Sea Control - Sea Control 215 - Bluetech: The Gateway to the Undersea "Internet of Things"

Episode Date: December 9, 2020

Links:1. Creating a Global Accelerator Network to Launch the Digital Ocean, Julie Angus and Michael Brasseur, CIMSEC, November 3, 2020.2. The ‘Digital Ocean’ as the Model for Innovation in the Perfect Storm, Keit Pentus-Rosimannus and Michael Brasseur, Atlantic Council, August 19, 2020.

Hey folks, Andrea Howard here. Thanks for joining us for this week's content from SimSec. On the Bilge Pump side of our podcast feed, Royal Navy Commander Stephen George, an aeronautical engineer, fostered a riveting conversation on the successes and blunders of the F-35, an episode that is sure to bust many myths around the program. If you find yourself in the spirit of Giving Tuesday this week, please consider supporting us by donating to our annual Write, Fight, Win holiday donation campaign directly via our website, and make SimSec your preferred non-profit on Amazon Smile so you can support

us while you shop. And lastly, the episode you are about to hear sets the scene of what life under the sea might look like with a subsurface internet of things. Sea Control welcomes Julie Angus and Michael Brasser to discuss how this possibility can become a reality in the approaching decades. As a reminder, all views expressed are our own and are not representative of any institution with which we may be otherwise associated. You're listening to Sea Control, hosted by the Center for International Maritime Security. Greetings, Sea Warriors! Let's dive, dive back into Sea Control. I'm Andrea Howard, one of your new SimSec hosts, and today we're discussing the creation of a global accelerator network as it pertains to the launch of the digital ocean.

We are joined by two incredible guests, Julie Angus, the CEO and co-founder of Open Oceans Robotics, and Michael Brasser, who served as the first director of the NATO Maritime Unmanned Systems Innovation and Coordination Cell. As a reminder, all opinions expressed are personal opinions and are not representative of any institutions with which we are otherwise associated. Thank you so much for joining us. Before we kick off our discussion on your fascinating article, I would love for our listeners to hear a bit about you. Julie, tell us about your work with Open Oceans Robotics and how you acquired the title of National Geographic's Adventure of the Year. Yeah, for sure. And thank you so much, Andrea, for having us on this podcast. It's really great to be able to discuss this with you. So I co-founded Open Ocean Robotics and I'm the CEO of the company.

We produce solar powered ocean drones or uncrewed surface vehicles that can go out on the ocean for months at a time collecting ocean data. that they can then communicate in real time. So providing a solution to protecting and understanding our oceans and really serving customers in a range of industries, as well as academia and government departments. I guess I've loved the ocean for a long time, and that is in part where the award from National Geographic came from for Adventure of the Year.

That award specifically was for an expedition that I did rowing across the Atlantic Ocean. So from Portugal to Costa Rica. And it was the first time a woman had rowed across the Atlantic from mainland to mainland. And it was quite a long and slow journey. So that took me five months. There were just two of us in the boat. And it's a fascinating way to explore the ocean. And in many ways, led to the development of the company Open Ocean Robotics because, you know, you really feel how large the ocean is and how poorly understood and how difficult it is to access those remote places when you are on the ocean for so long.

So, yeah, it's kind of been a bit of a journey that got me here today. I think that may qualify as possibly the greatest sea story of all time. It's certainly high up on the list, but how tremendous, too, that that resulted in the founding of Open Ocean Robotics. And then, Michael, flipping over to you, can you walk us through your journey with the U.S. Navy that led you to NATO and ultimately to this great project in collaboration with Julie? Like Julie, I love the ocean.

I grew up on an island in South Carolina, and I wasn't planning to join the Navy, but I went to Vanderbilt on an ROTC scholarship and joined the Navy soon after about, and that was in 97, and sailed on a bunch of different ships, commanded a PC, and then an LCS. We sailed the LCS. Speaking of the massiveness of the ocean, we sailed the LCS back from Singapore, and the Pacific is just enormous. And I just really got an appreciation for how big the ocean is and just how much I love it. So it was kind of one of the things that drew me towards Julie, trying to imagine somebody rowing across the ocean is just incredible. Did a bunch of deployments, but my first deployment was a NATO deployment back in 98. And I had so much fun. And we hit 18 port visits in the Mediterranean in the summer of 98.

And it was just fantastic. And I'd always wanted to get back to NATO and to Europe. And so when I was up for orders, I needed to do a joint tour. I asked my detailer, hey, can I do anything in Europe? And my detailer kind of owed me one because he jammed me with a 32-month XO tour. So for all the surface warfare officers out there, they know that's a very, very long XO tour. And so I asked him, well, what about Europe? He said, well, what about Brussels?

I got sent over to the U.S. mission to NATO in Brussels and had the naval armaments portfolio. And soon after arriving, we launched a maritime unmanned systems initiative with 14 nations. And we'll talk a little bit about that later, I hope. But that's eventually how I got connected with Julie. She's got this fantastic company and, you know, we were interested in some of the stuff she was doing. That's a little bit of my background. Another fascinating story, too, on how you got to this point. Julie, do you want to talk a little bit about how you met on the Innovation Advisory Board?

Yeah, so the Innovation Advisory Board is really a remarkable group of people across a broad spectrum of industries and knowledge. And the goal is to think innovatively about how we can advance maritime unmanned systems. Uh, so when Michael reached out to, um, you know, tell me a bit more about the board, uh, and the project, it's something that immediately fascinated me. Um, you know, I feel very strongly that, uh, innovative technology like robotics, like AI is going to play a transformative role in advancing our ability to protect and understand our oceans. So I think it's tremendously exciting that NATO is taking on such an ambitious initiative like this. I definitely agree. You know, Michael brought up the point that traversing the ocean and the fashions that both of you have just reveals the expansiveness of it. And as somebody who has traversed the Pacific a bit in a submarine while submerged, I totally agree with that sentiment and could not agree more that that transformative role of unmanned systems in the undersea domain will be hugely important as we move forward. So as we dive into this episode, a fundamental premise for our discussion is why oceans are so vital to the global economy. And this will set up our discussion, too, of how the undersea domain pertains to that.

So Julie, can you explain this importance to us, as well as the meaning of the term blue economy? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, first of all, our oceans are huge. You know, they cover 70% of our globe. They're critical to so many economies. The ocean economy is $2.5 trillion right now. It is growing rapidly. When you think about international shipping, you know, 90% of goods travel on the ocean. there's you know offshore energy is tremendously important there's significant advances now may

being made in offshore wind to provide uh green energy there's commercial fishing um you know fish is the primary source of protein for a third of the planet so not only is it important to our economy and the livelihood of a lot of these nations but but to the health of their planet And then when you look at the security issues as well, between nations, also in terms of illegal fishing, pollution, there's just so many issues on our ocean that need to be addressed. And they're incredibly important for not only the health of our planet, the security and our economy. Yes, it's hard to fully capture just how intricately the economy is tied into the ocean. So flipping over to Michael, you co-authored the article that prompted this podcast entitled Creating a Global Accelerator Network to Launch the Digital Ocean, which we will include in the podcast footnotes. In this piece, you note that the global blue economy is expected to grow $3 trillion by 2030. So what is blue tech and how is it spurring this growth?

So, yes, thanks, Andrea. I actually had the same question before I started this project a couple of years ago. But before I was introduced to Michael B. Jones at the Maritime Alliance, I was asked to moderate a panel at Blue Tech Week in San Diego. I really got introduced to this really vibrant community of blue tech companies. A Bluetech company is really anything sustainable, science-based, ocean and water industry. So it could be anything from a solar farm or wind out at sea. The stuff that I'm particularly interested in on the project was maritime robotics. So like Julie's company, for example, her USBs are powered by solar. There's other maritime robotics out there that are powered by wind.

a wave energy and really kind of the sustainable aspect of getting after understanding the ocean at a very in-depth level but doing it in a sustainable manner and so that's a little bit the blue tech industry i don't know julia if maybe i missed something you could comment on that yeah i think that was really well said michael you know it's it's a broad range of industries you know, everything from ocean robotics to offshore energy to sustainable maritime to, you know, growing seaweed or aquaculture. But as Michael said, it's combining innovation, economics and sustainability. And I think that, you know, triple bottom line is really important to the blue tech industry, looking at not only building profitable companies, but companies that will ensure the

oceans stay sustainable, that industry is able to operate more effectively and in a more environmentally friendly manner. So it's all of those. And as Michael said, it is an industry that is growing rapidly. I think we've seen increased awareness of the important role that our oceans play uh recently i'd say over the last few years you know a lot of that attention was drawn to the ocean um based on the pollution we see on our ocean so when you think of you know those all that plastic pollution and gyres out in the middle it's a very visual reminder about our oceans not being this infinite resource um that can will continuously replenish itself and I think that really drew more people's attention to the ocean and looking at solving many of the

other challenges the oceans face. And at the same time, finding more solutions to allow us to operate better on the ocean. So I think we're in a really great place right now for blue tech companies. There's a lot of support. There's a lot of interest. So that's why something like an accelerator program. And this initiative is just really well timed. That's a great explanation from both of you. Thank you for building off one another. Specifically, boot tech companies will serve as the major driver to create an internet of things for the ocean. Julie, what exactly does this look like for the ocean? Yeah, so I think, you know, one of the biggest challenges we face on our oceans right now is

that we just don't know much about it. You know, 80% of our oceans are unmapped, unexplored, unobserved. And that's because it is incredibly challenging and dangerous and costly to go out there. I mean, you know, you both have spent so much time on the ocean, you know what it's like. There's a reason that, you know, it's difficult to get data from the ocean. So I think an internet of things for the ocean or a digital ocean is really a way to bring a level of connectivity and understanding to the ocean that we have not yet seen and that we can you know envision so everything it's basically from satellite to seafloor connectivity so thinking about combining assets whether it's subsea sensors submersibles surface vehicles and aerial drones and linking

that all to satellite comms and then being able to network that information so that you can understand things like, you know, where is there a risk? Where is there an oil spill? You know, where is there illegal fishing? You know, where is there pollution? What is the weather like here? And that base of knowledge can inform so much from, you know, security to industry to our understanding of, you know, the impacts of climate change or overfishing. So there's a real potential to create this digital ocean and the advances that we're seeing in robotics and AI in communication, you know, thinking about low Earth orbit satellites, that's all going to be transformative and allow us to understand the oceans in a way that will really allow us to not only protect

our oceans and rebuild them, but to use them in a way that really benefits humanity and our economies. Absolutely. This progress that you outlined is so exciting. But Michael, what are the barriers to growth for blue tech companies and who are the major consumers for their services? Well, that's a great question. And, you know, I'm speaking from the government side. I know that the governments are not always the best customers, and I'm sure Julie can attest to this. We have sometimes a hard time of defining our requirements. We're not always sure what we want when we're putting something on contract. We're slow to deliver capital. There's a lot of ongoing projects now with the Defense Innovation Unit and Naval X to try and accelerate that.

But in general, from the government side, we're not fantastic customers. And, you know, in the life of a startup, they've got to cross over kind of the valley of death to to, you know, get their minimal viable product to market. And I'm sure Julie can comment on this. So from the government side, I guess navies would be interested in this. Coast Guards, NOAA would be interested in this sort of technology, any sort of maritime security organization. Obviously at NATO, we're very, I should speak in the past tense because I've moved on since NATO, but the Alliance is very interested in maritime security and what Blue Tech has to offer in that space. Probably, Julie, did you want to comment on that since you're a startup yourself? Yeah, absolutely. I would just echo the things that Michael has said.

And government is actually a large customer in the blue tech space. And that is, that can be challenging. You know, as Michael mentioned, many of the challenges and working with a government customer, you know, a long sales cycle there, there's also the difficulty of building a company where customer is primarily government so from a venture capital perspective from an investment perspective that's why many blue tech companies are really um dual uh use so they not only pursue applications that would target the government but applications that would target industry and i know that this is you know true for us um you can develop a application that has multiple uses and being able to target industry first can give you more immediate returns.

But that same technology could have applicability in defense or for other government departments. So I think those are some of the challenges facing blue tech companies. I think also historically, companies that develop hardware are more difficult to grow than those that are more software-based. And a lot of blue tech or clean tech company does have that hardware component. So, you know, for us, it's really important to know that hardware is important,

but also software, AI, the digital side of things is incredibly important as well. And so looking at ways to potentially return higher rates of growth to investors is crucial for a lot of blue tech companies. That's a great point. Right. And in between those gaps of government contracting and the long wait periods, accelerators may be the possible solution for struggling blue tech companies. Your article impressively notes that the number of accelerators increased tenfold in the United States between 2008 and 2014, and now there are more than 7,000 accelerators and incubators globally.

Julie, how do these accelerators work? Yeah, accelerators are incredibly important for growing early stage companies and building that innovation ecosystem so that we have incredible technologies that will transform, you know, the way we do things now. So there's a few different models for accelerators. But basically what an accelerator does is it helps an early stage company that may be at the stage of just an idea or maybe a prototype, and it helps them get the resources to take that technology to a farther, more advanced stage. And those resources could be mentorship. They could be financial. They could be a pilot customer. And I can give you a few examples because we are an early stage company. You know, we're two years old right now. We have 12 staff and we've gone through a number of accelerators as we've grown from, you know, a technology that was really very premature to one that is being deployed right now. And for us, they have been really beneficial. So, you know, Michael mentioned San Diego. They've got some great resources there. There's also some great resources in Washington, Maritime Blue on the east coast of the US. You have Sea Ahead in Boston, which is an accelerator that we're a part of. We did one called Creative Destruction Labs on the east coast of Canada, an ocean stream, and we're involved with Mars Discovery District, another accelerator. So all of those have been really good for growing our company. And I think accelerators do play a crucial role.

And we're seeing, I would say, an increased focus in the ocean environment. And we're also seeing a lot of collaboration between different countries in these accelerators, which I think is important in all industries, but especially in the blue tech industry, because, you know, our oceans know no borders, and we do need to work internationally to deploy this technology. Right. And the crux of your argument in your article is that a global accelerator network could turbocharge that blue tech sector. Michael, how would this global network come to fruition? Who is seated to lead the charge? Thank you, Andrew. A great question. And Julia kind of alluded to it. The international flavor of this is just readily apparent. And I think this is a perfect fit for a NATO lead. You know, NATO is 30 nations. Twenty four of them are maritime nations and the other six are, you know, still dependent on the maritime for portions of their economy. So it's kind of a natural fit for an alliance like NATO. And, you know, there's plenty of resources in this regard together. the combined defense expenditures for the alliance is $1 trillion. It would be, in my opinion, a perfect place to kind of stitch together all these various accelerators, which Julie alluded

to earlier. We've got a really exciting project that we just launched at NATO a couple of years ago maritime unmanned systems initiative which started out with 14 nations and it's growing to 18 soon and basically the premise of the initiative was hey we're all working on in this maritime unmanned systems we're all at different stages doesn't it make sense to work together on this and and the really the focus of the initiative is vertical integration so above on and below the water, and then horizontal integration, so across the allies. So you can see why an initiative like that might be a great place to help stitch these various accelerators together towards a common end like a digital ocean. And that's really the crux of the article which Julie and I authored.

Michael, that's fantastic. Can you talk a bit more about this Maritime Unmanned Systems Initiative and especially as you mentioned in your article how it might change deterrence in the undersea domain so thank you thank you so this was launched about like i said two years ago nato itself may not have a reputation for being super agile but i can tell you based on my two years there it's a very very agile organization and getting quicker and this is kind of a demonstration of that so the alliance itself is a consensus organization so it requires that all 30 members agree on something to move an effort forward but the maritime unmanned systems initiative is a multinational effort with a nato badge on it right so it's 14 nations and um let's say five of those

14 wanted to work together and and put together and or actually we have launched an asw barrier project, a smart defense project. I think it's got seven or eight nations on it. So it's just grouping together like-minded nations, going out and working quick to get some real capability to the alliance and the operators. In particular, and coming back to your original question, in the undersea domain, I know Julie talked about the digital ocean and the internet of things. All that stuff is wonderful for learning more about the ocean, but it's also very good for detecting large metal objects sailing underneath the ocean, which I'm sure you're well aware of. So that's very interesting from a security perspective. And could it have a very, very strong deterrent capability for those that might think they're sailing around undetected, but actually with basically a digital ocean, we would have more situational awareness below the water. Yeah, Michael, I think my official posture there has to be that I have no further comment on your anti-submarine warfare capabilities explanation.

But, you know, Julie even mentioned earlier that 80% of the ocean is unmapped. And so even just for undersea navigation, whether from a military or commercial standpoint in the future, there are some very serious consequences to how that Maritime Unmanned Systems Initiative changes the availability and openness of that undersea domain. Julie, do you have any comments on that? Yeah, no, I definitely agree. And, you know, when Michael was talking about the alliance and the resources it has and the shared vision, I think that is a really important point. And for our oceans, you know, this is so crucial that we consider the interoperability of systems being developed by different nations, because it needs to work together. You know, we need to link all of those different assets. So we want to be developing things that can meet those goals. And also, when you think of the budget, like a $1 trillion defense budget, you know, one of the big challenges for blue tech companies is getting customers and having a big enough market. So when you create a system or an initiative that puts out goals that meet these very significant requirements and you encourage blue tech companies to come up with solutions that are safer, more affordable, better, and that there's the potential payoff and customers that will pilot and eventually procure that technology, that is very powerful. And that can really do a lot to grow this entire industry, not only for defense, but for commercial and industry use as well.

So I think, you know, NATO is really positioned well to help drive technology that does solve some of these incredibly challenging problems in the ocean, but also provide solutions beyond defense that will really help the ocean ecosystem. Definitely. Go for it. billion for warships. And the maritime robotics looks very attractive from a fiscal perspective as well. You know, you can cover a lot of space, a lot of maritime domain at a relatively less expensive cost if we were able to actually build the digital ocean that Julie and I write about. Definitely. The defense industry and NATO clearly have a shared vision. But even at the same time that blue tech is surging, this vision extends to the United Nations. So Julie, can you talk about the United Nations Decade of Ocean Science for Sustainable Development campaign

that's launching next year? What is the significance of that? Yeah, absolutely. So that campaign um the goal is really to reverse the decline in ocean health and to bring together stakeholders from around the globe um to ensure that the oceans uh meet our needs now and in the future and i think this is really just another indication of how as a globe we're coming together to really recognize the importance of our oceans, the importance of science, of innovation in coming up with solutions to combat some of these very significant problems that we're facing on our ocean, whether it's from security threats, from overfishing, from pollution, and recognizing that we can't do things the way we've done it before. We have to find solutions that are better, that

are more affordable, that are safer, that utilize advances that innovative companies that, you know, out of the box thinkers can bring towards it. So I think it's, you know, really exciting. There's going to be a lot of resources and focus paid on the oceans, on advancing science and other initiatives, including business initiatives. And I think it's just an indication of the growing interest in protecting our oceans and finding solutions there. Right. This vision of collaboration and protection sounds fantastic, but there's obviously going to be some barriers and challengers to that. So, Michael, who do you foresee as the major challengers to a NATO-led accelerator for unmanned systems and to this United Nations campaign?

A couple of challenges come to mind. The first one is resources, which I kind of alluded to earlier. I think we're going to have the budgets. There's going to be a lot of downward pressure on defense budgets, but just budgets in general as we come out of the COVID pandemic. So resources are going to be an issue. And then one of the things that, you know, I'm an operator. I really want to get the technology in the hand of the operators. But we have such massive bureaucracies and they're not positioned well for this age of exponential technological growth. And I think we need a real culture change and not only the U.S. government, but governments in general. They've got to move quicker. They've got to focus on the problems we're solving. And there's such a huge opportunity here with our oceans. And I would just hate to see our bureaucracies. I wish they could just, you know, get out of our own way and get to the exciting work that's ahead of us. So resources and bureaucracy, we've got to get to yes on this and other kind of exciting projects. um and and i've you know there's i mentioned it earlier there's a lot of really good things happening in brussels at nato i hated to leave as a matter of fact um rob murray the head of innovation there is is really doing some exciting things and finance and and you know building a really strong innovation ecosystem the maritime unmanned systems initiative is really uh it's a

It's a it's a startup and it's kind of a rapid prototype of a new way of doing government. And so it was really exciting to be a part of that. I liked I like what I see going on in Brussels and it gives me hope for the future going forward. It's great to hear that the public side of the public private partnership is rethinking its structure and trying to become more innovative. Julie, on the private side of that, do you have any comments on some of these challenges and barriers? Yeah, I mean, I think that the challenges and barriers are the same ones that companies face in growth all the way from a technological idea to, you know, crossing that valley of death. So, you know, when you look at our academic institutions, there's great research and ideas coming out of that. We need to transform that into solutions that are then commercialized and delivered. So that's one stage.

Then the second stage is, you know, growing those small ideas into slightly larger companies. And that's often where accelerators come in so that they can pilot and get some early traction. And then there's the scale up stage. You know, we need to grow those companies from, you know, five to 10 people to 50 or or 200 people, where they're delivering these solutions. So each of those is challenging from a company perspective. I think accelerators can play a role. I think, you know, governments rethinking how they procure technology, closer collaboration between large companies and early

startups. So there's a number of solutions that have been explored and are being implemented in different ways that, you know, a NATO-based accelerator system could certainly, you know, move the dial significantly on many of those issues. Most certainly. And Julie, are there parties outside of NATO and the accelerators that we discussed, whether governmental or non-governmental, who are stakeholders and potential collaborators within this global accelerator network? Who have we missed talking about so far in this discussion? Yeah, absolutely. I think it's, it is a big network. So you mentioned the academic institutions and marine science centers, you know, all of those organizations that do research that develop technology. Um, there's, you know, companies, both small scale and larger scale that are already deploying

technologies. There's the industries that are operating on the ocean right now. Um, there's the, the government and non-government programs that support this kind of, uh, work. So, you know, a lot of ocean work is actually supported by nonprofits. So, for example, right now our company is doing some work in illegal and unregulated fishing enforcement. And it's a project supported by a nonprofit because, you know, it's a huge issue facing our oceans and we don't have any adequate solutions. So and then venture capital as well, you know, funding sources to grow companies, you know, debt financing, banks. We need to bring together all the parties that are involved in developing and growing ocean companies to be able to address that.

And some of that, you know, occurs organically. You know, so, for example, here in Victoria, I'm part of a steering committee that's building an ocean hub and an ocean cluster. uh so in canada you know we have um on the east coast we have quite a robust maritime sector that has ocean accelerators and clusters that i've been involved with uh but on the west coast we haven't really coalesced in that same manner even though we have you know incredible resources um incredible academic institutions you know lots of very innovative early stage and later stage companies. And geographically, you know, we're positioned as a gateway to the Arctic. You know, we can work closely with companies all along the U.S. and Canadian West Coast. But we need to come

together. So we need to bring those different stakeholders, government, industry, defense, startup, venture capital, all of them together. And that is, you know, basically what these accelerators and these networks do is they act like a nucleus, drawing together all the different stakeholders you need to grow the innovation network and then linking them across a country and then from nation to nation. So definitely community, bringing together stakeholders is very important in this industry. Julie, you just painted a fantastic vision of collaboration all up and down the West Coast. And Michael, I'm curious to hear what your perspective is

in terms of the ideal short-term deliverables and long-term deliverables for this project. For the global network of accelerators? Yes, absolutely. Or just even more expansively, the growth of the undersea domain in a collaborative sense. It's a really, really good question. I think the short term would be really to stitch together these innovation ecosystems into a global network, right?

And so we've got, as Julie mentioned, in Victoria, we've got, you know, in Brussels, we were part of a really interesting innovation ecosystem at the Imperial College of London, the University of Porto, down at the Center for Maritime Research and Experimentation in La Spezia, Italy. So it's just a matter for me would be to stitch together these innovation ecosystems so you can really enjoy the synergistic network effects of a global innovation ecosystem focused on the ocean. As far as the short term output, I would really I would really love to launch or get to work on the digital ocean rather than talk about it abstractly. I'd love to look at a smaller body of water, maybe the Baltic or the Mediterranean. And let's just launch the digital ocean and one of those areas and then grow it. and eventually grow it to the Atlantic and to the Pacific. And so we really unleash the untapped potential of the ocean and the digital economy.

You know, one of the other Innovation Advisory Board members, Kate Pentzis, and I wrote an article for the Atlantic Council about the digital ocean, and she's from Estonia. She's a member of parliament from Estonia, which is a digital nation. And I just want to get to work on it. Let's stop talking and let's do it. Yeah, Michael, I think you just outlined my dream shore duty. So if they need any motivated junior officers to head over to NATO, I will gladly act as a volunteer and make that terrible sacrifice.

um but i'll be i was gonna ask you uh what what do you know what's next for you or are you still not entirely sure what's next for me i'm uh rotating to short eating about a year but i'll be sure to also link that article that you wrote in the atlantic council to the episode footnotes i'm sure some of our listeners would love to hear that too julie do you have any last thoughts as well on these ideal short-term and long-term deliverables? I do, yeah. You know, as Michael said, I think linking these different resources and accelerators together is important. I think the shared vision that NATO countries have on what the priorities are for creating a digital ocean and for, you know, developing these maritime unmanned systems could really drive innovation.

And so, you know, linking these accelerators or creating specific accelerators that target those goals, I think would be really powerful. And then having the mechanism to deploy that technology, you know, in a digital ocean ecosystem like Michael has detailed, I think that would be really exciting. As an operator in the industry domain, I just find this entire conversation so fascinating. And I've learned a ton about how the area I will be operating is really going to change over the course of my career. This has laid the fodder for me to just begin to fathom how different in 20 years' time submarines will have to account for all of these different changes and challenges that it provides, but also opportunities of growth and expansion. It's truly remarkable to think into the future through the lens that you both have provided. Michael, do you have any final thoughts? well just i i wanted to thank you um and and simsac for publishing our our piece and then thank you for interviewing us uh this is my first podcast i hope i wasn't uh too clumsy online um it's it's really it totally energizes me to talk about this i i should say you know like i said i

have moved on from NATO. And as you said at the beginning, I'm not speaking on behalf of NATO. I'm just speaking as somebody that loves the ocean, that loves technology, that loves this kind of nexus of technology, security in the environment. And I see a huge opportunity and I'm ready and excited to get after it. So that's just a final parting shot from my side. Definitely. Anything else from you, Julie? um yeah thank you for this interview and thank you for since for publishing our article um and also you know i i think a big kudos should go to michael for what he has accomplished in developing the the maritime unmanned systems initiative and the innovation advisory board um you know i think

this is a really crucial piece in developing our uh digital ocean uh unmanned systems out in the ocean and i think you're right i mean the ocean is going to be a much different place in 10 20 years from now and it's exciting to to think about it um and you know it's exciting to hear your perspective as well embracing that change and you know um how that will impact um you out in the ocean and in the field as you um do your job most certainly so that's unfortunately all that we have time for today i'd like to thank my guests julie ingus and michael brasser for joining us you both are emerging subject matter experts and what is certainly to be one of the most dynamic domains on the entire planet julie where can we find you online and what are you

working on next yeah um so you can learn more about our company open ocean robotics at just openoceanrobotics.com um right now uh we're really busy doing a few different pilots and in various applications uh as we continue to develop our technology um i'm also pretty active in building the um ocean innovation ecosystem and um so you can follow me on linkedin uh julie angus probably one of the best ways. And yeah, definitely look forward to connecting with your readers and readers and listeners. And if anybody has any questions or, you know, thoughts on these subjects, I'd love to hear from them. Certainly, I hope you get some great follow on questions from our listeners. Michael, same question for you. Where is your digital footprint? And what

are you working on well um i've like i said i've moved on from brussels i'm now in bahrain out here as a deputy commodore uh for des ron 50 and uh next summer i'll fleet up to commodore we've got a squadron a big squadron of ships out here and maintaining maritime security and in the arabian gulf red sea uh gulf of oman so it's a really really challenging environment you could see how maritime robotics could be really key out here as well. So I'll be interested in advancing some of the work I did at NATO over here. Also still serving on the Innovation Advisory Board. So I'll be the senior operator on the board. Actually, I'm co-chairing it as well. So I'll stay connected to the NATO project through the Innovation Advisory Board, which, as Julie

mentioned is this really phenomenal group of very different people when we put the board together we really wanted to um get a really diverse team together and diverse from you know gender and race but more from experience we've got an artist on the on the board we've got uh julie we've got other startup ceos we've got a marketing executive from coca-cola so we've got this really dynamic board and it's really fun to synthesize with them on ideas how to accelerate and scale the MUS initiative. So I'll be connected to the project through that. And then I'm also see me on LinkedIn at Michael D. Brasser. So please, as Julie said, connect, keep the conversation going. We're very passionate about the ocean and very excited about the future.

Yeah, I mean, just mentioning all of the interdisciplinary parties that are on your advisory board makes me so excited for the future, too. I've just been thinking here as you guys are doing your outros that if we put this episode in a time capsule and the three of us revisited this in 10 years, I'm sure the results of all the work that you both are doing would lead us to just mind-blowing outcomes from this perspective that we have right now. So hopefully in 10 years time, we can revisit this subject or so and just see how much has actually changed based off these movements that you guys have been the pioneers for. And really with that thought, Andrea, go ahead. I just I just wanted to say one more thing because you really got me excited about the the M.U.S. project. There's so many, like I said, there's 14 nations on it, 18, soon to be 18, and really, really phenomenal people working on that project. It's a really exciting project with people that are really focused and not really constrained by the past. They're charting a new future.

So I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you as you were doing your outro. No problem. I'm equally excited to see the future of this project, and you've left us off on a high note. And with that, I'll just mention that Sea Control is produced and edited by Keegan Ingersoll, Ed Salo, and William McQuiston. Thank you for your time, and we'll catch you the next go-around. © BF-WATCH TV 2021 Hey, hey, hey, hey, put it in the alley. Put it on the alley.

Put it on the chain. Oh, no.