Scamfluencers - Wayne LaPierre: America’s Hired (and Fired) Gun | 179

Episode Date: September 22, 2025

Wayne LaPierre spent decades at the helm of the National Rifle Association, transforming it into one of the most powerful lobbying groups in America. But behind his carefully crafted image as a gun-toting cowboy was a man who barely knew how to fire a weapon. LaPierre’s true loyalty was never to guns—or even to the NRA—but to himself. He raised millions from devoted members, then siphoned off the organization’s funds to bankroll his own life of luxury.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey, scam influencers fans, Sachi here. If you live for the outrageous stories and unbelievable cons that we cover, you need Wondry Plus. It's like sitting in the room with us as we unravel every twist. Add free a week ahead of everyone else and packed with exclusive content you won't hear anywhere else. Start your free trial in the Wendry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify now. I'm scared. You know a lot about me, but do you know that I love guns? I love shooting guns.

You know, I didn't know that about you, but I really want to try shooting a gun. And no one will take me to a shooting range. Oh, I will take you. I will take you. Politics aside, they're cool. Yes, listen, to be clear, I don't think anyone should own a gun. They are awful death machines, but they are so cool. I know. There's a reason why they're in video games.

Well, as a gun expert, I'm here today to take you into the heart of gun culture and how one lobbyist built one of the biggest, most powerful advocacy groups in the world. And then almost brought it down because he was so needy and so greedy. It's early 2018, and Wayne and Susan Lapierre are house hunting in the Dallas suburbs. Wayne and Susan are a rich, white, married couple in their late 60s. So, unsurprisingly, they're looking at a 10,000 square foot mansion and a gated community. It's a huge property with four bedrooms, nine bathrooms, high ceilings, and plenty of natural light. There's a fireplace in the kitchen and an elevator.

It backs onto a man-made lake that's in the middle of a golf course. And the homeowners association provides security. That last perk is important for the couple, because lately, Wayne has been feeling unsafe. Wayne is the CEO of the National Rifle Association, the country's most influential gun rights lobby, and one of the most influential organizations in American politics for decades. Over the 27 years, Wayne has held this position, gun violence has surged. Just a month ago, 17 people were killed in the shooting at Parkland High School in Florida. And as the public face of the biggest organization promoting gun ownership, Wayne has been getting a lot of flack. He's been confronted by

protesters, and even swatted. It's been a really scary time for him. I mean, what if someone came to his house with a gun? Oh, my God. I love a clear villain. He's rotten, hate his guts. Mm-hmm. Well, this house would be the perfect fortress for Wayne to hide from his enemies.

But it costs about $6 million. And while Wayne is doing pretty well for himself, he doesn't have that kind of money, at least not in his personal bank account. So Wayne does something he's done countless. times before. He decides that this mega mansion counts as a business expense. He's been making huge luxury purchases on the company dime for decades, pulling millions of dollars from the organization's budget to buy expensive suits, pay for private flights, and even cover summer vacations on enormous yachts. For Wayne, this house would be the perfect place to monitor the

political world he helped build, and defend himself against all these lunatics who want to do insane things like ban assault rifles. But Wayne will never actually move in. In fact, this era of his life is about to end. A series of investigations, lawsuits, and eventually a major court case are going to expose his fraud and reveal to the world that his entire public persona is bullshit.

Wayne is an opportunist, but worse? He's a coward. And when the world finally sees who he really is, Wayne won't have anything left in the chamber. Grab a coffee and discover Vegas-level excitement with BetMGM Casino. Now introducing our hottest exclusive, Friends, the one with the Multi-Drop. Your favorite classic television show is being reimagined into your new favorite casino game, featuring iconic images from the show.

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So don't be shy. Join the conversation and head over to YouTube to watch Nick Cannon at night or subscribe on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcast. From Wondry, I'm Sachi Cole. And I'm Sarah Haggy, and this is scam influencers. Come and give me your attention. I won't ever learn my lesson. Turn my speakers to 11.

I feel like a legend. Wayne Lapierre was the face of the National Rifle Association for decades, and one of the most influential figures in American politics. As CEO, he transformed the NRA into one of the most feared lobbying forces in the world. But his image as a macho, gun-toting cowboy was a sham. Wayne barely knew how to use a cell phone, let alone an AR-15. He wasn't even a Second Amendment die-hard. The only thing Wayne believed in was Wayne.

He used the NRA's reputation to maintain proximity to power and raise millions from its devoted members. Then, he pilfered that war chest to live in the lap of luxury. This is a story where everybody loses, especially America. I'm calling it, Wayne LaPierre, America's. hired and fired gun. Before we talk about Wayne's role in bringing gun rights activism into the mainstream,

we need to get into the history of the NRA. The National Rifle Association is founded in 1871. At first, it's mostly an organization for hunters and marksmen. They advocate for things like additional gun safety laws and firearm regulations. In the 60s, they actually support California Governor Ronald Reagan when he signs a law banning the open carry of firearms. Of course, the law was passed in response to a Black Panther protest where participants marched through the state capital with loaded guns.

Huh, funny how that works. It's a little interesting coincidence, don't you think? Interesting, interesting. Throughout the 60s, high-profile assassinations of figures like John F. Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy, Martin Luther King Jr., and Malcolm X, lead to increased calls for gun control. This culminates in a 1968 bill that restricts firearms sales in a bunch of ways, including adding serial numbers to guns and requiring a minimum

age for gun buyers. These measures are popular. By the 70s, the NRA starts to consider dropping the word rifle from its name altogether. And they make plans to move their headquarters from Washington, D.C., to Colorado Springs, so they can focus less on politics and more on sportsmanship and outdoor activities. But a more radical group of NRA members wants to double down on the Second Amendment. They want the organization to fight to ensure everyone in the country can own guns

and take them virtually anywhere. And they have a plan to get their way. In May 1977, the NRA hosts its annual board meeting in Cincinnati. On the first day, a stream of activists in bright orange hunting caps march into the meeting holding walkie-talkies and carrying guns. One of the architects of this protest is Neil Knox. Neil is in his early 40s. He's a jowly gun.

with a wide forehead and big aviator glasses. He's a journalist who writes for hunting magazines, loves guns, and hates the government. And these orange hat NRA members agree with him. They're the type of people you might associate with the NRA now, hardcore Second Amendment fanatics who think the government is about to take away their sacred right to bear arms.

Right now, Neil and the orange caps are still on the fringes of the organization, but Neil is ready to change that. He thinks if enough hardline men members show up, they can overwhelm the NRA establishment. Then, they can vote out the more moderate board members and replace them with people who want to move the organization further to the right. Neil's plan works.

He swarms the board meeting with his crew and they refuse to leave, even when the organizers turn off the air conditioning and transform the conference room into a sweltering mess. After an all-night voting session, Neil and his allies replace most of the existing NRA board members with their own faction of right-wing pro-gun activists. This event becomes known as the revolt at Cincinnati, and it clears the path for Neal to be appointed chief lobbyist of the new NRA. He's about to change the trajectory of the organization and American politics forever, but he needs someone to help him push his new agenda, and he's about to find the perfect

partner in the place he'd least expect, across the aisle. It's 1978, about a year after the revolt in Cincinnati. 29-year-old Wayne LaPierre is wandering around the imposing NRA headquarters in Washington, D.C. He's here to interview for a job, but honestly, it seems like kind of a weird fit. Wayne is a rumpled, unassuming guy who really looks like a gopher. He's absent-minded and eccentric. He volunteered for a progressive Democrat, George McGovern, and has no interest in guns. Wayne grew up in the small city of Roanoke, Virginia, about a four-hour drive from D.C.

It's the type of place where you might expect to find some gun enthusiasts, but no one in Wayne's household cared much about guns or hunting. What Wayne does care about is politics. He got into it early. When he was in high school, he would go out canvassing for his parents' friends who were running for city council. Then he got a master's degree in political science from Boston College, and he started working as a legislative aide for a Democrat in the Virginia State.

House. Wayne's boss was really into hunting, fishing, and guns. And he's the one who heard the NRA was looking for a lobbyist to help them make inroads with Democrats and recommended Wayne for the gig. It never ceases to amaze me how, like, lobbyists and people in politics work where, like, there comes a point where I don't think they actually believe in anything. It's just about, like, what would be beneficial for who hired me or, like, what evil thing I want to do. It's Crazy. Yeah, well, we don't know exactly what draws Wayne to the NRA, but we do know that before interviewing for the NRA job, Wayne turned down an offer to work as a legislative aid for Democratic House Speaker, Tip O'Neill. This would have been more in line with Wayne's previous work.

But being a legislative aid is kind of a grind, and it means you actually have to focus on policy. Lobbying, on the other hand, puts you in the room where all the big decisions are made. It could give Wayne access, power, and maybe even wealth. In the end, Wayne takes the NRA job. He'll be working under Neil, the architect of the Cincinnati Revolt, helping him enact his vision for a more militant right-wing NRA. In other words, Wayne is fully ready to sell out. But though Wayne is ready to dive head first into the far right,

he isn't a perfect fit. For all that he doesn't know about guns, Wayne does know politics. and Neil is impressed. Over the next two years, Neil promotes Wayne up through the ranks at the NRA, eventually naming him head of the group's federal lobbying arm.

This rapid rise is pretty surprising because, as Neil quickly realized, Wayne is not a typical lobbyist. He's nerdy, clumsy, and socially inept. According to Misfire, the downfall of the NRA by Tim Mack, Wayne has a weak handshake, doesn't drink,

and he's so awkward that colleagues say the only way to make eye contact with him is to lie on the floor. His clothes are basic and ugly, and Mac adds that on Capitol Hill, people literally call Wayne shoes, because he always wears the same pair

of scuffed black wingtips. Wayne hates technology and refuses to use the computer. He writes all of his notes by hand on yellow legal pads using an unreadable shorthand. Then he puts all of the legal pads in a suitcase. He frequently forgets to close the suitcase,

so he's always dropping his notes all over. over the floor. Oh, my God. Why is this not adapted to a sitcom? Wayne is perfect. He's kind of Mr. Magoo. Yeah. He's disheveled.

Isn't that right, though? Well, he's the brains and, you know, Neil's DeBron. Yeah. Well, maybe Neil figures that his star employee needs encouragement to just come out of his shell. Because one day, he offers to take the NRA's golden boy on a ski shooting field trip. Neil hops in his 1978 Cadillac Seville and heads off to the range in rural Maryland. But when he meets up with Wayne,

Neil is shocked to see that his star employee is carrying a crappy old shotgun that's so rusted, it's basically unusable. Neil promptly pops open the hood of his Cadillac and cleans up Wayne's busted-ass gun with oil. Neil probably had an inkling that Wayne wasn't a gun guy, but now he knows just how clueless he really is. And Neil isn't the only person at the NRA to notice.

People start telling a joke about Wayne's aim at the office. The safest place you can be when Wayne has a gun is between Wayne and the target. This guy is so incredible. Like, he's just kind of a muse for insults, you know what I mean? People are coming up with their best work. This is incredible work. Yeah. I mean, they really got his ass.

They really did. Neil might find Wayne's lack of gun knowledge and interpersonal skill, off-putting, but there's no denying he's a great lobbyist. He's a political strategy savant. And, in an organization filled with big personalities, Wayne's blandness might actually be his secret weapon. In 1991, the NRA's chief executive leaves after being accused of harassing a female staffer.

He was the third guy to have the job in the last six years, including someone who fired an entire division without consulting the board. The NRA needs someone steady and boring to keep things calm for a while. So, of course, they give the job to Wayne. Neil has found a perfect, unassuming, politically savvy avatar to lead the NRA. Now, he just needs to make sure Wayne can play the part. And that means someone needs to put some lipstick on this Wayne-sized pig. Putting Wayne in charge of the NRA is a bit of a gamble.

But to Angus McQueen, it's also a golden opportunity. Angus is the head of an advertising firm called Ackerman McQueen, which everyone calls ACMAQ. His father founded ACMAQMAC in the early 70s. Angus started his career in news media and then worked for the Nixon administration. But then, he came to ACMAC and started running the family business. Right away, he identified the NRA as a very important client.

He grew the firm's relationship with the gun lobbying group into its most lucrative account. Wayne seems like the world's least likely poster boy for Second Amendment Warriors, which suits Angus just fine. He sees something he knows a lot about, a marketing opportunity. Angus is in his mid-40s with a soft, round face, close-cropped hair, and frameless glasses. He looks like he could be a kindly elementary school principal, except for his hard eyes and his intense and terrifying personality.

His colleagues say he's ruthless, with, quote, a violent, uncontrollable temper. Years later, some of them will tell a reporter about an incident where an IT expert tried to set Angus up with a new laptop. When Angus couldn't figure out how to use it, he got so frustrated that he grabbed a pair of scissors, cut through every cable, took the whole mess to the office lobby, and slammed it down on the marble floor. His employees were too scared to clean up the wreckage. But Angus gets away with this bad behavior because he's good at his job. In the 80s, he masterminded some very successful ad campaigns for the NRA. Sarah, do you want to take a look at some of Angus's work?

These ads are very hard to miss. They're all black and white. There's a big text at the top followed by an image. And one of them says, if you're attacked on your porch, do you want your neighbors to be opposed to gun ownership or members of the NRA? Another one says, what does a convenience store clerk think just before he is attacked? At the bottom of the ads, it says, defend your right to defend yourself, which I guess is exactly what they're doing.

it's like anything can happen. The world's crazy. Don't you want to defend yourself? Just in case something happens, you know, like making it seem like no matter what they're the victim of something. Yeah, these ads are like the template for every right-wing ad trying to scare you about like the rise of crime. Yeah. Angus is so successful that by the 90s, ACMAQ is in charge of all PR at the NRA. From ads to research to crisis management. They literally have their own floor in the NRA's Washington offices. ACMA employees are living well off the account.

They travel on private jets, wine and dine their clients at expensive restaurants, and smoke fancy cigars at private clubs. Of course, as their CEO, Angus leads by example. He wears bespoke suits, drives a Bentley, and wears $250 ties, which he often throws away after wearing once. I think this is going to be one of those episodes

where I'm like, oh, who's the craziest person? It's hard to pick. Yeah. Throwing away a tie. is so stupid. Like, what are you trying to prove here? That you could buy another one? We know you're rich. Yeah. Well, some of these purchases might seem like they ride the line between personal and business expenses. But the ACMA guys have developed a trick to cover this up. Allow me to explain.

Let's say, for example, that Angus wants to buy a brand new $250 single-use tie. When he's at the expensive tie store, instead of using his own personal credit card, he pulls out his ACMAQ AMICs and pays for it out of the company's expense account. After all, he's going to wear it at work. At the same time, other ACMA guys are doing this with other questionable expenses. Cigars, fancy dinners, private cars, whatever. And when the ACMAC finance team sees these charges, they put them all together in an invoice for the NRA.

But these invoices are extremely vague. Instead of breaking down each item and its associated cost, or including any receipts, they just add it all up and put the total under a vague heading-like expenses. Then they invoice the NRA for one huge lump sum

that covers everything. Angus never has to justify whether his tie counts as a business purchase because no one at the NRA even sees that he bought it. And the NRA always pays the bill. Ackmac executives call this

the out-of-pocket project. It's one of the jobs' special perks. I'm not even sure if I consider this a scam. I'm like, rob them. I don't care. You guys are all evil. Yeah. Well, Angus really wants the NRA to continue to grow. So when Wayne becomes the head of the organization, Angus has to work his magic and rehab Wayne's public image. Luckily for Angus, Wayne is a pushover, which makes him pliable and easy to manipulate. Angus makes Wayne his main focus. They talk every day. Angus teaches Wayne how to speak in public. They even start a two-hour call-in

radio show called The Wayne Lapierre show to help grow Wayne's confidence and his brand. Wayne calls Angus his Yoda. They get close enough that Angus fills Wayne in on the out-of-pocket project. And when he tells Wayne to use it to buy some nice new clothes, instead of being mad that Angus is ripping them off, Wayne decides he wants to do it too. Angus's plan works. Wayne's public profile starts to rise. In 1994, Angus has another stroke of genius.

having Wayne write a book called Guns, Crime, and Freedom, with an introduction by Tom Clancy. The book actually makes it onto the New York Times bestseller list, and Wayne goes on a three-month tour to promote it. The tour is extremely hard on poor Wayne's sensitive nerves, but it helps establish him as a national political figure. This is the plot of many movies, pop person turning someone into a star.

This is miscingeniality. I mean, it's the plot of any teen movie, where there's a bet involved. Yeah. But it's also really interesting because it's so clear that Angus believes that investing in Wayne will help him. Like that's the potential everyone sees in him,

which I find so fascinating because by all accounts, he's such a dork. Yeah. Well, Angus has managed to turn that political dork into a right-wing celebrity, poised to lead the NRA into its new era. But his obsession with image and skimming money off the top

is about to clash with another powerful, figure inside the NRA. Neil, who's not so easy to manipulate. And when Wayne is forced to choose between them, his decision will change the landscape of right-wing politics forever. In November 1974, IRA bombs ripped through two Birmingham pubs killing 21 innocent people.

Hundreds more were injured. It was the worst attack on British soil since the Second World War. When a crime this appalling and shocking happens, you want the police to act quickly. And boy, did they. The very next day, they had six men in custody. Confessions followed, and the men were sent down for life. Good riddance, you might think, except those men were innocent. Join me, Matt Ford.

And me, Alice Levine. For the latest series of British scandal, all about the Birmingham Six. It's the story of how a terrible tragedy morphed into a travesty of justice. and how one man couldn't rest until he'd exposed the truth. Follow British scandal now wherever you listen to podcasts and binge entire series early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Hi, I'm Denise Chan, host of Scam Factory. You might remember hearing about our investigative series

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Ready to uncover the full story? Binge all episodes of Scam Factory now. Listen to Scam Factory on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. I feel like a legend. It's 1996 and Neil is at the NRA's offices, staring at the United States. a stack of paper. Five years ago, Neil and the rest of the NRA board voted to make Wayne the organization's chief executive. And while Wayne has become a national figurehead, Neil is growing impatient with his lack of aggression. Just last year, he told the LA Times that

Wayne was, quote, too nice. But now, Neil's starting to think Wayne's bland exterior is hiding something darker. The NRA's finances have been shaky ever since Wayne took over. And last year, they got so bad that the board's finance committee did a comprehensive review. Neal's reading their report, and it's not pretty. Mac reports and misfire that the audit shows Wayne's been throwing millions of dollars at ACMAC, as well as at a bunch of other vendors to help improve his public image. And to make things worse, he didn't have written contracts with most of them. This makes the details of his spending even harder to track,

and the impact on the organization's bottom line is staggering. Since Wayne took over, the NRA has lost more than $85 million in assets. Under his direction, the organization has also quietly taken another $51 million out of the NRA's long-term investments. Technically, they are on the verge of bankruptcy. There is something about Neil where, forgetting how I feel about their opinions, he's kind of true to what he claims to be true to. He's maybe more of a hardcore crazy person and they're more opportunistic.

Yeah, it's an interesting distinction. Well, Neil is furious. He spent the last 30 years rebuilding this organization from the ground up. The rest of the board is equally pissed. Wayne scrambles to respond to the audit. He fires 20% of the NRA's employees and even tells Neil he'll stop working with ACMAC.

Now, Sarah, Neil doesn't know this, but Wayne is actually still pulling one over on the NRA. The PR firm he hires to replace ACMAC is one of ACMAC's subsidiaries. He's pulling the exact same scheme, but trying to hide it from the board. But even without this knowledge, Neil has had enough. He wants Wayne to step down entirely. When it becomes clear this isn't going to happen, Neil resorts to what he does best, guerrilla tactics. In the months before the 1997 board meeting, Neil goes to war with Wayne and the press. They both take out ads and write open letters, Neil calls Wayne and his allies, quote, self-serving, irresponsible,

and incompetent, while Wayne says Neil is a fringe, right-wing nut job. Pretty soon, Wayne takes things even further by starting a campaign to vote Neil off the board entirely and replace him with the actor Charlton Heston. Charlton used to be a Democrat who supported strict gun control back in the 60s, but by the 90s, he was giving speeches about reverse racism and Second Amendment rights. Charlton's a famous firebrand who Wayne and his allies are betting they can use to get NRA members on their side. It's really interesting through this scam, seeing how the NRA is changing with society almost, where it's being provocative in a very obvious way to really be famous. And also even just the idea of having a celebrity be the new face of it, it's so current compared to what Neil does.

Yeah. Well, when the board finally convened, at the Seattle Convention Center for the 1997 meeting, they face a vote for Neal or Charlton. Neil, the man who once orchestrated his own coup against the NRA's old guard, watches helplessly as the votes are tallied. In the end, he loses his spot on the board to Charlton Heston

by just four votes. Now, Neil's going to have to sit back and watch as his former protege starts shooting from the hip and treating their precious NRA as his personal piggy bank. It's 1998, one year after Wayne and Charlton Heston sees control of the NRA. And in Washington, D.C., Susan marries Dorka, an ambitious blonde in her late 40s with a tight, 10 smile, has decided she wants to marry her boyfriend, Wayne Lapier. Some women might start dropping hints.

Others might pop the question themselves. But Susan isn't some women. She just sends out the invitations to their wedding without even telling Wayne. It's aggressive, but Susan is. knows her boyfriend better than anyone. He's a pushover. Years later, talking to a reporter about this situation, a co-worker will say that Wayne has, quote,

the backbone of a chocolate Eclare. Oh my God, what is up with this guy? These insults are crazy. You know what it is? Wayne is smart, maybe technically, but he is the definition of an empty vessel. Yeah. And everyone knows they could just put whatever they want into that

and he will do it because he's actually really competent, which is pretty rare because usually empty vessels aren't really that smart. Yes, competent, but with no thoughts of his own in his head. The perfect husband. In the lead up to the wedding, Wayne asks everyone from his co-workers to his secretary if he should go through with it. And he's still wrestling with it minutes before the ceremony. His best man even offers to drive him away from the venue,

but Susan and the priest convince him to go through with it. As usual, Susan gets what she wants. Susan grew up in a working-class family in Wisconsin, and she's ashamed of it. Ever since college, she's been working hard to distance herself from her upbringing by wearing expensive clothes and saying cruel things about poor people. In the 80s, Susan started working as a political fundraiser in D.C. About a decade later, she did some work for one of the NRA's biggest vendors. And that guy introduced her to the organization's rising star, Wayne.

From the outside, they might seem like a weird match. But like Angus, Susan sees Wayne as an easily moldable vehicle for her own ambition. They both like power and having access to the NRA's expense account. After the wedding, people start calling Susan the first lady of the NRA. She's outspoken, loud, and wears flashy designer clothes to the office. Her perfume is so strong that everyone smells her before they see her. Susan tells people that she's just a volunteer at the NRA. And technically, that's true.

She doesn't draw a paycheck, but she doesn't need to. Ever since Wayne learned about the ACMAC out-of-pocket project, she's used it to pay for whatever she wants, like her own professional security detail, and a car service she uses while traveling. Susan's taste for luxury is rubbing off on Wayne. The couple regularly flies private to places like Lake Como, Budapest, and the Bahamas. Susan finally has the life that she always wanted.

She's got money, power, and popularity. But being married to a pushover like Wayne isn't easy. Susan is basically his assistant. She answers his emails, makes important political decisions when he can't pick a side, and takes pictures with his cell phone when he needs them.

She's tied to him and the NRA for better or for worse. And things are about to get much, much worse. In December 2012, the Sandy Hook School shooting in Connecticut shakes America to its core. citizens and elected officials grieved the deaths of 20 first graders and six school employees. Stronger gun control laws could prevent this from happening again, but Wayne has other ideas. After hours of meeting with the Brain Trust at Ackerman McQueen, Wayne holds an official NRA press conference a week after the shooting.

The conference room at D.C.'s Intercontinental Hotel is packed full of reporters and news cameras, all waiting to hear how the NRA will respond to this moment. Looking stiff and defensive, Wayne gives a career-defining speech. The only way, the only way to stop a monster from killing our kids is to be personally involved and invested in a plan of absolute protection. The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. It's beyond sickening. I feel like Sandy Hook was such a shift in how people talked about gun violence.

It's not even worth rebuking because it's so obviously a lie and so evil, but it just shows how I don't think these people care about anything at all. Yeah, and it actually wasn't always this craven. 13 years earlier, after the mass shooting at Columbine High School, Wayne held a similar press conference. And back then, he said, the NRA believed in, quote, absolutely gun-free schools. Now, it's a different story. In response to the shooting, a bipartisan group of senators develops a bill that would require background checks for

guns purchased at gun shows or on the internet. It's a pretty modest response to America's gun violence problem. But everyone knows that any gun-related bill needs NRA approval to get through Congress. Wayne has supported background checks since the late 90s, and the NRA's lobbyists even get to help write the legislation, which means they can add pro-gun provisions, like banning the creation of a national gun registry. But it's still not enough. The gun rights movement's rank and file has become more extreme than its leaders. Now, the most hardcore members of the NRA are opposed to anything that even looks like compromise. Rival groups like the National Association for Gun Rights and Gun Owners of America start sending out mass emails telling their members to flood Wayne with calls

until the NRA backs off. After that, the NRA's lobbyists straight up stop communicating about the bill. When one of the senators they were working with finally manages to get an NRA lobbyist on the phone, all they can say is that the organization now fully opposes the legislation. Just the fact that this all has to happen

with the participation of the NRA is so backwards. And these leaders, they have the backbones of Eclares, really. Well, a few days later, the NRA not only withdraws their support for the bill, they mobilize their base against the very law they helped write. Pretty soon, senators are fielding phone calls and emails and huge numbers from angry gun owners. The pressure works, and even this limited background check mandate fails.

This feels like a tipping point. Even after the horror of Sandy Hook, Wayne and the NRA have made it clear that they will unequivocally defend access to guns. no matter who gets hurt. In the decade following the tragedy at Sandy Hook, there were 189 school shootings in the U.S., resulting in 279 casualties. Wayne has successfully used his influence

to push for one of the worst causes imaginable and helped pave the way for hundreds of deaths over the years to come. And now, he's free to focus on the most important thing in his life, his own image. Just a few months after the Sandy Hook shooting, Wayne and Susan take a much-needed break from all that stressful political stuff by going on safari. Along with a production crew, they're filming a big game hunting show called Under Wild Skies. And it just so happens that the host of the show is both the head of the production company

and the head of ACMAX subsidiary, the Mercury Group. The whole show is, of course, sponsored and funded by the NRA. Let me guess. This is a tactic to get them back to the, oh, we use rifles in so many ways kind of vibe and not just about killing people. Yeah, distract and deflect. It works every time. And Wayne and Susan have been taking these safari trips for years. Wayne's shot episodes of the show all across Africa, Europe, and the U.S. It's a great situation for everyone involved, except, of course, the animals being hunted on camera, and maybe the NRA's donors.

Susan gets an exotic vacation. Wayne gets to bill tens of thousands of dollars in travel and lodging to the NRA, and the producers of Under Wild Skies make good money, too. Between 2010 and 2021, the NRA will spend $18 million on the show. Sometimes Wayne and Susan bring their friends, and the NRA pays for all of their expenses too. But most of all, the NRA gets footage of Wayne staring over the horizon and looking like he knows how to shoot a gun.

You know, real macho hero stuff. In the years following Sandy Hook, Wayne and the NRA go right back to business as usual. And in the lead-up to the 2016 election, the organization makes its boldest electoral play yet, going all in on Donald Trump. The NRA spends more than $30 million backing Trump's candidacy. So when the infamous access Hollywood tape leaks, featuring Trump making vulgar comments about women, the NRA goes out on a limb to defend their country. candidate. The organization buys up a ton of ad time on Access Hollywood itself to run ads like this one, targeted specifically at women. She'll call 911. Average response time, 11 minutes.

Too late. She keeps a firearm in this safer protection, but Hillary Clinton could take away her right to self-defense. Don't let Hillary leave you protected with nothing but a phone. Wow. They're saying like, you can only really defend yourself. 9-1-1 takes too long and this is all we have and Hillary Clinton is going to take that away. It's just such a fear-mongering distraction from everything that Trump said and all the issues with the NRA and gun laws and everything. It's honing in once again on this fear that gets people so mobilized that you're the only defense you have and Hillary Clinton wants to make you defenseless. Yeah, you might say it worked shockingly well. We all know how the 2016 election turns out.

After Trump is elected, Susan even gets appointed to the board of the Parks Foundation, and for a minute, everybody's happy. But things aren't going to stay blissful for long. In fact, the Trump election might actually be the worst thing that could happen to the NRA. The organization is spending way more than it's taking in and attracting tons of attention from Democrats who want nothing more than to take it down. And it turns out that, after decades of scamming, Wayne, Susan, and Angus are going to be shooting blinks. On Boxing Day 2018, 20-year-old Joy Morgan was last seen at her church, Israel United in Christ, or IUIC. I just went on my Snapchat and I just see her face plastered everywhere. This is the missing sister, the true story of a woman betrayed by those she trusted most.

IUIC is my family and the best family that I've ever had. The UIC isn't like most churches. This is a devilish cult. You know when you get that feeling, you just, I don't want to be here. I want to get out. It's like that feeling of like I want to go hang out. I'm Charlie Brent Coast Cuth,

and after years of investigating Joy's case, I need to know what really happened to Joy. Binge all episodes of The Missing Sister exclusively an ad-free right now on Wondery Plus. Start your free trial of Wondery Plus on Spotify, on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or in the Wondery app. It's your man, Nick Cannon, and I'm here to bring you my new podcast, Nick Cannon at night.

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I feel like I let's it. In November 2018, Leticia James gets elected Attorney General of New York. Leticia has straight shoulder-length hair, and when she smiles, her grin is warm and toothy. There are a lot of people Lettisha would like to prosecute, and one of her biggest targets is the NRA. Lettisha thinks the NRA is willfully abetting gun violence. During the campaign, she gives an interview in Ebony Magazine

where she calls the NRA a terrorist organization. Soon after she takes office, she opens an investigation into the group's finances. Letitia subpoena's NRA leadership and demands records. And as she goes through the documents, she's shocked. For an organization that throws its weight around so publicly, the NRA is broke as hell. Since Trump's election, there's been an immediate, sharp decline in memberships and donations. In one way, this is pretty normal.

The NRA always suffers during Republican presidencies since its members don't feel as fired up or threatened by the government. But Leticia notices that the NRA isn't just in a financial slump. They're struggling to pay their staff. They've stopped keeping coffee in their office kitchens. They've been pulling money from different sources to stay afloat, including a nearly maxed out line of credit

and their charitable foundation. But amidst all of this, one number is still going up. Wayne's salary. He actually took a raise this year, bringing his total take-home pay to more than $2 million. Wayne also got the NRA to sign a contract guaranteeing that they'll keep paying him over the next 10 years, even if he stops working for them.

As Leticia reads through the company's internal memos, she learns she isn't the only person who has beef with Wayne. Oliver North spent the 80s brokering illegal weapons deals for the U.S. government, and that apparently qualifies him for his new job as president of the NRA. The president is usually just a figurehead, while the EVP runs the show. But Oliver wanted to take a more hands-on approach. He came in with plans for how the group could expand its reach, but when he started trying to implement them,

he quickly realized they had no money. So he started looking into the NRA spending on big-ticket items, including tens of thousands of dollars paid to an outside law firm run by Angus McQueen's son-in-law. Eventually, he asked the board to perform an audit of Ackerman McQueen. Wow, once again, a clearly evil guy, but who is very real about his intentions, can see right through these people.

Yeah, it takes someone evil, competent, and committed to the ideology to see that Wayne is evil, competent, and just a flat-out grifter. And then the lawsuit started flying. The NRA sued ACMAC for refusing to comply with the audit. Then they sued again for defamation, which was followed by an ACMAC countersuit. In June of 2019, after decades of working side-by-side,

ACMAC cuts ties with the NRA altogether. Just a month later, Angus dies of lung cancer. In his New York Times obituary, his son calls the NRA, quote, repugnant and cowardly. You know, once again in one of these stories, all it took was one person checking the books to unravel like decades of lies

and it's interesting to think like if they hadn't done this audit would it just have gone on forever? Maybe. Yeah, maybe. And as all of this is happening, Leticia just keeps building her case. It's clear that the NRA is already falling apart. All she needs to do is deliver the final push.

This happens on August 6, 2020. Lettisha holds a press conference for a sparse audience of socially-distance journalists. Here's what she says. Just a few minutes ago, my office filed a lawsuit against the National Rifle Association to dissolve the organization in its entirety for years of self-dealing and illegal conduct that violate New York's charity's law and undermine its own mission. Trying to fully dissolve the NRA is a huge task, even for someone this dedicated.

But while Letitia might not be able to fully end the NRA, she can at least take down its most high-profile executive. It's April 2021, and Wayne LaPierre is on the stand in a New York courtroom. He's been on trial for four days, and the judge is absolutely fed up with him. Sarah, can you read what he says to Wayne? Yes, he says, can you answer the questions that are asked, do you understand that I've said that to you more than a dozen times over the last day? So he's talking to him like he's a toddler.

Yeah, he is. And the thing is, this isn't even Wayne's big New York State trial. That one hasn't even started yet. This is a bankruptcy hearing. When New York State filed its lawsuit against the NRA, Wayne put on his tough guy act in public, calling it, quote, an affront to democracy and freedom.

But in private, he was scrambling. The NRA filed for bankruptcy as a way to try to weasel out. out of the New York suit. It was a rogue move. Wayne did it without telling the NRA lawyers, his top lobbyist, or most of the board. It also doesn't seem like it's going to work. Wayne is, to put it mildly, not great on the stand.

He gives long, rambling answers that run way off topic. He blurts out incriminating evidence about himself and his lawyer has to make him stop talking. At one point, he tells the court that he doesn't know his own phone number. And when he does figure out how to answer a question, it doesn't exactly help his case. Wayne sees himself as a perpetual victim who needs all of his crazy expenses, for security reasons. For example, it comes out that every summer for the last five years, Wayne and Susan have hidden out in the Bahamas on a Hollywood producer's 108-foot yacht.

Sarah, do you want to read Wayne's testimony about the yacht? Yeah, he says, I was basically under presidential threat without presidential security in terms of the number of threats I was getting and this was a one place that I hope could feel safe where I remember getting there going, thank God I'm safe, nobody can get me here.

What? Oh my. He's so out of touch. Yeah. You're just kind of like, do you understand what is happening around you and the situation you're in at all? Yeah, delusional. And after six days of Wayne's brutal,

testimony, the judge dismisses the NRA's bankruptcy claim, saying it was filed in bad faith. The legal process drags out until January 2024, when the NRA's New York corruption trial is finally set to begin. Just three days before it starts, Wayne finally quits as EVP of the NRA. And he says it's because he has chronic Lyme disease. But even after resigning, he still has to take the stand. And this time, he's at least slightly more prepared. The state's lawyer Lawyers present evidence of all the personal expenses he's charged to the NRA. At first, Wayne gives mostly yes or no answers. But as the trial goes on, Wayne pivots to a new strategy.

In the bankruptcy trial, he said he needed his fancy things for security reasons. Now, he says they are professional expenses because he needs to play the character of Wayne Lapierre. And therefore, all of his crazy spending was what he needed to do to keep up the illusion. He blames his extravagant clothes budget on the ACMA execs who told him he needed to dress a certain way and literally calls the clothes costumes. He explains that he needed to take his under Wild Sky Safari so he could be filmed hunting because he, quote, needed to build a rep and be seen as a hunter.

I needed to develop the street cred. Then he tells the jury that he would never take a shot without it being on camera. You know, in some ways, he's right, but not as a way to absolve him of being guilty. Yeah. Yeah, he was a character and he was shaped by these people. He was, quite frankly, nothing before this. He didn't have an identity, it seemed, which is funny enough, kind of what Hulk Hogan did with the sex tape. He said, there's a character of Hulk Hogan, and then there's Terry Bollahua, and he's trying to pull that, but it's just not really going to work.

Yeah. Well, at least Wayne is finally telling the. truth about how deeply he's been conning people, sort of. But you're right, Sarah, it still doesn't get him out of trouble. In February 2024, a jury finds Wayne and several other NRA higher-ups guilty of a number of charges, including corruption and financial misconduct. And a year later, on February 23, 2025, Wayne is found liable for self-dealing in order to pay the NRA back more than $4.3 million. He's also banned from serving on the NRA's board for 10 years. Earlier this year, Wayne appealed his conviction,

and in August, the Department of Justice subpoenaed Letitia as part of an investigation into whether she and her office violated the civil rights of Trump or NRA executives. Wayne's three-decade-long career at the head of the NRA might have come to an ignoble end. But the culture shift he oversaw, making gun owners feel like they're the victims of an all-out liberal culture war,

will be his legacy. Sarah, did you predict that the NRA would be so rife with scandal? I, for one, am shocked. I'd say I wasn't shocked. No, no, I think I... This is kind of what I thought, yeah, yeah. Right. Does it make you think differently about the NRA and their lobbying tactics

and how they have worked in the United States for the last 20 years? It is just so infuriating how passive the government is to lobbyists in general. I mean, it's almost like abstractly not even about the guns. It's just like the ultimate tool and cause to make people do what you want. I think they're just like shitty, rotten people, you know? I think the thing that bothers me so much about this is the demise of the NRA is their own financial malfeasance and not the fact that they are in Congress making sure that it is as easy as possible for people to get something that murders children.

You know, there's really so much to say, but I want to zero in on Wayne as a human being. I think he's one of our most pathetic scammers because it's like he stumbled into a scam and he worked as though he had no agency almost. Yeah, there's a pitifulness to this that he got swept up in all of this for an organization that he didn't even seem to really give a shit

about that much, that he had to fake it. I mean, having to admit that you have been in character work for the better part of your career is rock bottom. He really wanted to get out of that corruption charge. He was just so craven and boring and nothing and just this vessel for people to pour their bad thoughts into and then he would just go do them. You know how there are some people and you're like, oh, they obviously like married the first person they dated? Like, they didn't really make a choice. it just kind of was like, well, I guess this is what's going on. And that's it.

I'm okay with this. I think he's just cut from that cloth. It's such an interesting character study to me of this like total loser who shares behavior of like losers of the world, you know? I do wonder if you really pressed him just like, hey, between us, like, what do you really think about guns?

Like, do you really care? Did you care about guns at all? I feel like he just wouldn't even know how to respond. Wayne LaPierre might be our first personality hire scammer, except the personalities he doesn't have one, and that's why he was hired. I think it's really important for people to understand, like, sometimes the best personality you can have is no personality, you know? Yeah, this episode is really loser, boring, tedious man representation.

If you're listening at home and you think you can't be a scam artist because you're not compelling, let this be proof. You can do it. Loving scam influencers, get exclusive episodes and early access to new ones all ad-free on Wondry Plus. Join now in the Wendry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Before you go, help us out by taking a quick survey at Wondry.com slash survey. This is Wayne LaPierre, America's hired and fired gun. I'm Sachi Cole.

And I'm Sarah Hegey. If you have a tip for us on a story that you think we should cover, please email us at Scamfluencers at Wondery.com. We use many sources in our research. A few that were particularly helpful were Misfire inside the downfall of the NRA by Tim Mack. Even before his trial, the NRA's Wayne LaPierre was a fraud

by Mike Spies for the New Yorker and the Civil War that could doom the NRA by Sarah Ellison for Vanity Fair. Emma Healy wrote this episode, Additional writing by us, Sachi Cole, and Sarah Haggy. Eric Thurm is our story editor. fact-checking by Kalina Newman

Sound designed by James Morgan Additional audio assistance provided by Augustine Lim Our music supervisor is Scott Velasquez for Frieson Sink Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock Janine Cornelow and Stephanie Jens are development producers Our associate producer is Charlotte Miller Our senior producers are Sarah Eni and Ginny Bloom Our executive producers are Jenny Lauer Beckman

Marshall Louis and Erin O'Flaherty For Wondry Thank you.