Scheananigans with Scheana Shay - The Hardest Chapter

Episode Date: July 25, 2025

This week, Scheana and Brock have their most vulnerable conversation yet. In the wake of Scheana’s headline-making memoir, they speak candidly about betrayal, accountability, and the decision to share this chapter of their relationship publicly. Brock opens up about his past, the work he’s done to change, along with the hypocrisy they’ve each had to confront. Scheana shares what healing has looked like and how honesty has brought them closer. It’s a raw, emotional conversation about growth, forgiveness, and what comes next. Follow us: @scheana @scheananigans Co-Host: @brock Come see Scheana on tour & buy MY GOOD SIDE! More details available at www.mygoodsidebook.comEpisode Sponsors:Go to www.vivrelle.com and apply for a membership today using code GOODASGOLD for 50% off 1 month of membership - the code will also allow you to skip the Vivrelle waitlist.Learn more and join using my link. The first 1000 get a $100 credit toward their membership. Visit www.functionhealth.com/GOODASGOLD or use gift code GOODASGOLD100.Produced by Dear MediaSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. From Vanderpump rules to motherhood and everywhere in between. Warm up the kettle, it's time to spill some tea. Let's get into some shenanigans with Sheena Shay You ready for this oh Yeah, of course I am. Okay. Well Are you ready for this? Oh yeah, of course I am. Okay, well, everyone, today's episode is one of the most vulnerable and personal ones I've ever done. I think next to me talking about our mis something that's been incredibly difficult behind the scenes,

but something Brock and I ultimately decided together was important to talk about. So I'm sure by now you have read the excerpt from My Good Side or seen people speculating online. Maybe you've even read the full book by now because it's out today. But today I'm going to speak directly to it and this isn't for shock value, this isn't for headlines, but it's because if I'm going to share my truth, my story, I literally have to share all of it.

So Brock and I made the decision to open up about this part of our relationship because to be truly honest with each other I think we needed to be honest with ourselves and that meant being honest about this chapter too. So I think let's just get right into it if that's okay honey. That's fine by me. Alright so this story is a chapter in my book and the excerpt had released first in Glamour that was only

a short portion of it. I have been trying to stay out of the comment section but I do still see the headlines I do still have friends send me stuff so I've seen some of it you know saying I did this to sell books. I did this to get buzz. Someone told me that there's this whole, I don't know if it's on Reddit, a whole thing that says that we just made this up completely to sell books. I'm trying to angle for a spot on the Valley, which I want to just point out here. I've said it in a couple of interviews this week. I was on The Valley before it existed. Season eight of Vanderpump Rules was going to transition into what now is season 12 and what now is The Valley.

So I was a part of the first season, the second season, but also still had Vanderpump Rules season 11 and we thought season 12. So this is not me trying to angle for a spot on a show that I already had a spot on. I just want to point that out. It's also not because, you know, my hand was forced, because parts of this story were published as a blind item by a gossip account.

Honestly, I mean, I expected some of that feedback. I get it, but here's the truth. So this story isn't a stunt. It's not this thing to try and sell books. Okay, it is our real story. And unfortunately, it's one some of you listening might identify with. Sharing this story when and how I did was about agency. This excerpt with glamour published simultaneously when advanced

copies of the book were being sent out in full. Previous copies of the book that had went out had this chapter excluded. But that was the moment I finally felt safe enough to share it and not because I wanted to be part of a headline. Trust me, I do not want a headline, a magazine cover with just the word cheating across my chest, but it's because I wanted to own my own story before someone else told it for me. Copies of the book were going out. We had galleys going out. We have people who need to read it, to review it, and prepare for the podcast interviews they're doing with me. And at any point in time, someone could have leaked this.

So this was the way that I wanted to do it. And this wasn't a decision I made alone. It was something Brock and I talked through together. And, you know, it would have been seemingly easier to leave it out, but we both knew that that would be dishonest. I think it would feel extremely inauthentic to have a literal chapter of my life missing as a chapter in this book.

So, and you know, there's also, there's people out there who know about this. There was someone else involved, and at any point it could have been exposed by anyone completely out of our control. And I didn't want to live in that fear anymore. I don't think Brock wanted to live in that. So we wanted to share this on our terms with our voice.

And it's also important to say this. I want to just say that when you're writing a memoir, it really has to be the whole story. You know, when we were going back and forth between, will this chapter be in, will it be out? Maybe the book will be okay without it. And the book did sell with a very vague description of what this chapter could look like, but not putting it in the book.

It felt like a piece of it was missing. And if I couldn't stand behind what I'd written with full transparency, then like literally what's the point of writing a memoir at all? I felt like it needed to be in because I would be doing a disservice to the readers and to myself to put out a piece of work that I'm not completely proud of that felt incomplete. So we have talked about this so much, but for everyone listening, can you talk about the conversation we had when I told you I needed to include this

in the book and why you ultimately supported that decision? I mean, yeah, look, it's first off, I'm proud of you for telling your story and I'm sorry for this being a part of your story. But I would like to be, you know, to be clear with this part, the leak didn't tell the create or tell the truth. It was just a means to speed up the timeline of when we wanted to address this publicly. Now, and when you came to me about the book and we had a conversation about it, at the end of the day, this was your story to tell.

And yes, it involved, my actions became a part of it, but you have every right to tell your story, how you want to tell it. And if I was saying, there was a version of me trying to minimize that and protect our relationship, I think it was just going back to that, that trait that I had where I was just not willing to face the music. So when you told me about it, I said, you know, I support you and then I will read

it once you've written your book because they didn't want to have any influence on it. And so it's not about the book per se. I'd rather just talk about and take accountability for my actions that are in the book, you know. And for us, we decided to do that head on. We didn't want to sit there and protect our relationship on that level, considering that we needed this to move on through our relationship, I think. Yeah. I think too, what's been eye opening for me in all of this is kind of watching you just peel back the layers and really look at why you made the choices you did. I have spent a lot of time trying to understand,

you know, how could the man I love do this to me? In my first marriage, it was an emotional affair. Now in this marriage, it's a physical affair. And I know we've talked about your past, the person you used to be, but for the listeners who are tuning in just today, say they've never heard your story before, can you explain to everyone who that man was? And I'm not saying this as an excuse by any means, but just to give more context into the why and the how.

Yeah, look, we're in a tough position here because this is not an excuse. It is exactly, I wanna give more context because through the learning and developing and working on myself, you'll call it, there's definitely a part of me that fundamentally is a core of me. It's how I developed through my 20s, through my 30s, and it was from my youth.

And without making an excuse, you know, in 12 years of education, I ended up going to 15 different schools. So crazy. And from that constant instability, it really created this drive for achievement, the urge to kind of find my value in achieving things and things that I did. And I became super focused on that and it created this egomaniac. Like I needed to find my value in my achievements and, you know, I detached from a lot of my emotions easily. I minimized a lot of my destructive qualities and characters, my actions.

And you know, I kind of just... Did you just like not care about the consequences? Yeah, I just shrugged it off. I just, I just, that's a part of life, you know, I used to... And looking back on that now, I can kind of understand where there's a serious problem there. And it wasn't until I was open to learning more about that, where I realized, okay, I am a part of this problem, you know, and I

can change it. Those skill sets in my twenties and thirties definitely served me in kind of getting to where I am from Ipswich, from this boy from New Zealand, from a dairy farm. But then going into this father role and husband role, those, those skillset that I developed do not serve me well at all. When we first talked about this, I mean, not the night of, because there was a lot of anger that night, but after, you know, we started having more conversations and stuff about it and something that I've been saying in interviews this week is,

it was like you were, and I talk about this in the book, but it's like you were self-sabotaging because you didn't feel like from your past actions with your two older kids, you deserved a second chance at being a father. Yeah, look, and on that statement, even that in itself was just an example of me just deflecting and being that version of myself, right?

And it wasn't until the years later that I actually think about that. It's not okay to even have that as a response because that was just me, again, blaming other reasons outside of facing it up to myself. So I apologize for even saying that. I think I just didn't know how to handle that experience and how to handle that at all.

And I think inherently I always deflected to just the worst version of myself, which was just dismissing it and just like ignoring those things. Like I said, the skills that I developed didn't help me. So I apologize for like because even that's not in its full context. I was scared of being a parent again. I didn't think I, you know, I believed what I read. I believed I was a bad dad. I believed a lot of that stuff. And I just use that as an easy way out. And in reality is you just got to do the work and you have to like look at this front on and just own that. And so yeah, I used fair then and that's a part of this that I'm trying to work out of.

So it does creep in again through developing a better trade or a better skill set to work in as a human race, you know, trying to blend in with everybody, but it's just tough sometimes. And so I apologize for that one because I was just being weak in that moment and blaming other things instead of looking deep within. Do you now think that you do deserve a second chance at being a dad? I think everyone deserves a second chance. You just can't fuck up that second chance.

You know, you got to really, you've got to, you have to understand the rules of the game. And this is, you know, you're an adult. Life needs to. Be respected, you need to respect other people. This is not just me anymore. Like I said, I'm not single, I'm not running around. I'm a father and I'm a husband, you know, and.

That's a lot of responsibility. And so, yeah, I believe everyone deserves you know, and that's a lot of responsibility. And so, yeah, I believe everyone deserves second chances as long as they take advantage of their second chances. Yeah, well, can you kind of expand on that a little more and just talk about the work you've done to evolve over the past couple years and how do you feel like you've changed? More recently, yeah, I get held accountable

and we're in a very unique situation where we get held accountable. And I, if anything, it's probably made me a better version of myself because it's really forced me to hold myself to that standard of being a better person. And I love that version I am. And I would just now have to, the work that I'm focusing on is to be able to do that without the outside influence. And I think over the years, and I hope you've seen it, and even everybody else with social

and that you've seen that version of me, which is why I do have close friends supporting me through this that believe in the version that I want to be. And I'm not judging me for the version I was. Yeah. I've had to have a serious conversation with myself and through the therapy and through the work, looking back and deconstructing kind of my view of who I was as a person and I've used that skill set and that therapy to kind of build on the future of where I want to go from that. But the reality is like,, I know what I was.

I know what I did and I know what I could have lost. And that is what's helped me just focus on my family a lot more. And I think you guys have seen that. And I've been very public with that over the last couple of years, especially since we started working on literally physically working on our home from within and so outside of therapy, it's just quality time for my family. I'm just respecting the fact that at the end of the day, what I've done doesn't define who I'm going to become.

Do you ever think about if I had found out when you actually did it and I did leave, what your life would look like today? Yeah, I would never have been held accountable for my actions. And I would probably be doing the same stupid things, blaming other people for the same reasons why I'm in that situation every day. And that's kind of like, that has been tremendous in my development of,

or at least my growth, because I've never been modeled that type of forgiveness before. I've always had a toxic environment based on me bringing that into it. And forgiveness was an emotion that growing up I never had, I don't think. I mean, that was kind of one of the hardest parts for me is that you kept this from me for two years. Yeah, I was pregnant, almost died in labor. Then I'm a new mom dealing with postpartum OCD

and I don't even know it. And then you proposed, we got married twice, literally said vows twice. And I know I had this question and you know, our audiences had it as well, but why did you wait? Were you trying to protect me? Were you trying to protect yourself? Did you just think if I tell her now what I did last night, she's gonna leave? Like, why did you wait so long?

I was just protecting myself, you know. I was an absolute coward. That man was a coward and he wasn't thinking about protecting you. He was just thinking about protecting himself, saving his face. You know, going back to what I was doing, I would just minimize my actions and compartmentalize it, put it in a box. But in this situation, I wrote it in a letter and then tried to forget about it. And I believe that I was never going to do it again and we could just move past this and I was just saving face, I think, at the end of the day.

And that was not, you know, it was selfish. It was a self preservation tactic, you could say. And it was just another level of betrayal that I put on top of the first one. You know? Well, yeah. And I mean, it wasn't just a one time thing. You know, you didn't realize it was wrong after the first time, the second time. I mean, it was more than a few times.

So what made you finally end it or did she end it? No, if we get into the nitty gritty of it, me minimalizing it, it was exactly that. I minimized what it was. It was a sexual affair. There was no dating. There was no courting. It was just purely that meetup and then we had sex.

And it happened multiple times. And then over a three week span, and I felt horrible about it. And I was like, this is not okay. I'm not doing this. And I pulled the pin and then I forgot about it. I compartmentalized it. I put it back there and I forgot about it.

And it wasn't until we went back to San Diego a year and a half later, because again, this was a skill set that I've developed over 10, 15 years. I wasn't good in relationship with people. I was great to people. But when it came to emotions, I was never skill set that I've developed over 10, 15 years. I wasn't good in relationship with people. I was great to people. But when it came to emotions, I was never available like that. And so then I didn't, it didn't come back until a year and a half later. We've gone through this. We got married.

We've had summer and she's a year and a half. And then we go back to San Diego. We're hanging out there. And then I ran into some of our old friends that we used to hang out with. And that was the reminder of like damn that's my destructive actions might cost me everything and then since then it was just been building up and building up and then eventually ended up telling you. If it weren't for Scandival and all of the rumors that were coming out about

you during that time do you think you would have ever told me? Yeah, look, the Scandival was fire on the flame, but the pressure I felt from being in San Diego, writing that letter, I remember I wrote the letter and it just carried with me. And every day it just got bigger and bigger and bigger and the weight was heavier and heavier. And Scandival on the side of it all was an element, but it wasn't the core reason. I remember going to the gym and it was just trying to convince myself, if you want to be a better version of yourself, you have to have it. And what I was listening to, it was like a speech and it was just about having tough conversations.

And so I realized that in order for me to to actually have a healthy relationship with you, one based on complete honesty, I needed to address this. I've readdressed with you with my ex and everything like that, and this was the one thing that was hanging over me. It burned a hole in my heart. It really did. And then I knew that I had to tell you and that was even the hardest thing What was going through your mind knowing that we were about to sit down? Watch housewives and you were gonna tell me this is this something you were thinking about all day on Easter What did you think my reaction was gonna be? Did you expect me to kick you out? Like I'm just wondering

What was going through your brain all day? It was it was the whole time since I wrote that letter until then it was always there. And then the day of I was at the gym and literally I had that motivational speech and it was kind of like encouraging you to do these hard things. So as soon as I went to the gym, I came home and I was like, you got to do it, you got to do it, you got to do it, you got to do it. And I, and it was as soon as I made that decision to tell you, I came home and I sat down, I think, no, we're watching Housewives.

Wasn't paying attention or anything It was just my heart was fucking throbbing through my chest and I had to sit down and I had to tell you but I had and then I had to Be direct. I had to tell you as much information I could give you without trying to like sugarcoat it because I Didn't want to keep being this guy that gave myself excuses. So I just had to grab it by the horns and just take it on. Looking back, there's things that I think about and question if it was a guilty feeling. Like, for example, you were so amazing when more in the second and third trimester

with like the stretch mark cream and every single night I got a massage, you put all the cream on me. Like was part of just like those extra nice things that you did for me after you had this affair part of feeling guilty? I don't think that was guilt because, and looking back on it,

it was, this is crazy to say out loud and no one has to believe me on this. But once I made the decision to move on from that, I didn't think of it. And we were golden. It wasn't until post baby, we were happy in hell in San Diego with James and everybody came down, we went to that festival and I ran to friends of mine. I was like, damn, this is wild. I'm going to lose everything.

And so yeah, that didn't change who I was with you. We just went through that pregnancy together and I was really proud of like doing that with you. It wasn't that there was no, like, it wasn't premeditated or because of the affair, I got to be extra. I just committed. It was just something I thought about the other night and I was like, huh, because every time I ask you to get a knot

out of my shoulder now, you get so annoyed. But I mean, I was pregnant also, but I just wondered if that was like. You know the reason why I do that. Cause you say to fix it myself. No, yeah, yeah. You just want, honey, we're talking about me being accountable and now you're gonna stir me up like that?

Honey, it was just something I thought about the other night as I had a knot in my shoulder and I was like, can I ask Brock to get this out? You're saying if you asked me the other day, I gave you a massage. When you're consistent working on yourself and taking it into your hands, I will help you always. I am not carrying you. I will be there for you. When you're pregnant, I'll carry you. But when you're a fully functioning adult.

When the surrogate's pregnant, can I get treated as if it's me? Listen, I do my best to treat you as my beautiful partner and I support you. One other thing though that I've wondered and never asked you about, looking back on the day of our, I'll say second wedding, the one that the world saw,

when you were saying your vows to me and you were so emotional, did this come up? Were those guilty tears or were those just pure love? That was the happiest day of my life, honey. Again, it's a psychotic path of me. I had that ability to just forget it. That's wild. It was.

And I just moved on with my life until the damage that came back up from it popped back up. And no, I remember our wedding and the words coming out, it was just pure emotion. And if anyone wants to look at my brain scan, there is evidence that I don't do too much other thinking except for emotion. I'm very emotional with things. It's interesting because yeah, I don't have that depth of emotion, but I have emotion. So no, I generally was just in love with that day. You walked out, we had that, the rainbow was over there.

What was awesome about our wedding was like all our friends got to hang out with each other for three days beforehand. So they got to share stories of how they knew each other and they just really, it really just kind of brought out two worlds together. So no, that that has, and my relationship with you has always just been that I've put it to, I forgot about it. And then when it came back up, it ate me, it ate me alive. And there's like, when I was younger, I got in trouble once and I tried to steal something.

And then I literally returned it two days later. Because I have a conscience, like I may be an asshole and I come across as an asshole, but I do have a heart in there. Well, on that note, we're gonna take just one break and we'll be right back with the rest of this. Okay, so anyone who knows me knows if I'm getting something of luxury. I'm getting it on a site like Vivrel.

Okay, I'm not going into the designer stores or anything. Vivrel is the first of its kind. Luxury accessories, it's a members only club providing members to access to borrow designer handbags, jewelry, watches, diamonds. So whenever I have something designer, just know that I got it from Vivrel. Members can treat the Vivrel closet like their own.

They can borrow anything within their tier. Viverelle has no return dates. And also, members can swap items once per month. Or this is my favorite part, keep items for as long as they'd like. Memberships start at $45 a month. The most popular is the Classique tier for 119 a month. And there's no better time to sign up because the inventory is incredible. I mean, we're talking Hermes, Fendi, Saint Laurent, Dior, and so much more. And you can use code good as gold to get 50% off your first month of membership.

Go to www.vivrel.com and apply for a membership today using code. Get out of your home. For 50% off one month of membership. The code will also allow you to skip the Vivrel wait list. That's V-I-V-R-E-L-L-E.com. Use code. Get out of your home.

For 50% off a one month membership. All right, one thing in my forties, I'm definitely making sure I am on top of my health. I chose Function because it's the only health platform that gives you access to the kind of data that most people will never see and the insights to actually take action. So inside function, you can test for over 160 biomarkers from heart

and hormones to toxins, inflammation, and we all know what the number one is for me, stress. That's right. You can also access multi-region MRI and CT scans, all tracked in one secure place over time. It's a near 360 view to see what's happening in your body. That's why top health leaders like Dr. Mark Hyman, Dr. Andrew Hubberman, and Dr. Jeremy London

are all behind Function Health. Some of the Function Health test examples include Mastering Stress, Cortisol and DHEA, Food and Emotions, Optimizing Hormones, Appetite Control, and these are all included in a Function Health membership. Learn more and join using my link. The first thousand get $100 credit towards their membership. Visit www.functionhealth.com slash Get a gift code.

Or use gift code goodasgold100 at signup to your own health. Mom, you forgot to say your book. Forgot to say my book? That I have a book out? Yeah. My book is called My Good Side. Good side? Yeah.

Did everybody read mommy's book? Yes. I love you. Love you, bye. Okay, bye. Okay, so we do have to talk about the hypocrisy. You were very vocal on the last season of Vanderpump Rules about transparency and people owning their stories while hiding this.

Myself as well, not just saying you, this was both of us. But as a question for you, how do you reconcile that man on screen then with the man sitting here right now? I mean, I don't think there's very much justification. It was exactly what it was. It was hypocritical of us. The hypocrisy was real. And that's just a very bright example

of literally me pointing the blame and you know, smoke and mirrors and like, oh, so it was just, it wasn't okay. Ariana definitely was going through it, her and Tom situation. And I kind of played the coward way out and was just like, well, if that's happening, we can just try and preach forgiveness because we knew what we were going through. But we didn't, I didn't have the courage to stand up for it. I apologize for that.

I think it was another piece of the damage that I left behind in my wake, another example. And it's one thing to know that you have flaws, but then it's another thing to see it played out on national television. Yeah, no, I mean, we were sitting on a huge secret. And so I absolutely understand that criticism. I get it.

I agree, you know, but at that time, I wasn't ready to talk about this. I certainly don't think you were ready to talk about this. I don't know that our marriage would have survived if we did talk about it that season. I felt like we were still very much in the middle of processing it privately. I hadn't talked to my family about it yet,

literally like no one knew. Your sister, Neema and Mark, that was it. And you know, I wasn't about to start unraveling all of this on camera before I had even processed what it meant for our marriage, for our daughter, for our entire life. I didn't know if I was going to be strong enough to stay. It can be easier to just walk away after a betrayal

and just hands are clean and be done. So sure, I could have disclosed it then, but I would have been speaking from a place of extreme confusion, pain, fear, you know, not clarity of any sort. I just, I wasn't ready. And I think I've learned the hard way once you say something on camera, it's out there forever, you know, even if it's not my original thought.

If I repeat someone else's words, it is out there forever and I have to be accountable for it. And knowing if we put this on the show, if we put this in the book, our daughter is going to find out about it one day. She's going to see it. She's going to read it. We're going to have to have a conversation with her. Thankfully, not for a very long time. But I wanted to be sure of what I was going to say if I was ever going to share it before it was on the show, you know, with our inner circle, with our family.

I wasn't ready to share it with the world. And I think that this is a big part of where I've evolved because I now looking back, hindsight is 2020, Ariana had every right in the world to protect her peace. That was her reality and she was giving us 100% that it was hard for me to see at the time, but I wasn't giving 100% because I wasn't ready to, but like Ariana didn't owe anyone a resolution

on anyone else's timeline. I understand completely why she walked away from that conversation. And those type of boundaries that she has, that's something in general I'm envious of, of people. I don't have that strength always. I don't think you knew you could just say no to production. I feel like you... I would have thought I'd get fired. Yeah, I've never had that confidence to hold a strong boundary. I just I show up, I do my job.

I have the conversations I need to have. And that was one thing looking back where I'm like, damn, that was a boss ass move. To just say, I'm protecting my piece. Yeah, it took power and she said that very clearly to us. Yeah. And... Like watching her do that, even though I don't think I fully understand it at the time,

but it did help me start unpacking some of my fears around setting boundaries. That is something that I want to be better with because I've always been a people pleaser, especially when it comes to authority production, you know, I just, I, I felt like I had to show up, I had to deliver or I could lose everything. And I wasn't willing to do that. So I said some things in the moment that did not age well.

I'm the first to admit that, you know, I own that. And I also think that's what growth looks like you know Realizing where you were wrong and using that to do better in the future to evolve I Also think that with reality TV and this was one thing I was saying at the time I'm like well, we agree to you know show a hundred percent of our lives We do sign up for that. However, some things can remain private until we are ready to discuss them.

Just because a conversation happened last night doesn't mean tomorrow I have a lunch scene. We have to disclose it. Although you and your friend group love a good disclosing conversation. However, with this, I felt like it's not that I'm never going to say something, but I'm going to say something on my own timeline when I'm ready to say something. I don't owe it to anyone to say it tomorrow because I found out last night. Yeah. And, you know, we've been through hell and back with this, but we're doing the get to grow up, evolve, you know, and be humans on a public platform.

Wild. So we get to go back in time and watch our friends say things behind our backs. Like there's nothing normal about this. But I do have another question for you. For me, for Summer, for your older kids, and for everyone watching our journey listening to this podcast, what is your promise moving forward? Well, look, this one, and I would like to add in here, I've learned two lessons. One was from my now wife,

and then recently I learned another lesson from my ex, and that was one of, you know, in our relationship, in a relationship and a family, when one needs space, they don't need to ask for it. You should just give them space and then when they need you to support, you step in. It was a bit more in the text, but it was a good- It was a very long text, one that you have to click

to expand and I read the whole thing. You needed to hear that. I'm proud of her for saying that and I agreed with what she said. I did too and I read the whole thing, you needed to hear that. I'm proud of her for saying that, and I agreed with what she said. I did too. I think that's what made it so hard for you, is that you knew she was right. Yeah, I think admitting when you're someone's wrong,

when you have an ego, is a problem, you know? And I'm the problem, and I don't care with that, but I would like to say, like, my promise isn't, you know, asking for forgiveness from the listeners, it's more of a promise to you and our family and my family that I will keep showing up. I will keep doing the work. I will continue to be honest and build a

foundation, our family on a foundation of honesty. And. honest and build a foundation, our family on a foundation of honesty. And I want to be a living example of what a man can be after he shows his worst parts of himself. And that's what I want to be for you, for Summer, for my older two kids, and for anybody else out there who has made mistakes. Yeah. I know this isn't an easy topic to discuss. So I mean, I do appreciate you doing the podcast and sitting here with me.

I can see it in your eyes. I know this is. I did good. We got through that, but it was rough. It's rough to have to like realize that your actions have betrayed the ones that you love, you know? Yeah. So I apologize to you, my love. And, um, for everybody else out there, you got to back off to be honest.

I feel like there's a lot of opinions that get thrown away and if all we need to do is look in a mirror. Okay. I'm a hypocrite. People are hypocrites sometimes. And I will fight for my wife till the end of the day. And so if anyone has a problem with this affair, they shouldn't be coming and attacking her, they should be coming to me and I'll be more than happy to buy you a coffee and you can tell me how you feel.

OK, but people got to realize like I grew up not in front of cameras for 12 years. I made this many fuck ups. I could only imagine what it's like for you and your friends to have to do that on national platform and then somehow find out who you are, build some confidence in your ability to own who you are and you're my world honey and I've got your back. I want you to know that. I know you do. I've got your back and if anyone else wants to have a crack at my wife

We're welcome to do you go through me? well the crack that a lot of people I think are wanting to have at me is why did I stay and yes, you know, I think there were a lot of nights where I Didn't know if I could stay. There were moments, months, I was just convinced that the damage was too deep, the trust was too broken, and I didn't know if I would ever be able to forgive you, to trust you again.

And that's why I didn't tell anyone. I did not want a single outside opinion. I didn't want my mom saying I should do this, my friend saying I should do this. I needed to figure it out for myself. And that was a very hard decision for me to make, to just suffer in silence for so, so long. But I felt like I, thanks honey. This fell out of there for me.

It just popped up out of nowhere that one. I felt like I really had to look at the entire picture here and you didn't run from this. You didn't minimize it or deflect. You looked me in the eyes and you took full ownership. And I know that was probably one of the hardest things you've ever had to do. But you really have shown me through your actions,

not just your words, because words can only mean so much after a betrayal like this. But you have truly showed me through your actions that you were committed to us and committed to changing, you know, that person who you were for so long. And I also felt like I didn't want our relationship solely defined by this transgression from years prior, you know, for that to outweigh all of the positive moments

that had happened since then, the life we had built together. I've truly never had a partner who is so supportive and involved and is encouraging as you are. You hold me to a really high standard that sometimes is frustrating, but it's because you know what I'm capable of. And you push me in a way that no one else has ever pushed me before because you believe in me. Yeah, baby. You got it. And that really means a lot. Like, I know that you're my biggest fan and you're an amazing partner to me. You're an incredible dad to Summer. And you're a person who reminds me every day

that I deserve happiness too, you know? So this wasn't easy, it isn't easy, it hasn't been, you know, easy to work through, a huge struggle in our relationship. And I think that this situation, as crazy as it sounds, has in a lot of ways brought us closer. I think that this situation, as crazy as it sounds, has in a lot of ways brought us closer. It has changed us in positive ways. And I'm really glad that we've been able

to turn a dark moment in our relationship into a moment of just a deep reflection, for both of us. For both of us, yeah. Individually. Yeah. And just because, you know, I chose to work through some of the hurdles in my marriage,

it doesn't mean that's always the right decision for someone else. And I literally say that in the book, you know, for Tom and Ariana, there was too much damage done. It was irreparable. And, you know, for Tom and Ariana, there was too much damage done. It was irreparable. And, you know, but for us, as I say at the end of this chapter, you know, infidelity is always going to be a part of our story, but it's not going to be the way our story ends. So I'm not here to advocate for anyone doing what I did.

You know, if you find yourself in my shoes, which I truly hope you don't, you have to do what's best for you. And I know that sometimes even if a person might not want to throw in the towel on their relationship, their boundaries, their sense of trust, it's just been violated beyond a point of repair. And I don't think there's any amount of time or therapy sessions that for some people, you know, are enough to rebuild. Sometimes the only way forward is a new direction.

And that's what I am so thankful, though, for us that we were able to rebuild and repair. And it is, you know, something that we're working on still every day, we have our moments, I have my insecurities, I don't wanna ever question where you are, but I will say and you probably don't know this because this isn't something that I tell you, but I think you would be very proud of me that when you tell me you're going to an event, like maybe I check

your location and make sure you've made it there safely, but I don't always. I just trust now that you are where you're telling me you're going. You could tell me you have an event in Culver City. I don't know what address that is. That could be an apartment complex, but I've gotten so much better with the intrusive thoughts that I'm not going straight to that dark place like I went to probably for the first year or more. And- Well, listen, if I'm going to like an event, it shouldn't be in a complex.

So we're very clear. And if it was, I will tell you we're at a complex. I'm not looking up the address of where you're going. I don't know where it is if you're... The point I'm trying to say is I'm not tracking you because you've proven that I can trust you again. I will still have that voice in the back of my head that's like, are you sure?

Sometimes. Like when I saw you swipe and delete that text when we were at mini golf last week. And I'm like, the fuck was that? Who is that? And you're like, it was a spam text. And I'm like, the fuck was that? Who is that? And you're like, it was a spam text. And I'm like, I don't delete texts. So yeah, I'm gonna have those triggers,

and I think those are warranted, but. Very warranted, and I will take it. Can I add something real quick on that? Because I know I shouldn't go on social media and look at the comments. You shouldn't, anybody. You should create content, Don't consume it. But the narrative of, you know, the burden that they, the fact that I had an affair and the burden

it puts on women. Like if you stay with me, you have no self-worth. If you leave, you can't keep a man. And then there's the other woman, you know, if there's another woman, she's a home wrecker. And it's ridiculous. And honestly, fuck you guys for coming at my wife like that. I'm the one that portrayed her and you're going to judge her based on her actions when she was 20 something. I have a problem with that because reality is I'm the problem here. She's just telling her story and you guys want to hear her story. So I love you, honey.

I love you. Anyone that has a problem with that, you know where to find me. So where do we go from here? You know, we're still healing. There's no perfect bow to wrap this all up with. We have our good days. We have our hard days. But one thing I do know is that this honesty, as I said earlier, I think it's really brought us closer.

I think transparency has allowed us to rebuild on something solid. I think choosing to share this, you know, with the world is healing in its own sense too. It's part of it. So last thing I'm gonna say, so if you're someone who has faced betrayal or shame or judgment for staying, I see you, I'm with you, you are not alone. And if cheating was the end of your story,

I completely understand that too, because sometimes you do have to walk away, but I also just wanna be a person here to say, sometimes it is okay to stay. And yeah, I think on that note, thank you for being here, honey. I know every time you're here, it's kind of like you're in the hot seat.

It's not really like fun hot topics, but I appreciate it. I do it to myself. So if this is a way of me, you know, allowing everyone to see that I am being accountable for my actions, of course I'm gonna be here. Yeah. I'm gonna support you.

And I'm gonna hold myself to a standard that everyone else holds me to, which is great. Thank you. I need that. And I appreciate it. Of course. And thank you to everyone for letting us share our story today.

And not for pity, not for clout, but for connection, you know? And sometimes the hardest truths are also the most human. So, with that said, if you haven't already read my book, it's now just fully available. You could probably get it tomorrow on Amazon Prime. So you can go to my goodsidebook.com, come see me on tour this summer. I will be touring for the next couple of weeks all over the country.

And you can check out my goodsidebook.com for all of the details. Thank you all so much for listening and we'll be back next week, probably doing shenanigans from the road. Bye. ["No Trouble," by The Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of Bunche of every week on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you like to listen.