Segments - 17: Jake's Parents

Episode Date: February 26, 2024

In this episode we get Mr. and Mrs. Hurwitz side of Jake's college history, then play a rollicking game of Hogwash or Ha Eun.Advertise on Segments via Gumball.fm.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a HeadGum Original. Hey, I'm Jake Johnson, host of the podcast, We're Here to Help. But this episode right now that you are listening to is sponsored by Brooklinen. Brooklinen provides luxury bed sheets, pillows, comforters, and blankets delivered straight to your door. How do I know this? Because Brooklinen delivered me a quilt, sheets, pillowcases, and I love them. Plus, Brooklinen has been tested and awarded by experts, including Good Housekeeping, GQ, Wirecutter, and the hosts of We're Here to Help.

So listeners can save a ton by purchasing a hardcore bundle, which includes a core sheet set, which is the thing I got, extra pillowcases, and a duvet cover. You can also mix and match. They do this stripe thing that's cool, but that's a dealer's choice. So are you ready to build your dream fall bed? Visit in-store or online at brooklinen.com. That's brooklinen.com. B-R-O-O-K-L-I-N-E-N.com. Get 15% off your first Brooklinen order and save extra when you bundle. Hello, if you're listening to this podcast before September 27th, 2024, we're doing a live show in Philadelphia. You can still buy tickets at headgum.com slash live. Hope to see you there. Nice. Try one more where it's clear that I'm like the star. There's a reason I didn't have you say anything. Yeah. Because you're nervous, you're skittish,

you're stuttering right now. I'm a little frightened. So I don't want you in this ad at all. I don't want to be steamrolled, but I want the live light. So no, I won't be recording one. In fact, for you asking that, I'm going to keep this part in. Don't. This part is now. Edit this part out, but let's do one clean ad. No. You will edit this part out. You will absolutely edit this part out. Tell you what, I'm going to say my fucking social security number,

so you have to edit it out, okay? Let's hear it. 091-3662. Now you have to edit it out. Keeping it in, but we'll see you guys there. No, no, no, no, no. Jake and Amir, two Jews that you can't forget. In 2010, they were big on

the internet. And all things considered, their success is more than fair. Now here's one more effort for only positive motivations. they swear! Sadness!

Another podcast. Sadness! Each app different from the last. Sadness! It's the Swiss Army Knife of Shows. Now let's meet your two emphatic hosts. Sadness! Welcome to the show, Mom and Dad.

Oh, my God. It's so much fun to be here. Yeah, really great to be here. So, you guys haven't seen Jake in over a decade. We wanted to bring you three together. We've come to address my trauma. Jake emancipated himself a decade ago, right? As a 28-year-old. Yeah, you're like, you're already financially independent. Right.

This is exciting to have you guys. One, thank you for coming all the way to LA for it. Happy to do it. Yeah. And two, this is like us getting this other side of a story that Jake told on a podcast weeks ago about his college experience or lack thereof

just a little joke to lighten the load you were clinically depressed for a year and a half yeah about a year ish ish no not to dive right into it but Jake was telling us about how you went to one college and then slowly phased himself out without telling you guys

how you found out. I'm like, I wonder if your parents remember it the same way. And Jake's like, oh, we should talk to them and see their side of the story. Yeah, then you guys were here, and one thing led to another. Also, I don't trust a troubled 18-year-old's recollection of such an event versus his parents. I assume you guys have a clearer memory of what happened. Yeah, because the way I remembered it, you guys hate me.

That was Yale. Yeah, as time goes on, the memories sharpen. They don't fade. Exactly, yes. Until you die and then it all comes into focus for one last second. We should say this is segments, a podcast that, you know, constantly changing. This segment, I guess we can call it interviewing Jake's parents. Yeah.

My mom has been on the show several times. This is your third or fourth appearance, maybe? I think third. Wow. I think third, maybe. Third, but first on camera. Yeah. And dad, your first appearance?

I believe it was my first appearance. I know I've been mentioned because I got an email from some guy in Finland looking for legal help based off some mention on a show that some banker heard and called this guy. I'm constantly shouting out your law practice. In Helsinki specifically. I don't know if you know the tax code over there. Fortunately, he was looking for U.S. tax advice. Oh, okay. So right up your alley. So really, you're welcome.

I don't know if you ever collected on that. We did. 10% is kind of supposed to be split amongst Jake and myself. Yeah. I'll offset the 10% fee against what Jake owes me. Which actually is a great segue to the story. As Jake told it, he went to, what was your first college? Moravian, right?

Moravian. Moravian. Yeah. And it was on a scholarship. Partial scholarship, partial financial aid. Yeah. And you would go less and less and less to the point where you weren't going at all, but you didn't tell your parents.

Yeah. You assumed they wouldn't find out. I left two or three weeks early before school was over, and I said that I had finished all of my finals. Did you guys believe that? Yes. So he shows up on like April 30th. You're like, oh, I guess that's a little early.

But what are we going to do? We don't know the schedule. Yeah, I think it was a little early. But yeah, I believed he completed whatever he was going to complete. We should tell you also have six children. So it's not like you're keeping tabs on just Jake. There's a lot of balls in the air. But the triplets were pretty good.

So you don't really need to look after them that much. This is, yeah, they were not a lot of balls in the air. But the triplets were pretty good, so you don't really need to look after them that much. Yeah, they were not a lot of trouble. But also, I thought colleges would tell you as a parent if your kid had stopped coming to classes and was flunking. They're not allowed to tell you that shit. I had no idea. I'm a grown-up. Shake out a gun to the dean's head. Hey, call my dad and tell him I'm doing

really well did you guys get my grades from the first semester at Moravian I don't recall that I recall vaguely I should say you're under oath right now I have a vague recollection of getting you know something maybe

in or towards the end of the second semester that you were not invited back. And that you knew that before he got home? I don't think so. Maybe after. It was after I got back. I think it was somehow after you got back. It was also because I wasn't invited back, not that I lost my... I thought it was that I lost whatever financial aid that I had.

I don't think that step... I don't think they took that step. I think you were aid that I had. I don't think that step, I don't think they took that step. I think you were just not going back. And is that how you found out or you found out from Jake? I don't recall exactly. I think we somehow gradually realized that he wasn't going back.

And did you, were you on the same timeline as Sam over here? You're like, oh, I guess Jake's not going back. Yeah, we're on the same timeline as Sam over here? You're like, oh, I guess Jake's not going back. Yeah, we're on the same timeline, but I think I knew that Jake was struggling a little bit more than Sam did. Did Jake open up to you about like, the class isn't for me?

Not really. Or he would hide it like, oh, school's going well. Shut up, Reagan. He said school was going fine. Phone calls? Yeah, just like, yeah, everything's fine. He was very vague, though. Right.

But most teenagers are. Yeah. Can't get. I know he at one point said he didn't want to go back for the second semester. Yeah, but I made it sound like it was my choice yeah like well i'm going to transfer schools yeah it's like meanwhile with what record can you transfer but i i think i was of a mentality back then is just if you know if you buckle down and just did your job you could get you know through anything and maybe that was a bit of a reaction

to having you know six kids and everything was you know very difficult and i a bit of a reaction to having six kids and everything was very difficult. And I was really of a mentality where just do your job and get through it. Yeah. Even if you're a C student, as long as you get to graduation. Yeah. If you work harder, you can be a B student. Right. And now it seems like I've taught you the valuable lesson that actually if you give up repeatedly, then you can fail into success.

Almost upward. I think you would be giving me the valuable lesson that I should have listed a bit more sensitive. Wow. That's nice to hear. Then what happened in between Moravian and the next college? You know, Jake, then I think we could call everything a gap year. We were able to sort of like frame it in that way. It was just like a step back. And my assumption was always that he was going to go to another better college than Moravian, even though his GPA was like 1.6

or less. I mean, he was going to take the classes at Southern, which is a fine, you know, it's a state school, but it was a decent school. And he was taking a couple of classes there. And so I was really very optimistic that if he did his work, he could get through. And then at that point, he was writing for this school newspaper and had things published in the school paper. So I was very optimistic that he would get back on track. Figure it out from there. Yeah. And yeah, I feel like once I left Moravian, I had I was like I had some level of like, well, I don't know if

you could call it success in writing for like the school paper, but I was proud of that and was like I could always point to I'm not doing nothing. At Moravian, it was like I was actually doing nothing. I wasn't going to class. I was like calling you guys for money so I could go to Quiznos during the day. And there was really not really anything else going on for me there. But when I went to Southern, I didn't necessarily like my classes, but I did like writing for the paper. So if the classes weren't going well, the paper was going fine. Right. And I think the fact that you were writing, I mean, I felt very aligned with you in that regard. I knew you were a really good writer. What about high school? Because before I even went to college, do you think I was going to go to,

did you think I was going to go to college? Because I was also a pretty bad student at high school. I believe I was kicked out of one high school. Kicked out of one. One high school, two colleges. My expectation, I think I just sort of am conditioned to thinking that all of my kids were going to go to college. It like didn't even cross my mind that that was like. You guys both went to school. Yeah. My mom went to Yale, My dad went to Columbia. Yeah, and like we didn't... I didn't have a choice. I mean,

I couldn't say, you know, Dad, I want to drop out of school. Travel the world. I did actually say that at one point, and there was just laughter. No, I think you'll be going to Yale, actually. But with Jake, I mean, my assumption was he would go to college, despite the fact that his college counselor at his high school said he didn't think Jake was ready for college.

Emotionally or intellectually? Yeah. Either. I remember we both felt really slighted by that. But in the end, he was right. Yes, he was correct. Doctors said I would never walk again. And they nailed it.

What was his name? I guess I should come out with his name just in case. Mr. Schroeder, right? No, that was a teacher. Mr. Richter. And he was a great guy. Fucking nailed it. So yeah, we're not throwing him under the bus.

No, no, he was a great guy. And he just like, he called it. He just said, some people aren't meant for college. And I think Jake might be one of those people. I feel like nowadays it's all like medication and like more mental health about like why this student is acting the way he is. Was that ever considered back then in like 2002? Or is it like college isn't for him and we're off to the next thing?

I think it was more the latter, like college isn't for him. I did wonder why we had paid for a private high school and not an inexpensive – Well, because they got kicked out of public. Well, you got – yeah. But then we sent you to private because we just thought. What do you mean you got kicked out of? I thought that I wasn't allowed to go back to North Haven. Because of the gun incident.

I was skipping classes at North Haven. I guess I don't know if it was like they fully said you can't go back, but there was like some kind of, like Mr. Dallai talked to you about like that I'd be better, that it would be better if I went to a different school. Yeah, you needed, that was not the right place for you. Yeah, you needed more one-on-one. That is exactly true. Yeah, but he wasn't actually thrown out. Yeah, I don't know if you can be thrown out. I think you can't get thrown out of public school unless you like.

They can just beg you to leave. I had enough like in-school suspension that it wasn't really worth anyone's time anymore. That's it. And you were expelled, I believe it. There was some point where you were- Yeah, I was suspended a few times. So Moravian comes and goes. Southern Connecticut State is happening.

Are you guys now like, all right, we really got to stay on top of Jake? Or like, he'll figure it out? How about you? I wouldn't say we were on top of him, but I think I was always optimistic that he would figure it out. How about you? I don't know. I think that I never felt like they were angry. I think if anything, I felt like I don't know. Maybe I felt like bad that I was disappointing them at certain points. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I sometimes I don't know that I felt disappointed. I worried, you know, you kind of worry what's going to happen.

And had I known what the future held. Yeah, it turned out all right. Yeah, it turned out fine. It turned out quite fine. Turns out you don't need college necessarily. But it's almost like going, you know, like when you accidentally go off a diet. It wasn't like my parents hate me and I'm a total fuck up. It was like, oh, things are fine.

Things are fine. Like, uh-oh. I cheated. I've had like cheat meals for three straight weeks. Like, OK, I'm going to school. I'm going to class. I got to see on that paper. That's all right. Oh, I didn't go for a week and a half.

Oopsie daisy. I hope this doesn't slide me out. Right. College entirely. And then I think I felt if anything, I probably felt more like guilty than angry or like they were disappointed. I think it was all projection from from me. But you were afraid to tell them basically. Yeah. Because I didn't want to get in trouble. No, you don't want to get in trouble. Did trouble from the school feel like trouble to you

or like, that's fine. I don't care if my teachers are pissed at me. No, I felt like I could always if I had time, I could find my way out of the trouble to some slight success that I could spin in my favor. Yeah, you just need to end on a high note. Yeah. Kind of like our videos back in the day. How did Southern Connecticut State end? I think similarly to Moravian, the first semester went fine. And then the second semester, I think I like maybe signed up for two classes, but very quickly didn't go to them at all.

Yeah. And then I was like, I'm not going to go to school this semester. I'm going to, I'm going to like, I think that was when I was working at the candy store. Right. I was like, I think I'm going to work at this candy store and go to school next year. And you guys were okay with that. Yeah. Yeah. That sounded like a good plan to you? Because it's like guys were okay with that. Yeah. Yeah.

That sounded like a good plan to you? Because it's like, hey, at least he has a responsibility. I was succeeding at the candy store. They gave me the keys. They were letting me close up. That was a fake key, actually. It was a candy key. Yeah.

Well, the manager always closed up right behind me. And I could just use this ring pop to get in? Yeah, yeah, sure. I think there was sort of like, it was a gradual letting go of college at Southern. Like, you know, you did okay that first semester, you were writing for the paper, we were feeling hopeful. Second semester, you kind of stopped going to class and it just, it was like a slow pulling of the rug out

from under our feet. So you say that you were feeling optimistic. Was there, what was the, what was like the low point? What was the time when you were feeling like the least optimistic? Like, wow, did you guys ever turn to each other and say, damn, I really don't know if Jake's good. But five out of six ain't bad. We still got Micah. No, I don't think I ever quite felt like that.

There's no like rock bottom, going to jail and all this kind of crazy stuff. I think there was an incident at Moravian, and correct me if I'm wrong about this, but one of your friends was going to Lehigh, which was right near Moravian, and you went to a frat party, and there was a fight and you got punched in the face or you punched someone in the face. I don't know. Somebody else punched me in the back of the head. Okay.

There was. And I was just thinking, you know, like maybe, I don't know. I was just worried about you. Like your judgment didn't seem quite there. Yeah. And also tennis team. You were on the tennis team, which to me seemed like this huge honor, you know. And I was so proud of you being on the tennis team and you had your tennis uniform.

Yeah, I actually stole that uniform. They wanted it back when I left and I took it. It's a very smart school. And I would have been worried about that had I known that. But I think it was that stuff where I would like feeling, you know, proud, like even going to a frat party at Lehigh. I mean, that sounds like a wholesome college activity. But then getting punched in the back of the head. How did you know he got punched? I think you told me. You didn't go to the infirmary or anything like that. No, no. It wasn't that serious. Do you know he got punched um i think you must have told you you told me

you didn't go to the infirmary or anything no no it wasn't that serious do you remember why somebody punched you i think i like did something i think i was getting kicked out because of the way we were playing beer pong and i don't remember unbelievable and like you finally got upset it was like you were playing lehigh. You can't swap the bounces there. I don't, I don't remember why we got, we like had done something or made fun of somebody while we were playing beer pong and we were getting kicked out. Then as we were leaving, I think I did something to deface the frat photo. Unbelievable.

You cannot do that. Not the frat photo. Yeah. Those are, those are. It was serious. Sacred. I thought you raised a better man than that yeah uh so what happens after the second college after the second college then i went to uh then

i enrolled at the new school well that's in new york yeah at that point you were in new york though yeah so i i think i dropped out of i dropped out of southern i worked at the sweet shop i volunteered at the hospital so like on paper I was still writing for the paper. You got an apartment too. Yeah. And I was living with Steve over at Willow street. So it looked like I had my life a little bit together. And then,

and then I was like, all right, I've, I've made it to the top tier of the sweet shop. I'm basically the manager, the candy man. I became the logo. I think I, at that point I had started my internship there. The candy man. The candy man. I became the logo. And I think at that point I had started my internship for college, or not internship.

I was writing articles for College Humor. And I emailed Streeter and I asked if they needed an editorial intern. Streeter let me interview. I interviewed with him and Jeff Rubin at the Tribeca office. And I got the editorial internship at College Humor. So that was like, I'm going to move to New York for this internship and I'll take classes at the new school. Were you guys excited about that?

Or were you like, I don't know about this whole College Humor thing? I'm sure I was concerned financially as to how he was going to avoid the apartment. I have an email from you that says you're proud of me. One second. Okay, hold on. I can pull it up. Just do that says you're proud of me. One second. Okay, hold on. I can pull it up. Just do a Google search for proud of me. It's the only one in your inbox.

It's in my starred emails. I saved it. Okay. He said, all right, this is, oh, wow. All right, August 29th, 2007. It looks like this is me talking about this is me talking about enrolling at classes at the new school. Hey, Dad, I just found out the prices listed in the course guide aren't really that accurate. I guess the price is closer to 800 per credit, which they didn't specify for cash. Each class is worth three credits. So it actually adds up to be over

$2,000 per course. I think I'd maybe said it was 800 per course or something. What should I do? Register for one, maybe? And you said, I do not want you to take on more than you can handle. So two is way too many. I said two. No, no, you said, if you can really handle two courses and do the work and complete the courses, I am okay with you taking two courses. But I also expect, whether it is one or two courses,

that you be very careful with spending money, including the use of your cell phone, using my speed pass, et cetera. This is when I was using dad's mobile speed pass to pay for gas. So you ended up taking one class?

So then I respond, I can definitely handle two courses. I was just concerned about how expensive they were. If I can become a degree student in the spring, the courses will be slightly cheaper. Also, I will be very frugal this year. And to this, my dad responded, okay, good luck. I am proud of you for your success at college humor and for following up on the courses. Wow. Do you remember writing that? I did not remember every single email. Yeah. But do you remember that general gist? Like, oh, he's in New York. He's on top of shit. He's not going to spend too much cash.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it was always really, as I said before, I was always optimistic and thinking that he would figure it out. See, that's interesting because I did not know that you guys were optimistic. Was that blind optimism or did he have something that you're like, oh, wait, there is something there? Well, I think he was a smart guy. He was.

He is a smart guy. I think he really just had to get through whatever he had to get through to be successful. Sometimes it is the classes and or colleges are not for you. Yeah. Well, I think at Hunter was where I finally took a creative writing course. And you loved it. And I did really well. And that was the first time I did well in a college course. Yeah. Well, I think at Hunter was where I finally took a creative writing course and I did really well. And that was the first time I did well in a college course. And then I dropped out. But your teacher really liked you. And I remember thought you had potential were going well at College Humor. I think I've said this already, but around this time when I was taking that class, Streeter said that my internship was going to be paid. And then Ricky said that I can come in as many hours as I want. So I said that my classes were all at night and then I dropped out. Did you guys know that he was dropping out?

No. You must have known because I would have asked you for money to register for the other courses, right? Which you did. Spend it on Quiznos again. I feel like if we, I don't know, I think maybe it's having so many kids or maybe just Jake being Jake. We just, if we didn't hear anything, if we didn't know there was a problem, we assumed everything was fine. And it was probably a little bit denial, a little bit of optimism. A little bit of distraction from the other kids. Yeah, that too, distraction. I definitely worried more than dad, I think, just because I couldn't

imagine a path forward. But then when college number really kicked in, I think, just because I couldn't imagine a path forward. But then when College Humor really kicked in, I could imagine. Right. Yeah. Was there a point where you're like, oh, wow, Jake's actually doing well? It's not just blind optimism. Probably an ad pod. It wasn't until Carnegie four months ago.

I think it was when we went on a tour of the College Humor office. Yeah, the snacks were just amazing. And you guys had free snacks. Yeah, that was incredible. Zero dispensers as far as the eyes could see. And then when people I knew started knowing who Jake was because their kids watched Jake and you. I had friends who would bring their kids over to the house

for a sighting of Jake. Did you guys like those videos? Because we've been re-watching some of the old ones and we were like, these are awful. They were fun. I thought they were great. Really? Yeah.

Even like the old, terrible, unfunny ones, you loved them all? I loved them all in degrees. Some of them I loved like a lot. But you were never like, oh my God, this is kind of embarrassing. Never. No, not at all. Never, never.

And I think the content, I think humor now, it's harder to find stuff that's genuinely funny and fresh and you know different you guys created these characters well we invented the funny man straight man dynamic yeah totally did the first YouTube video really and then everything took off from there but my parents don't even like don't understand it just maybe the language my parents don't even, like, don't understand it. Just maybe the language barriers. They don't, like, watch the videos or if they did,

they wouldn't fully understand what they are. So it was funny to have Jake's parents, you guys, watch them. And I'm like, I wonder if they even like this stuff. Well, I don't know.

Jake may have inherited some of his sense of humor from us. Interesting. Because you said it skipped a generation. But my grandparents were hilarious. These guys are sticks in the mud uh so that's cool so then by the time jake and amir and the college humor stuff rolled around you're like okay i can finally maybe rest easy about the whole not finishing college thing yeah i had to be partially that i stopped asking you guys for money at a certain point too right because yeah and you started giving people money yeah more recently yeah yeah

but i mean even you you're charitable that's that's just you you're very generous you know and at some point we didn't have to guarantee his leases yeah yeah that was real sign of 70 times rent or whatever the insane rule is yeah trust me i, trust me, I have $190,000 in the bank. It's not going to be an issue. Let me live here, Jesus. Yeah, God. There were a couple of times that I ran out of money in New York doing, you know, paying rent. But I don't think I told you guys that.

Oh, no. I borrowed money for you one time when I was like 24 or something. Yeah. I don't remember exactly. But it was harder to send money somewhere too because it was before Venmo and everything. Yeah, wow. Western Union.

Right. Now kids are fucking Venmo requesting their parents from college. You don't have to money transfer. Yeah, I mean, that's kind of interesting. If I could have just done that without even talking to you guys, that would have been really sad.

Well, they still would have to approve it on their app. Yeah, I guess so. I thought you learned a valuable life skill, like tactfully asking your parents for money. Yeah, it has to be fun. You read that email, right? Yeah, that was a really nice email. Yeah. That was a good email.

Congrats on the email. Email-wise, it was awesome. Regrets? Do you have a few? Or, hey, it was awesome. Regrets? Do you have a few? Or, hey, it all worked out. I think everyone did their best job. I have some.

What do you mean about this in particular? Yeah, all's well that ends well in a way. I wish I was more sensitive, and I wish I said, you know, second semester, don't go back to college. Or maybe don't go to Moravian. Go someplace local or take a year off. But I was, you know, too much of, you know, you got to, you know, go straight the, you know, the intended path and you just got to get through it. So I shouldn't have been like that. No, I don't.

I think that's very that's very sweet but i don't think that i i don't think that i felt i don't think that i felt that very intensely i guess i don't know i don't know maybe i did that seems like the hardest part about parenting is like when do you stop telling your kid to power through and figure it out and when do you like say okay you can give up sometimes you do want them to right like i didn't want to go to jewish sleep away camp because i was afraid of like being away from my home for three weeks. And now as a 41-year-old, I'm like, I wish my parents made me do that. But then it's like if I'm crying and I'm 11 years old, I'm like, I don't want to go to Jewish summer camp.

Do I actually wish they threw me into a Jewish summer camp and left me there? And I wish you guys made me play soccer for longer because I actually suck at soccer, and Micah's pretty damn good. And I think if you didn't let me quit soccer, well you're pretty good now you're you came back it's all it's really all heart though I don't really have any like game I don't have any but like Amir do you have like like is your mom kind of like do you have a good cop bad cop situation at your house with my parents or with yeah with? Uh, a little bit. My mom's like, she didn't want us to like learn things the hard way. So she's like, you know, created rules. Like

you have to do this. You don't, you don't have to do this. Don't drive at night, blah, blah, blah. Like taking the keys away. Like, it's not like, Oh, let him do whatever he wants and he'll figure it out. But then likewise, I didn't, you know, drink or do drugs in high school, which seems like it was a good thing, but then maybe you can zoom out and be like, maybe he should have done more of that stuff in high school. Maybe it would have been more gratifying if you forced him to do the Jewish summer camp thing. Was your dad more strict? No. Or he was more lenient?

He was more like, kind of, you do. Yeah, I think my dad was more listen to your mom and my mom had the rules because because i think sam and i just had such wildly different approaches and you can correct me if i'm wrong on that one jake but i just feel like i was a lot of love and it's okay and you're gonna be fine honey and dad was more call me for tax advice i really think that's that's almost what i keep on thinking of because you're saying like that you you wish you were more sensitive or like let me do stuff but i think it was mom is very very uh very emotional and and also like will give more words of affirmation she She'll share more. And I don't think you were necessarily mean,

but you were just more quiet and reserved. You never really said anything that was mean to me. If you look at this, bringing back the email. Yeah, but her email. But I think there, maybe just me being young, I took the silence for disapproval because I was disapproving of myself. It's almost like the reflection of your silence is whatever I was going to tell myself.

Yeah. I think maybe if you did something that would have logically disappointed me, you probably could have sensed disappointment on my part. Yeah. Makes sense. But yeah, it all worked out. It really did. It really did. I mean, you're sitting on a nice couch right now.

Yeah. Yeah. The posters are cool. Everything is cool. We have a podcast, which is pretty amazing. That's it. Yeah. Yeah.

I guess I failed out of college, but you never thought that one day i'd have a podcast the jokes on all of us uh should they stick around should we do another segment yeah let's do one more segment i wanted to run the um poems i've been writing past you oh because i know jake gets his love of poetry from you or maybe it's from Sam. Not from me. Okay, yeah, so I've been trying to write poems for Jake, try to trick him into thinking they're real award-winning poems. And I listened to this segment where Jake read

a Mary Oliver poem, an AI poem, and his poem, which I thought actually was pretty decent. Thanks, Mom. I really did. I thought it was good. It was really Mom. I really did. I thought it was good. It was no programmatic algorithmic one that was spit out in less than a nanosecond, but it was still pretty good.

Well, that one mentioned Mary Oliver by name, which was ideal. Yeah, that was so strange. It was, the kind that Mary Oliver walked through. I like the Haun poem. Yes, okay, so let's take a break, come back and we'll talk about the ha-oon poem. Thank you to Squarespace for sponsoring this episode of our show. Hell yeah. Jake, you've been building on Squarespace for decades at this point.

Exactly. Eons, it feels like. Yes. So you know how easy it is to use their simple, intuitive drag and drop design technology? Yes, yes, yes. Easy to create, easy to sell, easy to promote. Squarespace is my all-in-one, first stop, one-stop shop. Yeah. It's kind of funny that they have also award-winning customer support because it's so intuitive that even Jake was able to figure it out. But if you have any questions, they can figure it out for you as well. Exactly. And I did need a lot of help. I needed a lot of help. It's easy for everybody, but I still like to have my hand held.

They even have AI at this point. You can update written content, product description, or email with Squarespace AI. You can even buy a domain name through Squarespace. Exactly. Like, you know that movie Freaky Friday? Yeah. How'd you like to own FreakyFriday.com? That'd be great. Is that available? It's not available. Yeah. But how'd you like to own FreakyFriday.com? That'd be great. Is that available? It's not available. Yeah.

But how'd you like to own Freaky Tuesday? Interesting. Freaky Tuesday. So that's when like you run into each other and some parts of your personality change, but ultimately it's not a full body swap. Right. Mostly you're just concussed. Yeah.

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All right, we're back. One of my most, I guess, influential pieces was a poem I called Ha-oon, which I made about a Korean immigrant. Kind of like I moved from Israel to America. Oh, don't make it. This guy moved from Korea to try to trick Jake into thinking it wasn't about me. Right. And it was called Ha-oon. You have it on your phone, right?

Ha-oon. Okay. By H.E. Kim. Also fake, yeah. But that sounds pretty real, right? It does. Right off the bat, you don't think that's me. Tap as Harrison hopscotched across kindergarten chalk towers.

Clap as Harry graduates, now dancing across the stage in gowns and hats. Disguised symbolically at first, then veiling historically, Ha-un sits now to mourn Ha-un, then Harrison, then Harry. Now that I've read it a third or fourth time, it's awful. But let's go line by line.

I thought it was better when you read it now. I'm like, okay, that was my best attempt at a quote unquote real poem. Let's go stanza by stanza. First impressions. When you hear that, does that sound like it could have been an award winning poem? Or does that sound like a six year old trying his hardest to make it sound like a real poem? It doesn't sound award winning, to be honest. And that's fair.

Honestly, I don't even like it that much but there is a middle ground between six year old and award apparently high schooler? yeah

high school writer poem? but it's like higher really? so your dad liked it yeah I liked it I think it's a good poem what about Sadie?

did you like his poem Sadie? I don't remember Sadie Sadie was the that was the ancestry one. Oh, yeah. Let's stick to Haun. Okay, Haun. Oh, yeah.

So what did you think about that one? I actually thought it had, the flow was really interesting. It was all consistent with the character you created. Thank you. The language wouldn't be fluid. Yeah. So it was like kind of, it was structured well for what it was.

I thought that the structure kind of- You're really reaching to give him a compliment. Do you feel like that? No, it's really true. But I like it. I like the simplicity of the language. There was nothing about it that seemed overblown or like you were trying too hard. Yeah, like using words that nobody uses

just because I wrote a cool poem. But tell me, tap as Harrison hop scotched across kindergarten chalk Or like you were trying too hard. Yeah, like using words that nobody uses just because I wrote a cool poem. But tell me, tap as Harrison hopscotched across kindergarten chalk towers. That's really good. That was my favorite part. I feel like hopscotched, I don't think it needed to be past tense. Is that fair? Watch as?

Is it watch as or is it clap as? Tap as. Tap as Harry, yeah. What does that mean like he's tapping and then he's as a kid he's he's hairy playing hopscotch written in sort of a flowery poetic language yeah and then it cuts to his high school graduation and his name is different now can i read it on your phone i'm sorry to yeah of course i just want to pass this phone to my mother he obviously doesn't want you to read it.

It might be weird when you read it, but just know that. No, no, no, no. I didn't format it like that. It doesn't. Oh, sorry. I lost the format. Oh, well. Classic parents.

I'm sorry. It was classic. So embarrassing. No. You need glasses, honey? Oh, thanks, honey. It's really good. These are a little.

Okay. Yeah. Moved to tears a little bit, I think, reading it. It's kind of exciting. What did you like about Ha'un? I just thought the name progression was so cool. It just told so much. I also thought it was cool, and it did tell you so much.

And I feel like we've always had more of that practical connection versus Jake and Laura. I still like hopscotched across kindergarten chalk towers. I really do. I love that little stanza. Okay. I'm a little bit. One second. She's talking.

And what did you love about me? What else did H.E. Kim say in this poem? He. Kim. I get a little confused with disguised symbolically at first, then veiling historically. Oh, no, I'm not. I'm not confused. She figured it out.

I get it. I just figured it out. What is it? It means nothing. Because disguised symbolically in his name. Yeah. He didn't want to be known as Haun because the kids would have made fun of him. Right.

But why symbolically? What makes it disguised symbolically? The letters themselves are symbols rather than letters. Right? I think Jake just didn't understand the poem, and that's why he is tearing it down then veiling his story veiling historically like putting veils over his own history right because that might have been his name father's name harrison yeah yeah i i get it and then the last line um in terms of the last line did you think i stuck the landing or was it now to mourn haun

yeah then harrison and i will i think the last i think the last line is good i think the first line is fine i think the middle one where he's just graduating not enough there so did you major in poetry at college that's actually a really good question i didn't in fact i was trying to prove to jake that despite his love of poetry i could write something quickly that would move him and the same way that his real poems do. You haven't been able to. Yes. And it's something that Jake sort of has.

It's an intangible quality. I'm reading a poem. He's like, that one moves me emotionally. I can't put my finger on why, but I know you didn't write it. This one did not do that. I think if the middle stanza was more about him. I think, Jake, actually, you're completely right about that. Jake's good with this stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. Top and bottom, great. Middle stanza. That's the problem. You could work on that, though. You think so? Yeah.

Because he doesn't have to graduate. You're obsessed with school. Yeah. Because he's hopscotching at school. Then he's graduating. And you know what? It's the graduating across the stage and then sitting to mourn Ha-un. Yeah.

If you want to like, it kind of condenses this history. Is he sitting at graduation or is he sitting later in life? I'm not really sure what's happening. It's kind of interesting. I think it would be hopscotch to like maybe marriage or maybe the birth of a child. Oh, interesting. And then to the end of his life. I think that's, you're trying to.

But he's not there yet. So he should continue working on it and to the end of his life. I think that's, you're trying to- But he's not there yet. So he should- Yeah, yeah. Amir should continue working on it and develop the more middle stanzas. In real time, yeah. The middle stanzas. Yeah, I think you need middle stanzas, plural.

Well, at this point, Haun is bunk. Do you guys want to play Hogwash or Haun? I'm sure you're familiar with that game. Hogwash or Haun. Do you know how that works? You remember this one, right? You have to say the right word. No, you say,

you actually choose whichever one you want, either Hogwash or Haun, and whoever laughs is eliminated. Right. So I'll say either Hogwash or Haun, then Amir, then Mom, then you. Then Henry, then Harrison.

Yeah. Hogwash. You can say either Hogwash or Haun. The object is to just not laugh. Okay. We'll give it a shot. I think your parents will win. Okay, let's try.

Hogwash. Hogwash. Hogwash. Haun. So Jake's eliminated. That was really good. All right. So it's Amir and my mom's shot.

Playing that classic game once again, if you're just watching, we're playing hogwash or haun. Haun. Hogwash. Hogwash. You guys did great. I mean, there's nothing else to say.

It's my mom versus my dad. Someone's going to win. I think it will be me. Hogwash. Haun. Hogwash. Haun. Hogwash. Haun. job someone's gonna win i think it will be me all right hogwash oh you got her it's a game that's sweeping the nation it really is spreading i thought I saw two high schoolers playing outside. I swear I think I saw that for whatever reason. Exciting way to end. Great job.

Great job. Thanks for going down memory lane. Yeah. It felt like we went to couples therapy or parent therapy. It really worked through some stuff. It did a little in a good way. It really, really did. We'll get the other kids in here one at a time, too, so we can sort of audit you.

Yeah. See how you did. It's a good idea. Was anybody as time-consuming as Jake? We all have our own issues. Jake was so popular and charismatic, actually, that that was almost a problem in and of itself i think that was too cool you were you were a little i felt like i had to somehow tamp you i have to dull this light i remember the speech that i gave for your bar mitzvah about you and i

said that um you had a lot of like kind of power and that I wanted you to use it for good. And did I? Yeah, ultimately you really did. Ultimately, for sure. Yeah. That's nice. And we're back.

Yes. Your parents are gone. They left in a huff. That was so back. Yes. Your parents are gone. They left in a huff. That was so weird. Yeah. It was crazy to have them here. My mom threw her water at you. I guess we cut just before you said whatever you said to her.

I hissed at her. Tossed her water at you. My dad tried to attack you. I had to hold him back. Can we roll that? Oh, we weren't rolling on that. We weren't rolling on that. Yeah.

But I feel like cooler heads prevailed. Not really. Angrier heads left. Yeah, angry heads left. Yeah, now I'm fine. I don't know what you did. I'm scratched up. My chest is scratched up.

I'm surprised it's not leaking through this shirt. On the theme of this lie, we're actually going to play a game called Two Truths and a Lie. Good segue. I got mine written down. You just thought up two truths and a lie off the top of your head? Uh-huh. Okay, we'll start with yours since you might forget them. Okay.

I've been to 49 of 50 states. Anything? It feels true, but it might be like 48. So let's hear the other two. I once got 14 stitches. That feels true. i once pooped on the floor in a public restroom so it's the first or third one is the lie i'll say the first one's the lie you've been to 48 or

47 states what restroom do you think i pooped on the floor of? I think you had like some sort of diarrhea or bad situation when you were like nine or ten. Well, you should know that the point of two truths and a lie is to humble brag. So I've been to 49 states. Oh. I did get 14 stitches. Oh. Both pretty cool. And pooping on the floor of a bathroom.

I did that too. Hoorah! That's one thing I wouldn't cop to publicly. Really? Yeah, that's a lie. Interesting. All right, good game. Thanks.

Let's see if you can beat this one though. Okay. These are three sport-related ones. All right. I played- I think they should be about you. They are about me. Okay, all right.

The league leader in yards per catch was Yancey Thigpen in 1989 it's not you oh yeah sorry these ones are about me Yancey Thigpen Yancey Thigpen I played flag football last Thanksgiving dual

I turned my ankle playing tennis last week interesting I never learned how to swim Dual. I turned my ankle playing tennis last week. Interesting. I never learned how to swim. I just kind of figured it out. That one seems so true for you. Again, I played football last Thanksgiving. Yeah.

I turned my ankle playing tennis last week. Yeah. I never learned how to swim. I just sort of figured it out. Turned your ankle. Would that mean like I almost injured it, but I didn't? Like I twisted it. I like walked it off. Yeah.

It could have been a tweak. Yeah. That seems very in play. But I do believe there was a tennis injury that happened to Cohen. So that maybe is just why it's top of mind. Flag football seems like the kind of thing that Billy Scafuri would organize for everybody over Thanksgiving. Because he's just a good natured, good old American boy like that. The swimming, I just can't really picture you learning how to swim.

You're saying they all sound true. No, I think the lie sounds the most lie-esque. Which is what? Which is that you turned your ankle. Trying not to get emotional. But you're wrong. Really? I tweaked my ankle playing tennis last week.

You did? Yes. I sort of hit a backhand and then when i landed i like uh had my ankle rolled and i fell to the ground interesting a little sore but ultimately fine it wasn't a full twist yeah all right never learned how to swim is correct i never took like lessons i was just like all right that looks like swimming and i can sort of figure it out but i'm not very good you're old enough that you're like okay i flail my body yes exactly or like i watched the olympics i was like sort of i could do that but I'm not very good at it. You're old enough that you're like, okay, I flail my body. Yes, exactly. Or like I watched the Olympics.

I was like, sort of, I could do that. But I never like learned the technique with like twist to breathe, twist to breathe. Like the fucking doggy paddle, the breast stroke. If you jumped in a pool now, what's your stroke? I would die in 15 seconds. You're sitting to the bottom like a stone. Immediately inhale. I fill my lungs up with water, get on my back and go to the floor. So you didn't really play flag football?

Did not play flag football. It just sounds like something I would have done. Yeah, it sounds like something Billy Scarpuri would have organized. Yeah, I feel like he has done that before. Yeah. Maybe on Christmas. But yeah, I was definitely not invited. I haven't played flag football probably since seventh grade.

Wow. Yeah. The look on your face when you guess the tennis injury. In retrospect, I should have guessed the flag football because I definitely can't see you doing it. Right. Like what position would I play? And it's too cold outside. I'm with my family.

You might play left out. Like you're not. Like wide receiver? No, like everyone else is playing and you're left out. Like left tackle? No, not left tackle. You're not invited. You're not is playing and you're left out. Like left tackle? No, not left tackle. You're not invited. You're not told about.

You're left out. You're left out of the line. You were warming the bench. That one was the lie. Yeah. Are you okay? There was a game organized and I was left out, but that wasn't my position, if that makes sense.

Yeah, it does. Yeah. It does. So that insult was added to injury. So that insult, I didn't understand it. Nice. Good job. You embarrassed me.

Over my head. I don't feel shame. You tried to embarrass me, but it didn't work. I didn't get it. This guy's embarrass me, but it didn't work. They didn't get it. This guy's too dumb to realize he's even being insulted. All right. Good games. Great games.

I'm glad your parents are here to get to the bottom of that. Me too. Did you learn anything? Yeah. It was kind of interesting just to see, like, I feel like a big part of my history was how much I disappointed my parents or how much I failed, et cetera, et cetera. But having them here and then kind of remembering they did give me a lot of chances and really believed. Yeah. They were sort of optimistic. It was just really nice. Yeah. Yeah. In fact, it might've undone everything that you've done so far. Notice that you were,

you've been trying to prove them wrong. yeah yeah they watch this shit yeah like I never succeeded to prove I actually succeeded because I just kept on getting propped up after yeah right which is great parenting you sort of like you stumbled but since you were on a hill you were just sort of like winning the race by accident yeah so now you can quit because you don't have to sort of- You should quit while you're ahead. Chase after their approval anymore. You already have it.

Yeah, evidently. That's nice to hear. What would you have your parents on? I'm sure they would actually admit to being disappointed in you. For being on. I wonder if my parents would do this show. They would be like,

what are you talking about? It would be like, I don't understand. I don't think we'd be able to get a word in. What we'd have to do is record them at a dinner table and call it a podcast. Yeah. Yeah. Retroactively.

I would, I mean, I'm here for three weeks. Yeah. Let's do it. Okay, cool. Thank you for watching. Thank you for listening. However, you're consuming this a lot. We're also on our Patreon, patreon.com slash J.A.

Making new videos every Thursday. That's right. And We're also on our Patreon, patreon.com slash JA making new videos every Thursday. That's right. And we'll be back here next Monday, of course. Of course. And see you next week. If you have any segment ideas,

let us know. Bye, everybody. Later. That was a Hiddem Original.