Scuffed | USMNT, World Cup, Yanks Abroad, futbol in America - #512: Monday Review — The Copa final, the coach search & a Berhalter farewell

Episode Date: July 15, 2024

Vince and Belz were astounded by the Copa final and the difficult things it says about the USMNT. Watke runs us through all the coaching search rumors (Benitez sounds plausible). And then we eulogize the Berhalter era by talking about our favorite moments from his tenure. Skip the ads! Subscribe to Scuffed on Patreon and get all episodes ad-free, plus any bonus episodes. Patrons at $5 a month or more also get access to Clip Notes, a video of key moments on the field we discuss on the show, plus all patrons get access to our private Discord server, live call-in shows, and the full catalog of historic recaps we've made: https://www.patreon.com/scuffedAlso, check out Boots on the Ground, our USWNT-focused spinoff podcast headed up by Tara and Vince. They are cooking over there, you can listen here: https://boots-on-the-ground.simplecast.comAnd check out our MERCH, baby. We have better stuff than you might think: https://www.scuffedhq.com/store Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

From the USSF approved territories of Georgia and Kentucky, and also from the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia, this is the Monday Review. Everybody, it's the Monday Review. Got Vince and Waki with me. Vince, how you doing? Man, I'm doing great. I'm doing great, man.

Me too. How are y'all doing? Adam Bell's, Waki. I'm doing very well. It's been an adjustment into this post-Berhalter world, but the world keeps turning, doesn't it? Yeah, it keeps turning. pain heals with the passage of time.

And, yeah, so I think this is going to be fun. We're going to have fun with this coaching search, it seems, and I'm just, I'm excited for it all. I think we're going to have a good time here. There's new stuff happening. Tons of new stuff. We've got a lot of new stuff to talk about. We're going to eulogize Greg a little bit,

talk about some of our favorite moments from the, from the Burrhalter era. We'll get to that later. But first, I just want to say, I'm still buzzing from that COPA America final last night. That was just a bloody spectacle. The power of will, the suffering, the quality, the desire on display, just jaw dropping. I mean, come on. That was, that was insane.

It was tremendous. It was tremendous stuff. I mean, just spectacular theater. You know what I'm saying? everything for me in a match that I could want, it was there. Like, okay, maybe you saw this match and you saw the crunchy tackles coming in, you know, the potential yellow cards and other situations, and maybe that turned you off, and maybe you liken that to some type of relegation scrap

that you've seen in the Premier League or whatever. And you'd be wrong. You would absolutely be wrong. That was just not the case. Like, yes, we had all the, all the leg kicking and the ankle biting and all the stuff that went on. But also, the dispersed in between that quite regularly was just quality from everybody on the pitchman. It was just, I mean, wait was ball. Yeah, that bothers me.

Go ahead. Every fifth reply or so on Twitter to me saying that that was a great game is somebody saying, well, was crap. I'm like, man, get off the couch. Get off the couch and learn how to play soccer if you think that was crap. Because that was, yeah, go ahead. That game is why Adam Bells watches soccer.

For that. It was beautiful. And I knew you were enjoying it. And I got to say, we weren't, in retrospect, we're probably not quite up to the Copa America level. We are

just not. We're not up to that level. Just flatly. That's a big thing. Can you imagine us out there in that game? Giorana, Tim Weir. Dudes would be gassed after 35 minutes. And I don't know what that is. Do they have better sports science in Colombia and Argentina than we do in the U.S.?

Or do they just have like, you know, a hundred times more dog than we have? It's a question of dog. It's a question of the soccer soul. hamstrings. The hamstrings, the nationalist spirit. Right. The list could go on and on.

Yeah, yeah. Everything is called in the play at this point. You know, just our, as, as Waki said, our minerals as a nation, as an entire nation, man. You know what I'm saying? Like, we, I'm not saying there's been one in these countries, but, you know, we just haven't had a, we're the safest humans in the history of planet Earth.

You know? And particularly... Who do safe? And so, so, particularly I can't get to get that out with the type of kids that usually make it

in soccer in this country like maybe this is the biggest reason pay for play isn't good because you know what I'm saying it's like man you gotta have you gotta have something innate inside of you to pull out in these games like this

and maybe we just don't have it maybe you know these kids that grew up up with manicured lawns and et cetera, et cetera. You know, they just don't got that third eye, that gear, that gear to hit. That stuff really gets crazy. That reminds me. That reminds me of something, you know, people who listen to this podcast and also

listen to the rest of history will notice sometimes that I bring up stuff that they're talking about in that podcast. I've had, you know, some people have mentioned that. But I went back and listened to Jonathan Wilson talk about. the history of soccer, like the, you know, the Guardian writer. And he's talking about Argentina and how, now there's a whole part of Argentine history that we are not going to get into today. I don't think, well, unless Vince really wants to. But there, but this is one thing about Argentine history that is, I think, directly relevant to this, this discussion.

Apparently, early 20th century or late 19th century, it was difficult for Argentina to come up with like a national identity. And then that, because it was a bunch of people, mostly a bunch of people from different parts of Europe coming together to have a country at that point in its history. The gaucho, the image of the gaucho, the independent, self-sufficient, self-sufficient, scrappy cowboy out on the pompous was what they settled on in the 19th century. Then industrial farming came along and the gaucho became something that didn't really exist. anymore. And so what did they, what did they move to as the sort of the national, the figure of national identity? It was what they called the P-Bay, which was the, which was the street urchin, the boy on the streets of like the sprawling metropolis of Buenos Aires, who was, um, tough, crafty, clever, creative, inventive. And they were writing about this in like the 20s and 30s.

and then, you know, who comes along in the late 70s, early 80s, but Diego Maradona, who is like the personification of this ideal, you know. And, you know, I was thinking about that as I was watching the game. Everybody out there for Argentina is a peevei. They are absolutely, they're just a bunch of dogs who just rolling, they're ready to roll around in the dirt and do the dramatically, like, transcendent thing with the ball. They do both.

And, man, yeah, you can't roll around in the dirt if all you ever rolled around in is a manicured lawn or a plush carpet. There's no dirt to roll around it, man, unless you manufacture it. Yeah, you got to go to a construction site, basically. Go ahead, Waki. Maybe we just hear it again and again, but comes back to the question, what if our best street urchins played soccer? Yes. It sounds to me like Argentina basically jockey. the identity of Memphis, Tennessee

and decided to make it the entire country model. They call it El Peebe, and Memphis, they said the Shistee. You know what I'm saying? He's the two things of the same coin here. But I see what's going on. I see what's going on. As a man that's been to Memphis and is very charmed

by the charm of Memphis. I get it. But just to bring it back to the quality point real quick, I just want to like, I went through and looked at the the passing percentages of the midfielder. You know, because like I said, I feel like a lot of people just saw the initial fight

and likened into a relegation scrap. You know, Enzo Hernandez, 58 for 62, 94%. So we got McAllister, 54 for 58, 93% passing. Jefferson Lerma. He was 57 for 67, 85%. Like, you know what I'm saying? Passes were big.

The turnovers weren't happening because of bad passes. Because the passing was sloppy. The turnovers were happening because people were flying into challenges. Flying around, man. And the ball was flying too. Like, you would just, it would be nothing just to see a ping diagonal that was just a laser coming over to something. Like, you know, it was everything, man.

That is ball to me. That is ball to me. Like, we, of course watched the Euro final. It was cool. I don't think it was that. I only caught a little bit of it in the airport, but yeah, I can imagine it was a much more tame affair. The Jared Chowalter in the Discord made the point that every pass, I thought this was a great point. Every pass in that game, especially down the stretch, felt like a slash in a knife, in a knife fight.

You know, I mean, the passes were just laser beams, like, p, p, p, p, p, p, anyway, should we talk about our team? Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. go out walking so we lack the spirit and the dog it sounds like also we're the waist behind technically as well

so I just want to flag that as the two key areas correct right we do not have a Richard Rios in the pool I mean that man's just nasty but oh yeah you saw it on the Argentine gold right you know you got Leandro parades like I saw on Twitter somebody made the point

that messy gets hurt comes off you got parades still on the bench hasn't been subbed on yet. He comes over and Casol's messy and then just comes in the match and just... He's nasty. He's a dog like everybody else's a dog.

And the thing is, is like, if you saw Leandro Paredes play in Europe, he don't necessarily pull this out all the time, you know what I'm saying? Like, he's not... He does the win in Rome thing. Like when he's in Europe, he plays... Yeah.

plays that way. Him, McAllister. It's a different of Rarico de Paul. He plays for Athlete, of course, you know, they are basically, you know, Argentina and Spain. But, yeah, man, like, so you got Paredes, stop in a counter with just a beautiful slide tackle, gets the ball just so very clean. And that's the thing.

A lot of these were clean. There were some that came from behind, and so people were like, oh, that's a yellow, but they were clean. Just busting it. Could you see? I mean, you know, we can see these goals. and Zapruder it and say and end up assigned

that percentages of blame, you know, this person has 25, 15, 5. No, they take it as personal responsibility to make it happen. Anyway, prayer it takes personal responsibility to make it happen. I think it, I forgot, I think it might have been DePaul.

DePaul de Los Alcello, a little first time, just similar to one of the Sis had this year for Yuva into space for, beautiful, man. Beautiful. Yeah.

And also, one more question before we leave this, right? I saw the replies to the scuffed tweet. A lot of people were saying that, you know, the US used to have this. Did we have this? I'm talking the pure grit aspect of it. Yeah, maybe. I mean, I think it's the marriage of protagonist and grit that we saw last night. That was so striking to me, you know?

Like, Columbia did fall off as extra time went on, like, even as the, as extra time went on, even as regulation went on. But they were still trying, you know, they were pushing. They were pushing. So it was like haymakers coming back and forth from two big, like, heavyweight boxers. And I don't know if that has ever been the way the U.S. has played, you know. So sure, we sure we had the grit, but I think it was more grit in the service of preventing the other team from scoring. Yes.

Which is crucially important and actually missing from the national team right now. Okay. Yeah. I guess that's my answer. What do you think, Waki? Yeah, it was an underdog grit. I know we've incorporated some, some protagonist. And we just got to drag the grit along with it and get an alchemy going there.

Right. We may be a ways off from pure protagonist grit, But that is, I think that is the target. I think you put it very well there. Well, another thing is Argentina, you get the sense that they feel like they are underdogs still. You know, the way they all cry when they win. Yeah.

And it's like, what? You guys won everything. How are you willing to die to win this game? They are. So this is the thing, Bell, is when you were saying that the national identity transitioned from the gaucho to the pebay, I thought you were about to say it transitioned from the gaucho to the pebat. to Messi.

And Messi has become this saint-like figure. I mean, he probably is a saint-like figure. If it has a transition from the Peabay, it might at this point after bringing this

this period of success to the nation. But yeah, you just see the it seems to me that they want it so bad for him that every time they do it for him, they're just like, hell yeah.

that's why they were crying. It may also be that they just know how precious a victory of this sort is, you know, how difficult it is and how much they gave to get it, you know. I mean, I would cry probably after watching it if I had been out there and my team won. Yeah, Bells, we talked about it last night just in text, but this is real suffering. Right, you hear every, I don't know. A lot of coaches talk about suffering, right? Every Latin manager, basically.

Talk about, talk about something. Like, that's what it was. And also, you know, you go through a match like that, you take those haymakers, you deliver them back somehow come out on top. Yeah, you would be driven in tears. You know, another thing we texted about, we'll move on, we'll move on. But real quick, Anil D. Maria, dude's like 60 years old. Mm-hmm.

blowing by people in the 98th minute. Unbelievable. I couldn't believe it. I mean, he's obviously not 60 years old. But he's an older player. Yeah, man, just somehow some way, we have white dudes that they got white dudes, exclusively white dudes,

but somehow their white people are built different. And maybe it was some special super serum that they went and found at a dishevelled lab that was previously occupied by Dr. Yakub, but... Yeah. Who knows? Something's different, for sure. Should we get into some coaching search rumors and reports?

We got to... There's a lot to work through here. Yeah, there's a lot. We'll work through it slowly is a combination of rumor, fact, speculation. So it's... We've got to tease everything out as we go, I think. I'm going to start with... Tannenbaum reports the Federation sources have told him

Any idea the search is domestic-based or decision has already been made is a bunch of malarkey Good That there's a genuine search happening And he reported this in sort of an indignant tone as well Tanenbaum or Okay Okay Good

They saw that they saw that video of Chirondolo said we can't let this stand all hell broke loose when that happened everyone's coming for chondola we're getting churindolo's picture with cross marks through it yeah yeah just wait it's a little unsettling the turban's coming so people who love churondolo the what's coming soon the turban the turban the nine 11 uh bin lobby yeah yeah yeah yeah okay okay so the rumors making their way and disguffed hq have matt crocker right now on the in Europe. He's out hunting coaches. We have someone saying he's in France.

Another saying he's in Germany. Someone else saying Garis Southgate will almost certainly be contacted. I mean, great. France, that to me says Herfé Renard and Germany. Who's there? It could be. Well, the Euros are there. That does a complicating fact consideration there. So everyone's there, basically. Yeah, that's right.

So he's hitting everyone. okay yeah so i was about to say it could be any one of those uh former german uh wonder boy coaches that that have kind of fallen off and maybe he went to go talk to florian co felt you know oh yeah yeah i meanico tidesco was who was cadesco managing at the euros this year he was he was there no no no no no no no belgium had the uh belgium had the uh former n ycfc ofc yeah no he's belgium He's the Belgium head coach. Well, if he's good enough for Belgium, put him in the mixer. I always liked him back at Shalka.

I mean, I know a lot of people didn't, but he played Weston a lot, just like all of Weston's coaches. So has Renard been contacted? Do we know? Well, that's the one thing. That one's just sort of in the air. I'm not aware of any actual report. Okay.

But he's so handsome, and it makes so much sense. and everyone is talking about it so much, I assume he is a real candidate. Okay. And Crocker's supposed to have gone to France as well. Okay. Okay. And what we've... Go ahead, Waki.

Well, I was going to move on to what we've learned through the press from things that candidates are saying. Okay, so before we move on to that, real quick, and it seems like we have total USM&T internet approval. like we have hegemony on this on this thing like we got a tweet from tactical manager this morning saying that he has also heard that

our search is focused in Europe at the moment and he even went as far enough as to say we haven't even contacted Steve Toronto now take this with a grain of salt you can choose to believe or not believe etc all I'm saying is the tide has shifted completely from where it was on Saturday or whatever. Was it Saturday, Friday?

I can't remember. That when everybody was saying Tarandala was definitely the guy. Now with these reports that have come out, everybody from all different corners seem to be rebuking it. And when there's smoke, there was fire in it. That original tide may have been in retrospect, just us getting kind of emotional. which I don't apologize for one bit. Scaloni, just to, I mean, I know a lot of people know this, but for anyone who doesn't, both Scaloni,

the Argentina manager who just won the Copa America final, and Luis de la Fuente, the Spanish manager, they came from the youth national teams. They came from coaching the youth national teams to coach the senior national team. So they're not, they were not big time coaches before they took over two of the best programs in the world. They, I don't know what that tells you guys, but what it tells me is, maybe the coach really doesn't matter. It's possible.

It's possible. I just don't know. I think maybe Spain, and we also did have, we had the rumor that the, the, Spanish manager has thrown his name in the hat for the USM&T job, which is just very clearly a negotiation tactic. Right. But it seems like the RFEF might even believe in this too, because he seems, the manager of Spain seems to be feeling disrespected by them and lowballed by, you know, their offer, what they're paying them, etc., etc. So it seems like they might agree, but, but you know, when you got Spain, Spain is Spain, right? And a lot of people have seen this and like, are saying maybe we should hire a youth manager.

And my thought, once I gave it like a couple minutes of actual thought, it's like these coaching pools are not built the same, right? That's true. A U.S. youth coach is not congruent to a Spanish youth national team coach or a Argentinian youth national team coach. you know. Yeah. Well, I will say sometimes negotiating tactics don't work. You might have just messed around.

The next thing he knows he's managed. You got the job. So if any coaches out there, I want to use this as a negotiating tactic, keep doing it. Amen. We get 10, 20 guys doing that. We're going to have a world,

you know, a high level manager. You don't even got to sit in the room for 18 hours. All for accepted. Boom. Just clicked. Well, so the Luis Telephine, Fwent they being interested in the job or perhaps using it for leverage is something we've learned directly from the press. What else have we learned directly from the press? Well, we learned

Klop is either not interested or playing very hard to get. I think for our purposes, we should say he's not interested. Yeah, I think it's fair. If he jumps from the highest rope at the last minute, great. Let's put that out of our heads, though, I think, as a group. Okay. Wilfred Nancy probably doesn't want the job I wish I had the quote right now But they asked him And he gave this

A beautiful answer about him being limitless He doesn't put limits on anything Yeah Ooh He doesn't want the job right now And that came right on the back of Steve Turundle His quote When he was asked about it

That wasn't as eloquent And he probably fell down In the pecking order just on this answer alone. Can you play that on here? Yes, here we go. Thanks, Steve. So a follow up to that.

Is your intention to be LASC's coach through the end of the season? That's where your head's out? I am LASC's head coach right now. And that is my job. What I do every single day and tomorrow morning and training is at 1115, an hour later,

and I will be there for that. I will be there for that. And you're saying about the next day. Right. Well, that's what got everybody all fluster, including me, last week. Any thoughts on the jib here? Does it kind of sound like somebody asked him if he made out with Melissa at the party last night a little bit? Come on, yes. Have some cooot.

I, well, I like his jib. and I know that's not everyone agrees with that this is the way Steve Trundell is and I want him to keep being like he is Okay I haven't done extensive research

I'm not going to waste time researching somebody's jib until I see that they have taken the job but I will say just off initial initial impression you know I guess this would be

this would be the aura right you see the aura first and then you really dig in to get the jib later. But just rating that I would put other managers that have been rumored in the search above

Steve Tarundalo. Now maybe, you know how the Monday review goes. Everybody, you know Waki, of course. We are going to make it happen no matter the jib of the coach. You know, you're going to find something interesting and talk about once

we get in and do the true cycle analysis. But just off first impressions. Yeah, I'm a neutral to maybe a little negative. Just a drive, man. At this point in time, we'll see. Maybe it changes once he gets his dream job. And it did not help the Tarundalo agenda that he was shelled 5-1 by Nancy on Saturday night. That's crazy.

Two red cars by L-A-F-T, right? Yeah. I did it. I did say on Friday that I thought he just inherited Bob Bradley's system. And I had somebody on somebody message me on Twitter who is like a really, in a very gentlemanly and respectful way saying like, yo, he changed the system. He changed the system that Bradley used. They're much more, they're much more solid defensively and they hit on the counter more often. And so I just want to, I just want to throw that correction out there.

And in my reading whatever articles there exist out there about the type of stuff he does, and I haven't watched any of his team play, his reputation does seem to be as a pretty smart guy. He plays backgammon. Okay. I've never learned the rules of that game. Is it fun? I don't know the rules either. But I know it's a serious game that serious poker and chess people are interested.

So he's really tapped down to that type of community. When I have received confirmation from somebody that covers soccer in L.A. That if he is off for the job, he's leaving immediately. Though, I mean, and you could take that as you will. I would assume that he, like, it's not, I think it would be illegal for him to do anything like Turn It Down. Yeah. Yeah. You will also just the way, if he couldn't hear it in his voice, the way he was smiling in that clip.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm just saying there will be no caretaker manager. There will be no caretaker manager. If Stephen Tarandolo is the guy. That would be a positive if he were hired. Because if he were hired and then they said he gets to finish out the season at L-AFC, I would, you know, I'd not be happy about that. That's the one thing I don't want.

like higher I would hope you I would like somebody to be excited about but secondarily I would also like someone that we don't have to wait until the first camp

gonna be Jay got to be Cupcake and then we're doing that whole Greg Burrhawt the Nick Lima role you could say get to work but part of me doesn't want the new manager to have even an opportunity to lose to Jesse Marsh though.

Maybe just we'll help to skip that. This is another reason why I said no, sir, because we need a manager. We need a manager to make sure that we win that. That is my opinion on that matter. Now, maybe we can lose. We'll rationalize it. Yeah, but they're going to have the team for like two days. Yeah, we'll rationalize it later.

By the way, Marsh took Uruguay, Marsh and Canada took Uruguay to penalties in the third place game. 2-2, lost on penalties. And you might say, well, nobody cares about that game. Well, how much did Uruguay care about the game in Kansas City? You know? I'm not arguing for Jesse Marsh. I'm just saying it's, I'm just trying to fully absorb the pain.

Like, just give it all to me right now. Of what we have done to ourselves. If we were at a knockout game, we took on the penalties too. if we didn't have a egregiously called goal. That's all I'm saying. All I'm saying. And also, did you see?

We drew that game. And did you see how they gave up the lead to let them draw the game? Did you see, Bail? Waki. Bro. I did not. I almost want you all to go watch it right now.

Because this is pure Jesse Marsh leads like any lesson that he might have lied to Matt Crocker and said that he learned, that's probably a lie. Like, it's a jail break, breakaway situation. It's like the 93rd minute. It's like four minutes ahead of time. I'm sitting here.

I'm watching Severance on Apple TV. I couldn't bring it to myself to watch the match, especially once I saw, based on my foot mob app, the Canada was kind of cooking a little bit. I'm like, I don't know. Oh no. It's just going in the wrong direction. Then it went 2.1. 2.1.

80th minute comes. 90th minute comes. I'm like, oh, God, okay, I'm just going to turn my phone off. I give it one final check. 2-2. And then I check out the goal. Whatever pain we are feeling from the Copa America exit, it would have been 10 times harder.

It would have hit 10 times harder if we got, I don't know, grouped in the group stage or lost our first knockout, to whoever in the World Cup due to playing a high line in the in a 93rd minute et cetera essentially yeah it does look like it does look like I'm watching the clip right now it does look like quite a bit of defensive lack of defensive organization they got a four on four on two in the box not off a you know not off a lightning strike counter but off of like, um,

looks like they're playing against a low block or like playing against a block. And Canada just doesn't, yeah, anyway. I'm sorry I brought it up. We do have one more item on the coach rumors and we may have actually buried the lead here a little bit. Raffa Benitas has been floated on,

on Galazzo by Willem Ballogue, uh, that he's, he's a, he's a real option. Apparently he's been talking to Lucas. DeLotauri about what it's like to be the USM and team manager. Yeah.

No, this is, this is fascinating because this is the same reporter, Guillem Balaga or whatever, Balag, who said that probably Luis Dela Fuente is using this as leverage. He seems like a legit, he's a legit reporter and works for BBC and CBS, friends with Rafa Honigstein and, you know, that whole crew. So he says Benitez is realistic. Like it could happen. He's at a point in his career where he would take the job. So do we want to Benitez?

100% passes. I mean, aura check, flying colors. Jib check, flying colors. I mean, three-piece suit on the sideline. It's going to hit so crazy. If he was on a sideline in Kansas City against Jesse Marsh, which, the more I think about it, I'm probably going to be at that match.

I just can't let it pass me up. September 7th in Kansas City. It's a long drive to Kansas City, but it's a mostly flat drive, which I very much appreciate. It makes a difference. It does make a difference. But anyway, yeah.

Yeah, the three-piece suit, the way he takes the glasses off after every victory. Exactly. Jesse Marsh, fuming after the ruffa, taking the glasses off, walking over to shake the hand. Jesse Marsh refuses to shake the hand because he's salty about, you know,

everything that went on, et cetera. I can't wait. Yeah. And people will say, well, he's not done too well at Felta, Vigo. Well, who has, what manager has done really well at Felta Vigo? And then people will say he didn't do well at Everton. And my answer is that is, who? Who?

Who are you talking about? And then, but basically in all seriousness, it's some, it doesn't really matter. We just need a fresh set of eyes who knows the game. This dude knows the game inside and out. He's won Champions League. It was like 100 years ago, but he did do it. So let's just, if he wants the job, give him the job is what I say. Yeah.

I just want to mention real quick that I fell in love with Rafael Benitez the same time I fell in love with Solomon Rendon. Oh, at Newcastle. Yeah, the 2018-19 Newcastle season. I was watching every game, you know, watching DeAndre Yelland. And, yeah, it was just something about it. there's something about watching a a relegation a relegation contender

that just barely makes it I don't know if they barely made it or not but a relegation contender that makes it and they just get it done they got it done through you know the Rondo and the big man scoring goals they and play necessarily attractive brand of soccer but they just

they grind it through it and survived yeah I mean It's invigorating to me. When it comes to the national team, the U.S. national team, men's national team, an attractive brand of soccer is, I mean, I don't know how anybody could even be thinking about that right now. You know, that's not what we need. We don't need the word brand or attractive anywhere near the national team at this point.

Just get out there and do it. Should we take a little break, come back in eulogize Triple G? Okay, we'll be back in a second. Okay, we're back, but I forgot. Before we do the Burrhalter eulogy, let's listen to a clip from Anthony Hudson. This has also been making the rounds a little bit. He is, you know, he's kind of floating around doing commentary these days,

former interim head coach for the National Team, former assistant to Burrhalter. Here he is talking about the U.S. player player. I think we got to talk about this. And they don't have a huge amount of depth and they're still building. But unfortunately, the perception is, because all these players are at big clubs around the world,

but they're not key players at their clubs all in Europe. And this is where I think it's a little bit of illusion about where they're at. The kit 11 illusion. Yeah. Which US players are key players for their club? Cool a sec. Yep. He's won.

Malik Tillman. I'll give you, we'll give you Dest. Okay. So, Tillman, I mean, Tillman's borderline, right? Because he was, he, yeah, he was pretty key for PSV, wasn't he? Especially down the stretch. Yeah, I feel like Malik has earned that. Now, you can argue about the level of PSV and the league they're in, all that, whatever, whatever.

Tillman didn't start the season as a key player for PSV, but he, I would say, ended it as one. was key the whole season. I think given the level of, well, they did it, they had an amazing season. The level's pretty high. I would just want him to be a little bit more key there for us to count him as key. And I think we're about to count him as key after this next season. Okay. But you do agree, Dest is key for PSV.

Right? Yes. Okay. The only other one I would say, and I'm interested if you guys have other ideas, The only other one I would say is key for his team is Josh Sargent. He is, you know, he's a franchise player for Norwich City now. Now, hold on. So I agree with that.

But we do have to, we are leaving out the Fulham player of the year. Oh, yeah. Yeah, Jedi is key. For sure. Yeah. No, that's, of course. Tim Riem, not key for Fulham. Not key.

Not key. Let's see, anybody else? So, Wes, Wes is always just tricky. He's just Wes in it. He usually ends up being, he usually ends up being a big part of teams. Key, like, when I say key,

I do think about, Matt Doylew's talk about this. Like, who is responsible for the way that their teams play in, like, at their club? I guess it might be another way to put it. And Wes, while making huge impacts, is kind of on the periphery usually of how the team plays. Yeah.

You know, isn't, you know, he's usually, he usually has at least touches on the squad for the most part. Because key isn't just do you start or not. It's like when the chips are down, who's making plays, who's the ball going through? And, yeah. And who's like isn't even necessarily the ball's going through this guy all the time. guy either. That's true. That's true.

It's just hard not to call him a very key piece. I think we're counting him as a key piece, but the style is not based on him. I think Balagan, you know, some people will give a shout for him, but... The big sleeper here, right, is Johnny. If Johnny continues on this path at Batis, or Bettis, excuse me, that he's been on

so far, then yeah, this time next year we will be saying that he is key for his club i mean he was key in those in that little run that he had i thought the same thing could happen with adams too you think yeah but that now we got to talk about all the players who aren't key timwaya not key uh gio reina not key uh joe scally not key i mean he plays a lot has played a lot over the last three years but you know totally in a role player position. Tim Ream doesn't play. Chris Richards is, he has played a lot, but I think it'd be a stretch to call him a key part,

like a crucial member of that Crystal Palace team. Matt Turner doesn't play, and that's our starters. So I think Anthony Hudson is right. He is right, but what does it mean? Well, I think, you know, other people have uploaded this idea lately, but, you know, find your level and become a key player for a team. Yeah. I think that's maybe where we need to go.

Because you look at like, you know, people are like, well, Colombia has a bunch of players in the Brazil league. We should be able to, why are they so much better than us? It's because Burrhalter's terrible. Maybe. I mean, maybe that's it. But it's also the fact that these guys are, I mean, Richard Rios, like you said, he's a baller.

great teeth too. And, you know, go play in Brazil. Figure out how to become a, how to become indispensable to a team. Yeah. That's my takeaway. It's fair. It's hard to find it, though.

It's hard to find it, though, right? Because the one thing that I do think about often and the thing that we have seen is that you're just not going to get the same opportunities as an American whatever. Like maybe Weston should have stayed at shock or something. Well, when you find a nice little spot like that, maybe you should stay there and just figure it out.

But it's like you're not just going to, they are quick to make you, to make sure you're not key. You know what I'm saying? You're going to get pushed to fullback. You're going to get pushed to, you're going to become a utility man, all this different type of stuff.

Wow. Their academy prospects, countrymen, usually in these clubs where they're based, whether it's Italy, you know, Spain, whatever, while they push these other ones into maybe the exact positions that our players covet. So, I don't know, it's easier said than done, I think, as these players traverse Europe and try to manage their careers. And I don't think it's not really a criticism of the players because we call on them to go. push themselves in Europe and then go to better better teams and they've done that. It's more like we have to be realistic

at where we are right now. Yeah. Like we shouldn't suddenly have 11 key players at all the biggest clubs in Europe. No, we're not going to have that. But I do think, I do imagine that there is, there are some soft skills you learn

when you are the key player for a team, some courage, some sense of responsibility. that you don't have to learn when you're, you know, like, not, I'm not picking on him. Just as an example, Wes at Juventus, where he, if he's, like, sort of peripheral in the way they're playing, he doesn't have to be, like, it's not on his shoulders, you know. But at Norwich City, a much lower level, the performance is on Josh Sargent's shoulders. Is that ever going to translate for the national team? I don't know.

But it's his job. to drag Norwich City to a win. Yo, go ahead. So I would say, how's your right is key, by the way. Yeah,

that's true. Yeah. For Wes, I would settle for him just watching soccer in his, in his spare time. Yeah. You know what I'm saying?

Hopefully you watched the game last night. Yeah, like, like maybe you don't got to be key, but bro, like, and he's been, he's been very,

uh, forthcoming with this fact. you know, any interview of Wes, you know, talk to him. He's always like, yeah, I don't watch soccer at all. I don't watch any sports. I need to, I just do what I do, blah, blah, blah. Like, Wes, it's about that time, bro. You probably need to start.

You need to start. Just watch some ball. You've done great up until this point, for sure. Nobody can take that away from you. But if you want to reach the levels that you say you want to reach, you know, on the Tim Riem podcast, He said he wanted to be one of the best eights in the world. If you want to do that, bro, I think you've made it far enough applying your trade, how you have applied it so far. Maybe you got to do some things you don't want to do.

Right. A little independent study. Yeah, man. Maybe he did. Maybe he exaggerates that, and he is watching some soccer, I hope. So, there it is. Now the Burrhalter, I think the Burrhalter stuff, we should move on to. I kind of want to talk about our favorite moments of the Burrhalter era.

Do you want to start, Vince? Maybe we could each give three. I don't know, maybe that goes on too long. Let's each just give one at a time and see how it goes. I've got a quick three. Okay, go for it. All the times you beat Mexico. Yeah.

That's number one. The time he held up a Starbucks mug or a reporter gave them, and then he stared directly into camera. and then there's just a whole set of moments really all of my favorite moments are beating Mexico and him staring directly into camera he would do it at press conferences live television interviews

after he took a photo with fans during a game he did it that was the one in St. Paul the Snow Bowl that's one of my favorite moments for sure it's a weird dude man I saw a sizzle reel to bounce passes and I was cracking up laughing

and they put it over some the see you again the Charlie Poof song or whatever and yeah it was just It's been a long day and he's spamming Pousbassas and I was just shaking my head I'm like bro what who is this guy?

Like you know what I'm saying? Like he was just such a interesting fella It was Yeah Yeah I don't think anyone I don't think we

Anyone figured him out at all though I don't think so Bobby Warshall tried Do you remember I guess it was the The live interview from The San Ciro Where he's he really looked into the camera

Pretty fun That was funny Something unsettling about his About his demeanor I don't know But shout out to I like it I found his demeanor very calming.

I'll miss his demeanor. Maybe my favorite moment is when he... Well, just real quick. I just want to ask Wachie, is your least favorite moment when he told you to do something funny? No, I'm grateful for it. I'm grateful for it. Okay. I wish I had been more prepared.

I didn't handle it all at all, but I wasn't... No, it's okay. It occurs to me that maybe your presence and... It was just two... It was too awkward people meeting each other is what happened. Right. And you two meeting, maybe it was an omen. Maybe we broke some type of third wall that didn't need to be broken.

Yeah, it should never happen. It should never happen. I got a message from Sanjay. Do you want to come interview a player? I said, yeah, absolutely. At first I was thinking, no. I may have said this on the set before. I said, no, if I'm going to do a podcast about the team,

I can't turn down opportunities to interview players. And then once you agree to that, you've agreed to do the whole thing of things. and you show up at the training and suddenly your meeting Burrhalter should never have happened. Yeah. I mean, because the results just tanked immediately after that happened. It seemed to be some type of unsettling in the force. I just want to throw that out.

Huge mistake. Huge mistake. And I apologize to everyone. Well, apology accepted. I'll give my top three moments and then a couple of honorable mentions. So for me, the 3-2 win over Mexico in the 2021. Nations League final in Denver is number one, my favorite moment of the entire era. We went down in the first minute on a Mark McKenzie, oopsie, and then gave up another

on a header that was called off for offside, but we made our way back. And maybe I'm just thinking about the game last night and the parallels between the game in 2021 and the game last night. But I just, we just, we fought back. Raina scored, West scored. We scored on set pieces. Orvath came on and made some big saves. including the penalty saved late.

It went to extra time and Pulisic buried his penalty, which was probably the most cathartic moment of the Burrhalter tenure for me. The team fought that night and it flew around and it scrapped. Like I said, scored on set pieces. And we beat Mexico. And that was the first time we beat him under Burrhalter, right? And it felt really good. Remember the guy fell off the balcony right behind Dempsey that night, too?

There was a lot. There was a lot happening in that. How could you forget? So that's my, yeah. That was my favorite. There was a pitch invader. That's right. People throwing, like fans throwing stuff at the players and stuff.

Second would be the win over Iran. And I think this is my only tactical thing that I'm happy about from the Burrhalter era at this point. Because that goal was just extremely Burrhalterian. the diagonal from Wes over to Serginio on the on the back post. Serenio nods it across and then Pulisic's desire and commitment making that run to get his pelvic bruise. I could watch it on loop for a lot of, a lot of time. It is. The callback way of goal was really nice too, the one that he was like an inch offside for.

Yeah. It is quite nice to know that from the very start of Greg Burrhalter's tenure, we were working on that exact pattern. And, you know, in the biggest moment of the tenure, we pulled out that exact same pattern to score the goal that got us out the group. Right. That's cool, man. I got to respect it. Yep. Yeah, me too. And I feel like tactics probably matter less than we have made it seem like they do for a while. But that was cool.

And then, of course, the win over Panama in Orlando and World Cup qualifying. We saw that gorgeous Pulisic goal of romp, a 5-1 victory when we needed it. really, really, really, really fun tailgate that night. And that was awesome. And it was soured a bit by the loss to Costa Rica a couple days later, but it still qualified us for the World Cup. So it's fine. Yeah, I was not soured at all.

I mean, really, you know, that match was like, we qualified, you know, to. Yeah. No, totally fair. Other things, you know, Pet, Berlter winning all those dual national victories was great. Him giving his shoes to the Trinidadian YouTuber was something. Something about that just strikes me as cool. Like, Greg is a decent dude. But I agree.

I don't think anybody's figured him out. Well, I think it's pretty clear. He's a decent dude. At least that's my impression. Yeah. That's my impression. And then the peppy winner in San Pedro Sula. But he's got to go, obviously.

Not arguing with that at all. Yes. Not arguing with that. And furthermore, the more I really, really think about it, I'm not sure. You're not sure he was a plus at all? Yeah, basically. In the grand scheme of things. Yeah, I do not.

And I think, and this is why I ride for MMA as hard as I do, and I'm going to keep riding for him. until the end of time because it would have been an the error it would have been

an abject failure without MMA pulling up and solving some things for us and figuring out how we could get

reliably get the ball of the field which we reliably got the ball of the field once again these stats have been shot down by Tony Miola

but I will still cite them in a defense of my boys, you know, we, I think we were fourth in like field tilt at the World Cup and something, some other good number and amount of possessions that reached the final third, all on the backs of MMA, because any time that any one of those players missed, somehow it all went, it all went away. And we never found a reliable way to get the ball up the field and tilt the field in that same way. without MMA. We still have not found it.

So I do think it was all saved by MMA showing up. Now, he won, you know, he did the work to get Eunice Musa and all that, which is the big win for him. But as soon as it was like as soon as these dudes showed up, all of a sudden, boom, Burrhalter Ball has feet. We have something to be excited about now. We actually look like a team that is capable. of playing this possession soccer. And, yeah, like I said, without these dudes, it has not looked the same sense. Yeah, it's true.

And I do think, you know, to take it back to the Copa final last night, MMA could compete in that game for a little while. But Musa would be gassed after 30 minutes. Oh, yeah. You just would be tried. West would be gassed after 65 And I mean I mean They might be gassed even sooner than that

Given the intensity of this game last night But I mean But yeah At least at least with them we have Something that Keeps us in the game You know For a while

You think Rob Rico de Paul wouldn't track Memphis to pie Into the box Even if he had played 270 minutes in a group stage You know what I'm saying Like this is 15 minutes into the match Like you know

It's just all these things That we Zepruder and all that It's like, it doesn't have to happen. Like, whoever the blame is on, you can see the standard and you see how they don't allow things like this happen. But anyway. Rodrigo DePaul would track Memphis DePy all the way to Steve Harvey's house. You know what I'm saying?

He would be in the booth with him while he's recording another terrible rap song. You know what I'm saying? Turn up my snare. but yeah man it's uh some people have said i've seen it said on twitter that you know we played three destroyers and we we we mma was like three destroyers in midfield and other countries don't do that etc etc i mean but when you see enzo roerigo and alexi in in practice it uh kind of looks like three destroyers they just have a lot of quality too yes yes They have a lot of quality too, but it looks like three destroyers.

And if you pull up Alexi McHawish's World Cup numbers and you pull up Weston McKinney's World Cup numbers on sponsor of the pod, FB Ref's website, they look eerily similar. You know what I'm saying? That's all I'm saying. But anyway, we'll get off that. But I just, I know we probably do need to move away from MM.

Maybe we don't, though. Maybe we don't. Maybe we do. But all I'm saying is just put some respect on them. Yeah. I will. I will. I do.

Beautiful, beautiful Mexico win in Cincinnati. That was nice. That was, that was, you know what? That's number one for me. Bell's given everything. Wauke was giving you and stuff. That'll be number one for me at Mexico win. Tailgate before.

It's my, my biggest contribution to a scuff tailgate, bringing two smoke pork butts from Louisville down the way. This one, that's why I met Wachie at that. in Cincinnati, right? The Monday Review with Vince in it started probably like a month later. The match, tremendous. The play on the pitch,

particularly from Eunice Musa, sublime. I was sick. And, you know, I don't get too many matches that my wife can ascend. You know, we have kids or whatever. You know, we try to... Because it's a lot harder to take the both of us.

to a place. Then, leaving one behind. But she was able to be at that one. The only U.S.-Mexico match that I've been to still at this point, I didn't make it to Dallas this year. And so, yeah, that was particularly special for me. That's number one.

That's number one. Number two, this past Nation's League, the press conference, the spat between him and Jesse Marsh. I am very upset and sad that we're not going to get a Greg v. Jesse matchup. I wanted that more than anything, and I wanted us to win that matchup. We're not going to get it. With the way the results went down, we should not have gotten it because Greg didn't

hold up his end of the bargain. But that was great. Punded Jesse, sticking his foot in his mouth more times that you could count just over and over and over again, and also mentioning the fact that he was done wrong by the over and over and over again, you know, called Eunice Yusuf. I'm not going to get into the whole Jesse Marsh bill. But Jesse Marsh questioning if Giorina should have been brought in the camp, intimating that maybe if he was the coach, he would not have brought Giorina into camp.

Giorina getting two assists against Jamaica as we won by the skin of our chinny, chin, and then Greg taking that press conference as an opportunity to throw shots at Jesse. in a non, in a way that was obvious enough to where it was talked about on, on CBS Airwaves the next day

with Jesse Marsh and Tony Miela, et cetera. That was, that was good TV, man. That's good, whether it was fake or not, if that was a WWE production, I'll take that.

The K-Fabe is working on me. Number three, everything Airborne 69-related, that had to do with Greg Burrhalter. Airborne 69 conspicuously absent from this Copa America. And that's another thing.

The vibes were just, it just, it wasn't our year. I don't know. Airborne 69 wasn't vlogging, the way that he was in Qatar. I should have seen pictures of him with random Bolivian women, random,

random Panamanian women outside of Mercedes-Benz, Ben Stadium or something, you know, whether he was in full Atlanta cultural garb, maybe an airbrush tea or something, I don't know. I don't know. But airborne was missing. But the airborne moments that we did get, of course, with relation to Greg Burrhalter were just box office. Now, obviously, the tweet that started it was when he thanked coach Mr. Burrhalter for

disciplining his son. Weston McKinney after the U.S. the Mexico match, after we beat Mexico, airborne, tweeting, thank you, thank you to Mr. Burrhal. Coach Mr. Burrhalter,

coach Mr. Burrhalter for, you know, shepherding his son. I don't have the exact tweet in front of me, for shepherding his son through throughout this process and disciplining and making him into a man. And then also the World Cup. It's been some of its rumor, of its truth, I would like to think the Airborne 69 acted as Greg's muscle in the face of

the on-charging. The mom fights. Yeah. The mom fights on the roof. Yeah, got physical with moms is maybe my favorite phrase of the entire Burrhalter tenure. The barbecue, et cetera, where things may or may not have happened, I just like to think that Airborne was there every step of the way, providing protection. and then also as payment for the and the infamous

and cry amongst the scuff faithful with Greg Burrhalter, you know, hashtag the coach, that infamous tweet that I have in a poster in my house, it's just that that's the stuff. That's the stuff right there. You know, bounce pass, I could not, we cannot necessarily subsist on bounce passes and drive press conferences

and drive podcast with Bobby Warshaw. But the characters around Greg made sure that they gave us good Greg moments. Good Greg moments. And that's all. And the mentality will never die as well. It'll never die.

And you know what? I think we should also pat ourselves on the back because we've made the most of it. Exactly. You know? Especially you, Waki. When the lemon was dry, you still squeeze some juice out of it and made some lemonade. I mean, he helped us well by, you know, I don't want to take too much credit.

He did do those bounce passes. He didn't have to. He did, that's true. He didn't have to do that for us, but he did. He was an entertainer, and I appreciate it. Wish him all the best in the future. Good luck to you, Greg. Thank you for your service.

What else? We got to get out of here soon, but, Waki, you got a couple more things. I've just got some quick items. One, B.J. Callahan starts at Nashville in the 22nd. They're watching all those games. Very excited about the BJ tenure. Two, Dortmund measures their players for suits before the season for the Champions League because they come up dressed fancy.

They reportedly measured Cole Campbell. 18-year-old American. I don't think that means we need to expect. and playing Champions League, but that means he's maybe on the edge of the first team picture. Yeah. Awesome.

Inner are trying to get the Testman Tanner Testament deal done this week. Then the rumor is still dealt loan him out. The team's being floated. This was by, I believe, Fab. It was by Fab. It switched town and Fionord. Cool.

Let's do Fionord. I can weigh in. Weston. He seems to be, the plan seems to be he's kind of try to stick out Juventus. That's what he does.

Okay. John Brooks, he doesn't have a team right now. He's without a club. So the John Brooks comeback will need him to get a club first, probably. I just got to say, Weston preferring to live in Turin

over, say, Bormmouth or even like Western Germany, it's a no-brainer. Of course he wants to stay That's all. I imagine there's some financial consideration going on as well. Yes.

That's all I have. All right. Great stuff, guys. Let's get out of here. Thanks everybody for listening. We will see you.