Scamfluencers - Giancarlo Parretti: The Italian Job

Episode Date: March 31, 2025

When Thelma and Louise was being made in the early 1990s, production was in and out of financial trouble. Behind this shortage of cash was an Italian businessman and epic scammer named Giancarlo Parretti, who managed to buy multiple movie studios on two continents through falsified loans from a corrupt bank. Still at large in Italy, Giancarlo seems to be a scammer with nine lives.Be the first to know about Wondery’s newest podcasts, curated recommendations, and more! Sign up now at https://wondery.fm/wonderynewsletterListen to Scamfluencers on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen early and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/scamfluencers/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to scamfluencers early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or Apple podcasts. Wondery Plus. Sachi, I know you love power. What would you do if you were suddenly in charge of a movie studio? Every movie would be a sequel to RoboCop. RoboCop would be 50 Cent. I would be RoboCop's love

interest. The movies are seven to ten hours long. No cuts. OK, as you know, I never want to be in charge of anything ever. I am a proud follower,

but I think I would maybe reboot Mr. Bean. Like, he kind of united the world if you think about it. Oh, yeah. What if Mr. Bean and Robocop had a crossover and then they fell in love? Oh, f***. Mr. Bean doesn't have those feelings, but maybe he could teach Robocop the ways of the world. No, they have to kiss. Okay, well, Sachi, I think you'll be pleased to know

I am bringing you yet another Hollywood scam story. Today's story is about a guy who claims to have started from nothing and yet managed to scam his way to the top of Hollywood's most iconic studios. You are going to love this. It's March, 1990, and Hollywood's Dorothy Chandler Pavilion is crackling with excitement. That's right, Saatchi.

It's the 62nd annual Academy Awards, and the show is just about to start. The enormous theater is packed with gorgeous A-listers and Hollywood bigwigs. Everyone's in their gowns and tuxedos, ready to celebrate the hottest films of 1989. For one audience member, this is an extra special night. Giancarlo Peretti has just walked the red carpet

for the very first time. Giancarlo is a stout, squat Italian businessman with aggressively parted black hair, and he's relatively new to Hollywood. He's been in LA for about a year, and he's relatively new to Hollywood. He's been in LA for about a year, and he's made the most of it. When he's not hanging out at the private dance club he owns or holding lavish parties at his $9 million mansion,

he's been trying to buy some of the biggest film studios in Hollywood. And just a few weeks ago, he made his wildest move yet. He agreed to pay more than $1 billion to buy MGM, the historic studio behind some of cinema's all-time classics like Gone With The Wind and The Wizard of Oz. And sure, the tabloids might be talking about John Carlos' shady past and his legal issues back home,

but at least they're talking about him. And now he's at cinema's biggest night, sitting with celebrities like Spike Lee, Tom Cruise, and Morgan Freeman. The house lights go down, the music swells, and Billy Crystal walks out on stage. This is actually his first year hosting the Oscars. Billy starts firing off jokes.

He talks about some of the night's big movies movies like Driving Miss Daisy and Tim Burton's Batman. He roasts Jack Nicholson and Shirley MacLaine. And then he makes this joke aimed squarely at John Carlo. And right here in town, Hollywood has definitely taken on a foreign flavor. An Australian owns 20th Century Fox. MGM is being bought by an Italian who's promised only one small change.

From now on, the lion is not going to roar. He's going to be taking the fifth. Billy Crystal's, like, award show pablum is so dorky, like, in hindsight. This is such a ha-cha-cha joke. But the joke is basically that MGM, which, as you know, Sarah, the emblem is a lion, will now be in the mob and will have to take the fifth, which is when you say that you can't incriminate yourself on stand. Yeah, I mean, it is a pretty niche joke,

but it gets a huge reaction from the crowd because people in the entertainment business have followed the deal closely, along with John Carlo's legal issues. Everyone has the same question. Where does all his money come from? But Giancarlo does not appreciate the joke. Giancarlo feels like he's being smeared with an anti-Italian stereotype.

His big night has been ruined, all before the show even reaches its first commercial break. But for Giancarlo, Billy's jokes will soon be the least of his problems. Because once he takes ownership of MGM, he'll lead it into a debt-laden tailspin and get the attention of law enforcement agencies

all over the globe. Before it's all over, John Carlo will have earned a place on Hollywood's Walk of Shame. You just realized your business needed to hire someone like yesterday. With Indeed, there's no need to stress. You can find amazing candidates fast using Sponsored Jobs. With Sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates, so you can reach the people you

want faster. And just how fast is Indeed? In the minute I've been talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed, according to Indeed data worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed, and listeners of this show will get a $100 sponsored job credit to get your job's more

visibility at indeed.com slash wonder ECA. Just go to indeed.com slash wonder ECA right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com slash wonder ECA terms and. Hiring? Indeed is all you need. Hey, it's Amartinez. I work on a news show. And yeah, the news can feel like a lot on any given day. But you just can't ignore las noticias when important world-changing events are happening. So that is where the Up First podcast comes in. Every single morning in under 15 minutes, we take the news and boil it down to three essential stories. Listen to the Up First podcast comes in. Every single morning in under 15 minutes, we take the news and boil it down to three essential stories.

Listen to the Up First podcast from NPR. From Wondery, I'm Sarah Haggi and I'm Sachi Cole. And this is Scamfluencers. The American film industry has always had a dark side, but when Giancarlo Peretti arrives in Los Angeles in the 80s, it's in a haze of financial crimes so flagrant that even the sketchiest Hollywood executives take notice.

Like all legendary Hollywood figures, Giancarlo makes business look glamorous. He cut deals with foreign banks on yachts and bought himself a dance club so he could party till sunrise. But while he basks in the spotlight, behind the scenes the FBI and Interpol start connecting the dots of his global scheme. An enormous financial scam involving a French bank, multiple European governments, and shady characters on at least two continents.

I'm calling this one, Giancarlo Peretti, the Italian Job. Giancarlo's story starts way before Billy Crystal's Oscar debut. A few decades earlier, 17-year-old Giancarlo Peretti is scrambling to put all his orders in. It's 1958 and he's a waiter on the Queen Elizabeth, a transatlantic ocean liner. Serving the ship's upper-class guests

gives him the chance to rub elbows with people he could never meet in his tiny hometown. Giancarlo was born in 1941 in Orvieto, Italy. Like many of the scammers we cover, it's hard to pin down exact details of his early life. Most reports say he was the son of an olive merchant, but in the BBC documentary, The Man Who Definitely Didn't Steal Hollywood, Giancarlo claims he was abandoned as an infant

on the steps of a church. He says he spent five years in an orphanage until a local woman adopted him. John Carlo also says that in his teens he worked as a waiter at a fancy hotel in London. According to him, he became the personal waiter of one of his regular customers, Winston Churchill. A reporter for Spy magazine once contacted the company that owned the Queen Elizabeth and the London restaurant where Giancarlo says he worked, and neither had any record of him working there.

Oh, okay, good start. Good lying start. Whatever the truth actually is, it's clear that Giancarlo loves to give himself a cinematic origin story. But there is no denying he is a hustler. A friend who really did work with him at a restaurant in Orvieto later told the BBC that, quote,

all he wanted was money. Giancarlo's dedication on the cruise ship catches the attention of a man named Graziano Verzato. Graziano is a powerful politician and businessman who looks a bit like an Italian Wallace Shawn. He's about two decades older than Giancarlo and admires his work ethic. Before long, Graziano offers the young man a job

at his hotel he owns back in Sicily. Giancarlo takes a gig, and pretty soon, he and Graziano become close. We don't know exactly how involved Giancarlo is in Graziano's business at this point, but in 1975, a police investigation reveals that Graziano's been running money for a notorious mob boss. Sometime after this, Graziano winds up getting shot in the arm. It's allegedly a fake assassination attempt to delay prosecution.

And when he's in the hospital, Giancarlo is right there at his bedside. As soon as he recovers, Graziano leaves Italy and his wife puts Giancarlo in charge of all the business interests he's left behind, including a local soccer team. Giancarlo has denied that he ever had ties to the mafia. But he does pay the team every week from a bag full of cash. Oh, so now if you pay somebody in cash in a bag, mysteriously you're a part of the mob? Ah, it's a little anti-Italian. I mean, cash is king, so I have no issues with that.

Cash is king. Well, now that Graziano's properties are under his control, Giancarlo has a capital and connections to start his own business career. And it seems like he's found his calling. Throughout the 70s and 80s, he buys and sells all kinds of businesses. Banks, insurance companies, and tons of hotels. He even starts a chain of newspapers called Il Diario, which runs for a few years before going bankrupt.

And then in the mid-'80s, he takes over a French newspaper and bankrupts it within a year. Nobody knows how to make money on news. Tale as old as time, eh? Tale as old as time. But while he's doing all of this, he's also building up his criminal record. By the end of the 80s, Giancarlo's convictions range from conspiring to commit bodily harm to violating securities law to straight up fraud.

Weirdly, though, nothing ever seems to stick. It could be Giancarlo's connection to Graziano, the corrupt state of Italian politics in the 80s, or just a lax justice system. But he never faces any serious consequences. It probably doesn't hurt that when Giancarlo was running his first newspaper, he became close friends with a few political power players, which comes in handy when he's caught trying to withdraw money from a bank using forged documents.

Luckily, an Italian government minister sends an accountant to pay back the money Giancarlo tried to steal, and then the bank drops their charges. Giancarlo's connections are obviously great for helping him stay in business and out of prison, and they're about to introduce him to the perfect partner for his next set of business ventures in a new industry, the movies.

It's 1987 at the glamorous Intercontinental Hotel in Paris. The wealthy and well-connected are enjoying breakfast when Florio Fiorini starts screaming at his business partner, Giancarlo. Florio is a short businessman with a round face and square glasses. He's actually the accountant who helped John Carlo get out of trouble that time he forged bank documents. Now while most people might be put off by the idea of doing business with someone they met under these circumstances, Florio is not most people.

He's a financial whiz with ties to the oil business and Fortune magazine will later call him quote, one of the biggest, if not the biggest, political briber and money launderer in Europe. Giancarlo and Florio are kind of a classic odd couple. Giancarlo is dramatic and extravagant, while Florio stays behind the scenes organizing most of their financial deals. Here's how a journalist who knew them at the time described their dynamic in the BBC documentary. They were sort of like a traveling road show. Peretti would dominate attention.

Well, Farini would be quiet, but he would be intelligent and answer questions precisely. Farini was more or less a normal person. Peretti was extraordinary in every way. They sound like Pinky and the Brain. Exactly, this is a classic pairing for a reason. This works. Anyway, the partnership does work well. Mostly they buy existing businesses

and strip them for parts. But they also set up an enormous network of shell companies to hide and obscure any shady dealings. This network is actually so enormous that Giancarlo keeps a double-sided flowchart in his house just to keep track of all the company names. Lately, Florio and Giancarlo have been dipping their toes

into an industry that's brand new to both of them, the movies. Last year, a Catholic organization John Carlo had worked with in the past asked for help producing a movie called Bernadette. It's about a French peasant girl who sees a vision of the Virgin Mary and eventually becomes a saint. John Carlo doesn't really care about movies, but he does love that the production process brings him into contact with one of the biggest A-listers in the world, the Pope. According to Giancarlo, they screen the film

at the Vatican and when it's over, everyone in the audience has to sit in silence for five minutes because the Pope can't stop crying. Is it a rule that you can't do or say anything if the pope is crying? I feel like maybe it's just you're kind of caught off guard by the pope crying, you know? Well, regardless of the pope's emotional state, the religious material makes Florio uncomfortable. He wants them to take their names off the movie and separate themselves from the production. So Giancarlo recently met with Canon Group, Inc., the American distributor in charge of Bernadette, to see if he could sell their stake in the movie.

But he came away from that meeting with a new idea. And this morning, Giancarlo is explaining it to Florio. He says, they should buy Canon. Florio thinks this is a very bad idea. Canon is currently being investigated by the SEC for fraud. They're carrying almost a billion dollars in debt and they're teetering on the edge of bankruptcy. Sachi, can you read what Florio yells at John Carlo

over their fancy hotel breakfast? He says, Paredi, may God strike you dead. I send you to sell a movie and you come back wanting to buy a whole studio with a billion dollars in debt.'" Sarah, I cannot stress how much a billion dollars is in the 80s. It is so much money. I love the, "'May God strike you dead,' you know?

It's like, that's classic immigrant stuff. Yeah, you would say that, you know? They're already in the religious mindset. Yeah, that seems about right for these guys. Well, Giancarlo keeps making his case. He points out that Canon's not just a production company, they're also the largest movie theater operator in Europe. Giancarlo thinks they can make some serious money off this part of the business

if they can pick it up for cheap right now. Plus, they'd be sitting on valuable real estate all across Europe. The more John Carlo explains his idea, the more Florio has to admit there are upsides. By the end of breakfast, Florio is in. But there's one more hurdle to clear. To buy Canon, they'll need to get approval from Canon's bank. And this could be an issue.

Florio and Giancarlo have no trouble bribing and cheating in Italy, but this is a bigger international deal. And their sketchy past could raise major red flags for a bank. Lucky for them, they're about to find someone on the inside who's just as ready to break the rules as they are.

Not long after that dramatic breakfast, Giancarlo is at the Cannes Film Festival in the south of France. He's surrounded by movie stars, high-powered executives, and even royalty. Princess Diana is here. All across the city, people are mixing business with pleasure.

They're partying at premieres and making big deals, and Giancarlo is ready to join them. Today, he's waiting in a corner room at the Carlton Hotel with the two men who currently own Canon. They're here to talk with a bank executive about Giancarlo's proposal to buy the company. The guy they're meeting is named Frans Uffmann. Frans is a Dutch banker in his early 50s,

and he looks like a completely smooth Woody Harrelson. He's also one of the most powerful people in the film industry right now. That's because in the 80s, a single European bank was one of the biggest sources of money for all Hollywood studios. The bank is called CLBN. It's the Dutch arm of a French bank called Crédit Lyonnais.

Under France's direction, CLBN has lent out almost $800 million to the American film industry over the last few years. This would be a little over $2 billion in today's dollars. France has given money to the companies who've produced The Terminator, Superman, and Rambo, among other blockbusters. Yeah, I mean, those are big movies. Those are undoubtedly big movies, and if they had not been made, our culture would be very different,

and perhaps we would not have the RoboCops that we have now. Yeah, that makes total sense. France is also known for finding, let's say, creative workarounds for his clients. He's given out millions of dollars without asking for proper documentation. And he's not above saving a little of that money for himself. One year at Cannes, someone claims they saw him literally take a huge envelope of cash from a film exec on a yacht, though of course, Franz denies this ever happened. So, Giancarlo has every reason to expect that this guy is gonna be on his same shady level.

But the second Franz walks into the room, the vibes are off. Before Franz even sits down, Giancarlo is doing what comes most naturally to him, offering a bribe. But Franz doesn't seem that into it. He looks uncomfortable, and it only gets worse from there. All through their meeting, Giancarlo keeps staring at Franz's female assistant,

gesturing at his crotch to try and get her attention. To John Carlo, this is just normal business stuff. But by the end of the meeting, Franz says outright that John Carlo and Florio can't buy Canon. John Carlo is shocked and angry. He can't figure out what went wrong. This is the part of a scam that always bums me out,

when someone is deceptive already, clearly, but also like a piece of shit. So unfortunately, now we have somebody who is a liar and gross. Yeah, and John Carlo doesn't do any self-reflection. He decides he needs to talk to Franz's boss. So the next day, he, Florio, and the canon guys all head out to a meeting with Georges Vigeon, the head of CLBN.

They sit down on a beautiful, sunlit hotel terrace, and unlike yesterday, this meeting goes really well. Georges is younger than Franz, even though he's his boss. He's in his early 40s with slicked back hair, a pointy nose, and thick glasses. He looks kind of nerdy, but he's actually an ex-Foreign Legion paratrooper who once killed an enemy soldier with his own bayonet. And he seems like he commands a lot of respect in the film industry. All through their lunch, Giancarlo watches as stars and big-time producers drop by the

table to chat. Giancarlo even gets to flirt with a few actresses. Best of all, whatever rubbed France the wrong way doesn't seem to bother George at all. By the end of the lunch meeting, he's agreed to let Giancarlo and Florio buy Canon. And not only that, he's gonna give them an extra $250 million to get the company back on its feet.

I love that Slimeball sees Slimeball and they are willing to share millions of dollars and power and control over something that I don't think either of them are equipped to run. Perfect. You know, it's exactly what you said. Game recognize game, Sachi. And of course, Giancarlo is thrilled. After they make the deal, as a thank you, he gives a bunch of CLBN employees

drawings that he says are original works by Picasso. Then he flies George and his family to Bora Bora on a private jet for a nice vacation. The future is looking bright. Giancarlo's got money, a foothold in the movie business, and a boss who understands his vision. But his dreams are about to come up against an opponent who can't be bribed, seduced, or intimidated.

The Dutch government. A few months after Cannes, George is facing uncomfortable questions about CLBN's habit of lending lots of money to Hollywood studios. The Dutch Central Bank, which is like the Netherlands version of the US Federal Reserve, has finally noticed just how much CLBN is investing in Hollywood. They say the bank is concentrating too much money on risky investments in a single industry, and they tell George to diversify the bank's portfolio.

But he doesn't want to do this. He likes the power and prestige of Hollywood. In fact, he likes it so much that he just put $30 million into yet another film studio. And it doesn't hurt that the kickbacks he got from this investment were enough to pay for his new yacht. Thankfully, George did a background check on Giancarlo and Florio after their luncheon con. He learned that they have incredibly checkered pasts, including allegations of fraud and bribery.

He also knows they own a huge network of interconnected shell companies, presumably so they can move money without investigators nosing around. So in response to the Dutch Central Bank's warning, George reaches out to his new Italian partners and asks if he can start funneling some of the bank's money into their shell accounts. And of course, Giancarlo and Florio are more than happy to help. After all, what's a little money laundering between friends? Sarah, I am always saying this to you. It's a sign of respect if your friend helps you launder money. And you know what?

George's plan works. The shell companies give him the shield he's looking for. Soon enough, CLBN is able to go back to business as usual. In fact, it all works so well that around this time, George actually gets a promotion. Crediliones, the bank that owns CLBN, makes him their head of European lending. But this isn't gonna stop George from focusing

a lot of his attention and energy on Hollywood. Now that George is one of the most powerful men in European finance, the stage is set for him and his two Italian proteges to take Hollywood by storm. They've successfully taken over one studio, but they're not done yet, and they're gonna go follow the playbook of every sequel in Hollywood by going bigger.

Hey everyone, Sachi here. And Sarah. You know those sketchy messages we all get, the job offers that seem too good to be true? Well, we thought we'd seen every type of scam out there, but this story completely blew our minds. Those messages? They're actually coming from people trapped inside heavily guarded compounds forced to scam others at gunpoint. Scam Factory, Wondry's riveting new series,

exposes a multi-billion dollar criminal empire operating in plain sight. And this isn't your typical social media scam. Inside these compounds, armed guards ensure the only way out is to scam your way out. And trust us, after covering countless scams, this story left even us shocked. Follow Scam Factory on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of Scam Factory early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery

Plus. In the early hours of December 4th, 2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out onto the streets of Midtown Manhattan. This a silent starts firing at him and the suspect he's been identified as Luigi Nicholas man, Johnny became one of the most divisive figures in modern criminal history was meant to sow terror is walking the people to a true issue. Listen to law and crimes Luigi exclusively on one degree plus

enjoying one degree plus one degree app Spotify or Apple podcasts. to a true issue. Listen to Law and Crime's Luigi, exclusively on Wondery+. You can join Wondery+, in the Wondery app, Spotify, or Apple podcasts. I feel like a legend. The first thing Giancarlo and Florio do with Canon, their new Hollywood production company, is actually pretty surprising. They make a good business move. They take a portion of the $250 million they got from CLBN

and pay off some of Cannon's debt. This ensures the company won't go bankrupt yet. With Cannon back on more solid footing, Giancarlo feels free to start dipping into the company's coffers and living the high life. In 1988, John Carlo moves to Los Angeles with his wife and their three kids. He starts spending a lot of time with a new friend, the producer and fellow Italian expat Dino De Laurentiis. Saci, have you heard of this guy?

No, but he sounds like somebody who worked with, like, Al Pacino. Am I right? You know what? You are right. He does have a Pacino connection. And even if you don't know him by name, you have seen his work. Dino's produced a huge range of Hollywood movies, including Blue Velvet and Serpico, which starred Al Pacino. He's famous for taking big swings on ambitious projects, and now he's taking a big swing on Giancarlo.

Dino introduces him to other Hollywood bigwigs and even lets Giancarlo host a party at his lavish hilltop estate. Giancarlo immediately starts trying to live like his new mentor. He buys a $200,000 Brown Rolls Royce, just like the one Dino drives, and even takes over his friend's luxurious office

on Wilshire Boulevard. But Giancarlo doesn't stop there. He buys himself a private jet, and he moves his family into a $9 million house with seven bedrooms, a tennis court, and a pool. The walls are hung with art, he tells his guests our original works by Goya, Miroz, and Picasso, just like the drawings he gave

to the CLBN executives as gifts. Now that he's got a home base in Hollywood, Giancarlo throws huge bashes at his mansion. He serves his guests pasta, expensive wine and cigars. When he gets frustrated that Hollywood clubs don't stay open as late as the Italian ones he's used to, he buys himself a private, members-only nightclub called Tramp.

And he quickly becomes a regular on the dance floor of his own club. When he's not out dancing, he's hanging out at an upscale restaurant called Madeo. People stop by to pay their respects just like they did at George's table back at Cannes. Giancarlo is finally living his A-list dream, all paid for with CLBN loan money

that's meant to be financing Cannon Productions. Around this time, Giancarlo also picks up another cliched and extremely disturbing Hollywood habit. He puts three young Italian actresses on the Canon payroll, including a former Miss Universe contestant. One magazine later reports that these women are actually his quote, mistresses and that they've been paid to service him sexually. He buys them jewelry and promises them acting lessons, which of course never happened.

Never mind any actual parts in movies. However, when Giancarlo tries to grope Dino De Laurentiis' daughter, Raffaella, at a party, she reportedly punches him in the face. Hell yeah. Appropriate response. In fact, perhaps not even enough. She should have done it twice.

The most appropriate response. In December of 1988, Giancarlo hosts a massive Christmas party at his mansion. He even flies Georgian from Europe. and his generosity doesn't stop there. In the middle of the party, he gathers a few of his closest friends, including George and another CLBN executive, into the library. There, he presents them with a special Christmas gift,

stock certificates for a publicly traded company he's just acquired. The mechanics of this are complicated, but basically in a few months, Giancarlo's production company is going to buy up this company and use the acquisition to funnel a bunch of money into the pockets of its owners. In this case, his friends at the bank. It's essentially a huge bribe. The next day, just to seal the deal, he flies George out to Bora Bora again. All of this is classic Jean Carlo.

Bold, extravagant, and incredibly illegal. And it works. Before the end of the year, CLBN extends Jean Carlo's line of credit. Their business dealings and their fates are only getting more intertwined. And eventually, it's going to have serious consequences for everyone involved.

By 1990, John Carlo has made himself a player in Hollywood. But the American media doesn't know what to make of him. When he appears on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous, host Robin Leitch calls him the new king of Hollywood. But the LA Times interviews one industry insider who says that, quote, he mostly talks about food, movies, and his private plane. And even this doesn't seem totally true.

Giancarlo doesn't really know anything about movies. In one interview around this time, he has to ask a PR person what he should say his favorite movie is. When she suggests Gone with the Wind, he says he's never heard of it. That's obviously bad for a movie executive, but I will say a lot of movie executives don't watch movies. They don't know what makes a movie executive, but I will say, a lot of movie executives don't watch movies.

They don't know what makes a good one, and all they talk about is food and their plane. Yeah, it seems like he's honestly fitting right in. Yeah. Even though he doesn't seem to know much about movies, Giancarlo has told reporters he wants to take charge of some of the biggest production companies in Hollywood, as well as the French company Pathé Cinema. Pathé is actually the second oldest film

company in the world, and they own the work of a lot of important European directors. Taking over Pathé would be a huge feather in John Carlo's cap, and might even earn him the respect of Hollywood's elites. Johncarlo wants to own Pathé so badly, he literally changes Cannon's name to Pathé Communications Corporation. It's like the business equivalent of calling his shot. He also hires a well-respected Hollywood exec named Alan Ladd Jr. to run the company's film unit

and give him an air of legitimacy. He makes a $150 million bid for Pathé, and the deal actually goes pretty far until the French government steps in. Now, the details of this whole thing are a little messy. Some newspapers at the time report that Giancarlo's bid to buy the company was successful, but it seems like the French government intervenes after he had already put the money in, but before he could fully take control. C.L.B.N. might not have minded Giancarlo's sketchy past, but the country of France apparently has higher standards.

Do you know how bad you have to be for France to be the governing body that stops you? Yeah. You have to be so bad. Yeah, you have to be pretty governing body that stops you. You have to be so bad. Yeah, you have to be pretty messed up. As all of this is going down, the Wall Street Journal runs a piece on Giancarlo's criminal past in Italy. And Businessweek runs a story claiming that Giancarlo has ties to the mafia and that he's been laundering

loan money through a network of shell companies. He puts out a statement denying all of this, but it's a huge blow to the image he's trying to portray of a legit Hollywood player. And it's not just the press who are on his case. Back in Italy, the authorities have started to investigate the collapse of the newspaper chain that Giancarlo founded and then bankrupted.

He's been charged with falsifying balance sheets. John Carlo's not the only one with authorities breathing down his neck. The Dutch Central Bank has been getting on CLBN's case again. But this time, they don't just issue a warning. They impose a limit on the amount of money the bank is allowed to give out to any one client.

Of course, George, Giancarlo, and Florio already have a system for dealing with this. They can just move money around into different shell companies to make it look like they're setting things right. So now all Giancarlo has to do is lay low and press pause on his crazy business deals until things settle down.

But Giancarlo just can't help himself. And in the face of so much suspicion, he's about to make his biggest move yet. Sachi, when I say the name MGM, what do you think of? I think about Leo the Lion, the mascot in the MGM logo and his big roar. Yeah, that is undeniably iconic.

And I don't know, it just seems like one of those things you are always aware of if you've seen movies is the MGM logo and the fact that it's a big company, right? Mm-hmm. Well, the studio has been around since the 20s and has been one of the most prestigious names in cinema. Their logo, as you mentioned, a roaring lion, is an iconic symbol of classic Hollywood. But by 1990, MGM is a shell of its former self.

Over the previous few decades, the company has lost a ton of money, produced way fewer movies, and burned through multiple CEOs, including one guy they hired after he was fired from another studio for embezzlement. At this point, MGM is bleeding money, and the owner is looking for someone to take it off his hands. So when Giancarlo and Florio offer $1.25 billion for MGM, the owner accepts with a few conditions.

He doesn't trust that these two jokers actually have access to this much money, so he says they have to come up with it in four months. Until then, they have to pay him non-refundable deposits of $50 million a month. It's a pretty high bar to clear, but Giancarlo agrees. The press reception around all this is skeptical to say the least.

The LA Times runs an article about how nobody in the industry thinks Giancarlo can really afford MGM. His company has been steadily losing money. And it's only produced one actual movie since he took charge, a Sean Connery-Michelle Pfeiffer vehicle called The Russia House. Have you ever heard of this movie? I did not know the two of them were in a movie.

This feels like a fake 30 Rock movie, honestly, looking at the poster. It feels like the kind of movie Netflix would make now and you'd never watch. Yeah. But actually, things are worse than these Hollywood insiders realize. There's no CLBN loan money left, which means Giancarlo

and Florio have just agreed to an enormous business deal with absolutely no money to follow through on it. Giancarlo will have to tap into all his connections and raise over $1 billion. It's a tall order, but John Carlo gets off to a surprisingly promising start. An executive at Time Warner agrees to give him $650 million in exchange for video game rights to some of MGM's movies. The deal gets far enough along that Giancarlo gives the Time Warner exec one of his Picasso drawings he's famous for handing out as a thank you gift.

But the guy wisely sends the drawing out to be insured. And surprise, surprise. The appraiser tells him that it's a fake. The exec gets spooked and pulls out of the deal. It's so funny because I think like gifting the Picasso is such a common movie executive thing. There's like an old story about Robin Williams and how he took a pay cut when he did Aladdin under the condition that he wouldn't be used for a certain percentage of marketing products, of merchandising.

And they did it anyway, and then he didn't do the second movie, and then there was this changeover at Disney, and then the new executive gifted him a Picasso to get him to do the third movie, which worked, which is why he is in the third movie and not in the second. And you know why that probably worked?

Because it wasn't fake. Giancarlo is really messing up and he doesn't have much time left to fund the MGM deal, but things are about to get even worse. The Italian authorities finished their investigation into the collapse of Giancarlo's newspaper and he's convicted of fraud in absentia. He gets sentenced to three and a half years in prison

back in Italy. John Carlo appeals, but it's too late. The news travels across the Atlantic, and by awards season, John Carlo's conviction has become juicy Hollywood gossip. This is when Billy Crystal makes that joke about him. At this point, everyone is tired of his antics, and he's going from eccentric European mogul into LA laughing stock. But for John Carlo, the show must go on.

And it's his last desperate encore that will bring his whole life in Hollywood crashing down. About seven months after John Carlo buys MGM, he's in a car with Florio and Palm Springs. They're heading home from a meeting with a potential investor. After their funding from Time Warner fell through, they got an extension on raising money for the MGM deal. But they still have to pay that non-refundable

$50 million a month and their're hemorrhaging cash. They've managed to scrape together some deals, but they're still $600 million short and the clock is ticking. But the executive they just met with could be the answer to their prayers. He's an oil billionaire with an interest in media and he's nice enough to send them back to the airport

in a car with his own personal driver. But while Giancarlo and Florio discuss the meeting in the back seat, Giancarlo makes a series of incredibly anti-semitic comments about the executive. He's speaking Italian so he probably thinks he doesn't need to worry. But the limo driver also speaks Italian and can understand everything John Carlo is saying. So when John Carlo and Florio show up for their second meeting a few days later, the oil executive tells him he knows exactly

what they said about him. Sachi, can you read what he says to them next? He says, quote, You have a choice. You can get out of this office in the next 30 seconds, or I'm going to throw you have a choice. You can get out of this office in the next 30 seconds, or I'm going to throw you through this window. Perfect.

And that is also something that happens in Brobo Cop. Also, it's like after flying so high on his charms and all these idiotic things he did that put him up top, and he keeps making these stupid mistakes right before a deal is like all but signed. It's good schadenfreude I feel great. Well he's still that same scrappy striver who made his way from an orphanage to the sound stages of Hollywood. So unbelievably John Carlo manages to pull together yet another deal.

Giancarlo and Florio create an incredibly tangled web of loans, bribes, and backroom deals. They disguise some of their shell companies as legitimate outside investors to make themselves look like a better prospect to potential partners. Giancarlo promises an Italian media company the rights to play MGM movies on TV and pay-per-view. And somehow, they convince CLBN to lend them an obscene amount of money again. After weeks of desperate negotiating, they manage to cobble together a billion dollars to finally buy MGM. John Carlo and Florio have no concrete plan to deliver on any of their promises or pay anyone back,

but they don't care. All that matters is that they won. The deal closes on November 1, 1990. Despite having done this show for such a long time and we've covered so many scammers, I'm always shocked at how people are able to fundraise like this. Like how they were able to find this much money to buy something that they have no business owning.

There are all these people out here with stupid amounts of money who are just willing to give it away, knowing that they're dealing with a scammer. And yet, here we are, just being normal. -♪ Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Apparently, Giancarlo screams, "'Namma manja' when he sees it. That's Italian for, don't eat me. After the party, he puts out a press release saying the company is going to be, quote, the most powerful Euro-American communications group

of the 90s. Against all odds, Giancarlo has pulled off a deal for the Hollywood history books. But unlike the grand epics of cinema, this moment doesn't spell the end. Giancarlo has written a lot of IOUs and they're all about to come due. In the 1950s, America was glued to its television screens,

watching contestants battle it out for big money on quiz shows like 21 and the $64,000 question. But behind the scenes, producers were feeding answers to the most popular contestants to keep audiences hooked. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondry Show American Scandal. We bring to life some of the biggest controversies in US history, presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our latest series, quiz shows dominate 1950s TV

until a disgruntled contestant blows the whistle and reveals that the shows are rigged. Follow American Scandal on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts. Experience all episodes ad-free and be the first to binge the newest season only on Wondry+. You can join Hey everybody, we have some exciting news that we want to share. If you want to go on an adventure with Generation Y, we'd love for you to join us. January 26th through the 30th, 2026, we'll be sailing from Miami to the Bahamas on Wondry's first ever True Crime Cruise aboard the Norwegian Joy. Aaron and I will be there to chat, hang out, dive into all things True Crime, and we're thrilled to be joined by some familiar voices in the True Crime Podcasting world.

Sirte and Hannah from Red Handed, Sashi and Sarah from Scam Fluencers, and Carl Miller from Kill List. Super excited to hang out with them too. We got some cool activities, interactive mysteries we can solve, testing our forensic skills with a blood spatter expert, and so much more. So for some sun, fun,

and just the right amount of mystery solving, come join us. Ready to jump on this seriously epic adventure? Book your cabin right now at exhibitseacruise.com. For Alan Ladd Jr., being the head of film production at Pathé should be an exciting new chapter in his already storied career. Alan, whose friends call him Laddie, has a boyish face and a toothy grin.

He's best known for having been the president of 20th Century Fox in the late 70s, where he famously greenlit the original Star Wars. He's a popular and respected guy in the industry. But on the very first day after John Carlo takes over MGM Studios, Alan arrives at work and hears shocking news. John Carlo's first order of business is to fire a ton of the company's financial staff. And then he installs his 21-year-old daughter in a key finance position. Over the next few months, Alan watches in horror

as things at MGM start to go steeply downhill. The studio starts running a deficit of $1 million per day. They bounce a six-figure check to Dustin Hoffman, withhold a letter of credit to Sean Connery, and miss an important interest payment on one of their bonds. I don't know that I would want to withhold money from Dustin Hoffman or Sean Connery. I would be worried about my personal safety. Well, Hollywood is a small town and word quickly gets out about John Carlos' erratic behavior. A few months after buying MGM, he throws a huge gala dinner party, supposedly to raise

money for something called, Saatchi, it is called the National Council on the Aging. In all fairness, I do think we need a council on aging, the aging, whatever we are calling it. What does that mean? I did look it up and a table was 10 grand. What is the aging? Are you talking about Alzheimer's? Are you talking about dementia? I think it's elder care. I think it's elder care? On the aging? Sure. English is not his first language. You're right. And also this obviously doesn't exist therefore who cares? Yeah, it's not

real. It's not worth getting mad about. Well, it should be a coronation for the new owner of MGM, but unlike the parties he hosted when he first got to Hollywood, the guests here are C-list at best, and the vibes are bad. Alan sits as far away from his boss as possible. In fact, Alan will later tell Vanity Fair that this is when he gets fed up with John Carlo. Allen is preparing for the release of the movie Thelma and Louise.

He knows he's got a hit on his hands, but MGM's messy state of affairs is making everything chaotic. At one point, production loses control of the literal film. A processing lab holds it hostage because John Carlo refuses to pay them. Alan's been calling John Carlo every day asking for money, or at least some explanations, but of course he hasn't been getting either. Alan's dream job is turning into a nightmare. He and everyone else at MGM are trapped in the car with Johnlo as their new boss has his own showdown with the law. And soon they're all going over the cliff.

It's the spring of 1991 and Charles Meeker is starting to think he made a mistake taking on his new client, MGM. Charles is a Princeton graduate with a wide forehead and a square jawline. He's in his late 40s and he's a partner at an LA law firm working as an entertainment lawyer. He occasionally produces B-horror movies on the side, so he knows the movie business and how some of its shadier players operate.

A few months ago, his firm got called in by CLBN to help them manage a delicate situation. CLBN was worried about MGM and its new owner, John Carlo. A few of the studio's creditors have actually gotten together and threatened to sue. And if they're successful, MGM will have to pay $300 million of debt within 60 days. The company would go bankrupt, which would invite a lot of unwanted government scrutiny. CLBN doesn't want anyone looking too closely at their banking relationship with John Carlo. So they hired Charles to prevent this by negotiating a deal with the creditors, and he pulled it off.

The only person who doesn't like this new arrangement is John Carlo. Because as part of the deal, he gets demoted. He still works at MGM, but he's no longer the head of the company. Plus, Cradile Liones now has taken over voting control of a bunch of MGM stock. But while John Carlo is finally facing consequences for his stupidity, Charles is getting praised for pulling off this life-saving deal. In May of 1991, Cradile Ones asks Charles if he wants to be the president of MGM.

He says yes. Charles probably knows that Giancarlo isn't going to enjoy having a new boss. And things go south fast. Sachi, can you read what Giancarlo reportedly screamed at Charles after working for him for just one month? Yes, he says, I want you to understand, Meekers, that I am really crazy. I want you to understand that I am really dangerous. I am very dangerous.

Do you understand, Meekers? I'm very dangerous. I'm starting to think he might be a little dangerous. I'm starting to think that's what he wants us to believe, yeah. You don't have to tell me twice. Well, Charles has heard the rumors about John Carlo's mafia ties. He also knows that Credilliones executives have hired armed guards for security just in case. So when John Carlo makes this threat, Charles takes it seriously.

And he does the first reasonable thing any of John Carlo's coworkers have done so far. He calls the FBI and the SEC. He even takes it a step further by hiring a retiring head of the FBI's LA Bureau to start looking into John Carlo independently. The authorities start investigating Johncarlo pretty much immediately. And of course, he panics.

On June 14th, he tries to convene a board meeting to revoke the bank's control of MGM. Craddy Leonez responds three days later by fully seizing control of the company and firing Giancarlo altogether. Charles probably isn't shocked when Giancarlo flees the country to escape all the ongoing investigations. So Charles turns his attention to running MGM. About a year later, he learns that Florio has been arrested in Switzerland and is being held on fraud charges related

to one of their holding companies. Then Charles hears that American authorities are looking to press charges against officials at Crediliones, even while the bank sues Florio. About a year after Florio's arrest, Charles resigns as the head of MGM. He managed to negotiate a big-time distribution deal for the company, but Cardillones is also actively working to sell the studio. Charles is getting out while the getting is good. Luckily, he has a great escape.

He owns a winery in Sonoma. Finally, a couple of years later, in October 1995, Gian John Carlo is caught. He is suspected of misappropriating $100 million meant to go to MGM. He was back in America to give a deposition in his lawyer's office in downtown Los Angeles. The BBC later asks him why he returned to the country where he was being investigated. John Carlo says he had no fear

because he didn't do anything wrong. Charles must finally breathe a sigh of relief and probably treats himself to a very generous pour of wine. But anyone hoping for a clear-cut ending to this saga is going to be disappointed because John Carlos has a different vision for his final act. John Carlos' unraveling sets off a legal firestorm on both sides of the Atlantic. His web of crime spans multiple continents,

branches of government, and an enormous mess of companies. It's so complicated that different authorities start trying to pick it apart from different angles. In France, there's a massive investigation into fraud and conspiracies at Crédit Lyonnais. The press jumps on the story of the bank's involvement with the imploding MGM. CLBN executives are forced to defend themselves in the press

and in front of the government, and a few of them, including George, very quickly retire. Others are reassigned to new posts in new countries. And Saci, you'll never believe this, but in the middle of all this scrutiny, the bank's headquarters mysteriously catch fire in May 1996. This is the luckiest man in the world. I've never been so lucky. Sometimes fires just happen and there's no cause.

That's true. There is no reason they just spontaneously erupt. Well, during all of this, Florio has been in a Swiss prison writing his memoirs on a typewriter. But Giancarlo is harder to pin down. After his arrest, he manages to get released from jail after just 10 days due to mistakes

on his extradition paperwork from the French government. No one sees him in the US again until the fall of 1996 when he comes back to face charges relating to the whole MGM debacle. In October, he's convicted of perjury and evidence tampering. He's released on bail until his sentencing in the new year where he could face up to 10 years in prison.

But of course, Giancarlo's always got one more trick up his sleeve. In January of 1997, just days before he's due to be sentenced, he jumps bail and goes back to Italy. In the BBC doc, his former PR agent says she had seen John Carlo at his house the night before. And this is what John Carlo promised. He said, I will defend my name, I will defend my ownership, I will be there, and my word. He fled that night. Yeah, I bet he did.

You know, he's really good at like doing the movie type lines of like, I'll defend my name. Of course. I'll do this and then being like, actually, I'm just going to run. It's kind of his thing. Well, Giancarlo puts out a statement through his lawyer arguing that he technically didn't do anything wrong since his bail agreement didn't prevent him from traveling. The press speculates that he's trying to avoid extradition since he also has charges pending against him in France

where the punishment can be even more severe. There's an Interpol red notice out for him, which basically means that if he ever leaves Italy, he could be arrested and extradited to the United States to finally stand trial. So in one sense, he's trapped in Italy, but he also got away without serious consequences. Giancarlo Peretti managed to get out of this saga

the way he went into it, blatantly scamming and not really getting punished for it. And of course, he's managed to give his whole story a classic Hollywood ending. As of course, he's managed to give his whole story a classic Hollywood ending. As of August 2024, a Hollywood producer is shopping a movie script based on his crimes. And in September, the BBC released its documentary about John Carlo.

He participated in the documentary, telling his whole life story. But eventually, he stopped talking to them because he didn't like the documentary's name. telling his whole life story. But eventually, he stopped talking to them because he didn't like the documentary's name. Sachi, you, uh, you're kind of Hollywood adjacent in many ways, you know? You got all those documentaries.

You're always on TV. Do you feel like you want to find a way to get a billion dollars now? No, I don't think it's gonna come to me as easily as it seemed to come to these guys. I think you should actually be a little more charming, dude. Oh, charm is not my problem. I have so many problems,

that is the only thing keeping me afloat. That's why it's funny. I mean, this is such a frustrating story because there's just a million dudes in movies who are like this and are not considered scammers and are considered actually moderately successful despite being full of shit. It's funny because you also mentioned at one point,

like a lot of execs don't watch movies or read books based on movies they're trying to get or whatever. And I feel like many industries, Hollywood is kind of based on inventing value of certain actors or businesses or studios and creating a hype machine around it. And I think what is so crazy about this is, I guess, the involvement of real government banks and officials who were all for it.

Yeah. I mean, I think the thing that bothers me about this scam is it's like there's all these places that are kind of in cahoots. Like there are these investors who are feeding into it, banks that are feeding into it, other rich movie executives feeding into it, and then like the entertainment industry that always feeds into this. It just feels like a scam where the material that you need to eat to keep the scam going is everywhere. Yeah, and it's not a scam until someone decides it is one

and then everyone jumps away and is like, uh, actually this is super bad and I'm not a part of it at all. Yes. It's crazy because people in Hollywood want so much respect as like legitimate business people and artists and whatever, whatever. And then, you know, you read something like this and quite frankly, many other stories that involve some sort of Hollywood aspect. Everyone's just cosplaying as something else.

No one's actually doing anything. Yeah, I mean, that's an easy place to hide your fraud because the way movies are made is subjective and chaotic and expensive. It is easy to sort of just like hide your money and hide the fact that you're full of shit. Yeah, and we've done quite a few episodes of this show, I'd say, and I think one common thread here is that it's really easy to scam anyone in a creative industry. It's actually the easiest thing you could do.

It's easier than making good work. Yeah, greater likelihood of having a scam be successful than having your movie made, unfortunately. So, Robba Bank. Wow, what would you say your lesson is here? My lesson is that being Italian sounds fun. Does it? They have fun insults.

They have good turns of phrases, you know? Okay. Yeah. Okay. Well, you be Italian and I will rob a bank. I don't think I'm going to be Italian, but let's just rob a bank. Who cares? Okay. I don't think I'm going to be Italian, but let's just rob a bank, who cares? Okay. If you like scam flincers, you can listen to every episode early and ad free right now

by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondry.com slash survey. This is Giancarlo Peretti, the Italian Job. I'm Sarah Haggi. And I'm Saci Cole. If you have a tip for us on a story that you think we should cover, please email us at scamfluencers at Wondry.com. We use many sources in our research.

A few that were particularly helpful were The Predator, how an Italian thug looted MGM, brought Predator Leonis to its knees, and Made the Pope Cry by David McClintock in Fortune Magazine, A Hollywood Mystery by Alan Citron and Michael Seapley in the LA Times, and the BBC documentary, The Man Who Definitely Didn't Steal Hollywood, directed by John Dower.

Emma Healy wrote this episode. Additional writing by us, Sacha Cole and Sarah Hagge. Eric Thurm is our story editor. Fact-checking by Lexi Peery. Sound design by James Morgan. Additional audio assistance provided by Augustine Lim. Our music supervisor is Scott Velasquez for Freesan Sync. Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock. Our senior managing producer is Callum Clues. Janine Cornelo and Stephanie Jens are our development producers. Our associate producer is Charlotte Miller. Our producer is Julie Magruder.

Our senior producers are Sarah Enney and Ginny Bloom. Our executive producers are Jenny Lauer Beckman, Marshall Louie, and Erin Oflarity for Wondery. Everyone has that friend who seems kind of perfect. For Patty, that friend was Desiree. Until one day... I texted her and she was not getting the text. So I went to Instagram and she has no Instagram anymore. And Facebook, no Facebook anymore.

Desiree was gone. And there was one person who knew the answer. I am a spiritual person, a magical person, a witch. A gorgeous Brazilian influencer called Cat Torres, but who was hiding a witch. A gorgeous Brazilian influencer called Cat Taurus, but who was hiding a secret. From Wandery, based on my smash hit podcast from Brazil, comes a new series, Don't Cross Cat, about a search that led me to a mystery in a Texas suburb. I'm callingico Felitti. You can listen to Don't Cross Cat on the Wandery app or wherever you get your podcasts.