Scuffed | USMNT, World Cup, Yanks Abroad, futbol in America - #610: The lessons we learned from the Gold Cup

Episode Date: July 10, 2025

Watke, Vince and Belz take turns teaching each other what we learned from the tournament.Send a question for Tom Byer if you'd like! Here: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScAuZvwwUJZlf_3l6ADl5NiZafcnsLnfM4G0cFPhdadNQO5BA/viewform?usp=headerYou can also send us a voicemail: www.speakpipe.com/ScuffedPodcast Skip the ads! Subscribe to Scuffed on Patreon and get all episodes ad-free, plus any bonus episodes. Patrons at $5 a month or more also get access to Clip Notes, a video of key moments on the field we discuss on the show, plus all patrons get access to our private Discord server, live call-in shows, and the full catalog of historic recaps we've made: https://www.patreon.com/scuffedAlso, check out Boots on the Ground, our USWNT-focused spinoff podcast headed up by Tara and Vince. They are cooking over there, you can listen here: https://boots-on-the-ground.simplecast.comAnd check out our MERCH, baby. We have better stuff than you might think: https://www.scuffedhq.com/store Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to the Scuff podcast where we talk about U.S. soccer. Hey, everybody. We're going to talk about some things we learned in the Gold Cup, a tournament that had an odd roster and a fairly predictable result. We won a bunch of games against lesser competition. And then we got out classed by Mexico in the final. I mean, you could have predicted that, I think. Got Chris and Vince here with me.

What a pleasure. Hello, gentlemen. How you doing, man? too long. Doing well. Focus, just been focused on, you know, seeing what I could learn these past months from watching

this team. I think the first thing we learned, or I learned, is sometimes it's a good idea to lower your expectations. Because I was ready for total disaster. It went great. Okay. Because I've lowered

expectations. That was an outstanding. performance by everyone. How much did the friendlies play into that? Well, here's the key. I couldn't watch the friendlies live. And then I go and check the score in it. I don't need to watch that. That also helps my mood.

So I think I went through it in the right way. Let me give you the first thing I learned. I guess I already gave you the first thing. Let me give you the second thing I learned. Yeah, yeah. Keep going. Keep going, please. Chris Richards feels inspired by the free kicks of Sebastian Burhalter. Yes.

It's an emotional connection. There's that service to that head. I don't think you're wrong. I don't think you're wrong about that. It is an emotional connection. Sebastian, he sets his stance so distinctly and professionally. He goes. This guy's, this guy is definitely the coach.

the son of Gregorhalter, first of all. That's the third thing we learned. Make no mistake. If there were any doubts, no. This man was raised. Not only does he have a lot of Greg Berthorhoster's DNA in him, I think he was coached pretty much moment to moment on a gamesmanship and professional type of soccer stuff.

The posture is elite when he's standing there for those free kicks before he puts the hand up. I mean, you talk about straight up and down. Man, not a not a single hitch in that giddy up. You know what I'm saying? It's like, it's, he's standing over it like

I am Sebastian Burrhalter Supreme server of balls. And, uh, yeah. You know, I I think the Gold Cup commentators might have, might have overhyped it. Just a little bit. Just a little bit. At certain points, it's like, okay.

But the thing is Right before Maybe like one or two free kicks before The commentators might be like Oh okay we need to slow it down a little bit on this Sebastian Burrhalter set piece mastery He dropped you a dime Yep that's right

He dropped your dime right on somebody's head And For me it was about that stance Yeah And I like this much of the point I was always a little bit A little bit sad when McLean took over that role when he would come in.

Hold on, O'Waki, you probably didn't hear this. But on the Saudi Arabia, on the Saudi Arabia review, me and Bells got into it a little bit just about the legacy of the Burrhalters and then being multi-generational proponents of the black community and always helping to uplift black men. So the fact that you, so the fact that you made this year first point, that Chris Richards is inspired by Sebastian Burrhalter free kicks into the box.

It really tracks with what we were talking about in the Saudi Arabia match as well. You may not think of it in those terms exactly, but now I can only think of it in those terms now. But there's one other terms I can think of it in, which is Chris Richards is the new leader of the team. He sees that Sebastian Berhalter is, and his role as leader,

He really appreciates people who are, who uplift everyone, you know, black men, white men, all kinds of men. And so there is an emotional connection between these two men on the set pieces because Richard sees in Burrhalter someone who is pulling in the same direction as him. And the prime example of that, I think, this isn't anything I learned. This is just me piggybacking off of you, Chris. The prime example of this is when Richard scored his goal against Mexico. I don't know if you guys saw this in the celebrations. But they're over in the corner where Richards had like slapped the flag. And Burrhalter, he's not in the scrum.

What he's doing is he's outside the scrum and he's welcoming everybody who comes down to the corner and pushing them in. So he's like, get in here, pushes them in. Get in here. He gets Walker Zimmerman, you know, somebody who's like way old. older than him, way more experience. He's like, get on in here, buddy. And he pushes him in, you know? I saw that and I thought, okay.

I see that. So much his scrum work was incredible. Yeah. Really, all celebration work. Like, pre-scrum, he's going to, if he, if it's possible, he's going to be the first one in for the celebration, he will be. And he will be. Now, I do got to give him one to merit on the, uh, the Diego Luna dance after the, after one of the Guatemala goes,

I can't think of which one. But Sebastian is hanging off of Diego to a point to where he almost can't get the dance off. And it's like, Sebastian, in that moment, you do need to read the situation and let your boy shine a little bit. Because, I mean, Sebastian is trying to drape himself all over Diego.

And he can't even, it's, you can tell Diego does a little wince when he has to do the little arm. He's bringing the arm up. And he's like, bro, Sebastian, you are on my shoulders. you know what I'm saying like I did not I did not prep for this with the right amount of lateral raises to get yeah to get my posterior delts in in order to do this with a grown man hanging off me but uh Diego got it done but yeah he doesn't need to clean that up just a little bit just a little bit but that that was his one week moment and it was a I wouldn't say it's a little bit uncharacteristic

because otherwise he seemed to be reading giving the amount of space for the player getting a celebration, but he did get that one wrong. I also liked, and I apologize, I'm going to be talking about Sebastian Berhalter way more than it's really appropriate for a podcast moving forward here. I liked when he missed the penalty.

I liked his reaction. It wasn't a, I feel sorry for myself. Oh, no, I'm embarrassed. There was no embarrassment in it. It was just, he just looked up, oh, I got this, I made a technical mistake. that happens. And in his post-game celebrations, in this scrum, he leapt atop the scrum.

The whole scrum was there. You don't normally see a missed penalty taker celebrate with abandon like that. Yeah. And it shows up just a team guy. A selflessness, an almost divine type of selflessness. So I think everyone talked about, right, the sister almost crying. the Burhaw. It was really sad. It was really sad to see that. Almost crying when he missed. But I was impressed by Greg's reaction. Greg, hashtag the coach, still

acting in that capacity. I guess he's, you know, the father hashtag for the family or whatever. But, you know, in moments like that, people are going to look to you, especially former coach of this very team that you're watching, your son up there, taking a pen. Your daughter's going to look towards you. Rosalind's going to look towards you for, for, for, at that point in time, and Greg moved on quicker than anybody else that was up in that box. Greg, of course, I mean, of course, you could see it. His face was pained. He was like, please, Sebastian scored his penalty. But when he didn't, Greg was like, all right, it's okay.

It's okay. And that's a type of leadership you need. Fellas, I re-listened to both geopods this past weekend. No way. I sure did. I sure did. I was cleaning up. I was cleaning up and I listened to I listen to both of the G.R. Raina Pazza we did.

And this is just a furtherance of the leadership that Greg showed over in guitar while everything was going to was going to S word. Lifelong relationships breaking down. Players not, there's a strife in the locker room, etc., etc. and he got it us through that, which got us, which garnered the famous tweet, of course. But yeah, this is Greg just showing that same resolve. And what arguably could be an even more emotional moment than anything that happened at the World Cup when you're dealing with.

This is bigger than the World Cup for him now, having Sebastian in play there. This is huge. And this has opened up a possibility, a possibility, we could be looking at a storyline where we have a Burrhalter and Rayna at the next World Cup. His Burrhalter, he fits the role of a squad guy. He can, obviously, Pochitina likes him. Why not have him as a squad guy?

Yeah, he was. He's a perfect squad guy. He's not, I get him, I just feel like it needs to be said. He's not really that good at soccer. That's fine. That's fine. Okay. I just, just for all, for everybody out there.

Yeah. Yeah, he would take that Rodon role, no questions asked. No questions asked. I mean, and you can see every time he talks about it. Every time he talks about it, he's like, bro, I've been living this. I've been living this for, you know, the last 10 years. And then, of course, even before that, he basically said he's been a big USM&T fan his whole life. So it's like, yeah, he's made for it.

And I gave him the demerit on the celebration. Got to give him the plus one on the Saudi Arabia skirmish, where he jumped to, jump to Tyler's defense immediately, which is what got me started on the whole, what I'll call Sebastian, man? What's the dude's name? Never mind.

But what got me started on the whole rabbit, rabbit whole thing that I talked about earlier. But before we get too far away from Diego's dance, I do have this right here from the corrections and clarifications department, which is his dance, which neither Greg and I knew what it was. It's a TikTok dance. The dance he was doing, it's a TikTok dance

done by several people pointed this out, done by like a little boy who's at the front of a, speaking of crew, of a boat in, I think it's in Indonesia, more in Southeast Asia, and they're just going hard in these boat races.

And there's a kid in the front, standing there, not holding on anything, doing the dance. And there's a lot of swag to it because it's like, that boat's moving fast. He's not got, he's got nothing. nothing to keep him in balance except his feet. And that's exactly the dance they do, the one that Diego was doing. I believe, or at least I've seen people say aura farming in the context of this video,

it might be called aura farming, what that Indonesian boy is doing. I would encourage everyone to watch, if somehow you haven't seen these videos, definitely watch it. It's pretty cool. So aura farming is just a general concept. okay so maybe this that's that's why I was so cautious with what I was saying there because I knew I could potentially really embarrass myself

maybe this is just a great example of aura farming this Indonesian boy is doing so or farming is just basically doing things with the with the intention of of looking very cool Sebastian Berhalter's set up on the his freak kicks has a little bit of an war of farming

thing to it. No? Here's a thing. I'm just out of Sebastian Burrhalter notes. No, this is good. So the lesson was, if I remember correctly, he and Chris have an emotional connection on set pieces. But there's really more to it than that, as we've seen. Vince, why don't you give us your first lesson?

My first lesson. Who do you want? No, no, I got it. My first lesson is we talk about, growing the game a lot, right? And when we talk about growing the game, the number one thing is to optimize our opportunities to be in front of people, to be in front of the American public and whatnot. And I think we've made a mistake. We've prioritized a nation's league for the A team and whatnot when we should be prioritizing the Gold Cup. When you look at these

numbers, these ratings that have come out, I mean, it's insane, right? I mean, Nations League famously behind a paywall, not on linear TV, not on any type of TV whatsoever. I think it's just been on Paramount Plus. Fox and the boost that we get from being on Fox, I mean, it's come through in the Copa America. It's come through in this last Gold Cup, I think maybe even started in the Gold Cup prior, I want to say, but the numbers, I mean, the proofs in the pudding. Okay, I'm looking at Fox Sports PR where they release all. their good information about viewers and whatnot.

So the finals in both of these tournaments, I mean, our final in the Copa America was our final group match against Uruguay. That got 3,77,000 viewers maxed out at 400,000, I mean, 4,860,000. 67,000 viewers. Okay. And then we pull up to this final, USA versus Mexico, of course, 3.73 million viewers. The match peaked with 5.2 million viewers from 8.45 p.m. to 9 p.m. Oh, and actually, the final ratings update was 3.84 million viewers.

And a 5.4 million viewer peak, they updated their own tweet. I don't know how that works, but anyway, what I'm saying is, if we want to get these boys in front of, in front of the people and showcase our team, then we have to do away with these B-Team Gold Cups. Maybe see if we, if we have to. Now, no, I understand that a lot of the stuff was out of our hands, of course, for this tournament. but as far as a showcase and the fact of being seen in front of people, Fox is doing this thing and it proved it with the Copa America and maybe last year you would have just said, oh, it's the Copa America, but it's continued throughout this Gold Cup.

And we're getting big numbers for every matter. And even like the other knockout matches, we're talking about at least a million people, 1.2 million people, 2.1 million people, etc. Yeah. Which doesn't even take into account the... The Spanish language.

Yes. The Spanish language broadcast does not take that into account at all. And those are... Those are a huge number. I mean, those are, like, the biggest numbers for, like, any, like, American-based soccer broadcast over the course of... Well, speaking of that, the Club World Cup didn't do nearly as good of numbers as the Gold Cup, right? Which I think has to do with the television station. on, but the Gold Cup was, I think I saw that.

The Gold Cup outperformed the Club World Cup, at least earlier on, like a couple weeks ago. It's interesting, yeah, because Nations League is, I was just rewatching the highlights from some of the old Nations League victories, you know, just to like sort of refresh myself. And those were incredible games in incredible environments, 2021. Gio got a goal and an assist. That 3-0 went over Mexico when BJ was the coach in 2023. We got a late peppy goal to tack on to Dosa Serra. But you're right, man.

Was there a way to watch those games on regular TV? I don't know if they're going on. I don't think so. I don't think so. And they don't resonate in the same way, man. They just don't. Like, I can tell when I'm on, when I'm, when I'm perusing Twitter or whatever,

I can tell what's breaking contain. You know what I'm saying? Who are the regular people that would be tuned into this match anyway, and who aren't? And really the only time, other than the Copa America's special circumstance, but the only like regular, degular USMNT happenings

that have broken contain every time are the Gold Cup. It was the Gold Cup. And I don't know what the ratings were in 2019, the last women's World Cup, right? When we had the Women's World Cup final and then the Gold Cup final on that day, that one broke in Tain. This one broke in Tain,

2023 as well, also broke in Tane. Like, you can just feel it. There's different people talking about the USM&T who wouldn't usually be doing that. And, I mean, being on linear TV, which is still like the Grand Puba of TV, if you want something to get ratings,

you got to put it on, put it on CBS, put it on Big Fox, et cetera. And also that Uduguay number came on FS1, by the way. But, yeah, we need to put these boys on TV, not behind a paper. Yeah, I was get, I was just to, just to reinforce your point. I was getting text messages from people who do not text me about the U.S. men's national team on Sunday night saying, man, this Mexico, this USA Mexico game is crazy, or are you watching this, you know?

And it's, and it's very simple. It's because it's on Fox. Well, the highlight of it on YouTube also got a million views. Huh. Even the games against lesser opponents, the highlights of this get a surprising number of views. Interesting. So people are interested in being interested in this team, at least.

Yeah. And I don't know what Fox does, how they do it. But, I mean, yes, being linear TV has to be big thing. but it's like, you know, when you compare the end stadium, what we're seeing in stadium. Matter of fact, I was talking to my coworker. They went to the Guatemala match and asking him about his experience there yesterday before I left work because I know I was hopping on this podcast this morning before I went to work.

I wouldn't be able to talk to him again. But yeah, I was just like, I was like, man, what's going on, man? Like, I wasn't in stadium? He was like, yeah, man, it was just. It was Guatemalans everywhere. I mean, as we knew, as we knew, of course. But, yeah, there's still, like, a glimmer of hope. Not everyone has given up on this team, I guess.

I don't know. Yeah, most people are just playing with the idea of the team. My first lesson is very, it comes right in line with this one, and it's this. There really is a little bit of a power struggle between Pulisic and Pachitino going on. And so I think Poulisic, if we want to get an A team at the Gold Cup, the number one culprit here is Christian Poulosick. I get it. He's got good reasons that he should take the summer off. But, you know, we're not like, especially when we're not doing the Monday review and it's just me and Greg mostly, we're not really tuned into the controversy and like the war of words that's going on.

But I went back and I kind of like re-looked at it. And let me just break it down here. I know a lot of you know this, but look, Pulisic wanted to play in the friendlies, but not the Gold Cup. Pashtino said no. He said no. If you skip the Gold Cup, then you aren't playing in the friendlies. Then Pulisic, in his kind of whiny way,

kind of whiny, passive-aggressive way, was on a CBS podcast, said that he respected the decision, but he, quote, didn't understand it, which prompted, I think in relative terms, Potch to just fire back, you know, in relative terms to like what we usually see from our coaches and our players talking to each other. This was like a punch in the face from Potch. He said, players don't need to understand or not understand that. Players need to listen and stick with our plan.

They cannot dictate the plan because if so, then we'd invert positions, no? it is obvious and the most important thing is that we explain. We explained why we decided not to include him in the two friendlies. And then if you have some problems, it's not a problem if you understand or don't understand. I like that. So he didn't like that. He didn't like that Pulisic said I didn't understand. He does no time for that kind of talk.

He also used the phrase, I'm not a mannequin. Potch did in response to this. I'm the coach. I'm not a mannequin. So there's actually. actually something here. There's something going on between Paschitino and Pulisic.

They're not happy with each other. Paschino's certainly not happy with Pulisic. We still don't really know what Pach is thinking or how much he is thinking specifically about the U.S. men's national team. But I guess what I'm thinking is if the point of the Arfston and Ajamong show is to establish his authority,

reset the team culture, and get all the best players on side, fine. but I am a little worried. I'm a little worried about it. We don't know what the... Here's something we learned as well. The World Cup's starting 11. We don't...

It's not going to look like last time, and we don't really know what it's going to... No, we have no idea. It's going to... There's a range of possibilities. See, that's what I told... That's one thing I told Bells, Waki, is that we have to start treating, like...

You were right. We were... Reviewing these Gold Cup matches, you know, tongue and cheek, whatever. But no, we got to put some heft in our voice, act serious. Because if the World Cup started tomorrow, Big Pat and Max Arsson would be out there, buddy. For better for worse. Richards. Richard for Halter co-captains.

Mm-hmm. For better for worse. Yeah. It does. I mean, Pulisic has. Pulisic has to show Pachitino something. I think they have to have some sort of meeting of the minds. And I, you know, I have to credit Henry Bushnell for this, but there is a non-zero chance that we get like a Cleansman Donovan type situation here.

No, this is the most extreme. No, it's probably not going to happen. It's probably not going to happen. But it is on the spectrum of things that could happen with Pontchitino. Yeah, this group. And I mean, I've long thought Pulisic has too much sway on the team. So I want him to be brought into check. And I want him to have to play within a system where his strengths are elevated and his weaknesses are minimized.

So I think it's great for him to have to submit himself to Pocitino's agenda. But, I mean. I don't think too much is going to come from this. Like, ultimately, when we fast forward to September, you know, Pully's going to be there. Probably going to start for South Korea and Japan, et cetera. But as long as we get them off set pieces, you know, if this whole power struggle, everything that's been going on in the media or whatever

ends up with Christian Polic off of set pieces, then it will be, I'm going to have to give a shout out to Pach for that. Yeah. Worth it. Pullis is probably too good for this to end up impacting his place. But down the line through the rest of that 11, it's, you know, Pulitzer contingent. He's not going to have his first choice 11 out there. I think we can say that. Right, right, right, right. And I don't, who knows who his first choice 11 is? Do you have any ideas? Like, who's in that? I mean, he likes to do me out there.

It looks something like the traditional, uh, yeah, Weston. Adams, you know, it's the Burrhalterl. Yeah. Sergeant is, you know, he could be gone. He could be gone forever. We don't know that for sure either, but... He's going to need to score a lot of goals. Yeah, he's going to need to score a lot of goals

and really come in on fire with Potch. He can't score a lot of goals for Norwich, by the way. This needs to be a... Top, top level club, top flight. Yeah. The thing is, if he goes to a top flight club, do you think he'll score a lot of goals? It remains to be seen.

Not a lot. Look, man, after going to the Roma match and being like two inches away from declaring myself a Roma fan, I was hoping that that would come through for Josh, because I think that would be nice. Josh playing for Roma I think he could I think he could have some success there as well

but there may be seen well it's Chris's turn with the next lesson I think okay we learned that Tim Ream he does not intend to surrender his spot

and he might just be at the World Cup again it's incredible because we had he was out of the picture in September of 2022. Right. 21? Yeah. 22. Yeah. 22. Yes.

Yeah, you're right. September of 22. He was out of the picture. He was not there for Japan, Saudi Arabia. It was actually a Richard's injury that reopened the door for him, right? And he was playing really well. He had a great open to the season. I don't know what we learned from that actually. But he's still here. No, that's a, I mean, he sat Mark McKinty on the bench. I thought maybe we had a Walker Zemerman Rumontata on deck,

not set him on the bench too. And so Miles Robinson also on the bench. All for Tim Rine, baby. So, I mean, we learned he's in front of those three, and those are, I mean, we don't got too many more centerbacks, man. I mean, CCV, you throw him in the mix, but who else? Who else we got other than that?

So at this point, Tim Rieh, World Cup started. We learned, I think, in part, that if you participate in a stinker under Potch, you may never play again. Of the 11 players who started the game against Switzerland, or of the 10 outfield players who started the game against Switzerland, only two really played again. and those are Max Arfston and Sebastian Burhalter and they obviously have some special sauce with Podge.

Everybody else got a few minutes here or there but really didn't play. McKenzie and Zimmerman didn't play. Zimmerman played like a, came on as a heading specialist. So, you know, not participating in that game was probably the best thing for anybody in this camp that happened to anybody in this camp.

And it does have to do with the Ream thing because Ream came on at halftime. You know, maybe kind of settled things down a little bit. I don't know. And then played every minute henceforth. Same with Richards. And another thing I learned, Matt Fries is our number one.

Yeah. Matt Turner's gone. I've noticed that there's like some thought out there that Turner still has a chance. if he plays, but I don't, I see it your way, Chris. I think it's,

I think it's freeze his job to lose now. The mistakes have been a little crazy. I mean, the freeze mistakes? No, the Turner mistakes have been a little too crazy. To, I don't know, to keep himself on the same tier with Matt Freeze.

Because I've heard the same thing. People seem to be like, oh, if Matt Turner plays, he's right back in the mix. I don't think I'd want him right back in the mix. and number one and then number two if this Leon deal goes through

which it has been confirmed that they will be staying up in league if this Matt Turner deal goes through I am extremely scared for what could happen to Matt Turner because Leon once again I forgot if I talked about it on the pod before or not

but you have but you should reiterate it yeah one of the most brash audacious, daring, cunning, teams when it comes to playing the ball out of the back in all of Europe. Like, you know, I watch soccer all the time.

And there wasn't anybody, there wasn't a lot of teams doing it like Leon did last year. You know, we watched quite a bit of Tant Testament. You know, that double pivoted him and Matage would be in their own, they would be in their own six-yard box, both of them, at the same time, quite a bit. You know, they, you know, they, Yeah, Rondoing,

Rondoing, man. Tight spaces. I mean, you talk about, like, like I said, daring, brash, audacious. There would be moments where I'm sitting in my couch. I'm scared for them. And they are just as cool as can be. Like, hey, I'm going to get out of this tight space.

I'm going to switch to play. All of a sudden, boom, there's tons of space for, I don't know, Mika Tase, turkey or whatever, whoever, to run into. But they take, they take. take risks. They have not made a manager change. It doesn't seem like a good fit. Why did they sign Matt Turner?

Or why are they signing Matt Turner? Well, it seems like the relationship between, you know, Crystal Palace and Leon being that, uh, being those, being texter clubs or former texter clubs, I think he's finding his way out of both. I think he's transitioning out of both clubs, I want to say. In order to keep them both in their respective competitions, league on for Leon and Europa League for Crystal Palace. But I think that's the main reason why that's happening.

But if we get a month of Matt Turner being the starter and Leon continues to play this way, I mean, I don't think it's going to go that way. Imagine the first time he tries to play a clip of ball out to Shirkie and he just like flails at 40 yards off target. Well, Shurkey plays for Manchester City now. Oh, dang it. But, uh, what they did? Uh, Mikitaozae.

Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Shurkey was perfect because he's such a, he's such a subtle, elegant player. And to like have, play with a guy who, uh, can't really pass the ball. Play with a match. accurately.

Is, um, it's going to be some compelling television. for sure But For the hell For the long I last I'm a little scared But freeze is the number one

Freeze is the number one Yeah Well go ahead Vince Well Yeah Freeze is the number one And past me being a little bit

scared for Matt Turner What's going to happen on Leon I do think Matt Freeze has stronger Has stronger plot armor Than Matt Turner

Has or had Like Um the fact that he you know he goes to this penalty shootout against Costa Rica right and then it comes out that while at his Ivy League university he did a research paper on pins you know that I think that's just that's just too much for my turner to overcome I think like America right we love glitz glamour we want to be the best at everything here. is a man that went to an Ivy League university. He looks like Superman. He also happened to do a research paper on penalties that while in college. I think that beats the normal everyday.

Hey, I'm just a dude that picked up soccer was a former baseball player, went to Fairfield University, and now I find myself starting at the USM&T. I think Matt Freeze The narrative Plus he had the SportsCenter Sports Center not top 10 hanging over him And we laughed it off It's a fun little quirky thing

That was more of an albatross That we ever realized You don't want that in your In your head Wait what was it The It's not top 10 His

Matt Turner Low Light from college Sorry yeah Matt Turner Okay. I think it was a problem. I think it was a problem the whole time and we didn't realize it until Yeah.

I'm just, I'm unsaid. I actually think Matt Turner's a great guy. Seems like a great guy. Hope he has a bunch of success in life and maybe he does end up being the number one. But one thing I don't, one thing that unsettles me about him is how large his eyes are. Yeah.

It makes you feel like he's scared or worried all the time. And I don't know if that counts as plot armor, but it's, you know, you need somebody who can narrow his eyes. It doesn't work in his favor. You know, like, everything about him mostly gives you, like, lovable overachiever who probably shouldn't be here, you know. Well, he shouldn't. Like, you know, he took a very unconventional path. But, you know, Matt Freeze, even though, you know, he has.

is not flanked by the glamour of playing in Europe or anything like that. He is playing in New York, though. But, yeah, I think he's, I think he's someone that the public will more easily get behind. I don't know. We love an underdog until it's time for, we love an underdog in the round of 64, right, in the NCAA tournament. When you get to elite eight time, you want to see, you want to see the big, you want to see the big dogs. You want to see Kentucky, North Carolina, Duke, you know what I'm saying?

I think, I think, Michigan. Yeah, I think, I think Freeze is more in that. Yeah. All right. So, Vince, you got the next lesson. Tyler Adams reminded me why I was looking for Tyler Adams' replacements. Throughout this summer.

I mean, totally, totally unremarkable, absolutely unremarkable summer from Tyler Adams. Like, he was, he was, uh, anonymous. He was anonymous. Yeah, I was debating whether I was going to say ass or not. But yeah, we'll leave it at anonymous. He was very anonymous throughout, I mean, this entire tournament and the friendlies. And it's like, you know, him being one of the, one of the, for sure, a team guys.

And even, even more than that, you know, 18 plus, you know. name and pin in the starting lineup or whatever. And did he look a step up in footballing ability from any of his cohorts in the midfield? Like when we're talking about a Sebastian Burrhalter or like, you know what I'm saying? It's, it reminded me why I was hoping so much for Johnny. Because, you know, people like to, people love Tyler.

People love Tyler. and you, you, you receive a lot of pushback whenever you say, hey, maybe we can do a little bit better than Tyler Adams. People are like, oh, what? Better and are you serious? Look at how he tackles and whatever. And, yeah, I think a lot of, yes, I would like to hope that eventually we can do better than Tyler Adams. I'm not saying we can right now. I mean, look at the, look at the, look at.

how Johnny Cardoso Pee-Ps and poohs all over his stuff anytime he puts on the kit, unfortunately, unfortunately, as it stands right now. So I don't think his spot is like in danger or anything, but boy, he was, he was rough, man. He was rough and it just sticks in my mind. I'm not, and I'm not letting it go. Now, hold on. The one caveat I will throw out here before I just throw it out to y'all is just the fact that, Potch told us multiple times that he was dealing with stuff even like coming into camp.

He was carrying something. And what, sat out a few training sessions or whatever, did he miss one of the friendly matches? He missed some, yeah, I think so. So he might have been carrying an injury throughout this whole tournament or whatever. But you know. That's certainly the message Tyler is communicating now. That like he, you know, he just wanted to come in and be a good role model for the year. younger players and like gutted out and there's probably some truth to it so what like

what weston mckinney was carrying an injury into the goal i mean into the world cup uh and he was able to ball out through the him due to him being a a good soccer player you know that despite having a big footballer despite having limited mobility and whatnot Tyler adams without mobility bro i mean he's will trap Yeah, I mean, he's still, I think his ball winning was still like an asset for the game, for the team. But when he jumps out of position in the 4-42 block against Mexico and for no reason and allows Fabian Ruiz to pick up a 15-yard radius circle of open space on top of our goal to pick out a through ball for Roevo Jimenez, then he's like, really, he's really working against himself there. because that's where he needs to be locked in, absolutely reliable, very smart,

making all the right decisions, because he's not, you know, a magician on the ball. So if he's not doing, if he's not a magician on the ball and he's positionally undisciplined, I don't know how much that has to do with fatigue, you know, or dealing with a knock. Just like, just stick to your assignment, bro. Yeah.

But this is just like, man, we play in Guaya, Guatemala, we're paying a bad Costa Rica, Trinidad, Tobago, Haiti. Like, and he looks just kind of like he fits. You know what I'm saying? It's crazy. And what it makes it even crazier is that he would pull out one, maybe two good turns and progressive moments in a match.

And you could tell what it just did. for our team in general. It's like, oh, Tyler Adams turned here, and made a forward pass, maybe did a little one, two, carried it into the attacking third, and now the team's off and running. Like, oh, man, how different this team looks

now that Tyler Adams can do something for us. But then it just wouldn't happen again. And, yeah, so. Yeah. So he's not, it's not his comfort. It's not his comfort zone. I'm still on, I'm still on a lookout. I'm still on the lookout.

And now that his captaincy bona fides have been muddled a little bit, you know, I've been talking about this for a while now, but now that Chris has actually stepped up and showed y'all what I was talking about. Remember, I said Chris. I said Chris could be the one that stepped up. And I got some backlash. People like, he hasn't even played well for the national team yet. Look, man, some people prognosticate, okay,

and look into the future. tell you what could or should or is going to happen and other people look at the now and are left behind in the dust when when those things come to fruition so you know what I'm saying just respect me respect me please thank you I'm done talking I'm glad you mentioned Adam's handful of you know good good things he did on the half turn because I always I always appreciate those I feel like I know them in the timeline this is right though they're has been a leadership shakeup. I don't know if Adams is going to be able to reclaim that captain's spot.

He might not have the potch. Yeah, he don't got to a pot. They don't have the same type of juice flowing, you know? Richards with the two goals and I think we can get more into that. Does anybody else have any thoughts on the Cardoso meltdown? What a bad deal for him? bro like he he makes i mean everybody saw it for 20 minutes he's out there he's got all the swagger he's playing just like he does for reaubatis and then he makes a mistake and he's done he's it's like

he's like he yeah you said you say pooping and pee in himself earlier i don't know what the i don't know what the metaphor for it is but he basically and maybe he was dealing with the knock. Probably he had some kind of knock for real, but even if he didn't. I think he was. I mean... What a tragedy. He slow played the Athletico move to be in the camp, right? Because, you know, I mean, we had that club, World Cup window, essentially, where he could have transferred to Athletico Madrid. He could have been at the Club World Cup playing with him. He slow played it on purpose in order for him to come with the U.S. Men's National team and make his statement.

And so because of that, I think he probably was injured because I don't think, you know, people said he had the athletic oitis. I'm not sure that's the case. Because if he had it, he wouldn't have he just wouldn't have came

altogether. He would have done a pool of sick. Yeah. Yeah. So I think he was probably hurt, or had a knock. But I mean, once you get the knock, then you're probably not in a rush to come back from it. But I do think he actually had a knock.

But as far as his mental state and how he recovers from this, man. Because I was hoping he would get a, I would hoping he would get a Gold Cup group stage to get his feet wet, knock all the cobwebs out his head, and start to feel good about himself. And that man played himself out of contention before he even got to the gold cup group stage. To your point about the stinker, right? If you have a stinker in front of Potch, it didn't happen in that Switzerland match.

It happened in the Turquay match for Johnny, unfortunately. But he was out of there. Well, you just, you can't go out there and do something that loses your team the game when you're the number six. You just can't do it. So my next lesson is actually segues nicely with both the point about Tyler Adams and the stuff about Johnny. and it's about Malik because I think he's a contrast here to both of them

in different ways. He didn't show he could seize a match against Mexico by the scruff of the neck. But he took, I would say a big step forward as a men's national team player in a couple of specific ways. So,

you looked out there and you saw Tyler and you thought he fits perfectly into this picture He's just like He's just like everybody else on the screen Or he's a lot like everybody else on the screen You look at Malik out there Nobody has that thought

When they see Malik in a game against Guatemala Or Costa Rica He's different He has a He has an extra level of class And to borrow Velazquezism He's sometimes he looks like he's on cheat code mode

Now, when you compare him to Cardoso, both of these players came into this tournament. You're hoping that they can establish themselves and build some confidence for themselves with the national team. And obviously Cardoso didn't do that. I would say Malik did. He got blooded fully in Concaf, had to play Costa Rica and Mexico, went 90 in heat and humidity six times in 20 days. his area to busy workload is typically less intense than that. He got hacked a lot. He had some success.

He had some failure. And I think now he understands at least a little bit better than he used to what he'll have to do for the U.S. and international play. He, even more detailed here, he did serious and effective work against the ball in the press. So Sleepy Malik, he may still be in some ways, but man, does he love to take the ball off of somebody in the press? And he's not afraid to get physical.

I think these are things worth celebrating. He flashed his quality. Yes, his best moments on the ball were against weaker competition. So I don't think, as Bob Morocco put it, he has beaten the flat track bully allegations. He hasn't beaten the allegations, but he's built some confidence. Yes. And that's the first step in beating allegations. That's fax.

That's fax. Because if you never admit, you know, well, we don't need to get into how to beat allegations. There's no curse. There's no Malik curse. And I just want to remind you, I did stake my reputation on he would have a positive summer. And once again, my reputation emerges gleaming. Do an O. To an O.

To a no. I just want to, but I do want a bullet point of some things that happen. in the knockout rounds that Malik did. He keyed the move for the goal. Arfston scored against Costa Rica. I mean, he made that goal happen. Yes. He got the assist on Luna's second goal against Guatemala.

He, I wouldn't quite say he made the goal happen because Luna had a lot to do, but he did a lot to move that ball from right to left and put Luna in an extremely favorable situation. And I think, you know, I hesitate to mention it, but he accidentally croifed it to Luca Deloire at the top of the box for the first goal against Guatemala. And in general, he was the guy most likely to disorganize the opponent with the ball. To use hashtag the coach axiom. Last point on Malik for me is he should also leave this summer hungry to show more of what he can do when the chips are down. He missed a penalty.

He ball watched on Costa Rica, Costa Rica's late equalizer. He gave the ball away too much in general, I think. Yeah, probably. And he didn't make enough impact in the final against Mexico. So I think he will not be complacent going forward, and I'm going to take that as a positive. Didn't make too much impact on the final against Mexico. Didn't make too much impact against Turkey, despite all of our good play, all the times we arrived to the final third. we were lacking Malik showing that quality a little bit.

I've long been, I've been slow playing Malik. I've been slowly coming on season by season. You know, I think Pita Bosch has just done wonders for Malik. You know, I mean, all this industry and stuff that we saw on this tournament. I mean, that's direct correlation from Peter Bosch. You know, those times and then. those Monday reviews that we covered when Peter sat his ass

he would sit him down bro like if he comes out first half lollygagging or whatever I remember one specific against Iax I want to say he would hook that man and so he has him he got him playing at you know

respectable professional level you know bringing it for 90 leaving everything out there on the pitch etc as far as like because, you know, I mean, the moniker was earned at first. The man was sleepy, offensively and defensively. You know, he would just kind of come alive when the situation kind of favored it, popped up,

do something extremely nice, of course, and, you know, goal or sister, come from him or whatever. But offensively, defensively, and in his bed at the wrong time of day, you know? Right. When the bus is filled up with his teammates, ready to go to a game. Yeah. So yeah, the moniker was earned. I think we've seen, we've seen growth from the man, but I still, I still got some, I still, I still got some questions. I still got some questions. And it's not, they aren't questions that I don't think, um, I think he's going to answer the questions. I think he's going to answer the questions,

but I still need him to see him perform in the Bundesliga when he starts the season off of Levecues, and I want to see him do it. There's absolutely no reason to think that he will not do it. But I need to see him ball out, weekend, week out, for a letter. It's going to be a struggle.

It's a different ball. I mean, as everybody knows, it's a different ball game than the Air Divisi. I mean, those games are... Tough. Tough. You know, you go down to Augsburg. You got all these big boys.

These German middle managers in the middle of the field just coming after you. And they eat weight. Like, Malik's got a, yeah. This is a good situation he's in. Oh, yeah. Have a chance to do that every week. This could be a better situation. I mean, good, because, you know, Leviticus is, you know, put them.

up, put themselves up there with Byron. It's like, you know, kind of PSV of the, of the Bundesli, if you will. You know, I mean, they kind of, they kind of Rundus out the gym. So, yeah. You know who hasn't disappeared against Mexico, typically when he plays Mexico? Who? Gio Raina. I knew he was about to say that.

Yeah. Yeah. No, like, look, he may be, he may be, uh, on the fast track to Fort Myers, St. Petersburg in retirement and everything. But who knows? Who knows what's going on with, Gio? But you look back at how he's done against Mexico. He's done well.

Two, I think what is it? Two goals and an assist in four finals or semifinals against Mexico or World Cup qualifiers. So he's played them four times. He's been decisive in two of them. And then one of the games where he wasn't decisive, the qualifier in the Azteca, I think he played, was he the one who played the past to Pfok?

That Pfok missed from point blank. And he did that dribble through the entire team where he sat down Hector Herrera and started the clock on the end of his career. Sat down Hector Herrera twice. of that. So. Hey, I think that, Raina, I think a resurgence is coming.

Seeing Burrhalter, league prognum here, has lit a fire under. Is that one of the lessons from the Gold Cup? Is that a resurgence is coming? Well, let me, uh... He doesn't want a Burrhalter at the World Cup and not Raina. Tell you that much.

Let me, let me tell you all this. He hasn't beaten the, uh, is he cooked physically allegations. I just want to say that. That is the outstanding issue. That's why I brought up the west coast of Florida. The Club of World Cup, the Club World Cup being a FIFA competition, we have top speed stats. And G.O. Rana was the slowest field player for Berisha Dortmund by six kilometers per hour.

He was, he came in at. Sounds like a lot to be slower. He came in at 23.45 kilometers per hour. And Jamie Bino Giddens was at 29.46. He was slower than Gregor Cobal, the keeper. 25.71, Coble was at once again, Giorina, 23.45. Let me translate that to Miles real quick. My Google Machine, 23.45.

Remember, though, his thing is moving quickly, not fast. Yeah. Never fast. Yeah, even in that, if I watched that dribble back, he just kind of looks like he's kind of loping around out there. You know, it's not that fast. I thought, if he can loop around people like that, I was more than happy.

with it. Save the top speeds for the other sports. For the people that play soccer on a soccer pitch. Yeah, save for them. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it is, like he doesn't, he has not been the allegations. We need him to start running faster.

Yeah. We do, man. There's just no way around it, I don't think. Now, there's a way around it for the men's national team probably. but yeah for if we want his club career to succeed over in Europe without having to go to Moldova I think he probably needs to improve that just a little bit we really need a candid interview with poch like somebody to really talk to him I mean I don't care if it's in Spanish or not just translate it you know after you're done what is he really thinking about all this stuff

We're talking 14.5 miles an hour. I think he probably thinks similar to us. He's just, he needs to run faster. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean about everything. Like, does he, does, is there a cultural reason you don't want to have a, um,

Pulisic declined to come to the Gold Cup and then be able to come to the friendlies? Is that like a, Well, we are likely, after he's moved on and he's not, we'll probably get candid. He'll probably talk about it. Yeah. Candid away, which would be cool. Yep, sometime in the fall of 26. Gio would probably be the slowest offensive linemen at the NFL combat.

I just did some conversions. I'm just letting y'all know, man. Yeah. I'm just telling you all, like, how slow he is actually moving, bro. It's, yeah. Those guys are, they move pretty quickly for big guys. Very fast. People would be.

Dude, they're all faster than, well, I mean, I don't know about Vince, but they're definitely faster than us, Chris, you and me. I remember one time. Vince, you may be really fast, you may have been a fast offensive lineman. I don't know. Oh, I was, I remember four nine at six three, three, ten. but anyway I don't think I can run a 4-940

I remember my wife thought you couldn't we were working You definitely couldn't run a 4th That's really fast right It's fast A non-athlete It's fast for anybody

Yeah I don't Nobody would just step up to the line And run a 4-9 If you're not Running regularly But I remember my wife

Like when we were in college I was like home for the summer We were like working out And at the end of the workout she's like, she's like, let's race. And I saw it in her eyes. She really thought she could beat me in a race. And like from the moment, like we said go, like my start off, like,

she was dusted instantly. She's a college athlete as well, play college basketball. But, yeah, people don't understand. I think it's starting to get out there more that. Limemen are very athletic, not just defensive. I had offensive alignment as well, but yeah. Anyway. Yeah.

We do want our soccer players to be faster than them, though. Yeah, if we could help it. Is it my turn? Does anybody know whose turn it is? I think it's your turn, and it's, I think you close us out. I'm out of lessons. Yeah, that's fine. I don't have a third lesson, to be honest with you.

I just have a last, this is my last one. And we've touched on it a little bit, but lesson from the Gold Cup. Final lesson from the Gold Cup for me, Chris Richards is the man. You know, he is, as the kid, I don't even want to do it. I'll refrain from trying to sound younger than I am. You go say he's too. It's just wonderful. Yeah.

Exactly. It's just wonderful to see him have a good tournament and be pretty dominant overall. He even played great against Mexico. He was, so number one, totally dominant in the air. It may actually be a proclamation. now to call him Air Richards. You know, they've called him that. Yeah.

This was a fake, this was a fake nickname when they first started calling him this. He was not that good in the air. Now he's just bossing. He's boss in the airspace. And I do just want to remind you, it was Sebastian Burhalter who awakened that in him. Maybe. So whatever happens down the line with Sebastian, he's had an enormous mark on this national team. Yeah.

And, you know, other than getting subbed off in the 87th minute of that 5-0 win over Trinidad, he's played every minute of the tournament. Tim Ream is talking about how he's barking at people. You know, Tim Ream is ready to give him those plaudits. Maybe because Tim sees like, this is my ticket to the World Cup next to Richards. If we look at what came out of this, Richards emerges as leader. Malik gets some confidence to be. that he will one day beat the allegations. This is a great summer.

Just those two things. We have some more clarity at the goalkeeper position. And all those players who think of themselves as 18 players, they now know who's boss. And the boss is Mauricio Pocetino. Competition has opened. We didn't even talk about Diego Luna much. We didn't.

We need to talk about him at least a little bit. What do you think? Is he, has he, has he helped his stock? Has he hurt his stock? Is he just a old? I think he's, he's in the team. He's going to the World Cup. It's done.

Hmm. What do you think? Maybe, maybe from the Potch point of view. Yeah, for Potch, he's in there, I think. Yeah. Yeah, okay. Then I agree. I just wish he wouldn't suck, like, 50% of the time.

That's facts, bro. He did. He's like, he's like, I love the, I love the player. He scored some really nice goals. Both of those goals against Guatemala were like plus plus goals for me. But man, oh man, he gives the ball away so much. And he's just like calm down a little bit. Yeah.

Maybe that's another addendum to my first point about getting these boys in front of people. We want to make sure we have somebody that can capture the hearts and minds of the American people. And Diego Luna is one of those people. How necessarily we end up. Maybe we do some focus groups before we fire it up for every Gold Cup. Just show people, you know, pictures of soccer players. Do you resonate with him, him, him? But Diego Luna almost made in a lab, right, to be an overnight sensation in America.

and he became that, right? And I think it was not a small, his presence was not a small contributor. I think it was a large contributor to this tournament picking up momentum in the way that it did. That's another thing about a tournament, right? It picks up momentum, right, as it goes on. I was looking at, I was just reviewing group stage numbers.

You know, we're in the one million range, and then, you know, it picks up. We start winning games. the narrative is forming, everyone's feeling good. People are like, hey, let me turn on this. Let me turn on this USA team. You know, similar to the World Cup. We all see it there too as well.

But, yeah, the fact that we were picking up momentum, winning games, and then we had our mascot, our, yeah, our little trinket, Diego Luna, that people were able to fall in love with. And, uh, yeah. He is almost built in a lab. Like you could meet, you could imagine him at the Olympics as like a really good snowboarder with a, you know,

with a charming story behind him. And they, they would make that up. I mean, they would make a lot out of that on the NBC broadcast and everybody would be like, oh, Diego, you know,

it's like that. Yeah. And so, you know, it's going to bring more people on board. Love it. But come a, I mean,

it's a 26 man roster. It's more than just bringing people on board, though. It just, add some character to the team. That is a real... That's true. Yeah. It's a character piece.

People like Tim Wea, who are elegant soccer players and probably has a fairly elegant life. He does not bring a lot of character to the team, you know? He's reticent, he's shy, he doesn't, you know, he's not very good at talking in public.

I don't know that Diego is either, but... And Pulisic certainly doesn't add character. And Tim ain't worried about talking to the public. He's a, he's a statesman. He talks to politicians only. I don't know if y'all caught that, if y'all caught that moment that I'm alluding to. Yeah. So anyway, White House, we saw what happened there.

Timway is a statesman, baby. You know, it comes to talking to media and all that. I don't want to say, I don't want to say maybe he sees it as beneath him, but he probably, he probably sees it as beneath him. So, yeah, having an aristocrat probably doesn't resonate as well with the American people, but Diego Luna, he's the every man. He's, you know, he's built like your stepfather. And he combines that lovable quality with the neck tats, et cetera.

And then an attractive style of play on the field. I agree with that. I was going to, I'm glad he said that, because, I think Luna can play better than he did in this tournament. And if Pott's dead set on bringing Diego Luna to the World Cup, I got no objection. I just want him to play better. That's it.

Me too. For what it's worth. I would like for him to play much better. So I'm going to put a – I'm really going to do it this time. I'm going to put a Google Form link in the show notes for you to submit a question. for Tom Beyer because he and I are going to kick off the series on youth soccer

here next week and I'm really excited about that. Publication date, TBD. Also, thanks for listening. If you want to join the Patreon and skip the ads, the link for that will be in the show notes as well. Anything else from you guys?

Well, no. our next match is in Harris in New Jersey I get South Korea Bells we talked about it informally I'm going are you going Adam Bells I'm I'm strongly leaning towards going to it I think that's one of our

our scuffed epicenters in New York City area there's going to be a lot of people there Waki you're old stomping grounds Are you interested in going to visit NYC? Me? Yeah. It's not my old stomping grounds, Chris.

Probably not going to go. Okay. I understood. And I didn't make it in Nashville. Yeah, it's a little further than Nashville. That's all right. All right, yeah. So mark that on your calendars.

I think it's September 6th, which is a day before Chris's birthday. That's correct. All right. Hey, thanks everybody for listening. We'll see you.