know, anyway, thanks for listening. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. And that's jazz. Who are you? You know? Anyway, thanks for listening. And that's jazz. And that's that.

If you like scam flincers, you can listen to every episode early and ad-free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondry.com slash survey. This is Frédérique Bourdon, no country for old men. I'm Sarah Haggis. And I'm Saatchi Cole. If you have a tip for us on a story

that you think we should cover, please email us at scamfluencers at wendry.com. We use many sources in our research. A few that were particularly helpful were The Imposter, a documentary directed by Burt Leighton, The Chameleon by David Grant for The New Yorker, and The Imposter, Interview with the Chameleon by Mick Brown for The Telegraph.

Gabrielle Jolet wrote this episode. Additional writing by us, Sachi Cole, and Sarah Hegge. Olivia Briley and Eric Thurm are our story editors. Fact checking by Lexi Peery. Sound design by James Morgan. Our music supervisor is Scott Velazquez for Freesound Sync. Additional audio assistance provided by Augustine Lim. Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock. Our senior managing producer is Callum Clues. Janine Cornelow and Stephanie Jens are our development producers. Our associate producer is Charlotte Miller. Our producer is Julie Magruder.

Our senior producers are Sarah Enni and Ginny Bloom. Our executive producers are Jenny Lauer Beckman, Marshall Louie, and Aaron O'Flaherty for Wondery. Wondery. He was hip hop's biggest mogul, the man who redefined fame, fortune, and the music industry. The first male rapper to be honored on the Hollywood walk.

Did he built an empire and live the life most people only dream about everybody no no party like a did he party so yeah, but just as quickly as his empire rose it came crashing down. They're announcing the unsealing of a 3 count indictment charging Sean combs with racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, interstate transportation for prostitution. I was f***ed up. I hit rock bottom. But I made no excuses.

I'm disgusted. I'm so sorry. Until you're wearing an orange jumpsuit, it's not real. Now it's real. From his meteoric rise to his shocking fall from grace, from law and crime, this is the rise and fall of Diddy. Listen to the rise and fall of Diddy exclusively with Wondery+.