Scuffed | USMNT, World Cup, Yanks Abroad, futbol in America - #602: Walker Zimmerman joins the pod

Episode Date: June 9, 2025

The USMNT and Nashville SC centerback joins Belz and Sanjay Sujanthakumar to discuss how he practices attacking set pieces, aerial prowess in general, the differences in how centerbacks are instructed to operate under Poch compared to Berhalter, his mindset coming off the bench against Iran in 2022, that goal-line clearance, that penalty against Wales, his Christian faith, and much more. Skip the ads! Subscribe to Scuffed on Patreon and get all episodes ad-free, plus any bonus episodes. Patrons at $5 a month or more also get access to Clip Notes, a video of key moments on the field we discuss on the show, plus all patrons get access to our private Discord server, live call-in shows, and the full catalog of historic recaps we've made: https://www.patreon.com/scuffedAlso, check out Boots on the Ground, our USWNT-focused spinoff podcast headed up by Tara and Vince. They are cooking over there, you can listen here: https://boots-on-the-ground.simplecast.comAnd check out our MERCH, baby. We have better stuff than you might think: https://www.scuffedhq.com/store Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to the Scuff podcast where we talk about U.S. soccer. Our guest today is a native of Lawrenceville, Georgia, a two-time MLS defender of the year, a father of two, and the man who made a 98th minute goal line clearance against Iran to ensure we went to the knockout rounds of the World Cup in 2022. Nashville SCE and U.S. men's national team centerback Walker Zimmerman. Welcome to Scuff. Thank you guys for having me. Pleasure to be here. So I want to start off with the subject of area.

dominance. I just watched the last few minutes of that win over Ron. I think you headed the ball away like 300 times in the last 10 minutes. So to what do you attribute your ability in the air, besides the obvious height, you know? Yeah. I think timing is huge. I think the mentality and aggression piece is also big. I don't know if it's from like playing other sports growing up, just like the recognition

of as soon as the ball kind of leaves a foot or is in the air, I feel like knowing exactly where it's going to be the apex of where I can meet it. I feel like I can recognize that super early relative to other people. Because I've worked with other centerbacks in the past on various teams. They're like, hey, how do you work on this? And I'm like watching them do it. And I realize it's like it's picking up the flight of the ball to where you can still be aggressive and commit to your jump and like read it at its height, meet it at its height.

So I think there's something with timing there. Obviously the height helps. But yeah, I don't know if it's from other sports growing up. Just kind of hand-eye and recognize. But playing outfield in baseball in little league or? I was playing shortstop. Yeah, shortstop playing basketball. I don't know if it's like rebounding or I don't know.

I don't know what it is. There's even batting in baseball, you know, you're just recognizing the pitch so early, that kind of thing. But I don't know. I think it's timing. And then that kind of sets up everything else. It is fun to see, you know, how dominant you are in the air. Because you watch enough soccer, you realize not every centerback is like that, you know?

Totally. Yeah, I mean, it's a strength of mine for sure. And it gives, I think, our team confidence, too, when you're out there because you know to position yourself like, okay, he's going to win the header. Where can I position to now get it? And so that's been the next step of like my own career and helping other players like, okay, if I know I'm going to win the ball, how can I maintain possession and direct these headers down to feet and really focus on the precision of that? Because it's an important area of not just winning the header, but trying to maintain possession. And you've got the attacking part down to with headers. You scored 26 goals in MLS, which is pretty good for centerback. I'll take it. How often and how exactly do you practice the attacking side, set pieces, and all that? It kind of varies with team to team, whether they do a little crossing and finishing at the end of a training session, how often they do that. But, yeah, I like to at least have at least one day a week where I'm out there heading in some corners,

some set pieces. And a lot of that comes from the set piece training session, like the day before a game, maybe two days before a game. Maybe there's, you know, Nashville. We do like an old v. Young cross-kin finishing drill. In Dallas, we kind of did groups of three crossing and finishing where the losing team had to pay for a barbecue. So you get some reps in. Wait, how does that work if you have groups of three crossing? So they get a chance to.

Yeah. So we just basically, you'd hit a ball out wide and you have three guys kind of going into the box. And it's just unopposed and you just got to finish. Sometimes it's groups of two, sometimes groups of three. So the other three would just be watching while they're just. Yeah, yeah. Everyone gets probably like five or six balls aside and however any goals you have. If you have the least amount of goals, you got to pay for the barbecue. That's what it was in Dallas.

Nashville, we do kind of an old v. Young and old guys are just dominating. The Young's had to take a little sabbatical while we've had a lot of games. We haven't done that in a little while. But yeah, and then obviously when you come to camp, it's different corner kick takers or set piece takers. So I definitely try and work at least one session before a game, some extra reps of like getting the timing right, trying to make sure I'm reading how it's coming off of their foot, how much pace they're using, and then also having that conversation, I know you may love to whip the ball in, but can you try some that have a little bit more height? Because I think if you whip it,

you have to be so precise with the way you're putting it. If you get a little more air on it, that gives me time to react, to try and get my head on it, and that ultimately makes a bigger radius of which I can get to the ball. And then obviously, I mean, we have a lot of other talented guys too so sometimes like hey make the decoy sometimes you'll drag two three guys and bring them in the air post knowing that hey on this particular play we're going mid goal or back post and i'm just trying to bring two three guys with me do you have a preference um in swinging or out swinging uh it doesn't really matter i think it totally depends on the the situation i think out swingers um you know then i'm probably flicking him a little bit more towards the back post and i'm meeting it

a little bit further out from the goal in swingers i'm being a little bit more aggressive trying to really meet it at the six. So a lot of that depends on defensive setup and where we think they're weaker zones are. If it's someone in the near zone, then I'm going to want to end-swing her so I can just jump right at them. If they're pretty strong, maybe we swing it out a little bit more, and those guys who are in the main zone don't have the chance to get out there. Okay. Does the ball come weird off of Jack McGlynn's foot? It's nice. That's an exact conversation that I had with them at the Olympics was like, hey, you have such a good service. let's just be on the same page if you're really whipping it,

or can you hit some that are a little bit, not loopier, but a little bit more air under them so I can have some more time to react. But he's a very precise set piece taker. So I kind of default to him, like, but I just need to know beforehand. Because if you're going to whip it, I'm going to run hard. If you're not, I'm going to kind of try and read it a little bit.

So that's just communication on the field. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that was really, that was a deep dive. That's what we're all about. Yeah, yeah. That's what we're all. So your career arc is kind of a throwback to national team players of previous generations

in that you have built an international career by being, I mean, dominant, just to use that word again, dominant, consistently being a top performer in MLS. Was that always your plan? Or was there a time where you thought, like, I need to go to Europe to, I don't know, raise my profile or whatever the word is, you know? Yeah, I don't know that it was always the plan. I think, you know, starting out with the American system, especially when I was coming through, it was a little bit more rare to go straight from college, for example, to Europe.

And we didn't really have the full development of the MLS Academies to the extent that we have today. So I wasn't involved in an academy. I kind of went through club soccer, college, and that was kind of a more popular route. And it changed kind of within the five years that I turned pro. So, yeah, I mean, it had no idea whether I'd be an MLS lifer, whether I'd go to Europe. There are a couple opportunities. One fallen through when I was younger in Dallas, where I thought I was going to leave, didn't. was always open to it and then kind of just, you know, was able to create a pretty solid

career in MLS. And yeah, I've never been those guys, be like, oh, I'm never going to Europe, or I'm never going to stay in MLS my whole career. I'm like, I'm open to whatever opportunities out there. And at the end of the day, I'm going to make a choice that's best for both me and family and the situation itself. So you were asked this recently, and you kind of said there's not big difference with the way Potch and Greg handled the pool in terms of where guys are playing. But, you know, this roster, it's a big eye-opener for a lot of fans looking at a lot of these new MLS guys. Do you think Pottes maybe more open than you thought he'd be to MLS and including these guys? Yeah, I think that's fair.

I think that's fair assessment. You know, you never really know when a coach comes in, what their dynamic is going to be, how they're going to view the player pool. and he's certainly been, you know, accepting and, you know, fair and open to inviting in, whether you're an MLS or Europe, he's like, I just want guys that are going to compete and give it all for the badge and can perform when they're in camp, as well as club. You know, you need to be playing well at club to be called in. So, yeah, it's been refreshing. It's been good to see, and I think, you know, you have guys out there who are eager to take an opportunity when they get it. So I think Gold Cup is the perfect example of that. We're going to have. have a lot of games, a lot of opportunities for guys, both MLS and abroad.

And it's up to them to make the most of it. Who are the leaders you see on this team outside of some of you older guys? Like you, Tim, Matt, who else could emerge as a leader between now and the World Cup? Yeah, I think, you know, even getting to see a guy like Chris Richards wear the armband, he's a guy who's been a lot more involved in the past year and a half, two years. So it was great to see him take that next step, getting the arm band. band. You know, you look at obviously the older guys. You had, you know, Tyler, Tim, Matt, and myself, who might be more the veteran guys with the World Cup experience. But, you know,

there are certainly other younger guys who are capable and eager and hopeful to have that kind of impact from a leadership standpoint. So Chris is the one that came to mind first, just being a younger guy, but who also has experience. So, yeah, I'm stick with that one. With Chris, Chris seems like a funny guy charismatic guy. Have you noticed him taking the role more seriously now in a way or is he just kind of himself? Yeah, I mean, I think we can all talk about personalities off the field and we're like, oh yeah, he's a funny guy. But like when we're on the field, you know, we're all, we're all going to compete like super hard. And even a guy like Tyler Adams, you know, everyone's like, oh, he's so hard. And he's one who's actually very aggressive and intense off the field too.

But deep down, he knows it. There's a little bit of, there's a little bit of softy inside of him that fans don't get to see. Really down-to-earth, sweet, genuine guy. But yeah, when we're all in the field, I mean, your kind of personality is what it is on the field. It's going to be pretty consistent. That's what got you to this level, and that's what's going to keep you at this level. Speaking of Chris, a shift of gears here. I want to go into some more deep dives, but we had a Crystal Palace podcast on our show a couple weeks ago,

and he totally unprompted brought up Chris's Christian faith, and the fact that there's like a cohort of Christian. on the Crystal Palace team, including Everettche, as they had the guy who scored all the goals in their FAA cup run. And so I wanted to ask you, it seems like there's a cohort on the national team too. And what is the impact? So, first of all, is that true? And what is the impact of Christianity in your life?

Yeah, I mean, it plays a major role in my life. I am a pastor's kid, grew up in and around the church since I was, yeah, as young as I can remember. So it's always been very important to me. We're loving the church that we're attending here in Nashville, my family, raising our kids for sure to try and get them around and exposed to it. And then with the national team, yeah, they do a great job. We have some chaplains who come in, do some match day chapels or even meetings kind of throughout the week, especially on these long camps when you're kind of away, can be isolated, just they're there to check in and be a resource that people can use. So certainly a few guys, a handful of guys,

that will attend that kind of match day chapel or even the ones that take place during the week. And it's kind of like, hey, if you can make it great, if not, no big deal. I know it gets busy with treatments and meetings and all that. But it's a great resource to have, I think, to keep guys anchored into whatever they believe.

So for us as Christians, we have amazing resources with the chaplaincy program with the national team. And again, just a great way to kind of stay present and stay kind of grounded while you're kind of grinding through the day-to-day of a June window. I saw that like there was an Instagram video where the players were asked what's your one thing you have to take with you on a trip. And I think like four of the dudes said it was their Bible.

Yeah. I was like, huh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there's definitely, definitely a lot of believers here in this camp. And it's always fun to kind of meet with them and have fellowship throughout camp because you don't normally get to do that as much when you're at different clubs. Let me ask one more sort of personal question.

How old is your son? Is he three? He's three. He's going to be four in like two weeks. Okay. I saw I'm throwing a baseball pretty well. Yes, yeah. He's got a cannon.

He's got pretty good on. Yeah. Is he interested in soccer? He loves soccer. It's still probably his favorite sport. He is locked into the Nashville games. He's extremely excited for the game tomorrow here in Nashville. Yeah, he has, you know, his favorite toys, it's like

He's soccer guys and there's a full field and then he has 11 of one team and one color and 11 and the other. And he'll even like line them up on the sideline before he starts playing with them and start singing the Star Spingle Banner because he's just like been to so many games at this point and he's so locked in. He wakes up in the morning. He just wants to watch the recaps of all the Nashville games. So he's seen like so many of our recaps or he's definitely seen all of them.

A lot of them multiple multiple times where he's even like doing the commentating. So he'll be imitating Taylor Twelman and saying the exact quote, like at the exact time in the game. So he definitely loves soccer. He loves kicking in the backyard pretty much every day. But he loves all sports. Whatever he's doing, he's pretty into. So he did baseball. He's dabbled a little bit and some golf and certainly has been involved with soccer.

And already getting accruited by the Vanderbilt baseball coach. Of course, yes, of course. We'll get back into the deep dive soccer stuff in a second. But you mentioned golf, are you hands down the best? golfer in the pool? I mean, I need to try and really think, but if I'm not one, I'm up there. I think I'll, you know what? Honestly, I'm going to claim it. I'm going to claim it. I'm going to take down anyone in the pool. Including Christian. Like, because people say Christian's good. No, Christian's good. Yeah. He would, he would also admit I'm a little bit better than him. He's got a better

short game, but every other aspect I got him beat. That's really big that we got that settled on. Yeah. Yeah. No, he's, he's good. He's good. We're great scramble partners, honestly. We do a really good job together. Yeah, he's great around the greens, chipping, and I'll get us, you know, long off the T. Not to belabor the point, but if you're one and Pulisix 2, who's like in competition? Scali? No, no, no, no. Scali, Gio, Paxson, Brendan, those guys are all another tier. I try to think who else goes out there a lot. I mean, Weston would love to be considered, but he's not in there either. Yeah, I don't know. I think there's a big gap between the top two and the others. Yeah, cool.

Could you talk about the differences in the way centerbacks play under Potch and Greg? You get the, as a national team coach, you get the benefit of a second set of coaches watching your game, helping you develop. Yeah, what can you learn from that? And how has that impacted your development? I think the biggest difference would be just the fluidity between the centerbacks, whether you're building out with three or two, and also when you're defending in a two-three or a three-two, like you can end up being. kind of central or on the right or on the left depending on what side you play. But there's a lot more fluidity and flexibility with your movement involved with those kind of rotations. So even if it goes back to the keeper, you can bring a right back down inside the

box and that centerback, the right side centerback can be on top of the box in the middle and not the one who's opening deep and out wide. And that's a different type of position than what we would do under Greg. It'd be always centerback split out wide, defensive mid coming into the middle. Here, there's a little bit more rotation within that. It's not all. always, you know, right center back, you're rolling out deep to the right to open up. Sometimes you can stay in the middle, try and get us an extra number in there for a bounce to build out. And then also the defensive side of things, how that can work.

When you sit in a fullback high, whether an attacking mid goes load, you stay with, you pass them on. Some subtle differences, but yeah, I would say that's probably the biggest one is how often you're kind of changing your roles and build out. And is that up to you in the moment, basically? Yeah, yeah, you have the freedom based on what you see and what you read to make that change. And sometimes it can be a tactical adjustment from the sideline. Like, hey, you do this, you do that.

But yeah, it's just a little bit more of a flexibility probably within that. So I'm not trying to get you to, like, criticize Burrhalter, but is it, so it's more flexible under botched than it was under Burrhalter? Yeah, in terms of a centerback building out, I think so, yeah. We weren't really ever asked to stay in the middle and be kind of that. It's because we're building up in three a lot more under potch. We would sometimes under Greg, but it'd be a defensive mid dropping in between the two centerbacks. Now, that can still happen, but it could also be a centerback in the middle and a fullback being the deeper one. Then you bring the winger down low, put an attack mid into the pocket.

So it's just a little bit more rotation that's available to you. Yeah, like with Joe and Alex the other day, right, coming in. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, Potch and both Potch and Chris Richards have talked a little bit recently about the difficulty of going from three at the back, a three at the back formation with your club to two at the back. And I wonder, like, what's your thought on that? Is it, is it, because you've played both at Nashville over the years. Is it a big adjustment or what do you think? Yeah, I mean, I don't know exactly what they said. I think, you know, ultimately when you're going into a game,

You know if you're playing in a back four or back five. So as a centerback if you're in a back five and you're a side centerback Yeah, you can be extremely aggressive to step in. You're tracking the forward or the attacking mid down into the pocket every time as a side center back Ultra aggressive if you do that in a four all of a sudden you step up you open the space behind you and that gap between the outside back and the other center back is huge Yeah, I think I worry about those runs the timing of it. It's hard to maintain the line So that's that's the biggest difference So you got to be really aware of you know that would be a big a big shift, but you got to know going into the game, okay, well, I probably don't have as much freedom to attach to this forward or attacking mid when they drop down. I got to try and get the

center mid over to cover, and I kind of hold the line and try and drop and read those passes. I think that's basically what Chris said. I mean, something along those lines. Potch was just more like, this is difficult because most of them play. It's different. It's different positions for sure. I mean, even, you know, I know, I think he said something about Max, you know, left back versus left wingback in Columbus. These are, yeah, again, it's a great way to kind of, it's good teaching opportunities. It's good things to learn as a player. You need to know how to play multiple systems and change on the fly.

And yeah, I think they did a good job of that. And especially in watching film and reviewing it, it's just good talking points to solidify to make sure we're all on the same page. Let's go back in time a bit. Let's go back to 2022. too. When you subbed on against Iran, what were your instructions for that game? And then was your role as we switched to the three-back in relation to CCV and RIM? Yeah, I knew going into that game, obviously I was, you know, the night before I found out

I wasn't going to be playing in the game. So I remember I met with our mental coach. I was pretty pissed at the time. But I was like, I got to flush this out. And by the end of our conversation and the conversation with Greg, it was like, look, just know. Like, yeah, I can not be happy about it, but I will do whatever it takes for this team to win, and I will be ready when my name's called tomorrow. Like, you can count on that. And so I knew that that would be a situation in which I would get called in, as if we're winning, if we're tied, whatever it was, I was probably going to go in at the end of the game to try and lock things down.

And so my mentality was like, I'm going to absolutely lock it down. I have to win every challenge, every duel, be alert, bring it. energy because they'd been working so hard and obviously it's to fight for the knockout stages you know guys are gonna be tired they've given their all it's not the third game i knew i had to be a spark and bring energy in that situation so yeah i was out for it again using all that what could have been negative energy and just turn it into like a focused adrenaline like for the team i told gregg i'm always a team first guy like i can disagree with your decision but i'm gonna do everything i can't help this team win and move forward so um

Yeah, just wanted to lock it down. And when you go into a back five, I love that situation when other teams crossed the ball, putting balls in. It's just like, I'm going to eat it all up and try and give us some energy to close it out. I mean, that's exactly what happened. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So the sequence that led to the knockout, you know, to that goal line clearance, it's a long ball. It's one of the few long balls that didn't come in your direction. So it comes in Tim's direction. Tim Reams. Walk us through what you remember about that play. There's a lot going on in that moment. Yeah, I mean, I don't really remember exactly what happened before it. I remember watching, I was kind of covering down, Cam had kind of stepped up another guy, Matt was coming out, and I saw it kind of squirt through, but it was like alert and ready. I was like always thinking of the what if, like just in case. And sure enough, you know, it squirted through and I was able to make a play.

but I remember as I cleared it, Shaq Moore was kind of staying there, and it almost hit Shaq, and I was like thinking after the game we were joking about, I was like, yo, imagine, like if that would have hit you and somehow done something crazy because it like whizzed by his head on the clearance. But yeah, I was just trying to be alert and ready for the worst case, the what-ifs. And I just remember it kind of squirting through there and was able to get it out. That's a good listening to question. Swear on the Bible, was it a foul by CCV?

you know because the because i mean iran was going yeah no i think i think the guy was really looking for contact you know ccv's a strong guy you're going to feel it a little bit but i think he probably oversold it in that situation just knowing he wasn't able to make anything happen trying to get a foul and i think it was a good call obviously me too yeah yeah it's a good listener question and you mentioned that that mental side and the mental coach um psychologically do you connect the clearance that heroic moment to the way the tournament started in that first game with the bail penalty did it feel like any connection looking back no not really I mean at the end of the day like I'm gonna you got to play this game on instincts you got to play this game with the aggression

and what's gotten you there in the moment I don't see him coming I'm making a play on the ball trying to get it out he's a clever guy puts his foot in there like it happens it's do I wish I could have taken a quick glance and seen him not going to ground? Sure. Did it affect my mentality or my approach going into England in four days time? No. Like I flushed out of the system, next game, next moment mentality, you know? Immediately after they scored the penalty, I'm like, I got to score on a set piece. I got to try and get involved, like get one back, like wasn't dwelling on it, not thinking like, oh, I gave up, no, like it's, that's soccer, it happens, move forward. And then is it like redemption or anything?

Not really. I'm just trying out the other to do my job. And, yeah, sometimes you do a great job and sometimes you get a mistake, but that's the game we play. It's the profession that we're in. Is you're going to get criticized in some moments. You're going to get praised in others,

and you just got to roll with the punches, good and bad. Yeah. It's interesting you say that about flushing it from the system because I asked Pottch in the press conference a couple hours ago, what's the message to the team about, you know, a little bit fragile when we can see a goal because he talked about that on Saturday. Like we kind of fell apart a little bit emotionally and he was like he did like a pop quiz with all the reports.

He's like, what's the most important action in soccer? And I was like, I don't know, finishing. And then other people tried to answer. There were a bunch of different answers. And then he goes, um, the next one. Yeah. You really set you guys up for that one. Yeah.

It was pure theater. Let me tell you. Yeah. Oh, we've heard it before. We're getting asked something. Oh no. What have you observed watching BJ transition from a national team assistant and interim coach, obviously, now to national head coach? He's been great. He's been awesome. I think he's been an unbelievable fit for our team, for our city, our club.

He's really brought in from a soccer perspective, just a lot of clarity, a lot of simplicity and understanding with the ideas of how we want to play who we are as a team. And then off the field developing that culture of your, guy in Nashville, let's see this is what's expected of you on the field, off the field. And this is that we support each other. This is how we train. It's very process-based. It's not too emotional with a win or a loss. It's like, this is the facts.

This is how we played. This is what we did well. This is what we didn't. And that is for every game that we win or every game that we lose. We're going to evaluate it on a fair basis. It's all about growth. It's a long season. So it's a very steady and calming presence.

And whether you're on a losing streak or a winning streak, the idea is to continue growing and to, to play the next game as if the other one before didn't happen. It's the next opportunity to get better. And he's been preaching that all year. And yeah, we're off to a good start in the first half the season. I don't know how much you pay attention to the online discourse about the national team, but do you realize how much of a cult hero he was for a while?

Yeah. Does he realize that? I don't know. I need to talk to him about it. It was funny. He's obviously, you know, stepped in and won his Nations League trophy. and then got hired, which the next year. So he had a quick ascent, you know, I'd be curious to really dig deep

and talk to him about his growth as a coach because he started out in the video room, you know, in Philly. Did he? Yeah, and then his progression into, you know, doing an academy, doing assistant coach. And, you know, his role has, I think that helps when you become head coach because now he's kind of been in every department. He knows what he wants from those guys

and ultimately has had the training from the ground up, so to speak. So I think it's been really helpful for his development. And you can even see how he's improving as a head coach, you know, as time goes on. We like to joke that he looks like he could be a defensive coordinator at Clemson. He's like a perfect American soccer code. There's that. And then the other good analogy online is that he's like the cool substitute teacher. Oh, yeah.

You know, in hindsight. Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, so you were leading the way from the men's union side. I don't know if you've about this a lot, but in the equal pay negotiations, what have you thought of the first couple years? Has it worked? Has anything not worked? What are the next steps? Yeah, I think it's been awesome. I think you kind of see the response of FIFA to kind of the U.S. women and what we were able to accomplish together with our CBAs and how that's kind of transformed.

And the FIFA prize money for the Women's World Cup for the women's international tournaments. You see other teams starting to try and have some equal pay. And they were definitely the pioneers in that. I mean, leading the charge and so proud and happy that us as a men's national team, PA, could kind of run alongside of them and get it done and really proud to be a part of that.

I think it's a huge step forward. And I know they're really excited for this next World Cup for them, too, to kind of come back after a disappointing one last time. And it seems like, you know, Emma Hayes has done a phenomenal job. When you look at the Olympics, you look at the way that they're playing, the pool that they're kind of developing. I think when you look at the women's national team in the past, it was kind of like not as much depth.

They're calling in a lot of the similar players for that long stretch of time. And it's like, why would you change it? Because they're winning every time. but I think there's a little bit more development and rotation and searching for more answers and depth, which is encouraging to see. And you've got to be really excited if you're a young female soccer player because, like, I can have a great season in WSL. You look at even them calling in, how I forget her name.

Lily Honest. Yeah, yeah, calling her in, you know, over 30 years old and gets her first cap. It's like that's an amazing atmosphere to create. Labanta. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I said the wrong name. Sorry, yeah, yeah. I don't know why I blanked on her name, but yeah, it's just encouraging to see what Emma's done with the program and I'm excited to watch them compete for more trophies in the coming years.

It seems like you've been paying attention to the women's nationally. That's cool. Yeah, always. I mean, I think there's a crazy narrative out there that it's like we're jealous or competing. It's like, no, like we're on the same team here. We're, you know, one nation, one team. We're rooting for them. I mean, I remember it was such a bummer not to get up to meet up with them in the Olympics, you know, trying to text Lindsay and Rose trying to meet up.

It's like the schedules were just too crazy. It's like you're almost in the same city for like an hour and then you're leaving. So I do wish that there was more connectivity between the teams in terms of like, you know, camps. And maybe we'll see that more with the training center that's being done in Atlanta. Because there really has been limited interaction with the women's team over the past decade that I've kind of been involved with U.S. soccer. you know, hopeful that this training center can kind of bring not just the men's and women's team, but you look at all the national teams that are under U.S. soccer, whether that's Paralympic, beach, whatever it is, that now we can start meeting these other athletes and learning more

about their sports and learning more about their teams and all that goes on behind the scenes. And I think that builds a strong community within U.S. soccer that, you know, I'm hopeful it can really feel like we're all in it together and can pay a little bit more attention to each other. Have you thought about life after soccer, what you might want to do? It seems like you'd be great in the media, by the way. I appreciate it. Yeah. Coaching.

Yeah, I thought about it a lot. I think I looked at coaching. I looked at what that would look like, feel like. And I think as I've gotten a little bit older, been with the family a lot more, had the kids. I'm like, I think the number one thing I want is to control my schedule. I think you look at this profession and you look at, you know, every single day, you're on the same schedule.

you can't take the weekends off. You can't go to weddings. You can't go to funerals. You're pretty much having your whole life dictated for you. And so I don't want it to be dictated by a schedule. And so that kind of took coaching out of the equation for the most part. Media always a possibility. But I think what I really am passionate about is public speaking.

And I think going into corporations, businesses, teams, whoever it is, trying to create a couple keynotes, whether that's leadership, motivation, hard work, trying to inspire groups of people. So we'll see if that can take off. But I know one thing, and that's, I want to be able to control my time a lot more than while I'm playing. But that being said, I'm going to play till the wheels fall off.

So hopefully it's not in the near future. Speaking of time, I think we've taken plenty of it, but you get one more? Well, I would just want to know, on the public speaking tip, yeah. I think the performance, I'm just going to editorialize The performance on Saturday was actually, I think, pretty encouraging in a lot of ways.

But the fan base is not feeling great, has not been feeling great. And it's not that you haven't been part of why they're not feeling great. Give them a pep talk. Like, what's the... There's nothing I'm going to be able to say. It's going to make them feel better. It's going to be performances. It's going to be them seeing a team that is fighting for them.

And that's, you know, ideally that comes in the form of wins. and so winning a gold cup, winning all these games would be huge. But there's nothing I'm going to say that's going to get them on our side or get them rooting harder for us. We've got to show it on the field and show that we care. And that's what I think all 26 guys are here to do. Perfect. Hey, thanks so much for coming on.

Thank you guys. Appreciate it. All right. We'll see you.