Scuffed | USMNT, World Cup, Yanks Abroad, futbol in America - #491: The Brickyard Battalion on the future of pro soccer in Indianapolis

Episode Date: May 16, 2024

David Ziemba and Kyle Jeanor, the president and secretary of the Indy Eleven supporters group the Brickyard Battalion, join Belz to catch us up on the latest from Indianapolis, where the USL team's stadium plans are on hold after the mayor and Major League Soccer started discussing bringing in a new franchise with new ownership and a different stadium plan. Very much an evolving situation, but Ziemba and Jeanor help sort it all out. Progress has been made.———Subscribe to Scuffed on Patreon! Patrons get a private feed for the Monday Review, which is, among other things, a run-down of club action for national team players every week with Watke and Vince. We have recently added patron-only content that’s available every Friday. Patrons also get access to our private Discord server, live call-in shows, and the full catalog of historic recaps we've made: https://www.patreon.com/scuffed OTHER LINKSScuffed on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAoundrEkZUgZ13IE5XIqrg We’ve streamlined and revamped the merch we’re selling. Check it out: https://www.scuffedhq.com/store Scuffed on Discord: https://discord.gg/X6tfzkM8XU Skip the ads! Subscribe to Scuffed on Patreon and get all episodes ad-free, plus any bonus episodes. Patrons at $5 a month or more also get access to Clip Notes, a video of key moments on the field we discuss on the show, plus all patrons get access to our private Discord server, live call-in shows, and the full catalog of historic recaps we've made: https://www.patreon.com/scuffedAlso, check out Boots on the Ground, our USWNT-focused spinoff podcast headed up by Tara and Vince. They are cooking over there, you can listen here: https://boots-on-the-ground.simplecast.comAnd check out our MERCH, baby. We have better stuff than you might think: https://www.scuffedhq.com/store Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to the SCuff podcast where we talk about U.S. soccer. Our guests today are David Zimba and Kyle Janor of the Brickyard Battalion. David's the president. Kyle's the secretary. And the Brickyard Battalion is the Indie 11 supporters group. As you all may know, there's been a bit of a soccer dust up in Indianapolis over the last three weeks. The Indie 11, a club that plays in USL, had a new stadium in the works. But that's now hanging in the balance because Major League Soccer initiated talk.

with the mayor of the city about bringing an expansion team to the city, including plans for a different stadium at a different location. David and Kyle are going to help us sort through this, and whether they like it or not, the future of American soccer. Fellas, thanks for taking the time. Yeah, that's big. We'll try. We will do our best.

Happy to be here. So let me ask this. As I understand it, the ownership of Indy 11 has tried to join MLS since it was founded. 11 years ago. And the new group looking into getting an MLS team seems to have maybe a different, I don't know, political, financial situation, maybe not. Would you rather the city have a major league team with new ownership or a minor league team with the current ownership?

Well, that's a bright line. Let me tackle that one second, right? Tackle it however you want. Yeah, so the first one is the first one is the first. first question is kind of just, you know, what's going on. We don't know who the new investors are. I don't like to call them the new ownership group because that's not technically from the research and investigation that I've done kind of where they're at. Okay. It's an investor group. We don't know who they are. We just know that Mr. Glick, Tom Glick, is their kind of spokesperson at this point. And that they are still trying to hand them. camera out the details behind the scene of what percentages everybody gets if this thing happens. Okay. You know, Indy 11 has been around since 2013.

We started it in 2011 as the battalion. We were actually created in order to bring a professional soccer team to Indianapolis and create an atmosphere that was welcoming. And Mr. Osterner, lo and behold, decided that we had kind of earned that reputation enough to start a franchise in NASL. he has applied previously twice for an MLS franchise tag one was in 2017 the other one was in 2019 both of them were not supported by the mayor at the time

or the city and so I that kind of had you know a negative connotation I think probably to the application and we also at that point point did not have the groundwork settled for a stadium that is necessary for that kind of an application. Everything was still kind of in the balance. However, we had started working with the club and the city to get that framework with the state government, which is also here in Indianapolis.

Legislation passed in 2019 at the state house providing a specific tax benefit for it. We're very welcoming to sports franchises and sports stadiums here in Indiana. We love them. It's a great revenue for the state. It is. We are one of the biggest convention sites in the world. And so we do big events incredibly well. In fact, in two weeks, we're hosting the Annapolis 500.

We do it every year. And there's like a million people who come in for that every year in May. And we handle it without batting an eye. So we do big things really, really well. So that's kind of the framework, the backstory. of that whole thing. Kyle, anything you think I missed on that?

No, I think you summed up kind of the background as far as where we've been with MLS in the past and how we do really big events. The input I had was more on the minor league team versus major league team. I feel like Indie 11 gets an unfair rap as a minor league team in air quotes. in Indianapolis, we're blessed with the Colts and we're blessed with the Pacers. We don't have a professional, well, a major league MLB team. We have the Indianapolis Indians who are AAA, minor league teams. So when people think of the 11, sometimes they'll associate with them possibly unfairly.

They are a professional team. They play in the USL championship, as you said, which is just Division 2. So Haji Wright is playing for Coventry out in England, Division 2 over in England. for example. If I personally, and this is me, separate from the BYB, separate from anything else, had my wish, we would play in the U.S.L championship until the heat death of the universe. I have interned for Indy 11 in the past. I love the U.S.L championship. I love what they do in promoting soccer around the country.

I love what they've done to grow the game in America with so many of the smaller markets. But I am one person. I recognize that my opinion may not be everyone's opinion. In the end, whether it's the major league soccer team, whether it's a Division 2 team, what I think I and most of the members of the BYU want is a team period. When all this came about, we were a little bit unsure of maybe what is the future, what's going to happen next. So the discussion of MLS or USL championship went out the window, and in the end, what we want is in the 11, whether that is in USL championship or Major League Soccer. Okay.

I think that's to be underscored, right? Like bold, italicized, underline the whole nine yards, 45 font is, you know, what I think everybody has coalesced around within the BYB is. is that owners come and go, leagues come and go. Obviously, we've jumped from NASL to U.S.C, which is the moniker that we use. It happens. I mean, leagues come and go, owners come and go. But we've built this club in this community, and we considered our family at this point because it's been 13 years of us doing this.

And regardless of how things happen and where the money falls, and if there's a stadium one way or the other way, if it's Indy 11, we're good. We'll follow the crest and the colors and the community wherever it goes. And obviously we can't speak for everybody because the battalion is an umbrella organization, right? We've got all these affiliates that kind of feed into us. But for the most part, that's kind of how everybody feels. You know, we are loyal to what we've cheered for and loved for so long that if it happens to be that we end up in MLS, Okay. I mean, well, it might not be what everybody wants, but that's where the team goes. That's where we'll go. We don't really have control. It's not about the ownership group. It's not about the league. It's about the, it's about the club. It's about. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, obviously we've loved Mr. Ostmer. He's been a phenomenal owner. You know, he's got some, maybe some personal things that people don't agree with. But again, welcome to being a part of a family.

You know, there are parts of my family I don't like. I think everybody can say that. But, you know, he takes care of us and makes sure that the club is good at the BYB, and we have a great working relationship. And again, it's a family. We're not going to agree all the time on things. In fact, for the last three weeks, there's been times where we don't agree on things. But that's okay.

It's going to happen. You know, we don't control what the club does. They don't control what we do. And we're all kind of fighting for the same thing, which is, is, the continuation of what we've built for the last 13 years. So you, I know you've told me before we started, you've taken, you've taken a little bit of flack for some comments you made on TV about what happened in San Diego and St. Louis when MLS came in. And maybe you could just sort of repeat that in the, you know, in its full context. What did you learn about what happened in St. Louis and San Diego? Yeah.

Well, the FYI, WFYI interview was a radio thing, and Jill Sheridan did it. Jill's a great reporter. The whole kind of context of the thing was there's two avenues in which this kind of occurs in the last 15 years. There's been five cities in which the MLS has come in and said, we're going to, we're going to plop a team down here, right? you well know through Minnesota that's probably kind of where it all started and then you've got Cincinnati

and Nashville and in those three situations from the outside looking in because I don't know the whole story those USL teams kind of and the support groups were really kind of brought along right everybody kind of lynched in together there was an infestor group the original team owners were brought into that thing

the colors were stayed the same you messed with the logo a little bit the name a little bit but everything kind of just everybody worked together, right? There wasn't a lot of controversy. In the other end of that spectrum, seems to be, seems to be, St. Louis and San Diego. I've talked with the San Diego president, the supporter group support president, and, you know, from those situations, the USL team that was there was not brought along, right? And so the supporter group had to make a decision. you know and and that puts them in a very awkward hard place to be obviously they're going to support

soccer that's what they do that's you know why they exist but what i i think the context that got left off is i don't want that to happen here in indianapolis what i want to have happen is the first scenario which is everybody is working together and there's a PR photo with everybody on a stage and we're all shaking each other's hands and smiling and pat each other's backs and it's Indy 11 behind us and the big crest and everybody's got a hard hat and a shovel and that's what I would like. It's what I've expressed to the city. It's what I've expressed at the council, the mayor's office. It's what I have expressed through people to Mr. Glick as well as the club and Keystone construction, which is a whole different component to this. And I think it can happen

because obviously it's happened before. And from what I understand through my conversations is that's what they want to. But the problem is that I think everybody's got to realize that it's going to take some effort for that to actually happen. And the effort from my point of view, it's happening just very slowly. But it's all going to end up in the same scenario, which is everybody's got to sit down at a table and figure it out together. What gives you any assurance that that's happening, given that the way the, you know, we got a different proposal for a stadium with a different group of investors. And just to add to your point, St. Louis and San Diego are the sort of, you know, air quotes,

bad examples of how this is done. The other ones are the sort of the better, the more, at least more palatable examples. The two, the San Diego, St. Louis ones are the most recent. ones, right? Right. Right. So I guess two-part question, two-part question, what gives you any assurance that it's happening? And does it worry you that the two most recent examples of MLS expansion were basically done as they big-footed the local existing club? Right. Before we tackle that one, Kyle, did I, is there anything I missed on that last one? Did that kind of explain kind of the two avenues pretty well?

Yeah, I think it explains the two avenues really well. And then the third kind of, another additional expansion team that I think of that has an interesting story as well as Charlotte. Charlotte gained an MLS team. They had a USL team. That USL team moved from the USL championship, which is the second division to the USL League one. They both still operate in the same city.

So that is just an interesting way where it's kind of been split. Not saying that that is something that would necessarily happen in Indianapolis, but it is another kind of avenue that MLS expansion has gone in the past. And just to echo this part, which David, I have a feeling you're going to get more into bringing everyone into the same room is paramount for the best path forward for Indianapolis soccer. And so your question was, how do I know that that is possible and or happening? You know, this isn't my first rodeo, as I've kind of told a lot of people. You know, I spent 30 years, I have spent 30 years of my life in high-level political world. So I know all the players very personally. I consider them very close friends.

The mayor I've known for 20 years, his chief of staff, I've known for 10. I've known most of the city county counselors who are really high level involved in this for 10, 15 years. So, you know, I have a unique ability in this situation to go behind closed doors and not have to have conversations that are very public. I can call them on their cell phones, their personal cell phones, and say, hey, I heard this, what's going on? as I said, I think at the beginning, the club and I have a very good working relationship. And so when this story kind of broke, they immediately let me know that this was happening. We had an hour-long conversation. They answered every question I had.

In fact, they've continued to answer every question I've had. In fact, called me before news broke to kind of explain what's going on from their perspective. And like I said, I've had plenty of conversations through intermediation. with a whole bunch of people involved on the other end of the spectrum, which is the investor group. And so I kind of know without, you know, dropping the whole nine yards here, kind of what's going on behind the scenes. And, you know, I'm a lawyer by trade.

I've been a lawyer for 12 years. And so, you know, you put those two things together as well as my passion for the club. and you get me essentially. And so I can assure you without telling you the details, because I can't that I know that the proceedings are happening between all sides to figure out how Indy 11 can go forward as the club, regardless of how the investor group works itself out, whether or not that includes Mr. Ozedemur or not.

We hope it does, because, again, I mean, he's been the steward of professional soccer for the last 11 years here in town. We think he deserves it, whatever happens. But I know that those conversations are happening. And, you know, we have. Well, let me ask this. So there's maybe a path forward

where like Indy 11 could end up playing at a new stadium built in the new location on the southeast corner of downtown. Okay, I got it. Correct. Yeah. Yeah, there's absolutely an avenue that that could happen.

And it's, we've got the rules committee meets. I don't know if you want to go into the legislative end of this. So I'll give you a brief. Not too much, but yeah. You know, a very brief summary for your listeners. How about that? Please. That would be wonderful.

So again, we talked about what kind of happened in the state house, but then in the city level, they have to redistrict an area here in town in order for that tax district to take place. Okay. So the city county council worked on that for a couple of years. In December, they passed that specific rezoning map for the Indy 11 11 Park site, which is on the west side of downtown. Okay. And so at that point, everybody was like, let's go. Like, let's do this then. This, the new thing that's happened and it's been reported that because of what the council is doing that's closed down that option. That is not true. What the city is doing and reported is a second. option for a stadium to go up. Okay. So it can either at this point, based on whatever happens, if this legislative vehicle passes the city council on June 3rd, we have until June 30th to turn in one of those two site locations to the state board of accounts so that they can propose, get the taxing thing done.

So we've still got about 45 days left to work out something wherever, that PR phone. works out. And that could be that Indy 11 continues on at the 11 Park site that is already there with this new investor group. It could be that the investor group goes away because they can't get whatever they need to get

behind the scenes together enough to get it done. And Mr. Ozener just continues on with the plan that has always been the plan. It could be that they work all together and it's the new site location. So there's a whole different bunch of avenues at this point that we don't know how it's going to work out.

But again, I'm pretty confident at this stage that everybody's on the same path, I think, that they want Indy 11 to go forward. They want that to be the club. They just have to work out the details at this point. Yeah, and 45 days is both an incredibly small amount of time and an eternity all at the same time. And obviously, you know, David's continuing to put pressure on them through, you know, his internal conversations or relationships. and then us as a wider BYB, you know, we showed up at the meeting of the commission earlier and large numbers. We're continuing to show up to games in large numbers.

We held, you know, thousands of scientists that save our club, just continuing to put pressure on them to make the decision that is best for us. Okay. What was the reaction within the, the battalion when you all found out that the stadium site, the Indy 11 original stadium site, was on a, I guess, an historic African-American graveyard. And was there, yeah, go ahead. Well, let me give you the background.

So it's Green Lawn Cemetery. And it was the first public cemetery here in Indianapolis. It opened in about 1820, and it was opened until about 1880. Okay. It was the cemetery here in town. Okay. And it got completely filled, okay? There's a lot of black pioneers who were there.

There were a lot of governors who were there, state representatives. In fact, it was the primary location for, we had a Confederate Army prison here in Indianapolis during the Civil War. And anybody who died who couldn't be shipped home was buried there. Sounds like the full spectrum. Yeah, it was primary territory for all the union troops who were killed from Indiana. Indiana was one of the largest contributors to the Grand Army of the Republic during the Civil War. In fact, that's what we're named after is the 11th Regiment of the Grand Army of the Republic. And so it was massive.

I mean, we're massive. A lot of those people over the last 100 years or so have been removed. So the Union troops, the Confederate troops, the governors and state representatives, a lot of the pioneers. In fact, it was the original resting place of what we believed to be. the primary source for Uncle Tom's cabin. He was also buried there. But there's been a lot of development since the cemetery closed. When it closed, it became a park. And then railroads came in and a meatpacking place came in. In fact, 11 Park would not even be the first professional stadium that was built on the site. In fact, there were the Federal League, the Indianapolis Hoosiers,

won two Federal League championships being 1913 and 1914 on that site. So there, There's a lot of history. What sport? Sorry, what sport? Baseball. Baseball. Okay. Yeah.

So in 13, 14, they tried to take on Major League Baseball, and it didn't so much pan out because the league died in 1917. So it is what it is. But we've had a sports-specific stadium on the cemetery before. Now, granted, baseball, you don't have to dig underneath the whole thing. I mean, that is what it is. So there's some context there. So we've known for a...

Yeah, we've known. for a long time that there were most likely still people buried there. That is not something that people in Indianapolis are not aware of. What we did was, and this is prior presidents and prior boards, as we obviously talked with the club and Keystone Construction, which Mr. Rosemar owns and runs. And, you know, they, we had an understanding that we were going to memorialize the people that were removed in some way, shape, or form on the stadium site. We didn't know what that was. going to look like yet because we've still got two years if the plan goes through before that stadium even gets up and running at this point.

You know, we all knew that it was going to be an issue. The club was very respectful about how they were going to do it. There's a plan in place if they find any remains whatsoever all construction stops. Those remains are going to be removed by hand, by hand. And then, you know, respectfully replaced. some or put somewhere else here in town. And so, you know, they are doing everything they possibly can in order to make this area, you know, work for them. It's also in a pretty depressed area of town of downtown. It's been neglected for years, I mean, 50 or 60 years at this

point. And it is part of a larger economic development deal that the city has put a lot of effort into. And I think that gets lost in this situation as well. So just to the east of that location, about a block and a half away, is where the football stadium is. And then just directly to the west is what's called White River State Park. A huge river. It's a state park. They wanted to redevelop it. There's going to be a huge bridge that connects Indy 11 Park to the other side of that of the river. And then they had used this economic development piece. and that bridge and the White River State Park to pitch and get another huge pharmaceutical company to actually take the depressed area that's right across the river from 11 Park to come here.

It's called Alenco. It's an animal pharmaceutical company. They were going to move their headquarters from somewhere else in Indiana to another location that's been completely not used for 40 or 50 years. So there's a huge amount of development that was going to happen for this specific. area that's also kind of up in arms now because we don't know what's going to happen. You know, if 11 park doesn't get done, does Alenco still move here? That's a lot of jobs, a lot of prosperity for that side of town that always kind of just gets left out of things because the area is hard to develop.

And they have worked really hard to get these pieces in place in order to do that. And now it's doesn't, it may not happen. Yeah. And I think the other thing that's important to remember about 11 Park, right, is that it's not just the stadium. There was going to be mixed use developments as part of it. Apartment buildings, other businesses were going to go in there. It was really going to brighten up an area that is honestly, for lack of a better term, right now, a parking lot. And just a very large parking lot that doesn't get used ever.

It might sometimes if there's something going on in Lucas Oil, but there's nothing happening. It's just a large open area. Yeah. Incredibly depressed area, like I said, for decades at this point. And I know the neighbors, the people who live there were ecstatic about the fact that this very depressed kind of grim area was finally going to be used properly. And there's been a lot of residential updates. People are putting in work to their homes to update their homes. There's been a lot of condos and apartment buildings going up.

because of what this is planned to do. And now all of that is kind of up in the air. So that adds another component to how complex this situation is here in Indianapolis. Yeah. Okay. Well, so the 45 days, can you say that part again? There's 45 days until, like, what has to be done in 45 days, the tax classification of the property? Right.

So there was two legislative vehicles. There was one at the State House that we worked on for about a decade or so, five or six years, part of that component. And we finally got the legislation passed in 2019. It was re-uped again in 2021 or 2002. I can't remember which one it was to extend the timeframe because we just didn't have things lined up because of the pandemic. That legislative vehicle created a special taxing district for a sports stadium, just like all the other sports stadiums that we have here in Indianapolis. It's not new. We've done it plenty of times before.

It's kind of old hat at this point, but they just needed to get it done. So that created that specific point. So the state can then allow for funds to be distributed, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Then the city had to do their end of that deal. That happened in the end of December of 2023 to agree that that location, the 11th Park location, was going to be the place where all that money was going to to go. And so that's kind of what is that question right now because the new map, if that's how we

refer to it here in town, the new map is a new location, but it doesn't close down that option. So it got referred to the Rules Committee. That hearing is on May 28th. And then that'll be a public hearing. We'll all be there. I enforce, I'm sure of it. I will most likely be to testifying in front of the committee, something I've done before. So I'm not really too worried about it. We just have to figure out what it's going to be at that point. And then if it passes out of that committee, it would be sent to this full city county council. And that next meeting is June 3rd.

The full then council has to vote. If they approve the new map on June 3rd, that gives us 27 days. If we haven't figured it out by then, gives us 27 days to continue to negotiate for the best result. for Indianapolis, which we hope would be for Indy 11 to go forward and for everybody to agree on one of the two locations, right, because it's just two options. It's not going to close down 11 Park. It's just creating a different space that could take this tax benefit. Sounds like maybe you guys prefer 11 Park as the location, though. Is that fair or not? Kyle, you want to explain? Yeah, it's not that we necessarily prefer.

for 11 Park, it's that we would prefer a place to have Indy 11 play. We've played in several different locations during our history. We're currently at the Mike Carroll Stadium at IUPY now, IUI, because they're going through some transitions there. We've played at Lucas Oil Stadium, the football stadium. Personally, I'm just going to say, I think that's been our least favorite, even though that's been the biggest venue. And then we've played a game or two at the Sele.

Bowl at Butler. We just played our U.S. Open Cup game there against San Antonio. And honestly, not a bad experience, to be totally honest with you. Whatever ends up being the decision, we just want to make sure that it's Indy 11 that's playing in that stadium. Whether it is 11 Park, whether it is whatever this new location may be named, whether it's a mixed use development, whether it's just the stadium, whether it has 15,000, 20,000, 25,000 seats, however many. As long as it sits Indy 11 on the field, we feel confident that we're going to be able to pack out the stadium, whatever it is. Yeah, I think that pretty much sets it up. You know, there's what we try to do is, and this is something that we've constantly talked about as a board.

And we have a committee of past presidents that has been incredibly helpful. as well. There's about six or seven of us who are in this like deep text message chain. And anything that comes up, you know, we take their advice into account as well. We also have an advisory board of deep long-term members who continue to keep apprised of it. So there's a lot of people involved in the BYB, probably around 100 or so, who are kind of involved in advising me, thankfully, about what the members really feel is the best avenue. to go forward with. And the one thing that has continuously been expressed to me and to the board, frankly,

is that, you know, we're not going to take sides about the financial thing. That's not our purview. You know, they've got enough people that they can hire lobbyists and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, to advocate for their location site. You know, that's not something that the B.YB can pick. Or, you know, do we? You know, we don't have millions and billions of dollars to make this kind of a decision. That's not our thing.

What we can do, what we've continuously done for the last three weeks now is said, exactly as Kyle mentioned, whatever happens and whatever site location is picked, what we want is we want our club that you are the stewards of or potentially the stewards of, right? because the investor group could coales, that that should be in the 11 so that we all are moving forward together and we get that nice PR photo stage somewhere at the end of this process. Yeah. And I think also, just to the point,

is maybe some of the attachment to 11 Park is the fact that we've seen renderings. We know what it might look like. So, you know, when you give even casual fans, you know, that image of, okay, here it is on the river, here's what it might look like inside, here is what it might look on the outside. People get attached and expect that.

And, you know, I've been guilty of that. I went to TQL in Cincinnati for the first time last year. I walked in. It was a totally empty stadium. And I'm not going to lie, almost teared up a little bit because I was like, we might have this in three years. So I think the expectation with the 11th Park and maybe some of the gravity to that is because it's been the expectation.

Now, whatever this new stadium might possibly be, there will be renderings. People might get attached to that as well. So it's not that it's one or the other. We just, we've played in Carroll for so long. We love Carol, but we're excited to take that next step, whatever it might be. Yeah. And the one thing that I think I would add to that as an ending piece, that conversation is that Carroll Stadium is not going to do it for much longer. one of the things people probably don't know is that when we were at Lucas Oil Stadium, Indiana University,

who owns that piece of property because that's where we play, actually proposed destroying it and blowing it up and rebuilding something on that site. And so, you know, we're back there. We love it. We affectionately call it the greatest dive bar in North American soccer and love it. But that's what it is. I mean, it's the greatest dive bar in North American soccer. We would love for you to come and enjoy it. You know, there's a great caveat story. Like, I was a couple of weeks ago at a home game. I was trying to get something out of one of our storage units that is a literal pod.

You know, like, would you hire when you move? You get a pod that a storage unit. We have one of those to store all of our things in. And I had my lanyard on and a nice young mother walked up to me and said, do you work here? And I said, no, but what can I help you with? And she says, there's nowhere to change my baby. I need to change a diaper.

Where can I change a diaper? Because all the baby changing boards are broken. Yeah. It's just not going to work long term. It's just not going to. So I let her go into our pod and I shut the doors and I let her change the kid in there because that was the easiest way to do it. It's just not long term. It's not going to work.

So at this point, we need a stadium. and that's one of the reasons why I'm continuously working behind the scenes to figure out what is the best way forward because it's going to happen. It just needs that we need to pick which one it's going to be. Okay. And make sure Inde 11 is the club that plays in that stadium. Correct. It sounds like you guys are feeling fairly good.

At least you, David, are feeling fairly good about that possibility. Is that? Yeah. And it's morphed a lot in three weeks because, man, for the first probably seven days, it was pretty dire. It was not a great storyline. It got a little better for the second week. You know, it was like, okay, well, maybe, you know, I'm working the channels and I'm talking to people and I'm making sure that BYB is present in these conversations and that they understand what the fans want and what is necessary for the atmosphere that we've created for professional soccer as well as the. club to bring forward.

You know, one of the key components of that, that conversation in the second week was that if you're going to build a stadium that's 20 to 25,000 people, you know, we have probably 4,000 hardcore members of the battalion. And then probably another 2 or 3,000 on top of that who are, who consider themselves part of the battalion, but don't really take part into it because we've just built this brand for ourselves. So we're talking six to seven thousand people. who are attached to us and to the club.

So that's a third of the stadium. And then you put in the fact that the club has incredibly invested in youth academy soccer here in central Indiana. We have the club has and we have 18,000 kids who are currently sponsored by Indy 11 to play 18,000. 18,000. So you're talking 18,000 plus their moms and dads, plus their grandparents, plus their aunts and uncles, brothers and sisters.

So you're talking probably 50 to 100,000 people who are attached to the crest and one way of shape or form. And if you take that away, and once we dropped all that information on the key stakeholders, the conversations dramatically shifted because they were like, oh, okay. So if we take the crest away and we take the name away and we take this brand that you guys have built together away, we're going to really dig our. ourselves a whole trying to fill a 20 to 25,000 seat stadium. That's not a good business decision. Because if you take that away, how many people are going to just be like, I'm done?

Like, I just don't care. Sorry. But you, we had this vehicle and we had all this support from this club and from the owners and from the fans. And you've just gone away? Like, no. Like, that's not going to work, especially here in Indiana where people are incredibly bled. loyal to their sports franchises. And I mean, incredibly loyal. And that became a problem in the second. Yeah. I'm sorry, but that's still really annoying to me that they didn't, you know, happy that

facts and logic sort of had an impact. But how do you come into this situation talking about, you know, starting a new soccer club and not knowing that stuff or not having considered it? Like, come on. Yeah. I honestly think where some of it comes. comes from is maybe just an experience with the sport of soccer, to be totally honest with you. When you look at the NFL or you look at the NBA or you look at the MLB, NHL, any of them, yeah, there's

fans of those teams. There is not a supporter section like any supporter sections when it comes to soccer. Soccer is one of the most fan-centric sports in the entire world, if not the most fan-centric sport. It has a completely different, for frankly, lack of better term, vibe than any other sports. So when you start to look at, yeah, we've, you know, we brought the Colts here, the Pacers have played here for so long, you know, you start following those models because you think it's what works. But frankly, soccer is a completely just different beast. And I think honestly, it was the lack of experience with a sport like soccer that maybe led to this initially. I think whether I disagree or disagree with the mayor or not, maybe he kind of had a different idea of, you know,

what to bring to the table initially, then maybe what was the right idea. Maybe he and his heart, it was right for what he thought was doing. But what I will say is since David, you know, has been brought to the table a bit more, since they're listening to the fans a little bit more, you know, since this entire thing's happening,

that's what we can ask for. Did they make a mistake initially? I think it's safe to say quite possibly. Yeah, they did. But what they can do from that time is make up for it. And that's really all they can do. I don't know if we'll ever get, you know, a full stop. Sorry, we did that.

But what they can do is make up for it down the road and continue to include us in the conversations, listen to us, and realize that maybe the initial approach wasn't the correct one. Yeah. And that's kind of the right way to look at it. I mean, that was the conversations that I've all had. And that's one of the reasons why I think it was smart on our end to keep the battalion out of the conversation about which site location it needs to be. And who needs to own the team?

And honestly, what we care about is what we care about our family and we care about these kids and these families that have grown up now rooting for 11 and have such an emotional attachment to it. You know, that's that's the component that we needed to focus on because we didn't want it to be forgotten in all of this. And I think we've done a pretty good job of that. I hope we have. I hope. And if I haven't, then I'm sorry. I will personally apologize for that because that's kind of on my shoulders and that's what we can do. Where does Don Garber fit into all this?

Ooh, that's a great question. You know, I can tell you from a legal point of view from that perspective is that he can't really do a lot because he can't just call up the mayor and say, hey, we're going to give you a team if you give them in a stadium. That would be against the bylaws from the MLS, from what I understand. There's more of governors. They've got to go through a proposal process, an application process, a franchising fee thing. And so, you know, from what I've heard behind closed doors between reporters that I've talked to who've gotten information directly from folks who've been in meetings about 11 or a professional soccer team in MLS in Indianapolis is that what he has suggested is that the atmosphere that we've created is incredibly attractive. the tax benefits that the state gives and the city has agreed to is incredibly attractive. And that is what brought not only MLS's interest, but also the investor group's interest to the table.

We know, even though I can't confirm what other cities are being considered, from what I understand is that MLS has said essentially that they are looking to add one team in the West and one team in the East. at this point and that we are up against another city just to the north of us that is being considered. And so that's kind of where we're at and we're just being evaluated. So, you know, amongst all the other pressures that we have as the battalion, we're also being watched very closely. And the team is being watched very closely about how we conduct ourselves. Well, maybe you can correct me on this, but my my impression at when the news first broke was that it was Garber. Garber was the one who was saying, like, let's, no, it was all the mayor. That is not the information that I've learned of. Essentially how this worked was the state did what they did and passed the law. The city did what they did and they passed their thing. And then Indy 11 and Keystone Construction did this huge PR thing in January.

In fact, you can Google all the stories that were put out there. In fact, 11 Park was a feature article in the New York Times. I mean, a huge spread. Like, look at this, like, gem that's going to be on the white river. It's going to be gorgeous. And look at what the 11th's put together and do-do-do-do-do-do-do. That was one of the things that I will tell you as a backstory is that one of our first conversations, the battalion's first conversations with Mr. Ozdem, was that.

was that it was his dream to eventually try to become an MLS team. And so it's not, again, behind us. He's applied twice before. So this was always kind of a dream for him. Well, in order to do that, there's a $500 million franchise fee. That's a lot of money. And he can't put that down by himself because that would be, you know, ridiculous financially for one person to do. Okay.

So, you know, there was a huge push in January. to throw all of this out there and look at these pretty plants in the stadium. And one of the reasons you do that is because you want to bring in people who are going to invest in the club so that you can get the $500 million and apply for the thing. Well, the investors came, obviously, because we wouldn't be talking if they didn't. But for whatever happened behind scenes, they either wanted to work with Mr. Oostomer and it didn't work out or they wanted to go on their own because of the attractiveness of not only the Italian and the soccer culture we've built, but also the tax benefits that are there.

We don't know what happened in that scenario, but we know the investors came. And they are the ones who are really driving this conversation. It's not Mr. Garber. It is this new investor group. We know that this is not their first rodeo. They have done this multiple times in MLS, is what I've been told. And they have won every single time that they've applied for a franchise. So they know what they're doing.

And they have a good working relationship with Mr. Garber and the Board of Governors, which is not a bad thing. It's a good thing. And so, you know, they are the ones who are kind of driving this whole thing. They really, really want to come here, really, really want to come here. And they think Indianapolis could be a phenomenal city for MLS. And that's, again, where it's a compliment is what I've told, continue to tell people, because they wouldn't be coming here, if not the fact that the battalion and the club has done a

phenomenal job at building a soccer culture here in central Indiana. Right. Well, you guys have cleared up a lot for me, so I appreciate that. And I think a lot of people who listen will probably feel the same way. I want to ask you this, though, how often you guys think about promotion relegation? Kyle, I see you smiling. You say you would, you schooled me on not minor leagues, second division. that was a crudely worded question.

But like if Indianapolis was in a second division that could be promoted, you know, the Brickyard Battalion would be a massive asset and it would be a totally different sort of scenario here. You must dream about it sometimes. Oh, yeah. I mean, I've talked about it from time to time. and it feels like the correct path forward, especially when you look at any, you know,

major soccer league and anywhere in the rest of the world. It feels like the correct path forward. It feels like there are teams in the U.S.L championship who deserve the potential to gain promotion and play in MLS. I mean, we've had great results. Louisville, as much as we may, you know, hate the other side of the river, they have had results that would gain them promotion to MLS

and this Sacramento is another great one, Pittsburgh. I mean, the list goes on and on and on of teams that deserve the chance to potentially one day be promoted. And even when you look into the third division forward Madison, you know, Lexington just got a team a couple years ago. Greenville has been great in the past. South Georgia Tormenta, these smaller teams, they deserve the ability to one day be promoted. When that's going to happen, where that's going to happen, we have no idea. We have no idea if it'll even ever happen. Doesn't seem like it's going to happen.

Doesn't seem like it's going to happen at the moment. But I will say as, you know, leagues continue to expand, whether it's the USLC, whether it's the MLS, you start getting up into the 30 range. You start getting up into the 35, 40 range. And does it make logistical sense to have that many teams in one league? I can't think that it will. whether it is one day USLC and MLS working together, whether it's MLS or USLC working within themselves to create promotion or relegation,

I think one of these leagues is going to find a way to differentiate themselves from the other one and potentially do it one day. If I had to bet money on it, I think it would be USL before MLS, just because I think USL will have the amount of teams before MLS does. But we'll see what happens in the next 10, 15 years.

years, I just think for the sport to continue to evolve, you have to give these smaller markets the opportunity to compete because everyone loves a Cinderella story. Look at what Lutton Towns done over in the Premier League. I would love nothing more than to see a team like Lexington win USL League won and then win the USL championship and end up in MLS somehow. I mean, what kind of story would that be? It would bring so many eyes to the sport. To me, it doesn't make sense why that's more attractive person. Yeah, you could imagine. I mean, you could just see. it on Sports Center. I mean, it's it's pure, pure drama.

It's the community field. It's, you know, smoke bombs going off at half line. You know, I can tell you that from what I've been told is that USL headquarters down in Tampa were actually talking

about it and embedding it within USL to go to Kyle's point about how I think they're going to differentiate themselves that way. I don't know how far along those conversations are, but It would be a dream. I mean, it would be a dream. You know, I don't think anybody who's a pure soccer fan in this country thinks that pro rel is bad.

Unless you're just like, you know, I don't care about the lower leagues and screw them all because my team's the best and blah, blah, blah. But when you really get down to the brass tacks and you have a deep conversation about it, those people would even probably say, yeah, pro rel is a really good thing and we need it in this country. We just don't know what it's going to look like. I do have faith that it's going to happen in some point. What it looks like and what it needs actually, how it coales, and where it works out the financials, I don't know. And how long it's going to take? I don't know.

You know, is it what MLS is going to be up to? Let's say they add both teams, right, the east and the west. They're going to be up to, what, 32, 33 teams? It's too many. It's too many for the league. Yeah. I agree with Kyle that 20 leagues to the top league, 20 teams in the top is enough. You don't need more than that.

So what do you do with the other 12 or 13 or 14 or 15 teams that they've got? And then you've got MLS next underneath it. So if you look at the T leaves, maybe MLS is setting itself up to start that in some way, shape, or form. But I think it's going to happen. I don't know when it's going to happen. Yeah, and of course there's been the rumor that within MLS next, and I'm not sure if this is a rumor or it's been confirmed or whatever, they're going to start renaming those two teams to other local, you know, cities or towns. You've seen that with Huntsville for Nashville. You know, Chicago, who knows it might be like Naperville. Is that kind of gross a little bit? Yeah, but. Don't piss off another city. Oh, that's true. Sorry, Naperville. It's not personal. It's just maybe we differentiate a little bit,

more than a suburb within the own city itself is all that I'm asking. So you know what? You want to do Rockford in Illinois? Bring a team there. Maybe that's not a bad idea at all. But it just kind of depends how they want to move forward. I got to tell you something real quick, which you're talking about the lady changing the diaper at Carroll Stadium made me think of this. But I was, I had the privilege of being at a Como FC game a couple weeks ago in Italy. And they, you know, they're just now promoted. They just won promotion last weekend because another team lost. But we were there for

a game they won. They did. Well, the game I was there for, they won with a stoppage time winter and it gave them like a four point cushion. So it was kind of the key one. And it was so amazing. Like the people, like

people kissing their children and like, you know, climbing up on the walls. I mean, it was like a huge thing for families and, you know, working class people. You know, it wasn't, you know, Como's, Lake Como is a fancy place, but the stadium and the club are not that fancy.

In fact, the diaper made me think of this. I was standing there at halftime after getting a beer, and this guy walked off the last step of the steps down from the tribuna, and he looked down and he had just ripped open his pants. I looked down, there's like a rusty screw sticking out, you know? And he was like kind of mad. He's like, man, he's got like a cut. on his leg and I was like they're there it's not very fancy down here you know I mean I guess they

have to make some improvements before they go to Syria but but it just struck me that uh some parallels between that and the lady changing the diaper in the pod you know yeah yeah you know you know and I think that's you work I've talked a lot about because of the popularity of welcome No Wrexham. It's been a nice way to, especially when I talk to people who don't, are not fans of soccer or don't know enough about it, they know Welcome to Rexham. And they know Ryan Reynolds and Rob Napclanee. And they know the whole story, right? And so I've been able to use that documentary series as a, you know, listen, this is kind of where we're at. Like, this club belongs to us and Indianapolis and these kids who are playing soccer who carry the crest all over themselves. And, you know, in season one, episode one, they have to talk to the fans about why they should own the club and why they're going to be good stewards of the club. And that's the way this should be looked at. And in that initial conversation, when I framed it that way, most people I've talked to went, oh, so this is not like the Colts where the Ursa's are just kind of in charge of everything, where the Simons are in charge of, you know, Pacer. No, no, this is not like those situations, as Kyle pointed out.

This is, we own the thing. This is ours. And you've got to come to us and ask us to support your club. And I can't guarantee you that we're going to do that if you don't bring along Indy 11. Can't. What I've told people is that most likely what will happen at the end of this if it's not in the 11. And I think even if it is in the 11, there's probably going to have to be

some sort of general meeting amongst the battalion and all the affiliates. And we were an official nonprofit. So we do this once a year anyway. But we would call a general meeting and we would call either Mr. Oestimer or the new investors in or both of them in and say, pitch us. And we'll take a vote. And if you don't win, then you don't get us. Period. Sorry.

That's just the way this is going to work. And that was the conversations that I've had with multiple people, they were like shocked by that. what do you mean you're not going to just support whatever we put here no no no no no that's not how cyber works around the world sorry um here watch season one episode one of welcome to and see how this is going to work because that's exactly how this is going to work whether you are or not that's how this is going to happen and that's also just common sense like if they come and change the name of the team the crest everything about it they're just going to expect everybody who who's been cheering for Indy 11 for the last 13 years to just...

Well, it's common sense to us soccer people, right? But to the rest of the world who doesn't have a connection to a club and hasn't spent the last 25 or 30 years rooting on their club in one way, shape, or form or 13 years for us here in the battalion, they don't understand that connection. And they don't understand that that's how soccer culture works. And so a lot of my conversations have been education. more than anything else.

And so they get a different perspective about where we're coming from and why we're coming that way and what this whole thing means to all of us and how important it is. And you mentioned it perfectly well. Promotion happened and there are old men crying in the stands because of how much it meant to people. When people are kissing their kids and hugging and embracing and they can't control their emotions because of how much the club means to them and how much they've poured their lives into. the colors that they carry around their scarves all year long. People just don't get that if they aren't soccer people.

And you've got to do a lot of educational end on that front. So we've done a really good job, I think, at this point. And we just need to continue on for the next 45 days and make sure that Indy 11 is the club going forward. Yeah, good luck to you. You've done a good job of educating me as well. And, you know, I hope hopefully we can see the Indy 11 beating the Chicago fire in like five years. relegating them, you know? Hey, you said that.

I mean, they need to take it seriously or else they should get relegated, you know? That's what I'm saying. But anyway, thank you guys. It was definitely me who said that, not you. We apologize again to Naperville. Any complaints from Chicago can come directly to me. My Twitter account appreciates you

taking accountability for that statement and not me. Yeah, yeah, I do fully. And I appreciate you guys this time. Thank you so much. And thanks everybody for listening. We'll see you.